Feminine Belles - Info/discussion/support Thread

[Crystalicequeen123]

I don't know if I completely agree with this. I think that book like The Rules and WMLB is more about women learning how to set boundaries, both for men and (most importantly) themselves. That in itself is rather freeing, at least in my opinion. Alison even touches on it in TQC, but I think one thing women suck at is setting boundaries. And esp when we like a guy, forget it. Partially b/c of our need to be liked and our desire to be chosen so to speak.

I guess it depends on how you look at The Rules and WMLB (which I really prefer). You can have rules and be authentic. I look at them as training wheels to help get you started. And as you get more comfortable with yourself and with men, your own personal "Rules" or "cover charges" will change to fit you and your needs.

Maybe I'm weird, I like boundaries. When they're set, it's one last thing vying for my attention and I'm able to relax and be myself.

As with any of these books, if a piece of advice doesn't resonate with you, let it go.

Really??? You found "The Rules" freeing?? Hmm.... Well, I found it freeing in the sense that I know I don't have to go chasing after a man lol. I found it freeing in THAT way yes. But overall...I don't know, I just felt like "The Rules" was coming from a place of fear. Don't get me wrong, as I mentioned earlier, I like the books "The Rules", WMLB, etc. I've read them off and on for years and have used the advice in them. I think it's eye-opening for women who used to always pursue men. But with "The Rules" especially, I found myself beating myself up or getting down on myself if I accidentally "broke" one of the rules, and I feel like the whole book is coming from a place of fear. FEAR of letting a man even know you're interested in him, fear of even looking his direction, etc. It doesn't allow a woman to be AUTHENTIC imo. THAT is what I mean by "fear".

With WMLB, I felt that book is probably the better of the two, and a little more light-hearted and humorous, but again....it also seemed to come more from a place of "don't let the guy get the upper hand" Again....Fear-based.

I think what we are experiencing in TQC and KTTK is the paradigm shift that we don't need to "compete" any more. It's 2015, so the historical contexts and instincts hardwired into us are not necessarily valid. Men and Women can provide/protect/have sex/get attention/power from many different sources. So now, we can come from a place of understanding and build partnerships. From this paradigm, TQC and KTTK have already broken several of "The Rules"
- Ask him if he may want to get together this weekend and let you know
- Don't play hard to get
- Remind him to call you- especially if he is a prince.

^^THIS right here!!!

Exactly! This is basically what I meant. While other relationship books tend to stem from a place of fear, or treating men like they are some kind of anomaly (ie. "the enemy"), these books TQC, KTTK seem to come more from a place of UNDERSTANDING, appreciating, and coming to LOVE men genuinely for who they are. Whereas some of the other books seem to be some type of competition of "who can NOT end up getting caught up the longest??" "Who can outlast whom?" "Don't let him get the upper hand!" "Don't show your feelings TOO early!"

I think it's more so the writing style perhaps. Maybe even the fact that her books are more like novels and less like "rule books" makes it easier to digest.

I don't feel any fear of making a "mistake" or doing the "wrong thing" while reading her books, whereas with the others (while the advice is STILL very valid and GOOD), I always felt on edge and like I wasn't being myself because I was trying SO hard not to "blow it" and break one of the "rules". I was not being myself.

Whereas while reading TQC I feel like I can finally just completely be myself around men....my BEST self.

 

[LoveisYou]

I view those books as a screening mechanism that encourage reciprocity. If the woman is constantly reaching out and chasing it takes her out other feminine essence and receiving. You don't have to play games but go for the man who shows interest in you and who want to spend time with you. I don't agree with everything in any of those books or the books we read here, but I take the meat and spit out the bones.

 

[ladysaraii]

@Kimbosheart @Crystalicequeen123

I respect your thoughts. And keep in mind, I'm coming at this having just read TQC. I might feel differently as I read more of her stuff.

I think with things like The Rules and WMLB depend on the way you look at them. I don't see them as manuals to make a man commit. I see them more as a guide for me to set proper boundaries for myself so that I can evaluate him properly. Now, if you are able to have that objective distance, great. Me, I'm not so good at that. I'm the type to see everything through rose colored glasses, to the point where the person I think I'm seeing and the person I'm actually seeing are two different people. I also tend to be very overly analytical and obsess over everything. Add in the fact, I was never taught how to date....well, recipe for disaster.

So I'll share a very embarrassing example from my college days. I was seeing a guy and one of the ways we'd communicate was over AIM. Fine, right? Well, except that I had his username on alert so that it would let me know when he logged on. Then I'd sit here and worry about 'can I text him? is it too soon? Hmm, what do I say, I need something good!' and so forth. As you can imagine, I did very little studying. For a lot of reasons, the guy wasn't right for me, but if I'd been able to center my needs and give myself space to focus on those things, things would have been much better.

That's what I mean by freeing. Imagine how much angst, etc I would have saved myself by having some set guidelines for myself. I certainly would have studied more. And as I got more confident and sure of myself, those would have changed to meet my needs. And if I did feel like I wanted to chat, I could have done so without over analysis.

I think Alison has great advice so far. And I like the idea of understanding men. I think that's the idea that Techniques of the Love Affair (which I think WMLB was based on) advocates. I think for me, a melding of the two will bring success. As with anything, take what you need and leave the rest.

I'm excited to read the delve into the rest of the books and videos.

 

[Crystalicequeen123]

@Kimbosheart @Crystalicequeen123

I respect your thoughts. And keep in mind, I'm coming at this having just read TQC. I might feel differently as I read more of her stuff.

I think with things like The Rules and WMLB depend on the way you look at them. I don't see them as manuals to make a man commit. I see them more as a guide for me to set proper boundaries for myself so that I can evaluate him properly. Now, if you are able to have that objective distance, great. Me, I'm not so good at that. I'm the type to see everything through rose colored glasses, to the point where the person I think I'm seeing and the person I'm actually seeing are two different people. I also tend to be very overly analytical and obsess over everything. Add in the fact, I was never taught how to date....well, recipe for disaster.

So I'll share a very embarrassing example from my college days. I was seeing a guy and one of the ways we'd communicate was over AIM. Fine, right? Well, except that I had his username on alert so that it would let me know when he logged on. Then I'd sit here and worry about 'can I text him? is it too soon? Hmm, what do I say, I need something good!' and so forth. As you can imagine, I did very little studying. For a lot of reasons, the guy wasn't right for me, but if I'd been able to center my needs and give myself space to focus on those things, things would have been much better.

That's what I mean by freeing. Imagine how much angst, etc I would have saved myself by having some set guidelines for myself. I certainly would have studied more. And as I got more confident and sure of myself, those would have changed to meet my needs. And if I did feel like I wanted to chat, I could have done so without over analysis.

I think Alison has great advice so far. And I like the idea of understanding men. I think that's the idea that Techniques of the Love Affair (which I think WMLB was based on) advocates. I think for me, a melding of the two will bring success. As with anything, take what you need and leave the rest.

I'm excited to read the delve into the rest of the books and videos.

@ladysaraii

Yea I understand what you're saying and believe me, I can definitely relate. I too didn't grow up with any dating advice (hardly), and I never had any brothers or stable father figures (I'm learning about men as I go along) , and I too am an "over-thinker" and VERY analytical as well. So I definitely feel you on that one girl.

I guess for me it's not that I don't like books like "The Rules"/WMLB, etc.... I still refer to them from time to time and recommend them for my friends. Those books helped me to fight the urge to pursue a man (even subtly) or "help him along" and allowed me to just sit back, relax, and take things as they come. But the FEELING I got while reading them is a totally completely DIFFERENT feeling that I get when I read TQC.

I feel like those other books (while spot on and entertaining to read) wasn't coming from a place of LOVE and appreciation for men. Whereas w/TQC I can automatically tell that the author loves and appreciates men, she understands them, she loves them at her core, and it's a "softer" feeling. You can even tell how the author talks about men in her interviews and how she comes across....she has a different energy. Whereas, when you look at Ellen Fein or Sherrie Schneider (authors of "The Rules") and their interviews, etc.....it's almost as if there's a different energy there. Like, it's "us" vs. "them". If you break the rules you will be ring-less or you won't have a "Rules Relationship" Idk....call me crazy, but I feel like their angle is more fear-based than Alison's, and with Alison's I actually am coming to APPRECIATE men and have more loving and endearing feelings towards them. Whereas with "The Rules" and WMLB, I personally felt more aggressive, inauthentic, on edge....I felt like I had to be super sassy, don't let a man take advantage of me, always on-guard, etc... I felt empowerd, but I felt empowered because it was "me" vs. "them".

Whereas with TQC I feel empowered but not because there's a competition or because I feel like I have to be on guard in order to protect myself, but more so because there's finally an UNDERSTANDING of men that I never got before, and now I feel freer than ever to just be me and see where things go.

Idk if I'm making any sense lol, and this may just be one of those things where we'll just have to agree to disagree, but I can definitely say that I get a definite different vibe when reading those different books, and I don't think that's a coincidence.

 

[ladysaraii]

@ladysaraii

Yea I understand what you're saying and believe me, I can definitely relate. I too didn't grow up with any dating advice (hardly), and I never had any brothers or stable father figures (I'm learning about men as I go along) , and I too am an "over-thinker" and VERY analytical as well. So I definitely feel you on that one girl.

I guess for me it's not that I don't like books like "The Rules"/WMLB, etc.... I still refer to them from time to time and recommend them for my friends. Those books helped me to fight the urge to pursue a man (even subtly) or "help him along" and allowed me to just sit back, relax, and take things as they come. But the FEELING I got while reading them is a totally completely DIFFERENT feeling that I get when I read TQC.

I feel like those other books (while spot on and entertaining to read) wasn't coming from a place of LOVE and appreciation for men. Whereas w/TQC I can automatically tell that the author loves and appreciates men, she understands them, she loves them at her core, and it's a "softer" feeling. You can even tell how the author talks about men in her interviews and how she comes across....she has a different energy. Whereas, when you look at Ellen Fein or Sherrie Schneider (authors of "The Rules") and their interviews, etc.....it's almost as if there's a different energy there. Like, it's "us" vs. "them". If you break the rules you will be ring-less or you won't have a "Rules Relationship" Idk....call me crazy, but I feel like their angle is more fear-based than Alison's, and with Alison's I actually am coming to APPRECIATE men and have more loving and endearing feelings towards them. Whereas with "The Rules" and WMLB, I personally felt more aggressive, inauthentic, on edge....I felt like I had to be super sassy, don't let a man take advantage of me, always on-guard, etc... I felt empowerd, but I felt empowered because it was "me" vs. "them".

Whereas with TQC I feel empowered but not because there's a competition or because I feel like I have to be on guard in order to protect myself, but more so because there's finally an UNDERSTANDING of men that I never got before, and now I feel freer than ever to just be me and see where things go.

Idk if I'm making any sense lol, and this may just be one of those things where we'll just have to agree to disagree, but I can definitely say that I get a definite different vibe when reading those different books, and I don't think that's a coincidence.

No, you make sense. And, btw, I'm not trying to argue or dissuade you from your view, I'm mostly bored lol!

I will agree that her books do provide a different vibe than I'm used to in other manuals. And it's one that I really do appreciate. So far, I think that it's probably the best place to start to build a good foundation for interpersonal relationships.

 

[Crystalicequeen123]

No, you make sense. And, btw, I'm not trying to argue or dissuade you from your view, I'm mostly bored lol!

I will agree that her books do provide a different vibe than I'm used to in other manuals. And it's one that I really do appreciate. So far, I think that it's probably the best place to start to build a good foundation for interpersonal relationships.

Yes, same here. I find it refreshing. I more so feel like men and women are equal partners, and not so much competing against each other, or trying to get the upper hand over the other.

 

[caribeandiva]

In my experience, if a man really likes you and want to be with you, you won't even need "The Rules" or "Why men love ". When he likes you, he does all those things automatically to get things rolling.

Where Allison's books are brilliant is what to do after things have already started and not to take the things he does as a reflection of men's feelings for us or the relationship. For example, if you don't know about the stages of development that men go through, you might assume that he's not asking you out as much as he used to because he's losing interest in you when I'm reality he's in Prince mode and all of his attention is focused on his career. Without that crucial piece of info you'd either start to resent him or worse break up with him leaving the poor guy dumbfounded!

Allison explains all that thus allowing us to see men for who they really are and understand why the act the way they do. Take it or leave it. While I agree that The Rules and WMLB teach us how to set boundaries, they don't really provide a blueprint for a satisfying long-term relationship. Again that's where Allison comes in.

 

[sweetvi]

I read a wonderful article about Ice Cube and his wife on the Tavis Smiley show. They have been together almost 25 years. Here are some tidbits he said in the article:

-He gets up pretty early in the morning, but he doesn't rush straight to work. “I like to hang out with my wife, talk about things, get some coffee, you know?”

-Sometimes he eats the dinner she made last night, for breakfast in the morning. “She's the best cook” he says, which is why he doesn't do it, because he isn't so great at it.

-Cube says they’re also a great partnership. He puts it this way: “It'll be like if she went to make a record. We just both do what we're best at.”He advises staying on your P’s and Q’s and going for what you know.

Wishing Cube & Kim a continued lifetime of wedded bliss.


If you guys noticed, some of Alison Armstrong suggestion about relationship is noted by me.

Partnership...she respected his job as a provider and supported him... I also noticed how they still communicate until today. It is beautiful

 

[caribeandiva]

By the way, The keys to the kingdom is the first book in the frog farmer trilogy. The Queen's code is the second. I was wondering why KTTK read like a a prelude to queens code.

 

[Crystalicequeen123]

By the way, The keys to the kingdom is the first book in the frog farmer trilogy. The Queen's code is the second. I was wondering why KTTK read like a a prelude to queens code.

Yes it is lol.....

@Kimbosheart already mentioned this in previous posts so I knew this before I bought TQC. But since I'm single, she recommended that I read TQC FIRST before KTTK since she says that TQC seems to be better suited for a woman who is single at the moment. They're both good books, but I think the character of Kimberlee in the book is a good one that us single girls can relate to. Not sure about the characters in KTTK since I haven't read that one yet.

 

[caribeandiva]

Yes it is lol.....

@Kimbosheart already mentioned this in previous posts so I knew this before I bought TQC. But since I'm single, she recommended that I read TQC FIRST before KTTK since she says that TQC seems to be better suited for a woman who is single at the moment. They're both good books, but I think the character of Kimberlee in the book is a good one that us single girls can relate to. Not sure about the characters in KTTK since I haven't read that one yet.

Makes sense. KTTK is geared more towards marriage and those in long-term relationships.

 

[TracyNicole]

I feel like I've missed a ton on here so just wanted to poke my head in and say hello. I abandoned TQC in favor of KTTK and so far I am loving it. It's a bit difficult to digest. I've been just processing. I will come back when I'm finished.

 

[caribeandiva]

Today I was talking to one of my long time friends over text. She was telling me about how she gives her fiancée a hard time because he lives in another country. I immediately started telling her to cut that out and love on him instead so that the distance between them seems smaller. She was like: "Who are you and what have you done with caribeandiva?" She thought it was my sister cuz my sister has been in a relationship for years. She didn't believe it was really me talking to her. I didn't realized I had changed that much. I guess I've softened a lot over the past few years, especially the last few months.

 

[LoveisYou]

So a man called me out for giving into "societal norms" when I implemented a QTC tactic...Ah well. I guess he wasn't used to the respect I showed him. He didn't complain for long though

 

[caribeandiva]

So a man called me out for giving into "societal norms" when I implemented a QTC tactic...Ah well. I guess he wasn't used to the respect I showed him. He didn't complain for long though

I'm confused.

 

[caribeandiva]

I bought( and already finished ): Making sense of men by Alison. I had a lot of aha moments with that one. Especially the understanding men-glish chapter. I was bowled over when I realized how many men are charmed and enchanted by me and already taking care of me in their own masculine way. I'm touched.

 

[sweetvi]

Girl here I am on vacation and your finishing a book..eeek lol

I bought( and already finished ): Making sense of men by Alison. I had a lot of aha moments with that one. Especially the understanding men-glish chapter. I was bowled over when I realized how many men are charmed and enchanted by me and already taking care of me in their own masculine way. I'm touched.

 

[LoveisYou]

Alison is right. I can definitely see how the words she wrote about in TQC can be used to manipulate. It makes me very careful and very intentional about using them respectfully and for good only. At first, I wondered about the warning she gave in the book before sharing the words, but now I get it. Using the words elicit the exact reactions she outlined. Man....learning so much.

TQC is a lot to digest, I find myself going back to the parts I highlighted to read them over.

 

[PeaceFlow]

I'm hesitant to buy a book by her because I hear it's told as a story and I'm not keen on that lol. I wish I could find it second hand in my country.
ETA: found a copy. Will be back with thoughts

 

[Kimbosheart]

Well, I hope everyone is well. I've been quiet in this thread for a few days. I took in quite a bit of information over the past few weeks, and now I'm just processing it all and trying to implement it. I've said all along that it's not quite as easy as it reads in the books. There are a few lessons, that I will reread. But right now, I just have to let it all sit in my mind and work on getting rid of any limiting beliefs that may be holding me back from really embracing this information permanently.

 

[TracyNicole]

I finally finished both books. I am equally parts sad and hopeful. I need to take a bit of time to process and then I really want to share some thought with you ladies. I now wish we had done TQC in book club format. I so stunned! Be back soon

 

[TopShelf]

In my experience, if a man really likes you and want to be with you, you won't even need "The Rules" or "Why men love ". When he likes you, he does all those things automatically to get things rolling.

Where Allison's books are brilliant is what to do after things have already started and not to take the things he does as a reflection of men's feelings for us or the relationship. For example, if you don't know about the stages of development that men go through, you might assume that he's not asking you out as much as he used to because he's losing interest in you when I'm reality he's in Prince mode and all of his attention is focused on his career. Without that crucial piece of info you'd either start to resent him or worse break up with him leaving the poor guy dumbfounded!

Allison explains all that thus allowing us to see men for who they really are and understand why the act the way they do. Take it or leave it. While I agree that The Rules and WMLB teach us how to set boundaries, they don't really provide a blueprint for a satisfying long-term relationship. Again that's where Allison comes in.

which book are you talking about?

sorry, i keep trying to read the entire thread but some responses are waaaaaayyy too long...lol

 

[caribeandiva]

which book are you talking about?

sorry, i keep trying to read the entire thread but some responses are waaaaaayyy too long...lol

The Queen's code and The Keys to the kingdom

 

[LoveisYou]

I read QTC is Keys to the Kingdom worth buying?

 

[TracyNicole]

I read QTC is Keys to the Kingdom worth buying?

I really enjoyed it. It went into more detail about the stages of development in men.

 

[Crystalicequeen123]

I've been on vacation for the past week, so I didn't get much reading done lol, but I'm SO glad I finally finished the sex chapter lol. It was definitely informative, but the sex chapter took the corniness to a whole different level lol
I'm curious to see how Kimberlee does on her date with Jack.

 

[ladysaraii]

I've been on vacation for the past week, so I didn't get much reading done lol, but I'm SO glad I finally finished the sex chapter lol. It was definitely informative, but the sex chapter took the corniness to a whole different level lol
I'm curious to see how Kimberlee does on her date with Jack.

The sex chapter was painful. It got better, but geez. And normally I love sex talk.

 

[Crystalicequeen123]

The sex chapter was painful. It got better, but geez. And normally I love sex talk.

Lol yes!!!!

I was sitting there reading the chapter looking like...

It seemed to last forever too lol

 

[caribeandiva]

I don't know what y'all are talking bout. I loved the sex chapter. Corniness and all.

 

[LoveisYou]

On Keys to the Kingdom

During my teen years, I was very close to a lady from my church, she treated me like family so to me she was like an adopted aunt. She was a stay-at-home mother although she ran a small business from home. I wanted to be like her back then - she had all the trappings that I admired at the time. She was able to stay home, had a nice home and car and the family went on great vacations, plus she is truly a beautiful person inside and out. BUT...her husband was barely home and always working. You could tell that he worked hard to provide for them. My first year of college, I went to visit her and her children (actually I went to her because I really needed dating advice lol). While we spoke, she shared some of her own struggles with me and how difficult it was being with a man who worked all the time, but I will never forget what she told me, "If you can't play with the big dogs, stay on the porch." I always told her I admired ambition and drive in a man (my early definition of what a man does = provides, it's almost subconscious at this point). She explained to me that there are some compromises you will have to make if you want to marry a driven and ambitious man. In her case, her husband worked a lot and wasn't always home when she wanted/needed him at home. At the time, her explanation made me sad. You see, I'm also a romantic, and that just didn't align with my romantic views at the time.

Reading about the prince stage brought back that sad feeling. It's honest and realistic and very true...but the romantic in me weeps a little lol.

I recently dated someone in the prince/building stage. One of the most hardworking people I know...in life. On Valentine's Day, he was working on a HUGE project. Since my work schedule can also be hectic, I completely understood. Yet he made it his business to plan something for us on that day despite his schedule. It meant the world to me, because I saw how hard he works...

I do agree with Alison that it's still important to let the man know what you need and to ensure the time you do spend together count.