# Spinoff:  Does Voodoo/Black Magic have REAL Power?



## StrawberryQueen (Nov 20, 2006)

I'm asking for a Christian perspective.  Can you "not believe" in these things?  Or is it not a question of belief?  Are these things real and cannot be denied or do we make them real with our fear of them?  

As Christians should we refuse to acknowledge such things, or should we recognize them for what they are and behave in a certain manner...which would be...how?  

Has anyone experienced such things, as in the "*sexual demons*."  I have my own experiences that I believe I've posted before.   

*Just some questions.  I have no answers.*


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## Be Positive (Nov 21, 2006)

Yes, voodoo is real but it's nothing compared to the blood of Jesus.


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## pebbles (Nov 21, 2006)

Without getting into any detail, trust me when I tell you: Voodoo is real and has real power. 

I can't stress this enough: *Though the enemy is not all powerful, do not be deceived! He has power!* People would be surprised at some of the things that the enemy can do, and by the most "innocent" looking ways imaginable. 

It's ok if people want to scoff and "pooh-pooh" voodoo and black magic into a corner. It's probably for the best. That way, they won't get curious and start doing any investigative work into it. That would be a disaster waiting to happen, and  I pray against it!! 

1 Peter 5:8-9 *Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. 9 Resist him, steadfast in the faith, knowing that the same sufferings are experienced by your brotherhood in the world.*

Recognize that we are in a war against the powers of darkness, *and prayer is the primary and mightiest weapon we have*, both in (1) aggressive war against the enemy and his works; (2) in the deliverance of men from his power, and (3) against him as an hierarchy of power opposed to Christ and His Church. The believer should pray against the devil, not only for himself, but for the whole Church (Ephes. 6: 18), and for the whole world, which in due time will be absolutely freed from his presence and power. Thank the LORD, GOD!!!


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## gn1g (Nov 21, 2006)

Absolutely.  I agree with Pebbles.


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## Shimmie (Nov 21, 2006)

I'm in the middle of something right now (at work), BUT I will also have something to share about this....


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## StrawberryQueen (Nov 21, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> I'm in the middle of something right now (at work), BUT I will also have something to share about this....


I am waiting on you Shimmie!


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## EbonyEyes (Nov 21, 2006)

I agree with Pebbles.  You are putting yourself in jeopardy if you underestimate Satan's power. His power is no where near the power of Jesus but he does have power.

I liken this to believing that Satan knows what's in the Bible.  If you know that Satan knows the Bible, then you know that it is vital that you know the Word so that you can't be deceived by him when he tries to twist it around.


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## rozlips (Nov 21, 2006)

I think the human mind is incredibly powerful. I've seen many clients wasting away because they believed someone put 'roots' on them. (Isn't it interesting that this stuff only works if the person knows they've been 'rooted?') Now, I could've spent endless time trying to convince them otherwise, but what was the point? Nope, I'd either do some 'voodoo' of my own to remove the spell. Or send them to someone else to do the same. Its amazing how quickly they'd recover.


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## Crackers Phinn (Nov 21, 2006)

> Does Voodoo/Black Magic have REAL Power?



Nope.

To voodoo I say pbbbbttttt.

I have never heard good intentions behind voodoo. It's not practiced to give glory to any God or Gods, it's kind of a 'what's in it for me' selfish religion. There is something unquestionably WRONG with a religion where love/protection spells and hexes are run of the mill. The emphasis is instant emotional gratification without regard to anyone else's feelings or desires. I find the whole thing unseemly and unethical and I have questioned the values of anyone I know who was involved with the practice.

With that said, I wholly believe that voodoo is psychosomatic in that it only works if everyone involved believes in it. If one uses a love potion and subsequently finds a mate, then OF COURSE, that's due to the spell. If you acknowledge that this is something to be feared, then you have given power to something otherwise powerless. 

Psalms 23 says " I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, *I fear no evil; for You are with me. *

As long as God is with me, I refuse to be afraid of a pot of soup made with evil intentions.  Yes Satan is present in the world, I ain't scared of him.  He got his role in this world and I got mine. If our paths cross, and they have, I seek counsel from the Lord and keep it moving. No big productions needed.


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## chocolatemom_of_3 (Nov 21, 2006)

My mother-in-law, devout Catholic, was almost struck down with Voodoo. She has never believed in it until that time. At all. In fact, she really took it for a joke. After her experience, she won't sleep on it again.


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## victorious (Nov 21, 2006)

Voodoo is an evil power.  But God is all-mighty, all-powerful.  

I trust God's word, and I don't fear what others practice.  I believe no weapon formed against me can prosper once I'm prepared:
Eph 6:11-20​_Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. __Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil._

_For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age,  against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places._

_Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand._

_Stand therefore, having girded your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness, and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace; above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one._

_And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God;__praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saintsâ€¦_​


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## Aubergold (Nov 21, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> Without getting into any detail, trust me when I tell you: Voodoo is real and has real power.
> 
> I can't stress this enough: _Though the enemy is not all powerful, do not be deceived! He has power!_ People would be surprised at some of the things that the enemy can do, and by the most "innocent" looking ways imaginable.
> 
> ...


 
This is what my momma says.  She tells me crazy voodoo stories from Ghana.  Then she tells me not to pay attention to what she's saying b/c she doesn't even want my mind going there.


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## EbonyEyes (Nov 21, 2006)

victorious said:
			
		

> Voodoo is an evil power.  But God is all-mighty, all-powerful.
> 
> I trust God's word, and I don't fear what others practice.  I believe no weapon formed against me can prosper once I'm prepared:
> Eph 6:11-20​_Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. __Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil._
> ...



You quoted one of my favorite scriptures!


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## Crackers Phinn (Nov 21, 2006)

victorious said:
			
		

> Voodoo is an evil power.  But God is all-mighty, all-powerful.
> 
> I trust God's word, and I don't fear what others practice.  I believe no weapon formed against me can prosper once I'm prepared:
> Eph 6:11-20​_Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. __Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil._
> ...



I couldn't agree more. On point all the way.


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## Lucia (Nov 21, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> Without getting into any detail, trust me when I tell you: Voodoo is real and has real power.
> 
> I can't stress this enough: *Though the enemy is not all powerful, do not be deceived! He has power!* People would be surprised at some of the things that the enemy can do, and by the most "innocent" looking ways imaginable.
> 
> ...


 
the best way to protect and hide a great evil is to deny it's entire existence. Be diligent and don't sleep on anything.


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## StrawberryQueen (Nov 21, 2006)

Well let me share my story-I forgot to tell!

Apparently my great grandmother's husband left her and was living with another woman.  Well one day he decided to go back to my great grandmother, and the woman decided it was time for some "payback."

At an all day meeting at church, she put something/and a voodoo spell in the food that my great grandmother ate.  And from whatever was put in the food, my great grandmother had a scorpian born in her stomach!  And she had to take all kinds of expensive meds to keep it quiet, and keep it from moving and stinging her. * And one day it just crawled up her throat and stung her and killed her*.  

I never knew this woman, and whenever I ask anyone about the story they act funny.  So I don't know who witnessed this or the truth behind it.  But still....? 

 But this, combined with some of the things I saw in the sexual demons thread inspired me to discuss this with y'all.


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## pebbles (Nov 21, 2006)

rozlips said:
			
		

> I think the human mind is incredibly powerful. I've seen many clients wasting away because they believed someone put 'roots' on them.* (Isn't it interesting that this stuff only works if the person knows they've been 'rooted?')* Now, I could've spent endless time trying to convince them otherwise, but what was the point? Nope, I'd either do some 'voodoo' of my own to remove the spell. Or send them to someone else to do the same. Its amazing how quickly they'd recover.


 
Unfortunately, for a nonbeliever, most of this is going to seem like it's "in the mind." Give them some meds and they'll be fine. I can't deny that for some people, that really is the case.

However, without giving the devil any glory, I can tell you that I personally know of more than 3 people who have lost their eyesight and suffered other physical handicaps and deformities due to voodoo. They were fine before these ceremonies. I'm not talking about stories I've heard, I'm talking about people *I know* personally. One was healed, and had their eyesight restored after being taken to a church and repenting of their sins. The others choose to continue not to believe in the Saving Grace of Jesus Christ, no matter how much people try to bring them to church. Such a shame.

And mind you, there's so much worse than this I could recount, but I'd rather just leave it alone. It's not a subject I like. But I want people to know that when they engage in voodoo or black magic of any kind, there is always a price to pay, and if you don't do what is required of you, you have to forfeit something, and you don't have a choice what that is. . .

I'm cool with all who want to think this isn't real or just one big mind game. But with the things I know and have seen myself, I know of what I speak. This is no joke.

I believe in the Power of Jesus Christ. I believe that no weapon formed against me shall be able to prosper, not because I'm special or powerful on my own, but because I'm covered by The Blood. I have nothing to fear. But I can't walk around thinking everything is coming up roses and there is no evil looking for a weak spot or open door to bring havoc into my life. I rely on the spirit of discernment to show me where I should go, what I should look out for, who I should trust, who I should be weary of, when I should pray, what I should pray for, etc. 1 Peter 5:8 tells me to be *sober and vigilant,* and to be vigilant means _to be watchful and alert, especially to danger or to something that is wrong.  _


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## pebbles (Nov 21, 2006)

Lucia said:
			
		

> *the best way to protect and hide a great evil is to deny it's entire existence.* Be diligent and don't sleep on anything.


 

I'm in agreement!!


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## live2bgr8 (Nov 21, 2006)

4everblessed said:
			
		

> Yes, voodoo is real but it's nothing compared to the blood of Jesus.


 
Amen!!!!!!


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## EbonyEyes (Nov 21, 2006)

Voodoo has power but the blood of Jesus can render it powerless as if it had no power to begin with.


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## StrawberryQueen (Nov 22, 2006)

Thank you all!


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## Miss*Tress (Nov 22, 2006)

Voodoo, obeah, etc. are all just as real and valid as any other belief system. These African-based religions provided the impetus for freedom - especially in Haiti and Jamaica - which is why the colonial powers passed laws against and "demonized" them.

ETA: Like many non-monotheistic beliefs, voodoo can be used to do good or it can be used to do bad. When voodoo is used to do evil, the belief is that the evil-doer will and must bear the consequences of their evil acts. It's important to know this in order to understand that voodoo in and of itself is not evil. 

I've looked into African belief systems in the Caribbean a bit, so if anyone is interested I can post more later.


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## pebbles (Nov 22, 2006)

Miss*Tress said:
			
		

> Voodoo, obeah, etc. are all just as real and valid as any other belief system. These African-based religions provided the impetus for freedom - especially in Haiti and Jamaica - which is why the colonial powers passed laws against and "demonized" them.
> 
> ETA: *Like many non-monotheistic beliefs, voodoo can be used to do good or it can be used to do bad. When voodoo is used to do evil, the belief is that the evil-doer will and must bear the consequences of their evil acts. It's important to know this in order to understand that voodoo in and of itself is not evil. *
> 
> I've looked into African belief systems in the Caribbean a bit, so if anyone is interested I can post more later.


 
Respectfully, this is where our beliefs part ways. I'm well aware of voodoo and it's history and how it's used in Haitian culture, (being Haitian myself, and having personal experience with this stuff), perhaps more so than a lot of people here. 

Anything, *anything* that can be used for "good" as well as evil is *not* of The Lord. The Lord does not allow His Power to be used to harm people as well as to help people. This suggests that The Lord can be manipulated, and therefore, if He can be manipulated He is not in full control and Sovereign over all. I know that many believe this is possible, but that's false. God is a Just and *Holy* God. And He does not give His Power over to be used for evil. Again, I urge people NOT to underestimate the power of the enemy, nor the length to which he will go to in an effort to distort and pervert the truth. 

Seriously, I do understand that some believe voodoo is good. That's fine. But I know better, and I'm compelled to speak the truth. I wasn't going to say anything, but the Holy Spirit kept knocking me on the head saying, "you can't let this go unanswered. Speak. Somebody needs to hear it." Again, I don't speak as one who's studied it, or heard stories about it, or read about, or looked up stories about it. I speak from experience, and one who has seen with her own eyes! There is nothing I can be taught about this subject. I know it well.

I say this not to debate with anybody, because I won't debate this issue on the Christianity forum. We're here to give God glory, not offer the enemy a spotlight on God's territory. I just want my sisters to be sober and to be vigilant. Anything that is not Christ centered, and calls on Jesus and the Holy Spirit *only* is suspect, and you need to stay far away from it. This is the Christianity Forum, and we have to speak the truth, no matter the cost. Remember, GOD is an Honorable, Just, Sovereign, and Holy GOD! HE *cannot* be used for evil, nor will HE share HIS GLORY with the enemy. 

Be Blessed, sisters!


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## Shimmie (Nov 22, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> Respectfully, this is where our beliefs part ways. I'm well aware of voodoo and it's history and how it's used in Haitian culture, (being Haitian myself, and having personal experience with this stuff), perhaps more so than a lot of people here.
> 
> Anything, *anything* that can be used for "good" as well as evil is *not* of The Lord. The Lord does not allow His Power to be used to harm people as well as to help people. This suggests that The Lord can be manipulated, and therefore, if He can be manipulated He is not in full control and Sovereign over all. I know that many believe this is possible, but that's false. God is a Just and *Holy* God. And He does not give His Power over to be used for evil. Again, I urge people NOT to underestimate the power of the enemy, nor the length to which he will go to in an effort to distort and pervert the truth.
> 
> ...


*Pebs, the truth could not be better told. *  I too, know all too well about how this mess operates.  

And now for my $10 worth because 2 cents won't do it.  This mess is not a game.

All too well, the enemy uses deception to lure one away from God.  The devil knows that most people will not yield to 'bad' Consiously OR to justify his works, he will put a *"deceptive cover' *of good over it.  

But satanic is satanic and there's nothing good or safe about it.  There's no such thing as a 'good-bad' or a 'good-evil' ergo, a good demon or good devil; a good witch or a bad witch.   Evil is what it is -- it's evil...so don't mask it with a false cover.

Jesus has said many things in the Bible and one that stands out to me is this in Mark 4:22.

"For there is nothing hid which shall not be manisfested, neither is anything kept secret but that it should come abroad." 

Anyone foolish enough to think that a demonically based ritual has any iota or even a smidgeon of good in it, is deceived and in for great trouble. 

God's word says there's nothing hid which shall not be manifested.  These are serious words.   For once you step into the devil's area and begin to expose yourself to his methods and schemes you are in for it.   

Many have been deceived this way only to end up later discovering that they were in over their heads and lives have been ruined and endangered.  Souls have been lost and are being lost still, as I write.  

They've 'blindly' (not innocently for innocense doesn't apply here), but blindly people have taken the devil as a game and have entered into his gates of hell, right here on earth, with no way out.   

The dangers which were disguised as 'good' or a game (hidden) were shortly manifested into their lives with all hell breaking loose.  The very foundation of evil is simply that.... it's evil and no good shall come of it.  Not ever.  It's what it is...evil...straight up point blank evil. 

You think this mess is a game?  The devil has you tricked and hood-winked for sure:

*Isaiah 14:12*

*In Luciferâ€™s fallen state *he was still known as a light bringer, daystar and a son of the morning. *These are all counterfeits to the real thing.* We are the genuine and when we become an early riser to command the morning and capture the day, we displace the devil.

*God doesn't need the devil's help to bring about anything good or anything period! * Yet the devil would have one think that his 'goods' are above that of God's.  I wouldn't trust the devil to give me hell if I wanted it, for there'd be rope to hang me attached to it.   

God gave us a warning, to have NO other Gods before Him.  For once you step outside of God's protective covering, there's hell to pay and pay you will.  

It was mentioned by a poster that it's a mind-set and those persons are placed on meds.  I cannot rule out medication for those who don't know deliverance, will and do need medication.
But know this, meds do not cure and they cannot deliver.  They can only mask and apply control to the symptoms.  So if one is on medication, until God delivers you, PLEASE take it, you need it. Don't make life worse for yourself by not doing so.  And medication is NOT a sin, it is simply not the CURE.  

While it is true, that the mind and it's belief structure bears upon a person's vunerability and the degree of being suseptible to Voodoo, witchcraft, Black magic, etc.  The question is who's mindset is protecting you?    Don't depend on your own abilities and self-propelled belief system.   

You better have the Blood of Jesus as your rear-guard and to guard your mind.  For there is none higher to protect you.  We are not above God.  No matter who or what you choose to believe; how to believe, when to believe or even why to believe, none of us are above God.  

The one who Created you; the One whose sole desire is to love and protect you; the Createor of all Heaven and Earth upon which we have been given MUCH grace to live upon.

Each of us here, have our needs met and not anyone here can DARE say you are without that which pertains to life.   For if you are in possession or have access to a computer to log on this website or any other, and if you have been given an ounce of water to drink and a crumb of bread to eat, you have been BLESSED!  

If you have been given the ability to type a letter of reply, YOU have been blessed.

If you have a home to call your own or one to even DREAM of, you have been blessed.  For a Dream is a guarantee that you see more in your future coming to pass.

If you have a 'thought' to dwell on, a disagreement to this thread, you have been blessed, for the God that one has chosen to ignore and disregard, has even endowed you with working brain to use as you choose.

So what am I saying?   Don't ever confuse evil over God.  For you will lose 
everytime.  And what does it profit a man (or woman) to gain evil and lose one's soul or peace of mind. 

There is no in-between with good or evil.  God says, "I call before Heaven and Earth,  this day...choose life or death, cursing or blessing..."Choose Life." 

Peace and Loving blessings to all...


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## pebbles (Nov 22, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> *Pebs, the truth could not be better told. *I too, know all too well about how this mess operates.
> 
> *And now for my $10 worth because 2 cents won't do it. This mess is not a game.*
> 
> ...


 
Shimmie, if I had to highlight all the great points in your post, I'd have to highlight the entire post!!! Thank-you, Shimmie!! Once again, you tell the truth like it is!! Love ya!!!


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## Shimmie (Nov 22, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> Shimmie, if I had to highlight all the great points in your post, I'd have to highlight the entire post!!! Thank-you, Shimmie!! Once again, you tell the truth like it is!! Love ya!!!


Pebs, we both know this mess is not a game, but that's a whole other thread that the devil will dread.  

The fool may as well just give up...!  

Love you,


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## StrawberryQueen (Nov 22, 2006)

OT: I didn't know you were Haitian Pebbles.  I think 90% of the women here are Haitian.  Interesting.


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## pebbles (Nov 22, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> Pebs, we both know this mess is not a game, *but that's a whole other thread that the devil will dread. *
> 
> *The fool may as well just give up...!*
> 
> Love you,


 
Oh, I can't wait for the day he's finally shut up for good!!


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## pebbles (Nov 22, 2006)

StrawberryQueen said:
			
		

> OT: I didn't know you were Haitian Pebbles. I think 90% of the women here are Haitian. Interesting.


 
Yes, my parents are Haitian, though I was born and raised here.


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## Shimmie (Nov 22, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> Oh, I can't wait for the day he's finally shut up for good!!


I got first dibbs on stomping him first.    I'll race ya'...    Cause I've just about had enough of his mess!!!  

Pebs, what's that scripture that says, "...is this the one...the one who was causing all the trouble?  Pebs, he turned out to be a pip-squeak.


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## pebbles (Nov 22, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> *I got first dibbs on stomping him first.  I'll race ya'...*   Cause I've just about had enough of his mess!!!
> 
> Pebs, what's that scripture that says, "...is this the one...the one who was causing all the trouble? Pebs, he turned out to be a pip-squeak.


 
You're on! I've got a few scores to settle with that buster! LOL!!  

And won't that just be a mess if after Jesus strips him of all his power, he really does turn out to be some little pip-squeak?? I'll be really ticked off!!You'll have to hold me back from kicking him again!!


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## Shimmie (Nov 22, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> You're on! I've got a few scores to settle with that buster! LOL!!
> 
> And won't that just be a mess if after Jesus strips him of all his power, he really does turn out to be some little pip-squeak?? I'll be really ticked off!!You'll have to hold me back from kicking him again!!


Just in case he has some height, I may be short but I can leap and this fool better run.  As a matter of fact Jesus said to him, 'get thee behind me, satan.' (in other words, I've had enough of you).  

And the Bible does say the devil must flee.

Well to God and only God be the GLORY!  Praise Jesus forever and ever... Amen!


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## rozlips (Nov 22, 2006)

I'm not a nonbeliever, at least not in God and Jesus Christ. I AM most emphatically a nonbeliever in organized religion. I would be the last one to dismiss the power of ANYTHING. Goodness knows, I've seen stuff that leaves me baffled. I just believe in doing what works. If putting salt around your house, burning sage and having your house blessed helps you feel better, then by all means do so. But I also believe that a lot of these issues are psychomatic. Others fall in that 'unknown' or 'not proven' category. But I'd certainly never say there's no such thing as evil or evil practitioners in the world. 



			
				pebbles said:
			
		

> Unfortunately, for a nonbeliever, most of this is going to seem like it's "in the mind." Give them some meds and they'll be fine. I can't deny that for some people, that really is the case.


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## pebbles (Nov 22, 2006)

rozlips said:
			
		

> *I'm not a nonbeliever, at least not in God and Jesus Christ. I AM most emphatically a nonbeliever in organized religion.* I would be the last one to dismiss the power of ANYTHING. Goodness knows, I've seen stuff that leaves me baffled. I just believe in doing what works. If putting salt around your house, burning sage and having your house blessed helps you feel better, then by all means do so. But I also believe that a lot of these issues are psychomatic. Others fall in that 'unknown' or 'not proven' category. But I'd certainly never say there's no such thing as evil or evil practitioners in the world.


 
Ah! I stand corrected!!


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## ChasingBliss (Nov 22, 2006)

RavenIvygurl said:
			
		

> This is what my momma says.  She tells me crazy voodoo stories from Ghana.  Then she tells me not to pay attention to what she's saying b/c she doesn't even want my mind going there.



 This is my grandmother. I swear after she gets finished with one of her stories, I'm literally up all night, lights on, TV on, I swear I'm a big ole punk.


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## Shimmie (Nov 22, 2006)

HoneyLemonDrop said:
			
		

> This is my grandmother. I swear after she gets finished with one of her stories, I'm literally up all night, lights on, TV on, I swear I'm a big ole punk.


The devil is nothing to fear.  He cannot cross the Bloodline which protects those of us who are in Christ Jesus.   However, he is no one to be in alliance with, pitied or taken casually.  he's the devil and cannot be trusted...

However God will never fail us with His love and our trust in Him. 

Always remember this, Jesus is not subject to satan, satan is subject to Jesus.  Hence....Fear not...fear not, fear not.  These are soft and loving words that you can sleep on...lights out...TV off...Jesus on.  

{{{ Hugs }}}


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## Miss*Tress (Nov 23, 2006)

First mistake: a non-Christian posting in the Christian Fellowship forum. My bad. 

BTW, I'm not a practitioner or believer of voodoo either and never said I was, therefore our beliefs cannot part ways. 


			
				pebbles said:
			
		

> Respectfully, this is where our beliefs part ways. I'm well aware of voodoo and it's history and how it's used in Haitian culture, (being Haitian myself, and having personal experience with this stuff), perhaps more so than a lot of people here.
> 
> Anything, *anything* that can be used for "good" as well as evil is *not* of The Lord. The Lord does not allow His Power to be used to harm people as well as to help people. This suggests that The Lord can be manipulated, and therefore, if He can be manipulated He is not in full control and Sovereign over all. I know that many believe this is possible, but that's false. God is a Just and *Holy* God. And He does not give His Power over to be used for evil. Again, I urge people NOT to underestimate the power of the enemy, nor the length to which he will go to in an effort to distort and pervert the truth.
> 
> ...


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## Shimmie (Nov 23, 2006)

Miss*Tress said:
			
		

> First mistake: a non-Christian posting in the Christian Fellowship forum. My bad.
> 
> BTW, I'm not a practitioner or believer of voodoo either and never said I was, therefore our beliefs cannot part ways.


You're always welcome to post here. 

The issue of disagreement was the statement, 


> "voodoo can be used to do good", ....It's important to know this in order to understand that voodoo in and of itself is not evil.


which iit simply cannot.  Anything rooted in evil is indeed evil and it cannot be used for anything good.  God is not confused.  He is good and the devil is the evil one.  

God doesn't need the devil's assistance for anything.  All that satan and his voodoo can do is 'impersonate' so why would one choose a fake...in obtaining good. 

It is fully established that 'Evil Cannot Triumph over Good." 

So regarding the response to your post, that's where the differnce is...okay?    For I also responded to the same.   

We're glad to have you, for your post presented a crucial point which needed to be addressed.  

"Happy and Blessed Thanksgiving"


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

HoneyLemonDrop said:
			
		

> This is my grandmother. I swear after she gets finished with one of her stories, I'm literally up all night, lights on, TV on, I swear I'm a big ole punk.


 
LOL! Girl, you ain't scared for no reason!! Some of those stories are scary! 
But as Shimmie said, he can't cross the Bloodline of Christ.


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

Miss*Tress said:
			
		

> *First mistake: a non-Christian posting in the Christian Fellowship forum. My bad.*
> 
> BTW, I'm not a practitioner or believer of voodoo either and never said I was, therefore our beliefs cannot part ways.


 
It wasn't a mistake for you to post here. I don't want you to feel that way. However you made a comment that I could not ignore:

"ETA: _*Like many non-monotheistic beliefs, voodoo can be used to do good or it can be used to do bad. When voodoo is used to do evil, the belief is that the evil-doer will and must bear the consequences of their evil acts. It's important to know this in order to understand that voodoo in and of itself is not evil." *_

I really was going to let that comment go, but The Lord rebuked me for it. I had to speak up and tell the truth about this. I'm not speaking against you, _*I'm speaking against voodoo*_, and calling it what it really is, which is a method of evil disguised as something that is generally good, but that some people use for evil. 

Nothing in your previous post suggested that you were a practioner of voodoo, so I didn't assume that you were. You said you looked into voodoo, and I assumed that you, yourself, believed that voodoo in and of itself is basically a good thing, after studying about it. Therefore I was saying that if you believe that voodoo is really a tool that is good that some people used for evil, *this* is where our beliefs part ways. If you hadn't mentioned that you weren't Christian in this post, I never would have known. 

I can tell you first hand that in Haiti, over 80% of the population is Christian, yet of that number of Christians, an unbelievably high percentage of them practice voodoo as well. The lines have been greatly blurred, and too many people believe this is fine to do since it's another "avenue" to reach God.

Yet the word of God is so clear: in Matthew 6:24 it says that we cannot serve two masters, no matter what that other master is, be it money, or another belief in another power, etc. It cannot be done. And Acts 4:12 clearly states: "_There is salvation in none other, for neither is there any other name under heaven, that is given among men, by which we must be saved!" _So any mass or ceremony where you have all these different "entities" being called upon, (and I won't even mention any of their names), is something I want my Christian sisters to be on the alert for. If the name of Jesus is not being called in prayer and on bended knee, run! You are in a place you *don't* want to be! 

I hope I cleared up any confussion. This is a great discussion, and really, I'm glad you brought that point up.  I think it needed to be addressed, anyway. 

Happy Thanksgiving! Be blessed!!


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> You're always welcome to post here.
> 
> The issue of disagreement was the statement,
> 
> ...


 
Thank-you, Shimmie!! I can always count on you to have my back!


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## DragonPearl (Nov 23, 2006)

I was born and raised in Haiti.  And yes, I heard stories too...  

Coming from a strictly Roman Catholic family that was against voodoo, I never practiced it, so for me, it's all hearsay.  Unless I witnessed a ceremony where a hex was put on someone, and then soon after witnessed that someone coming down with a particular unexplained and uncurable illness, it is still not proven to me that a person got ill due to the power of voodoo alone.  Now, as for the power of the mind that believes in voodoo being real, I am sure if you tell a Haitian who believes that voodoo is powerful that they've been hexed, they are more likely to come down with an illness.  Such is the power of the mind. 

The problem that I have with the Voodoo has REAL powers is this:

Considering how many Haitians practice voodoo (the good stuff or the bad stuff however you want to call it) how come most of them are so poor?  If voodoo was so powerful, Haiti should be one of the most powerful countries on the face of the earth.


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

Jessy55 said:
			
		

> I was born and raised in Haiti. And yes, I heard stories too...
> 
> Coming from a strictly Roman Catholic family that was against voodoo, I never practiced it, so for me, it's all hearsay. Unless I witnessed a ceremony where a hex was put on someone, and then soon after witnessed that someone coming down with a particular unexplained and uncurable illness, it is still not proven to me that a person got ill due to the power of voodoo alone. Now, as for the power of the mind that believes in voodoo being real, I am sure if you tell a Haitian who believes that voodoo is powerful that they've been hexed, they are more likely to come down with an illness. Such is the power of the mind.
> 
> ...


 
More accurately, if voodoo was really giving God the glory, the country and it's people would be blessed and prosperous. The state of the country alone should tell people that they need to repent and turn from their ways, but I guess it's hard to accept the truth, even if it's staring you in the face.   But voodoo isn't just something done in Haiti. I don't want people to get that impression. It's really spread everywhere.


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## DragonPearl (Nov 23, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> More accurately, if voodoo was really giving God the glory, the country and it's people would be blessed and prosperous. The state of the country alone should tell people that they need to repent and turn from their ways, but I guess it's hard to accept the truth, even if it's staring you in the face.   But voodoo isn't just something done in Haiti. I don't want people to get that impression. It's really spread everywhere.



Yes, voodoo isn'st just something done in Haiti.  It is also done in Cuba, in Brazil, and in many other countries... none of which are in the mess we are.   I only used Haiti because this is where I grew up and I voodoo stories/tales are part of the fabric of life there.

I am not sure that we can blame the state of the country on voodoo as the main problem.  There are so many factors that contribute to making Haiti what it is...  I love my country of birth, but there are many negative things in the culture that I have look at and say wtf?  For instance,   I was trying to sing some nursery rhymes for my girlfriend's new baby boy, and when I began singing the Haitian song "do do ti titit maman", I paid attention to the words and I had to stop.  Then I tried singing "ti zuazo kote ou prale" then the same thing happened, so I had to stop again.  Haitian nursery rhymes are a bloody mess.


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## Shimmie (Nov 23, 2006)

Jessy55 said:
			
		

> I was born and raised in Haiti. And yes, I heard stories too...
> 
> Coming from a strictly Roman Catholic family that was against voodoo, I never practiced it, so for me, it's all hearsay. Unless I witnessed a ceremony where a hex was put on someone, and then soon after witnessed that someone coming down with a particular unexplained and uncurable illness, it is still not proven to me that a person got ill due to the power of voodoo alone. Now, as for the power of the mind that believes in voodoo being real, I am sure if you tell a Haitian who believes that voodoo is powerful that they've been hexed, they are more likely to come down with an illness. Such is the power of the mind.
> 
> ...


 
Because of its origin.  Good can never come of evil.  Evil works are 'dead' works, and if something is dead it cannot produce life or anything that pertains to it.  

In the Bible, there are several accounts of famine and destruction which came upon the lands of those who chose other Gods.  satan, himself is hindering progress, by invitation.   

Haiti is not the only area who uses Voodoo; neither is Haiti the culprit or the ring leader; it's more widespread than we realize.  Haiti is also not in its condition only because of Voodoo as there are those in authority, the same as here in the US, where government rule has hindered progress.  The perfect example here is "Katrina."  Look at the inner cities of the US, the endless neighborhoods and regions which look like a war zone.

I do know this, with or without money those who truly allow God to be their God have every provision fulfilled one miracle after another.


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

LOL! Oh my goodness, aren't those nursery rhymes a mess?? 

Not for one moment would I say that voodoo is mainly to blame for the state of the country. There are many contributing factors to why the country is in the state that it's in. But to me, the voodoo doesn't help. I would love to see people turn away from voodoo in large numbers and dedicate the country and it's leaders to the Lordship of Jesus Christ. I believe it would make a big difference.


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> *Because of its origin. Good can never come of evil. Evil works are 'dead' works, and if something is dead it cannot produce life or anything that pertains to it. *
> 
> *In the Bible, there are several accounts of famine and destruction which came upon the lands of those who chose other Gods. satan, himself is hindering progress, by invitation. *
> 
> ...


 
Great points, Shimmie!!


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## Shimmie (Nov 23, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> Great points, Shimmie!!


 
Thanks Pebs.   I hope this thread stays open for a while.  Exposing the enemy in this area is *much* needed.   

I've noticed that you ane I have been on the same flow, post per post; and before I've read many of your replies. (And that's only because my Internet connection is slower, due to Dial-up).  Yet it proves that God has us, One in the Spirit and same Heart, same Holy Ghost. To God be the Glory.


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> Thanks Pebs.  I hope this thread stays open for a while. Exposing the enemy in this area is *much* needed.
> 
> I've noticed that you ane I have been on the same flow, post per post; and before I've read many of your replies. (And that's only because my Internet connection is slower, due to Dial-up). *Yet it proves that God has us, One in the Spirit and same Heart, same Holy Ghost. To God be the Glory. *


 
Yes, One in the Spirit, same Heart, same Holy Ghost. That's how God works. To God be the Glory!!


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## rozlips (Nov 23, 2006)

> Haitian nursery rhymes are a bloody mess.



Nursery rhymes in general are a mess!  I don't know any Haitian ones, but I've had to 'reconfigure' songs and prayers for my son. "If I should die before I wake..." Who the hell wants to say that to their kid before he goes to sleep?


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## pebbles (Nov 23, 2006)

rozlips said:
			
		

> Nursery rhymes in general are a mess!  I don't know any Haitian ones, but I've had to 'reconfigure' songs and prayers for my son. "If I should die before I wake..." Who the hell wants to say that to their kid before he goes to sleep?


 
HA! One of the lines in the nursery rhymes Jessy was talking about says, "if you don't go to sleep, the monster will eat you. If you don't go to sleep the monster will eat you." How would you like to sing that mess to your kid?  Not a chance!


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## rozlips (Nov 23, 2006)

Aren't children a miracle of resiliency? Little wonder we didn't all grow up to be serial killers.


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## Shimmie (Nov 23, 2006)

rozlips said:
			
		

> Aren't children a miracle of resiliency? Little wonder we didn't all grow up to be serial killers.


 
Yes we are resilient.  What about Rock-a-bye Baby?  

Who in their right mind would place their baby in a tree-top?  And it doesn't say 'if' the bough breaks...it says 'when' the bough breaks.   Ummm, sounds like reckless endangerment.  Where was Child Protective Services when these lulabies were written...  

A baby eagle in a tree...yes.   But a baby of ours...Oh no, not my baby.


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## baby42 (Nov 23, 2006)

i just stay pray up and dont even deal with people who deal with the dark side to mess with that is a fast track to hell i knew a lady who told me she  could stop my ex from stop drinking   i told her i knew how to stop him  from drinking around me too  i took my 6kids and left and never look back there nothing god can not do he got me out of there


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## Shimmie (Nov 23, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> HA! One of the lines in the nursery rhymes Jessy was talking about says, "if you don't go to sleep, the monster will eat you. If you don't go to sleep the monster will eat you." How would you like to sing that mess to your kid? Not a chance!


This is not just in Haiti.   When we were little, we never went right to sleep...we played, we fussed, we giggled, we jumped around on the beds -- you know how it was.     And we'd hear a yell from downstairs from our parents, "You better go to sleep or the boogey man will get you." 

Fast forwarding Shimmie's sleep pattern to now:  

Let's just say this...when my head hits the pillow, I'm out.


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## pebbles (Nov 24, 2006)

rozlips said:
			
		

> Aren't children a miracle of resiliency? Little wonder we didn't all grow up to be serial killers.


 
LOL!!  You got that right!


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## pebbles (Nov 24, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> Yes we are resilient. What about Rock-a-bye Baby?
> 
> Who in their right mind would place their baby in a tree-top? And it doesn't say 'if' the bough breaks...it says 'when' the bough breaks. *Ummm, sounds like reckless endangerment. Where was Child Protective Services when these lulabies were written...*
> 
> A baby eagle in a tree...yes. But a baby of ours...Oh no, not my baby.


 
Oh my, how is it that I never paid attention to these nursery rhymes? Bad mommy! LOL!   Seriously though, I never sang them to my boys. The song my mom always liked to sing to them and that I sang to them as well was "Yes, Jesus loves me." Thank God for my mother! She set the standard for me to follow. Otherwise. . .


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## pebbles (Nov 24, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> This is not just in Haiti. When we were little, we never went right to sleep...we played, we fussed, we giggled, we jumped around on the beds -- you know how it was.  And we'd hear a yell from downstairs from our parents, "You better go to sleep or the boogey man will get you."
> 
> *Fast forwarding Shimmie's sleep pattern to now:*
> 
> *Let's just say this...when my head hits the pillow, I'm out.*


 
Amen to that! That's me, too!


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## Shimmie (Nov 24, 2006)

pebbles said:
			
		

> Oh my, how is it that I never paid attention to these nursery rhymes? Bad mommy! LOL!  Seriously though, I never sang them to my boys. The song my mom always liked to sing to them and that I sang to them as well was "Yes, Jesus loves me." Thank God for my mother! She set the standard for me to follow. Otherwise. . .


 
Jesus loves me....this I know.  For the Bible tells me so.  
Little ones to Him belong, we are weak, but He is strong.

Yes, Jesus loves me, Yes, Jesus loves me, 
Yes, Jesus loves me, 

For the Bible, tells me so.....

Amen, Pebs.   Shimmie sings it too.   I just did, especially for you. 

If you look at these words of the song, your can see how it is by our parents' profession of faith and love, we've always been covered under His everlasting Covenant of Blood; where satan, dare not cross it.  

Day after day and night after night, they 'spoke' it over us in song -- God's annointing and covering over us.  They made a perpetual degree and the devil had to flee, because of  Jesus.   Amen and Amen.


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## rozlips (Nov 25, 2006)

Girl, its a trip! And why we got to drown Indians in One Little Two Little Three Little Indians? Its a good beat and does teach kids to count, so...Remix. One Little Two Little Three Little Froggies. I figure if the froggies fall off the log they can swim.  

And of the prayer is now, Angels watch me through the night and keep me in their blessed sight. 

I doubt this makes much difference, but I certainly feel better. 



			
				pebbles said:
			
		

> Oh my, how is it that I never paid attention to these nursery rhymes? Bad mommy! LOL!   Seriously though, I never sang them to my boys. The song my mom always liked to sing to them and that I sang to them as well was "Yes, Jesus loves me." Thank God for my mother! She set the standard for me to follow. Otherwise. . .


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## pebbles (Nov 25, 2006)

rozlips said:
			
		

> *Girl, its a trip! And why we got to drown Indians in One Little Two Little Three Little Indians? Its a good beat and does teach kids to count, so...Remix. One Little Two Little Three Little Froggies. I figure if the froggies fall off the log they can swim. *
> 
> And of the prayer is now, Angels watch me through the night and keep me in their blessed sight.
> 
> I doubt this makes much difference, but I certainly feel better.


 
Oh my goodness, another twisted nursery rhyme! LOL! Honestly, I never really paid close attention to any of the lyrics. Thank God for revelation!


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## Lucia (Nov 26, 2006)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> Jesus loves me....this I know. For the Bible tells me so.
> Little ones to Him belong, *we are weak, but He is strong*.
> 
> Yes, Jesus loves me, Yes, Jesus loves me,
> ...


 
I have to point this out, yes we should be god loving, but not fearing and we should not beleive that we are weak, God created us in HIS image.


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## Shimmie (Nov 26, 2006)

Lucia said:
			
		

> I have to point this out, yes we should be god loving, but not fearing and we should not beleive that we are weak, God created us in HIS image.


 
Here Darlin'  

*I Corinthians 1:25* 

Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the *WEAKNESS* of God is stronger than men. 

*I Corinthians 2: 3* 

And I was with you in *WEAKNESS*, and in fear, and in much trembling. 

*2 Corinthians 12:9* 

And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in *WEAKNESS*. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 

As for fear...we better 'fear' God.  Fear in the sense of reverence and honor unto to Him.  He's God and there is no other. 

And yes, we are made in His image, but we are not Him nor can we overcome or challenge Him.   

I am also made in the express image of my mom and dad....Uh, let me cross them the wrong way.  I then belong to my 'mama.'..... 

Blessings Lucia...


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## Lucia (Nov 26, 2006)

thanks Shimmie, 
I get what the quotes are saying but i just don't like the idea of having to be weak and useless, but myabe I'm exaggerating what the text means.


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## smitmarv (Feb 22, 2007)

What has set me free in my spiritual life is focusing on Jesus instead of the devil and his ways.  Quit giving him the time of day and you will be amazed at how your relationship with the Lord grows.  I don't believe anyone can do anything to you unless God allows them to.  (Look at 9-11 for example, only God allowed that to happen or it would have happened a long time ago.  Time for us to wake up).  If we live for God and quit blaming everything that goes wrong in our life on the devil we will be set free and we won't need to live in fear of the devil and his ways.

I have come into the Hebrew roots of my Christian faith and it has set me free from always looking over my shoulder in case the devil is trying to get me.  I have learned to look at the Bible and life from a Hebrew prospective because Jesus was a Hebrew and so was almost everyone else who wrote the Bible.  The western mindest or Greek mindset has allowed us to be taken captive by these things.  

I know the devil is real and he can show some signs through voodoo and other practices that people do but there is no REAL power there in the end.  If we "LIVE" for God then we have nothing to fear from evil doers.  And even so, to leave this body is to be present with the Lord.  But God has a purpose for our lives and for this earth so we should not be so quick to try and escape it (another western mindset).  Focus on God and not these type of things.


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## StrawberryQueen (Feb 22, 2007)

smitmarv said:
			
		

> What has set me free in my spiritual life is focusing on Jesus instead of the devil and his ways.  Quit giving him the time of day and you will be amazed at how your relationship with the Lord grows.  I don't believe anyone can do anything to you unless God allows them to.  (Look at 9-11 for example, only God allowed that to happen or it would have happened a long time ago.  Time for us to wake up).  If we live for God and quit blaming everything that goes wrong in our life on the devil we will be set free and we won't need to live in fear of the devil and his ways.
> 
> I have come into the Hebrew roots of my Christian faith and it has set me free from always looking over my shoulder in case the devil is trying to get me.  I have learned to look at the Bible and life from a Hebrew prospective because Jesus was a Hebrew and so was almost everyone else who wrote the Bible.  The western mindest or Greek mindset has allowed us to be taken captive by these things.
> 
> I know the devil is real and he can show some signs through voodoo and other practices that people do but there is no REAL power there in the end.  If we "LIVE" for God then we have nothing to fear from evil doers.  And even so, to leave this body is to be present with the Lord.  But God has a purpose for our lives and for this earth so we should not be so quick to try and escape it (another western mindset).  Focus on God and not these type of things.


How do you go about learning the Hebrew roots of the Bible?


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## smitmarv (Feb 23, 2007)

StrawberryQueen said:
			
		

> How do you go about learning the Hebrew roots of the Bible?



Well my husband and I use to go to this really great church and we loved it but I always felt like there had to be more.  We had been in Bible College for years at the Church and we were very involved.  Then they had the option of taking the regular class for Bible college or this other class called "The Hebrew Roots of the Christian Faith".  At that time we were planning to move to Arizona soon but after the first class of Hebrew Roots, my husband and I looked at each other and said "Were not going anywhere!"  It was amazing!  We learned more in that one semester then all the time in Bible College and my whole life in the Church combined!

I'm sure we have all felt that at times the Bible seemed to contradict itself and that is because we are looking at the Bible through Western eyes and not Hebrew eyes.  When you start to understand that the WHOLE Bible is suppose to have meaning to us and not just the last half.  When you learn the history as to why there is that little piece of paper in the middle of our Bible that says "New Testament".  Which keeps the Jews reading only the first half and the Christians only reading the second half.  And if we do read the first half we don't see Jesus in it and it is just history or nice stories to us.  When you come into the Hebrew Root of the Christian Faith then you can clearly see that the Old Testament is look towards the Cross where as we are looking back at the Cross and Jesus is through the WHOLE Bible.

Haven't you ever wondered why Jews seem to be the hardest people to get saved?  It is because the church has left the Hebrew Roots of the Bible due to anti-simitism all the way back at 300 A.D. with Constantine.  Since Christians can't see Jesus in the Old Testament then neither can the Jews.  

Check out www.Torah.tv.  My husband and I have been going to this congregation for the last 6 going on 7 years.  He is the best teacher by far of the Hebrew Root that I have ever seen and I have seen a lot of them.  Learning the Hebrew Roots helps you learn more about your God and we need to remember that the Bible was written by Jews and that Jesus was a Jew.  We understand the certain foreigner think different from us and yet we only go back to the Greek to do deep studies of the Bible.  Greeks and Hebrews don't really think very much a like and that is where a lot of misunderstanding and different interpretations come from when it comes to the Bible.  I still have a lot to learn and it is very exciting.

I hope that makes since.  

God Bless.


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## PrincessDiva (Feb 23, 2007)

chocomom said:
			
		

> My mother-in-law, devout Catholic, was almost struck down with Voodoo. She has never believed in it until that time. At all. In fact, she really took it for a joke. After her experience, she won't sleep on it again.



It is REAL & You do NOT have to believe in it for it to work.  I will say that if you are covered by the Blood of Jesus it will not be as effective ( It may not affect you but can cause chaos around you & those you love) Many people believe that this is harmless but it is not. The people asking for this must realize that in every spiritual sin a sacrafice MUST be made & THEY pay the consequences sooner or later .  Believe me it is Never worth the sacrafice that must be made. For any Christians that don't belive please read HE CAME TO SET THE CAPTIVES FREE....


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## StrawberryQueen (Feb 23, 2007)

smitmarv said:
			
		

> Well my husband and I use to go to this really great church and we loved it but I always felt like there had to be more.  We had been in Bible College for years at the Church and we were very involved.  Then they had the option of taking the regular class for Bible college or this other class called "The Hebrew Roots of the Christian Faith".  At that time we were planning to move to Arizona soon but after the first class of Hebrew Roots, my husband and I looked at each other and said "Were not going anywhere!"  It was amazing!  We learned more in that one semester then all the time in Bible College and my whole life in the Church combined!
> 
> I'm sure we have all felt that at times the Bible seemed to contradict itself and that is because we are looking at the Bible through Western eyes and not Hebrew eyes.  When you start to understand that the WHOLE Bible is suppose to have meaning to us and not just the last half.  When you learn the history as to why there is that little piece of paper in the middle of our Bible that says "New Testament".  Which keeps the Jews reading only the first half and the Christians only reading the second half.  And if we do read the first half we don't see Jesus in it and it is just history or nice stories to us.  When you come into the Hebrew Root of the Christian Faith then you can clearly see that the Old Testament is look towards the Cross where as we are looking back at the Cross and Jesus is through the WHOLE Bible.
> 
> ...


THANK YOU!


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## Cichelle (Feb 23, 2007)

smitmarv said:
			
		

> Well my husband and I use to go to this really great church and we loved it but I always felt like there had to be more.  We had been in Bible College for years at the Church and we were very involved.  Then they had the option of taking the regular class for Bible college or this other class called "The Hebrew Roots of the Christian Faith".  At that time we were planning to move to Arizona soon but after the first class of Hebrew Roots, my husband and I looked at each other and said "Were not going anywhere!"  It was amazing!  We learned more in that one semester then all the time in Bible College and my whole life in the Church combined!
> 
> I'm sure we have all felt that at times the Bible seemed to contradict itself and that is because we are looking at the Bible through Western eyes and not Hebrew eyes.  When you start to understand that the WHOLE Bible is suppose to have meaning to us and not just the last half.  When you learn the history as to why there is that little piece of paper in the middle of our Bible that says "New Testament".  Which keeps the Jews reading only the first half and the Christians only reading the second half.  And if we do read the first half we don't see Jesus in it and it is just history or nice stories to us.  When you come into the Hebrew Root of the Christian Faith then you can clearly see that the Old Testament is look towards the Cross where as we are looking back at the Cross and Jesus is through the WHOLE Bible.
> 
> ...



Blessings on your journey.

As to the bolded part, you are misunderstanding Judaism and why many Jews reject Jsus/Christianity.


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## smitmarv (Feb 23, 2007)

Cichelle said:
			
		

> Blessings on your journey.
> 
> As to the bolded part, you are misunderstanding Judaism and why many Jews reject Jsus/Christianity.



I know this is only a small part of the reason, but from a Christian perspective they can never seem to explain why Jesus is the Messiah because they reject to Torah.  I know a lot has happened in history and that is the bigger reason why for Jews.  Thank you for your blessings.  I have been so blessed.


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## StrawberryQueen (Feb 23, 2007)

smitmarv said:
			
		

> I know this is only a small part of the reason, but from a Christian perspective they can never seem to explain why Jesus is the Messiah because they reject to Torah.  I know a lot has happened in history and that is the bigger reason why for Jews.  Thank you for your blessings.  I have been so blessed.


Well I won't speak for any Jews, but I think they do not believe Jesus is the Messiah b/c he did not fulfill the requirements/expectations of what their Messah was supposed to do/be. 

Correct me if I'm wrong-please


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## snugglez41685 (Feb 23, 2007)

StrawberryQueen said:
			
		

> Well I won't speak for any Jews, but I think they do not believe Jesus is the Messiah b/c he did not fulfill the requirements/expectations of what their Messah was supposed to do/be.
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong-please



I am a Jew and as far as I know that isn't the reason. I can't remember the reason  because I was so young and  my Grandmother had paased away. I'll find out for you though.


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## snugglez41685 (Feb 23, 2007)

And I believe "things exist with or without you" in regards to the voodoo.


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## Cichelle (Feb 24, 2007)

StrawberryQueen said:
			
		

> Well I won't speak for any Jews, but I think they do not believe Jesus is the Messiah b/c he did not fulfill the requirements/expectations of what their Messah was supposed to do/be.
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong-please



You are not wrong.  

There are other reasons, but that is a huge one. Additionally, many Jews of the "non-convertible" variety have a solid Jewish education and a good knowledge of Hebrew (modern and biblical) and history. We know very well what Torah does and does not say and what is or isn't in it. But this is OT. I apologize.

On topic: I haven't read this whole thread, but I think the mind is very powerful and therefore the power of voodoo and black magic would differ amongst people. 

I once read an article that talked about how when outsiders fear a certain group it can lead to victimization. It actually compared Judaism and Haitian voodoo somehow....and I believe, the relationship with Christianity. If I can find it, I'll link it later.

ETA: http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~haeber/voodoo-jews.html


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## baby42 (Feb 24, 2007)

4everblessed said:
			
		

> Yes, voodoo is real but it's nothing compared to the blood of Jesus.


 and stay pray up all the time


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## AmyInAtl (Apr 27, 2008)

It exists, but GOD is Most High. Nothing can happen, but by His leave.
There are prayers, one can say to prevent this and all afflictions.
You can PM me, if you want. I don't mind sharing prayers.


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## Caramela (Apr 29, 2008)

I think that it is real and exists. Isn't it Newton's law that says for every action there is an equal reaction? Or something like that. Or is it Ying & Yang I'm thinking of? .... hmmmm well whatever it is, I believe that for every good there's and equal evil, for dark an equal light, for every up an equal down. So yes it exists, but as a Christian we must not handle it... _touch not, taste not, handle not_... Col 2:21


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## carcajada (Apr 30, 2008)

Caramela said:


> I think that it is real and exists. *Isn't it Newton's law that says for every action there is an equal reaction?* Or something like that. Or is it Ying & Yang I'm thinking of? .... hmmmm well whatever it is, I believe that for every good there's and equal evil, for dark an equal light, for every up an equal down. So yes it exists, but as a Christian we must not handle it... _touch not, taste not, handle not_... Col 2:21



You are correct. That's Newton's 3rd Law.

To expand on what you said: I've already shared my voodoo story on the off topic forum and I learned that you must be where you need to be spiritually in order for that stuff not to affect you. Unfortunately, I was not and people who do not guard themselves with their own beliefs and faith will be susceptible to outside those forces.


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## metamorfhosis (Apr 30, 2008)

I dated a guy awhile ago and he seemed miserable. He told me one day that a woman he used to date put a "root" on him. I was like huh? So he told me that he was going to a warlock to get it taken off. 

I wasn't saved at the time. I had heard of witches but that was from the tv show _Bewitched._ 

He went to the warlock to get the root taken off BUT he was still miserable. Just from my personal experience, I didn't experience true joy until I experienced the love of GOD.


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## divya (Apr 30, 2008)

Voodoo is real for those who meddle in it.  But when we have our hearts and minds on Jesus, it is powerless. Our God is the God above all gods.


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## Afrobuttafly (Jun 8, 2008)

Simply put.. Deuteronomy 18: 10-12 says "There should not be found in you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, anyone who employs divination, a practicer of magic or anyone who looks for omens or a sorcerer,  or one who binds others with a spell or anyone who consults a spirit medium or a professional foreteller of events or anyone who inquires of the dead. For everybody doing these things is something detestable to Jehovah, and on account of these detestable things Jehovah your God is driving them away from before you."

So if these things did not exist and exert power why would we be warned against them? God himself acknowledges Satan has power. Anyone recall the account of Job where Satan was allowed to test Job to the full. Satan controlled the elements causing a storm and had Jobs' children killed at sea plus more. He is a spirit, superhuman. Not more powerful than the Almighty as mentioned, but he does have power and people can channel it if they submit to him. Through his power many things can happen..sometimes the y appear beneficial such as predicting lottery numbers and sometimes they are obviously evil. Do not be too naive...but do not fear him either because if you call on the ONE greater than he is The father specifically Jehovah, he will flee from you.


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## silvergirl (Jun 13, 2008)

voodoo, white/black magick are all very real


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## GV-NA-GI-TLV-GE-I (Mar 31, 2009)

MzNeekie said:


> Simply put.. Deuteronomy 18: 10-12 says "There should not be found in you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, anyone who employs divination, a practicer of magic or anyone who looks for omens or a sorcerer, or one who binds others with a spell or anyone who consults a spirit medium or a professional foreteller of events or anyone who inquires of the dead. For everybody doing these things is something detestable to Jehovah, and on account of these detestable things Jehovah your God is driving them away from before you."
> 
> *So if these things did not exist and exert power why would we be warned against them? *God himself acknowledges Satan has power. Anyone recall the account of Job where Satan was allowed to test Job to the full. Satan controlled the elements causing a storm and had Jobs' children killed at sea plus more. He is a spirit, superhuman. Not more powerful than the Almighty as mentioned, but he does have power and people can channel it if they submit to him. *Through his power many things can happen..sometimes the y appear beneficial such as predicting lottery numbers and sometimes they are obviously evil.* Do not be too naive...but do not fear him either because if you call on the ONE greater than he is The father specifically Jehovah, he will flee from you.


 

I have to tell a story and I hope and pray I do not scare anyone.  I lived in the Caribbean and for anyone to say it's not real there, they're lying, honestly.  They know.  I had a neighbor who ran a pension (student housing) down the corner from me.  My best friend took a room with her but I didn't want to because I had gotten my own kitchenette.  The lady started giving me evil looks and I felt something was wrong.  When I visited my bff there, she was just glaring at me...I took the hint and didn't come around inside anymore.  Just waited for my friend outside when we wanted to go somewhere.  

Things began happening to us in very strange ways.  I lost all my book money - something impossible for me.  Left my money in the ladies bathroom.  Just mindlessness.  Accidents and other unfortunate things were happening all over the place to me and my friend and suddenly.  One evening, when I was walking her down the street to the pension, we just stopped and prayed and asked G-d to protect us because something was not right.  We felt we needed to.  All those bad things ceased.  

It wasn't 2 weeks later that I later learned from the other students there that this woman dabbled in the occult, in black magic or something like it.  She had children!!!  Looked like a nice christian lady with a lovely home.  Some of the girls left.  

Another time in summer, I lived elsewhere when my family was remodeling and wasn't going to have students.  This lady was a military person.  The only available space was a bunk in her room.  The house was full.  

One evening, she was explaining to me about her Silva mind control.  I was like, erplexed  Okay.  But I wasn't interested.  We were conversing like normal and when I looked around at her...she had instantly fallen into  a very deep sleep with a glassy look on her face...she had gone to another plane.  I kid you not.  Out of mind experiences.  She was altering her conscience.  I felt instant evil.

Later that night, I was awakened to something shaking the bunk bed and it happened twice.  I also heard growling little voices in my ears.  I sat up and looked out the hurricane window and there was a black cat slyly walking away on its hind legs .  I picked up a rosary hanging above and started praying the Our Father.  It went away.   I told one of the girls about some strange happenings later and learned that not only she but another girl were witches, in that very house.  Oy vey.  When my family came back...I ran to them!!!!  They prayed the rosary nightly.  Very holy family.  

That stuff is evil, ugly and real.  But it's another level in the Caribbean and Africa.  However,  G-d is more powerful.  It doesn't mean, though, that one will be untouched by evil.  But I have seen evil things and I have experienced very holy things.  I prefer the holy.  

Moral?  If you learn of something about someone like that, get moving fast.  Do not delay.  Pray without ceasing.  Most of all, trust in Creator!!!


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## Afrobuttafly (Apr 1, 2009)

GV-NA-GI-TLV-GE-I said:


> I have to tell a story and I hope and pray I do not scare anyone.  I lived in the Caribbean and for anyone to say it's not real there, they're lying, honestly.  They know.  I had a neighbor who ran a pension (student housing) down the corner from me.  My best friend took a room with her but I didn't want to because I had gotten my own kitchenette.  The lady started giving me evil looks and I felt something was wrong.  When I visited my bff there, she was just glaring at me...I took the hint and didn't come around inside anymore.  Just waited for my friend outside when we wanted to go somewhere.
> 
> Things began happening to us in very strange ways.  I lost all my book money - something impossible for me.  Left my money in the ladies bathroom.  Just mindlessness.  Accidents and other unfortunate things were happening all over the place to me and my friend and suddenly.  One evening, when I was walking her down the street to the pension, we just stopped and prayed and asked G-d to protect us because something was not right.  We felt we needed to.  All those bad things ceased.
> 
> ...



OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Many people have had similar and even worse experiences with people who submit to the Devil's power and even Demons themselves! My mother has been bothered by them at least twice that I know of. One time I was asleep and the 2nd time she was in the hospital and I wasn't there. But I have gotten an eerie feeling many times before and sometimes I hear sounds that I convince myself are just normal..but I say Jehovah's name anyway JUST IN CASE and I have no problems after that. Ugh I can't stand them..can you imagine being in the presence of a superhuman being that is just pure evil inside and out, who has the power to do terrible things to you?  I hope I NEVER have the displeasure. Some people have been physically and even sexually assaulted by them, not knowing what they are or how to stop them. I'm telling you, if you even think something's not right say Jehovah repeatedly..go around ur house and say it if you have to so they can leave you alone. This is no joke.


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## cutiebe2 (Jan 19, 2010)

Voodoo is not "black magic" or evil

evil is evil
Voodoo has been propagandized to be an evil religion. Why? Because colonialist wanted to make sure that we thought everything that came from Africa was evil and bad. Voodoo is the religion of our ancestors. If you know what it really it you will not attack it.

To be clear, I am a Christian, and I do not participate in Voodoo. It is present in every place where there are African diaspora...from Lousiana to Venezuela and it makes my heart break to hear how there people had to hide in secret and were beaten for practicing what they believe it.

Black magic on the other hand is evil...but I don't know much about it. I have never come across it


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## Shimmie (Jan 19, 2010)

cutiebe2 said:


> *Voodoo is not "black magic" or evil*
> 
> *evil is evil*
> 
> ...


 
Cutiebe2......  :Rose:

It's one in the same. voodoo, black magic, whatever folks want to call it, it's all one in the same and it's *'ALL*' evil.    Yes, sweetheart, it's all evil. 

I grieve for those who have 'suffered' from it's practice and we cannot blame the colonists for voodoo's preception.  It is an evil practice and those who participate in it will reap what they sow, which unfortunately is evil.   It's God's law, that every 'seed' produces after it's own kind. 

Just because we are 'Christians', we cannot ignore what's true.  God does not practice voodoo, nor any other works of darkness, which again, is what voodoo is, works of darkness.    

Nothing can clean it up; nothing.   Folks can disagree until Jesus comes, and the facts will never change.   voodoo is an evil work of darkness and you will never see it approved by God. 

Angel, it is what it is...'evil'.  

Yet it cannot triumph over God, neither the Blood of Jesus.  It cannot cross the 'Bloodline' of our Lord Jesus Christ.   Bless His Holy Name, Forever, Jesus!   Praise, Praise Him, forevermore.


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## cutiebe2 (Jan 19, 2010)

Shimmie said:


> Cutiebe2......  :Rose:
> 
> It's one in the same. voodoo, black magic, whatever folks want to call it, it's all one in the same and it's *'ALL*' evil.    Yes, sweetheart, it's all evil.
> 
> ...



Of course God will never approve Voodoo..its not the same religion. Again, I will not call Voodoo evil. I just put it in a basket with every other religion that is out there. Again, its not my religion. If I say that Voodoo is evil then I would have to say the Judiasm, Hinduism, Islam, etc is too (which they are not)..because my exposure and knowledge about Voodoo has not been far off from the exposure of other religions. But again, since I don't practice the religions they don't apply to me. I just respectfully keep my distance...


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## cutiebe2 (Jan 19, 2010)

Shimmie said:


> I grieve for those who have 'suffered' from it's practice and we cannot blame the colonists for voodoo's preception.  *It is an evil practice and those who participate in it will reap what they sow, which unfortunately is evil.*   It's God's law, that every 'seed' produces after it's own kind.
> 
> J



Also, we need to be very carefully of the statements we make like this. Unfortunately, the first place people point to Voodoo is Haiti, even thought its practiced in tons of other sites, including the US. Now people are saying Haiti is suffering because of Voodoo which is hurtful lies. You wouldn't believe the number of times I have heard people say this. People take what we say and use it how they please


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## Shimmie (Jan 20, 2010)

cutiebe2 said:


> Also, we need to be very carefully of the statements we make like this. Unfortunately, the first place people point to Voodoo is Haiti, even thought its practiced in tons of other sites, including the US. Now people are saying Haiti is suffering because of Voodoo which is hurtful lies. You wouldn't believe the number of times I have heard people say this. People take what we say and use it how they please


"Cutie" ... there's only 'one' thing I need to be careful of, and that is to speak the Truth of God and not man's perceptions or emotions.   

If you see voodoo as not being evil, that's your perspective, however it is not the truth, regardless of whether you practice it or not.    I hate to disillusion you, but any 'religion' outside of God is evil.   Anyone who prays to idols or to other dieties or spirits is evil in the sight of God.     God is very clear about this in His word.      Quite clear.  

Don't confuse this with what's going on with Haiti.   And also let's be clear, not everyone, including myself is blaming Haiti for what has happened to her.   It's a tragedy and believe me, it grieves the heart of God to see this happen to them as well as others and myself.   

What exactly was your point in resurrecting this thread in the first place?    It's not going to change the fact of what voodoo is.. which is *indeed *darkness.   

And please do not insult the religions of the Muslims and the Jews, *by* placing them in the _same basket _as voodoo.    voodoo is witchcraft in one of it's highest forms.  It's demonic, it works upon conjouring up and communicating with the spirits of darkness.    

The Jews DO acknowledge God and honor and respect Him as God and there is none other.  They do not converge with the spirits of darkness as those who do with voodoo.    Period, point blank.   

Muslims, honor God as God.   They do not practice voodoo.  They do not converge with spirits of darkness as those who practice voodoo. 

Hindus worship 'idols' and other spirits.  

It does not matter whether you agree or not.   What does matter is not to insult these two religions (Jews and Muslims) by placing them in the same category as voodoo.   

Let me be clear.  You are not the only person who is upset about what's being said about Haiti and if this is your way of defending Haiti, by defending voodoo, it's a waste of time  and the wrong path in doing so.  

I'm speaking to you and any and everyone else who is wasting so much precious time and energy complaiing about what is being said about Haiti.    Do what others are doing instead.    Get up from the keyboard and get some money over there and keep it going.   

Instead of pouting about what so and so said about Haiti and voodoo and who-doo, *PRAY *-- STOP wasting your time and words on what somebody said and use your words to keep praying.      

These folks just had another earthquake ... 6.0 on the richter.  For God's sake!   *Ignore the distractions and Pray.*   Stop complaining about what other folks have said and do something productive.     

As wrong as it is for those who are casting Haiti down with their words, it's even MORE wrong of those who waste their time 'crying' and complaining about it.    And in the meantime, Haiti is attacked by another geographical disaster.  Our words are needed to keep them in prayer and under God's protection.     

I'm gonna tell you something and I hope you understand it. 
*"IF"* . . . Haiti is indeed suffering due to practices of voodoo and other practices of such, wouldn't it make sense to get rid of the cause in order to set in place the cure?    I'm *not* accusing Haiti of anything; they've been through more than enough suffering.    

 However,  If smoking cigarettes give lung cancer......  stop smoking.    *"IF"* indeed there is a _spiritual_ casue going on there, then I refuse to be an enabler, instead, I choose to love her and help her and by the loving grace of God, to see her set free.    Haiti has suffered long and hard enough.    

To Haiti...may the grace of all mighty God rest upon you and yours.  Haiti you are loved and indeed many are 'actively' reaching out to you with our hearts, our money and most of all our prayers.    No time is being wasted disputing the cause of this terror upon you.


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## divya (Jan 20, 2010)

cutiebe2 said:


> Of course God will never approve Voodoo..its not the same religion. Again, I will not call Voodoo evil. I just put it in a basket with every other religion that is out there. Again, its not my religion. If I say that Voodoo is evil then I would have to say the Judiasm, Hinduism, Islam, etc is too (which they are not)..because my exposure and knowledge about Voodoo has not been far off from the exposure of other religions. But again, since I don't practice the religions they don't apply to me. I just respectfully keep my distance...



I agree with being careful about how we describe the religions of others. If we are to reach people, we ought to watch our speech. We may not agree with their practices but at least, we should respect their choice. 

Further, as Christians, I do believe we should be careful when pointing fingers, particularly with the amount of non-Christian practices that have found their way into the mainstream of the religion. Some of us who have exposure to both can see how similar certain practices are within Christianity and Orisha faiths...where did it really come from? I'll just leave it at that.


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## Nice & Wavy (Jan 20, 2010)

May God lift up His Word today in our hearts.  As people of God, we should be coming together and praying, rather than showing who's right and who's not right.

How can two walk together unless they are in agreement?  And, how can God's Word be established in the heart of man unless His people come together, in love?

We must show the world that Jesus is alive by our actions.  What we say and do is very important in this journey because people are watching us.  

We must be willing to grow with God and let our light shine in this dark world. When God is about to do something, He takes the initiative and comes to one or more of His servants. He invites them to adjust their lives to Him so that He can accomplish His eternal purpose through them. When God speaks we must respond. What will your answer be?

We influence the people around us for good or bad. Like the pebble thrown into the lake we send out ripples that touch distant shores. Sisters, let’s touch those distant shores in our heavenly Father’s name as we live out our prayer that His will be done on earth as it is in heaven. No two people are exactly the same and we have callings hand picked for us by our Lord. Let’s take advantage of every opportunity to be God’s faithful servants until He calls us to our eternal rest with Him.


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## divya (Jan 20, 2010)

How many people have studied Orisha religions? To be completely honest, it can be compared in certain ways to Hinduism...and even Roman Catholicism. That's why the two have been melded to some extent in certain places, particularly in the Americas.

Adherents believe in one supreme god over all, who uses many deities to carry out his work. The aspect that tends to alarm people is the invoking of the deities (orishas) for communication. There are also believed to be evil spirits that can be invoked to harm individuals, if a particular person so chooses (also known as black magic). 

You can find a mixture of orishas and saints in many places, as it doesn't seem different for people. Certain people have even mixed of orishas and Hindu deities.

Anyway, I don't agree with Voodoo or any other orisha religion and avoid spiritualism in any form. In my belief, those practices are not of God. At the same time, I am careful not to being insulting because if it wasn't for God's grace, where would I be? We all need the Lord, and I pray that we are walk in the truth we are given.


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## Janice (Jan 20, 2010)

I posted this in another forum, but I might as well post it here as I see that there appears to be alot spirtual misconceptions concerning Haiti posted among several of the posters here.


God is no respector of persons. We are living in the last days whether you believe it or not, or are a Chrisitan or not. What hapenned in Haiti can happen anywhere else. Jesus said it himself, that he did not come to judge the world but to save them. So as far as anyone saying that these nations/countries that have undergone horrible natural disasters because of some sort of judgement for their sins, are inaccurate statments and certainly not biblical to begin with. 


These natural disasters mark the beginning of ends times. They are not judgement on any nation. These natural disasters, famines, pestilences, will continue to happen in other countries and in increasing numbers as the end draws near to Jesus's second coming. Similar to how labour pains increase as a woman is close to delivery. God knows all. I'm no God but one thing for sure that I know is that he wouldn't have allowed Haiti to undergo it unless there was a greater purpose behind it,.. hence the purpose of salvation. Its sad and devasting that countless lives were lost, even lives of the missionaries working there, but in the wake of this tragedy many are turning to him.


Desperate times call for desperate measures and only God above knew that he would have to use such great disaters when the end was soon near to turn many ppl at huge numbers to him. He doesn't want anyone to be without excuse. By the grace and mercy of God, many in Haiti are praying and turing to him as a nation. This wasn't just a wake up call for Haiti but for those on the outside as well. 

Jesus told those who felt that ppl or nations deserved judgement or were judged to "repent, lest you receive a harsher judgement". So please lets stop perpetuating the nonsensical statements as far as God is concerned. He already told us about these diasters and that is all they are, the marking of ends times. (Rd more of Luke 21, Mark 13)


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## cutiebe2 (Jan 20, 2010)

divya said:


> How many people have studied Orisha religions? To be completely honest, it can be compared in certain ways to Hinduism..*.and even Roman Catholicism. That's why the two have been melded to some extent in certain places, particularly in the Americas.*
> 
> Adherents believe in one supreme god over all, who uses many deities to carry out his work. The aspect that tends to alarm people is the invoking of the deities (orishas) for communication. There are also believed to be evil spirits that can be invoked to harm individuals, if a particular person so chooses (also known as black magic).
> 
> ...



I agree 100%, especially with the bold


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## cutiebe2 (Jan 20, 2010)

Shimmie said:


> *What exactly was your point in resurrecting this thread in the first place? *   It's not going to change the fact of what voodoo is.. which is *indeed *darkness.
> 
> *
> I'm speaking to you and any and everyone else who is wasting so much precious time and energy complaiing about what is being said about Haiti.    Do what others are doing instead.    Get up from the keyboard and get some money over there and keep it going.   *
> ...


1. I did not bump this thread. I kept seeing it in the "new post" so I clicked on it and entered. And you are right, this thread is not about Haiti. I guess someone bumped it because of other thread? I don't know 

2. I will say this very clearly. Do not question what I am doing for Haiti. If you read the post I have made over the past few months, I do a lot of work in Haiti. I went there last summer and will be going again to continue to the community health project that I have going with my school. I have attended national conferences and am setting up another event at my school as we speak, even though I am abroad right now (in DR, where I will probably get involved in Haitian human rights issues). I have done a whole lot more than texting $5 to yele so please do not disrepect me. 

The comments in bold have honestly been the most disrespectful thing anyone has ever said to be on LHCF.


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## divya (Jan 21, 2010)

cutiebe2 said:


> 1. I did not bump this thread. I kept seeing it in the "new post" so I clicked on it and entered. And you are right, this thread is not about Haiti. I guess someone bumped it because of other thread? I don't know
> 
> 2. I will say this very clearly. Do not question what I am doing for Haiti. If you read the post I have made over the past few months, I do a lot of work in Haiti. I went there last summer and will be going again to continue to the community health project that I have going with my school. I have attended national conferences and am setting up another event at my school as we speak, even though I am abroad right now (in DR, where I will probably get involved in Haitian human rights issues). I have done a whole lot more than texting $5 to yele so please do not disrepect me.
> 
> The comments in bold have honestly been the most disrespectful thing anyone has ever said to be on LHCF.



Bless your heart. The thread was likely resurrected because someone answered the polled. Anyway, I was awaiting your response, being that you have been so active in the Caribbean region. It's really refreshing to see people - especially those of us of descending from the region - giving back. It's unfortunate that anyone would attempt to suggest that others must not be doing anything simply because they have chosen to disagree with certain statements made here. It's interesting that no thought was given to the fact that significant exposure may be what leads others to different conclusions. But then, sometimes that's what happens when you dare to perceive things differently... 

Since I may fall under the _everyone else_ who is spending time on this time (in other words, voicing disagreement), I also began give to Haiti before the earthquake. It was nothing more than giving clothes for the next mission/health-related trip and looking into going myself. Now there's all the more reason to go, of course.

Very sad that the Christian forum can be the place where someone experiences the worst disrespect, but guess we all have our issues. It's sometimes easier to point fingers than to do some self-examination. We have to pray for each other.

On another note, where are you in the DR? Are you able to see a lot of the movement of aid going through to Haiti?


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## Laela (Jan 21, 2010)

Cutie,

When a poll is attached to a thread, each time someone votes it brings up the thread as 'new' even though there's no new comment. I figured with all the Haiti discussions someone voted and resuscitated the thread. It happens all the time.

It's good to see what you've been doing and are doing in Haiti. Reading your post, I'm humbly reminded that whatever we do for the least of us, we do for Christ.  



cutiebe2 said:


> 1. I did not bump this thread. I kept seeing it in the "new post" so I clicked on it and entered. And you are right, this thread is not about Haiti. I guess someone bumped it because of other thread? I don't know


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## cutiebe2 (Jan 21, 2010)

divya said:


> Bless your heart. The thread was likely resurrected because someone answered the polled. Anyway, I was awaiting your response, being that you have been so active in the Caribbean region. It's really refreshing to see people - especially those of us of descending from the region - giving back. It's unfortunate that anyone would attempt to suggest that others must not be doing anything simply because they have chosen to disagree with certain statements made here. It's interesting that no thought was given to the fact that significant exposure may be what leads others to different conclusions. But then, sometimes that's what happens when you dare to perceive things differently...
> 
> Since I may fall under the _everyone else_ who is spending time on this time (in other words, voicing disagreement), I also began give to Haiti before the earthquake. It was nothing more than giving clothes for the next mission/health-related trip and looking into going myself. Now there's all the more reason to go, of course.
> 
> ...



thank you Divya 
I am in Santo Domingo. There is tons of stuff being done here which is great considering the DR-Haiti issues. There are billboards up everywhere to donate, I get text messages everyday from my cellphone company telling me to donate and the DR gov is doing a lot it terms of supporting the Haitian gov. It actually touches me more than the US helping because 1. Dominicans  had to overcome their issues and see whats importing (helping others) and 2. this may lead to new relations between the two countries and maybe even better treatment of Haitians in DR on a day to day basis


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## Jenibo (Jan 23, 2010)

I literally screamed when you said you saw a black cat walking off on it's hind legs like it was nothing!!! Lord Jesus!!! 


GV-NA-GI-TLV-GE-I said:


> I have to tell a story and I hope and pray I do not scare anyone.  I lived in the Caribbean and for anyone to say it's not real there, they're lying, honestly.  They know.  I had a neighbor who ran a pension (student housing) down the corner from me.  My best friend took a room with her but I didn't want to because I had gotten my own kitchenette.  The lady started giving me evil looks and I felt something was wrong.  When I visited my bff there, she was just glaring at me...I took the hint and didn't come around inside anymore.  Just waited for my friend outside when we wanted to go somewhere.
> 
> Things began happening to us in very strange ways.  I lost all my book money - something impossible for me.  Left my money in the ladies bathroom.  Just mindlessness.  Accidents and other unfortunate things were happening all over the place to me and my friend and suddenly.  One evening, when I was walking her down the street to the pension, we just stopped and prayed and asked G-d to protect us because something was not right.  We felt we needed to.  All those bad things ceased.
> 
> ...


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## Almaz (Jan 23, 2010)

Thank you my thoughts exactly. These same people that are saying how evil voodoo. Which came from Ifa and Indigenous AFRICAN religion is bad but some of these same people have Christmas trees in their homes and pay homage to the easter bunny. (Pagan) Not all but some. 

I am saying I grew up in Africa and the Mid East and I have seen it in many forms. Also in my travels. Yes it may be powerful to some and others don't care.

Cause let me ask it is REALLY that powerful. They why are the people that usually practise it poor. Why couldn't the slaves used what they know to kill their oppressors?  If people who I know personally are still practising it and if very successful with it is a white man. I see white people taking up IFA from which Voodoo (which means light came from) 

I just wanna know if it is really that powerful then why are blacks as a whole still not quite there yet. We should be ruling. 

Please clarify. I am sorry I am looking at this from a Non-christian stance so I am just asking for some clarity thats all




cutiebe2 said:


> Voodoo is not "black magic" or evil
> 
> *evil is evil*
> *Voodoo has been propagandized to be an evil religion. Why? Because colonialist wanted to make sure that we thought everything that came from Africa was evil and bad. Voodoo is the religion of our ancestors. If you know what it really it you will not attack it.*
> ...


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## lilanie (Jan 31, 2010)

It is real enough for me to leave it and those who concern themselves with it - alone...

Angel Heart and Devil's Advocate put it in its proper perspective.  (also two of the best movies that unintentionally advocate turning to Christ as your Lord/Saviour)


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## Shimmie (Jul 30, 2014)

Someone must have 'voted' in the poll which bumped this thread.


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## JaneBond007 (Jul 30, 2014)

Honestly^^^.  And for the record, the Christmas tree and Easter Bunny are not evil.  Whichever is transformed for Christ is transformed for Christ.  The symbolism is one thing, that of fertility.  Madonna and Child new?  Prefigured for eons.  There is one authentic and is for salvation of mankind.  The evergreen symbolizes everlasting life.  Circumcision began in Egypt.  It was transformed.  So is the symbolism of the Pesach egg...transformed.  This is nothing new.  I'm not about to honor Ifa, which is not even remotely related to my African tribe to begin with.  Those are separate g-ds.  

Catholics do not worship separate g-ds and the saints are venerated, not worshipped.  We do not have a hierarchy of g-ds with a primary one and millions of lesser ones.  Caribbean religion is a syncretism.  When a symbol is transformed into usage in a religion, it is not syncretism or two distinct beliefs or one covering for a secretive other.  Afterall, G-d uses the spiritual and the physical and the latter is likewise a blessing that can explain the former.  But when something is covering for another religious system - meant, actual worship of other g-ds, as in the religious practices of using catholic saints to represent non-catholic religion and other g-ds, that is apples and oranges.  Ifa is not the African American's "true religion."  One's true religion is what one desires today.  There were plenty of christians and muslims on those slave ships.    

I know that people do not have understanding so I won't be angry but let us gain understanding before we expound incorrectly on things we have no interest nor knowledge about.  For the record, voudoun is the anti-thesis of faith.

----------------

For the record, spiritual manipulation as in trying to control for oneself or for another is either white magic or black magic.  Black magic attempts to inflict harm.  They are both wrong in that G-d is the one to look to and not self.  Voudoun is "real" because anything the devil wishes to destroy (us human beings) can be given "power" so that humans will think they have control and will believe in it.


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## MrsHaseeb (Jul 30, 2014)

JaneBond007 said:


> Honestly^^^.  And for the record, the Christmas tree and Easter Bunny are not evil.  Whichever is transformed for Christ is transformed for Christ.  The symbolism is one thing, that of fertility.  Madonna and Child new?  Prefigured for eons.  There is one authentic and is for salvation of mankind.  The evergreen symbolizes everlasting life.  Circumcision began in Egypt.  It was transformed.  So is the symbolism of the Pesach egg...transformed.  This is nothing new.  I'm not about to honor Ifa, which is not even remotely related to my African tribe to begin with.  Those are separate g-ds.
> 
> Catholics do not worship separate g-ds and the saints are venerated, not worshipped.  We do not have a hierarchy of g-ds with a primary one and millions of lesser ones.  Caribbean religion is a syncretism.  When a symbol is transformed into usage in a religion, it is not syncretism or two distinct beliefs or one covering for a secretive other.  Afterall, G-d uses the spiritual and the physical and the latter is likewise a blessing that can explain the former.  But when something is covering for another religious system - meant, actual worship of other g-ds, as in the religious practices of using catholic saints to represent non-catholic religion and other g-ds, that is apples and oranges.  Ifa is not the African American's "true religion."  One's true religion is what one desires today.  There were plenty of christians and muslims on those slave ships.
> 
> ...



JaneBond007 For clarification, are you saying that the Christmas tree and easter bunny have been transformed for Christ? If so, where did Christ transform them to make them symbols for Himself and what purpose do they serve? What is the purpose of taking pagan symbolism and trying to "transform" it for Christ. Let's not use examples of cultures who had practices that are also mentioned in the Bible such as circumcision. God is the sovereign creator. He has no need to copy pagan customs.


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## JaneBond007 (Jul 30, 2014)

The symbolism of representing fertility (body of Christ, winning souls for Christ) and the tree (evergreens, eternal life) make them not sinful.  Jesus never said, "don't get on the Internet, there's porn in other sites, it's pagan."  The Internet can be used for Christ and it is.  I'm not going to involve myself into legalism.  We have sacramentals of the physical which can be a vehicle of blessing into the spiritual realm.  G-d created this earth as He has and many lessons of the scripture as we have them today have been prefigured long before Abraham.


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## Shimmie (Sep 18, 2014)

Just an FYI: 

Each time someone discovers this thread and votes in the attached poll, it bumps the thread.    

So just in case someone wonders why the date of the latest post is not recent, that's why.   

God bless...
Shimmie


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