# Do people really believe that pyshics are demonic?



## landakaye (Feb 23, 2005)

*Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

I am having a hard time coming to grips with this. I'm not talking about people who make money off it by doing those 1800 numbers or write books and tell you that they can talk to dead people. I am speaking of the ones who truly help people out of kindness like helping police solve murders or things like that. This just started to bother me for some reason.


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## Honeyhips (Feb 23, 2005)

I think it has to do with what source are they receiving their information from.   I'm not sure how it works (how they get those visions and if/why they are demonic) when they are solving crimes.  I've been meaing to ask my Pastors about that.


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## pebbles (Feb 23, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				landakaye said:
			
		

> *Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*
> I am having a hard time coming to grips with this. I'm not talking about people who make money off it by doing those 1800 numbers or write books and tell you that they can talk to dead people. I am speaking of the ones who truly help people out of kindness like helping police solve murders or things like that. This just started to bother me for some reason.



I struggled with this myself many years back because I was really into my horoscope, and all of that. But when I got saved, I came face to face with the word of God that speaks against it, over and over again. There is so much scripture that teaches against psychics, divination, etc, that it was impossible for me to go on and pretend I didn't see it.


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## Cowgirl (Feb 24, 2005)

As Pebbles said, I too have struggled with an explanation for this. Mainly because of some of the popular shows like Charmed & the Harry Potter books etc.. Which I'm not going to lie, I still do watch on occasion, so I guess that's something I need to reevaluate.  

However, the scripture says (This is from the NASB version): *Deuteronomy 18:9-14*

"When you enter the land which the LORD your God gives you, you shall not learn to imitate the detestable things of those nations. There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, one who uses *divination*, one who practices *witchcraft*, or one who *interprets omens*, or a *sorcerer*, or one who *casts a spell*, or a *medium*, or a *spiritist*, or one who *calls up the dead*. 
"For whoever does these things is detestable to the LORD; and because of these detestable things the LORD your God will drive them out before you.


***So to answer your question, yes it is demonic, because the Bible also says: the dead *cannot* communicate with the living as there is a great chasm separating the dead from the living *(Luke 16:26)*. 

Therefore, when psychics think they are communicating with the dead, they are actually communicating with *demonic spirits* impersonating the dead.


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## pebbles (Feb 24, 2005)

Cowgirl said:
			
		

> As Pebbles said, I too have struggled with an explanation for this.  Mainly because of some of the popular shows like Charmed & the Harry Potter books etc.. Which I'm not going to lie, I still do watch on occasion, so I guess that's something I need to reevaluate.
> 
> However, the scripture says (This is from the NASB version): *Deuteronomy 18:9-14
> 
> ...



 

Most people know that I have a love for the story of Harry Potter. I think that reading the books from an adult perspective, I was more caught up in Harry's struggle to survive than the actual magic that would capture young children in the book. Then the budding romance between Ron and Hermione kept me reading because I wanted to know who she would grow up to marry. 

Years ago, when I read the story to my boys I told them that, as much as I enjoyed the stories, if Harry, Ron, Hermione, Dumbledore and the rest were real, they would all be on a fast train to hell because witchcraft is forbidden by God. Now that Harry Potter has come under such scrutiny, I'm thankful that my boys were never fascinated by the story, because I would hate to know that I gave them a desire to indulge in witchcraft because of something I read to them.


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## Poohbear (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

_*I see it this way... what those psychics do are not of God... they are doing the work of the devil... that's what demonic spirits do: the work of the devil.*_


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

It depends on what we're talking about under the psychic umbrella. There are some people who actually get visions...and I don't think that's devilish. It's a gift from God. Daniel interpreted dreams, and prophets often warned people.

Now, if you are sitting around collecting cash from anyone who'll pay ya...or claiming to hear from dead people...I'm leary of those type of folks.


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## pebbles (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

Hmm. According to the bible, anything that is "psychic" is forbidden. Daniel was given dreams and prophetic visions through praying and a clear connection to the Father, but psychics operate differently. Tarrot card reading, palm reading, tea leaves, astrology, etc., is not of God. These people are operating with "familiar spirits" and that's strictly forbidden.


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## pebbles (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

I don't know if people have an understanding of familiar spirits, but here's a brief definition and a link. 

Familiar spirits: Sorcerers or necromancers, who professed to call up the dead to answer questions, were said to have a "familiar spirit" (Deut. 18:11; 2 Kings 21:6; 2 Chr. 33:6; Lev. 19:31; 20:6; Isa. 8:19; 29:4). Such a person was called by the Hebrews an 'ob, which properly means a leather bottle; for sorcerers were regarded as vessels containing the inspiring demon. This Hebrew word was equivalent to the pytho of the Greeks, and was used to denote both the person and the spirit which possessed him (Lev. 20:27; 1 Sam. 28:8; compare Acts 16:16).

The word "familiar" is from the Latin familiaris, meaning a "household servant," and was intended to express the idea that sorcerers had spirits as their servants ready to obey their commands.

Here's a link on psychic power: http://www.teachingpages.co.uk/minilesson/psychics.html


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



> Hmm. According to the bible, anything that is "psychic" is forbidden.



To me a psychic is anyone that foretells the future, that's why I wanted to clarify b/c prophets and people of God can fall under that definition.


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## naptrl (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				pebbles said:
			
		

> The word of God that speaks against it, over and over again. There is so much scripture that teaches against psychics, divination, etc, that it was impossible for me to go on and pretend I didn't see it.


DITTO!!!  ITA!!


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## AnnDriena_ (Feb 24, 2005)

God topic 

**Shouts at the top of lungs**You are ALL evil. Evil I tell ya'. EVVIIILLL!!!   (okay so I have nothing better to do right now, shoot me)

But seriously as I understand it there is a difference between prophets and psychics. Prophets get a word from God. Psychics get a word from the dead. And since the dead can't communicate with us their words can only be from demons. 

But do I believe the psychics *ARE* demons? No.

As for helping people that is very kind but remember the devil can appear as an angel of light and I think an important thing to remember and someone please help me if I'm not phrasing it right:

Not everything _nice_ is of God.
And not everything of God is _nice_. (right,yes, nice, no)

Swarm of locust. Not nice but from God.
Helping people to reach the dead for their own peace of mind. Nice but not from God.


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## Cowgirl (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> To me a psychic is anyone that foretells the future, that's why I wanted to clarify b/c prophets and people of God can fall under that definition.


 
This is where the confusion begins and why this whole topic can be hard to understand. These two words (psychic & prophet) should not be interchangable. A *psychic* can not foretell the future but receives messages from demonic spirits who have knowledge regarding the activities of humans and have a limited ability to foretell the future. In otherword "a false prophet". A true *prophet* is one who speaks a *divine* or sacred message that comes from the Holy Spirit. The message should be for the purpose of exhortation, comfort, and edification of the body of Christ. (I'm paraphrasing: 1 Corinthians 14:3) 

That's my understanding. But I'm just human and still learning, so I'm open for other explanations from someone who has more knowledge.

*Edited to add*: AnnDriene, I agree with you.  I did not mean to repeat some of what you said. But by the time I got off the phone & finished my post, you had already answered.


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## pebbles (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> To me a psychic is anyone that foretells the future, that's why I wanted to clarify b/c prophets and people of God can fall under that definition.



There is a difference, though. The prophets of GOD hear or receive a word directly from GOD through constant communion and prayer with HIM.

Psychics deal with spirits, which they contact in different ways. Let me list a few ways here. Please, forgive the length of the post! 

*Fortune Telling*
Fortune telling is the art forecasting the future supposedly by supernatural means, is an ancient practice which is still popular today. Fortune telling is also known as divination. The one who practices this activity is known as a diviner. Fortune tellers include all those who claim to predict your future or advise your life through such means as ouija boards, mirror mantic such as crystal balls, mirrors, rock crystals, extra sensory perception (ESP), horoscopes, astrology or biorhythm, telepathy, palm-reading, clairvoyancy, kabala (Jewish mysticism), pendulums, tarot and other card readings, coffee grounds, tea leaves, beans, candles, and use of certain devices such as throwing special sticks or dice, etc.

*Interpreters*
Interpreters practice looking into crystal balls, throwing cane, dice, using Ouija board, practicing palmistry, interpreting patterns of birds flying, or interpreting dreams, automatic writing and handwriting analysis.

*Spiritism*
Spiritism also called Necromancy involves the magic of calling spirits (seances), in which spiritist try to communicate with the dead. Spiritism sometimes called spiritualism is the oldest form of religious counterfeit known to man. The Bible speaks of spiritistic practices going back as far as ancient Egypt. The book of Exodus records to the Egyptians' many occultic activities, including magic, sorcery and speaking to the dead (Exodus 7 and 8).

*Seances*
(a meeting at which mediums try to communicate with the dead) During Seances people who seek to communicate with loved ones are often startled to hear familiar voices supplying details about one's life which no one else present could know. In addition to impersonating the voice of the dead these may well be the voices of the unclean spirits who actually lived within the person during their lifetime. 

Mediums or sorcerers absolutely have no access to call the spirits of dead people, any manifestation belongs to evil spirits and their job is deceiving the people and bringing them under the curse of God to get control over them and their offspring. This wrong doing was the reason God turned His face from Saul, took away his kingship and gave it to David. Saul died in his sin.

*Palmistry*
Palmistry or Chiromancy, is the art of divination from the shape and markings of the hands and fingers. A proper interpretation of these signs supposedly can be used to forecast the future. It is not to be confused with chirology, which is scientific study of the development of the shape and lines of the hands, or with graphology, which is handwriting analysis.

*Cartomancy*
Cartomancy (Tarot Cards) forecasts the future by means of using cards. The elaborately illustrated cards used in this technique are called Tarot Cards. Supposedly these cards hold the secrets to the future. Those who turn to Tarot reading are often insecure about the future.


Psychics claim to speak for God but are actually frauds. (Ezekiel 13:6-9) Their visions are false and their divinations a lie. They say, "The LORD declares", when the LORD has not sent them, yet they expect their words to be fulfilled. Have you not seen false visions and uttered lying divination's when you say, "The LORD declares", though I have not spoken? "`Therefore this is what the Sovereign LORD says: Because of your false words and lying visions, I am against you, declares the Sovereign LORD. My hand will be against the prophets who see false visions and utter lying divinations. They will not belong to the council of my people or be listed in the records of the house of Israel, nor will they enter the land of Israel. Then you will know that I am the Sovereign LORD.'"

*Psychometry*
Psychometry can also be classed in the area of fortune telling. Psycometry has no place in a Christian's life. Psycometry consists of a person holding some material object of another in his hands and having the ability to make statements and identify characteristics of the owner of the article. He may foretell part of the future of the owner.

*Tea cup reading*
Tea cup reading - This form of divination interprets the shapes and relative positions left by tea leaves at the bottom of a cup. Fortunes are told using the same principles as are found in the oriental 1 Ching readings.

*Geomancy*
Geomancy - This system of divination employs a map with 12 divisions in which the symbols of geomancy are placed in conjunction with the planets.

*Arithmancy*
Arithmancy - Divination by numbers, especially by attaching mystical significance to the numbers associated with a person, especially those numbers associated with the letters of the person's name.

*Aeromancy*
Aeromancy - This form of divination observes atmospheric conditions or ripples on the surface of an open body of water.

*Capnomancy*
Capnomancy - This form of divination uses the smoke of an altar or sacrificial incense as a means of foretelling the future.

*Rhapsodmancy*
Rhapsodmancy - this form of divination is based upon the line in a sacred book that strikes the eye when the book is opened after the diviner prays, meditates or invokes the help of spirits.

*Augury*
Augury - Divination by the flight of birds. The word is used for all kind of divination, also for any omen or sign on which divination is or can be based.

*Ouija Board*
Ouija Board is an instrument for communication with the spirits of the dead. Made in various shapes and designs, some of them used in the sixth century before Christ. The common feature of all its varieties is that an object moves under the hand of the medium, to different corners, or through the pointer attached to it, spells out messages by successively pointing to letters of the alphabet, numbers, "yes" or "no" marked on a board which is a part of the instrument.


Whew!!!


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## landakaye (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

Thanks for the responses, ladies. My main thing was about people who think they are getting visions from the Lord or that he is telling them to act on things. I was confused about it all.


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## JuJuBoo (Feb 24, 2005)

AnnDriena_ said:
			
		

> God topic
> 
> **Shouts at the top of lungs**You are ALL evil. Evil I tell ya'. EVVIIILLL!!!   (okay so I have nothing better to do right now, shoot me)
> 
> ...



*pahahahah!*


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## ShortyDooWhop (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				pebbles said:
			
		

> I don't know if people have an understanding of familiar spirits, but here's a brief definition and a link.
> 
> Familiar spirits: Sorcerers or necormancers, who professed *to call up the dead* to answer questions, were said to have a "familiar spirit" (Deut. 18:11; 2 Kings 21:6; 2 Chr. 33:6; Lev. 19:31; 20:6; Isa. 8:19; 29:4). Such a person was called by the Hebrews an 'ob, which properly means a leather bottle; for sorcerers were regarded as vessels containing the inspiring demon. This Hebrew word was equivalent to the pytho of the Greeks, and was used to denote both the person and the spirit which possessed him (Lev. 20:27; 1 Sam. 28:8; compare Acts 16:16).
> 
> ...


 

Honestly, I am not sure about this topic. I don't consult/open myself to psychics, sorcerors, etc. I don't think that is of God. It is of the Devil. However, I think it's a bit unrealistic to not recognize that we are spirits encased in a body. We live in a spiritual world, and spirits exist amongst us. Having said that, I don't believe that every spirit is demonic. God sends angels to protect us. 

Sometimes you get a feeling in your spirit. Sometimes something about someone does not agree with you/sit right. What are those things? they are the spirit (your spirit) communicating with either the Spirit of God, or some other spirit in existence. 

I think some people invite negative spirits/demonic spirits into their lives (ie. by contacting a psychic, using tarot cards and the like). Other people are more receptive to spiritual things. There are somepeople - and I think we have all experienced that person in church who picks up on things spiritual, and the like - who are more aware of the spirit filled realm than others. And I don't think they are doing anything to invite a negative spirit in. They are just more alive and receptive to things of the spirit

However, to address the point above, I think it depends on what YOUR actions are. Are you opening yourself to negative spirits - watching certain things, going certain places, doing certain things - or are things coming to you?

Honestly, I don't know the answer to the question and I think the best source is the Word. But the Word must be search exhaustively. Various versions of the word should be read. Different study aides should be consulted, and you should discuss the topic with your pastor and/or someone with a high level of knowledge and understanding of the Word. At the end of the day, I know that God is knowledge and He will make all things clear if we ask Him for understanding.


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## pebbles (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

Well I hope that everyone knows that each person has a spirit, since death itself is a separation of the body and the *spirit.* If that fact would ever be up for debate, then we would all need to go back to Christianity 101. 

The Lord will send HIS *angels* to protect and minister to us, and the only Spirit that God will ever send to us is HIS HOLY SPIRIT, which has many roles including that of Comforter, Healer, Giver of joy, etc. HE's the Spirit of Holiness, Spirit of Might, the Spirit of the Highest, etc. HE has many roles, but all those roles are from ONE SOURCE. Anything else is suspect. And if any bible translation would say otherwise, throw it out, because that's not what The Word of GOD teaches and it's not what the HOLY SPIRIT reveals of HIMSELF, no matter what language or translation you pick up.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> It depends on what we're talking about under the psychic umbrella. There are some people who actually get visions...and I don't think that's devilish. It's a gift from God. Daniel interpreted dreams, and prophets often warned people.
> 
> Now, if you are sitting around collecting cash from anyone who'll pay ya...or claiming to hear from dead people...I'm leary of those type of folks.


_*Just because these psychics receive visions, whether good or bad, doesn't mean it's a gift of God.  Like pebbles has been trying to say... the Bible forbids any psychic/mystic/fortune telling activity.  Prophets back in the Bible days received their messages from God... totally different.*_


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

AnnDriena_ said:
			
		

> But do I believe the psychics *ARE* demons? No.


 *I don't think anyone here is saying psychics are demons, just debating whether what they practice or do is demonic.*



> As for helping people that is very kind but remember the devil can appear as an angel of light and I think an important thing to remember and someone please help me if I'm not phrasing it right:
> 
> Not everything _nice_ is of God.
> And not everything of God is _nice_. (right,yes, nice, no)
> ...


 *I agree!  But when God does something that we feel is not nice, there's is a purpose for what God does... whether we did something wrong (when we have to suffer consequences for sins) or whether he wants to make us stronger (like when he puts us through a struggle or hard time, like Job).*


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				Poohbear said:
			
		

> _*Just because these psychics receive visions, whether good or bad, doesn't mean it's a gift of God.  Like pebbles has been trying to say... the Bible forbids any psychic/mystic/fortune telling activity.  Prophets back in the Bible days received their messages from God... totally different.*_



Who's to say what's from God and what isn't? I agree with the poster who says you have to line it up with the Word and it's a personal thing. There are people like me who define everything "psychic" under one umbrella, which is why I clarified. As for being from God, I've had some crazy people in the church tell me some crazy stuff they saw in a vision. They would claim to be hearing from God, but I would say otherwise. My Spirit did not bear witness, so I stayed away from them.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> *Who's to say what's from God and what isn't?* I agree with the poster who says you have to line it up with the Word and it's a personal thing. There are people like me who define everything "psychic" under one umbrella, which is why I clarified. As for being from God, I've had some crazy people in the church tell me some crazy stuff they saw in a vision. They would claim to be hearing from God, but I would say otherwise. My Spirit did not bear witness, so I stayed away from them.


 
*Who's to say? The Holy Bible which is God's Word!  Not talking about me or other people but what God says about these things. What may seem right to the world isn't always right with God!*
*About the people claiming to hear things from God, that's not a gift from God either. Prophesy ended when Jesus came. Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament prophesy when he came to this earth and died for our sins on the cross. Today, we just have messages/sermons from teachers and preachers of His Word to help us to know the Lord better, understand God's Will, and live contructive & productive Christian lives.  *


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

prophesy ended?  show me that in the word...I've never heard of that before.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> prophesy ended? show me that in the word...I've never heard of that before.


 
*Prophesy is when prophets received a message from God and foretold the coming of Jesus Christ.  That's already happened.  What some of these people are doing today about receiving messages from God that foretells people's future is not prophesy.  Jesus has already came to save the world by dying on the cross. What more is there to prophesy about?  There's no need to point out a certain scripture in the Bible because the Bible shows us that it ended through Christ. I don't know what you would call what these people are doing in churches today.  But this is not the thread to debate about prophesy because there are many different views on this subject with churches today.  Some believe in it and some don't...I'm happen to be one that does not believe in prophesy after Jesus has already fulfilled prophesy.*


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## MomofThreeBoys (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

I think you are talking about Messianic Prophesies.  In this, I will agree. But, there are also end time prophecies that point to Jesus' return and what will happen in those last days before he returns.  This is the point of the book of Revelation.  I don't believe those propheccies have been entirely fulfilled yet.



			
				Poohbear said:
			
		

> *Prophesy is when prophets received a message from God and foretold the coming of Jesus Christ. That's already happened. What some of these people are doing today about receiving messages from God that foretells people's future is not prophesy. Jesus has already came to save the world by dying on the cross. What more is there to prophesy about? There's no need to point out a certain scripture in the Bible because the Bible shows us that it ended through Christ. I don't know what you would call what these people are doing in churches today. But this is not the thread to debate about prophesy because there are many different views on this subject with churches today. Some believe in it and some don't...I'm happen to be one that does not believe in prophesy after Jesus has already fulfilled prophesy.*


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

What about other prophets...such as Jonah?  Not all of them prophesied all of the time only about the coming of Jesus.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				natalied said:
			
		

> I think you are talking about Messianic Prophesies. In this, I will agree. But, there are also end time prophecies that point to Jesus' return and what will happen in those last days before he returns. This is the point of the book of Revelation. I don't believe those propheccies have been entirely fulfilled yet.


*Hmmm...that would make sense, but foretelling people's future in the church is NOT prophesy. If they have a message from God about those last days before Christ returns again, then that's fine.*


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

What if God gives them a different message?  You can only be sent by God if your message matches a message from hundreds of years ago?  If it is the same, then why do you need a prophet to repeat it?


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## MomofThreeBoys (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				Poohbear said:
			
		

> * but foretelling people's future in the church is NOT prophesy.** If they have a message from God about those last days before Christ returns again, then that's fine.*



I can agree with this.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> What about other prophets...such as Jonah? Not all of them prophesied all of the time only about the coming of Jesus.


 
*I didn't say ALL prophets prophesied.  I just said "prophets".  Some prophets were also just preachers of God's word back then.  Please don't add words to what I say on here.  *


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> What if God gives them a different message? You can only be sent by God if your message matches a message from hundreds of years ago? If it is the same, then why do you need a prophet to repeat it?


*Can you clarify what you are trying to ask...maybe give an example?  *


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				Poohbear said:
			
		

> *I didn't say ALL prophets prophesied.  I just said "prophets".  Some prophets were also just preachers of God's word back then.  Please don't add words to what I say on here.  *



Am I irritating you?  I asked a question...which means I'm trying to understand what you are saying. I did not make a statement saying you said anything.


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				Poohbear said:
			
		

> *Can you clarify what you are trying to ask...maybe give an example?  *



I'm saying that there could be prophets today with a new message...sent from God. Just because it is a different message from other prophets in the bible, does that make their message any less valid?


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## MomofThreeBoys (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> What if God gives them a different message? You can only be sent by God if your message matches a message from hundreds of years ago? If it is the same, then why do you need a prophet to repeat it?



Revelation and Daniel gives us an overview of what will happen.  The Bible says:

*Acts 2:17*
*  “ ‘In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young **men will see visions, your **old **men will dream dreams.  *

There will be end time prophets. I don't think their messages will be contrary to the Word. It might be more specific and might bring clarity to what is already stated in the Bible. Just like the book of Revelation brought more clarity to the book of Daniel. It didn't contradict it.  Any "prophet" that contradicts the Word, I would be VERY leary of.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> I'm saying that there could be prophets today with a new message...sent from God. Just because it is a different message from other prophets in the bible, does that make their message any less valid?


*Well, I never said anything about a message that someone gets from God today being less valid than the message someone got in the past.  I guess you're asking someone else...*


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				natalied said:
			
		

> Revelation and Daniel gives us an overview of what will happen.  The Bible says:
> 
> *Acts 2:17*
> *  “ ‘In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young **men will see visions, your **old **men will dream dreams.  *
> ...



Thanks for posting that scripture.  That brings much clarification. I don't by any means believe that everyone that claims to be a prophet is one...but at the same time I know that there are prophets. That scripture also talks about dreams...which was mentioned as being a bad activity (psychic) in one post.  I'm interested to find out what makes them bad vs. good.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				natalied said:
			
		

> Revelation and Daniel gives us an overview of what will happen. The Bible says:
> 
> *Acts 2:17*
> *“ ‘In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young **men will see visions, your **old **men will dream dreams. *
> ...


 
*Now I can agree with this post! As long as what they say is in alignment with the Bible, they are okay. Thanks for sharing!  *


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



> If they have a message from God about those last days before Christ returns again, then that's fine.



@ Poohbear...I'm saying what if a prophet is given a different message than this?


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## MomofThreeBoys (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> Thanks for posting that scripture. That brings much clarification. I don't by any means believe that everyone that claims to be a prophet is one...but at the same time I know that there are prophets. That scripture also talks about dreams...which was mentioned as being a bad activity (psychic) in one post. *I'm interested to find out what makes them bad vs. good.*



The bible gives us tests we can use to PROVE a prophet.

1) _A true prophet does not lie. His predictions       will be fulfilled._ (Jer. 28:9, "But the prophet who       prophesies peace will be recognized as one truly sent by the LORD only if       his prediction comes true.")

2) _A true prophet prophesies in the name of the       Lord, not in his own name._ (2 Pet. 1:21, "For prophecy never       had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were       carried along by the Holy Spirit.")

3) _A true prophet does not give his own private       interpretation of prophecy._ (2 Pet. 1:20, "Above all, you       must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's       own interpretation.")

4) _A true prophet points out the sins and       transgressions of the people against God._ (Isa. 58:1, "Shout       it aloud, do not hold back. Raise your voice like a trumpet. Declare to my       people their rebellion and to the house of Jacob their sins.)

5) _A true prophet is to warn the people of God's       coming judgment._ (Examples of judgment such as portrayed in Isa.       24:20, "The earth reels like a drunkard, it sways like a hut in the       wind; so heavy upon it is the guilt of its rebellion that it falls --never       to rise again." and Rev. 14:6, 7, "Then I saw another angel       flying in midair, and he had the eternal gospel to proclaim to those who       live on the earth --to every nation, tribe, language and people. He said       in a loud voice, 'Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his       judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea       and the springs of water.'").

6) _A true prophet edifies the church, counsels and       advises it in religious matters._ (1 Cor. 14:3, 4, "But       everyone who prophesies speaks to men for their strengthening,       encouragement and comfort. He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but       he who prophesies edifies the church.")

7) _A true prophet's words will be in absolute       harmony with the words of the prophets that have preceded him._ (Isa.       8:20, "To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak       according to this word, they have no light of dawn.")

8) _A true prophet recognizes the incarnation of       Jesus Christ._ (1 John 4:1-3, "Dear friends, do not believe       every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God,       because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you       can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus       Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not       acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist,       which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the       world.")

9) _A true prophet can be recognized by the results       of his work._ (Matt. 7:16-20, "By their fruit you will       recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from       thistles? Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears       bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear       good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and       thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.")

10) _A true prophet acts in accordance with the       will and approval of God._ (Deut. 18:19, "If anyone does not       listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call       him to account.")


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> That scripture also talks about dreams...which was mentioned as being a bad activity (psychic) in one post. I'm interested to find out what makes them bad vs. good.


 
*Having dreams/visions are not bad per se.  When it comes to dreams/visions from psychic activity/powers and foretelling people's future, that's bad because God forbids it.  I can see why it's wrong because people can get so caught up in someone telling what's going to happen in their future that they start to stray away from God and depend on those psychics.  It's like they will feel like they no longer need God. So anything that God is against is wrong.  Just like sex...it may feel good but it's wrong if you're not married!  *


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## pebbles (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> @ Poohbear...I'm saying what if a prophet is given a different message than this?



Are you asking, for example, if they say that the book of Revelations will not occur as was originally stated? That Jesus Christ will not return yet, but that God will suspend His return to a very far off time? Are you talking about something like that?  Is that what you mean?


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

Thanks Natalie! I'll be chewing on those scriptures.

I see Poohbear...that makes sense. Good example!


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> @ Poohbear...I'm saying what if a prophet is given a different message than this?


*Oh okay!  Well, you will have to give me an example of something someone said in your church that they claimed was a message from God that didn't have nothing to do with the last days before Jesus' return. I've never been encounter with so-called prophesy in the church... I just don't believe in it (meaning the telling of prophesy/messages that have nothing to do with Christs' return) because of what the Bible says...*


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				pebbles said:
			
		

> Are you asking, for example, if they say that the book of Revelations will not occur as was originally stated? That Jesus Christ will not return yet, but that God will suspend His return to a very far off time? Are you talking about something like that?  Is that what you mean?



No...I don't know of an example...something that maybe to specific group of people that hasn't been said before, but still lines up with the Word. I tend to be an analyzer...so I think of questions without specific examples in mind sometimes.


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## pebbles (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> No...I don't know of an example...something that maybe to specific group of people that hasn't been said before, but still lines up with the Word. I tend to be an analyzer...so I think of questions without specific examples in mind sometimes.



Gotcha!


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## DelightfulFlame (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				Poohbear said:
			
		

> *Oh okay!  Well, you will have to give me an example of something someone said in your church that they claimed was a message from God that didn't have nothing to do with the last days before Jesus' return. I've never been encounter with so-called prophesy in the church... I just don't believe in it (meaning the telling of prophesy/messages that have nothing to do with Christs' return) because of what the Bible says...*



Here are some. This lady (whom I never met) told my best friend (lives in another state) that God told her to pray for me. We only know each other through my best friend (who knows us both). Apparently we both discuss the Word with my friend, so the lady knows that I'm really into bible study. 

Anyhow, she told my friend to tell me that she had a vision to pray for me, and that it spooked her like something bad was going to happen to me. 

It really pissed me off actually, and I discarded it. It came with no specifics, and didn't line up with the Word. I was wondering why in the world did she even bother to tell her to tell me that?

Another lady whose husband is a preacher told me that she had a vision from God that I was going to be very successful. This lady was very lazy...half worked...half took care of her kids...cheats on her husband...just doesn't even try. Here I am struggling with 3 children (she has 4), and trying to work and go to school. So I'm like...ya think?  Clearly I'm not doing all of this work just to stay the same.

My cousin met a man from another church. He walked up to her and just started telling her stuff. He said she was going to move into a red brick house soon and gave details about it. He also said that her marriage was going to go through some things, but it would be alright and God was with her. Within the next year she moved into that house, and her husband left her with no notice and moved to California for 3 months. He came back and they worked it out and are together to this day.  

That one I think was crazy too. 

But the point of my original post before I got off topic with all of this was about Jonah.  He was sent to tell the people of Ninevah (from memory so forgive me if this is not 100% correct), to change their ways. It had nothing to do with the coming of Jesus or His return, yet was still a valid prophesy.

Now I've written so much, I don't know what I was writing about to begin with...LOL.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				DelightfulFlame said:
			
		

> Here are some. This lady (whom I never met) told my best friend (lives in another state) that God told her to pray for me. We only know each other through my best friend (who knows us both). Apparently we both discuss the Word with my friend, so the lady knows that I'm really into bible study.
> 
> Anyhow, she told my friend to tell me that she had a vision to pray for me, and that it spooked her like something bad was going to happen to me.
> 
> ...


*Those things that those people have said are not prophesies.  I think anyone can say things like that by looking at how you live and act.  My dad is a minister and says things like that all the time like "God told me to pray for you" or "I have a vision about the church" etc.  Those are just everyday inclinations that people get based on what they think is going to happen which may or may not come true.*

*And about Jonah...no, I do not think he prophesied about Jesus' coming.  That doesn't mean he didn't give a valid prophesy.  Prophesy is also the inspired declaration of divine will and purpose, not just a prediction of something to come.  I don't think I was clear about that earlier...sorry.  But what these people are doing today in churches like foretelling people's future, whether good or bad, or predicting some natural disaster, is not from God and is not true prophesy. *
*Whew! I think I almost confused myself too! This is a tough subject. I hope that was more clear... if not, you can ask for clarification of anything I said. 

*


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## dstdiva (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

i am so confused! i've been to some churches with my bf's family and they are all "sanctified". there's lot of prophesying going on...which they claim comes from God...someone will walk up to you and say,"i've got a word for you from god..." sometimes there are revivals and there will be a "prophet" there. example:my old stylist took a new client. the lady gets in her chair and says,"i don't usually do this, because it makes people uncomfortable, but God just gave me a word for you. Would you like to hear it?" she goes on to tell the stylist that she has great ideas but hasn't been following thru in her church. which was true, but how did this lady know? at least she gave her the choice of her telling her or not.
i'm babbling, but the question is: how do you know if someone gives you a prophecy, whether or not it's from God? the first criteria i saw in the list of scriptures above says that you'll know if it comes true, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's from God, right?


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## MomofThreeBoys (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*



			
				dstdiva said:
			
		

> i am so confused! i've been to some churches with my bf's family and they are all "sanctified". there's lot of prophesying going on...which they claim comes from God...someone will walk up to you and say,"i've got a word for you from god..." sometimes there are revivals and there will be a "prophet" there. example:my old stylist took a new client. the lady gets in her chair and says,"i don't usually do this, because it makes people uncomfortable, but God just gave me a word for you. Would you like to hear it?" she goes on to tell the stylist that she has great ideas but hasn't been following thru in her church. which was true, but how did this lady know? at least she gave her the choice of her telling her or not.
> i'm babbling, but the question is: how do you know if someone gives you a prophecy, whether or not it's from God? *the first criteria i saw in the list of scriptures above says that you'll know if it comes true, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's from God, right?*



No, that's why you have to use ALL the tests to verify if the person is truly a prophet.


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## AnnDriena_ (Feb 25, 2005)

If it comes true and is not in line with the teachings of Jesus I don't think it's from him.


If it doesn't come true ( a la Benny Hinn gave a specific year about what he said God was going to do to homosexuals. He said God was going to destroy them by fire the coming year) then you know he's a lie.

If it comes true and lines up with the word then you'll know it was from God. That's it in a nutshell for me. 

Good verses, natalied


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## Sweet C (Feb 25, 2005)

*Re: Do people really believe that psychics are demonic?*

I think the scriptures natalied laid out were very good in what u should do when testing a prophet.  That is why it is key to try the spirit.  I know the Lord has given me visions about myself and sometimes other people, and some are very hard for me to understand, and that is why I seek the Lord for guidance and interpretation.


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## Poohbear (Feb 25, 2005)

AnnDriena_ said:
			
		

> If it comes true and is not in line with the teachings of Jesus I don't think it's from him.
> 
> 
> If it doesn't come true ( a la Benny Hinn gave a specific year about what he said God was going to do to homosexuals. He said God was going to destroy them by fire the coming year) then you know he's a lie.
> ...


 
*Yeah... what she said!  *


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## sbg4evr (Feb 26, 2005)

This is a very interesting topic.  I do believe I have psychic ability, does that make me a demon?  I try to live my life according to God's teaching.  I do have the ability to know about things before they occur.  I know (by an inner sense)when a challenge will come before me.  I find that if I have faith in God and pray a solution will come.   For instance, a month ago, on a thursday,  I felt tense, hot and my hand was shaking.  I find water later in my basement.  I thought it was coming from my hot water tank and later found out it was coming for my chimney that is not used any more.  I cried and prayed with a friend.   Tuesday, a solution to my chimncy problem was given to me.  Am I a demon?

I knew that my Mother died in hospital, hours before she died.   I tried to deny it but the dreaded phone call in early morning hours confirmed it.  Am I a demon?  

I have dreams that do come true. Am I a demon?

I can sense when others say things that what they say will be proven wrong in the future.  For instance, when a close friend a mind was getting married, she said that I would not be a bridesmaid and hope I would understand since she choosed childhood friends.  She said that she wanted me to be the godmother of her first child.  I felt honored.  But I also felt something else, that I can not explain in words.  A few years later,  she ends our relationship without warning and talking bad about me.  Am I a demon?

I do not tell fortunes.  But I can sense a person aura.  I can feel something about people's characters by being in their presence.   I try not to judge people by first impressions.   A lot of the times, what I feel reveals itself to be true in time.  Am I a demon?

I grew up in the church and wandered away from the flock when I got feed up with religion and hypocrites in churches.  I always believe in God and the trinity.  Now I found my way back to the flock but do not want to choose a denomination.   I am searching for a church home but have not found one yet.  I do not consider myself a demon.


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## pebbles (Feb 27, 2005)

sbg4evr said:
			
		

> This is a very interesting topic.  I do believe I have psychic ability, does that make me a demon?  I try to live my life according to God's teaching.  I do have the ability to know about things before they occur.  I know (by an inner sense)when a challenge will come before me.  I find that if I have faith in God and pray a solution will come.   For instance, a month ago, on a thursday,  I felt tense, hot and my hand was shaking.  I find water later in my basement.  I thought it was coming from my hot water tank and later found out it was coming for my chimney that is not used any more.  I cried and prayed with a friend.   Tuesday, a solution to my chimncy problem was given to me.  Am I a demon?
> 
> I knew that my Mother died in hospital, hours before she died.   I tried to deny it but the dreaded phone call in early morning hours confirmed it.  Am I a demon?
> 
> ...



What you describe is not "psychic." There is a difference between being given prophetic dreams and visions from God, and the Spirit of discernment, and "psychic" power. They are not the same. The gift of prophecy is God given, and many Christians are gifted with it. It is not unique. What you describe is given to many, myself included. "Psychic" powers are not connected to God. And "psychics" are not demons, but their ability is demonically influenced. They're known as "familiar spirits." That's what The Word of God says.


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## sbg4evr (Feb 27, 2005)

Thanks Pebbles,  I was confused by this post.  My abilities are of a good nature.  I can not control them.  I just received them.  They were lost to me for about 3 years and recently came back.


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## pebbles (Feb 27, 2005)

sbg4evr said:
			
		

> Thanks Pebbles,  I was confused by this post.  My abilities are of a good nature.  I can not control them.  I just received them.  They were lost to me for about 3 years and recently came back.


I was telling someone else that my sister has the gift of prophecy, and with her God reveals things clearly. With me, I sometimes have to figure it out a bit more. That is, if I can even remember what I dreamt!  LOL!


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## dstdiva (Mar 1, 2005)

pebbles said:
			
		

> What you describe is not "psychic." There is a difference between being given prophetic dreams and visions from God, and the Spirit of discernment, and "psychic" power. They are not the same. The gift of prophecy is God given, and many Christians are gifted with it. It is not unique. What you describe is given to many, myself included. "Psychic" powers are not connected to God. And "psychics" are not demons, but their ability is demonically influenced. They're known as "familiar spirits." That's what The Word of God says.



that's very helpful, thanks.


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