# Rape: Should We Change How We View Men as Christian Women?



## MonPetite (Dec 22, 2011)

Thanks for the insight ladies!


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## Guitarhero (Dec 22, 2011)

Many things.  This is a very serious thread and I probably have very many thoughts on the issue.  It's so deep, I'm going to ponder it awhile.  One thing, though, it's not that some men cannot control their penises...this type of passion is rooted in anger, domination and eventually objectification of humans - not initially sexual lust.  I think we should all be careful, no matter our faith.  But I cannot condemn all men for the actions of a few, neither can I suspect all of them as potential abusers.  It's difficult once you've been the victim of a rape, hence the side of the poster of that thread.  The victim need counseling because having a fear of rape and hatred for all those of the same sex as the perpetrator is a hell of its own.


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## LucieLoo12 (Dec 22, 2011)

Hmmmm interesting topic


I belive that as Christian women we should not live in fear to men. The bible says God has not given me a spirit of fear, but of love, power and a sound mind. A sound mind to make wise decisions not to be in compromising situations.If I knew a guy was physically attracted to me, I would not be alone in a apartment with him. Is it because Im some holy rollie?  No, its because I put no confidence in my flesh and I dont want my good to evil spoken of. 

So its not a fear that is associated with men, its more of a carefulness. Even with the brothers at my church I am very careful with how I carry myself, not wanting to put a stumblingblock before them. So im even more careful with men I dont know. I believe that we shouldnt be in fear to anyone but God.


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## MonPetite (Dec 23, 2011)

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## Shimmie (Dec 23, 2011)

The way I see it (which is a rare statement coming from me).  

However, the way I see it, is that any Good Christian Man, is not going to have any woman in his house or apartment 'alone', in the first place, unless it's his mother, his sister, his grandmother, or the woman that he is engaged / married to.   

Why would he invite temptation and why would any woman (Christian) be alone in a man's home with him when he has already made it clear in the past that he was 'physically attracted' to her.   

That's a pretty bold statement coming from a man (who is Christian), a statement that he really should not have made to any woman in the first place, let alone he should have his 'flesh' subdued; his 'thought's under control. 

I'm not getting anything 'deep' out of this.  It's simple.  A woman doesn't  have to put herself in such a vunerable position by being alone in a man's home, when he's not 'vested' in her as his wife or future wife.   

How deep is that?   I'm not trying to be offensive nor condescending.   Somethings are just obviously simple.   As Christian women we are not of this world.   We do not pattern ourselves after the world when it comes to being social.     Rape its self doesn't have to happen, just the simple course of a man and a woman being alone together without accountabiity.   The flesh holds no account to anyone.  A man and a woman alone is a natural course for nature to 'take it's course'.    It's our decisions and our counscientiousness which yield to accountability, however when given the _right _conditions for the 'flesh' to rise, the flesh overtakes the conscience.   

This issue is not deep.   It just isn't.


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## MonPetite (Dec 23, 2011)

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## Shimmie (Dec 23, 2011)

LittleGoldenLamb said:


> THAT is simple enough. Agreed.
> 
> Shimmie
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This right here is just way too much when all a man has to say, 'You're very pretty'.   Period!  



> If a man says: "It's a shame that Eurocentric beauty standards praise only fair skin. Dark skinned women, like yourself, are attractive without having "pure white skin". I've been physically attracted to plenty of women your complexion, who were not the blonde, blue-eyed ideal. You're not ugly, simply because your hair isn't blonde. Some men prefer brunettes anyway!"



Why go into all of the dramatics especially when unsolicited.  Red Flag Alert!  He's trying too hard to win your confidence in him.   The key words:  'Physically Attracted' are true red flags.    Even the slave masters were physically attracted to the Black women on their plantation and they took full advantage of it.     Toss that line out with the 'cat litter'. 

*When it's Family:  *

Okay, leaving girls alone with with family members should never be a concern however, there are far too many times when it has been and things have gone wrong.    My grandmother was 'molested' when she was 12 years old by her sister's husband and my dad was the result of that incident.  

However, in these situations, the family realizes that the danger signs and red flags were always there.   'We' just didn't 'see' them, blinded by feigned trust.   But the signs are always there, meaning that before leaving a woman or a child male or female, with a family member, we have to tune into what God is trying to show us about the person(s). 

As a child, I can remember being left alone with my Dad and Granddad (not the one who molested my grandmom), and I was always safe with them.   I do remember my parents being very selective with whom they allowed to babysit me and my sisters (male and female family or babysitters). 

As for young people 'mixing'... why not?   That's what chaperones are for.   As a teen, I remember the parents were always present; within ear shot and sight when 'friends' hung out together.   

I'm not minimizing what your concerns are, for there is definitely far too many sexually related crimes ocurring these days among children and adults as victim.   We can only use common sense and most of all, allow our hearts to be lead of God as with whom and where we allow ourselves and our children to be.  And this applies to Churches as well.   The devil is too active where he shouldn't be in the first place.   The Church should be the place for healing not hurting.


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## MonPetite (Dec 23, 2011)

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## Shimmie (Dec 23, 2011)

LittleGoldenLamb said:


> @ Shimmie Duly noted!  You give it straight with no chaser. I love it.
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Your concerns are legitimate and I apologize for appearing 'cystic'.    What you've shared and asked here is a 'wake-up' message for all of us to be vigilant and by reading your blogs, always beautiful.   

God bless you, Little Lamb.  Fret not little one.   God is with you.  

Sweet sleep


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Dec 24, 2011)

I'm in total agreement in with this no chrisitan man or woman should be alone in a house where it's obvious that feelings were expressed...we really don't shun the appearane of evil we go into spritually and potentially harmful situations wided eye and by invitation it seems... 




Shimmie said:


> The way I see it (which is a rare statement coming from me).
> 
> *However, the way I see it, is that any Good Christian Man, is not going to have any woman in his house or apartment 'alone', in the first place, unless it's his mother, his sister, his grandmother, or the woman that he is engaged / married to. *
> 
> ...


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## SummerSolstice (Dec 24, 2011)

just to clarify, you're not saying that people tend to get raped just because they're alone with a man when they shouldn't be? it seems like you're saying women who get raped put themselves in that position.



Shimmie said:


> The way I see it (which is a rare statement coming from me).
> 
> However, the way I see it, is that any Good Christian Man, is not going to have any woman in his house or apartment 'alone', in the first place, unless it's his mother, his sister, his grandmother, or the woman that he is engaged / married to.
> 
> ...


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## LoveisYou (Dec 25, 2011)

So I take it you ladies would be totally against having a male roommate?


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 25, 2011)

SummerSolstice said:


> just to clarify, you're not saying that people tend to get raped just because they're alone with a man when they shouldn't be? it seems like you're saying women who get raped put themselves in that position.



As controversial as it sounds, yes, sometimes they do.  There are countless stories of women allowing themselves to get drunk and helpless and go home with strange men they just met in a club or party setting. Then when they get raped they want to do the feminist roar and scream that regardless of the circumstances, he shouldn't have raped her. Wellll since we know that men tend to have trouble controlling themselves, and since we learned in kindygarten that you should be careful about talking to strangers, I think the feminist  roar is misplaced.    As a woman you should keep your wits about you and avoid dangerous and tempting situations.  Period.  Even if you aren't drunk, you should not just go into a situation with a man where you are alone and things could get out of control.  Until women are willing to stop fighting the double standard and just handle themselves accordingly, it's going to continue happening.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 25, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> So I take it you ladies would be totally against having a male roommate?



Um yeah. It's not necessary. I'm sure a woman can find a woman to have as a roommate.  I give the side eye to those kinds of situations.  There's more going on than just being a roommate.


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## aribell (Dec 25, 2011)

I don't think we need to change our view of men.  Women are capable of molestation...but should every woman be treated as a potential abuser?

There's an element of common sense to it.  Don't put yourself in situations where you are vulnerable to men whose character you do not know.  Many women are victimized by men they know, but simply knowing a man does not mean he is of good character.  And I wouldn't leave my children with someone just because they're family.

Sent from my LS670 using LS670


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## LoveisYou (Dec 25, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Um yeah. It's not necessary. I'm sure a woman can find a woman to have as a roommate.  I give the side eye to those kinds of situations.  *There's more going on than just being a roommate*.



I guess I can see where you are coming from, but I definitely disagree with such a blanket statement. I think it all depends on the people and situations involved.


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## dicapr (Dec 28, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> As controversial as it sounds, yes, sometimes they do. There are countless stories of women allowing themselves to get drunk and helpless and go home with strange men they just met in a club or party setting. *Then when they get raped they want to do the feminist roar and scream that regardless of the circumstances, he shouldn't have raped her. Wellll since we know that men tend to have trouble controlling themselves, and since we learned in kindygarten that you should be careful about talking to strangers, I think the feminist roar is misplaced.* As a woman you should keep your wits about you and avoid dangerous and tempting situations. Period. Even if you aren't drunk, you should not just go into a situation with a man where you are alone and things could get out of control. Until women are willing to stop fighting the double standard and just handle themselves accordingly, it's going to continue happening.


 
While I agree that women need to be smart about the situations they find themselves in I cannot agree that getting drunk around a male makes it the woman's fault if they get raped. Rape is a violent act of dominance, not s.ex. It is not about a male's selfcontrol but rather his need to control another human being. Women should be smart but we shouldn't have to bare the blame when bad choices leads to us being victimized.  For example, I know that going out at night is probably not the safest choice.  However, due to work or circumstances it is sometimes necessary for me to be out and about town unaccompanied at night.  Would it be my fault if something happened to me because I knowingly put myself in an unsafe situation?  The bible states that if a man forces a woman and she cries out only the male is guilty of rape.


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## MonPetite (Dec 28, 2011)

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## Shimmie (Dec 28, 2011)

My response to SummerSolstice, dicapr   ( FYI to nathansgirl1908 )

*No one deserves to be raped, No One!  Whether it's a female, a male and God forbid, a child for children cannot defend themselves.* 

*However, I agree with nathansgirl1908 's post.  Her points are valid. * 

*As sad as it is,* there are women who place themselves in a position of compromise.  And they know exactly what they are doing.  They know it.  *With purpose and intent*, they are out to seduce men to take them to bed.  

I'm sorry if anyone disagrees, however, it's still the truth and it makes it bad for women who are truly innocent and they have such a horrid time in court / legal cases because of the women who do not master their behaviour.  

Let me repeat this again before my post is misunderstood:

*No one deserves to be raped, No One!  Whether it's a female, a male and God forbid, a child for children cannot defend themselves.* 

In response to dicapr's post:   A woman who gets drunk is a far cry from a woman who has to work at night.  It is not the same compromise.  For years, I worked late hours as I worked my way through college and took care of my children during the day.  I worked while they were asleep and when my family was able to watch them, as they worked during the day.  Many nights I had to come home on the bus, alone.   So yes, it was high risk, and it was only by the grace of God that I was kept safe as well as my children during those years.     

By contrast, a woman who chooses to get herself 'stinkin' drunk be it alone with a man in his home or hers, or in a bar or at a party, or a hotel room during an out of town business meeting with business associates.... SHE SHOULD KNOW BETTER.   She's too drunk to 'fight' for herself or to even know what's going on.   

I'll say it again:

*No one deserves to be raped, No One!  Whether it's a female, a male and God forbid, a child for children cannot defend themselves.* 

Natalie Holloway is a tragic example.   No one except the 'sharks' in the ocean knows where she is.     She thought it was 'cute' to get drunk and leave the bar with guys that she did not know.   

The girl who went to Kobe Bryant's hotel room *at 2:00 in the morning ???????? *

Like it or not, she was telling the man that she wanted to have sex with him.   I don't want to hear about her 'innocense', she KNEW what she was doing.  Was Kobe wrong?  Indeed he was and always will be.  So was the 'fast' acting girl. 

I've had it with the behaviour of women who think it's cute to dress close to naked, to go clubs, doing the booty clap on the dance floor, get drunk thinking it's cute and then get mad when a man makes a play on her.   

Just who are they kidding?   They have 'invited' the men to approach them.  They are literally advertising and inviting a man to be sexually aroused ...for whatever reason they deem justified.

Somewhere along the line, women have to take responsiblity for their actions which incites sexual arousal and/or dominance in men.   

*Rape is WRONG ! ! !  It is WRONG !   Rape will ALWAYS be WRONG !*

And wrong will always be the women who help it along.   And as long as 'we' choose to be in denial of this, it only makes it worse for women and children and even the men, who did nothing to incite such violence in their lives.  

There are women out there who know what's up and how to get down and then cry rape, when indeed it could have been avoided.     They're wrong.  They are indeed wrong and they need to just stop.   It's hurting the truly innocent ones who have been deeply injured and scarred mentally, physically and spiritually.  

Again, so that I will not be misunderstood or misquoted:

*No one deserves to be raped, No One!  Whether it's a female, a male and God forbid, a child for children cannot defend themselves.*


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## Shimmie (Dec 28, 2011)

t 





LoveisYou said:


> So I take it you ladies would be totally against having a male roommate?


 


LoveisYou said:


> I guess I can see where you are coming from, but I definitely disagree with such a blanket statement. I think it all depends on the people and situations involved.


 
There's no way around this issue. It will always be unacceptable *especially* for a Christian woman. The 'world' has a carefree attitude that it doesn't matter or that it depends upon the people / situations. However, it's still not acceptable. 

LoveisYou ... :Rose:

There's always compromise when a man and a woman share the same living space. He 'hears' you in the shower/tub and his mind is 'wondering' and wandering.  You're in separate bedrooms, yet he still 'wonders'.   

It's far different than living with a sister or a female roommate.  

_Note:  I'm using 'first person singular' ('you', 'your') in the general sense, not 'you' personally. _

There's no validation if he is a 'Christian', for why would 'you' tempt your brother in Christ or to put him in such a position to be tempted.   

If he is a non-Christian ...  that's alone speaks for its self.

it is a known fact that men think about sex every two seconds of their waking hours.   Ummmm yeah.    'Google' it.  

Another thing to consider:

What happens when God brings a man into your life?   What then?  How will he (a potential husband) feel or think about you living with another man?   

Men KNOW Men.... (Men know how 'men' think about women and sex and what arouses them).    It will never be an innocent or valid reason that will settle in his heart.    He will always wonder if 'anything' ever came close to happening between you and your 'male' room mate.  

Male and female roommates are just another 'trap' of satan to get people into sexual sin.   _It's a known fact that most such arrangements do end up with sexual involvement and seldom a permanant relationship.  _

Just in case it's a thought, living with a gay man is not acceptable either.


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## Shimmie (Dec 28, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> As controversial as it sounds, yes, sometimes they do.  There are countless stories of women allowing themselves to get drunk and helpless and go home with strange men they just met in a club or party setting. Then when they get raped they want to do the feminist roar and scream that regardless of the circumstances, he shouldn't have raped her.
> 
> Wellll since we know that men tend to have trouble controlling themselves, and since we learned in kindygarten that you should be careful about talking to strangers, I think the feminist  roar is misplaced.
> 
> As a woman you should keep your wits about you and avoid dangerous and tempting situations.  Period.    Even if you aren't drunk, you should not just go into a situation with a man where you are alone and things could get out of control.  Until women are willing to stop fighting the double standard and just handle themselves accordingly, it's going to continue happening.



Just wanted to thank you for 'putting this out there'.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 28, 2011)

You're taking this to an extreme. And it's an extreme I often see where some women don't want to recognize that everyone has to SOMETIMeS take responsibility for putting themselves in a bad situation.  I thought it was clear that the distinctions in my post were to be drawn between truly innocent situations and outright irresponsible behavior. I'm not talking about someone who has to walk to the bus stop.  I'm talking about someone who goes to a man's house the same night  after meeting him for the first time.  I'm talking aout someone who gets so drunk they are helpless. That actually happened in NY.  The cops accused of rape got off. Why?  Because the woman was drunk.  Too drunk. She couldn't prove anything actually occurred. 

It's not too much to ask to use common sense. And that doesn't mean viewing every man as a potential rapist. 




LittleGoldenLamb said:


> Good question. Perhaps we should? Paranoia isn't attractive, though.
> 
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## dicapr (Dec 28, 2011)

It seems that the issue hear is actually the way the woman dresses and her level of intoxication. If the issue was truely about behaviors that are dangerous  woman walking into work in the morning or in leaving the office late at night should be just as much to blame for any attack as a drunk woman. She knowingly and willfully placed herself in harms way just as the intoxicated woman.  Even women who are not intoxicated are sometimes unable to identify their rapist.


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## Shimmie (Dec 28, 2011)

dicapr said:


> It seems that the issue hear is actually the way the woman dresses and her level of intoxication. If the issue was truely about behaviors that are dangerous  woman walking into work in the morning or in leaving the office late at night should be just as much to blame for any attack as a drunk woman. She knowingly and willfully placed herself in harms way just as the intoxicated woman.  Even women who are not intoxicated are sometimes unable to identify their rapist.



This time of year, it gets dark early.  Most people do not get off from work until 5:00 p.m. and it's dark.   Be it a male or female, they cannot help but be in the dark while trying to get home.   Especially women who have to stop at a day care to pick up their child/ren and then go home.    What choice does she have?   She didn't create the seasons and the time it gets dark.  She has to get home  

Now... a woman who chooses to leave work, goes to 'happy hour' (which is totally unnecessary), she gets drunk and leaves to go home in the dark, she has carelessly 'invited' herself to be in harm's way.  

Major difference....

Important:  dicapr 

This is for you    My post responses are not addressed to you personally nor anyone else in this thread.    

It's the topic, not you.   

Happiest of New Year Blessings to you and your loved ones.


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## Shimmie (Dec 28, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> .... between truly innocent situations and outright irresponsible behavior. I'm not talking about someone who has to walk to the bus stop.
> 
> 
> I'm talking about someone who goes to a man's house the same night  after meeting him for the first time.
> ...



What bothers me is that many women who drink become very 'flirty' and it gives men the impression that they are being propositioned by the woman.   

As I shared in my post upwards and I truly know that you agree, is that no one deserves to be raped.   No one 

But there are behaviours of some women which need to be addressed.   It's not fair to the innocent victims of rape who truly deserve to seek and obtain justice in the legal system, yet many of their cases have been deteriorated due to the mishaviours of women who were just plain 'out there' and didn't care how they behaved, where and with whom.   

It breaks my heart to say this, but not all women are innocent victims.   

In saying this, I still maintain for those reading that I do not dismiss anyone who has been raped; i do not validate rape for any reason.  I never did and never will.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 28, 2011)

Shimmie said:


> What bothers me is that many women who drink become very 'flirty' and it gives men the impression that they are being propositioned by the woman.
> 
> As I shared in my post upwards and I truly know that you agree, is that no one deserves to be raped.   No one
> But there are behaviours of some women which need to be addressed.   It's not fair to the innocent victims of rape who truly deserve to seek and obtain justice in the legal system, yet many of their cases have been deteriorated due to the mishaviours of women who were just plain 'out there' and didn't care how they behaved, where and with whom.
> ...


Youre right  i agree with you that No one deserves to be raped. I find it sad that any attempts to analyze situations and discuss preventive measures is typically characterized in such a way.   

And to piggyback on point you have made, Katt Williams tells a joke about women in the club acting a certain way and then being offended when a man approaches them in a certain way. He said, "you're a ----- over there. I thought you'd be a ----- over here." The language is crass but the point is well taken.


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## Shimmie (Dec 28, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> You're right  i agree with you that No one deserves to be raped. I find it sad that any attempts to analyze situations and discuss preventive measures is typically characterized in such a way.
> 
> And to piggyback on point you have made, Katt Williams tells a joke about women in the club acting a certain way and then being offended when a man approaches them in a certain way. He said, "you're a ----- over there. I thought you'd be a ----- over here." The language is crass but the point is well taken.



Kat Williams is raw but he's telliing the raw truth about raw behaviour.  

And it's not just the ladies in the club.   *Some* of the ladies in Church are misbehavin' for the wrong attention and then cry 'offended'.  And these are not 'newbies' in the pew.  They know better.  

Holy 'Cheese Cakes'....  

I don't want to see or hear of any one getting hurt (raped) for any reason.  When possible that we all render caution by all means necessary.    My prayer is that God's grace continues to fall upon all of us wherever we are in this life.  And the healing of God rests upon those who have been violated.   In Jesus' Name, Amen.


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## LoveisYou (Dec 28, 2011)

Shimmie said:


> t
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@Shimmie I was responding to the idea that "there's always more" I wouldn't necessarily think there is something else going on between a man and a woman who are roommates. I wouldn't make such an assumption or draw such a conclusion.  I don't automatically think "sexual involvement" when I hear of opposite sex roommates. I can't and won't make that call without more. 

I am not debating the "rightness" or "wrongness" of a man and woman living together. I m not debating the risks etc.  I am simply talking about drawing conclusions not based on facts.

I think you bring up some great points to think about, I just wanted to address that particular assumption, which I understand but don't support.


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## Shimmie (Dec 29, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> Shimmie I was responding to the idea that "there's always more" I wouldn't necessarily think there is something else going on between a man and a woman who are roommates. I wouldn't make such an assumption or draw such a conclusion.  I don't automatically think "sexual involvement" when I hear of opposite sex roommates. I can't and won't make that call without more.
> 
> I am not debating the "rightness" or "wrongness" of a man and woman living together. I m not debating the risks etc.  I am simply talking about drawing conclusions not based on facts.



Okay, Please help me to understand exactly what you are sharing.   

For the record, I'm not being confrontational.   I'm just trying to understand the reason for the question of men and women roommates?

Do you agree with a man and a woman (unmarried to each other) living together as roommates?

Do you feel that there are reasons to validate this?   

Are you saying that a man and a woman have a right to live as such and not be 'suspect'?    

I agree that no one should falsely accuse anyone, however, why would a Christian put themselves in such a position of 'suspect'.  God isn't going to place anyone in that position.  

The fact is that it's unnecessary and should never be validated.   It's a human choice which indeed becomes suspect and a lack of faith, that God has better living arrangements for them which will not put them in a position of being tempted or suspected of such.  

This is why 'folks' get messed up, by using rhymns and reasons for doing what the world does and the Church needs to come correct on this deception.  God simply doesn't place us in positions of compromise.  

_Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

James 1:13 _

The word 'evil' is a strong word .... it's not being applied to you.  Okay?  I just want to make that clear.  

Again, this is not controversy nor an afront towards you.  I'm just trying to understand the reason for the question.   

Blessings to you...


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## LoveisYou (Dec 29, 2011)

Shimmie said:


> Okay, Please help me to understand exactly what you are sharing.
> 
> For the record, I'm not being confrontational.   I'm just trying to understand the reason for the question of men and women roommates?
> 
> ...



@Shimmie I am not questioning the validity of a man and woman living together, I have heard both sides of the issue from Christians and actually lean toward your reasoning.

I was simply explaining to you that I was responding to another poster's statement that there is always something more. I don't believe there is always something more, I am careful in making conclusions about people's lives based on assumptions alone - that is the specific issue that I responded to in my second post.  Again I am not debating the validity of opposite sex roommates, I asked a question, someone responded, and I responded to that poster. You responded to my response, and I provided clarification (I hope). That's all.


Blessings to you.


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## MonPetite (Dec 29, 2011)

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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 29, 2011)

LittleGoldenLamb said:


> Perhaps not as clear as you thought.



hmmm. I guess. I just figured since my post was heavy on the drunken behavior comments and situations where you are alone and tempted, that it was clear I wasn't talking about the average situation where someone is accosted at a bus stop or mugged or something. 



> I'm just noting what is "common sense" for one is not for another --sometimes it is because people are willfully missing the obvious, other times it's not as obvious.



You may be right. But deep down I think most people know they shouldn't drink to the point of oblivion.   Maybe they aren't as aware on the other issues like not going to a man's house after a date if you just met him or something lie that.  But I have to wonder why that would even be the case why DON'T they know that?  Is it because instead of teaching women things like that, women want to focus more on labeling rape as an act of dominance and get deep about it and focus on telling women they should be able to go to his house and not have anything happen?


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## Laela (Dec 29, 2011)

You know what is sad about all this? There are men (and women) with questionable character who can put up a good facade. Saying "I'm Christian" is not enough. Sadly, this is how people get shocked and appalled when a 'pastor' or 'uncle' or someone they think they know does something vile to a child or woman.  It's an age-old "secret" in the black community where family members are molesting children and the mothers/girlfriends are looking the other way (sometimes blaming the child) instead of dealing with the issue. "I know why the Caged Bird sings" the book, and "Precious" the movie attempted to address this issue.
Rape is not a sex crime, it's an act of violence by someone who feels they have no control. The devil goes to church, too. 
When Jesus handpicked the 12 disciples, He said "Have I not chosen you, the Twelve? Yet one of you is a devil!". The devil goes to church, too.





nicola.kirwan said:


> I don't think we need to change our view of men.  Women are capable of molestation...but should every woman be treated as a potential abuser?
> 
> There's an element of common sense to it.  *Don't put yourself in situations where you are vulnerable to men whose character you do not know.  Many women are victimized by men they know, but simply knowing a man does not mean he is of good character.  And I wouldn't leave my children with someone just because they're family.*
> 
> Sent from my LS670 using LS670


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## Shimmie (Dec 29, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> @Shimmie I am not questioning the validity of a man and woman living together, I have heard both sides of the issue from Christians and actually lean toward your reasoning.
> 
> I was simply explaining to you that I was responding to another poster's statement that there is always something more. I don't believe there is always something more, I am careful in making conclusions about people's lives based on assumptions alone - that is the specific issue that I responded to in my second post.  Again I am not debating the validity of opposite sex roommates, I asked a question, someone responded, and I responded to that poster. You responded to my response, and I provided clarification (I hope). That's all.
> 
> ...



Okay... I'm sorry for misunderstanding.


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## MonPetite (Dec 29, 2011)

.......................


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## dicapr (Dec 29, 2011)

LittleGoldenLamb, I couldn't have said it better myself.  Yes women make silly and dangerous decisions everyday.  We should teach one another how to stay safe. However, as long as society still views rape as an act of sex rather than a voilent act there will be those who see prevention as part of a woman's responsibility.


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## LoveisYou (Dec 29, 2011)

@LittleGoldernLamb I couldn't agree more! Let every man be responsible for his own actions.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 29, 2011)

*sighs and shakes head*


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## MonPetite (Dec 30, 2011)

...........................


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

There's no degree of powerlessness that we fail to acknowledge. Here's my perspective: 
I'm a practical person. I generally have little tolerance for sitting around and trying to be deep and philosophical about this. I just look at what is happening and desire a solution/remedy.  Having said that, I will be blunt and say that it doesn't matter how you characterize rape. It's a violent sex act. Duh. That doesn't require as much thought or debate as people would like. What does require thought is what women can do to protect themselves. At this point, it's not WORKING to just sit there and say the men shouldn't do it.  That's not accomplishing anything. I believe we would much more progress if women in general would stop trying to be philosophical about it and be more proactive. Teaching women that no matter what, he shouldn't touch you is not getting the job done. They need to be taught, if they don't already know, to be more cautious and careful.  It's not rocket science that he shouldn't rape you.  But I'm sure women see how difficult it is to deal with a rape case in court.  As cold as it sounds, don't give them ammunition to work with.  And if we want to be honest with ourselves, there also tend to be red flags in a  man's character and behavior that women willingly ignore until it's too late.


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## JinaRicci (Dec 30, 2011)

The fact is that you can't control everything that happens to you.  You can take every precaution to reduce your chances but you can't eliminate them.  We live in a progressively sinful world and whether they're Christian or not, you can't control or always predict other people's actions.

You can do everything right and still get run over by a drunk driver in broad daylight (God forbid) and that's a reality with which we have to deal.  What we CAN do is pray for God's protection and mercies while using every ability that He gave us to keep safe.  

No one is saying that a woman shouldn't protect herself.  But this society, especially us women, need to stop believing that men just can't control themselves.  They need to be given back the responsibility for their actions.  You may miss a red flag one day because you're distracted, tired or just simply human.  Is that an invitation?


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

JinaRicci said:


> The fact is that you can't control everything that happens to you. You can take every precaution to reduce your chances but you can't eliminate them. We live in a progressively sinful world and whether they're Christian or not, you can't control or always predict other people's actions.


 
This really is not in opposition to what I'm saying.  But I think some people don't want to even DISCUSS the fact that women SHOULD take more precautions than they do in some cases.   





> You can do everything right and still get run over by a drunk driver in broad daylight (God forbid) and that's a reality with which we have to deal. What we CAN do is pray for God's protection and mercies while using every ability that He gave us to keep safe.


Again, this is true.  But I feel better when I know I have done all that_ I_ can do to prevent a situation.  



> No one is saying that a woman shouldn't protect herself. But this society, especially us women, need to stop believing that men just can't control themselves. They need to be given back the responsibility for their actions. You may miss a red flag one day because you're distracted, tired or just simply human. Is that an invitation?


 
It's not an invitation.  But in many cases, there's typically behavior that has been on display by that man that should give a woman pause.  Still, because people try to be so politically correct all the time, they don't want to be honest about what certain behaviors mean/indicate.


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## SummerSolstice (Dec 30, 2011)

JinaRicci said:


> The fact is that you can't control everything that happens to you.  You can take every precaution to reduce your chances but you can't eliminate them.  We live in a progressively sinful world and whether they're Christian or not, you can't control or always predict other people's actions.
> 
> You can do everything right and still get run over by a drunk driver in broad daylight (God forbid) and that's a reality with which we have to deal.  What we CAN do is pray for God's protection and mercies while using every ability that He gave us to keep safe.
> 
> *No one is saying that a woman shouldn't protect herself.  But this society, especially us women, need to stop believing that men just can't control themselves.  They need to be given back the responsibility for their actions.  You may miss a red flag one day because you're distracted, tired or just simply human.  Is that an invitation*?



 This thread makes it seem as if men are just walking around lurking and waiting for that female that isn't acting chaste enough or something...
If my brother EVER even layed a FINGER on a woman without her permission... I don't care if she was passed out drunk and naked, my father and our family would hold him  FULLY responsible. A penis doesn't make you a violent idiot.
I do however understand everyone's posts about the woman's responsibility.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> There's no degree of powerlessness that we fail to acknowledge.
> 
> Here's my perspective:
> 
> ...



@the 'red' bolded....

Far too often than I'd like to admit, this is true.   Many women 'ignore' the red flags.   

This is not to discredit anyone's feeling's in this thread, I respect what everyone is sharing, however, 'red flag blindness' occurs far too often.   Much of it is among 'Church' women who want so much to be married, and to have a 'man' in their lives.    

Far too often a woman in 'Church' will see these red flags and makes a decision that she can 'fast', 'pray', 'speak the word' and 'change' this man.   

_Pausing for a minute here ....  _ 

I'll be the FIRST to tell anyone that I know that I know, that I know that prayer, fasting, speaking / appling the Word of God does indeed 'change' the hearts of even the coldest heart.    I've been a witness to it.  

However, there is a 'deception' among too many Church women (and some men too, ), that *they* can 'change' a person, however God is not in it and the change does not always take place and if / when a red flag changes into a flag of surrender , the woman has been to 'hades' and back and years of her life and vigor have been sorely spent upon something that God has not called her to.  

It is imperative to 'acknowledge' the red flags, for they will surely stop one's hair growth / let alone their spiritual growth as they are not following God but their own human desires.    Many times the devil will disguise a red flag as a red rose bush, however there are multiple thorns in the midst. 

satan is roaming about seeking whom he may 'trick' and devour.


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## MonPetite (Dec 30, 2011)

...................


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

I'm on my phone and can't type a long response. However the only thing I want to say right now is that your illustration of how a defense attorney would construe working late is miguided.  No jury would get down with that. Certainly not in this economy.


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## MonPetite (Dec 30, 2011)

.........................


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

When I see those "upset" verdicts, there tends to be some element of major irresponsible behavior. I can't recall seeing a rape case where a woman was draggd brought the mud for working late or being mugged or what have you. I also don see the common sense Thing as a slippery slope.   Again I reference the NY rape case against the cops.  I also think about the William Smith rape case.  That woman didn't know him from Adam but because he came from a rich family, she went back to his house in Palm Beach.  Why would a woman do that with someone she doesn't know?  And she caught flack for it during the case. But truthfully some of her actions made it difficult to prove that there wasn't consent.


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## MonPetite (Dec 30, 2011)

...................


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## dicapr (Dec 30, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I'm on my phone and can't type a long response. However the only thing I want to say right now is that your illustration of how a defense attorney would construe working late is miguided. No jury would get down with that. Certainly not in this economy.


 
A better example would be the policy adopted at the hospital where I work.  We are located in a high crime area.  Many men and women have complained about the poor lighting and lack of security provided for employees.  We are instructed to call for an escourt to and from our vehicles during early morning and night hours.  We cannot sue our employer for any crimes that may happen due to our unsafe environment because they provide security (per our contract).  However, security during off hours is scarce and it may be up to 30 minutes before they arrive to escourt you to your work area.  We have a strict no fault late policy-if you are late no matter what the reason it counts against you.  So as a female, I have to make the decision to walk in to work (which is unsafe) to prevent disciplinary actions for tardiness.  The hospital takes the stance that it is my fault for any crime comitted against me because I chose not to wait for an escort. So it is easier than you think for someone doing what is necessary to maintain employment to be turned around to absolve a guilty party of their action.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

dicapr said:


> A better example would be the policy adopted at the hospital where I work.  We are located in a high crime area.  Many men and women have complained about the poor lighting and lack of security provided for employees.  We are instructed to call for an escourt to and from our vehicles during early morning and night hours.
> 
> We cannot sue our employer for any crimes that may happen due to our unsafe environment because they provide security (per our contract).  However, security during off hours is scarce and it may be up to 30 minutes before they arrive to escourt you to your work area.
> 
> ...



dicapr, I'm so sorry that you are facing this injustice.

The hospital is 'wrong'.   They are literally using a double standard and it's not *truly *legal that they cannot be blamed as they are not providing you necessary security for the times needed for the shift changes and designated arrival times for staff to report for work.  

I hate when companies do this hodge podge.   They need to have active, dependable 'structured security' schedules according to the needs of the staff.   It is THEN that they can 'cry' that they are not to blame when a staff person (God forbid) is harmed.     

What's the point of having security if it's not being correctly structured?   They are also responsible for having correct lighting and security cameras which 'fit' the needs of the area where they are located.


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## MonPetite (Dec 30, 2011)

.......................


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> When I see those "upset" verdicts, there tends to be some element of major irresponsible behavior. I can't recall seeing a rape case where a woman was draggd brought the mud for working late or being mugged or what have you. I also don see the common sense Thing as a slippery slope.
> 
> Again I reference the NY rape case against the cops.  I also think about the William Smith rape case.  That woman didn't know him from Adam but because he came from a rich family, she went back to his house in Palm Beach.  Why would a woman do that with someone she doesn't know?  And she caught flack for it during the case. But truthfully some of her actions made it difficult to prove that there wasn't consent.



Do you remember a case (a few years ago) about the 'Dancer' who performed at a fraternity party and was later raped by some of the men who attended?

I can't remember her name, but I think the case turned out against her and I'm more than sure the jury made their decision based upon the following:

She attended the party 'alone' (no escort)
The dance was not a _'Ballet'_ performance.
It was late hours
It was a party where she knew the men would be roudy and drinking.
frat members are known to be 'stupid'.  

If I'm not mistaken, this is what hurt her case.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

LittleGoldenLamb said:


> Agreed. This isn't right.  I'm sorry you're being treated this way, as well.



This hospital is using Bullying tactics against it's employees.   I'd sue them for breach of protection.


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## Laela (Dec 30, 2011)

This..right there 

Excellent point and that is why it's possible to get 'shocked' or 'surprised'. Hearing from God, having a discerning spirit keeps deception at bay. Great word...




Shimmie said:


> @the 'red' bolded....
> 
> Far too often than I'd like to admit, this is true.   Many women 'ignore' the red flags.
> 
> ...


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

Shimmie said:


> Do you remember a case (a few years ago) about the 'Dancer' who performed at a fraternity party and was later raped by some of the men who attended?
> 
> I can't remember her name, but I think the case turned out against her and I'm more than sure the jury made their decision based upon the following:
> 
> ...



I think you're talking about the Duke Lacrosse case.  If so, that was my neck of the woods and it was ugly.   It never went to trial but part of the problem WAS all of the things you mentioned.  The charges were ultimately dropped due to prosecutorial misconduct.  But other than the racial implications, most people viewed her as someone who put herself in harm's way.  

Her behavior was irresponsible. And it made it even more difficult for Nifong to try and prosecute those boys.


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## Rainbow Dash (Dec 30, 2011)

I have skimmed through this thread and agree that women have to protect themselves and no one ever deserves to be raped.

Before coming to the Lord, I remember when I was about 18. I went out with some friends and we met these guys, they seemed nice.  (dumb, I know). Well, we did not have cars at the time and they gave us a ride to their house in the 'country'. We started playing cards and drinking. It was after I got tipsy, that I realized I had put myself in a bad situation. I hoped that somehow we would get out of this situation without being raped. One girl did not drink. She was kind of looking out for us and I believe this is the reason we were not taken advantage of. I tried my best to not go to the restroom or outside of the living room area. After that, I vowed to never put myself in a situation like that again.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I think you're talking about the Duke Lacrosse case.  If so, that was my neck of the woods and it was ugly.   It never went to trial but part of the problem WAS all of the things you mentioned.  The charges were ultimately dropped due to prosecutorial misconduct.  But other than the racial implications, most people viewed her as someone who put herself in harm's way.
> 
> Her behavior was irresponsible. And it made it even more difficult for Nifong to try and prosecute those boys.



NG, that's it.   The Duke Lacorsse case.  Okay.... now I remember the details more clearly.    i remember how it didn't 'win out' for her.  It was a mess.   I pray she's been able to heal from this.   I know she's been 'bricked'  over the head time and again for her bad decisions with this.   

Thanks again for helping me with the details of this.


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## LoveisYou (Dec 30, 2011)

I understand being aware of te devil's tactics and I am not trying to be facetious but not everyone is saved or even Christian. They are NOT aware. So what are those women to do? What are the implications for them? What is our role as Christian women toward these women? Blame them? Accuse them? Is that doing any earthly good?


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## LoveisYou (Dec 30, 2011)

Tho thread is quite unsettling to me....Not because I don't believe women shouldn't be wise and protect themselves but because I sense that some posters are blaming victims of rape. Rape, something that God does not condone.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

Health&hair28 said:


> I have skimmed through this thread and agree that women have to protect themselves and no one ever deserves to be raped.
> 
> Before coming to the Lord, I remember when I was about 18. I went out with some friends and we met these guys, they seemed nice.  (dumb, I know). Well, we did not have cars at the time and they gave us a ride to their house in the 'country'. We started playing cards and drinking. It was after I got tipsy, that I realized I had put myself in a bad situation. I hoped that somehow we would get out of this situation without being raped. One girl did not drink. She was kind of looking out for us and I believe this is the reason we were not taken advantage of. I tried my best to not go to the restroom or outside of the living room area. After that, I vowed to never put myself in a situation like that again.



I've done some unwise things too; I am far from innocent.   Thank God for His undying grace and mercies over my life.    

I'm hardcore on 'prevention' now because some women will not listen and think I'm just being nice and that I'm just looking out for them.     

Ummmmm, no I'm not being nice.  I'm being this   and I'm looking out for them.   

But nice, *No*.   This is too serious for _cupcakes and pink icing._


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## Rainbow Dash (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> I understand being aware of te devil's tactics and I am not trying to be facetious but not everyone is saved or even Christian. They are NOT aware. So what are those women to do? What are the implications for them? What is our role as Christian women toward these women? Blame them? Accuse them? Is that doing any earthly good?


 
Blaming them is like raping them all over again. You can only tell them to use wisdom and discern their surroundings. Using examples of other women who were not 'aware' is a good tool. I was not a Christian at the time of my situation but I could tell that I was in a bad situation.


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## LoveisYou (Dec 30, 2011)

Health&hair28 said:


> Blaming them is like raping them all over again. You can only tell them to use wisdom and discern their surroundings. Using examples of other women who were not 'aware' is a good tool. I was not a Christian at the time of my situation but I could tell that I was in a bad situation.



I do agree prevention is necessary but how do we respond to those who were raped after the rape?


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## Rainbow Dash (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> I do agree prevention is necessary but how do we respond to those who were raped after the rape?


 

The only way we should respond is through love and support. The damage is done and can't be taken back. Even if the person did not use good judgement, it is not okay to blame them. Maybe this is why many women do not report their rape.  I would not dare blame a person for being raped. I would be scared that God would strike me down. That person is torn, the soul has been bruised, and a lot of healing has to take place.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> Tho thread is quite unsettling to me....Not because I don't believe women shouldn't be wise and protect themselves but because I sense that some posters are blaming victims of rape. Rape, something that God does not condone.


 

You know, I'm aware that people have issues with my method of communication.  They think I'm combative and that I try to "start" things.  But honestly, it's posts like this that annoy me to no end.  It has been stated numerous times that no one blames women for being raped.  Why would you continue to say that people ARE blaming victims?  Why are you unable to separate and recognize the difference between blame and taking precautions?  Why must people always have endless discussion about issues of power and dominance when it comes to rape in order for their commentary not to be seen as blaming the victim?  Why can't people view rape cases with a critical eye to protect BOTH parties?


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> I understand being aware of te devil's tactics and I am not trying to be facetious but not everyone is saved or even Christian. They are NOT aware. So what are those women to do? What are the implications for them? What is our role as Christian women toward these women? Blame them? Accuse them? Is that doing any earthly good?



If I can learn from someone else's experience, than trust me, I'm not going to waste time being unsettled when they're trying to save me from something.

As women we do not have to be victims.  Whatever I can learn from to protect myself, I'm going to learn it.   

The very fact that women in any situation can be harmed, is enough for me to learn self-defence meassures and beat the living devil out of any man or woman who may attempt to bring harm on me or someone I care about.

I know what it's like to be beat black and blue; to have my hair pulled out by the roots, to be dragged across the floor, and viciously raped with raw skin and bruises between my thighs, abrasions on my genitals and a broken spirit.   My first husband put me through one abusive attack after another and it was my father who finally came to my rescue to protect me from him.   

I was an innocent victim and was trapped by someone who was cruel and vicious.   I was told by the police that a husband could not 'rape' his wife.  I was threatened day and night that if I went to the police ever again that he would kill me, our two babies and then himself.      Yeah.... I lived through that horror.

I thank God that I was one of the ones who was able to escape as I know that many women do not.   

So please, do not assume that it is thought of in this thread that some women deserve to be raped.    It could not be further from the truth.  

Since my experience, I have learned how to fight back and not be a victim ever again and there are ways for a woman to protect herself.   

Let me point out that I am a 'girly girl' to the utmost.   I am utra feminine, I am not afraid to dress like a woman and flow with all of my feminine attributes.   I'm short, cute and sassy and I love being a woman.    

However, I have the mindset that I am not a victim; I refuse to wimper and cry and run into a corner because of some bully;  that if anyone approaches me wrong, that someone is going down and it's not going to be me.    I won't take foolish chances, however if I have to pick up a stick or a brick and bust someone in the head to protect myself, I will and get forgiveness later.  

Babygirl, please don't allow this to offend you.   Instead, be a fighter; fight for your God given rights to have life and to have that life more abundantly.

Use that 'unsettled' feeling you have to your advantage.   Use it to become your arsenal against being fearful.  Learn to protect yourself.  Even if all you can do is carry a can of wasp spray with you to spray into the eyes of an attacker which allows you space to run to safety.    God is on your side, ride the fear, don't let it ride you.   

Because what this 'unsettled feeling' all comes down to is fear of being a victim, which is quite understandable, but you can have weapons to overcome it.  

As for those who don't know, learn it, pay it forward and teach it to them...


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## LoveisYou (Dec 30, 2011)

Shimmie said:


> If I can learn from someone else's experience, than trust me, I'm not going to waste time being unsettled when they're trying to save me from something.
> 
> As women we do not have to be victims.  Whatever I can learn from to protect myself, I'm going to learn it.
> 
> ...



I am not unsettled because of fear. Thanks be to God I don't struggle with that fear. There is nothing in any of my posts to even suggest that I don't take self-protective measures....nothing. If you knew my testimony you would know I am a fighter, I am nobody's victim because through Christ I am more than a conqueror.

I am unsettled by Christian women blaming victims of rape, that's the only thing that's unsettling to me in this thread.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> I am not unsettled because of fear. Thanks be to God I don't struggle with that fear. There is nothing in any of my posts to even suggest that I don't take self-protective measures....nothing.
> 
> I am unsettled by Christian women blaming victims of rape, that's the only thing that's unsettling to me in this thread.



Okay Love,  tell me who they are.   Who are the Christian women who are blaming victims of rape?   Tell me so that I can set them straight.   

I'm very serious about this.   Who are they?


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

Where's my lawyer?   

"NG' where you at?  I'm officially turning myself into custody. ::


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## LoveisYou (Dec 30, 2011)

No not my style, it's implied in some of the posts in here. I don't want this to be a combative thread, I posted my observations and that's that. This is all I have to say on the topic and in the thread. We don't have to agree but we can do so without bickering. So I'll simply agree to disagree and move on.
Now ladies, have a Happy New Year!!!!


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> No not my style, it's implied in some of the posts in here. I don't want this to be a combative thread, I posted my observations and that's that. This is all I have to say on the topic and in the thread. We don't have to agree but we can do so without bickering. So I'll simply agree to disagree and move on.
> Now ladies, have a Happy New Year!!!!



Happy New Year to you too, and this is not a cliche', I mean it sincerely.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

Shimmie said:


> Okay Love,  tell me who they are.   Who are the Christian women who are blaming victims of rape?   Tell me so that I can set them straight.
> 
> I'm very serious about this.   Who are they?



I would like to know as well.


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## LoveisYou (Dec 30, 2011)

So did I. I really don't want this to turn into a thread where we are at each other's throats, it's just an issue I feel strongly about. I have a passion for fighting for those I believe have been victimized.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

Shimmie said:


> Where's my lawyer?
> 
> "NG' where you at?  I'm officially turning myself into custody. ::



  right here, Shimmie.


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## MonPetite (Dec 30, 2011)

.................


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou said:


> So did I. I really don't want this to turn into a thread where we are at each other's throat, it's just an issue I feel strongly about. I have a passion for fighting for those I believe have been victimized.



LoveisYou

It doesn't have to be combative. But if you are going to accuse people of something so heinous, then you should be willing to be honest about who you are referring to. You're not the only one fighting for victims. That's great that you are passionate but it  doesn't mean you should ignore reality and have tunnel vision either.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

LittleGoldenLamb said:


> Thank you for sharing your harrowing account with us. I did not know you lived through such a thing and it further explains why you have such great wisdom to share with women like myself.
> 
> I find it unnerving that people still think men can't rape their wives. It is as unsettling as thinking a woman has to make a man not rape her, or that she is such the property of someone else that it's a non-issue. Where's the common sense in that?



LittleGoldenLamb, thank you.    God made me an overcomer.  It is God who gets all of the glory.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> right here, Shimmie.



Thanks 'Lady Counselor'.


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## Laela (Dec 30, 2011)

LoveisYou, I don't think  anyone here is blaming the victim (that's not where I'm going with  this). Seems there is more concern for consequences of poor choices than  events happening beyond one's control. No one is _perfect_, and we  all make mistakes. That is why being in tune with the Holy Spirit is  important, and with all the common sense in the world, there are times  the Holy Spirit trumps common sense. For some,  it's: "something told me" or "I feel this strongly in my spirit".  Psalms 91:12 comes to mind.  Can God work with our mistakes? I believe so...

Then, there is this:

I'd heard a testimony from a Christian woman (Lawrence Hilton Jacobs' mom) who was raped in  her home  during an invasion.   She was home, alone. The robber gave  her a choice of being raped or getting killed and she chose to get  raped. I remember her saying she prayed during the ordeal. I'll try to find this testimony for you, because I can't remember what became of the robber. It's a situation many  can easily judge this woman for, in some way; but I remember feeling sad and being confused when she  shared that painful part of her life. She didn't appear bound by this experience; and clearly she didn't live in fear after, but was able to share it with others in a public testimony. Look what happened to Job, yet he remained faithful to God, like this woman did.

 I'll try to see if I  can find her testimony....she'd shared that during a visit to our church when I was a teen.

Happy New Year to you! 



LoveisYou said:


> So did I. I really don't want this to turn into a thread where we are at each other's throats, it's just an issue I feel strongly about. I have a passion for fighting for those I believe have been victimized.


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## Shimmie (Dec 30, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> LoveisYou
> 
> It doesn't have to be combative. But if you are going to accuse people of something so heinous, then you should be willing to be honest about who you are referring to.
> 
> ...



Thank you, because we're all fighting for victims.  I've learned some things in this life; some lessons I didn't appreciate and I have deep regrets.   But I still have to learn from them, mistakes and all.   

I don't know everything, there's a whole lot more I need to know, as each day teaches us something more.   If I can help someone from what I do know, then I'm here to do just that.


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Dec 30, 2011)

this right here is golden...some of us have had some horrendous experiences but God brings healing when we let him...when you can look back at an experience with out pain or bitterness ,you know that you are totally healed from that thing...this is where God wants us to get so we can truly walk in his fulness and real freedom that this walk can bring...




Laela said:


> *didn't appear bound by this experience; and clearly she didn't live in fear after, but was able to share it with others in a public testimony. Look what happened to Job, yet he remained faithful to God, like this woman did.*


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## LoveisYou (Dec 31, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> LoveisYou
> 
> It doesn't have to be combative. But if you are going to accuse people of something so heinous, then you should be willing to be honest about who you are referring to. You're not the only one fighting for victims. That's great that you are passionate but it  doesn't mean you should ignore reality and have tunnel vision either.



I find it difficult to see where you see tunnel vision in my posts especially sine I clearly stated that I believe women should be wise and take preventative measures. I guess perception is indeed reality.....

Where do we draw the line when it comes to rape victims? Is wearing a short skirt a mitigating circumstance? Hanging out with a man without someone else present? Even if "you" think those actions are unwise do they make rape less black and white? Is the act of rape then in a grey area?????? I can't see rape as a balancing act. I can't view it from both sides. It is wrong!!!! Again women should be wise but being unwise certainly doesn't justify or mitigate such a violent act.


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