# Landlord Tenant struggles



## Kanky (May 13, 2021)

So I was reading this story with sympathy for the landlord until I got to this bit. 


> He knew everyone in the room, and their stories were similar to his: Most of them were immigrants who had arrived in Schenectady at its lowest point in the early 2000s, after it had lost half of its manufacturing jobs and a third of its population. The city at that time was blighted by thousands of vacant homes, and instead of spending $18,000 to demolish each one, the mayor had come up with a plan to go to New York City and recruit Guyanese immigrants who had built a reputation for fixing up derelict property. The mayor handed out his cellphone number and offered to sell houses for as little as $1, and more than 5,000 Guyanese began to move. They bought cheap homes, rehabbed them, rented them out, and then started paying property taxes that helped revive the city.



And suddenly I don’t care that the dude who lost his job paid off his debt with his stimulus checks instead of paying rent.  Has the government ever offered to help black people become landlords for cheap?


----------



## dancinstallion (May 13, 2021)

Kanky said:


> So I was reading this story with sympathy for the landlord until I got to this bit.
> 
> 
> And suddenly I don’t care that the dude who lost his job paid off his debt with his stimulus checks instead of paying rent.  Has the government ever offered to help black people become landlords for cheap?



I cant read the story because it is subscription. Can you post it please.


----------



## Kanky (May 13, 2021)

> The battle for 1042 Cutler Street​As landlords and tenants go broke across the U.S., the next crisis point of the pandemic approaches​Eli Saslow
> May 1, 2021
> SCHENECTADY, N.Y. — The landlord had highlighted the first of the month on his office calendar and marked it as “Pay Day,” but now the first had come and gone, the one-week grace period was ending, and for the 13th consecutive month, Romeo Budhoo had collected less than half of his total rent. “Time to try begging for it,” he said, and he grabbed his booklet of receipts and walked out to his car.
> 
> ...


----------



## Kanky (May 13, 2021)

dancinstallion said:


> I cant read the story because it is subscription. Can you post it please.


I posted it. I also really don’t like that the Washington Post used the man’s address in the title of the story.


----------



## Keen (May 13, 2021)

I did not read the full story.  I just read the quote on the initial post.  I fail to see how that has anything to do with landlords not paid rent fmonths across the country but aren’t able to evict tenants.  

Rent is also a contractual agreement just like debt. If someone choose to pay one debt over the other, just understand there are consequences. 

Just because someone took advantage of a government program to own a house, does not mean they are to provide free housing (unless that was part of the agreement).


----------



## B_Phlyy (May 13, 2021)

Keen said:


> I did not read the full story.  I just read the quote on the initial post.  I fail to see how that has anything to do with landlords not paid rent fmonths across the country but aren’t able to evict tenants.
> 
> *Rent is also a contractual agreement just like debt. If someone choose to pay one debt over the other, just understand there are consequences.*
> 
> Just because someone took advantage of a government program to own a house, does not mean they are to provide free housing (unless that was part of the agreement).



I read the article and I see both side but I definitely agree with the landlord.

Even though they can't be evicted right now due to the moratorium, the notifications and court summons are still going to be on the tenant's record. You literally refused to pay anything, for a year? And you don't do basic upkeep on the property? Yes there are tenants right but those rights come with responsibilities. You can't let the property fall into disrepair, especially if you aren't letting anyone in to assess damage (that you likely caused).


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67 (May 13, 2021)

I wondered by the tenant allowed the place to look like that, he is not working and should be responsible for basic upkeep.


----------



## Kanky (May 13, 2021)

Keen said:


> I did not read the full story.  I just read the quote on the initial post.  I fail to see how that has anything to do with landlords not paid rent fmonths across the country but aren’t able to evict tenants.
> 
> Rent is also a contractual agreement just like debt. If someone choose to pay one debt over the other, just understand there are consequences.
> 
> Just because someone took advantage of a government program to own a house, does not mean they are to provide free housing (unless that was part of the agreement).


It doesn’t have much to do with it. I am a landlord. I have been paid throughout the pandemic and I would be trying to get rid of any tenant that didn’t pay. However it was interesting to me that the mayor of this town called this particular group of people and offered them free/cheap houses. I’m sure that there are black people, some of whom are probably living in these raggedy places now, who would’ve liked to own them.


----------



## Kanky (May 13, 2021)

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> I wondered by the tenant allowed the place to look like that, he is not working and should be responsible for basic upkeep.


He is flushing toilet with buckets of water and the ceiling is falling in. That’s not the kind of thing that tenants should be fixing. The slumlord needs to fix that. The tenant should mow the grass and pickup the trash, but I can see why someone using a bucket to flush a toilet might decide that they can’t be bothered.


----------



## Theresamonet (May 13, 2021)

In the beginning of the article it said the landlord paid $79,000 for that house.


> For Budhoo, the essence of his problems came down to one house: 1042 Cutler St., a three-story square box built in 1901, with faded green siding and fresh graffiti spray-painted on the windows. The house had been sold four times out of foreclosure, condemned by the city, and scheduled for demolition when Budhoo first saw it after immigrating to New York from Guyana in the early 2000s. *He’d worked at a nearby pick-and-pack warehouse for $8 an hour and saved up a small down payment toward a $79,000 purchase price. He’d rewired the electricity, gutted the plumbing, installed granite countertops, and begun renting it out for up to $950 per month.* Gradually those profits had paid for more distressed properties, for his daughter’s college degree, and for a small home of his own where her diploma now hung above the entryway. He’d spent two decades growing his business on the first of each month until the pandemic hit Upstate New York.


----------



## Keen (May 13, 2021)

Kanky said:


> He is flushing toilet with buckets of water and the ceiling is falling in. That’s not the kind of thing that tenants should be fixing. The slumlord needs to fix that. The tenant should mow the grass and pickup the trash, but I can see why someone using a bucket to flush a toilet might decide that they can’t be bothered.


Is the tenant withholding rent because the landlord is not making repairs? The tenant has rights.  He/she can call the city or go to court to force the landlord to make repairs.  Even without going to court, if they document well that the landlord refused to make necessary repairs, they are within their right to use the rent money to make necessary repairs (such as ensuring the toilet flushes)

From my experience, non-paying tenants don’t report repairs because they would have to pay rent. 
I’m not excusing the landlord.  You can’t let your property fall apart like that. If a tenant won’t let me in to fix the property, I would sue to evict on the ground the property is not safe to live in.  Many cities are allowing evictions for reasons other than payments


----------



## lavaflow99 (May 13, 2021)

Kanky said:


> I posted it. I also really don’t like that the Washington Post used the man’s address in the title of the story.


Right??  I was shocked that they posted his first and last name and full address!  Like whoa.....maybe it was their technique to help the landlord evict?


----------



## Crackers Phinn (May 13, 2021)

I'm lucky to only have a small percentage of total renters defaulting and I don't expect to recover any of that money.  My income streams are diversified so I'm in a better position to take the hit but I still feel salty about it the same way anybody who is owed money feels. 




That said, as entrepreneurs, none of us are promised security.  It sucks when a business fails, but they do and that's what's happening to landlords who are going broke.


----------



## Keen (May 13, 2021)

Crackers Phinn said:


> I'm lucky to only have a small percentage of total renters defaulting and I don't expect to recover any of that money.  My income streams are diversified so I'm in a better position to take the hit but I still feel salty about it the same way anybody who is owed money feels.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Right! I have one tenant behind in rent.  She still pays something because she knows I’m riding shotgun to the court house to file papers as soon as they start processing eviction. 

She keep saying there’s a pandemic out there.  I ask her for proof of lost income so we can work something out. I know she’s in health care and still working.   That usually follows with her making some type of payment.


----------



## Kanky (May 14, 2021)

Keen said:


> Right! I have one tenant behind in rent.  She still pays something because she knows I’m riding shotgun to the court house to file papers as soon as they start processing eviction.
> 
> She keep saying there’s a pandemic out there.  I ask her for proof of lost income so we can work something out. I know she’s in health care and still working.   That usually follows with her making some type of payment.


Plenty of people decided that this pandemic would be a come up for them. My friend has tenant who has been collecting unemployment that actually increased her income and still not paid a dime. The courts are so backed up that it will probably be this time next year before she can evict her. The tenant told her that she was engaged and saving the money for the down payment on her own house with her new husband.


----------



## Keen (May 14, 2021)

Kanky said:


> The courts are so backed up that it will probably be this time next year before she can evict her.


That’s why my attorney advised me not to file yet if she is paying something.


----------



## TrulyBlessed (May 14, 2021)

Smh




Apartment complex releases statement after woman says she came home to find they had mistakenly evicted her​Brianni Bonner said she came home to find her locks had been changed - and her belongings in the dumpster.​DALLAS — _Updated at 4:31 p.m. Thursday with a statement from the Riviera Apartments._

A single mother who just moved from Chicago said her apartment complex managers mistakenly evicted her instead of the apartment downstairs. 

Brianni Bonner said she came home to her apartment at the Riviera Apartments on Audelia Road in Dallas Saturday morning to find her locks had been changed.

“The maintenance man pulls up, and tells me I’m going to go to jail because it’s against the law for me to get into my apartment,” Bonner recounted

The 23-year-old is a single working mother to her 4-year-old son Izi. She said management made a mistake.

Bonner told WFAA she lives at apartment 1721, and she said management told her they meant to evict 1712.

Thursday, the Riviera Apartments released a statement about the eviction, apologizing for evicting Bonner and saying they are trying to fairly compensate her:

"Since learning about the incident involving Brianni Bonner and her young son our senior management team has been trying to reach out to Ms. Bonner to apologize and address the problems caused when our staff mistakenly emptied the contents of the wrong apartment.

"We want to offer our sincere apologies for the way the situation was addressed once the error was discovered and are attempting to contact Ms. Bonner to discuss how we can fairly compensate her and her son.

"In addition, we are reviewing our procedures to see if additional safeguards or training are necessary to help make sure this type of incident is not repeated."

Bonner said management told her they made "a big mistake."

“She told me it was a big mistake, it was an accident. They meant to evict the apartment underneath me, but they evicted me by accident,” Bonner said, adding that she found her belongings in the trash, including her medication for PTSD and anxiety. 

“I can’t even explain to you the depression it’s caused,” Bonner described.

Bonner said most of her things were taken, with the rest dumped in the dumpster, including her son's teddy bears. She called Dallas police to file a report.

“I feel like everything was taken from me," she explained. "It doesn’t feel like home anymore."





Credit: Courtesy

A North Texas woman says her belongings were stuffed into trash bags after being wrongfully evicted from her apartment.

On Wednesday, WFAA went to the apartment complex to try to speak with the management. We called two times, and emailed them twice, as well. WFAA finally made contact with the property manager at the leasing office, but they did not want to make a comment. But, Bonner said management tried to compensate her.

“She told me, all they would be able to do for me is to give me a $200 Visa debit card. It was definitely a slap in the face,” Bonner said.





Credit: Provided

A North Texas woman says her belongings were stuffed into trash bags after being wrongfully evicted from her apartment.

Hours later, Bonner said she was allowed to get back into her apartment, but it was empty. 

"They had repainted,” she said.

Bonner said she has been left traumatized and is trying to get back on her feet.

“I’m paying my rent, I’m trying to save up to go to school. It’s so stressful, and I have to start all over,” she said.

Bonner set up an online fundraising campaign, hoping to at least buy toys, and the necessities her son.









						Apartment complex accused of mistakenly evicting Dallas woman claims it was a result of a maintenance mix-up
					

Brianni Bonner said she came home to find her locks had been changed - and her belongings in the dumpster.




					www.wfaa.com


----------



## lavaflow99 (May 14, 2021)

Kanky said:


> Plenty of people decided that this pandemic would be a come up for them. My friend has tenant who has been collecting unemployment that actually increased her income and still not paid a dime. The courts are so backed up that it will probably be this time next year before she can evict her. The tenant told her that she was engaged and saving the money for the down payment on her own house with her new husband.


Umm that’s not how it works though…..  You don’t stop paying rent in order to save for your own home. 

Where are these people raised?  Whatever happened to self respect and obligation to duty?  I understand if you don’t have the money at all to pay. But you are now receiving a higher income and not pay?  Lawd…


----------



## Crackers Phinn (May 14, 2021)

> On Wednesday, WFAA went to the apartment complex to try to speak with the management. We called two times, and emailed them twice, as well. WFAA finally made contact with the property manager at the leasing office, but they did not want to make a comment. But, Bonner said management tried to compensate her.
> 
> *“She told me, all they would be able to do for me is to give me a $200 Visa debit card. It was definitely a slap in the face,” Bonner said..*


How could somebody let this come out of their mouth?


----------



## Keen (May 14, 2021)

Crackers Phinn said:


> How could somebody let this come out of their mouth?


I don’t know about Texas, but in FL they owe her a month rent for changing the locks.  Possibly another month rent for removing her stuff.  She needs to contact legal aid.


----------



## Kanky (May 14, 2021)

Keen said:


> I don’t know about Texas, but in FL they owe her a month rent for changing the locks.  Possibly another month rent for removing her stuff.  She needs to contact legal aid.


This is still not enough. Her stolen items are probably worth a lot more than a couple of months rent. I hope that she sues them and gets a lot more. The $200 gift card offer was just insulting.


----------



## Crackers Phinn (May 14, 2021)

Kanky said:


> This is still not enough. Her stolen items are probably worth a lot more than a couple of months rent. I hope that she sues them and gets a lot more. The $200 gift card offer was just insulting.


$200 would buy a week or so worth of groceries that she would bring back to a kitchen with no pots, pans, plates, utensils, storage containers to cook, eat or store the food with.  People acquire lots of stuff over time.  I think it would easily cost $3K-5K minimum to replace everything in a 1-2 bedroom _lived in_ apartment even if you bought everything including mattresses at Walmart.


----------



## Kanky (May 14, 2021)

Crackers Phinn said:


> $200 would buy a week or so worth of groceries that she would bring back to a kitchen with no pots, pans, plates, utensils, storage containers to cook, eat or store the food with.  People acquire lots of stuff over time.  I think it would easily cost $3K-5K minimum to replace everything in a 1-2 bedroom _lived in_ apartment even if you bought everything including mattresses at Walmart.


This! And if she had nice things then it could be 5 or 10x that. I wonder if she has renter’s insurance and if that would cover this kind of thing.


----------



## TrulyBlessed (May 14, 2021)

Nah apology not accepted until I’m fully compensated. I hope she’s not one of those meek passive people to just let stuff slide. I would’ve at least thrown a chair against the wall.


----------



## Crackers Phinn (May 14, 2021)

This was timely. 

*Dear Quentin,*

One of my oldest friends of 30 years rented an apartment from me for 8 years. She stopped paying rent during the last year when she started her own business. She kept saying she would pay me back, but by the time she moved out 3 years ago, she owed me more $20,000 in back rent and stopped taking my calls when I tried to collect it.

Out of the blue she texted me on my birthday last week, and said she missed me and would like to be friends again. However, her texts mentioned nothing about paying me back. I have already made peace with the lost money, and lost friendship, but I’ll bring up the back rent if we do speak again, which will probably be the end of that.

So what should I do? What should I say?

Bad Blood


*Dear Bad Blood,*

“...and I miss my $20,000.”

If your friendship is that important to your friend, she should have led with her amends. The price of that is $20,000. The most interesting, if not surprising, thing about her text message is that it focused on how she feels and her needs. It does not address the harm she has done to your friendship — possibly irrevocably.

U.S. states have a dollar limit on small-claims court cases. Unless you live in Delaware, Texas or Tennessee, it seems that your dispute with this friend exceeds that amount in other states. But that also speaks to the amount of money she pocketed. It’s a lot of money, and it should not be brushed off so lightly. Think again about taking legal action.

Enough texting. Meet her face to face. Tell her that you had to pay the mortgage while she lived there rent-free, and remind her that she is not the only person with financial responsibilities and that she abdicated her duty to you as a tenant and as a friend to pursue her needs. She used your friendship as leverage to scam free rent.

She cannot repair the friendship until she has repaid the debt.


----------



## awhyley (May 16, 2021)

TrulyBlessed said:


> Nah apology not accepted until I’m fully compensated. I hope she’s not one of those meek passive people to just let stuff slide. I would’ve at least thrown a chair against the wall.



She should have walked up in there with her lawyer.


----------



## TrulyBlessed (May 16, 2021)

Hopefully this is code for I have consulted with an attorney


----------



## naturalgyrl5199 (May 17, 2021)

The biggest problem is what Crackers mentioned upthread, diversification of income. Or LACK OF

Many people have ALL their income in rental properties, which will ALWAYS be subject to health of housing in the country. Many MANY landlords are actually able to handle this pandemic because they receive income elsewhere. They are digging into their savings and paying the taxes and upkeep with an understanding that they will evict immediately when allowed. These landlords are also the ones able to afford to take them to small claims court (lets say the tenants cause some serious damage and due harm) or take the time to push things into collections for wage garnishment. For me, if you are verified to still be working cause you are in healthcare, then YES, I will be pushing all legal ramifications for wage garnishment and to move things into collections. Working folk pay taxes and their bosses pay payroll taxes so income can be traceable. THOSE FOLK are looking for a come up and are (like many people) using misinformation to get over. But the bill ALWAYS comes due. So in 5 years they gone wake up and realize their credit is jacked because some owed money is sitting in collections. Especially when they try to rent a new property or buy a home. And Landlords can remind their working folk about this. Or, their tax refund that year will be really low.

The other problem is---millions of renters are already on the EDGE of homelessness. Like one check away from it. And this pandemic was it. 
The gov. knew it and made the moratorium. With no relief for landlords...because like the city above, those land taxes are good revenue and keep city workers (police, firemen, etc.) paid and working....and they never extended help to landlords who are now taking out loans to pay them. Poor folk don't understand that land lords have a lot of other bills to pay to keep the renters in the homes outside of receiving rent. Finally, you base a GOOD chunk of your livelihood on renting to poor folk, and yeah, you ASKING for disaster. And yeah, like any other business....renting for income is a business subject to utter failure in a perfect storm of disasters. High risk = Higher reward.


----------



## Kanky (May 18, 2021)

naturalgyrl5199 said:


> The biggest problem is what Crackers mentioned upthread, diversification of income. Or LACK OF
> 
> Many people have ALL their income in rental properties, which will ALWAYS be subject to health of housing in the country. Many MANY landlords are actually able to handle this pandemic because they receive income elsewhere. They are digging into their savings and paying the taxes and upkeep with an understanding that they will evict immediately when allowed. These landlords are also the ones able to afford to take them to small claims court (lets say the tenants cause some serious damage and due harm) or take the time to push things into collections for wage garnishment. For me, if you are verified to still be working cause you are in healthcare, then YES, I will be pushing all legal ramifications for wage garnishment and to move things into collections. Working folk pay taxes and their bosses pay payroll taxes so income can be traceable. THOSE FOLK are looking for a come up and are (like many people) using misinformation to get over. But the bill ALWAYS comes due. So in 5 years they gone wake up and realize their credit is jacked because some owed money is sitting in collections. Especially when they try to rent a new property or buy a home. And Landlords can remind their working folk about this. Or, their tax refund that year will be really low.
> 
> ...


This is why I rent to middle class people and people in the military. They pay their bills and are not living on the edge financially. Of course the properties are not the type where you can get a house for $1 and then have someone using a bucket to flush the toilet but still sending you a check every month. I would be too ashamed to do that to someone, and it takes a lot to shame me when it comes to making money.  

If I were going to rent to poor people then I would rent to section 8 folks because at least the government will make sure that you get your money. But the government will also insist that you make basic repairs, so that’s probably why the landlord in the OP didn’t do that.


----------



## Kanky (May 18, 2021)

lavaflow99 said:


> Umm that’s not how it works though…..  You don’t stop paying rent in order to save for your own home.
> 
> Where are these people raised?  Whatever happened to self respect and obligation to duty?  I understand if you don’t have the money at all to pay. But you are now receiving a higher income and not pay?  Lawd…



I told my friend that even if the freeloader is not planning on paying the military might make her fiancé pay up after they get married. I know that military folks have to pay their bills to avoid trouble, but IDK if they’d make him pay for something his wife did before they got married. Still worth a shot. Suing probably won’t help because they are in Florida.

She only admitted to all of this after someone saw her post about getting over on Facebook and told the landlord that she isn’t actually broke. The replies to the post were mostly people congratulating her on her come up, so I guess duty and obligation are dead.


----------



## naturalgyrl5199 (May 18, 2021)

Kanky said:


> Plenty of people decided that this pandemic would be a come up for them. My friend has tenant who has been collecting unemployment that actually increased her income and still not paid a dime. The courts are so backed up that it will probably be this time next year before she can evict her. The tenant told her that she was engaged and saving the money for the down payment on her own house with her new husband.


If that was my tenant I'd explain to her that if you served the eviction now, she'd have a hard time getting a job and a loan in the future.  If your friend serves her now, the time WILL come eventually and it will be a mark against her credit as well.

Many people are super super ignorant of the facts regarding how and what types of things can ruin credit. I know people to this day are learning that apartments they abandoned showed up as evictions on their credit.

I tell new employees all the time: working for us, we do a preliminary background, which is enough to get you the job....but we do a deeper hit about 60 days in and boy, people have lost their jobs for not disclosing stuff or the evictions and past frauds they committed 10-20 years ago that shows up to haunt them now.


----------

