# Are vision boards Demonic



## humility1990

I'm leaning towards thinking vision boards may be demonic, because some people tend to make idols out of their desires. I would love to hear your opinions and maybe some scriptures about this please.


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## LifeafterLHCF

Just my little 2 pennies I feel as long as ppl aren't worshiping a piece of cardboard with magazine cutouts then it can be used as a reminder of goals one wants to hit.At times we need a visual reminder daily like those who have crosses on their walls as a reminder of our amazing father Jesus Christ did for us to spare our souls..ok I'm sorry just got happy about our daddy.

Now if one is into this law of attraction stuff that looking at magazine cutouts will manifest their dream of that Black Bentley coupe with the pink and green interior and that amazing baby toe length hair then that's where we have any issue.We need to be in constant presence of God in order to keep a balance of the desires and the real purpose of our life.


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## MamaBear2012

I think that it's important to have a vision. In fact, the Bible says "Where there is no vision, the people perish..." Proverbs 29:18. When DH and I were going through pre-marital counseling, our pastor asked us to create a vision statement for our family, our finances, our careers, etc. He wanted it to be detailed because without that vision, you're just going through life with no purpose. Or you make decisions that aren't in line with where you want to go or what you want to do.

I think that you get off track when you start to focus on that vision thinking that you can do it in your own strength. Or that you can provide for yourself. So, no I don't think vision boards in themselves are bad, as long as you keep them in perspective (as with most things).


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## BostonMaria

I have a vision board and whatever I'm trying to manifest I back it up with scripture. 

For example I wanted to manifest good credit so I put that on my board and I loosed it in heaven and earth by holding on to Deuteronomy 15:1 and the law of debt cancellation (I hope that's the right verse). I want to finish grad school next year so next to a picture of a cap and gown I added proverbs 2:2-11. 

The law of attraction isn't something that the world invented. These principles are discussed throughout the bible.  You have to have a vision and faith if you want something in your life whether its a house, peace in your household, or to be healed. Jesus said "Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours." (Mark 11:24 NIV)


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## Livingmylifetothefullest

BostonMaria ....I agree with everything she wrote


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## Sharpened

The only way to answer that question is by evaluating the issue with another question: is it about advancing His Kingdom or self?


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## Laela

ITA... Our Father supplies all my needs, if I seek His Kingdom and His righteousness first... he takes care of the birds, how much so Man. Had to repeat that to hubby this weekend... 




Nymphe said:


> The only way to answer that question is by evaluating the issue with another question: is it about advancing His Kingdom or self?


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## Shimmie

humility1990 said:


> I'm leaning towards thinking vision boards may be demonic, because some people tend to make idols out of their desires. I would love to hear your opinions and maybe some scriptures about this please.



You've 'sensed' (discerned) the spirit behind this activity. 

Word of Caution:   'Manifest'

Purpose and Intent:   'To manifest material items' (fleshly desires).  

Soul:  "Self" -  

Heart: _ I am manifesting ; So that I can manifest;  I want to manifest_ ....

Where is the heart of a Christian who joins with 'others' who do not have a Godly heritage nor are they in relationship with Jesus?  

Vision boards are from the laws of attraction practice, where 'self' is god and self is the manifestor of one's carnal desires.     Carnality is all up in the spirit and content of these vision boards and to apply scripture makes it no less carnal. 

witches and voo doo priests use vision boards and objects to represent their subject and object they desire to prey upon.  Its part of the practice to have a symbol / proxy to accomplish their goal.    

It may not be a Chrisitian's intent to practice witchcraft however, when they post a picture with the 'intent' to 'manifest' it into their lives or the life of someone else, it's witchcraft.  It's the practice of 'self-will'.   They are literally _seducing_ the desired object/item to come to life into their life.   

Again, this may not be a Christian's intent, however this is exactly what they are doing.  The key words:  "manifest" and "I".    God is no where in it; especially if Christians have 'joined' themselves in this practice with those who are not Christians, the ungodly. 

As I shared earlier, a Christian can apply any and all of the scriptures they want to their boards, however if God were in it, they wouldn't need to post a scripture, let alone post pictures or have a board in the first place.

Those who oppose God already 'know' that they don't need God's presence for a 'vision board' to work, because it is 'self will' and they've been working their self will all along without God...

Genesis 11:6*

...and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have IMAGINED TO DO. ... 

God has given us a far better Vision which is Him and in Him is all Provision and all Manifestation for every need and desire in our hearts for our lives.

The world has to 'steal' from God, and they do so with 'darkness';  but as His children, we don't.  Every desire is His desire to fulfill for us, far better from Him than a counterfeit.  As His children, we get to commune with Him, one on one.  The world doesn't have this, yet we do.   

What a gift, far beyond a vision board.  

Lord, thank you, that our only vision is 'you' and your love for us which will always be far beyond any 'vision' and beyond any measure of any piece of 'board'.   Your dreams for us will never perish, nor will your love.

The world doesn't have this, we do.   

Selah...*


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## Guitarhero

I think that hard work is the basis of success, as well as ability.  Where one is lacking, one should ask Creator.   Given that the difference between christians and non-christians is the personal relationship with the Divine Presence amongst us, Jesus, we have a deeper sense that everything in our lives matters, even the small things.  We can ask Him everything according to His will.  The world doesn't comprehend this and fashions other ways to come to success.  There's nothing wrong with positive thinking and good effort, but we know that christians will be ostracized for even the notion that where there is lack, one can ask the Father.  I guess when you have that closeness with Him, it's not ridiculous in the least and it certainly doesn't mean G-d is deaf nor incapable.  We sometimes do not have because we do not ask.  Ask.....HIM.  And that goes for everything, including a good spouse.  I have stories from people who weren't christians at all but asked G-d to help them...and He did.  I mean, to the letter of what they asked for.  The stories are encouraging.  And it's not just truly "christian" to put your life into the Father's hands...it goes back long before...back to Genesis.  Just make sure that, in the vision, He is the focus.  No hocus-pocus.


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## blackberry815

This is a good thread... I def was about to get a vision board... Now i feel like i have to think on it a bit longer

Sent from my ADR6400L


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## RoseTintedCheeks

BostonMaria said:


> I have a vision board and whatever I'm trying to manifest I back it up with scripture.
> 
> For example I wanted to manifest good credit so I put that on my board and I loosed it in heaven and earth by holding on to Deuteronomy 15:1 and the law of debt cancellation (I hope that's the right verse). I want to finish grad school next year so next to a picture of a cap and gown I added proverbs 2:2-11.
> 
> *The law of attraction isn't something that the world invented. These principles are discussed throughout the bible.  You have to have a vision and faith if you want something in your life whether its a house, peace in your household, or to be healed. Jesus said "Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours." (Mark 11:24 NIV)
> *
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using LHCF



Yes Yes Yes!


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## Shimmie

RoseTintedCheeks said:


> Yes Yes Yes!





No, No, No!

Please do not be deceived, for God is not mocked.

I promise you and everyone else that I am belittling anyone who believes in the practice of vision boards and the practice of loa which is the base of it.  I speak as one who cares, for satan is out to steal, kill and to destroy and he begins by distracting one's focus from depending upon and looking unto God for the needs / desires of their lives.  This mode of witchcraft has gone too far in the lives of too many who call themselves Christians.  

It's time to put an end to it; for it is compromising the faith to which we have been called.  

Everyone whom I've noticed who sings the praises of having a vision board and justify Christians who use of the laws of attraction, are using these principles for 'Material' gain, which is not spiritual growth. 

When God says to 'Meditate upon His Word both day and night" (Book of Joshua), He is speaking of meditating for spiritual growth not for 'mammon' which is all I see the mis use of God's Word.  

No one needs a vision board nor practice loa to grow in the Lord, in His wisdom, in His Godliness, nor in His Holiness.   

The only purpose a vision board, participation in loa manifestations serves to to increase one's carnal desires.   The vision and loa 'shopping' or 'wish lists' speaks clearly of this.  Quite clearly.

I'm not putting anyone down for having desires in their lives for there are indeed material things in this life that have a purpose.  But what is motive and the heart behind the desire?

Christians should not be in the company of those who do these practices and practicing with them.   For what they are saying is that their faith in God is not only weak, but of no use to them.    Why else would they have a vision board or practice loa?    Why else, when God says that when we delight ourselves in Him that He will give us the desires of our heart... and to those in a trusting and real relationship with Him this is exactly what one does.   

If we are the Light of the World than we are to be the example of what it means to have God on our side who will and does indeed always provide.  We do not do what the 'world' does, we do not have to.   We have a higher calling and a higher standard and a higher principle and most indeed a higher God whom we serve and we as Christians do not have resort to the world's deceptions which are in truth the world's rejections of God Himself.  

Not once have I ever been denied what I've asked God for.   Not once.  God honours His Word when He says, that His promises to us are Yay and Amen.  

God honours His Word when He says, "Every good and precious gift comes from Heaven above."

God honours His Word when He says, "Ask of Me and I WILL show you great and mighty things which you know not." 

This false representation that loa are God's principles is just that... a false representation.   Those in God should know better.   The loa principles, the rules of engagement of loa have a different leader.   God is no where in the practice of loa...no where.   Christians who are intwined with loa are intwined with witchcraft and gimme gimme spirits.  

To those who insist upon defending loa and choose it, than do so, however stop trying to put God in it, for He is not.  God does not have partnership in the works of satan.   They are not business partners.   God's headquarters are of Heaven, satan's are of hell.   God is no where present in the acts of loa thereof.   

If Christians (who defend loa) were using God's principles than why are they not just asking God one on one, instead of 'sleeping' with the enemy without a condom; opening their souls to loss of immunity from other deceptions ... loa is a satanic ritual disguised otherwise.  It is a seducing spirit of those who are not tightly knit with the Spirit of God.  

'We' as Christians have to wake up and see what is behind what we are seeking and where it's coming from.   Wake.... UP!!!  satan has ALWAYS abused the laws of God to deceive the very ones who say they are God's children.   As the accuser of the brethren, satan stands before God and points at those he has 'taken in' with his wiles and lies saying.... 

_Hmmppp!  I told you she / he was weak.   Now they're over here with me bowing to my methods, my rules.  They show no faith in asking you as you have instructed them to...they do not trust you, they trust in themselves and me...deceptively."   _

You do not have to agree with me... not at all.   The truth is God is not in this.  He is not into 'self', He is not into idolatry, He is not into long distance relationships... nor does He share hearts with other gods.    

He IS GOD and there is none other.   We are to 'seek' HIM, not satan, but to seek God All Mighty Himself, for it is He who have made us and not we ourselves.  

I love this scripture and it is indeed a heart to heart wake up call...

How long will you halt between two opinions?  If baal (loa, satan, vision boards) be god.....serve him.    

If God be God....

Serve Him

How long will you halt between two opinions?   

Who is your Provider?  Who died for your soul?  

Who do you trust?

No man can have two masters...he will serve one and hate the other. 

Who is it?


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## Shimmie

Guitarhero said:


> I think that hard work is the basis of success, as well as ability.  Where one is lacking, one should ask Creator.   Given that the difference between christians and non-christians is the personal relationship with the Divine Presence amongst us, Jesus, we have a deeper sense that everything in our lives matters, even the small things.  We can ask Him everything according to His will.  The world doesn't comprehend this and fashions other ways to come to success.  There's nothing wrong with positive thinking and good effort, but we know that christians will be ostracized for even the notion that where there is lack, one can ask the Father.  I guess when you have that closeness with Him, it's not ridiculous in the least and it certainly doesn't mean G-d is deaf nor incapable.  We sometimes do not have because we do not ask.  Ask.....HIM.  And that goes for everything, including a good spouse.
> 
> *I have stories from people who weren't christians at all but asked G-d to help them...and He did.  I mean, to the letter of what they asked for.  The stories are encouraging.  *
> 
> And it's not just truly "christian" to put your life into the Father's hands...it goes back long before...back to Genesis.  Just make sure that, in the vision, He is the focus.  No hocus-pocus.



God's loving mercy was upon them.... And God does this just to show that His love is not discriminating.   He loves all, no matter, God loves all. 

Yet, to enter into His Kingdom, in spite of their prayers in need, they must confess the Lord Jesus Christ.


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## Guitarhero

Thing is, we don't know where it is applied in the spiritual realm.  Someone unknowing at all can still go to heaven but that it was paid for in advance by you know who.


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## Shimmie

Guitarhero said:


> Thing is, we don't know where it is applied in the spiritual realm.  Someone unknowing at all can still go to heaven but that it was paid for in advance by you know who.



As I respond, this is not coming against you in disrespect nor disharmony. 

I want to make a strong point to 'Be careful with this' perception, as it can be misleading...it 'implies' that Jesus is not the 'only' path into God's kingdom. 

In connection, 'you know who' is a 'dismissal' of God's importance.   His Name is Jesus, not you know who. 

Shared in love...


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## Nice & Wavy

There is so much crap being added to this forum on a daily basis....

WHAT YOU COMPROMISE TO KEEP.....YOU LOSE!

I just can't right now.....


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## Guitarhero

Shimmie said:


> As I respond, this is not coming against you in disrespect nor disharmony.
> 
> I want to make a strong point to 'Be careful with this' perception, as it can be misleading...it 'implies' that Jesus is not the 'only' path into God's kingdom.
> 
> In connection, 'you know who' is a 'dismissal' of God's importance.   His Name is Jesus, not you know who.
> 
> Shared in love...



I understand what you mean..but that is not what I'm pointing to.  We speak differing languages.  The debt was paid but G-d is always compassionate.  None of us deserve it.  The life we live knowing Him here on earth is more complete.  He still shines on those who do not know Him in this completed faith.  We do not know at what point that those who lived according to the righteousness (on their hearts) they knew and abided by will meet Him....at the moment of death or shortly after.  We simply do not know.  None of us determine heaven or hell, we can only abide in the good He has commanded since the beginning of time.   When He told us to be Jesus to one another, it was to all people, not just christians. When anyone helps the poor, that person is being Jesus, no matter His religion and He never overlooks it.  This is a point that many christians miss about Jesus.  We followers to the faith like to draw lines but He opened the temple curtain of the H-ly of H-lies.  I fell like this will be ill-received or thought of as it will be misunderstood.  But I only say it to demonstrate that no christian can move G-d's hand, it moves of its own accord and we have His instructions.  We are to live that faith until the end and rest upon His promise and hope of salvation.   We are to share it, not force it.  He certainly realizes that not all mankind will hear of Him before they die.   Our waiting and hoping while living out the faith as best we can is one way to humble us until the last moment where we receive final grace.  But that not all who are in heaven will have lived as christians.  We will be absolutely surprised at who goes to heaven.  Some we thought should be there will not be and those we just knew who wouldn't go might have a higher place than ourselves.


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## Sharpened

I strongly recommend Watchman Nee's book, The Latent Power of the Soul.


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## MariposaSexyGirl

I know I'm never in here , but imo loa and vision board fall under the law of faith. Faith is a law just like gravity is a law. Everyone has access to use this law( from witches to Christians to satanic cults). It can be used for good and for bad. God tells about the law of Faith all through the bible. What matters is how you use this law of faith. Because you will be judged on how you use it when that time comes.

Sent from my Sprint EVO using LHCF app


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## ladylibra_30

If one's "visions" are pure in mind/heart; it is not demonic.


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## CarefreeinChicago

I have about 10 bible verses on mine which I stand their and read them very day. So, no I don't believe them to be demonic.


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## makeupgirl

I don't believe vision boards are demonic unless you choose to make that the god of your life and idolize it, then at that point it's sin but I wouldn't say demonic (seems really far fetch to call it demonic).  To me, a vision board is just a photographic goal sheet or a collage if you will.  Other than that, my opinion is muted.  If God has placed it on your heart to not have a vision board, then listen to him and don't have one.


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## RoseTintedCheeks

Shimmie Maybe different people have different ideas of the purposes of this because it's become so popular among non believers. LOA/vision boards, to me, is just the name non-believers give to the power of Faith. The Bible says death and life are in the power of the tongue, and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof. The act of speaking forward fruition in your life is nothing new regardless of how it's advertised. We need only the faith of a mustard seed to move mountains, and when I am blessed with the breakthrough I have been praying for, I give all of my praise to the Lord.  

Having a strong faith as your foundation is crucial because you don't want to forget that God takes us through trials and tribulations.  Find the Job in you and praise Him anyway.  You can't be sitting around wondering why the "LOA" isn't working like it used to and getting depressed.  That's a weak show of faith in HIM.

The world gives up when their LOA/vision boards/luck seems to run out.  Christians are supposed to stay strong and remain soldiers for the Word.


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## Shimmie

RoseTintedCheeks said:


> Shimmie Maybe different people have different ideas of the purposes of this because it's become so popular among non believers. LOA/vision boards, to me, is just the name non-believers give to the power of Faith. The Bible says death and life are in the power of the tongue, and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof. The act of speaking forward fruition in your life is nothing new regardless of how it's advertised. We need only the faith of a mustard seed to move mountains, and when I am blessed with the breakthrough I have been praying for, I give all of my praise to the Lord.
> 
> Having a strong faith as your foundation is crucial because you don't want to forget that God takes us through trials and tribulations.  Find the Job in you and praise Him anyway.  You can't be sitting around wondering why the "LOA" isn't working like it used to and getting depressed.  That's a weak show of faith in HIM.
> 
> The world gives up when their LOA/vision boards/luck seems to run out.  Christians are supposed to stay strong and remain soldiers for the Word.



RoseTintedCheeks .. this is not directed at you personally.   I want to make this clear.   

If one has true 'mustard seed faith' which moves mountains, then why the need to be involved in the practice of loa, vision boards and the like?

How it's 'advertised' or not...the practice of loa has nothing to do with the Word of God for it has taken off in a whole different direction which is far from Him and His Word.   

There are laws in the earth, therefore I'm fully aware of 'speaking' things into being and the power behind it which is a power that has been God - given.   Everything in this earth is God given,* yet *there is misuse, sin and abuse of it.  

"The Church" is in danger of falling away from God's presence.  To be more truthful, God is turning away from many who call themselves Christians.  

Why?  Because they do not 'need' Him.   God's Word has been taken so far out of context --  to the higest degree, all because of 'you can 'speak' things into existance (the power of the tongue (James 1), you can have what you say (Mark 4:22-23), there is much more and  I KNOW "ALL" of them, by heart.  So many of these scriptures are being abused under the guise of standing on God's Word.   When God's Word says 'write the vision', it has nothing to do with a vision board.  Nothing.

  ...yet this scripture has been desecrated, along with many others and there are Christians who are literrally interracting with those in the world as if they have no faith or relationship at all with the Lord.   And for a Christian to say they are with the world as a witness to them, who are they kidding?  The world and the devil and GOD know exactly why they are there; it is because their faith is in the world and not in God.  

One huge danger is that Christians become so engrossed into this pattern of 'manifesting' their speciic desires, that the only reason they go to God's Word is to obtain another Scripture to bring about their item list which is 'abuse' and misuse for 'their' glory and not Gods. 

I know all about 'confessing' the word, believe and receive, name it, claim it, stand on the Word..... just who are folks fooling?    It's a game and folks who are in it can defend it all they want, it's still a game and God is not fooled by it.  

It's is only because He is God and because He will not go back on His Word, that folks have been getting away with this.  They have robbed His storehouse of promises and laws which govern the earth, are using His goods for their own desires, without regard to their true meaning. 

God is nof fooled by the numerous 'justifications'.   The writing is still on the 'wall' of their vision boards and more so upon their hearts. 

What ever happen to just sitting before the Lord and just talking to Him?  Asking Him what in His plan and what you can ask Him for?   All of this 'vision' practice has nothing to do with building a relationship with God, how can anyone do this, they are instead building a list of what they want and envisioning upon it and not upon God is the Keeper and the Creator of the True vision that He has for our lives.  

Be careful of what you defend...be careful.  Defending loa as a principle of God is still misleading.  Too many Christians are taking this as 'validation' and in the process they are straying from God and building their faith upon THEIR personal desires; not God's ... but for what they want for themselves and then say God is in it when He is indeed not.   

That's a huge problem and a misleading which is beyond dangerous.  Just because 'one' is thanking God doesn't mean He's in what they are doing.   They have simply 'worked' a principle which works for both the 'just and the unjust'.  Just admit that one is doing what they want for themselves and stop trying to extort validation where it does not exist. 

God has called us to develop and enrich our relationship with Him, for as His Word says, 

_ "If you abide in Me, and My Word abides in you...than you can ask what you will and it shall be given..."  _

Pleae hear me, I am not saying that you have the heart of the world; I am simply making it clear that there are no options to this plain and simple.  

I have the heart and the mind of Joshua... _ 'Choose you this day whom you will serve, as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord. ' _

There are too many people who are not being taught to develop a close and true relationship with the Lord.  This is why prayers are not being answered... no connection, the wires are loose/disconnected.

The principles of loa and the focus of vision boards are not building a relationship with God, instead it is a wedge and a complete disconnect. 

I didn't grow up in the Lord, with a vision board.... I  bowed my head and prayed and watched God do exploits in my and my loved ones lives.   The same for my children.  They were taught to stay in constant communion with the Lord, build upon their relationship.   Anything else is a distraction and a watered down version of being under His Blood. 

There are no shortcuts for Christians... you mentioned trials and tribulations, that's where a strong relationship is built with God, not board games and witchcraft.


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## mieshashair

I am Christian and hv been been saved along time, not saying I'm perfect by NO MEANS! I was just reading over the comments and I want to say that I once three years ago was introduced to LOA and I got pretty intrigued with it and wanted to know more about it. I bought the secret and watched it and read the book, but I noticed I kept getting an unsettling spirit about it but I kept going. I made vision boards etc. But I NEVER seen any types of manifestation from it. About 3 weeks ago I had in depth discussion with some ppl about it and realized it was NOT of God!!! I then immediately threw away everything I had in my home that was related to the LOA!!! If u noticed they gv god NO reverence to God they believe u hv the power to manifest things on your own and if that were the case we would not hv the need to go through Jesus and there would be no need to pray and ask God for anything because we wouldn't need him we could manifest it ourselves. Now we are to hv faith and trust that God can bring our desires according his will to pass in our life. Anything that does not reverence God/Jesus and leaves him out is NOT of him. And if u/it r not with God then it/u r against God.

If u find that u r offend by what I just typed then it's time to do some self inventory and seek God to make sure u r making wise decisions in your beliefs


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## RoseTintedCheeks

Shimmie  So do you think vision boards and such are diverting people away from going to God in prayer?  I see what you are saying, and I am going to pray about it.  I don't want to be hard-hearted.

mieshashair "﻿﻿Anything that does not reverence God/Jesus and leaves him out is NOT of him. And if u/it r not with God then it/u r against God."  << This is true now.

I definitely see where you all are coming from.


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## Shimmie

RoseTintedCheeks said:


> Shimmie  So do you think vision boards and such are diverting people away from going to God in prayer?  I see what you are saying, and I am going to pray about it.  I don't want to be hard-hearted.
> 
> mieshashair "﻿﻿Anything that does not reverence God/Jesus and leaves him out is NOT of him. And if u/it r not with God then it/u r against God."  << This is true now.
> 
> I definitely see where you all are coming from.



Indeed loved one... 

Think about it.   Believing God takes faith and learning to trust Him.   Only a solid relationship with Him can do that.     

This foolishness with vision boards, and the loa 'defense' is of man, not God.  Abraham, Moses, Joshua, the prophets of the Bible, spoke to God directly.  They had a 'relationship' directly with him.   All they had to do was speak and God moved on their behalf.   

In the heat of the battle, Joshua was able to say, Sun _stand ye still, moon don't you move..._until the battle has been won.   

It didn't take a vision board to do so; Joshua believed the promise and the command that God gave Him to fight the battle and win it.  

satan knows the principles of God's laws of nature.  As children made in the express image of God, we have been given the ability to create andmake things happen, however, one can get so caught up in 'making their own' Destiny, that God becomes a distant 2nnd in their focus.  

Self power is 'addictive' and it makes one become their 'own' god and not depend upon the one true God who is our Father in Heaven.  

Watch how those 'addicted' to vision boards, defend what they are doing.  Watch...'listen' to their words and their defence.   Not one word of admission that God is not in it, neither is there one word of repentence for putting something before God.   They don't want to let go of their fleshly desires.   They don't believe that God has better for them; they don't care what God has, it's all about what 'they' have specified and nothing else. 

If you ever look at the language that the vision board users speak and the list upon their boards...it's all about self and 'want' and nothing about honoring a growing and inter-dependent relationship with God the Father; and one does not need a vision board to establish a relationship with Him.    

The preachers who teach and support this activity are misleading people 'away' from God and not towards Him as their provider and keeper.  God's gifts are without repentence, why not become solely tied up in Him and allow Him to be the one who blesses.  

You're a good heart "RoseTintedCheeks"...you are open to God's leading as you choose to please Him first and only. 

You are so right about vision boards failing people (from your earlier post); for they will not hold up in a storm.  They will fall apart and their faith will be drowned along with the 'paper' board and faded pictures...

With God, the wind and the waves...'Be Still'...

God bless you.


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## makeupgirl

I'm having a Rose Nylund moment.  What does LOA means?


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## hair_rehab

^^^^It stands for Law of Attraction.


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## Guitarhero

mieshashair said:


> I am Christian and hv been been saved along time, not saying I'm perfect by NO MEANS! I was just reading over the comments and I want to say that I once three years ago was introduced to LOA and I got pretty intrigued with it and wanted to know more about it. I bought the secret and watched it and read the book, but I noticed I kept getting an unsettling spirit about it but I kept going. I made vision boards etc. But I NEVER seen any types of manifestation from it. About 3 weeks ago I had in depth discussion with some ppl about it and realized it was NOT of God!!! I then immediately threw away everything I had in my home that was related to the LOA!!! If u noticed they gv god NO reverence to God they believe u hv the power to manifest things on your own and if that were the case we would not hv the need to go through Jesus and there would be no need to pray and ask God for anything because we wouldn't need him we could manifest it ourselves. Now we are to hv faith and trust that God can bring our desires according his will to pass in our life. Anything that does not reverence God/Jesus and leaves him out is NOT of him. And if u/it r not with God then it/u r against God.
> 
> If u find that u r offend by what I just typed then it's time to do some self inventory and seek God to make sure u r making wise decisions in your beliefs




I was up early this morning watching t.v. and some minister named Popoff came on.  It seems to me that his ministry is based upon LOA.  I heard no salvific story of anything, just getting miracle water and having him write a letter of prophecy to contributors to his ministry.  In other words, it was a prayer in exchange for money - a lot of money!  There were people who had been praying for answers to their mortgages etc. (I know some might be plants and fake) but this is attractive to the hurting.  In a large sense, I believe they were putting their sights on material needs and somehow imagining them to be fulfilled...via Popoff.  Of course, everything comes from G-d.  But if we divert our trust in Him, it might be through evil.  I'm not saying that holy water, prayer cloths etc. are wrong, they are biblical.  But I suspect that ministries like that are basically focused on a type of LOA with the "christian" stamp of approval on it.  Essentially, it seems to be name-it-claim-it, which is LOA in many regards.


----------



## Shimmie

makeupgirl said:


> I'm having a Rose Nylund moment.  What does LOA means?



   Hi  makeupgirl....

ummm,  now it's my turn:

Who's Rose Nylund?     I'm serious who is she?


----------



## Shimmie

Guitarhero said:


> I was up early this morning watching t.v. and some minister named Popoff came on.
> 
> It seems to me that his ministry is based upon LOA.  I heard no salvific story of anything, just getting miracle water and having him write a letter of prophecy to contributors to his ministry.
> 
> In other words, it was a prayer in exchange for money - a lot of money!  There were people who had been praying for answers to their mortgages etc. (I know some might be plants and fake)
> 
> *but this is attractive to the hurting.  *
> 
> In a large sense, I believe they were putting their sights on material needs and somehow imagining them to be fulfilled...via Popoff.  Of course, everything comes from G-d.
> 
> But if we divert our trust in Him, it might be through evil.  I'm not saying that holy water, prayer cloths etc. are wrong, they are biblical.
> 
> But I suspect that ministries like that are basically focused on a type of LOA with the "christian" stamp of approval on it.  Essentially, it seems to be name-it-claim-it, which is LOA in many regards.



@ the bolded.   That's exactly what the game is...attracting the 'hurting' and the desperate; taking full advantage of them.    

Why not do this for free?   I'm serious.   Practice what they are preaching.   They're seducing people to give their all so that God can bless them.   Well the truth is this...if they gave as they direct others to give, wouldn't they also reap the same blessings?    

Stop taking people's money!  

*Clarity:  *   Not you, Guitar, I was referring to the 'Preachers' who are gulity of fleecing God's sheep.   

Your post speaks volumes.


----------



## cinnespice

Shimmie
Lol rose nylund was one of the characters on golden girls played by betty white. 
She was kind of dense in the head at times. 


Shimmie said:


> Hi  @makeupgirl....
> 
> ummm,  now it's my turn:
> 
> Who's Rose Nylund?     I'm serious who is she?


----------



## Guitarhero

As you can see, there's lots of clarity ...my faith is fine...
\



But I was so disgusted.  And the way they look into the camara, guilting people to send them 1700.00.  Ok, so your mortgage is in trouble and G-d has told Popoff to tell you to send him 1700 bucks so that he can hear from G-d that you'll be blessed with 10,000 bucks via Popoff's holy letter?    Um, dood, trust in Jesus anyway...pray for a change anyway...but if you have 1700 bucks and are in foreclosure danger, you might wanna contact the bank, make 1/2 the payment, apply for mortgage relief, buy groceries, medicine, pay other bills...rather than a faith witness to pay Popoff and HOPE that G-d honors your stupidity.  How wretched are those who prey on the poor, sick and hurting!  Does anyone consider that they are just one dime in a stack of hundreds of thousands sending in 1700.00?  

This is where I think people get into trouble mostly...they fret and become vulnerable to thieves.  I'm not calling Popoff a thief, I'm questioning him and anyone else who demands a large sum of money for G-d's blessing to ensue.  Secondly, they fall into the prosperity gospel where LOA is quite active.  G-d does give us riches...but some He keeps poor and sick for His own reason.  There is much blessing in suffering and who knows how much G-d uses their faith and pain to magnify His own for the benefit of folks we will never know?  We don't know.  We are to trust and WORK for our needs, believing Him...but if it's "no", then it's "no."  Where's there's an impasse or lack, when we have honestly given it all or are absolutely incapable, TRUST...there is G-d in the gap anyway, always.   

 G-d has certainly worked miracles in my life and I know there are some who are appalled, surprised, shocked and downright jealous...but He honored my prayers.  We're to trust in Him but use our *common sense*.  We've lost our ability to use our common sense thereby allowing people to abuse us.  We now believe in mumbo-jumbo such that it wasn't our own hard work that helped us achieve things?  Sure, you sow well, you reap well but this goes beyond that principle (prosperity gospel that's now secular).

My eyes were opened to this before I converted to the Church.  Sometimes, you'd listen to those convincing ministers and want to believe.  They use psychology and "magic" to reel people in.  How many of them are left cold and hungrier than when they came?  Those are fakes to make you believe.  And Popoff uses BLACK people for those erplexed  Look at the hordes of Latinos, Blacks of all nationalities, Hmong/Laotian and Russians in those audiences.     But anyhoo, draw your house, make a playset, plan and work but if it crosses into the realm of you willing such, you've gone to far.


----------



## Shimmie

cinnespice said:


> Shimmie
> Lol rose nylund was one of the characters on golden girls played by betty white.
> She was kind of dense in the head at times.



Hey!  I know who she is now...


*"Betty White" ...  *


The Lone Golden; she's the only one left.   She had all of the funny stories about the farm and her former husbands.  

cinnespice ...    Thanks Love...    I guess I was having a Rose Nylund moment of my own...


----------



## Shimmie

Guitarhero said:


> As you can see, there's lots of clarity ...my faith is fine...
> \
> 
> 
> 
> But I was so disgusted.  And the way they look into the camara, guilting people to send them 1700.00.  Ok, so your mortgage is in trouble and G-d has told Popoff to tell you to send him 1700 bucks so that he can hear from G-d that you'll be blessed with 10,000 bucks via Popoff's holy letter?    Um, dood, trust in Jesus anyway...pray for a change anyway...but if you have 1700 bucks and are in foreclosure danger, you might wanna contact the bank, make 1/2 the payment, apply for mortgage relief, buy groceries, medicine, pay other bills...rather than a faith witness to pay Popoff and HOPE that G-d honors your stupidity.  How wretched are those who prey on the poor, sick and hurting!  Does anyone consider that they are just one dime in a stack of hundreds of thousands sending in 1700.00?
> 
> This is where I think people get into trouble mostly...they fret and become vulnerable to thieves.  I'm not calling Popoff a thief, I'm questioning him and anyone else who demands a large sum of money for G-d's blessing to ensue.  Secondly, they fall into the prosperity gospel where LOA is quite active.  G-d does give us riches...but some He keeps poor and sick for His own reason.  There is much blessing in suffering and who knows how much G-d uses their faith and pain to magnify His own for the benefit of folks we will never know?  We don't know.  We are to trust and WORK for our needs, believing Him...but if it's "no", then it's "no."  Where's there's an impasse or lack, when we have honestly given it all or are absolutely incapable, TRUST...there is G-d in the gap anyway, always.
> 
> G-d has certainly worked miracles in my life and I know there are some who are appalled, surprised, shocked and downright jealous...but He honored my prayers.  We're to trust in Him but use our *common sense*.  We've lost our ability to use our common sense thereby allowing people to abuse us.  We now believe in mumbo-jumbo such that it wasn't our own hard work that helped us achieve things?  Sure, you sow well, you reap well but this goes beyond that principle (prosperity gospel that's now secular).
> 
> My eyes were opened to this before I converted to the Church.  Sometimes, you'd listen to those convincing ministers and want to believe.  They use psychology and "magic" to reel people in.  How many of them are left cold and hungrier than when they came?  Those are fakes to make you believe.  And Popoff uses BLACK people for those erplexed  Look at the hordes of Latinos, Blacks of all nationalities, Hmong/Laotian and Russians in those audiences.     But anyhoo, draw your house, make a playset, plan and work but if it crosses into the realm of you willing such, you've gone to far.



Guitar:  You have good sense... and a whole lot of questions... 

Regarding your observation with the Popoff followers.   They can't do that.  What happens when Popoff is too old to continue or when he dies, then what?     

Those poor people are so broken that it's just like you said, ministries like his 'attract the hurting people' who are so lost in their hope and hurts that they get lured into his web of misdirection.      

If he were truly sent of God, he'd be leading the people to God completely and without a fee.   I don't like that.  

I am a strong Believer in supporting Ministries financially, it is a principal and a direction from God.   But too many people are being mislead and taken advantage of and it's just wrong.    

I'm glad you brought this up as it ties in with the lures of the loa... people who are desperate and weak in faith.


----------



## Rainbow Dash

Why would a Christian need LOA? 

Where do your desires actually come from? Is it based on God's will for your life or your own will for your life?

It seems to me, that LOA is a wish whatever you like, you can be, have and experience whatever you can imagine, all your desires come from you. 

The bible tells us that the steps of a righteous man are ordered by the Lord.

When we consider our walk here on earth we need to commit or shall I say trust in the Lord in all ways and concerning all things. 
Psalms 37:3,4,5,&7 

Proverbs 3:6 
In ALL your ways acknowledge Him, and He SHALL direct your paths. 

There is only one God and in Him we find truth and everlasting life through Christ. 

Seek first the Kingdom and His righteousness and all these things will be added to you.


----------



## makeupgirl

Shimmie said:


> Hi  @makeupgirl....
> 
> ummm, now it's my turn:
> 
> Who's Rose Nylund?  I'm serious who is she?


 
Hi Ms. Shimmie 

Rose is a character on Golden Girls.  She a little out there and scatterbrain but very sweet.


----------



## makeupgirl

Guitarhero said:


> As you can see, there's lots of clarity ...my faith is fine...
> \
> 
> 
> 
> But I was so disgusted. And the way they look into the camara, guilting people to send them 1700.00. Ok, so your mortgage is in trouble and G-d has told Popoff to tell you to send him 1700 bucks so that he can hear from G-d that you'll be blessed with 10,000 bucks via Popoff's holy letter?  Um, dood, trust in Jesus anyway...pray for a change anyway...but if you have 1700 bucks and are in foreclosure danger, you might wanna contact the bank, make 1/2 the payment, apply for mortgage relief, buy groceries, medicine, pay other bills...rather than a faith witness to pay Popoff and HOPE that G-d honors your stupidity. How wretched are those who prey on the poor, sick and hurting! Does anyone consider that they are just one dime in a stack of hundreds of thousands sending in 1700.00?
> 
> This is where I think people get into trouble mostly...they fret and become vulnerable to thieves. I'm not calling Popoff a thief, I'm questioning him and anyone else who demands a large sum of money for G-d's blessing to ensue. Secondly, they fall into the prosperity gospel where LOA is quite active. G-d does give us riches...but some He keeps poor and sick for His own reason. There is much blessing in suffering and who knows how much G-d uses their faith and pain to magnify His own for the benefit of folks we will never know? We don't know. We are to trust and WORK for our needs, believing Him...but if it's "no", then it's "no." Where's there's an impasse or lack, when we have honestly given it all or are absolutely incapable, TRUST...there is G-d in the gap anyway, always.
> 
> G-d has certainly worked miracles in my life and I know there are some who are appalled, surprised, shocked and downright jealous...but He honored my prayers. We're to trust in Him but use our *common sense*. We've lost our ability to use our common sense thereby allowing people to abuse us. We now believe in mumbo-jumbo such that it wasn't our own hard work that helped us achieve things? Sure, you sow well, you reap well but this goes beyond that principle (prosperity gospel that's now secular).
> 
> My eyes were opened to this before I converted to the Church. Sometimes, you'd listen to those convincing ministers and want to believe. They use psychology and "magic" to reel people in. How many of them are left cold and hungrier than when they came? Those are fakes to make you believe. And Popoff uses BLACK people for those erplexed Look at the hordes of Latinos, Blacks of all nationalities, Hmong/Laotian and Russians in those audiences.   But anyhoo, draw your house, make a playset, plan and work but if it crosses into the realm of you willing such, you've gone to far.


 
Popoff is probably one of the top false prophets out here (yep I said it).  When I go through my insomnic phrases, sometimes I turn the channel and it's always on BET for some reason, Popoff, Kerney Thomas, and a few others with the prayer cloth, healing water, schemes to get you to pay them money by claiming that God will bless you, etc....Oh my heart is bleeding from the torture of them scaming people from their own glory.  The just use God as an excuse to cover up their scheming nature.  

I get so tempted sometimes to call them up from that 800 number they provide and call them out.  It's annoying to us who truly are in Christ spreading his gospel knowing that Satan got his folks doing the same thing but evil purposes.  

The trip thing is, maybe it's me the fraud investigator talking but common sense will tell the people to not send money to these people.  But also, if they were really of God, why think that a prayer cloth or healing water will work?  That's just a slap in the face to God.  It's with Christ stripes we are healed.  Not man's.  God said he would supply all of our needs according to his riches and glory in Christ Jesus.  

At this point, I don't know what's worse, False Prophets on TV trying to scam people out of money by pretending to be for Jesus or the Nigerian scheme.  

Don't get me started on Pat Robinson.  My mom loves to watch 700 club.  But that name it and claim it stuff. Yeah right.  How in the world do we or can anyone tell another person, they are already healed or they are going to do this or that?  We don't know the mind of God.  He is the only one that can determine when we are healed, when this or that will happen.  Why not people just go to Jesus directly?  He has the best open door policy and we dont' take advantage of it enough.


----------



## makeupgirl

Now, I'm totally changing my mind about the vision board....Father forgive me for thinking about it and thank you that I never got around to making it.  Now I know why.


----------



## Guitarhero

makeupgirl,

Thank you.  I was like...???????HUH??????   Can you imagine spending an early morn waking up way to early in front of that?  The only other alternative was Tracy  Morgan exercise something...Cindy Crawford...diamonds for 29.99   So, I thought, why not watch this religious program.    Why don't they investigate this man?  But I know I'm getting off topic...but I sure saw a link to what he's doing and this prosperity "gospel" which borders LOA.erplexed  I'm all for positivity and hardwork, having a vision in your mind or plans for the future, rather, of where you wish to go/do but when it touches on the occult in some way willing it to yourself from the cosmos...(and I see it that way because it is devoid of divine providence), it's problematic for believers.  Open-door policy...that was a good one!!!!


----------



## Shimmie

Nice & Wavy said:


> There is so much crap being added to this forum on a daily basis....
> 
> WHAT YOU COMPROMISE TO KEEP.....YOU LOSE!
> 
> I just can't right now.....



I missed this post.... and it's a good word.   

My daughter and I share a similar statement:   

_Whatever you compromise to get, you will ultimately lose.  _

They both go hand in hand...    When a person compromises to get something, they end up compromising even more to 'keep it', for there is no security in what they have gained and how they obtained it.  

I feel so sad; so many people are losing out on knowing the true love of God.


----------



## Shimmie

Health&hair28 said:


> Why would a Christian need LOA?
> 
> Where do your desires actually come from? Is it based on God's will for your life or your own will for your life?
> 
> It seems to me, that LOA is a wish whatever you like, you can be, have and experience whatever you can imagine, all your desires come from you.
> 
> The bible tells us that the steps of a righteous man are ordered by the Lord.
> 
> When we consider our walk here on earth we need to commit or shall I say trust in the Lord in all ways and concerning all things.
> Psalms 37:3,4,5,&7
> 
> Proverbs 3:6
> In ALL your ways acknowledge Him, and He SHALL direct your paths.
> 
> There is only one God and in Him we find truth and everlasting life through Christ.
> 
> Seek first the Kingdom and His righteousness and all these things will be added to you.



They feel defeated in their faith and give up.   loa gives them a false sense of control and 'safety' .

You posted some beautiful promises from God's Word.


----------



## Shimmie

makeupgirl said:


> Hi Ms. Shimmie
> 
> Rose is a character on Golden Girls.  She a little out there and scatterbrain but very sweet.



Thanks Loved one...  

She's a hoot.


----------



## Shimmie

kinchen said:


> I have about 10 bible verses on mine which I stand their and read them very day. So, no I don't believe them to be demonic.



But why do you need Bible verses on a vision board?  God is enough all by Himself; He doesn't need to be on a vision board to prove His love for you.  

Why not read the Bible verses off the board instead?   Draw closer to God beyond the board which He is not upon.  

It may 'seem' okay, but it's not okay.   Baby, you're 'mis-using' God's Word to bring about your material desires.  

No condemnation... I promise you.  No condemnation.   I've simply 'been there' and I know about visions boards and their distractions from being close to God.  It gives you a false sense of 'control' and power to produce your desires without having to ask God or to even include Him.   

With a tight relationship with the Lord, there is no need for a vision board.   They are not compatible.   God does not play 2nd to anyone or anything.  It's all Him or nothing.


----------



## Shimmie

mieshashair said:


> I am Christian and hv been been saved along time, not saying I'm perfect by NO MEANS! I was just reading over the comments and I want to say that I once three years ago was introduced to LOA and I got pretty intrigued with it and wanted to know more about it. I bought the secret and watched it and read the book, but I noticed I kept getting an unsettling spirit about it but I kept going. I made vision boards etc. But I NEVER seen any types of manifestation from it.
> 
> About 3 weeks ago I had in depth discussion with some ppl about it and realized it was NOT of God!!! I then immediately threw away everything I had in my home that was related to the LOA!!! If u noticed they gv god NO reverence to God they believe u hv the power to manifest things on your own and if that were the case we would not hv the need to go through Jesus and there would be no need to pray and ask God for anything because we wouldn't need him we could manifest it ourselves.
> 
> Now we are to hv faith and trust that God can bring our desires according his will to pass in our life. Anything that does not reverence God/Jesus and leaves him out is NOT of him. And if u/it r not with God then it/u r against God.
> 
> If u find that u r offend by what I just typed then it's time to do some self inventory and seek God to make sure u r making wise decisions in your beliefs



Beautiful testimony Miesha... 

God wants to give us so much..... of Him.    

The loa and all of it's distractions and deceptions are a means to take away our focus from God's love for us. 

In Psalm *91, God shelters us under His feathers and under His wings do we trust.    It's under HIS wings, do we trust.    He spreads His wings and gathers us safely unto Himself to love and protect us.    He hides us from the enemy and provides all that we need or could ever desire.     

Nothing else in this life can do this, nor is the world willing to give us anywhere need what God's love wants to give us.   

We who dwell in the secret place of the Most High...shall abide under the shadow of the All Mighty.   And we will say of the Lord, He is our Refuge, and our Fortress, Our God in whom do we trust.   

His Name is Jesus... *L*ord *O*f *A*ll 

The only LOA one will ever need.   Jesus is Lord of All.


----------



## proverbs31woman

Shimmie said:


> As I respond, this is not coming against you in disrespect nor disharmony.
> 
> I want to make a strong point to 'Be careful with this' perception, as it can be misleading...it 'implies' that Jesus is not the 'only' path into God's kingdom.
> 
> In connection, 'you know who' is a 'dismissal' of God's importance.   His Name is Jesus, not you know who.
> 
> Shared in love...




I agree.  Very well put!


----------



## Laela

Thanks button not enough. Dreams and visions that come from God will be realized/fulfilled and won't fail, because they align with God's will. He never fails.







Health&hair28 said:


> Why would a Christian need LOA?
> 
> Where do your desires actually come from? Is it based on God's will for your life or your own will for your life?
> 
> It seems to me, that LOA is a wish whatever you like, you can be, have and experience whatever you can imagine, all your desires come from you.
> 
> The bible tells us that the steps of a righteous man are ordered by the Lord.
> 
> When we consider our walk here on earth we need to commit or shall I say trust in the Lord in all ways and concerning all things.
> Psalms 37:3,4,5,&7
> 
> Proverbs 3:6
> *In ALL your ways acknowledge* Him, and He SHALL direct your paths.
> 
> There is only one God and in Him we find truth and everlasting life through Christ.
> 
> Seek first the Kingdom and His righteousness and all these things will be added to you.


----------



## joy2day

I haven't read all the responses (and please forgive me if some of what I say has already been said), but I totally agree with @Health&hair28. It appears that practioners of loa and many of the people that use vision boards are essentially worshipping the attainment of the material things posted on the boards, whether they be in line with God's plan for their life or not. Once upon a time, I was almost caught up into believing that "God will give me anything that I ask Him, if I just believe and have faith" i.e. Prosperity Movement, which is just as deceptive as loa and these vision boards. The truth that I came to is as follows:

1.) If I truly want God's plan and purpose for my life, God is not going to give me any thing that I am not ready for, or that is not for me to have - period. As stated in a post above, if I am seeking His Kingdom and His righteousness, I don't have to put a picture of a house up on a board that I want, God will add the *right* house to me! I can testify to this, because he has done that in my life!

2.) It is possible for the enemy to set me up, confuse and cause me to stumble in pursuit of material wealth and possesions when I forget that God is the one who provides ALL *good* things for us (in His Will). Once we start down this path, and we attain "things" that seem good, and then we want to put God in it, but God never provided any of this stuff to begin with. Scripture states, "What does it profit a man to *gain the whole world*, and *lose his soul*." Therefore it must be possible to amass material wealth, gain influence and power, do amazing things, live an amazing life, and yet still lose your soul in the end. That is incredible when you really meditate on that. People like Oprah are prime example. She has wealth unimaginable, but what does she really have if her soul is lost? Yet, she loves to half quote scriptures and talk about God being "good." Yes, God is good. But, there is only One Way to Him, and if you try to come to Him any other way, you are lost. All the good works and good deeds and nice and luxurious stuff on this planet can't help you...

...And the universe certainly can't do anything for you either. 

(ETA: for those ladies (and gents) who use vision boards according to Habbakuk 2:2, a vision board is cool as long as it is based on a *vision which has ben inspired and given of the Lord.* Seemingly, this is not the norm though, which is why it is great that we are sharing this info.


----------



## Laela

^^^ joy2day, I enjoyed the testimonial! 

I think you mean *Joel 2:28*?
_And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions_

Blessings and The Blessing are not the same thing. Amein~


----------



## joy2day

^^ Actually, that was supposed to say Habbakuk 2:2, thank you for pointing that out! I'mma fix it.


----------



## dicapr

I don't do "vision boards" but I have always found it helpful to write down my goals and what I am working toward.  Right now in my mirror I have words of encouragement to help me stay positive about my life right now.  I think it is how something is used not what is actually being done.  Believing these having these goals before me will draw them into my life is not of God.  However, looking in the mirror at my haggered face and seeing the post-it with the affirmation that "I will have success" or that "I will complete my degree" are positive reminders.  I see nothing wrong with that.  They are nothing more than the belief in an answered prayer.  This is not a practice of LOA but it could be seen as a vision board-Affirmations for what I pray my future will be.


----------



## Jynlnd13

All I can say right now is, I got way to wrapped up in LOA. I was getting confused and thinking I could do it myself, and kind of pushing God to the side. Don't get me wrong, I still loved God, I was just thinking I could manifest stuff myself. Next thing I know, I'm in the hospital with a rare agressive stage 4 cancer that had doctors confused and crying for me, because they were,'t sure what to do ( I'm 20, btw a youngin lol ) My mom and I stopped anything LOA that second, I was in the hospital for months, so my mom threw my vision board and journal away for me. I believe this was a test of faith for me. God healed me after two chemo treatments and on my last cat scan every tumor was gone. I had them on my cervix and uterus, and also nodules on my lungs that how far the cancer had spread. I will never again mess with LOA in thinking I am in control. I lean and rely on God and by the stripes of Jesus I am healed. The whole experince humbled me and def. turned me away from LOA. It is not for me, I will do what God's word says. I'm too blessed to get caught up in that again.


----------



## Guitarhero

^^^It's one of the things that the world cannot comprehend about faith in Jesus...reliance upon Him.  Doesn't mean we don't act, working toward the goal, but that we have reliance first and foremost on Him for all the process.  Great explanation of why it didn't work out for you.


----------



## ellebelle88

I think that if you think about the world today, you can relate anything to God or God's plan and you can make anything related to the Devil. I've seen it done countless times. People put their own spin on things according to the way they see the world.

I fail to see how putting your goals on a board and asking God to give them to you is a sign of worshiping the Devil or someone other than God. We all have a purpose on this Earth and I think we should be actively working towards it while carrying out God's work at the same time. Just like church may be a reminder for you, visionboards can be daily reminders for someone else. Remember --- God helps those who helps themselves. For me, my vision board is to keep me proactive and never complacent. I have things on there that I want to do like volunteer, learn to be happy, and pray more. None of those have to do with material things.

Sometimes I think people need to step outside of their boxes because what you are doing is boxing God in himself. God isn't as one-dimensional as many of you think. And I also hate when people give God human characteristics and tendencies. Please think of your God as much more powerful and creative.


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

BostonMaria said:


> I have a vision board and whatever I'm trying to manifest I back it up with scripture.
> 
> For example I wanted to manifest good credit so I put that on my board and I loosed it in heaven and earth by holding on to Deuteronomy 15:1 and the law of debt cancellation (I hope that's the right verse). I want to finish grad school next year so next to a picture of a cap and gown I added proverbs 2:2-11.
> 
> *The law of attraction isn't something that the world invented. These principles are discussed throughout the bible. You have to have a vision and faith if you want something in your life whether its a house, peace in your household, or to be healed. Jesus said "Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours." (Mark 11:24 NIV)*
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using LHCF


 
My vision board helps me stay in faith for the things God has promised me. When I get discouraged, I look at my board and I KNOW that it has already been done. 

LOA, helped me to be more positive in my thought life, I truly believe there is power of life and death in the tongue.(Proverbs 18:21)  I am more active in trusting God, because of the words I am speaking and my thought life. I only want to be around people who are speaking life!!! Anything that manifests in my life, I know without a shadow of a doubt is was not my own doing.  God work that thing out for me.


----------



## nerdography

ellebelle88 

I couldn't have said it better myself. I use vision boards, but I don't just put material things on there. I put my favorite quotes from the bible, pictures of my family and quotes from Christian ministers that speak to me. 

We all have a unique relationship with God. We are all different and our journey to with him will be different as well. If you don't like something it doesn't make it of the devil. At one point in time people believed chocolate to be a temptation of the devil, and we all know that isn't true. 

God created this universe that we live in, that shows that He is not limited. As humans we need to stop trying to box God within the limitations of man. I talk to God everyday and ask him to bless the things that I want for myself wheather that be spiritually, mentally, emotionally or physically. And if I want something that isn't good for me then I ask for guidance and direction to the place I need to be. 

I find that having a vision board helps me weed out all the unnecessary things and focus. I believe that through my faith and works I will be blessed.


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## Sharpened

nerdography said:


> @ellebelle88
> 
> I couldn't have said it better myself. I use vision boards, but I don't just put material things on there. I put my favorite quotes from the bible, pictures of my family and quotes from Christian ministers that speak to me.
> 
> We all have a unique relationship with God. We are all different and our journey to with him will be different as well. If you don't like something it doesn't make it of the devil. At one point in time people believed chocolate to be a temptation of the devil, and we all know that isn't true.
> 
> God created this universe that we live in, that shows that He is not limited. As humans we need to stop trying to box God within the limitations of man. I talk to God everyday and ask him to bless the things that I want for myself wheather that be spiritually, mentally, emotionally or physically. And if I want something that isn't good for me then I ask for guidance and direction to the place I need to be.
> 
> I find that having a vision board helps me weed out all the unnecessary things and focus. I believe that through my faith and works I will be blessed.


The one thing people do not understand about idolatry is that it always ends up being about "me, me, me"...what I think is best...oh, look at how good I am...see how successful/blessed I am... Every time Israel thought she could do what the world does and worship the Father, her husband, He taught her otherwise, multiple times. Just because God ordered a brass serpent to be made and hung to heal people does not mean He wanted it to be an thing of worship.

Did the Father tell anyone to do this? Did anyone seek His permission? Where is this in the Bible? I want verses! How does this advance the Kingdom? Are the people unable to do this less blessed? Does not the Scripture say we are to walk by faith (intangible truth, power, and spirit) and not by sight (the focus on the physical, the senses). No, this practice is not expanding how God operates; it is limiting your complete submission to His will and how He wants you operate in His Kingdom. Only those in complete submission will enter into His rest, flowing with His power and truth for all the world to see. Why can people not see that embracing gimmicks of the world keeps one in the soul, not manifesting ALL He has for His children in spirit. 



> *2 Corinthians 4:18* - While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which  are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things  which are not seen are eternal.



The only things we should be visualizing in our mind's eye is the faith of things asked for in His will be done and how each of us can be like Christ through His Guiding Spirit.

Father, Jesus, Your Spirit has His work cut out for Him. Please, have mercy and ease our separation from this world. Amen.


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## CarefreeinChicago

You will never convince me reading my favorite bible verses everyday is demonic. I don't have any material items on mine.


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## Shimmie

kinchen said:


> You will never convince me reading my favorite bible verses everyday is demonic. I don't have any material items on mine.



'Favorite Bible verses'....

Why do they need to be on a board?  

See...God's not fooled by any of this.  A vision board is not required nor is it necessary to study God's Word.


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## Shimmie

Dear Ones... Who has bewitched you?  Who has lured you into a web of deception? 

This is what the Lord is hearing from you...

_"... If it weren't for 'my' vision board"...

"LOA, helped me to be more positive in my thought life..."

"My vision board,  "My vision board, "My vision board..."   _

All glory is being given to the 'vision board' and the loa and not unto God.

Let's be real.   Your faith is based upon 'your' vision boards, not God.   

If not, then throw them away?  Get rid of them and put your trust and your faith solely into God's will and trust your heart's desires in God's hands.  

Whatever happen to the Holy Spirit who leads and guides you into all truth?

Each of those who defend having a vision board, are saying that you cannot 'live' without them.   You've expressed that your need for having a vision board is beyond your need for God.   If you deny 'cannot', then it's far worse for you are then saying, you 'will not'... live without the vision board... 

Your 'trust' has been 'sold' to the loa and your vision board. 

Where is your faith, what is it's true loyalty, it's true trust?  Putting 'scriptures' on a vision board to make it 'okay', to justify one's use of it, is a farce and God is no where in it. God is not mocked, neither is He fooled.   One doesn't need a vision board, neither the loa to grow closer to Him, nor to be reminded to do 'good deeds'.     Something is seriously 'amiss' here.  Seriously amiss.   It takes a vision board to do good deeds?  To pray and read God's word?   

satan has truly sold you a lie.  

Give up the board.  Give it up.  Allow God to have all of your attention; give Him the rights back into your heart and in your life to replace your vision boards and to give you far more than you could ever hope for.   And that being, fully one on one with Him.   

Those boards are master deceptions.  God is not a part of it.   Come away from the loa, it's not God.  Destroy the boards... let God be the One that you consult your life with, not an instrument of satan's distractions.   

Let there be not one named among us...who have defected from the faith; the faith of trusting fully our Holy God.  

Give up the boards...Trust God who loves you too much to let you down. 

Give up the boards... He loves you and will never forsake you.

Give up the boards... God is waiting for you to be true blue to Him.

Give up the boards...for the hours are coming for them to completely fail you.


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## loulou7

Shimmie said:


> You've 'sensed' (discerned) the spirit behind this activity.
> 
> Word of Caution: 'Manifest'
> 
> Purpose and Intent: 'To manifest material items' (fleshly desires).
> 
> Soul: "Self" -
> 
> Heart: _I am manifesting ; So that I can manifest; I want to manifest_ ....
> 
> Where is the heart of a Christian who joins with 'others' who do not have a Godly heritage nor are they in relationship with Jesus?
> 
> Vision boards are from the laws of attraction practice, where 'self' is god and self is the manifestor of one's carnal desires. Carnality is all up in the spirit and content of these vision boards and to apply scripture makes it no less carnal.
> 
> witches and voo doo priests use vision boards and objects to represent their subject and object they desire to prey upon. Its part of the practice to have a symbol / proxy to accomplish their goal.
> 
> It may not be a Chrisitian's intent to practice witchcraft however, when they post a picture with the 'intent' to 'manifest' it into their lives or the life of someone else, it's witchcraft. It's the practice of 'self-will'. They are literally _seducing_ the desired object/item to come to life into their life.
> 
> Again, this may not be a Christian's intent, however this is exactly what they are doing. The key words: "manifest" and "I". God is no where in it; especially if Christians have 'joined' themselves in this practice with those who are not Christians, the ungodly.
> 
> As I shared earlier, a Christian can apply any and all of the scriptures they want to their boards, however if God were in it, they wouldn't need to post a scripture, let alone post pictures or have a board in the first place.
> 
> Those who oppose God already 'know' that they don't need God's presence for a 'vision board' to work, because it is 'self will' and they've been working their self will all along without God...
> 
> Genesis 11:6
> 
> *...and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have IMAGINED TO DO. ...
> 
> God has given us a far better Vision which is Him and in Him is all Provision and all Manifestation for every need and desire in our hearts for our lives.
> 
> The world has to 'steal' from God, and they do so with 'darkness'; but as His children, we don't. Every desire is His desire to fulfill for us, far better from Him than a counterfeit. As His children, we get to commune with Him, one on one. The world doesn't have this, yet we do.
> 
> What a gift, far beyond a vision board.
> 
> Lord, thank you, that our only vision is 'you' and your love for us which will always be far beyond any 'vision' and beyond any measure of any piece of 'board'. Your dreams for us will never perish, nor will your love.
> 
> The world doesn't have this, we do.
> 
> Selah...*


*

I agree! Satan is very subtle in trying to entrap humanity. He'll use something that on the surface seems perfectly fine, but really it is about you becoming your own G-d. The "I" factor. 

Remember, that's one of the enticements he used on Eve, telling her that she will become as G-d.*


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## jenny87

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the purpose of vision boards are to keep your goals close at heart and in mind.  Is wanting to be debt free advancing Satan's kingdom?  How about getting closer to your family?  Did God not say he wants his children to prosper? 

Some people get waaaaay too out of control on here, imo.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


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## CandiceC

jenny87 said:


> Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the purpose of *vision boards are to keep your goals close at heart and in mind.*  Is wanting to be debt free advancing Satan's kingdom?  How about getting closer to your family?  Did God not say he wants his children to prosper?
> 
> Some people get waaaaay too out of control on here, imo.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2



If the Lord places something on your heart, you don't need a vision board. Pray that His will be done in all areas of your life. Why does one need to look at a board?


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## nathansgirl1908

I don't think the vision board is demonic.  The scriptures say to make the vision. Plain. I think Boston Maria said it best.


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## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the purpose of vision boards are to keep your goals close at heart and in mind.  Is wanting to be debt free advancing Satan's kingdom?  How about getting closer to your family?  Did God not say he wants his children to prosper?
> 
> Some people get waaaaay too out of control on here, imo.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2



You don't need a vision board to be debt free.   God can free you all by Himself.   And so will a budget.   Stop letting satan lie to you.   Your focus time upon that board is less focus upon strengthening your relationship and time spent with God.   

I can't believe how strong this board has a hold upon people that really think they need it to succeed in life.   It's like an addiction... crack.   Anything that one clings to other than God that strongly is in way too deep.  

These boards are indeed demonic with all of what I'm seeing in defense of them.   Where's the defence for God 'ONLY'?    

What happens if you lose the board in a flood or some other disaster?  Then what?  Where's your faith based upon?   How will you survive and be successful then?     Those who have placed their sole faith upon God will have a sure foundation to stand upon.   Those whose faith were upon a vision board will be without hope.


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## Shimmie

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I don't think the vision board is demonic.  The scriptures say to make the vision. Plain. I think Boston Maria said it best.



See how the devil has lied to you?   The scripture does not say, 'make the vision'.   

God is speaking to the prophet and it has nothing to do with a vision board.   This scripture has been taken fully out of context with the methods of witchcraft in the loa and you're allowing yourself to follow after it as if you have no faith in God.   

This is what has happened.   There are children of God who have lost hope and faith in trusting God to fulfill their dreams.   

Here comes satan with his loa and their cheerleaders, boasting and parading their 'stolen' success with their practice of witchcraft and disrespect for God.   Of course the children of God are watching and those who have 'fainted' in their faith, have crossed over into satan's territory to join those who don't reverence God and give Him glory.

To cover the conviction, the children of God who have succombed to the temptation and the lure of the loa...have it your way... they call themselves 'being' a witness to those of satan, yet they still follow satan's way.    

So the children of God get a taste of receiving of what satan has been deceiving and they call it 'good'.   Yet again, to cover the conviction, they place scriptures upon their walls in an attempt to white wash the sin they are in.   The sin?   The sin of joining in with those who oppose God in every way there is.   The sin of giving in to where God has not placed them.  The sin of calling it God when God is no where in it.  

Why have they entered the loa threads, vision board posts and forums?   The devil knows who they are and he laughs.  he laughs heartily saying... _"Did not God say.... ?    Why do you not believe Him?   Why are you here worshipping me?    

'Me'.... Me.... Me... The vision boards... are all about 'Me'.  _

satan is well known as the accuser of the brethren.   Day and night he stands before God pointing at the ones of God who have 'defected' from the faith of God and have chosen to follow the practices of him, God's arch enemy.  

When you have God... you do not need the devil too.   No man can serve two masters.    Choose whom you trust indeed ... let it be God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit all the way.    

Faith isn't easy ... God knows that.   But if you are a child of God faith isn't supposed to be easy, but it is counted as righteousness.    vision boards do not take faith to operate, but they do operate to take your faith.  

Give it up and trust God.  God never fails, leaves nor does He ever stop loving and giving to those, His children.


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## loulou7

Shimmie said:


> You don't need a vision board to be debt free. God can free you all by Himself. And so will a budget. Stop letting satan lie to you. Your focus time upon that board is less focus upon strengthening your relationship and time spent with God.
> 
> I can't believe how strong this board has a hold upon people that really think they need it to succeed in life. It's like an addiction... crack. Anything that one clings to other than God that strongly is in way too deep.
> 
> These boards are indeed demonic with all of what I'm seeing in defense of them. Where's the defence for God 'ONLY'?
> 
> What happens if you lose the board in a flood or some other desaster? Then what? Where's your faith based upon? How will you survive and be successful then? Those who have placed their sole faith upon God will have a sure foundation to stand upon. Those whose faith were upon a vision board will be without hope.


 
*Preach it, Shimmie. We all need to be aware that a lot of things that are being introduced in these last days, that are the equivalent of being on a slippery slope. We need to really pray for the spirit of distinction.*


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## CandiceC

Shimmie said:


> *You don't need a vision board to be debt free.   God can free you all by Himself.   And so will a budget.   *Stop letting satan lie to you.   Your focus time upon that board is less focus upon strengthening your relationship and time spent with God.
> 
> I can't believe how strong this board has a hold upon people that really think they need it to succeed in life.   It's like an addiction... crack.   Anything that one clings to other than God that strongly is in way too deep.
> 
> These boards are indeed demonic with all of what I'm seeing in defense of them.   Where's the defence for God 'ONLY'?
> 
> What happens if you lose the board in a flood or some other desaster?  Then what?  Where's your faith based upon?   How will you survive and be successful then?     Those who have placed their sole faith upon God will have a sure foundation to stand upon.   Those whose faith were upon a vision board will be without hope.



Right! Lol. A budget and maybe a second job if you want to be aggressive about it... You have to trust that God will place inside of you the strength to accomplish (or have patience in waiting for) things He wants for you. Trying to channel the motivation from a board?


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## Shimmie

loulou7 said:


> I agree! Satan is very subtle in trying to entrap humanity. He'll use something that on the surface seems perfectly fine, but really it is about you becoming your own G-d. *The "I" factor. *
> 
> Remember, *that's one of the enticements he used on Eve, telling her that she will become as G-d*.



  Good Word, loulou7 

That's exactly where it started... with Eve in the garden; being lured by satan's *h*isses and whispers.


----------



## Shimmie

CandiceC said:


> Right! Lol. A budget and maybe a second job if you want to be aggressive about it... You have to trust that God will place inside of you the strength to accomplish (or have patience in waiting for) things He wants for you.
> 
> *Trying to channel the motivation from a board?*



 CandiceC 

@ the bolded....

satan will use anything to steal God's glory.   Yet he always fails and it always those who are deceived by him who suffer.


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## Shimmie

loulou7 said:


> *Preach it, Shimmie. We all need to be aware that a lot of things that are being introduced in these last days, that are the equivalent of being on a slippery slope. We need to really pray for the spirit of distinction.*



Oh my goodness!   loulou7    Thank you.   You just reminded me of a scripture.   Remember this one?    I know you do. ..       I just having a 'lightbulb' moment here. 

Loulou... when you said, 'we need to pray for the Spirit of Distinction', immediately I remembered this scripture.   You spoke a true Word, Angel... a solid true word.    

Here it is... this scripture shows the *'Distinction':*

_*"Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. *

The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like  .......a man who built his house on sand. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell with a great crash."

Matthew 7:24-27_

   Thank you Loulou7 ...     Yes... God used you to bring this to my rememberance.   I 'blanked' out one of the words as I didn't post this scripture as an afront to anyone.   I only wanted to show the relevence / comparison of a vision board vs God's faith.    God is the Rock.   A vision board is sinking sand. 

Blessings...   

Sweet sleep Angel ...


----------



## CandiceC

Shimmie said:


> @CandiceC
> 
> @ the bolded....
> 
> satan will use anything to steal God's glory.   Yet he always fails and it always those who are deceived by him who suffer.



Hey Shimmie!

Yep. Folks talking about how vision boards worked for them to get/do x, y or z. What about God? If you were praying and had faith a board shouldn't have anything to do with it. Faith pertains to things not seen. 

I'm fine with writing a "to do" list with some action steps, but to create a board with images and words seems like a shrine to me. 

It is possible for good things we may want to lead to idolatry.


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## Shimmie

CandiceC said:


> Hey Shimmie!
> 
> Yep. Folks talking about how vision boards worked for them to get/do x, y or z. What about God? If you were praying and had faith a board shouldn't have anything to do with it. Faith pertains to things not seen.
> 
> I'm fine with writing a "to do" list with some action steps, but to create a board with images and words seems like a shrine to me.
> 
> It is possible for good things we may want to lead to idolatry.



Now that I think about it, I need to make my list for 'Almond Milk'... 'chocolate'     and a few other things that I need from Whole Foods.   

Love to you and your family...  

Sweet sleep   

I also pray for the love and the peace of God over everyone here.   I mean no harm or attack against our precious sisters with vision boards.   It's the boards I'm attacking... only the boards.


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## CandiceC

Shimmie said:


> Now that I think about it, I need to make my list for *'Almond Milk'... 'chocolate'*   and a few other things that I need from Whole Foods.
> 
> Love to you and your family...
> 
> Sweet sleep
> 
> I also pray for the love and the peace of God over everyone here.   I mean no harm or attack against our precious sisters with vision boards.   It's the boards I'm attacking... only the boards.



I'm going to have to try the chocolate almond milk. I've been eying it @ Trader Joe's. I use the original kind for cereal. 
ETA: Were those two separate items on your list? Opps. Lol.


I feel ya. I'm only speaking out against the boards too.  

Goodnight!


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## CoilyFields

Hey Ladies!

I had heard of vision boards and LOA but had not thought much of it. At one point I believed as many of you do that there was nothing wrong with it. Its just putting your goals on a board or the law of reciprocity in effect etc.

BUT NOW...I done seen da light! lol.

 God specifically told us to delight in him and HE would give us the desires of our hearts (i.e. He would put His desires in our hearts so that HE could fulfill them). 

The reasoning behind the board/LOA is this: YOU can design your own destiny. Its in YOUR hands. All you have to do is WANT it enough. YOU attract what happens to you...good and bad. All of this is contradictory to scripture. God says HE will direct our paths if we acknowledge HIM...not our board. In the instance of LOA: Sin has caused much ruckus in the world and because of it innocent people get hurt. The word says that the ENEMY is seeking to destroy/devour us. Not that all the bad stuff that happens to us is because we attracted it to us. (the 9 y/o that was raped and killed...it was her own fault?)

If we believe LOA then what place have we given to God's mercy? If the vision board is necessary then What place does prayer have?

We have to be careful of compromise ladies. There are so many new age movements that sound good, seem harmless, and are "not that serious" that are gently steering us in the wrong direction. We come to depend on our vision board and our own power to make it happen, rather than depending on God. 

It really is a slippery slope. Just think about it...most of us would not accept an actual demon coming to us saying "There is no God". So satan does not try to lure us with that...he takes those "not so serious" things and before we know it we are operating completely outside of Gods will and encourageing others to do it. 

We cannot pretend that the Worlds Vision boards or LOA are harmless...even if we try to "white-wash it in the blood" and mold it to vibe it with scripture (or even worse, mold scripture to vibe with it).

I encourage everyone to pray about it. Theres nothing wrong with having goals, or writing them down...but just realize that the worlds message about vision boards/LOA wil NOT change because you try to make it holy. A rose by any other name...


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## nerdography

Ok, I've changed my mind about vision boards, though I had to do the research myself because no one really explained as to why they were evil  Apparently, vision boards are derived from the Satanic Bible 



> If you have material desires, you must gaze upon images of them - surround yourself with the smells and sounds conducive to them - create a lodestone which will attract the situation or thing that you wish!


For those that want to read more about it: http://www.freewebs.com/satanic-bible/textbob.imagery.html

So, here my question. Would writing down my goals on a piece of paper be the same as creating a vision board? And if not why?

I want to get married one day, so if I wrote down that  I wanted someone who is funny, loving, patience and loved to travel would that make me a participant in Satanic rituals?

I had a friend who made a request to God for a boyfriend. She wanted someone who was fair skinned and a Kappa, and that's what she got, a fair skinned Kappa, but he treated her horribly because she didn't specify about his personality.


----------



## Crown

Prov. 4.14 *Enter not into the path of the wicked, and go not in the way of evil men.* 4.15 *Avoid it, pass not by it, turn from it, and pass away.*

Jer. 12: 1 You are always righteous, LORD (YHWH), when I bring a case before you. Yet I would speak with you about your justice:  *Why does the way of the wicked prosper? Why do all the faithless live at ease?*

Jer. 10.2 Thus saith the LORD, *Learn not the way of the heathen*…

  [FONT=&quot]Nbr. 15.39 And it shall be unto you for a fringe, that ye may look upon it, and remember all the commandments of the LORD, and do them; and that *ye seek not after your own heart and your own eyes, after which ye use to go a whoring*: 15.40 That ye may remember, and do all my commandments, and be holy unto your God.

[/FONT]1Pet. 1: 15 But just as *he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do*; 16 for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”


----------



## Laela

@ bolded... It _can_ be, yes... *IF* the desire in one's heart is to be debt-free for selfish reasons and not to become a blessing (enlarging God's territory) to others. That desire couldn't have come from God because He is selfless. Oh, it's still a _good_ desire.. who doesn't want to live debt-free? But living debt-free to do what? Just enjoy life and that's it? Is that desire one that comes from God? That's the key and where the subtlety comes in, with justifiying 'good things'. Good things can be used for the wrong reasons...good intentions _can_ cause harm. 

It is God who places the desires in our hearts (through which He speaks to us) so that it can be manifested in the physical realm, to become His arms and legs on earth. That's how He operates. He wants us to prosper, but only to enable us to help, save or teach others. The story of Joseph is a great example of this..he was already 'rich and powerful' being with God (The Blessing) even though it wasn't evident in plain sight at first. Joseph's riches and power manifested in the physical in God's time, and it was to save others, because it was part of God's plan.



jenny87 said:


> Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the purpose of vision boards are to keep your goals close at heart and in mind. *Is wanting to be debt free advancing Satan's kingdom?* How about getting closer to your family? Did God not say he wants his children to prosper?
> 
> Some people get waaaaay too out of control on here, imo.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2


----------



## Laela

I find it ironic what is said in bold...

... because what I do see is that vision boards do just that. They put God in a box, contained only to what is on the board and not taking into consideration any plan God has for us, which likely will never make its way onto a vision board. I pray that you do see that...

If you have time, please read the entire chapter of 2 Kings 17, when Samaria was repopulated. They made what was low high and what was high low... This is what visions boards do.. very crafty, subtle to the point we 'see' NOTHING wrong with it, like the people of Samaria. Of course there are all types of 'idols'. Anyone or anything can be a false god.


*2 Kings 17*
*24 The king of Assyria brought people from Babylon, Kuthah, Avva, Hamath and Sepharvaim and settled them in the towns of Samaria to replace the Israelites. They took over Samaria and lived in its towns. *
*25 When they first lived there, they did not worship the LORD; so he sent lions among them and they killed some of the people. *
*26 It was reported to the king of Assyria: “The people you deported and resettled in the towns of Samaria do not know what the god of that country requires. He has sent lions among them, which are killing them off, because the people do not know what he requires.” *
*27 Then the king of Assyria gave this order: “Have one of the priests you took captive from Samaria go back to live there and teach the people what the god of the land requires.” *
*28 So one of the priests who had been exiled from Samaria came to live in Bethel and taught them how to worship the LORD. *
*29 Nevertheless, each national group made its own gods in the several towns where they settled, and set them up in the shrines the people of Samaria had made at the high places. *
*30 The people from Babylon made Sukkoth Benoth, those from Kuthah made Nergal, and those from Hamath made Ashima; 31 the Avvites made Nibhaz and Tartak, and the Sepharvites burned their children in the fire as sacrifices to Adrammelek and Anammelek, the gods of Sepharvaim.*
*32 They worshiped the LORD, but they also appointed all sorts of their own people to officiate for them as priests in the shrines at the high places. *
*33 They worshiped the LORD, but they also served their own gods in accordance with the customs of the nations from which they had been brought. *
*34 To this day they persist in their former practices. They neither worship the LORD nor adhere to the decrees and regulations, the laws and commands that the LORD gave the descendants of Jacob, whom he named Israel. *
*35 When the LORD made a covenant with the Israelites, he commanded them: “Do not worship any other gods or bow down to them, serve them or sacrifice to them.*
*36 But the LORD, who brought you up out of Egypt with mighty power and outstretched arm, is the one you must worship. To him you shall bow down and to him offer sacrifices. *
*37 You must always be careful to keep the decrees and regulations, the laws and commands he wrote for you. Do not worship other gods. *
*38 Do not forget the covenant I have made with you, and do not worship other gods.*
*39 Rather, worship the LORD your God; it is he who will deliver you from the hand of all your enemies.” *
*40 They would not listen, however, but persisted in their former practices. *
*41 Even while these people were worshiping the LORD, they were serving their idols. To this day their children and grandchildren continue to do as their ancestors did. *




ellebelle88 said:


> I think that if you think about the world today, you can relate anything to God or God's plan and you can make anything related to the Devil. I've seen it done countless times. People put their own spin on things according to the way they see the world.
> 
> I fail to see how putting your goals on a board and asking God to give them to you is a sign of worshiping the Devil or someone other than God. We all have a purpose on this Earth and I think we should be actively working towards it while carrying out God's work at the same time. Just like church may be a reminder for you, visionboards can be daily reminders for someone else. Remember --- God helps those who helps themselves. For me, my vision board is to keep me proactive and never complacent. I have things on there that I want to do like volunteer, learn to be happy, and pray more. None of those have to do with material things.
> 
> *Sometimes I think people need to step outside of their boxes because what you are doing is boxing God in himself.* God isn't as one-dimensional as many of you think. And I also hate when people give God human characteristics and tendencies. Please think of your God as much more powerful and creative.


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

Shimmie said:


> Dear Ones... Who has bewitched you? Who has lured you into a web of deception?
> 
> This is what the Lord is hearing from you...
> 
> _"... If it weren't for 'my' vision board"..._
> 
> _"LOA, helped me to be more positive in my thought life..."_
> 
> _"My vision board, "My vision board, "My vision board..." _
> 
> All glory is being given to the 'vision board' and the loa and not unto God.
> 
> Let's be real. Your faith is based upon 'your' vision boards, not God.
> 
> If not, then throw them away? Get rid of them and put your trust and your faith solely into God's will and trust your heart's desires in God's hands.
> 
> Whatever happen to the Holy Spirit who leads and guides you into all truth?
> 
> Each of those who defend having a vision board, are saying that you cannot 'live' without them. You've expressed that your need for having a vision board is beyond your need for God. If you deny 'cannot', then it's far worse for you are then saying, you 'will not'... live without the vision board...
> 
> Your 'trust' has been 'sold' to the loa and your vision board.
> 
> Where is your faith, what is it's true loyalty, it's true trust? Putting 'scriptures' on a vision board to make it 'okay', to justify one's use of it, is a farce and God is no where in it. God is not mocked, neither is He fooled. One doesn't need a vision board, neither the loa to grow closer to Him, nor to be reminded to do 'good deeds'. Something is seriously 'amiss' here. Seriously amiss. It takes a vision board to do good deeds? To pray and read God's word?
> 
> satan has truly sold you a lie.
> 
> Give up the board. Give it up. Allow God to have all of your attention; give Him the rights back into your heart and in your life to replace your vision boards and to give you far more than you could ever hope for. And that being, fully one on one with Him.
> 
> Those boards are master deceptions. God is not a part of it. Come away from the loa, it's not God. Destroy the boards... let God be the One that you consult your life with, not an instrument of satan's distractions.
> 
> Let there be not one named among us...who have defected from the faith; the faith of trusting fully our Holy God.
> 
> Give up the boards...Trust God who loves you too much to let you down.
> 
> Give up the boards... He loves you and will never forsake you.
> 
> Give up the boards... God is waiting for you to be true blue to Him.
> 
> Give up the boards...for the hours are coming for them to completely fail you.


 

What is the difference between a vision board and a journal? People write their goals down or what they want in a mate, so is that demonic? People write in their journals and go back over them to see how God has blessed them... is that demonic?


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

CandiceC said:


> Hey Shimmie!
> 
> Yep. Folks talking about how vision boards worked for them to get/do x, y or z. What about God? If you were praying and had faith a board shouldn't have anything to do with it. Faith pertains to things not seen.
> 
> I'm fine with writing a "to do" list with some action steps, but to create a board with images and words seems like a shrine to me.
> 
> It is possible for good things we may want to lead to idolatry.


 
What is the difference between an action plan vs. a board?  It gets you to the same goal..... You just make a list and I like pictures.


----------



## CandiceC

Do_Si_Dos said:


> What is the difference between an action plan vs. a board? It gets you to the same goal..... You just make a list and I like pictures.


 
I view a vision board different from a list like, for example:

Personal bible study each morning for at least 30 minutes.
Pay off $200 extra on credit card debt each month.
Limit caloric intake to 1400 calories each day.
Exercise on Monday, Wednesday and Saturday mornings this summer.
Join the church anniversary committee. Attend the three planning meetings.
Offer encouraging words to husband/boyfriend every day.


----------



## CoilyFields

Do_Si_Dos said:


> What is the difference between an action plan vs. a board? It gets you to the same goal..... You just make a list and I like pictures.


 
Correct me if Im wrong, but isnt it called a vision board because the point is to see what you desire and your actually "seeing" it creates some kind of power magnetism/attraction that brings it to pass.

Im a very visual person so I write plans down. Thats how I follow them better. But they were just that...plans. I didnt believe my plan had any special powers for me having written it down nor did I believe that looking at it did anything other than allow me a better grasp of what I needed to do and to keep track of what I'd accomplished so far. 

Like I mentioned before, the problem with the vision board is that it was CREATED with principles that based human success on human ability/power alone. Whereas we believe that we can do all things through CHRIST who strengthens us.  I see that many are trying to transform its popular use into something that is in line with scripture but forreal forreal its like taking a ouigi (sp) board and trying to use it to get the Holy spirit to make intercession for you.


----------



## CarefreeinChicago

CandiceC said:


> I view a vision board different from a list like, for example:
> 
> Personal bible study each morning for at least 30 minutes.
> Pay off $200 extra on credit card debt each month.
> Limit caloric intake to 1400 calories each day.
> Exercise on Monday, Wednesday and Saturday mornings this summer.
> Join the church anniversary committee. Attend the three planning meetings.
> Offer encouraging words to husband/boyfriend every day.



How is different from that list? The only difference is you stick the list in a purse and forget about it with a vision board you walk past and see it more. I got up today and read my verses and kept going it reminds me of what I am doing that day. If it's demonic oh well.


----------



## nerdography

Ok, I went looking back through the forums to see if I could find anything about setting goals for yourself and I found this post--> http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=469690&highlight=goals

And the verse they used was: Hab 2:2 says "And the LORD answered me: “Write the vision; make it plain on tablets, so he may run who reads it." 

So, we're allowed to write down our vision/goals, but not make a visual board because we would end up worshiping the item? I'm not sure if I'm understand this correct, could someone please explain.


----------



## Shimmie

nerdography said:


> Ok, I went looking back through the forums to see if I could find anything about setting goals for yourself and I found this post--> http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=469690&highlight=goals
> 
> And the verse they used was: Hab 2:2 says "And the LORD answered me: “Write the vision; make it plain on tablets, so he may run who reads it."
> 
> So, we're allowed to write down our vision/goals, but not make a visual board because we would end up worshiping the item? I'm not sure if I'm understand this correct, could someone please explain.



  Hi nerdography...  I'm on my way home from work. I'll log on later tonight with a reply.  Okay?


----------



## CarefreeinChicago

"It is dangerous to be concerned with what others think of you." (Proverbs 29:25 LB)


----------



## Shimmie

kinchen said:


> "It is dangerous to be concerned with what others think of you." (Proverbs 29:25 LB)



What if they love you?  Is that dangerous?  

Babygirl... there is no scripture to defend the issue of vision boards. None.  Not even Proverbs 29:25.    

You see, the devil is crafty.   he KNOWS scripture... and quite well.   he also knows the power of it and that God stands behind His word.    But he can only misuse the Word of God; it will never bless his mess.   With the loa and its components such as vision boards, etc., satan has taken the Word of God and has misused it to* offend *God.   

As for Proverbs 29:25, I don't think badly of you.  I more than positive that no one here does.    I do think badly of what satan has control of.  

Don't ever think that anything that is said against the works of satan is about you or anyone else personally.    If nothing more, we are here to destroy the works of the devil; to expose his deceptions, and to take full authority over all of his works, for this is the TRUE POWER which Jesus has gifted upon us....

*Luke 10:19

Behold, I give to you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.*

We're not supposed to 'link' up with the devil, otherwise we will not tread upon him, instead he'll tread upon those who are in his domain.

I've been reading each of the 'siggies' and the 'language' of followers of loa and vision boards....     The glory of God is not among them; the words are mantra's ... about 'self'.


----------



## Shimmie

nerdography said:


> Ok, I've changed my mind about vision boards, though I had to do the research myself because no one really explained as to why they were evil  Apparently, vision boards are derived from the Satanic Bible
> 
> For those that want to read more about it: http://www.freewebs.com/satanic-bible/textbob.imagery.html
> 
> So, here my question. Would writing down my goals on a piece of paper be the same as creating a vision board? And if not why?
> 
> I want to get married one day, so if I wrote down that  I wanted someone who is funny, loving, patience and loved to travel would that make me a participant in Satanic rituals?
> 
> I had a friend who made a request to God for a boyfriend. She wanted someone who was fair skinned and a Kappa, and that's what she got, a fair skinned Kappa, but he treated her horribly because she didn't specify about his personality.



My eyes are a little watery right now.   All that I can see in you is a heart that wants to be right with God.  Instead of defending this issue, you chose... CHOSE to research this and when you discovered the truth about the vision boards origin, you came back and posted what you discovered.

This is a true woman and a woman of God.  Yes.. that's you.   Not because what you've shared 'agrees' with what I've been posting, but because you have no pride, instead you have humility and I can see our Father God just beaming with joy, because you chose Him and nothing else. 

This is not about anyone else but you and God.  He has another level to raise you up to...just you and Him, where nothing and no one can separate you from the Love of God.   

I promise you an answer from your other post about journals.  God has given all of us dreams and planning for the future is not a sin; the sin comes from excluding God and putting 'self' in front of God and His will for us.

I have several Journals.  I write my prayers down often; I date them and I have scriptures which I 'feel' the Lord has given me for my prayers.   If I'm away from my prayer Journal, I have often 'emailed' myself a prayer and a scripture which I feel lead to share.     Perfect example:   Many of the threads which I've started on encouragement are actually from my journals.      I write a lot ...    (You may 'insert' large grin here... as it's obvious by my many long posts... ).

When I'm praying for someone, and God gives me a 'Word' for them, I'll write it down so that it doesn't 'slip' away or before I become distracted and forget to share it.   My Bibles have scores of highlighted verses in them; and I use bookmarks and little post-it notes to flag the pages.   I write in my Bibles all the time; this is because almost ALWAYS God will givve me a Word or someone's name to write beside a scripture and to pray for them.

When I'm planning a trip or a party, I write my plans out and my shopping lists also the theme of the party and how I want to arrange the setting and the order.   For travel, I have my packing check list and phone numbers of whom I need to call or keep in touch with during my times away.   I have a little note pad or mini notebook for addresses of places I plan to visit.

I read the thread you posted regarding listing the traits that one desires in a husband.   Guard your heart with this.   This is something that one should go before the Lord, asking Him what you should ask for in a husband.   Note what God speaks to you in your prayer journal.   

You are so very close to understanding the difference between a prayer journal and a vision board.    A prayer journal notes and keeps record of what God is speaking to one's heart and what one speaks to God's heart.   

A vision board is just the total opposite.  People are 'willing' things into their lives and they are doing so without God.


----------



## dicapr

LOA has perverted something that people have been using for years.  Even before the hype I have always left notes for my self to encourage me on my journey for life.  I am single, but I have on occasion picked up a Kay's circular and picked out my engagement and wedding ring.  Some would think that could be a practice of LOA but I call it being prepared for when God sends me my husband.  I never thought doing these things would bring them into my life-only God can do that. As a individual who responds to visual cues it is helpful for me to have something concrete to look at.  Even at work I leave visual cues to let me know what is important, what can wait, what I am working on, ect.  Now, all of a sudden, because someone takes something that people have been doing for ages and gave it a name and linked it to thier own ideas I should abandon my practices?  I have been doing this long before I ever heard of LOA.  Having a vision board does not mean that you are practicing LOA.  If someone would simply say I have a board or list of things that I look at daily to help keep me focused on what is important to me many Christians would not have a problem with it. (I don't even have a board I just used post its in my mirror). The issue has become confused.  No one is supporting using LOA for personal gain.  What is being said is that because someone using a tool for some practice that we don't agree with doesn't mean we should completely abandon the tool. Why should I have to give up a helpful tool for myself all because someone took an old concept and repackaged it?


----------



## dicapr

Shimmie said:


> My eyes are a little watery right now. All that I can see in you is a heart that wants to be right with God. Instead of defending this issue, you chose... CHOSE to research this and when you discovered the truth about the vision boards origin, you came back and posted what you discovered.
> 
> This is a true woman and a woman of God. Yes.. that's you. Not because what you've shared 'agrees' with what I've been posting, but because you have no pride, instead you have humility and I can see our Father God just beaming with joy, because you chose Him and nothing else.
> 
> This is not about anyone else but you and God. He has another level to raise you up to...just you and Him, where nothing and no one can separate you from the Love of God.
> 
> I promise you an answer from your other post about journals. God has given all of us dreams and planning for the future is not a sin; the sin comes from excluding God and putting 'self' in front of God and His will for us.
> 
> I have several Journals. I write my prayers down often; I date them and I have scriptures which I 'feel' the Lord has given me for my prayers. If I'm away from my prayer Journal, I have often 'emailed' myself a prayer and a scripture which I feel lead to share. Perfect example: Many of the threads which I've started on encouragement are actually from my journals.   I write a lot ...  (You may 'insert' large grin here... as it's obvious by my many long posts... ).
> 
> When I'm praying for someone, and God gives me a 'Word' for them, I'll write it down so that it doesn't 'slip' away or before I become distracted and forget to share it. My Bibles have scores of highlighted verses in them; and I use bookmarks and little post-it notes to flag the pages. I write in my Bibles all the time; this is because almost ALWAYS God will givve me a Word or someone's name to write beside a scripture and to pray for them.
> 
> When I'm planning a trip or a party, I write my plans out and my shopping lists also the theme of the party and how I want to arrange the setting and the order. For travel, I have my packing check list and phone numbers of whom I need to call or keep in touch with during my times away. I have a little note pad or mini notebook for addresses of places I plan to visit.
> 
> I read the thread you posted regarding listing the traits that one desires in a husband. Guard your heart with this. This is something that one should go before the Lord, asking Him what you should ask for in a husband. Note what God speaks to you in your prayer journal.
> 
> You are so very close to understanding the difference between a prayer journal and a vision board. A prayer journal notes and keeps record of what God is speaking to one's heart and what one speaks to God's heart.
> 
> *A vision board is just the total opposite. People are 'willing' things into their lives and they are doing so without God*.


 

This is where the issue gets confused.  A vision board doesn't do anything.  LOA wills things into an individuals life. It is the practice of LOA that is wrong.  To me, posting something that would be written daily in a prayer journal in one place to be looked would be less time consuming than re-writting the same thing over and over again. As a Chrisitan, the things that I post would be something that I would write in a "prayer" journal.  I don't see the difference if I place them on a wall or put them in a notebook.  In both cases I am writing down spiritual matters that God has placed on my heart.  Like I said before, I believe that there is a breakdown in communication.  Vision board does not equal practicing LOA.  It is just adopting a word to give a better discription on what our prayer journal looks like.  Maybe we should call it a public prayer journal verses a private prayer journal.  The way I was raised, we were not allowed to mark or write in a bible, or even write on a piece of paper using the bible as a surface.  My Dad thought it was disrespectful and I still feel uncomfortable marking in a bible. My verses, ect would have to be written elsewhere.


----------



## jenny87

Shimmie said:


> You don't need a vision board to be debt free.   God can free you all by Himself.   And so will a budget.   Stop letting satan lie to you.   Your focus time upon that board is less focus upon strengthening your relationship and time spent with God.
> 
> I can't believe how strong this board has a hold upon people that really think they need it to succeed in life.   It's like an addiction... crack.   Anything that one clings to other than God that strongly is in way too deep.
> 
> These boards are indeed demonic with all of what I'm seeing in defense of them.   Where's the defence for God 'ONLY'?
> 
> What happens if you lose the board in a flood or some other disaster?  Then what?  Where's your faith based upon?   How will you survive and be successful then?     Those who have placed their sole faith upon God will have a sure foundation to stand upon.   Those whose faith were upon a vision board will be without hope.



Really? What if you lose your list in a fire?  What if you lose a photo album in a fire?  You start the heck over.  If you believe in God and have a board then you faith should be in him anyway.  I see no more problem with incorporate the things you are already praying and having faith for in picture form than having an illustrated prayer journal.

As far as vision boards having a demonic origin--sure they could.  Isn't Christmas actually a PAGEN holiday? But most Christians celebrate it as the birth of Jesus and still have Satan Clause hanging in their windows going broke to buy their children presents.  How is that different?  If you are praying over your board every night for God to grant you what you have precisely placed on a piece of paper, then yes you have a problem.  BUT you would have the same problem if you were praying over "just a list".  I have quotes on my wall about weight loss, self esteem, and financial freedom and according to these posts that's fine and I am alright with God.  BUT the minute I put a picture of flat abs next to it I am a devil worshipper? 

 That logic doesn't even make sense........

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


----------



## jenny87

kinchen said:


> "It is dangerous to be concerned with what others think of you." (Proverbs 29:25 LB)



I died laughing at this post!  I don't remember seeing this in Proverbs, but I may be adding it to my e-mail signature!

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


----------



## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> Really? What if you lose your list in a fire?  What if you lose a photo album in a fire?  You start the heck over.  If you believe in God and have a board then you faith should be in him anyway.  I see no more problem with incorporate the things you are already praying and having faith for in picture form than having an illustrated prayer journal.
> 
> As far as vision boards having a demonic origin--sure they could.  Isn't Christmas actually a PAGEN holiday? But most Christians celebrate it as the birth of Jesus and still have Satan Clause hanging in their windows going broke to buy their children presents.  How is that different?  If you are praying over your board every night for God to grant you what you have precisely placed on a piece of paper, then yes you have a problem.  BUT you would have the same problem if you were praying over "just a list".  I have quotes on my wall about weight loss, self esteem, and financial freedom and according to these posts that's fine and I am alright with God.  BUT the minute I put a picture of flat abs next to it I am a devil worshipper?
> 
> That logic doesn't even make sense........
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2



  You're right   Your logic doesn't make sense.


----------



## jenny87

Shimmie said:


> You're right   Your logic doesn't make sense.



No. Your logic does not make sense.  But everyone is entitled to their own opinions.....no matter how outlandish I supposed.  

You cannot honestly sit there and say the moment you add a picture to something and put it on a piece of paper that makes it demonic.  Then again, maybe you can.......

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


----------



## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> No. Your logic does not make sense.  But everyone is entitled to their own opinions.....no matter how outlandish I supposed.
> 
> You cannot honestly sit there and say the moment you add a picture to something and put it on a piece of paper that makes it demonic.  Then again, maybe you can.......
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2



Jenny please stop talking foolishness.   You're simply defending your use of a a vision board and your participation with the loa.   If that's what you want to do  then go for it.   No matter what defense you put up for it, it will never be justified by the Word of God.     

If you chose to base your foundation of faith upon a vision board as opposed to believing solely in God and His provision, than that's your choice.    This issue is beyond pictures.   Far beyond.    This is about where your faith is.  

This is sad.   I mean truly sad.   It's sad that so many are fighting so hard to keep a vision board which has no life in it whatsoever.   With the fuss you've been putting up to defend having one, it's just plain unreal.    

Now if someone where speaking against reading one's Bible I could see the defense.  It would surely be justified.    But for a piece of fiber?   A piece of cork?  A board and the material items upon it?    You are literally falling apart over the fight to defend a vision board.    Where is God in this?   Where is the fight for Him?  Where is so much passion for Him?   

What kind of 'hold' does having this board have over you?    What possible harm could happen to you by getting rid of it and just having Jesus?  Just how bad could one's life be without....... a board?

Jesus said to the rich man, _'Sell all that you have, give it to the poor and come follow me..."_   The rich man hung his head in despair and walked away from Jesus.   

I'm telling you, these boards have a stronghold ...  a serious stronghold.  

To discard a vision board to follow Jesus all the way, to depend upon Him solely, to get to know Him one on one... just by laying down a board.   

Jesus...


----------



## HauteHippie

This is... *sigh*. "Claiming it" is 1st cousins with vision boards. It's just as easy to question whether or not those who say vision boards are demonic are actually demonic themselves or carriers of a spirit of fear.

Demonic? Pft! Joseph, Abraham Paul (among others), and Jesus, himself, would all get straight roasted on LHCF. Luckily, we have hindsight.

Go on, walk soley by physical sight.

Continue to believe what you see and you will always see what you believe.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using T-Mobile G2


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## proverbs31woman

Great discussion ladies!  I've never thought about vision boards as demonic, but I definitely have a new take on it.  I think it's worth considering that it may be demonic even if you don't initially believe it is.  I'd rather be safe than sorry when it comes to protecting my soul.  The devil has far too many things out there that can lead us astray.  Remember, he is in charge of this world.


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## HauteHippie

Also, thank you for this thread. It's a good reminder that I hit the Mommy lottery. She is such a good example of a woman who is truly walking with Christ.

We grew up on vision boards and manifestation before we knew what they were. She made a list of "I am..." scriptures, framed them and put them around the house. I am a child of God, I am walking by faith and not by sight, I am redeemed... etc. There were at least 25 of them and we said them almost daily. To date, our moral compass is strong.

Thank God for clarity; thank God for guidance; thank God for logic.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using T-Mobile G2


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## nathansgirl1908

Shimmie said:


> See how the devil has lied to you?



I will put it like this: I can sense when something I am doing is not right in God's eyes.   I also know that not everyone is into the law of attraction stuff.  Nor do I believe that very many people here have indicated that they can't live without the board or that they are focusing on the board and not God.  

I will admit that I had some misgivings about things said in the Vision Board thread because many people clearly were not seeking God to fulfill the desires of their heart.  Many of them are borderline atheists.  But that does not apply to everyone.  There's nothing wrong with visual reminders of the desires in your heart.  And it seems as though people often assume that when we speak of things we desire, God has not placed that desire on our heart.  You truly can't say what desires God has placed on anyone's heart.  God does want to give us things that we enjoy without being made to explain to others how it will be used for the kingdom.  More than anything, I think the judgment in this thread is considerably worse than people putting up pictures or writing things down that they want to see happen in their lives.


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## nathansgirl1908

nerdography said:


> Ok, I went looking back through the forums to see if I could find anything about setting goals for yourself and I found this post--> http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=469690&highlight=goals
> 
> And the verse they used was: Hab 2:2 says "And the LORD answered me: “Write the vision; make it plain on tablets, so he may run who reads it."
> 
> So, we're allowed to write down our vision/goals, but not make a visual board because we would end up worshiping the item? I'm not sure if I'm understand this correct, could someone please explain.



Indeed we are.  That's the scripture I referenced.  And I stand by it.


----------



## jenny87

Shimmie said:


> Jenny please stop talking foolishness.   You're simply defending your use of a a vision board and your participation with the loa.   If that's what you want to do  then go for it.   No matter what defense you put up for it, it will never be justified by the Word of God.
> 
> If you chose to base your foundation of faith upon a vision board as opposed to believing solely in God and His provision, than that's your choice.    This issue is beyond pictures.   Far beyond.    This is about where your faith is.
> 
> This is sad.   I mean truly sad.   It's sad that so many are fighting so hard to keep a vision board which has no life in it whatsoever.   With the fuss you've been putting up to defend having one, it's just plain unreal.
> 
> Now if someone where speaking against reading one's Bible I could see the defense.  It would surely be justified.    But for a piece of fiber?   A piece of cork?  A board and the material items upon it?    You are literally falling apart over the fight to defend a vision board.    Where is God in this?   Where is the fight for Him?  Where is so much passion for Him?
> 
> What kind of 'hold' does having this board have over you?    What possible harm could happen to you by getting rid of it and just having Jesus?  Just how bad could one's life be without....... a board?
> 
> Jesus said to the rich man, _'Sell all that you have, give it to the poor and come follow me..."_   The rich man hung his head in despair and walked away from Jesus.
> 
> I'm telling you, these boards have a stronghold ...  a serious stronghold.
> 
> To discard a vision board to follow Jesus all the way, to depend upon Him solely, to get to know Him one on one... just by laying down a board.
> 
> Jesus...



Hahahahahaha!  You know the funniest part in all of this to me?  I knew you would say something about me having a vision board and I hate to burst you bubble Shimmie, but I don't have a vision board.  Never have.  I had to google LOA because I had actually never heard of it.  So me "defending" this has nothing to do with my participation because I am not a participant.  I just have a problem with people having far-reaching theories and then trying to back it up with the bible.  

Just like a previous poster brought up "name it/claim" it.  I feel that is FAR more dangerous that posting some pictures on a board, a journal, or making a list.  But there are die hard Christians out there that really believe they can have anything they "claim".  I think its pure foolishness.

As I stated previously, I do believe that some people can have a problem with vision boards.  Some people may use them in demonic ways.  But actually making one? Naaa, I don't see that as demonic.  I mean which part is demonic? The cutting or the pasting? Worshipping anything other than God is demonic.  That covers a lot; if someone worships food that is a demonic act.  However, do not bring that full circle to say that food is demonic.  That is what I feel is happening in this thread.  If you are worshipping your vision board then yes, by all means, you have a problem.  If you are just making a poster and adding hopes, dreams, and aspirations and putting faith in God to bring prosperity, weight loss, and better relationships your way then it so be it.  

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


----------



## jenny87

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I will put it like this: I can sense when something I am doing is not right in God's eyes.   I also know that not everyone is into the law of attraction stuff.  Nor do I believe that very many people here have indicated that they can't live without the board or that they are focusing on the board and not God.
> 
> I will admit that I had some misgivings about things said in the Vision Board thread because many people clearly were not seeking God to fulfill the desires of their heart.  Many of them are borderline atheists.  But that does not apply to everyone.  There's nothing wrong with visual reminders of the desires in your heart.  And it seems as though people often assume that when we speak of things we desire, God has not placed that desire on our heart.  You truly can't say what desires God has placed on anyone's heart.  God does want to give us things that we enjoy without being made to explain to others how it will be used for the kingdom.  More than anything, I think the judgment in this thread is considerably worse than people putting up pictures or writing things down that they want to see happen in their lives.



Well said!

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


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## Laela

Bolded...so true, but the world ain't his 

Heard a great worship this morning that says "_believing what I can't see doesn't come naturally for me_..." 




proverbs31woman said:


> Great discussion ladies! I've never thought about vision boards as demonic, but I definitely have a new take on it. I think it's worth considering that it may be demonic even if you don't initially believe it is. I'd rather be safe than sorry when it comes to protecting my soul. *The devil has far too many things out there that can lead us astray. Remember, he is in charge of this world*.


----------



## CoilyFields

jenny87 said:


> Really? What if you lose your list in a fire? What if you lose a photo album in a fire? You start the heck over. If you believe in God and have a board then you faith should be in him anyway. I see no more problem with incorporate the things you are already praying and having faith for in picture form than having an illustrated prayer journal.
> 
> As far as vision boards having a demonic origin--sure they could. *Isn't Christmas actually a PAGEN holiday?* But most Christians celebrate it as the birth of Jesus and still have Satan Clause hanging in their windows going broke to buy their children presents. How is that different? If you are praying over your board every night for God to grant you what you have precisely placed on a piece of paper, then yes you have a problem. BUT you would have the same problem if you were praying over "just a list". I have quotes on my wall about weight loss, self esteem, and financial freedom and according to these posts that's fine and I am alright with God. BUT the minute I put a picture of flat abs next to it I am a devil worshipper?
> 
> That logic doesn't even make sense........
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2


 
As far as Christmas...there was a pagan holiday celebrated around the time of the winter solstice and pagans celebrated new birth etc. Well Christians took that same day and created a celebration about the birth of Christ and now the pagan day has been lost. They *counter-acted* a sinful practice by practicing somehting Holy...and they called it Christ-mass to deliberately differentiate it from the pagen celebration.

Why not have a "faith board"? I have definately posted scriptures around my office, written things down, acknowledged the desires that God had placed in my heart etc. But to make it a "vision board" is aligning something spiritual with something that is unrighteous.  Its not just semantics. 

A vision board has a distinct worldly origin and is immersed in the LOA school of thought. (Not sure if anyone in this thread has said they support LOA or not). So when we align ourselves with it we are in a sense also supporting LOA and whatever else may come under that umbrella. We are giving our approval for this school of thought and this may lead others astray (i.e. babies in Christ who are not skilled in discerning good from evil, and sinners that believe since a Christian is doing it then theres nothing wrong with it).

I have a feeling that if the discussion of vision boards came up and a Christian said..."I dont believe in vision boards...I have a faith board" that would lead to a discussion of the differences between the two and would be a great tool of witnessing.

For all the ladies that still believe there is nothing wrong with a vision board, yall know there is no condemnation right? Its all love, and I hope that you will at least consider and pray about the status of vision boards before you make a final decision to approve it or have/keep one. Thats all we can ask from each other.


----------



## Laela

The bolded is all that some of us are saying.. of course no one knows what desires God puts on anyone's heart. I see there is misunderstanding about vision boards altogether. The ones the LOA encourage (to will things into happening) as opposed to Christians confessing what they already believe and what God laid on their hearts. From my understanding of LOA vision boards, the more you see it, the more you believe. That's the opposite of faith!



nathansgirl1908 said:


> I will admit that I had some misgivings about things said in the Vision Board thread because many people clearly were not seeking God to fulfill the desires of their heart. Many of them are borderline atheists. But that does not apply to everyone. There's nothing wrong with visual reminders of the desires in your heart. *And it seems as though people often assume that when we speak of things we desire, God has not placed that desire on our heart. You truly can't say what desires God has placed on anyone's heart. God does want to give us things that we enjoy without being made to explain to others how it will be used for the kingdom*. More than anything, I think the judgment in this thread is considerably worse than people putting up pictures or writing things down that they want to see happen in their lives.


----------



## jenny87

CoilyFields said:


> As far as Christmas...there was a pagan holiday celebrated around the time of the winter solstice and pagans celebrated new birth etc. Well Christians took that same day and created a celebration about the birth of Christ and now the pagan day has been lost. They *counter-acted* a sinful practice by practicing somehting Holy...and they called it Christ-mass to deliberately differentiate it from the pagen celebration.
> 
> Why not have a "faith board"? I have definately posted scriptures around my office, written things down, acknowledged the desires that God had placed in my heart etc. But to make it a "vision board" is aligning something spiritual with something that is unrighteous.  Its not just semantics.
> 
> A vision board has a distinct worldly origin and is immersed in the LOA school of thought. (Not sure if anyone in this thread has said they support LOA or not). So when we align ourselves with it we are in a sense also supporting LOA and whatever else may come under that umbrella. We are giving our approval for this school of thought and this may lead others astray (i.e. babies in Christ who are not skilled in discerning good from evil, and sinners that believe since a Christian is doing it then theres nothing wrong with it).
> 
> I have a feeling that if the discussion of vision boards came up and a Christian said..."I dont believe in vision boards...I have a faith board" that would lead to a discussion of the differences between the two and would be a great tool of witnessing.
> 
> For all the ladies that still believe there is nothing wrong with a vision board, yall know there is no condemnation right? Its all love, and I hope that you will at least consider and pray about the status of vision boards before you make a final decision to approve it or have/keep one. Thats all we can ask from each other.



So its okay if you call it something different?  The same basic concept; cut out a picture, glue it, add a bible verse and NOW its holy because I called it a "faith" board instead of a "vision" board?  Changing the name of it does not change the purpose of it.  (I don't know about LOA, so I am speaking of a basic human having a basic vision board and faith that the things they post will come to fruition.)  You add the picturs/goals and pray and have faith for them to come to pass.  So if I call it a "glitter board" I am still doing the same thing.

I guess if people feel that changing the name makes it okay for them then its okay.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


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## Crown

nerdography said:


> Ok, I went looking back through the forums to see if I could find anything about setting goals for yourself and I found this post--> http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=469690&highlight=goals
> 
> And the verse they used was: Hab 2:2 says "And the LORD answered me: “Write the vision; make it plain on tablets, so he may run who reads it."
> 
> So, we're allowed to write down our vision/goals, but not make a visual board because we would end up worshiping the item? I'm not sure if I'm understand this correct, could someone please explain.



Yes, they take this verse to justify vision boards. But, please, look at the context :

Hab. 2: 2 Then the LORD replied: “Write down the *revelation* and make it plain on tablets so that a herald may run with it. 3 For the revelation awaits an appointed time; *it speaks of the end and will not prove false*. Though it linger, wait for it; it will certainly come and will not delay. 

  [FONT=&quot]This word revelation (#2377) means vision, oracle; it is translated by prophecy in some versions (Fr. Vers. LS); it is revelation about the end, nothing in common with our soulish visions.[/FONT]


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## Crown

This thread reminds me of this story :

Nbres. 21.8 *And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole*: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live. 21.9 And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, *and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived*.

GOD said to Moses to make a serpent, and this was a blessing for Israel.
But what happened after that :

2Kgs. 18.3 And *he* (Hezekiah) *did that which was right in the sight of the LORD*, according to all that David his father did. 18.4 *He removed the high places, and brake the images, and cut down the groves, and brake in pieces the brasen serpent that Moses had made: for unto those days the children of Israel did burn incense to it: and he called it Nehushtan.*

Just be careful :
Mat. 26.41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: *the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.*


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## Crown

I have scriptures from the Bible written here and there in my home. I have a cabinet of prayer for when I want to be really alone with my Father, and the walls are decorated only with verses and even chapters of the Bible.

But with a vision board :

What are you focusing on ?

Don’t you fear to fell into idolatry ?

Idolatry is everywhere in the confusion (world, times) where we are living and idol became a good word : Who is your idol ? What is your idol ?

With a vision board, are you sure to know when you are relying only upon your heavenly Father ? or turning God into the genius of your lamp ? or upon the Self  

Don’t answer me, it is just for thinking, the line is personal.


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## Laela

Well thank God for your Momma as your example.


She is woman of faith, confessing with her mouth what she believes in her heart what God already says that she is. 

NOT the same thing as an LOA vision board. 



EtherealEnigma said:


> Also, thank you for this thread. It's a good reminder that I hit the Mommy lottery. She is such a good example of a woman who is truly walking with Christ.
> 
> We grew up on vision boards and manifestation before we knew what they were. She made a list of "I am..." scriptures, framed them and put them around the house. I am a child of God, I am walking by faith and not by sight, I am redeemed... etc. There were at least 25 of them and we said them almost daily. To date, our moral compass is strong.
> 
> Thank God for clarity; thank God for guidance; thank God for logic.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using T-Mobile G2


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## Laela

Naw...not OK.

I don't think you're trying to understand what she said. She already believes what she's seeing. LOA vision boards work the opposite way.




jenny87 said:


> *So its okay if you call it something different*? The same basic concept; cut out a picture, glue it, add a bible verse and NOW its holy because I called it a "faith" board instead of a "vision" board? Changing the name of it does not change the purpose of it. (I don't know about LOA, so I am speaking of a basic human having a basic vision board and faith that the things they post will come to fruition.) You add the picturs/goals and pray and have faith for them to come to pass. So if I call it a "glitter board" I am still doing the same thing.
> 
> I guess if people feel that changing the name makes it okay for them then its okay.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2


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## Iwanthealthyhair67

I've been a 'lurking' member of lhcf from 2009, this post brought me out of lurking mode...

what I've noticed is the 'defence' of the vision board and that in itself tells me that something is wrong, the word of God is defended less vigorously, I say research it as one of the ladies did...

Every self help book is not to be read, even in literature we must ask God for direction less we hop on the latest 'bandwagon' all the way to hell...the devil is crafty and deceptive and uses the most subtle things to distract us from the Truth, just because scripture is being used it does not make it good or right...

Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God...-John 4:1


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## Do_Si_Dos

CandiceC said:


> I view a vision board different from a list like, for example:
> 
> Personal bible study each morning for at least 30 minutes.
> Pay off $200 extra on credit card debt each month.
> Limit caloric intake to 1400 calories each day.
> Exercise on Monday, Wednesday and Saturday mornings this summer.
> Join the church anniversary committee. Attend the three planning meetings.
> Offer encouraging words to husband/boyfriend every day.


 
So that's your list... I have pictures that represent encouraging a stronger relationship with God.. I have the words prayer, quiet time, and my church name on the board.
 For health, I have how much weight I want to lose,  pictures of healthy food, and pictures of people exercising.
 For personal relationships, have a picture of two women having lunch, and a picture of a man and a woman holding hands.  The two women represent friendship and other the couple represent a committed healthy relationship.
 I have career goals listed on there as well.....
So for everything you have listed, I have pictures to keep my goals in front of me. 
If my board is demonic, so is your list.



CoilyFields said:


> Correct me if Im wrong, but isnt it called a vision board because the point is to see what you desire and your actually "seeing" it creates some kind of power magnetism/attraction that brings it to pass.
> 
> Im a very visual person so I write plans down. Thats how I follow them better. But they were just that...plans. I didnt believe my plan had any special powers for me having written it down nor did I believe that looking at it did anything other than allow me a better grasp of what I needed to do and to keep track of what I'd accomplished so far.
> 
> Like I mentioned before, the problem with the vision board is that it was CREATED with principles that based human success on human ability/power alone. Whereas we believe that we can do all things through CHRIST who strengthens us. I see that many are trying to transform its popular use into something that is in line with scripture but forreal forreal its like taking a ouigi (sp) board and trying to use it to get the Holy spirit to make intercession for you.


 
I don't believe the power is in the board. You are giving it the power, not me.  Faith without works is dead.  (2:20) People are so caught up in the board, but not all people who have vision boards believe that LOA is better than the word of God. I know where all my blessings come from.  Yes, I read LOA and I correlated it to having faith and being mindful of the words I am speaking. (Everything else I left in LOA)  Personally, I don't believe I am willing anything for my life.  I pray about it, and I don't worry about it anymore.  




kinchen said:


> How is different from that list? The only difference is you stick the list in a purse and forget about it with a vision board you walk past and see it more. I got up today and read my verses and kept going it reminds me of what I am doing that day. If it's demonic oh well.


 
EXACTLY!!!  Thanks was not enough.  People can't tell you how to have a PERSONAL relationship with God!!!  Do you!


----------



## CandiceC

Do_Si_Dos said:


> So that's your list... I have pictures that represent encouraging a stronger relationship with God.. I have the words prayer, quiet time, and my church name on the board.
> For health, I have how much weight I want to lose, pictures of healthy food, and pictures of people exercising.
> For personal relationships, have a picture of two women having lunch, and a picture of a man and a woman holding hands. The two women represent friendship and other the couple represent a committed healthy relationship.
> I have career goals listed on there as well.....
> So for everything you have listed, I have pictures to keep my goals in front of me.
> If my board is demonic, so is your list.


 
That's not my list. That was just an example of one.  

I actually don't keep a list. I was saying I think a "to do" list, if someone were to choose to have one, is fine.


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## Do_Si_Dos

CandiceC said:


> That's not my list. That was just an example of one.
> 
> I actually don't keep a list. I was saying I think a "to do" list, if someone were to choose to have one, is fine.


 
Whether it is yours or not, based on the things that are being said in this thread, it would be demonic also. 

SN::It is really great to hear other perspectives on these types topics.


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## CoilyFields

jenny87 said:


> So its okay if you call it something different? The same basic concept; cut out a picture, glue it, add a bible verse and NOW its holy because I called it a "faith" board instead of a "vision" board? Changing the name of it does not change the purpose of it. (I don't know about LOA, so I am speaking of a basic human having a basic vision board and faith that the things they post will come to fruition.) You add the picturs/goals and pray and have faith for them to come to pass. So if I call it a "glitter board" I am still doing the same thing.
> 
> I guess if people feel that changing the name makes it okay for them then its okay.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2


 
Im not saying just to change the name and its ok. 

Im saying that for the ladies who do not believe inLOA but really do use visual aids (keeping a journal, writing plans/goals, putting words to the desires that God has placed on their hearts)...it would be better for them to give it its own name because to use the words "vision board" is to align it with the general meaning of the vision board (which purposefully excludes GOd). 

Two diametrically opposed ideas...with two different names (as opposed to trying to ease a different meaning into a demonic practice).

Call it something different because it is something different.


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## curlycue

I'm not all the way through this thread yet, but Shimmie you are speaking the truth up in here. I love it. Praise God!


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## nerdography

@Shimmie

Thank you, your post was very helpful.

 First I want to say, everyone's walk/conversations with God is  different. In all honesty, I think depending on how things come to us, will determine if they are blessed or not. And I always consult everything though God first. If something is not right, I have a very strong negative reaction to it. 

 It was 2009 and I was talking to God and I told him that I feel  stuck. I know that I want different from what I have, but I'm not sure  what that is. And He said, I've given you your desire, but your blocking  yourself because your scared. I said, "how do I unblock myself?" And He said  "look in your heart and use your talent."

 God has given me the gift of art, and I can tell Shimmie that He has given you the gift of writing, me not so much . So I created a collage on a poster  board. He told me to release the shackles of fear because He would  always be there for me and that His desires would be known to me. 

I've always loved pictures, so much so that photography is a past time of mine. Anyway, I'm a visual learner, and God has sent me messages before, but sometimes He has to spell things out for me because I don't always catch on. I understand things better when I can see them in front of me. So, I went though magazine and online and found pictures that spoke to me and that I though were where He wanted me to go. I found pictures of bible quotes, magazine ads of happy married couples, articles about taking care and honoring your body.

And with every new desire He gave me I slapped it on the board. And anything that didn't feel right I removed.

I remember I was complaining to him about how men in my generation seem very demanding and disrespectful to women and they don't cherish us. And my magazine fell open and the title of the article was "Chivalry is Not Dead." And I said "You certainly don't waste time." 

Just this year He's given me the desire to start my own business and gave me a business name and added it to my board. I came across the term vision board on the internet and I thought it fit so I used it. I don't practice the LoA, it sounds a little silly to me. Perhaps, maybe I should have called it a Board of Faith? 

I guess that's why I didn't see the evil in having a board. Because, I guess what I have isn't a vision board.


----------



## jenny87

nerdography said:


> @Shimmie
> 
> Thank you, your post was very helpful.
> 
> First I want to say, everyone's walk/conversations with God is  different. In all honesty, I think depending on how things come to us, will determine if they are blessed or not. And I always consult everything though God first. If something is not right, I have a very strong negative reaction to it.
> 
> It was 2009 and I was talking to God and I told him that I feel  stuck. I know that I want different from what I have, but I'm not sure  what that is. And He said, I've given you your desire, but your blocking  yourself because your scared. I said, "how do I unblock myself?" And He said  "look in your heart and use your talent."
> 
> God has given me the gift of art, and I can tell Shimmie that He has given you the gift of writing, me not so much . So I created a collage on a poster  board. He told me to release the shackles of fear because He would  always be there for me and that His desires would be known to me.
> 
> I've always loved pictures, so much so that photography is a past time of mine. Anyway, I'm a visual learner, and God has sent me messages before, but sometimes He has to spell things out for me because I don't always catch on. I understand things better when I can see them in front of me. So, I went though magazine and online and found pictures that spoke to me and that I though were where He wanted me to go. I found pictures of bible quotes, magazine ads of happy married couples, articles about taking care and honoring your body.
> 
> And with every new desire He gave me I slapped it on the board. And anything that didn't feel right I removed.
> 
> I remember I was complaining to him about how men in my generation seem very demanding and disrespectful to women and they don't cherish us. And my magazine fell open and the title of the article was "Chivalry is Not Dead." And I said "You certainly don't waste time."
> 
> Just this year He's given me the desire to start my own business and gave me a business name and added it to my board. I came across the term vision board on the internet and I thought it fit so I used it. I don't practice the LoA, it sounds a little silly to me. Perhaps, maybe I should have called it a Board of Faith?
> 
> I guess that's why I didn't see the evil in having a board. Because, I guess what I have isn't a vision board.



According to Shimmie it is (a vision board).  It has pictures therefore it is demonic.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


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## nerdography

@jenny87

How depressing, I prayed and asked God what He feels I should do.

In the mean time I've found another forum talking about vision boards and the occult. Here's the link if anyone is interested--> http://www.lipstickalley.com/f83/vision-boards-occult-237578/

I haven't been able to find much about vision boards and the occult, except for what I posted, but I'm still looking. From what I read 'the secret' is a blend of Christianity, Buddhism, science, psychology and occult practices.

Also, Steve Harvey talks about the law of attraction all the time. I've always questioned his Christianity and practices.

ETA// I've been looking for Bible versus taking about asking for things that you want. And I came across Matthew 7:7-12 and it says



> "Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks, receives. Everyone who seeks, finds. And to everyone who knocks, the door will be opened. "You parents--if your children ask for a loaf of bread, do you give them a stone instead? Or if they ask for a fish, do you give them a snake? Of course not! So if you sinful people know how to give good gifts to your children,  how much more will your heavenly Father give good gifts to those who ask  him.Do to others whatever you would like them to do to you. This is the essence of all that is taught in the law and the prophets.


Matthew 21:22



> "All things, whatever you ask in prayer, believing, you will receive."


Mark 11: 23-24



> I tell you the truth, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw  yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in his heart but believes  that what he says will happen, it will be done for him. Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.


Luke 11:9



> "So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.


1 John 3:21-22



> "Dear friends, if we don't feel guilty, we can come to God with bold confidence. And we will receive from him whatever we ask because we obey him and do the things that please him."


So, i can ask for whatever I want and it fine and long as I don't put it on a board. Because once I've put what I've asked for on a board it become demonic/divination? I'm confused. erplexed


----------



## Laela

ITA... 



curlycue said:


> I'm not all the way through this thread yet, but Shimmie you are speaking the truth up in here. I love it. Praise God!


----------



## jenny87

nerdography said:


> @jenny87
> 
> How depressing, I prayed and asked God what He feels I should do.
> 
> In the mean time I've found another forum talking about vision boards and the occult. Here's the link if anyone is interested--> http://www.lipstickalley.com/f83/vision-boards-occult-237578/
> 
> I haven't been able to find much about vision boards and the occult, except for what I posted, but I'm still looking. From what I read 'the secret' is a blend of Christianity, Buddhism, science, psychology and occult practices.
> 
> Also, Steve Harvey talks about the law of attraction all the time. I've always questioned his Christianity and practices.
> 
> ETA// I've been looking for Bible versus taking about asking for things that you want. And I came across Matthew 7:7-12 and it says
> 
> Matthew 21:22
> 
> Mark 11: 23-24
> 
> Luke 11:9
> 
> 1 John 3:21-22
> 
> So, i can ask for whatever I want and it fine and long as I don't put it on a board. Because once I've put what I've asked for on a board it become demonic/divination? I'm confused. erplexed



I'm confused too.  I don't understand why it should matter if it is just a poster and you ask God for these things in faith.  But from the other posters in this thread it seems like if you have picture of anything then you are only serving your own personal desires.

I think you should just pray about it.  If you are not making it demonic or inviting the devil in, I don't see the problem.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


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## Iwanthealthyhair67

Dear Heart,

Have you considered that Father has already answered your prayer based on the little research that you've done and from the sound answers given on this board...

When truth and error are mixed, it brings about 'confusion' and God is not to author of confusion...

Habakkuk 2:2 has often been missued the 'vision' that is being spoken of here is the one that God gives to Habkkuk...

Ask God for the vision for your life and to place HIS desires in your heart, often times what we desire and what he desires for us are contrary to each other..

A 'vision' should and must originate from God, 'visions' originated from us are likely to fail...This is not to say that God is not concerned about what we want, he knows the desires we have in our hearts, and He will help us to achieve them if they are in accordance with His will for our lives.


----------



## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> According to Shimmie it is (a vision board).  It has pictures therefore it is demonic.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2



  

@ _'According to Shimmie' _ 

This is for you "Jenny"   

And  I owe you a huge apology.   I was responding 'upwards' to your comments to my particular posts.   This without understanding that you were not personally defending loa and neither were you practicing loa.   

Please accept my apology.   I mean it.


----------



## makeupgirl

jenny87 said:


> I'm confused too. I don't understand why it should matter if it is just a poster and you ask God for these things in faith. But from the other posters in this thread it seems like if you have picture of anything then you are only serving your own personal desires.
> 
> I think you should just pray about it. If you are not making it demonic or inviting the devil in, I don't see the problem.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2


 
It can become idoltry in the eyes of God.  He said not to have any other gods before him and anything as simple as a push pin can be worshipped by some people.  Satan is really tricky and is more dangerous than ever because his time is almost up.  If people focus more on earthly things instead of God, then that's has become the god of their life.  

basically, if it takes away from God, then it's not good.  If that board keeps your focus, then it's not of God.  It's of the world.  

1 John 2:15 says "Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, then the love of the Father is not in him."

basically you're treading the lust of the pride of life, which is one of the ways Satan tempts us.  The vision board takes away from God, thus giving you glory for accomplishing that particular goal that is on the vision board.  

Everyone has goals.  But it doesn't mean that we allow it to consume us by focusing on pictures, words, or whatever regarding that goal.  We give it to God in prayer and believe that we're going to receive it but if you don't have it, it could be that God doesn't want you to have that or it may not be time.  

Sometimes things are ask amiss, in other words, the right reasons are not there as to why you want what you want.  

I hope this helps


----------



## Shimmie

I pray that I can clear this up.   I'm asking for God's leading and His wisdom as I'm sharing this.

Here at LHCF there began a thread series entitled: "The Secret" -- "Creating Your Own Reality".   

From there it took off in the Forum like wildfire.  The bandwagon became a fleet of ocean liners.  At first glance, I had 'mixed feelings' because I admired the person who started the thread who is a very nice person.   But it still did not fit well in my spirit.   

I knew what it was... its was a work of darkness casting it's shadow over here.   

I began noticing the Chrisitan 'Sell-outs' (those who sang the praises of Jesus) were now singing the praises of LOA and it's teachers, seminars, books, CD's, Videos, and you name it...then came the true validation of it... "Oprah".  

Everything in LOA is self centered.   The enemy has the 12 commandments of deception for those to follow.  If you look at the diagrahm in the link provided  it's actually a pentagrahm featuring the nine 'energies' which bring a person to their desired destinies and/or material access.

In addition to the 9 energies in the pentagram (sp?) the other aspects are:  "Good Thoughts" which are utilized to draw a desired result into the person's life; "Good Deeds" and then there's the 'Breathing' and Vibrations.

Adding to this 'The vision boards' as their one of their working tools; in addtion to: 

Praising the Universe for it's Release of Their Desires
Asking the Universe for the Release of Their Desires
Seeking the Universe ......
Focusing and Meditations Upon One's Desires
Vibrations of Mediations...

Okay... bringing this up to date:   The secret and it's components were then popping up here in the Christianity forum with it's supporters and their aruguments to defend it.  Every once and a while a thread pops up and in it you will find those who support it and those who know better.    

What's sad is seeing Christians who have jumped ship and are in total support of this afront against God.   Why?  They are in with the group of non-believers doing what non-believers do.   Why?  

I just don't understand how material things can mean more than a relationship with Him. 

There is a major difference between the 'secret's tool of vision boards and one having a list of life's priorities.   There are several in this thread who have clearly shared that difference.   nerdography is one of them and so did several others.


----------



## makeupgirl

Shimmie said:


> I pray that I can clear this up. I'm asking for God's leading and His wisdom as I'm sharing this.
> 
> Here at LHCF there began a thread series entitled: "The Secret" -- "Creating Your Own Reality".
> 
> From there it took off in the Forum like wildfire. The bandwagon became a fleet of ocean liners. At first glance, I had 'mixed feelings' because I admired the person who started the thread who is a very nice person. But it still did not fit well in my spirit.
> 
> I knew what it was... its was a work of darkness casting it's shadow over here.
> 
> I began noticing the Chrisitan 'Sell-outs' (those who sang the praises of Jesus) were now singing the praises of LOA and it's teachers, seminars, books, CD's, Videos, and you name it...then came the true validation of it... "Oprah".
> 
> Everything in LOA is self centered. The enemy has the 12 commandments of deception for those to follow. If you look at the diagrahm in the link provided it's actually a pentagrahm featuring the nine 'energies' which bring a person to their desired destinies and/or material access.
> 
> In addition to the 9 energies in the pentagram (sp?) the other aspects are: "Good Thoughts" which are utilized to draw a desired result into the person's life; "Good Deeds" and then there's the 'Breathing' and Vibrations.
> 
> Adding to this 'The vision boards' as their one of their working tools; in addtion to:
> 
> Praising the Universe for it's Release of Their Desires
> Asking the Universe for the Release of Their Desires
> Seeking the Universe ......
> Focusing and Meditations Upon One's Desires
> Vibrations of Mediations...
> 
> Okay... bringing this up to date: The secret and it's components were then popping up here in the Christianity forum with it's supporters and their aruguments to defend it. Every once and a while a thread pops up and in it you will find those who support it and those who know better.
> 
> What's sad is seeing Christians who have jumped ship and are in total support of this afront against God. Why? They are in with the group of non-believers doing what non-believers do. Why?
> 
> I just don't understand how material things can mean more than a relationship with Him.
> 
> There is a major difference between the 'secret's tool of vision boards and one having a list of life's priorities. There are several in this thread who have clearly shared that difference. @nerdography is one of them and so did several others.


 
well said, Ms. Shimmie


----------



## nathansgirl1908

I still don't understand why Christians who happen to have vision boards are all being lumped into the categories of those who are not Christians.  All this talk about how it CAN turn into idolatry is starting to become borderline judgmental.   Seriously. People have made it clear that their focus is on Him. Let it go at that. 

I also want to reiterate some things that have already been said.  First and foremost, everyone that quotes scripture is not of God. And while people are trying to "check" 
people about vision boards, I hope they are "checking" themselves as well.  

This has been the first time I have truly understood why so many people are turned off from Christians. No matter how hard people try to order their steps, someone always comes along to try and make them feel bad about it.  Someone always tries to make them feel that they are borderline demonic or engaging in demonic practices.  Not to mention that too many people in the Kingdom seem to place certain people on pedestals because they talk a good game. We are all equal in this walk. No one is better than anyone else. And the same way a vision board can result in idolatry is the same way food can, or shopping, or a host of other things.


----------



## Shimmie

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I still don't understand why Christians who happen to have vision boards are all being lumped into the categories of those who are not Christians.  All this talk about how it CAN turn into idolatry is starting to become borderline judgmental.   Seriously. People have made it clear that their focus is on Him. Let it go at that.
> 
> I also want to reiterate some things that have already been said.  First and foremost, everyone that quotes scripture is not of God. And while people are trying to "check" people about vision boards, I hope they are "checking" themselves as well.
> 
> This has been the first time I have truly understood why so many people are turned off from Christians. No matter how hard people try to order their steps, someone always comes along to try and make them feel bad about it.  Someone always tries to make them feel that they are borderline demonic or engaging in demonic practices.  Not to mention that too many people in the Kingdom seem to place certain people on pedestals because they talk a good game. We are all equal in this walk. No one is better than anyone else. And the same way a vision board can result in idolatry is the same way food can, or shopping, or a host of other things.



The OP's thread question is:  Are vision boards demonic?

The answer is 'Yes'.

And nathansgirl1908, you are absolutely right, no one is better than anyone else.    Only Jesus and even He humbled Himself BEYOND humility placing Himself not only as one of us, but even beneath us by His love upon the Cross.    

And yes, not everyone who quotes scripture is of God.  Even satan quotes scripture and he quotes and KNOWS it well.    he uses it to deceive even the very elect of God to lead them astray; to lure them away from God.  he did it to Eve in the Garden.  he went further by trying to tempt Jesus with _"If you be the Son of God..."_  Yet Jesus did not succomb to satan's deceptions.  

Now let's be real.   Any Christian who claims that having a vision board has deepened their relationship with God has not seen Jesus.   For when one sees Jesus, they're not going for anyone nor anything less.    And a vision board is indeed far less than Jesus.   Far less.   

Therefore, does one really need or require a vision board to get closer to God when Jesus Himself is our advocate, our liaison, our direct contact with God the Father.  Because of Jesus we can call God Abba Father, which only a child of His can do.  No one else.   

No vision board has ever done what Jesus has done for us to bring us closer to God and a vision board never can do this...none.   

The vision board practice in this forum didn't start with God, it started with the loa concept and it's been growing ever since.    Those who joined it, didn't join it to get closer to God, they were 'lured' by the concept of manifesting their dreams.   This is not a judgment, it's just plain and simple and obvious.   The process is:  Focus on your board.   If it was focus on Jesus, there'd be no need for a board.

When it comes to Jesus, no board can come between us.  He's all we need and will give us His All without fail...

Jesus masters and protects our destinies.  He keeps His promises and will lead us in the paths of Righteousness for His names' sake.   God said we can trust Him to bring it to pass; all that we commit to Him, He will keep it.  
protected.    

I can toss loa and its practices out of the window and never regret it... 

Psalm 56:9

_This I know for God is for me.... _

And you...   All of you.  

No condemnation...


----------



## nathansgirl1908

Shimmie said:


> The OP's thread question is:  Are vision boards demonic?
> 
> The answer is 'Yes'.
> 
> Now let's be real.   Any Christian who claims that having a vision board has deepened their relationship with God......



Who said that though?  I know I never said it because it isnt true. 

I'm sorry but you can't definitively say that a  vision board is demonic.   It may be in some circumstances but not all.


----------



## jenny87

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I still don't understand why Christians who happen to have vision boards are all being lumped into the categories of those who are not Christians.  All this talk about how it CAN turn into idolatry is starting to become borderline judgmental.   Seriously. People have made it clear that their focus is on Him. Let it go at that.
> 
> I also want to reiterate some things that have already been said.  First and foremost, everyone that quotes scripture is not of God. And while people are trying to "check"
> people about vision boards, I hope they are "checking" themselves as well.
> 
> This has been the first time I have truly understood why so many people are turned off from Christians. No matter how hard people try to order their steps, someone always comes along to try and make them feel bad about it.  Someone always tries to make them feel that they are borderline demonic or engaging in demonic practices.  Not to mention that too many people in the Kingdom seem to place certain people on pedestals because they talk a good game. We are all equal in this walk. No one is better than anyone else. And the same way a vision board can result in idolatry is the same way food can, or shopping, or a host of other things.



I agree 110%!

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


----------



## Shimmie

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Who said that though?  I know I never said it because it isnt true.
> 
> I'm sorry but you can't definitively say that a  vision board is demonic.   It may be in some circumstances but not all.



Stemming from the loa, it's demonic.    

It is what is... 

Yet God has given us Himself, which is far, far better.  God is solid.  A vision board is sinking sand. 

Sincere Questions:  Do you feel lost without a vision board?   Why fight so hard to defend it?   I don't understand the fight to defend it so.    

It has no comparison to having a direct connection with God as our Father in Heaven. 

Again, no condemnation here.  None.  I'm just asking.


----------



## nerdography

Shimmie said:


> Sincere Questions:  Do you feel lost without a vision board?   Why fight so hard to defend it?   I don't understand the fight to defend it so.



At the end of the day it isn't about the board and I don't think any of us feel lost without it. Some people have boards and some people have journals. I agree with @nathansgirl1908 anything can fall into idolatry. Someone could say that you're worshiping your journal. If you're constantly talking about it, writing in it, going back and reading it, and carrying it everywhere with you. Then they could say "Why do you write your prayers down, you should just be able to say them and let it be. You're worshiping that piece of paper it's demonic. You don't need that journal all you need is you Bible and nothing else."

But, we know that's not true.

For me personally, I felt like you were saying I was a bad Christian and that I didn't love God or Jesus and that I was a devil worshiper. At the end of the day my strength comes from my faith in the Lord and no one else.

By calling the board demonic you're indirectly calling us demonic and people were hurt and offended by that.



> 1 Corinthians 10:31
> 
> So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God.


----------



## Solitude

This thread has been helpful to me. I've been having a hard time goal-setting and was looking into vision boards since reading about them on here. As a Christian, I wanted to research it more and see how it all aligned with my faith. I now feel that the vision board concept is not for me. 

I will say that I have used "visuals" of my goals since long before I heard of the concept of manifestation. I did it as teen - posted a picture up of a body type to stay focused on fitness, posted up pictures of a college I wanted to go to, or a picture of an item I was saving up for. During my senior year in HS, I put pictures of my college goals in my senior book and achieved every single one of those goals by the time I graduated. I did the same while trying to get admitted for law school. So, I do not think that visual reminders in themselves are demonic, but I steer clear of asking the universe for anything or thinking that I can manifest things myself. 

I've never read The Secret or looked into LOA or any of that, but the whole vision board thing just doesn’t sit right with me.


----------



## nathansgirl1908

Shimmie said:


> Stemming from the loa, it's demonic.
> 
> It is what is...
> 
> Yet God has given us Himself, which is far, far better.  God is solid.  A vision board is sinking sand.
> 
> Sincere Questions:  Do you feel lost without a vision board?   Why fight so hard to defend it?   I don't understand the fight to defend it so.
> 
> It has no comparison to having a direct connection with God as our Father in Heaven.
> 
> Again, no condemnation here.  None.  I'm just asking.



Nope.  YOU are the one intent on turning it into something where we are lost without it.  As for defense of the boards, it really is more about defense of character at this point.  You are saying that we are using demonic tactics.  I resent that for several reasons.  However, no one said anything about it being a direct connection with God.  Are you resentful that others are strong enough to come boldly to the throne and ask for the desires of their heart?  God does want us to have things we enjoy.  As long as we aren't asking amiss and we don't forget that He is the one who does everything for us, there's no issue.  
I've already told you that I have not had any feeling that God was not pleased with my vision board or that it was demonic.  I'm not sure why you have a hard time recognizing that.   

After it's all said and done, you obviously don't recognize that not everyone is into LOA stuff.


----------



## JayAnn0513

Vision boards my be used by people who practice LOA but they didn't invent, nor are they the only ones who use it.  The practice of visualizing your goals is way older than LOA. 


Sent from my iPhone using LHCF


----------



## makeupgirl

Ok, just reading the posts from yesterday and today, I am dumbfounded by the defensive mode that is going on.  We are all sisters in Christ, we're family.  Agree to disagree and move on if possible but lets not argue about this.  The bible is very clear on what is of God and what is not.  There is nothing wrong with someone pointing out scriptures to prove their point, especially if they are being led by the Holy Spirit to do so.  

There is confusion, God is not a God of confusion.  This lets me know that Satan has a foothold right now in this thread.  Lets end it and lets end it now.  If you're having doubts about the vision board, pray about it.  Ask God is it of his will to have one.  If it's against his word, then you know immediately that the answer is no.  

Here is something to read regarding prayer.  It speaks about asking amiss and other topics such as bothering God, using God, laundry list prayer.  http://www.spirithome.com/prayersp.html

Here is a little snippet about what the site says about asking amiss.



> *ASKING AMISS*
> 
> Prayer is no place for illusions. Yet, each of us clings to illusions, and we will end up somehow bringing them into our prayers. This leads to what James called "asking amiss". The Spirit is working to tell us the truth, and the growth of our prayer relationship with God depends on how well we take heed.


 
What does it mean regarding the vision boards?  Don't know, you'll have to ask God.  But lets all ask the question, the items or dreams or goals that may be on the vision boards, loa, or anything else that may pertain to our wants vs. our needs, ask is it of God?  Does it apply and follow his word and his purpose for our lives?  Does it take away from the glory of God?  

This is just food for thought, not to judge or call out anyone, I'm beginning to ask myself if what I want for my life is in alignment with what God's plan is for my life based on his word.  

At the end of the day, we're here to worship God, which is why we were created in the first place.  This world is not about us, in fact, if you're in Christ, then you know that this world is no longer our home.  We're just passing through being about our Father's business spreading the gospel of Christ.  That should be the forethought.  Not earthly things and visions.  

Ok people, I got to go back to work before this ADD kicks in.


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67

I admonish you to put aside what you think you know and how you feel and how harmless 'the board' seems and seek Father God directly on the matter

Let him know that you don't want to displease him in anyway not even in the slightest and to give you instruction concerning the Vision Board and wait on his answer, trust me I know that he will answer your prayers...

Let Thy (HIS) will be done not yours...


----------



## nathansgirl1908

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> I admonish you to put aside what you think you know and how you feel and how harmless 'the board' seems and seek Father God directly on the matter
> 
> Let him know that you don't want to displease him in anyway not even in the slightest and to give you instruction concerning the Vision Board and wait on his answer, trust me I know that he will answer your prayers...
> 
> Let Thy (HIS) will be done not yours...



Do you realize that these statements imply that you know better than someone who has said they have already sought God on the matter?  Stop assuming that you know what God is telling people on an individual basis. You don't.


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

Personally, I feel this is the reason why a lot people stop going to church. As Christians, some of us can be so small minded. The world is not black and white there are a lot of beautiful shades of grey in between. We ALL have a our OWN personal relationship with GOD! Other people do not have the right to tell others how to worship, and then go a step further and calling their practices demonic. I like visionboards or should I call it a faithboard to pacify others..... Someone else may like to journal, SO WHAT! 

As Christians, we should spend more time loving each other vs. condemning or judging others because they don't worship like you do. Clearly we are overlooking bible verses such as John8:7.


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67

Aren't you doing to the same thing that you have accused me of, please don't perceive to know who I directed my comments to, which in fact were to the persons who have not yet seeked God's view on this...

You would agree that many people do what 'they' think is right without asking God what he thinks...




nathansgirl1908 said:


> Do you realize that these statements imply that you know better than someone who has said they have already sought God on the matter? Stop assuming that you know what God is telling people on an individual basis. You don't.


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67

Acutally we are to be single minded in the things of Christ and guarded on matters left to individual conscience, imo Godly reasoning recognizes no gray areas, recognizing that just because something is 'lawful' does not mean it should be practiced.


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> Acutally we are to be single minded in the things of Christ and guarded on matters left to individual conscience, imo Godly reasoning recognizes no gray areas, recognizing that just because something is 'lawful' does not mean it should be practiced.


 
Vision boards and journals are grey, imo. No one is practicing LOA!!!


----------



## Shimmie

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> Acutally we are to be single minded in the things of Christ and guarded on matters left to individual conscience, imo Godly reasoning recognizes no gray areas, recognizing that just because something is 'lawful' does not mean it should be practiced.



Yes... single minded indeed.


----------



## Shimmie

makeupgirl said:


> Ok, just reading the posts from yesterday and today, I am dumbfounded by the defensive mode that is going on.  We are all sisters in Christ, we're family.  Agree to disagree and move on if possible but lets not argue about this.  The bible is very clear on what is of God and what is not.  There is nothing wrong with someone pointing out scriptures to prove their point, especially if they are being led by the Holy Spirit to do so.
> 
> There is confusion, God is not a God of confusion.  This lets me know that Satan has a foothold right now in this thread.  Lets end it and lets end it now.  If you're having doubts about the vision board, pray about it.  Ask God is it of his will to have one.  If it's against his word, then you know immediately that the answer is no.
> 
> Here is something to read regarding prayer.  It speaks about asking amiss and other topics such as bothering God, using God, laundry list prayer.  http://www.spirithome.com/prayersp.html
> 
> Here is a little snippet about what the site says about asking amiss.
> 
> 
> 
> What does it mean regarding the vision boards?  Don't know, you'll have to ask God.  But lets all ask the question, the items or dreams or goals that may be on the vision boards, loa, or anything else that may pertain to our wants vs. our needs, ask is it of God?  Does it apply and follow his word and his purpose for our lives?  Does it take away from the glory of God?
> 
> This is just food for thought, not to judge or call out anyone, I'm beginning to ask myself if what I want for my life is in alignment with what God's plan is for my life based on his word.
> 
> At the end of the day, we're here to worship God, which is why we were created in the first place.  This world is not about us, in fact, if you're in Christ, then you know that this world is no longer our home.  We're just passing through being about our Father's business spreading the gospel of Christ.  That should be the forethought.  Not earthly things and visions.
> 
> Ok people, I got to go back to work before this ADD kicks in.



Beautiful message.   makeupgirl, you always have the heart of keeping peace.   There is absolutely nothing ADD about you...ever.  

I've already openingly apologized to two of our posters and I apologize to you as well.    

It is not my intent to hurt, offend, call out or devalue anyone.   Neither am I placing myself above anyone, for I am first to proclaim that I am not and I have no shame to admit it.     

My attack is not upon anyone personally, it is upon the subject and the widespread deception of the New Age movement which has seaped into Christianity.  

None of us who know God can deny what's going on. It's obvious when satan is spilling his lies to deceive the Body of Christ.  It's all over the world, not just in here.  And it's linked to one thing, satan wants to rule. 

There's 'blood' in the waters and it's not the Blood of Jesus.   What seems harmless is satan's lure and it's leading to many falling away from the true Faith of which we hold dear... *"Christ Alone".*

There is no room for compromise; there are no gray areas.   Jesus is not compiled into mix of confusion of other beliefs and practices.  

God is Sovereign not gray (or grey).   Gray is a dismal distortion of compromise, a color that has been faded, a substance which has been diluted...weakened.    None of us serve a 'weakened' God; He is more than able and most willing to bless us.  If He can hold the world than He most definitely can hold our individual Destinies. 

I cannot stop anyone from becoming upset, offended, or saying, 'this is why people don't go to Church... etc.'.    When it comes to offense, in this life it's going to happen... period.  On any given subject there will always be those who oppose and those who do not.   And others who simply do not care one way or another, until it hits them on a personal level.    This indicates only one thing.   That we need God in our lives all the more without any distractions or wedges or self will. 

satan would love nothing more than for me and the others who are exposing his lies, to succomb to 'counter' reactions and speak no further about his lies.   satan wants entry into the Body of Christ so that he can have and keep full control.   

Jesus said that we would encounter opposition; he, himself did...big time. He was wrongly accused and misunderstood by many, yet He never stopped.  

I'm not Jesus, none of us are.   I am not righteous of my own right but only by God alone.  He's done this for us all.    

How much more to serve Him and honour Him with grateful heart.  How much more we need Him who is far more solid than a vision board.


----------



## Sharpened

Do_Si_Dos said:


> Vision boards and journals are grey, imo. No one is practicing LOA!!!



You are comparing recording our relationship with the Father to fixed objects which grab our attention, which we think is best. My children may one day find my writings and see how God has operated in my life, they will see that my focus, my obsession was on Him, His will and His Powerful Spirit. There is no comparison.

Speaking for myself, the number one reason I do not attend "church" is because I do not see His will being done that I see in the Book of Acts. Nobody bothered to ask Him want He wanted. People tend to forget He is a sovereign ruler who does have a protocol in how He wants to be approached. Since people want to believe and worship as they see fit, little-to-no heavenly power affects the world at large. This will soon change...


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

deleted........ Be blessed!







Sent from my HTC Glacier using HTC Glacier


----------



## ajoke

Solitude said:


> This thread has been helpful to me. I've been having a hard time goal-setting and was looking into vision boards since reading about them on here. As a Christian, I wanted to research it more and see how it all aligned with my faith. I now feel that the vision board concept is not for me.
> 
> I will say that I have used "visuals" of my goals since long before I heard of the concept of manifestation. I did it as teen - posted a picture up of a body type to stay focused on fitness, posted up pictures of a college I wanted to go to, or a picture of an item I was saving up for. During my senior year in HS, I put pictures of my college goals in my senior book and achieved every single one of those goals by the time I graduated. I did the same while trying to get admitted for law school. *So, I do not think that visual reminders in themselves are demonic, but I steer clear of asking the universe for anything or thinking that I can manifest things myself.
> 
> I've never read The Secret or looked into LOA or any of that, but the whole vision board thing just doesn’t sit right with me*.




I totally agree with the bolded.


----------



## Sharpened

Do_Si_Dos said:


> I can't.
> 
> For the record no one is saying LOA is the way to go. No one has said anything about LOA being more powerful than God. To me God is all powerful. Vision board does not equal LOA. LOA is the issue not the vision board.
> 
> And the grey area for me as nothing to do with whether God is all powerful, but in how people worship.
> 
> Some churches sing straight hymnals and some are comtemporary in their choice of music. Does it make one greater than the other? No, this is the beautiful grey area I speak.
> 
> Lastly, having a vision board does not mean your goals/vision are not aligned with God's purpose for your life. No one is asking the universe to do anything for them.



There is no black, white, or gray; those are inventions of the human mind. There is light and darkness, which can give off a false light (2 Corinthians 11:14). What the Father Almighty finds beautiful should be our focus: a contrite heart, generosity though destitute, obedience in the face of temptation, desiring His will above ours, worshiping on our faces at His feet, asking for His Blood to cover our sins, patience, endurance, and faith without compromise...the fruits of the Spirit.

The question still remains: did God tell anyone to make a vision board to remind them of their role in the Kingdom? If you made one, did He approve of it? If not, it is of man and draws on _soul power_, not spiritual power from His Holy Spirit. We are to give up the soul (our will, what we think is best) for His will. His will be done, right?


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

Nymphe said:


> There is no black, white, or gray; those are inventions of the human mind. There is light and darkness, which can give off a false light (2 Corinthians 11:14). What the Father Almighty finds beautiful should be our focus: a contrite heart, generosity though destitute, obedience in the face of temptation, desiring His will above ours, worshiping on our faces at His feet, asking for His Blood to cover our sins, patience, endurance, and faith without compromise...the fruits of the Spirit.
> 
> The question still remains: did God tell anyone to make a vision board to remind them of their role in the Kingdom? If you made one, did He approve of it? If not, it is of man and draws on _soul power_, not spiritual power from His Holy Spirit. We are to give up the soul (our will, what we think is best) for His will. His will be done, right?



Do you have the answers to these questions or a should a person  take up with God? If they say they have, will it then be said that they heard wrong.  Its about a personal relationship and everyone's relationship with God is different........... The only person I am here to please is him, and there is nothing more for me to say.

Do I believe in God? The answer Christians is yes. That's black and white, meaning it is a fact that can be supported by the bible. We should worship in spirit and in truth. Again a fact thats in black and white. However, the bible does not say how I have to personally have a relationship with God, which is grey because its on an individual basis.

Please be blessed and let's agree to disagree. I am really over it. Thanks.

Sent from my HTC Glacier using HTC Glacier


----------



## Shimmie

Jynlnd13 said:


> All I can say right now is, I got way to wrapped up in LOA. I was getting confused and thinking I could do it myself, and kind of pushing God to the side. Don't get me wrong, I still loved God, I was just thinking I could manifest stuff myself. Next thing I know, I'm in the hospital with a rare agressive stage 4 cancer that had doctors confused and crying for me, because they were,'t sure what to do ( I'm 20, btw a youngin lol )
> 
> My mom and I stopped anything LOA that second, I was in the hospital for months, so my mom threw my vision board and journal away for me. I believe this was a test of faith for me. God healed me after two chemo treatments and on my last cat scan every tumor was gone. I had them on my cervix and uterus, and also nodules on my lungs that how far the cancer had spread.
> 
> I will never again mess with LOA in thinking I am in control.
> 
> I lean and rely on God and by the stripes of Jesus I am healed. The whole experince humbled me and def. turned me away from LOA. It is not for me, I will do what God's word says.
> 
> I'm too blessed to get caught up in that again.



Jynlnd13

Dear Jynlnd13... 

I'm so happy that God has healed you.  So, so glad.   I give Him all the praise right along with you and your Mom.

God bless you, always.


----------



## Shimmie

Do_Si_Dos said:


> My vision board helps me stay in faith for the things God has promised me. When I get discouraged, I look at my board and I KNOW that it has already been done.
> 
> *LOA, helped me to be more positive in my thought life, I truly believe there is power of life and death in the tongue.(Proverbs 18:21)  I am more active in trusting God, because of the words I am speaking and my thought life.*
> 
> I only want to be around people who are speaking life!!! Anything that manifests in my life, I know without a shadow of a doubt is was not my own doing.  God work that thing out for me.





Do_Si_Dos said:


> Vision boards and journals are grey, imo.
> *
> 
> No one is practicing LOA!!!  *



 ...... There is no mix of the two, Dear One...


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

Shimmie said:


> ...... There is no mix of the two, Dear One...



As I said previously, the only thing I took from LOA was being more positive. Which is something my pastor spoke about and I have read books by christian authors, such as Joyce Meyers that spoke about the same thing. So again, I am done with this conversation, but thanks........ So thanks for your help, but I am good. Be blessed. 

Sent from my HTC Glacier using HTC Glacier


----------



## Jynlnd13

Shimmie said:


> Jynlnd13
> 
> Dear Jynlnd13...
> 
> I'm so happy that God has healed you.  So, so glad.   I give Him all the praise right along with you and your Mom.
> 
> God bless you, always.



Thank you shimmie  God is really lifting my spirits right now, because I've been having a little problem with negative thoughts. Your comments really touched me and I apperciate it.

God bless you too sister.


----------



## Shimmie

Jynlnd13 said:


> Thank you shimmie  God is really lifting my spirits right now, because I've been having a little problem with negative thoughts. Your comments really touched me and I apperciate it.
> 
> God bless you too sister.



  Precious Jynlnd, God's gifts are without repentence.  He never gives and takes them away from you.   Your healing is His gift of love to you and it's yours forever.   The Blood of Jesus has sealed it and it cannot be unsealed.  Nothing unseals the Blood of the Lamb.  

Be healthy, be strong, be beautiful...always.  For it is truly yours without regret from God our Father.  

You are healed ... this 'we' know for God is for you.  He never lies.


----------



## Successfulmiss

*If we don't know how to talk and minister to one another in loving kindness, how will we win the world?*

Peace to all of you and thank you Lord for our personal relationship with you and that you will deal with our hearts as you see fit.


----------



## Afrobuttafly

I commend you for questioning something like this and not just blindly following it. When things like this arise always look at the ORIGIN. What is it based on, where did it come from? Some things of and within themselves are not necessarily bad..but if their origin is pagan or Satanic no true Christian would want to have even limited involvement in it. Others have made very valid points here. The devil is as slick as they come. Keep questioning..keep seeking truth.


----------



## Sharpened

Keep in mind, my answer is not only towards you, but the forum as a whole. By His direct Guidance do I operate and I will always encourage freedom from worldly things and the desire the world feeds us.



Do_Si_Dos said:


> Do you have the answers to these questions or a should a person  take up with God?



We should take all things to Him first, always. The Bible is full of examples of what happens when we do not. Even so, he sometimes say “yes” to teach us a lesson.



> If they say they have, will it then be said that they heard wrong.



That is just it; no one has. Also, God does allow us to do our own thing, even to the detriment to ourselves. Thanks to the self-esteem/positivity trap, people do not take the time to pray to God to keep them from deception and distraction. 



> Its about a personal relationship and everyone's relationship with God is different...........



Yes, we all have a different role in the Body to advance the Kingdom, but that only happens when we “kill” all of self daily. Is His Spirit dwelling within not enough?



> The only person I am here to please is him, and there is nothing more for me to say.



But have you asked Him what make Him happy? Did you wait for the answer?



> Do I believe in God? The answer Christians is yes. That's black and white, meaning it is a fact that can be supported by the bible. We should worship in spirit and in truth. Again a fact thats in black and white. However, the bible does not say how I have to personally have a relationship with God, which is grey because its on an individual basis.
> 
> Please be blessed and let's agree to disagree. I am really over it. Thanks.



As I said, the black, white, and gray distinctions are from the human mind; God desires us to focus on His Holy Light and what He finds beautiful. The adversary and his minions believe, but true believers sacrifice all (as Jesus did) to be filled with His Light and, in turn, radiate that Light. 

You have to take it to the next level, which _is_ worshiping in spirit and truth. The only way to do that is to be willing to transcend (outgrow) the tangibles (the physical, emotions, or whatever the world deems important), like vision boards, to have His will transform into your will. If not, one will stay stuck on the path until something happens to take it away as some in this thread have testified to (thanks to the Lord for your witness, ladies).

I did ask how He wanted us to approach His throne and He gave me the answer several times. I posted it, but it is up to each of us to ask Him what He wants, not what we think is best.


----------



## jenny87

I see the number of people losing all control in this thread is increasing......you cannot tell someone something when they have already made up their minds about you.  And why attempt to defend yourself and your walk with God to anyone anyway?

Sent from my T-Mobile G2


----------



## Incognitus

Despite its divisiveness, this thread has helped me immensely. I've read posts by those who brought up varying perspectives and those who were completely oblivious to what others were saying. Nonetheless, each post contributed to the discussion and raised many different factors for me to consider. Thus, I say thank you to _*all *_posters for contributing and assisting me in reaching my own conclusions.


----------



## makeupgirl

jenny87 said:


> I see the number of people losing all control in this thread is increasing......you cannot tell someone something when they have already made up their minds about you. And why attempt to defend yourself and your walk with God to anyone anyway?
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2


 
If you know who you are in Christ, then there is nothing to defend.  Paul wrote to the Romans that we are to present our bodies as a living sacriface, holy and acceptable unto God which is our reasonable service.  Then he goes on to say that we should not conform to this world but be transformed by the renewing of our minds.  (This is Romans 12:1-2)  

Think about it this way.  God is always in control even when we relinquish control.  Each born again Christian has the Holy Spirit in them, as Jesus promised to us as the comforter, to lead and guide us into all truths.  If something isn't of God, he's going to let us know straight up.  However, he's not going to force us to do anything that we don't want to do.  If we chose at that moment not to follow what the Holy Spirit is saying, then we have choosen to walk in the flesh instead of the Spirit.  

Know that Satan is the author of confusion, strife, injustice, ok basically anything and everything that is bad and against God.  He's enjoying the confusion that is going on, the lost of control, the snap judgments, etc.  That's his deal.  He loves it when Christians mess up.  We're his former kids, so he's pretty ticked off at us and just want to go up to Heaven to gloat and tell God that we're not to be trusted.  That's his MO.  His number is almost up and he's doing everything he can to take some people with him on his eternal fiery trip.  

Just from reading your posts, you have a thrist for knowledge regarding learning more about Christ and pleasing him.  Whenever that confusion comes about or you feel attacked, go directly to God and tell him about how you're feeling.  He wants us to do that anyway.  He's open 24/7.


----------



## lilanie

A great story about compromise...

Dad's Brownies

    A father of some teenage children had the family rule that they could not attend PG-13 or R rated movies. His three teens wanted to see a particular popular movie that was playing at local theaters. It was rated PG-13.
    The teens interviewed friends and even some members of their family's church to find out what was offensive in the movie. The teens made a list of pros and cons about the movie to use to convince their dad that they should be allowed to see it. The con's were that it contained ONLY 3 swear words, the ONLY violence was a building exploding (and you see that on TV all the time they said), and you actually did not "see" the couple in the movie having sex - it was just implied sex, off camera.  The pros were that it was a popular movie - a block buster.  Everyone was seeing it.  If the teens saw the movie then they would not feel left out when their friends discussed it. The movie contained a good story and plot. It had some great adventure and suspense in it. There were some fantastic special effects in this movie. The movie's stars were some of the most talented actors in Hollywood. It probably would be nominated for several awards.


    Many of the members of their Christian church had even seen the movie and said it wasn't "very bad".  Therefore, since there were more pros than cons the teens said they were asking their father to reconsider his position on just this ONE movie and let them have permission to go see it.
    The father looked at the list and thought for a few minutes. He said he could tell his children had spent some time and thought on this request. He asked if he could have a day to think about it before making his decision. The teens were thrilled thinking; "Now we've got him! Our argument is too good! Dad can't turn us down!"  So, they happily agreed to let him have a day to think about their request.
    The next evening the father called in his three teenagers, who were smiling smugly, into the living room. There on the coffee table he had a plate of brownies. The teens were puzzled. The father told his children he had thought about their request and had decided that if they would eat a brownie then he would let them go to the movie.  But just like the movie, the brownies had pros and cons.
    The pros were that they were made with the finest chocolate and other good ingredients. They had the added special effect of yummy walnuts in them. The brownies were moist and fresh with wonderful chocolate frosting on top. He had made these fantastic brownies using an award-winning recipe. And best of all, the brownies had been made lovingly by the hand of their own father.
    The brownies only had one con. The father had included a little bit of a special ingredient. The brownies also contained just a little bit of dog poop. But he had mixed the dough well - they probably would not even be able to taste the dog poop and he had baked it at 350 degrees so any bacteria or germs from the dog poop had probably been destroyed.
    Therefore, if any of his children could stand to eat the brownies which included just a "little bit of crap" and not be effected by it, then he knew they would also be able to see the movie with "just a little bit of smut" and not be effected.
    Of course, none of the teens would eat the brownies and the smug smiles had left their faces. Only Dad was smiling smugly as they left the room.
    Now when his teenagers ask permission to do something he is opposed to the father just asks, "Would you like me to whip up a batch of my special brownies?"


----------



## Shimmie

makeupgirl said:


> If you know who you are in Christ, then there is nothing to defend.  Paul wrote to the Romans that we are to present our bodies as a living sacriface, holy and acceptable unto God which is our reasonable service.  Then he goes on to say that we should not conform to this world but be transformed by the renewing of our minds.  (This is Romans 12:1-2)
> 
> Think about it this way.  God is always in control even when we relinquish control.  Each born again Christian has the Holy Spirit in them, as Jesus promised to us as the comforter, to lead and guide us into all truths.  If something isn't of God, he's going to let us know straight up.  However, he's not going to force us to do anything that we don't want to do.  If we chose at that moment not to follow what the Holy Spirit is saying, then we have choosen to walk in the flesh instead of the Spirit.
> 
> Know that Satan is the author of confusion, strife, injustice, ok basically anything and everything that is bad and against God.  He's enjoying the confusion that is going on, the lost of control, the snap judgments, etc.  That's his deal.  He loves it when Christians mess up.  We're his former kids, so he's pretty ticked off at us and just want to go up to Heaven to gloat and tell God that we're not to be trusted.  That's his MO.  His number is almost up and he's doing everything he can to take some people with him on his eternal fiery trip.
> 
> Just from reading your posts, you have a thrist for knowledge regarding learning more about Christ and pleasing him.  Whenever that confusion comes about or you feel attacked, go directly to God and tell him about how you're feeling.  He wants us to do that anyway.  He's open 24/7.



Forever the 'peace maker'   

_Blessed are the Peace Makers for they shall see God... _


----------



## makeupgirl

Shimmie said:


> Forever the 'peace maker'
> 
> _Blessed are the Peace Makers for they shall see God... _


 
Hi Ms. Shimmie,

I never thought that I was a peacemaker...lol.  I guess it's just lets me know further that I am yielding to the Holy Spirit's command.  I give Jesus all the credit because without him, peacemaking will not happen.


----------



## Shimmie

makeupgirl said:


> Hi Ms. Shimmie,
> 
> I never thought that I was a peacemaker...lol.  I guess it's just lets me know further that I am yielding to the Holy Spirit's command.  I give Jesus all the credit because without him, peacemaking will not happen.



You are... indeed.


----------



## nathansgirl1908

I get the point of the story but this is all a bit too dramatic.    




lilanie said:


> A great story about compromise...
> 
> Dad's Brownies
> 
> A father of some teenage children had the family rule that they could not attend PG-13 or R rated movies. His three teens wanted to see a particular popular movie that was playing at local theaters. It was rated PG-13.
> The teens interviewed friends and even some members of their family's church to find out what was offensive in the movie. The teens made a list of pros and cons about the movie to use to convince their dad that they should be allowed to see it. The con's were that it contained ONLY 3 swear words, the ONLY violence was a building exploding (and you see that on TV all the time they said), and you actually did not "see" the couple in the movie having sex - it was just implied sex, off camera.  The pros were that it was a popular movie - a block buster.  Everyone was seeing it.  If the teens saw the movie then they would not feel left out when their friends discussed it. The movie contained a good story and plot. It had some great adventure and suspense in it. There were some fantastic special effects in this movie. The movie's stars were some of the most talented actors in Hollywood. It probably would be nominated for several awards.
> 
> 
> Many of the members of their Christian church had even seen the movie and said it wasn't "very bad".  Therefore, since there were more pros than cons the teens said they were asking their father to reconsider his position on just this ONE movie and let them have permission to go see it.
> The father looked at the list and thought for a few minutes. He said he could tell his children had spent some time and thought on this request. He asked if he could have a day to think about it before making his decision. The teens were thrilled thinking; "Now we've got him! Our argument is too good! Dad can't turn us down!"  So, they happily agreed to let him have a day to think about their request.
> The next evening the father called in his three teenagers, who were smiling smugly, into the living room. There on the coffee table he had a plate of brownies. The teens were puzzled. The father told his children he had thought about their request and had decided that if they would eat a brownie then he would let them go to the movie.  But just like the movie, the brownies had pros and cons.
> The pros were that they were made with the finest chocolate and other good ingredients. They had the added special effect of yummy walnuts in them. The brownies were moist and fresh with wonderful chocolate frosting on top. He had made these fantastic brownies using an award-winning recipe. And best of all, the brownies had been made lovingly by the hand of their own father.
> The brownies only had one con. The father had included a little bit of a special ingredient. The brownies also contained just a little bit of dog poop. But he had mixed the dough well - they probably would not even be able to taste the dog poop and he had baked it at 350 degrees so any bacteria or germs from the dog poop had probably been destroyed.
> Therefore, if any of his children could stand to eat the brownies which included just a "little bit of crap" and not be effected by it, then he knew they would also be able to see the movie with "just a little bit of smut" and not be effected.
> Of course, none of the teens would eat the brownies and the smug smiles had left their faces. Only Dad was smiling smugly as they left the room.
> Now when his teenagers ask permission to do something he is opposed to the father just asks, "Would you like me to whip up a batch of my special brownies?"


----------



## lilanie

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I get the point of the story but this is all a bit too dramatic.


 

I agree it's dramatic, the most glaring example of the inability to serve two masters...

And how I don't want to.


----------



## nathansgirl1908

lilanie said:


> I agree it's dramatic, the most glaring example of the inability to serve two masters...
> 
> And how I don't want to.



I don't see the two masters issue at all.


----------



## Incognitus

^^I agree. I see it more as a compromise issue. Reminds me of a story my stepmom would tell me when I was a kid...


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67

Our warefare is not carnal but mighty through the pulling down of strongholds...for we wrestle not against flesh and blood...

This is a supernatural fight that we are in not of the flesh not always the things we can see ...it more 'serious' than we think and more serious that we 'know', remember we are in a war for our very souls ...

Don't discount the plan of the enemy who is about his mission to kill steal and destroy,  remember he comes like and Angel of light which is deception...

Be on your guard at all times having put on the whole armour of God, it's that serious...


----------



## silenttullip

There's no bible for it BUT if people are making idols of them its on them can't bash the boards themselves...
I look at it as the equivalant of hitting the rock instead of speaking to it...
If you know God wants you to do one thing or go in one direction and you follow your wants out of anger stubbornness or what have you, you won't receive all God has for you.


----------



## Shimmie

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> Our warefare is not carnal but mighty through the pulling down of strongholds...for we wrestle not against flesh and blood...
> 
> This is a supernatural fight that we are in not of the flesh not always the things we can see ...it more 'serious' than we think and more serious that we 'know', remember we are in a war for our very souls ...
> 
> Don't discount the plan of the enemy who is about his mission to kill steal and destroy,  remember he comes like and Angel of light which is deception...
> 
> Be on your guard at all times having put on the whole armour of God, it's that serious...



Wow...


----------



## lilanie

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I don't see the two masters issue at all.


 
Satan is a thief and a liar... If you notice when personified on screen ~ not much is blatant, but done in a coaxing manner.  Compromise upon compromise leading to things very far removed from God.


----------



## BreeNique

So...I'm looking through one of my favorite monthly magazines, and considering tearing out photos for a vision board of my own. When I was younger, I'd make collages all day based around "themes"--Black Hollywood, candy, cake, etc. Lately I've discovered Pinterest, and a whole new worry inside of me has exploded--giving my God-given creativity over to the world/ becoming a consumer in every possible sense--just taking things in at all times. Anyway, I was thinking about creating a 2012 vision board, and Google'd "vision board sin", the like.

Ya'll KNOW lhcf was the FIRST hit on Google. -_-

Anyway, I really appreciate the input from contributors to this thread. I have decided not to create a vision of tangible and limited things like stylish women in stilettos or healthy plates of food, but to focus my 2012 energy in journaling these thoughts out, to further examine them, instead of paste them to cardboard. It's just better for my lifestyle, my sanity, and my relationship with God. I don't want to live by my own idea of success, but by His, and manifesting a board, with my own hands, seems unnecessary. I just don't think that God would be the center of it. I know myself, how I think, and how I strive. I feel that, at some point, it would become a collection of worldly inspiration, not a manifestation of what God is capable of.

So, I'm good for now.

*closes magazine, backs out of forum...*

bn


----------



## Shimmie

BreeNique said:


> Anyway, I was thinking about creating a 2012 vision board, and Google'd "vision board sin", the like.
> 
> *Ya'll KNOW lhcf was the FIRST hit on Google. -_-*
> 
> 
> bn





BreeNique, that's funny regarding LHCF being first on the Google hit. 

I'm glad you're allowing God to lead you with this.

God bless you in 2012 and beyond.


----------



## aribell

BreeNique said:
			
		

> I have decided not to create a vision of tangible and limited things like stylish women in stilettos or healthy plates of food, but to focus my 2012 energy in journaling these thoughts out, to further examine them, instead of paste them to cardboard. It's just better for my lifestyle, my sanity, and my relationship with God. I don't want to live by my own idea of success, but by His, and manifesting a board, with my own hands, seems unnecessary. I just don't think that God would be the center of it. I know myself, how I think, and how I strive. I feel that, at some point, it would become a collection of worldly inspiration, not a manifestation of what God is capable of.



I agree with this.

The fact that we can obtain and accomplish much in this world is a given.  Whether we are living in submission to His will and word rather than our own is another question entirely.  *That's* the hard part.


Sent from my LS670 using LS670


----------



## Shimmie

nicola.kirwan said:


> I agree with this.
> 
> The fact that we can obtain and accomplish much in this world is a given.  Whether we are living in submission to His will and word rather than our own is another question entirely.  *That's* the hard part.
> 
> 
> Sent from my LS670 using LS670



I don't want to 'bypass' God in this journey of Life, nor after.  :Rose:


----------



## disgtgyal

I'm actually considering doing a vision board, but doing it differently. My vision board will consist of all the things God has promised me, all the plans He laid out for me. My vision board isn't going to be based on the law of attraction, in fact I plan on dividing the cardboard in three and in the middle will be Bible verses that correspond with His promises and purpose beginning with seeking Him first... and on the outer sides will be pics representing the promises He made but it'll held together by the Word. Before reading this thread it never occurred to me it could be demonic, especially since in Habakkuk God says to write the vision down which IMO serves a visual reminder for the person when their faith maybe lacking... am I missing something? 

Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925


----------



## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> I'm actually considering doing a vision board, but doing it differently. My vision board will consist of all the things God has promised me, all the plans He laid out for me. My vision board isn't going to be based on the law of attraction, in fact I plan on dividing the cardboard in three and in the middle will be Bible verses that correspond with His promises and purpose beginning with seeking Him first... and on the outer sides will be pics representing the promises He made but it'll held together by the Word. Before reading this thread it never occurred to me it could be demonic, especially since in Habakkuk God says to write the vision down which IMO serves a visual reminder for the person when their faith maybe lacking... am I missing something?
> 
> Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925



google practices of witchcraft; even the sites that support witches have 'vision board' instructions and recommendations. vision boards are definitely one of the hallmark tools of LOA, of which people use them as a tool to manifest what they want.

As Christians we have to be careful with this practice and misinterpreting the scripture of 'writing the vision'.


----------



## disgtgyal

Shimmie said:


> google practices of witchcraft; even the sites that support witches have 'vision board' instructions and recommendations. vision boards are definitely one of the hallmark tools of LOA, of which people use them as a tool to manifest what they want.
> 
> As Christians we have to be careful with this practice and misinterpreting the scripture of 'writing the vision'.



I'm familiar with LOA but I think we as Christians need to remember that one of the key tactics the devil uses is perversion. He tells the ppl that instead of placing your faith in God place it in yourself and you can manifest those things... the devil doesn't come up with anything original. The principles of LOA are perversions of biblical laws. If we want truly shun things that have pagan/ demonic associations then there are a lot of wedding rituals Christians shouldn't include in their ceremony... 

Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925


----------



## Sharpened

disgtgyal said:


> I'm actually considering doing a vision board, but doing it differently. My vision board will consist of all the things God has promised me, all the plans He laid out for me. My vision board isn't going to be based on the law of attraction, in fact I plan on dividing the cardboard in three and in the middle will be Bible verses that correspond with His promises and purpose beginning with seeking Him first... and on the outer sides will be pics representing the promises He made but it'll held together by the Word. Before reading this thread it never occurred to me it could be demonic, especially since in Habakkuk God says to write the vision down which IMO serves a visual reminder for the person when their faith maybe lacking... am I missing something?



 Habakkuk 2:2 is talking about the prophet writing down what the Lord shows him so the people will get the warning. He does this several times in the Scriptures (Deuteronomy 27:8, Isaiah 30:8, Jeremiah 30:2, Jeremiah 36:2, Revelation 1:11, Revelation 1:19). Did you ask the Lord if He wanted you to do this? If we worship Him in spirit, why not trust Him in spirit? Why must we always try to make the intangible tangible for our senses?


----------



## disgtgyal

No God didn't specifically say I want u to make a vision board, but when the idea came to me and I brought it so Him immediately I got several verses to put on my vision board. How is creating a vision board making the intangible (my promises) tangible when its still in theory intangible, because until manifestion occurs it's still intangible. How is a vision board which one is using as a visual reminder any different frm the person who writes Bible verses throughout their home as a means of reminding themselves of what God says... As I said in my previous post, the enemy perverts the things of God. However, as Paul says if u deem something sinful then its sin for you, but do not put it on another believer, and I in turn should not flaunt my freedom, lest you stumble; therefore, this will be my last post on this subject. I hope I haven't offended anyone if I have, I'm sorry.

Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925


----------



## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> No God didn't specifically say I want u to make a vision board, but when the idea came to me and I brought it so Him immediately I got several verses to put on my vision board. How is creating a vision board making the intangible (my promises) tangible when its still in theory intangible, because until manifestion occurs it's still intangible. How is a vision board which one is using as a visual reminder any different frm the person who writes Bible verses throughout their home as a means of reminding themselves of what God says...
> 
> *As I said in my previous post, the enemy perverts the things of God. *
> 
> However, as Paul says if u deem something sinful then its sin for you, but do not put it on another believer, and I in turn should not flaunt my freedom, lest you stumble; therefore, this will be my last post on this subject. I hope I haven't offended anyone if I have, I'm sorry.
> 
> Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925



Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm      @the bolded.

The Word of God doesn't speak of 'vision boards'.   

I understand what you're trying to 'convey' , but there's a 'twist' in the theory that you're sharing.   Something not right with this, Angel.   

Please know that this is not a personal issue with you.  It's not.  As I shared above, I understand what you're trying to convey .     But there's something about this 'vision board' theology / practice that is not in line with God's Word.  

I have to stress that the scripture in Habakuk does not support nor does it relate to vision boards.    This scripture has been used to mislead Christians and to deceive them into a practice that is not lead of God.  

vision boards stem from vain imaginations, for it leads one to 'envision' a manisfestation of what's desired by a person, not what God has instructed. 

Bottomline, we can't say vision boards are of God when truthfully they are of man.   That's where the issue is.  The deception and misleading that scripture supports a vision board when it does not.   It is a practice of man and his/her imagination, ideas and desires and it should addressed as such.   

Folks have got to stop saying things are of God when they are in truth of man.  God's not placing scriptures on those boards, 'humans' are; humans being lead of their own choice, decisions and their will.    

The same 'will' that Eve yielded to when choosing to eat the forbidden fruit in the Garden of Eden, is the same will that humans are using to create their vision boards.  satan placed all kinds of 'scripture' before Eve and he even did the same thing to Jesus while trying to 'tempt' him after the 40 days/night fasting in the wilderness.    Scripture is often used by the enemy to mislead a person and to deceive them.   

For those using scripture to justify creating a vision board, it's not validated and because it's one's decision, God is not going to 'stop' you, it's your choice to do so, not His and He's not in it just because a person posts scriptures there.


----------



## disgtgyal

Shimmie said:


> Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm      @the bolded.
> 
> The Word of God doesn't speak of 'vision boards'.
> 
> I understand what you're trying to 'convey' , but there's a 'twist' in the theory that you're sharing.   Something not right with this, Angel.
> 
> Please know that this is not a personal issue with you.  It's not.  As I shared above, I understand what you're trying to convey .     But there's something about this 'vision board' theology / practice that is not in line with God's Word.
> 
> I have to stress that the scripture in Habakuk does not support nor does it relate to vision boards.    This scripture has been used to mislead Christians and to deceive them into a practice that is not lead of God.
> 
> vision boards stem from vain imaginations, for it leads one to 'envision' a manisfestation of what's desired by a person, not what God has instructed.
> 
> Bottomline, we can't say vision boards are of God when truthfully they are of man.   That's where the issue is.  The deception and misleading that scripture supports a vision board when it does not.   It is a practice of man and his/her imagination, ideas and desires and it should addressed as such.
> 
> Folks have got to stop saying things are of God when they are in truth of man.  God's not placing scriptures on those boards, 'humans' are; humans being lead of their own choice, decisions and their will.
> 
> The same 'will' that Eve yielded to when choosing to eat the forbidden fruit in the Garden of Eden, is the same will that humans are using to create their vision boards.  satan placed all kinds of 'scripture' before Eve and he even did the same thing to Jesus while trying to 'tempt' him after the 40 days/night fasting in the wilderness.    Scripture is often used by the enemy to mislead a person and to deceive them.
> 
> For those using scripture to justify creating a vision board, it's not validated and because it's one's decision, God is not going to 'stop' you, it's your choice to do so, not His and He's not in it just because a person posts scriptures there.



I understand all that you have said, and I also understand ppl create vision boards and it leads to idolatry, but I am not talking about name it u claim it, I'm not talking about things I decided I want, nor is it vain, carnal lusts and desires I am talking about a visual reminder of the things God has promised me, things that he has spoken directly to me and things he relayed to prophets about me, and I thought I was pretty clear about that... What if I didn't call it a vision board and I called it "visual reminder of God's promises, would those who oppose still oppose. Again what if I decided to write out the blessings laid up for me according to Deuteronomy, would those who oppose still oppose, because its the same thing, I'm writing out God's promises. Again LOA is a perversion of a biblical principle. We as Christians need to realize the world puts God's law and principles into practice and it bears fruit because God's law doesn't change e.g. think about how many celebs tithe, Kim k and Oprah to name a few... again as I said in an earlier post, a lot of wedding traditions are steeped and rooted in paganism, but no one is opposing them because its become the norm, or as one Christian told me "its been washed in the blood" if you're going to critique certain things then go across the board and examine everything for demonic/ pagan roots.... the "you" in my post isn't to anyone in particular its to Christians

Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925


----------



## Rainbow Dash

Quote from an x-witch now a Christian....

*"Vision boards and the New Age law of attraction is demonic and sinful to partake in. Christians must stay away from it."*

Here is the link to her interview...
http://pamsheppard.com/?cat=1&paged=5


This is from another board that was discussing the subject.

"If you have material desires, you must gaze upon images of them - surround yourself with the smells and sounds conducive to them - create a lodestone which will attract the situation or thing that you wish! " -* Taken verbatim from the Satanic bible.*

"Sounds just like a vision board, huh? All this "The Secret" stuff is the same old game, just repackaged in a soccer mom friendly, Oprah-approved format. Even the title is unoriginal"


----------



## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> I understand all that you have said, and I also understand ppl create vision boards and it leads to idolatry, but I am not talking about name it u claim it, I'm not talking about things I decided I want, nor is it vain, carnal lusts and desires I am talking about a visual reminder of the things God has promised me, things that he has spoken directly to me and things he relayed to prophets about me, and I thought I was pretty clear about that...
> 
> What if I didn't call it a vision board and I called it "visual reminder of God's promises, would those who oppose still oppose. Again what if I decided to write out the blessings laid up for me according to Deuteronomy, would those who oppose still oppose, because its the same thing, I'm writing out God's promises.
> 
> Again LOA is a perversion of a biblical principle. We as Christians need to realize the world puts God's law and principles into practice and it bears fruit because God's law doesn't change e.g. think about how many celebs tithe, Kim k and Oprah to name a few... again as I said in an earlier post, a lot of wedding traditions are steeped and rooted in paganism, but no one is opposing them because its become the norm, or as one Christian told me "its been washed in the blood" if you're going to critique certain things then go across the board and examine everything for demonic/ pagan roots.... the "you" in my post isn't to anyone in particular its to Christians
> 
> Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925



Something is still not right...  

And I know what it is.  it's taking an idea of man and placing God as the originator.    As humans 'we' have free will and that's what a vision board is, no matter what one calls it and the scriptures used to support it are being misused.  

What wedding traditions are paganistic?    Standing before an ordained Minister to become man and wife is honoured by God.   

Now if they were a same sex couple, there's definitely a problem.


----------



## Shimmie

Health&hair28 said:


> Quote from an x-witch now a Christian....
> 
> *"Vision boards and the New Age law of attraction is demonic and sinful to partake in. Christians must stay away from it."*
> 
> Here is the link to her interview...
> http://pamsheppard.com/?cat=1&paged=5
> 
> 
> This is from another board that was discussing the subject.
> 
> "If you have material desires, you must gaze upon images of them - surround yourself with the smells and sounds conducive to them - create a lodestone which will attract the situation or thing that you wish! " -* Taken verbatim from the Satanic bible.*
> 
> "Sounds just like a vision board, huh? All this "The Secret" stuff is the same old game, just repackaged in a soccer mom friendly, Oprah-approved format. Even the title is unoriginal"



Thanks for sharing, this information is vitally important.


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67

Shimmie I don't know why I'm reminded of Saul and Samuel...

1 Samuel 15
18 And he sent you on a mission, saying, ‘Go and completely destroy those wicked people, the Amalekites; wage war against them until you have wiped them out.’ 19 Why did you not obey the LORD? Why did you pounce on the plunder and do evil in the eyes of the LORD?” 

 20 “But I did obey the LORD,” Saul said. “I went on the mission the LORD assigned me. I completely destroyed the Amalekites and brought back Agag their king. 21 The soldiers took sheep and cattle from the plunder, the best of what was devoted to God, in order to sacrifice them to the LORD your God at Gilgal.” 

 22 But Samuel replied: 

   “Does the LORD delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices 
   as much as in obeying the LORD? 
To obey is better than sacrifice, 
   and to heed is better than the fat of rams. 
23 For rebellion is like the sin of divination, 
   and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. 



and of course Proverbs 16:25
There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof is the ways of death


----------



## Shimmie

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> Shimmie I don't know why I'm reminded of Saul and Samuel...
> 
> 1 Samuel 15
> 18 And he sent you on a mission, saying, ‘Go and completely destroy those wicked people, the Amalekites; wage war against them until you have wiped them out.’ 19 Why did you not obey the LORD?
> 
> *Why did you pounce on the plunder and do evil in the eyes of the LORD?” *
> 
> 20 “But I did obey the LORD,” Saul said. “I went on the mission the LORD assigned me. I completely destroyed the Amalekites and brought back Agag their king.
> 
> 21  *The soldiers took sheep and cattle from the plunder, the best of what was devoted to God, in order to sacrifice them to the LORD your God at Gilgal  * .”
> 
> 22 *But Samuel replied:
> 
> “Does the LORD delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices
> as much as in obeying the LORD?
> To obey is better than sacrifice,
> and to heed is better than the fat of rams.
> 23 For rebellion is like the sin of divination,
> and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. *
> and of course Proverbs 16:25
> There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof is the ways of death



My Lord... look at what you've shared here...
_
"Pouncing on the Plunder"...  _This is what a vision board is, the plunder (the ways of sorcery).   

The soldiers thought that they could make it right by treating it as an offering unto the Lord, however it was not of God.   

There are times when God allows us to take the goods  (plunder) of the enemies, but there are some things that have so much evil attached to it. that God wants it destroyed so as not to defile what/whom He has cleansed.

The problem with vision boards is that it falls into tainted plunder, and there's too much 'twisting' to make it Godly.


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## NitaChantell

NO!!! They're a creative way to form goals...I'm having my girls (I'm a Girl Scout Leader) do one next week. Saying a vision board is demonic is equivalent to saying that making a list of financial or educational goals is demonic. God wants us to be smart and prepared. I think the balance comes in when we make the board then giving it to God, ya know? Like just saying God these are my desires, and although you may have put some of them in my heart, I lay them all at your feet, and I surrender to your will for my life....like God this is what I want, but I'll surrender this for whatever you want me to do!!!


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## jenny87

I can't believe this thread is still going on with the same arguements on both sides!  No one is going to change Shimmie's mind or get her to see your point.  She is the vision board police after all.  

It is amazing how when you add a photo to a list of goals it magically becomes a vehicle of witchcraft and a sin.  So all of you that have goal journals make sure you don't draw in the margins!

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


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## aribell

That which is used as a vrhicle or conduit of manifesting desires, other than simple faith in God's word is relying on elements of witchcraft.

Perhaps we don't really get what witchcraft is.  Most of us were raised to think of it as some hocus pocus spell casting  Witchcraft is more subtle than that and relies on self will.  When we are attempting to harness "energies" and whatnot, that's witchcraft.  We are to believe what we hear in God's word, obey His word, and wait for His fulfilling of His promises.  It's one thing to keep Scriptures around to meditate on, but another to look to a vision board to somehow facilitate the manifestation of those Scriptures.


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## jenny87

So keeping a prayer journal is witchcraft as well??

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


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## Nice & Wavy

jenny87 said:


> So keeping a prayer journal is witchcraft as well??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


No, you have it all wrong.

How could praying to the only true and living God be considered witchcraft?

 A prayer journal is just that....writing your prayers to God....the creator of the Universe.

When people get to the point where they don't put the things of God in order, something is terribly wrong.


----------



## aribell

jenny87 said:
			
		

> So keeping a prayer journal is witchcraft as well??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



If you are relying on the the journal as a way to manifest the answer, then yes.  Only the person and God can say what is in that person's heart when they pray.  I have used journals in the past to note things to pray for and it served as a reminder and a record of God's answer.  But I wasn't looking at the act of writing prayers out in a journal as a means of seeing the prayer answered.  God responds simply to faith in and obedience to His word and belief that He will answer, according to His will.  There is no other power, force, object or energy that we look to for the answer to our prayers.

Nothing can be added to genuine faith.  Nothing more is needed.

Watchman Nee wrote a booklet called The Latent Power of the Soul, in which soulish prayer is discussed.  All prayers are not spiritual, all prayers are not truly directed toward God.  The booklet is available to read online.


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## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> I can't believe this thread is still going on with the same arguements on both sides!  No one is going to change Shimmie's mind or get her to see your point.
> 
> *She is the vision board police after all.  *
> 
> It is amazing how when you add a photo to a list of goals it magically becomes a vehicle of witchcraft and a sin.  So all of you that have goal journals make sure you don't draw in the margins!
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF





Your _'Miranda Rights' _have been revoked....  

Your 'Vision Board' has been withheld for evidence; until further notice.


----------



## Sharpened

I was ordered by the Creator Himself to write down my prayers and He gave me half of what He wanted me to pray for. Why? So I would not forget what to pray for and to demonstrate His authority as each one is answered. 

Most of my prayers are not about me or my wants, either. I do not meditate on or visualize anything...I pray the list in earnest with praise and glory and place it aside when done.


----------



## loolalooh

jenny87 said:


> So keeping a prayer journal is witchcraft as well??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



*Are there prayer journals that are demonic?* Yes. Believe it or not, there are people who pray for the downfall or demise of others.  

*Are there prayer journals that are not demonic?* Yes, particularly those with prayers for the poor, prayers of praise, prayers for the afflicted ... prayers not merely dedicated to the self.


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## Do_Si_Dos

nicola.kirwan said:


> *If you are relying on the the journal as a way to manifest the answer, then yes.* Only the person and God can say what is in that person's heart when they pray. I have used journals in the past to note things to pray for and it served as a reminder and a record of God's answer.* But I wasn't looking at the act of writing prayers out in a journal as a means of seeing the prayer answered.* *God responds simply to faith in and obedience to His word and belief that He will answer, according to His will. There is no other power, force, object or energy that we look to for the answer to our prayers.*
> 
> Nothing can be added to genuine faith. Nothing more is needed.
> 
> Watchman Nee wrote a booklet called The Latent Power of the Soul, in which soulish prayer is discussed. All prayers are not spiritual, all prayers are not truly directed toward God. The booklet is available to read online.


 
This is where the disconnect lies.  No one has said they are using a vision board to will something into their life.  With any prayer you have you have to put action behind it, right? Last time I checked God was not in the business of dropping stuff out the sky.   Well I am praying to pass the CPA exam, and I have the letters CPA on my board.  It reminds that I need to study even when I don't feel like it.... That's it!!!!  I believe God wants me to pass the exam, but I have to do my part in the natural.     

I wrote out a list of the qualities I would like in a mate is that demonic too?

All this demonic stuff does not pertain to everyone who has a vision board..... that is a sweeping generalization.


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## Do_Si_Dos

jenny87 said:


> I can't believe this thread is still going on with the same arguements on both sides! No one is going to change @Shimmie's mind or get her to see your point. She is the vision board police after all.
> 
> It is amazing how when you add a photo to a list of goals it magically becomes a vehicle of witchcraft and a sin. So all of you that have goal journals make sure you don't draw in the margins!
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


 
  Deleted..... I thought better and I apologize........


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## sharentu

i am grateful to this thread. i had a visionboard last year. on everything that i had on it, every subject, the situation got worse instead of better. life is a journey and you learn. i am seriously grateful. i know what i need to do now. thanks for all the input ladies, i enjoyed your discussion.


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## loolalooh

Do_Si_Dos said:


> This is where the disconnect lies.  No one has said they are using a vision board to will something into their life.  With any prayer you have you have to put action behind it, right? Last time I checked God was not in the business of dropping stuff out the sky.   Well I am praying to pass the CPA exam, and I have the letters CPA on my board.  It reminds that I need to study even when I don't feel like it.... That's it!!!!  I believe God wants me to pass the exam, but I have to do my part in the natural.
> 
> I wrote out a list of the qualities I would like in a mate is that demonic too?
> 
> All this demonic stuff does not pertain to everyone who has a vision board..... that is a sweeping generalization.



*The definition (at least in LOA) of a vision board is not to inspire, but to manifest things into your life.*  What I don't understand is why we as believers would take a non-believer concept and try to make it our own.  Oh well.

The problem with vision boards is that they facilitate the entrance of the enemy into our lives.  (As if we don't have enough of him already.)  You paste photos from magazines or the internet of what you want in your life.  Your hope in creating the board is that the Universe (what non-believers call it) or God (what we call Him) will bring you those things you want.  You meditate (what non-believers call it) or pray (what believers call it) on the board daily or regularly so that those things manifest themselves.  Before you know it, these desires become the forefront of your mind and God becomes the background.  In fact, God is only in the picture as "the One you pray to so you can get what you want" and nothing more.  You lose sight of what God has called us to do (to serve Him, to spread the Good News, etc.).  You focus more on what you want in the physical world (a big house, a new car, etc.).  *This is what vision boards have the potential to do.*  After one thing is manifested, you ask for the next thing, and it doesn't end.  This is what I've seen.

Now whether this will happen to you is something I don't know.  Only God knows.  I'd personally tell Christians to beware of starting a vision board. 

Be careful.

*As for the CPA letters and list of qualities for a mate:* Reminders are one thing, but a vision board is not intended to merely be a reminder.  It is intended to manifest things into existence.  Taking an LOA vision board and trying to make it Christian reminder is a dangerous thing.


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

loolalooh said:


> *The definition (at least in LOA) of a vision board is not to inspire, but to manifest things into your life.* What I don't understand is why we as believers would take a non-believer concept and try to make it our own. Oh well.
> 
> The problem with vision boards is that they facilitate the entrance of the enemy into our lives. (As if we don't have enough of him already.) You paste photos from magazines or the internet of what you want in your life. *Your hope in creating the board is that the Universe (what non-believers call it) or God (what we call Him) will bring you those things you want. You meditate (what non-believers call it) or pray (what believers call it) on the board daily or regularly so that those things manifest themselves*. Before you know it, these desires become the forefront of your mind and God becomes the background. In fact, God is only in the picture as "the One you pray to so you can get what you want" and nothing more. You lose sight of what God has called us to do (to serve Him, to spread the Good News, etc.). You focus more on what you want in the physical world (a big house, a new car, etc.). *This is what vision boards have the potential to do.* After one thing is manifested, you ask for the next thing, and it doesn't end. This is what I've seen.
> 
> Now whether this will happen to you is something I don't know. Only God knows. I'd personally tell Christians to beware of starting a vision board.
> 
> Be careful.
> 
> *As for the CPA letters and list of qualities for a mate:* Reminders are one thing, but a vision board is not intended to merely be a reminder. It is intended to manifest things into existence. Taking an LOA vision board and trying to make it Christian reminder is a dangerous thing.


 
To the purple:  That can be said for almost anything.   We live in the world. 

To the pink: I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't worship or pray to my vision board that's silly, imo. I don't practice LOA, so I am not worried.  Again I don't give construction paper authority in my life, I try my best to seek God so that I act in accordance with his will for my life. 

To the green:  People can do that without vision boards.  When they see one prayer has been answered, they ask for something else.  Whether they are praying for someone else or for their own desires whatever they are.  

Another assumption I am seeing is that people are only have material things on their vision boards.  SMH......  Thanks for the advice.


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67

What I've noticed is that people incorporate certain methods to aid in their spiritual life regardless of the things origin, and because it looks harmless and it's created to help the individual get what 'they' want, then it *must* be a good thing ...

Just because a few scriptures are used to promote or endorse a thing it does not mean that it's from God...we are to be wise of the enemy's devices that are created to take hold of us subtly leading us into deception...


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

Shimmie said:


> Something is still not right...
> 
> And I know what it is. it's taking an idea of man and placing God as the originator. As humans 'we' have free will and that's what a vision board is, no matter what one calls it and the scriptures used to support it are being misused.
> 
> What wedding traditions are paganistic? Standing before an ordained Minister to become man and wife is honoured by God.
> 
> Now if they were a same sex couple, there's definitely a problem.


 
Witches "Jump the Broom"  http://www.broommagic.com/

I am looking for other sources too.  I know they jump the broom, but I need I more reliable source.


----------



## loolalooh

Do_Si_Dos said:


> To the purple:  That can be said for almost anything.   We live in the world.
> 
> To the pink: I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't worship or pray to my vision board that's silly, imo. I don't practice LOA, so I am not worried.  Again I don't give construction paper authority in my life, I try my best to seek God so that I act in accordance with his will for my life.
> 
> To the green:  People can do that without vision boards.  When they see one prayer has been answered, they ask for something else.  Whether they are praying for someone else or for their own desires whatever they are.
> 
> *Another assumption I am seeing is that people are only have material things on their vision boards.  SMH......  Thanks for the advice.*



No assumption was made on my end, unless you're mixing up my use of the "physical world" as "material". 

A vision board consists of what people want in the physical world, whether material or intangible (i.e., job promotion).  

There are two worlds - the physical (i.e., the "natural" in which we live) and the spiritual.  Or, is there something you want in the spiritual world that you are placing on your vision board?


----------



## loolalooh

Do_Si_Dos said:


> To the purple:  That can be said for almost anything.   We live in the world.



So, you agree that vision boards facilitate the entrance of the enemy?  If so, then why place yourself in that position.



Do_Si_Dos said:


> To the pink: I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't worship or pray to my vision board that's silly, imo. I don't practice LOA, so I am not worried.  Again I don't give construction paper authority in my life, I try my best to seek God so that I act in accordance with his will for my life.



Be careful.



Do_Si_Dos said:


> To the green:  People can do that without vision boards.  When they see one prayer has been answered, they ask for something else.  Whether they are praying for someone else or for their own desires whatever they are.


 
I agree.  The quest to manifest one's own desires comes in many different forms.


----------



## jenny87

loolalooh said:
			
		

> A vision board consists of what people want in the physical world, whether material or intangible (i.e., job promotion).



So I take it that no one in here has ever prayed for a promotion or a better job or a better boss at work??  If you pray for it with you mouth, out of a journal, of with a picture you still want it.  Period.  

And how do you know that G-d himself didn't tell me to express myself and prayers through construction paper and pictures??

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


----------



## Rainbow Dash

Health&hair28 said:


> Quote from an x-witch now a Christian....
> 
> *"Vision boards and the New Age law of attraction is demonic and sinful to partake in. Christians must stay away from it."*
> 
> Here is the link to her interview...
> http://pamsheppard.com/?cat=1&paged=5
> 
> 
> This is from another board that was discussing the subject.
> 
> "If you have material desires, you must gaze upon images of them - surround yourself with the smells and sounds conducive to them - create a lodestone which will attract the situation or thing that you wish! " -* Taken verbatim from the Satanic bible.*
> 
> "Sounds just like a vision board, huh? All this "The Secret" stuff is the same old game, just repackaged in a soccer mom friendly, Oprah-approved format. Even the title is unoriginal"


 
Reposting this in case some missed it. Research it, see where it originated. Looking, gazing, and manifesting images is not going to make God move. Just simply pray to Him and ask Him with the understanding that His will be done. He knows what is best for each one of us.


----------



## Iwanthealthyhair67

About 17 years ago before I was saved I had a horrid boss many days I would cry and feel inept, that was my prayer Lord get me out of here or remove this man...fast forward to today after 5 years of working for a delightful boss now suddenly she is turning into something (that's all I'mma say) my prayer today was Lord you have prepared me for such a time as this (I'm glad he didn't answer my prayers all those years ago, that man made me tough) just give me the strength to make it through this season...

I said all that^^ to say this; as christians are prayers should really change more to praying the will of God but much of it is still 'self' centered, the vision board encourages self advancement, self promotion self empowerment, everything to do with 'self' under the guise of helping us manifest what we want spiritually (again things that we want)..that can't be good...God want us to loose our life/self to find a new life/self in him.

Matt 16:

*24* Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. *25* For whoever wants to save their life[f] will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will find it. *26* What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul?




jenny87 said:


> So I take it that no one in here has ever prayed for a promotion or a better job or a better boss at work?? If you pray for it with you mouth, out of a journal, of with a picture you still want it. Period.





jenny87 said:


> And how do you know that G-d himself didn't tell me to express myself and prayers through construction paper and pictures??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


----------



## Shimmie

Do_Si_Dos said:


> Witches "Jump the Broom"  http://www.broommagic.com/
> 
> I am looking for other sources too.  I know they jump the broom, but I need I more reliable source.



Okay...    I know that the practice of 'Jumping the Broom' became quite popular after seeing this on 'Roots' as part of Kunta Kinte's wedding ceremony.  It was an African tradition that those who were in slavery performed as they were not permitted to 'marry' otherwise. 

It became an embodied sentiment in the hearts of many African Americans, as they felt that they were taking on a tradition of their Black Heritage and from their Ancestors. 

It's been a while since I've witnessed this.  It was very popular in the 80's and the 90's.   Back then, almost every wedding ceremony ended with the couple 'jumping the broom.    

 Thanks Do_Si_Dos, for bringing this up.  I'll take some time to research this as well.


----------



## loolalooh

jenny87 said:


> So I take it that no one in here has ever prayed for a promotion or a better job or a better boss at work??  If you pray for it with you mouth, out of a journal, of with a picture you still want it.  Period.



Reposting my original post (which I think you overlooked): 

"The definition (at least in LOA) of a vision board is not to inspire, but to manifest things into your life. What I don't understand is why we as believers would take a non-believer concept and try to make it our own. Oh well.

The problem with vision boards is that they facilitate the entrance of the enemy into our lives. (As if we don't have enough of him already.) You paste photos from magazines or the internet of what you want in your life. Your hope in creating the board is that the Universe (what non-believers call it) or God (what we call Him) will bring you those things you want. You meditate (what non-believers call it) or pray (what believers call it) on the board daily or regularly so that those things manifest themselves. Before you know it, these desires become the forefront of your mind and God becomes the background. In fact, God is only in the picture as "the One you pray to so you can get what you want" and nothing more. You lose sight of what God has called us to do (to serve Him, to spread the Good News, etc.). You focus more on what you want in the physical world (a big house, a new car, etc.). This is what vision boards have the potential to do. After one thing is manifested, you ask for the next thing, and it doesn't end. This is what I've seen."



jenny87 said:


> And how do you know that G-d himself didn't tell me to express myself and prayers through construction paper and pictures??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



Can you quote me where I said that *"God himself did not tell you to express yourself and prayers through construction paper and pictures?"*  I see vision boards as going down a dangerous path.  I said "The problem with vision boards is that they facilitate the entrance of the enemy into our lives."    What God told you (or didn't tell you) is not my place to say.


----------



## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> So I take it that no one in here has ever prayed for a promotion or a better job or a better boss at work??  If you pray for it with you mouth, out of a journal, of with a picture you still want it.  Period.
> 
> And how do you know that G-d himself didn't tell me to express myself and prayers through construction paper and pictures??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF




Prayers are a direct communication with God and nothing else in between.   It's based upon having a personal relationship with God as our Father.  Because of Jesus, this has been made possible for each of us.

A vision board 'implies' that one is not sure of God and not believing they are having a direct connection with Him.  

To be perfectly honest, the practice of vision boards on this forum never became popular until it was introduced by the loa threads, which I've noticed have lost their 'wind', the thread can't seem to keep it's power going as it once did.    Hmmmm, I wonder why?  

loa started a big wind in this forum and it easily took off because people were unhappy and wanted 'things'.   loa made them a promise that they could not resist, people could have 'all' that they ever wanted in life.   All they had to do was 'ask the universe' to give it to them.    

The loa threads / monthy challenges were filled with resources, to make their dreams come true; books, exercises which included  'vibrations' ???  ,  and yes, creating a vision board; how to make one and what to put on it.

The 'struggle' I had was that so many of the people who were drawn into it were people that I cared about, prayed with.    Orginally, I wanted to see the 'good', because of them; it was hard to think of them who spoke of God, would turn and be in serious error.    But I was wrong.  Very wrong.   I had to speak up regardless of the cost.   loa and vision boards are straight up witch craft and there's no amount of justification to validate being involved with it.

From time to time, loa and it's practices tries to rear it's demonic head here in the Christian forum, I'm not having it.  And nobody's mad or offended but the devil.   

*Let it known that 'Icabod' will never hang it's shingle over this Chrisitan forum.   There are too many of us who honour God over here and no other god shall be allowed.  *

The devil will try his best to hinder our prayers and attempt to water down and weaken the power of God in our lives.  The world stinks of impurities in its attempts to re-create God and His order to what they want Him to be.      In here, we're not going to allow it.  Case Closed.  

Another thing I've noticed about the loa is that many of it's strongest supporters have / are now experiencing some of the most bizarre and troubling issues in their lives and loa has not come to their rescue.    This is what satan does.   he deceives and misleads for his mission is to separate one's faith from God in order to derail them.  My heart aches for them and they are held with love in prayer.    

Time and again, these same consequences have been recorded in the 'Bible' as a warning to us.  

Be careful, 'Little One'.   Faith built upon 'construction paper' blows far in the wind.  When storms come, your vision board will blow with it.  

In leiu of a vision board this is what God wants:

_Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.

Psalm 119:11_

When God's Word and His promises are in our heart, no storm in this life can blow it away.


----------



## sharentu

i accept this wisdom.  thanks Shimmie, God bless you, you really blessed me right now.  ((((hugs))))



Shimmie said:


> Prayers are a direct communication with God and nothing else in between.   It's based upon having a personal relationship with God as our Father.  Because of Jesus, this has been made possible for each of us.
> 
> A vision board 'implies' that one is not sure of God and believing they are having a direct connection with Him.
> 
> To be perfectly honest, the practice of vision boards on this forum never became popular until it was introduced by the loa threads, which I've noticed have lost their 'wind', the thread can't seem to keep it's power going as it once did.    Hmmmm, I wonder why?
> 
> loa started a big wind in this forum and it easily took off because people were unhappy and wanted 'things'.   loa made them a promise that they could not resist, people could have 'all' that they ever wanted in life.   All they had to do was 'ask the universe' to give it to them.
> 
> The loa threads / monthy challenges were filled with resources, to make their dreams come true; books, exercises which included  'vibrations' ???  ,  and yes, creating a vision board; how to make one and what to put on it.
> 
> The 'struggle' I had was that so many of the people who were drawn into it were people that I cared about, prayed with.    Orginally, I wanted to see the 'good', because of them; it was hard to think of them who spoke of God, would turn and be in serious error.    But I was wrong.  Very wrong.   I had to speak up regardless of the cost.   loa and vision boards are straight up witch craft and there's no amount of justification to validate being involved with it.
> 
> From time to time, loa and it's practices tries to rear it's demonic head here in the Christian forum, I'm not having it.  And nobody's mad or offended but the devil.
> 
> *Let it known that 'Icabod' will never hang it's shingle over this Chrisitan forum.   There are too many of us who honour God over here and no other god shall be allowed.  *
> 
> The devil will try his best to hinder our prayers and attempt to water down and weaken the power of God in our lives.  The world stinks of impurities in its attempts to re-create God and His order to what they want Him to be.      In here, we're not going to allow it.  Case Closed.
> 
> Another thing I've noticed about the loa is that many of it's strongest supporters have / are now experiencing some of the most bizarre and troubling issues in their lives and loa has not come to their rescue.    This is what satan does.   he deceives and misleads for his mission is to separate one's faith from God in order to derail them.  My heart aches for them and they are held with love in prayer.
> 
> Time and again, these same consequences have been recorded in the 'Bible' as a warning to us.
> 
> Be careful, 'Little One'.   Faith built upon 'construction paper' blows far in the wind.  When storms come, your vision board will blow with it.
> 
> In leiu of a vision board this is what God wants:
> 
> _Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.
> 
> Psalm 119:11_
> 
> When God's Word and His promises are in our heart, no storm in this life can blow it away.


----------



## Shimmie

sharentu said:


> i accept this wisdom.  thanks Shimmie, God bless you, you really blessed me right now.  ((((hugs))))



Sharentu... I cannot count the number of times that you have blessed me in this forum.   You and I came here about the same time and you have always 'been there' for me even in highest of controversies.    You've always kept it real and I adore you.


----------



## Shimmie

Do_Si_Dos said:


> This is where the disconnect lies.  No one has said they are using a vision board to will something into their life.  With any prayer you have you have to put action behind it, right? Last time I checked God was not in the business of dropping stuff out the sky.   Well I am praying to pass the CPA exam, and I have the letters CPA on my board.  It reminds that I need to study even when I don't feel like it.... That's it!!!!  I believe God wants me to pass the exam, but I have to do my part in the natural.
> 
> I wrote out a list of the qualities I would like in a mate is that demonic too?
> 
> All this demonic stuff does not pertain to everyone who has a vision board..... that is a sweeping generalization.



No Angel...    The disconnect is that God *tells* us to pray.  

All throughout the Bible, we are told to pray.   Jesus even gave us an instruction guide, which has been known (entitled) to us as "The Lord's Prayer".    We have been instructed by God's Word to pray without ceasing.  Jesus made this perfectly clear to us in His Word. 

This is totally disconnected from the creation and use of a vision board.   Prayer is talking to God our Father.   Jesus did this the entire time of His Ministry as He walked upon this earth.   Now He sits on the Right Hand Side of the Father upon His throne, talking to God face to face.


----------



## sharentu

Shimmie, you have ALWAYS kept it real in the matters of God.  ALWAYS.  you and n&w always made me smile with what you brought to the forum.  i cant help what i was taught, yall usually line up to all i was raised to know.  its always good to get a reminder, rebuke, or reprimand per se.  so i will definitely to be there.


----------



## Do_Si_Dos

Shimmie said:
			
		

> No Angel...    The disconnect is that God tells us to pray.
> 
> All throughout the Bible, we are told to pray.   Jesus even gave us an instruction guide, which has been known (entitled) to us as "The Lord's Prayer".    We have been instructed by God's Word to pray without ceasing.  Jesus made this perfectly clear to us in His Word.
> 
> This is totally disconnected from the creation and use of a vision board.   Prayer is talking to God our Father.   Jesus did this the entire time of His Ministry as He walked upon this earth.   Now He sits on the Right Hand Side of the Father upon His throne, talking to God face to face.



So does having a visionboard mean one isn't praying? I pray daily. I am constantly talking to God.

I am really not understanding this post, no one has stated the board has authority over Jesus Christ. No one is practicing LOA.  


If I actively practiced LOA that would be another story. You are giving the board power, not me. Personally, I believe LOA is a bunch of hoopla.(that's another story)  I truely believe God has the final say so..... Well anyway take care.


I decided to call my board a goal board


----------



## aribell

jenny87 said:
			
		

> So I take it that no one in here has ever prayed for a promotion or a better job or a better boss at work??  If you pray for it with you mouth, out of a journal, of with a picture you still want it.  Period.
> 
> And how do you know that G-d himself didn't tell me to express myself and prayers through construction paper and pictures??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



Perhaps a part of the confusion is about prayer itself.  We pray the will of God back to Him.  Yes, we have desires, but if we have a.request to make and do not know if it is in fact His will, then we ask and leave it at His feet, and He will either deem it acceptable to Him or not, and He'll either answer affirmatively or He won't.  We don't continually focus on our wants in prayer; that's not effective prayer with God.  Prayer that moves Him.starts with the.knowledge of His will and builds upon that.

If we are confident that we have understood God's will (and have truly done so) and believe He will.answer, then He will answer and there is nothing more that can or need be added.  But again, if we are simply bringing desires to Him, not yet knowing His will, our focus in prayer ought to be asking for.discernment to know His will, asking for wisdom, and searching Scripture to gain a deeper understanding of His general will.  To take a desire and continually focus and meditate on it without having laid it at His feet to judge whether it is good or not is an act of self will.  We do this all the time.  Self will is the natural state of humanity without Christ; so in that sense a vision board is perfectly natural.  And yet in Christ we transcend the natural and do not focus on the manifestation of our own will, but rather that of God.

And again, if we know that something is God's will, and have faith that He has heard, then there's nothing that meditating on a vision of the outcome in pictures will do to bring His will to pass.   It certainly doesn't add power to God's movement.

It may very well tap into other forces, demonic or otherwise which have and are used by people to accomplish their will.  But relying on it with God is kind of like asking your best friend for something and then creating a vision board of what you want the outcome to be.  What purpose does it serve?  Your friend will either say yes or no, for whatever reason.  Time would be better spent getting to know that friend so well that you'll know even before asking whether it's something they will or won't do.

Also, a "vision board" has specific connotations and purposes.  If people are constructing simple Scripture reminders or prayer lists, that falls outside of the realm of the question.


----------



## Shimmie

Do_Si_Dos said:


> So does having a visionboard mean one isn't praying? I pray daily. I am constantly talking to God.
> 
> I am really not understanding this post, no one has stated the board has authority over Jesus Christ. No one is practicing LOA.
> 
> 
> If I actively practiced LOA that would be another story. You are giving the board power, not me. Personally, I believe LOA is a bunch of hoopla.(that's another story)  I truely believe God has the final say so..... Well anyway take care.
> 
> 
> I decided to call my board a goal board



It doesn't matter what you call it, it will still be what it is, a tool of witchcraft.  satan changes names all the time, but it's still the same practice and deception. 

The question is this.   Can you trust God without it?   Can you give up having a vision board, and place your trust in God totally without leaning towards your own understanding.    The board is a crutch, it's your alternate... it's your 'just in case' God says 'no', you'll get it for yourself.    

So can you?  Can you take God as He is and solely as He is and just leave all in His hands and walk away from the 'board' and believe Him and His power and most of all, His love for you.    God won't turn on you and forget your prayers.  If a goal is in your heart, neither will you forget it.  And if it's part of God's plan, it will definitely come to pass.   

It's all a matter of choice and where your faith is.   

If God be God, believe Him, Trust Him, leave all other gods aside.   If the vision board be god, honour it.   The choice is yours.


----------



## Shimmie

sharentu said:


> Shimmie, you have ALWAYS kept it real in the matters of God.  ALWAYS.  you and n&w always made me smile with what you brought to the forum.  i cant help what i was taught, yall usually line up to all i was raised to know.  its always good to get a reminder, rebuke, or reprimand per se.  so i will definitely to be there.



   None of us can take compliments, but I sure thank God for all of you. My life has indeed become richer in areas where I am yet still growing and learning.


----------



## Shimmie

Do_Si_Dos said:


> So does having a visionboard mean one isn't praying? I pray daily. I am constantly talking to God.
> 
> I am really not understanding this post, no one has stated the board has authority over Jesus Christ. No one is practicing LOA.
> 
> 
> If I actively practiced LOA that would be another story. You are giving the board power, not me. Personally, I believe LOA is a bunch of hoopla.(that's another story)  I truely believe God has the final say so..... Well anyway take care.
> 
> 
> I decided to call my board a goal board



loa = laws of _attraction_ 

vision board = a tool used to _'attract'_ what one desires in their lives. 

It's loa all the way; this is how it is practiced.  one is instructed to place their desires on a board and _'attract'_ it into their lives.   

The danger is the spirit behind the board...

BTW:  I want to thank you again for posting about the brooms being used in wedding ceremonies.   This is vital information.    Please continue to share what you find.   We may have to start a thread for Christian Brides, entitled things to consider when planning their ceremonies.       I'm thinking that I will post one once I gather the necessary information.  

Thanks again.


----------



## Shimmie

Nice & Wavy said:


> No, you have it all wrong.
> 
> How could praying to the only true and living God be considered witchcraft?
> 
> A prayer journal is just that....writing your prayers to God....the creator of the Universe.
> 
> When people get to the point where they don't put the things of God in order, something is terribly wrong.



Sis, your siggy







Speaks volumes to this thread topic.  We can't go by what we 'see'.  

As the scripture says:

_We walk by 'Faith' not by 'Sight'._   2 Corinthians 5:7

A vision board is not by an act of faith, but it is in trusting and dependent upon what one can 'see'.  

I know it's not easy, yet if we take just one step towards faith, God will strengthen the next steps.   

The scripture above is the answer to the question posed.  _We walk by Faith not by sight.    _

Glory to God...    :Rose:


----------



## Nice & Wavy

sharentu said:


> Shimmie, you have ALWAYS kept it real in the matters of God.  ALWAYS.  you and n&w always made me smile with what you brought to the forum.  i cant help what i was taught, yall usually line up to all i was raised to know.  its always good to get a reminder, rebuke, or reprimand per se.  so i will definitely to be there.


I'm happy that I make you smile, Sharentu 



Shimmie said:


> Sis, your siggy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Speaks volumes to this thread topic.  We can't go by what we 'see'.
> 
> As the scripture says:
> 
> _We walk by 'Faith' not by 'Sight'._   2 Corinthians 5:7
> 
> A vision board is not by an act of faith, but it is in trusting and dependent upon what one can 'see'.
> 
> I know it's not easy, yet if we take just one step towards faith, God will strengthen the next steps.
> 
> The scripture above is the answer to the question posed.  _We walk by Faith not by sight.    _
> 
> Glory to God...    :Rose:


----------



## jenny87

loolalooh said:
			
		

> Reposting my original post (which I think you overlooked):
> 
> "The definition (at least in LOA) of a vision board is not to inspire, but to manifest things into your life. What I don't understand is why we as believers would take a non-believer concept and try to make it our own. Oh well.
> 
> The problem with vision boards is that they facilitate the entrance of the enemy into our lives. (As if we don't have enough of him already.) You paste photos from magazines or the internet of what you want in your life. Your hope in creating the board is that the Universe (what non-believers call it) or God (what we call Him) will bring you those things you want. You meditate (what non-believers call it) or pray (what believers call it) on the board daily or regularly so that those things manifest themselves. Before you know it, these desires become the forefront of your mind and God becomes the background. In fact, God is only in the picture as "the One you pray to so you can get what you want" and nothing more. You lose sight of what God has called us to do (to serve Him, to spread the Good News, etc.). You focus more on what you want in the physical world (a big house, a new car, etc.). This is what vision boards have the potential to do. After one thing is manifested, you ask for the next thing, and it doesn't end. This is what I've seen."
> 
> Can you quote me where I said that "God himself did not tell you to express yourself and prayers through construction paper and pictures?"  I see vision boards as going down a dangerous path.  I said "The problem with vision boards is that they facilitate the entrance of the enemy into our lives."    What God told you (or didn't tell you) is not my place to say.



I didn't miss this by any means.....I saw it and read it.  I will say, just like I have said up thread, I do not participate in LOA, I do not know anything about it.  Most of the other people I have seen in this thread that have vision boards do not participate in LOA.  My main problem is when people, Christians or otherwise, have these extreme opinions on what other people need to do in their lives or walk with God.  You say that it isn't your place to say what God did or didn't tell me, but if that is what God told me you are judging it and condemning it.

I agree that people should pray God's will over, as in above or instead of desires, but we all know that is not what everyone does.  If having a piece of cardboard is going to lead you to sin, then by all means don't have one.  But don't act like a picture on a piece of cardboard is the end all be all for facilitating the devil.  Did you throw away your magazines and gluesticks?  What about your markers?  Surely those things must be inviting Satan into your home since together they can make something so evil.  If you are praying TO your vision board to bring about your desires, then yes that's a prroblem.  If you are praying over it the same way you do your prayer journal, I think you will be okay.  

Adding a picture to some words does not make it demonic; the person using it does.  A vision board is just that, a board, some words, some pictures, and some glue.  YOU have to give it power in and over your life to invite a spirit in.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


----------



## jenny87

Shimmie said:
			
		

> It doesn't matter what you call it, it will still be what it is, a tool of witchcraft.  satan changes names all the time, but it's still the same practice and deception.
> 
> The question is this.   Can you trust God without it?   Can you give up having a vision board, and place your trust in God totally without leaning towards your own understanding.    The board is a crutch, it's your alternate... it's your 'just in case' God says 'no', you'll get it for yourself.
> 
> So can you?  Can you take God as He is and solely as He is and just leave all in His hands and walk away from the 'board' and believe Him and His power and most of all, His love for you.    God won't turn on you and forget your prayers.  If a goal is in your heart, neither will you forget it.  And if it's part of God's plan, it will definitely come to pass.
> 
> It's all a matter of choice and where your faith is.
> 
> If God be God, believe Him, Trust Him, leave all other gods aside.   If the vision board be god, honour it.   The choice is yours.



You can ask the same questions of a prayer journal, which several people have said they have.  So should I get rid of my prayer journal??

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


----------



## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> You can ask the same questions of a prayer journal, which several people have said they have.  So should I get rid of my prayer journal??
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



Jenny, the Bible its self is a Prayer Journal ... no questions are necessary.

A vision board is not.    

You're still connected to a lot of the things of the world, Jenny.  I don't know if you are 'Saved' or not,  however, if you're living in sin (such as having sex outside of marriage), there's an influence that blinds you to the truth that God wants you to live in.     In time, as you grow in Christ Jesus, you'll be able to see and understand the difference. 

In Christ we cannot have it both ways, we cannot be conformed to this world and be in God's Kingdom.   It's one or the other.  

Our hearts as Christians should have Jesus as far more important than a material board which has no life other than what we give it, which is in reality,  'lifeless'.     

Jesus says, 

_ If ye abide in Me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. 

John 15:7_

All you need is Jesus... no boards allowed.


----------



## disgtgyal

Wow I'm surprise this is still continuing,  I think those who staunchly oppose vision boards aren't approaching the matter of "reasoning together" and to me there seems to be this self righteous air about it. To quote my minister "ppl only judge that which they feel they are superior to" I understand we are to be careful about what we take part in but as I've said loa is a perversion of biblical principle "calling things into being" the difference is we as Christians understand that its not by our might nor by power but by His spirit are we able to do such things. From what I've read those who have vision boards aren't worshiping it nor relying on themselves to bring their goals to pass. Speaking of wedding traditions many Christians incorporate several things that have to do with bad/good luck into their wedding ceremony, e.g. carrying a wife over the threshold, to name one. To those that oppose vision boards as well as those that support it, go before God without any preconceived beliefs and ask Him earnestly to open the eyes of your heart concerning vision boards because afterall if it isn't explicitly expressed as sin in the bible its the Holy spirit that will let us know whether its sinful for that individual because only He knows our hearts.


----------



## loolalooh

jenny87 said:


> I didn't miss this by any means.....I saw it and read it.  I will say, just like I have said up thread, I do not participate in LOA, I do not know anything about it.  Most of the other people I have seen in this thread that have vision boards do not participate in LOA.



Summary: Some Christians have started adopting vision boards.  We don't disagree there.



jenny87 said:


> My main problem is when people, Christians or otherwise, have these extreme opinions on what other people need to do in their lives or walk with God. You say that it isn't your place to say what God did or didn't tell me, but if that is what God told me you are judging it and condemning it.



Can vision boards facilitate entrance of the enemy?  Yes. I would by lying if I said no.  The OP asked the question.  I chose to answer.  I'm merely warning those who are inquisitive.  Whether you take that as me telling you what God did or didn't tell you is your own personal problem.  Whether you take that as an extreme opinion on what you need to do in your life is your own personal problem.



jenny87 said:


> I agree that people should pray God's will over, as in above or instead of desires, but we all know that is not what everyone does.



Correct.  Not everyone does.  Will you follow them?



jenny87 said:


> If having a piece of cardboard is going to lead you to sin, then by all means don't have one.  But don't act like a picture on a piece of cardboard is the end all be all for facilitating the devil. Did you throw away your magazines and gluesticks?  What about your markers?  Surely those things must be inviting Satan into your home since together they can make something so evil.



You haven't read what people posted in this thread concerning the dangers of the vision board.  It is not that it is merely "a picture on a piece of cardboard".



jenny87 said:


> If you are praying TO your vision board to bring about your desires, then yes that's a prroblem.  If you are praying over it the same way you do your prayer journal, I think you will be okay.



Vision boards can lead to focus on the self.  It doesn't matter whether you are praying to the board itself, to the Universe, or to God.  Your prayers are directed to gratifying the self.  Focus on the self can open the door to the enemy.



jenny87 said:


> Adding a picture to some words does not make it demonic; the person using it does.



You'd be surprised how the devil can work.



jenny87 said:


> A vision board is just that, a board, some words, some pictures, and some glue.  YOU have to give it power in and over your life to invite a spirit in.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



No, my dear.  A vision board is not just that.


----------



## jenny87

Shimmie said:
			
		

> Jenny, the Bible its self is a Prayer Journal ... no questions are necessary.
> 
> A vision board is not.
> 
> You're still connected to a lot of the things of the world, Jenny.  I don't know if you are 'Saved' or not,  however, if you're living in sin (such as having sex outside of marriage), there's an influence that blinds you to the truth that God wants you to live in.     In time, as you grow in Christ Jesus, you'll be able to see and understand the difference.
> 
> In Christ we cannot have it both ways, we cannot be conformed to this world and be in God's Kingdom.   It's one or the other.
> 
> Our hearts as Christians should have Jesus as far more important than a material board which has no life other than what we give it, which is in reality,  'lifeless'.
> 
> Jesus says,
> 
> If ye abide in Me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
> 
> John 15:7
> 
> All you need is Jesus... no boards allowed.



Ummm no.  You know that is not what I meant.  Not to meantion the bible is much more than a "prayer journal". There are songs, hymns, parables, letters, and other things besides prayers so no, not the same.  

I'm serious, don't try to sidestep the questions.  Since Christians do not need anything blocking/coming btw their communication with God, why does one need a prayer journal?  It is nothing but a book that you write you prayers to go in and then pray for those same things?

As far as my "living in sin", it almost looks like you were trying to imply that you are above all the temptations of the world and not living in sin?  But I know you would do something like that.  

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


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## jenny87

loolalooh said:
			
		

> Can vision boards facilitate entrance of the enemy?  Yes. I would by lying if I said no.



Several things can facilitate "the entrance of the enemy".  Money is one of the biggest ones.  Are you going to be poor to make sure you are not tempted?  Doubt it.  But people worship money all the time.

If you are trying to rid yourself of things that MIGHT facilitate the enemy you have to throw out more than just your vision board.  What movies do you have?  What books do you read?  How do you spend your time off??  Think of all of that stuff too before you pass judgement on everyone else.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


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## disgtgyal

jenny87 said:
			
		

> Several things can facilitate "the entrance of the enemy".  Money is one of the biggest ones.  Are you going to be poor to make sure you are not tempted?  Doubt it.  But people worship money all the time.
> 
> If you are trying to rid yourself of things that MIGHT facilitate the enemy you have to throw out more than just your vision board.  What movies do you have?  What books do you read?  How do you spend your time off??  Think of all of that stuff too before you pass judgement on everyone else.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



Could not have said it better, it was very self- righteous and judgmental... Being part of this hair board could become an  "open door" because it could be interpreted as idolatry by some more religious Christians ... I think the heart of the matter is there are some Christians who are so fearful of doing anything because it may give the enemy an entry, while I do believe we are to be vigilant I more than anything trust my relationship with God, and I know the Holy spirit will let me know if I'm heading into something I shouldn't. I chose to live by faith not fear.


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## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> Wow I'm surprise this is still continuing,  I think those who staunchly oppose vision boards aren't approaching the matter of "reasoning together" and to me there seems to be this self righteous air about it. To quote my minister "ppl only judge that which they feel they are superior to" I understand we are to be careful about what we take part in but as I've said loa is a perversion of biblical principle "calling things into being" the difference is we as Christians understand that its not by our might nor by power but by His spirit are we able to do such things. From what I've read those who have vision boards aren't worshiping it nor relying on themselves to bring their goals to pass.
> 
> Speaking of wedding traditions many Christians incorporate several things that have to do with bad/good luck into their wedding ceremony, e.g. carrying a wife over the threshold, to name one.
> 
> To those that oppose vision boards as well as those that support it, go before God without any preconceived beliefs and ask Him earnestly to open the eyes of your heart concerning vision boards because afterall if it isn't explicitly expressed as sin in the bible its the Holy spirit that will let us know whether its sinful for that individual because only He knows our hearts.



I can assure that my husband did not carry me over the threshold.  The door wasn't wide enough.    

The truth is this.  Vision boards are for those who need to 'see' in order to believe.   God's Word instructs otherwise.   We walk by faith, not by sight.  Pure and simple.     A vision board is not in line with scripture, for it is for those who are 'sight' dependent.   They have to see it to believe it.  

There is no basis to make it scriptural.   Just one's dependency to have one. 

There are people dying to have a Bible.  Literally dying.  And when they have access to one, they cherish God's Word so much, that they committ God's Word deep within their hearts.  And this is just as God commanded us to do; to committ  His Word into our hearts and to live by Faith, not sight, but by Faith to believe in Him.

You can bring up anything you want to try and compare the ills of traditions of men, yet it still will not make a vision board holy.  It is what it is and will always be... a tool of witchcraft.


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## loolalooh

jenny87 said:


> Several things can facilitate "the entrance of the enemy".  Money is one of the biggest ones.  Are you going to be poor to make sure you are not tempted?  Doubt it.  But people worship money all the time.
> 
> If you are trying to rid yourself of things that MIGHT facilitate the enemy you have to throw out more than just your vision board.  What movies do you have?  What books do you read?  How do you spend your time off??  Think of all of that stuff too before you pass judgement on everyone else.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



Jenny, I'm not going to argue with you.  The OP asked a question, and I answered.  If you are looking for an argument, you won't find it with me.  You are clearly not asking questions from a place of curiosity, but from a place of stirring up dissension.  Here is my response to this most recent post and, unless you have *genuine* questions in the future, I will no longer respond to your future replies:

The Bible says that "love of the money" is the root of all evil (1 Timothy 6).  So yes, "love of money", can facilitate entrance of the enemy.  Is money in itself evil? No.  Money feeds the poor, helps the sick, etc.  Tell me ... do vision boards feed the poor and help the sick?

Yes, certain movies and books and how one spends their time can facilitate the enemy.  This is more realistic comparison (than money and vision boards).  There is no disagreement with that.  You asked "do I rid myself of those things"?  Yes, I do. I try to avoid movies and books and activities that promote sexual immorality, selfishness, violence, etc.


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## Laela

Habbakuk 2 is so often misused to support manifestations..  we tend to forget to note that the vision came directly from God and Habbakuk had to wait (pray, keep faith) for it to be manifested in its appointed time. Whatever that revelation God gives Him...

*Verse 1 *
_I will stand my watch
And set myself on the rampart,
And watch to see what He will say to me,
And what I will answer when I am corrected._

He gave his complaints, requests, etc to the Lord and waited for God's answers.

Rather, people tend see this the other way around : Habbakuk has his own vision, and waited on God to make it happen. That introduces our own efforts, to see to it that it does happen. Basically, our will vs God's.



disgtgyal said:


> I'm actually considering doing a vision board, but doing it differently. My vision board will consist of all the things God has promised me, all the plans He laid out for me. My vision board isn't going to be based on the law of attraction, in fact I plan on dividing the cardboard in three and in the middle will be Bible verses that correspond with His promises and purpose beginning with seeking Him first... and on the outer sides will be pics representing the promises He made but it'll held together by the Word. Before reading this thread it never occurred to me it could be demonic, especially since in Habakkuk God says to write the vision down which IMO serves a visual reminder for the person when their faith maybe lacking... am I missing something?
> 
> Sent from my LG-P925 using LG-P925


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## loolalooh

disgtgyal said:


> Could not have said it better, it was very self- righteous and judgmental...



Before you say I am being "self-righteous" and "judgmental", quote me where I have been "self-righteous" and "judgmental".  That is a baseless personal attack you are making merely because you are in disagreement with my viewpoint.  Just there, you have judged me.



disgtgyal said:


> Being part of this hair board could become an  "open door" because it could be interpreted as idolatry by some more religious Christians ...



Yes, being a part of this hair board could become an "open door".  Where are we disagreeing?  Maybe because I feel a vision board opens a wider door?  So am I not allowed to warn others of the dangers of a vision board in a thread specifically asking whether vision boards are demonic?  



disgtgyal said:


> I think the heart of the matter is there are some Christians who are so fearful of doing anything because it may give the enemy an entry, while I do believe we are to be vigilant I more than anything trust my relationship with God, and I know the Holy spirit will let me know if I'm heading into something I shouldn't. I chose to live by faith not fear.



There are things we should avoid because they will lead us so easily into sin (James 4:7).  Then there things we cannot avoid because it will prevent us from accomplishing the work of God.


----------



## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> Ummm no.  You know that is not what I meant.  Not to meantion the bible is much more than a "prayer journal". There are songs, hymns, parables, letters, and other things besides prayers so no, not the same.
> 
> I'm serious, don't try to sidestep the questions.  Since Christians do not need anything blocking/coming btw their communication with God, why does one need a prayer journal?  It is nothing but a book that you write you prayers to go in and then pray for those same things?
> 
> *As far as my "living in sin", it almost looks like you were trying to imply that you are above all the temptations of the world and not living in sin?  But I know you would do something like that.  *Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



I'm not 'above' it, no one is; I've been 'there',  however I had sense enough to get out of it, and not to 'do it' any longer.   

So are you admitting that you are in sexual sin?  Little one, I hope not.  It may not seem to you that I care, but your life means far, far more for me to not care.  It involves too much of your being and you deserve so much better.  

*If *you are in this activity, do you advocate this, even as a Christian?   Adding this to not seeing the dangers of a vision board?  

*If* you're in sexual sin; giving your virtue to someone who is not your husband,  can lead to other misconceptions in life.... The elements of deception are there and prominant; because of the emotions involved in sex it renders one unable to see the right from the wrong.   

One of the biggest misconceptions of unmarried sex, is that you can change a man; make him yours; make him yield to your desires by giving him your body, only to lose yourself instead; leading you to make other unwise decisions in your life.  

Bottomline:  It's selling yourself short and it is blocking God from being 'total' in your life.  

Be safe and please be careful.  You deserve far better.


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## LucieLoo12

Can we just stick to the word? Can the word of God be the word all by itself? The bible says His word is spirit and live. We dont need no boards, just apply the word of God to your life and you will begin to see manifestations unfold in your life.


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## aribell

disgtgyal said:


> Could not have said it better, it was very self- righteous and judgmental... Being part of this hair board could become an "open door" because it could be interpreted as idolatry by some more religious Christians ... I think the heart of the matter is there are some Christians who are so fearful of doing anything because it may give the enemy an entry, while I do believe we are to be vigilant I more than anything trust my relationship with God, and I know the Holy spirit will let me know if I'm heading into something I shouldn't. I chose to live by faith not fear.


 
It's not fearfulness to avoid what you clearly see is a wrong path--it's wisdom and understanding. God certainly does guide, and there have been several people in this thread issuing warnings. It reminds me of SuperNintendo's MarioKart, when you would drive in the wrong direction, a little creature would drop out of the sky with a sign that said "Wrong way! Wrong way" until you turned around. What has been shared is simply a warning sign. And many times people are able to give warnings because they've been down a wrong path and back again and therefore _know_ (not just guess or assume) that it's not the right way.


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## jenny87

Shimmie - it really doesn't matter what type of sin I'm in.  lol.  God doesn't look at any sin as better than another.  

I wish I could unparticipate in this thread!  I'm sick of seeing.  I'm sick of seeing all of these people and their opinions.  You know what they say about opinions......

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


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## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> Shimmie - it really doesn't matter what type of sin I'm in.  lol.  God doesn't look at any sin as better than another.
> 
> I wish I could unparticipate in this thread!  I'm sick of seeing.  I'm sick of seeing all of these people and their opinions.  You know what they say about opinions......
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



Please don't say it doesn't matter.  Jenny, YOU matter.  It's about you. 

Okay, putting aside the issue with the vision board, there is something here which is of value and Jenny, that's you.   Sin matters to God because it's about individual you and what the consequences are because of it.   

Your heart matters.  And if indeed the sin is sexual, it matters ever so much, for a woman has to ask herself, does this man love her as much as she is giving of herself to him?  Does his love for her measure up to her 'virtue'? 

Her virtue is a 'gift', a gift that a man has to earn.  She is far worth the price that a man must pay in order to be intimate with her.    Jenny you are worth that price.  You are worth the price that a man must earn.  

Boaz paid the price for Ruth; with heart he took the responsibility of being her kinsman redeemer.    He paid the price to honour and to marry her.   

No woman, especially a deeply loved daughter of God, has to 'sell' herself short of what she is worth.   Jenny you are God's daughter and yes, all sin is sin to Him, yet each sin has it's own consequences and heartache.  There is a set consequence that matches each sin.   

I'm not condemning you.... I can't.  I know what's it like to want love yet I've learned that it has to be the right love and I had to trust God to bring it/him into my life and God did just that.    God has better for us as His daughters.  Don't be afraid to walk away from the counterfeits and place your heart in God's care to bring the right man into your life. 

Sex outside of Marriage and vision boards have much in common.   They are based upon misplaced desires; they give a false sense of hope; neither of them are the real thing.  

Please be safe... Little One.


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## jenny87

^^^ I simply meant to God sin is sin.  Sexual sin is no different than lying in God's eyes.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


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## Shimmie

jenny87 said:


> ^^^ I simply meant to God sin is sin.  Sexual sin is no different than lying in God's eyes.
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF



It is...   We both agree.    

Yet still each sin has it's own related consequences.

Jenny, I'm laying down the 'arms', meaning the disagreements that we have exchanged in this thread.  Something far more important needs to be dealt with; 'You', Little One.   If sexual sin is in your life, you are the most important of all, that needs attention.     I don't want to see you in trouble.  

The issue of the vision board is officially dropped.   If you ever want to PM me, please do.   There's no condemnation.    

There's such a beauty in you that no one can ever take away, unless you give it away.  You are precious and rare, that's how God designed you.  The sin's consequence would be to lose it to someone who doesn't deserve it. 

Please take care....


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## Kookookiwi

Shimmie said:


> It is...  We both agree.
> 
> Yet still each sin has it's own related consequences.
> 
> Jenny, I'm laying down the 'arms', meaning the disagreements that we have exchanged in this thread. Something far more important needs to be dealt with; 'You', Little One. If sexual sin is in your life, you are the most important of all, that needs attention. I don't want to see you in trouble.
> 
> The issue of the vision board is officially dropped. If you ever want to PM me, please do. There's no condemnation.
> 
> There's such a beauty in you that no one can ever take away, unless you give it away. You are precious and rare, that's how God designed you. The sin's consequence would be to lose it to someone who doesn't deserve it.
> 
> Please take care....


 
I'm confused, what does her sexual life or PERSONAL sins have to with the topic at hand?erplexed Should we have everyone confess their sins so we can determine if they are worthy of having an opinion on this topic? If someone does one particular type of sin are they somehow incapable of understanding the word of God? I don't do Vision Boards and haven't done the research to know how I feel about them, and I surely don't support LOA, but this just isn't right. If you're sincerely concerned about her wellbeing why not send her a PM? Why would you put this judgement, because that's definitely what it sounds like, of her out in the middle of the threaderplexed?This was an interesting topic but now it's just going


----------



## Shimmie

Kookookiwi said:


> I'm confused, what does her sexual life or PERSONAL sins have to with the topic at hand?erplexed Should we have everyone confess their sins so we can determine if they are worthy of having an opinion on this topic? If someone does one particular type of sin are they somehow incapable of understanding the word of God? I don't do Vision Boards and haven't done the research to know how I feel about them, and I surely don't support LOA, but this just isn't right. If you're sincerely concerned about her wellbeing why not send her a PM? Why would you put this judgement, because that's definitely what it sounds like, of her out in the middle of the threaderplexed?This was an interesting topic but now it's just going



I closed the issue....


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## Kookookiwi

Shimmie said:


> I closed the issue....


 
I understand that I just don't see why whether or not she's having sexual relations outside of marriage was brought up in the first place. But you know what nevermind because I don't want to derail the thread further. OP I'll have to do some research and then I'll get back to you


----------



## disgtgyal

Yes we walk by faith and not sight, never did I nor anyone say the vision board makes them believe in God's promises what I did say however is that is serves as a visual reminder, its no different than writing verses on index card and placing them throughout your home, you know the word but the index cards serves as a reminder nothing more nothing less. I spoke of wedding traditions Christians practice because those who are oppose vision boards are do so because of it's origins, so I'm suggesting to those individuals look at the origins of everything they do, including wearing makeup, because the women who worshipped baal  put makeup on as part of their worship, and what about earrings ... I say all of this to say if you're going to say vision boards are wrong, sinful, unscriptual, witchcraft, then look at everything in your life and find its origins and scriptural reference for doing it.


----------



## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> Yes we walk by faith and not sight, never did I nor anyone say the vision board makes them believe in God's promises what I did say however is that is serves as a visual reminder, its no different than writing verses on index card and placing them throughout your home, you know the word but the index cards serves as a reminder nothing more nothing less. I spoke of wedding traditions Christians practice because those who are oppose vision boards are do so because of it's origins, so I'm suggesting to those individuals look at the origins of everything they do, including wearing makeup, because the women who worshipped baal  put makeup on as part of their worship, and what about earrings ... I say all of this to say if you're going to say vision boards are wrong, sinful, unscriptual, witchcraft, then look at everything in your life and find its origins and scriptural reference for doing it.



Nothing you've said defends the use of a vision board.   People are not using jewelry or makeup to 'will' things into their lives. 

Like I said up post, this spirit of witchcraft did not become as prevalent in this forum until the loa threads were introduced,  along with the 'self help' tools and books, introducing and promoting the use of vision boards to perform their manisfestations.    All of which is the New Age movement to distract and move people further away from God.   

Please do not think for one minute that I am not fully aware of the spirit behind those who attempt to bring that witchery here into the our Christian forum.    It's a demonic strategy to feign innocense of something which in truth is not innocent.  It's an attempt to lure Christians into a practice which will do more harm than any good.    

You can use any comparisons you want to validate the use of a vision board, or to present it as less harmful.   However the attempt of satan is clear.   It is to 'relax' the precautions and allow it to seep into its use among Christians with the result of the practice of witchcraft flowing in the midst.    I'm not having it over here.   

This Christian forum is a place where the presence of God will not be minimized.    God's power will not be limited.    There are numerous members here who have paid the price of putting their full faith in trusting and honouring God and in that our prayers have and will be heard and answered by HIM and not defiled by interferring spirits.   

People are hurting. People are searching for their purpose in life.   People need the wholeness of God and in this time of which we are living, we need God all the more.  None of us can afford to be on our own with the future that lies ahead.   None of us can afford to be without God. 

*For those who think I am making a big deal over a little board... get real!   *

The devil is not fooling anybody.  he knows exactly what he's doing, by trying to convince a Christian that a vision board is fine for posting scriptures.  However, that's the 'entrance'.   Once he's gotten in, the vision board becomes an 'altar' for other things that they begin to post / place on that board; especially when trials come into their lives.   The board is 'there' and it seems 'okay' to place their desires on that board and they begin to put into action 'self will' instead of prayer and strengthening their relationship with God and to trust Him to get them through whatever comes into their lives.

All of this foolishness defending a demonic tool such a a vision board is proof that people are not dependent upon God but what they choose for themselves.   It is also an indication that something else is going on in their lives which is hindering God from being the full focus in their lives.  Often, it is connected to a sexual experience.  Sex opens the soul to many things, and if it's sex outside of marriage, it can often lead to the practice of witchcraft and the person doesn't recognize it as such.    

Often, vision boards are used by women who place pictures of men they've been intimate / or wish to be intimate with; men that they want to marry; men who have left them, men whom they've had sex with and have been abandoned; they use the board as an attempt to 'will' these men to either stay with them or to come back onto their lives.     

More often than not, vision boards are used in this form of witchcraft, to 'will' ... to manifest the object of ones' affection, to manifest a person into the user's life.   There are Christian women who are doing this, they have the man, the house, pictures of a family, the family car.... all that they desire, is placed upon these boards to 'will / manifest' into their lives.  They've lost their faith, patience, their hope in believing God; so they create their own.  This is not God.  

You can say all day long that you're not going to use the board for this.  Okay... if the board is there, you've already placed your faith in it.  It's just a matter of time for it to be 'used' as satan intended, to depart you from the faith. 

At this point, I truly do not care who gets offended.   I'm not out to hurt anyone.    I tried to warn people before when this mess first started evolving.    Of course it caused controversy big time, however, things have occurred in some of the lives of those who were strong supporters of loa and vision boards which  is indeed loa.    When you 'invite' or give entrance to these spirits, it's only a matter of time before 'they' become the manifestors of their character and they begin to wreck havoc in the person's life.   

It's like the rattlesnake story which was posted.   The snake convinced someone that they would not bite them, when the person dropped their guard and allowed the snake to come in, they bit the person afterall.    

Keep letting satan fool you.   It's only a matter of time before he strikes.


----------



## loolalooh

disgtgyal said:


> Yes we walk by faith and not sight, never did I nor anyone say the vision board makes them believe in God's promises what I did say however is that is serves as a visual reminder, its no different than writing verses on index card and placing them throughout your home, you know the word but the index cards serves as a reminder nothing more nothing less. I spoke of wedding traditions Christians practice because those who are oppose vision boards are do so because of it's origins, so I'm suggesting to those individuals look at the origins of everything they do, including wearing makeup, because the women who worshipped baal  put makeup on as part of their worship, and what about earrings ... I say all of this to say if you're going to say vision boards are wrong, sinful, unscriptual, witchcraft, then look at everything in your life and find its origins and scriptural reference for doing it.



:Shaking my head:

You apparently do not understand what those "oppose vision boards" are trying to say.  First, you throw out the words "self righteous" and "judgmental" (in a previous post) to those same people.  Now you equate vision boards to makeup and earrings to challenge those people's lives.  It seems like you are in attack mode to those who disagree with you.

If you and others want to have discussion on what other things in one's life are "wrong, sinful, and unscriptural", we can gladly start a new thread on that topic and discuss.  (In this thread, we've already discussed the topic of movies, money, activities, hair boards, prayer journals, etc. to appease you and others'.)  The OP asked about vision boards, and so those who are warning against them are merely sharing the dangers associated with a vision board.  No one here claims to be perfect in his/her life.  As far as I know, some of us do analyze the origins of other things in our life and attempt to avoid what leads to sin (again, this was answered in previous posts by many others).

If you want to create a vision board, no one is tying you down.  After all, God gave us free will.  However, that does not mean we will stop warning others.


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## disgtgyal

No one and correct me if I'm wrong but no one said by using vision board they are willing something into their life. I made the reference of makeup and earrings because you're talking about the origins of things and not participating in it because of its origins, so what I'm suggesting is that you look at everything in your life and find out the history of those things, or even research the beliefs of the early church before the Protestant reformation, you will be amazed at some of the things Christians didn't do because of its associations, and like one of my favorite minister said Jesus didn't die for us to have a religion He died so we can have a relationship and fellowship with God, and I say that because the argument against it sounds very "spirit of religion-ish". As ridiculous a reference makeup and earrings may seem to us now, think back a few centuries and how it was viewed, which is exactly how vision boards will be viewed in the future.  I understand what those who oppose it are saying, yes it can be an open door for some because it can lead to idolatry and that its used as a tool for witchcraft which is why i said earlier if anyone is considering it, bring it before God and He will let you know whether it's a danger for you, what's the problem with that, because if it is what you profess it to be then God will let them know. Isn't it the holy spirit's job to convict and lead us into all truth. As I said earlier if something isn't explicitly forbidden in the bible then you are to go before God with it, Paul says do not put your bondage on me nor will I flaunt my liberty in front of you. And no I'm not in attack mode that isn't in my character, but maybe what you picked up is frustration. when I said judgemental and self- righteous I was referring to the tone of your post not you hun you seem offended by that, I'm sorry.


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## aribell

I don't think it's about origins.  In fact, origins never really crossed my mind.  It's the nature of the thing itself...not simply as a potential tool of witchcraft, but an act of witchcraft in its nature.  It wouldn't matter if it originated with someone sitting in a church service--if the activity is forbidden by Scripture (which I hope we can all agree that witchcraft is), then it's not something to be embraced.

As mentioned upthread, we are accustomed to thinking about witchcraft as boiling cauldrons, broomsticks and other hocus pocus nonsense.  All of these caricatures of witches only serve to desensitize us to the way that a spirit of witchcraft manifests itself in many other ways that are much more subtle.  Witchcraft is basically relying on spirits or a "force" other than the Holy Spirit to accomplish something or guide us.  There's a reason all of this stuff is so popular in non-Christian, but "spiritual" circles--they can have their desires manifested (or "prayers answered") without following Christ, without waiting on or submitting to Him.  You just put your desire out to the "universe" and the "universe" will give it back to you.  This is just calling on familiar spirits to do one's bidding; _and they will_, if a person gets deep enough into it.  It doesn't matter if the person realizes that they're calling on spirits--I'm sure the vast majority don't--but that's what's operating.  

In I Corinthians 10, Paul mentions that people who were sacrificing to idols were in fact sacrificing to demons.  As far as Christians go, Watchman Nee said something interesting--that there's a reason Jesus told us to pray to our Father who is in _heaven_, for if we pray to the "God" in our room, we'll get an answer from the "god" in our room--which is not the triune God.  (http://www.worldinvisible.com/library/nee/5f00.0634/5f00.0634.02.htm)  It's not beyond Christians to be deceived as to what power they are really tapping into.  If we focus on the temporal, the metaphysical, the "universe" or what have you, we'll get the prince of the power of the air rather than our Father in heaven.

One might say, "But God didn't explicitly say that this was bad."  Well, He also gives us reason to be able to apply biblical principles to what we encounter, since there are lots of things that aren't explicitly mentioned that Christians know to be wrong.  Everything doesn't come down to personal leadings, as we could list plenty of activities and habits that are not explicitly mentioned in Scripture, and yet we know God is not telling one person it's OK and another that it is.  It's not about personal weakness, in this case, it's about whether an activity itself is or is not offensive to God.  Besides, the apostles asked Jesus to teach them how to pray, and He did.  Why isn't that enough?

If a vision board is not being used as a "vision board" then it doesn't apply to this discussion.  There are posters that I love that have scripture written on them.  There are ones that list the names of God.  Sunday school classrooms have verses and prayers hanging up.  These are not "vision boards."  I don't understand the point of arguing about something that doesn't apply to the question asked.  If what one is doing is not how a "vision board" is used, then I don't think it fits into this conversation and there's no need to defend it.  If it _is_ how a "vision board" is used, then no amount of dressing it up changes what it is.  

But I think that what has been said is more than enough for people to read, think about, pray about and move on in their walk with the Lord.


----------



## loolalooh

disgtgyal said:


> No one and correct me if I'm wrong but no one said by using vision board they are willing something into their life.



Though that is usually the case, one does not have to start a vision board with that intent.  Some people have started vision boards with innocent intent and, before they know it, fall into the dangerous path.  (I believe at least one  person has shared their story in this thread.)



disgtgyal said:


> I made the reference of makeup and earrings because you're talking about the origins of things and not participating in it because of its origins, so what I'm suggesting is that you look at everything in your life and find out the history of those things, or even research the beliefs of the early church before the Protestant reformation, you will be amazed at some of the things Christians didn't do because of its associations, and like one of my favorite minister said Jesus didn't die for us to have a religion  He died so we can have a relationship and fellowship with God, and I say that because the argument against it sounds very "spirit of religion-ish". As ridiculous a reference makeup and earrings may seem to us now, think back a few centuries and how it was viewed, which is exactly how vision boards will be viewed in the future.



Here's the point you are making: If the origin/association of vision boards are suspect, so are the origins/associations of other things.  Why don't those who oppose vision boards also look at those other things.  Please re-read the answers I and others gave in previous posts.  



disgtgyal said:


> I understand what those who oppose it are saying, yes it can be an open door for some because it can lead to idolatry and that its used as a tool for witchcraft which is why i said earlier if anyone is considering it, bring it before God and He will let you know whether it's a danger for you, what's the problem with that, because if it is what you profess it to be then God will let them know. Isn't it the holy spirit's job to convict and lead us into all truth. *As I said earlier if something isn't explicitly forbidden in the bible* then you are to go before God with it, Paul says do not put your bondage on me nor will I flaunt my liberty in front of you. And no I'm not in attack mode that isn't in my character, but maybe what you picked up is frustration. when I said judgemental and self- righteous I was referring to the tone of your post not you hun you seem offended by that, I'm sorry.



As Christians, we can look to this verse: *“So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God” (1 Corinthians 10:31).*  If something is not explicitly forbidden in the Bible, we should ask ourselves: "Will this be for the glory of God?"  

We can also look to this verse: *"But whoever has doubts is condemned if he eats, because the eating is not from faith. For whatever does not proceed from faith is sin." (Romans 14:23).* If one is having doubts about creating a vision board, one sins by creating a vision board.

So in summary, one can ask themselves: "Will I be creating this vision board for the glory of God?"  "Do I have doubts about creating this vision board?"


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## loolalooh

nicola.kirwan said:


> If a vision board is not being used as a "vision board" then it doesn't apply to this discussion.  There are posters that I love that have scripture written on them.  There are ones that list the names of God.  Sunday school classrooms have verses and prayers hanging up.  These are not "vision boards."  I don't understand the point of arguing about something that doesn't apply to the question asked.  If what one is doing is not how a "vision board" is used, then I don't think it fits into this conversation and there's no need to defend it.  If it _is_ how a "vision board" is used, then no amount of dressing it up changes what it is.



This is critical.  The thread is about "vision boards".  If one is not creating a "vision board", then much of what has been stated in this thread does not apply.


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## disgtgyal

Nicola I agree with you, not everyone who has a vision board is using it as a "vision board" and those who aren't should not be told that its witchcraft, and that's my point, its not about those who oppose it being a kill joy its about them taking it out of context of how the user is using the vision board. If you found out tomorrow witches are using pictures of doves as a witchcraft tool are you gonna throw out any and all pictures of doves you may have, just an example to illustrate how there's a relinquishing of power and authority, and I don't think the book of revelation is a kill joy, atleast it shouldn't be to anyone in Christ. Revelation was explained to me as an unveiling of God. On a side note hungry for God on ITunes is a great podcast, but its definitely not for those who are religious and steeped in traditions


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## aribell

I think we're missing each other in that the label of the person doing the activity doesn't matter, it's the thing itself.  People can and do operate in a spirit of witchcraft unknowingly.  I'm not concerned about what "witches" do, as that label is a distraction.  Like I said, it wouldn't matter if this idea were created in a church service and promoted by ministers.  We need to be able to discern the nature of the thing itself.


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## disgtgyal

Jenny, I have no doubts and yes its done to His glory, and with that said the questions you asked is a helpful response to someone trying to decide whether they should or shouldn't make one, as oppose to some who basically say witchcraft witchcraft witchcraft, because the why is what's important. I do agree the nature of it is important and I do not share the belief its demonic. And as someone who has experience the effect of witchcraft I know there is no way God would allow me to create something that would be a gateway for the demonic.


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## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> *
> 
> Nicola I agree with you, not everyone who has a vision board is using it as a "vision board"...  *



Don't get too happy with this comment.  God isn't giving you permission nor is He validating you to be at peace with having a vision _ouija_ board for _'other_' purposes....   

This is not a game.   

The devil is slick and as I said earlier, he knows exactly what he's doing in order to gain access to one's life.  he is out to steal, kill and to destroy.   The very fact that it's a tool of witchcraft makes it an accursed thing.   The intent of its use is not pure.  There is absolutely no intention nor is there an ability for any Christian to use this as progress towards their walk or devotion to God.   It's a ''back-up" plan, put into place for the 'just in case', what one desires doesn't come on their terms.  

No, No... Uh-uh...     I see right through it.  

satan's intent is to seep into Christian lives with his lies of innocense, where he can gain access to their faith and hinder their relationship with God.

I Peter 5:6-8

_Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time: 

Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you. 

*Be sober, be VIGILANT; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour*:_


----------



## Kookookiwi

nicola.kirwan said:


> I think we're missing each other in that the label of the person doing the activity doesn't matter, it's the thing itself. People can and do operate in a spirit of witchcraft unknowingly. I'm not concerned about what "witches" do, as that label is a distraction. Like I said, it wouldn't matter if this idea were created in a church service and promoted by ministers. We need to be able to discern the nature of the thing itself.


 
So can any of you ladies share what you would view as a vision board as oppose to a "vision board"(this one being the one with origins and uses in witchcraft)?  Do two separate vision boards exist, or do you believe that the difference is so minute it would be to easy to cross that line and is not even worth the risk?  I think that would definitely be helpful to me and probably many other ladies in this thread.


----------



## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> Jenny, I have no doubts and yes its done to His glory, and with that said the questions you asked is a helpful response to someone trying to decide whether they should or shouldn't make one, as oppose to some who basically say witchcraft witchcraft witchcraft, because the why is what's important. I do agree the nature of it is important and I do not share the belief its demonic.
> 
> *And as someone who has experience the effect of witchcraft I know there is no way God would allow me to create something that would be a gateway for the demonic.*



The truth is coming out all in this thread.   You have a 'history' with witchcraft which 'clues' why you are in denial. 

And you are right, God would not allow you to create a gateway, however it doesn't stop you from doing what you will to do.     

When a person is no longer under any remnants of witchcraft, they absolutely refuse to have any type of any association with anything that has any association of the occult.   

*I am not saying that you are practicing witchcraft*, at least not knowingly, however, unless you have been completely delivered from its affects, you will not support anything that has a link to it.   

You don't need a vision board anywhere near you....   It's a setup.  satan knows how to get to you, since he's been there before.   he knows how to set you up.   It's up to you to give him no place... in any space or area of your life. he is still seeking to devour you.  

So far there are three (3) posters in this thread who support vision boards and yet there are 'links' in their lives where the enemy has been prevalent.   This is not a game.    The use of vision boards in this forum are *NOT INNOCENT*.  

I'm not trying to hurt anyone here, not even embarrass them.  No...   I apologize right here and now to everyone to whom I have offended.   

The answers to the OP's question about vision boards being demonic is being answered, in a full fledged 'yes', they are demonic.      

_*Mark 4:22*

For there is nothing hid, which shall not be manifested; neither was any thing kept secret, but that it should come abroad. _


----------



## jenny87

nicola.kirwan said:
			
		

> If a vision board is not being used as a "vision board" then it doesn't apply to this discussion.  There are posters that I love that have scripture written on them.  There are ones that list the names of God.  Sunday school classrooms have verses and prayers hanging up.  These are not "vision boards."  I don't understand the point of arguing about something that doesn't apply to the question asked.  If what one is doing is not how a "vision board" is used, then I don't think it fits into this conversation and there's no need to defend it.  If it is how a "vision board" is used, then no amount of dressing it up changes what it is.



This!!  I think that is the main point of me and others in this thread.  There are people that are not using their "vision boards" in this way, but are still being told that they are demonic and a tool of the enemy.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using LHCF


----------



## Nice & Wavy

The one thing I have learned in this 25 year journey with the Lord is that we must be TEACHABLE.  If we are not able to be teachable, then we are not able to teach.  Period.

As believers in Jesus, it's important to _study to show yourself approved to God, a workman that needs not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth._  2 Tim. 2:15 AKJV

As we study the Word, we should begin to find ourselves conforming to the nature of Jesus and less of the world.  We should begin to share what the Holy Spirit is teaching us and that word is truth!  The truth of God always prevails against the enemy.  

I want to continue to be teachable...I don't want to be in a position where I think that everything I say is right.  But, my prayer is that the truth of the Holy Spirit will penetrate the hearts of those who need hear it and bring change, because from what I see in this thread...change is needed.

May the Lord continue to bless those who have a teachable spirit in this thread and this forum, and for those who are sharing the uncompromising word of the Lord!  Continue to be his hands (as you type) ...your work is not in vain!

N&W


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## aribell

Kookookiwi said:


> So can any of you ladies share what you would view as a vision board as oppose to a "vision board"(this one being the one with origins and uses in witchcraft)?  Do two separate vision boards exist, or do you believe that the difference is so minute it would be to easy to cross that line and is not even worth the risk?  I think that would definitely be helpful to me and probably many other ladies in this thread.



I'm responding since I was quoted, but I don't use them either way.  I think there's some slight of hand going on in claiming there are different types.  If something were not a "vision board" then it wouldn't be called such.  If it's just a poster, it would just be called a poster.  If it were just a prayer list, it would be called that.  So, I have my own skepticism as to whether there are genuinely different kinds of vision boards--some being "innocent"...but hey, as I don't use it I'm not going to say more than that.  

A cousin has been encouraging me to create one, and I think they simply are what they are, so I haven't done it.  I suppose those who have created "something" that is only called a vision board could explain how it is used.


----------



## Nice & Wavy

_[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Geneva]Then the devil  led Jesus to the top of a very high mountain. The devil showed Jesus all  the kingdoms of the world, and all the great things that are in those  kingdoms. The devil said, *"If you will bow down and worship me, I will  give you all these things."* Jesus said to the devil, "Go away from me,  Satan! It is written {in the Scriptures}, 'You must worship the Lord  your God. Serve only him!'"[/FONT]_ [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Geneva](ERV)  ...hmmmm  Key words: give you all these things. 

[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Geneva]What's our breaking point? At what  point would we quit honoring God and begin to choose Satan's path? Not a  very comfortable question, is it? What if we knew someone had power  over the world and would give it to us if we would just acknowledge him  as king? What if we knew we would suffer and be offered as a sacrifice  because we would not acknowledge him as king? 

Jesus is Lord. Not because  he took Satan's phony bargain, but because he refused it. "Away from  me!" Jesus ordered and Satan obeyed -- as the next verse describes. But  the cost of this victory meant a far more gruesome battle. *But Jesus  refused to compromise his devotion to the Father even at the cost of his  own comfort, acceptance, and life. Jesus won these battles over Satan  and repeatedly chose to walk the path of total devotion to God*, at  incredible cost, to redeem us![/FONT]   

(taken from http://www.heartlight.org/wjd/matthew/0128-wjd.html)


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## Shimmie

Nice & Wavy said:


> _[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Geneva]Then the devil  led Jesus to the top of a very high mountain. The devil showed Jesus all  the kingdoms of the world, and all the great things that are in those  kingdoms. The devil said, *"If you will bow down and worship me, I will  give you all these things."* Jesus said to the devil, "Go away from me,  Satan! It is written {in the Scriptures}, 'You must worship the Lord  your God. Serve only him!'"[/FONT]_ [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Geneva](ERV)  ...hmmmm  Key words: give you all these things.
> 
> [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Geneva]What's our breaking point? At what  point would we quit honoring God and begin to choose Satan's path? Not a  very comfortable question, is it? What if we knew someone had power  over the world and would give it to us if we would just acknowledge him  as king? What if we knew we would suffer and be offered as a sacrifice  because we would not acknowledge him as king?
> 
> Jesus is Lord. Not because  he took Satan's phony bargain, but because he refused it. "Away from  me!" Jesus ordered and Satan obeyed -- as the next verse describes. But  the cost of this victory meant a far more gruesome battle. *But Jesus  refused to compromise his devotion to the Father even at the cost of his  own comfort, acceptance, and life. Jesus won these battles over Satan  and repeatedly chose to walk the path of total devotion to God*, at  incredible cost, to redeem us![/FONT]
> 
> (taken from http://www.heartlight.org/wjd/matthew/0128-wjd.html)



The very power of these words.... 

* "Away from  me!" Jesus ordered* ... and Satan obeyed 

satan did everything he could to present the compromises to Jesus as 'innocent', as if he were showing Jesus a better way.... 

Yet... Jesus knew the scheme behind it.   Jesus rebuked the offer and said 'No'. 

Oh the power of these words of Jesus...

 "Away from  me!" Jesus ordered and Satan obeyed ..."

The presence and the power of God has been spoken in these very words of Jesus is all Authority over Heaven and earth.

My Jesus, My Lord... Praise your name forever and ever.


----------



## Nice & Wavy

Shimmie said:


> The very power of these words....
> 
> * "Away from  me!" Jesus ordered* ... and Satan obeyed
> 
> satan did everything he could to present the compromises to Jesus as 'innocent', as if he were showing Jesus a better way....
> 
> Yet... Jesus knew the scheme behind it.   Jesus rebuked the offer and said 'No'.
> 
> Oh the power of these words of Jesus...
> 
> "Away from  me!" Jesus ordered and Satan obeyed ..."
> 
> The presence and the power of God has been spoken in these very words of Jesus is all Authority over Heaven and earth.
> 
> My Jesus, My Lord... Praise your name forever and ever.


Yup....


----------



## loolalooh

Kookookiwi said:


> So can any of you ladies share what you would view as a vision board as oppose to a "vision board"(this one being the one with origins and uses in witchcraft)?  Do two separate vision boards exist, or do you believe that the difference is so minute it would be to easy to cross that line and is not even worth the risk?  I think that would definitely be helpful to me and probably many other ladies in this thread.



Responding in a few ...


----------



## loolalooh

Kookookiwi said:


> So can any of you ladies share what you would view as a vision board as oppose to a "vision board"(this one being the one with origins and uses in witchcraft)?  Do two separate vision boards exist, or do you believe that the difference is so minute it would be to easy to cross that line and is not even worth the risk?  I think that would definitely be helpful to me and probably many other ladies in this thread.



I went back to re-read nicola's post before this.

I interpreted her point as being that people might be misusing the word "vision board".  That some people might not really have a "vision board". Maybe, I interpreted her post wrong.  

There is one (not two) "vision board".


----------



## Shimmie

Kookookiwi said:


> So can any of you ladies share what you would view as a vision board as oppose to a "vision board"(this one being the one with origins and uses in witchcraft)?  Do two separate vision boards exist, or do you believe that the difference is so minute it would be to easy to cross that line and is not even worth the risk?  I think that would definitely be helpful to me and probably many other ladies in this thread.



There's definitely a minute difference meaning there is no separation of the two for they are still one in the same.   Too much compromise exists in the Body of Christ today.   There are shortcuts to prayer and study, as opposed to turning off the world and giving God the time that He is worthy of.  

Why are 'we' taking in more of the world when the world should be taking in more of us?   Is living for God that taxing and time consuming?  Is taking the time to actually read the Bible as opposed to tidbits of scripture here and there, such a task?   Yet there's always time to petition Him when we want or need His intervention.   

Why when God has already given us His tools of success (His Word and Prayer), do we allow satan to come in with tools and resources to steal our hearts away from being completely one with God?    

*The Fine Line is a trap:*   People are spending more time creating and looking upon their vision boards than spending time reading the Word of God and in Prayer.   They now have a new god to consult.   They are gradually being primed to look to a vision board as opposed to consulting God.   It's all seems so innocent yet it is so subtle and it is a gateway to self fulfillment and destruction.    

So often when I hear Christians 'excuse' their board use, by stating that they add scriptures, etc.      It's a bribe... Lord let me have this board and I'll pretend to make it all about you.    Yet it becomes an altar of their desires.  

By taking this directly from the root of witchcraft (the laws of attraction) that is an insult to God our Father in Heaven.   We may as well be saying, that God has not offered us enough, so we're getting our desires, prayers answered elsewhere.    Often this person has already begun to spend less time with God and this board has become the vehicle to spend even less time with Him.  People become self / more and God / less.

There are some things that appear innocent yet it is a trap that we are to be discerning of and to have absolutely nothing to do with.   Why on earth would a Christian incorporate a witch's tool to facilitate a need / desire in their lives, especially when they have all they could ever need and much more in Jesus.  

*Joshua 7*

*Achan’s Sin*

*1 But the Israelites were unfaithful in regard to the devoted things[a]; Achan son of Karmi, the son of Zimri, the son of Zerah, of the tribe of Judah, took some of them. So the LORD’s anger burned against Israel. 

 2 Now Joshua sent men from Jericho to Ai, which is near Beth Aven to the east of Bethel, and told them, “Go up and spy out the region.” So the men went up and spied out Ai. 

 3 When they returned to Joshua, they said, “Not all the army will have to go up against Ai. Send two or three thousand men to take it and do not weary the whole army, for only a few people live there.” 4 So about three thousand went up; but they were routed by the men of Ai, 5 who killed about thirty-six of them. They chased the Israelites from the city gate as far as the stone quarries and struck them down on the slopes. At this the hearts of the people melted in fear and became like water. 

 6 Then Joshua tore his clothes and fell facedown to the ground before the ark of the LORD, remaining there till evening. The elders of Israel did the same, and sprinkled dust on their heads. 7 And Joshua said, “Alas, Sovereign LORD, why did you ever bring this people across the Jordan to deliver us into the hands of the Amorites to destroy us? If only we had been content to stay on the other side of the Jordan! 8 Pardon your servant, Lord. What can I say, now that Israel has been routed by its enemies? 9 The Canaanites and the other people of the country will hear about this and they will surround us and wipe out our name from the earth. What then will you do for your own great name?” 

10 The LORD said to Joshua, “Stand up! What are you doing down on your face? 11 Israel has sinned; they have violated my covenant, which I commanded them to keep. They have taken some of the devoted things; they have stolen, they have lied, they have put them with their own possessions. 12 That is why the Israelites cannot stand against their enemies; they turn their backs and run because they have been made liable to destruction. I will not be with you anymore unless you destroy whatever among you is devoted to destruction. 

 13 “Go, consecrate the people. Tell them, ‘Consecrate yourselves in preparation for tomorrow; for this is what the LORD, the God of Israel, says: 

There are devoted things among you, Israel. You cannot stand against your enemies until you remove them. 

 14 “‘In the morning, present yourselves tribe by tribe. The tribe the LORD chooses shall come forward clan by clan; the clan the LORD chooses shall come forward family by family; and the family the LORD chooses shall come forward man by man. 15 Whoever is caught with the devoted things shall be destroyed by fire, along with all that belongs to him. He has violated the covenant of the LORD and has done an outrageous thing in Israel!’” 

 16 Early the next morning Joshua had Israel come forward by tribes, and Judah was chosen. 17 The clans of Judah came forward, and the Zerahites were chosen. He had the clan of the Zerahites come forward by families, and Zimri was chosen. 18 Joshua had his family come forward man by man, and Achan son of Karmi, the son of Zimri, the son of Zerah, of the tribe of Judah, was chosen. 

19 Then Joshua said to Achan, “My son, give glory to the LORD, the God of Israel, and honor him. Tell me what you have done; do not hide it from me.” 

 20 Achan replied, “It is true! I have sinned against the LORD, the God of Israel. This is what I have done: 21 When I saw in the plunder a beautiful robe from Babylonia,[c] two hundred shekels[d] of silver and a bar of gold weighing fifty shekels,[e] I coveted them and took them. They are hidden in the ground inside my tent, with the silver underneath.” 

 22 So Joshua sent messengers, and they ran to the tent, and there it was, hidden in his tent, with the silver underneath. 23 They took the things from the tent, brought them to Joshua and all the Israelites and spread them out before the LORD. 

 24 Then Joshua, together with all Israel, took Achan son of Zerah, the silver, the robe, the gold bar, his sons and daughters, his cattle, donkeys and sheep, his tent and all that he had, to the Valley of Achor. 25 Joshua said, “Why have you brought this trouble on us? The LORD will bring trouble on you today.” 

   Then all Israel stoned him, and after they had stoned the rest, they burned them. 26 Over Achan they heaped up a large pile of rocks, which remains to this day. Then the LORD turned from his fierce anger. Therefore that place has been called the Valley of Achor[f] ever since. 

-------------------------------------------*


----------



## disgtgyal

loolalooh said:
			
		

> I went back to re-read nicola's post before this.
> 
> I interpreted her point as being that people might be misusing the word "vision board".  That some people might not really have a "vision board". Maybe, I interpreted her post wrong.
> 
> There is one (not two) "vision board".



I interpreted her post as there are two purposes or two ways a vision board is used and she may correct me if I'm wrong.  I am very cognizant of what I do, where I go, what I watch, and what I hear and I'm very aware of how subtle the enemy is.  There are some things that in an of itself aren't but can lead to sin. My weakness isn't your weakness and vice versa, and I think that's something believers need to remember when they are giving advice... My vision board consists of promises God has spoken specifically to me, as well as verses that not only lines up with it but verses I like, and those I need to meditate on, that's my vision board and I can only speak for myself when it comes to its purpose. My vision board doesn't make me believe because I have already accepted what God has said to me, and personally when I look at it and read the verses I'm reminded of his grace and mercy because God knows I don't deserve all that he has done and will do for me, but he looks past my faults, so I'm not going to let anyone try to convict, condemn, or judge me. God may not want a particular person to create a vision board because it will become their idol, they make think they can acquire it on their own, or find other means of acquiring whatever was promised, and more than not its those type of ppl who God doesn't give a prophetic word about their future. At this point Jenny, I'm going agree to disagree, I know it's purpose for me. To shimmie, I don't and haven't taken joy or peace in any one's comment here, God has given me both with my vision board, I wasn't nor do I need validation.


----------



## disgtgyal

Shimmie said:
			
		

> Don't get too happy with this comment.  God isn't giving you permission nor is He validating you to be at peace with having a vision ouija board for 'other' purposes....
> 
> This is not a game.
> 
> The devil is slick and as I said earlier, he knows exactly what he's doing in order to gain access to one's life.  he is out to steal, kill and to destroy.   The very fact that it's a tool of witchcraft makes it an accursed thing.   The intent of its use is not pure.  There is absolutely no intention nor is there an ability for any Christian to use this as progress towards their walk or devotion to God.   It's a ''back-up" plan, put into place for the 'just in case', what one desires doesn't come on their terms.
> 
> No, No... Uh-uh...     I see right through it.
> 
> satan's intent is to seep into Christian lives with his lies of innocense, where he can gain access to their faith and hinder their relationship with God.
> 
> I Peter 5:6-8
> 
> Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:
> 
> Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you.
> 
> Be sober, be VIGILANT; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:



So you're telling me God hasn't given me peace about my vision board, so you're in me now you know my heart do you not see a problem with what you said, who are you to say whats in my heart omg I'm done with you lmbo gimmie a break and I never mentioned a ouiji board like wth, where did that come from an ouiji board is used to contact the dead and other spirits which both of which are explicitly forbidden, so no hun not the same, so just stop


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## disgtgyal

Shimmie said:
			
		

> The truth is coming out all in this thread.   You have a 'history' with witchcraft which 'clues' why you are in denial.
> 
> And you are right, God would not allow you to create a gateway, however it doesn't stop you from doing what you will to do.
> 
> When a person is no longer under any remnants of witchcraft, they absolutely refuse to have any type of any association with anything that has any association of the occult.
> 
> I am not saying that you are practicing witchcraft, at least not knowingly, however, unless you have been completely delivered from its affects, you will not support anything that has a link to it.
> 
> You don't need a vision board anywhere near you....   It's a setup.  satan knows how to get to you, since he's been there before.   he knows how to set you up.   It's up to you to give him no place... in any space or area of your life. he is still seeking to devour you.
> 
> So far there are three (3) posters in this thread who support vision boards and yet there are 'links' in their lives where the enemy has been prevalent.   This is not a game.    The use of vision boards in this forum are NOT INNOCENT.
> 
> I'm not trying to hurt anyone here, not even embarrass them.  No...   I apologize right here and now to everyone to whom I have offended.
> 
> The answers to the OP's question about vision boards being demonic is being answered, in a full fledged 'yes', they are demonic.
> 
> Mark 4:22
> 
> For there is nothing hid, which shall not be manifested; neither was any thing kept secret, but that it should come abroad.



My history of witchcraft hun is that someone out of jealousy of my mom send demonic attacks on me, her first born and it was why I had alot of hinderances in my life so before you continue with your judgmental comments you should have asked before you assumed. What is coming out in this thread is your character, my convo with you is done.


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## aribell

I want to be clear that my purpose in participating in the thread is mainly for the sake of those who come across it later or who search for answers on this topic.  I'm not personally concerned about the individual choices people make, though as fellow believers we should continuously encourage and admonish one another.  I'm actually glad this topic is going as it is, as I think what has been shared needed to be said for the sake of greater understanding in the Body of Christ.

Regarding two types of vision boards, no I don't think there are two types.  It seems that some people *may* be doing something and calling it a vision board when it is not.  But as I said, I'm skeptical of that because if it were not a vision board, you wouldn't call it that.  (general "you")  It would just be called journaling or Scripture memory or a poster.  And if you weren't doing "vision board" activities, you wouldn't have to defend anything.  If what you have is not a vision board, then stop calling it that.  I'm sorry for being that direct, but mislabeling things is confusing the conversation.  

I just have a couple of things in response to some comments.

--It was mentioned that vision boards are just a part of "calling those things which are not as though they are."  The issue with this is that we as individual believers do not call things into existence.  That is a misquote of Romans 4:17, which says that Abraham believed in "_God_, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were."  Abraham, our forerunner in the faith, our example believed in _God_ who has the power to call things into existence.  Abraham did not have that power, nor do we.  The only thing we do is believe God's word.  Again, when we pray, we pray God's will back to Him.  When we believe, we--like Abraham--believe what He has promised us.  Everything originates with Him, never with us.  I think this verse is often misquoted and misapplied because my sister mentioned it to me tonight as well, and we had to hash it out.  It makes a big difference when one thinks they have the power to call things which are not as though they were, and when a person believes on a _God_ who calls things which are not as though they were. 

--God allows people to be deceived.  God allows Christians to sin.  God allows people to fall into temptation.  It doesn't matter what anyone's personal history is.  God allowed His most chosen servants to sin in grievous ways.  If He didn't stop David from murdering an innocent man, or Peter from denying Him, why would He stop someone from creating a vision board?  No one is exempt from possibly falling prey to the world's temptations.  God does not make our decisions for us.  He doesn't will for us.  If a person chooses to go down a path that is unwise, the Lord may warn, but He generally doesn't stop them.  If I think that somehow I don't have to critically examine my own beliefs because God would stop me if I were wrong, more likely than not, I'm going to be deceived--precisely because I mistakenly think that I can't be.


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## Babysaffy

I found this thread yesterday and I'm so glad. I have picked up on various members throughout the forum mentioning vision boards and started to think it was a cool idea.

SO and I are working hard to reach our financial goals and facing some big challenges on the way.

This is the text I sent him on Friday, word for word 

" I'm going to create an aspirational visual folder of what I want for the house and lifestyle and will be damned if dont get it!!"

He didn't reply and hasn't mentioned it since. I haven't fully researched the whole vision board thing, I was thinking more of a scrapbook with cutouts of things I want to buy for the house and pictures of the car and holidays I'd like us to take, something on the lines of a wedding scrapbook that some women start compiling even in their teens with dress ideas, colour schemes and scraps of material.

However, when I look at that text now I realise I wasn't thinking in a Christian manner at all and in my childish frustration was speaking in a materialistic, selfish frenzy which is so unlike me. I was seeming to lean on my own understanding and talking like I alone have the power to get these blessings...very wrong.

I have always believed in writing check lists of what I would like to achieve in any given year but I'm now agreeing with some posters here that adding pictures of material objects and focusing on them can easily cross the spiritual lines into worshiping false idols. That is a sin I don't want any part of and I repent even half thinking I could call objects to myself through my own will!

I have fasted in prayer in the past with written reasons for the fast which I incorporated into my prayers. I achieved miraculous results where God in his sweet time gave me all that I had prayed for. I know I should not stray from this and glad I came across this thread. 

Sorry if I'm going OT I have also attended certain churches where the emphasis is on claiming and calling financial riches and some of the things that came out of the pastors mouths made me so mad I wanted to get up and leave or at the least give a super side eye! Such as 'if you don't gift £150 now you will lose your blessing- God is telling me 10 people are coming up to give £150' and 'close your eyes and put your hand out, God is putting money in your hand, say I believe it I receeeeeive it!' 
I'm all for tithing and offerings but some of this extra stuff can cause confusion leading to vulnerable churchgoers getting things twisted and going down the wrong spiritual path..

Anyway again this type of thread is so useful and proves once more that LHCF is not just a hair board- one can learn so much here!


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## Nice & Wavy

I wasn't going to post this because I did not want to infect this Christianity Forum with garbage. However, the Lord spoke to me about it, so before I go to church, some people need to see how these vision boards relate to witchcraft directly:



> *I have decided to take the quote that was here out.  No need to keep it here all day.  If interested in what it said, pm me.  Thanks.*



I am in the ministry of the Lord.  I am here to help people whichever way  that I can.  I will not just give you information and not care about  you, that would be out of character for me.  But, I will say this: "stop  playing with the enemy...get out of his playground, for he is not for  you but against you!

Have a good day, ladies!

N&W


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## Nice & Wavy

Babysaffy said:


> I found this thread yesterday and I'm so glad. I have picked up on various members throughout the forum mentioning vision boards and started to think it was a cool idea.
> 
> SO and I are working hard to reach our financial goals and facing some big challenges on the way.
> 
> This is the text I sent him on Friday, word for word
> 
> " I'm going to create an aspirational visual folder of what I want for the house and lifestyle and will be damned if dont get it!!"
> 
> He didn't reply and hasn't mentioned it since. I haven't fully researched the whole vision board thing, I was thinking more of a scrapbook with cutouts of things I want to buy for the house and pictures of the car and holidays I'd like us to take, something on the lines of a wedding scrapbook that some women start compiling even in their teens with dress ideas, colour schemes and scraps of material.
> 
> However, when I look at that text now I realise I wasn't thinking in a Christian manner at all and in my childish frustration was speaking in a materialistic, selfish frenzy which is so unlike me. I was seeming to lean on my own understanding and talking like I alone have the power to get these blessings...very wrong.
> 
> I have always believed in writing check lists of what I would like to achieve in any given year but I'm now agreeing with some posters here that adding pictures of material objects and focusing on them can easily cross the spiritual lines into worshiping false idols. That is a sin I don't want any part of and I repent even half thinking I could call objects to myself through my own will!
> 
> I have fasted in prayer in the past with written reasons for the fast which I incorporated into my prayers. I achieved miraculous results where God in his sweet time gave me all that I had prayed for. I know I should not stray from this and glad I came across this thread.
> 
> Sorry if I'm going OT I have also attended certain churches where the emphasis is on claiming and calling financial riches and some of the things that came out of the pastors mouths made me so mad I wanted to get up and leave or at the least give a super side eye! Such as 'if you don't gift £150 now you will lose your blessing- God is telling me 10 people are coming up to give £150' and 'close your eyes and put your hand out, God is putting money in your hand, say I believe it I receeeeeive it!'
> I'm all for tithing and offerings but some of this extra stuff can cause confusion leading to vulnerable churchgoers getting things twisted and going down the wrong spiritual path..
> 
> Anyway again this type of thread is so useful and proves once more that LHCF is not just a hair board- one can learn so much here!


Thank you for your post and welcome to the CF!!!


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## Babysaffy

Thanks, Nice and Wavy. I lurk in the Christian forums but had to post this time as I was just so close to taking disastrous actions had I not come across this thread. I feel blessed.

I may be a sinner but I don't want to knowingly drag myself towards possibly Satanic practices!


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## loolalooh

disgtgyal said:


> I interpreted her post as there are two purposes or two ways a vision board is used and she may correct me if I'm wrong.  I am very cognizant of what I do, where I go, what I watch, and what I hear and I'm very aware of how subtle the enemy is.  There are some things that in an of itself aren't but can lead to sin. My weakness isn't your weakness and vice versa, and I think that's something believers need to remember when they are giving advice... *My vision board consists of promises God has spoken specifically to me, as well as verses that not only lines up with it but verses I like, and those I need to meditate on, that's my vision board* and I can only speak for myself when it comes to its purpose. *My vision board doesn't make me believe because I have already accepted what God has said to me, and personally when I look at it and read the verses I'm reminded of his grace and mercy* because God knows I don't deserve all that he has done and will do for me, but he looks past my faults, so I'm not going to let anyone try to convict, condemn, or judge me. God may not want a particular person to create a vision board because it will become their idol, they make think they can acquire it on their own, or find other means of acquiring whatever was promised, and more than not its those type of ppl who God doesn't give a prophetic word about their future. At this point Jenny, I'm going agree to disagree, I know it's purpose for me. To shimmie, I don't and haven't taken joy or peace in any one's comment here, God has given me both with my vision board, I wasn't nor do I need validation.



It's interesting, because around the time Nicola mentioned Abraham, I thought about him too.  God had given him promises but Abraham just kept them in his heart/mind until the promises came to pass. 

To the bolded: This is a genuine question, as I would like to hear your answer.

What is the "why" behind you creating a vision board?  You don't have to answer if you don't feel like it, though I'd genuinely like to know.


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## Shimmie

disgtgyal said:


> I interpreted her post as there are two purposes or two ways a vision board is used and she may correct me if I'm wrong.  I am very cognizant of what I do, where I go, what I watch, and what I hear and I'm very aware of how subtle the enemy is.  There are some things that in an of itself aren't but can lead to sin.
> 
> My weakness isn't your weakness and vice versa, and I think that's something believers need to remember when they are giving advice...
> 
> * My vision board * consists of promises God has spoken specifically to me, as well as verses that not only lines up with it but verses I like, and those I need to meditate on, that's my vision board and I can only speak for myself when it comes to its purpose.
> *My vision board* doesn't make me believe because I have already accepted what God has said to me, and personally when I look at it and read the verses I'm reminded of his grace and mercy because God knows I don't deserve all that he has done and will do for me, but he looks past my faults, so I'm not going to let anyone try to convict, condemn, or judge me.
> 
> *God may not want a particular person to create a vision board because it will become their idol,*
> 
> they make think they can acquire it on their own, or find other means of acquiring whatever was promised, and more than not its those type of ppl who God doesn't give a prophetic word about their future. At this point Jenny, I'm going agree to disagree, I know it's purpose for me.
> 
> To shimmie, I don't and haven't taken joy or peace in any one's comment here, God has given me both with *my vision board*, I wasn't nor do I need validation.





disgtgyal said:


> So you're telling me God hasn't given me peace about *my vision board*, so you're in me now you know my heart do you not see a problem with what you said, who are you to say whats in my heart omg I'm done with you lmbo gimmie a break and I never mentioned a ouiji board like wth, where did that come from an ouiji board is used to contact the dead and other spirits which both of which are explicitly forbidden, so no hun not the same, so just stop





disgtgyal said:


> My history of witchcraft hun is that someone out of jealousy of my mom send demonic attacks on me, her first born and it was why I had alot of hinderances in my life so before you continue with your judgmental comments you should have asked before you assumed. What is coming out in this thread is your character, my convo with you is done.



Okay....   Okay.

I'm sorry about the incident that happen to your mom.   This kind of thing occurs alot when there's an issue concerning a fight over a man.   

All the more reason to avoid anything / tool that is associated with/used by witches, no matter what one uses it for.   

*I apologize for appearing to make a judgement upon your personal character as well as your walk with the Lord.   I do mean this.     * 

This 'adoption' of the use of vision boards simply does not sit well with Christianity.    Christians have looked upon an occult practice and became attracted to it as a means to enhance their lives.   Since when do we go to a witch's harbour and buy into their goods?  Their ways of 'living'?    

The dangerous clue of deception is when Christians fight so hard to defend it?  They are defending a practice and a tool that has nothing to do with the Bible, defending a tool / practice which is of the occult.   

This where the problem becomes dangerous.  

Why does a Christian need something from a witch's artillery to help them?


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## DDTexlaxed

The Bible condemns things like that. Please don't get in league with the demons. In the Old and New Testament, those who practiced those things were to be killed or put outside the Christian congregation. (Deut.18:10-14;Gal.5:19-21;Rev.21:8)  Just a few of many Scriptures.


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