# I am confused about Christians and their voting habits



## SummerSolstice (May 10, 2012)

So now a bunch of women I'm friends with online are saying they will vote for Romney because of what Obama said yesterday 

Whats up with our community failing to research before they vote??? 
Don't they understand that there are traps set for Christians along the political trail?

With that said...
Did you decide who you were voting for already? 
Have any of the voters in CF read the budget proposals on either side? 
*
2012 Republican Budget Proposal
2013 Democrat Budget Proposal*


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## smwrigh3 (May 10, 2012)

I am Christian liberal. What Obama said yesterday didnt change my vote one bit. 

However I know some people (I will not call them friends) who changed their vote but also refuse to vote for a Mormon so they are voting independent or stayinig home. 

I don't think God participates in politics or sports. The Republicians don't believe in God's charity but in his morals. Democrats not so much morals but his charity. Yesterday I was called a "lukewarm" Chrisitan because of my beliefs and that's fine. I simply said "If you think Im wrong pray for me... Bcuz I'm surely praying for you." 

I urge everyone I know to watch Jefferson Bethke's "Why I Hate Religion" video on youtube. He is a Chrisitan poet.

Eta: There are people on this board who probably don't agree with me. I have stated once before I am not trying to change anyone's mind. I just ask my opinion to be respected.


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## loolalooh (May 10, 2012)

I'm definitely not voting for Romney.  I'm on the fence about Obama.

The topic of voting has become a difficult one for me, particularly for this election year.  Why?  Because it's like choosing between two meh candidates, neither of which is the ideal candidate.  So let me vote for the one who will do less harm to the country.  I'm not really a politics person because there is so much "acting" involved.


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## TracyNicole (May 10, 2012)

I know who I am voting for and the recent announcement doesn't change my mind. IRL I live for God but I can't stomach religion. IMO it's an excuse for people to think they are better than others and to try control and moralize others. That's not what my God is about. I don't know what God some of these people serve. Their words and deeds show that they may have read the good book but failed to understand the most fundamental messages God had for his people. 
In the political arena I weigh the main issues of the times and vote for the public servant I believe capable of delivering in the best interest of the nation. That's all. I don't care about gender, color, political party...just the facts man. I can't vote for someone because their words are in line with my religious beliefs if their actions will have disastrous effects on millions. That's not standing on Christian principles, I think they call that insanity - to sacrifice people's welfare for what amounts to pure vanity, delusions of grandeur and just plain 'ole foolishness!


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## Laela (May 10, 2012)

Romney will oppress the poor..I'm not voting for him..


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## SummerSolstice (May 10, 2012)

Laela said:


> Romney will oppress the poor..I'm not voting for him..



GIRL! thank you!!!!!

I'm sorry but I don't want someone who has no idea nor needs to know that organic eggs cost $5 at the grocery store leading millions of people who can't afford it...


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## LovelyNaps26 (May 10, 2012)

most of the folks i know will either vote for obama or not vote at all. i will be voting in november but i might write in. i'm in obama country so he'll get my states electoral votes anyways. last time black folks showed out in record number to support obama. he may have some folks 'in the bag' but i'm not one of them. his announcement certainly didn't help my indecision.


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## aribell (May 10, 2012)

Here's the thing I think _lots_ of people don't get about Christians and politics.

Political policies are about pragmatic solutions to practical problems.  People get in heated discussions about them, but they usually are not about morality.

When a political issue *does* implicate morality, those who care have to make a choice as to whether they will support someone who stands for something they believe to be morally wrong, or not.  

Flat tax v. progressive tax:  non-moral question of policy.
Privatized social security:  non-moral question of policy.
School choice/vouchers versus the educational system as is:  non-moral question of policy.

When I say "non-moral" I mean that people can disagree about the best way to approach these issues without violating their consciences.  Someone might disagree with a candidate on some non-moral issues, but still vote for them because in the grand scheme of things, they think that candidate will be better than the alternative.

The issue arises when a candidate will work for something that does violate someone's conscience, that a person believes is immoral.  Moral political questions and non-moral political questions are totally different things and many will not trade the moral questions for the non-moral ones.

I happen to believe that the House GOP budget is immoral in the extent to which it caters to the wealthy and neglects the "least of these", like the Conference of Catholic Bishops said in their statement.  For that reason I cannot support a candidate who would back such a measure.  However, I don't necessarily buy that the morality of economic issues are more important than the morality of social issues (like marriage, religious freedom, etc.).  They *both* have a significant impact on our society in the long run.

Also, I think that Christians have to realize that while we definitely have a duty to make good choices for the coming generations, this world is passing away.  I have spent years of education devoted to political issues and at work monitor this stuff all day long...so I really get the significance.  At the same time, I am much more concerned about what I will have to say to the Lord when I meet Him and with remaining unspotted from the world, as James tells us to be.


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## SummerSolstice (May 10, 2012)

> I happen to believe that the House GOP budget is immoral in the extent to which it caters to the wealthy and neglects the "least of these", like the Conference of Catholic Bishops said in their statement. For that reason I cannot support a candidate who would back such a measure. However, I don't necessarily buy that the morality of economic issues are more important than the morality of social issues (like marriage, religious freedom, etc.). They *both* have a significant impact on our society in the long run.



nicola.kirwan

This was key to me 
I think that the party is also immoral for using morals to get votes... but anywho...

u said u watch this stuff all day, could you school us on what you've noticed as far as negative impacts on culture due to litigation on gay marriage, abortion and other hot button issues?

I feel like I'm the only person thats watching politics and food... thats where most of my political reading goes, so I would really like to hear from you about


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## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

For those who say they are not voting for Romney and unsure if they will vote at all this time around....remember a no vote IS a vote for Romney.....so........would you rather spend the next 4 years under a Romney Presidency or under an Obama Presidency........never will we ever agree with everything a politician says or believes but we must be real and think which person will have MY best interests - would you be better off next year or the next under Romney and the Repubs or Obama????

If we were still slaves who would you feel comfortable would free us - Romney? or Obama?


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## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> So now a bunch of women I'm friends with online are saying they will vote for Romney because of what Obama said yesterday
> 
> Whats up with our community failing to research before they vote???
> Don't they understand that there are traps set for Christians along the political trail?
> ...



Blame Obama for being 'stupid'...  Did he not think before he allowed his puppet strings to be yanked.    A dog collar is more like it... a choke chain.  

There will be a price to pay and he will pay it... dearly.   He has only himself to blame and no one else.


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## NewDayNewMe (May 10, 2012)

I will definetly be voting for Obama. What religions the candidates _claim_ to adhere to does not influence my vote. They are all politicians which means they are all liars. These republicans are always on their high horse and claim to be so Christian but want the poor, even children die and suffer from lack of healthcare. The only God most of them serve is money. I don’t agree with everything the dems do as I am pro-life. But the quality of my life and society as a whole was best under Clinton, worse under Bush and will 1,000% be better under Obama vs. Romney.  I know so many people who voted for Bush because he was a so called Christian and against gay marriage. I haven’t ever seen anything Christ like about him.


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## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

Laela said:


> Romney will oppress the poor..I'm not voting for him..



Behave....    Now you done got me started and in the wrong thread at that... Oh well...   here I begin...  

I have to be honest.  I've never suffered financially under any of the presidents.  

Why?  

Because God is my source and my Provider.  He has always gone around any legalistic rule and has provided for me and my family.   My son has his own business and never missed a dime, since he's been on his own... long before Obama.    My daughter who is a Stay at home Mom with a husband and 4 children (my babies) ... My God, everything she touches turns to gold on one solid pay check.  

We have a Godly principle and it never fails us.   God is our Provider... we have chosen to live righteously and God honours that.     It doesn't matter what the government says/does God provides.  

How many of us, as Christians here, STILL made it in spite of the economy?   Are we still here and making it. 

My family and I live by this principle "As for me and my House'.     

I choose to honour God and He will Never Fail anyone who does.   Never. 

One thing has surely come to the surface.   Obama is self-serving and he has used this gay issue for his self/ not anyone else.  

He'll do this very same thing with other issues that come up.  Issues and decisions to benefit himself and not others.    

It's fearful to depend upon 'man' to fulfill God's plan for one's life.   We'll get fooled and disappointed every single time.   

I will not insult the love and the grace of God nor my faith by voting for a man who has literally pooped in God's face, let alone the order of the human race.  It's all about the poop... that's what Obama wants, he's gonna get it.

gays are not going to let him slide by with just this.  They are going to turn completely against him.  He's still 'Black' and there's still lack in what he needs to succeed.    The very thing he will say to himself,  "What a dumb decision I made, drinking the wrong koolaide.     gays are going to 'bury him'.   He's still hated and Black and that's going to be his biggest attack.   gays will not save him...they still have oughts against him and it won't be pretty.


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## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

NewDayNewMe said:


> I will definetly be voting for Obama. What religions the candidates _claim_ to adhere to does not influence my vote. They are all politicians which means they are all liars. These republicans are always on their high horse and claim to be so Christian but want the poor, even children die and suffer from lack of healthcare. The only God most of them serve is money. I don’t agree with everything the dems do as I am pro-life. But the quality of my life and society as a whole was best under Clinton, worse under Bush and will 1,000% be better under Obama vs. Romney.  I know so many people who voted for Bush because he was a so called Christian and against gay marriage. I haven’t ever seen anything Christ like about him.



So your faith is more in man than in God?   It shouldn't matter who's president, the Just shall live by Faith.   God provides even when man does not.   

As a Christian, Obama is not your Provider.  What happens when he fails to deliver, then what?


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## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> For those who say they are not voting for Romney and unsure if they will vote at all this time around....remember a no vote IS a vote for Romney.....so........would you rather spend the next 4 years under a Romney Presidency or under an Obama Presidency........never will we ever agree with everything a politician says or believes but we must be real and think which person will have MY best interests - would you be better off next year or the next under Romney and the Repubs or Obama????
> 
> *If we were still slaves who would you feel comfortable would free us - Romney? or Obama?*



Neither one...


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## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> Here's the thing I think _lots_ of people don't get about Christians and politics.
> 
> Political policies are about pragmatic solutions to practical problems.  People get in heated discussions about them, but they usually are not about morality.
> 
> ...


 
Such a good Word (the bolded).   I'm not selling out to earn an extra dime.  

Everything that I've ever asked God for, I've gotten.  He has never withheld any good thing from me.   I refused to 'sell out' for 30 pieces of fake silver.


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## NewDayNewMe (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> So your faith is more in man than in God? It shouldn't matter who's president, the Just shall live by Faith. God provides even when man does not.
> 
> As a Christian, Obama is not your Provider. What happens when he fails to deliver, then what?


 
As I said I don't but my faith in any of these politicians they are all liars and will say and do anything to get a vote. It is always a decision of what is the lesser of two evils. I have to ask myself does a man who believes that everyone should have the same rights under the law regardless of the sexual orientation worst than a man who believes that children whose parents cannot afford healthcare should die or receive substandard healthcare? God is my provider and he provided my with the funds to go to college through financial aid, the same aid that Obama wants to increase and that Romney wants to cut.


*Matthew 22:36-39*
*Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”*

*Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments"*


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## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

You know what I can't stand about some Christians (trust I am a believer) is that they feel they believe and put all faith and trust in God and then they sit back and wait for things to happen......I don't believe it works that way....God gave us the brains, mindset, education, etc to go out and use what HE gave us.......So my brain, mindset and education tells me that although I may not agree with some of what Romney says and some of what Obama says but my God given intelligence tells me I will be much better off with Obama in the White House as opposed to Romney.

It's like being unemployed and saying "I have faith and trust that God will make a way and I will get a job" and then sitting at home all day doing nothing on your part to obtain that job.


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## nathansgirl1908 (May 10, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> GIRL! thank you!!!!!
> 
> I'm sorry but I don't want someone who has no idea nor needs to know that organic eggs cost $5 at the grocery store leading millions of people who can't afford it...


 What is this thing people have with demanding whether politicians know the price of some random item at the grocery store? 
 I can't honestly say I could quote the exact price of milk even though I buy it whenever I go to the store.  What exactly is this supposed to prove or measure?  No snark intended I just don't get it.


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## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> What is this thing people have with demanding whether politicians know the price of some random item at the grocery store?
> I can't honestly say I could quote the exact price of milk even though I buy it whenever I go to the store.  What exactly is this supposed to prove or measure?  No snark intended I just don't get it.



In Romneys case it shows he is out of touch with the middle class, poor and everyday Jack and Jill - Heck he told a bunch of college students, who more than likely were attending on student loans, to ask their parents for $20k and take a risk and start a business.......he even tried to bet someone $10k on an issue regular people don't have $10k to place an everyday bet with.

So he is not one that I believe would understand my issues with needing affordable healthcare and with no pre existing conditions loophole or needing a job that pays a LIVING wage, or understanding how much housing costs - he and Ann "struggled" in college with no job by living off of Romneys stock investment erplexed   - Michelle and Barack paid of their college loans within the last 7 or so years.


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## nathansgirl1908 (May 10, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Heck he told a bunch of college students, who more than likely were attending on student loans, to ask their parents for $20k and take a risk and start a business.......he even tried to bet someone $10k on an issue regular people don't have $10k to place an everyday bet with.


 
 THIS is indicative of being out of touch.  Not knowing the price of milk is not.


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## SummerSolstice (May 10, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> What is this thing people have with demanding whether politicians know the price of some random item at the grocery store?
> I can't honestly say I could quote the exact price of milk even though I buy it whenever I go to the store.  What exactly is this supposed to prove or measure?  No snark intended I just don't get it.



nathansgirl1908 its cool boo...

my point was people who don't know how expensive stuff is or who aren't being effected by the economy are out of touch with reality.


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## SummerSolstice (May 10, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> In Romneys case it shows he is out of touch with the middle class, poor and everyday Jack and Jill - Heck he told a bunch of college students, who more than likely were attending on student loans,* to ask their parents for $20k and take a risk and start a business.......he even tried to bet someone $10k on an issue regular people don't have $10k to place an everyday bet with.*
> 
> So he is not one that I believe would understand my issues with needing affordable healthcare and with no pre existing conditions loophole or needing a job that pays a LIVING wage, or understanding how much housing costs - he and Ann "struggled" in college with no job by living off of Romneys stock investment erplexed   - Michelle and Barack paid of their college loans within the last 7 or so years.



What a jerk. My parents don't just have 20k laying around to give me. That was a horrible thing to say. And it shows that he has no clue about what the average American family is dealing with.


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## LoveisYou (May 10, 2012)

I'm not sold on either candidate to be honest


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## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

NewDayNewMe said:


> As I said I don't but my faith in any of these politicians they are all liars and will say and do anything to get a vote. It is always a decision of what is the lesser of two evils. I have to ask myself does a man who believes that everyone should have the same rights under the law regardless of the sexual orientation worst than a man who believes that children whose parents cannot afford healthcare should die or receive substandard healthcare? God is my provider and he provided my with the funds to go to college through financial aid, the same aid that Obama wants to increase and that Romney wants to cut.
> 
> 
> *Matthew 22:36-39*
> ...



I hope you're not applying this scripture to Obama... this is not what his intentions were nor is it anywhere in his heart.   

This man changes his spots and stripes to what benefits him and no one else.   He says just enough to get 'Christians' to believe him; there's very little he has to say to get most Blacks to support him, for it's the color of his skin that drew us to him in the first place.   And out of all of the people who love him 'most', we're the ones for whom he has done the least for.  The very least.   

gay is in and Blacks are out.  The new 'affirmative action' will be for gays  and Blacks will be pushed even further down the pipes.   No other group of people are being hailed and rallied for than gays.  Black was already a faded gray but now even more erased and invisible...and pushed behind yet another group of people ... gays.   And Black gays *will not *benefit equal to white gays.   Noooooppppe   

Oh Really?   Yes... indeed Really!   Look at the media, who do you see most represented and for whom (which group of people) does one receive the most flack from?  gays!  Say something negative about a gay person, lawsuits and angry mobs come out the wood work like mad roaches and rats in a New York alley.  

I've yet to see a president give so much favour and attention to any one set of people than Obama has to gays.  If his wife and children weren't Black, I'd dare say the man didn't like Black folks at all.   

Here's a fact and watch for it to happen.  Watch for it.  You won't have long to wait...just watch for it.   

Before the end of this election, gays are going to pull at him for more and what he doesn't deliver they are going to drag him through the mud.  

Obama is STILL Black and highly disliked for being a Black man in the White House.   An attack is surely coming against him and gays will not support him.    But Black folks will.   Oh indeed, cause that's how Black people are, no matter how wronged they are by someone they love, they will still come to the rescue of their own.   Right now, knowing full well how wrong Obama has been, there are millions of Blacks who still love and support him, no matter what.  

He used us... Oh yes he did.  He used us.  We prayed for this man, protected this man, supported this man and he used us.   Of all of the candidates, why could he not be different and not be like the rest?   Why did he have to be a liar and a trickster?   Why could he not just stand upon integrity and not compromise the true character of a man and not be a politician?    He used us and he lied.   And for this alone, I have lost all respect for him.   

I could care less about Mitt Romney and whoever any of them are.   

But this one.... Obama, I expected more from him in character and in intergrity.  He's a snake, no different than any of the rest and for this he's lost me.   It's a game to him and I refused to be played.  Why did he have to lie?  Why did he have to cheat?   Why did he use the very people who loved him, not just the most, but the very people who loved him period?    We didn't have enough to get him where he wanted to be, that's why.

The gay agenda has MONEY... Hundreds and Hundreds of Millions and this will cause a man who wants power to fail each and every time.    Obama isn't about gay equality.   They were never not equal.   There were always laws to give them hospital visits and care for their children.   

Don't be fooled ...  It's time to turn away from the deceptions of man which includes Obama and focus upon God and no one else.   

Obama will not be able to save anyone.  His heart is not with us... it is on himself.


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## cutiebe2 (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I've yet to see a president give so much favour and attention to any one set of people than Obama has to gays.  If his wife and children weren't Black, I'd dare say the man didn't like Black folks at all.



I read/ lurk and try not to say much but that is going to far. Why do you have to stoop low like that? Obama doesn't like black people? 

On twitter someone asked why Obama seems to like "everyone else but blacks" and won't support their issues. The answer is that we are too confused ourselves to give politicians something to fight on. Gays gave Obama Gay Marriage: Do you believe in it YES OR NO. Immigrants (mostly Latino) gave Obama the Dream Act YES OR NO. 
We just tell obama "make our lives great!" thats no politics. Lets give him a bill to work with. Something centered around prison or education, something clear.

smh lets try to not sling mud..


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## dicapr (May 10, 2012)

I will not be voting for Romeny-I can't as a black or as a woman.  While I'm not in love with Obama I never hailed him as the second coming as so many people did so my disappointment isn't as great.  For me the gay issue isn't about right and wrong it is about freedom of religion.  Should someone, who doesn't believe the same way I do, be allowed to have the rights that I have in this country?  My answer is yes so I have no problem with gay marriage.  But people tend to view this issue as a moral one rather than an issue of rights and freedom of religion.  As long as our politicians continue to try to frame the issue as a moral decision they will continue to distract us from the real issues in our government.  The decision to dissolve the rights of women, erase the middle class, and cut social programs for the poor and elderly will be completely ignored because of the marriage issue.


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## dicapr (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I hope you're not applying this scripture to Obama... this is not what his intentions were nor is it anywhere in his heart.
> 
> This man changes his spots and stripes to what benefits him and no one else. He says just enough to get 'Christians' to believe him; there's very little he has to say to get most Blacks to support him, for it's the color of his skin that drew us to him in the first place. And out of all of the people who love him 'most', we're the ones for whom he has done the least for. The very least.
> 
> ...


 

O.K.  I don't know what blacks expected him to do for them that they couldn't do for themselves.  I hear blacks say that but then I ask what was he supposed to do? They have no idea.  Some people  really did think they were voting for Superman.  I actually felt sad when he was elected.  With the poor economy (not much anyone can do about it), 2 wars, and a health care agenda I knew he was facing a situation that he couldn't win.


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## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> What a jerk. My parents don't just have 20k laying around to give me. That was a horrible thing to say. And it shows that he has no clue about what the average American family is dealing with.



True - he is probably a great PERSON, husband and father but just like if you were gong to trial you would want a jury of your peers....well in the case of the Presidency I want someone closer to being my peer and that happens to be Obama this time around.


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## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I hope you're not applying this scripture to Obama... this is not what his intentions were nor is it anywhere in his heart.
> 
> This man changes his spots and stripes to what benefits him and no one else.   He says just enough to get 'Christians' to believe him; there's very little he has to say to get most Blacks to support him, for it's the color of his skin that drew us to him in the first place.   And out of all of the people who love him 'most', we're the ones for whom he has done the least for.  The very least.
> 
> ...



I'm not one of those who was looking for Obama to "save" me for anyone who thought like that shame on them.......I don't look for any person or any President to "save" me.

Perhaps those who were looking for Obama to "save" them are now against him because they feel as if he didn't "save" them.....well that was not his job.


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## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

dicapr said:


> I will not be voting for Romeny-I can't as a black or as a woman.  While I'm not in love with Obama I never hailed him as the second coming as so many people did so my disappointment isn't as great.  For me the gay issue isn't about right and wrong it is about freedom of religion.  Should someone, who doesn't believe the same way I do, be allowed to have the rights that I have in this country?  My answer is yes so I have no problem with gay marriage.  But people tend to view this issue as a moral one rather than an issue of rights and freedom of religion.  As long as our politicians continue to try to frame the issue as a moral decision they will continue to distract us from the real issues in our government.  *The decision to dissolve the rights of women, erase the middle class, and cut social programs for the poor and elderly will be completely ignored because of the marriage issue*.



Well said....and those are the issues I will base my vote on....for or against gay marriage won't put food on my table, access to affordable health care, a job, a college education for my children etc etc and at this point I am afraid Romney is clueless about those issues so he is not the candidate for me and my family.


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## auparavant (May 10, 2012)

So many try and get us to vote republican but I figure out that they are not truly pro-life if they want to save the fetus but don't give a damn after he's born.


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## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

dicapr said:


> O.K.  I don't know what blacks expected him to do for them that they couldn't do for themselves.  I hear blacks say that but then I ask what was he supposed to do? They have no idea.  Some people  really did think they were voting for Superman.  I actually felt sad when he was elected.  With the poor economy (not much anyone can do about it), 2 wars, and a health care agenda I knew he was facing a situation that he couldn't win.



You're missing the point... Blacks are still hailing this man as the one to put food on their tables and to insure that they'll have decent health care, etc., all of this before righteousness.   However, they're looking to a man who could care less about them.   

I'm not the one calling him superman, however the alligience that this man still has is coming from people that he could care less about.  Obama is more focused upon appeasing gays who want hospital visit and other whiney complaints.   They are not the victims that every has made them out to be and Obama knows this.  YET... he has still catered to them.... 

All the while...

We still have Travon Martins happening all over this country, not just Florida.   Laws which allow them to be 'killed while walking Black'.  

Why are our Black men still the vast olume of Jails?   

Why are Black neighborhoods still without better homes and Black schools still the lowest in quality education? 

Why are drugs still predominant in Black neighborhoods and schools?

Why are Blacks still the highest of welfare receipients?

Yet the gay cries and whines took presidence over all of this and much more?

Those voting for Obama are still voting for a man who could care less about them and that's my point.   He could truly care less.


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## SummerSolstice (May 10, 2012)

we have some lurkinators in the room 
 yall gonna reply or what?


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## SummerSolstice (May 10, 2012)

I will say this. I'm glad I'm reading today... I'm getting kinda confused over here. Overseas is definitely looking fantastic


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## dicapr (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> You're missing the point... Blacks are still hailing this man as the one to put food on their tables and to insure that they'll have decent health care, etc., all of this before righteousness. However, they're looking to a man who could care less about them.
> 
> I'm not the one calling him superman, however the alligience that this man still has is coming from people that he could care less about. Obama is more focused upon appeasing gays who want hospital visit and other whiney complaints. They are not the victims that every has made them out to be and Obama knows this. YET... he has still catered to them....
> 
> ...


 

I'm sorry, but you do not have a clear understanding what the President can and cannot do. You want him to do something that is not within his powers and them blame him when he cannot. The issues you speak of cannot be legislated away. They are issues in the community that the community must take care of themselves. The fact that so many blacks are sitting back waiting for someone to do something rather than doing it for themselves is a huge part of the problem.


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## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> You're missing the point... Blacks are still hailing this man as the one to put food on their tables and to insure that they'll have decent health care, etc., all of this before righteousness.   However, they're looking to a man who could care less about them.
> 
> I'm not the one calling him superman, however the alligience that this man still has is coming from people that he could care less about.  Obama is more focused upon appeasing gays who want hospital visit and other whiney complaints.   They are not the victims that every has made them out to be and Obama knows this.  YET... he has still catered to them....
> 
> ...



Shimmie you my girl and all  so don't stone me...but you say all of this to say because Obama is BLACK and the President he was supposed to single handedly fix all of the ills of the black people and community?

I won't say he could care less about us but we first must care enough about ourselves to have others care about us and we need to begin to affect our own change if a change is going to come.

The gays came with a specific agenda - same sex marriage and we need to come with a specific agenda as well.

gays did not ask Obama his opinion yesterday the media has been stirring all of this up, why? to get black folks right where they are now...all up in arms and against Obama.


----------



## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> I'm not one of those who was looking for Obama to "save" me for anyone who thought like that shame on them.......I don't look for any person or any President to "save" me.
> 
> Perhaps those who were looking for Obama to "save" them are now against him because they feel as if he didn't "save" them.....well that was not his job.



I definitely wasn't looking for Obama to save me... I didn't need saving.  However many have placed their Black hopes in him and he has proven that he is not a 'Black' loving president.   

You shared about health benefits up thread.    Effective July 1, 2012 every insurance provider in Maryland has dropped their coverage by 10% and in addition have increased co-pays by as much as an additonal $25.     This is with Obama in office.  

Here is a quote from our Health Benefits Booklet :


_The Patient Protection and Affordable

Care Act (Healthcare Reform)

In March 2010, President Obama signed the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act

(PPACA) into federal law. The federal regulations identified by the enactment of the PPACA has various impacts on employee benefit plan designs, costs, and eligibility. The initial changes occurred for the State Employee and Retiree Health and Welfare Benefits Program participants on July 1, 2011. _

One sad example of the changes:

People with cancer are no longer covered at 100%, yet these are the very ones unable to work and obtain sustainable income to cover medical treatments, let alone cost of living expenses.  

We are now allowed only one GYN, Base Mamogram, Annual Physical at 100%; the insurances will only cover 90% PLUS the increased co-payments for any subsequent doctor visits.   

Last year my cousin was called back to have a second mamogram, because the first one had 'questions'.   She's now paying the lab over $400 to cover the expenses of the 2nd scan which was NOT her fault.  The insurance provider would not cover it.        (Obama in office)  

ER Visits are $150 ($75 for the hospital / $75 for the attending physician) plus any additional charges including some labs where all labs were covered at 100 %.    Hospital stays are no longer covered at 100%.   

I've been insured for years (PPO Plans - ability to select any doctor outside of the network) and have never had to pay anything over a co-payment.    These increases also apply to in-network physicians as well.   

*Obama...*missed something, because now our health care is costing more. 

God truly provides, but what about those who don't have the faith that I've been blessed with?   Their suffering is more.   

Trust me, I'm not defending Republicans, I can't stand any of these politicians, however Obama hasn't done any better for anyone financially, that I can attest to.   Especially coming July 1 which is only weeks away.  

Please believe me, that I'm not contending with you.   I have the highest of regard for you.   I don't fault you for supporting Obama.   That's your choice and so be it.    

From what I've seen of him, he's no better than the ones before him in office.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> You're missing the point... Blacks are still hailing this man as the one to put food on their tables and to insure that they'll have decent health care, etc., all of this before righteousness.   However, they're looking to a man who could care less about them.


You sound like someone from another race that is stereotyping us as thoughtless drones. Newsflash, Black people are not simpletons, most of us do not look to him to solve our day to day problems, we see him as a capable leader that we are politically aligned with, simple as that. You sound like a republican and thats all well and good, but don't stereotype Blacks and their politics like this, its ridiculous. 



> I'm not the one calling him superman, however the alligience that this man still has is coming from people that he could care less about.  Obama is more focused upon appeasing gays who want hospital visit and other whiney complaints.   They are not the victims that every has made them out to be and Obama knows this.  YET... he has still catered to them....


 You sound like you see gays as the enemy or something. Gay people are a diverse group of people how can you generalize like thiserplexed 



> All the while...
> 
> We still have Travon Martins happening all over this country, not just Florida.   Laws which allow them to be 'killed while walking Black'.


The sobering fact of the matter is, most black men/boys are killed by black men/boys, thats something we have to grapple with ourselves on the micro level. 

You accuse others of it but it seems you're the one that expected Obama to be our savior more then anyone else and thats what has you in a tizzy. I never got it twisted. There are things that have to be handled on a community level and there are things that have to be legislated. The vast majority of black folks issues must be addressed on a community level and then have capable surrogates that will see to it that it is backed up politically.



> Why are our Black men still the vast olume of Jails?


 Various reasons including but not limited to racial profiling.



> Why are Black neighborhoods still without better homes and Black schools still the lowest in quality education?


 The better question is, how can we as Black people be proacive in improving the quality of our neighborhoods and take charge of educating our children ourselves?



> Why are drugs still predominant in Black neighborhoods and schools?


 FALSE the vast majority of drugs consumed in this country are consumed by whites. I never saw as much hard drugs as I did when I moved to a mostly white affluent suburb. The worst I saw in the hood was weed and alcohol, once I got out here I was shocked to see a YT girl snort coke like it was nothing in between poses for our senior picture.



> Why are Blacks still the highest of welfare receipients?


  Categorically FALSE, Whites receive 85% of public assistance in this nation. We are a minority, even if 100% of Blacks were on welfare (which we aren't) we only comprise 13% of the population so it is impossible for us to be the top welfare recipients. The fact of the matter is, there are various classes of Blacks just like any other group so the percentage of us being on public assistance is minuscule in the grand scheme of things. Its important to know your facts



> Yet the gay cries and whines took precedence over all of this and much more?
> 
> Those voting for Obama are still voting for a man who could care less about them and that's my point.   He could truly care less.


 To say someone could care less means that they care 

*Things Obama has done for Blacks:​**CRACK VS. POWDER COCAINE.* In 2010, the President signed the Fair Sentencing Act, which narrowed the huge disparity between sentences for possession of crack cocaine vs. powder cocaine. Under the old law, possession of five grams of crack resulted in the same mandatory five-year sentence as five hundred grams of powder cocaine. Obama reduced the 100 to 1 ratio to 18 to 1. Crack users are disproportionately African-American, and the war on drugs has been a war on the poor and people of color, destroying black families and communities. As a result of America’s drug laws, the U.S. has the world’s largest prison population, and a majority of prisoners are blacks and Latinos.

*HBCUS and STUDENT LOAN AID.* In 2010, the president signed an executive order for the president’s Initiative on Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs). The order provides $98 million in extra funding for HBCUs for 10 years. The order—which also provided for $20.5 million more to the HBCU Capital Financing program and $64.5 million for the Strengthening Historically Black Graduate Institution program—makes nearly $400 million more available in Pell Grants to students at all colleges. Obama appointed Hampton University President William Harvey as chairman of the President’s Board of Advisors on Historically Black Colleges and Universities. In addition, President Obama made a sweeping overhaul of the federal student loan program by eliminating fees to private banks. Much of the $68 billion savings will go to student aid, and the law invests $2 billion in community colleges.

*MINORITY ACCESS TO CAPITAL.* As a result of the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act, also known as the Obama stimulus package, the Small Business Administration (SBA) has expanded its outreach to minority owned businesses. Twenty percent of the billions of dollars in SBA loans provided by the stimulus have gone to minority-owned companies.


*DIVERSITY.* The Obama administration is the most diverse White House in U.S. history. Eric Holder is the first black Attorney General. The UN Ambassador, Susan E. Rice, is also an African American, as is EPA Administrator Lisa P. Jackson, U.S. Trade Representative Ron Kirk, NASA chief Charles F. Bolden, Jr., and Surgeon General Regina M. Benjamin. Diversity is extending to the federal bench as well, with blacks as 25 percent of the President’s judicial nominees, and minorities as nearly half. For example, Irene Cornelia Berger was confirmed as the first black federal judge in West Virginia. Tanya Pratt became the first African-American appointee to a federal judgeship in Indiana, and Michelle Childs became the second black federal judge in South Carolina. President Obama recently nominated Judge Bernice Bouie Donald, a federal district judge in Tennessee, to the United States Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit. Last year, the President nominated Sonia Sotomayor, the first Latina and third justice of color to sit on the Supreme Court. Elections do matter.

*NATIONAL MUSEUM OF AFRICAN AMERICAN HISTORY.* Obama funded the design of the Smithsonian National Museum of African-American History, which is scheduled to open in 2015 on the National Mall in Washington. The museum will occupy a five-acre site near the National Museum of American History and the Washington Monument. The Smithsonian is reviewing design proposals from six architectural teams.


*BLACK FARMERS' SETTLEMENT.* On December 8, President Obama signed legislation that provided $1.15 billion to black farmers who sued the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) in the 1997 case, Pigford v. Glickman. In the suit, which settled out of court 11 years ago, the farmers claimed the government discriminated against them by denying or cheating them out of federal aid. More than 75,000 farmers will receive up to $50,000 each. Some have suggested that it made a difference to have a black man in the White House. In any case, the symbolism is clear, as is the message that the government wants to correct a grievous injustice. “This is a settlement that addressed a historical wrong, I mean something that this country is not about and should not be about,” said U.S. Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr.


----------



## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I definitely wasn't looking for Obama to save me... I didn't need saving.  However many have placed their Black hopes in him and he has proven that he is not a 'Black' loving president.
> 
> You shared about health benefits up thread.    Effective July 1, 2012 every insurance provider in Maryland has dropped their coverage by 10% and in addition have increased co-pays by as much as an additonal $25.     This is with Obama in office.
> 
> ...



but do you understand all the extra stuff that many of these bills are padded with, the repubs agenda was to block Obama at every turn so they either voted no or padded bills with junk so when bills were finally passed the blame would fall squarely on Obama's shoulders....which it appears the Repubs did their job.....never ever has what happened with the debt ceiling fiasco happened until we got a black President.


----------



## dicapr (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I definitely wasn't looking for Obama to save me... I didn't need saving. However many have placed their Black hopes in him and he has proven that he is not a 'Black' loving president.
> 
> You shared about health benefits up thread. Effective July 1, 2012 every insurance provider in Maryland has dropped their coverage by 10% and in addition have increased co-pays by as much as an additonal $25. This is with Obama in office.
> 
> ...


 

Shimmie, you must have great insurance already. For many that is a vast improvement for what they already have. Very few people have 100% coverage for cancer, my ED visits are a $300 co-pay, and I don't know anyone who has their hospital covered 100%. Wherever you work they are really taking care of you. You should let them know how much you appreciate the healthcare benefit you are recieving.

Secondly, the Health Care Law is not fully in effect yet.  Most of the provisions do not go into effect until next year-so you are complaining about a law that has not been put into action yet.  Also, you are quoting State healthcare coverage.  Currently that has nothing to do with Obama.  His plan is not in effect except for two provisions (coverage for college age students and the high risk pools).  The complaints you have about health coverage are strictly a state issue and should be taken up with your representative.  

Again, you are expecting him to do something that he does not have the power to do.  I don't care whether you like Obama or not.  I just want your reasons for dissatisfaction to be based on his lack of performance rather than the expectation that he do the impossible.


----------



## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Shimmie you my girl and all  so don't stone me...but you say all of this to say because Obama is BLACK and the President he was supposed to single handedly fix all of the ills of the black people and community?
> 
> I won't say he could care less about us but we first must care enough about ourselves to have others care about us and we need to begin to affect our own change if a change is going to come.
> 
> ...



No stones... not at all.    This is only an issue and at the end of the day, I'll look out for you before allowing an issue like this come between us.   

Plus, I still need you when Jaleel and Gladys return week after next for the show finale.    Those are the only true votes that count.    

The way I see it , Obama isn't worth it.   I'll drop the issue before flaring up and discrediting you.     It's foolish to disconnect over someone with whom I have no connections with.    We (you and me) share hair, family members we love, prayers, Jaleel and Gladys.   And I'm serious.    So no stones. 

I'll say this.   But I already said it...  

Rhonda, as Blacks we did have a agenda presented to him.  The Ministers went to him who not only prayed with him but shared with him their hearts and the cries of their communities.   Obama wasn't ignorant of the Black elimininations yet he chose the group with the MONEY.   gays have MONEY and lots of it.   As Blacks we did not and could not finance his plans.  Reality.

So I'm back to Jaleel and Gladys with you and always, always, *always* here to pray and support you no matter what.     

I learned a long time ago, I will never fight with any of my 'sisters' over a man... this includes Obama.


----------



## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

dicapr said:


> Shimmie, you must have great insurance already. For many that is a vast improvement for what they already have. Very few people have 100% coverage for cancer, my ED visits are a $300 co-pay, and I don't know anyone who has their hospital covered 100%. Wherever you work they are really taking care of you. You should let them know how much you appreciate the healthcare benefit you are recieving.
> 
> Secondly, the Health Care Law is not fully in effect yet.  Most of the provisions do not go into effect until next year-so you are complaining about a law that has not been put into action yet.  Also, you are quoting State healthcare coverage.  Currently that has nothing to do with Obama.  His plan is not in effect except for two provisions (coverage for college age students and the high risk pools).  The complaints you have about health coverage are strictly a state issue and should be taken up with your representative.
> 
> Again, you are expecting him to do something that he does not have the power to do.  I don't care whether you like Obama or not.  I just want your reasons for dissatisfaction to be based on his lack of performance rather than the expectation that he do the impossible.



Hey di... if that's your man... stand by him.    

No stones, and most definitely no contention with you coming from me.


----------



## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> No stones... not at all.    This is only an issue and at the end of the day, I'll look out for you before allowing an issue like this come between us.
> 
> Plus, I still need you when Jaleel and Gladys return week after next for the show finale.    Those are the only true votes that count.
> 
> ...



Yes Jaleel and Gladys it's unbelievable Melissa lasted this long. Now I hope Donald wins I love his wife and kids.


----------



## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Yes Jaleel and Gladys it's unbelievable Melissa lasted this long. Now I hope Donald wins I love his wife and kids.



I know and he's in the semi-finals.  Maria (not Merena which is what I called her from day one ... ) bet' not win.      I see Donald in the finals.   

I wish Jaleel was there for the Jerry Rice and Kenny Mann Dance Round up.  I would have loved to hear what they had to say about him.  They are too funny.  I love Jerry Rice.  He's another 'Black' family man, like Donald.  

Oh well... we'll see...  Have a wonderful Friday.


----------



## nathansgirl1908 (May 10, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> I won't say he could care less about us but we first must care enough about ourselves to have others care about us and we need to begin to affect our own change if a change is going to come.


 How do you suppose that will happen when Blacks spend so much time fighting for and celebrating the rights of others instead of fighting for and celebrating the rights of their own community?


----------



## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I know and he's in the semi-finals.  Maria (not Merena which is what I called her from day one ... ) bet' not win.      I see Donald in the finals.
> 
> I wish Jaleel was there for the Jerry Rice and Kenny Mann Dance Round up.  I would have loved to hear what they had to say about him.  They are too funny.  I love Jerry Rice.  He's another 'Black' family man, like Donald.
> 
> Oh well... we'll see...  Have a wonderful Friday.



Jerry Rice with those bunny ears on was too funny!


----------



## MzRhonda (May 10, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> How do you suppose that will happen when Blacks spend so much time fighting for and celebrating the rights of others instead of fighting for and celebrating the rights of their own community?



Then we should not expect it to be done for us by someone else. 

We have been so brainwashed to fight amongst ourselves it will forever keep us down.


----------



## dicapr (May 10, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> Hey di... if that's your man... stand by him.
> 
> No stones, and most definitely no contention with you coming from me.


 
No problem.  I just always tell everyone be informed.  If you want change you need to know where to look.  Many things we look for the federal government to do is the jurisdiction of the state government.  I agree that things need to change but  community problems are not the juristiction of the federal government and certainly not the President. They start at the local and county level and then the state.  Waiting for any President to deal with the crime levels in the inner city is a waste of time.  It is not his or her jurisdiction.  You need to be involved with county and city elections.  Blacks need to turn out for local city elections and state elections if they want to see change in our communities.  The federal government is not the source for the type of change the black community wants to see.


----------



## Shimmie (May 10, 2012)

dicapr said:


> No problem.  I just always tell everyone be informed.  If you want change you need to know where to look.  Many things we look for the federal government to do is the jurisdiction of the state government.  I agree that things need to change but  community problems are not the juristiction of the federal government and certainly not the President. They start at the local and county level and then the state.  Waiting for any President to deal with the crime levels in the inner city is a waste of time.
> 
> *It is not his or her jurisdiction. * You need to be involved with county and city elections.  Blacks need to turn out for local city elections and state elections if they want to see change in our communities.  The federal government is not the source for the type of change the black community wants to see.



Isn't that a cop-out?   Not speaking sarcastically... just those very words ring loud and clear... 'cop out'.    

Our family is very much involved with the community, our county representatives, the elections, etc.   I live in an area that I want to remain in the 'protected' level that it is.      

C'mon you see me on this forum.   I'm worse with reps/delegates in person and by written correspondence.  They know me... well.   I fear no one when I'm fighting for a cause.  You can't be mute or afraid or nothing changes.    I don't play kiss up with any of them.  

I have to agree that it is very tiring when I feel no one else is speaking up when all they have to do is exactly what I'm doing to make a change.   Sometimes I want to walk away... but I'm a fighter.


----------



## dicapr (May 11, 2012)

I don't think it is a cop out.  Just like the CEO of a company does not deal with the day to day issues but those responsibilites are delegated lower a President is not supposed to be worried about what is happening in the hood.  Besides, the best he could do is introduce legislation to give more money to the states.


----------



## auparavant (May 11, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> This man changes his spots and stripes to what benefits him and no one else. He says just enough to get 'Christians' to believe him; there's very little he has to say to get most Blacks to support him, for it's the color of his skin that drew us to him in the first place. And out of all of the people who love him 'most', we're the ones for whom he has done the least for. The very least.


 

It was his words and charism that attracted most folks to him.  As for changing stripes, I always reply that "he's President of... the United States..."  so he's not going to dismantle the system.  He's still a U.S. president.  What do people expect?  He works for it, not against the very same system he's a part of.


----------



## aribell (May 11, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> @nicola.kirwan
> 
> This was key to me
> I think that the party is also immoral for using morals to get votes... but anywho...
> ...



My focus at work is mostly on economic issues.  But I do have to read the news/legislation all day, and regarding gay marriage one of the biggest issues I see is what will happen with the public education system and how children are made to accept or be taught that such and such is the case.  I think it will become a freedom of speech issue as well as a religious freedom issue, as there are numerous cases where churches _have _been sued because they would not allow same sex couples to use their facilities or would not place a child with a homosexual couple.  The constant line has been that this doesn't impact how religious people exercise their faith, but of course it has already:   

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource.php?n=514

There's a football coach in Nebraska that has been attacked by the LGBT community because of comments he's made about homosexuality being a sin.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...-football-coach-anti-gay-views_n_1455712.html

The coach is not discriminating against players, but the LGBT community is turning his free expression (that is not derogatory in any way) into something that is itself discrimination.  He explains clearly that he does not treat gay players differently, but that's not enough:  

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...tball-coach-tolerate-lifestyle_n_1496380.html

______________________________________________________

The Family Research Council also lists some consequences here: 

http://www.frc.org/issuebrief/the-top-ten-harms-of-same-sex-marriage


----------



## Laela (May 11, 2012)

As Christians we should be more concerned about the welfare of others than ourselves... that was the premise for my comment.


I understand and agree 1000% with your reply; as Children of God we are taken care of by our Father, in spite of the economy ... *no doubt* and Amein~!
 {I have testimonies to prove it as well} But, sorry you missed my point.  




Shimmie said:


> Behave....    Now you done got me started and in the wrong thread at that... Oh well...   here I begin...
> 
> I have to be honest.  I've never suffered financially under any of the presidents.
> 
> ...


----------



## auparavant (May 11, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> My focus at work is mostly on economic issues. But I do have to read the news/legislation all day, and regarding gay marriage one of the biggest issues I see is what will happen with the public education system and how children are made to accept or be taught that such and such is the case. I think it will become a freedom of speech issue as well as a religious freedom issue, as there are numerous cases where churches _have _been sued because they would not allow same sex couples to use their facilities or would not place a child with a homosexual couple. The constant line has been that this doesn't impact how religious people exercise their faith, but of course it has already:
> 
> http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource.php?n=514
> 
> ...


 

I don't condone him talking about homosexuality/sin while coaching but I know this is going to eventually go straight to the pulpit and the banning of the bible.


----------



## Shimmie (May 11, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Jerry Rice with those bunny ears on was too funny!



Those 'ears' were hilarious.


----------



## Shimmie (May 11, 2012)

Laela said:


> As Christians we should be more concerned about the welfare of others than ourselves... that was the premise for my comment.
> 
> 
> I understand and agree 1000% with your reply; as Children of God we are taken care of by our Father, in spite of the economy ... *no doubt* and Amein~!
> {I have testimonies to prove it as well} But, sorry you missed my point.



Your point is well taken...    Very well.    

I'm improving ..... somewhat   

Well trying to anyway.


----------



## Shimmie (May 11, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> My focus at work is mostly on economic issues.  But I do have to read the news/legislation all day, and regarding gay marriage one of the biggest issues I see is what will happen with the public education system and how children are made to accept or be taught that such and such is the case.  I think it will become a freedom of speech issue as well as a religious freedom issue, as there are numerous cases where churches _have _been sued because they would not allow same sex couples to use their facilities or would not place a child with a homosexual couple.  The constant line has been that this doesn't impact how religious people exercise their faith, but of course it has already:
> 
> http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource.php?n=514
> 
> ...



Thanks for sharing this Nicola.   I've been trying to 'say' what you've shared above in numerous threads/posts about the negative consequences of gay marriage and how our children are being 'targeted' in schools to accept this lifestyle as the norm.   Folks get all mad and stuff.      I knew that someone else up in here would speak up sooner or later with facts to support it.   You did just that.  

See... Obama is only thinking of himself.  He's partying with George Clooney and 'em' who have promised to back him up with millions.   He could care less about the negative back lash and impact of what he's just proclaimed.   He can't back out now, cause the gay bunch will kill him and with a hangman's noose.   Seriously.   

He really messed up with this one.   I mean he really messed up.   He's not going to win this election.      He blew it...and no one's to blame but him.


----------



## MzRhonda (May 11, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> Thanks for sharing this Nicola.   I've been trying to 'say' what you've shared above in numerous threads/posts about the negative consequences of gay marriage and how our children are being 'targeted' in schools to accept this lifestyle as the norm.   Folks get all mad and stuff.      I knew that someone else up in here would speak up sooner or later with facts to support it.   You did just that.
> 
> See... Obama is only thinking of himself.  He's partying with George Clooney and 'em' who have promised to back him up with millions.   He could care less about the negative back lash and impact of what he's just proclaimed.   He can't back out now, cause the gay bunch will kill him and with a hangman's noose.   Seriously.
> 
> He really messed up with this one.   I mean he really messed up.   He's not going to win this election.      He blew it...and no one's to blame but him.



See I don't get why people think because of this 1 issue he has messed up  and won't get re-elected. That fundraising dinner raised almost $15mil
for his re-election campaign - the biggest in presidential history. He does not have the super pacs funding his campaign like Romney does. It's going to take alot of money to compete with Romney on the ads and commercials war.

I'm sorry I want this man to win because the alternative is not a person I want to spend the next 4 years having as my President......to be honest black folks are not going to be the ones to push him over the hump for re-election. He needs to broaden his base...because those blacks that voted for him last time that are now saying he has not done anything for "them" won't be voting this time, those who will be turned away because of this voter ID push and some of those whites who voted for him the first time who won't now he needs to increase his base of potential voters. I'm sorry I would never put all my marbles in the bag counting on black folks.


----------



## Shimmie (May 11, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> See I don't get why people think because of this 1 issue he has messed up  and won't get re-elected. That fundraising dinner raised almost $15mil
> for his re-election campaign - the biggest in presidential history. He does not have the super pacs funding his campaign like Romney does. It's going to take alot of money to compete with Romney on the ads and commercials war.
> 
> I'm sorry I want this man to win because the alternative is not a person I want to spend the next 4 years having as my President......to be honest black folks are not going to be the ones to push him over the hump for re-election. He needs to broaden his base...because those blacks that voted for him last time that are now saying he has not done anything for "them" won't be voting this time, those who will be turned away because of this voter ID push and some of those whites who voted for him the first time who won't now he needs to increase his base of potential voters. I'm sorry I would never put all my marbles in the bag counting on black folks.



Rhonda, please don't think I'm not listening.  I am.  I feel bad as well because I do not like Mitt Romney... I never did.   

But the truth remains is that Obama chose the gays cause of the money.  He made his mistake by playing with Church Folks.   He played the political game.   He figured, their prayers and the righteousness of God isn't enough, so I'll compromise with the devil ... literally he sold out.   

It doesn't matter about Church and State / Separate, God is still ruler and when you 'play' with Him and then go off and make a devil's alliance... it's over.   God says, 'Okay... have it your way.'   You don't trust me, then go ahead see how far you'll get with satan.   

Obama went too far.   You don't play games with God.   Yeah... I know other politicians do it, however Obama made it a priority to claim Christianity as his backbone.... Folks .. Serious Christians and Prayers / Intercessors prayed for him night and day.    Hear this... no other president has had such a strong following of Believers to back them.   







He violated a strong principle... 'Be not deceived... God is not mocked'... ' (Galatians 6:7)

He should have just left God out of his campaign knowing he wasn't sincere about it.  He played 'Christianity' for his own purpose, knowing he wasn't sincere about it.    

He even 'pimped' his daughters in his explanation of how his decision to support gay marriage came about.   He pimped his daughters, using them to gain 'compassion' from those listening.   According to him, his daughters were asking why were gays treated so differently...   

Folks may not agree but you know... why not just man up and tell the truth.  He made his decision to gain more funding... Period!   Stop lying!  Just tell the truth.   

Rhonda, this is why I am so very disappointed in him.  His lies... like the rest of them.   I knew he wasn't perfect, no one is.   But he played the games that politicians play and he played those of us who respected him and saw him as intelligent and trustworthy.    He lied.  He kept everyone hanging on the gay marriage issue with his 'leaning' or 'evolving' responses to the question when asked.    

Biden... blew his cover.  There's scripture in Mark 4:22 "For there is nothing hid which shall not be manifested, neither anything kept secret but that it should come abroad." 

Biden blew his cover... straight up blew Obama's cover.   And you know what?  This is only the beginning.  His campaign is shot to blazes.   The gay issue is going down.  It's falling upon it's face the same manner as Dagon, the idol in the book of Daniel.   The Word of God is nothing to play with.  

Watch the news... it's all coming to fruition, God is tired of being played.  

I'm sharing this all in peace.  I'm not trying to offend anyone nor am I being contentious.   It's just something to be made aware of.   Watch the news.   God is uprooting all of it.


----------



## Kurlee (May 11, 2012)

obama was strong-armed, plain and simple.


----------



## MzRhonda (May 11, 2012)

I understand your feeling and belief Shimmie we will just have to agree to disagree......people have differing views on this subject and it will always be devisive. That's why it always comes into play during an election year.  I personally have not lost any respect for him as a person or as my President.


----------



## BostonMaria (May 11, 2012)

I'm voting for Romney. When he was governor of my state (MA) there was a surplus and jobs were abundant.  He's not very immigrant friendly so I'm a little hesitant to vote for him since I'm foreign born, but I gotta pick my poison. 

As much as I love Obama I can't vote for such a liberal president. I have to be accountable one day for that decision. 

BTW Obama was always anti gay marriage. He's trying to get the young voters and the 4% gay population to vote for him. Romney is trying to get the conservatives and older voters. It's all about politics folks, I won't play that game. They'll do and say anything for a vote. The only person that can save us is Jesus. 

PS I hate that they compare gays with blacks. Last time I checked my gay white co-workers have never been enslaved, never had their families taken away, aren't getting raped, and they've always enjoyed the privileges of being white. Not sure why blacks think gay people care about us.


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## Kurlee (May 11, 2012)

BostonMaria said:


> I'm voting for Romney. When he was governor of my state (MA) there was a surplus and jobs were abundant.  He's not very immigrant friendly so I'm a little hesitant to vote for him since I'm foreign born, but I gotta pick my poison.
> 
> As much as I love Obama I can't vote for such a liberal president. I have to be accountable one day for that decision.
> 
> ...



Love the bolded and totally agree. As for the rest, supporting Romney will make things worse. Republicans don't care one bit about regla folk!


----------



## Shimmie (May 11, 2012)

BostonMaria said:


> I'm voting for Romney. When he was governor of my state (MA) there was a surplus and jobs were abundant.  He's not very immigrant friendly so I'm a little hesitant to vote for him since I'm foreign born, but I gotta pick my poison.
> 
> As much as I love Obama I can't vote for such a liberal president. I have to be accountable one day for that decision.
> 
> ...





Eventually I go downstairs and begin my laundry.   After thanking Lilani, I saw your post (the bolded) and I just had to thank you too.

THANK YOU!


----------



## Shimmie (May 11, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> I understand your feeling and belief Shimmie we will just have to agree to disagree......people have differing views on this subject and it will always be devisive. That's why it always comes into play during an election year.  I personally have not lost any respect for him as a person or as my President.



I understand and I respect your feelings.   I still 'love' him, he's still one of us and to be honest, I feel sorry for him.   

Rhonda, one day we're going to have a Black Man upfront who will show the world that there is no compromise and no selling out and no loss of integrity.   These Black men are out there, however the world doesn't want good men, they want the ones who waver between right and wrong and wrong again. 

I'll tell you something else.  If anyone comes hard against you for supporting him and says something to attack you personally, they have me to contend with.     Just because we disagree, doesn't mean I don't care.   There are some that I can disagree with and still love them   You are one of them. 

Then ..... there are others.....    


Happy Mother's Day, Mz Rhonda.   I truly mean it.


----------



## nathansgirl1908 (May 11, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> I understand your feeling and belief @Shimmie we will just have to agree to disagree......people have differing views on this subject and it will always be devisive. That's why it always comes into play during an election year.  I personally have not lost any respect for him as a person or as my President.


 

What exactly did you expect in the CHRISTIAN forum?  Seriously. I ask that without a bit of snark.


----------



## Shimmie (May 11, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> What exactly did you expect in the CHRISTIAN forum?  Seriously. I ask that without a bit of snark.



 

nathansgirl1908.....

The real question may be... what did anyone expect around me...?    

My son used to watch Martin.  I* hated* that show except for one episode.... "My Mama's Bird".     

That was my reaction to Obama's speech and announcement.   I won't post it because it's Martin.  But when he did the 'Florida Evans' routine ... that was me!  The entire scene.     I have been in total disbelief since he spoke out.


----------



## missann (May 11, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> This man changes his spots and stripes to what benefits him and no one else. He says just enough to get 'Christians' to believe him; there's very little he has to say to get most Blacks to support him, for it's the color of his skin that drew us to him in the first place. And out of all of the people who love him 'most', we're the ones for whom he has done the least for. The very least.
> 
> I've yet to see a president give so much favour and attention to any one set of people than Obama has to gays. If his wife and children weren't Black, I'd dare say the man didn't like Black folks at all.
> 
> ...


 
Seriously?? But you all saw his character in '08 when he denied his pastor and threw Rev. Wright under the bus - all in the name of politics. 

So many people on here ridiculed those who supported Hillary and hailed Obama because he was black and him winning would be so historic and symbolic for all the black kids. I don't see how you can be surprised at his actions. Same 'ol Obama.

Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality.


----------



## MzRhonda (May 11, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> What exactly did you expect in the CHRISTIAN forum?  Seriously. I ask that without a bit of snark.



 nathansgirl1908  I know I know, lol.


----------



## MzRhonda (May 11, 2012)

missann said:


> Seriously?? But you all saw his character in '08 when he denied his pastor and threw Rev. Wright under the bus - all in the name of politics.
> 
> So many people on here ridiculed those who supported Hillary and hailed Obama because he was black and him winning would be so historic and symbolic for all the black kids. I don't see how you can be surprised at his actions. Same 'ol Obama.
> 
> *Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality*.



The bolded is what I have been saying on the political forum


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## menina (May 11, 2012)

missann said:


> Seriously?? But you all saw his character in '08 when he denied his pastor and threw Rev. Wright under the bus - all in the name of politics.
> 
> So many people on here ridiculed those who supported Hillary and hailed Obama because he was black and him winning would be so historic and symbolic for all the black kids. I don't see how you can be surprised at his actions. Same 'ol Obama.
> 
> *Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality.*



oh trust, if those things happen to be placed on the ballot, i'd vote accordingly..


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## BostonMaria (May 12, 2012)

*DELETE* not even worth posting....


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## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

missann said:


> Seriously?? But you all saw his character in '08 when he denied his pastor and threw Rev. Wright under the bus - all in the name of politics.
> 
> So many people on here ridiculed those who supported Hillary and hailed Obama because he was black and him winning would be so historic and symbolic for all the black kids. I don't see how you can be surprised at his actions. Same 'ol Obama.
> 
> Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality.



What diffence does it make what we did in '08.  We gave the man the benefit of the doubt.  We sure didn't want Palin and McCain.   Don't get all feathered, because we've changed our view.   Has he not changed his?  

Reality has kicked in.   In 2008 we had a new hope for a better and newer change. As voters we had a right to choose.  Now had we chose and supported McCain, you'd have a valid argument about 2008.   However at the end of the day, it didn't pan out with Obama.   He didn't HAVE to choose to support gay marriage.  What could someone do to him if he chose not to support it?   Nothing!   

As for being against homosexuality... are you kidding me?  You better believe we're going to go against it and hard.  Don't ever look for the battle to stop, just because you don't approve of it.    Out of all of the sins you mention, who in the Church is fighting to make them law as gay supporters are fighting to make gay marriage law?    

None of what you've stated is not going to validate homosexuality.   It's not in God's plan.  Out of all sins, it is the ONE sin that God Himself calls an abomination.   No Church that I know of condones the sins you speak of EXCEPT gay churches.   You heard me  ... gay churches go all around scripture to validate being gay to the extent of making excuses for the other sins you've mentioned above.   They doctrine is to erase all convictions of sexual sins, to validate their lifestyle.   

I don't want to be in a 'rile' with you, so please... don't go there.  It's a waste to falsely accuse Christians of 'cherry picking' / condoning all other sins.   It's not true loved one... it's simply not true.   

You may find it true with those who _call _themselves Christians who also condone homosexuality.  I think this is where your misinformation lies.   

Let's be real.  God is not validating Obama and gay marriage.


----------



## aribell (May 12, 2012)

> Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality.



There are political questions at play here as well.  For other believers who might be wondering how these issues are different, here's a breakdown (it's long!):

The U.S. respects freedom of religion, but has always respected the right of Americans to allow their laws to be informed by moral principles.  Many who complain today either do not know the political tradition of the U.S., or want to ignore it.  Morality is simply people's belief in what is right or wrong.  Religion is an express affirmation of a deity, accompanied by religious observance.  All "separation of church and state" means is that the government cannot make anyone worship a particular God or follow particular religious observances...or discriminate against people because of the religion they follow.

Religious freedom does not mean that moral questions are excluded from the law.  Law is inherently moral because it pertains to right and wrong in society.  People develop their moral values by many different means that may or may not be religious, but morals are always implicated.  There are many whose moral convictions are based on biblical principles, others on their own observance of the world around them or family tradition, whatever.    _But to say something is wrong and to stand against it is not to make someone observe your religion._

No one in this country has ever been free to be free from society's morals, as that is what law has always been based on--right and wrong.  The government does not criminalize every wrong behavior, mostly because it cannot be everywhere at once, and also because it's authority has to be limited.  (No one is going to be thrown in jail for jealousy).  The government pretty much sticks to criminalizing behavior that harms other people or the State itself.

But, the government also makes positive affirmations, which are also moral.  For instance, the Government provides survivor's benefits for widows and orphans because society recognizes that we ought to support widows and orphans.  The federal government will also make accommodations/support married couples, like those in the military...which comes with certain benefits. _ No one is owed those benefits or that government support._  The government does it in recognition of the value of marital relationships and their contribution to society...morals again.  

Because society/the government chooses to support marriages because of their value in society and the government does not have to give benefits to anyone, the question of whether certain types of unions should receive government affirmation is definitely up for grabs.  It is a question that will depend on societal values and whether the American people (the ones who actually vote) believe that gay marriages should be affirmed and supported legally and receive the same benefits as traditional married couples.  Obviously, many people do not believe these unions should be supported and affirmed by the government.  

But it is not at all about the imposition of religion or theocracies, as in a theocracy, people are forced to worship a particular God.  But, this is a democracy, which means that the people have a say in what the government does.  People have a right to live their private lives as they choose, but that is a separate issue from having the government/society make a positive affirmation/give the same benefits to homosexual couples as it does to heterosexual spouses.


----------



## auparavant (May 12, 2012)

Biden should have kept his disability in check...A BIG MOUTH.  At least they got Romney on bullying a gay and he can't even recollect it.  Isn't that some kind of psychological condition?    The lesser of two evils...well, we've been feeling this every since the Pilgrims, so it's nothing new to us.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

auparavant said:


> Biden should have kept his disability in check...A BIG MOUTH.  At least they got Romney on bullying a gay and he can't even recollect it.
> 
> Isn't that some kind of psychological condition?    The lesser of two evils...well, we've been feeling this every since the Pilgrims, so it's nothing new to us.



"Aupar"...  you were back there with the Pilgrims?    


 


Don't stone me.   I'm just teasing.

ETA:  Romney said he didn't know that he was gay....  

Where do these reporters dig this stuff up anyway?


----------



## auparavant (May 12, 2012)

Shimmie

Romney doesn't even remember cutting off his hair and roughin him up   I don't think they dug this up from nowhere...cuz if he did it, he's got a serious psychological condition not knowing he beat the crap out of somebody AHAHA.  Yeah, I've been around since the Pilgrims lolol...that's what my left crazy hip tells me.  Hopefully, it comes along younger with this new mattress purchase lol.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> There are political questions at play here as well.  For other believers who might be wondering how these issues are different, here's a breakdown (it's long!):
> 
> The U.S. respects freedom of religion, but has always respected the right of Americans to allow their laws to be informed by moral principles.  Many who complain today either do not know the political tradition of the U.S., or want to ignore it.  Morality is simply people's belief in what is right or wrong.  Religion is an express affirmation of a deity, accompanied by religious observance.  All "separation of church and state" means is that the government cannot make anyone worship a particular God or follow particular religious observances...or discriminate against people because of the religion they follow.
> 
> ...



Wow.  Thank you.  Nicola, it's the manner in which you break it down; it simply cannot be disputed, for it is no doubt that you are sharing the Truth, and it's a Truth that stands on it's own.   

Without contention I have some questions.   

1.  How can gays state that they have a constitutional right to marriage?   It makes no sense to me, as they are not male and female.  

2.  I know what's behind it 'spiritually', yet what are they using to validate that they are entitled?   There are others who need the same benefits (elderly singles, or individuals who want someone other than a family member that they trust,  etc.).   There are legal documents which allow anyone, including gays, to designate someone as an Advanced Medical and/or Financial Power of Attorney, and other issues they claim they don't have rights to currently.   

My mom legally gave me complete control over her financial and medical decisions, including her house and insurance policies.  I was legally named her beneficiary and no one could dispute it.  After her passing, I was legally So what is the issue with gays who have the same right to name anyone as their Power of Attorney, etc.  After she passed away, I was the Adminstrator of her Estate. 

3.  Instead of redefining marriage the government has these legal methods in place for anyone who wishes to have a designee for their personal affairs. 

Why aren't gays utilizing this?   Marriage is not theirs to redefine.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

auparavant said:


> Shimmie
> 
> Romney doesn't even remember cutting off his hair and roughin him up   I don't think they dug this up from nowhere...cuz if he did it, he's got a serious psychological condition not knowing he beat the crap out of somebody AHAHA.  Yeah, I've been around since the Pilgrims lolol...that's what my left crazy hip tells me.  Hopefully, it comes along younger with this new mattress purchase lol.



He cut his hair ????   Oh that's going way too far.   Girl he 'betta' know not to touch anyone's hair.  That will NOT fly over up in this here forum.   Naw uhhh,   

I think I was back there with the Pilgrims too.   Those pictures in the school history books look kinda familiar...   

BTW:  Hey Sweets... Happy Mothers Day to You... Happy, Happy Day


----------



## Kurlee (May 12, 2012)

I'm disappointed in Obama for caving. Everyone is rejoicing, but I think it's kind of short-sighted. Who cares if he said it, if it's only because Biden and his big mouth kind of forced him to say something. I think privately he doesn't really agree and prally will not do much to move legislation forward. Why is everyone so happy, he obviously doesn't mean it?


----------



## Kurlee (May 12, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> Wow.  Thank you.  Nicola, it's the manner in which you break it down; it simply cannot be disputed, for it is no doubt that you are sharing the Truth, and it's a Truth that stands on it's own.
> 
> Without contention I have some questions.
> 
> ...


this!!!


----------



## Spring (May 12, 2012)

Kurlee said:


> I'm disappointed in Obama for caving. Everyone is rejoicing, but I think it's kind of short-sighted. Who cares if he said it, if it's only because Biden and his big mouth kind of forced him to say something. I think privately he doesn't really agree and prally will not do much to move legislation forward. Why is everyone so happy, he obviously doesn't mean it?


 
Obama didn't cave... he wanted to hide his true feelings about homosexuality from blacks for as long as possible.


----------



## Kurlee (May 12, 2012)

Spring said:


> Obama didn't cave... he wanted to hide his true feelings about homosexuality from blacks for as long as possible.



I don't think so.  Obama seems to be a pretty open book, but he knows that homosexuality is a hot button issue, so he was towing the line, IMO.  I think he's full of it on this issue and Biden forced his hand.  Black folk are not the ones who voted him in (too little of the population), so I don't see him hiding from black folk. People are so overjoyed, they only want to see what they want to see.


----------



## HappilyLiberal (May 12, 2012)

dicapr said:


> I'm sorry, but you do not have a clear understanding what the President can and cannot do. You want him to do something that is not within his powers and them blame him when he cannot. The issues you speak of cannot be legislated away. They are issues in the community that the community must take care of themselves. The fact that so many blacks are sitting back waiting for someone to do something rather than doing it for themselves is a huge part of the problem.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

Kurlee said:


> I'm disappointed in Obama for caving. Everyone is rejoicing, but I think it's kind of short-sighted. Who cares if he said it, if it's only because Biden and his big mouth kind of forced him to say something. I think privately he doesn't really agree and prally will not do much to move legislation forward. Why is everyone so happy, he obviously doesn't mean it?



The 'happy' that folks are expressing is blindness; they're rejoicing over a sin that has the president's stamp of approval.   Those who rejoice are those who are blocking God's conviction over this sin.   They now feel that if Obama approves it, then it's their redemption from moral conviction.  Obama (who is their god) has removed homosexuality from the 'sin' list.  It's no longer under penalty.  

Yet... there is a penalty for sin which is unrepented of; how sad for those who rejoice.


----------



## HappilyLiberal (May 12, 2012)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> You sound like someone from another race that is stereotyping us as thoughtless drones. Newsflash, Black people are not simpletons, most of us do not look to him to solve our day to day problems, we see him as a capable leader that we are politically aligned with, simple as that. You sound like a republican and thats all well and good, but don't stereotype Blacks and their politics like this, its ridiculous.
> 
> You sound like you see gays as the enemy or something. Gay people are a diverse group of people how can you generalize like thiserplexed
> 
> ...


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

Kurlee said:


> this!!!



 

Legalizing gay marriage will never erase homosexuality from being sin.  It doesn't 'clean it up' nor make homosexuality equal to a male/female relationship / marriage.  

Legalizing gay marriage is not the remedy for the healing / redemption of gays, it only pulls them deeper into their sin along with their supporters. 

It's 'tatted' for life as invalid and nothing and no one can ever change that.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> You sound like someone from another race that is stereotyping us as thoughtless drones. Newsflash, Black people are not simpletons, most of us do not look to him to solve our day to day problems, we see him as a capable leader that we are politically aligned with, simple as that. You sound like a republican and thats all well and good, but don't stereotype Blacks and their politics like this, its ridiculous.
> 
> You sound like you see gays as the enemy or something. Gay people are a diverse group of people how can you generalize like thiserplexed
> 
> ...



*News Flash*  

After all of this, it's still amounts to nothing compared to his dedication to gays as compared to Blacks.   

You can defend him all you want, as a Black you've still been 'swept' under his rug.


----------



## HappilyLiberal (May 12, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> How do you suppose that will happen when Blacks spend so much time fighting for and celebrating the rights of others instead of fighting for and celebrating the rights of their own community?



I don't think this is a matter of blacks going out and fighting for someone else.  It is a matter of blacks not complaining because someone else decided to protect their rights.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

HappilyLiberal said:


>



cheering for the 'crumbs'....


----------



## HappilyLiberal (May 12, 2012)

missann said:


> Seriously?? But you all saw his character in '08 when he denied his pastor and threw Rev. Wright under the bus - all in the name of politics.
> 
> So many people on here ridiculed those who supported Hillary and hailed Obama because he was black and him winning would be so historic and symbolic for all the black kids. I don't see how you can be surprised at his actions. Same 'ol Obama.
> 
> Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality.




He needed to throw Wright under the bus then put it in reverse.  He gave that speech in Philadelphia which gave Wright a chance to be gracious.  Instead of being gracious, Wright went to a major press event and openly mocked JFK.  I would have distanced myself from him as well. Wright acted like a straight up coon!


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> How do you suppose that will happen when Blacks spend so much time fighting for and celebrating the rights of others instead of fighting for and celebrating the rights of their own community?



This is so true... especially when gays come before Blacks when it come to opportunities.   

The new 'affirmative action' is for gays, because no one 'wants' to be accused of being intolerant...or sued by the LBGT's  (please... )    

It's also a sure guarantee that White gays will be ahead of Black gays.


----------



## nathansgirl1908 (May 12, 2012)

missann said:


> Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality.


 Why won't people give this lame, tired argument a rest?  erplexed


----------



## nathansgirl1908 (May 12, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> This is so true... especially when gays come before Blacks when it come to opportunities.
> 
> The new 'affirmative action' is for gays, because no one 'want's to accuse of being intolerant...or sued by the LBGT's (please... )
> 
> It's also a sure guarantee that White gays will be ahead of Black gays.


 Absolutely.  I'm not sure why others can't see this happening.


----------



## Kurlee (May 12, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Why won't people give this lame, tired argument a rest?  erplexed



strawman argument at it's finest


----------



## Kurlee (May 12, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> The 'happy' that folks are expressing is blindness; they're rejoicing over a sin that has the president's stamp of approval.   Those who rejoice are those who are blocking God's conviction over this sin.  * They now feel that if Obama approves it, then it's their redemption from moral conviction.*  Obama (who is their god) has removed homosexuality from the 'sin' list.  It's no longer under penalty.
> 
> Yet... there is a penalty for sin which is unrepented of; how sad for those who rejoice.



this is exactly what it is


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Why won't people give this lame, tired argument a rest?  erplexed



It's all they've got.    It's a worn out T-shirt with so many holes and stretches, that it no longer holds enough soap and water to even wash it. 

They can't apply it me  .   I'll 'attack' someone for not saying Grace or even _God Bless You_ when someone sneezes.   God have mercy on the adulterer, and please don't fornicate near my gate.  

And please don't let someone come to Church in the wrong attire, I preach a cannon express to hell. 

Nothing slides with me.... not even a 'skateboard', which is made to do so.  I have no mercy to give...


----------



## ambergirl (May 12, 2012)

HappilyLiberal said:


> He needed to throw Wright under the bus then put it in reverse. He gave that speech in Philadelphia which gave Wright a chance to be gracious. Instead of being gracious, Wright went to a major press event and openly mocked JFK. I would have distanced myself from him as well. Wright acted like a straight up coon!


 
Thank you! That was so disrespectful and prideful it was ridiculous. But of course since he's "annointed" he's above criticism.


----------



## ambergirl (May 12, 2012)

missann said:


> Seriously?? But you all saw his character in '08 when he denied his pastor and threw Rev. Wright under the bus - all in the name of politics.
> 
> So many people on here ridiculed those who supported Hillary and hailed Obama because he was black and him winning would be so historic and symbolic for all the black kids. I don't see how you can be surprised at his actions. Same 'ol Obama.
> 
> *Also, if Christians are getting all riled up about homosexuality, they should approach premarital sex, shacking, and divorce/remarriage with the same vigor. Don't cherry-pick sins and immorality*.


 
They will NEVER take these on because no preacher wants to look at empty pews and tithing baskets Sunday after Sunday.


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## nathansgirl1908 (May 12, 2012)

ambergirl said:


> They will NEVER take these on because no preacher wants to look at empty pews and tithing baskets Sunday after Sunday.


 Yes, there are MANY ministers who take on these issues.  





Next.


----------



## Ivonnovi (May 12, 2012)

This "the homos will take over" shiggady is the same okeydoke us's fell for & voted Bush II into office thinking "he'd save" the nation..... We went to WAR (loss thousands of lives & maimed countless others) which in many ways is far worse than allowing a "marginalized" segment of our population the freedom to live their lives.

ETA: I had "christian" co-workers declaring that if we didn't vote for Bush we were voting for the devil.  (In much more polite terms though; and yes, I agree overall the elections were stolen....if he didn't get the vote, he took it (on the electoral college level especially)


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## nathansgirl1908 (May 12, 2012)

Ivonnovi said:


> This "the homos will take over" shiggady is the same okydoke us's fell for & cited Bush II into office thinking "he'd save" the nation..... We went to WAR (loss thousands of lives & maimed countless others) which in many ways is far worse than allowing a "marginalized" segment of our population the freedom to live their lives.


 Bush stole the election both times.  His "victory" wasn't the result of some okey-doke.


----------



## Kurlee (May 12, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Yes, there are MANY ministers who take on these issues.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



 Thank you! I grew up in churches that faced these issues head on.  They would however, still counsel and help those who had those problems, though.  I just don't get it.  You don't have to bash Christianity to support homosexuality.  The same narrow-mindedness they accuse Christians of, is the same type of tunnel vision used to support their argument. Sigh  . . . .  Why are folks so bitter about religion?  Every time these discussions come up about religion and Christianity, folks are bitter as hell about other real and hypothetical people in the church and what they did/do. Who cares? Are you following God or other people? :roll eyes: Folks talk about Christians picking and choosing what they follow, what about them picking and choosing what to condemn and deem irrelevant?  What about all the things that are happening in this world that are S-P-E-L-L-E-D out in Revelations. Translate the bible into any version or language you want, the essence and meaning of the book is the same.  

I just can't with all of this, sometimes.  You want to support homosexuality, great, but there is no need to cherry pick at religion to make your argument.  I feel like these arguments are so weak because they are premised on blaming, guilting and shaming folks into compliance, because, as I have said before, honest dialogue is not happening and folks don't really understand the whole thing, but I digress.  . . .


----------



## HappilyLiberal (May 12, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Bush stole the election both times.  His "victory" wasn't the result of some okey-doke.




After he messed-up so badly the first four years, the second election should not have been close enough to steal!


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## SummerSolstice (May 12, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> This is so true... especially when gays come before Blacks when it come to opportunities.
> 
> The new 'affirmative action' is for gays, because no one 'wants' to be accused of being intolerant...or sued by the LBGT's  (please... )
> 
> It's also a sure guarantee that White gays will be ahead of Black gays.



Shimmie i am listening over here LOL.


I always tell my black gay friends nobody is checking for them. *the gay movement is for white men and it makes white men richer.* they ain't checkin for women, kids, or minorities... most of these rich fools sleep with any and everything and this "civil rights movement" make it easier for them to stay rich while doing it.


----------



## SummerSolstice (May 12, 2012)

There is definitely going to be a line in the sand and Christians will be persecuted for the side they stand on.


----------



## menina (May 12, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> There is definitely going to be a line in the sand and Christians will be persecuted for the side they stand on.




Most definitely. I'm not surprised about it as it's predicted in the bible, but sometimes the angle of the persecution is peculiar. Not unexpected, just.. peculiar.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

Ivonnovi said:


> This "the homos will take over" shiggady is the same okeydoke us's fell for & voted Bush II into office thinking "he'd save" the nation.....
> 
> We went to WAR (loss thousands of lives & maimed countless others) which in many ways is far worse than
> 
> * allowing a "marginalized" segment of our population the freedom to live their lives.*



No one is stopping gays from living their lives.  They've been doing so since Sodom and Gomorrah and that 'spirit of rebellion' has not ceased.   

Christians didn't make gay marriage 'political', gays did.  They took upon themselves to impose upon an all ready preexisting, established, and predefiined union between a man and a woman which does not belong to them.   gays nor the government have the right to redefine marriage.   It's not their's to redefine.  It is not their right.  

The very fact that gays and the government have come into our territory (Marriage, which has been given to us by God, not man) and to redefine it, creates a war which they have started.   They are the 'invaders' and are without territorial rights.   

Nothing about gay relationships equate with that of a man and a woman.  They are not the same.  Nothing and no one can make them the same.   Neither the government nor the gay agenda have the right to bring the sacredness of marriage down to their level which is unholy.   The sanctity of marriage is still and always ordained of God and will always be such.  

If their validations were not so ludicrous, there wouldn't be an issue.   All of this foolishness about hospital visits, insurance benefits, etc., is untrue.  Single parents have access to insurance benefits for *their *children.  Anyone can legally elect anyone of their choosing to be their medical representative.   Even a wife can legally elect someone over her husband, this is anyone's right.   

Marriage belongs to God, not to gays for redefinement.   They can live how they want without touching that which does not belong to them, which is the sanctity of Marriage.


----------



## Shimmie (May 12, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> There is definitely going to be a line in the sand and Christians will be persecuted for the side they stand on.



You know what "Little Summer"  ?   

The Bible asks:  "Who's on the Lord's side?"   (Exodus 32:26 KJV)

The Persecution for being on the Lord's side will prove who's truly standing and who takes God seriously.  

Many will say they're on the Lord's side, yet their fruit bears the opposite.


----------



## aribell (May 13, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Yes, there are MANY ministers who take on these issues.
> 
> Next.



Many just ignore the ministers that actually preach about sin and then say they don't exist.  They dismiss the real deal as "fire and brimstone" preachers...too old fashioned.  People don't realize that churches that preach and believe in right living are very much alive and well today.  But of course, if all people pay attention to are the ones who are the smoothest talkers, have the best choirs or put out the best books and TV ministries, they will easily miss the message.

I have to add that so much of this reminds me of Elijah dealing with Jezebel and Ahab.  Basically, Jezebel assumed the men of God were weak and that it was just down to Elijah, and she assumed he'd be easily defeated.  Even Elijah started believing it too and started to despair.  But what did the Lord tell him?  "Yet I reserve seven thousand in Israel--all whose knees have not bowed down to Baal and all whose mouths have not kissed him."  Even if that 7000 is scattered all over, those who seek God and truly want to follow Him in holiness are here.  Real preachers, real prophets, real evangelists, teachers of the word.

The same line is continually repeated--Christians are just hypocrites.  Christians don't really have great faith.  Christians are no different.  Just like Jesus said, there will be a day when the wheat and tares are separated, but even so, _today_ there are definitely those who follow God in truth.  At this point, I'm just like, OK, let Jezebel (the devil) dismiss the presence and power of God in the land.  How did that work out for her?


----------



## aribell (May 13, 2012)

Kurlee said:


> Why are folks so bitter about religion?  Every time these discussions come up about religion and Christianity, folks are bitter as hell about other real and hypothetical people in the church and what they did/do. Who cares? Are you following God or other people?



You know, it really boils down to this:  This society hates the concept of any standard by which a person will be judged right or wrong, good or bad.  People balk at the idea that there is such a thing as _sin_.  Christians understand that God forgives sin, but you have to recognize that God judges you for your sin and repent.  No one wants to repent.  Christians aren't the ones who have never done anything wrong, Christians are the ones who fear God enough to _repent_ from the wrong they've done and turn back to Him.  

Many put so much _sheer energy_ into discrediting Christianity altogether because if the truths told in Scripture were indeed valid, then everyone would have to recognize that they are not OK as they are and would have to live a life in submission to God's commands and not just what they want to do.  People hate the idea of that, it is offensive.  But as Jesus said, "Blessed is the one who is not offended by me."


----------



## Kurlee (May 13, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> *You know, it really boils down to this:  This society hates the concept of any standard by which a person will be judged right or wrong, good or bad.*  People balk at the idea that there is such a thing as _sin_.  Christians understand that God forgives sin, but you have to recognize that God judges you for your sin and repent.  No one wants to repent.  Christians aren't the ones who have never done anything wrong, Christians are the ones who fear God enough to _repent_ from the wrong they've done and turn back to Him.
> 
> *Many put so much sheer energy into discrediting Christianity altogether because if the truths told in Scripture were indeed valid, then everyone would have to recognize that they are not OK as they are and would have to live a life in submission to God's commands and not just what they want to d*o.  People hate the idea of that, it is offensive.  But as Jesus said, "Blessed is the one who is not offended by me."


----------



## ambergirl (May 13, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Yes, there are MANY ministers who take on these issues.
> 
> 
> Next.


 
Really? So are there ministers calling for making adultry a criminal or civil offense? How about reinstituting sodomy laws which also applies to heterosexual interactions? I know the religous right is trying to make it impossible for women to get contraception but why not just make it illegal to engage in premarital sex at all?

Until the religous right starts trying to legislate heterosexuality it is not the same as its approach to homosexuality.


----------



## ambergirl (May 13, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> You know, it really boils down to this: This society hates the concept of any standard by which a person will be judged right or wrong, good or bad. People balk at the idea that there is such a thing as _sin_. Christians understand that God forgives sin, but you have to recognize that God judges you for your sin and repent. No one wants to repent. Christians aren't the ones who have never done anything wrong, Christians are the ones who fear God enough to _repent_ from the wrong they've done and turn back to Him.
> 
> Many put so much _sheer energy_ into discrediting Christianity altogether because if the truths told in Scripture were indeed valid, then everyone would have to recognize that they are not OK as they are and would have to live a life in submission to God's commands and not just what they want to do. People hate the idea of that, it is offensive. But as Jesus said, "Blessed is the one who is not offended by me."


 
Oh gosh. When I first posted in here I didn't realize this was the Christian forum. 

I try to respect this space for those who are Christians, but I will say this with regards to this post.

This is not why most people question Christianity at all. In fact, I think most people are quite hard on themselves about their flaws and a lot of the dysfunction we see is a result of trying to compensate and cover up those flaws. One of the biggest sections in any book store is the personal development section because people are searching for ways to make their lives work better and to feel whole and complete.

Atheists question the existence of anything beyond the physical and rational. But for those who are more open to spiritual experience it's more about not agreeing that Christianity is the one and only true path, doubting that the Bible is the literal word of God, questioning the interpretations of any of the churches, priests, preachers, and ministers, and especially rejecting the imposition of those interpretations on others. 

Christianity is also done in by some of its followers. There are some great Christians and there are some hateful, angry, judgemental, manipulative, mean spirited Christians and the second group is much more vocal. I don't know what you do about that but all that condemnation and judgement just makes people like me who are respectful of many aspects of Christianity just tune out and run away.

The Jesus quote you listed. "Blessed is the one who is not offended by me" is really telling. I don't think people are offended by Jesus. I know I'm not. But people are offended by Jesus' followers who from the earliest days of Christianity have skewed the message to fit their own needs and beliefs.


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## Kurlee (May 13, 2012)

^^^ so again, it's about what individuals do and not about God.  Why are they the focus. I meet people that are MDs that are snobs. Should I avoid MDs cuz some use their education to think they are better than others? Of course not.  Christians are individuals with flaws just like everyone else and how they interpret or misinterpret their faith, should not be the criteria that people use to judge the possibility of a Christian spiritual experience. It really just sounds like a copout to me.


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## ambergirl (May 13, 2012)

Kurlee said:


> ^^^ so again, it's about what individuals do and not about God. Why are they the focus. I meet people that are MDs that are snobs. Should I avoid MDs cuz some use their education to think they are better than others? Of course not. Christians are individuals with flaws just like everyone else and how they interpret or misinterpret their faith, should not be the criteria that people use to judge the possibility of a Christian spiritual experience. It really just sounds like a copout to me.


 
But why would I or anyone else want to hang around those people? I go to A doctor, but I would not go to the Church of Doctors or ascribe to a belief system that I don't believe in. Jesus was amazing! But I don't believe he is the only way. 

I have some cool Christian friends ( and you're pretty cool yourself Kurlee) but we just have an agreement that we accept each other where we are. I don't try to convert them and they don't try to convert me.


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## aribell (May 13, 2012)

ambergirl said:


> Oh gosh. When I first posted in here I didn't realize this was the Christian forum.
> 
> I try to respect this space for those who are Christians, but I will say this with regards to this post.
> 
> ...



I'll start with the second bolded.  People were and are definitely offended by Jesus.  That's why He was crucified. That's why He said the quote, and that's why many people turned away from Him in the Gospels...because they were offended by His teachings.  And I mean the hard ones.  I don't mean the nice ones that everyone likes.  One's like _"I am the way, the truth and the life; no one can come to the Father except through me."_  In order to still like and not be offended by Jesus, many have to either ignore words like those or make them into something they aren't.  It is easy not to grapple with Jesus' teachings when some are conveniently left out or glossed over.

With respect to the first bolded, genuine atheists are a very small segment of the population.  The vast majority of people do believe and have always believed in God.  Polls also show that the vast majority of Americans pray often.  The concept of defined "doctrine," though, offends people because it boxes everyone in.  If there are 5000 ways to get to "heaven," then whatever way I feel like going is probably fine, and "heaven" is whatever I envision it to be.  If someone tells me there is "one" way, then I have to conform to that one way...I do not decide for myself what is wrong and what is not wrong, I don't decide what is the best way, and I have to submit to another standard that I may not like.

Of course people have a sense of their faults.  Knowing that you are not perfect is not the issue.  The issue is meeting God's standards rather than one's own.


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## Kurlee (May 13, 2012)

ambergirl said:


> But why would I or anyone else want to hang around *those people*? I go to A doctor, but I would not go to the Church of Doctors or ascribe to a belief system that I don't believe in. Jesus was amazing! But I don't believe he is the only way.
> 
> I have some cool Christian friends ( and you're pretty cool yourself Kurlee) but we just have an agreement that we accept each other where we are. I don't try to convert them and they don't try to convert me.



Thanks ambergirl. I know exactly the type of Christians that you're talking about. The ones that finish every sentence with, "the devil is a liar" . I guess for me, I just feel like they are not reflective of everyone. When it comes to homosexuality, I feel that if they want to do whatever, they have every right to do so, without being mistreated or disrespected. 

However, I feel that because marriage in North America is premised on Christianity (yes marriage has different meanings and histories from donkey years ago), I think it's problematic to change it to include something that Christianity doesn't believe.  I still feel that if they want to get married, they should be free to define and create their own rules and parameters that suit what they believe and what is important to them and have the room to create a system of beliefs that meet their needs and is not inferiorized. 

 I feel some kind of way about Obama, because his support came off as fake and half-hearted to me.  It was insincere.  I feel like all this strong-arming is going to back fire, because just like race, things are changing rapidly and people are getting on board, but nobody is really talking and understanding these issues and what both sides are feeling. So we will move forward as a society, but the prejudice and discomfort will be bubbling right under the surface. I think we should do this differently and actually engage each other.


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## Kurlee (May 13, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> I'll start with the second bolded.  People were and are definitely offended by Jesus.  That's why He was crucified. That's why He said the quote, and that's why many people turned away from Him in the Gospels...because they were offended by His teachings.  And I mean the hard ones.  I don't mean the nice ones that everyone likes.  One's like _"I am the way, the truth and the life; no one can come to the Father except through me."_  In order to still like and not be offended by Jesus, many have to either ignore words like those or make them into something they aren't.  It is easy not to grapple with Jesus' teachings when some are conveniently left out or glossed over.
> 
> With respect to the first bolded, genuine atheists are a very small segment of the population.  The vast majority of people do believe and have always believed in God.  Polls also show that the vast majority of Americans pray often.  *The concept of defined "doctrine," though, offends people because it boxes everyone in.  If there are 5000 ways to get to "heaven," then whatever way I feel like going is probably fine, and "heaven" is whatever I envision it to be.* *If someone tells me there is "one" way, then I have to conform to that one way...I do not decide for myself what is wrong and what is not wrong, I don't decide what is the best way, and I have to submit to another standard that I may not like.
> *
> Of course people have a sense of their faults.  Knowing that you are not perfect is not the issue.  The issue is meeting God's standards rather than one's own.


off topic, but kind of on.  ..  . post-modernist thinking is everywhere and it's driving me nuts. I have developed a disdain for it, but it seems to be following me around everywhere..  I think I need to finally confront it.

continue. . . .


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## ambergirl (May 13, 2012)

nicola.kirwan said:


> I'll start with the second bolded.  People were and are definitely offended by Jesus.  That's why He was crucified. That's why He said the quote, and that's why many people turned away from Him in the Gospels...because they were offended by His teachings.  And I mean the hard ones.  I don't mean the nice ones that everyone likes. * One's like "I am the way, the truth and the life; no one can come to the Father except through me."  In order to still like and not be offended by Jesus, many have to either ignore words like those or make them into something they aren't.  It is easy not to grapple with Jesus' teachings when some are conveniently le*ft out or glossed over.
> 
> With respect to the first bolded, genuine atheists are a very small segment of the population.  The vast majority of people do believe and have always believed in God.  Polls also show that the vast majority of Americans pray often.  The concept of defined "doctrine," though, offends people because it boxes everyone in.  If there are 5000 ways to get to "heaven," then whatever way I feel like going is probably fine, and "heaven" is whatever I envision it to be.*  If someone tells me there is "one" way, then I have to conform to that one way...I do not decide for myself what is wrong and what is not wrong, I don't decide what is the best way, and I have to submit to another standard that I may not like.*
> 
> Of course people have a sense of their faults.  Knowing that you are not perfect is not the issue.*  The issue is meeting God's standards rather than one's own.*



The only reason I mentioned atheists is because they're out there and they just don't believe in any supernatural force.

However, on the first bolded yes some people where offended by Jesus back in the day, but most of the people I know who question Christianity today actually resonate with a lot of Jesus' teachings. They understand that biblical scripture today reflects a long history of men editing content,  just don't take them literally, and certainly don't accept the interpretations coming out of most of the churches. 

I would argue that for most of us spiritual but not religious people, we believe the Bible was written by man, that Jesus was a man, that Paul was a man and therefore these texts should be interpreted that way. Some of the things in the Bible are very beautiful and ring true. Others sound like they are coming straight out of the BC and 1st century period because....they were. What we reject is this notion that just because something was said 2000 year ago and made it into a book doesn't mean it's shouldn't be questioned and subjected to discernment as you would with anything else you encounter. 

For example, I like the scripture you quote here of Jesus saying he is the way. But does that mean worshiping him  and following some antiquated rules from 2000 years ago? Not to me. It means follow his example, of compassion for the sick, scorned, and weak with humility and faith in the order of a Divinely inspired universe. Matter of interpretation.

I also think where folks differ is whether God has a standard and if so, what is it and who interpretes it ? For me,  if there are Godly standards they are off the highest order and inspire us to be our best selves rather than giving in to pettiness and smallness. For example, I just don't believe that a Divine being capable of creating the majesty of the universe would care one whit about whether you ate meat on Friday or what type of sex you have with your partner or any of the other small minded stuff the Bible tries to say are God's standards. 

That's why I just can't get with the Christian program. It's one part compassion and acceptance and four parts condemnation and judgement based on human interpretations of a book written thousands of years ago.


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## BostonMaria (May 13, 2012)

I can't pick and choose which parts of the bible are convenient for me. My mentor is a gay Jewish man. My manager is gay. My gay friend sent me a "happy mothers day" text this morning. I genuinely love these men. The thought of them losing their souls haunts me. I never discuss gay marriage or politics because I don't want to offend them. Jesus tells me I have to love them anyway. I have to love the person, but not the sin. I'm not perfect and I'll never be perfect. But I can't willingly support something that God calls an abomination. 

BTW I go to an awesome bible based church that also has a healing ministry. I'm sorry that some of you guys have encountered mean Christians that have ruined your relationships with God. I once was VERY offended with a priest to the point where I stopped going to church for about 10 years. I realized that the priest didn't represent all Catholics. I ended up finding a nondenominational church that taught the Word.


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## auparavant (May 13, 2012)

A very Jewish concept is scripture and sacred writings that are to be applied and transformed to modern living in whichever era one finds it. That has likewise passed onto christianity. It is there. Saying it is not is demonstrating misunderstanding and lack of knowledge of the very thing condemned as not possessing that ability nor having practiced it.


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## Shimmie (May 13, 2012)

ambergirl said:


> *Oh gosh. When I first posted in here I didn't realize this was the Christian forum.
> 
> I try to respect this space for those who are Christians, but I will say this with regards to this post.*
> 
> ...



This seems to be the 'unconscious' destination for several 'non Christians' regarding this topic....  

You came here to get your point across regarding how you feel about Christians, otherwise you would have left saying nothing.


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## nathansgirl1908 (May 13, 2012)

BostonMaria said:


> I'm sorry that some of you guys have encountered mean Christians that have ruined your relationships with God.


It's really just an excuse.  The bottom line is that people just don't want to be held accountable. They want to make their own rules and ignore God's rules.  Many of the "mean" Christians they have encountered That they claimed made them turn away have simply been unwilling to participate or condone sinful behavior.  When you really want to do something, including following Christ, you will do it.  And the behavior of others won't stop you.


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## SummerSolstice (May 13, 2012)

BostonMaria said:


> I can't pick and choose which parts of the bible are convenient for me. My mentor is a gay Jewish man. My manager is gay. My gay friend sent me a "happy mothers day" text this morning. I genuinely love these men. The thought of them losing their souls haunts me. *I never discuss gay marriage or politics because I don't want to offend them. *Jesus tells me I have to love them anyway. I have to love the person, but not the sin. I'm not perfect and I'll never be perfect. But I can't willingly support something that God calls an abomination.
> 
> BTW I go to an awesome bible based church that also has a healing ministry. I'm sorry that some of you guys have encountered mean Christians that have ruined your relationships with God. I once was VERY offended with a priest to the point where I stopped going to church for about 10 years. I realized that the priest didn't represent all Catholics. I ended up finding a nondenominational church that taught the Word.



This is why I started that other thread... some of my associates seem to be drawing a line and I am wondering if avoiding the topic altogether is the wrong thing, just because those people's souls are in question. its so scary.


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## ambergirl (May 13, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> This seems to be the 'unconscious' destination for several 'non Christians' regarding this topic....
> 
> You came here to get your point across regarding how you feel about Christians, otherwise you would have left saying nothing.


 
Perfect example of what I'm talking about. 

I can't remember the last time I posted in here, in no small part to some of your behavior in the past.

Hope you had a great Mother's Day 

Thanks to those who were cordial and thoughtful.


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## Shimmie (May 14, 2012)

ambergirl said:


> Perfect example of what I'm talking about.
> 
> I can't remember the last time I posted in here, in no small part to some of your behavior in the past.
> 
> ...



It was very nice, thanks for the rose.

The point I'm making it that a 'trend' is following:   Opposers of Christians come in to post their disdain of Christians and the Bible, and then the 'stream' of 'thanks' are posted and others follow suit posting their opposition to Christians and God's Word.  

It's one thing to share a view, however it's another to post negative / bashing views against Christians for others to join on the band wagon with it.     

Christians get 'bashed' enough as it in the other areas of this forum.  The Christian forum is not for that.


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## firecracker (May 14, 2012)

I see this forum resembles off topic with a lil Jesus juice throw in.


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## DaiseeDay (May 14, 2012)

firecracker said:
			
		

> I see this forum resembles off topic with a lil Jesus juice throw in.



Now it kind of does doesn't it?

More accurately it now resembles Christian Fellowship with a little mess starting thrown in.


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## firecracker (May 14, 2012)

DaiseeDay said:


> Now it kind of does doesn't it?
> 
> More accurately it now resembles Christian Fellowship with a little mess starting thrown in.


 Just like the Church!  LOL  If my presences makes you feel that way that is greaaaaat! LOL


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## DaiseeDay (May 14, 2012)

Just like church, how?

Your presence? no.

Thanks for judging me though.


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## firecracker (May 14, 2012)

DaiseeDay said:


> Just like church, how?
> 
> Your presence? no.
> 
> Thanks for judging me though.


 Your welcome! LOL


----------



## BostonMaria (May 14, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> This is why I started that other thread... some of my associates seem to be drawing a line and I am wondering if avoiding the topic altogether is the wrong thing, just because those people's souls are in question. its so scary.



SummerSolstice

I see how Shimmie and others are very knowledgeable on the word. I'm still a "baby" Christian and I am scared to be one of those Christians to scare somebody away from Christ


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## SummerSolstice (May 14, 2012)

BostonMaria... I'm like a tween at this point  i totally know how you feel. I haven't memorized a ton of scripture yet so I'm always fumbling for what I am trying to say. It is almost better to say nothing  makes me feel like I will be held responsible for lost souls


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## DaiseeDay (May 14, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:
			
		

> BostonMaria... I'm like a tween at this point  i totally know how you feel. I haven't memorized a ton of scripture yet so I'm always fumbling for what I am trying to say. It is almost better to say nothing  makes me feel like I will be held responsible for lost souls



As long as your heart is right I don't think you'll be responsible for lost souls. 

Sometimes I don't think I've memorized much scripture at all, but when I need one the right one ones to mind (though I need to work on getting the exact verse reference lol). 

A tip I got from a retreat was to

1. Cut up printer paper into pocket sized squares 

2. On one side write the verse reference and it's "category" (whatever it means to you such as "sin" "hope" "faith") ( ex. "Philippians 4:7 - peace")

3. On the other side write the verse out, and write the verse reference at the bottom (ex. "Philippians 4:7 And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus. - Philippians 4:7")

4. Keep it in your pocket (they sold little "verse keepers", but you can keep them with rubber bands around them or whatever)

5. Work on ONE verse at a time saying the whole thing out loud whenever you have a moment (red lights, lunch, waiting in line) it doesn't matter how long you work on a verse, quality is better than quantity.

6. Keep all of your memorized verses in your pocket along with the one you're working on so you can "quiz" yourself and just have them for reference.

It's just cool to realize how much time we have throughout the day where we're doing nothing except for waiting and we could be memorizing verses.


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## NaturallySweet73 (May 14, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> So now a bunch of women I'm friends with online are saying they will vote for Romney because of what Obama said yesterday
> 
> Whats up with our community failing to research before they vote???
> Don't they understand that there are traps set for Christians along the political trail?
> ...




I have read this thread and some like it on here.  I will be honest,  I am  quite disturbed.  Our aim as Christians is to be Christ like and reflect  him.  If I truly am a CHRISTian my fruits will bare that out.  One of  the main things that will happen is that I will hate what he hates.  I  may stumble, but it is only due to me being in ignorance or struggling  to be obedient, not a flat out refusal to be obedient and a refusal to  aligned myself with his will.  

I am going to be disgusted with  things he calls abominable .  If I am not, I am going to be obedient in  not entertaining it, condoning it, or taking part in it in anyway.  

Homosexuality,  as it has been pointed out, is the only sin that the Lord calls an  abomination:  Leviticus 20:13;  Leviticus 18:22 

Romans 1:18-31 says:  

Rom  1:18  For the *wrath of God* is revealed from heaven against all  ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in  unrighteousness; 
Rom 1:19  Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 
Rom  1:20  For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world  are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his  eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 
Rom  1:21  Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God,  neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their  foolish heart was darkened. 
Rom 1:22  Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 
Rom  1:23  And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made  like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and  creeping things. 
Rom 1:24  Wherefore God also gave them up to  uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their  own bodies between themselves: 
Rom 1:25  Who changed the truth of  God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the  Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 
Rom 1:26  *For this cause God  gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the  natural use into that which is against nature: *
*Rom 1:27  And  likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in  their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is  unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error  which was meet. *​ 
There is no confusion here.........God is against homosexuality and homosexual marriage is consequently evil to him!  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktliUuaThfg 

Isaiah 5:20  says: 
Isa  5:20  Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put  darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet,  and sweet for bitter! 

I  thinks it comes down to who we are with, because this is an issue that  is causing a line to be drawn. What we believe is good or bad and what  we use to interpret that belief.  The Word of God or Worldly Culture.  

I  am in this world but not of it(Romans 12:2), and am a representative of  Christ on the earth (2 Corinthians 5:20)  as an ambassador I am hear to  do his will in the earth, not align with the World.  

But that  is the decision that many have to make.  We cant be on the fence  anymore.  The enemy wont let us and the hour is late and if we insist on  staying their he will spew us out of his mouth (Revelations 3:16) 

To answer your original question, I will NOT be voting for either.


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## Shimmie (May 14, 2012)

BostonMaria said:


> SummerSolstice
> 
> I see how Shimmie and others are very knowledgeable on the word. I'm still a "baby" Christian and I am scared to be one of those Christians to scare somebody away from Christ



The two of you have more knowledge of scripture than you're giving yourselves credit for.    

I used to go to sleep listening to Bible tapes; our spirits never sleep and while we are sleeping our spirits absorb and retain what we hear.  

Scriptures end up pouring from your hearts without a second thought.  It's been planted there while you were sleeping.


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## LucieLoo12 (May 15, 2012)

What has happened to the CF??


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## BostonMaria (May 15, 2012)

I saw this on Facebook today and thought I'd share:

*A person who walks by faith is simply one who refuses to be moved away from their firm confidence in the word of God. #WalkByFaith*


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## Rainbow Dash (May 15, 2012)

Alicialynn86 said:


> What has happened to the CF??


 

Spiritual warfare...that's all.

We are human, but we don't wage war with human plans and methods. We use God's mighty weapons, not mere worldly weapons, to knock down the devil's strongholds... break down every proud argument that keeps people from knowing God... conquer their rebellious ideas, and we teach them to obey Christ. 2 Corinthians 10:3-5 NLT


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## Poohbear (May 15, 2012)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> It's really just an excuse.  The bottom line is that people just don't want to be held accountable. They want to make their own rules and ignore God's rules.  *Many of the "mean" Christians they have encountered That they claimed made them turn away have simply been unwilling to participate or condone sinful behavior. * When you really want to do something, including following Christ, you will do it.  And the behavior of others won't stop you.


Not really true... not standing up with the rest of the church when the choir sings is not a sin. Not participating in all the church ministries is not a sin. Not going to church every Sunday is not a sin.  

It some things that are not even sins that these "mean" Christians try to call out others on while they are the actual ones participating in sinful behavior.

I see nothing wrong with Christians speaking out against actual sin.


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## LucieLoo12 (May 15, 2012)

What gets alot of us is in trouble is people have this "Let me see what I can still do and be saved" mindset. 

We are suppose to fulfill the word of God and its laws, but anything that God tells us to do and we don't do is disobedience/sin. But people only want to live in the boundaries of the 10 commandments and it goes waaayyy past that.


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## Poohbear (May 15, 2012)

Alicialynn86 said:


> What gets alot of us is in trouble is people have this "Let me see what I can still do and be saved" mindset.
> 
> We are suppose to fulfill the word of God and its laws, but anything that God tells us to do and we don't do is disobedience/sin. But people *only want to live in the boundaries of the 10 commandments *and it goes waaayyy past that.



But when I said "actual sin", I'm not just talking about the 10 commandments. I'm talking about other sins mentioned throughout the bible too, not just in Exodus.


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## LucieLoo12 (May 15, 2012)

I was just making a comment about the responses I read in general in here, this comment wasn't made toward you.



Poohbear said:


> But when I said "actual sin", I'm not just talking about the 10 commandments. I'm talking about other sins mentioned throughout the bible too, not just in Exodus.


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## Galadriel (May 15, 2012)

I'm voting third party, just like I did last election.


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## Shimmie (May 15, 2012)

Galadriel said:


> I'm voting third party, just like I did last election.



I'm writing 'Jesus' in.   

And with this purpose:

_'Thy Kingdom Come, Thy Will Be Done, on Earth as it is in Heaven', Amen. _


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## Renewed1 (May 15, 2012)

Shimmie girl you are funny!!!

Anyways, I LOVE it when Christians have political debates.  I have it with my friends all the time. 

Sorry.....carry on.....


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## Renewed1 (May 15, 2012)

Shimmie girl you are funny.

Anyways, I love it when Christians have political debates. I have them with my friends all the time.

Sorry....carry on...


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## Shimmie (May 15, 2012)

MarriageMaterial said:


> Shimmie girl you are funny.
> 
> Anyways, I love it when Christians have political debates. I have them with my friends all the time.
> 
> Sorry....carry on...


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## BostonMaria (May 16, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I'm writing 'Jesus' in.
> 
> And with this purpose:
> 
> _'Thy Kingdom Come, Thy Will Be Done, on Earth as it is in Heaven', Amen. _



So you ladies are not going to vote at all?  I have to admit I don't like Romney or Obama, but I can't just not vote for anyone.  Its tempting though! LOL  You can't complain about Obama if you don't vote.  I know Romney is mediocre, but I have to admit that he at least is conservative and is a good business man.


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## Poohbear (May 16, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I'm writing 'Jesus' in.
> 
> And with this purpose:
> 
> _'Thy Kingdom Come, Thy Will Be Done, on Earth as it is in Heaven', Amen. _



Shimmie - you don't need to... God is already sovereign over this entire world...

...and this scripture, which speaks for itself:

*Matthew 4:8-11*

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, *Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.*

11 Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.

~~~

Just because Obama or Romney or whoever is going to be president for the next 4 years doesn't mean you have to renounce your Lord and bow down and worship these men. They are only elected officials over a country, not ruler over the entire world like the Lord.


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## Laela (May 16, 2012)

Good idea! I'm serious.... voters write-in all kinds of names all the time. Why not Jesus?


You have no idea how profound this is. My DH and I were talking this elections and I'm leaning on not voting at all (first time I won't exercise that right if I do); but this all started when this nation separated Church and State. Once God is removed from anything, it's all downhill from there. Instead of not voting, I'll just write in JESUS...good idea Shimmie! I'm spreading the word... 





Shimmie said:


> I'm writing 'Jesus' in.
> 
> And with this purpose:
> 
> _'Thy Kingdom Come, Thy Will Be Done, on Earth as it is in Heaven', Amen. _


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## NaturallySweet73 (May 16, 2012)

Laela said:


> Good idea! I'm serious.... voters write-in all kinds of names all the time. Why not Jesus?
> 
> 
> You have no idea how profound this is. My DH and I were talking this elections and I'm leaning on not voting at all (first time I won't exercise that right if I do); but this all started when this nation separated Church and State. Once God is removed from anything, it's all downhill from there. *Instead of not voting, I'll just write in JESUS...good idea Shimmie*! I'm spreading the word...



Awsome Idea


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

Laela said:


> Good idea! I'm serious.... voters write-in all kinds of names all the time. Why not Jesus?
> 
> 
> You have no idea how profound this is. My DH and I were talking this elections and I'm leaning on not voting at all (first time I won't exercise that right if I do); but this all started when this nation separated Church and State. Once God is removed from anything, it's all downhill from there. Instead of not voting, I'll just write in JESUS...good idea Shimmie! I'm spreading the word...



I'm definitely going to the polls.  We still have other issues to vote for/against.   We're still working on the referendum for Protecting Marriage in Maryland.   I love how the Churches are coming together to let their voices be heard.   

For my write in I'm thinking about : Matthew SixTen 

"Thy Kingdom Come; thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven (Matthew 6:10)

I would have voted for Rick* Perry *  Easy!  

But I'm definitely not staying home from the polls.  There'll still some judges that need Jesus and are making too many devil decisions.  They gots to go!  So at the polls and voting I'll definitely be.  



---------------------------
Correction made


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

Laela said:


> Good idea! I'm serious.... voters write-in all kinds of names all the time. Why not Jesus?
> 
> 
> You have no idea how profound this is. My DH and I were talking this elections and I'm leaning on not voting at all (first time I won't exercise that right if I do); but this all started when this nation separated Church and State. Once God is removed from anything, it's all downhill from there. Instead of not voting, I'll just write in JESUS...good idea Shimmie! I'm spreading the word...





NaturallySweet73 said:


> Awsome Idea



Wouldn't be a hoot if "Jesus" won the election with the most votes, including the electorials....      I would be elated.


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## MzRhonda (May 16, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> I'm definitely going to the polls.  We still have other issues to vote for/against.   We're still working on the referendum for Protecting Marriage in Maryland.   I love how the Churches are coming together to let their voices be heard.
> 
> For my write in I'm thinking about : Matthew SixTen
> 
> ...



Rick Santorum really? even after his "blah" people comment and other issues surrounding him? He does not want to make black peoples lives better 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/03/rick-santorum-entitlements-black-people_n_1181212.html


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Rick Santorum really? even after his "blah" people comment and other issues surrounding him? He does not want to make black peoples lives better
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/03/rick-santorum-entitlements-black-people_n_1181212.html



Wrong Rick... 

Rick Perry... 

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0112/71657.html


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## Poohbear (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Rick Santorum really? even after his "blah" people comment and other issues surrounding him? He does not want to make black peoples lives better
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/03/rick-santorum-entitlements-black-people_n_1181212.html



I'm not taking up for Santorum or anything, I know nothing about him, but in that article you posted, he actually said, "I don't want to make black people's lives better *by giving them somebody else's money; I want to give them the opportunity to go out and earn the money.*"

So he didn't flat out say, "I don't want to make black people's lives better" PERIOD.  He said he doesn't want to make their lives better from giving them other people's money which I assume is our tax dollars and welfare/government assistance.


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

Poohbear said:


> I'm not taking up for Santorum or anything, I know nothing about him, but in that article you posted, he actually said, "I don't want to make black people's lives better *by giving them somebody else's money; I want to give them the opportunity to go out and earn the money.*"
> 
> So he didn't flat out say, "I don't want to make black people's lives better" PERIOD.  He said he doesn't want to make their lives better from giving them other people's money which I assume is our tax dollars and welfare/government assistance.



Either way, he's something.   I don't know why I brought his name up because I never followed him.  I followed the Texas Rick (the Perry guy).  As much as I appreciate his strong stand on faith, he kinda went overboard with it in every speech he made.


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## MzRhonda (May 16, 2012)

Poohbear said:


> I'm not taking up for Santorum or anything, I know nothing about him, but in that article you posted, he actually said, "I don't want to make black people's lives better *by giving them somebody else's money; I want to give them the opportunity to go out and earn the money.*"
> 
> So he didn't flat out say, "I don't want to make black people's lives better" PERIOD.  He said he doesn't want to make their lives better from giving them other people's money which I assume is our tax dollars and welfare/government assistance.



I know the rest of what he said but does it matter what else he said??? He did not say he did not want to make people receiving entitlements lives better by giving them other peoples money.....etc....etc....etc...he said BLACK people, that to me says alot about how he feels about ME!!!!!!!

He said this in response to medicaid in that state.

As a matter of fact "other Peoples" money is code for white people and "Blah/their" lives better is code for black people.

When talking about "entitlements" white republicans see a picture of a black person as the definition - he was talking about those things to that audience there was no need to single out a race when other races also benefit from those "entitlements" as well.......white republicans think black folks are lazy so they should be off of welfare and working and not accepting handouts but their white folks on welfare are just on hard times and it's ok..... 

actually in Iowa, where he was speaking, the numbers are: 

Food Stamps --- 84% Whites      9% Black
Medicaid -----    74% Whites      8% Black


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## Poohbear (May 16, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> Wrong Rick...
> 
> Rick Perry...
> 
> http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0112/71657.html



Shimmie

What was it about Rick Perry that you liked? Do you know his stance on all the political issues?


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## MzRhonda (May 16, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> Wrong Rick...
> 
> Rick Perry...
> 
> http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0112/71657.html



Shimmie, Rick Perry is no better  his family had a ranch called N***head and the rock with the name on it was painted over alledgely in 1983 others are saying later than that. Also once Obama became President he was talking about Texas seceding also he rejected $550 million in federal economic stimulus money slated to help Texas' unemployment trust fund.

Why would you hurt the people of your state like that????


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## MzRhonda (May 16, 2012)

Poohbear said:


> Shimmie
> 
> What was it about Rick Perry that you liked? Do you know his stance on all the political issues?



he was and may still be a tea party follower.


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## MzRhonda (May 16, 2012)

I actually really liked Jon Huntsman ....IF he were to run again and there is no Democrat I could get behind I would vote for him......I would have to do more research on him and his policies and beliefs though.

I like:

Education reform - Huntsman’s vision for the federal government’s role in education is to end our “one size fits all approach” and create a new focus on individual students.

Financial Regulatory Reform - financial reform will mean breaking the Faustian bargain between Wall Street and Washington that helped fuel the housing bubble, drove a series of bailouts, and prevented meaningful reform in the aftermath of the financial crisis.


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

Poohbear said:


> Shimmie
> 
> What was it about Rick Perry that you liked? Do you know his stance on all the political issues?



Aside from the 'obvious' (his social values); he's working in progressing the use of renewable energy which is the field that I work in (environmental).  There is a lot of legislation for / against it and 'we' (our organization and others like us) work hard to assure legislators as well as residents about the need preserve our environment with renewable energy resources. 

There are facilities world wide which convert 'waste-to-energy'.  They've found ways to pull the gas that emits from landfills and to convert it to renewable energy as well.   Anytime we have a person in office to support these methods, it is a huge plus for the environment, the communities, residents, companies and it creates jobs with good income for each level of employment.    Instead of trash going to waste, it's converted to energy.


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> I actually really liked Jon Huntsman ....IF he were to run again and there is no Democrat I could get behind I would vote for him......I would have to do more research on him and his policies and beliefs though.
> 
> I like:
> 
> ...



Rhonda, isn't he the one who 'lashed' out against his fellow Republicans?   He called them communists or something to that effect?   

I liked him though...


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## Poohbear (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> *I know the rest of what he said* but does it matter what else he said??? He did not say he did not want to make people receiving entitlements lives better by giving them other peoples money.....etc....etc....etc...he said BLACK people, that to me says alot about how he feels about ME!!!!!!!
> 
> He said this in response to medicaid in that state.
> 
> ...



Oh okay, like I said, I wasn't taking up for him and never followed him or anything...and I don't like Republicans as a whole to begin with.


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## LadyRaider (May 16, 2012)

Take Rick Perry... please! 

/signed
Texas.


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## Poohbear (May 16, 2012)

Has anyone checked out this site which shows how each candidate feels on different issues?

http://www.ontheissues.org/default.htm

Obama: http://www.ontheissues.org/Barack_Obama.htm

Romney: http://www.ontheissues.org/Mitt_Romney.htm

There's also a quiz you can take to see which candidate matches your views on issues: http://www.ontheissues.org/Quiz/Quiz2010.asp?quiz=Pres2012


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## MzRhonda (May 16, 2012)

Poohbear said:


> Has anyone checked out this site which shows how each candidate feels on different issues?
> 
> http://www.ontheissues.org/default.htm
> 
> ...



Wow Obama 58%   and Romney at 28%


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## Poohbear (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Wow Obama 58%   and Romney at 28%



Ut oh, look at this poll:

Should Barack Obama be re-elected?

Yes, he deserves re-election         22,576 (31%)

No, he should not be re-elected     48,635 (68%)


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## Poohbear (May 16, 2012)

When I took that quiz on what candidate best matches my views, Tim Pawlenty was #1 on my list with a 45% match. He's a Republican MN Governor.

I had a 33% match with Obama and Romney...a tie!  However, I was more economically matched with Obama and more socially matched with Romney.


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Shimmie, Rick Perry is no better  his family had a ranch called N***head and the rock with the name on it was painted over alledgely in 1983 others are saying later than that. Also once Obama became President he was talking about Texas seceding also he rejected $550 million in federal economic stimulus money slated to help Texas' unemployment trust fund.
> 
> Why would you hurt the people of your state like that????



But Obama isn't any better.   I 'expect' whites to be bigots...I'm serious.  It's their ignorance, but at least I know up front what to expect.  For the most part I see whites as prejudice until they show me otherwise.  

Obama 'hid' his bigotry against his own kind.  He squeezed whatever juice (loyalty) from Blacks, all the time knowing that we were not his choice to pledge his alligence to.   He's Judas, a kiss on the cheek and then off to obtain the 30 pieces of silver by compromising and selling out to the highest bidder.   He's a 'betrayer' and no heart of repentance with it.   

I don't expect Whites to pledge their alligence to Blacks.   The Word of God says that every seed produces after it's own kind.   Whites look after Whites... plain and simple.   Obama turned his face in another direction and it wasn't towards his own.   No one, stood behind this man and supported him to the level that Blacks did... No one.  Even the Blacks in Africa, ones who will never see this side of the earth, yet they pledged their support to this man, knees to the earth in prayer for his life and safety.  

It's already fully established that Obama is expected to do more for gays ... they're coming to 'collect' from him the rest of the deal or else...  

The Black Boy in the oval office has been told what he will and will not be allowed to do and whom and what he will support.   

One of the head leaders of the gay agenda made it plain, that they only had a 'bite' of the apple, now they are going for the full apple.   And guess who's helping them?     Obama.   

I've been handling the Rick Perry's all of my adult life and I'm not poor nor kissing any of their cheeks, neither upper nor lower.   They either love me or they don't.   Those who love me will go to hell and back to prove it.   Those who don't, neither make nor break me and when I want something from them, I more than likely get it.  One thing I've noticed about Whites and Blacks is that Whites don't want to get sued, so they will tiptoe around Blacks. 

I know how to handle the Rick Perry's, they're Angel Cakes compared to Obama's stale crumbs that he tossed to the Blacks and gave the banquet to gays.  

FYI:  No contention, No ill feelings towards your personal dedication to Obama.   He is who he is to you.    I'm just not 'brand loyal'.   The novelty of Obama's Black Man in the White House over for me and countless millions of others.  He's on the walls with the other presidents 'Past'.     

My votes are precious and one has to earn them.   Obama didn't.


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Wow Obama 58%   and Romney at 28%



30 / 30  

Sarah Palin was at the top of my list....  

I don't even like her.


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## MzRhonda (May 16, 2012)

Shimmie said:


> 30 / 30
> 
> Sarah Palin was at the top of my list....
> 
> I don't even like her.



Sarah Palin 

Obama was on the top of my list with that quiz and next was Ralph Nader, huh? 

As far as my having "loyalty" to Obama because he is black...not so....for me I prefer the lessor of 2 evils and he is it.......perhaps you are my age perhaps you are not I just don't want things to go back to the time of my parents growing up and my grandparents and I see the writing on the wall with the current repubs in office and the current repub presidential candidate.....I don't want my kids to grow up in that world. The american dream will no longer be available to them as it was for me  and others of color...that dream is slowly slipping away.

My dad grew up with colored only signs while working side by side with white folks and not being able to eat inside of the establishment for lunch with his white boss and co workers...lucky for him his white boss was not having that but not everyone was like that back then.


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## Shimmie (May 16, 2012)

MzRhonda said:


> Sarah Palin
> 
> Obama was on the top of my list with that quiz and next was Ralph Nader, huh?
> 
> ...



I understand your feelings and they matter.  I've been around you on this forum long enough to know your heart .   You're real and this is where I stand with you.  When I'm talking about Obama, it's* not * a personal afront towards you nor anyone else.    It's about him,

However,............. Did you fix my quiz to make Palin the top score?   I know you did.   

I'm on the train tryna' conceal my scores 

You gave me a Palin link...


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## SummerSolstice (May 17, 2012)

That quiz has me ride or die with Hilary


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## Shimmie (May 17, 2012)

SummerSolstice said:


> That quiz has me ride or die with Hilary





That quiz is 'pranked'... ain't no way Palin tops my list and Hilary yours...


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## MrsIQ (May 20, 2012)

Shimmie said:
			
		

> But Obama isn't any better.   I 'expect' whites to be bigots...I'm serious.  It's their ignorance, but at least I know up front what to expect.  For the most part I see whites as prejudice until they show me otherwise.
> 
> Obama 'hid' his bigotry against his own kind.  He squeezed whatever juice (loyalty) from Blacks, all the time knowing that we were not his choice to pledge his alligence to.   He's Judas, a kiss on the cheek and then off to obtain the 30 pieces of silver by compromising and selling out to the highest bidder.   He's a 'betrayer' and no heart of repentance with it.
> 
> ...



Thanks is not enough. Erry word you said is what is rolling over in my spirit. I know that voting is a privilege that many of our forefathers bled and died for, but I ain't seeing nobody worth cutting my lunch hour short for in November.


----------

