# CurlyNikki Responds



## brebre928 (Jul 3, 2014)

If anyone cares to read CurlyNikki posted to her blog about the drama that's going on.

http://www.curlynikki.com/2014/07/curlynikki-responds-to-ebonycom.html


_For those that haven’t been following the natural hair drama (and I  hope you haven’t, really), let me explain.  About once or twice a year, I  receive submissions from non-black readers. If you look back in the  annals of the site, you’ll see that I’ve always chosen inclusion over  exclusion and aired the ones that contributed meaningfully to the  discussion. These ‘looser curly’ pieces were met with little opposition,  but nevertheless, sometimes sparked a healthy debate. But a recent  interview which featured *Sarah*, was met with much resistance. My good friends at Ebony.com _*published an editorial*_ that weighed in on the debate.  Since I found the article bogus and hypocritical, I felt compelled to respond. _​ 
*Read On!>>>*

  Dear Ebony.com,

Or should I say, Dear Jamilah, whose article "does not reflect the views  of Ebony.com". The controversy concerning the definition of the term  'natural' is one that is charged with emotion and often goes hand in  hand with the issue of protecting 'the sanctity of black spaces.' 

Many women sincerely feel that we must keep these spaces to ourselves in  order to maintain a sense of self and security.  You know what, they’re  right. On the other hand, a lot of non-black women identify strongly  with the self-esteem issues black women face as the result of cultural  and institutionalized racism.  If they feel this way, then they’re right  too.  I believe that the most important part of my job is to provide a  space for all women to enjoy the security they deserve while living in a  society that openly questions their legitimacy.  Jamilah, if I am only  providing enough space for my readers to feel comfortable in a room (or a  blog) full of women similar to me, then I haven’t provided my readers  any security at all. 


  Now, unless you’ve been in the natural hair game for less than 15  minutes, you know this whole argument is old as hell.  I’ve come down  clearly *on the side of inclusion before*.   The reasons are simple, but I’ll state them again.  Success in the  natural hair movement is defined by the total acceptance of our hair by  ourselves, and then ultimately, others.I and other  bloggers have been working hard to make the natural hair movement  popular.  It’s obvious now that our impact on the hair care industry and  popular culture has been tremendous.  Generally, this has led to good  outcomes like a crap load more products options, and a warmer reception  among friends, family and colleagues.  Without popularity, none of this  would have been possible. However, we can't have popularity without  sacrificing privacy.  Is it worth the trade? Hmmm...who knows. As a  practical matter, what I do know, is that it is difficult to try to make  something popular and accepted by not sharing it with others.  #WhereTheyDoThatAt 

There are other advantages, too.  If women from other cultures are  inspired by our stories, I'm cool with that.  This means that it will  become easier for black women to display their blackness outside of our  ‘safe’ black spaces.   As far as I’m concerned, the site is doing  exactly what I designed it to do- promote the natural hair movement. As  for the decision to run the article, it was mine alone.  I’m a dope  black chick, and so I made the site in my image.  This is the main  reason why it features mostly other dope black chicks.  But, I never  gave any thought to excluding anyone.  The site is for black women, and  whoever else finds it useful.  If you would have bothered to contact me,  I could have told you that.  For those that do feel a certain way, I  don’t think that those views make them racist or somehow wrong.  But, I  do believe that we need to learn to have this conversation without  attacking each other. If you're concerned about the integrity of this  'black space', I would direct you to the thousands of black women that  have been featured elsewhere on this site.  No really, all you have to  do is scroll down. 


  What I found intriguing about your decision to speak on this matter was  the strong sense of entitlement you must have felt to discuss the  meaning and purpose of the blog I created.  I mean if I understand you  correctly, you’re on my side, but only because the site was never for  black women anyway?  Well, damn...with friends like that, who needs  trolls? So, first things first, Jamilah, it’s obvious that you’re  mistaken.   As it turns out, featuring other ethnic groups does not mean  that my blog is not for black women. Just like Ebony.com’s failure to  show up for one of my charity promotions doesn’t make Ebony.com any less  qualified to promote charities. Put a pin in that.  But I’ve been  thinking, who really is “here for black women?”  Is CN dedicated to  serving black women or not?  Is Ebony.com dedicated to serving black  women or not? 

I must admit, I like the folks at Ebony (and Essence, too), especially  since you've become more natural hair friendly.  I do always wonder,  however, why our biggest black publications didn’t lead the natural hair  charge. 


_*pours Kermit tea*_


  At any rate, I have a good relationship with the folks at Ebony Online  and I try to support your initiatives.  Unfortunately, your article  reminded me of an incident I had working with your team last December. 


​ ​ Last Christmas *I went to South Africa*  for a service mission/vacation.  I began doing these culture trips a  while back...let's call them Curly Culture Missions.  When I go, I  usually serve my readership by telling them interesting stories about *women like them around the world*. On this particular trip, we found a great non-profit organization, *Metro Kids South Africa*  that works with young black women (and children) in Cape Town.  We knew  this would be a great opportunity to help the organization with their  mission and so we went to work. We looked for media outlets with wide  distribution.  We figured Ebony.com was an online publication that could  (let’s face it), use some interesting features and perhaps some more  traffic.  We reached out and were happy to find that you all were  excited about the project.  So we get to Africa and start emailing you  stories, only to find out that all of Ebony.com was on vacation.   So  here I am in Africa, trying to promote a charitable cause, and with  ‘Christmas vacation’ on your horizon, several excuses and a few  automated email responses later, the only thing that ran was the intro  article which is still on your website,* here*.   Just saying, what would Santa have to say about that? No really, let  me reiterate.  This would have done good for a lot of black women and  children and would’ve cost Ebony.com nothing. 


​ 
 We had a very successful trip, raised some money for our charity and  personally sponsored one of the young ladies who acts as a mentor to the  younger children (pictured above).  Still, we were disappointed that  y'all dropped punted the ball.  We saw for ourselves  that the folks of Metro Kids South Africa really needed help and I tried  my best to convey that to my audience.  What was equally disappointing  is that you all missed the story which ultimately led to *THIS*, and I can’t help but wonder how many women have been encouraged by seeing such a public figure show her natural beauty* in such a public way*. 

I do appreciate your (and Ebony.com's) attempt to get a few extra pageviews bring  attention to this important issue.  Ultimately, it is a legitimate  question.  Must we do this natural hair thing ourselves in order to  preserve a black space, or should we popularize and push our movement to  the broader public?  Both sides have legitimate points. To those that  want to define the term natural for me, I've discussed it *here*, *here* and *here*.  

Jamilah, I would like to thank you for bringing to light a very  controversial and provoking topic. But, you’ll forgive me if I don’t,  right?  I and the rest of the community that I fight tooth and nail to  represent, would very much appreciate it if you and your contemporaries  would talk less and show up more.  When you write about subjects that  tear down a sense of community while ignoring the work I do to build  them up, you remind me of the Pharisees who prayed loud, with many  words, not to be holy, but just to be heard. 


  And the church said… 

Later gators,
Nik


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## tru4reele (Jul 3, 2014)

Can someone sum it up for me? I'm lazy.


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## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 3, 2014)

Hmmmmm...so the Ebony article prompted the response but not the response about Waterlily or Sarah wanting to start a little controversy. OR the numerous comments under the article.

I think you did the same thing Nikki. It seems you wanted to broaden your reader base. Well congratulations, it worked.

Okay.


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## MileHighDiva (Jul 3, 2014)

tru4reele, I need Cliff Notes too!  I can't make it past  "pours kermit tea."  What happened in Africa that concerns Ebony Magazine?


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## hairsothick (Jul 3, 2014)

She went in on Jamilah Lamieux and ebony.com for the article that she published regarding the white girl drama.

She then proceeded to deflect and go off on them for not doing something for some charity she has.

Then she asked them why they (and Essence) didn't lead the natural hair movement if it was so important to them.

Also, the only way to make the natural hair movement popular is to share it with others.

*insert major eyeroll here*

I'm even more done with her than I was yesterday. Out of all of the people who have voiced their opinions on this matter, she chose to go off on Jamilah and ebony. And didn't really address anything that the white girl has said at all.


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## tru4reele (Jul 3, 2014)

hairsothick said:


> She went in on Jamilah Lamieux and ebony.com for the article that she published regarding the white girl drama.  She then proceeded to deflect and go off on them for not doing something for some charity she has.  Then she asked them why they (and Essence) didn't lead the natural hair movement if it was so important to them.  Also, the only way to make the natural hair movement popular is to share it with others.  *insert major eyeroll here*  I'm even more done with her than I was yesterday. Out of all of the people who have voiced their opinions on this matter, she chose to go off on Jamilah and ebony. And didn't really address anything that the white girl has said at all.



So what's the white girl drama?


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## Lucie (Jul 3, 2014)

So Felicity gets a pass?


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## overtherainbow (Jul 3, 2014)

She purposely missed the point, didn't even address the real issue (Sarah's dingbat answers and twitter responses), and instead, chose to verbally attack Jamilah, after complaining about the lack of cordial debate.  Then, she proceeded to be extra with hashtags and "tea pouring".  Her response was useless and catty and I wish I didn't take the time to read.
I really hope this does not turn into a back and fourth argument between them.


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## Bette Davis Eyes (Jul 3, 2014)

NaturallyATLPCH, that's exactly what I got from reading that.


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## JulietWhiskey (Jul 3, 2014)

Curly Nikki is forever wack and I'm with you hairsothick.  I'm *SUPER *good with her!

It is clear that she is trying to broaden her "brand," i.e. her monies by including those that really don't need to be included.  She's on her "New Black" hella hard!

The Natural Hair movement is popular because *WE* (black women) made it popular, not because folk like Sarah "linked" up with us!  The moment she sold her site to naturallycurly.com should have been a clue as to where this was all going (intergrationist, stepped on, gentrification of the site).


And I don't understand what her bringing up the charity in SA had to do with *ANY *of this controversy but whatever.

I won't be giving Nikki Walto any more of my clicks.


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## naturalmanenyc (Jul 3, 2014)

I'm guessing this is more about the White woman being part if the natural hair community thread.  Not reading all of that. 

As someone with White family members and mixed family members, I prefer White women take the time to learn about and,if necessary, care for natural Black hair.

Not here to give more clicks to that blog.


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## cocosweet (Jul 3, 2014)

Lucie said:


> So Felicity gets a pass?


Sure looks like it.

ETA: She should have just stopped right here in her reply without dragging poor Kermit into it:


> _For those that haven’t been following the  natural hair drama (and I  hope you haven’t, really), let me explain.   About once or twice a year, I  receive submissions from non-black  readers. If you look back in the  annals of the site, you’ll see that  I’ve always chosen inclusion over  exclusion and aired the ones that  contributed meaningfully to the  discussion. These ‘looser curly’ pieces  were met with little opposition,  but nevertheless, sometimes sparked a  healthy debate. But a recent  interview which featured *Sarah*, was met with much resistance. My good friends at Ebony.com _*published an editorial*_ that weighed in on the debate.  Since I found the article bogus and hypocritical, I felt compelled to respond. _​
> *Read On!>>>*
> 
> Dear Ebony.com,
> ...



Spilling that so called Ebony tea has nothing to do with the controversy at hand. I hate that she ignored addressing Waterlily's troll tactics.


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## pattyr5 (Jul 3, 2014)

She either missed the point that was being made or her "bosses" asked her to miss it.  I hope she isn't counting on those checks for her book sales to come from white girls.


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## MzRhonda (Jul 3, 2014)

I don't get where yt folks feel their "natural" hair plight is the same as ours and I don't understand black folks who understand and feel that it is. 

I don't think I had ever heard yt folks refer to their hair as "natural" until our natural hair plight took off.


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## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 3, 2014)

Lucie said:


> So Felicity gets a pass?





Y'all and Felicity!!

This somewhat saddens me.  I discovered CN when I first big chopped, even met some amazing curlfriends on there. Then all went down hill with the drama that was allowed to take place on that forum. And, the forum update that just killed all participation.

It would only make sense to publish the Felicity article and this catty Ebony response to increase her site views.

OH WELL. Time to officially move on (even though I have already). *pours out 40*


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## DoDo (Jul 3, 2014)

At the end of the day it does come down to money doesn't it?

This was all a marketing ploy, however it is a marketing ploy that is part of a larger marketing machine. As such bottom line financial numbers are important rather than individual reader support. Anything owned by texture media is just there to promote its position as a polyethnic beauty corporation.

Even in CurlyNikki's response there are so many links I didn't want to click on because they are there just for the clicks. You can explain a point rather than just insert a url. Last I checked the English language is still spoken and written. 

For me it isn't about the fact she featured the white woman. It was the woman's blithe responses to the questions posed to her (no significant difficulties on her journey, in fact no journey at all really) coupled with her attitude afterwards. In addition to this there is the inescapable fact that she just did this for attention and to get her face out there, so she knew and did not concern herself with the fact that it was a delicate situation.

However, all this is happening on CurlyNikki's site because as Curly Nikki has made clear its all about publicity notoriety and most of all self promotion. I didn't need to be informed about your unrelated endeavors and your appearance on the Tyra Banks show within the context of this address.

But, hey I guess articles about her getting 'turnt up' and articles about white women celebrating the beauty and ease of their natural hair are what her site has to offer now.


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## PatTodd (Jul 3, 2014)

CurlyNikki = unsubscribed.

I have been getting a little sick of her blog's emphasis on 20 somethings anyway (not real relevant to me) and her self-congratulatory tone.

I think she has gotten a little big for her britches.


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## cocosweet (Jul 3, 2014)

oops.................


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## Maneylovee (Jul 3, 2014)

I personally do not support this all inclusive method for encouraging the returning back to natural movement. The fact that these caucasian women feel like they can seriously relate to us when it comes to our natural hair is in my opinion absurd. Just because they may have thick curly hair, and they felt embarrased with the hair that grew out of their head is absolutely not the same thing as, black women having to deal with generations of being brain washed and manipulated into feeling they're hair was not acceptable or beautiful in society. A white woman with curly hair will not have the same stigma in society as a black woman embracing and loving her natural hair.


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## MileHighDiva (Jul 3, 2014)

I need clarification, she and the South African charity led Tamron Hall to wear her hair natural on the Today Show?

I'm confused!  Thank God it's a long weekend, because my comprehension and faculties are obviously down.

Sent from my Speak & Spell using LHCF


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## nlamr2013 (Jul 3, 2014)

Can u get a cliffs note of the entire debate?  Lol I have no clue what's going on


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## BostonMaria (Jul 3, 2014)

I haven't read the whole article yet
I met CN on naturally curly and she was such an inspiration to so many of us. I was one of the first naturals featured on her blog. Makes me sad to see her go through this. Not saying what she did was right, just saying I feel bad.


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## LdyKamz (Jul 3, 2014)

I read "Sarah" aka the white girl's interview and she couldn't even answer the questions properly. Simply because the general hair journey questions for us are not questions geared toward people with her type of hair. Natural hair for black women is not just "curly" hair that will include everyone.

I couldn't even read Curly Nikki's entire response because it was wayyy too long and I already wasted time on the white girl and then the Essence article. But I feel like Curly Nikki has decided that she doesn't care whether or not the women that helped her get started are still fans as she rises to the top. It looks as if she's already pretty happy with including her new buddies with silkier hair textures. Let's see how much they can help her when they realize the advice she's dolling out doesn't apply to them and they disappear.


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## Holla (Jul 3, 2014)

CN missed an opportunity to express her viewpoint in a clear, concise and articulate manner. Instead she chose to state her opinion with a snarky undertone, in a passive agressive manner, and full of colloquialism. 

If I were Ebony, I would not have associated with her brand either.  She came across as very unprofessional. She is too old to not know better.


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## MzRhonda (Jul 3, 2014)

Maneylovee said:


> I personally do not support this all inclusive method for encouraging the returning back to natural movement. The fact that these caucasian women feel like they can seriously relate to us when it comes to our natural hair is in my opinion absurd. Just because they may have thick curly hair, and they felt embarrased with the hair that grew out of their head is absolutely not the same thing as, black women having to deal with generations of being brain washed and manipulated into feeling they're hair was not acceptable or beautiful in society.* A white woman with curly hair will not have the same stigma in society as a black woman embracing and loving her natural hair*.



Exactly - were any female yt singers back pre 60's have to wear wigs when performing for acceptance..... ?????


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## MzRhonda (Jul 3, 2014)

MileHighDiva said:


> I need clarification, she and the South African charity led Tamron Hall to wear her hair natural on the Today Show?
> 
> I'm confused!  Thank God it's a long weekend, because my comprehension and faculties are obviously down.
> 
> Sent from my Speak & Spell using LHCF



I think she meant to point out Tamron/she was showcasing Tamron's natural hair during that trip and they failed to cover the trip and showcase that.  but after the Today show they now have the article all over their site.


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## curlytwirly06 (Jul 3, 2014)

Bye Nikki. For a long time I have been getting a "me me me" vibe from you and your blog. Your information is not even helpful or groundbreaking anymore. I can find my info somewhere else. I refuse to give you anymore clicks for not addressing what you should have but instead go after your own people. I guess money does talk though...


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## Starbucks (Jul 3, 2014)

brebre928 said:


> *What I found intriguing about your decision to speak on this matter was  the strong sense of entitlement you must have felt to discuss the  meaning and purpose of the blog I created.*



I think she's being very arrogant about the "blog she created," as if her thousands of black subscribers had nothing to do with her success. I refuse to give her website any clicks or hits. There are other resources  for me and Nikki shouldn't get the big head.

The second half about the volunteering was deflecting and had nothing to do with this. The second half should have addressed Sarah's attitude and the way she belittled Nikki's own subscribers. 

This whole thing shouldn't be that hard to grasp.  There is a difference between a website vieawable by all vs. what is featured.  I may visit Asian websites out of interest, but I don't expect to be featured on their websites, or Diwali, or anything else. And they definitely don't feel guilty about not doing so. But all of a sudden, we're supposed to roll out the red carpet because someone feels entitled to be featured, even if she wouldn't feature us in the reverse. 



nlamr2013 said:


> Can u get a cliffs note of the entire debate?  Lol I have no clue what's going on



http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=733333


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## DDTexlaxed (Jul 3, 2014)

This thread saddens me.


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## Froreal3 (Jul 3, 2014)

TL;DR


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## felic1 (Jul 3, 2014)

I cannot consider Sarah as part of our natural hair movement. She will not experience hiring discrimination because her hair is not straight. There are a lot of us that wear their hair straight or relaxed. I am not rejecting my relaxed sisters. Sarah is not a person with styling and length retention needs. She is not a part of us. I have looked at some of the more basically white hair blogs/sites. They are not really suitable for the needs of my hair type. I sort of get the impression that CN featuring her is a way to broaden or apply cross over techniques to expand her site. I am not trying to be ugly. The black community is experiencing cohesiveness via natural hair care. It is a good thing. For a caucasian person to indicate that she is natural also does not make her part of our group. She is not of african descent living in a culture that does not accept or celebrate our difference. If CN believes that she has disappearing ends, dry hair like ours, with breakage issues like ours, and any of our other needs she is mistaken. CN can cross over. I have already determined that caucasian based sites cannot help me.


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## Froreal3 (Jul 3, 2014)

Ok I did read it. 

First of all, if someone respects a "movement," they don't necessarily have to be a part. You don't have to usurp and insert yourself into everything just because you can kind of relate. That is the point that many of us were making.

I am all for stylists and people of all colors appreciating and learning to do kinky/coily and kinky/curly hair. However, that doesn't mean that it is ok to dubiously proclaim that you are part of the natural hair movement. It means something totally different for us. Please. This is the most ludicrous claim about this movement that I have ever heard. 

Nikki is wrong by saying that in order to be fully accepted, we need to let others insert themselves into our spaces and it's necessary to expand our movement to include people who it was never for. This just dilutes the premises and ideologies upon which this movement was built. This movement was founded due to the systematic oppression, humiliation, and degradation that black men and women have faced/are facing across the globe.

Now we want to expand it to include anyone who got called names due to having some poofy (albeit long) hair that they could easily put into a bun?  They want to expand it to include people who never struggled with growing their hair due to never having the products and techniques? Our traditional combs and other hair grooming tools and techniques were taken away from us and we never had a chance to learn about our hair. Hello? Pickaninnys anyone? 

We are just now..._just freakin now_ after hundreds of years of oppression...seeing the light and learning ourselves. Yes, "natural hair" has been around for years waterlilly....YOUR natural hair...not ours. The mere fact that we have to even say "natural hair" and differentiate it from permed hair says a crap ton about our situation that you/they clearly don't understand.

Sorry Nikki, I don't agree. Waterlilly and others like her can accept our movement by simply accepting it.  They can cheer from the sidelines and they can even relate to the struggle if they've dealt with their own identity issues, negative self concepts, and unrealistic standards of beauty. I get it. We can ALL relate.

However, that does not mean that they have to insert themselves and act like they are part of it in order for the movement to be accepted. Like a pp said, this movement is the way it is because WE made it...we created it because there was/is a desperate need. To include people who honestly have nothing to do with it will only diminish the true meaning of it. It actually doesn't even make sense. I'm confused as to what natural white women with curly hair going are back to? erplexed

Nobody is saying that they can't/shouldn't read black hair blogs or share tips. That is what women do and that's fine. I'm just saying please do not insert yourself under the context of #natural hair when you know good and got-damned well that that is not nor has ever been your experience.

Stop appropriating our ish. Just respect it and accept it! There is a difference.


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## Foxglove (Jul 3, 2014)

cocosweet said:


> Sure looks like it.
> 
> ETA: She should have just stopped right here in her reply without dragging poor Kermit into it:
> 
> ...



She did that on purpose. She knew what she was doing. Hope she enjoys her new readers. Hope it was worth alienating the base that got her where she is in the first place


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## Froreal3 (Jul 3, 2014)

Reminds me of the scene from Malcolm X in which the white girl asks what she can do 

http://www.zimbio.com/watch/69A0K0b1ubm/Malcolm+X+Nothing/Malcolm+X

"Whites can help us, but they can't join us. There can be no black/white unity, until there is first some black unity." - Malcolm X.


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## MzRhonda (Jul 3, 2014)

Well said Froreal3


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## Froreal3 (Jul 3, 2014)

Furthermore, Nikki can have all the seats in the world for acting brand a.ss new. Why did she create Curly Nikki in the first place? She could have stayed her butt right on NC. Why separate??? What was the initial need to do that? Don't we all have curly hair? 

I'm looking at you like


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## shelli4018 (Jul 3, 2014)

I genuinely don't see what the big deal is. I saw the article and threads about it. But the subject matter didn't appeal to me so I kept it moving. Why we're giving it so much attention (and clicks) boggles my mind. There are a 1001 things we could be discussing besides a curly headed white woman on a curly hair site. I know several of you will disagree.....but this mess right here is a non-MF factor.

I like Nikki and will continue to support her.


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## Seraphina (Jul 3, 2014)

Starbucks said:


> The second half about the volunteering was deflecting and had nothing to do with this. The second half should have addressed Sarah's attitude and the way she belittled Nikki's own subscribers.



And it was poor deflecting.  If she was going to change the subject, you'd think that she would've tried to make it smoother.

I was actually ready to give Nikki a pass on the feature itself, but after reading what the girl said, I saw how ridiculous it was.  I can't be mad at her readers for feeling some kinda way about seeing this girl come on just to say that all she does is slap some gel on her head and call it a day.  That's not helpful and her readers are not learning anything.

To me this is like group A discussing their severe acne problems and person B comes in, tells the story of when she had a pimple once, how it was gone the next day and then walking out.


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## charmtreese (Jul 3, 2014)

Seraphina said:


> To me this is like group A discussing their severe acne problems and person B comes in, tells the story of when she had a pimple once, how it was gone the next day and then walking out.



Now that was funny!


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## JulietWhiskey (Jul 3, 2014)

DDTexlaxed said:


> *This thread saddens me.*


 

 Wait a minute.

DDTexlaxed








*THIS* thread saddens you?

This thread---the one in which the majority of (black) women are clearly not here for the appropriation of our Natural Hair movement by a woman who's "journey" ended when she (literally) let her hair down?

This thread---the one in which the majority of (black) women are not giving Curly Nikki or Felicity lol passes for their trolling, self-promotion, and willful ignorance of what the real issues are.

So, *THIS* is the thread that saddens you, not Miss Lily's (oh, the irony) ignorant responses to folk trying to explain to her that while it may have been a difficult, painful struggle for her to wear her curly hair in a bun during her adolescence and finally learn to accept her silky curls, this doesn't mean she's entitled to sit with us---and by "us" I mean the black women in the military who are *PUTTING THEIR LIVES ON THE LINE EVERY DAY IN SERVICE TO THIS RACIST, UNGRATEFUL COUNTRY*, who can't even wear their hair in braids, dreds, twist-outs, twists or puffs because it's "unprofessional" and looks "dirty."

So, it's not any of these things.

It's *THIS* thread.  This thread of black women *NOT HAVING IT.*






Ok, sis.

Keep on with the caping.  I see you.







.


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## DDTexlaxed (Jul 3, 2014)

JulietWhiskey said:


> Wait a minute.
> 
> @DDTexlaxed
> 
> ...








It saddens me because you're judgmental about others. Sorry, but everything you said is not the truth about me. I'm saddened because it seems like every time someone has a different opinion, folks got to always be on blast. I'm so tired of the new spirit on this board. LHCF used to be about embracing our diverse cultures and textures. I have family members who have natural hair and they are white, spanish, and indian. They are also lurkers on this site. So not everyone here is drinking the tea you're drinking. You and I should agree to disagree with the politics and without shade throwing.


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## JulietWhiskey (Jul 3, 2014)

DDTexlaxed said:


> It saddens me because you're judgmental about others. Sorry, but everything you said is not the truth about me. I'm saddened because it seems like every time someone has a different opinion, folks got to always be on blast. I'm so tired of the new spirit on this board. LHCF used to be about embracing our diverse cultures and textures. *I have family members who have natural hair and they are white, spanish, and indian.* They are also lurkers on this site. So not everyone here is drinking the tea you're drinking. You and I should agree to disagree with the politics and without shade throwing.


 

@DDTexlaxed

But yet, you still didn't address any of the questions I asked in my post but, ok.  

And it sounds like you're trying to shame posters who aren't co-signing with Curly Nikki's gentrified madness as being judgemental.  Much like her and Felicity, you are actively, willfully choosing to ignore what the real issues are.


As for your white, spanish and indian family members that have "natural" hair, do they face the same discriminitory practices as you, me or those women in the military that I referenced in my previous post?

If you say, "Yes," then, I'm sorry but: *YOU NEED MORE PEOPLE* (to substantiate your claims).

Because these people aren't the ones being asked time and time again to defend their hair texture nor press for acceptance of their hair in its natural state.

So enjoy that hot mug of tea you're drinking, too.

I believe it's called New Black Tea.  I think Curly Nikki is selling it on her website...


----------



## dicapr (Jul 3, 2014)

JulietWhiskey said:


> DDTexlaxed  But yet, you still didn't address any of the questions I asked in my post but, ok.  As for your family members that have "natural" hair, do they face the same discriminitory practices as you, me or those women I referenced in my previous post?  And by spanish, do you mean from Spain or something else?  Because that would mean they are European and well, white, too.



No one faces the same discriminatory practices as the next person. But to say someone's journey isn't valid because it isn't your journey is dismissive and hurtful. And that goes across all hair types and textures.


----------



## kellistarr (Jul 3, 2014)

Froreal3 said:


> Ok I did read it.
> 
> First of all, if someone respects a "movement," they don't necessarily have to be a part. You don't have to usurp and insert yourself into everything just because you can kind of relate. That is the point that many of us were making.
> 
> ...



I can appreciate most everything that you are saying, but just perhaps Sarah didn't see it that way or doesn't see it that way.  I know I didn't realize that I was jumping into any "movement" when I said "adios" to my relaxer and I certainly didn't realize there was any movement going on here when I first discovered the hair boards.  I thought LHCF was just that, a forum about long hair or how to achieve and care for it.  I didn't care about race, I was just looking for some hair care advice.  I asked an online question, Pocahantas and this forum came up with her advice that I found interesting.  She was discussing different products she used on her curly hair.  Maybe, that's what Sarah can relate to.  I've been watching her for at least 2 years now and her videos are all about caring for curly hair and what products she uses, which happen to be very close to products I use.  

I thought CurlyNikki was about curly hair.  Yes, I noticed that practically all the women featured were black.  So what.  They could be purple for all I care.  I was looking for some hairstyles, products and tips.  Maybe that's what was/is up with Sarah.  Maybe to Sarah, her hair ain't silky. Her texture never struck me as silky.  It struck me as thick and curly.  I don't think she's inserting herself.  Inserting herself into what?   I like this forum for the advice I get on it; not on any "hair movements designated for who?  Black women who don't have any silky texture, get discriminated against, didn't have any styling tools or products.... didn't know that's what this was about.


----------



## Seraphina (Jul 3, 2014)

dicapr said:


> No one faces the same discriminatory practices as the next person. But to say someone's journey isn't valid because it isn't your journey is dismissive and hurtful. And that goes across all hair types and textures.



This is how I was feeling, and still do to a certain extent.  I would actually not protest at all if it were really contributing something.  But this isn't much different than if she went into the "Type 4" forum on NaturallyCurly and said, "Let me tell you about my regimen.  I wash every few days and put gel in it. Now my hair is gorgeous."  Why do that?


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 3, 2014)

dicapr said:


> No one faces the same discriminatory practices as the next person. *But to say someone's journey isn't valid because it isn't your journey is dismissive and hurtful.* And that goes across all hair types and textures.


 

@dicapr

No one is saying her "journey" isn't valid *TO HER* but equating simply "letting her hair down" within the context of the Natural Hair movement is absurd.

As a previous poster said, that would be like me---a woman who _*RARELY*_ gets pimples, possesses clear, even toned skin with microscopic pores--- joining a support group for people dealing with the struggles of cystic acne and bemoaning the one time in 9th grade that I had a pimple.

Everyone in the room would be looking at me like,







.

I can feel "traumatized" all I want but it doesn't mean that other people should treat this like it's valid. Because it isn't. 

They could dismiss my claims all they want. And quite frankly, if I was this stupid, shallow, and trolling enough to do some wack mess like this, then I should get clowned. Rightly so. Just like "Felicity" and Curly Nikki are being clowned now.

Therefore, I'm not capin' for this woman and her "pain." She has not been told by employers and the very government she serves that her hair is umkempt, dirty or unprofessional. She can cry me a river, build a bridge over said river and get over it.

In fact, they both can.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 3, 2014)

kellistarr said:


> I can appreciate most everything that you are saying, but just perhaps *Sarah didn't see it that way or doesn't see it that way.*  I know I didn't realize that I was jumping into any "movement" when I said "adios" to my relaxer and I certainly didn't realize there was any movement going on here when I first discovered the hair boards.  I thought LHCF was just that, a forum about long hair or how to achieve and care for it.  I didn't care about race, I was just looking for some hair care advice.  I asked an online question, Pocahantas and this forum came up with her advice that I found interesting.  She was discussing different products she used on her curly hair.  Maybe, that's what Sarah can relate to.  I've been watching her for at least 2 years now and her videos are all about caring for curly hair and what products she uses, which happen to be very close to products I use.
> 
> I thought CurlyNikki was about curly hair.  Yes, I noticed that practically all the women featured were black.  So what.  They could be purple for all I care.  I was looking for some hairstyles, products and tips.  Maybe that's what was/is up with Sarah.  Maybe to Sarah, her hair ain't silky. Her texture never struck me as silky.  It struck me as thick and curly.  I don't think she's inserting herself.  Inserting herself into what?   I like this forum for the advice I get on it; not on any "hair movements designated for who?  Black women who don't have any silky texture, get discriminated against, didn't have any styling tools or products.... didn't know that's what this was about.



That's ok for Sarah not to see. It is obvious that she didn't see nor did she try to see after it was brought to her attention. You didn't realize you were part of something bigger than you are...but you are/were. That's ok too.

ETA: My problem is the whole fact that she tried to say she was #team natural when it means something entirely different for us and the supporters of that board than it does to her. She KNOWS it is something different because she admitted it was. She just wants to continue to play the victim in this situation.


----------



## Starbucks (Jul 3, 2014)

Froreal3 said:


> That's ok for Sarah not to see. It is obvious that she didn't see nor did she try to see after it was brought to her attention. You didn't realize you were part of something bigger than you are...but you are/were. That's ok too.



But why would she say on her Facebook that it was "fun" to start the controversy?  I think some people missed part of the story and are commenting on face value. The girl knew exactly what she was doing.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 3, 2014)

Starbucks said:


> But why would she say on her Facebook that it was "fun" to start the controversy?  I think some people missed part of the story and are commenting on face value. The girl knew exactly what she was doing.



I saw that part too. I agree that it wasn't all innocent and that she wants to play the victim now. Honestly, I don't even care whether she was ignorant or if she intended to start the controversy on purpose. The fact is, she did it and is not even attempting to empathize and see it from our pov.

My whole thing is that when a white woman with 3a hair comes in and says "I have natural hair," in the context of a blog of black women w/natural hair, it is ridiculous and offensive. The context in which she did it did not make sense.

What is she even differentiating "natural hair" from?


----------



## dicapr (Jul 3, 2014)

JulietWhiskey said:


> dicapr  No one is saying her "journey" isn't valid TO HER but equating simply "letting her hair down" within the context of the Natural Hair movement is absurd.  As a previous poster said, that would be like me---a woman who RARELY gets pimples, possesses clear, even toned skin with microscopic pores--- joining a support group for people dealing with the struggles of cystic acne and bemoaning the one time in 9th grade that I had a pimple.  Everyone in the room would be looking at me like,  .  I can feel "traumatized" all I want but it doesn't mean that other people should treat this like it's valid.  Because it isn't.  They could dismiss my claims all they want.  And quite frankly, if I was this stupid, shallow, and trolling enough to do some wack mess like this, then I should get clowned.  Rightly so.  Just like "Felicity" and Curly Nikki are being clowned now.  Therefore, I'm not capin' for this woman and her "pain."  She has not been told by employers and the very government she serves that her hair is umkempt, dirty or unprofessional.  She can cry me a river, build a bridge over said river and get over it.  In fact, they both can.



 So someone with wavy hair wants to play natural. Why should I care? If it was a big step for her in her journey great. If she was trolling why give her the time of day?  

At the end of the day I can't be bothered fighting silly battles. The mine pain is greater than your pain battle is fruitless. Just as soon as you dismiss someone's struggle another person is judging your pain irrelevant also. 

I've come to the point in my life where I understand someone's pain or struggle doesn't diminish mine.


----------



## LivingInPeace (Jul 3, 2014)

White woman playing the victim. How original.


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 3, 2014)

My only comments on this whole issue is that with our "hair movement" our community is getting recognition and seeing how important we are. Period. In turn, the community is trying to build back and repair years of mental damage, even if everyone doesn't deal and heal the same way. Out community needs to be stronger and maybe this is what we need. 

With that being said, being that Nikki clearly feels anyone who proclaims natural after our community worked hard to accept ourselves and out natural hair is disrespectful. By accepting Nikki and her brand new a$$, your accepting they fact that it's ok for us as black people to not have or fight for anything. So for those who think it's not that serious or are saddened by it, continue to be oppressed. 

I refuse to believe that some Becky or Molly can tell me we have the same struggle when she can just wash, skipping the go, and meanwhile my washday is still a 5-step process. And I still use relaxers. This is our time. We need to fight hard to keep it that way.


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 3, 2014)

dicapr said:


> So someone with wavy hair wants to play natural. Why should I care? If it was a big step for her in her journey great. If she was trolling why give her the time of day?
> 
> At the end of the day I can't be bothered fighting silly battles. The mine pain is greater than your pain battle is fruitless. Just as soon as you dismiss someone's struggle another person is judging your pain irrelevant also.
> 
> I've come to the point in my life where I understand someone's pain or struggle doesn't diminish mine.


 

@dicapr

Okay, girl!  I've already stated, clearly, how I feel.

Hope your 4th is "turnt up!"






!


----------



## robot. (Jul 3, 2014)

We can't even come together to agree to be angry (and not even angry but at least a little annoyed) at a white person who ADMITTED to coming into our community to troll us. 

How did this somehow become a problem amongst ourselves? We ain't do **** wrong!

My people, my people.


----------



## dicapr (Jul 3, 2014)

JulietWhiskey said:


> dicapr  Okay!  Bye!  Hope your 4th is "turnt up!"  !



Thanks you too (even though I know you call yourself throwing shade). I think I'm too old for this board. My real life experience is interfering with the new less welcoming group think that dominates the board now.


----------



## dicapr (Jul 3, 2014)

robot. said:


> We can't even come together to agree to be angry (and not even angry but at least a little annoyed) at a white person who ADMITTED to coming into our community to troll us.  How did this somehow become a problem amongst ourselves? We ain't do **** wrong!  My people, my people.



She wanted attention and so our solution is to give it to her?  Ignore her and she and others like her will go away. Give her the reaction she wants and this will not be the last time it happens. What ever happened to not feeding the trolls?


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 3, 2014)

robot. said:


> *We can't even come together to agree to be angry (and not even angry but at least a little annoyed) at a white person who ADMITTED to coming into our community to troll us. *
> 
> *How did this somehow become a problem amongst ourselves? We ain't do **** wrong!*
> 
> *My people, my people.*


 

robot.


*YAAAASSSSS!!! *I read your post, got to the end and was like, 







!


----------



## robot. (Jul 3, 2014)

dicapr said:


> She wanted attention and so our solution is to give it to her?  Ignore her and she and others like her will go away. Give her the reaction she wants and this will not be the last time it happens. What ever happened to not feeding the trolls?



She's going to get the attention anyway, it's how the internet works. However the issue should've been addressing the WW and now we're somehow pointing fingers at one another. Not how that should've gone down.


----------



## robot. (Jul 3, 2014)

You and these Prince gifs!


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 3, 2014)

robot. said:


> You and these Prince gifs!


 

*He's the best!*





*!*


----------



## DoDo (Jul 3, 2014)

JulietWhiskey said:


> *He's the best!*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



JulietWhiskey

You are giving me so much *LIFE *with those Prince gif's!!

I am over here like 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





!


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

So first I read the article and some posts and thought "Bye Felicia!"

Then I saw the Prince gifs and decided I can now speak.


I feel that we can still have "our community" while not alienating other curly heads.  I  know we've been through some thangs!!!  But we cant turn this into curlism!!!  I remember when I first became natural on BHM and my initial acceptance was non-existing because I'm not a 4 something.  I was hurt!!!  I had been relaxing my hair for ever and a day.  Made to feel ashamed of my hair but not strangers but my own blood!!!  But because I wasnt a 4lmnop I didnt count! 

Luckily for me that lasted a week because everyone loves me and you just cant help but to love me cause I'm a Libra.

Any ways.  After I did my big chop and had my hair grown out for about a year I shared my pic on fb with some other hair group (I dont remember who) but before they publicly shared my picture I was asked if I was black!!!  I was like 
"Yeah, why?!"  
"oh cause you dont look black and your last name looks kind of spanish"  
"Yeah...  cause black people were taken to more than just Amaricas slave plantations.  Must I pull out my black card on you?"

Then my pic was posted.  Why?  Why are we fighting each other?!?!

And you know what!!!  CN posted a feature of a south Indian girl with curly hair and I was so proud!!!!  For an Indian to accept her curls?!?!?  I mean its unheard of!  AND SHE STILL LIVES IN INDIA!!!  I was in awe!!!  I know I got HE!! for wearing my hair curly when I lived in India! I also got heck cause I didnt use skin lighteners.

I'm just staying, any where that straight blonde hair has been boasted as what IS beautiful there have been women who have been made to feel lesser than because of it.

As women we need to stick together.  As black women we need to stick together.  We have enough enemies so be going at each others throat man!!!

Lets just post Prince gifs and bask in his glory and ignore this phuckery that is meant to divide us!!!


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)




----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 4, 2014)

Disclaimer* this is not my post, I saw it on another forum and thought it was interesting*   Also starred out swear word at the bottom , could not find a way to edit it out completely. 



luxe said:


> The other thing, Chescaleigh called out Sarah tonight because of a post Sarah tweeted back in 2012 claiming that it was "reverse racism" for BW to not let WW touch our hair. (This is the CNN feature btw)  Once she got called out by several people, she tried to delete the tweet. When Chescaleigh asked her about it, she tried to pretend like she didn't know what Chescaleigh was talking about, but Chescaleigh had screencaps. Once she was caught in that lie, she tried to pretend like it was because she had forgotten about it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Enyo (Jul 4, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> So first I read the article and some posts and thought "Bye Felicia!" Then I saw the Prince gifs and decided I can now speak.
> 
> Lets just post Prince gifs and bask in his glory and ignore this phuckery that is meant to divide us!!!


----------



## marta9227 (Jul 4, 2014)

The post on Curly Nikki upset me and I thought about unsubscribing. Her response confirmed that action. How is Sarah natural anyways? I mean as opposed to what? And no, we can't share this with white women because they don't get it and never will! I went to a predominantly white school for middle school and most of high school. They teased me about my hair being nappy and greasy, and none of the white girls with curly hair felt any solidarity with me and my kinky, natural hair. CN is trying to get more readers and so is that Sarah girl and I wish they would both just be real about it, because then at least I would respect the hustle.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

marta9227 said:


> The post on Curly Nikki upset me and I thought about unsubscribing. Her response confirmed that action. How is Sarah natural anyways? I mean as opposed to what? And no, we can't share this with white women because they don't get it and never will! I went to a predominantly white school for middle school and most of high school. They teased me about my hair being nappy and greasy, and none of the white girls with curly hair felt any solidarity with me and my kinky, natural hair. CN is trying to get more readers and so is that Sarah girl and I wish they would both just be real about it, because then at least I would respect the hustle.



marta9227 This story reminds me of the movie The Craft where the blonde chick is forever teasing the black girl!!!!


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> Disclaimer* this is not my post, I saw it on another forum and thought it was interesting*   Also starred out swear word at the bottom , could not find a way to edit it out completely.



I did not see this when I went on my kumbaya rant.

I'm back to saying "Bye Felicia"


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)




----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 4, 2014)

^^^ 

 I am back in here for the gifs! Prince or otherwise!


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 4, 2014)




----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 4, 2014)




----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

Knowing black  history and knowing how the world has been taught to think of us and our hair and how we have been taught to think of ourselves and our hair I read all three articles and a handful of the reader responses - I cannot help but to wonder if Nikki Walton  is making an age old classic mistake here - not a new one (study history)  but if you factor in the natural hair discrimination that joulzey and others have already pointed out - this might really be going in a direction we may all end up regretting - just a thought - I'm not prejudice at all - people are people - but this hair thing is deep and the natural hair movement has demonstrated that there is money and popularity in it - we should proceed with caution with this one..... That's my two cents because as much money as we've BEEN spending on our hair - we are JUST getting products that are dedicated to OUR kinkier textures.   
PS I saw the article before all of this and just clicked away from  the page and never thought twice about it because I did not feel her hair story applied to mine - wasn't insulted per say but did wonder why she was there.


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

Is it true that Nikki Walton no longer owns the site?  If so who owns it?   Whose texturemedia?   Just wondering.....


----------



## BostonMaria (Jul 4, 2014)

girlcherokee said:


> Is it true that Nikki Walton no longer owns the site?  If so who owns it?   Whose texturemedia?   Just wondering.....



Naturallycurly.com owners (2 white women) bought over the blog about 3-4 years ago.


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

Thanks Maria - then I think this explains it.   :-( 
Sounds like there is a lot more going on here than "inclusion"


----------



## MixedBerry (Jul 4, 2014)

BostonMaria said:


> Naturallycurly.com owners (2 white women) bought over the blog about 3-4 years ago.




Well damn. She sold out, both literally and figuratively. ohwell:


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 4, 2014)

I was on naturally curly and this WW said that curlynikki was never for black woman, just dominated by them. She said black women are narrow minded to think WW could not understand the struggle. She said she understood because she had in fact seen Roots.

Thats when I left. Also Sarah keeps popping in and out of the forums directing people to her site if they are interested in the 411. She is cashing in on this.


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

Can anyone tell me where I can find "natural hair" sites that are truly dedicated to the kinky/curly hair and that are owned by people who are black?    "For us about us" 
I put quotes on "natural hair" now because suddenly I guess the term no longer belongs to us?


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 4, 2014)

^^^ blackgirllonghair.com is the only other hair site I go to besides this one.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 4, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> I was on naturally curly and this WW said that curlynikki was never for black woman, just dominated by them. She said black women are narrow minded to think WW could not understand the struggle. She said she understood because she had in fact seen Roots.
> 
> Thats when I left. Also Sarah keeps popping in and out of the forums directing people to her site if they are interested in the 411. She is cashing in on this.



She had seen Roots? I can't believe you. This can't be real life. 

Sent from my Snow White Frost Galaxy S4 using LHCF


----------



## MilkChocolateOne (Jul 4, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> I was on naturally curly and this WW said that curlynikki was never for black woman, just dominated by them. She said black women are narrow minded to think WW could not understand the struggle. *She said she understood because she had in fact seen Roots.*
> 
> Thats when I left. Also Sarah keeps popping in and out of the forums directing people to her site if they are interested in the 411. She is cashing in on this.


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 4, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> ^^^ blackgirllonghair.com is the only other hair site I go to besides this one.



Your hair in your avi is very beautiful. Tis is all.


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 4, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> She said black women are narrow minded to think WW could not understand the struggle. She said she understood because she had in fact seen Roots.



  

#exitsthread!


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 4, 2014)

Froreal3 said:


> She had seen Roots? I can't believe you. This can't be real life.
> 
> Sent from my Snow White Frost Galaxy S4 using LHCF





MilkChocolateOne said:


>





Saludable84 said:


> #exitsthread!




Yes. I read that and was to through. I am not against women who want to learn about their hair and share tips and information, but when you start disrespecting us and diminishing OUR struggle as the ones who pioneered the movement, then pretend as though we had blip to do with its uprising... that's where I have a problem. This is not a WW movement. They can be included but don't try and Columbus it. At least take the time to understand what it was all about, the history, the prejudice, the pain, the racism.


----------



## cocosweet (Jul 4, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> I was on naturally curly and this WW said that curlynikki was never for black woman, just dominated by them. *She said black women are narrow minded to think WW could not understand the struggle. She said she understood because she had in fact seen Roots.
> *
> Thats when I left. Also Sarah keeps popping in and out of the forums directing people to her site if they are interested in the 411. She is cashing in on this.



Well I guess we should just give her a PhD in Negritude right now then. "Roots--the alpha and omega of all things black." Who knew?


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 4, 2014)

Kunta is looking at her like


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

Reminds me of my college days when I had a Caucasian female professor who tried to argue with a straight face that the plight of the Caucasian female was as bad as that of the African American - smh - at this whole thing - I think we better wake up or the natural hair movement is going to go the way of the black radio stations we no longer have(WBLS anyone?) and the way of the  black entertainment TV (BET) we no longer own.   Hmmmm.   Anybody see a trend here?  I could go on if you need more.   Anyone wonder why we were hating our hair in the first place?    Does anyone honestly think that if we went back 1000 years to Africa our ancestors were sitting there complaining about how kinky their hair was?   So um - where do you think these complains really came from?   Think about it.....   I'm looking for specific youtubers and sites to support.


----------



## SimJam (Jul 4, 2014)

You know what I find reprehensible, the fact that ppl are OK with trivializing slavery in general and black ppls fight for freedom (lets just leave it at physical freedom for now)

this blasted WW is gonna say she watched Roots so now shes "one of us" ??? 

The holocaust and everything around it is apparent hallowed ground .... really if someone said oh "I watched Schidlers list, now Im one with dem jews" I can just imagine the outrage.

I know this is off on a tangent but this whole debacle is just pissin me the **** off!!!!


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

Thanks missc320 - I'll be looking that one up.   Anyone have any other suggestions?


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

The more disturbing part is that WE don't feel the right to be hurt and angry at having been enslaved, denigrated, beat up, institutionally held back and down and told we are ugly - we have to act and feel politically correct.  I repeat what I said earlier - people are people but we have a right to feel our pain - and we have a right to have space and time to heal it.   
I'm not apologizing for saying ouch.  OUCH. now go home and leave us to our natural hair community.


----------



## CurlyBuu (Jul 4, 2014)

I wasn't a huge fan of curlynikki but she was one of the first sites I went to for natural hair advice after my big chop. 

I vouched for her when she sold her company and she was feeling the heat from that. Angers me that this is how she wants to go out.

On the plus side though, this debate has really "cleaned house" for me. Watching Taren Guy and Sunkiss jump in and cape for this girl has made me hop off both their fences.

Some said it wasn't a curious thing for them to do because if white women did get welcomed into the movement that they (and other popular light skinned/loose curls gurus) will be the new mouth piece on natural hair.

Just pisses me off that Taren took the opposite side when the texture discrimination video was posted. She said that if kinky hair chicks want to see more dark skinned ladies with right curls, we need to create that. Like that wasn't the goal from the beginning *eyeroll*

Now here we are defending the little space we have and shame on us for not making more room for white women. Miss me with that


----------



## koolkittychick (Jul 4, 2014)

I just read this thread from beginning to end, and I don't have much to add to it except to say that:

I am so glad I never was a fan of Curly Nikki, the person or the site, since I always felt she was more interested on chasing a dollar, even if it meant climbing into Massah's lap to get it.
I am saddened to see so many Black women, especially on CN, who seem to feel that the natural hair movement only has legitimacy when White people want to Colombus it. :-\
Once again, Felicity gets a pass because too many of us (including Nikki) are more interested in being catty amongst ourselves than spent the time and effort to call her on her trolling BS, like that one smart woman did.

I am just glad we are now taking a stand and not letting this Colombusing happen here, lest we follow in the footsteps of the following examples:

Face of Rock 'n' Roll: Elvis Presley
Face of Rap: Macklemore/Iggy Azealea
Face of Cornrow hairstyle: Bo Derek/Kylie Jenner
Face of Twerking: Miley Cyrus

and now,

Face of Natural Hair Movement: Sarah/Felicity?!?
Bye Felicity, Bye!


----------



## Amarilles (Jul 4, 2014)

I think the problem with exclusivity is that black Americans end up shutting out black non-Americans for not quite understanding. Black people elsewhere don't always feel that exclusivity is needed because they may already be included in their society...and do not understand the deep-rooted issues in the US. Some black peoples (non-Americans) take little to no reservations with white people, all because of inclusion. For example in France, black people are French and white people are French, the term "African French" does not exist. Inclusion always lessens a divide. I'm a black Hispanic, grew up in the states, lived in Montreal and now in Paris...as per my personal experience with black people in these different places, the black and white divide has struck the US the worst. Our black Americans struggle the most as far as acceptance, our white Americans are the most clueless to that struggle.

And so, I'm torn. I wish we could include white American women's struggles (whatever they may be) but then reading their comments anger me. White Americans really have the most catching up to do, in my opinion.

I've officially unsubscribed from both Nikki and Sarah. Both handled this so poorly, Sarah with her clueless remarks and Nikki with her "6000 clicks. 20 minutes” Twitter BS. Both with their agendas. Such a shame. I'm so disappointed in these two, they could've handled this so much better.


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

Haven't read through everything but, y'all know I had to chime in on this one.  Yes, it's good to be inclusive and "we are the world," kumbiya (sp), etc.  And I certainly am NOT a believer in making any assumptions about anyone based solely on race/appearance -- I have had  many white/non-Black people treat me and my family with love, grace, respect and conversely, had just as many Black people act like complete idiots, on the job, at the store, yada yada.  That said, I just wanna know:  *what the he!! happened to Black Pride?* Did "they" (whoever "they" is) guilt it out of us? 

Back in the 70s (yeah, I'm a lady of a certain age and I still look good, thank-you), I remember as a little girl all of the products, styles, expressions, hand-shakes, dances, foods, shows, music that were uniquely and unapologetically BLACK.  Black was beautiful and we were saying it loud and proud.  (James sang the song but Smokey wrote a poem all 'bout it -- check it out.) Indeed, some of my earliest memories were of holding my ears and the scent of UltraSheen Cream Satin Press (still love that smell) as we watched Don Cornelius and alllllll those fros bobin' up and down on Sooooooooul Train every other Saturday AM. My family was one of the first to integrate into our corner of the burbs (to my great dismay) and I cherished and extolled anything Afro-Sheen related and any/all things red-black-and-green with a fist silhouette or a fro or that smelled like incense and the record store.  

Even as the only Black girl in my day-camp troop, when I handed my matching lucite brush and comb to the White camp counselor after a day in the pool and waited for her to make my hair pretty as she had done for the little White campers, I didn't get mad when she threw up her hands in exasperation and said (so all could hear), "I don't know what to do with _this_." It was the "this" that got me.  Referring to my beautiful, thick, tightly coiled hair that did not like the chlorine she said "this" with such disgust and disdain -- I remember the look on the other girls' faces as I got up, put my little brush set back in my bag and went home with my hair still looking a mess.  (That and the second grade teacher who told me that the White Barbie was "just betterrrr" (you know the tone) than the Black one because of the hair left an indelible impression -- not about me and my hair mind you (fortunately home gave me enough pride to combat that) but about others and the way that others view our hair. This ish is highly personally to Black Women y'all -- recognize.

We were all too happy to pump our fist and embrace all that was and is uniquely "ours."  Now ... this did NOT mean that we didn't invite others in to share/witness. (Don't we always?) Quite the contrary.  But the difference between then and now is that we didn't make any _apologies _for wanting to call it our own. If you ask me, that's what made it so attractive to everyone else.

I remember the first hints of this Black guilt 'ish in high school when the group of us Black kids who were college bound enjoyed sitting together in the lunch room.  We would go back to our AP classes where we were the "onlies" and the distinguished clubs where we were the "firsts" but at fifth period, we were convening at the Black lunch table and EN-JOY-ING it and each other's company. Everyone at the table wasn't necessarily college bound but they were positive and we shared useful, low-stress info like ... there was a new "Soul-Scissors" coming to town and the girl at the last booth was the only one who knew how to do a good asymmetrical cut. We also played Uno and talked about Black Colleges that we had visited (without having to explain "why") -- which sororities we wanted to pledge, which frats had the cutest guys, whose homecoming/band was the best, etc. and do you know what? Some of the folks who weren't college bound, got sort of interested because they felt comfortable and un-judged asking/sharing ... at the Black lunch table during 5th period. We would go back to our classes/friends/interests of different backgrounds and know that the next day, we would again convene to, e.g., compare lyrics from the latest rap song hand-scribbled in pencil on a loose-leaf piece of paper. (They didn't play rap on the radio back then y'all so it was strictly underground and sort of insular.)

At some point right before the end of my junior year, some of the "enlightened"  (mentally, not skin color) started passing along "concerns" from the majority students that they didn't understand why we didn't want to sit with them and they wondered what they could do to be more "all-inclusive."

In hindsight, the answer should have probably been "leave us be; we don't have a problem with you all, we just need a little *US* time."  If that had been our response on a larger scale, our Black business communities would not have been completely decimated by integration and Blacks wouldn't be topping the unemployment rates - over and above anybody. And I know that this is a touchy subject, you have to ask, if we had continued to embrace our "us-ness," would there really be some high schools now a days where you literally _never _see a Black boy with a Black girlfriend?  Love who you want but the phenom has GOT to give you pause. 

So I say all this to say, that OU-R hair (and I have enough education/credentials to be able to pronounce "our" with two syllables when I feel like it) is OU-R thing.  True, some of it looks like other peoples' and if, like the lady in Walgreens with an adopted Ethiopian baby, you ask me about Bronner Brothers grease versus Sufur8, I will gladly share that information.  But please (please) know that you are stepping on hallowed ground -- OU-R hair is our Crowning Glory and I don't care if it plasters our forehead in the rain because of late-night or cross-town tipping or stands up like steel freakin' wool in the face of homemade lye, it is OU-R's!!!!!  And after all of the ish that we have endured (yup, I'm talkin' bout rejection from some of our own) because of it, we have earned the right to include or exclude whomever we want in the discussion. 

Look-a-here: we are and have been defining this ish as we have defined culture since the beginning of time. We gave birth to civilization so, please (please), give us our props, a "cold glass of water" (in memory of Sister Maya) and just step back. We have survived because we have places of respite and refuge where we can do "US" -- in the church, at the lunch table, and now, on the hair boards. (Wasn't it enough that we nurtured and actually nursed future slave masters when common sense and a bit of hemlock might have suggested otherwise?) Dang.

Aren't other cultures proud of their special sauces, chicken dishes, music, beauty regimes?  No matter how long they have been here, they always refer to the special thing/ritual from "their country." True they sometimes share info, but so do we. The difference is that everyone always expects us to give up our "us-ness."  I ain't doing it. How 'bout that?  I don't care how curly kinky nappy your hair is, if you haven't shared my cultural experience, I still want the right/ability to converse with those who do -- without guilt or apology. And guess what, when you start to water down the "us-ness," you loose me.

Now, with hand on hip, neck going, finger waging and 40 plus years of building/embracing/enhancing/supporting stuff and watching others step in and claim it as their own I say, "leave it alone." You are welcomed to be sure; but _know _that in the context of discussing Black Hair (no matter the curve, kink or lack thereof) you are a guest.


----------



## koolkittychick (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk, PREACH!!!!! *stands and slow claps*


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk.  Stands with excitement and claps!    You said it!   No apologies.


----------



## havilland (Jul 4, 2014)

After what rawsilk said. This thread can officially be silenced.  She said it all. And then some.  

Pass the plate please....the ushers will be coming around for your donations. 

The Church is ready for the benediction!

AMEN AMEN AMEN.


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

LOL -- y'all are silly.  Thank you for positive comments -- felt good to let that out and exhale. 





havilland said:


> After what rawsilk said. This thread can officially be silenced.  She said it all. And then some.
> 
> Pass the plate please....the ushers will be coming around for your donations.
> 
> ...


----------



## cocosweet (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk,


----------



## cami88 (Jul 4, 2014)

If it comes out that white folks own Nappturality I will be #deadandburied.

Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF


----------



## havilland (Jul 4, 2014)

cami88 said:


> If it comes out that white folks own Nappturality I will be #deadandburied.  Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF


  Nah.  Turns out nappturality knew what they were doing all along. I used to be turned off by how you had to be "referred" by someone and how you couldn't even mention straight hair on their site. Turns out they knew what was up all along.   

And don't get it twisted. There is a long hair care site for WW that we can't join either.  You have to know a secret code in order to add your profile. THEY know what's up too.   

I really can't say anymore on this topic.  This whole thing has me feeling some kind of way.....rawsilk covered it best. She came with the big momma knowledge. We need to respect and learn.


----------



## KidneyBean86 (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk said:


> Haven't read through everything but, y'all know I had to chime in on this one.  Yes, it's good to be inclusive and "we are the world," kumbiya (sp), etc.  And I certainly am NOT a believer in making any assumptions about anyone based solely on race/appearance -- I have had  many white/non-Black people treat me and my family with love, grace, respect and conversely, had just as many Black people act like complete idiots, on the job, at the store, yada yada.  That said, I just wanna know:  *what the he!! happened to Black Pride?* Did "they" (whoever "they" is) guilt it out of us?
> 
> Back in the 70s (yeah, I'm a lady of a certain age and I still look good, thank-you), I remember as a little girl all of the products, styles, expressions, hand-shakes, dances, foods, shows, music that were uniquely and unapologetically BLACK.  Black was beautiful and we were saying it loud and proud.  (James sang the song but Smokey wrote a poem all 'bout it -- check it out.) Indeed, some of my earliest memories were of holding my ears and the scent of UltraSheen Cream Satin Press (still love that smell) as we watched Don Cornelius and alllllll those fros bobin' up and down on Sooooooooul Train every other Saturday AM. My family was one of the first to integrate into our corner of the burbs (to my great dismay) and I cherished and extolled anything Afro-Sheen related and any/all things red-black-and-green with a fist silhouette or a fro or that smelled like incense and the record store.
> 
> ...



Let the church say AMEN! This post said it all.


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 4, 2014)

You just SHUT IT DOWN! Do You mind if I share your response on other boards? Obviously stating it is not my reply and giving you props for your words.


----------



## sunnieb (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk - Girrrllll you betta shut yo mouth with all that sense outta this NONsense!

You took me back to the 70s too!  My momma made hair miracles using grease, a bowl of water and a goody brush.  It was OK to be black and proud of it.  White folk left us alone with our stuff and we were fine.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 4, 2014)

Amarilles said:


> I think the problem with exclusivity is that *black Americans end up shutting out black non-Americans for not quite understanding. Black people elsewhere don't always feel that exclusivity is needed because they may already be included in their society...and do not understand the deep-rooted issues in the US.*




Amarilles I feel what you're saying. However, I believe that what we have experienced with natural hair transcends national borders and reaches black women/people across the diaspora. I want to clarify that this is not about American blacks vs. blacks of other nationalities.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk said:


> Haven't read through everything but, y'all know I had to chime in on this one.  Yes, it's good to be inclusive and "we are the world," kumbiya (sp), etc.  And I certainly am NOT a believer in making any assumptions about anyone based solely on race/appearance -- I have had  many white/non-Black people treat me and my family with love, grace, respect and conversely, had just as many Black people act like complete idiots, on the job, at the store, yada yada.  That said, I just wanna know:  *what the he!! happened to Black Pride?* Did "they" (whoever "they" is) guilt it out of us?
> 
> Back in the 70s (yeah, I'm a lady of a certain age and I still look good, thank-you), I remember as a little girl all of the products, styles, expressions, hand-shakes, dances, foods, shows, music that were uniquely and unapologetically BLACK.  Black was beautiful and we were saying it loud and proud.  (James sang the song but Smokey wrote a poem all 'bout it -- check it out.) Indeed, some of my earliest memories were of holding my ears and the scent of UltraSheen Cream Satin Press (still love that smell) as we watched Don Cornelius and alllllll those fros bobin' up and down on Sooooooooul Train every other Saturday AM. My family was one of the first to integrate into our corner of the burbs (to my great dismay) and I cherished and extolled anything Afro-Sheen related and any/all things red-black-and-green with a fist silhouette or a fro or that smelled like incense and the record store.
> 
> ...










That lunch room thing was real for me too! They even wrote a book about it.


----------



## Leeda.the.Paladin (Jul 4, 2014)

Wow what a mess. 

I didn't read the article about the the white girl but those tweets someone posted up thread says a lot. 

I don't know how to properly word what I want to say, so I'll just be quiet. I'm happy to see such a passionate response though.


----------



## Divine. (Jul 4, 2014)

I was at the store today and I couldn't help but gush over the cashier's natural hair from the line. When it was my turn to check out, she exclaimed "I love your hair!" I responded in kind, then she said "It must be a natural hair thing. There's always a connection when we get together!"

Her saying that is really at the heart of what the natural hair community is all about. Immediately identifying with women who have undergone the same obstacles to embracing not only their hair, but the skin they're in too. How many times have you met a fellow natural at the store and within a few seconds, you guys are engaging in great conversation? There's something about that immediate connection that others will never be able to fully understand.


----------



## Ogoma (Jul 4, 2014)

Which Paris is this one? Because it ain't the one in France. Just had a chat with a black guy that just moved from Paris and a white friend of mine that have lived in Paris for a long time. If black people want any chance of a career in finance, they need to move to London because they have barely a chance. They were recounting the deep institutional racism that works to keep black and brown people as second class citizens and how they use not collecting stats on race to cover up the extent of the racism.

How anyone can claim there are no issues with racism in France with all the recent race related issues going on over there is mind-boggling. Do you guys know this is not 1889. You can't lie to me. 




Amarilles said:


> I think the problem with exclusivity is that black Americans end up shutting out black non-Americans for not quite understanding. Black people elsewhere don't always feel that exclusivity is needed because they may already be included in their society...and do not understand the deep-rooted issues in the US. Some black peoples (non-Americans) take little to no reservations with white people, all because of inclusion. For example in France, black people are French and white people are French, the term "African French" does not exist. Inclusion always lessens a divide. I'm a black Hispanic, grew up in the states, lived in Montreal and now in Paris...as per my personal experience with black people in these different places, the black and white divide has struck the US the worst. Our black Americans struggle the most as far as acceptance, our white Americans are the most clueless to that struggle.
> 
> And so, I'm torn. I wish we could include white American women's struggles (whatever they may be) but then reading their comments anger me. White Americans really have the most catching up to do, in my opinion.
> 
> I've officially unsubscribed from both Nikki and Sarah. Both handled this so poorly, Sarah with her clueless remarks and Nikki with her "6000 clicks. 20 minutes” Twitter BS. Both with their agendas. Such a shame. I'm so disappointed in these two, they could've handled this so much better.


----------



## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 4, 2014)

havilland said:


> Nah.  Turns out nappturality knew what they were doing all along. I used to be turned off by how you had to be "referred" by someone and how you couldn't even mention straight hair on their site. Turns out they knew what was up all along.
> 
> And don't get it twisted. There is a long hair care site for WW that we can't join either.  *You have to know a secret code in order to add your profile*. THEY know what's up too.
> 
> I really can't say anymore on this topic.  This whole thing has me feeling some kind of way.....rawsilk covered it best. She came with the big momma knowledge. We need to respect and learn.



Really? I so did not know that. Wow.


----------



## CocoGlow (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk 

Your response should be featured & widely publicized all over social media .... what a great writer! I felt like I was right there during 5th period with you at the lunch table LOL ... you articulated what needs to be said so well .... and it was not offensive, just real and from the heart!

A *lot *of you ladies have explained it so well


----------



## DoDo (Jul 4, 2014)

cami88 said:


> If it comes out that white folks own Nappturality I will be #deadandburied.
> 
> Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF



They will have to pry that site from Deecoily's cold dead hands.

Deecoily = *#Neverscared*


----------



## havilland (Jul 4, 2014)

NaturallyATLPCH said:


> Really? I so did not know that. Wow.



Yep.  I wish I could remember the name.  I found it early in my journey.  SMH


----------



## marta9227 (Jul 4, 2014)

havilland said:


> And don't get it twisted. There is a long hair care site for WW that we can't join either.  You have to know a secret code in order to add your profile. THEY know what's up too.



This is so true which is why I'm so perplexed. They have their own sites, we have ours. Reason being we have different hair with different hair needs! Why the girl wanted to be on the site and why they had her on makes no sense- unless everyone comes clean and admits the whole thing was a publicity stunt.


----------



## CocoGlow (Jul 4, 2014)

At this point I feel as if there is nothing left to debate....

If a person can honestly read all the backlash and still not understand .... and still want to assert their agenda, then they are willfully ignoring the feelings of the majority within this movement which is extremely disrespectful!

You don't have to "get it" ... you don't have to agree .... but you are not going to bully or guilt trip your way into this.

I mean the audacity!! 

I could never bogart my way into some other movement that has nothing to do with me ... and even if I did out of ignorance & then got told about myself by those within it, I would have the humility to recognize my mistake, try to understand where they are coming from and gracefully make my exit ... but then again, I don't have issues with entitlement and inserting myself into other people's affairs ....


----------



## Amarilles (Jul 4, 2014)

Ogoma said:


> Which Paris is this one? Because it ain't the one in France. Just had a chat with a black guy that just moved from Paris and a white friend of mine that have lived in Paris for a long time. If black people want any chance of a career in finance, they need to move to London because they have barely a chance. They were recounting the deep institutional racism that works to keep black and brown people as second class citizens and how they use not collecting stats on race to cover up the extent of the racism.
> 
> How anyone can claim there are no issues with racism in France with all the recent race related issues going on over there is mind-boggling. Do you guys know this is not 1889. You can't lie to me.


Ogoma erplexed do not get confused, because I did not say that racism was a non issue. I said the divide is *less*. In Paris (uh, the one in France?) I have personally seen black and white older ladies being the best of friends. I've ran across many "odd" racial pairings that I've noted and remembered...because I just never saw friendship pairings like those at home. 

The Minister of Justice has been compared to monkey by those of the right, which sparked an outcry and outrage, but it happened and does happen. She's a black woman that always wears her hair in cornrows. And is not fashionable, and doesn't have a particularly desirable shape. And she's accepted by most as is, despite her hair and style not conforming to the European standards of beauty. 

At no point did I imply or say that there was zero racism? Your friends should've also mentioned that those who are of the right (and far right) have issues with everyone that is not French "de souche" meaning pure, or native born. It really is not about being black per se (maybe moreso about being Arab as they are usually at the receiving end of all injustices). It's about not being 100% French.

Sorry for the off topic


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 4, 2014)

sunnieb said:


> rawsilk - Girrrllll you betta shut yo mouth with all that sense outta this NONsense!  You took me back to the 70s too!  My momma made hair miracles using grease, a bowl of water and a goody brush.  It was OK to be black and proud of it.  White folk left us alone with our stuff and we were fine.



Back then we weren't to be feared, just oppressed. Today not so much. We were shunned, so we took ourselves back and now people wanna hang out with the cool kids.  

I said it once, I'll say it again: Black is the new cool!


----------



## DoDo (Jul 4, 2014)

Saludable84 said:


> Back then we weren't to be feared, just oppressed. Today not so much. We were shunned, so we took ourselves back and now people wanna hang out with the cool kids.
> 
> I said it once, I'll say it again: Black is the new cool!



:reddancer:


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> I was on naturally curly and this WW said that curlynikki was never for black woman, just dominated by them. She said black women are narrow minded to think WW could not understand the struggle. She said she understood because she had in fact seen Roots.
> 
> Thats when I left. Also Sarah keeps popping in and out of the forums directing people to her site if they are interested in the 411. She is cashing in on this.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

CurlyBuu said:


> I wasn't a huge fan of curlynikki but she was one of the first sites I went to for natural hair advice after my big chop.
> 
> I vouched for her when she sold her company and she was feeling the heat from that. Angers me that this is how she wants to go out.
> 
> ...



WHAT THE FRENCH TOAST?!?!?  She just lost a long time subber who never watched her videos!!!  Think I'm playing!


----------



## DoDo (Jul 4, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> WHAT THE FRENCH TOAST?!?!?  She just lost a long time subber who never watched her videos!!!  Think I'm playing!



I just unsubscribed too.

I was already on the fence anyway .


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk

You have awaken my inner militant!  You have a way with words! 









Lets all say "BYE FELICIA!"  to Sarah who has disrupted our peace!!

I'm off to find a panthers chapter to join.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

Just on a side note... I almost peed my pants with the Felicity gifs


----------



## MzRhonda (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk

  

Well said and I too am a product of the 70's and remember vividly all that you described.....oh how I miss it. 

I have seen many upper middle class thriving black neighborhood with black businesses taken over by "them"....we moved out, in the name of redevelopment  so they can build things for themselves, us having to split up and move into various other neighborhoods and losing our tight knit community and businesses only to have to now buy goods and services from them.


----------



## felic1 (Jul 4, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> Yes. I read that and was to through. I am not against women who want to learn about their hair and share tips and information, but when you start disrespecting us and diminishing OUR struggle as the ones who pioneered the movement, then pretend as though we had blip to do with its uprising... that's where I have a problem. This is not a WW movement. They can be included but don't try and Columbus it. At least take the time to understand what it was all about, the history, the prejudice, the pain, the racism.



curlytwirly06    I had to quote this. The WW want to claim that they were the discoverers of the natural hair movement? They want to be Columbus. This is a really great statement. I am not saying that their attempts to thwart and coup de tat (sp) the natural hair movementis a great idea. It is preposterous. I did not know that CN had sold the blog. It may have been sold prior to my joining LHCF in 2011erplexed. CN(NW) appears to be very involved in the posts that appear on the blog.The posts are written in her name and with her pictures and she does not have anything to do with operations? Is this true? Is nothing sacred? Black women going natural is a cash cow for the Becky group? This is a sell out. Sarah wishes to divide and conquer.


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

Don't mind at all. 





curlytwirly06 said:


> You just SHUT IT DOWN! Do You mind if I share your response on other boards? Obviously stating it is not my reply and giving you props for your words.


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

LOL -- I wasn't able to open the Kerry W. loop before - hilarious. 





cocosweet said:


> rawsilk,


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

LOL Yeah Girl, Power to the People and all that. A collective "Bye Felicia" re the whole negative vibe is in order.  (Sidenote: do women named Felicia still tell people their real name? I feel kinda bad for them. LOL) 





Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> rawsilk
> 
> You have awaken my inner militant!  You have a way with words!
> 
> ...


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

OMG, not the Goody Brush LOL -- takes me back.  (Anybody remember Dipity-Doo and HairSoNew?) 



sunnieb said:


> rawsilk - Girrrllll you betta shut yo mouth with all that sense outta this NONsense!
> 
> You took me back to the 70s too!  My momma made hair miracles using grease, a bowl of water and a goody brush.  It was OK to be black and proud of it.  White folk left us alone with our stuff and we were fine.


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

Please don't even get me started on the money other folk are making off of us and our hair -- my keyboard might melt. 





MzRhonda said:


> rawsilk
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

LOL re vid-loop and thanks for that link!! I remember seeing her promote that book about 10 years ago and noting how much it resonated and filled in the blanks left by the "nothing is wrong with Black kids who sound white" discussion. 





Froreal3 said:


> That lunch room thing was real for me too! They even wrote a book about it.


----------



## rawsilk (Jul 4, 2014)

Thank you -- it's so nice to feel comfortable sharing and then be appreciated for doing so. 





NappyRina said:


> rawsilk
> 
> Your response should be featured & widely publicized all over social media .... what a great writer! I felt like I was right there during 5th period with you at the lunch table LOL ... you articulated what needs to be said so well .... and it was not offensive, just real and from the heart!
> 
> A *lot *of you ladies have explained it so well


----------



## Adiatasha (Jul 4, 2014)

Great thread!!!!
I am definitely enjoying this dialogue.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 4, 2014)

rawsilk  up in her starting a revaluation!!! 
http://youtu.be/j0A_N-wmiMo


----------



## ellebelle88 (Jul 5, 2014)

....................


----------



## lalla (Jul 5, 2014)

Ogoma said:


> Which Paris is this one? Because it ain't the one in France. Just had a chat with a black guy that just moved from Paris and a white friend of mine that have lived in Paris for a long time. If black people want any chance of a career in finance, they need to move to London because they have barely a chance. They were recounting the deep institutional racism that works to keep black and brown people as second class citizens and how they use not collecting stats on race to cover up the extent of the racism.
> 
> How anyone can claim there are no issues with racism in France with all the recent race related issues going on over there is mind-boggling. Do you guys know this is not 1889. You can't lie to me.



I, and other black friends of mine have worked in finance (m&a, transaction services, asset management, pe etc...) . We didn't have to go to London to do that. And we are not alone, Lionel zinsou is head of pai partners, one of the largest pe fund in Europe. To be honest, a large share of finance graduates from top business schools are Moroccan. And they find jobs quite easily. 
The advantage of London (and Switzerland ) is that the financial industry is much larger there. London has much more financial activity than Paris dies. 

Not collecting racial stats is something that existed long before there was a sizeable black presence in Metropolitan France. It was actually decided after WW2, because those types of data were used to identify and deport Jews. 

I am not saying that racism does not exist.  But painting France as a hell for black people is quite incorrect IME.


----------



## felic1 (Jul 5, 2014)

I went to the grocery store to get some cat food. On the way in I saw a lady (yt) with pretty red curly hair. I said " your hair looks pretty!" She responded, "Thank you! It's natural by the way". I guess that means no artificial color or permanent.


----------



## westNDNbeauty (Jul 5, 2014)

I share this in the other thread, I figured I'd share it here too:

The debate of White women joining the #naturalhair movement continues. Now there are accusations of APARTHEID?! Ironic how this is all occurring during the celebration of America's independence, a holiday which we are ALL celebrating, though most of us were slaves at that time. I say that to say, we CAN share in some experiences together. But there is historical relevance of why the acceptance of our #naturalhair hair is a big deal for Black women. Equating the White woman's struggle of having curly hair is not the equivalent of the journey our little girls experience growing up with kinky hair. Quite frankly, I've always understood #teamnatural to be the opposite of #teamrelaxed, which many naturals were previous to #teamnatural. What "team" were White women on before #teamnatural? No shade. Help me understand. 

Honestly, we all need to agree to disagree. We are out here tripping when there are are other battles to be fought


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 5, 2014)

Apparently, CN is deleting posts and blocking posters that do not agree with her gentrifying stance on the Natural Hair movement.


----------



## DoDo (Jul 5, 2014)

JulietWhiskey said:


> Apparently, CN is deleting posts and blocking posters that do not agree with her gentrifying stance on the Natural Hair movement.



Wow. 

That doesn't change her readership's opinions though and it doesn't help to deflect attention from how the situation was poorly handled.


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 5, 2014)

DoDo said:


> Wow.
> 
> That doesn't change her readership's opinions though and it doesn't help to deflect attention from how the situation was poorly handled.


 

Yeah, I'm done with her.


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 5, 2014)

JulietWhiskey said:


> Apparently, CN is deleting posts and blocking posters that do not agree with her gentrifying stance on the Natural Hair movement.[/QUOTE
> 
> Yeah she is. My post never Made it through and I was quite polite about expressing my views. She wants to make it look like her opinion is valid and everyone else agrees with her whole heartedly.


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 5, 2014)

Ya'll need to stop going over there giving her clicks. I hope she wakes up tomorrow to zero followers and a site full of white women.


----------



## cami88 (Jul 5, 2014)

KammyGirl said:


> Ya'll need to stop going over there giving her clicks. I hope she wakes up tomorrow to zero followers and a site full of white women.



   I hope she wakes up to zero followers of any ethnicity.

Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF


----------



## Ogoma (Jul 5, 2014)

lalla said:


> I, and other black friends of mine have worked in finance (m&a, transaction services, asset management, pe etc...) . We didn't have to go to London to do that. And we are not alone, Lionel zinsou is head of pai partners, one of the largest pe fund in Europe. To be honest, a large share of finance graduates from top business schools are Moroccan. And they find jobs quite easily.
> The advantage of London (and Switzerland ) is that the financial industry is much larger there. London has much more financial activity than Paris dies.
> 
> Not collecting racial stats is something that existed long before there was a sizeable black presence in Metropolitan France. It was actually decided after WW2, because those types of data were used to identify and deport Jews.
> ...



I did my study abroad at HEC for 6 months and I was friends with some Moroccans in my class and they would absolutely disagree with you that it was easy to find finance jobs. I don't know if we are discussing different types of finance jobs, but I am referencing MBA level jobs.

IME, the racism in France is worse than that in England, US, and Canada.


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 5, 2014)

KammyGirl said:


> Ya'll need to stop going over there giving her clicks. I hope she wakes up tomorrow to zero followers and a site full of white women.


 
KammyGirl

I didn't give her any clicks. She's done gettin' my clicks, ! 

Several posters were commenting on her deleting unfavorable posts in the article on BGLH that *compared the desire to keep the Natural Movement a Black movement to apartheid in SA.*




*.*

*APARTHIED.*

*Re-reads history of apartheid, reads the article on BGLH.*

*Yep.*

*It's EXACTLY the same.*


----------



## Subscribe (Jul 5, 2014)

havilland said:


> After what rawsilk said. This thread can officially be silenced.  She said it all. And then some.
> 
> Pass the plate please....the ushers will be coming around for your donations.
> 
> ...



Let the church say Amen.


----------



## Subscribe (Jul 5, 2014)

cami88 said:


> If it comes out that white folks own Nappturality I will be #deadandburied.
> 
> Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF



I think there are a lot of hidden white faces in the black natural hair movement.


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 5, 2014)

From a poster on Naturally Curly :

The article that was linked didn't say that type three hair wasn't accepted in the natural movement--though I'm sure someone has felt that way. And even if the article had said that, it would be nonsense.

So is the idea that the natural hair movement isn't for white women--give me a break. One of the lead forums that has spear-headed "the natural hair movement" and been a resource for folks including future bloggers/vloggers and Youtubers etc. is this site which was created by white women long before many black women could stand to look at the hair growing from their head. I hate it when people don't know history/facts.

http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/3/173349-not-us.html


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 5, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> From a poster on Naturally Curly :
> 
> The article that was linked didn't say that type three hair wasn't accepted in the natural movement--though I'm sure someone has felt that way. And even if the article had said that, it would be nonsense.
> P
> ...


----------



## cami88 (Jul 5, 2014)

Subscribe said:


> I think there are a lot of hidden white faces in the black natural hair movement.



Sadly, I think you might be right. I am just floored that Curly Nikki would sell her site to white people. It feels like the time I learned Ampro gel was manufactured by whites.

Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 5, 2014)

Some interesting stuff from another forum about how NC is wanting to monopolize the Natural Movement:

Ironically enough, CharJay tweeted this in 2011, in response to some other Curly Nikki drama.

Read This After reading the attachments: 

POSTER 1: Notice the issue of Naturally Curly buying up black owned sites came up in the letter. The following bloggers/sites were all bought out by NC.

CharJay (above)
Quest/Denim Pixie (just mentioned her yesterday)
Taren916 ()
NaturalChica 


POster 2
The poster in this thread that said that the bloggers speaking out for CN all happened to be NC sponsored, was spot on. CharJay didn't weigh in on the recent controversy but her tweet from 2011 is enough to let me know how she thinks.


I remember when that letter was posted on here, I unsubscribed from CharJay and AE back then.
I was done with DenimPixie and Curlykimmystar the other day too and I think I also unsubscribed from Makeupandbeautyjunki e.
Not NaturalChica too? 

Dang, NC wants to own the natural hair movement.


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 5, 2014)

Another post from another form talking about how Nikki has always been about her money over loyalty and has plagiarized (read stolen) content from BGLH a while back:

Originally Posted by lurkinonthelow  View Post
First let me say that I joined this forum JUST SO I COULD COMMENT ON THIS THREAD (lol!) That's how deep this is to me.

I am SO HAPPY that people are putting two and two together regarding Nikki and her shady ways. I've been a fan of Black Girl Long Hair since it started and I witnessed the fight (well, really it was one-sided, so I should say "the bullying") in 2009. But ladies, that's just the half of it. I was so upset about the whole incident that I started tracking other instances of CN's shadyness. So you ready? Here we go:

1. In March 2009, although it's very clear that she's, um, borrowed heavily from the tone and content of BGLH, CN publicizes private emails that Leila sends her, asking her to stop.

2. I know for a fact that Leila reached out to CN at LEAST 3 times to try to smooth things over, in addition to a third blogger reaching out to both to try to reconcile, CN didn't respond all 3 times.

3. CN keeps the post bashing Leila and BGLH up on her site for MONTHS, and allows over 300 nasty comments towards Leila to accrue. She only takes the post down the week she is featured on the Tyra Banks show. (Probably because her fake *** brand is supposed to be about "positivity" and she was afraid of being seen for the ***** that she really was.)

4. All links to and mentions of BGLH on CN's site are automatically deleted. So, for example, if someone leaves a comment on an article that references BGLH. (As in, "Oh yeh, this is great information! Similar to an article I saw on BGLH!) It is automatically deleted.

5. The day after BGLH launches their first forum, CurlyNikki *magically* launches her forum less than 12 hours later stating that "she got the idea from her readers" (SMH)

6. CN is acquired by NaturallyCurly.com (aka TextureMedia, Inc. TextureMedia) for an undisclosed sum. NaturallyCurly.com feeds into CN's swagger jacking ways. The heads of the company proceed to buy up as many natural hair blogs as they can or pay the writers off (Cassadie of Natural Selection, CurlyNikki.com, Charyjay on YouTube, Elle of the Denim Pixie, Natural Chica are all on the NaturallyCurly payroll in some way). NaturallyCurly begins a slow process of blackballing of any natural hair site that is not in their 'crew'.

7. NaturallyCurly feeds stories to the media (HuffingtonPost, New York Times and Essence.com) about their bloggers. Now, check this out, The New York Times did a story about NATURAL HAIR BLOGGERS AND VLOGGERS WHO MAKE A LIVING DOING IT. To my knowledge there are very FEW (probably less than 5) women online who make a fulltime salary off of blogging/vlogging. But the three we know for sure are: CurlyNikki, KimmayTube and Leila of BGLH. Because all three have mentioned it before. And yet the article features CurlyNikki, KimmayTube and NATURAL CHICA. The story was a NaturallyCurly.com vehicle to introduce CurlyNikki & NaturalChica to the mainstream press, they threw KimmayTube in there (who, later on Twitter said she DID NOT like how the interview went down) for the appearance of objectivity. And blackballed Leila of BGLH, who is probably one of the highest earning natural hair bloggers/vloggers.

8. The same occurs for stories in the HuffingtonPost (which omit Leila and BGLH) and Essence.com

9. NaturallyCurly.com strikes a partnership with Essence.com to share and distribute some of CurlyNikki's content and make her their natural hair expert.

10. Essence does a "Hot Hair" issue in October -- and DESPITE THEM PREVIOUSLY MENTIONING BGLH AS A GREAT WEB RESOURCE -- and despite the fact that Leila's site is one of the highest ranked (traffic-wise) black beauty sites on the web, period, the site is OMITTED from their list of "web leaders"

11. NaturalChica -- whose blog is dismal (though her channel is cool) -- is listed as a web leader.

So, there you have it. CurlyNikki is insidiously spiteful and has taken her nasty attitude to the offices of NaturallyCurly.com

Oh, and don't even get me started on how NaturallyCurly.com is basically using Nikki as "blackface" because they know that, as two white women with loosely curled hair, they don't have widespread credibility with black women -- who they make the majority of their money off of. 

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that they were happy to see CurlyNikki's "brand expanding". Well, when you have the backing of a multimillion dollar company (NaturallyCurly/TextureMedia) of COURSE you're gonna be able to throw upscale events, land celebrity interview and do press appearances. It's true that Nikki was doing some of these things prior to being acquired by NaturallyCurly, but it's accelerated wildly since she joined the team. It's smoke and mirrors. They are working the levers behind the scenes and want you to think it's all Nikki's doing.


----------



## Bette Davis Eyes (Jul 5, 2014)

and they are full of ca ca.

Why do you think Dee left NC and started NP?

A lot of folks never liked Dee and what she stood for but she created NP for a good damn reason.  Call her Militant if you want but there was a need to create a space eked out for us.

To this day I subscribed over there and give money to the site even if I dont post over there actively.  I dont post over here a lot either but I've been joined since 08.  I used to come before that and lurk.  Same thing with NC, I was over there lurking years before I joined.

Texturemedia has made  a lot of money off of the natural movement.  Yes, you have different curls types over there and its more than hair going over there BUT take a real good look whos posting in the hair forums and whos posting in the other forums.

I was over there giving many of companies are start by giving my reviews and then they lost their damn mind with the treatment of the Type 4 forum.  So I took all my links out and stopped posting.

Like I said in the beginning of this mess, the article didn't   bother me but they should have reworded those questions.

I just find it hilarious how folks now realize TM was buying up all the blogs.  So yall didnt realize they was sending them products for reviews and hosting their videos on their own channels?


----------



## lookingforkeona (Jul 5, 2014)

Sorry, I'm Team Nikki.

I agree with her for not addressing whatever waterlily said, that's none of her business. She didn't know she was being "trolled" when she decided to put her on the blog. She addressed the big issue of why she put a white woman on the blog anyway.

I, for one, agree with her points. I've never been about exclusion and I'm not going to start because I've joined the natural hair movement.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 5, 2014)

I'm so irate by all of this!!!


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 5, 2014)

Deleted post


----------



## intellectualuva (Jul 5, 2014)

After looking at that post count & comment.


----------



## Ogoma (Jul 5, 2014)

Saludable84 said:


> Are you on the TM payroll too? I really can't believe you are wishfully thinking that statement



Don't bother responding to comments like those. They always pop up when we are cohesive so the thread can disintegrate into in-fighting. Ignore. As @IDareT'sHair noted it is a tactic that we should not let be successful.


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 5, 2014)

Ogoma said:


> Don't bother responding to comments like those. They always pop up when we are cohesive so the thread can disintegrate into in-fighting. Ignore. As @IDareT'sHair noted it is a tactic that we should not let be successful.



Ok. I found it weird too. I will delete. 

Thanks!


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 5, 2014)

lookingforkeona said:


> Sorry, I'm Team Nikki.
> 
> I agree with her for not addressing whatever waterlily said, that's none of her business. She didn't know she was being "trolled" when she decided to put her on the blog. She addressed the big issue of why she put a white woman on the blog anyway.
> 
> I, for one, agree with her points. I've never been about exclusion and I'm not going to start because I've joined the natural hair movement.



That is very nice for you dear. I'm sure Curly Nikki welcomes you with open arms. Come back when that site is predominately white and let us know your thoughts. 

I just couldnt resist ya'll.


----------



## Divine. (Jul 5, 2014)

Deleted. Not worth it


----------



## JulietWhiskey (Jul 5, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> Another post from another form talking about how Nikki has always been about her money over loyalty and has plagiarized (read stolen) content from BGLH a while back:
> 
> Originally Posted by lurkinonthelow View Post
> First let me say that I joined this forum JUST SO I COULD COMMENT ON THIS THREAD (lol!) That's how deep this is to me.
> ...


 
*I'm over here like*,

 *!*


SMH.  What we do in the dark...


----------



## Divine. (Jul 5, 2014)

Ogoma said:


> Don't bother responding to comments like those. They always pop up when we are cohesive so the thread can disintegrate into in-fighting. Ignore. As @IDareT'sHair noted it is a tactic that we should not let be successful.



Man, I took the bait didn't I?


----------



## Enyo (Jul 5, 2014)

Divine. I feel you. I'm not sure why certain blacks feel like we should be overly accommodating to a group of people who never reciprocates unless forced. I know some folks think it's more...elevated...to say that all forms of discrimination are wrong, but in the case of non-whites, that is simply not the case. Non-whites banding together and supporting their own is how so many groups were able to make social progress. When you put white people into the equation, things just get more complicated than they already are when it's just "us". 

This is going on in Hawaii right now because Hawaiians want to be self-governing. A lot of people have good points as to why the idea may not work, but it pisses me off when I see white people trying to be all up in the conversation with their personal opinions. They don't seem to want to accept that their race is the reason why there are so few Hawaiian left and why they tend to be the poorest group despite being the original inhabitants. Hmm. I think that sound familiar. I wish the average white person would be banned from speaking on the subject down here. There are lots of white historians and sociopolitical experts who weigh in, but they tend to stick to facts which is cool. But everyone else needs to have a seat.


----------



## Golden75 (Jul 5, 2014)

Divine. said:


> Man, I took the bait didn't I?



But what you said was truth.  Wish you didn't delete, but glad I read it before you did.


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 5, 2014)

Golden75 said:


> But what you said was truth.  Wish you didn't delete, but glad I read it before you did.



Yeah because I missed it.


----------



## Divine. (Jul 5, 2014)

KammyGirl said:


> Yeah because I missed it.



Now I kinda wish I didn't delete it  I was really irritated as I wrote that post so I didn't want to incite any negative emotions in this thread.


----------



## CodeRed (Jul 5, 2014)

The funniest part of this whole thing will be when Nikki loses her foundation supporters for fair-weather replacements and Sarah comes out winning with a whole solid army of white (and some black) supporters who feel sorry for her being "attacked".

This whole thing is stupid but I can't help but just laugh - especially at Nikki.


----------



## girlcherokee (Jul 6, 2014)

You know I think everything happens for a reason.   I'm going over to YouTube and do some house cleaning.  Boy was there so much I didn't know - thanks for the info


----------



## DayStar (Jul 6, 2014)

We got a lot of Auntie Coons on this board  always ready to jump to massas defense. Yeah I said it.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 6, 2014)

I'm sorry. I keep reading this and am becoming ever increasingly confused. Hasn't the word "natural hair" been part of the black lexicon for a minute now? For the past 40 years, hasn't it meant you don't have a perm/relaxer?  erplexed

Has this word _*in this context*_  been part of the white community?  

Have white people been wanting to adopt this word as a reference to their hair back in 1980? 

^^No? So why do they want to now? *scratches head*

For white women, what would "natural" be in direct opposition to? 

As an aside: It's funny that the white women who do have sense and are agreeing with our stance are pretty much ignored.


----------



## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 6, 2014)

I thought being "natural" in the white community had absolutely nothing to do with texture, but hair color (natural blonde, brunette, etc.).

I did a quick survey of my white friends and "natural" at the gym and they referred to their hair color. No one commented on their texture. NO ONE.

I know that's a small sample but I thought it was interesting.

Now all of a sudden it refers to texture since we, yes WE, started this movement.

Hmmmm...

Great points ladies. Great reads.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 6, 2014)

^^^Good point NaturallyATLPCH 

I've heard white women say, "It's natural" in reference to their color all the time. To the majority, it wouldn't make sense to say it in reference to their texture. Natural as opposed to what? 

And yes, I know white women with curly hair straighten, but even they don't say "I'm natural," in that way.


----------



## angelhairtype4 (Jul 6, 2014)

Froreal3 said:


> I'm sorry. I keep reading this and am becoming ever increasingly confused. Hasn't the word "natural hair" been part of the black lexicon for a minute now? For the past 40 years, hasn't it meant you don't have a perm/relaxer?  erplexed
> 
> Has this word in this context  been part of the white community?
> 
> ...



I honestly thought to white woman being natural meant they don't shave and are into organic products. Not one white person I've come across refers to their hair as natural, but just refer to it as HAIR.


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 6, 2014)

Not my post, shared by a lady in another forum:

In light of recent events, I thought it would be a good idea to make a thread to list the New Blacks who have sold out so I and others can unsubscribe/ stop giving them clicks. So far I know of:

Curly Nikki (Obvs) ( Also notorious in her early days for stealing content, editing it, and pushing it off as her own a.k.a BGLH drama and her grease post- directly stolen and did not even bother to edit it before passing it off as her own) 

Denim Pixie (Quest for the Perfect Curl)
CharyJay
Taren916 (Also a bad example to represent BW, cheated and pregnant by a married man, dissed the wife on social media, been very messy, catty, to her) 

The Natural Haven (JC)
NaturalChica
SunKissed Alba
Melshary Arias

People to Support:
Jouelzy
KashTV
FusionofCultures
J. Joelle
HelloLowelo
Chime Edwards (aka Haircrush)
Rinny Riot

Background Information: (LUXE Thank you girl!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by luxe  View Post
For those that need background.

Curly Nikki featured a white woman on her blog. Not a big deal when you consider the fact that CN is now owned by NaturallyCurly/Texture Media. However, things reached a fever pitch on Sunday when the white woman got on twitter proclaiming that black women were being exclusive, the natural hair movement was not created for black women, and that the blog is called "CURLY Nikki not BlackNikki". She deleted certain tweets once she got called out, but we have screencaps.

The thread covering everything is here.


There have been numerous articles, blogs, tumblr and facebook posts surrounding her reaction and both sides of the argument.

Some blogs/responses:
http://blackgirllonghair.com/2014/07...is-not-racism/
http://www.clutchmagonline.com/2014/...r-white-woman/
http://www.ebony.com/style/white-wom...#axzz36eNXanRx
http://blog.franchesca.net/post/9051...hair-tutorials
http://madamenoire.com/444464/seriou...n-teamnatural/
http://blackgirllonghair.com/2014/07...t-black-women/

Other responses (from twitter, facebook etc) were posted in the thread mentioned.

An Ebony writer (article listed above) chimed in very early in the debate speaking about the importance of the Natural Hair Movement and black women having safe spaces to commune and share experiences, motivations, and stories etc. 

Curly Nikki decided to respond (I refuse to link her blog, if you want to read her response it was posted in the thread I mentioned above) and focused on attacking Jamilah (author of the Ebony article) rather than discussing the debate at hand or the ignorant comments that Sarah (the white woman) made. She also tried to claim that her blog was always all inclusive and that she never started it for only black women, though her bio specifically says the opposite. 



She basically sold out for white money/clicks/pageviews and is willing to alienate the black women who got her site to the place where it is today.

Melshary, Taren, SunKissAlba and others all spoke out in favor of CN and Sarah. The original thread is worth the read if you actually care, if you just want to be obtuse, kindly find a seat on the sidelines and stay there.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Creole Kickin  View Post
If anyone does not see the significance in boycotting some of these "gurus", I suggest you do some research. 

Some of these "gurus" have auctioned and sold themselves and their brand to the highest bidder. That highest bidder also happens to be white. 

So while you're watching and coveting these YTers, thinking they are doing something innovative with the "Natural Hair Movement", they are ushering in a new movement, which is to allow non-blacks in the "Natural Hair Movement". These "gurus" are serving as bridges between black women who by and large, experienced the "Natural Hair Movement" in peace without infiltration from others, and others who seek to infiltrate that space and capitalize on it---and eventually push black women out and either claim the movement for themselves or claim to have revolutionized the movement.

That is why you see these "gurus" aligning themselves with this mess and other non-blacks into the "Natural Hair Movement". 


I think the person who wrote this piece, made a good point. They also wrote that it is important to be careful in who you support and allow to become a talking head for your cause and community.


----------



## ezina (Jul 6, 2014)

^I feel so betrayed by some of those bloggers you mentioned that are apparently backed by Naturally Curly...and breathed a huge sigh of relief reading the list of those not backed by Naturally Curly. The latter group represents my hair better, anyway.

I just hope, in light of this situation, that the Naturally Curly backed bloggers will grow some sense and jump ship. But the dollar is king so who knows.


----------



## Ogoma (Jul 6, 2014)

^^^ if people actively stop supporting them, there would be no $ to be king to. But, they are banking on lots of talk and inaction. Time will tell if they are right.


----------



## kellistarr (Jul 6, 2014)

I came back to this post to read up on others thoughts and opinions and read rawsilk's post.

rawsilk  Wow, that was incredibly moving; refreshed my memory, put things in proper perspective, brought back good ol' times and bad ones and was beautifully stated.


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 6, 2014)

Ogoma said:


> ^^^ if people actively stop supporting them, there would be no $ to be king to. But, they are banking on lots of talk and inaction. Time will tell if they are right.



I wish we could have more solidarity in the black community... I really hope our message gets heard no matter what the end result in all of this.


----------



## Kurlee (Jul 6, 2014)

Wow, so they just gonna appropriate everything until there's nothing left, huh?  Even the hair on our heads.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 6, 2014)

I'm glad that out of the traitors (yup, that is what I'm calling them) I was only subbed (notice past tense) to one.

I will not bother with giving them any more clicks by trying to get the scoop. I've got all the info I need.  My mind is made up and they are BLACK BALLED to me!!


----------



## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 6, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> I'm glad that out of the traitors (yup, that is what I'm calling them) I was only subbed (notice past tense) to one.
> 
> I will not bother with giving them any more clicks by trying to get the scoop. I've got all the info I need.  My mind is made up and they are BLACK BALLED to me!!



Me too. I unsubbed from CharyJay a while back and just unsubbed to Quest for the Perfect Curl.


----------



## MissCrawford (Jul 6, 2014)

rawsilk

That....was....*AMAZING!!!* you said everything I could not find the words to say. I am so empowered right now. My future was bright but now it is GLEAMING!!


----------



## MissCrawford (Jul 6, 2014)

I  was never subscribed to anyone. I have perused CN and KT and maybe a few others but never felt home (sorry but I thought they were dry). Their advice also did not work for me. Once I found LHCF I was done. I guess it was mostly because I had no interest in styles but mainly growth. I will consider supporting those who deserve my support now.


----------



## LadyRaider (Jul 6, 2014)

I thought I'd responded to this thread, but now I can't find it. But if it's there somewhere, I take it back. Rawsilk has convinced me it DOES matter. 

I will graciously cede White Women a tiny island off the coast of the Natural Hair Movement as they learn to stop with all the heat use. But the actual main continent of Natural Hair Movement should indeed belong to us. We have earned it.


----------



## Solitude (Jul 7, 2014)

ezina said:


> ^I feel so betrayed by some of those bloggers you mentioned that are apparently backed by Naturally Curly...and breathed a huge sigh of relief reading the list of those not backed by Naturally Curly. The latter group represents my hair better, anyway.
> 
> I just hope, in light of this situation, that the Naturally Curly backed bloggers will grow some sense and jump ship. But the dollar is king so who knows.


 


NaturallyATLPCH said:


> Me too. I unsubbed from CharyJay a while back and just unsubbed to Quest for the Perfect Curl.


 
Y'all have every right to unsubscribe from these vloggers, but just realize that a lot of Type 4 vloggers are involved with NaturallyCurly.com and I don't think they are all "sell-outs." They get involved for free products, brand promotion, and to just to help other Type 4s. 

My whole thing is, y'all would be mad if NaturallyCurly.com did _*not*_ include blacks/women with type 4 hair, but you're also mad at the women who get the deals and partnerships. Let those women live. 

Evelyn from the Internets works for NC.com in Austin and Jouelzy is always flying down there to Texas, so she is either involved with NC.com or trying to be, even as much as she gripes about texture discrimination. 

Blakizbeautyful (Jennell Stewart) keeps it all the way real about her hair journey and she is a NC.com vlogger. Mahogany Curls started out on NC and LexiwiththeCurls has worked with them as well. Before some of the black blogs were established, these ladies partnered with NC.com. I don't care for the continued characterization of NaturallyCurly's founders as some sort of racists. I don't get that from them, at all. They were pioneers in the curly hair thing and were smart enough to snatch up some black blogs early on in order to expand their reach. I don't see anything wrong with that...

Texture Media (Naturally Curly) is a MEDIA company. Of course they promote _their own_ bloggers and vloggers.


----------



## ellebelle88 (Jul 7, 2014)

...............


----------



## zora (Jul 7, 2014)

Solitude said:


> Y'all have every right to unsubscribe from these vloggers, but just realize that a lot of Type 4 vloggers are involved with NaturallyCurly.com and I don't think they are all "sell-outs." They get involved for free products, brand promotion, and to just to help other Type 4s.
> 
> My whole thing is, y'all would be mad if NaturallyCurly.com did _*not*_ include blacks/women with type 4 hair, but you're also mad at the women who get the deals and partnerships. Let those women live.
> 
> ...



I don't know enough about the politics or recent history of the natural hair care industry community to vouch for the NC founders, but I do know that site was around before the natural hair popularity exploded.  I got my first sense of community and advice from that site.  

I long since left them to be here. I've been here almost 15 years with no progress.  I kid 

I tried Nappturality and they were a bit too extreme for me, but to each their own.  I'm sure they had their reasons.

Anyhoo, I agree that the natural hair care community belongs to US.  It's not just about being curly, it's about be kinky, nappy, and the cultural consequences of that self-acceptance.  It was deeper than deciding not to blow out your curls.  And it's nice when you don't have to go into a long explanation about it.  You just know.  

And _they_-Becky, Sue and dem-don't 'just' know.  They're clueless.


----------



## zora (Jul 7, 2014)

And call it intuition, but I never liked CN.  I never got what all the hoopla was about.


----------



## greenandchic (Jul 7, 2014)

NaturallyATLPCH said:


> Me too. I unsubbed from CharyJay a while back and just unsubbed to Quest for the Perfect Curl.



I don't know CharyJay but what's wrong with Quest for the Perfect Curl?

ETA: I just found my answer on the previous page.


----------



## Kurlee (Jul 7, 2014)

NaturallyATLPCH said:


> Me too. I unsubbed from CharyJay a while back and just unsubbed to Quest for the Perfect Curl.



What's up with Quest for the Perfect Curl? I don't follow her closely, but her hair is awesome.


----------



## Ogoma (Jul 7, 2014)

Don't feel obligated to subscribe to anyone that doesn't represent your interest. No one is trying to punish all bloggers, just those that have actively shown they would not represent our interests. 

This is how they keep us compliant and down, by playing on our sense of fairness when they never have and never will have any intention of doing the same.

Since they want white women in the movement, they should go and find them for support. Wish them all the luck with that because when we are not there, trust and believe the white interlopers would lose interest.


----------



## greenandchic (Jul 7, 2014)

Kurlee said:


> What's up with Quest for the Perfect Curl? I don't follow her closely, but her hair is awesome.



Come to think of it, I thought she was writing for BGLH?


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 7, 2014)

Kurlee said:


> Wow, so they just gonna appropriate everything until there's nothing left, huh?  Even the hair on our heads.



Next thing you know they will TM our hair type and make us pay for growing it.


----------



## felic1 (Jul 7, 2014)

Are Nikki Walton's missionary hair expeditions to Africa being paid for by her white sponsors? Ebony is not required to fund her travels. Furthermore, Ebony and Essence have featured natual hair in their magazines for years. Like LHCF, these publications have features that celebrate hair that is relaxed and non relaxed.  I really believe that women in Africa have the lead on us regarding kinky hair care. They were never forcibly displaced by slave owners to desist in hair care practices. These women had hair care techniques passed on to them by mothers and grandmothers. I think CN is chasing fame and fortune. Her mission is not to attain cultural cohesiveness.


----------



## aquajoyice (Jul 7, 2014)

MzRhonda said:


> I don't get where yt folks feel their "natural" hair plight is the same as ours and I don't understand black folks who understand and feel that it is.
> 
> I don't think I had ever heard *yt folks refer to their hair as "natural" until our natural hair plight took off*.




This. I was in the Dollar Store over the weekend and overheard one of the employees compliment a WG on her stick thin, bleached blonde hair. The WG responded by saying she's decided to "Go Natural" and is really excited about her new hair journey as she thanked the employee for the compliment. That was the first i'd ever heard of them using the term "going natural". I rolled my eyes and kept it moving. This little girl was so clueless as most of those that use the term and have no idea what it really means.


----------



## alex114 (Jul 7, 2014)

There were black women with looser curls than Sarah's  featured on CN and just like those women, who didn't have a problem with texture or breakage or even too-early relaxing, Sarah went on a hair journey of self-acceptance. It's not always about the hair itself, but one's own conception of her hair. Self-acceptance is important too, and plenty of mixed black women with looser curl patterns have had to navigate their hair journeys in less tangible, but no less important ways than someone like me with thick, stubborn 4C hair. I understand those who might be upset with this for more political/historical reasons, but natural hair journeys are individual journeys, and as long as we stick together and continue to build ourselves up, while creating a positive and enriching environment for present and future black women, it won't matter what others are doing.


----------



## cami88 (Jul 7, 2014)

Solitude said:


> Y'all have every right to unsubscribe from these vloggers, but just realize that a lot of Type 4 vloggers are involved with NaturallyCurly.com and I don't think they are all "sell-outs." They get involved for free products, brand promotion, and to just to help other Type 4s.
> 
> My whole thing is, y'all would be mad if NaturallyCurly.com did not include blacks/women with type 4 hair, but you're also mad at the women who get the deals and partnerships. Let those women live.
> 
> ...



Unfortunately we do not have many black companies with the manpower, finances and connections to extend  deals and partnerships to the black natural hair bloggers. Being that this is the case I can understand why some natural hair bloggers might partner with a company like Texture Media to expand their viewership. But is it too much to ask that these things stay exclusively black? It seems like Texture  Media and others like them want to mold the blogs and vlogs to represent their own interests (ie white folks interests) rather than those of the black women on whom the empire has been built.

Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF


----------



## aviddiva77 (Jul 7, 2014)

aquajoyice said:


> This. I was in the Dollar Store over the weekend and overheard one of the employees compliment a WG on her stick thin, bleached blonde hair. The WG responded by saying she's decided to "Go Natural" and is really excited about her new hair journey as she thanked the employee for the compliment. That was the first i'd ever heard of them using the term "going natural". I rolled my eyes and kept it moving. This little girl was so clueless as most of those that use the term and have no idea what it really means.



It's Chef all over again.
NSFW: http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/154102/flippity-floppity-floop


----------



## curlytwirly06 (Jul 7, 2014)

aviddiva77 said:


> It's Chef all over again. NSFW: http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/154102/flippity-floppity-floop



Girl bye, you are so wrong for posting this, I peed a little.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 7, 2014)

zora said:


> And call it intuition, but I never liked CN.  I never got what all the hoopla was about.



Me either!!!  I was on the site for like 2 days when I found BHM and then found LHCF.  I stayed on BHM through most of my learning curve and then put my big girl chonies on and came here (meaning I finally paid to post.  I was always a lurker while I was learning and posting on BHM) 

But on CN I couldnt find what I was looking for I guess.  Mind you I have a loose curl pattern so you would think I would fit in where ever.  But I didnt have the sense of community or unity there I guess is what I'm saying.  

I forgot they even existed in all honesty until all this popped off. I also want to add that I'm not mad at these bloggers for making money and having white folk sign the check.  I mean white folk sign my checks.  But there is a difference between making your money, your hustle, what ever you want to call it and turning your back on the ones who made you.  You dont bite the hand that feeds you.  White girls were not checking for these chicks until we (not me obviously but we as a whole) gave them clicks, made their videos youtube features, shared them on social medias and what not.  We did that!  Not Becky.  But now Becky wants to be involved and you give her some shine and we have something to say about it you want to cape for her?  nah, thats where she messed up.  Had she gave the girl shine and got the feedback from her followers that they werent thrilled with this and said "Hey yall, my bad, just sharing different stories.  I know this chick dont have OUR natural issues but she could help some of my becky followers"  I think there would have been a totally different response.  But to cape for her the way she did and then have her "homie" throw their capes on?  I dont see how she DIDNT see this coming is all I'm saying.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 7, 2014)

Saludable84 said:


> Next thing you know they will TM our hair type and make us pay for growing it.



If I could high five you right now!!!  GIRL!!!


----------



## DeepBluSea (Jul 7, 2014)

I'm late to the party but I must say I had no idea all this was going on behind the scenes.  I refer people to CN all the time because her website is pretty user friendly and generic for people new to being natural.  You know how you refer folks to LHCF or NP and they say " Ain't nobody got time for that."  SMH.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 7, 2014)

felic1 said:


> Are Nikki Walton's missionary hair expeditions to Africa being paid for by her white sponsors? Ebony is not required to fund her travels. Furthermore, Ebony and Essence have featured natual hair in their magazines for years. Like LHCF, these publications have features that celebrate hair that is relaxed and non relaxed.  I really believe that women in Africa have the lead on us regarding kinky hair care. They were never forcibly displaced by slave owners to desist in hair care practices. These women had hair care techniques passed on to them by mothers and grandmothers. I think CN is chasing fame and fortune. Her mission is not to attain cultural cohesiveness.



In Africa they may have not been uprooted physically but mentally many of them were through colonization.  White man when hard in Africa like they do any area they put their grubby paws in.  They have also been made second class citizens in their own homes and taught for many years that white is right and black is wrong causing self hate there as well.  

If you go to certain parts of Africa you will see just as much weaves and relaxed to death hair along with skin lighteners and blue contacts.

One thing I can say for white is they have a pigeon hold on pushing their issues on to others.  They have it down pact to a science and I would swear they learn this in the womb!!!


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 7, 2014)

aviddiva77 said:


> It's Chef all over again.
> NSFW: http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/154102/flippity-floppity-floop




EXACTLY!!!!  WE CANT HAVE NOTHING!!!!! 

If yall could hear the way I yelled that in my head!!!


----------



## aviddiva77 (Jul 8, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> Girl bye, you are so wrong for posting this, I peed a little.





Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> EXACTLY!!!!  WE CANT HAVE NOTHING!!!!!
> 
> If yall could hear the way I yelled that in my head!!!


I imagined it George Lopez style. "We can never have NOTHIN'!" 

I can't help it. That scene pops up every time someone mentions white people stealing black culture. Because it's so d**n true! They have the rest of the freaking world. What more do they want?!

I'm all for people accepting others and us as human beings coming together but I think us having spaces to where we can express our issues and get support from people who have gone through the same things is critical to us as a people healing after centuries of pain and negativity. Only then can we even try to open ourselves to considering others. And only then can we create a loud enough voice to get us on equal footing (not acceptance. I'm not here for that). 

I hope that makes sense.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 8, 2014)

aviddiva77 said:


> I imagined it George Lopez style. "We can never have NOTHIN'!"
> 
> I can't help it. That scene pops up every time someone mentions white people stealing black culture. Because it's so d**n true! They have the rest of the freaking world. What more do they want?!
> 
> ...



it makes complete sense!!!  Its like the Oktoberfest!  Yes everyone is invited to partake in some German culture. But You dont see me setting up a tent to do black folk stuff.  AND THERE ARE BLACK PEOPLE BORN AND RAISED IN GERMANY!!!  But its their culture that we all get to celebrate.  But they dont want to celebrate WITH us!  They want it for them selves!  And why should we hand it over?

They can have their "curly becky" revolution.  I dont care!  Let them embrace their curls they've blow dried and flat ironed into submission. Do it, have fun, do the damn thing.  But leave our space alone and for us. 

That's really what the whole thing boils down to.  We want our own space where we can be safe, be amongst each other, black women from all over the globe with a common ground and support system.  When do we ever get to have that?  When have we been able to have this on the scale that it is now because of the awesomeness of the internet?  

What I feel it really goes down to is how many times do we come together for positivity and uplifing and how often do they barge in and say "nope, we cant have this?" Why?  Because they know how powerful we can be when we have unity and with power comes independence...  independence form THEM!


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 8, 2014)

aviddiva77 said:


> I imagined it George Lopez style. "We can never have NOTHIN'!"



That's pretty much how I said it lmfao


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jul 8, 2014)

> But on CN I couldnt find what I was looking for I guess.  Mind you I have a loose curl pattern so you would think I would fit in where ever.
> 
> I also want to add that I'm not mad at these bloggers for making money and having white folk sign the check.  I mean white folk sign my checks.



O-M-G


.........


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 8, 2014)

@tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT whats so "OMG" about what I said?

Some people think that its about curl type. I'm showing that its not, its about the unity we have here as black women to support each other through this growing and accepting process.  So whether you have type 3 or 4 we're in it together because we know each others story.  A white woman with 3a hair isnt going to be in the same boat even if she does blow dry it straight everyday. 

And I'm not mad at them for the bloggers for trying to get money.  People seem to think that we're upset about them promoting them self.  they can promote all they want but does it have to be at the expense of losing the fan base that got them to where they are to even be ask to get paid for blogging. If it werent for us these media companies wouldnt be handing them money to join their teams, so now they're getting paid they think they can just skip out on their loyal base group because they THINK they have this new found base group with the beckys by "including them to the team" when they're not going to stick around once Sarah or who ever starts who own thing promoting the "natural white woman"

And when quoting me, keep the full context of what I say. Rather than editing it to make it look what ever kind of way



Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> But on CN I couldnt find what I was looking for I guess.  Mind you I  have a loose curl pattern so you would think I would fit in where ever.*   But I didnt have the sense of community or unity there I guess is what  I'm saying.  *
> 
> I  also want to add that I'm not mad at these bloggers for making money and  having white folk sign the check.  I mean white folk sign my checks.   *But there is a difference between making your money, your hustle, what  ever you want to call it and turning your back on the ones who made you.*


----------



## oneastrocurlie (Jul 8, 2014)

I've got nothing new to add really. I rarely actually read the CN home page. I stayed in the forums. I like bglh better for hair articles. Then CN jacked up the forum so there went that.


----------



## 1QTPie (Jul 8, 2014)

Solitude said:


> Y'all have every right to unsubscribe from these vloggers, but just realize that a lot of Type 4 vloggers are involved with NaturallyCurly.com and I don't think they are all "sell-outs." They get involved for free products, brand promotion, and to just to help other Type 4s.
> 
> My whole thing is, y'all would be mad if NaturallyCurly.com did _*not*_ include blacks/women with type 4 hair, but you're also mad at the women who get the deals and partnerships. Let those women live.
> 
> ...





CN had the power to keep her blog and take on other black bloggers. She could have taken then entire black portion of NC with her if she really wanted.  She gave her power away.


----------



## BostonMaria (Jul 8, 2014)

If you guys scroll back a few years of CN's blog you'll see that in the beginning she tried to have WW on her blog. I'm talking about NC members that were highly regarded and knowledgable about hair. One woman in particular comes to mind... I think she went by The Curl Whisperer. Those posts were not very well received. I personally didn't mind (to a certain degree) but I think most readers prefer to receive advice from people that look like them so they can relate to the article. I don't see anything wrong with that.


----------



## Solitude (Jul 8, 2014)

Ogoma said:


> Don't feel obligated to subscribe to anyone that doesn't represent your interest. *No one is trying to punish all bloggers*, just those that have actively shown they would not represent our interests.
> 
> This is how they keep us compliant and down, by playing on our sense of fairness when they never have and never will have any intention of doing the same.
> 
> *Since they want white women in the movement*, they should go and find them for support. Wish them all the luck with that because when we are not there, trust and believe the white interlopers would lose interest.



Yes, they are trying to punish vloggers. A list of "who to support" and "who not to support" ??? As if these women did something to stop you from wearing your natural hair? I can name partnerships that each of those women on the "support" list have done with white companies.

Did we expect black bloggers and vloggers to pledge allegiance to the black nation of hair care? This is pretty ridiculous and way too politicized. What is the purpose of the "movement." Are we going to get women with natural hair a seat in the Senate or something? Like what is the actual goal here that is going to improve black people's lives? 

This is the BEAUTY industry, let's keep it in perspective.



aquajoyice said:


> This. I was in the Dollar Store over the weekend and overheard one of the employees compliment a WG on her stick thin, bleached blonde hair. The WG responded by saying she's decided to "Go Natural" and is really excited about her new hair journey as she thanked the employee for the compliment. That was the first i'd ever heard of them using the term "going natural". I rolled my eyes and kept it moving. This little girl was so clueless as most of those that use the term and have no idea what it really means.



I don't know how many times I can say it, but "natural" was a thing before the "natural hair movement." Did you think Whole Foods and organic, natural living was inspired by the hair movement? Or was it here, with "natural hair products" on the shelves long before 2001?

There have been naturalistas, naturalists, and others "going natural" by living a chemical-free lifestyle for decades. 




1QTPie said:


> CN had the power to keep her blog and take on other black bloggers. She could have taken then entire black portion of NC with her if she really wanted.  She gave her power away.



She didn't "give her power away." She leveraged her brand to do what SHE wanted to do. Maybe SHE didn't want to "take on other black bloggers." Maybe that was not her career goal. 

She _could _start a product line. She _could _do this, she _could _do that, but she doesn't want to. She is making a living off blogging, making appearances, and she wrote a book. It's not Nikki's job to be the builder-upper of other black blogs. 

I could easily say that a black vlogger like Jouelzy needs to start her own YouTube network and take on other black vloggers instead of "giving her power away" by joining a predominately white YouTube network (Makers Studio), but who am I to deem her responsible for building up other black vloggers?


----------



## kikisf (Jul 9, 2014)

IDK. I used to do CN and naturallycurly.com CT but stopped because there are not enough 4 (especially 4b/c!) women on those sites. I can't tell you how many times I have rolled my eyes at someone's hair journey when they finally reveal their natural type 3 curls. They have the kind of hair that my grandmother would say didn't "need" a relaxer in the first place. It does not surprise me that a white woman was featured and that she picked up tips from CN. If I decided to go natural again I would stick to the sites celebrate and represent the hair that many grandmothers called "nappy" or more commonly "bad" hair!


----------



## aquajoyice (Jul 9, 2014)

Solitude said:


> Yes, they are trying to punish vloggers. A list of "who to support" and "who not to support" ??? As if these women did something to stop you from wearing your natural hair? I can name partnerships that each of those women on the "support" list have done with white companies.  Did we expect black bloggers and vloggers to pledge allegiance to the black nation of hair care? This is pretty ridiculous and way too politicized. What is the purpose of the "movement." Are we going to get women with natural hair a seat in the Senate or something? Like what is the actual goal here that is going to improve black people's lives?  This is the BEAUTY industry, let's keep it in perspective.  I don't know how many times I can say it, but "natural" was a thing before the "natural hair movement." Did you think Whole Foods and organic, natural living was inspired by the hair movement? Or was it here, with "natural hair products" on the shelves long before 2001?  There have been naturalistas, naturalists, and others "going natural" by living a chemical-free lifestyle for decades.  She didn't "give her power away." She leveraged her brand to do what SHE wanted to do. Maybe SHE didn't want to "take on other black bloggers." Maybe that was not her career goal.  She could start a product line. She could do this, she could do that, but she doesn't want to. She is making a living off blogging, making appearances, and she wrote a book. It's not Nikki's job to be the builder-upper of other black blogs.  I could easily say that a black vlogger like Jouelzy needs to start her own YouTube network and take on other black vloggers instead of "giving her power away" by joining a predominately white YouTube network (Makers Studio), but who am I to deem her responsible for building up other black vloggers?



Those that don't understand the movement will never get it. With that being said it clearly isn't for
you and that's okay. 

The Natural Hair Movement is for BW that need support to accept what is natural to us. There is no way that a non BW could ever understand the hardships that we've had to ensure which is why it wasn't created for them. If they have challenges then they need to come together and create their own movement. Comparing YT to the struggles of black hair is like comparing apples to  lettuce.

Sent from my iPhone using LHCF


----------



## Femmefatal1981 (Jul 9, 2014)

Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh


----------



## sunnieb (Jul 9, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh



I'll come back and respond to you tomorrow. Thanks.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using LHCF


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 10, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh


 
Nah this isn't about the relaxed ladies. Let's not lose focus. 

Besides most of them seem to agree with us when there are naturals who are telling us this doesn't matter.


----------



## PJaye (Jul 10, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh



Please, don't.


----------



## MileHighDiva (Jul 10, 2014)

KammyGirl said:


> Nah this isn't about the relaxed ladies. *Let's not lose focus.*
> 
> *Besides most of them seem to agree with us* when there are naturals who are telling us this doesn't matter.



Agreed, plus the relaxed heads have just as much of a vested interest in how we're represented, and how we "gate keep" our movements of self acceptance.

They probably have daughters, mothers, sistahs etc. that are natural etc.


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 10, 2014)

DONT FALL FOR THE BAIT! Stay focused on what this is really about.


----------



## krikit96 (Jul 10, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh





sunnieb said:


> I'll come back and respond to you tomorrow. Thanks.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I545 using LHCF



When I first got here I was relaxed (2008)... here we are 6 years later, I've transitioned and am now fully natural.  Just cuz your relaxed don't mean you ain't relating or ain't able to pick a side and stand.  

This entire ww in the movement thing is doing exactly what was secretly intended - cause confusion and division.  They think this is entertaining... what happened to a United front? We can't achieve unity within our lil small bw hair community, how are we fighting each other to bring THEM in, so they can set up more traps?


----------



## SuchaLady (Jul 10, 2014)

sunnieb said:


> I'll come back and respond to you tomorrow. Thanks.  Sent from my SCH-I545 using LHCF



Don't hurt her girl


----------



## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 10, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh


*

*


----------



## Serenity_Peace (Jul 10, 2014)

felic1 said:


> I cannot consider Sarah as part of our natural hair movement. She will not experience hiring discrimination because her hair is not straight. There are a lot of us that wear their hair straight or relaxed. I am not rejecting my relaxed sisters. Sarah is not a person with styling and length retention needs. She is not a part of us. I have looked at some of the more basically white hair blogs/sites. They are not really suitable for the needs of my hair type. I sort of get the impression that CN featuring her is a way to broaden or apply cross over techniques to expand her site. I am not trying to be ugly. The black community is experiencing cohesiveness via natural hair care. It is a good thing. For a caucasian person to indicate that she is natural also does not make her part of our group. She is not of african descent living in a culture that does not accept or celebrate our difference. If CN believes that she has disappearing ends, dry hair like ours, with breakage issues like ours, and any of our other needs she is mistaken. CN can cross over. I have already determined that caucasian based sites cannot help me.



My girl SupremeDejhan could not have put it more plainly or said it more emphatically. Her words are simply beautiful:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0MXrHWxgKk

Video at link above.


----------



## Kurlee (Jul 10, 2014)

Solitude said:


> Yes, they are trying to punish vloggers. A list of "who to support" and "who not to support" ??? As if these women did something to stop you from wearing your natural hair? I can name partnerships that each of those women on the "support" list have done with white companies.
> 
> Did we expect black bloggers and vloggers to pledge allegiance to the black nation of hair care? This is pretty ridiculous and way too politicized. What is the purpose of the "movement." Are we going to get women with natural hair a seat in the Senate or something? Like what is the actual goal here that is going to improve black people's lives?
> 
> ...



so individualism?! Gotcha. Everyone has a price.


----------



## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 10, 2014)

Serenity_Peace said:


> My girl SupremeDejhan could not have put it more plainly or said it more emphatically. Her words are simply beautiful:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0MXrHWxgKk
> 
> Video at link above.



Loved it. I subscribed. Powerful message and so well put!


----------



## sunnieb (Jul 10, 2014)

SuchaLady said:


> Don't hurt her girl



I'll leave it alone. Ya'll know how I feel. 

I grow natural hair out of my scalp daily. I was also the " nappy headed" little girl with"bad" hair. I'm black. I know exactly what natural ladies go through. 

There's no place for Becky in this.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using LHCF


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 10, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh



Because thanks was NOT ENOUGH 
......... Yeah I'm looking atchu! (Not you Femmefatal)


----------



## PinkSunshine77 (Jul 10, 2014)

*prances through the Tulips*


----------



## marta9227 (Jul 10, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Relaxed folks in here arguing about the natural hair movement...smh



Lets not fall for the divide and conquer.


----------



## alex114 (Jul 10, 2014)

I am not sure what to say anymore, because I am somewhat alarmed by the hair blog articles cropping up with white women claiming that they are 'natural', and 'transitioning', but I really just have to evaluate my feelings and wonder. Sometimes I feel like this is something that could become a huge act of cultural thievery, and no, I don't feel comfortable knowing that there are ww who fancy themselves as going through a journey anything like the ones experienced by black women.
But how can they truly steal this from us if we continue to help and support each other? And on that note, is CN not someone who helps and supports many newly naturals, and does the threat that she poses to the 'purity' and unity of the movement truly occasion forgetting all of the women that she's educated and helped? I just don't know.


----------



## Femmefatal1981 (Jul 10, 2014)

sunnieb said:


> I'll leave it alone. Ya'll know how I feel.  I grow natural hair out of my scalp daily. I was also the " nappy headed" little girl with"bad" hair. I'm black. I know exactly what natural ladies go through.  There's no place for Becky in this.  Sent from my SCH-I545 using LHCF



sunnieb

My comment wasn't directed at you but since you responded let me elaborate. 

It was directed specifically to relaxed heads on the Becky rescue mission. If you are relaxed and you support the natural hair movement then more power to you but to come in here and try to tell me I should accept Becky? I'm well within my rights to come for you.


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 10, 2014)

I only partially agree with relaxed heads in the "natural hair movement". The point of the natural hair movement was for people to accept the natural texture of their hair. At least that's what I thought.....


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 10, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> I only partially agree with relaxed heads in the "natural hair movement". The point of the natural hair movement was for people to accept the natural texture of their hair. At least that's what I thought.....



And it's comments like this that's going to keep Becky and 'em trying to get in. Makes us look like a bunch of discriminatory bitter ol' ABW. What about women that have been natural for years and are a part of the NHM and then they decide to relax for styling reasons? We kick them out? Come on now. Ridiculous. Not everyone that has a relaxer hates their natural hair you know. 

And the fact remains, no matter how hard Becky's hair is to manage she won't be getting a relaxer and will never understand why that is even something considered. A relaxed BLACK woman would. I can't believe how all of these threads have lost focus. Got people in here talking about relaxed heads don't belong. 

P.S. I'm natural btw.


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 10, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> I only partially agree with relaxed heads in the "natural hair movement". The point of the natural hair movement was for people to accept the natural texture of their hair. At least that's what I thought.....



I understand where your coming from, however, we need to come together as a people and embrace each other without fear of discrimination against each other. That's out problem. Not hair, but our state of thinking and it's crippling us. No one has to know your reason for relaxing or being natural, the fact is that we all go through the same struggle and discrimination and we shouldn't have to deal with it from each other. I know what it's like to be natural, I've been there. Does it make me less of a black person that I don't want to deal with it but will support my natural sisters? No it doesn't. 

Bleach blonde Becky, curly perm Becky and fire crotch Becky still help each other out at the end of the day and are getting ahead together; you think they care about who is using chemicals? No ma'am, they are not.


----------



## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 10, 2014)

Question: I'm still half relaxed, does this means that I can only halfway support the natural hair community? 







.....EXACTLY!

Support is support. Whether its from a 2c-4c natural, A transitioner, or a Bone straight relaxed head. Let's not lose focus and turn on our own shall we.  

Please and Thanks


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 10, 2014)

KammyGirl said:


> And it's comments like this that's going to keep Becky and 'em trying to get in. Makes us look like a bunch of discriminatory bitter ol' ABW. What about women that have been natural for years and are a part of the NHM and then they decide to relax for styling reasons? We kick them out? Come on now. Ridiculous. Not everyone that has a relaxer hates their natural hair you know.  And the fact remains, no matter how hard Becky's hair is to manage she won't be getting a relaxer and will never understand why that is even something considered. A relaxed BLACK woman would. I can't believe how all of these threads have lost focus. Got people in here talking about relaxed heads don't belong.   P.S. I'm natural btw.



Huh? How? I'm NATURAL. You can't run around telling people they can't be on a team you aren't even on. If you permanently alter your hair texture you aren't natural. You can cheer from the side lines but that's it.


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 10, 2014)

Saludable84 said:


> I understand where your coming from, however, we need to come together as a people and embrace each other without fear of discrimination against each other. That's out problem. Not hair, but our state of thinking and it's crippling us. No one has to know your reason for relaxing or being natural, the fact is that we all go through the same struggle and discrimination and we shouldn't have to deal with it from each other. I know what it's like to be natural, I've been there. Does it make me less of a black person that I don't want to deal with it but will support my natural sisters? No it doesn't.  Bleach blonde Becky, curly perm Becky and fire crotch Becky still help each other out at the end of the day and are getting ahead together; you think they care about who is using chemicals? No ma'am, they are not.



I understand that but "team natural" means NO permanent hair straighteners. It's about loving the hair texture you were born with. Blacks are as bad as whites about hair texture discrimination.
I'm all for us helping each other as "black girls rock" but again... If you aren't on the team you only get to cheer from the side lines.


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 10, 2014)

EnExitStageLeft said:


> Question: I'm still half relaxed, does this means that I can only halfway support the natural hair community?  .....EXACTLY!  Support is support. Whether its from a 2c-4c natural, A transitioner, or a Bone straight relaxed head. Let's not lose focus and turn on our own shall we.  Please and Thanks



Uuuuhhh you didn't even wait for my response.  team natural is for transitioners who are growing out natural hair to wear and style in public. Why is everyone acting so obtuse? I'm not saying I want to see WW on a site designed for BW. Team Natural is about loving the hair you were born with. You weren't born with relaxed hair. ;-)


----------



## Brwnbeauti (Jul 10, 2014)

Were there any relaxed ladies in here caping for Becky? Did I miss something?


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 10, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> I understand that but "team natural" means NO permanent hair straighteners. It's about loving the hair texture you were born with. Blacks are as bad as whites about hair texture discrimination. I'm all for us helping each other as "black girls rock" but again... If you aren't on the team you only get to cheer from the side lines.



So I should cheer you on, but not have a say on how it affects my people? I should be disrespected but not have a feeling about it because you have an Afro and I don't? You have a right to be more passionate about it that me, meanwhile your criticizing people who are supporting the movement for whatever reason they feel? Instead of trying to curb ignorance?

Maybe you have no problem living on a "side line" from time to time, but I do. 

You've redirected the topic just like Nikki, but from this moment on I refuse to come back in this thread. I leave it at that, because you and Nikki are not worth my time anymore.


----------



## DoDo (Jul 10, 2014)




----------



## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 10, 2014)

@MissC320


MissC320 said:


> Huh? How? I'm NATURAL. You can't run around telling people they can't be on a team you aren't even on. If you permanently alter your hair texture you aren't natural. You can cheer from the side lines but that's it.



.....but here's the thing. THEY CAN!

Whether they alter they're hair texture has nothing to do with them supporting a cause. You seem to have confused the two. 



MissC320 said:


> I understand that but "team natural" means NO permanent hair straighteners. It's about loving the hair texture you were born with. Blacks are as bad as whites about hair texture discrimination.
> I'm all for us helping each other as "black girls rock" but again... If you aren't on the team you only get to cheer from the side lines.



But why?

There are white women on Naturally Curly as we speak supporting us, so why shouldn't relaxed sista's? What so wrong with supporting a cause that doesn't directly affect you? What's wrong with supporting one another? 



MissC320 said:


> Uuuuhhh you didn't even wait for my response.  team natural is for transitioners who are growing out natural hair to wear and style in public. Why is everyone acting so obtuse? I'm not saying I want to see WW on a site designed for BW. Team Natural is about loving the hair you were born with. You weren't born with relaxed hair. ;-)



My question was Rhetorical actually.

The only one that's acting obtuse in this situation is YOU. You don't seem to understand that they're not trying to impose on our community or even be apart of it for that matter. THEY'RE SUPPORTING US! Because that in the end is what we need for our message to be heard....SUPPORT!

What were trying to figure out is why YOU'RE trying to exclude someone from a cause with the same viewpoint as yourself. We all want the Natural Hair Community to remain something that glorifies and positively represent BLACK women. So whats the issue? Whether they're chemically process shouldn't be an issue. WE'RE ALL FOR THE SAME THING! 

You're just not making sense to me.


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 10, 2014)

Saludable84 said:


> So I should cheer you on, but not have a say on how it affects my people? I should be disrespected but not have a feeling about it because you have an Afro and I don't? You have a right to be more passionate about it that me, meanwhile your criticizing people who are supporting the movement for whatever reason they feel? Instead of trying to curb ignorance?
> 
> Maybe you have no problem living on a "side line" from time to time, but I do.
> 
> You've redirected the topic just like Nikki, but from this moment on I refuse to come back in this thread. I leave it at that, because you and Nikki are not worth my time anymore.



Saludable84 but we're being obtuse.I'm right behind on you on rolling out of thread. And I think I'm serious this time.


----------



## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 10, 2014)

@Saludable84

Oh no honey. YOU'RE WELCOMED! (and not on some sidelines either....whatever the hayle that means .  I embrace you with my my half natural/half relaxed hair and all. Don't let ignorance, keep you from stating your opinion. Its warranted. Trust me.

KammyGirl

You need to stay too. People like you keep the REAL message surrounding this thread alive.


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 10, 2014)

Alright, I will stop feeding them...
*walks back out of thread*
O_O


----------



## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 10, 2014)

Yeah.....We're the trolls .


----------



## DoDo (Jul 10, 2014)

EnExitStageLeft said:


> @Saludable84
> 
> Oh no honey. YOU'RE WELCOMED! (and not on some sidelines either....whatever the hayle that means .  I embrace you with my my half natural/half relaxed hair and all. Don't let ignorance, keep you from stating your opinion. Its warranted. Trust me.
> 
> ...



Thanks could not EVER be enough!!!

EnExitStageLeft was in my head! Don't go, you are Black women who share the struggle, we are sisters in this and your opinions are valued . Please don't forget it, .


----------



## DoDo (Jul 10, 2014)

EnExitStageLeft said:


> Yeah.....We're the trolls .



In my comment I do believe it said Troll, in the singular . I am not sure where the confusion came from...


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 10, 2014)

And I'm natural. I just don't like hearing stuff like that. We are always talking about being divided and we can't even come together to keep Becky out. That's not cool. I'm a natural that is all for every single black woman supporting and being involved in the NHM. 

Chile them ww laughing at us. Where sunnieb at? If I spelled her username wrong someone correct me and get her in here. Lol


----------



## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 10, 2014)

DoDo

She's clearly confused overall, so I'm not surprised.


----------



## TamaraShaniece (Jul 10, 2014)

I'm so confused. There is something that I don't get concerning this movement. 

Curly hair in General is unacceptable in western beauty. When I read the Curly Girls Guide, she looked white to me, even the white lady on the cover, but black women still used her method. 

I feel like shade is thrown to black, Spanish, etc for having easier natural hair. I love YTber MoKnowsBest. She doesn't have my hair texture but I love her tutorials. 

I don't know about this whole sell out stuff but a woman is a woman no matter their ethnicity or hair texture. We have a lot more history behind our hair but WW w/ curly hair have hair issues too. We shouldn't force them out as was done to us.


----------



## ezina (Jul 10, 2014)

When natural hair becomes a lifestyle and not merely a movement, and we as black women fully accept it, relaxing your hair will more readily be seen as a styling choice and not something to do because of a deep-rooted hatred for black hair. It makes a lot of sense for relaxed ladies to be in this movement, because at the end of the day, this goes deeper than hair; it's about total acceptance of the black self.


----------



## ezina (Jul 10, 2014)

TamaraShaniece said:


> I'm so confused. There is something that I don't get concerning this movement.
> 
> Curly hair in General is unacceptable in western beauty. When I read the Curly Girls Guide, she looked white to me, even the white lady on the cover, but black women still used her method.
> 
> ...



That's why they have the curly hair movement. Let's not conflate the two issues.

I would say that the curly hair movement is an umbrella term for all things involving non-straight hair (regardless of race or ethnicity). The natural hair movement is a compartment under the curly hair movement that is specific to black women. 

Someone correct me if I'm wrong. This is my understanding. Are the two movements completely separate with no ties whatsoever to each other?


----------



## DoDo (Jul 10, 2014)

It's like Feminism and Black Feminism. In my opinion it works similarly.


----------



## sunnieb (Jul 10, 2014)

KammyGirl


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 10, 2014)

sunnieb said:


> @KammyGirl


 I just felt like I couldn't give a decent argument on the subject and since I know you didn't speak your peace before, maybe you wanted the floor.  LOL


----------



## PJaye (Jul 10, 2014)

DoDo said:


> It's like Feminism and Black Feminism. In my opinion it works similarly.



I wholeheartedly agree.  

Since the Feminism Movement failed to take into account the distinct needs of Black women, the Womanism Movement arose as a result of that deficiency (e.g., Feminism = the eradication of gender-based oppression versus Womanism = the eradication of class, race and gender-based oppression).  Conversely, the Natural Hair Movement focused on the specific needs and issues encountered by Black women that were not being addressed within the Curly Hair Movement.

Additionally, similar to Womansim, one of the many benefits of the Natural Hair Movement is that it’s resources and solutions will provide needed assistance to others, men and women alike.  However, receiving benefit from a group’s resources does not necessitate inclusion.  Others can share with us and learn from us, but their participation should be marginal, at best.


----------



## Femmefatal1981 (Jul 10, 2014)

PJaye said:


> I wholeheartedly agree.  Since the Feminism Movement failed to take into account the distinct needs of Black women, the Womanism Movement arose as a result of that deficiency (e.g., Feminism = the eradication of gender-based oppression versus Womanism = the eradication of class, race and gender-based oppression).  Conversely, the Natural Hair Movement focused on the specific needs and issues encountered by Black women that were not being addressed within the Curly Hair Movement.  Additionally, similar to Womansim, one of the many benefits of the Natural Hair Movement is that it’s resources and solutions will provide needed assistance to others, men and women alike.  However, receiving benefit from a group’s resources does not necessitate inclusion.  Others can share with us and learn from us, but their participation should be marginal, at best.



Now what's so hard to understand about this? Makes perfect sense.


----------



## sunnieb (Jul 10, 2014)

KammyGirl said:


> I just felt like I couldn't give a decent argument on the subject and since I know you didn't speak your peace before, maybe you wanted the floor.  LOL



No ma'am. I'm done with this thread and that subject.  I want it to get back on topic and stop with the same old natural/relaxed bs.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using LHCF


----------



## PJaye (Jul 10, 2014)

Femmefatal1981 said:


> Now what's so hard to understand about this? Makes perfect sense.




IMO, the predominant schools of thought from those in favor of inclusion appear to be based upon feelings of affinity and kinship:

- They experience discomfort at the thought of being a part of something that does not include their white friends and family members

- They do not wish to take part in anything that seems to highlight and celebrate the Black portion of their heritage over the white portion

- They believe that a connection, a sisterhood, exists between all women; and they are unwilling to participate in any enterprise that severs or impedes upon that relationship 

A smaller percentage of the dissenters are operating under the argument of increased enlightenment and tolerance.  The remainder are wholly bogus and self-serving.  This is what I observed at the onset of these threads, and nothing has occurred since then to modify my opinion.


----------



## lovemyhair247 (Jul 11, 2014)

The reappropriation of black culture to include or comfort those not affiliated within it is something that has gone on way too long. From music to fashion to now hair, almost every aspect of modern pop culture and trends are a reformulation of things associated with black culture. Fashion designers and magazine editors introducing cornrows, bantu knots, wave caps and African prints as "new" trends really saddens me. The texture, density and structure of my hair can not be duplicated with a teasing comb and some hair spray and has yet to be deemedor revered by Vogue. It's a distinct extension of myself that took me 12 years to appreciate and love. By going natural and accepting my hair I also began to accept that my hair won't grow out my head like Sally, Becky and Sue, I accepted that men and women alike would turn their noses up at me, I accepted that something as simple as hair would make me stand out even when I didn't necessarily want to. So until a full white women has written a tell-all bestselling story of how at the tender age of three years old her mother had to slap on a lye relaxer on top her head to deal with the toughness of her hair, then and only then will the natural hair movement be for "all". *sips tea*


----------



## greenandchic (Jul 11, 2014)

NaturallyATLPCH said:


> Me too. I unsubbed from CharyJay a while back and just unsubbed to* Quest for the Perfect Curl*.





curlytwirly06 said:


> Not my post, shared by a lady in another forum:
> 
> In light of recent events, I thought it would be a good idea to make a thread to list the New Blacks who have sold out so I and others can unsubscribe/ stop giving them clicks. So far I know of:
> 
> ...




QFTPC uploaded a video answering the questions/rumus about her being involved with Texture Media:  I'm Tired of Rumors Started...QFTPC & TextureMedia **FULL Disclosure**


----------



## LdyKamz (Jul 11, 2014)

@greenandchic summary please. Not sure I want to click the link.

Edit: It was short so I watched it. I do remember a while back that issue she referenced in the video where vloggers were talking about knowing their worth and not getting paid. But I didn't pay close attention to it at the time and I don't even remember companies being named. 

But basically NC doesn't own her blog. Got it.


----------



## Avyn (Jul 12, 2014)

Can they join the movement?




Lol! Kidding! A little comic relief!


----------



## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 12, 2014)

I know I mentioned I had unsubbed from Elle (Quest for the perfect curl) but I had to go back and research. I didn't see any information that warranted me to do such. I haven't heard her comment on this issue like the others (Taren916, CharyJay, Melshary,  etc.). So why were we suggested to unsub from her? (From a quote a member posted from another forum in here)

If it was based on the rumor that her blog is owned by NC that's not true. *subs again*


----------



## LadyRaider (Jul 12, 2014)

I haven't unsubscribed to anyone over this. Like Elle said, I'm just there for the information. I don't care what their politics are, particularly if they are not putting it in their videos.


----------



## LadyRaider (Jul 12, 2014)

Hah hah... all those links in that post above didn't take long to read because all but one of them were inactive. Doh!


----------



## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 12, 2014)

LadyRaider said:


> I haven't unsubscribed to anyone over this. Like Elle said, I'm just there for the information. I don't care what their politics are, particularly if they are not putting it in their videos.



Honestly had she spoken on it then yes, I probably would've unsubbed depending on her view, but of those she was the only one I was subbed to (I'm not subbed to the others I mentioned for personal reasons). She has always just seemed straight forward and objective over the years since I big chopped and that's what made her cool.

Anyway, moving on along...


----------



## IDareT'sHair (Jul 12, 2014)

ezina said:


> *It makes a lot of sense for relaxed ladies to be in this movement, because at the end of the day, this goes deeper than hair; it's about total acceptance of the black self*.


 
This is where I am with supporting the Natural Hair Movement (as a Relaxed Head).

For me, it doesn't matter how I wear my Hair, it matters that we all as Black Women face the same issues in the Workplace, the Marketplace, Political and Social issues including Healthcare.

If White Women were suffering with Fibroids at the rate Black Women are, they would have been a cure decades ago. (and that's just one quick example that readily comes to mind).

So, Yes, I can "Cape" for Natural Hair.  And if not for Natural Hair, for being a Black Woman in America.

After all, we all face the same discriminatory practices in this Country regardless of "how we wear our hair"

And to be quite frank, I've run into a lot of Oreo's on the job that were sporting natural hair.  

So, just because you wear your hair "Natural" don't mean you're down with the movement.

The former CEO where I work sported a TWA for the 12-13 years she ran the company and was the biggest, hugest, Uncle Tom since Clarence Thomas.  Maybe the Biggest one on the Planet.  

So don't get it twisted and equate "Blackness" with Natural-ness.


----------



## Froreal3 (Jul 12, 2014)

Saludable84 said:


> So I should cheer you on, but not have a say on how it affects my people? I should be disrespected but not have a feeling about it because you have an Afro and I don't? You have a right to be more passionate about it that me, meanwhile your criticizing people who are supporting the movement for whatever reason they feel? Instead of trying to curb ignorance?
> 
> Maybe you have no problem living on a "side line" from time to time, but I do.
> 
> You've redirected the topic just like Nikki, but from this moment on I refuse to come back in this thread. I leave it at that, because you and Nikki are not worth my time anymore.



Saludable84 watch ppl liken this discourse to being similar to us "excluding" Becky an em. Imo it isn't the same because regardless of whether blk women relax or go natural,  we are all are affect the same.

Sent from my Snow White Frost Galaxy S4 using LHCF


----------



## cami88 (Jul 12, 2014)

Oh God, why do we have to do this? Questioning blackness, calling folks coons, uncle toms, and new blacks? Can we not all come together over this one issue, applauding those who support our stance, and respectfully disagreeing with those who don't, without accusing each other of not being black enough? We are ALL black in here, and personal views/opinions do not take away from that.

Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 12, 2014)

Froreal3 said:


> Saludable84 watch ppl liken this discourse to being similar to us "excluding" Becky an em. Imo it isn't the same because regardless of whether blk women relax or go natural,  we are all are affect the same.  Sent from my Snow White Frost Galaxy S4 using LHCF



I definitely agree. Someone bought up Jim Crow to me the other day because of something at my job the other day and as I was writing this I really thought about separate but equal. We can't all be for one thing while letting some separate us at the same time. There will always be a few bad apples, but in order to get up and get past, we have to stomp down what's kept us down in the first place. I didn't mean to get so rude and upset, but it important we all accept each other. 

EnExitStageLeft
Next time I come to ATL, I really need to meet you!


----------



## Saludable84 (Jul 12, 2014)

IDareT'sHair said:


> So, just because you wear your hair "Natural" don't mean you're down with the movement.  The former CEO where I work sported a TWA for the 12-13 years she ran the company and was the biggest, hugest, Uncle Tom since Clarence Thomas.  Maybe the Biggest one on the Planet.  So don't get it twisted and equate "Blackness" with Natural-ness.



It's true though. There is a women at my job who is natural and has a cute Fro with a nice texture and curl pattern. I used to tell her all the time her hair was nice until she told me she wasn't natural by choice but because her hair can't handle relaxing. I told her it looks good on her but she said "eh, I care for it I just enough to make it look good" because she is a supervisor. She keeps is bleached blond and neat, but that's about it because she does not like her hair. I was talking to her one day in the bathroom and her attitude over her own hair was so negative. She never fails to let me know she wants my hair and never have I seen her compliment any natural women's hair. Only relaxed. And this was about 3-4 years ago I first met her and had to work closely with her and realized that not everyone is for acceptance.


----------



## MissCrawford (Jul 12, 2014)

LadyRaider Hey...Why were the blog responses removed??...


----------



## IDareT'sHair (Jul 12, 2014)

I feel I can use any term I feel appropriate to apply to the situation in the Workplace I experience for 12+ Years. And I'm Grown.

So, for the sake of being P.C. let's just say, this particular woman had a Great _Affinity_ for White Women. (White people in general). 

I think she was upset & disappointed when her only Son married a Black woman instead of a White Women (yeah it was that deep).

Black women, Relaxed, Natural, Braided, BKT'ed Twisted Out whatever...sat there and watched this woman steadily 'promote' less qualified White Women at a faster pace than well educated Credentialed Black Women.

She looked at other Black Women as a "Threat"

Before she came and took over, Well qualified Black Women held spots as General Counsel and various /numerous VP positions.

She came in and dismantled everything and put a bunch of 'lesser' qualified White Women & Men in many of those spots where Black Women were kickin' butt & takin' names.

In the end however, her White inner Circle set her up and she ended up being forced out of the Organization into retirement.

She will forever be the Biggest Sell-Out I have ever seen to this date.

Yeah....She may have 'looked' the part and being down for "The Movement" but trust me, her actions and her decisions demonstrated something entirely different.


----------



## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 12, 2014)

greenandchic said:


> QFTPC uploaded a video answering the questions/rumus about her being involved with Texture Media:  I'm Tired of Rumors Started...QFTPC & TextureMedia **FULL Disclosure**



I figured she did this based on this rumor of her blog being owned by NC, etc. greenandchic. I watched the vid and saw her FB, thanks for the link.


----------



## cami88 (Jul 12, 2014)

IDareT'sHair said:


> I feel I can use any term I feel appropriate to apply to the situation in the Workplace I experience for 12+ Years. And I'm Grown.
> 
> So, for the sake of being P.C. let's just say, this particular woman had a Great Affinity for White Women. (White people in general).
> 
> ...



I don't know what any of this has to do with anything. I'm wasn't commenting on the workplace politics at your job. I was referring to the divisive tactics used by others in calling names and questioning folks blackness.

Sent from my galaxy s4 using LHCF


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

Froreal3 said:


> Saludable84 watch ppl liken this discourse to being similar to us "excluding" Becky an em. Imo it isn't the same because regardless of whether blk women relax or go natural,  we are all are affect the same.  Sent from my Snow White Frost Galaxy S4 using LHCF



No we are not. Which is why I had more disapproval for going natural from black women then I did from WW. Don't try and put words in my mouth. If you are relaxed you ARE NOT NATURAL! If you are a WW you ARE NOT TEAM NATURAL.


----------



## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

IDareT'sHair said:


> I feel I can use any term I feel appropriate to apply to the situation in the Workplace I experience for 12+ Years. And I'm Grown.  So, for the sake of being P.C. let's just say, this particular woman had a Great Affinity for White Women. (White people in general).  I think she was upset & disappointed when her only Son married a Black woman instead of a White Women (yeah it was that deep).  Black women, Relaxed, Natural, Braided, BKT'ed Twisted Out whatever...sat there and watched this woman steadily 'promote' less qualified White Women at a faster pace than well educated Credentialed Black Women.  She looked at other Black Women as a "Threat"  Before she came and took over, Well qualified Black Women held spots as General Counsel and various /numerous VP positions.  She came in and dismantled everything and put a bunch of 'lesser' qualified White Women & Men in many of those spots where Black Women were kickin' butt & takin' names.  In the end however, her White inner Circle set her up and she ended up being forced out of the Organization into retirement.  She will forever be the Biggest Sell-Out I have ever seen to this date.  Yeah....She may have 'looked' the part and being down for "The Movement" but trust me, her actions and her decisions demonstrated something entirely different.



What do your work place politics have to do with anything?......
I'm TEAM NATURAL. I'm all for BW loving themselves the way they are naturally. I don't knock other black woman. I don't need some relaxed head telling me who should and should not be on MY TEAM.


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## Froreal3 (Jul 12, 2014)

DoDo said:


> It's like Feminism and Black Feminism. In my opinion it works similarly.



And in this case I am pretty sure going natural in the way it means for us came first.

Sent from my Snow White Frost Galaxy S4 using LHCF


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## Froreal3 (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> No we are not. Which is why I had more disapproval for going natural from black women then I did from WW. Don't try and put words in my mouth. If you are relaxed you ARE NOT NATURAL! If you are a WW you ARE NOT TEAM NATURAL.



I wasn't speaking for you and thus wasn't putting words in your mouth.


Obviously relaxed ladies are not natural and would thus not be featured as a natural icon on a blog, nor would they claim #teamnatural with a pic of relaxed hair on Instagram (as some white women have brazenly done). No one is disputing that.

We're confusing the issue here. Most ppl are now speaking of support for the movement. Yes, relaxed ladies can support and should because their hair grows out nappy.  Also a relaxed head can choose to go natural. On the other hand, white women can't do that. Therefore "natural" in this context doesn't and will never belong nor apply to them. I hope that made more sense.

Sent from my Snow White Frost Galaxy S4 using LHCF


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## SuchaLady (Jul 12, 2014)

Why are you so angry? And why are you yelling?



MissC320 said:


> No we are not. Which is why I had more disapproval for going natural from black women then I did from WW. Don't try and put words in my mouth. If you are relaxed you ARE NOT NATURAL! If you are a WW you ARE NOT TEAM NATURAL.


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## Saludable84 (Jul 12, 2014)

SuchaLady said:


> Why are you so angry? And why are you yelling?



This is my only response from now on. I just cannot.


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

^^^ Good. Lol


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## Honey Bee (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> No we are not. Which is why I had more disapproval for going natural from black women then I did from WW.


I was waiting for this, never fails. 



> If you are relaxed you ARE NOT NATURAL! If you are a WW you ARE NOT TEAM NATURAL.


Interesting that you wrote two different things. No, if you are relaxed, you are not natural. Duh. But you can, however, be '#teamnatural' as in, supporting the movement. What if you're relaxed and have three natural daughters? Or if you're transitioning? One month post? What about three years post? It starts gettting a lil ridiculous at a certain point.

Signed,
One year post with relaxed ends #teamnatural

Who gon check me, boo?!


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## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 12, 2014)

Saludable84

DITTO!!


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## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 12, 2014)

Froreal3

MissC320 Can't seem to fathom how one group can support something that doesn't immediately affect them. I tried explaining it, but she called me and a couple others trolls and implied how she wouldn't "feed" us anymore and dipped.


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

I never said they couldn't support. I said they shouldn't dictate. They can cheer in the corner next to Becky.


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## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 12, 2014)

Lord have mercy at the turn this thread has taken...


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

Honey Bee said:


> I was waiting for this, never fails.   Interesting that you wrote two different things. No, if you are relaxed, you are not natural. Duh. But you can, however, be '#teamnatural' as in, supporting the movement. What if you're relaxed and have three natural daughters? Or if you're transitioning? One month post? What about three years post? It starts gettting a lil ridiculous at a certain point.  Signed, One year post with relaxed ends #teamnatural  Who gon check me, boo?!



Welcome to the team. O_O


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## Honey Bee (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> I never said they couldn't support. I said they shouldn't dictate. They can cheer in the corner next to Becky.


But who was dictating? And what is there to dictate? I thought the 'movement' was pretty much solidified that '#teamnatural is for Africans, at home and abroad'. look: sorry 'bout that, Mr. Garvey )


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## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320

Because they relax their hair, they basically want to be "Becky". Right? 

This isn't a Relaxed vs. Natural debate, so please do me a favor and miss me with that.

Please and Thanks!

Also, what's your definition of support? Because as I remember it, people didn't have to show their support on some sorry behind "sidelines". 

Non-blacks whom supported the civil rights movement walked side by side with the same BLACKS this movement directly affected, though it didn't really benefit them at all. 

So my question to you is...

Why can't a relaxed haired BLACK woman, support a natural haired BLACK woman side by side in a "fight" to preserve a movement that wholeheartedly represents the BLACK woman?

Again, you're not making sense to me?


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## curlytwirly06 (Jul 12, 2014)

Please ladies keep this thread on course. Please don't let it veer off point and fail to address its topic.


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## SmileyNY (Jul 12, 2014)

Honey Bee said:


> I was waiting for this, never fails.
> 
> Interesting that you wrote two different things. No, if you are relaxed, you are not natural. Duh. But you can, however, be '#teamnatural' as in, supporting the movement. What if you're relaxed and have three natural daughters? Or if you're transitioning? One month post? What about three years post? It starts gettting a lil ridiculous at a certain point.
> 
> ...



Nice! No one can check you, boo! 

I think tranistioners like you & relaxed heads who support the natural movement are more #TEAMNATURAL than the militant naturals who treat #teamnatural like some sort of exclusive group that makes them better than anyone else. 

IMO, #teamnatural is about black women supporting, encouraging, and educating one another about natural hair.  

It's not a therapy group for needy insecure types who have a strong selfish need to feel more "special" than others


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## GoldenRule (Jul 12, 2014)

EnExitStageLeft said:


> MissC320
> 
> Because they relax their hair, they basically want to be "Becky". Right?
> 
> ...



I agree. This is about something being stolen from the black woman (yet again). It isn't all about the hair and the status of one's head need not disqualify them from supporting "team natural".


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## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 12, 2014)

GoldenRule

.....but she don't hear me tho'.


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## Saludable84 (Jul 12, 2014)

EnExitStageLeft said:


> GoldenRule  .....but she don't hear me tho'.



Mama always said we can't come together as a people because sometimes it's our own people that hold us down. But clearly a majority of us in here are not about keeping us down so clearly the previous generation taught most of us something right.


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## GoldenRule (Jul 12, 2014)

That's ok though. We're not all going to agree. It's a little sad that we can't come together to support a common cause but within every group of people, no matter how tightly-knit, you'll always have some who have a need to feel superior to others. You have the naturals, then you have the naturals who have been natural since 1976, then you have the naturals who have been natural ALL THEIR LIVES, then you have the naturals who have never ever even hot combed, then you have the ones who never even used COLOR (wait until they start to go gray...lol). Then you look up and lo and behold, their white SO is over in the corner cheering with Becky too. It's exhausting. God save us all.


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## Honey Bee (Jul 12, 2014)

GoldenRule said:


> Then you look up and lo and behold, *their white SO is over in the corner cheering with Becky too*. It's exhausting. God save us all.


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

EnExitStageLeft said:


> MissC320  Because they relax their hair, they basically want to be "Becky". Right?   This isn't a Relaxed vs. Natural debate, so please do me a favor and miss me with that.  Please and Thanks!  Also, what's your definition of support? Because as I remember it, people didn't have to show their support on some sorry behind "sidelines".  Non-blacks whom supported the civil rights movement walked side by side with the same BLACKS this movement directly affected, though it didn't really benefit them at all.  So my question to you is...  Why can't a relaxed haired BLACK woman, support a natural haired BLACK woman side by side in a "fight" to preserve a movement that wholeheartedly represents the BLACK woman?  Again, you're not making sense to me?



Why do you keep trying to put words in my mouth?...
 Please go back and READ. You both Becky and you can support from the side.


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

SmileyNY said:


> Nice! No one can check you, boo!   I think tranistioners like you & relaxed heads who support the natural movement are more #TEAMNATURAL than the militant naturals who treat #teamnatural like some sort of exclusive group that makes them better than anyone else.  IMO, #teamnatural is about black women supporting, encouraging, and educating one another about natural hair.  It's not a therapy group for needy insecure types who have a strong selfish need to feel more "special" than others



Who is trying to be better then who???... What are you even talking about?
I'm making a clear point that before curly Becky tried to join team natural relaxed ladies were not checking for team natural. 
And to those who think relaxed black women and natural black women are treated the same??... Uh no. We know that's not true so you can miss me with that.


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

GoldenRule said:


> I agree. This is about something being stolen from the black woman (yet again). It isn't all about the hair and the status of one's head need not disqualify them from supporting "team natural".



No one said they couldn't support. 
Please READ and not just go with 'group think'.


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## Honey Bee (Jul 12, 2014)

SmileyNY said:


> IMO, #teamnatural is about black women supporting, encouraging, and educating one another about natural hair.


Thank you. If this had happened while I was still relaxing, I would still be up in here showing love.


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## Honey Bee (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> I'm making a clear point that before curly Becky tried to join team natural relaxed ladies were not checking for team natural.


And your point would be incorrect. 

A perm only takes a few minutes. That relaxed woman you see mighta been natural an hour ago. 


eta, re: "groupthink." Is that, like, when black people agree on something?  If so, I like it and would like some more, please.  

ok, I'm done participating in the derailing. Like Obama said, be the change you wanna see.


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## Froreal3 (Jul 12, 2014)

Honey Bee said:


> But who was dictating? And what is there to dictate? I thought the 'movement' was pretty much solidified that '#teamnatural is for Africans, at home and abroad'. look: sorry 'bout that, Mr. Garvey )





I think we may be viewing the hashtag "teamnatural" in two different ways. It can mean that we have natural hair, are transitioning to natural, or it can mean we support and respect natural hair. 

We all have a problem with how Becky an 'em wanna show their hair with the hashtag "natural hair", be "natural hair icons" on our blogs, and say they are natural in the same context that blk women say it.  That is plainly and simply wrong imo. They simply can't do that. It doesn't make sense. 

On the other hand, unlike Becky an'em, black relaxed ladies aren't on Curly Nikki talking about "I'm a natural style icon."  Relaxed ladies can and do support their natural sisters in unity. They don't have to be natural in order to show support or agree that Sarah doesn't need to be on CN as a natural icon.

We also have to understand that the aesthetic of straight hair is the same on relaxed ladies and naturals who straighten. We are trying to promote a certain aesthetic when it comes to natural hair. Therefore, naturals who straighten would also not be part of "the movement."


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

Honey Bee said:


> And your point would be incorrect.   A perm only takes a few minutes. That relaxed woman you see mighta been natural an hour ago.   eta, re: "groupthink." Is that, like, when black people agree on something?  If so, I like it and would like some more, please.    ok, I'm done participating in the derailing. Like Obama said, be the change you wanna see.


Banding together on "stupid" just because we are all black women is not for anybody's benefit.
O_O


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

GoldenRule said:


> That's ok though. We're not all going to agree. It's a little sad that we can't come together to support a common cause but within every group of people, no matter how tightly-knit, you'll always have some who have a need to feel superior to others. You have the naturals, then you have the naturals who have been natural since 1976, then you have the naturals who have been natural ALL THEIR LIVES, then you have the naturals who have never ever even hot combed, then you have the ones who never even used COLOR (wait until they start to go gray...lol). Then you look up and lo and behold, their white SO is over in the corner cheering with Becky too. It's exhausting. God save us all.



Um ok. So Becky and her SO don't get to cheer on team natural....so what.?...


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

Froreal3 said:


> I think we may be viewing the hashtag "teamnatural" in two different ways. It can mean that we have natural hair, are transitioning to natural, or it can mean we support and respect natural hair.  We all have a problem with how Becky an 'em wanna show their hair with the hashtag "natural hair", be "natural hair icons" on our blogs, and say they are natural in the same context that blk women say it.  That is plainly and simply wrong imo. They simply can't do that. It doesn't make sense.  On the other hand, unlike Becky an'em, black relaxed ladies aren't on Curly Nikki talking about "I'm a natural style icon."  Relaxed ladies can and do support their natural sisters in unity. They don't have to be natural in order to show support or agree that Sarah doesn't need to be on CN as a natural icon.  We also have to understand that the aesthetic of straight hair is the same on relaxed ladies and naturals who straighten. We are trying to promote a certain aesthetic when it comes to natural hair. Therefore, naturals who straighten would also not be part of "the movement."



I partially agree with this. It's the mindset of SOME straight haired naturals that confuses me.


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## EnExitStageLeft (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> Why do you keep trying to put words in my mouth?...
> Please go back and READ. *You both Becky and you can support from the side.*








This conversation is becoming overwhelmingly pointless. You're clearly confused.


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## Saludable84 (Jul 12, 2014)

EnExitStageLeft said:


> This conversation is becoming overwhelmingly pointless. You're clearly confused.



ITA. Let's all move on. Please!!!!!


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## LadyRaider (Jul 12, 2014)

Yeah. This thread has jumped the shark.


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

honeybee since you clearly don't have a mind of your own there's no need for your senseless ranting. I can ask the group what YOU think. *insert eyeroll*


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## AnjelLuvs (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> @honeybee since you clearly don't have a mind of your own there's no need for your senseless ranting. I can ask the group what YOU think. *jnsert eyeroll*











*
HARLEM... Lol* ​


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## NaturallyATLPCH (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> honeybee since you clearly don't have a mind of your own there's no need for your senseless ranting. I can ask the group what YOU think. *jnsert eyeroll*



What in the heyal...


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## SuchaLady (Jul 12, 2014)

Idk if you are a reincarnate but your posting style is very strange. When people dont agree or cosign what you say you start going off on these off the wall tangents. Its rather odd  Typing in all caps, repeating the same thing, and insulting people will never make them agree. Close the laptop and go get some fresh air. 




MissC320 said:


> honeybee since you clearly don't have a mind of your own there's no need for your senseless ranting. I can ask the group what YOU think. *jnsert eyeroll*


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## SuchaLady (Jul 12, 2014)

I wasnt invested in this thread but now Im wondering if I should read it  The entire thing was ridiculous to me. All the annoyance my hair is giving me through I wish I white girl would say Team Natural in front of me. She dont know my life  Same thing as when white girls complain about not being able to find makeup that matches them. I be like bishh if you dont stfu.


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## MissC320 (Jul 12, 2014)

SuchaLady said:


> Idk if you are a reincarnate but your posting style is very strange. When people dont agree or cosign what you say you start going off on these off the wall tangents. Its rather odd  Typing in all caps, repeating the same thing, and insulting people will never make them agree. Close the laptop and go get some fresh air.



I'm not a reincarnate...whatever that means. I'm not looking for anyone to agree with me I'm merely stating my opinion. If you feel insulted by my opinion then that's your problem.


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## ronie (Jul 12, 2014)

Please stop. All of you. This is going nowhere good. 
Yes I be been reading E V E R Y single posts from the start.


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## HairPleezeGrow (Jul 12, 2014)

Okay I read this thread plus 2 others in its entirety and my head hurts. Y'all stop this...now I want some cookies

Where the heck is Mz.MoMo5235 at?


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## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 12, 2014)

HairPleezeGrow said:


> Okay I read this thread plus 2 others in its entirety and my head hurts. Y'all stop this...now I want some cookies
> 
> Where the heck is Mz.MoMo5235 at?



Girl I took a break and got some cookies. I cant deal with all this. 

I'll come back when people get some act right up in here. This whole thing makes me sad.  I dont like all this arguing and personal insults on each other.

Its exactly what becky wanted and we fell for the okie doke. This and other threads are proof. 

*runs out crying* I HOPE YALL HAPPY!


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## Saludable84 (Jul 12, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> Girl I took a break and got some cookies. I cant deal with all this.  I'll come back when people get some act right up in here. This whole thing makes me sad.  I dont like all this arguing and personal insults on each other.  Its exactly what becky wanted and we fell for the okie doke. This and other threads are proof.  *runs out crying* I HOPE YALL HAPPY!



Sings "Baby Come Back!"


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## curlytwirly06 (Jul 12, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> Girl I took a break and got some cookies. I cant deal with all this.  I'll come back when people get some act right up in here. This whole thing makes me sad.  I dont like all this arguing and personal insults on each other.  Its exactly what becky wanted and we fell for the okie doke. This and other threads are proof.  *runs out crying* I HOPE YALL HAPPY!



Said the same in another thread. We can have a discourse without resorting to name calling. I stand firmly on the side of team natural not being taken over by WW, but I'm not going to name call and berate someone who disagrees. 


Unless they actin foolish,  then I would kindly tell them where to find the exit button and take that divide and conquer subject changing bull somewhere else.


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## ronie (Jul 12, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 I blame you for my failed weigh-in on Monday. I was at the mall and got 3 each of macadamia nut, chocolate chip, and oatmeal cookies. My excuse was that I will share with DH when I get home, but I ate all 9 cookies, lol.


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## Honey Bee (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> @honeybee since you clearly don't have a mind of your own there's no need for your senseless ranting. I can ask the group what YOU think. *insert eyeroll*



 I feel like I talked about this technique in OT last week. Ladies, I'm sure we all remember that scene from Malcolm X where, in the practice run before the assasination, dude was like 'Get your hand out my pocket!!' Somebody in OT asked what that was about and I mentioned how, as I know it, that phrase is commonly used to create a distraction in a public place for nefarious purposes (like pickpocketing).






I choose take it as a sign that we're on the right path.


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## marta9227 (Jul 12, 2014)

MissC320 said:


> I don't need some relaxed head telling me who should and should not be on MY TEAM.



This is giving into that divide and conquer. We're all black women dealing with black women hair issues and I am not natural at this time but I may be in the future and have been in the past. I definitely learn things from natural hair sites, and I think all textures and styles of black hair are beautiful. I cannot learn anything about hair care from a white woman and therefore don't want to see one on the hair care websites I sub. But as black women we need to stick together, later for that team natural vs team relaxed, we are all black women trying to grow, style and love beautiful healthy hair! 

*drops mike*


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## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 13, 2014)

Saludable84 makes me think of transformers.  Love that movie!

curlytwirly06 I just dont understand why its so hard for us to stick together. I really don't get it. We dont all have to agree 100% no questions asked! Just stick together as a people though

ronie I hate when I buy snacks for other people but I end up being the primary or only consumer of said snacks  nice to see I'm not alone lol

marta9227 fully agree...  but when you put "drops mike" I read drop MILK! 
I was like "NNNOOOOO!!!!!! WHAT ABOUT THE COOKIES?!"


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## marta9227 (Jul 13, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> marta9227 fully agree...  but when you put "drops mike" I read drop MILK!
> I was like "NNNOOOOO!!!!!! WHAT ABOUT THE COOKIES?!"



Lol! That's going to be my new thing from now on. After I've said my piece I'll be like *drops the milk*


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## Cattypus1 (Jul 13, 2014)

marta9227 said:


> Lol! That's going to be my new thing from now on. After I've said my piece I'll be like *drops the milk*


This is what "drops the mike"...or the "milk" makes me think of...
https://www.facebook.com/2535572510...5100_4065_n.jpg&size=324,200&fbid=25355785100


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## curlytwirly06 (Jul 13, 2014)

Cattypus1 said:


> This is what "drops the mike"...or the "milk" makes me think of... https://www.facebook.com/25355725100/photos/pb.25355725100.-2207520000.1405287892./25355785100/?type=3&src=https%3A%2F%2Fscontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-xfa1%2Ft1.0-9%2F10400937_25355785100_4065_n.jpg&size=324%2C200&fbid=25355785100



You are to wrong for this. What is in that mans head?


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## Cattypus1 (Jul 13, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> You are to wrong for this. What is in that mans head?


I'm sorry...but every single time I see "drops the mike" I see Eddie and hear "that boy can sang."


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## Mz.MoMo5235 (Jul 14, 2014)

curlytwirly06 said:


> You are to wrong for this. What is in that mans head?



JUST LET YOUR SOUL GLO!


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## Serenity_Peace (Jul 14, 2014)

Everyone needs to watch this to understand why it matters:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKg2c7iWtis


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## aquajoyice (Jul 14, 2014)

Honey Bee said:


> I was waiting for this, never fails.
> 
> 
> Interesting that you wrote two different things. No, if you are relaxed, you are not natural. Duh. But you can, however, be '#teamnatural' as in, supporting the movement. What if you're relaxed and have three natural daughters? Or if you're transitioning? One month post? What about three years post? It starts gettting a lil ridiculous at a certain point.
> ...



I love this come back  and agree with everything you've said here. What's most important to understand is that relaxers may permanently change the texture of your hair but since our hair continues to grow there is a point when you deal with the texture that society tells you is bad. Being relaxed doesn't mean you can't be part of the movement because on some level you still have to deal with the negative labels of having kinky hair. That's the real issue. We have to remember that coming together is more important than segmenting based on some ridiculous notion.


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## RockRideTrue (Jul 14, 2014)

I disagree with her stance on the issue. But really, don't attack her (or each other),don't read her blog anymore (or the posts of those who you can't be civil with). It was becoming repetitive anyways. There are plenty of black bloggers who thinks the same way on the issue. 


Either you're for integration of the "natural hair movement" or you know integration on issues like this never works well for black women. We always end getting the short end of the stick...

Still,no matter the stance,be respectful.


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## curlytwirly06 (Jul 15, 2014)

Mz.MoMo5235 said:


> JUST LET YOUR SOUL GLO!



O dear, I was on my phone so I only saw the screen shot of the video.  To funny.


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## *Frisky* (Jul 15, 2014)

Serenity_Peace said:


> Everyone needs to watch this to understand why it matters:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKg2c7iWtis


 

Yessss!! This is why the division between black women needs to end. We need to work together to further what ever causes are important. There is more strength in one big army fighting the same fights than several little ones doing their own thing.


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## Honey Bee (Jul 15, 2014)

Psssst.  If this whole thing riled you up, come join us in taking *action*.

Find us over here... and then follow the breadcrumbs.


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## rawsilk (Sep 6, 2014)

You have no idea how great it feels to hear that -- thank you MissCrawford. 

I have shared before that I REALLY wish that I had daughters because I feel like I have so many lessons to share that have been hard (hard!) learned/won. So ... I'm happy to report that the "adopting a lil' brown girl from 'somewhere'" topic is back at the top of priority list.  (I had to get the household on board w/ the big plan  ).  Anyway, hence the absence; been kind of busy and emotionally consumed. Pray for us that this goes smoothly and that God's plan continues to reveal itself clearly and with sense of ease, purpose and joy ...



MissCrawford said:


> rawsilk
> 
> That....was....*AMAZING!!!* you said everything I could not find the words to say. I am so empowered right now. My future was bright but now it is GLEAMING!!


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## Mz.MoMo5235 (Sep 6, 2014)

rawsilk congrats and good luck!!!  I would love to adopt one day if I ever get my stuff together


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## rawsilk (Sep 7, 2014)

Thank you for saying that kellistarr  -- as I mentioned above, it means a lot to know that one's words inspire. 





kellistarr said:


> I came back to this post to read up on others thoughts and opinions and read rawsilk's post.
> 
> rawsilk  Wow, that was incredibly moving; refreshed my memory, put things in proper perspective, brought back good ol' times and bad ones and was beautifully stated.


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