# What is the difference between 3c and 4a hair?



## Gleek (Apr 25, 2010)

I am really confused by this hair typing thing. Can someone show me pictures of the two?

Thank You.


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## JayAnn0513 (Apr 25, 2010)

4A- kinks

3C- curls


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## Gleek (Apr 25, 2010)

Okay, what is the difference between a kink and a curl?


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

A kink is a tiny curl. So anyone with big curls doesn't have kinks. So all kinky hair is curly but not all curly hair is kinky. Curly hair made of big curls is not kinky.

Examples of 4A hair:

A WNG on 4A is clearly visible from a distance but notice how the hair stands:




Also 4A can be combed out into a perfect microphone afro...and the curls can still be seen from far (4B would just look like a cloud):



Examples of type 3C hair:

The curls are much bigger and flop more than stand up:



I think if you brushed out or combed out type 3C hair, it'd look like this and I think it's hard to form a round afro with 3C hair:


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## Sapphire_chic (Apr 25, 2010)

Thank you Nonie  i've always been just a lil confused


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## NIN4eva (Apr 25, 2010)

ooh. Love that first 4A picture!


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## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 25, 2010)

Here is a picture of my friends hair she is the perfect example of type 4a hair we are texture twins.

*Type 4a*

















*Type 3C*






This is me rocking one of my favorite protective styles done with added 
synthetic hair but if it were real it would be 3C








​​


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## Platinum (Apr 25, 2010)

Those type 4 pics make me want to chop right now!


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## SEMO (Apr 25, 2010)

Perfect explanation Nonie, and the pictures are right on point.

I think the confusion between 3c and 4a comes in when a person  has both textures on their head.  Then it can be hard for someone trying to learn the differences in hair types.  For example, I personally consider myself a 3c/4a.  I used to think I had more 4a than 3c, but now I think it may be the other way around.



Nonie said:


> A kink is a tiny curl. So anyone with big curls doesn't have kinks. So all kinky hair is curly but not all curly hair is kinky. Curly hair made of big curls is not kinky.
> 
> Examples of 4A hair:
> 
> ...


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## Kurlee (Apr 25, 2010)

curl size/diameter. That's it.


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## lwilliams1922 (Apr 25, 2010)

great thread/info!

I'm confused myself. I don't think I have the body/thickness like the great looking 4's. I also think I don't have the popping curls that 3's have.

my hair tends to look diff depending on what i've done to it or put in it.


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## Gleek (Apr 25, 2010)

Thanks you Ladies. I am new and transitioning(6-7 months). I this has really been confusing me.


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

Platinum said:


> Those type 4 pics make me want to chop right now!



 Don't be too quick to chop. There's also 4B hair, like mine which will not look at all like that and can be quite a shocker for one thinking all 4's look like that. 

Here's 4B beside the 4A I posted:




4B hair sort of curls back into a compact mass whose curls are not easy to see.

Also here's a comparison of 4A puff vs 4B puff:


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## Platinum (Apr 25, 2010)

Hmm...I think I may be more of a 4b than a. I guess I won't really know until I BC. Thanks for the demonstrations, Nonie. You're my She-Ro.


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## JJamiah (Apr 25, 2010)

My question is the shine factor, my son has I believe 4a hair but so does my cousin, her hair has no natural shine to it, yet his shines similar to mine, any of you girls understand what I am saying?


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## drappedup (Apr 25, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> Here is a picture of my friends hair she is the perfect example of type 4a hair we are texture twins.
> 
> *Type 4a*
> 
> ...



Wait....I'm confused.....the first pics look like what was just said to be 4b....at least I think I can tell between 3C and 4A now, lol. erplexed


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## SEMO (Apr 25, 2010)

JJamiah said:


> My question is the shine factor, my son has I believe 4a hair but so does my cousin, her hair has no natural shine to it, yet his shines similar to mine, any of you girls understand what I am saying?



I understand what you're saying.  Though two people may have the same size curls and curl pattern (4a for example), their hair can also differ based on hair texture (silky vs. cottony).


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## JJamiah (Apr 25, 2010)

SEMO said:


> I understand what you're saying.  Though two people may have the same size curls and curl pattern (4a for example), their hair can also differ based on hair texture (silky vs. cottony).



U hit the nail on the head that is exactly what I am saying, hers is more cottony and his is more silky I am like they look to have the same curl size, She alway tries to get the same effect but I am like "I Dunno". 


Thanks so much!


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## Gleek (Apr 25, 2010)

What is the best way to get your hair typed? Washed and conditioned? Just washed? leave-in no leave-in?


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## lushcoils (Apr 25, 2010)

drappedup said:


> Wait....I'm confused.....the first pics look like what was just said to be 4b....at least I think I can tell between 3C and 4A now, lol. erplexed



Yea, the first 2 pics look 4b to me.


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## lwilliams1922 (Apr 25, 2010)

wheezy said:


> What is the best way to get your hair typed? Washed and conditioned? Just washed? leave-in no leave-in?



wet/damp/dry?

combed or not combed?


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

drappedup said:


> Wait....I'm confused.....the first pics look like what was just said to be 4b....at least I think I can tell between 3C and 4A now, lol. erplexed



Actually, the reason you think that is because that first pic is not shiny but if you pay close attention, you can clearly see that the puff is made of curls. Here it is again (hope you don't mind BMP):


BlackMasterPiece said:


> *Type 4a*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Compare that with *4B hair*:




In the enlarged pic, the curls are _kiiiiinda_ visible, but notice what happens when I shrink the pic to about the size of the pic BMP posted: the curls are no longer visible because of their size. Does that clarify it for you?


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## Spring (Apr 25, 2010)

My hair type is definitely between the 4a and 3c pics.


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## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 25, 2010)

drappedup said:


> Wait....I'm confused.....the first pics look like what was just said to be 4b....at least I think I can tell between 3C and 4A now, lol. erplexed





lushcoils said:


> Yea, the first 2 pics look 4b to me.



No dont be confused....the 4a nonie posted is the same as the 4a I posted its just in the one I posted you can't see her coils because her hair is naked with no products.

4b is an even smaller curl diameter like the pictures nonie posted....me and nonie could have the same hair length but hers will have much more shrinkage and look more like a cloud whereas with 4a when the hair is moisturized you can identify tiny pen spring sizedcurls with the naked eye.

To use my friend again as an example:

When I did comb coils on her (using only gel and a fine tooth comb to define her coils) this is her natural coil diameter: (she has maybe 50-60% shrinkage)











Then contrast that with a type 4b/c little girls hair I recently did: (she had 70-80% shrinkage meaning her hair would shrink up to appear to be about 1/3 its actual length....that is due to her very tiny coil diameter)






*Note the extremely tiny size of the coils at the ends of her twists*



​​


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## HarySituation (Apr 25, 2010)

great thread, pics, and explanations! thx!


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

lwilliams1922 said:


> wet/damp/dry?
> 
> combed or not combed?



I think to get a good idea it'd have to be clean (so shampooed and hence free of products) and then you can post a pic of not combed as well as combed. 

Since it's hard to comb most types of hair dry and w/o product, maybe comb with conditioner and rinse while combing under water and then leave well alone (for the combed look). And if you want to show the uncombed look, comb with conditioner or finger comb with conditioner if you prefer (separate strands using fingers), rinse while finger combing and let be (for the uncombed look).

My naked hair finger combed with conditioner then rinsed with finger combing (ie very little manipulation) looks like this:



My naked hair combed with conditioner and then rinsed while being combed looks like this:


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## lushcoils (Apr 25, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


>



Her hair still looks 4b to me.. especially in the above 2 pics. I don't see curls. I see a cloud like in Nonie's hair.

I don't think you can compare twists and coils. If I do my hair in coils, it will act/look different than if my hair was in twists, braids, etc.

So our hair texture is defined with what our hair looks like with product in it?

In that case, I have 4a hair. 


See, Nonie, the top pic in the post you just made makes your look like its 4a. This hair typing stuff makes no sense.


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## JJamiah (Apr 25, 2010)

It makes sense in the fact that it goes by the size of your curls, my hair size curls are that of Chalk, not side walk chalk.

I would go by wet hair as well, my hair when combed out is poofy, frizzy and buffont like, LOL. As the question I asked above my son's hair is between 4a/3c my cousin is 4a his hair is shiny while her hair more dull would probably make people think otherwise.


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## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 25, 2010)

I posted the pictures of her comb coils to simply make her coil diameter more obvious since it hard to tell in the pics I posted  .....when you do comb coils on someone you're simply defining their natural coil diameter....it doesn't alter the width of the coils like setting it in rollers would.

Hair typing is all about curl diameter and nothing else....thats the most important thing to keep in mind. Really the biggest point that was made here is that 4a is the widest coil of the kinky hair types and the coils get smaller from there


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

lushcoils said:


> Her hair still looks 4b to me.. especially in the above 2 pics. I don't see curls. I see a cloud like in Nonie's hair.
> 
> I don't think you can compare twists and coils. If I do my hair in coils, it will act/look different than if my hair was in twists, braids, etc.
> 
> ...



I think your confusion is you assume 4B doesn't have coils coz they don't show from afar. The photo you are talking about that I just posted is what anyone with 4B hair would look like if they clarified their hair (Please do this on a small section or you'll have a nightmare to deal with) then conditioned and combed through, then during rinsing, used fingers to separate strands (please be sure to stretch strands when separating or you'll knot your hair up). In other words, open the springs up and then pull the strands apart or let the weight of the water provide that stretch for you so you can separate strands. 

That same hair I posted that you think looks like 4A seen here beside real 4A hair, as I posted before:




Notice the ends of the Turner's hair in the 4A pic look like the hair of the chick BMP posted.

And for another perspective of the difference in coil size between 4A and 4B, the ends of my twists show you the size of my 4B coils which are way tinier than 4A coils:


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## Mandy4610 (Apr 25, 2010)

drappedup said:


> Wait....I'm confused.....the first pics look like what was just said to be 4b....at least I think I can tell between 3C and 4A now, lol. erplexed


 


lushcoils said:


> Yea, the first 2 pics look 4b to me.


I am confused too. I too thought those first two pics looked more 4b. So what about 4c?
Lawd, this is why I stay far away from hair typing, I get more confused the more information I get lol.

Ladies, I know your explanations are thorough, I am just generally confused and mystified by hair types


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## JJamiah (Apr 25, 2010)

Nonie said:


> I think your confusion is you assume 4B doesn't have coils coz they don't show from afar. The photo you are talking about that I just posted is what anyone with 4B hair would look like if they clarified their hair (Please do this on a small section or you'll have a nightmare to deal with) then conditioned and combed through, then during rinsing, used fingers to separate strands (please be sure to stretch strands when separating or you'll knot your hair up). In other words, open the springs up and then pull the strands apart or let the weight of the water provide that stretch for you so you can separate strands.
> 
> That same hair I posted that you think looks like 4A seen here beside real 4A hair, as I posted before:
> 
> ...



I love cornrows and braids that have the curls at the bottom  NICE!


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## worthy2b (Apr 25, 2010)

I'm confused which one looks like cotton?  The front of my hair won't curl no matter what I do to it, twists, plait nothing it just looks like a black cotton ball. The back and sides of my hair have pen spring coils I love that.  I think the back is 4a right?


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## jupitermoon (Apr 25, 2010)

*Nonie*, I know I've probably said this before but I love how you break it down when explaining things.  I enjoy looking at your hair pics too.

I think hair typing is kind of subjective plus there are so many factors that make up our hair such as strand size, density, porosity, etc.


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

Mandy4610 said:


> I am confused too. I too thought those first two pics looked more 4b. So what about 4c?
> Lawd, this is why I stay far away from hair typing, I get more confused the more information I get lol.
> 
> Ladies, I know your explanations are thorough, I am just generally confused and mystified by hair types



There's no such thing as 4C. People who've never seen the coils in their hair coz they never let it shrink up to its "resting phase"--a smart move if you ask me--assume that their hair has no form so came up with 4C or CNapp. Those are just nicknames for manipulated 4B hair. 

4A hair can be combed to look like 4B hair, and I do agree it can be confusing. But the difference comes in that 4A hair can be worn in a very clearly clumped WNG look because of the size of curls while 4B hair would just look like an uncombed mess. Also when you look at the two hair types side by size, you would clearly know the difference. So maybe WNG should be the test? 

When I tried a WNG puff, my hair was probably as long as Turner's. But while hers looks like this:



Mine looked like this:


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## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 25, 2010)

/\ Nonie gives the most comprehensive explanations

Hair typing is *ONLY* about curl diameter...nothing else. We shouldn't expect it to tell us about porosity, density, thickness of strands shine or forecast our good hair days or bad hair days....only curl diameter.

I think alot of people on the board are under the mistaken impression that 4a is within the curly range......and its not. 4a is the first sub-set of the kinky hair textures....if you comb 4a hair out it will look like an indistinct cloud.....however if you moisturize 4a hair....you can see some coils with the naked eye.....with 4b hair and above.....even if the hair is moisturized....the coils are sooooo tiny that it will still appear to be an indistinct cloud even with product.


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

worthy2b said:


> I'm confused which one looks like cotton?  The front of my hair won't curl no matter what I do to it, twists, plait nothing it just looks like a black cotton ball. The back and sides of my hair have pen spring coils I love that.  I think the back is 4a right?



Worthy, could you shampoo a section of hair in the front, then DC it (Emergencee or GPB) then shampoo again, condition...up to this point, feel free to comb through. Then when you rinse out the conditioner, use fingers only and then leave well alone. Post both pics if you can.

Kinda like I did here:

First with conditioner: 





And then rinsed out and finger combed to separate:



​
And you may see your true pattern. I say may coz sometimes our styling methods can affect how our hair in the front behaves, especially if we wear it pulled back a lot, so it may take time of leaving it alone to see what it really is like. Sometimes we just happen to have different textures on different parts of our head. (I think it's Kbragg who had a photo of her son with all sorts of textures on his head as a baby. Just giggle-inducing priceless and cute.  )


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## Mandy4610 (Apr 25, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Worthy, could you shampoo a section of hair in the front, then DC it (Emergencee or GPB) then shampoo again, condition...up to this point, feel free to comb through. Then when you rinse out the conditioner, use fingers only and then leave well alone. Post both pics if you can.
> 
> Kinda like I did here:
> 
> ...


Cute coils Nonie. I will post a pic of my hair later and see if you can help me figure out what my hair type is. Judging my the pics I see here, I am starting to think I am predominantly 4a with a hint of 3c, I used to think I was predominantly 4b with a hint of 4a. I was not planning to wash my hair today, but I might do it just to show yall.


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## worthy2b (Apr 25, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Worthy, could you shampoo a section of hair in the front, then DC it (Emergencee or GPB) then shampoo again, condition...up to this point, feel free to comb through. Then when you rinse out the conditioner, use fingers only and then leave well alone. Post both pics if you can.
> 
> Kinda like I did here:
> 
> ...


 
 Thank you I will once I take out these braids.  What you said made sense when I wear it out I do pull it back alot.


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

Mandy4610 said:


> Cute coils Nonie. I will post a pic of my hair later and see if you can help me figure out what my hair type is. Judging my the pics I see here, I am starting to think I am predominantly 4a with a hint of 3c, I used to think I was predominantly 4b with a hint of 4a. I was not planning to wash my hair today, but I might do it just to show yall.



You don't have to wash all of it, if you were not planning too. I wasn't washing my hair when I took those pics. I was trying to answer a certain post so I undid my twist bangs to demonstrate. 

Not sure how you're wearing your hair, but don't get it all shrunken and matted just to learn about your hair type. Test a small section. Or if you have photos of your hair that you've worn out before, just post those.


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## Taina (Apr 25, 2010)

After reading all the post, thanks very much for your comments Nonie and BMP. I think that my hair type should be a 4a. Now i have a question. Are there any differents 4a hair? Let me make myself clear. Is it possible that a person could have a full head of 4a hair but the hair acts different in some places of the head?  

Cause most of the time when the hair is different in some areas we automatically think there are places with some 3c or some 4b, but can that happend, diferent ways that a hair type can act?


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## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 25, 2010)

/\ Yes it is possible....if you ever go on youtube and see a channel called familygoingnatural.....the mother on that channel is type 4a silky which is a hair type that can easily slick down with little more the stroke of a hand....it has very high sheen and can easily look curly but when naked it has type 4a diameter coils....another example of this hair type is robot's professor....however in my opinion from the looks of your signature pic and your fotki pix you appear to be 3c


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## LadyRaider (Apr 25, 2010)

Nonie rules. I think Snape is a good avatar for her. (Smart!)

I thought "the community" invented 3c and there's no such thing "officially."

My hair looks exactly like my mom's except that her hair was silky and my texture is fine, but not silky (I don't know the opposite of silky, as my hair is not coarse... it's fine.) But the curls are the same. In that sense, I get the feeling that curl diameter doesn't really say much about how your hair should be treated/handled.


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## Taina (Apr 25, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ Yes it is possible....if you ever go on youtube and see a channel called familygoingnatural.....the mother on that channel is type 4a silky which is a hair type that can easily slick down with little more the stroke of a hand....it has very high sheen and can easily look curly but when naked it has type 4a diameter coils....another example of this hair type is robot's professor....however in my opinion from the looks of your signature pic and your fotki pix you appear to be 3c


I will check that channel thanks.
About my type, i dont get the curls that you mention and show at the begining of the thread, also i can get an afro style and it was said before that 3c hair can`t  or difficulty can do that.

After all i still confused


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## JayAnn0513 (Apr 25, 2010)

I think I've said this before but Nonie you for 100% my daughters hair twin.


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## Geminigirl (Apr 25, 2010)

After reading this thread I know I am a 4a. I have shrinkage but not like Nonie. I can wear WNG and my coils are noticeable...I think.

Here is my hair freshly conditioned













This is pretty much the texture of all of my hair. I heart it. Or is it 4ab?


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## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 25, 2010)

/\ BINGO! You got it Geminigirl! Youre my texture twin!



Taina said:


> I will check that channel thanks.
> About my type, i dont get the curls that you mention and show at the begining of the thread, also i can get an afro style and it was said before that 3c hair can`t  or difficulty can do that.
> 
> After all i still confused


 I guess we'll just haveta see in a coupla months Either way your hair is beautiful.


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## LadyRaider (Apr 25, 2010)

Your hair is so pretty, Geminigirl! 
I wish I could get a good picture like that! (sigh!)


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

Taina said:


> I will check that channel thanks.
> About my type, i dont get the curls that you mention and show at the begining of the thread, also i can get an afro style and it was said before that 3c hair can`t  or difficulty can do that.
> 
> After all i still confused



Have you seen LynnieB's hair? I think she's 3C/4A, IIRC. Maybe you have that sort of hair. 

Someday, post your pics and then we will be able to tell you.


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

I was trying to see if there's a way to very clearly differentiate between 4A and 4B and I see it really isn't that easy. I think someone with 4B hair can very clearly see the difference. 

When I was learning to draw, one of the things I was told when drawing African hair is not to just shade in a black block moving pencil to and fro, but to shade in using circles. It didn't seem to make sense since after all you will shade it in completely, but trust me, it makes a difference. Try it. 

Draw my little afro head in my siggy and then color in the 'fro using a back and forth pencil movement then do it again using circular motions. You'll see the difference in textural appearance.

I think 4A and 4B differ in a similar way from those two ways of shading. 4A has a look of having been created by many circles packed together. If you were to drive a car on the edge of a 4A afro like BMP's friend's hair, you'd go over bumps as if the road were made of pebbles, so you'd be rocking back and forth as you rode over it.

While with 4B hair, it'd feel less bumpy and more like driving over fine gravel, expecially if combed into a perfect 'fro like the bottom pics in the 4B set I post below. I think it takes a while to start to see the difference...but if you have 4B hair, you will know it. It doesn't clump like Geminigirl's hair.

ETA: In the photo I posted of my 4B WNG hair, I used S Curl Gel to stretch the hair so it'd hang and be bouncy like my 4A haired friend's, but instead of the hair stretching, it just curled back on itself. I don't know if that's another feature of 4B hair, or not, but I do know that my hair doesn't show any hint of length with product. Maybe something heavy like Bentonite Clay...but just the same product y'all use for WNGs? They are shrinkage catalysts for my hair.


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## lushcoils (Apr 25, 2010)

For once, 4b hair is described with a positive connotation!

Like driving over fine gravel, I like that.


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## mjdaisy (Apr 25, 2010)

Geminigirl - What kind of conditioner do you use?


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

lushcoils said:


> For once, 4b hair is described with a positive connotation!
> 
> Like driving over fine gravel, I like that.



 Girl, I love 4B hair so much that I have never thought of it negatively. In fact, I have to be careful that I don't come off a bit haughty talking about it. 

But I do know it baffles a lot of people because it does seem to have a mind of its own. And for one not prepared to deal with it--especially because natural hair of this kind was never the norm for most people who lived with only relaxed hair--it can be quite the unruly child. But once you figure it out, it can be blast to live with it. Sonce, Mwedzi, Sera...are some of my sheros in showing the versatility of the hair. And one day when my hair is as long as theirs, I'ma wear it in all it's many faces and help to show what a joy it is to have.


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## Embyra (Apr 25, 2010)

would keisha knight natural aka rudy huxtable hair be 4a?


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## Geminigirl (Apr 25, 2010)

mjdaisy said:


> Geminigirl - What kind of conditioner do you use?




In this picture I had used Skala Avocado conditioner and mask. It made my coils very defined and soft.


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## Gleek (Apr 25, 2010)

Can someone please show me what a combo of 3c/4a looks like?


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## JJamiah (Apr 25, 2010)

Taina said:


> I will check that channel thanks.
> About my type, i dont get the curls that you mention and show at the begining of the thread, also i can get an afro style and it was said before that 3c hair can`t  or difficulty can do that.
> 
> After all i still confused




To me It depends on your length 3c hair when short does get a little afro when combed out. 

AND YES it annoying flops when it gets longer,


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

coconut said:


> would keisha knight natural aka rudy huxtable hair be 4a?



Not really sure. I think she could be 3C/4A. Her hair reminds me of LynnieB's hair:











I don't know if it's pressed here but it looks that way to me:




​


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## JJamiah (Apr 25, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Not really sure. I think she could be 3C/4A. Her hair reminds me of LynnieB's hair:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I love RUDY Huxtable


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## BillsBackerz67 (Apr 25, 2010)

I havent read the thread but for my hair it just all comes down to the size of my curls. Texture wise Its cottony, not at all silky, and fluffy. But curl wise they are a little bit larger in diameter compaired to the 4a hair Ive seen.


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## peachfuzzz (Apr 25, 2010)

Great info ladies! Now if only I could figure out my texture and porosity!! Any tips for this?


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

peachfuzzz said:


> Great info ladies! Now if only I could figure out my texture and porosity!! Any tips for this?



I don't know how accurate this test is but here's a suggested test for porosity:
http://www.hair-styles-secrets-revealed.com/hair/255/hair-porosity-test/

As for hair texture, just do what we all do: post pics of your hair after you wash off all products, uncombed and then combed. Or just closeups of your styled hair.


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## Embyra (Apr 25, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Not really sure. I think she could be 3C/4A. Her hair reminds me of LynnieB's hair:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Thanks nonie her hair is very similar to mine 4a /4b pi cs i seen have much more texture than my own hair but im no way a 3c


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

Just wanted to add what 3C/4A looks like to me. With LynnieB's permission, here are some pics of her hair--notice how the first pic in the album below looks a lot like 3C and then later you see hair that looks a lot like 4A:

http://public.fotki.com/IsItOnlyHair/textureshair-typing-/no-product-hair-tex/

Her coils are way bigger than 4A hair looking more like 3C but they shrink up into an afro-ish puff...almost looks like it can't decide which way to go. 

To me it looks very much like Rudy's hair. Pity I can't get a very good pic of Rudy's unstretched hair:


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## MonPetite (Apr 25, 2010)

It's also important to note that strand diameter can play a role in making it hard to make visual distinctions.

Fine 4a hair with product may look more "3c-ish" than dense, thick 3c hair with product in terms of ringlets and "stretched" out looking spirals. However if you were to compare how well they made rounded fros or how they looked sans product, the difference due to CURL diameter would be more obvious.

Hair typing, on the Joy! *Nonie, your explanations are fantastic.*


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

BillsBackerz67 said:


> I havent read the thread but for my hair it just all comes down to the size of my curls. Texture wise Its cottony, not at all silky, and fluffy. But curl wise they are a little bit larger in diameter compaired to the 4a hair Ive seen.



I'd say you were 3C.


----------



## LadyRaider (Apr 25, 2010)

I did a porosity test when I first started my journey. I mean real early. Supposedly you are supposed to put your hair in water and see how long it takes to sink. Mine never sank. Never. I forgot what that meant. I guess I should try it now after I've been working on my hair for over a year.


----------



## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> I did a porosity test when I first started my journey. I mean real early. Supposedly you are supposed to put your hair in water and see how long it takes to sink. Mine never sank. Never. I forgot what that meant. I guess I should try it now after I've been working on my hair for over a year.



According to that site I linked to, it meant it wasn't porous. But hair whose cuticle is that tightly shut can also be difficult to moisturize...but once moisturized (perhaps with DCing) it holds onto moisture well.

Overly porous hair would sink immediately. That sort of hair absorbs water easily, so gets wet easily but also dries up just as fast. That sort of hair may need to be moisturized more often because it doesn't hold onto moisture. If the cuticle is intact, it may just need it closed (increase hair acidity) by doing an ACV rinse or using Roux Porosity Control. Otherwise if hair is damaged, cuticle broken/torn off, there's probably little that can be done to improve porosity.


----------



## Duff (Apr 25, 2010)

this is my hair taken a few days ago.  I figure I have a mixture of 3b to 4a on my head.  I still say my head is 3c/4a.  they are all coils of 3 different diameters; the smallest is about the size of a coffee stirrer.  I tried to capture all three of them on this pic (please dont be grossed out, I cleaned afterwards ).  my strands are fine also.  let me know if you guys disagree with my accessment....


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## Nonie (Apr 25, 2010)

Duff said:


> this is my hair taken a few days ago.  I figure I have a mixture of 3b to 4a on my head.  I still say my head is 3c/4a.  they are all coils of 3 different diameters; the smallest is about the size of a coffee stirrer.  I tried to capture all three of them on this pic (please dont be grossed out, I cleaned afterwards ).  my strands are fine also.  let me know if you guys disagree with my accessment....



It's hard to tell from the attached photos because the coils look so tiny and we don't have anything beside them to use as a reference to get an idea of the size of coil. But I don't think 3C when I see those. From your siggy pic, it's hard to tell coz as long as relaxed hair is adding its own pull, the texture will look different. The pics you posted look a bit like my shed hair:


----------



## jerseygurl (Apr 25, 2010)

Nonie as usual your explanations are usually on point. I used to get confused also but your explanation and BMP's make a bunch of sense. It will be interesting to see what my hair type is since I'm transitioning now. For now I just say it's a mixture of 4a and 4b


----------



## Mandy4610 (Apr 25, 2010)

Here is my hair, its not the most recent pic, but maybe it works for now FYI my hair texture in the back is a lot looser than the rest of my head, its looser and a little silky


----------



## Nonie (Apr 26, 2010)

Mandy4610 said:


> Here is my hair, its not the most recent pic, but maybe it works for now FYI my hair texture in the back is a lot looser than the rest of my head, its looser and a little silky



Your hair is 4B. It reminds me a lot of Afrokink's WNG and Mwedzi's.


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## lilsparkle825 (Apr 26, 2010)

for whoever wanted to see 3c/4a....i am a 3c/4a with a mix of silky strands and not-so-silky strands. my 3c is around the perimeter, my 4a towards the crown. i have about 50-60% shrinkage. these are all WNG pics.


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## FlowerHair (Apr 26, 2010)

I love these explanations, Nonie! 

I just wanted to add that for 3 hair, wetting your hair is not going to tell you anything about your curl size. For most type 3 hair the hair stretches when wet and looks like 2a/b hair. 

For some other hair types, the hair shrinks when wet.

That's also a distinction between type 3 and 4, I think?

For type 3 hair, it's better to wait until your hair has dried with no product to see what type it really is (curl size).


----------



## skegeesmb (Apr 26, 2010)

Nonie your explanations are terrific!

I'm a 3c/4a.  When my hair is wet my hair looks like 3a/3b hair, but after the second day my hair looks like 3c/4a hair.  Without any product on my dry hair my hair is definitely 3/4. I have curls that you can see, but they are different sizes (i.e.  my hair wet makes curls the size of sidewalk chalk and pen (not pen spring) sized curls.  But when my hair is completely dried it is pen sized (not pen springed) curls small waves.

I know a difference between 4a and 4b hair is that you can manipulate 4a hair to mimic 3c hair dried.  But from Nonie's pictures with product on wet 4b hair you can mimic 4a hair without product, but not 3c.

Nonie please help me here.  Am I talking out the side of my neck?!?


----------



## FlowerHair (Apr 26, 2010)

skegeesmb said:


> Nonie your explanations are terrific!
> 
> I'm a 3c/4a.  When my hair is wet my hair looks like 3a/3b hair, but after the second day my hair looks like 3c/4a hair.  Without any product on my dry hair my hair is definitely 3/4. I have curls that you can see, but they are different sizes (i.e.  my hair wet makes curls the size of sidewalk chalk and pen (not pen spring) sized curls.  But when my hair is completely dried it is pen sized (not pen springed) curls small waves.
> 
> ...



That sounds right. Just like you can manipulate 3 hair to look like a 2 with the right technique...


----------



## SerenavanderWoodsen (Apr 26, 2010)

OT but can I really test porosity by dropping a strand of hair into a glass of water? I'm about to do that now lol. I'm very curious. I think my hair is overly porous since it dries so quickly. I've been doing ACV rinses after every wash for a couple of months now and my hair seems happier...


----------



## DarkVictory (Apr 26, 2010)

JJamiah said:


> My question is the shine factor, my son has I believe 4a hair but so does my cousin, her hair has no natural shine to it, yet his shines similar to mine, *any of you girls understand what I am saying*?



I know exactly what you mean, because several people in my family have the no-shine hair. Someone on another hair board was telling me about how shine figures into hair type, but here on LHCF the consensus is it's about the curl size only.


----------



## JJamiah (Apr 26, 2010)

FlowerHair said:


> I love these explanations, Nonie!
> 
> I just wanted to add that for 3 hair, wetting your hair is not going to tell you anything about your curl size. For most type 3 hair the hair stretches when wet and looks like 2a/b hair.
> 
> ...



I find the opposite in my household on some. My 9 year old 3c/3b hair short seems to appear tighter (chalk) but when let dry it seems looser, yet his hair is not real long, so no real weight. 

My 7 year olds 3b/3c hair the 3b hair stays straight and has a wave when dry, and the top 3c gets half a curl when dry.

My 10 year old 4a hair seems to draw up when dry, heavy but same coil size when wet.

My baby has such a mixture it is sad, his hair is just confused ear to ear different texture, back different and top crown, his color is sandy brown, while all of us have black hair, my 10 year old has a brown color too.

My hair seems to flop the longer it gets which is why I usually relax it at a certain point, it has a great shine, and when wet it looks like chalkboard chalk until I comb it out  took me a while to find the no comb keeps the curls formed. 

I only go by the curl size myself, shine or no shine. It's like out of all the years working in the salon and going to school I never questioned the shine, it was all just beautiful hair to me. There is no good hair or bad hair, I love it all. I love milking damaged hair back to health, I love keeping healthy hair healthy. Weird fetish I am just glad I am not alone.


----------



## glamazon386 (Apr 26, 2010)

SEMO said:


> Perfect explanation Nonie, and the pictures are right on point.
> 
> I think the confusion between 3c and 4a comes in when a person  has both textures on their head.  Then it can be hard for someone trying to learn the differences in hair types.  For example, I personally consider myself a 3c/4a.  I used to think I had more 4a than 3c, but now I think it may be the other way around.



ITA... Many people have both so it gets confusing. I always thought I was primarily 4a but as my hair got longer I started to see a mixture. IMO, 3C looks more like a corkscrew or spiral whereas 4a looks more like a spring or coil. It's tighter. If that makes sense


----------



## JJamiah (Apr 26, 2010)

glamazon386 said:


> ITA... Many people have both so it gets confusing. I always thought I was primarily 4a but as my hair got longer I started to see a mixture. IMO, 3C looks more like a corkscrew or spiral whereas 4a looks more like a spring or coil. It's tighter. If that makes sense



Totally makes sense 

Like you need pen and paper to go left crown 3/4/5 

But all textures live happily on our heads LOL,


What did you do to your hair in your siggy? Rollerset? ( I like it and want body waves that is why I bought some soft rollers)


----------



## glamazon386 (Apr 26, 2010)

JJamiah said:


> Totally makes sense
> 
> Like you need pen and paper to go left crown 3/4/5
> 
> ...



Thanks... That's not my hair. It was a weave. It was body wave hair. I took it out a while ago. I need to change my siggy pic.


----------



## JJamiah (Apr 26, 2010)

glamazon386 said:


> Thanks... That's not my hair. It was a weave. It was body wave hair. I took it out a while ago. I need to change my siggy pic.



 I bought some soft rollers to duplicate Macheries Body/Beach waves I just wanted to know if others have tried it. That is a route I might take next winter. I have some Virgin Indian hair I told my husband I must have that has been sitting for a year and I might do that. But I want my real hair to get that wave on


----------



## FlowerHair (Apr 26, 2010)

JJamiah said:


> I find the opposite in my household on some. My 9 year old 3c/3b hair short seems to appear tighter (chalk) but when let dry it seems looser, yet his hair is not real long, so no real weight.
> 
> My 7 year olds 3b/3c hair the 3b hair stays straight and has a wave when dry, and the top 3c gets half a curl when dry.
> 
> ...


 
I don't quite understand - is their hair straight?
In that case it's not a 3 anything?

My hair has always been straighter when wet, even when I had a TWA.

For the people I know their curl is definately looser and the hair looks longer when wet (type 3s). 

LOL @ your baby's hair! I bet it's really cute in spite of all the different textures.  My hair was sandy brown when I was a child too, especially in the summers.

Kudos to you for dealing with so many heads of hair every morning!


----------



## peachfuzzz (Apr 26, 2010)

Nonie said:


> I don't know how accurate this test is but here's a suggested test for porosity:
> http://www.hair-styles-secrets-revealed.com/hair/255/hair-porosity-test/
> 
> As for hair texture, just do what we all do: post pics of your hair after you wash off all products, uncombed and then combed. Or just closeups of your styled hair.



Thanks for the link! I tried that test and the hair just floated.  After a few hours I discarded it...it was still floating. I also found a couple of other tests but the outcome was the exact opposite.  So I am officially confused. LOL

I attached 3 pics for curl typing.  The one w/green flower was highly manipulated. It's actually a closeup of my siggy.  The second pic is wet w/no prod but finger detangled (after DC). The last pic was actually Sept. of last year, wet w/ no product.


----------



## Nonie (Apr 26, 2010)

peachfuzzz said:


> Thanks for the link! I tried that test and the hair just floated.  After a few hours I discarded it...it was still floating. I also found a couple of other tests but the outcome was the exact opposite.  So I am officially confused. LOL
> 
> I attached 3 pics for curl typing.  The one w/green flower was highly manipulated. It's actually a closeup of my siggy.  The second pic is wet w/no prod but finger detangled (after DC). The last pic was actually Sept. of last year, wet w/ no product.



Just as I guessed (visitor's message I left you after stalking your album), you seem to be 4B.


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## peachfuzzz (Apr 26, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Just as I guessed (visitor's message I left you after stalking your album), you seem to be 4B.



LOL, I just realized I had a message!  I'm like, man! Nonie works quickly!

So is that why racking gel through my hair is nothing but a big mess?? I thought my hair was just too short! Edited to add: I think my gel application was just wrong!  I tried gel today with great success!!


----------



## song_of_serenity (Apr 26, 2010)

Does gel ever work for 4b hair then?


----------



## chebaby (Apr 26, 2010)

BillsBackerz67 said:


> I havent read the thread but for my hair it just all comes down to the size of my curls. Texture wise Its cottony, not at all silky, and fluffy. But curl wise they are a little bit larger in diameter compaired to the 4a hair Ive seen.


this is exactly how i would explain my hair. i didnt know if i were 3c or 4a so i would usually say 3c/4a mix. and my hair is very fine and not dense at all.


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## JJamiah (Apr 26, 2010)

FlowerHair said:


> I don't quite understand - is their hair straight?
> In that case it's not a 3 anything?
> 
> My hair has always been straighter when wet, even when I had a TWA.
> ...



Not that bad I could have had four girls! Thank heaven for little boys.

I best described it above, 3 hair isn't exactly straight it has form to it, , my 7 year olds hair is straight when wet and a wave pattern when dry.http://www.naturallycurly.com/hair-types
according to this chart it perfectly describes his hair, lol. I mousse his hair in the front to give it a little lip
My other sons hair 9 has a curl to it when towel dried kinda rough if anyone understands me please chime in. Other wise when I wash it, I can form a curl or lay it straight. The sides are always straight until it gets a little longer then his hair too has a bump, top is definitely a 3c no doubt about it. He is picture 3 my half and half actor. he usually enjoys his waves. LOL reminds me of wave caps and brushes! LOL

No 3c's b's or d's are going to act exactly alike. Same way I was questioning my son and my cousins 4a texture.

Oh yes the most I let their hair grow is 2 inches, I only let my son with 4a hair grow, because he wears twist in his hair. I can't form twist with the others so they suffer and go to the barber, yet they are dying for a set of twist, I just can't do it!


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## drappedup (Apr 26, 2010)

Okay, so now that I think I understand the difference between 3C and 4A, and the differences between 4A and 4B......what about the differences between 3B and 3C? And what is 4C hair? Because I have seen hair kinkier than what 4B was said to be.

Yeah, I've googled and stuff on this before, but I can never seem to find a definite and concise answer with good pictorial examples.


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## Nonie (Apr 27, 2010)

drappedup said:


> Okay, so now that I think I understand the difference between 3C and 4A, and the differences between 4A and 4B......what about the differences between 3B and 3C? And what is 4C hair? Because I have seen hair kinkier than what 4B was said to be.
> 
> Yeah, I've googled and stuff on this before, but I can never seem to find a definite and concise answer with good pictorial examples.



There's no such thing as 4C. What people call CNapp hair or 4C is really just manipulated 4B hair so that it appears to have no pattern. 

I'm not sure about 3's (coz I tend not to bother my head with things that have little to do with me), but I've always thought that the move from A to B to C involves a tightening of the curl as well as diminishing in size. 

So if I were to guess, I'd say 3B has bigger curls than 3C almost like 3A but 3B looks more like compact/compressed springs while 3A looks looser like stretched springs or corkscrews. 

I'd guess these are 3A:
















And maybe these are 3B:














Anyway this is so outside my league so I'ma pass the mike to someone in the 3's or anyone else who's paid attention to this type and is better qualified at explaining the differences within the group to us.  

ETA: And if I were to guess, I'd say Corinne Bailey Rae is 3B/3C:




















And on that note, I'ma dodge the tomatoes  and promptly exit this post before I get hurt. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




​

​


----------



## jupitermoon (Apr 27, 2010)

*Nonie*, don't leave, lol!   Seriously.  I like how you explain things with pictures included.  I'm a pictures person, too.

I think hair typing becomes tricky when texture is considered.  My hair is afro like but at the same time my hair feels smooth not cottony.








^^^Dry near naked hair with just a little EVOO for moisture and nothing else.  No flash.

Curls sizes.  Pictures taken with flash because my hair is very dark in color and doesn't show good detail without flash:




^^^Larger curls on top.  Dry 3rd day hair with a little EVOO and Giovanni as a leave in.  

My curls get smaller underneath:




^^^^ Dry 3rd day hair with a little EVOO and Giovanni as a leave in.

My smallest curls are underneath:




^^^^Dry 3rd day hair with Giovanni conditioner only as a leave in.  My curls are more like "S"'s and less like spirals.

Even in this thread people are describing and percieving the hair types differently and I find it all interesting.  This is why I'm not a fan of hair typing. I call my hair curly and highly textured.


----------



## ckisland (Apr 27, 2010)

CelinaStarr, the pic where you're holding half of your hair up is soo cool!!! You have a ton of curl patterns going on and it makes your hair look so interesting . 

I think to really know the difference between 4a and 4b (or 3c for that matter) you have to have dealt with them. I have all three (at least I believe so) on my hair and I think that there are obvious differences between 4a and 4b.


----------



## Nina_deF (Apr 27, 2010)

Calling NONIE!

My hair is a mixture of textures and some parts don't seem to fit into a catagory at all.

Exhibit A:
S-top that will curl up for nothing





Exibit B:
Curls in back, topped up with (what I imagine to be) 3Z (FRIZZ)





No product, airdryed:
No I do not go out like this





I guess I need solutions more than typing but still....


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## Eisani (Apr 27, 2010)

lilsparkle825 said:


> for whoever wanted to see 3c/4a....i am a 3c/4a with a mix of silky strands and not-so-silky strands. my 3c is around the perimeter, my 4a towards the crown. i have about 50-60% shrinkage. these are all WNG pics



I think we're hair twins, but que confusion! This is why I don't even get into the whole hair typing thing.


----------



## JJamiah (Apr 27, 2010)

Nonie said:


> There's no such thing as 4C. What people call CNapp hair or 4C is really just manipulated 4B hair so that it appears to have no pattern.
> 
> I'm not sure about 3's (coz I tend not to bother my head with things that have little to do with me), but I've always thought that the move from A to B to C involves a tightening of the curl as well as diminishing in size.
> 
> ...





CelinaStarr said:


> *Nonie*, don't leave, lol!   Seriously.  I like how you explain things with pictures included.  I'm a pictures person, too.
> 
> I think hair typing becomes tricky when texture is considered.  My hair is afro like but at the same time my hair feels smooth not cottony.
> 
> ...





Nina_deF said:


> Calling NONIE!
> 
> My hair is a mixture of textures and some parts don't seem to fit into a catagory at all.
> 
> ...


Nonie your great at explaining things me on the other hand get all tongue tied and blah blah blah, so don't exit 

Ladies  your hair beautiful lots of it, LOL! 
Off to the dentist, have to make sure those are intact, no use having nice long hair without nice teeth  LOL
GB and have a good day!


----------



## Stiletto_Diva (Apr 27, 2010)

*Nonie* don't leave yet!! I need your expertise. I've never been able to figure out my hair type because my hair always looks different. I claim 4a/b cause I figure that's the "safe" thing to call it. My hair acts different on a daily basis. One day there are curls another day it’s just fluff. Please help me figure it out.

This is my hair freshly washed, still damp with no product






Hair pulled back into a puff. Puff only has moisturizer and oil on it. Next 4 pictures are the same puff just different angles and distance away from the camera.

















Another puff picture with same products as previous puff. Notice the different look in texture and curl size.









Individual strands to show different curl patterns.






*Any idea what my hair type is?*


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## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 27, 2010)

drappedup said:


> Okay, so now that I think I understand the difference between 3C and 4A, and the differences between 4A and 4B......*what about the differences between 3B and 3C?* And what is 4C hair? Because I have seen hair kinkier than what 4B was said to be.
> 
> Yeah, I've googled and stuff on this before, but I can never seem to find a definite and concise answer with good pictorial examples.


Here you go!

*3A*





*3B*






*3C*​​





~*~*~*~*~*~​


CelinaStarr said:


> I think hair typing becomes tricky when texture is considered.  My hair is afro like but at the same time my hair feels smooth not cottony.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think in this pic your hair is big but I wouldn't say its afro like.....just poofy....afro textured hair would have more of a tendency to grow up and out....even when your hair is poofy it still hangs down and you can still kinda tell that its curly.



> Curls sizes.  Pictures taken with flash because my hair is very dark in color and doesn't show good detail without flash:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 To me your hair type is very clearly evident mostly 3c with maybe a touch of 3b at the crown

~*~*~*~*~​


Nina_deF said:


> Calling NONIE!
> 
> My hair is a mixture of textures and some parts don't seem to fit into a catagory at all.
> 
> ...


I know you didn't ask me...but I love hair typing so I'll respond anyway I think you're a 3c/4a silky combo

~*~*~*~*~​


Stiletto_Diva said:


> *Nonie* don't leave yet!! I need your expertise. I've never been able to figure out my hair type because my hair always looks different. I claim 4a/b cause I figure that's the "safe" thing to call it. My hair acts different on a daily basis. One day there are curls another day it’s just fluff. Please help me figure it out.
> 
> This is my hair freshly washed, still damp with no product
> 
> ...


You appear to be 4a silky to me....pen spring sized curls and from what I can tell it seems your hair can easily be slicked into a wet bun or make waves you probably have finer strands that make this possible....anywhoo thats my take


----------



## lux10023 (Apr 27, 2010)

Celina you appear to be a great example of 3C
your hair and texture come to mind as in afro but loose springy curl pattern..when it hinkof 3C


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## Nonie (Apr 27, 2010)

*Nina_deF* and *CelinaStarr*, you're mostly in the 3C group IMO. Now whether you have some 4A in there, I dunno. I'll let those who are 3C/4A chime on that note. But if I were to put you in just a group, I'd straight up say 3C. 

*Stilleto Diva*, your hair is combed out in all those photos, so it's really hard to say (Do you have a WNG pic?) but if I were to guess, I'd say 4B. Your puffs look very much like mine does in this pic but you seem to have more clumping than I do (which could mean you're 4A):




*Song of Serenity*, you asked if gel can work on 4B. Work how? What are you hoping it will do? As far as slicking hair down, I think gel can slick down any fine hair and "glue" it down. I just hate sticky hair so I don't use gel. But maybe if you explain what you're trying to achieve with it, I might be able to tell you if I think it can do that on 4B.


----------



## Nonie (Apr 27, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> Here you go!
> You appear to be 4a silky to me....pen spring sized curls and from what I can tell it seems your hair can easily be slicked into a wet bun or make waves you probably have finer strands that make this possible....anywhoo thats my take



BMP, I will trust your opinion coz you work with different textures more than I do. I do notice the waves on the slicked down part and they do appear bigger than would be formed by 4B, so you're probably right. I probably should retire from this typing.


----------



## lala (Apr 27, 2010)

3c/4a...I'm not sure the folks who are confused (like myself) will be able to identify their hair type based on these illustrations. I've always identified as 4a (based on previous hair typing posted on LHCF), yet my hair texture is no where near the 4a types displayed in this thread . I'd been relaxing my hair for over 15+ years and was typing my hair with chemicals in my hair. Now, that I'm 8-9 months post, I see that my hair type doesn't fall into these categories. I'm just gonna say that my hair is textured because that's what it is.


----------



## ms.blue (Apr 27, 2010)

My hair looks like geminigirl execpt the lower bottom half of head is silkier and the curls are slightly larger.  Does texture also cause confusion in determining hair type?


----------



## wavezncurlz (Apr 27, 2010)

This is fun! 
Our hair is soo amazing! I love all the variety.

BMP - according to the pictures you've posted I'm a 3bc - maybe some 3a. I have mostly silky texture and it's fine but dense. Would you agree?

I agree with Flowergirl - my hair wet looks straight/wavy. It dries with curls.

Can ya'll help me with my girls?

DD2 - she's 2. Her hair is very curly. Here it is freshly washed and styled.





It doesn't stay that smooth though. As the day goes on, it gets fuzzy at the crown and the pigtails are more poofy:






DD1 is so far my hair twin:
Here is her hair in a wng 





a different wng - different products- her curls are tighter here?!?





and hair styled in ponytails





If you look in my photobucket account in the folder called "experiments with my girls" (password in profile) you'll see how different their hair can look depending upon the style, product, and manipulation. What would you say their hairtypes are?



TIA!


----------



## FlowerHair (Apr 27, 2010)

Wavez - your girls are soooo pretty!!! 

I agree that DD1 is your hair twin, you both have a very silky type of 3b/c. DD2 looks more like a 3c/4a to me?


----------



## Stiletto_Diva (Apr 27, 2010)

Nonie said:


> *Stilleto Diva*, your hair is combed out in all those photos, so it's really hard to say (Do you have a WNG pic?) but if I were to guess, I'd say 4B. Your puffs look very much like mine does in this pic but you seem to have more clumping than I do (which could mean you're 4A):



This is my "WnG" Lol. The only parts of my hair that have been brushed are the edges that are laying down. The rest of my hair hasn't been combed.That's why I was so confused as to how I could do the same thing on different days and get different results (one day having defined curls, the next just fluff).The first picture is me fresh out of the shower after washing my hair. The only manipulation in that picture is from me pat drying my hair.

I think I will just keep claiming both types because I probably have a little bit of both mixed on my head.


----------



## FlowerHair (Apr 27, 2010)

I think my hair is a 3b/c, maybe leaning more towards a 3b?
The curls are fairly loose and big, but the texture is more like CelinaStarr's.

My naked hair (no products, just air dried):





A bright picture where you can really see the texture and curl size. Products: olive oil.





Dry hair brushed, it takes on a more fro-like texture:


----------



## Nonie (Apr 27, 2010)

Stiletto_Diva said:


> This is my "WnG" Lol. The only parts of my hair that have been brushed are the edges that are laying down. The rest of my hair hasn't been combed.That's why I was so confused as to how I could do the same thing on different days and get different results (one day having defined curls, the next just fluff).The first picture is me fresh out of the shower after washing my hair. The only manipulation in that picture is from me pat drying my hair.
> 
> I think I will just keep claiming both types because I probably have a little bit of both mixed on my head.



OK, then I will have to disagree with BMP and say you're 4B even with the sheen. I say that because your hair looks like Mandy's and the only difference is unlike Mandy's which is free, yours is pushed together into a compact mass. The ends clump like Afrokink's ends do...but the base does not, which is a characteristic of 4B.

ETA: Or maybe that's what people call 4A/B?  Can we just talk about the weather? It's balmy in Hogwarts today!


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 27, 2010)

/\ LOL! *Nonie* you wylin today....you know stilettodiva is a 4a silky her coils are larger and way more evident then yours....stop playin!

*FlowerHair* you hit the nail on the head with the self typing! Mostly 3b with possibly a touch of c 

 ~*~*~*~ ​


wavezncurlz said:


> This is fun!
> Our hair is soo amazing! I love all the variety.
> 
> *BMP - according to the pictures you've posted I'm a 3bc - maybe some 3a. I have mostly silky texture and it's fine but dense. Would you agree?*
> ...


You're right on the money 100% in agreement



> Can ya'll help me with my girls?
> 
> DD2 - she's 2. Her hair is very curly. Here it is freshly washed and styled.
> 
> ...


Both those cutie pies appear to be 3c Your babies are absolutely gorgeous!!!


----------



## blkbeauty (Apr 27, 2010)

Me too...and actually people always said that my hair texture is curly.  I see it as kinky instead of curly and I have rated my hair as 4A instead of 3C. However from looking at the pics I am not sure.  

Could there be an in between 3C or 4A?


----------



## Stiletto_Diva (Apr 27, 2010)

Nonie said:


> OK, then I will have to disagree with BMP and say you're 4B even with the sheen. I say that because your hair looks like Mandy's and the only difference is unlike Mandy's which is free, yours is pushed together into a compact mass. The ends clump like Afrokink's ends do...but the base does not, which is a characteristic of 4B.
> 
> ETA: Or maybe that's what people call 4A/B?  Can we just talk about the weather? It's balmy in Hogwarts today!





BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ LOL! *Nonie* you wylin today....you know stilettodiva is a 4a silky her coils are larger and way more evident then yours....stop playin!




And that's why I'm sticking to 4a/b lol. Even the experts can't agree on what my hair type is. Now I don't feel so bad about being totally confused about my hair type for the past few years.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 27, 2010)

/\ Yea I think 4a/b is pretty accurate anyhow


----------



## wavezncurlz (Apr 27, 2010)

thanks guys! I'm subbing to this thread.


----------



## wavezncurlz (Apr 27, 2010)

FlowerHair said:


> Wavez - your girls are soooo pretty!!!
> 
> I agree that DD1 is your hair twin, you both have a very silky type of 3b/c. DD2 looks more like a 3c/4a to me?


 
I tend to agree. Thanks!


----------



## lilsparkle825 (Apr 27, 2010)

Eisani said:


> I think we're hair twins, but que confusion! This is why I don't even get into the whole hair typing thing.


Really?? I love your hair, but don't think I've ever seen too many pics of your texture!! This excites me!

I think hair typing only gets confusing when people try to incorporate things like density, porosity or thickness. Like BMP said earlier, this system *only takes diameter into consideration. *One person's 3c can look totally different from someone else's, especially if one is more silky than another or one person has more s-shaped waves than curls. For instance, I have both 3c curls and s-shaped things that never quite turn into corkscrews on my head....and while some are silky and reflect a lot of light, other areas are dull and sort of dry.


----------



## jupitermoon (Apr 27, 2010)

lilsparkle825 said:


> Really?? I love your hair, but don't think I've ever seen too many pics of your texture!! This excites me!
> 
> I think hair typing only gets confusing when people try to incorporate things like density, porosity or thickness. Like BMP said earlier, this system *only takes diameter into consideration. *One person's 3c can look totally different from someone else's, especially if one is more silky than another or one person has more s-shaped waves than curls. For instance, I have both 3c curls and s-shaped things that never quite turn into corkscrews on my head....and while some are silky and reflect a lot of light, other areas are dull and sort of dry.


 
Agree.  That's why I describe hair as straight, wavy, curly, or coily/kinky.

I've too noticed how curly hair can be s-shaped, spiral or corkscrew shaped.  There's just too much variation that the hair typing system doesn't consider.


----------



## Nonie (Apr 27, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ Yea I think 4a/b is pretty accurate anyhow



OK, we can agree on that. 

You know BMP, when it comes to experience, you are the pro coz you handle other folks' hair (while Nonie only deals with her hair and her cats' fur) and so you can probably tell the types with your eyes closed. So I won't even take this outside with you.  

I'd wait to hear BMP's take on this, *blkbeauty*, but personally I'd call hair that is in-between 3C and 4A, 3C/4A. That's what I see in LynnieB's hair.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 27, 2010)

/\ lol thanks hun! You still give some of the most easy to understand comprehensive explanations around

*blkbeauty *I'd have to see some naked/and or wet hair pix to know


----------



## AvaSpeaks (Apr 27, 2010)

wavezncurlz said:


> This is fun!
> Our hair is soo amazing! I love all the variety.
> 
> BMP - according to the pictures you've posted I'm a 3bc - maybe some 3a. I have mostly silky texture and it's fine but dense. Would you agree?
> ...


 
 I think we get so caught up in using ONLY Type 3 and Type 4 as possible combinations, that we forget about other combos? 

Clearly these children have either some Type or Type 2 to their hair. More like maybe 3a/3c and then maybe 2b/3c or 2b/3a. There is no Type 4 in any of these children's hair. 

That's why I don't like and stop hair typing my hair. There are possible combinations that are not going to fit our "usual" hair types that run here on this board.


----------



## MilkChocolateOne (Apr 27, 2010)

AvaSpeaks said:


> I think we get so caught up in using ONLY Type 3 and Type 4 as possible combinations, that we forget about other combos?
> 
> Clearly these children have either some Type or Type 2 to their hair. More like maybe 3a/3c and then maybe 2b/3c or 2b/3a. There is no Type 4 in any of these children's hair.
> 
> That's why I don't like and stop hair typing my hair. There are possible combinations that are not going to fit our &quot;usual&quot; hair types that run here on this board.



  These girls do not have any type 2 hair. Type 2 hair does not curl, it only waves.  I think you are confusing their silky texture with type.  Andre's system only types according to the presence of a curl pattern and the diameter of the curl.  His system does not type according to density, texture, shine, strand size or anything else.


----------



## wavezncurlz (Apr 27, 2010)

MilkChocolateOne said:


> These girls do not have any type 2 hair. Type 2 hair does not curl, it only waves. I think you are confusing their silky texture with type. Andre's system only types according to the presence of a curl pattern and the diameter of the curl. His system does not type according to density, texture, shine, strand size or anything else.


 
wow- 
thanks mco- I would never classify any of our hair is 2. I think the wave comes from brushing the curls into styles.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 27, 2010)

MilkChocolateOne said:


> These girls do not have any type 2 hair. Type 2 hair does not curl, it only waves.  I think you are confusing their silky texture with type.  Andre's system only types according to the presence of a curl pattern and the diameter of the curl.  His system does not type according to density, texture, shine, strand size or anything else.


 Exactly.

This is type 2 hair.....not even _*close*_ to wavesncurls daughter's texture.


----------



## BlaqBella (Apr 27, 2010)

Wavesncurls those are some dollbabies you got there....TOO CUTE!
BTW me likey this thread also.


----------



## Shay72 (Apr 27, 2010)

What's the difference between a spiral, corkscrew, and a coil?  Is the spiral the loosest of the three and the coil the tightest?


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 27, 2010)

/\ Yep!.........​


----------



## O-ren (Apr 27, 2010)

I am so lost when it comes to my hair type. I've been saying 3c/4a. I may be right, but I'm not sure. From looking at different pictures on different websites, I don't know where I fit in.  I was thinking about it today, and I think if I put on a Yakima, then it would be sitting on my 4a and everything else would be 3c. Alas, I am unsure. Can someone please help me out here?! 

The smallest the curls (at my crown) are about straw size, and in the front they are pen, and behind my ears they are about the size of chalk, and do not like to curl at all. 
















I think my hair is fine, and I have yet to do the porosity test, but I'll do that in a minute and update.

ETA: Did the porosity test on three strands and they all float. Woohoo! I'm glad that isn't an issue, now I just have to find my staple moisturizer (looking at Qhemets and Darcy's).


----------



## ChristmasCarol (Apr 27, 2010)

Nina_deF said:


> Calling NONIE!
> 
> My hair is a mixture of textures and some parts don't seem to fit into a catagory at all.
> 
> ...


 
Nina, we're hair twins! My crown doesn't match the rest of my hair and it doesn't curl, either. I have corkscrews in the rear just like you, too. I measured my crown today while flatironing and it's 16 inches, while the curly hair in the rear is only about 10 inches. I'm always cutting my crown and thought I had a retention problem with the curly hair, but when I look at the new growth, the looser hair actually grows faster. I've been transitioning for a year, so it's easy to compare progress. Because of this, I always have a "mushroom". I have to cut the crown often so it doesn't hang so far below the rest of the hair. The bsl hair in my siggy is from the crown, underneath, the hair is noticeably shorter.

Because of the constant need to trim, I don't know how I'll ever achieve long lengths with hair like this.erplexed


----------



## NikkiGirl (Apr 27, 2010)

This is a very interesting thread. In any case, all you ladies have lovely curls. I can't wait until mine grows out.


----------



## BostonMaria (Apr 27, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> *3B*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Just wanted to point out that as my hair grew, I have more S waves than curls. I do have curls, but they're more at the bottom now not all over. I know its because of the length and my hair weighing down. This is why I don't pay attention to hair types. My hair looked more like the second picture, now it looks more like the first.

The front of my hair has absolutely no curl pattern, just S waves and it frizzes up like nothing I've ever seen. So does that mean its 3a? Its weird because altho we aren't supposed to take into consideration the kinkiness,  I think most people do. Oh and no I'm not claiming 3a LOL


----------



## drappedup (Apr 28, 2010)

wavezncurlz said:


> This is fun!
> Our hair is soo amazing! I love all the variety.
> 
> BMP - according to the pictures you've posted I'm a 3bc - maybe some 3a. I have mostly silky texture and it's fine but dense. Would you agree?
> ...



Soooooo cuuuuute! I just had to comment and say! I love it when moms take good care of their little girl's hair! I see so many day to day with poorly treated hair. erplexed


----------



## wavezncurlz (Apr 28, 2010)

BostonMaria said:


> *Just wanted to point out that as my hair grew, I have more S waves than curls. I do have curls, but they're more at the bottom now not all over. I know its because of the length and my hair weighing down. This is why I don't pay attention to hair types. My hair looked more like the second picture, now it looks more like the first.*
> 
> The front of my hair has absolutely no curl pattern, just S waves and it frizzes up like nothing I've ever seen. So does that mean its 3a? Its weird because altho we aren't supposed to take into consideration the kinkiness, I think most people do. Oh and no I'm not claiming 3a LOL


 
Same for me. 
Also, BMP, when wet, my hair looks like the 2 hair you posted above. Not when it dries though!


----------



## Nina_deF (Apr 28, 2010)

sipp100 said:


> Nina, we're hair twins! My crown doesn't match the rest of my hair and it doesn't curl, either. I have corkscrews in the rear just like you, too. I measured my crown today while flatironing and it's 16 inches, while the curly hair in the rear is only about 10 inches. I'm always cutting my crown and thought I had a retention problem with the curly hair, but when I look at the new growth, the looser hair actually grows faster. I've been transitioning for a year, so it's easy to compare progress. Because of this, I always have a "mushroom". I have to cut the crown often so it doesn't hang so far below the rest of the hair. The bsl hair in my siggy is from the crown, underneath, the hair is noticeably shorter.
> 
> Because of the constant need to trim, I don't know how I'll ever achieve long lengths with hair like this.erplexed


 
Yay, finally a hairtwin!
I'm so sorry though, I wouldn't wish parts of my hair on anybody.....

I was debating cutting the looser texture to avoid the mullet but as it is now I wouldn't be able to make a high ponytail without that length so I'm trying to ride out the mullet phase. I hope it will all even out by Chrstmas.... Until then I'll keep looking for the miracle curling creams to "correct" the S's and 3z frizz on top!


----------



## ChristmasCarol (Apr 28, 2010)

Nina_deF said:


> Yay, finally a hairtwin!
> I'm so sorry though,* I wouldn't wish parts of my hair on anybody*.....
> 
> I was debating cutting the looser texture to avoid the mullet but as it is now I wouldn't be able to make a high ponytail without that length so I'm trying to ride out the mullet phase. I hope it will all even out by Chrstmas.... Until then I'll keep looking for the* miracle curling creams to "correct" the S's and 3z frizz on top!*



You know your hair's pretty, even if it is bi-polar, lol

Nina, Have you ever tried curl activator?  I think I'll go get some and see if it will work on natural hair.


----------



## Nina_deF (Apr 28, 2010)

sipp100 said:


> You know your hair's pretty, even if it is bi-polar, lol
> 
> Nina, Have you ever tried curl activator? I think I'll go get some and see if it will work on natural hair.


 
The only one I've tried is S-curl (back in the day) during my first transition try. Too heavy for me.

I'm still searching though.

You have any tips?


----------



## ChristmasCarol (Apr 28, 2010)

Nina_deF said:


> The only one I've tried is S-curl (back in the day) during my first transition try. Too heavy for me.
> 
> I'm still searching though.
> 
> You have any tips?


 
No, nothing. A long time ago I used various scrunch/curling sprays. Some worked, but they were full of alcohol and other bad stuff. I used to wonder why I'd comb out handfulls of hair.   Now that I know better, I'll need to find something with better ingredients. I'm still transitioning and wearing my hair straight, so I won't have to worry about it for awhile.

Anywhoo, back to hair type - I often wondered why there was no "afro-ish wave" category. My crown is nothing like type 4, but it also doesn't fit the description for type 3.

*If you have waves and not curls, how do you measure the size of the curl to determine hair type? *


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 28, 2010)

BostonMaria said:


> Just wanted to point out that as my hair grew, I have more S waves than curls. I do have curls, but they're more at the bottom now not all over. I know its because of the length and my hair weighing down. This is why I don't pay attention to hair types. My hair looked more like the second picture, now it looks more like the first.
> 
> The front of my hair has absolutely no curl pattern, just S waves and it frizzes up like nothing I've ever seen. *So does that mean its 3a?* Its weird because altho we aren't supposed to take into consideration the kinkiness,  I think most people do. Oh and no I'm not claiming 3a LOL


I've seen your fotki and I always saw you as 3a/b



Oren_Green said:


> I am so lost when it comes to my hair type. I've been saying 3c/4a. I may be right, but I'm not sure. From looking at different pictures on different websites, I don't know where I fit in.  I was thinking about it today, and I think if I put on a Yakima, then it would be sitting on my 4a and everything else would be 3c. Alas, I am unsure. Can someone please help me out here?!
> 
> The smallest the curls (at my crown) are about straw size, and in the front they are pen, and behind my ears they are about the size of chalk, and do not like to curl at all.
> 
> ...


I think you typed yourself perfectly especially considering you said your curls vary from straw sized to pen sized.


----------



## Ediese (Apr 28, 2010)

Great thread. I would post some pics of my hair, but I'm too lazy. I've realized that I'm a very cottony 4a. My curls/coils differ in size. I have perfect definition in the back, but they get a little bigger in the crown/sides. Even when I comb out my hair, you can still see the curls but it's not as defined. It's growing down, and not out. As soon else mentioned, I can easily manipulate my hair so it looks like it's 3cish.


----------



## thetall1 (Apr 28, 2010)

Ok, I'm VERY confused now...I always thought I was the perfect example of 4a...Here's some of my photos...

Here's a puff w/ product several months after my BC:





Here's my hair (last year) w/ no product:










Here's a WNG (earlier last year):





Here's a puff w/ gel on the sides:





Here's a bun pic:





Latest WNG (December):










Here's a pic of two strand twists:






Yea, I'm EXTREMELY confused can someone help me out?? BC I'm a little salty...my hair only "curls" with product, and it's very spongy/fluffy, my hair is very fine and dense!!...


----------



## Ediese (Apr 28, 2010)

Proudnapps said:


> Ok, I'm VERY confused now...I always thought I was the perfect example of 4a...Here's some of my photos...
> 
> You have gorgeous hair! I'd definitely say you're a 4a.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 28, 2010)

@ *Proudnapps*: First of all your hair is absolutely beautiful! Wow love the color love the texture love the styles! You weren't wrong, you're definitely a 4a...its just that your hair type is whats known as type 4a silky. Which is to say that you have the pen spring sized coils typical of a 4a, but you have fine strands which means that not only can you achieve an afro....your hair behaves in many of the same ways curly hair does like clumping curls, effortlessly slicking down into styles like wet buns and your (gorgeous) puff with the slicked edges, you can achieve a smooth rollerset when you wanna straighten and get sleek results and even as your hair grows longer....you'll probably always be able to do wash and go's on loose hair with ease regardless of length.

~*~*~*~*~​


Ediese said:


> Great thread. I would post some pics of my hair, but I'm too lazy. I've realized that I'm a very cottony 4a. My curls/coils differ in size. I have perfect definition in the back, but they get a little bigger in the crown/sides. Even when I comb out my hair, you can still see the curls but it's not as defined. It's growing down, and not out. As soon else mentioned, I can easily manipulate my hair so it looks like it's 3cish.


Hey hun! Ediese your fotki is one of the most extensive around soo many styles and pics! Its awesome! Your hair is beautiful and your progress is remarkable.

As for hair type, you seem to be really attached to the notion that you're a type 4a.....and I hate to disappoint you but you're definitely not lol maybe a small patch of 4a silky comprising like 10% of your hair but thats about it lol just being real but its pretty evident.

Here's why....when looking at your hair texture album the size of your curls are clearly that of the 3 family....although some of them fall in the tighter 3c curls its still clearly curls...not coils.

A great example is your (stunning) Halley's Curls Creole Curly Weave, there is no type 4 hair that could ever blend with your weave with the crown hair left out the way your curly hair does. Even though you have waves in some spots they're very loose waves...on a type 4 silky the waves would be wayyyyy tighter then yours....so yea I'm like 100% certain that you're mostly a 3c, maybe a tiny patch of 4a silky but predominantly 3c


----------



## jupitermoon (Apr 28, 2010)

*Edise, *hair type aside, I've seen your pics and I *heart* your hair. I think it's so cool how uniform your little curls/coils are. Your wash and goes almost reminds me of a straw set but they are natural.

*Proudnapps*, your hair is such a lovely color in your first pic and your coils are gorgeous.



BlackMasterPiece said:


> I think in this pic your hair is big but I wouldn't say its afro like.....just poofy....afro textured hair would have more of a tendency to grow up and out....even when your hair is poofy it still hangs down and you can still kinda tell that its curly.
> 
> To me your hair type is very clearly evident mostly 3c with maybe a touch of 3b at the crown


 
*BlackMasterPiece*, thanks. My hair is looser on top. Gel makes this more evident. Here's my hair with conditioner and gel in it:






^^^^This is either 2nd or 3rd day hair. 

My hair takes on many different looks. That's the beauty of natural hair.

Interesting thread and I enjoy reading your interpretions, *BlackMasterPiece. *


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 28, 2010)

/\  Celina your hair is sooooooo *beautiful*! wow....when my crochet braids were wet thats kinda how they looked....they kinda looked like that from afar as well.....alota fun


----------



## jupitermoon (Apr 28, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\  Celina your hair is sooooooo *beautiful*! wow....when my crochet braids were wet thats kinda how they looked....they kinda looked like that from afar as well.....alota fun


 
Thanks.  That means a lot coming from you.  

Your hair is amazing.  I've seen your fotki and all of your hair styles.  I really liked your fro hawk and your crochet braids and bantu knot outs are fierce too.  You're not style challenged at all and can do so much with your hair.  You have a wonderful sense of style to.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 28, 2010)

/\ :blush3: Thanksomuch hun!


----------



## glamazon386 (Apr 28, 2010)

Ediese said:


> Great thread. I would post some pics of my hair, but I'm too lazy. *I've realized that I'm a very cottony 4a*. My curls/coils differ in size. I have perfect definition in the back, but they get a little bigger in the crown/sides. Even when I comb out my hair, you can still see the curls but it's not as defined. It's growing down, and not out. As soon else mentioned, I can easily manipulate my hair so it looks like it's 3cish.



It's funny that you say this because looking at my hair and looking at your pics I think our hair looks very similar. Everything else is the same but I wouldn't consider my hair cottony. I hope that made sense  

Looking at proudnapps pics my hair looks similar to hers too. It depends on how I style it and what products I use. So what the heck type am I? I thought I had this figured out.

ETA: I finally bought that HCCC. I haven't installed it yet but I see what you meant about the "looser curls" in it. It doesn't really look kinky either. I think the Bohyme Brazilian was a better match for my hair. I'll see what it looks like once I install it.


----------



## PJaye (Apr 28, 2010)

Although I've read the entire thread, I'm still confused.


----------



## Nonie (Apr 28, 2010)

Glam, I've always thought you were 4A. I think that your hair reminds you of both Ediese and Proudnapps sorta confirms that you are 4A.

*Pjaye*, what types in particular are you confused about? BMP will break it down. Just ask. oke:


----------



## PJaye (Apr 28, 2010)

The nature and extent of all of the 3s and 4s - curl patterns, diameter, texture, density, fine, course, cottony, and a partridge in a pear tree (my head is swimming ).


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 28, 2010)

/\ Just post some pix & I can help


----------



## Dee_33 (Apr 29, 2010)

^^^wet pics or dry pics?  Which show texture best?  Also the hair should be product free correct?

Thanks


----------



## PJaye (Apr 29, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ Just post some pix & I can help


 

Thank you, I would appreciate that.


----------



## Nonie (Apr 29, 2010)

luving me said:


> ^^^wet pics or dry pics?  Which show texture best?  Also the hair should be product free correct?
> 
> Thanks



Post both. Post even combed out hair. Post product free (hence the reason it's washed first)...and if you like you can also show with product...but bare is best.

If you saw type 3 hair wet, it stretches and looks wavy, but curls up as it dries. So seeing the hair in all its forms is what would give a clear picture of the type one is dealing with.


----------



## glamazon386 (Apr 29, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Post both. Post even combed out hair. Post product free (hence the reason it's washed first)...and if you like you can also show with product...but bare is best.
> 
> *If you saw type 3 hair wet, it stretches and looks wavy, but curls up as it dries. *So seeing the hair in all its forms is what would give a clear picture of the type one is dealing with.



The front of my hair does this. The back half doesn't. It's weird.


----------



## MzK (Apr 29, 2010)

Geminigirl said:


> After reading this thread I know I am a 4a. I have shrinkage but not like Nonie. I can wear WNG and my coils are noticeable...I think.
> 
> Here is my hair freshly conditioned
> 
> ...


 

......I heart your hair too! )


----------



## Petiteness (Apr 30, 2010)

My 3yr old ,id love to see what you ladies say.

I think no hair type/texture is exactly the same and one shouldnt compare their hair to the next person.

His hair in all stages


----------



## Petiteness (Apr 30, 2010)

Later in the week..pony with no product


----------



## loulou82 (Apr 30, 2010)

Is anyone up for the thought that there may be a "silky" 4B just like that are "silky" and "dull" 4As, 3Cs, etc.? I realize that strand size, porosity, and density can make two ladies within the same hair type look different. So what are the different looks of 4B? I'm leaning toward the conclusion that all 4B may not look a like AND I'm thinking I'm a "fine-strand and sheeny" 4B.   A lot of my hair is frizzy and with no definable curl pattern. The coils that I do possess can vary from pen spring to smaller than pen spring. My hair tangles very badly after WNGs and puffs so I don't do them often anymore.

























Natural Hair Blow Dried and Flat Ironed





Sorry for the big pics .


----------



## Stiletto_Diva (Apr 30, 2010)

^^^ I'm no expert, as you can tell from my previous post, but I would say you are closer to 4a than 4b. You seem to have more defined curls than me and I've been labeled 4a/4b. You have very pretty hair by the way.


----------



## TaraDyan (Apr 30, 2010)

I'm totally loving this thread!!!  I definitely have both:  3c in the front and sides / 4a in the back.


----------



## BlaqBella (Apr 30, 2010)

loulou82 said:


> Is anyone up for the thought that there may be a "silky" 4B just like that are "silky" and "dull" 4As, 3Cs, etc.? I realize that strand size, porosity, and density can make two ladies within the same hair type look different. So what are the different looks of 4B? I'm leaning toward the conclusion that all 4B may not look a like AND I'm thinking I'm a "fine-strand and sheeny" 4B.   A lot of my hair is frizzy and with no definable curl pattern. The coils that I do possess can vary from pen spring to smaller than pen spring. My hair tangles very badly after WNGs and puffs so I don't do them often anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> ...








Beautiful ^^^ hair!....I'm curious too.?


----------



## BlaqBella (Apr 30, 2010)

Petiteness said:


> My 3yr old ,id love to see what you ladies say.
> 
> I think no hair type/texture is exactly the same and one shouldnt compare their hair to the next person.
> 
> His hair in all stages




Hi is so HANDSOME...and has SO MUCH BEAUTIFUL HAIR!


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 30, 2010)

Petiteness said:


> My 3yr old ,id love to see what you ladies say.
> 
> I think no hair type/texture is exactly the same and one shouldnt compare their hair to the next person.
> 
> His hair in all stages


He's definitely 3c all over



loulou82 said:


> Is anyone up for the thought that there may be a "silky" 4B just like that are "silky" and "dull" 4As, 3Cs, etc.? I realize that strand size, porosity, and density can make two ladies within the same hair type look different. So what are the different looks of 4B? I'm leaning toward the conclusion that all 4B may not look a like AND I'm thinking I'm a "fine-strand and sheeny" 4B.   A lot of my hair is frizzy and with no definable curl pattern. The coils that I do possess can vary from pen spring to smaller than pen spring. My hair tangles very badly after WNGs and puffs so I don't do them often anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


First of all your hair is beautiful Your coil diameter still falls within the 4a type So you're a 4a silky.

I've been wondering if I'll ever see a 4b silky as well....I have yet to ever see that.


----------



## TCatt86 (Apr 30, 2010)

I'm definitely a cottony 3c/4a.  My hair i have bigger curls around the perimeter and smaller curls in the middle.  I can make my hair fro up by picking or fluffign it out.  Am I right in my ascertian BMP and Nonie?


----------



## belleza (Apr 30, 2010)

When i had a TWA - I would put activator in it and it would have these soft little curls or I would put black gel in it and it would slick down with waves.  Would that be 4a or 3c?


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Apr 30, 2010)

/\ We can't know without seeing wet naked hair pix hun.



TCatt86 said:


> I'm definitely a cottony 3c/4a.  My hair i have bigger curls around the perimeter and smaller curls in the middle.  I can make my hair fro up by picking or fluffign it out.  Am I right in my ascertian BMP and Nonie?


You called it 100% correct


----------



## Nonie (Apr 30, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> I've been wondering if I'll ever see a 4b silky as well....I have yet to ever see that.



I think the reason it's hard to see shiny 4B hair unless it's stretched is because the small kinks make it impossible to have a large enough "straight section" along the curve that can bounce off like and appear shiny. Even if the hair may feel like silk, it may not look like it due to not reflecting light. But if you straightened silkier 4B hair, I bet it'd bling a lot more than straightened duller-looking hair.


----------



## peachfuzzz (May 1, 2010)

song_of_serenity said:


> Does gel ever work for 4b hair then?



I'm still learning how to apply gels and stuff and my first attempt was a hot mess.  I've been watching CoilsKinksCurls on yt http://www.youtube.com/user/CoilsKinksCurls and used her rake technique and I'm loving the results!  So, gel worked this time!  I used IC Fantasia w/Elucence leave in underneath on one part and I used AfroVeda Gelly w/Elucence underneath for the other side, just to see if it'd work differently.  They look the same to me. Curls poppin everywhere!


----------



## Nonie (May 1, 2010)

peachfuzzz said:


> I'm still learning how to apply gels and stuff and my first attempt was a hot mess.  I've been watching CoilsKinksCurls on yt http://www.youtube.com/user/CoilsKinksCurls and used her rake technique and I'm loving the results! * So, gel worked this time!*  I used IC Fantasia w/Elucence leave in underneath on one part and I used AfroVeda Gelly w/Elucence underneath for the other side, just to see if it'd work differently.  They look the same to me. Curls poppin everywhere!



When you guys say gel worked or didn't work, what do you mean? How is gel supposed to work? And how do you know when it isn't working? 

I think of gel as this sticky, wet, jelly-like product that can moisturize but also stick strands together but not like a mousse but more gently kinda. (Think of S Curl gel, aloe vera gel, etc)

So it works? It doesn't work? What do these mean, pray do tell!


----------



## peachfuzzz (May 1, 2010)

Nonie said:


> When you guys say gel worked or didn't work, what do you mean? How is gel supposed to work? And how do you know when it isn't working?
> 
> I think of gel as this sticky, wet, jelly-like product that can moisturize but also stick strands together but not like a mousse but more gently kinda. (Think of S Curl gel, aloe vera gel, etc)
> 
> So it works? It doesn't work? What do these mean, pray do tell!



I think different applications of gel does different things. Gel can cause the hair to clump, minimize frizz, imparts hold & shine, and reduces obscene shrinkage. It also does the obvious slicking the edges and such.

The first time I tried scrunching gel in my hair(this was supposed to freeze the curls that I see when wet so I could have them while dry), it eliminated the curl definition that I had.  It ended up looking like waves instead of defined coils.  I tried shingling my hair on my second attempt w/gel. I don't know what went wrong but there were no curls in sight (even though I see lots of curls when my hair is wet). 

I tried shingling again today and my hair is coily/curly, I have definition, shine, hold...my hair is not completely dry yet so I can't tell you about shrinkage yet, though it hasn't shrunken too much yet.  I tried getting a pic, but they come out fuzzy.  

I hope this explains what I meant by the gel working (doing what I wanted it to do).


----------



## Nonie (May 1, 2010)

^^Yes it does. Thank you.


----------



## UrbainChic (May 1, 2010)

Guys, I am now even more confused than before.  First of all I am completely lost on my texture, i used to think it was coarse, then i wasn't sure anymore because I had 2 hairstylists called my hair fine, but i know so many people with even finer strands than mine, but i figured, well they see more heads of hair up close and personal than i do, so maybe they are right.....so I then was like okay. I guess I dont really know my strand texture.

NOW, I am not sure if i am 3C or 4A, and even worse, is that my hair really doesnt curl without putting in much effort so my hair does what BMP's 2A picture does, (where it waves up untill the end of the hair)--- except with the frequency of change in direction a 3C/4A head would have.... with a few distinct 3C curls instead of squiggle in some spots in the back. I know my hair is definitely not straight, but there's too many bumps or wavies per inch to call it wavy, I always call it curly but seeing all those perfect coils are making me think i am some kind of hair freak. I just want to call it 3C/4A mix, but now I'm confused on that as well. 

It has a lot of volume, but it flops, its silky strands, theres a whole lot of hair so its always thick, and it really doesnt curl like the rest of you posted without some manipulation. I dont even comb it often with anything other than my fingers, so I dont think i'm "brushing out the curls"  Its not heat damaged, or even color damaged. I leave it alone. The top part of my hair has more "wavy" tendencies than the rest of my hair, but i repeat, there are too many turns to call it wavy, i definitely call it something kinky/curly/nappy. It literally just grows this way. PLEASE tell me I'm not the only one or i will start to cry.

*Don't you guys ever see 4Bs or 4A's that go in an s or z pattern? *I dont think i would be the only one here with this kind of curl. I have seen it before on one of my good friends who used to be natural. Her hair made tiny zig zags, but not always necessarily a curl.

The only thing I know for certain now, is that my hair is thick, as in I have numerous strands on my head compared to the average human being. This at least has never been a question. The rest I need some serious help on.


----------



## UrbainChic (May 1, 2010)

Also, I have a non african decent friend who has what i have always considered 3C-4A hair, but like mine, her hair goes in a zig zag or S and not really spirals. But again, there is no way her hair could be classified as wavy... no way!

ETA:

Think in pasta terms--- Ramen noodles instead of Fusilli:

Ramen
http://timeinthekitchen.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/dried-ramen-noodles-1024x552.jpg

Instead of
Fusilli
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/Fusilli_lunghi_bucati.jpg


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 1, 2010)

/\ I have two words for ya: Pics please!

Just post some pics of your naked hair wet/dry whatever you have so we can judge


----------



## NikkiGirl (May 1, 2010)

Hey, BMP I have a question for you. Can you tell my hair type if I only have pics of new growth. I don't know for sure and I think it would be helpful for products I can buy to help me as it grows out. (I am transitioning) Thanks so much.


----------



## PJaye (May 1, 2010)

Since I don't know how to post pictures within a thread, I had to attach them.

The first picture was taken while doing a ponytail rollerset; some Lacio Lacio was applied prior to making the ponytails.  The second picture is of my typical post-wash ponytail air dry; the "wrigglies" at my nape are clearly visible.

Although my hairline is smoother than the center and nape, it all has some manner of "wrigglies."  Can you tell me what type(s) this is?


----------



## UrbainChic (May 1, 2010)

I will post some in a bit! They are definitely ramen noodley more than fusilli.... someone else has to have this kind of "curl" also.


----------



## UrbainChic (May 1, 2010)

Okay, I think I am between 3c and 4a, but now in addition to being even more confused about hair type then before,  I am freaked out that everyone's hair seems to spiral and mine is just doing something crazy.

So here are some pictures of my hair completely naked. All I used was a bar of solid shampoo, did not even condition in these pictures.

Sorry if these are too large!

This is my hair wet:





This is the curly part of my hair, dry








Here is some Ramen noodle action going... uncombled, not in the shower or anything, just doing its own thing....




THIS weird thing is what a shed hair looks like... as you can plainly see, it is not curling, twirling, or anything of the like, it is just changing directions a lot. In fact, I almost never find a hair that looks coiled, not a stretched coil or a coiled coil, mostly just schizophrenic hairs.





and here's me and the whole thing, uncombed, no product, just shampooed and air dried. 



I am pretty sure this is still easily 3c/4a, not sure which one, but I didn't see many of you with the zig zag/ or S pattern, just 2 of you. Are there more? or do you all actually curl?


----------



## NikkiGirl (May 1, 2010)

I don't really know my hair type at all.. so I have some pics here. It is not down. I am transitioning. So I don't wear it out much. So sorry, but you may not be able to tell at all.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 1, 2010)

PJaye said:


> Since I don't know how to post pictures within a thread, I had to attach them.
> 
> The first picture was taken while doing a ponytail rollerset; some Lacio Lacio was applied prior to making the ponytails.  The second picture is of my typical post-wash ponytail air dry; the "wrigglies" at my nape are clearly visible.
> 
> Although my hairline is smoother than the center and nape, it all has some manner of "wrigglies."  Can you tell me what type(s) this is?


Are you natural/ relaxed/transitioning? Are you a regular direct heat user? Meaning has heat altered your texture considerably? 



UrbainChic said:


> Okay, I think I am between 3c and 4a, but now in addition to being even more confused about hair type then before,  I am freaked out that everyone's hair seems to spiral and mine is just doing something crazy.
> 
> So here are some pictures of my hair completely naked. All I used was a bar of solid shampoo, did not even condition in these pictures.
> 
> ...


You're a consistent 3c.....Theres nothing wrong with having a texture thats different then most....thats part of what makes you unique! 



NikkiGirl said:


> I don't really know my hair type at all.. so I have some pics here. It is not down. I am transitioning. So I don't wear it out much. So sorry, but you may not be able to tell at all.


 Pics are a tad big so that makes it a little hard but you appear to have 3c curlies poppin


----------



## NikkiGirl (May 1, 2010)

Thanks bmp. I am trying to learn how to take better care of it. I am looking forward to being natural.


----------



## PJaye (May 1, 2010)

I think it would be safe to describe my hair as being natural since my last relaxer attempt was more than 20 years ago.  

I also don't frequently straightened my hair; I've done it twice this year in January and in February when I discovered the MaxiGlide.

I have been wearing the same ponytail air dry for the last ten years or so; I can count on one hand the number of times I've worn my hair out/down.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 1, 2010)

/\ Ahh okay well then your hair type is 3b/c

@ *NikkiGirl* I wish you all the best on your transition!


----------



## UrbainChic (May 1, 2010)

BMP you are always so helpful! You are like an encyclopedia.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 1, 2010)

/\ :blush3:Glad to help!​


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## PJaye (May 1, 2010)

Thank you very much for taking the time to clarify things for me; it is greatly appreciated.


----------



## PJaye (May 1, 2010)

I have another question...

Is hair type established only by the nature of the curl/wave pattern, or is the texture of the hair a determining factor as well?


----------



## Jhuidah (May 1, 2010)

loulou82 said:


> Is anyone up for the thought that there may be a "silky" 4B just like that are "silky" and "dull" 4As, 3Cs, etc.? I realize that strand size, porosity, and density can make two ladies within the same hair type look different. So what are the different looks of 4B? I'm leaning toward the conclusion that all 4B may not look a like AND I'm thinking I'm a "fine-strand and sheeny" 4B.   A lot of my hair is frizzy and with no definable curl pattern. The coils that I do possess can vary from pen spring to smaller than pen spring. My hair tangles very badly after WNGs and puffs so I don't do them often anymore.
> 
> 
> Sorry for the big pics .



Your hair looks a lot like mine--twinnish, even. Except, my hair doesn't really wave up when I pull it back, and it's not silky. And for the longest I thought I was a 4a, but then Nonie who has twinnish hair as well calls herself a 4b, so I don't know. 

I'm wondering if my hair not waving up is a product thing. When I hennaed last night, I could definitely see the waves under/through the henna.

Anywho, I might need to take new pics of my wet/mostly dry hair. I won't take any dry without product pics this time around. I have a hard time letting it dry without product, because to manipulate it dry is mostly a no no for me.


----------



## brg240 (May 1, 2010)

Geminigirl your coils look just like my twin's. He asked me what his hair type was before and I was like I don't know my own how am I supposed to help you? XD It's gorgeous by the way.

I have different textures in my hair but I think it's mostly 3c. I wish I was done my transition then I could be sure. 

Also, thanks flowergirl, bmp and nonie this has been a very helpful thread


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 1, 2010)

PJaye said:


> I have another question...
> 
> Is hair type established only by the nature of the curl/wave pattern, or is the texture of the hair a determining factor as well?


Only about curl diameter/wave pattern. Its not gonna give you a completely personalized profile on everything your hair would need but it does steer you in a general direction which can be massively helpful.

When I started really exploring haircare I found out my hair type on naturally curly and that made a huge difference for me....it helped me be able to understand why alot of the methods and styles I see type 3's employ have never and will never work for me. And it helped me be able to identify others with my same tightly coily afro hair. I started looking at the natural products geared toward type 4's and started noticing patterns in the ingredients.....and I was quickly able to find products that agreed with my hair...hair typing if you take it for what it is can really be a great turning point in a healthy hair journey


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## PJaye (May 1, 2010)

My mind is filled with lots of questions and I am trying to digest the fact that I may not have Type 4 hair, which has always been my assumption.  In my mind, I’ve always envisioned Type 3 hair to resemble that of TaraDyan, with silky waves and ringlets (I apologize for putting you in the spotlight, Madame, but your hair is the perfect example of my perceptions regarding Type 3 hair).

Still, I must bow to your expertise because I haven’t the slightest clue about the various types and textures of hair; I am still trying to decipher my own hair.  I do think that your idea of identifying the different products and ingredients that have proffered good results for specific hair types is a very good one; I will definitely explore that avenue further.

At any rate, I thank you again for all of your help; this thread has certainly been enlightening.  I really enjoyed seeing the pictures of everyone’s hair, the different textures and styles.  How can anyone not appreciate the diversity of Black hair is beyond me.


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## twinkletoes17 (May 1, 2010)

I hate to hijack, but can someone help me too? 

I'm pretty sure I'm 4a. I think. Lol. At least, according to the pics in the first post, that's what it looks like. I know I have 3something in the nape. The texture is looser back there for some reason. Anyway, here are some pictures. Sorry for the blurry ones.


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## NikkiGirl (May 1, 2010)

Hair type is really confusing to me also. But I think it is only a small part of the equation. Right now I just enjoy learning more about my hair and trying products and I will continue to use what works, regardless of hair type. This forum has really changed my idea of what my hair should be and I am thankful for that. Before I thought my hair was too puffy and frizzy and I know now that I didn't know how to take care of it at all. So I am trying to learn from the ladies on this forum. And I am enjoying it.


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## BlackMasterPiece (May 1, 2010)

twinkletoes17 said:


> I hate to hijack, but can someone help me too?
> 
> I'm pretty sure I'm 4a. I think. Lol. At least, according to the pics in the first post, that's what it looks like. I know I have 3something in the nape. The texture is looser back there for some reason. Anyway, here are some pictures. Sorry for the blurry ones.


I *think* you're a 4a...it'd be easier to tell with the cam a little farther away but I'm leaning pretty strongly toward 4a


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## Jewell (May 2, 2010)

I don't take the hair typing thing seriously AT ALL.  All I know is that some parts of my hair are 3c (i.e. looser texture than type 4), and some areas are lightly type 4, which constitutes type 4a to me.  That is all.


----------



## CocoGlow (May 2, 2010)

I think the reason why the hair typing system is flawed is due to the lack of differentiating between silky & cottony textures within each group possessing the same curl/coil size/diameter. It leads to so much confusion. This thread and countless other ones just like it is a clear indication that the system is flawed....I want to dismiss the system but I know it has helped me so I don't think we should ignore it...

As for the type 3-type 4 confusion....

All the pics that represent the 3 category in the hair typing system show well defined large-medium curls/coils and silky shiny slick back edges- but do not take into consideration the cottony/frizzy curls of the *same *size that are not silky and well defined..So anyone w/ a cottony texture who does not see their hair represented in the pics *assumes *they must be 4B since the basic definition of 4B is hair having no real coil/curl definition/clumping from root to tip, etc. I've seen countless individuals who claim to have 4B hair in videos/pics due to the fact their hair does not naturally clump when wet, however the diameter of their curl was definitely larger than the tight small coils of those w/ 4B hair 

*Just b/c the hair can easily take on the “afro” appearance does not mean it is in fact 4B. * 

As a true 4B (according to the same flawed typing system) I can usually tell when someone claims 4B but is actually misled and really a 3B/3C/4A, etc. Every single time I come across one I totally understand why…they typically have more of a cottony frizzy texture than a silky defined texture. However I see them in videos parting, combing, brushing & washing their hair in a way they would *not *be able to do if their coils were actually tight & small like mine. 

All that said I really don’t know HOW or IF the typing system should be changed or if we should come up w/ new categories to include both silky & cottony…I don’t even know if that would really benefit anybody but it might- just MIGHT help with all the confusion. 

Some people may think the typing system doesn't matter but I will say that it wasn't until I found those w/ a similar texture that I was able to figure out how to *handle *my hair properly from the way I wash to the way I style, etc. When I tried to follow the regimens of those w/ a looser coil/curl pattern, my hair suffered tremendously (case in point: doing wash n go's - big no no for my hair and most 4B's I know, but a LOT of those in the 3 category thrive from them). Therefore, it is really important to find others with your hair type, especially when you are new.  I can't say I found these individuals b/c of the typing system though .. honestly I just looked at pics/videos and found my hair twins/cousins that way LOL!

In terms of products- the advice I have received from those in the 3 & 4 category have been helpful--honestly I think product preference has more to do w/ personal hair porosity, protein/moisture needs, personal lifestyle, etc and less to do with hair type...

BTW I too am interested to see if there is a such thing as a SILKY 4B – I’ve never come across one and I don’t see how it could be possible w/ such tight-small coils, but hey, who knows?

*BlackMasterPiece* kudos for providing answers for those who question their hair type


----------



## Nonie (May 2, 2010)

UrbainChic said:


> *Don't you guys ever see 4Bs or 4A's that go in an s or z pattern? *I dont think i would be the only one here with this kind of curl. I have seen it before on one of my good friends who used to be natural. Her hair made tiny zig zags, but not always necessarily a curl.



You mean like this?


----------



## Sharpened (May 2, 2010)

NappyRina said:


> All that said I really don’t know HOW or IF the typing system should be changed or if we should come up w/ new categories to include both silky & cottony…I don’t even know if that would really benefit anybody but it might- just MIGHT help with all the confusion.


Have you check out the LOIS system?

*Find Your Pattern:*

*L *- If the hair has all bends, right angles and folds with  little to no curve then you are daughter L. 

*O* - If the strand is rolled up into the shape of one or several  zeros like a spiral, then you are daughter O. 

*I* - If the hair lies mostly flat with no distinctive curve or  bend you are daughter I. 

*S* - If the strand looks like a wavy line with hills and valleys  then you are daughter S.

  You may have a combination of the LOIS letters, possibly with one  dominant. If you cannot see one letter over the others, then combine the  letters. Example: LO or IL or OS..

*Find Your Strand size:*
  A strand of frayed thread is about the thickness of a medium sized  strand of human hair. If your strand is larger than this, then your hair  is thick. If your strand is smaller than this, hair is thin, or fine..

*Find Your Texture:*
  Shine is a sharp reflection of light while Sheen is a dull reflection  of light.

  Thready - Hair as a low sheen, with high shine if the hair is held  taut (as in a braid), with low frizz. Wets easily but water dries out  quickly.

  Wiry - Hair has a sparkly sheen, with low shine and low frizz. Water  beads up or bounces off the hair strands. Hair never seems to get fully  wet.

  Cottony - Hair has a low sheen, a high shine if the hair is held taunt  and has high frizz. Absorbs water quickly but does not get thoroughly  wet very fast.

  Spongy - Hair has a high sheen with low shine with a compacted looking  frizz. Absorbs water before it gets thoroughly wet.

  Silky - Hair has low sheen, a very high shine, with a lot or low  frizz. Easily wets in water.


----------



## Tene (May 2, 2010)

NappyRina said:


> I think the reason why the hair typing system is flawed is due to the lack of differentiating between silky & cottony textures within each group possessing the same curl/coil size/diameter. It leads to so much confusion. This thread and countless other ones just like it is a clear indication that the system is flawed....I want to dismiss the system but I know it has helped me so I don't think we should ignore it...
> 
> As for the type 3-type 4 confusion....
> 
> ...




I agree with this


----------



## DDTexlaxed (May 2, 2010)

Maybe I'm a 4ab, then.  I thought I was 3C because I have small corkscrew like curls. Fine with me. Now I am going to try to learn more about 4A/b texture.


----------



## UrbainChic (May 2, 2010)

Nonie said:


> You mean like this?



YES!!!!! EXACTLY!!!!

I usually have to mess with my hair and coax it into some sort of spiral ( and i dont often have the time or energy to do so), otherwise most days my hair is doing the ramen noodle thing instead of fusilli thing.

Many people have curls that flatten out with product, so I guess all this time I thought there were a lot of people's curls that don't actually curl-- looks like its more unique than i thought!

A very good friend of mine has that kind of ramen noodle curl too.


----------



## Nonie (May 3, 2010)

UrbainChic said:


> YES!!!!! EXACTLY!!!!
> 
> I usually have to mess with my hair and coax it into some sort of spiral ( and i dont often have the time or energy to do so), otherwise most days my hair is doing the ramen noodle thing instead of fusilli thing.
> 
> ...



That's usually how you will see 4B hair because no one with 4B who doesn't like a lot of work or dealing with tangles will leave his/her hair in an unmanipulated state. That is how my hair looks when it comes out of braids. In other words, that's how 4B hair looks when it's been manipulated. 

When I applied Trader Joe's Nourish Spa conditioner to that section while dry, it started to coil back into the minute coils that make up the texture of 4B hair. These pics show this effect:



After I rinsed out the conditioner, I got this:



All I did in these pics was finger comb, ie, separate the strands from each other so I'd not have knotting. I do so by first stretching the strands and then pulling them apart. 

But even when my hair is well moisturized from deep conditioning not from leave-in products (internal moisture) and I use a comb as in the case where I used a fine-tooth seamless comb, I still ended up with contracted coils packed tightly together:



As for curls flattening out, it's coz people use products like Shea butter or pomades that sort of freeze hair in the style in which it was worn. If you apply Shea butter and then braid the hair, it will be "frozen" in that ramen noodle shape. That's one characteristic of 4B hair: it tends to maintain the style you wear it in--especially if you wore it dry (or wet and let it dry in that style) and kept it in that style for a while. I don't use products when I braid my hair but even then 4B hair will tend to keep that stretched appearance until you wet it.


----------



## CocoGlow (May 3, 2010)

Nymphe said:


> Have you check out the LOIS system?
> 
> *Find Your Pattern:*
> 
> ...



Thanks *Nymphe*...this sounds like a great hair typing system...I've seen it before but since I am more of a visual person when it comes to things like this I would love it if they provided pictures as examples ... honestly I am a little confused as to how I would categorize my hair w/ this system LOL!! 

*Based on this, would a 4B according to the old system be considered an OS/Fine/Spongy with this system?* That's a strong guess 

I knew I was a 4B immediately based on the pics and the description in the 1-4abc typing system but I know it's not that easy for everyone...I think this LOIS system is much more detailed about the aspects of the hair that might really matter (especially the texture part)... I dunno....I think the things that are missing from LOIS is: *determining the size/diameter of the curl/coil/wave, the density level of hairs on the head & photo representation*!!-a combination of all these aspects with the things above would probably make perfect hair typing system


----------



## belldandy (May 3, 2010)

wow! some gorgeous hair up in this thread!


----------



## CocoGlow (May 3, 2010)

Nonie said:


> You mean like this?



Thanks Nonie for these pics! 

If your hair looks like this ^ when wet or after drying (without any manipulation) then I would consider this person a 3a/b/c with a *Cottony *texture or use another hair typing system like the LOIS. *The frizz here is what causes the confusion but notice the large-medium size of the curl/coil/zigzag/wave * however you choose to describe it (of course, we know that Nonie stretched out her tight 4B coils w/ braids to get the look in this pic- but this is representative of the UNmanipulated/UNstretched size/diameter of one w/ a looser curl pattern *and *a cottony/frizzy texture)

As we can see from Nonie's later post, when her hair is wet or allowed to dry (without any manipulation) the tiny coils are very compact and look nothing like the pics above .... So basically if you *don't *have to manipulate your hair or stretch it somehow to get the look above then you are most likely not in the 4 category of this flawed hair typing system ....


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 3, 2010)

I think hair typing is very straightforward and helpful so long as you take it for what it is. General hair typing is only about curl diameter...which actually simplifies things and makes it easier to categorize. 

It won't give you an immediate personalized description of every idiosyncrasy that makes up your specific head of hair. You have to ascertain that on your own.....but it will steer you in a general direction which will more then likely lead to you identifying the ingredients/techniques that agree best with your hair....and thats where it is most useful.


----------



## beautyaddict1913 (May 3, 2010)

NappyRina said:


> Thanks Nonie for these pics!
> 
> If your hair looks like this ^ when wet or after drying (without any manipulation) then I would consider this person a 3a/b/c with a *Cottony *texture or use another hair typing system like the LOIS. *The frizz here is what causes the confusion but notice the large-medium size of the curl/coil/zigzag/wave *however you choose to describe it (of course, we know that Nonie stretched out her tight 4B coils w/ braids to get the look in this pic- but this is representative of the UNmanipulated/UNstretched size/diameter of one w/ a looser curl pattern *and *a cottony/frizzy texture)
> 
> As we can see from Nonie's later post, when her hair is wet or allowed to dry (without any manipulation) the tiny coils are very compact and look nothing like the pics above .... So basically if you *don't *have to manipulate your hair or stretch it somehow to get the look above then you are most likely not in the 4 category of this flawed hair typing system ....


 
My hair looks like this when wet and dry but I consider myself a 4b because I have zigzags instead of big loose curls (type 3) or tight coils (type 4a)...thats how I learned the difference...4b normally has the z pattern and the others are more spiral or s shaped...I can normally distinguisgh 3c curls from 4a by looking at how fine the hair is around the hairline...but thats general...my hair is a fine 4b...people are shocked at how soft and tangle free it is compare to how it looks lol...and my hair requires so much moisture and thats def a 4b characteristic!


----------



## UrbainChic (May 3, 2010)

I think for the case of my ramen noodles... I will go with the LOIS system.

In which case I am LS/ medium-fine/ mostly cottony, some silky

Really, I am very curious, does anyone else here look like ramen without manipulation?


----------



## ChristmasCarol (May 3, 2010)

Yes, I have "ramen" hair, too. 

Wavy-afro hair is what I was referring to in an earlier post. This is what my hair looks like and why I couldn't figure out if it was type 3-something or 4a/4b. It doesn't have the characteristics of 4b, like massive shrinkage. But it also doesn't curl into the larger curls that are characteristic of 4a or 3c. It is always very easy to comb out, but it doesn't lay down and look silky like what is normally shown as 3a/b hair. It's fairly flat when it's wet and then it grows and grows into a semi-fro. You can almost see it rising as it dries. After it's dry, it looks like a giant wedge, lol.

BMP, would you say this is kinky 3 or wavy 4?

I'll try to find a pic to post. TIA


----------



## Janet' (May 3, 2010)

BillsBackerz67 said:


> I havent read the thread but for my hair it just all comes down to the size of my curls. Texture wise Its cottony, not at all silky, and fluffy. But curl wise they are a little bit larger in diameter compaired to the 4a hair Ive seen.



ITA with you...I don't know what texture I am but your description of how your hair is reminds me of how my hair is...


----------



## Janet' (May 3, 2010)

UrbainChic said:


> I think for the case of my ramen noodles... I will go with the LOIS system.
> 
> In which case I am LS/ medium-fine/ mostly cottony, some silky
> 
> Really, I am very curious, does anyone else here look like ramen without manipulation?



My hair looks like "ramen" to me...


----------



## ChristmasCarol (May 3, 2010)

http://public.fotki.com/Sipp10/texture-shot/ramen-hair.html

Couldn't find a good pic, so here's a shot of DD#3's hair. This is not stretched, just being held up. It never spirals (even with product), just kinky waves. Her waves are much smaller than mine, but otherwise, it's the same - frizzy, kinky and wavy.


----------



## Sharpened (May 3, 2010)

NappyRina said:


> Thanks *Nymphe*...this sounds like a great hair typing system...I've seen it before but since I am more of a visual person when it comes to things like this I would love it if they provided pictures as examples ... honestly I am a little confused as to how I would categorize my hair w/ this system LOL!!
> 
> *Based on this, would a 4B according to the old system be considered an OS/Fine/Spongy with this system?* That's a strong guess


Here is an article with pictures.



> I knew I was a 4B immediately based on the pics and the description in the 1-4abc typing system but I know it's not that easy for everyone...I think this LOIS system is much more detailed about the aspects of the hair that might really matter (especially the texture part)... I dunno....I think the things that are missing from LOIS is: *determining the size/diameter of the curl/coil/wave, the density level of hairs on the head & photo representation*!!-a combination of all these aspects with the things above would probably make perfect hair typing system


Over at the LHL (white long-hair forum), a poster, Fia, came up with categories expanding on Andre's system:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]First classifier - Your  curliness (or lack thereof) 
The straight ones 
1a - stick straight 
1b - straight but with a slight body wave, just enough to add some  volume, doesn't look wavy 
1c - straight with body wave and one or two visible S-waves (e.g. nape  of neck or temples) 

The wavy ones 
2a - loose, stretched out S-waves throughout the hair 
2b - shorter, more distinct S-waves (similar to waves from braiding damp  hair) 
2c - distinct S-waves and the odd spiral curl forming here and there 


The curly ones 
3a - big, loose spiral curls 
3b - bouncy ringlets 
3c - tight corkscrews 

The really curly ones 
4a - tightly coiled S-curls 
4b - tightly coiled hair bending in sharp angles (Z-pattern) 

Second classifier - What (most of) your individual strands look like 

F - Fine 
Thin strands that sometimes are almost translucent when held up to the  light. Shed strands can be hard to see even against a contrasting  background. Similar to hair found on many people of Scandinavian  descent. 

N - Normal 
Strands are neither fine nor coarse. Similar to hair found on many  Caucasians. 

C - Coarse 
Thick strands that where shed strands usually are easily identified  against most backgrounds. Similar to hair found on many people of Asian  or native American descent. 

Third classifier - Your overall volume of hair 
Put your hair in a ponytail with as much hair as possible in it. Don't  bother with the way it looks - the goal is to have most/all of your hair  in there. If it means it sits smack dab on top of your head, put it  there. 

Measure the circumference of the ponytail. If you have bangs and/or you  can't get all of your hair in there adjust according to how much of your  hair you have measured. 

i - thin (less than 2 inches/5 centimeters) 
ii - normal (between 2-4 inches or 5-10 centimeters) 
iii - thick (more than 4 inches/10 centimeters) 

If you are having difficulty determining the thickness of individual  hairs, this might help: 

Take a strand of hair from the back of your head. Roll the strand  between your thumb and index finger. 

Fine Hair -- Your hair is difficult to feel or it feels like an  ultra-fine strand of silk 

Coarse Hair -- Your hair feels hard and wiry. As you roll it back and  forth, you may actually hear it! 

Medium Hair -- Your hair feels like a cotton thread. You can feel it,  but it isn't stiff or rough. It is neither fine or coarse [/FONT]


----------



## kblc06 (May 3, 2010)

This is a long post and I haven't read through the entire thread. But this has been mentioned on other occasions so I'll post my previous responses:




kblc06 said:


> I think Andre's misconception lies within the fact that according to his system, curl size correlates very closely with actual texture, i.e. 1a-3a=silky hair. This is hardly the case. There are many Polynesians who have 1a-2a hair with very little wave or curl that is highly textured, almost to the point where it resembles afro hair. Likewise, I have seen individuals like my mother and other members who have silky 4a hair that is very easily manipulated to the point that it can even resemble type 2c/3ab hair







kblc06 said:


> Actually, this tends not to be the case, hence the reason why so many 4a/b hair types suffer from breakage. I have seen very few 4a/bs with coarse, thick stranded hair. Most of the time, they are fine or medium but with densely packed strands (which implies that they have more hair follicles). Likewise, there are type 3s like Lynnieb and EmpressRi who have very thick individuals strands of hair with high density, making their hair appear even thicker than average. This breakdown may help to explain things a bit:
> 
> 1.) Hair Texture: Silky, thready, cottony. This actually measures how the hair feels to the touch and can give you more information about how the hair behaves and the potential porosity of the hair. Silky strands of hair typically feel very smooth along the hair strand with lower porosity. Thready and cottony are a little harder to distinguish. Typically, thready hair may have a slightly larger diameter and feels uneven but still smooth along the hair strand. Sometimes, it even has a halo-y appearance, much like a strand of thread. This type of hair generally has a lower porosity and can "feel" coarse even though the strands may be fine. Cottony hair usually feels soft to touch and feels uneven along the hair shaft due to kinks along the hair strand- this hair texture is generally associated with type 4 hair, but this is not always the case. Some type 3s can have cottony hair and some type 4s can have silky or thready hair.
> 
> ...


----------



## manter26 (May 4, 2010)

Nonie said:


> There's no such thing as 4C. What people call CNapp hair or 4C is really just manipulated 4B hair so that it appears to have no pattern.



This is an interesting thought... So all 3 and 4 type hair has some sort of curl or coil to it. 

My bang area has always seemed to be straight. Not bone straight or slick but a kinky or course straight. It doesn't curl like rest of my 4A hair. It doesn't hold a twist and braids unravel quite easily. 

After seeing this quote, I've given thought to the possibility that it's just stretched from pinning in back and putting it up so often... hmm erplexed
Maybe i'll leave it alone or pin it loosely and see if it truly grows out of my head straight.


----------



## tberry2688 (May 4, 2010)

What hair type am I?

still wet






Dry


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 4, 2010)

/\ DEFINITELY 3c


----------



## SimplyBlessed (May 4, 2010)

I think I'm a 3c....


----------



## Ese88 (May 4, 2010)

^^^ your hair is gorgeous!!
And i havent really been readnig this thread but looking at the wonderful pics of natural hair


----------



## MzK (May 4, 2010)

I think I'm a wiry/cottony 4a/b......?  What do you guys think??

Thing is, when it dries, it has curls...but looks frizzy..........:S


----------



## MzK (May 4, 2010)

tberry2688 said:


> What hair type am I?
> 
> still wet
> 
> ...


 

Pretty hair!!!!


----------



## tberry2688 (May 4, 2010)

Thanks very much MzK, yours is very pretty


----------



## UrbainChic (May 5, 2010)

sipp100 said:


> Yes, I have "ramen" hair, too.
> 
> Wavy-afro hair is what I was referring to in an earlier post. This is what my hair looks like and why I couldn't figure out if it was type 3-something or 4a/4b. It doesn't have the characteristics of 4b, like massive shrinkage. But it also doesn't curl into the larger curls that are characteristic of 4a or 3c. It is always very easy to comb out, but it doesn't lay down and look silky like what is normally shown as 3a/b hair. It's fairly flat when it's wet and then it grows and grows into a semi-fro. You can almost see it rising as it dries. After it's dry, it looks like a giant wedge, lol.
> 
> ...



Wavy afro is what i am going to call it forever now.


----------



## LadyRaider (May 7, 2010)

I'm still struggling to get a good texture shot with my relaxed ends and ancient cameras.

Can the experts type my curls from this pic?

Forgive the room behind me and the Murloc. heh heh. I haven't decorated my computer room yet and I love the murloc. I was afraid cropping the picture would distort my hair.


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## BlackMasterPiece (May 7, 2010)

/\ LadyRaider I 'm thru with your crazy angles and almost complete absence of light! J/K!

lol its all love hun but on the real, you need to take a pic in the bright sunlight and put it on a timer or let someone else take the pic for you!

This is like the third time I haven't been able to decipher your curl pattern because of your "unique pictures" 

P.S. *MzK* and *SimplyBlessed* I think you typed yourself flawlessly

**From here on in people should try to type themselves and if they're right me and nonie(if its ok with her) will thank the post and if you're off we'll make a post**


----------



## LadyRaider (May 7, 2010)

See how much I suck? LOL. Thanks for giving it a go, anyway, BMP.


----------



## Dee_33 (May 7, 2010)

Here are my pics, hope they're clear enough, I think I'm 4a.  My hair is dry here with EVCO in it.


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 7, 2010)

/\ Wow. Those are super blurry hun....whats going on today?


----------



## Dee_33 (May 7, 2010)

^^^LOL, it's from trying to take our own pics.  Our families are prob tired of us asking about hair pics.


----------



## Marie_Star (May 7, 2010)

I'm going to jump on the bandwagon 
Anyone like to help diagnose my random textures!

I think I'm 4a at the front, 4b at the back plus those random strands which do their own thing in the back...


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 7, 2010)

/\ You appear to be 3c on the crown 4a on the bottom.

ETA: Are you a regular heat user?


----------



## Marie_Star (May 7, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ You appear to be 3c on the crown 4a on the bottom.
> 
> ETA: Are you a regular heat user?




Thanks, used to be a heat user. Do I look heat damaged


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 7, 2010)

Okay so you really might be 4a/b then. Yea you have areas that have loosened but its not the end of the world....just treat your hair well and you'll be good

ETA: if that loosely wavy part thats hanging outta the roller is the way it grew outta ur head then you're a 3c/4a combo.....if not thats just heat alteration.


----------



## morehairplease (May 7, 2010)

twinkletoes17 said:


> I hate to hijack, but can someone help me too?
> 
> I'm pretty sure I'm 4a. I think. Lol. At least, according to the pics in the first post, that's what it looks like. I know I have 3something in the nape. The texture is looser back there for some reason. Anyway, here are some pictures. Sorry for the blurry ones.



My hair looks exactly like this in it's natural state.


----------



## tetbelle (May 12, 2010)

tberry2688 said:


> What hair type am I?
> 
> still wet
> 
> ...



You are definitely a hair twin of mine.  That is 3c/4a hair.


----------



## MzK (May 12, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ LadyRaider I 'm thru with your crazy angles and almost complete absence of light! J/K!
> 
> lol its all love hun but on the real, you need to take a pic in the bright sunlight and put it on a timer or let someone else take the pic for you!
> 
> ...


 

WOOOOOOOT!

Finally, I got it.


----------



## Janet' (May 12, 2010)

Alright BMP (or anyone else),

I'm really scared to type my hair... The pic in my siggy is a wash and go...The first thumbnail is my hair totally dry, at the end of the night, having gone to an amusement park (frizzy). The second is a typical wash and go from the front. 

If I had to say something---ummm, 3c/4a????


----------



## Janet' (May 12, 2010)

...subscribing...


----------



## Janet' (May 12, 2010)




----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 12, 2010)

You typed yourself correctly Janet

Just to reiterate:

***From here on in people should try to type themselves and if you called it correctly you'll know because I'll thank your post(or Nonie if she's game)***...for those that are off I'll make a post to clarify


----------



## Janet' (May 12, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> You typed yourself correctly Janet
> 
> Just to reiterate:
> 
> ***From here on in people should try to type themselves and if you called it correctly you'll know because I'll thank your post(or Nonie if she's game)***...for those that are off I'll make a post to clarify



Thanks BMP!

I get really nervous about hair typing...I don't know why.


----------



## wavezncurlz (May 12, 2010)

Janet' said:


> Thanks BMP!
> 
> I get really nervous about hair typing...I don't know why.


 
Janet -   who cares...it's so damn pretty! 

Really - I'd say 3c/4a


----------



## Janet' (May 12, 2010)

wavezncurlz said:


> Janet -   who cares...it's so damn pretty!
> 
> Really - I'd say 3c/4a



Awww! Thanks, Wavezncurlz- your hair is AMAZING!!


----------



## Ediese (May 12, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> @ *Proudnapps*: First of all your hair is absolutely beautiful! Wow love the color love the texture love the styles! You weren't wrong, you're definitely a 4a...its just that your hair type is whats known as type 4a silky. Which is to say that you have the pen spring sized coils typical of a 4a, but you have fine strands which means that not only can you achieve an afro....your hair behaves in many of the same ways curly hair does like clumping curls, effortlessly slicking down into styles like wet buns and your (gorgeous) puff with the slicked edges, you can achieve a smooth rollerset when you wanna straighten and get sleek results and even as your hair grows longer....you'll probably always be able to do wash and go's on loose hair with ease regardless of length.
> 
> ~*~*~*~*~​
> Hey hun! Ediese your fotki is one of the most extensive around soo many styles and pics! Its awesome! Your hair is beautiful and your progress is remarkable.
> ...


 
Ooop..I totally forgot about this thread.  Thanks BMP!! Yea, you know I'm stuck on that 4a wagon.  On this site, it's easier that way. 



CelinaStarr said:


> *Edise, *hair type aside, I've seen your pics and I *heart* your hair. I think it's so cool how uniform your little curls/coils are. Your wash and goes almost reminds me of a straw set but they are natural.
> 
> *Proudnapps*, your hair is such a lovely color in your first pic and your coils are gorgeous.
> 
> ...


 
Thanks so much Celina. I absolutely ADORE your hair. It's drool worthy! 



glamazon386 said:


> It's funny that you say this because looking at my hair and looking at your pics I think our hair looks very similar. Everything else is the same but I wouldn't consider my hair cottony. I hope that made sense
> 
> Looking at proudnapps pics my hair looks similar to hers too. It depends on how I style it and what products I use. So what the heck type am I? I thought I had this figured out.
> 
> ETA: I finally bought that HCCC. I haven't installed it yet but I see what you meant about the "looser curls" in it. It doesn't really look kinky either. I think the Bohyme Brazilian was a better match for my hair. I'll see what it looks like once I install it.


 
Hey Glam! Yep, I've felt that we definitely have a similar texture. I don't really know how to describe the cottony thing. The top part of my hair isn't as defined. It's really loose almost straight, while the back is perfectly defined. With entirely no product, it would dry with some definition into a cotton ball. Makes sense? 

I'm about to wash all my old hair and get it installed, so I'll be reinstalling the HCCC. The texture definitely isn't very kinky. That's the one thing I didn't like about it, but the curl size is pretty cool. Please post pics when you get it installed. I used some IC fantasia gel and Cantu leave in to help me blend it.


----------



## Mad Scientist (May 12, 2010)

omg is this the "hair type me" thread? I've been waiting for this! I STILL have no idea what my hair type is. I usually say 3C but I can make my curls really small with a flick of my denman. It's like magic. So idk I think I'm 3c-4a. Here we go:

With Denman:











Without Denman:














that picture is kinda dark. my hair is basically just a puff ball with a some zig zaggy pieces


----------



## LadyRaider (May 12, 2010)

I'mma say 3c because your hair is curly, not coily. But I don't know what I'm talking about. The experts will be in soon.


----------



## chebaby (May 12, 2010)

Janet' said:


> Alright BMP (or anyone else),
> 
> I'm really scared to type my hair... The pic in my siggy is a wash and go...The first thumbnail is my hair totally dry, at the end of the night, having gone to an amusement park (frizzy). The second is a typical wash and go from the front.
> 
> If I had to say something---ummm, 3c/4a????


man my hair looks almost identical to yours. even the way the front hangs a little more. i thought it was heat damage at first but ive been natural for a year and havent used heat for over a year so thats just the way my hair grows.
i always say 3c.


----------



## UrbainChic (May 12, 2010)

TigerInTransit said:


> that picture is kinda dark. my hair is basically just a puff ball with a some zig zaggy pieces



Are you one of my Ramen Sisters?  

You look like 3C


----------



## Janet' (May 12, 2010)

chebaby said:


> man my hair looks almost identical to yours. even the way the front hangs a little more. i thought it was heat damage at first but ive been natural for a year and havent used heat for over a year so thats just the way my hair grows.
> i always say 3c.



Chebaby,

Really??? Yeah, I might have a hair twin! I've been natural for 5 years and I know mine is not heat damage. My hair just grows that way...You say 3c- I agree but I do think that my back has some 4a because the curls are smaller, right?


----------



## Mad Scientist (May 12, 2010)

UrbainChic said:


> Are you one of my Ramen Sisters?
> 
> You look like 3C



LOL that's exactly what it looks like!


----------



## chebaby (May 12, 2010)

Janet' said:


> Chebaby,
> 
> Really??? Yeah, I might have a hair twin! I've been natural for 5 years and I know mine is not heat damage. My hair just grows that way...You say 3c- I agree but I do think that my back has some 4a because the curls are smaller, right?


yea smaller curls are 4a. but my back is much silkier and hangs longer than the rest so i dont know what that is. lol


----------



## glamazon386 (May 13, 2010)

Ediese said:


> Hey Glam! Yep, I've felt that we definitely have similar texture. I don't really know how to describe the cottony thing. The top part of my hair isn't as definitely. It's really loose almost straight, while the back is perfectly definitely. With entirely no product, it would dry with some definitely into a cotton ball. Makes sense?
> 
> I'm about to wash all my old hair and get it installed, so I'll be reinstalling the HCCC. The texture definitely isn't very kinky. That's the one thing I didn't like about it, but the curl size is pretty cool. Please post pics when you get it installed. I used some IC fantasia gel and Cantu leave in to help me blend it.



That sounds like my hair.  The front doesn't really have definition without product. I have to play with it. If I do too much to it, it will go totally straight and will be frizzy/poofy. The back is fine but the curls seem to shrink more. I think they're smaller too.

I'm just trying to get through finals now before I do anything. I've been wearing a bun for weeks now. I'm long overdue for everything - hair, nails, etc.  A day of beauty is definitely in order as soon as my grades post. 

How many oz of the HCCC did you buy? I think I have 8 but it doesn't look like enough. I'm guessing it looks like less because I bought longer lengths. I usually leave a good portion of the front out and the perimeter and just put the tracks in the middle. That should be enough right? 

Also how'd you get the Cantu and the IC to work together? I always get white crap through my hair when I try to put something over the Cantu. But it doesn't give me enough hold on it's own.  I stopped using it for that reason.


----------



## Ediese (May 13, 2010)

glamazon386 said:


> That sounds like my hair.  The front doesn't really have definition without product. I have to play with it. If I do too much to it, it will go totally straight and will be frizzy/poofy. The back is fine but the curls seem to shrink more. I think they're smaller too.
> 
> I'm just trying to get through finals now before I do anything. I've been wearing a bun for weeks now. I'm long overdue for everything - hair, nails, etc.  A day of beauty is definitely in order as soon as my grades post.
> 
> ...


 
Goodness! I need to start proofing the stuff I write on here. lol Good luck on your finals! 

I bought 8 oz of the HCCC. I think I got 18" and 20". It should definitely be enough. I only left a small piece in the horseshoe and in the front. I still had a small track leftover.

With the Cantu, I only used it on the length of the hair. I used the IC gel on my leave out and brushed it through with my denman. That automatically made it blend. Then, I'd do the plop and plunk method, so the curls wouldn't frizz. That worked all the time.


----------



## LoveCraze (May 16, 2010)

...........


----------



## Gleek (May 24, 2010)

Ok, I finally took some pictures of my new growth.

Help me out!


----------



## JustSimplyTish (May 24, 2010)

Oh I just posted in another thread asking......Never knew about this thread

I am 3c I am told.....Is that right?


Clickable







wet:


----------



## chebaby (May 24, 2010)

^^^^i'd say you are more like 3b but i could be wrong lol.


----------



## Janet' (May 28, 2010)

Just Tish,

I would say 3B too, but I definitely could be wrong!


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 28, 2010)

TigerInTransit said:


> omg is this the "hair type me" thread? I've been waiting for this! I STILL have no idea what my hair type is. I usually say 3C but I can make my curls really small with a flick of my denman. It's like magic. So idk I think I'm 3c-4a. Here we go:
> 
> With Denman:
> 
> ...


You're a 3c....somewhat possible you have some 3b up in there  your hair looks so lush and thick!



JustSimplyTish said:


> Oh I just posted in another thread asking......Never knew about this thread
> 
> I am 3c I am told.....Is that right?
> 
> ...


Yep! Def 3c loving the color girl....you braver then me!


----------



## JustSimplyTish (May 28, 2010)

^^ you can be brave when it's this short haven't put a lot of work into it yet LOL...when it's longer....I will probably be just as hair protective.....thanks ladies I always thought 3c/4a but I never really knew....

I have vowed no more color in 2010...that is my self challenge.....


----------



## Nelli04 (May 28, 2010)

hey I have ramen noodle hair too! I can't type my hair either...but quick question...people with ramen hair are automatically 4b??


----------



## Bublin (May 28, 2010)

Hey Nonie and BMP - The Experts - my avatar pic is small so i hope you can confirm - i think i'm a 3c\4a.  I think its half dry in the pic.  My strands are extremely thin but my hair is very dense.  I have major issues with detangling and the coils coil onto themselves like they want to loc.  The strands are silky and when its blown out i would describe it as fluffy - a floppy afro.  I have a patch of very coarse hair in the crown that desn't seem to have much of curl pattern compared to the rest of my hair.


----------



## LaFemmeNaturelle (May 28, 2010)

J'ai un question!

Anyone can answer this. Can type 4a hair slick back wet hair with just a brush and a leave-in (not gel) and no scarf and not get puffy as/after it dries? Is this a characteristic of silky 4?


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 28, 2010)

/\ Yes, that is a classic characteristic of 4a silky hair.

Bublin its hard to tell with that avi but I think you typed yourself correctly.


----------



## LaFemmeNaturelle (May 28, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ Yes, that is a classic characteristic of 4a silky hair.
> 
> Bublin its hard to tell with that avi but I think you typed yourself correctly.


 

Are you silky? My ng looks exactly like one of your pics you've posted when showing someone your before and after flat ironing pics. But I'm able to just brush it back. Or is coarse the opposite of silky? Is silky fine or can you be thick and silky?

I'm no longer going by what I thought my hair type was based on 4 years ago because my hair is definitely not growing in the way I remember it lol it was probably heat trained since I blow dried once a month


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 28, 2010)

Most definitely not. My strands are coarse...there is no gel brush comb or method that could get my hair to slick back while wet.....ever. Even when I was a heat straightened natural it could never do that.

I'd say type 4 silkys typically have fine strands from what I've gathered.

If you have the same tiny coils I showed in my texture shot but you'r e able to effortlessly brush it down to gel it down and get smooth neat waves then you're most likely a 4a silky

Take a look at this video from familygoingnatural on youtube. Here she has slicked her afro back into a ponytail....would you say your texture has the same characteristics/behavior? If so, you're definitely a 4a silky


----------



## JustSimplyTish (May 29, 2010)

^^ Oh her hair looks great...it is so silky looking....Her baby girl is adorable


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (May 29, 2010)

She takes great care of her all her baby's hair and she's HILARIOUS. Check her out in this thread I started.


----------



## JustSimplyTish (May 29, 2010)

OMGeeeshhh she got her hair to go that straight from the above video posted...I need her at my house.....she is soo funny!!


----------



## petitmaui (Jun 1, 2010)

This is the best hair typing thread ever!


----------



## UrbainChic (Jun 1, 2010)

Nelli04 said:


> hey I have ramen noodle hair too! I can't type my hair either...but quick question...people with ramen hair are automatically 4b??



I think ramen noodle is just another kind of curl. I have a very good friend whose ramens are too big to be type 4, and she is probably 3b/c... I would say one ungulation per one inch of hair.... ( since its not a full rotation of a curl/coil)

i love my fellow ramen sisters


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 2, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Don't be too quick to chop. There's also 4B hair, like mine which will not look at all like that and can be quite a shocker for one thinking all 4's look like that.
> 
> Here's 4B beside the 4A I posted:
> 
> ...


Perfect analogy! Right on point!


----------



## LadyRaider (Jun 13, 2010)

Hah! Didn't want to start a new hair typing thread! But I found a hair twin for at least part of my hair! 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFF3assK22s&NR=1

The hair at my nape is like this lady's. (This lady has the hair all over.) WHAT hair type is she? 

And gee whiz... this girl has absolutely ZERO frizz. Do you think it's the conditioner she left in? Or is she just really lucky? 

Only my hair in the back is like this. The rest of my hair has relaxed ends so I can't tell what it is. 

What Hair type?  I'm saying she is 3c? (Nonie and BMP said to make a guess and if I was right, they'd add a thank you.


----------



## Sapphire_chic (Jun 13, 2010)

I always thought i was a type 4 a/b coarse. I can slick my hair back with gel and get waves but it has to be a good gel and I definately cannot slick it back with water or just a leave in.
My hair coils up visably without product (like a curly fro) wish I had a good camera. Anyways I'm pretty sure of my hair type, this has been a very useful thread


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

Nonie said:


> I think to get a good idea it'd have to be clean (so shampooed and hence free of products) and then you can post a pic of not combed as well as combed.
> 
> Since it's hard to comb most types of hair dry and w/o product, maybe comb with conditioner and rinse while combing under water and then leave well alone (for the combed look). And if you want to show the uncombed look, comb with conditioner or finger comb with conditioner if you prefer (separate strands using fingers), rinse while finger combing and let be (for the uncombed look).
> 
> ...



hey nonie......

when did u big chop???   maybe i can catch up to you

i chopped maybe feb 2010  (i know between end of jan-beginning marcH)

if my scalp ever freakin stops ITCHING SO BAD.....I CAN GET BACK TO MY GROWTH REGIMEN

right now it's slightly longer than my blackberry (when stretched)  that's about as much as i know .....as good as it gets


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Hah! Didn't want to start a new hair typing thread! But I found a hair twin for at least part of my hair!
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFF3assK22s&NR=1
> 
> The hair at my nape is like this lady's. (This lady has the hair all over.) WHAT hair type is she?
> ...


<<<<----  if u guess right...thank you....if you guess wrong....you get a BOOOOOOOOO!


----------



## LadyRaider (Jun 13, 2010)

tHeHaIRLaB said:


> <<<<----  if u guess right...thank you....if you guess wrong....you get a BOOOOOOOOO!
> [/SIZE][/COLOR]



Noooooo. 

I was a first grade teacher years ago. I was giving happy face stamps for kids who got 100 on their paper. This kid who got an F was all sad because he wasn't getting a stamp. I said, all I have would be a sad face stamp. He said, yes... he wanted a sad face stamp. So I gave him a sad face stamp. He took one look at it and started crying. 

NO ONE wants a sad face stamp. I learned that lesson.


----------



## missjones (Jun 13, 2010)

In my eagerness to join in the hair typing fun giggle, this is a pic of my new growth. Now, I probably should have taken a pic at another time because yesterday I blow dried my hair a little. I wanted my hair to be straighter because I wanted to dust my ends. I think I might be 3c? My curls look like corkscrews. Now, I am transitioning so the relaxed end may be weighing the curls down some.


----------



## Nonie (Jun 13, 2010)

tHeHaIRLaB said:


> hey nonie......
> 
> when did u big chop???   maybe i can catch up to you
> 
> ...



 You're so silly. I didn't BC. That's what my shrinkage looks like. See?


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

Nonie said:


> You're so silly. I didn't BC. That's what my shrinkage looks like. See?




ok....CANCEL THAT! you & your fancy camera work (i still get my pics developed) 

guess i won't be catching up anytime soon.....(putting my blackberry away)


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Noooooo.
> 
> I was a first grade teacher years ago. I was giving happy face stamps for kids who got 100 on their paper. This kid who got an F was all sad because he wasn't getting a stamp. I said, all I have would be a sad face stamp. He said, yes... he wanted a sad face stamp. So I gave him a sad face stamp. He took one look at it and started crying.
> 
> NO ONE wants a sad face stamp. I learned that lesson.




awwww that so sad, i'm a softee...i would had to at least give him a straight face or at least a dayuum blank start

so sad.... no "needs improvement stickers?"


----------



## Nonie (Jun 13, 2010)

tHeHaIRLaB said:


> ok....CANCEL THAT! you & your fancy camera work
> 
> guess i won't be catching up anytime soon.....(putting my blackberry away)



Oh, you'll catch up soon enough. I'm not going anywhere fast. I am too lazy to seal and protect my ends and we all know once you get to SL, that becomes a necessity. I haven't even used a moisturizer leave-in for a whole year!  

So don't worry, Hun. I'll be right here waiting for you.


----------



## LadyRaider (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Hah! Didn't want to start a new hair typing thread! But I found a hair twin for at least part of my hair!
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFF3assK22s&NR=1
> 
> The hair at my nape is like this lady's. (This lady has the hair all over.) WHAT hair type is she?




Any idea suggestions on this lady's hair type?


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Any idea suggestions on this lady's hair type?



3a   have u checked her no heat straightening video?  fabulous

she also stated it i think in one her videos  ....(either on her channel or naturallycurly.com)


----------



## JustSimplyTish (Jun 13, 2010)

I thought MahoganyCurls  said she was 3b/3c ...but maybe I read wrong...it's been awhile


----------



## Nonie (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Any idea suggestions on this lady's hair type?



My guess would be 3C.


----------



## JustSimplyTish (Jun 13, 2010)

Nonie said:


> My guess would be 3C.



I agree...because mine is super similar 



This is what her YT profile states


Hi Guys,

My Name is Jess and I did the big chop on February 15, 2009. I went from having a little past shoulder length relaxed hair to a very short TWA. 

*My last relaxer was December 5, 2008*

It is a big change but I love it. I decided to make youtube videos after following many hair blogs and watching many hair videos on youtube. I have always had a passion for hair care. I believe in healthy hair. 

Now, that I am natural I would like to share my thoughts with the vlogosphere about natural hair care and my experiences. 

BTW, My hair type is 3b/3c...I am also VERY protein sensitive...


----------



## kblc06 (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Any idea suggestions on this lady's hair type?



I pretty certain she's a silky/fine-medium?, 3c/4a.


----------



## FlowerHair (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Any idea suggestions on this lady's hair type?



I would say a 3c/4a. Her curls are tighter than mine.

Why in the world is she putting so much junk in her hair?! Isn't that a little bit too much?


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

kblc06 said:


> I pretty certain she's a silky/fine-medium?, 3c/4a.





ya'll know i don't know types....not my thing  I thought she was a 3a ...but she says 3b/3c on her page...

so don't listen to me!  ya'll know i throw out numbers on my own type!


----------



## song_of_serenity (Jun 13, 2010)

3a? no way, too loose! Yes, in the 3b/c/4a range. 

*Nonie*, I had *NO idea *your hair was* that long!* LOVE IT!


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Oh, you'll catch up soon enough. I'm not going anywhere fast. I am too lazy to seal and protect my ends and we all know once you get to SL, that becomes a necessity. I haven't even used a moisturizer leave-in for a whole year!
> 
> So don't worry, Hun. I'll be right here waiting for you.



i don't do that often either....i'm more a condition & go girl! (mostly leaving the conditioner in....not worried about it....WILL BE BRAIDING AS SOON AS MY SCALP CAN TAKE IT!)


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 13, 2010)

song_of_serenity said:


> 3a? no way, too loose! Yes, in the 3b/c/4a range.
> 
> *Nonie*, I had *NO idea *your hair was* that long!* LOVE IT!



yes, yes...her hair seems pretty dope

too bad she chooses to scare the shyte out of me with that picture  nightmares i tell ya!


----------



## Nonie (Jun 13, 2010)

tHeHaIRLaB said:


> yes, yes...her hair seems pretty dope
> 
> too bad she chooses to scare the shyte out of me with that picture  nightmares i tell ya!



You need to leave Snape out of this.  There's nothing nightmarish about him. Now if you want to see what sort of pics might cause nightmares, these might come in handy:

Grudge

No clue where from

The Exorcist

No clue where from


----------



## LadyRaider (Jun 13, 2010)

FlowerHair said:


> I would say a 3c/4a. Her curls are tighter than mine.
> 
> Why in the world is she putting so much junk in her hair?! Isn't that a little bit too much?



Yay! I am getting closer to my hair type. The part that has no relaxed ends curls exactly like that. I am so happy.  I don't think my hair will look like hers allover though. I don't see the 3b at all. Her hair looks so uniform. 

Yeah, I don't see why she is putting all that in her hair. She seems to have zero frizz and be well defined all over without the gel.


----------



## LadyRaider (Jun 13, 2010)

tHeHaIRLaB said:


> awwww that so sad, i'm a softee...i would had to at least give him a straight face or at least a dayuum blank start
> 
> so sad.... no "needs improvement stickers?"



At the time I had one box set of six stamps. I was a new teacher. I didn't have anything else  and the kid said he wanted it until he saw it on his paper. Heh. First and only time I used that stamp. I got others later. 

Why on earth do they make sad face stamps? In later years I still had it in my large collection of stamps. Once when I was letting my third graders stamp some behavior calendars, they accidentally used that one. I had to tell them the same story. No one likes a sad face stamp.


----------



## LadyRaider (Jun 13, 2010)

Love Alan Rickman, Nonie. Don't change that avatar!


----------



## Ms.Christ3n (Jun 13, 2010)

Random question: I think I'm 4a/3c, am I more of one than the other?


----------



## Nonie (Jun 13, 2010)

LadyRaider said:


> Love Alan Rickman, Nonie. Don't change that avatar!



Behold a woman who knows a good man when she sees one. ^5 and 

Wasn't going to change it. I'm very stubborn and rarely do anything I don't want to do, no matter how many people think I should.


----------



## naturalmanenyc (Jun 13, 2010)

I'm confused now too.  I always say that I'm 4a but maybe I'm not?


My hair did blend well with this texture, Milkyway human hair weave - corkscrews - 4a






After BKT my hair blends better with this texture. Milkyway human hair weave - coil curls - 3c





Are they both 4a?


----------



## Nonie (Jun 13, 2010)

naturalmanenyc said:


> I'm confused now too.  I always say that I'm 4a but maybe I'm not?
> 
> 
> My hair did blend well with this texture, Milkyway human hair weave - corkscrews - 4a
> ...



I personally wouldn't call the second one 4A. The first one looks like shingled 4A. The second one looks like 3C to me.


----------



## dollface0023 (Jun 13, 2010)

UrbainChic said:


> Okay, I think I am between 3c and 4a, but now in addition to being even more confused about hair type then before, I am freaked out that everyone's hair seems to spiral and mine is just doing something crazy.
> 
> So here are some pictures of my hair completely naked. All I used was a bar of solid shampoo, did not even condition in these pictures.
> 
> ...


 
Your hair is SO much like my own! 

Mine doesn't have any real curl pattern to it as well, but when it does show some type of curl towards my ends its fairly large. My hair pretty much just waves up or goes in a zig zag...


----------



## kblc06 (Jun 13, 2010)

Ms.Christ3n said:


> Random question: I think I'm 4a/3c, am I more of one than the other?



You look more like a silky/thready 3c/3b to me, but I can't quite tell from your pic


----------



## ryanshope (Jun 13, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> I posted the pictures of her comb coils to simply make her coil diameter more obvious since it hard to tell in the pics I posted  .....when you do comb coils on someone you're simply defining their natural coil diameter....it doesn't alter the width of the coils like setting it in rollers would.
> 
> Hair typing is all about curl diameter and nothing else....thats the most important thing to keep in mind. Really the biggest point that was made here is that 4a is the widest coil of the kinky hair types and the coils get smaller from there



Co-signing and thank u!! Hair typing isn't hard at all--the bigger the curls, the closer you are to 3; the smaller coils are 4. I have always known I have 4a/b/c hair, no "z" patters per se, but definitely corkscrews(from pen coil to straw size).  The smaller coils are definitely more fragile than the looser ones, but fortunately I have coarse hair throughout so my hair can take a licking and keep on ticking.


----------



## Ms.Christ3n (Jun 13, 2010)

:





kblc06 said:


> You look more like a silky/thready 3c/3b to me, but I can't quite tell from your pic


 
Thank you so much! I;ve been looking for my hair twin for months looking at 4a/3c hair types. I just looked at some 3b/3c mixtures and I found my hair twin on the second picture!!! My friend said before that I couldn't be 3b/3c because I was too dark in skin color. That's what I get for listening to her ignorant arse...


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 14, 2010)

This is to Noni and BlackMasterPiece, could you please help me and tell me my hair type! I am so confused at times. Here are some pictures when my hair was relaxed and when I bc'd. Also the ones that were bc'd some are without product right after I washed and dc and some are with me just combing my hair back after I applied lv-in con. TIA

I think it's a combo of 3c on crown and back and 4a or 4b on the sides


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 14, 2010)

Here are more pictures. I think my hair is identical to the mother on youtube from familygoingnatural! Just need some clarification.  I welcome all opinions as well!


----------



## Nonie (Jun 14, 2010)

Your hair is too short for me to really tell. Maybe you're 3C/4A or 4A. I don't think you've got 4B anywhere from the pics you posted.


----------



## davisbr88 (Jun 14, 2010)

You guys better be around in January 2011 when I cut off my ends so someone can type meeeeeee!


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 14, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Your hair is too short for me to really tell. Maybe you're 3C/4A or 4A. I don't think you've got 4B anywhere from the pics you posted.


OK, I have some more recent ones. Those were taken when I bc'd in Dec 08.

Ok, the last two are from me cutting off the texlaxed hair completely off, and wanted to see how long it will take for the section I cut to catch up with the rest of my hair that still has the textlaxed ends. Hope these are better  to determine. So the last two are my natural hair with no product in it. TIA


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 14, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Your hair is too short for me to really tell. Maybe you're 3C/4A or 4A. I don't think you've got 4B anywhere from the pics you posted.


One more showing the back of my hair. My hair is extremely curly in the nape.

Also, I've been transitioning since Feb 09 if that helps!


----------



## Nonie (Jun 14, 2010)

ycj1 said:


> OK, I have some more recent ones. Those were taken when I bc'd in Dec 08.
> 
> Ok, the last two are from me cutting off the texlaxed hair completely off, and wanted to see how long it will take for the section I cut to catch up with the rest of my hair that still has the textlaxed ends. Hope these are better  to determine. So the last two are my natural hair with no product in it. TIA



I can't really tell. Is the hair out of braids? I ask because the waves look different and larger than your previous pics, as if your hair has been manipulated, kinda like this difference:


----------



## Nonie (Jun 14, 2010)

ycj1 said:


> One more showing the back of my hair. My hair is extremely curly in the nape.
> 
> Also, I've been transitioning since Feb 09 if that helps!



These pics look like they would show your texture better, except they are blurry.


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 14, 2010)

Nonie said:


> These pics look like they would show your texture better, except they are blurry.


OK, when I take them out which won't be until around the 1st wk or so in July I will post some more just washed and then some with after my dc.  I try my best taking them since I live alone. It's a bit hard to take yr own especially the back. But I will do my best. Thanks anyway NONIE


----------



## tamikachu =] (Jun 14, 2010)

Geminigirl said:


> Here is my hair freshly conditioned



ok so whate type is this because this is what my hair looks like when wet


----------



## Nonie (Jun 14, 2010)

tamikachu =];11241254 said:
			
		

> ok so whate type is this because this is what my hair looks like when wet



4A Geminigirl told her hair type when she posted that pic in post #46 and then BMP confirmed it in post #47.


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 14, 2010)

Nonie said:


> Your hair is too short for me to really tell. Maybe you're 3C/4A or 4A. I don't think you've got 4B anywhere from the pics you posted.



HEY NON!!!  

although i'm not into the type thingy ma doo!!! 

what do you think about a thread seperating the all types....just for you to nuture these ladies who love your typing advice (for real).... you are great at this


----------



## Nonie (Jun 14, 2010)

tHeHaIRLaB said:


> HEY NON!!!
> 
> although i'm not into the type thingy ma doo!!!
> 
> what do you think about a thread seperating the all types....just for you to nuture these ladies who love your typing advice (for real).... you are great at this



I'm not really that good. Not like BlackMasterPiece. I am good at identifying 4B though and its many faces. CNapp is just manipulated 4B so still 4B to me. 4C doesn't exist in my book. 

You are either unafraid or crazy to start so many typing threads when they annoy folks.


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 15, 2010)

Nonie said:


> I'm not really that good. Not like BlackMasterPiece. I am good at identifying 4B though and its many faces. CNapp is just manipulated 4B so still 4B to me. 4C doesn't exist in my book.
> 
> You are either unafraid or crazy to start so many typing threads when they annoy folks.



i know.... but you encouraged me!
honestly...i'm hoping "minimal dialogue (to avoid confusion).... maximum pics"  

perhaps that will reduce confusion...and AVOID IRRITATION & CONFLICT!!

I'M SERIOUSLY HOPING   ....i'll pray on that one.... positive thoughts sis!  positive thoughts!


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 15, 2010)

Ms.Christ3n said:


> :
> 
> Thank you so much! I;ve been looking for my hair twin for months looking at 4a/3c hair types. I just looked at some 3b/3c mixtures and I found my hair twin on the second picture!!! My friend said before that I couldn't be 3b/3c because I was too dark in skin color. That's what I get for listening to her ignorant arse...


I have never heard of anything like that before in my life! Look at SEMO's hair! I guess yr friend would have a fit if she saw her's! It does not matter what the skin color of a black person is regarding hair type.

I've seen the most beautiful heads of hair on dark skinned people! Da** she really needs to be educated on different hair types and not different skin tones!


----------



## LaFemmeNaturelle (Jun 15, 2010)

^^By beautiful you mean.....well taken care of and healthy looking riiiiight?


SMH!


----------



## wavezncurlz (Jun 15, 2010)

Ms.Christ3n said:


> :
> 
> Thank you so much! I;ve been looking for my hair twin for months looking at 4a/3c hair types. I just looked at some 3b/3c mixtures and I found my hair twin on the second picture!!! My friend said before that I couldn't be 3b/3c because I was too dark in skin color. That's what I get for listening to her ignorant arse...


 
what the ....? 
smdh. we've been fighting this stereotype since forever. jesh louise.


----------



## TwistNMx (Jun 15, 2010)

Well, here's my hair shot. I could never know for sure my type. 4a /4o, etc. 'cause it's not kinky and the curls not big but springy when dry. It's even curlier with conditioner.
Any clue?


----------



## TwistNMx (Jun 15, 2010)

Any experts? etc...
I'd love to hear your thoughts.


----------



## ReeseNicole (Jun 15, 2010)

So I have a question then ladies, I haven't quite decided where I fall into the hair type bc my hair has obvious curls but its also incredibly pic. I've included some pics. I wish I knew how to include the pic in the post and not as an attachment, I'd be able to tell the story better. There are pics of my hair wet and dry; I chose the dry pics without product to make this easier.


----------



## ReeseNicole (Jun 15, 2010)

okay one more


----------



## loonggood (Jun 15, 2010)

4a: Tightly coiled hair that, when stretched, has an "S" pattern, much like curly hair. It tends to have more moisture than 4b; has a definite curl pattern

4a celebrities: Macy Gray, Monique Coleman, Leela James


Tips

• Use styling creams, butters and oils for type 4 hair

• This hair type needs extra moisture and tender-loving care because it can be fragile

• Detangle hair with a lot of conditioner in your hair and use a comb or detangling brush

• Let hair air dry or use a hood dryer

• Do not use a brush or comb on your dry curls

• Reduce tangles by sleeping on a satin pillowcase or wrap hair in a satin cap


Subtype 3c is really more than a subtype. It's a type NaturallyCurly members developed because the original system left out this hair type, which falls between 3b and 4a, having its own special characteristics.

• Type 3c hair has tight curls in corkscrews

• Circumference: Pencil or straw

• The curls can be either kinky, or very tightly curled, with lots and lots of strands densely packed together

• Getting this type of hair to blow dry straight is more challenging than for 3a or 3b, but it usually can be done

• The very tight curls are usually fine in texture

• 3c celebrities: Heather Headley, Alicia Keyes, Jada Pinkett-Smith
Tips

• Use styling creams, butters and oils for type 3c hair

• This hair type needs extra moisture and tender-loving care because it can be fragile

• Detangle hair with a lot of conditioner in your hair and use a comb or detangling brush

• Do not use a brush or comb on your dry curls

• Reduce tangles by sleeping on a satin pillowcase or wrap hair in a satin cap


----------



## ReeseNicole (Jun 15, 2010)

hahah I just noticed I said pic....lol..i meant thick..duh :/


----------



## TwistNMx (Jun 15, 2010)

loonggood said:


> 4a: Tightly coiled hair that, when stretched, has an "S" pattern, much like curly hair. It tends to have more moisture than 4b; has a definite curl pattern
> 
> 4a celebrities: Macy Gray, Monique Coleman, Leela James
> 
> ...


I don't seem to fit in either of these categories.  Is it written in stone? erplexed


----------



## Sapphire_chic (Jun 15, 2010)

let me have a try lol 

Twist and mix I'm sorry I can't really tell from the pic, I would have to admit I am guessing 4a (maybe some wet hair pics)

Curly reese I think you have type 3c hair but as your hair gets longer I can definately see it being a mix of 3b/c as the weight stretches it. but just judging by the pics you gave i'd say 3c.

Please tell these poor ladies If I have completely missed the target


----------



## softblackcotton (Jun 15, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> /\ Nonie gives the most comprehensive explanations
> 
> Hair typing is *ONLY* about curl diameter...nothing else. We shouldn't expect it to tell us about porosity, density, thickness of strands shine or forecast our good hair days or bad hair days....only curl diameter.
> 
> I think alot of people on the board are under the mistaken impression that 4a is within the curly range......and its not. 4a is the first sub-set of the kinky hair textures....if you comb 4a hair out it will look like an indistinct cloud.....however if you moisturize 4a hair....you can see some coils with the naked eye*.....with 4b hair and above.....even if the hair is moisturized....the coils are sooooo tiny that it will still appear to be an indistinct cloud even with product*.


 
I've found out that you can define 4b curls with only some gel and some finger manipulation I will post pics soon.


----------



## loonggood (Jun 15, 2010)

Getting this type of hair to blow dry straight is more challenging than for 3a or 3b, but it usually can be done


----------



## ReeseNicole (Jun 15, 2010)

Sapphire_chic said:


> let me have a try lol
> 
> Twist and mix I'm sorry I can't really tell from the pic, I would have to admit I am guessing 4a (maybe some wet hair pics)
> 
> ...



Thanks, it just gets so thick sometimes I wonder myself. Hair type isn't that important to me, but the curiosity is becoming too much..lol


----------



## TwistNMx (Jun 15, 2010)

loonggood said:


> Getting this type of hair to blow dry straight is more challenging than for 3a or 3b, but it usually can be done


 
I may blow dry for length check and/or trim 2-3 times a year.  It's quite easily straightened.


----------



## TwistNMx (Jun 15, 2010)

Sapphire_chic said:


> let me have a try lol
> 
> Twist and mix I'm sorry I can't really tell from the pic, I would have to admit I am guessing 4a (maybe some wet hair pics)
> 
> ...


 
Thanks Sapphire_chic,
I believe 4a, yes, until I see other pictures posted here that do not resemble my hair then I'm confused all over again.  Can't decide. I guess I expect too much.   And maybe I should concentrate on growth rate, but I'm just so tied into this.  Did you see this site?


----------



## JustSimplyTish (Jun 15, 2010)

ycj1 said:


> I have never heard of anything like that before in my life! Look at SEMO's hair! I guess yr friend would have a fit if she saw her's! It does not matter what the skin color of a black person is regarding hair type.
> 
> I've seen the most beautiful heads of hair on dark skinned people! Da** she really needs to be educated on different hair types and not different skin tones!



I know that was so funny...My 25 y/o niece has a beautiful dark chocolate complexion and she has natural hair like 2b/2c .....It is almost completely straight with a few waves here and there...and my sister is black and so is her father


----------



## Sapphire_chic (Jun 15, 2010)

^^ I am a member at NC but I just checked that link why was kelis' hair the pic under 4b


----------



## MzK (Jun 15, 2010)

subscribing....


----------



## glamazon386 (Jun 15, 2010)

TwistNMx said:


> I don't seem to fit in either of these categories.  Is it written in stone? erplexed



I don't think so. Some of the stuff on the 4a list doesn't really apply to me. And some of the stuff on the list for 3c works better for my hair. :shrug:


----------



## TwistNMx (Jun 15, 2010)

glamazon386 said:


> I don't think so. Some of the stuff on the 4a list doesn't really apply to me. And some of the stuff on the list for 3c works better for my hair. :shrug:


 
What do you do??? 
...and I'm just lovin' that picture of you in the siggy.


----------



## ycj1 (Jun 15, 2010)

LaFemmeNaturelle said:


> ^^By beautiful you mean.....well taken care of and healthy looking riiiiight?
> 
> 
> SMH!


Of course I do! Healthy, strong. Not necessarily has to be down a person's back to be beautiful. I used SEMO's as an example because of her skin tone being gorgeous as well but you don't have to be light skin to have gorgeous hair is what I am saying! That's all


----------



## Janet' (Jul 25, 2010)




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## Nonie (Jul 25, 2010)

softblackcotton said:


> I've found out that you can define 4b curls with only some gel and some finger manipulation I will post pics soon.


 
That is something we 4B's know. It's called shingling. It's the only way to define curls on 4B. It involves stretching the hair and then letting it spring back down. The strethching opens up the coils so that when they spring back down they cup those beside them to form a more clearly seen spiral. It takes a lot of work. And it is necessary for the tiny curls of 4B hair. 

4A on the other hand can just be defined with a simple WNG. So can 3's. And that's because their coils are bigger and easily cup each other without the need to be opened up. 

Tkj25 has nice photos of his shingled 4B hair so we have seen it before. 

When it comes WNGs though, from close up, you can see the coils on 4B, but from far it looks like an uncombed mess.


----------



## Boujoichic (Jul 25, 2010)

Nonie could you help me with typing I think Im 4A\3C
I posted in the type thread here is a link with pics
http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?p=11597966&highlight=#post11597966
I think Im 4A in the front with 3C in the middle and back.  My hair kinda S waves in the front with a little curl on the end then in the middle and back I get big curls a little bigger than a pencil in diameter like pinky sized and they feel very silky


----------



## Nonie (Jul 25, 2010)

Boujoichic said:


> Nonie could you help me with typing I think Im 4A\3C
> I posted in the type thread here is a link with pics
> http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?p=11597966&highlight=#post11597966
> I think Im 4A in the front with 3C in the middle and back. My hair kinda S waves in the front with a little curl on the end then in the middle and back I get big curls a little bigger than a pencil in diameter like pinky sized and they feel very silky


 
My guess is you're right, 3C/4A. You hair looks like LynnieB's hair and she's my idea of 3C/4A.


----------



## Boujoichic (Jul 25, 2010)

Thanks Nonie Im off to look for LynnieB hope she has a fotki


----------



## Nonie (Jul 25, 2010)

Boujoichic said:


> Thanks Nonie Im off to look for LynnieB hope she has a fotki


 
I share pics of her texture in this thread at post #64


----------



## nikolite (Aug 6, 2010)

Alas, I was cursed with having both on my head.  3C at the front, edges, nape and crown, 4A in the back.  

So I can't wear an afro all by itself anymore (only when I had short hair after the BC).  I can only do a puff, which takes a lot of manipulation because I have to set it way back, comb out the curls up front and press them down a lot to get them to appear as compact as the ones in back.  

I also can't really do a WNG because while the front of my hair falls in looser curls with length and definition, the back shrinks up more and the curls have tighter spirals.  So it always looks really uneven and short in the back, and up front gel makes it hang too long and nearly straightens the curls out.


----------



## Kindheart (Aug 6, 2010)

BlackMasterPiece said:


> I posted the pictures of her comb coils to simply make her coil diameter more obvious since it hard to tell in the pics I posted  .....when you do comb coils on someone you're simply defining their natural coil diameter....it doesn't alter the width of the coils like setting it in rollers would.
> 
> Hair typing is all about curl diameter and nothing else....thats the most important thing to keep in mind. Really the biggest point that was made here is that 4a is the widest coil of the kinky hair types and the coils get smaller from there


 i thought 4b and C are not coily .


----------



## MilkChocolateOne (Aug 6, 2010)

Kindheart said:


> i thought 4b and C are not coily .





4b hair is very coily, if it wasn't there would be no shrinkage.


----------



## song_of_serenity (Aug 6, 2010)

Kindheart said:


> i thought 4b and C are not coily .


You may have coil mixed up with curl. It is extremely coily!


----------



## PhonyBaloney500 (Aug 6, 2010)

nikolite said:


> Alas, I was cursed with having both on my head.  3C at the front, edges, nape and crown, 4A in the back.
> 
> So I can't wear an afro all by itself anymore (only when I had short hair after the BC).  I can only do a puff, which takes a lot of manipulation because I have to set it way back, comb out the curls up front and press them down a lot to get them to appear as compact as the ones in back.
> 
> I also can't really do a WNG because while the front of my hair falls in looser curls with length and definition, the back shrinks up more and the curls have tighter spirals.  So it always looks really uneven and short in the back, and up front gel makes it hang too long and nearly straightens the curls out.



Could you go to a hair salon that specializes in curls to get it evened out a bit and cut in a style you might want for WNG purposes?

My hair has various textures as well and another trick I use for drying is to wear it on a bun high up on my head (this stretches out the back).

HTH!


----------



## NikkiQ (Aug 6, 2010)

I'm so subbing to this thread. I wanted to know what my hair type was, but I'm still transitioning so it might be difficult to decipher even though my NG has some defined curls to them. Oh to be patient


----------



## NikkiQ (Oct 5, 2010)




----------



## Chantelle09 (Oct 5, 2010)

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder... 3c 4a, Thank you for LHCF!!!


----------



## tricie (Oct 5, 2010)

Bumping...gotta keep this thread alive for new transitioners!


----------



## silenttullip (Oct 5, 2010)

I'm soooooo curious and confused now but on the other hand I haven't done a wash and go in a loooong time... I thought I was 3c/4a but by some of these pics I think I'm 4b.


----------



## Janet' (Nov 3, 2010)

Usefule info for newbies!!!


----------



## Amoreofcurls (Nov 3, 2010)

Nonie said:


>


 

This actually resembles my fro alot


----------



## Qtee (Nov 3, 2010)

I want to play whats my "correct" hair type..now I think Im 3b/3c..I havent taken a texture pic with out product in a year..



This is a WNG with eocstyler..


----------



## Qtee (Nov 3, 2010)

Bump........


----------



## diadall (Nov 3, 2010)

> A kink is a tiny curl. So anyone with big curls doesn't have kinks. So all kinky hair is curly but not all curly hair is kinky. Curly hair made of big curls is not kinky.



Girl, that sounds like the beginning of an LSAT question! LOL


----------



## Amoreofcurls (Nov 3, 2010)

Qtee, have you seen any of these threads?

http://www.longhaircareforum.com/ha...-3c-mixed-texture-only-pics-here-⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓.html


----------



## Amoreofcurls (Nov 3, 2010)

I think this pic kinda shows a difference between my 3c and 4a hair regarding size

Most of my 4a sections are actually smoother than my 3c sections....


----------



## BlackMasterPiece (Nov 3, 2010)

Qtee, yes, you are a 3b/c


----------



## Janet' (Nov 7, 2010)




----------



## DaPPeR (Dec 13, 2010)

i love this thread. Thank u to whoever started it!


----------



## LoveCraze (Dec 19, 2010)




----------



## LuvlyRain3 (Dec 19, 2010)

After reading this thread I an more confused than ever about hair typing.

All the hair that I am seeing in this thread has a curl pattern. Some curls a way tighter than others but are curls nonetheless. But yet the 4s are considered kinky while the 3s are considered curly.i know they say that all kinks are curls but not all curls are kinks.
But What makes a curl a kink?


----------



## Janet' (Dec 19, 2010)

Quote: A kink is a tiny curl. So anyone with big curls doesn't have kinks. So all kinky hair is curly but not all curly hair is kinky. Curly hair made of big curls is not kinky. 

I'm trying to find the original poster of this statement...but it makes sense to me...


----------



## LuvlyRain3 (Dec 19, 2010)

Janet' said:


> Quote: A kink is a tiny curl. So anyone with big curls doesn't have kinks. So all kinky hair is curly but not all curly hair is kinky. Curly hair made of big curls is not kinky.
> 
> I'm trying to find the original poster of this statement...but it makes sense to me...



Ok I get what you're saying. But 3c and 4a kinda look the same to me


----------



## Janet' (Dec 19, 2010)

^^^Now that! Yeah, I dunno...I say that that is my type because that's what Nonie and BlackMasterPiece told me  

I think 3c are the bigger curls and 4a are the smaller curls...I guess


----------



## EllePixie (Dec 19, 2010)

LOLOL and this is exactly why I have given up on hair type. People tell me I'm 3c/4a, some people tell me I'm just 3c, there are lots of spirals and s curls in there, some are fine, some are coarse, and it's ALL very dense... I'm like...I have no idea as long as my hair is growing!


----------



## Gleek (Dec 19, 2010)

I forgot about this thread. I think I have more than enough NG to figure it out but I just straightened my hair on sat. Maybe after wash day I'll post some pics.


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## Embyra (Dec 30, 2010)

ill be back with my pictures....


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## Embyra (Feb 12, 2011)

Nonie said:


> A kink is a tiny curl. So anyone with big curls doesn't have kinks. So all kinky hair is curly but not all curly hair is kinky. Curly hair made of big curls is not kinky.
> 
> Examples of 4A hair:
> 
> ...




    thats the best explanation i have seen


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## EllePixie (Feb 12, 2011)

3c hair can form a micrphone afro, depending on its texture. This is why hair typing isn't comprehensive or an accurate way to analyze hair.


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## Embyra (Feb 16, 2011)

EllePixie said:


> *3c hair can form a micrphone afro, depending on its texture. *This is why hair typing isn't comprehensive or an accurate way to analyze hair.



TRUE TRUE


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Feb 16, 2011)

Qtee said:


> I want to play whats my "correct" hair type..now I think Im 3b/3c..I havent taken a texture pic with out product in a year..
> 
> 
> 
> This is a WNG with eocstyler..



wow i absolutely agree... such perfect 3c curls in there  beautiful!


----------



## **SaSSy** (Feb 25, 2011)

Now that I'm natural I wanted to revisit this thread. This is very confusing. Now that I'm growing out of the TWA stage, my hair is starting to look more 3c in certain spots than 4a. When I first BC, I cut more of my front because I though it was relaxer, but in reality it was my texture. My front is really soft, fine, with a lot of 3c strands; my hair right near my widows peck is actually a 3b which I was very surprise about. from my nape to crown, is actually more 3c. My crown looks all 4a only, with a slight 3c curl.

I have crazy shrinkage. When I blew my hair out I was able to put my hair in a pony tail  , but unstretched it's still short! 

I blew out my hair for my one year post anniversary and its very easy to blow out which makes me think I have mostly 3c with a mix of 4a.

I really don't care about the whole hair typing system, but it's kind of important when you are buying products. I keep things simple for me. I just say I'm 3c/4a mix. I don't even count my patch of 3b

I added a video of my hair wet, to help give more of a visual:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxDnHJVQsmU


----------



## Nonie (Feb 25, 2011)

**SaSSy** said:


> Now that I'm natural I wanted to revisit this thread. This is very confusing. Now that I'm growing out of the TWA stage, my hair is starting to look more 3c in certain spots than 4a. When I first BC, I cut more of my front because I though it was relaxer, but in reality it was my texture. My front is really soft, fine, with a lot of 3c strands; my hair right near my widows peck is actually a 3b which I was very surprise about. from my nape to crown, is actually more 3c. My crown looks all 4a only, with a slight 3c curl.
> 
> I have crazy shrinkage. When I blew my hair out I was able to put my hair in a pony tail  , but unstretched it's still short!
> 
> ...



**SaSSy**, I do not think you have type 3 hair. Your hair looks like it's the 4's. Ease of blowdrying or pressing has nothing to do with type. Texture could explain that. People with really coarse hair have to work harder to make it change shape, so you may have fine hair. Your hair's coils look too small to be 3 anything IMO. But it may just be hard to see the type 3C areas you are referring to coz you say they are mixed in there.

You should perhaps post photos of various parts of your hair. Bare...both wet and dry. Also a WNG of your hair would be another telltale sign of your type.


----------



## **SaSSy** (Feb 25, 2011)

Nonie said:


> @**SaSSy**, I do not think you have type 3 hair. Your hair looks like it's the 4's. Ease of blowdrying or pressing has nothing to do with type. Texture could explain that. People with really coarse hair have to work harder to make it change shape, so you may have fine hair. Your hair's coils look too small to be 3 anything IMO. But it may just be hard to see the type 3C areas you are referring to coz you say they are mixed in there.
> 
> You should perhaps post photos of various parts of your hair. Bare...both wet and dry. Also a WNG of your hair would be another telltale sign of your type.



Thanks @Nonie I knew if anyone would know it would be you. I'm still really confused with this whole hair typing thing. So am I a 4a/4b mix? When I was natural before I thought I had ZZZ hair, but someone else assessed my hair and told me I didn't. I know my hair is fine, which would explain the ease of detangling and blow-drying.

I will be doing a wash and go video next month, so I will post that one.


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## Nonie (Feb 25, 2011)

**SaSSy** said:


> Thanks @Nonie I knew if anyone would know it would be you. I'm still really confused with this whole hair typing thing.* So am I a 4a/4b mix*? When I was natural before I thought I had ZZZ hair, but someone else assessed my hair and told me I didn't. I know my hair is fine, which would explain the ease of detangling and blow-drying.
> 
> I will be doing a wash and go video next month, so I will post that one.



I don't know if you're 4A/B mix. I would have to see your hair's other characteristics but otherwise when I saw it, it reminded me of my own here:






I do know you're a 4. You may have to check out tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT's threads of pics for 4A, 4a/b and 4B to see which hair looks most like yours. ​


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## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Feb 25, 2011)

4a/4b HAIR TYPING


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## **SaSSy** (Feb 25, 2011)

tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT said:


> 4a/4b HAIR TYPING





Nonie said:


> I don't know if you're 4A/B mix. I would have to see your hair's other characteristics but otherwise when I saw it, it reminded me of my own here:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks ya. Even though to me hair typing is not that important, but it does feel good to finally know what my hair type is officially. I'm somewhere embracing my 4 whatever letter hair.


----------



## Gleek (Mar 17, 2011)

Ok, I think I have enough new growth now. I am 17 months post relaxer. This is washed, no products.


----------



## AvaSpeaks (Mar 17, 2011)

That's kinda why I don't do hair typing anymore. Too confusing and too many answers from people who are just looking at your hair from pictures and not actual touching or seeing your hair in person


----------



## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Mar 17, 2011)

Ms.Christ3n said:


> :
> 
> Thank you so much! I;ve been looking for my hair twin for months looking at 4a/3c hair types. I just looked at some 3b/3c mixtures and I found my hair twin on the second picture!!! *My friend said before that I couldn't be 3b/3c because I was too dark in skin color.* That's what I get for listening to her ignorant arse...


     ok  friend


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## southerncitygirl (Mar 17, 2011)

just so all of you ladies know 3c though its a sub hair type is classified as a curly kinky texture.....i thin many 4b's have preconceived notions about 3c hair and truthfully i think 4a is an additional subtype as there seems to be a big difference btw 4a and 4b/c napp hair,imo....most people on this board that are labeled 3c look like 3b's to me as their curls seem larger than a drinking straw  and more like a kids jumbo crayon/pencil.....i can easily see how 3c and 4a hair typing could be difficult for many. 
people that are 4b's also tend not to realize that you don't have to be silky to be a 3c and that one can be cottony or thready or have a combo of these textures on their head, hair type and hair texture are 2 totally different things, which also makes things confusing for many.


----------



## Embyra (Mar 17, 2011)

southerncitygirl said:


> just so all of you ladies know 3c though its a sub hair type is classified as a *curly kinky texture*.....*i thin many 4b's have preconceived notions about 3c hair* and truthfully i think 4a is an additional subtype as there seems to be a big difference btw 4a and 4b/c napp hair,imo....*most people on this board that are labeled 3c look like 3b's to me as their curls seem larger than a drinking straw  and more like a kids jumbo crayon/pencil*.....i can easily see how 3c and 4a hair typing could be difficult for many.
> *people that are 4b's also tend not to realize that you don't have to be silky to be a 3c and that one can be cottony or thready or have a combo of these textures on their head, hair type and hair texture are 2 totally different things, which also makes things confusing for many*.




right on sister



ellepixie IMO is a good example of a 3c hair with a ''coarse'' texture because of her texture she could get a afro i think......whereas rachel true has a much silkier finer texture which i couldnt see getting a dense afro without some backcombing or something of that nature

my 2 pence....


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## Gleek (Mar 19, 2011)

whoops Repost


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## growinghealthyhair (Mar 19, 2011)

Platinum said:


> Those type 4 pics make me want to chop right now!





Platinum 

Lol @ you Bc'ng 3days later.


----------



## AvaSpeaks (Mar 19, 2011)

coconut said:


> right on sister
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Rachel True to me is a real good example of true 3c hair


----------



## Platinum (Mar 20, 2011)

growinghealthyhair said:


> Platinum
> 
> Lol @ you Bc'ng 3days later.



growinghealthyhair  I forgot about that. I really didn't plan to BC that soon, I wanted to wait another 6 months to a year. I was planning to go to braid shop but my started to tangle like mad so I chopped out of frustration with the detangling process.


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## Nonie (Mar 20, 2011)

I don't think hair being silky or not has anything to do with whether an afro can be formed or not. Small kinks tend to form a microphone afro better than large coils.  The girl below has very silky hair but that afro is as good as any I've seen on dull type 4 hair. She's able to do that coz she's got tiny kinks in her hair (Her hair reminds me of LynnieB's 3C/4A hair:





This little girl also has silky looking type 4 hair which forms nice afro puffs:



100% type 3 hair can't from a microphone afro even when combed out. It just flops as seen in this image that's too big to post here: http://loveisntenough.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/ayla.jpg

The kinkier the hair is, the harder it is to see its silkiness because the absence of a long section that is straight means light reflection isn't as good as in the 3's. So it's easy for folks to think a 4 isn't silky when it is.

*ETA: My theory about type 3 hair not being able to form a perfect afro changed on May 27,  2011 after wavezncurls posted images of her hair when she was a kid. She's type 3B/3C IMO and yet her hair was clearly formed into an afro puff. In that discussion I clearly I stood corrected on this note, and I was beyond thrilled to see this. In my defense, my "knowledge" of type 3 hair has been from simple observation, not really from working with it. I even asked then why nowadays type 3 folks ack like their hair can't do what type 4 can, and wavezncurlz explained that products had a lot to do with it. 

Here's a link to the discussion in which I got my education on the fact that type 3 hair can form a microphone afro, starting from wavezncurlz very informative post: * *http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?p=13516425#post13516425*


----------



## theNaturalWonders (Jun 23, 2011)

so i read all 19 pages and i kinda sorta have an idea of what my hair type is but i would love to hear everyone's opinion. i have always been confused with my hair...it gets very frizzy and i have like 3 different textures on my head..it is def not silky maybe cottony???~i think i am a 4a/4b mixed 

a dry twist out




a wash n go doing the tightly curly method_-(product still drying-made this big so you can see my texture and curl pattern-pls excuse the anime-too early in the am to take pics)_




a twist updo




another dry twist out


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## theNaturalWonders (Jun 29, 2011)

DOING THE DA BUMP!!
anybody somebody please help!!

i went to urbanbella this past friday and she told me i have a kinky texture with a looser curl that was more wavier in some areas and that a finger style(wash n go) would not produce good definition~ which made me even more fustrated as i peeped at the other ladies who seemed to have a more consistent (tighter) pattern. i honestly don't know what to do with my hair. i can do really good twists, but wash n gos-negative! anything loose my hair is a hot mess. so much frizz and the poof factor. i may have a porosity problem. definitely a ph balance problem with the products i am using. i am really debating if i should just be a heat trained natural, or texlax my hair or cut it off and start over. i am bummed for real


----------



## knt1229 (Jun 29, 2011)

I agree with you on the 4a/b. Also, have your tried anything to fix your PH problem. And what's wrong with your wash n go's it looks nice in the pic.


----------



## theNaturalWonders (Jun 30, 2011)

^^^thanks!! 
well when i do wng and its dripping wet with conditioner it looks really good but as soon as its dry its a hard, tangly mess with tons of frizz...

i ventured over to walmart to pick up GDLI after reading the ph thread and used AV juice as a spritizer and twisted my hair last night...i will use GDLI and AV juice as a styling product for my twists for 6-8 weeks to see if there is a difference

i do have porosity control but i dont know how to include it in my regimen~any ideas??


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## Poohbear (Jun 30, 2011)

Nonie - whether type 3 or 4, natural hair can either form a microphone or flop down.


I have type 4a/b hair and look at these two different fro instances with my hair:

Microphone fro (not perfectly shape) picked out from shrunken hair:





Floppy fro blowdried







Now here's a few pics of my hair completely shrunken:


----------



## Chiquitita (Jun 30, 2011)

Ok, I am now more confused than ever regarding my own hair type.  IMO, trying to type your hair right after BC can be misleading, and I'm sure others will disagree, but I strongly believe in the notion of 'scab hair'. After all, I was relaxed for over 20 years of my life so I am sure using a chemical for that long could affect the hair underneath the scalp.

I also believe that a person needs to have some length to really see how their hair is going to form curls.  Now that my hair has grown out more to CBL, I am thinking that I am more 4a than 4b as I thought before.  For one, it has taken me a whole year to figure out what products work best for my hair (i.e bringing out the curls).  

Another issue I've had is with porosity control, if my porosity is off, then my hair will not form curls, just frizz.  There are many factors than can affect what type of curls your hair will form and it takes time and research (thank you LHCF) to really learn about your hair.


----------



## AuNaturalMaMa (Jun 30, 2011)

Nice thread! I loved every page of it. I'm pretty sure about my hair type now! Who hoo! I love the ramen noodle explanation I have lots of that in my crown but the typical 3c curls in the back and sides. Question: Does 3c hair change as it grows? For instance from a twa to neck length to BSL. Would the curls get looser? Or could they be loose while it is short and get tighter as it gets longer? Thanks.

ETA: Pictures
The first two are wash and go's with just a little cantu shea thats it and i pinned them up or did a style with them. 

The *first* one is one month from my BC. 
*Second* 3 months post bc

*Third* my nape with product wet and conditioner defined curls wet tightly curly method.
*Fourth* one side of my head dry from doing the tightly curly method
*Fifth* 9mo post bc

Nonie
Poohbear


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## AuNaturalMaMa (Jun 30, 2011)

I know its thursday night and the experts might be busy but BUMP!!


----------



## MyAngelEyez~C~U (Jun 30, 2011)

......................................


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## Amoreofcurls (Jun 30, 2011)

Poohbear im jealous of your fro!!!

If tried to do it straight from a wash or when dry,some of my curls and coils will find a way to return and flop...Unevenly erplexed







I'm its seem the only way I can get a fro close to that perfect is when I twist or braid it first then pick + humidity...but even then with humidity my coils will try to form at the ends...I found that grease combats that a lil...






Here's my hair totally dry and unmanipulated with nothing but my leave in


----------



## Amoreofcurls (Jun 30, 2011)

AuNaturalMaMa said:


> Question: Does 3c hair change as it grows? For instance from a twa to neck length to BSL. Would the curls get looser? Or could they be loose while it is short and get tighter as it gets longer? Thanks.



With weight that comes along with length, the shape of your curls may change...
Some area's of my head have went from from coily ended curls to just waves...Some have formed a looser curl but maintained the coily ends...

but hair texture, and is also a factor in this...Ive seen some 3c's with the same kind of shrinkage they had when their hair was shorter...


My hair was definitely alot more coily when shorter


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## CurlsBazillion (Jun 30, 2011)

wow I'm offically confused....
I'm still 4a, right?











....and of course this is dry product free hair.


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## AuNaturalMaMa (Jun 30, 2011)

Amoreofcurls said:


> With weight of the length the shape of your curls may change...
> Some area's of my head have went from from coily ended curls to just waves...Some have formed a looser curl but maintained the coily ends
> 
> but hair texture is also a factor in this...Ive seen some 3c's with the same kind of shrinkage they had when their hair was shorter...


 
Thanks. @Amoreofcurls. I love your hair by the way! So pretty! I was asking because looking at pictures it seems mine have changed shape. They went from tight(1 month post bc) to loose (3mo post bc) to tight (9months post bc) and back and forth since then. Now I feel like my smaller curls in the back are slowly changing and my front has went from loose ringlets to the ramen noodle ppl were talking about! When I was a baby my hair was straight then it slowly had ringlets to curls kinda like my sons hair. Thats why I ask about length cause some say they get looser with length but my sons have gotten tighter and mine did at a time too. 

My son went from straight to curly 3c id say. Thats going from loose to tight vs tight to loose with more length. 
.


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## tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT (Jun 30, 2011)

MyAngelEyez~C~U said:


> Okay, what do I have, LOL? My hair's just plain old weird IMO. (calling on @Nonie  @tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT and anyone else who care's to give their two cents...)
> 
> wet hair, freshly washed/conditioned
> 
> ...



girl you have such pretty hair... who cares...

it looks like your "freshly washed" pics have stretched hair though

as in...maybe you washed in twists or hair was stretched for a long period, manipulated or something.  The curls are clumping (as it would if loose--IMO)
i have this issue as well b/c i do my best to wash,condition, rinse in twists

if not heat-laxed.... is this (or can you) twit pic a shot of a cowash on loose hair?....that may help you


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## MyAngelEyez~C~U (Jun 30, 2011)

.......................


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## MWilson569 (Jul 4, 2011)

I found this online....


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## deja86 (Aug 22, 2011)

Hi it's been 1 month post BC and I'd really like to know what my hair type is please  

Not sure if you'd be able to tell from this image below 


[IMG]http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff238/deja021106/IMG01667-20110822-1509.jpg[/IMG]


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## LadyRaider (Aug 22, 2011)

Your hair type is:
Drumroll, please!

























Pretty!


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