# The Worship of Baal-Peor



## Sarophina (Feb 10, 2012)

Hi Ladies,

I saw the current discussion on oral sex and I thought you guys may be interested in an article on the seriousness of this sin. May those who have ears to hear, hear 

First, its important to realize the definition of sodomy, 

Webster's defines sodomy as anal or *oral copulation* with a member of the same or *opposite sex*; also : copulation with an animal

Here's a great video explaining Baal-Peor

http://www.youtube.com/watchv=i6yjTBlrSiI&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL
and here's the gist of the article


Baal-Peor & Marriage?

After seeing the videos, some have asked us, "Are you saying that acts of sodomy are sinful, even in marriage?" While there are likely a number of mixed messages people give to this question, it is a sin - even in marriage. There are several reasons why.


Sodomy is a sin.   Similar to the meaning of Beor (Balaam's father), the Hebrew word for Sodom literally means "burning". Sodomy is defined as "anal or oral copulation with a member of the opposite sex; copulation with a member of the same sex; or bestiality." The act is considered sodomy even when it pertains to the opposite sex. Heterosexuals who participate in this act are sodomites by the very definition of the word. It wouldn't take long in reviewing the Scriptures to understand how God feels about sodomy. The Bible is not silent on this topic.

It is idolatry.   The word "sodomite" in the Old Testament is the word "qadesh" which means "male temple prostitute". The female counterpart to that (the word "qĕdeshah") is often translated as "harlot" or "whore". Some say that God only disapproved of this act as it related to temple prostitution. Yet, the act itself is an act of idolatry no matter who performs it. One does not have to be a temple whore of Baal for the act to be sinful. On the contrary, one becomes a temple whore of Baal by doing the act.

Holding true to the definition of the word sodomy, these temple prostitutes would perform homosexual acts on anyone, regardless of gender. The act itself was the means by which the participants were joined to or became one with Baal; the act itself was the means of worship by which Baal was sought to cross over and indwell the participants.

The marriage bed should be kept in honor (Hebrews 13:4). Some assert that there is an anything goes mentality to intimacy in marriage because "the marriage bed is undefiled." However the Bible prefaces that text by saying that marriage is first honorable. The text also states that fornication and adultery defiles the marriage bed. The word for fornication is the Greek word porneia which means illicit sexual intercourse. So sex acts that God deems as illicit are not acceptable just because it is practiced in the confines of a marriage. It defiles the marriage bed which should be held in honor. The question then becomes are acts of sodomy illicit?

God gives us GOOD gifts (James 1:17). God does not give us gifts that would cause us harm. Therefore, we can look at the function, purpose, and design of certain acts to determine whether or not these would be considered natural in God's eyes. If a sexual act is ordained by God (i.e. it is natural), then it would have certain inherent protections for the participants in the act.

Design - The woman and man are given sexual parts that physically correlate to and fit each other. They are designed to meet together naturally, without forced manipulation. Protection - God designed protections into the body for this interaction. The lining of the uterus is designed to prevent the semen from entering into the blood stream of the woman. God does not provide the same protections for acts of sodomy. These acts can disrupt normal bodily functions and cause damage to bodily systems. There is also an element of danger involved in the act oral sex performed on women that can lead to death. It is not a protected act (in terms of the body's design) the way that sexual intercourse is. Union - Man and woman being joined together sexually become one flesh only occurs during sexual intercourse. Procreation - Children can only result during sexual intercourse.

We can see by its design, function, and purpose that sexual intercourse between a man and woman is a natural use of sex. All of these elements work together to provide a safe, enjoyable, and purposeful interaction. The same cannot be said for acts of sodomy.

It is uncleanness. Apart from the physical uncleanness of the act, there is also a spiritual component. Romans Chapter 1 describes man's degradation into reprobation. Man doesn't just wake up one day reprobate, but there are a series of steps man takes further and further into sin. The sin immediately preceding homosexuality is men and women dishonoring their bodies between themselves with uncleanness. The word for "dishonor" in that text is a derivative of the word "honorable" in the Hebrews 13:4 text about marriage. This refers to all heterosexual sexual sin (oral copulation, anal copulation, bestiality, etc.).

It is an "unnatural use". Romans 1:26 states, "For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature." The word "use" is the Greek word "chrēsis" which refers to use of the sexual parts of the woman. Note that there is a "natural" use and an "unnatural" use. What the women were doing with each other sexually was an unnatural use of that part of their bodies.

Similarly, we are told in Romans 1:27 that the acts performed between the men was likewise unnatural. "And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet." Romans 1:26-27 not only condemns the affections that draw men and women to the same gender (vile affections), it also condemns the acts that they performed as a result of these desires (against nature).

It formats the mind to be asexual. The act itself is not gender-specific. In an attempt to validate homosexuality as a norm, Jamake Highwater's book The Mythology of Transgression: Homosexuality as Metaphor states how the masculine and feminine depiction of Baal-Peor represents a bi-gender nature. He goes on to say, "During the worship of Baal-Peor, priests dressed as women and priestesses dressed as men." The transgender cross-dressing is entirely consistent with the asexual nature of the act. Since it can be performed by anyone who has a mouth, gender becomes irrelevant. It is an intentional blurring of the sexes. That makes participation in this act a critical step for Satan to use in preparing man's mind for the acceptance of homosexuality. This is discussed a little more in the post Turning the World Upside Down - Part 5.
God is able to give husbands and wives a fulfilling, exciting, and pleasurable intimate relationship because that is how He designed it to be. We sometimes forget that sex was God's gift to married people...and He knows what He is doing.

Full article can be found on Latter Days Blog 
http://thelatterdays.blogspot.com/2009/03/worship-of-baal-peor.html#more


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## LucieLoo12 (Feb 10, 2012)

Thank you. This thread was very informative and you broke it down very well! 

I know some wont receive it, but its truth here.


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## sidney (Feb 10, 2012)

Alicialynn86 said:


> Thank you. This thread was very informative and you broke it down very well!
> 
> I know some wont receive it, but its truth here.



This is all very interesting and I think its worthwhile to read up on it and use the word to see if it aligns with what is written here.  We have to stay studious.  I read this recently while studying the book of Acts: 
*
Acts 17:11
 Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.*

Basically the Thessalonian Jews rejected knowlegde and the "Way"(Acts 22:4) which was the way to Christ in the early christian church.  Neither the Thessalonian Jews or Barean Jews were familiar with this new "WAY" but the Thessalonians rejected it and hounded down those who preached it.  BUT, the Barean Jews were more noble...they searched the scriptures...and with eagerness to see if this were true!  

I know the truth bell has been ringing a lot and may seemingly be ringing too much, but I wanted to share WHY it's important to be open to the truth?  Because when you reject truth you reject God.  How is this so?  John 14:6 says, "I am the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE."  When we reject the way, the truth, and the life...we reject God.  Because he is all those things.  

In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God..and the word was made flesh and dwelt among us....John 1:1 *Let me pull back, I feel a praise coming on*

John got straight to the point in verse 1!  If we love him, we obey his commandments.  His first commandment is that we love him with all our hearts, minds, and souls.  I hope that none of these other "idols" come before him.  I have never heard of baal-poer...and I'm single lol, so this isn't a problem for me right now.  BUT, I will study and read up about this and see for myself if this is true.  I want to be like the Bareans!  I want to choose God and his word and not reject HIM!  God first, even before any pleasure.


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## LucieLoo12 (Feb 10, 2012)

I believe its lined up well. Scriptures were lined up in the right context. I dont see any error in this. If you do, please share


@sidney


Baal-poer is just another name of the false god Baal. Its plural form is Baalim.He was know for his perverted behavior.He is spoken of in the OT very often.


Numbers 25:1-9 Deuteronomy 4:3


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## LucieLoo12 (Feb 10, 2012)

How is this so?




sidney said:


> I* know the truth bell has been ringing a lot and may seemingly be ringing too much*, but I wanted to share WHY it's important to be open to the truth? .


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## sidney (Feb 10, 2012)

Alicialynn86 said:


> I believe its lined up well. Scriptures were lined up in the right context. I dont see any error in this. If you do, please share
> 
> 
> @sidney
> ...



I didn't see any error either, Alicia.  But I meant I wanted to study more and get the revelation for myself so that I can know for sure...as per the comment about the bareans...the searched the scriptures and with eagerness...  I just gave a cursory read to the whole thing.


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## sidney (Feb 10, 2012)

Alicialynn86 said:


> How is this so?



It is not!  The truth to be spoen in season and out of season,2:Timothy 4:2.  There is no fall line or winter line for God's word.  It's relevant yesterday, today, and tomorrow.  But it SEEMINGLY may be ringing to much for some.  Girl, we are on the same page, trust me!


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## Laela (Feb 10, 2012)

Thanks for posting this OP....


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## LucieLoo12 (Feb 10, 2012)

sidney


Oh yes girl I know we on the same page . I just gave you the information and scripture on Baal-peor because you said you had never heard of it. and I thought maybe some scriptures reference would help you out some.

I just didnt understand when you said it was ringing too much for some. I was trying to get a better understanding. 



sidney said:


> It is not! The truth to be spoen in season and out of season,2:Timothy 4:2. There is no fall line or winter line for God's word. It's relevant yesterday, today, and tomorrow. But it SEEMINGLY may be ringing to much for some. Girl, we are on the same page, trust me!


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

This is interesting.  I always thought sodomy was defined differently (i.e., unwanted anal or oral copulation).  Thank you for sharing.  I'll read up on this some more.

I wonder if various "worldly" sexual positions should not be brought into the marriage, though the bible doesn't specifically say so.  Some things to ponder.


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## Shimmie (Feb 10, 2012)

Thank you for posting this.   

You've just revealed the name of the spirit behind homosexuality...

Baal Peor... 

'We' (in Christ -- being taught of the Holy Spirit) have always known there was a 'spirit' behind this lifestyle.  I mean who without a demonic spiritual influence would behave in the total opposite of their gender, or a gender which they've created in between, i.e. transgender? 

I need to emphasize that I am not calling an indiviudal who is living a gay lifestyle, demonic.     It is the spiritual influence of this behaviour that is. 

 This spirit is bringing gay people out in groves.  It reminds me of those madi grai parades where all demonic activity is exposed and is paraded through the town with no shame or conviction whatsoever.  

I'm not saying anymore, not now.   

Alicialynn86 and sidney ....  take the wheel.   I'm serious.  Take the wheel.   The Lord uses the two of you to keep me 'still' for a minute in certain topics.     So, take the wheel.


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## Shimmie (Feb 10, 2012)

loolalooh said:


> This is interesting.  I always thought sodomy was defined differently (i.e., unwanted anal or oral copulation).  Thank you for sharing.  I'll read up on this some more.
> 
> I wonder if various "worldly" sexual positions should not be brought into the marriage, though the bible doesn't specifically say so.  Some things to ponder.



That's a good question regarding positions.  In 'normal' sex, there has to be some adjustments in weight distribution, etc.     Also, if a woman is trying to conceive she sometimes needs to be elevated at a 90 degree angle in order for her husband's 'seed' to flow upwards; they are still facing each other.     

I would think that the Karma Sutra positions would definitely be quite questionable.


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## Laela (Feb 10, 2012)

I remember years ago reading the Karma Sutra ... based on the design of man/woman, in some positions, the parts weren't er, fitting right.  




loolalooh said:


> I wonder if various "worldly" sexual positions should not be brought into the marriage, though the bible doesn't specifically say so.  Some things to ponder.


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## Shimmie (Feb 10, 2012)

Laela said:


> I remember years ago reading the Karma Sutra ... based on the design of man/woman, in some positions, the parts weren't er, fitting right.



We posted this at the same time...


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Sarophina said:


> Hi Ladies,
> 
> I saw the current discussion on oral sex and I thought you guys may be interested in an article on the seriousness of this sin. May those who have ears to hear, hear
> 
> ...



I did some reading, and I think we have to be careful here.  The term "sodomy" in the story of Sodom may refer to the homosexual activities going on during that period.  The term "sodomy" today is more "gay" friendly to encompass both heterosexuals and homosexuals performing such activities.

I'll do some more reading, as I want to be certain whether a husband and wife can do such things.  For some reason, I feel more convicted that an act of doing doggy-style defiles the marriage bed but a husband caressing his wife's nether regions to prepare her for intercourse is not.

Thank you for starting this discussion.


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## Laela (Feb 10, 2012)

I see!  




Shimmie said:


> We posted this at the same time...


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## Shimmie (Feb 10, 2012)

loolalooh said:


> I did some reading, and I think we have to be careful here.  The term "sodomy" in the story of Sodom may refer to the homosexual activities going on during that period.  The term "sodomy" today is more "gay" friendly to encompass both heterosexuals and homosexuals performing such activities.
> 
> I'll do some more reading, as I want to be certain whether a husband and wife can do such things.  For some reason, I feel more convicted that an act of doing doggy-style defiles the marriage bed but a husband caressing his wife's nether regions to prepare her for intercourse is not.
> 
> Thank you for starting this discussion.



For a husband and wife to carress each other is actually necessary for preparation and penetration.   He just can't jump on the wagon and expect it go; the motor needs to be pre-heated / warmed up or she's not moving.   Carressing is necessary and Biblical as 'hinted' at in the Song of Solomon.     

Just don't touch the back door; there's 'mud tracks'.


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## Rainbow Dash (Feb 10, 2012)

Thanks for sharing. I* am really trying to understand how oral sex now becomes sodomy. Just because Webster dictionary states this, is this really what God's word is saying?*

Also, Solomon speaks of her breast, so should not a husband enjoy this part of his wife. 

_Proverbs 5:15-19) Drink water from your own well—share your love only with your wife. Why spill the water of your springs in public, having sex with just anyone? You should reserve it for yourselves. Don't share it with strangers. Let your wife be a fountain of blessing for you. Rejoice in the wife of your youth. She is a loving doe, a graceful deer. Let her breasts satisfy you always. May you always be captivated by her love._


Even the book of Leviticus, which mentions many Old Testament sex-related prohibitions and rules for the Israelites, never mentions it.

*Also, where in scripture does God say certain sexual positions in the marriage are sin?*

I am not being difficult, I just want to know. I will study more indepth.


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Okay, I just learned something new.  I thought fingering was a form of oral copulation.  Shows what I know.

Anyway, back to reading.


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Health&hair28 said:


> Thanks for sharing. I* am really trying to understand how oral sex now becomes sodomy. Just because Webster dictionary states this, is this really what God's word is saying?*
> 
> Also, Solomon speaks of her breast, so should not a husband enjoy this part of his wife.
> 
> ...



*Hopefully others chime in, but here are some of my understandings:*

What Solomon described is not oral sex.  Oral sex is the "the stimulation of the genitalia of a sex partner by the use of the mouth, tongue, teeth or throat."

God makes it clear in Genesis 19 (and other areas), that he is against such activities between those of the same gender.

*The term sodomy has been redefined over time. * It's current definition involves oral/anal sex amongst both heterosexuals and homosexual.  At one point, sodomy was simply defined as anal sex. http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/sodomy.  

*Here is where I'm unclear:*
Does the the Bible prohibit such activities amongst homosexuals only?  Even if it does, is it possible that heterosexuals have adopted a homosexual activity?


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## aribell (Feb 10, 2012)

Health&hair28 said:


> Thanks for sharing. I* am really trying to understand how oral sex now becomes sodomy. Just because Webster dictionary states this, is this really what God's word is saying?*



Sodomy refers also to the acts of the Baal temple prostitutes, which included oral sex.


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Health&hair28 said:


> *Also, where in scripture does God say certain sexual positions in the marriage are sin?*
> 
> I am not being difficult, I just want to know. I will study more indepth.



It doesn't mention it in scripture.  I was just wondering (maybe I'll start a different thread) if certain positions can defile the marriage bed.  Some of the positions I've seen in books/online make wonder "Would God approve?"

I don't want to derail this thread, though.


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## Rainbow Dash (Feb 10, 2012)

loolalooh said:


> It doesn't mention it in scripture. I was just wondering (maybe I'll start a different thread) if certain positions can defile the marriage bed. *Some of the positions I've seen in books/online make wonder "Would God approve?"*
> 
> I don't want to derail this thread, though.


 

 at the bolded. 

I may need to stay out of that thread. My husband will be back soon and we plan on having lots of fun.


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Feb 10, 2012)

@loolalooh mmhhh this could be very interesting and informative...the wheels are turning as I read your post...

I think Shimmie mentioned something about Karma Sutra different positions particulary if you are trying to have a baby...

This is what came to me:

Are we going to end up sinning and displeasing God by;

Gratifying ourselves round and round meaning through the act/position and the possibility that the position can increase my chances of getting pregnant (oh Lord my mind is flooded) 

OR

Are we (my husband and I) gonna make our petition and request known by telling God we want a child and trust and wait on him to get us pregnant...(we will still be having sex of course, though HE is able to get me pregnant with my husbands sperm without us having sex)... 

these folk also came to mind ....Sarah Abraham and Hagar ....


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## Rainbow Dash (Feb 10, 2012)

I know Im derailing this thread but....

What sexual position between husband and wife displeases God? I just don't see how. 

*Sex is to be enjoyed between a husband and wife.* *We have to be careful that we do not get legalistic. *


*Proverbs 5:18-19 *
May your fountain be blessed, and may you rejoice in the wife of your youth. 
A loving doe, a graceful deer-- may her breasts satisfy you always, may you ever be captivated by her love.

_(1 Corinthians 7:2-5) But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband. *The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife.* D*o not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. *_​​


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Feb 10, 2012)

I don't know cause I'm not married ..

but what I trying to say/ask here is suppose that there are 'positions' that displease God but we are not thinking that they would because we use the 'undefiling of the mariage bed' as if the marriage bed can sanctify an act (meaning make that which may be wrong right) Kwim?

and 

knowing that my body does not belong to me alone does not mean that I should be made to perform an act that I may not be comfortable with ...

Sincerely I'm curious ...


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Health&hair28 said:


> I know Im derailing this thread but....
> 
> What sexual position between husband and wife displeases God? I just don't see how.
> 
> ...



We were pointed to the same Scripture just now.  I just finished looking at Corinthians, and it actually makes me more comfortable about "sex for pleasure" within a marriage.  Prior to seeing Corinthians, two positions that came to mind (sorry for being so graphic) were: 1) wife bending over touching her toes while husband is in the back erplexed, and 2) wife up in the air against the wall while facing husband.


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> I don't know cause I'm not married ..
> 
> but what I trying to say/ask here is suppose that there are 'positions' that displease God but we are not thinking that they would because we use the 'undefiling of the mariage bed' as if the marriage bed can sanctify an act (meaning make that which may be wrong right) Kwim?
> 
> ...



These are good questions.  I look to 1 Corinthians 7 (quoted by Health&Hair) and view it as saying it's "okay" to do such things in the confines of a marriage. I feel like I need to digest it a little more, but that's where my thoughts are leaning: "Sexual pleasure within a marriage is okay."  I'll answer part II in a second.


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> and
> 
> knowing that my body does not belong to me alone does not mean that I should be made to perform an act that I may not be comfortable with ...
> 
> Sincerely I'm curious ...



Edited: did more reading.


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Feb 10, 2012)

I understand what you're staying though I'm not in complete agreement...I won't be withholding myself from my husband trust me, lol but if I am not comfortable with something I will not be doing it...


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## Rainbow Dash (Feb 10, 2012)

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> I understand what you're staying though I'm not in complete agreement...I won't be withholding myself from my husband trust me, lol but if I am not comfortable with something I will not be doing it...


 

Your husband should respect what you are not comfortable with. If he is a man after God he will respect that.


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Feb 10, 2012)

yes yes exactly ...I do agree (and think someone else eluded to this) that this sex (as well as other thing) should be prayed about and discussed thoroughly prior to marriage ..

I once heard a guy said that his wife didn't believe in fellatio and how does she expect him to survive without that, eventually they got divorced I'm hoping for many more reasons that that ...it's sad really that they couldn't work it out I hate to see marriages fail meanwhile the devil is off somewhere grinning cause he destroyed another family...prolly destroying another family..


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Feb 10, 2012)

ladies @loolalooh and @Health&hair28 


I just want to thank you both for being civil and respectful...I'm really enjoying this discussion in both threads and learning much...


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## Rainbow Dash (Feb 10, 2012)

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> yes yes exactly ...I do agree (and think someone else eluded to this) that this sex (as well as other thing) should be prayed about and discussed thoroughly prior to marriage ..
> 
> I once heard a guy said that his wife didn't believe in fellatio and how does she expect him to survive without that, eventually they got divorced I'm hoping for many more reasons that that ...it's sad really that they couldn't work it out I hate to see marriages fail meanwhile the devil is off somewhere grinning cause he destroyed another family...prolly destroying another family..


 

Sad, he was being selfish. These things should be discussed before marriage. Also, I think that Paul in Corinthians, is saying, do not withhold sex from one another. Most men get  when the wife withholds and women too, if that's the case lol


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## loolalooh (Feb 10, 2012)

Iwanthealthyhair67 said:


> yes yes exactly ...I do agree (and think someone else eluded to this) that this sex (as well as other thing) should be prayed about and discussed thoroughly prior to marriage ..
> 
> I once heard a guy said that his wife didn't believe in fellatio and how does she expect him to survive without that, eventually they got divorced I'm hoping for many more reasons that that ...it's sad really that they couldn't work it out I hate to see marriages fail meanwhile the devil is off somewhere grinning cause he destroyed another family...prolly destroying another family..





Health&hair28 said:


> Sad, he was being selfish. These things should be discussed before marriage. Also, I think that Paul in Corinthians, is saying, do not withhold sex from one another. Most men get  when the wife withholds and women too, if that's the case lol



I agree with you, ladies.  Apparently Paul was talking about "sexual relations", which I missed in Health&Hair's post: 

1 Corinthians 7:5 - _*Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time*, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer._

Thanks for the discussion, ladies.


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## Iwanthealthyhair67 (Feb 10, 2012)

@loolalooh and Health&hair28

I have a question about spilling the seed (not as it pertains to contraception) that I would like to pose @Shimmie your thoughts are welcomed...

right now I'm heading home and have a massive migrain I might come back tonight or maybe tomorrow.


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## Sarophina (Feb 10, 2012)

I've really enjoyed reading everyone's responses 

I agree, regular penetrative sex isn't wrong in marriage. It's God's gift. Both couples are meant to go all out and enjoy each other. The man cuts a covenant with his wife's body their wedding night. It's a beautiful act of worship to God.


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