# The Church And Social Justice



## sheanu (May 31, 2020)

Hi ladies. In light of everything that's going on, I wanted to poll to see how other churches are dealing with issues of social inequity/injustice. Are your pastors speaking to the grief and rage that's gripped our nation? Are they calling for prayer vigils? Or petitions? Or funds/food drives to help families affected by COVID? Please participate by answering the poll; saying what your church is doing, if anything; and how you feel about what your church is/isn't doing. Also, please indicate the demographic makeup of both your Pastor and congregation. Thanks. The point of this is not to be divisive but I'm just curious about something.


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## Maracujá (May 31, 2020)

sheanu said:


> Hi ladies. In light of everything that's going on, I wanted to poll to see how other churches are dealing with issues of social inequity/injustice. Are your pastors speaking to the grief and rage that's gripped our nation? Are they calling for prayer vigils? Or petitions? Or funds/food drives to help families affected by COVID? Please participate by answering the poll; saying what your church is doing, if anything; and how you feel about what your church is/isn't doing. Also, please indicate the demographic makeup of both your Pastor and congregation. Thanks. The point of this is not to be divisive but I'm just curious about something.



Double post.


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## sheanu (May 31, 2020)

Maracujá said:


> Double post.


Hi! I only see your post saying "double post". I intend to come in and add my own reply but dealing with prepping lunch and feeding the baby now.


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## Maracujá (May 31, 2020)

sheanu said:


> Hi ladies. In light of everything that's going on, I wanted to poll to see how other churches are dealing with issues of social inequity/injustice. Are your pastors speaking to the grief and rage that's gripped our nation? Are they calling for prayer vigils? Or petitions? Or funds/food drives to help families affected by COVID? Please participate by answering the poll; saying what your church is doing, if anything; and how you feel about what your church is/isn't doing. Also, please indicate the demographic makeup of both your Pastor and congregation. Thanks. The point of this is not to be divisive but I'm just curious about something.



The church is doing the same thing it did, when Jesus was about to be crucified. Which is normal: the Bible said that a man who teaches The Word, has to receive money. Yet Jesus also said that He never had anywhere to lay His head. Go figure.

If one wants to start something, start alone. JMHO


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## sheanu (May 31, 2020)

So my pastor didn't speak on it this morning. I was fairly disappointed as I feel this would be a good opportunity for the Church to respond to what's going on in a real way. Our pastor is a white man speaking to a multicultural and multi racial church of mostly black people and i know he knows we're hurting as a community. There's a lot more to the story and how my church got here but I just need hope that there are other churches out there engaging society and providing guidance to their congregations on how to have their anger and grief in a real way. 

Generally speaking when things in our society occur that just don't seem right, I feel like the Church is silent as we don't seem to have a presence and platform on addressing social issues like police brutality, corporate greed leading to wealth inequality, or people being bankrupted by medical costs instead of nationalizing healthcare. In reality it could just be that MY church just doesn't address these things. 

This could be because as Christians our only response is to pray and move on if it doesn't really affect us. Or it could be because we feel that the church shouldn't have a say in this stuff. But if it's either of those I feel maybe there's an issue with how we're practically approaching loving our neighbors. 

All that being said, these are just musings and not meant to cause discord or anything. I'm really just wondering if I'm alone in thinking the Church should have something to say about all this. I think we could think of a better approach to airing our grievances if we worked together prayerfully to seek some sort of reform.


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## blessedandfavoured (May 31, 2020)

sheanu said:


> So my pastor didn't speak on it this morning. I was fairly disappointed as I feel this would be a good opportunity for the Church to respond to what's going on in a real way. Our pastor is a white man speaking to a multicultural and multi racial church of mostly black people and i know he knows we're hurting as a community. There's a lot more to the story and how my church got here but I just need hope that there are other churches out there engaging society and providing guidance to their congregations on how to have their anger and grief in a real way.
> 
> Generally speaking when things in our society occur that just don't seem right, I feel like the Church is silent as we don't seem to have a presence and platform on addressing social issues like police brutality, corporate greed leading to wealth inequality, or people being bankrupted by medical costs instead of nationalizing healthcare. In reality it could just be that MY church just doesn't address these things.
> 
> ...



You're not alone.
I think there's been this false idea that Christians aren't supposed to speak on 'world' matters, but Jesus said occupy till I come.  He said we should pray that God's Kingdom should come and His will should be done on earth _as it is in Heaven_.  There is no racism in Heaven.  The whole idea of 'race' is man-made (Acts 17:24-28).

We're still in lockdown where I am, and the church's stream isn't live.  The current situation wasn't mentioned but I don't know how far in advance they film.  It's a multicultural church with white preachers.  I expect that the lead pastor (who hasn't been here long, so don't know about his reaction to previous similar murders) has been grieved by this situation, just from the way he speaks about Christ and people, regardless of skin colour.  That said, I don't expect him to mention it next week, but who knows?

I have seen several white pastors and speakers talk about this on social media (see below), so at least some are paying attention and allowing God to touch their hearts.  Whether words will turn to action is something we need to pray about.  I saw a livestream in which the (white female) preacher said we should physically stamp our feet on the 'head of racism' as a prophetic sign that we want God to destroy it.

Some social media posts:


Spoiler











My focus in this post is on white Christians because, in my opinion, they're the ones with the most resources and influence (humanly speaking).  To whom much is given, from him much is required (Luke 12:48).  Also, through the blood of Christ we are all family.  Not to mention that white people created white supremacy, so it makes sense that they would be instrumental in its destruction.  But the world can't defeat racism without the church - they don't have that power, but through the Holy Spirit, we do.  The church can't defeat racism without unity.  God commands the blessing where there is unity (Psalm 133), as seen on Pentecost (today!) when the Lord poured out the Holy Spirit (Acts 2:1-4).  If we're divided or white people have their heads in the sand, this fight will take longer than it needs to.

I think we really need to pray for God to bring about change, and ask Him what part He wants us to play, and how we need to go about it.  We need God's grace to forgive, and we NEED to cry out for justice.   Above all else, we need prayer - we wrestle not against flesh and blood but against demonic forces.  Like they said in The Hunger Games, remember who the real enemy is.  I pray God has mercy on us all.

ETA: They are doing things regarding COVID-19 - supporting food banks, women's shelter, encouraging us to give to charities.  Yeah, the pastor is very interested in helping the poor and he keeps telling us that we're dying and we need to make our lives count for eternity by knowing Christ and living for Him.


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## Brwnbeauti (May 31, 2020)

Don’t have a church but if they could speak out on gay marriage, they shouldn’t get shy now. Can’t tell you how many times I heard “God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve” from ~ 2004-2008 while visiting churches during college.


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## sheanu (May 31, 2020)

blessedandfavoured said:


> You're not alone.
> I think there's been this false idea that Christians aren't supposed to speak on 'world' matters, but Jesus said occupy till I come.  He said we should pray that God's Kingdom should come and His will should be done on earth _as it is in Heaven_.  There is no racism in Heaven.  The whole idea of 'race' is man-made (Acts 17:24-28).
> 
> We're still in lockdown where I am, and the church's stream isn't live.  The current situation wasn't mentioned but I don't know how far in advance they film.  It's a multicultural church with white preachers.  I expect that the lead pastor (who hasn't been here long, so don't know about his reaction to previous similar murders) has been grieved by this situation, just from the way he speaks about Christ and people, regardless of skin colour.  That said, I don't expect him to mention it next week, but who knows?
> ...


Thanks girl. Your post definitely gave me some hope.  It's nice to see white folks finally being like "okay enough of this mess".


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## sheanu (May 31, 2020)

Brwnbeauti said:


> Don’t have a church but if they could speak out on gay marriage, they shouldn’t get shy now. Can’t tell you how many times I heard “God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve” from ~ 2004-2008 while visiting churches during college.


My hubby and I were just saying today that before the church can effectively speak to this, we have to revisit the way we approached homosexuality. I don't think Scripture leaves a ton of leeway on the issue itself but how we practically apply the Bible to relationships today and how we welcome everyone in the church is something we need to have some discussions on because I feel we went wrong somewhere. 

Do you have any thoughts? Even if it's just "folks need to mind their own business" i would like to hear what others have to say about how we could bridge the gap in live between the church and the gay community. Not to detract from the original discussion but I just can't see unity happening without addressing that issue.


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## Brwnbeauti (May 31, 2020)

sheanu said:


> My hubby and I were just saying today that before the church can effectively speak to this, we have to revisit the way we approached homosexuality. I don't think Scripture leaves a ton of leeway on the issue itself but how we practically apply the Bible to relationships today and how we welcome everyone in the church is something we need to have some discussions on because I feel we went wrong somewhere.
> 
> Do you have any thoughts? Even if it's just "folks need to mind their own business" i would like to hear what others have to say about h*ow we could bridge the gap in live between the church and the gay community*. Not to detract from the original discussion but I just can't see unity happening without addressing that issue.


I don’t know. Honestly isn’t something I give much thought to because I’m not knowledgeable enough on the topic from a biblical perspective.
I do think the church should bold speak to social issues that way it did/does homosexuality since the Bible is very clear on racism, classism, etc.


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## sheanu (May 31, 2020)

Brwnbeauti said:


> I don’t know. Honestly isn’t something I give much thought to because I’m not knowledgeable enough on the topic from a biblical perspective.
> I do think the church should bold speak to social issues that way it did/does homosexuality since the Bible is very clear on racism, classism, etc.


Thanks for sharing! I agree.


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## Maracujá (Jun 1, 2020)

Dr. Myles Monroe once spoke about this, saying that Nelson Mandela stood alone when he went to jail...The Body of Christ did nothing. If you read Scripture carefully, there's never any talk of a body of people actually doing something. That's why they speak of individuals (Mary mother of Christ, Mary of Magdala, Martha, Apostle Paul,...etc.). 

Remember when Jesus healed the 10 and...only one came back to thank Him? Don't believe for a second that because you hear people shouting 'amen' in unison, that we're all after the same thing. Some are after marriage, children, homes, cars, green card, food and what have you. The Bible says that if any of you two agree upon anything...it shall be done according to His will. Yet nothing ever really changes. Is God's word a lie? No. People are simply not agreeing. 

Small example: I remember living with my two sisters and my mom in a two-bedroom apartment. All of us were bringing in a joint income of at least €3000.00/month. Yet because we were on such discord, we never agreed on who should pay rent (which was around €700.00 - €800.00/month), how we should furnish the place, who should pay the utilities and so on. Basically, we lived there for 3 years and never got to the point we wanted because there was so much di-vision.


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## sheanu (Jun 1, 2020)

Maracujá said:


> Dr. Myles Monroe once spoke about this, saying that Nelson Mandela stood alone when he went to jail...The Body of Christ did nothing. If you read Scripture carefully, there's never any talk of a body of people actually doing something. That's why they speak of individuals (Mary mother of Christ, Mary of Magdala, Martha, Apostle Paul,...etc.).
> 
> Remember when Jesus healed the 10 and...only one came back to thank Him? Don't believe for a second that because you hear people shouting 'amen' in unison, that we're all after the same thing. Some are after marriage, children, homes, cars, green card, food and what have you. The Bible says that if any of you two agree upon anything...it shall be done according to His will. Yet nothing ever really changes. Is God's word a lie? No. People are simply not agreeing.
> 
> Small example: I remember living with my two sisters and my mom in a two-bedroom apartment. All of us were bringing in a joint income of at least €3000.00/month. Yet because we were on such discord, we never agreed on who should pay rent (which was around €700.00 - €800.00/month), how we should furnish the place, who should pay the utilities and so on. Basically, we lived there for 3 years and never got to the point we wanted because there was so much di-vision.


Agreed. But I don't think we can all claim to be the Body and not have some kind of common ground. Do you think prayerful and thoughtful communication can change things? We're no longer legally segregated so I think we can. I have hope. The post above gives me hope. The conversations I'm having with friends gives me hope that many of us are receiving a word that we are to do more.


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## Maracujá (Jun 1, 2020)

Jesus did not preach to attract people, He did so...to eliminate people. Again, make sure the people you are engaging with also want that 'more' and are willing to p(r)ay the price for it. The road is narrow as Scripture goes.


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## sheanu (Jun 1, 2020)

Maracujá said:


> Jesus did not preach to attract people, He did so...to eliminate people. Again, make sure the people you are engaging with also want that 'more' and are willing to p(r)ay the price for it. The road is narrow as Scripture goes.
> 
> View attachment 459915


Thanks for the reminder.


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## blessedandfavoured (Jun 1, 2020)

sheanu said:


> My hubby and I were just saying today that before the church can effectively speak to this, we have to revisit the way we approached homosexuality. I don't think Scripture leaves a ton of leeway on the issue itself but how we practically apply the Bible to relationships today and how we welcome everyone in the church is something we need to have some discussions on because I feel we went wrong somewhere.
> 
> Do you have any thoughts? Even if it's just "folks need to mind their own business" i would like to hear what others have to say about* how we could bridge the gap in live between the church and the gay community*. Not to detract from the original discussion but I just can't see unity happening without addressing that issue.



I think that first up, the True Church needs to repent of and reject idolatry, compromise and hypocrisy.  You can't shout about God said marriage is one man and one woman for life when pastors are impregnating random parishioners and folks are turning a blind eye to Christians who are fornicating, cohabiting, etc.  It doesn't work like that.  Jesus died to* save *us from sin.  His blood paid the price for ALL sin.  We don't get to define sin - He does.  We need to go back to the Bible, see God's definition of sin, agree with it and humble ourselves under Him.  We need to clean the house out and ask God to forgive us for misrepresenting Him.  God's desire is to save *everyone*, though we know not everyone will agree to be saved.  The Church, after repenting, needs to lean on the Holy Spirit for guidance and direction, and speak the truth boldly, but in love.  The Lord will lead all who are willing and humble enough to follow Him.  



Maracujá said:


> Dr. Myles Monroe once spoke about this, saying that Nelson Mandela stood alone when he went to jail...The Body of Christ did nothing. If you read Scripture carefully, there's never any talk of a body of people actually doing something. That's why they speak of individuals (Mary mother of Christ, Mary of Magdala, Martha, Apostle Paul,...etc.).
> 
> Remember when Jesus healed the 10 and...only one came back to thank Him? Don't believe for a second that because you hear people shouting 'amen' in unison, that we're all after the same thing. Some are after marriage, children, homes, cars, green card, food and what have you. The Bible says that if any of you two agree upon anything...it shall be done according to His will. Yet nothing ever really changes. Is God's word a lie? No. People are simply not agreeing.
> 
> Small example: I remember living with my two sisters and my mom in a two-bedroom apartment. All of us were bringing in a joint income of at least €3000.00/month. Yet because we were on such discord, we never agreed on who should pay rent (which was around €700.00 - €800.00/month), how we should furnish the place, who should pay the utilities and so on. Basically, we lived there for 3 years and never got to the point we wanted because there was so much di-vision.



Sis, I completely understand your point but you sound defeated/jaded.  Please don't be - Jesus has already won the victory.  He has people of every tribe who are His and His Spirit is moving.  Take a break from the news and sit with Him.  He's working behind the scenes, and He doesn't need a million people to do something great.  Like with Gideon, who went into battle with 300 men, God just need those who are willing and obedient.  He will do the rest.  The devil is trying to bring discouragement and foster (more?) disunity to hinder God's blessing.  Don't fall for it.  We can't let bitterness or hatred take root in our hearts.  Our hearts are for Christ's dwelling.  Please cast your cares on Him.  He loves you so much and wants to hear your concerns.  I pray that Jehovah Shalom will pour His peace into your heart.  Be still and know that He is God.  

God bless us all.


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## sheanu (Jun 1, 2020)

blessedandfavoured said:


> I think that first up, the True Church needs to repent of and reject idolatry, compromise and hypocrisy.  You can't shout about God said marriage is one man and one woman for life when pastors are impregnating random parishioners and folks are turning a blind eye to Christians who are fornicating, cohabiting, etc.  It doesn't work like that.  Jesus died to* save *us from sin.  His blood paid the price for ALL sin.  We don't get to define sin - He does.  We need to go back to the Bible, see God's definition of sin, agree with it and humble ourselves under Him.  We need to clean the house out and ask God to forgive us for misrepresenting Him.  God's desire is to save *everyone*, though we know not everyone will agree to be saved.  The Church, after repenting, needs to lean on the Holy Spirit for guidance and direction, and speak the truth boldly, but in love.  The Lord will lead all who are willing and humble enough to follow Him.
> God bless us all.



Agreed. I feel that the second the Church tries to speak to the killing of unarmed black men, people who've experienced church hurt will hold us accountable for the things you mentioned above. I think a fear of that is part of why we've been silent on things before. We have our own skeletons in our closet. I don't think we can really be effective in America unless we humble ourselves, confess, and apologize for at least the recent wrongs.


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## newgrowth15 (Jun 13, 2020)

Something I saw on YouTube yesterday.


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## Shimmie (Jun 13, 2020)

newgrowth15 said:


> Something I saw on YouTube yesterday.


My question to most of these Pastors is:   'Why now?"   Why express your sorrow about racism now?   Black members have been up in your 'face', in your churches for decades.   And now you're sorry about racism?  And now you speak about the murdering of unarmed Black men / women?    Black lynchings have been going on forever, and NOW you're sorry?    

Okay...


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## blessedandfavoured (Jun 13, 2020)

Shimmie said:


> My question to most of these Pastors is:   'Why now?"   Why express your sorrow about racism now?   Black members have been up in your 'face', in your churches for decades.   And now you're sorry about racism?  And now you speak about the murdering of unarmed Black men / women?    Black lynchings have been going on forever, and NOW you're sorry?
> 
> Okay...


I've not watched the video, but all I hope is that the Holy Spirit is bringing conviction and the fear of God into people's hearts.  I hope this is God doing a new thing in His House.


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## Queenie (Jun 13, 2020)

My church is mostly white, I'd say 60%. The senior pastor is white and he spoken about it multiple times in the last month. Things like what needs to be done by the non-blacks, mostly listening and having conversations with black people about what we've experienced, and apologized chocking back the tears. The church also runs feeding centers for COVID-19, which feeds 50% of those getting free meals in the city. We also resettle about half of the refugees in Washington, DC. I know a big reason for the boldness is because the median age of the church is 28, so people are not set in their ways.
This was sent by my campus pastor a couple of weeks ago, who is a 1st generation Chinese woman. 

_Family, 

As we stand together against racism in all its forms, our heart is for complete unity at National Community Church. We will continue to be ambassadors of reconciliation because that is our only hope—in Christ alone. Our posture is one of humility and gentleness as we learn from each other. 

Because we are from many backgrounds, we will experience this season differently, but no matter what, we must stand together.

If you don’t know what to pray: Pray the scriptures.
Cry to God - Psalm 13, 44
Prayer of Anger - Psalm 79
Affliction - Psalm 25
Trust in God - Psalms 4 and 85 
Peace - Psalm 119

10 Days of Prayer: 
Last week, Pastor Mark called us to 10 days of prayer for breakthrough. Hundreds of NCCers have joined each morning at 7:14am. Please join us there at ncc.re/upperzoom.
Some will be moved to protest. We pray you do so as a peacemaker. 

*For our black and brown brothers and sisters:*  As your church family, we pray into the pain, the unbearable grief, and the hope of healing through Jesus for our community and our country. We stand beside you. We lament and we repent. I believe our repentance will come through not just our words, but our actions in the months to come.

*For our "in-between” brothers and sisters (not black, and not white): *I recorded a 4 minute 41 second video sharing my thoughts on this earlier last week. If you aren’t on social media or have missed it, I wanted to share that HERE. Yes, we too have experienced racism and discrimination, but right now, it’s not about us. We have a privilege our black and brown brothers and sisters don’t have so I want to encourage you not only to use your voice to stand in the gap but to be Aaron right now in their exhaustion.

*For our white brothers & sisters:* Let's occupy this moment with deep soul searching. It is not enough to "feel bad" about what happened in the killing of George Floyd. Let us run deep into the discomfort and defenses to lay bare what exists in our nation, in our churches, in our own hearts. Many of you have asked me what you can do. Please allow me to share four points from Pastor Dave Schmidgall (NCC Lincoln Campus) listed out: _

_You're going to have to open yourself up to hard questions. You're going to have to do the work. James Baldwin says too often "we're trapped in a history we do not understand, and until we understand, we cannot be released from it.” Commit to entering a season of leaning in and learning. Books such as "White Awake" (if you're less aware) or "White Fragility", or "Woke Church". We will send further resources. _
_16 tips for White People. There are many things we can do to learn before going to our black friends to help solve our questions or end up caring for our own emotions. Use wisdom and discernment. We must allow our black brothers and sisters to say "I don't want to talk right now". Too often we don't do the work and expect those who are most in pain to fix our pain. _
_Watch "The Ache" and "Awakening" by Bittersweet Creative. We must listen in this season in the Wilderness (as we have been in the Pandemic) to borrow the right biblical metaphors for where we are at. We're in the wilderness right now and the Bible has much to say about this. _
_Join a "Be the Bridge" small group to further engage. Choose solidarity. (More info on this below)_
_ 
As a church family, we commit to entering a season of leaning in and learning. Let me remind you of the four practices of peacemaking we learned during last year’s Peacemakers series: Ask Anything. Listen Well. Disagree Freely. Love Regardless. _
As we walk this road together, I invite you to visit ncc.re/reconcile. There you will find resources and groups designed to equip each of us as we grow in reconciliation and the fight against racism. Check back often; the list will continue to grow.

I’ve received emails and texts from many of you inquiring about a group/space where we can lean in together in learning and listening. I apologize for how long it’s taken to respond, but I wanted to make sure it would be a forum that would actually help and one that will last and with proper support. We are planning on hosting a *Be The Bridge* online group (that will break into smaller groups within that group time). The goal is to start at the end of June. Stay tuned for more info to come soon… but if you’d like to get started, please purchase Be The Bridge now. It’s currently sold out, but you can get the Kindle version to get started.


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## Queenie (Jun 13, 2020)

Follow-up to what I posted above. My employer had sent us a similar type of response, but they are a totally secular organization.


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## Shimmie (Jun 13, 2020)

Queenie said:


> Follow-up to what I posted above. My employer had sent us a similar type of response, but they are a totally secular organization.


Your campus Pastor spoke the Truth when she said:  “It’s not enough to feel bad...”

Why did it take so long for so many to finally speak up.   Brutality against Blacks didn’t start with George Floyd. 

It’s not enough to feel bad...now.


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## Shimmie (Jun 13, 2020)

blessedandfavoured said:


> I've not watched the video, but all I hope is that the Holy Spirit is bringing conviction and the fear of God into people's hearts.  I hope this is God doing a new thing in His House.


Hi @blessedandfavoured 

it’s not just those in this video that I question.  It’s “all” of them, all over the news, etc. who know how long the Blood of Black people has been shed and crying from the earth for justice, and now it’s just being heard.


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## Queenie (Jun 13, 2020)

Shimmie said:


> Your campus Pastor spoke the Truth when she said:  “It’s not enough to feel bad...”
> 
> Why did it take so long for so many to finally speak up.   Brutality against Blacks didn’t start with George Floyd.
> 
> It’s not enough to feel bad...now.



In the message that she sent this week, she said that she didn't realize how much we've been going through. 
From what I've seen with white people I know, they also have no idea what are dealing on a daily basis.


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## Shimmie (Jun 13, 2020)

Queenie said:


> In the message that she sent this week, she said that she didn't realize how much we've been going through.
> From what I've seen with white people I know, they also have no idea what are dealing on a daily basis.


Thanks @Queenie ....You've always had  a gentle and loving heart.

My question is how could they not have known?  The sufferings of the Black community have always headlined the news.    I just want these people to be upfront, stop acting as if they didn't know.  They just didn't see it as a priority.   

Black oppression isn't the New Kid on the block.    It's the neighbor that everyone ignored, because it meant a commitment to get involved and to do more than talk about it.


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## sheanu (Jun 13, 2020)

Queenie said:


> In the message that she sent this week, she said that she didn't realize how much we've been going through.
> From what I've seen with white people I know, they also have no idea what are dealing on a daily basis.


Yeah i think they must have thought we were exaggerating all this time. 

I would really prefer a pastor to address it late rather than never. Our pastor hasn't really spoken on it and definitely not in the pulpit or in a Sunday. He says he "doesn't want to use the pulpit for that." I'm really just disappointed. Please pray for my family for wisdom. I'm trying to give my husband space to lead on whether (in my mind when)  to find another church home. This is by no means the only reason why but I think it says a lot about our pastor's ability to lead a multicultural church that he doesn't see it as a heart issue worth addressing. There was tension in the church in the past with some members expressing racist sentiments and i feel like this is a good opportunity for our new head pastor to address that. He's been in leadership in the church for quite a while but only recently became the head pastor. I was hopeful he would be different but I guess birds of a feather flock together.


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## blessedandfavoured (Jun 14, 2020)

Shimmie said:


> Your campus Pastor spoke the Truth when she said:  “It’s not enough to feel bad...”
> 
> Why did it take so long for so many to finally speak up.   *Brutality against Blacks didn’t start with George Floyd. *
> 
> It’s not enough to feel bad...now.





Shimmie said:


> Hi @blessedandfavoured
> 
> it’s not just those in this video that I question. * It’s “all” of them, all over the news, etc. who know how long the Blood of Black people has been shed and crying from the earth for justice, and now it’s just being heard.*



Honestly, @Shimmie, I've wondered about this too.  I've really wondered.  It might be because due to the pandemic, there's been nothing to do - not many people working, little entertainment, few distractions.  Even the news has been 'boring.'  Whites (Christian and unbelieving) have nothing else to look at.  It might just be the 'right' time, spiritually speaking.  I pray that our cries have finally reached the ears of our Father, and that He's pouring out His Spirit to bring humility and conviction and JUSTICE. 

The Sunday after my first post, my pastor's entire pre-recorded sermon was bout George Floyd's murder (I'm in the UK where it's nowhere near as bad as the US) and about how whites need to take this seriously, how it's not God's will, how we are one in Christ, white people need to listen to us and take a stand.  We then had a zoom meeting where they asked how the church could better serve blacks.  My pastor is young-ish (40s) so I think that has something to do with it.  I think part of this global reaction is generational.  I was impressed by the level of humility, especially since a friend's church just said 'it's a shame, all we need to do is preach the gospel' and the pastor was a black American! 

It should have happened decades ago, but hopefully things will progress now, with the Church at the forefront.  Had my pastor not spoken about it, I'd be fervently praying about which church to go to next, lol.  God have mercy on us.

ETA:  It's not enough to feel bad.  I think another reason it's taken this long is that most Western churches are lazy and complacent, and God isn't at the centre.  So rather than seeing, say Michael Brown's murder and getting up in arms, and asking Jesus what His perspective on it is, they just shrug and go back to whatever it is that makes them feel good.  I'm not sure I've expressed that properly but I hope you get my meaning...


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## Shimmie (Jun 14, 2020)

blessedandfavoured said:


> Honestly, @Shimmie, I've wondered about this too.  I've really wondered.  It might be because due to the pandemic, there's been nothing to do - not many people working, little entertainment, few distractions.  Even the news has been 'boring.'  Whites (Christian and unbelieving) have nothing else to look at.  It might just be the 'right' time, spiritually speaking.  I pray that our cries have finally reached the ears of our Father, and that He's pouring out His Spirit to bring humility and conviction and JUSTICE.
> 
> The Sunday after my first post, my pastor's entire pre-recorded sermon was bout George Floyd's murder (I'm in the UK where it's nowhere near as bad as the US) and about how whites need to take this seriously, how it's not God's will, how we are one in Christ, white people need to listen to us and take a stand.  We then had a zoom meeting where they asked how the church could better serve blacks.  My pastor is young-ish (40s) so I think that has something to do with it.  I think part of this global reaction is generational.  I was impressed by the level of humility, especially since a friend's church just said 'it's a shame, all we need to do is preach the gospel' and the pastor was a black American!
> 
> ...


@blessedandfavoured 

Thank you, I sincerely mean this...Thank you.

What concerns me is why did it take “the world” to step up “First” to protest Black sufferings instead of the Church leaders who suddenly just joined in?     They could have stepped up long before this.   

Your last paragraph is a wonderful explanation and much better and more eloquent than mine.


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## sheanu (Jun 14, 2020)

blessedandfavoured said:


> Honestly, @Shimmie, I've wondered about this too.  I've really wondered.  It might be because due to the pandemic, there's been nothing to do - not many people working, little entertainment, few distractions.  Even the news has been 'boring.'  Whites (Christian and unbelieving) have nothing else to look at.  It might just be the 'right' time, spiritually speaking.  I pray that our cries have finally reached the ears of our Father, and that He's pouring out His Spirit to bring humility and conviction and JUSTICE.
> 
> The Sunday after my first post, my pastor's entire pre-recorded sermon was bout George Floyd's murder (I'm in the UK where it's nowhere near as bad as the US) and about how whites need to take this seriously, how it's not God's will, how we are one in Christ, white people need to listen to us and take a stand.  We then had a zoom meeting where they asked how the church could better serve blacks.  My pastor is young-ish (40s) so I think that has something to do with it.  I think part of this global reaction is generational.  I was impressed by the level of humility, especially since a friend's church just said 'it's a shame, all we need to do is preach the gospel' and the pastor was a black American!
> 
> ...



Totally agree with all of that.


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## Mitzi (Jun 14, 2020)

Please don't take this the wrong way as I am not saying I have an advantage to heaven over others but, I do know that God gifted me with something regarding prayer and that I see results (for others, I always have to wait for something for myself) when I pray for someone else's intentions.    To make it short, I had been praying for God to release us in ways to bring about justice for a LONG time and for something else which I won't divulge here but it's for our benefit as people and is related to OT  prophecy.  All of a sudden, the world is paying attention.  I thought it was because everyone is bored and has nothing else to do or that they are keen on joining bandwagons but from what I can see, it is sincere.  I am thoroughly shocked at this outpouring of concern for us.  Shocked!  God uses His own timing and sometimes, what others plan for evil, God uses for good.  He is revealing to me that these prayers (coupled with the same prayers from others He has prompted) are being answered.  I believe we are in a very special time.  Even as these changes have come, I am quasi incredulous.  I see it but I still don't quite believe it.  All I have is hope and faith.  He will protect us.  We are the apple of His eye.  

Please don't forget our brothers in Latin America, esp. in Brazil and Colombia.  There are some serious issues with police brutality against our Black people.  Pray for them as they are a part of us, too.


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## Queenie (Jun 14, 2020)

Well said. 

I listen to Perry Stone regularly, and one thing that the preaches on is that it takes 400 years for a country's "cup of inequity" to be full. It is based the Jews being in Egypt for 400 years before they could return to the Promised land. The sin of those nations who were in the land for those 400 years caused "their cup" to fill. 

He has been talking about it since 2007, which was 400 years since the settlement in Jamestown, Virginia. This year is 400 years since the Pilgrims settled in Massachusetts. I do believe, this time, the change for us is real.


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## mrselle (Jun 15, 2020)

I've been very disappointed in my pastor's response to the social injustices that have been going on and I can't decide what is more disheartening.  The fact that he used George Floyd's death to talk about the rate at which  black women have abortions, the fact that he, his adult daughter and his wife are "all lives matter" people or the fact that his adult daughter was silent about George Floyd, but vocal when people started rioting.  We belong to a multicultural church, but he is a black man, with a black wife and black, adult children.  His response to the congregation, in my opinion has been lukewarm.


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## gn1g (Jun 15, 2020)

Queenie said:


> Well said.
> 
> I listen to Perry Stone regularly, and one thing that the preaches on is that it takes 400 years for a country's "cup of inequity" to be full. It is based the Jews being in Egypt for 400 years before they could return to the Promised land. The sin of those nations who were in the land for those 400 years caused "their cup" to fill.
> 
> He has been talking about it since 2007, which was 400 years since the settlement in Jamestown, Virginia. This year is 400 years since the Pilgrims settled in Massachusetts. I do believe, this time, the change for us is real.



I sure hope you are right.  I am acutely watching Louisville!  Lord settle me down, I come unglued just thinking about the police walking around free with a pay check.

I too am praying, near the end of the 2019 Bishop Jakes brought a prophetic word in which he said God hears the cries of your brothers blood, the injustice that is done to AA men God will repay.  SELAH!


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## sheanu (Jun 16, 2020)

Ladies,  thanks so much for participating in this thread. Again, it's provided some much needed encouragement over the last couple of weeks. You all are a constant reminder to face all that's going on in our world today with a kingdom-focused mindset.


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## newgrowth15 (Jun 21, 2020)

There is a turn in the road ahead as long as we keep on the main road.


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## Maracujá (Jun 22, 2020)

For those questioning whether White people knew or not, remember when Jesus prayed: "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do?" Timothy Keller once said that whenever you feel bad about past sins, you ought to actually rejoice. Because that means that God is the one working in you. We as human beings, do not have the capacity to feel remorse on our own ('apart from Me, you can do nothing'). 

Those of us whose eyes are open, can see things clearly. Other people are literally sleepwalking. This is why it's important to tell people about God. It can be very simple things: my sister is moving out for the umpteenth time (she's a non-believer) and asked me about the SOCKERBIT boxes from Ikea. She said I have never seen them on their page. There are many things that God does for us on a daily basis, that we simply assume He's doing for everyone, because they are so simple. But my mother is the one who let me in on the secret: it's not the case. LHCF is a great example of that: there are some Black women, who have believed the lies of the enemy for so long, that they would be shocked to stumble on a site like this one; with so many intelligent, beautiful, well to do Black women.


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## Sharpened (Aug 6, 2020)

While some whites are humbling themselves (and may they be blessed of Yah), others have, to quote a phrase, "stiffened their necks." Their collective ego is the main sticking point; they HATE being wrong, HATE being told they are blind. Unfortunately, this means more judgment is coming in order to break that stiffness. *sigh*


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## sheanu (Aug 6, 2020)

Sharpened said:


> While some whites are humbling themselves (and may they be blessed of Yah), others have, to quote a phrase, "stiffened their necks." Their collective ego is the main sticking point; they HATE being wrong, HATE being told they are blind. Unfortunately, this means more judgment is coming in order to break that stiffness. *sigh*


I've noticed this too. It's tough to deal with.


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## Sharpened (Aug 6, 2020)

sheanu said:


> I've noticed this too. It's tough to deal with.


The only way to deal with it is one-on-one slamming them with facts, documentations, and make them draw conclusions. I tell them your guilt (or pity) is useless; we need action, no fear!


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