# Speaking in Tongues---Should every be able to do it?



## ZapMami (Dec 15, 2011)

*Speaking in Tongues---Should every1 be able to do it?*

I was raised baptist....and I remember being told that only certain people had the gift of speaking in tongues and some people have the gift of interpretation.

I now attend a non-denominational church which is a mega church in the DMV area that I really like but one thing is bothering me.....


Baptism by the Holy Spirit. 
They keep saying that speaking in tongues is evidence of the holy spirit.  That all Christians should pray in tongues  cause GOd understands it even when you don't.   Like for instance...have you ever went to pray and you just didn't know what to say but you know you needed God to step in, they would say this is the best time to pray in tongues because even when you don't know what to ask for the holy spirit does.  Does that make sense?

In fact when I got saved there part of the process is them praying for you, you accept Jesus as your savior and then they ask you to speak in tongues...they claim it should come naturally.  All the other people in the room who got saved and joined the church at the same time I did just started speaking in tongues when we got to that part.  I'm standing there waiting for these foreign words "the holy language" to start pouring from my mouth, but  nothing happened.  I standing there like WTF these people are faking they are just making noises.  I decided that I didn't want to go there anymore.  I stopped for a while cause it was bothering me so much, but I love the pastor, his style of teaching and I've learned so much.

I really like the church, the sermons are on point. But it bothers me that I can't speak in tongues and I feel like all these other members are faking it.  And then sometimes I think okay if they aren't faking do I not have a connection like they do with God.  Why can't this holy spirit thing fall on me?

How do you feel about speaking in tongues? What type of church do you attend and what have you learned about it?


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## lwilliams1922 (Dec 15, 2011)

Subscribing....
I was raised in church but still feel I missed that class.


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## chelseatiara (Dec 15, 2011)

Nope everyone is given different gifts

1 Corinthians 12

New International Version (NIV)

1 Corinthians 12
Concerning Spiritual Gifts
 1 Now about the gifts of the Spirit, brothers and sisters, I do not want you to be uninformed. 2 You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols. 3 Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

 4 There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit distributes them. 5 There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. 6 There are different kinds of working, but in all of them and in everyone it is the same God at work.

 7 Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. 8 *To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom, to another a message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[a] and to still another the interpretation of tongues. 11 All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he distributes them to each one, just as he determines. *


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## LucieLoo12 (Dec 15, 2011)

I speak in tongues and it is not just for certain christians...its for all who receive the Holy Ghost. All through the book of Acts EVERYONE that received the Holy Ghost spoke in tongues. People get confused with the unknown tongue and the gift of tongues. The  unknown tongue is our prayer language which no man can understand but God. The gift of tongues is the interpretation of tongues ,which everyone dont have. I will elaborate more with scripture .....i will be back ........

Sent from my VM670 using VM670


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## ZapMami (Dec 15, 2011)

Thanks Chelsea that makes me feel alot better. 



So do you think these people are faking it or they believe so much that everybody can do it that they just start making noises thinking thats what it is and that it's connecting them to GOD?  I mean it's so weird to me that no matter how hard I try to speak in tongues I can't do it.

I also notice that alot of them seem to be speaking a similar language.  I mean it sounds the same to me.   All some version of "OH Run Ta Shun a Bop to Lah! RRRah Bop to Shak"  I mean why all the rolling R's, tons of syllables and the extra emphasis on them.   Lol..I mean I'm laughing cause it's ridiculous to me.  It's like they hear someone else do it and go home and practice making similar sounds. 

I do believe some people can, but its so hard for me to believe that every one can do this.

I'm going to have to do some more research.

Thanks Alicia.  My church also refers to Acts a lot.  So am I a bad person if I don't speak in tongues and what type of church do you attend.  Do I have to speak in tongues to be saved?


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## chelseatiara (Dec 16, 2011)

ZapMami said:


> Thanks Chelsea that makes me feel alot better.
> 
> 
> *
> ...



Black
No Just accept Jesus as the Son of God and your Savior,etc.

Red
I went to a church where they said if you couldnt speak in tongues it was your fault for not trying hard enough.  I don't think everyone is faking but I do think most people's heart is in the right place. Please continue your research..


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## delitefulmane (Dec 16, 2011)

OP I understand your confusion but take this time to read it for yourself and let the Holy Spirit reveal this to you. I would suggest that you grab a bible with a "clear" English interpretation of the bible that you will be able to understand (i.e. not in Old English as King James is written. A lot of people find this language confusing in itself) and read 
1 Corinthians CHAPTER 14. Read what Paul tells the people of Corinth about the gift of tongues. I pray that your eyes will be opened to what the Word says. 

The bible tells us that "All scripture is given by the inspiration of God." It is His word. Let it speak to your heart.
HTH


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## LucieLoo12 (Dec 16, 2011)

ZapMami,

Sorry I didnt elaborate on the post more last night, I was falling asleep as I was typing my first post, but to answer your questions:

*How do you feel about speaking in tongues? What type of church do you attend and what have you learned about it? *

I also tend a non-denominational church as well..What I have learned about speaking in tongues is this..

1). It is a sign of the believer
*Mark 16 v17-18*
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; *they shall speak with new tongues*; 
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

2). It is a prayer language between you and God, and no man can understand it
*1 Corinthians 14 v2*
For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 

*1st Corinthians 14v14*
For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

3). It prays for things that we dont know what to pray for, and it prays for our infirmities(weaknesses)
*Romans 8 v 26-27*
Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. 
And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God. 

*Why can't this holy spirit thing fall on me?*

When I was seeking for the Baptism  of the Holy Ghost, I didnt get it immediately, it took me months to get it. I would tarry and tarry at the altar, but nothing would happen.. It would discourage me at times, but I kept coming because I remembered the scripture 
*Acts 2 V 38*

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

It said SHALL, so I knew it was a promise to me...I knew God couldnt lie.So one night I was at a prayer shut-in and I began to cry out to God..I had been on a 3day fast, I was desperate because I knew I needed the Spirit of God, it was a necessity for my salavtion. So I cried out to God and I remembered saying "God, give me your Spirit, I need it God, I need it"..well I didnt get at the moment, but when I began to say "God your holy, God you've been so good to me,You're worthy" thats when it feel on me, and I began to speak in tongues immediately. But God taught me something in that, He showed me that I dont have to beg for anything, but just simply acknowledge Him for who He was and He would do the rest.I believe your mindset is wrong about the Holy Ghost, its not just something that makes you speak in tongues, but its a tool to help you in your walk with God..It teaches you about the nature of God and how to please God.People refer to the Holy Ghost as something that makes you jump and down and dance and shout, but its sooooo much more than that..Its our 'comforter' as Jesus says in John 15. It's the SAME spirit that Jesus had in Him. So when you are at the altar seeking for it(or whereever you are), dont have your mind on just the "tongues", because its not all about that, but its your "comforter". We have people in my church that it took them 2,4,5 years to get it...but they got it because it was a promise.The worse things to do is compare yourself to anyone, because everyone's course and calling isnt the same.

Acts 5v32
And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

I am not saying you dont obey God, because of course I dont know anything about you. But remember that if you are living your life in obedience to God you will get it...when? I dont know, I'm not God...but you will get it..

Tongues is for every believer, but alot of times people speak against it because they dont understand it. 95% of people who say tongues isnt real or its not for everyone...have never spoke in tongues. But EVERY believer at my church speaks in tongues, so God just decided to give every member at my church the gift of tongues?? 
and not just at my church, but others I have went to. the scripture said in Romans 8 that the spirit prays for our weaknesses and things we dont know to pray for. So God just want certain people to pray for their weaknesses???? Wouldnt He want the Spirit praying for everyone's weaknesses?

I heard testimonies over and over again of people who had the Holy Ghost 
and didnt even know it. Alot of Pastors dont teach on this, so alot of people dont know about tongues. but one lady said she was praying one night then all of a sudden she thought she began to stutter. She said she thought she was stammering over her words or couldnt get them out. It would continue to happen, she thought it was devil.So she would stop praying.But it turned out that she was speaking in tongues.God allowed her to meet someone who began to teach her about it
After you receive the Baptism of the Holy Ghost, just remember its not about just the tongues and enforce this over and over because its sooooo important...The bible says those that are led by the spirit of God are the sons of God, it dont says those who have the spirit are the sons of God but its those who are LED by it.




Now as far as the people at your church are they faking? I dont know and I will not speak against them. But you can't worry about them, you gotta be focused on you and your relationship with God.I hoped this help, if you have any questions please let me know..I know this can be a touchy subject...


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## FlyyBohemian (Dec 16, 2011)

Tongues don't take you to heaven. Seek a deeper relationship with Christ and the Lord will give you spiritual gifts as he pleases.


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## SvelteVelvet (Dec 16, 2011)

I speak in tongues and I look at is a my prayer language, going behind the veil and having a personal talk with God spirit to spirit. It usually happens in my prayer closet which is my bedroom and its happened in other spiritually heightened circumstances. I started after my spiritual baptism. The feeling I have after is always amazing peace and fulfillment.


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## Laela (Dec 16, 2011)

OP, if it's one thing about God, He cannot be found if we don't seek Him for ourselves. 

I pray you read the suggested Scriptures and ask God to help you understand; (and I believe that you will)... the answer for you is buried in the Word. It's YOUR answer directly from God and it's not for anyone else. Can you believe that?


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## Prudent1 (Dec 16, 2011)

ZapMami,


FlyyBohemian said:


> *Tongues don't take you to heaven.* Seek a deeper relationship with Christ and the Lord will give you spiritual gifts as he pleases.


The bible says b/c we like God are tri-part beings our spirits (like His Spirit) are knowledgeable of spiritual things in a way we cannot be if relying on our brains alone. Sorry, I can't remember the scripture right now. 
That's right. They don't. What they do do is unlock unbelievable _*POWER*_ that you will not have otherwise here on this earth. We need every advantage possible. This thing gets uglier and uglier as time progresses. I don't like settling.
IA with _every single word_ of the post below but am cropping in the interest of saving space. 


Alicialynn86 said:


> @ZapMami,
> *How do you feel about speaking in tongues? What type of church do you attend and what have you learned about it? *
> 
> *I also tend a non-denominational church* as well..What I have learned about speaking in tongues is this..
> ...


 
OP, it sounds like you are being taught correctly by your pastor. If this was one of those you must speak now or you're going to '_hayle'_ type places I would say RUN!! 


ZapMami said:


> I'm standing there waiting for these foreign words "the holy language" to start pouring from my mouth, but nothing happened. I standing there like *WTFerplexed...*
> 
> I really like the church, the sermons are on point. But it bothers me that I can't speak in tongues and I feel like all these other members are faking it. And then sometimes I think okay if they aren't faking do I not have a connection like they do with God. Why can't this holy spirit thing fall on me?
> 
> ...


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 16, 2011)

*Re: Speaking in Tongues---Should every1 be able to do it?*



ZapMami said:


> And then sometimes I think okay if they aren't faking *do I not have a connection like they do with God.  *


Stop right there.  I think that's the biggest misconception about tongues.  And some people like to use that to make others feel what you stated: that they don't have a connection like they do with God.  The Word says it best when it comes to tongues.  Not everyone has the same spiritual gifts.  People need to have different spiritual gifts so that when they all come together, they work together for the kingdom.  


Not to mention that my understanding of tongues is that you can't command someone to speak in tongues on cue.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 16, 2011)

I have to be honest and say that I don't believe this is completely accurate.  

And whether you intended to or not, your statements carried with them the misconception that I spoke about: that you have to have a certain type of relationship with God in order to speak in tongues.  But what you have said is not biblically sound in my opinion.  As I stated in an earlier post, the Word is clear that everyone has different gifts.  Your post appears to suggest that ALL believers will receive this gift which would contradict what the Word says.  




Alicialynn86 said:


> ZapMami,
> 
> Sorry I didnt elaborate on the post more last night, I was falling asleep as I was typing my first post, but to answer your questions:
> 
> ...


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 16, 2011)

ZapMami said:


> I also notice that alot of them seem to be speaking a similar language.  I mean it sounds the same to me.   All some version of "OH Run Ta Shun a Bop to Lah! RRRah Bop to Shak"  I mean why all the rolling R's, tons of syllables and the extra emphasis on them.   Lol..I mean I'm laughing cause it's ridiculous to me.  It's like they hear someone else do it and go home and practice making similar sounds.



Indeed in the "suspect" situations, this has been my experience.  I also witnessed a group where everyone was uttering the same syllables over and over: ummm ba ba ba ba ba." Literally.  The one time I've heard tongues  it really did sound like a language.  She wasn't forcing it.  It just came.  she wasn't shouting it all over the place.  She was actually pretty low key with it but I could hear her because I was close by and she was praying over people.


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## Prudent1 (Dec 16, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Indeed in the "suspect" situations, this has been my experience. I also witnessed a group where everyone was uttering the same syllables over and over: ummm ba ba ba ba ba." Literally. *The one time I've heard tongues it really did sound like a language. She wasn't forcing it. It just came.* she wasn't shouting it all over the place. She was actually pretty low key with it but I could hear her because I was close by and she was praying over people.


There has been significant research where ppl were recorded speaking in tongues (now remember there are tongues as in other languages and unknown tongues known only to your spirit and God). Then language experts were brought in (non-Christian, just linguistics professionals)to interpret/ determine the validity of the words being spoken. In each case the experts determined and in many case interpreted the words being spoken. Some were languages not spoken for the past several hundred years. Each time the ppl were glorifying, praising, or magnifying God. Sid Roth did a show on a recent episode. You may be able to google his show- _It's Supernatural_ or google the actual research effort and it's findings. Just make sure you're not having a Gideon experience.


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## ZapMami (Dec 16, 2011)

*Re: Speaking in Tongues---Should every1 be able to do it?*



nathansgirl1908 said:


> Stop right there.  I think that's the biggest misconception about tongues.  And some people like to use that to make others feel what you stated: that they don't have a connection like they do with God.  The Word says it best when it comes to tongues.  Not everyone has the same spiritual gifts.  People need to have different spiritual gifts so that when they all come together, they work together for the kingdom.
> 
> 
> Not to mention that my understanding of tongues is that *you can't command someone to speak in tongues on cue*.




At the end of church one time  the pastor says turn to your neighbor and ask them if they are saved.  So the guy beside me turns to me and says "Sistah are you saved and filled with the holy ghost?"  I nod my head yes and he demands "Let me hear you speak in tongues."  I was caught off guard.  He looked at me and said. "I'm serious. Let me hear you."  I mean I hurt me that he implied that I wasn't saved because i couldnt. I always thought you can't command on cue....but apparently not.  This guy was serious.  When I didn't comply he shook his head at me  like he was disgusted or something.  

Anyway, I'm more confused than ever. But thank you to those who replied.  You gave me some things to consider.


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## LucieLoo12 (Dec 17, 2011)

Please dont let that bad experience affect you. That man had no wisdom or understanding. U cannot make yourself speak in tongues, its done by the Spirit. Im sorry u had to experience that

Sent from my VM670 using VM670


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## Shimmie (Dec 17, 2011)

*Re: Speaking in Tongues---Should every1 be able to do it?*



ZapMami said:


> At the end of church one time  the pastor says turn to your neighbor and ask them if they are saved.  So the guy beside me turns to me and says "Sistah are you saved and filled with the holy ghost?"  I nod my head yes and he demands "Let me hear you speak in tongues."  I was caught off guard.  He looked at me and said. "I'm serious. Let me hear you."  I mean I hurt me that he implied that I wasn't saved because i couldnt. I always thought you can't command on cue....but apparently not.  This guy was serious.  When I didn't comply he shook his head at me  like he was disgusted or something.
> 
> Anyway, I'm more confused than ever. But thank you to those who replied.  You gave me some things to consider.



I'll be back, later.  I just saw this but I'm running out of the door for errands.  I need to address this for you and how to respond if this ever happens again.    

In the meantime....


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## Laela (Dec 17, 2011)

ZapMami, it's unfortunate you were approached this way. I hope you don't allow a bad experience like that to  keep you from experiencing the power of the Holy Spirit for yourself, without force or extras. Everyone's relationship with God is unique; there may be fakers in churches, but that doesn't mean God's Holy Spirit isn't real. When His Spirit moves in YOU, you will surely know it. Don't worry about other people.

I encourage you to focus on what's good and what is of God, to keep from operating in unbelief... He is not able to function in the midst of unbelief.


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## Shimmie (Dec 17, 2011)

*Re: Speaking in Tongues---Should every1 be able to do it?*



ZapMami said:


> At the end of church one time  the pastor says turn to your neighbor and ask them if they are saved.  So the guy beside me turns to me and says "Sistah are you saved and filled with the holy ghost?"
> 
> I nod my head yes and he demands "Let me hear you speak in tongues."  I was caught off guard.  He looked at me and said. "I'm serious. Let me hear you."
> 
> ...



   Hi ZapMami...  

I am so sorry that you had this negative experience.   Please don't ever feel that you are less saved, less of a Christian, or that you love God less just because you do not have a 'prayer language'.     

While I personally have a prayer language and I find that it helps me immensely, I have family, friends, and know of many 'annointed' and appointed Men and Women of God who lead Churches and Ministries who excel in their lives and love for God, *who do not speak in tongues*, YET...*they are still *strong leaders and they make tremendous strides and make differences in the lives of others and all to the glory of God.  

*Loving and serving God isn't complicated*.  It's men (mankind) who make it seem such.   Therefore do not ever be hindered in your walk with Jesus trying to be what others think you should be.   Anyone can see that you indeed love God and if anyone ever says or implies or tries to intimidate you ever again, tell them to take it up with Jesus.    

The man who misjudged you in Church was wrong and he should have known better.  As a matter of fact, his behaviour towards you, shows his immaturity in knowing the Holy Spirit for if he were 'that' on point, then he would have known that you were 'saved' by the Spirit of God' showing him so.   

If this ever happens again, simply say, 

_"Sir or 'Sister', I am indeed saved and I don't have to prove it to you or anyone.  God is my Judge, not you.   God bless you." _

Give them the Holy Ghost cheesy grin   and blink three times fast...  

I need a 'gif' someone to describe the grin and rapid triple blink.


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## Nonie (Dec 17, 2011)

ZapMami, if there's one thing that gets under my skin is when people take scripture and interpret it their own way and preach it as gospel. I tell you when in doubt, ask Father to guide you to the truth and He will.

I do not believe everyone must speak in tongues. God used tongues to reveal His Spirit to a world that didn't know Him after Jesus left. But nowhere has He said in His word that this is the only way it will be known that you are His. This is what His word says:



> *1 Corinthians 12*
> 
> 1 Now about the gifts of the Spirit, brothers and sisters, I do not want you to be uninformed. 2 You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols. 3 Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.
> 
> ...


* [^^bold, mine] (Source)

(Continued in next post coz it got too long again  )*


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## Nonie (Dec 17, 2011)

And let's examine 1 Corinthians 14:



> 1 Follow the way of love and eagerly desire gifts of the Spirit, especially prophecy. 2 For anyone who speaks in a tongue[a] does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit. 3 But the one who prophesies speaks to people for their strengthening, encouraging and comfort. 4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves, but the one who prophesies edifies the church. 5 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues,* but I would rather have you prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues,[c] unless someone interprets, so that the church may be edified.
> 
> 6 Now, brothers and sisters, if I come to you and speak in tongues, what good will I be to you, unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction? 7 Even in the case of lifeless things that make sounds, such as the pipe or harp, how will anyone know what tune is being played unless there is a distinction in the notes? 8 Again, if the trumpet does not sound a clear call, who will get ready for battle? 9 So it is with you. Unless you speak intelligible words with your tongue, how will anyone know what you are saying? You will just be speaking into the air. 10 Undoubtedly there are all sorts of languages in the world, yet none of them is without meaning. 11 If then I do not grasp the meaning of what someone is saying, I am a foreigner to the speaker, and the speaker is a foreigner to me. 12 So it is with you. Since you are eager for gifts of the Spirit, try to excel in those that build up the church.
> 
> ...


* (Source)

Nowhere in those two chapters do I see any command that I must speak in tongues but rather the Spirit determines who will and who won't according to His wishes. What's more, speaking in tongues is supposed to be a private prayer between God and the person and so I'm not sure why it is anyone else's concern who can or cannot speak in tongues. The Spirit intercedes for us when we don't know what to pray for but Jesus also taught us a prayer to pray at which time He also told us that Father knows what it is we need so whether we utter it or not, saying the prayer the Lord taught us will suffice.

Another thing OP you mentioned was about the babbling sounding made up. While it is true that Speaking in Tongues has been scientifically proven to be involuntary and to actually be a real language, there is also the fact that the mind is easily influenced and if you are next to someone babbling something you don't understand and you open your mind to it, you can end up babbling the same thing. I once learned from a former satanist that that is how they'd get people to curse God while in church. They loved charismatic churches where people love to pray shouting at the top of their voices the way Jesus warned us not to do. They would stand next to a person speaking in tongues and start rambling curses also in tongues. The person would get confused and join in the cursing. I don't know if this happened because some people were forcing issues and not truly controlled by the Spirit or if it's just a case where someone did not have the gift but was so desperate to talk in tongues that they were just the right victim for this to work. (I do wonder sometimes if this might be one reason Jesus warned us about loud praying....). 

Since I believe prayer is unique to each one, I do find it odd that two people from two different lives would be babbling the same prayer for themselves...so I too don't know about that. And I also do think that it's important to heed Jesus' advice to pray in silence, because as scripture tells us, unless there's an interpreter then you aren't edifying anyone else so why the shouting? 

Anyway, OP, I heard the same stuff you heard from your preacher when I was a new Christian, but I was finding out just how clearly God can speak to one if one asks a direct question. And I asked about this...and in a few days, He revealed these scriptures to me. So I am sure, speaking in tongues is not a must or an essential part of being a Christian. If the Spirit wills, He will give you the gift, but if you never speak in tongues, it doesn't make you any less a Christian than the one who does. In fact, if you have love in addition to whatever the Spirit feels is the gift for you, it is so much greater than any gift, for they all come to pass but love lasts forever (1 Corinthians 13).

I think our church leaders lack in humility and some need to return to scripture to remind themselves of the truth instead of using their own experiences to decide what must be for others. God's never changing word does not contradict itself. And if you read it, you will find several parts that say the same thing and remove all doubt. And if you read it prayerfully, the truth will become as clear as day.

OP, you did well to question everything you hear. We are warned to do this because the devil masquerades as an angel of light. Not saying your preacher is a devil so don't take me literally. Just know that Satan is so good at mixing the truth with lies so that he can get people to buy his BS. And if he can make you doubt your walk with Father and make you feel not good enough for God's Kingdom, then he will use any means necessary to do that. Let the Word of God be the sword you use to extinguish the flames of lies he tries to throw at you even through well-meaning folks.*


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 18, 2011)

With it being laid out so clearly in those scriptures, I still don't understand some of the teachings surrounding tongues.   The only thing I can say is that people really need to read the Word for themselves on the issue.  

Thanks for posting that Nonie.


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## LifeafterLHCF (Dec 18, 2011)

Im glad your wrote this OP.I too have had a really bad thing with the whole tongues thing.I feel its not everyone gift simple bc the word says we all have different gifts and serve different purposes.One can't want to be a foot or an eye bc if we all were the same we wouldn't be able to do other things.Some can sing,dance,preach,teach,cook etc so I believe speaking in tongues esp those who actually have the gift cool.

My incident lead to me dissolving a mentorship with a older lady that had her bible thumping daugther who came in town to pray over me and basically push me to speak in tongues.I felt so conflicted as I still am so lost at that night.It felt very belittled bc the daughter felt that bc I didn't speak in tongues I was just a whoring sinner.I couldn't do anything right like pray correctly etc.Now to this day Im extremely untrusting of so called christian chicks and won't dare get close bc I can't ever go through something like that again.I would denounce my Christianity.To my understanding about the Word things should flow smoothly with God.It shouldn't be a production thus the gift your given should move smoothly and it should glorify him..just my 2 cents.


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## Nonie (Dec 18, 2011)

@GoddessMaker, you reminded me of the dude who was laying hands and praying for people at my boarding school. Some people fell after he laid hands on them and folks attended to them. He said the "Spirit was coming over them" hence the falling down. When he got to me he jerked me so hard. What the? I staggered back. He gently placed his hand on my head and pushed me again making me stagger back again at which point he hollered... "Do not resist the Spirit my sister!"   I don't remember how that all ended. I might have just taken a seat so he'd quit jerking my head like it was made of rubber. I don't know when his big strong arm became the Spirit and I don't think that's how things happen. 

Sorry to hijack OP.


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## MonPetite (Dec 18, 2011)

............................


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## Laela (Dec 18, 2011)

@Nonie, how do you pray in the Spirit? 
From my understanding, Paul is clearly making the distinction in 1 Corin 14 between the private prayer language/worship, verse 2  (for private edification) and the Gift of Tongues (for public edification, which requires translation) - verse 21

A mature Christian knows we cannot truly worship / communicate with God through emotions but through our spirit. The emotional part is our human reaction to the moving of the Holy Spirit, much like how the waters moved in Genesis when the Holy Spirit moved over it.


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## Nonie (Dec 18, 2011)

Laela said:


> @Nonie, how do you pray in the Spirit?
> From my understanding, Paul is clearly making the distinction in 1 Corin 14 between the private prayer language/worship (verse 2) and the public gift of speaking in tongues (which requires translation) - verse 21
> 
> A mature Christian knows we cannot truly worship / communicate with God through emotions but through our spirit. The emotional part is our human reaction to the moving of the Holy Spirit, much like how the waters moved in Genesis when the Holy Spirit moved over it.


 

@Laela, there are times I feel a hollow inside that I don't understand. A sadness and a pressing need to pray. But because I don't know what to pray for, I simply respond to the command "Be still and know that I am God" and become still and very aware of God's presence, wisdom, might and love. I go into a mode of worship and into a mode of prayer that is without words. Romans 8:26-27. I sometimes start off with hymns of praise (I LOVE HYMNS!) and then I go silent. I usually end my prayer with the prayer the Lord taught us because His words "Your Father already knows what you need" seem to along with the words in Romans.

I think people assume that praying in the Spirit has to be in tongues, but I don't believe that to be the case. I believe when you pray in the Spirit, it's God Spirit who moves you to pray. When I get that heaviness that brings me to my knees, it is something beyond my understanding yet every time I respond as I described, I get up feeling like a burden has been lifted. There are times when I later find out that someone needed a prayer right at the time I responded. I believe the Omniscient One's Spirit prodding was the reason for that timely prayer. 

Ephesians 6 which talks about the Armor of God says in verse 18: 



> 18 And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests. With this in mind, be alert and always keep on praying for all the Lord’s people.


 
*Pray in the Spirit...with all kinds of prayers. *Not just when praying in tongues, but on all occasions with all kinds of prayers. In other words, praying in the Spirit is how we ought to pray no matter how we pray. Praying in the Spirit I believe also means praying in the will of God. The verses I linked to above says in verse 27 that the Spirit intercedes for us according to God's will. And Romans 8:15-16 says:



> 15 The Spirit you received does not make you slaves, so that you live in fear again; rather, the Spirit you received brought about your adoption to sonship.[a] And by him we cry, _“Abba,_[b] Father.” 16 The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children.


 
By God's Spirit we cry out to Father. In other words, He moves our prayer and energizes it and as I shared from my own experience, motivates us to pray. 

So what does praying in the Spirit really mean? Phillipians 3:3 says* we* serve God *by the Spirit[*...*]*. And how do we do that? By *putting no confidence in the flesh*. If we cross reference that with Romans 8:5-8 we see that the mind led by the Spirit submits to God's law and is set on things the Spirit desires. So praying in the Spirit would be not putting confidence in the flesh but relying totally on Him to guide our prayer. Which is what I do when I am lost and don't know what to pray for. 

I also mentioned that I believe praying in the Spirit is to pray according to God's will. Proverbs 3:6 says "In all your ways acknowledge the Lord and He will direct your paths" so that's one way of knowing His will--being in touch with Him and involving Him in all you do, surrendering your will to His and trusting Him with all your heart. (Proverbs 3:5) Another way to know His will is by reading His word and meditating on it. 



> *2 Timothy 3:16-1*
> 
> New International Version (NIV)
> 
> 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God[a] may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.


 
By studying God's word, we come to know what pleases God and then we will be able to do what Romans 12:1-2 says:


> 1 Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God—this is your true and proper worship. 2 Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.


 
So when we worship in the Spirit, live in the Spirit, pray in the Spirit, etc...we do these things with the Spirit as our guide and we put all our faith in Him and let Him direct us in how to do these things according to God's will.


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## BostonMaria (Dec 19, 2011)

I haven't read everyone's posts, but just wanted to chime in.

I was raised Catholic and speaking in tongues isn't something that is taught. I changed over to a non-denominational church back in 2002 and when I became born again I didn't speak in tongues. Looking back I believe that my other beliefs kinda clashed and got in the way.  It wasn't until I became desperate for God in 2010 that I started to learn more about speaking in tongues.  I tried, couldn't do it. One day I asked the Holy Spirit to help me speak in tongues. I cried out to Him really.  I was in a dark place in my life. All of a sudden it just came to me.  It took me 7 years to accept the gift.

I think you should give it time.  Just keep praying and eventually when you are ready you will speak in tongues. In the meantime just keep reading your bible, go to church, and just keep learning.


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## Prudent1 (Dec 19, 2011)

Just wanted to add too OP- your prayer language will initially be similar to a baby learning to speak. IOW, it may sound like babbling at first but will become clearer with time. When we pray in tongues, the distinction of speaking utilizing your brain (as you have done since infancy) vs this new way (from your soul) is just _different_. You _will not_ be confused between the two.


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## Prudent1 (Dec 19, 2011)

Here are some resources for anyone interested. Let me say again, as a believer you are *not* *obligated* by God to speak in tongues no more than you are obligated to grow long hair!!! But, if you want to you can. What happens in your life is_ your_ experience so no comparisons and realize that some things may need to change before you are _ready_ to receive this gift.
*Filled with the Holy Spirit Prayer*
Heavenly Father, I ask You to fill each of us with Your precious Holy Spirit. I ask You to fill each of us with all of the fruits of Your Holy Spirit including Your love, Your joy, Your peace, Your gentleness, Your goodness, Your meekness, Your faithfulness and Your self-control. Heavenly Father, in Jesus‘ Holy Name I ask You to fill me, and all those I am praying for with Your Holy Spirit Anointing and Power, cover us with Your presence, and to fill us and seal us with Your peace, character, and nature. I ask You to do all these things in the Name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To God Be the Glory. Amen!

Some resources that helped me...

http://www.amazon.com/Why-Tongues-Kenneth-E-Hagin/dp/0892760516
http://www.kcm.org/real-help/article/how-receive-baptism-holy-spirit
https://my.kcm.org/products/authors...deeper-understanding-of-praying-in-the-spirit


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## crwnandglory (Dec 20, 2011)

ZapMami said:


> Thanks Chelsea that makes me feel alot better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...






Lady,  I wish I could hug you.

I often tell people that because I was not raised in church I was not/have not assimilated to the culture of church.  I am saved, baptised, received the holy spirit and have a church home but I have too noticed that there is a culture in the church that is not always bibically based but is learned...especially in the black church.   Anytime someone tries to assess whether or not you have the holy spirit by asking you to show it, I would say may not be following the word of God.    

I too live in the DMV and attend a church where praise is central, people speak in tongues, are over come with the spirit, etc every service.   Sometimes I wonder if SOME of the people are just showing off but I never doubt the fact that His presence/spirit is present in our services so most of the praise, tongues, etc is absolutely genuine.  When I first got saved and started attending I felt so awkward because I didn't express my praise the way that they do (at that time).  To stand next to someone who is literally overcome by the holy spirit made me feel like I was out of line for not expressing in the same manner.  As I have grown in my faith I realize that not everyone has the same gifts, anointing or testimony.  Furthermore, we praise differently based upon our gifts, testimonies and anointing.  My praise has shifted and grown as I have shifted and grown and it did not come from my church's expectations but it is how my spirit responds to His glory.  

IMO, what is most important is that you genuinely  know Jesus for yourself.  Develop a prayer life and know His word and you will not be easily deceived and you will be able to discern between His will and word even while in church, also knowing Jesus personally will bring out your gifts (whichever they may be) and praise will come naturally.  

You are more than welcome to visit my church home!


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## crwnandglory (Dec 20, 2011)

Nonie said:


> @GoddessMaker, you reminded me of the dude who was laying hands and praying for people at my boarding school. Some people fell after he laid hands on them and folks attended to them. He said the "Spirit was coming over them" hence the falling down. When he got to me he jerked me so hard. What the? I staggered back. He gently placed his hand on my head and pushed me again making me stagger back again at which point he hollered... "Do not resist the Spirit my sister!"   I don't remember how that all ended. I might have just taken a seat so he'd quit jerking my head like it was made of rubber. I don't know when his big strong arm became the Spirit and I don't think that's how things happen.
> 
> Sorry to hijack OP.



Hey Nonie,

I read your post and wanted to share my personal experience.   Occasionally, my Bishop will "lay hands" on people.  I use to watch this act and see people fall out and thought :.  One day I allowed him to lay hands on me and guess what happened...I fell out, lol!  He didn't jerk my head or push me, he lightly touched me and I was overcome by the spirit.  It was the most unique experience I have ever had and since then I have had several other experiences but I will say that when my spirit is open I do fully receive His spirit.  

Come to think of it, I've witnessed my bros and sisters in Christ be overcome with the Spirit before the Bishop even touched them...


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 20, 2011)

I have always wondered why people desire the gift of tongues so much. I never really hear about people begging God for some of the other gifts that much...


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## Nonie (Dec 20, 2011)

[FONT=&quot]





nathansgirl1908 said:


> I have always wondered why people desire the gift of tongues so much. I never really hear about people begging God for some of the other gifts that much...


[/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]I don't either, nathansgirl1908. Especially because all the gifts of the Spirit are suppose to build up the church. In Acts where speaking in tongues is mentioned w/r/t the Holy Spirit, [/FONT]



> *[FONT=&quot]The Holy Spirit and the Day of Pentecost[/FONT]*
> [FONT=&quot]2:1 Now 1  when the day of Pentecost had come, they were all together in one place. 2:2 Suddenly 2  a sound 3  like a violent wind blowing 4  came from heaven 5  and filled the entire house where they were sitting. 2:3 And tongues spreading out like a fire 6  appeared to them and came to rest on each one of them. 2:4 All 7  of them were filled with the Holy Spirit, and they began to speak in other languages 8  as the Spirit enabled them. 9 2:5 Now there were devout Jews 10  from every nation under heaven residing in Jerusalem. 11  2:6 When this sound 12  occurred, a crowd gathered and was in confusion, 13  because each one heard them speaking in his own language. 2:7 Completely baffled, they said, 14  “Aren’t 15  all these who are speaking Galileans? 2:8 And how is it that each one of us hears them 16  in our own native language? 17  2:9 Parthians, Medes, Elamites, and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and the province of Asia, 18  2:10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene, 19  and visitors from Rome, 20  2:11 both Jews and proselytes, 21  Cretans and Arabs – we hear them speaking in our own languages about the great deeds God has done!” 22  2:12 All were astounded and greatly confused, saying to one another, “What does this mean?” 2:13 But others jeered at the speakers, 23  saying, “They are drunk on new wine!” 24 [/FONT]


[FONT=&quot] (Acts 2)[/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]Notice, they spoke in tongues so that the message of God could be communicated to those who would not have otherwise understood it because they spoke different tongues.[/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]The second mention of speaking in tongues was when Peter went to Cornelius' house to speak to him and those of his household about God. So God's gift of tongues was again used for the purpose of converting his house. God used signs and miracles to communicate His word to unbelievers. Those who went with Peter who were already believers did not speak in tongues...which is why they were astonished. [/FONT]



> *[FONT=&quot]The Gentiles Receive the Holy Spirit[/FONT]*
> [FONT=&quot]10:44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell on 125  all those who heard the message. 126  10:45 The 127  circumcised believers 128  who had accompanied Peter were greatly astonished 129  that 130  the gift of the Holy Spirit 131  had been poured out 132  even on the Gentiles, 10:46 for they heard them speaking in tongues and praising 133  God. Then Peter said, 10:47 “No one can withhold the water for these people to be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, 134  can he?” 135  10:48 So he gave orders to have them baptized 136  in the name of Jesus Christ. 137  Then they asked him to stay for several days.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot](Acts 10)[/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]This was a sign for the Jews at a time when the gospel was being shared without any Bibles. 

(continued next post)
[/FONT]


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## Nonie (Dec 20, 2011)

[FONT=&quot]You can see that in the following chapter where Peter explains to believers how God moved and changed the Gentiles:[/FONT]



> *[FONT=&quot]Peter Defends His Actions to the Jerusalem Church[/FONT]*
> [FONT=&quot]11:1 Now the apostles and the brothers who were throughout Judea heard that the Gentiles too had accepted 1  the word of God. 2  11:2 So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, 3  the circumcised believers 4  took issue with 5  him, 11:3 saying, “You went to 6  uncircumcised men and shared a meal with 7  them.” 11:4 But Peter began and explained it to them point by point, 8  saying, 11:5 “I was in the city of Joppa praying, and in a trance I saw a vision, 9  an object something like a large sheet descending, 10  being let down from heaven 11  by its four corners, and it came to me. 11:6 As I stared 12  I looked into it and saw four-footed animals of the earth, wild animals, reptiles, 13  and wild birds. 14  11:7 I also heard a voice saying to me, ‘Get up, Peter; slaughter 15  and eat!’ 11:8 But I said, ‘Certainly not, Lord, for nothing defiled or ritually unclean 16  has ever entered my mouth!’ 11:9 But the voice replied a second time from heaven, ‘What God has made clean, you must not consider 17  ritually unclean!’ 11:10 This happened three times, and then everything was pulled up to heaven again. 11:11 At that very moment, 18  three men sent to me from Caesarea 19  approached 20  the house where we were staying. 21  11:12 The Spirit told me to accompany them without hesitation. These six brothers 22  also went with me, and we entered the man’s house. 11:13 He informed us how he had seen an angel standing in his house and saying, ‘Send to Joppa and summon Simon, who is called Peter, 11:14 who will speak a message 23  to you by which you and your entire household will be saved.’ 11:15 Then as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on 24  them just as he did 25  on us at the beginning. 26  11:16 And I remembered the word of the Lord, 27  as he used to say, 28  ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 29  11:17 Therefore if God 30  gave them the same gift 31  as he also gave us after believing 32  in the Lord Jesus Christ, 33  who was I to hinder 34  God?” 11:18 When they heard this, 35  they ceased their objections 36  and praised 37  God, saying, “So then, God has granted the repentance 38  that leads to life even to the Gentiles.” 39
> 
> [/FONT]


[FONT=&quot](Acts 11)[/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]The next time speaking in tongues is seen in the book of Acts is when Paul met disciples of John the Baptist. They knew about Jesus but had not accepted Him as their savior. They basically knew about Jesus the way those who know His story (history) but haven't accepted them as their savior know him. They had never heard of the Holy Spirit. So again, this was used as a sign:[/FONT]




> *[FONT=&quot]Disciples of John the Baptist at Ephesus[/FONT]*
> [FONT=&quot]19:1 While 1  Apollos was in Corinth, 2  Paul went through the inland 3  regions 4  and came to Ephesus. 5  He 6  found some disciples there 7  19:2 and said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” 8  They replied, 9  “No, we have not even 10  heard that there is a Holy Spirit.” 19:3 So Paul 11  said, “Into what then were you baptized?” “Into John’s baptism,” they replied. 12 19:4 Paul said, “John baptized with a baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, 13  that is, in Jesus.” 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, 19:6 and when Paul placed 14  his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came 15  upon them, and they began to speak 16  in tongues and to prophesy. 17  19:7 (Now there were about twelve men in all.) 18[/FONT]


 (Acts 19)

  [FONT=&quot]Earlier in this thread, I shared chapters from 1 Corinthians 12-14 where again the purpose of gifts is shared. Also one thing to remember is the Spirit gives the gifts according to His will. I don't think it's right to ask for gifts. I think we should trust God to give us the gift He wills. [/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]I have heard people say that when you are baptized with the Holy Spirit you will speak in tongues. Again this is not accurate. Everyone who accepts Jesus Christ as Savior has had baptism of the Holy Spirit. That's how we become part of the Body of Christ. 1 Corinthians 12:13 makes this very clear. And then the chapter goes on to talk about how we then have different gifts from the Spirit that help us edify each other. 
[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot](continued in next post)
[/FONT]


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## Nonie (Dec 20, 2011)

[FONT=&quot]OK, compare the part in bold with the previous readings where Peter is explaining to the Jews what happened when he was in Cornelius' house. He says "And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, *as on us at the beginning*” (Acts 11:15). Also notice how when Paul is teaching us in 1 Corinthians 14 that the gifts should be used for the good of all and that tongues should not be used unless there's an interpreter, there's a warning not to be like children but to be mature.[/FONT]


> [FONT=&quot]14:13 So then, one who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may interpret. 14:14 If 6  I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unproductive. 14:15 What should I do? 7  I will pray with my spirit, but I will also pray with my mind. I will sing praises with my spirit, but I will also sing praises with my mind. 14:16 Otherwise, if you are praising God with your spirit, how can someone without the gift 8  say “Amen” to your thanksgiving, since he does not know what you are saying? 14:17 For you are certainly giving thanks well, but the other person is not strengthened. 14:18 I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you, 14:19 but in the church I want to speak five words with my mind to instruct others, rather than ten thousand words in a tongue.[/FONT]
> [FONT=&quot]14:20 Brothers and sisters, 9  do not be children in your thinking. Instead, be infants in evil, but in your thinking be mature. 14:21 It is written in the law: “_By people with strange tongues and by the lips of strangers I will speak to this people, yet not even in this way will they listen to me_,” 10  says the Lord. 14:22 So then, tongues are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers. Prophecy, however, is not for unbelievers but for believers. 14:23 So if the whole church comes together and all speak in tongues, and unbelievers or uninformed people enter, will they not say that you have lost your minds? 14:24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or uninformed person enters, he will be convicted by all, he will be called to account by all. 14:25 The secrets of his heart are disclosed, and in this way he will fall down with his face to the ground and worship God, declaring, “God is really among you.”[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot](1 Corinthians 14)[/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]I think if people will study God's word prayerfully and ask Him to show them the truth, they will stop taking man's word as gospel. The mind is very complex and very powerful, but it's also easily influenced. I already shared about satanists and their way of making people curse God in tongues by inducing them to babble curses when masquerading as fellow parishioners next to one praying in tongues. I also believe that if you want something so badly, you make yourself vulnerable to Satan's wiles. I believe speaking in tongues can be self-induced, Satan-induced or even group induced. I think we need to be careful about coveting something so much that it becomes an idol. What's more, since most people who pray in tongues seems to do it loudly and in a way that is showy--when Jesus taught us not to pray like that and Paul also warns us against it unless one is there to interpret--we need to ask why this is. Our God is a humble and meek God. Showy, loud yelling is not how Father would have us pray, otherwise His Son would not have warned us against it. [/FONT]

  [FONT=&quot]The Bible does not contradict itself, and if you study it, you will find how different parts support each other, and if you prayerfully ask Father to reveal His truth to you, you will find it and be so sure of it.[/FONT]


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## nathansgirl1908 (Dec 20, 2011)

Nonie said:


> I think if people will study God's word prayerfully and ask Him to show them the truth, they will stop taking man's word as gospel. The mind is very complex and very powerful, but it's also easily influenced. I already shared about satanists and their way of making people curse God in tongues by inducing them to babble curses when masquerading as fellow parishioners next to one praying in tongues. I also believe that if you want something so badly, you make yourself vulnerable to Satan's wiles. I believe speaking in tongues can be self-induced, *Satan-induced *or even group induced.



I had a dream a few years ago that confirms the statement in bold.  



> I think we need to be careful about coveting something so much that it becomes an idol. What's more, since most people who pray in tongues seems to do it loudly and in a way that is showy--when Jesus taught us not to pray like that and Paul also warns us against it unless one is there to interpret--we need to ask why this is. Our God is a humble and meek God. Showy, loud yelling is not how Father would have us pray, otherwise His Son would not have warned us against it. ]


. Yes!!!!!!  I wholeheartedly agree!!!!

 Your posts have been awesome on this subject!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## aribell (Dec 20, 2011)

Nonie said:


> [FONT=&quot]I have heard people say that when you are baptized with the Holy Spirit you will speak in tongues. Again this is not accurate. *Everyone who accepts Jesus Christ as Savior has had baptism of the Holy Spirit. That's how we become part of the Body of Christ. 1 Corinthians 12:13 makes this very clear. And then the chapter goes on to talk about how we then have different gifts from the Spirit that help us edify each other. *
> [/FONT]
> 
> 
> ...



I don't believe I Corinthians 12:13 is speaking of the "baptism of the Spirit" that Christians who believe in the baptism of the Spirit are talking about.  In fact, that verse is speaking of being baptized into the Body of Christ.  To say that all believers are baptized in the Spirit upon accepting Jesus as Lord is to essentially not believe in the baptism of the Spirit that, say, Pentecostals speak of.  That's fine--many and perhaps even most Christian denominations don't believe in the baptism of the Holy Spirit as Pentecostals and others would define it.  I just wanted to highlight that those are different things.


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## felic1 (Dec 20, 2011)

*Re: Speaking in Tongues---Should every1 be able to do it?*

Hi Sis,

Speaking in tongues is a gift. Everyone has not received it. Everyone saved does not have this baptism. Do not feel condemned because you do not speak in tongues yet. God will give it to you, it just has not happened yet. It's hard to leave a church that has some characteristics that you like, while some behaviors seem really odd.Bless you!


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## Nonie (Dec 21, 2011)

nicola.kirwan said:


> I don't believe I Corinthians 12:13 is speaking of the "baptism of the Spirit" that Christians who believe in the baptism of the Spirit are talking about. In fact, that verse is speaking of being baptized into the Body of Christ. To say that all believers are baptized in the Spirit upon accepting Jesus as Lord is to essentially not believe in the baptism of the Spirit that, say, Pentecostals speak of. That's fine--many and perhaps even most Christian denominations don't believe in the baptism of the Holy Spirit as Pentecostals and others would define it. I just wanted to highlight that those are different things.



@nicola.kirwan, you are right, I don't believe in the way Pentecostals speak of baptism of the Holy Spirit because nowhere in the Bible do I see that definition they use. In the book of Acts as I shared, the gift of speaking in tongues was used to communicate the word of God and to confirm His presence to non-believing folk. (In other words, the gift was used for the sake of building the church, not self-edification.)

What I believe are Paul's words that _"For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body. Whether Jews or Greeks or slaves 4  or free, we were all made to drink of the one Spirit."_ (1 Corinthians 12:13) I try to get my direction from the word of God rather than from teachings of denominations created by man. I have found as long as I return to the word of God, and test everything by scripture, I will usually find the truth. 1 Timothy 3:16-17 tells us_ "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God[a] may be thoroughly equipped for every good work." _

When Paul was speaking to the Corinthians, it was because the same thing we see today was going on. They were emphasizing some gifts of the Spirit over others. So he was warning them to stop dividing into cliques because we are all one Body of Christ! And to emphasize his point he reminded them that by one Spirit we were all baptized into the Body of Christ. And this happened when we received Christ and accepted Him into our lives and became heirs and sons of God.  Paul points out that all believers have been baptized in the Spirit, he ends by listing all the gifts of the Spirit and how not everyone will be an apostle, a prophet, a teacher, a miracle worker, have healing powers, speak in tongues, prophesy. 

In Acts 1:8, Jesus said, _"__But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to me in Jerusalem, and all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." _

Notice that Jesus tells us that when we receive the power of the Holy Spirit we become witnesses to the end of the earth. This seems to be in line with spreading of the message that Paul says is the purpose of the gifts of the Spirit. 

See what Peter says after some people saw those speaking in tongues and thought they were drunk:

(continued next post)


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## Nonie (Dec 21, 2011)

> *Peter’s Address on the Day of Pentecost *
> 2:14 But Peter stood up 25 with the eleven, raised his voice, and addressed them: “You men of Judea 26 and all you who live in Jerusalem, 27 know this 28 and listen carefully to what I say. 2:15 In spite of what you think, these men are not drunk, 29 for it is only nine o’clock in the morning. 30 2:16 But this is what was spoken about through the prophet Joel: 31
> 
> 2:17 ‘*And* in the last days 32 *it will be,*’ *God says,*
> ...


 (Acts 2:14-41)

When those who had thought the tongue speakers were drunk then asked how they too can experience what the others had experienced and they were told to repent and they too will receive the Holly Spirit. Notice the last sentence, "So those who received his message were baptized and that day about 3,000 people were added." (Remember this when I talk about John the Baptist later on.)

(continued next post)


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## Nonie (Dec 21, 2011)

You see, I think to understand the Bible you have to read everything in its context and you have to study it. Every miracle in the Bible was done for the purpose of showing God's glory to a disbelieving world. The speaking of tongues that people from different countries could understand was done for a purpose: for the word of God to be conveyed to those who would have otherwise not understood it, and for the purpose of confirming to a people who didn't believe the fact that God's power was in that place. When Jesus touched people and healed them, they would be converted and would praise God. I believe God's wonders happen for a purpose not just because. And I believe Paul that among believers the gifts of prophesy, tongues, etc are meant for the growth of the church, and if they aren't uplifting the church, then they fail to do the serve the purpose for which they are meant.

Lastly, remember how John the Baptist always talked about Jesus as the one who will come and baptize with the Holy Spirit not with water? I believe then that when Jesus talked of baptism, it was with the Holy Spirit just as John had prophesied. Let's look at John's words:




> "John answered them, saying "I baptize with water, but there stands one among you whom you do not know. It is He who, coming after me, is preferred before me, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose." These things were done in Bethabara beyond the Jordan, where John was baptizing. The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world!" This is He of whom I say 'After me comes a man who is preferred before me, for he was before me.' I did not know Him; but that He should be revealed to Israel, therefore I came baptizing with water. And John bore witness, saying, "I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and He remained upon Him. I did not know Him, but he who sent me to baptize with water said to me, "Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit." And I have seen and testified that this is the Son of God" (John 1:26-34).


 And then see what Jesus says in Mark 16:14-16:


> 14 Later Jesus appeared to the Eleven as they were eating; he rebuked them for their lack of faith and their stubborn refusal to believe those who had seen him after he had risen. 15 He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16 *Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.*


(bold, mine)

(Continued next post)


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## Nonie (Dec 21, 2011)

So I truly believe that baptism of the Holy Spirit occurs when we believe and accept Jesus as our Savior. That Jesus was the one who baptized with the Holy Spirit IMO means it was happening while He was on earth. It isn't the same as being filled with the Spirit. Baptism of the Spirit occurs when you get saved, and you get saved when you believe in Jesus Christ as the Son of God and accept Him as Savior. When you are filled with the Spirit of God you are controlled by the Spirit and are empowered to do great things and this is where gifts (of tongues, of prophesy, of teaching etc) come in--from one being filled with the Spirit. There are examples in the Bible of the Spirit of God filling people and then they manifest the gifts of the Spirit:




> *The Birth of John the Baptist*
> 
> 57 When it was time for Elizabeth to have her baby, she gave birth to a son. 58 Her neighbors and relatives heard that the Lord had shown her great mercy, and they shared her joy.
> 
> ...


(Luke 1:57-80)

Another example is seen in Acts 4 where again the filling of the Spirit brought with it the gift of wisdom/teaching:



> 1 The priests and the captain of the temple guard and the Sadducees came up to Peter and John while they were speaking to the people. 2 They were greatly disturbed because the apostles were teaching the people, proclaiming in Jesus the resurrection of the dead. 3 They seized Peter and John and, because it was evening, they put them in jail until the next day. 4 But many who heard the message believed; so the number of men who believed grew to about five thousand.
> 
> 5 The next day the rulers, the elders and the teachers of the law met in Jerusalem. 6 Annas the high priest was there, and so were Caiaphas, John, Alexander and others of the high priest’s family. 7 They had Peter and John brought before them and began to question them: “By what power or what name did you do this?”
> 
> ...


(Acts 4:1-21)

(Continued in next post)


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## Nonie (Dec 21, 2011)

And of course Acts 2 tells us how being filled with the Spirit led to speaking of tongues:



> 3 They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. 4 *All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues*[a] as the Spirit enabled them.
> 5 Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven.


(Acts 2:3-5)

And we see the gift of teaching after Saul was filled with the Spirit in Acts 9:10-22:



> 10 In Damascus there was a disciple named Ananias. The Lord called to him in a vision, “Ananias!”
> 
> “Yes, Lord,” he answered.
> 
> ...


 (Acts 9)

So tongues are not as a result of baptism with the Holy Spirit. Baptism with the Holy Spirit is what happens when we repent to Jesus and give our lives to Christ. When people repented to John the Baptist, they got baptized with water; when people repent to Christ, they get baptized with the Holy Spirit. 


> John answered, saying, to all "I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire" (Luke 3:16).


 



> And John bore witness, saying, "I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and he remained upon him. I did not know him, but he who sent me to baptize with water said to me, "Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, this is he who baptizes with the Holy Spirit." And I have seen and testified that this is the Son of God" (John 1:32-34)!


 
So 1 Corinthians 12:13 speaks of the same baptism with the Spirit that the prophets of old and John the Baptist spoke of--the one that Jesus was to bring. What happened at Pentacost was the *filling with **the Holy Spirit* thus equipping God's people with power to do His work and making them witnesses just as Jesus promised in Acts 1:8: 
_"__But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to me in Jerusalem, and all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth."_​


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## Laela (Dec 21, 2011)

What is also very important is to be open to the Holy Spirit to reveal to one's spirit what thus says the Lord. That is very critical in receiving a Rhema Word from God that is not there to be 'seen' or 'read' but is definitely  'understood.'   This is where many people like to think 'some Christians' think they have a better relationship with God than another. When all it is, is that person chose to receive the Word into their spirit...not just read it.

"We live by faith, not by sight" surely applies to this topic!

ITA that context is very important... 




Nonie said:


> You see, I think to understand the Bible you have to read everything in its context and you have to study it.


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