# Can a man really rape his wife?



## WhipEffectz1 (Jul 22, 2008)

Assuming they're together and all. I just came from the local Starbucks and overheard a heated conversation about rape involving married people. The woman(yes a woman) said that there's no such thing as a man raping his wife because when they married she promised to honor, obey, and submit to him. The funny thing is that a man joined in on the conversation with the two ladies and totally disagreed.

What is your take on this. Personally, I think rape is rape but the discussion got me to thinking....

*Coming from a religious standpoint only!*


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## Blossssom (Jul 22, 2008)

Yes!  LOL!

You really posted here, huh?

Now let's see what happens *evil grin*


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## WhipEffectz1 (Jul 22, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> Yes!  LOL!
> 
> You really posted here, huh?
> 
> Now let's see what happens *evil grin*



Just for you!!!!


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## Blossssom (Jul 22, 2008)

WhipEffectz1 said:


> Just for you!!!!



Sho' quiet in here


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## Blossssom (Jul 22, 2008)

I wonder who said "no".  Ha!


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## Mortons (Jul 22, 2008)

Can the person who said no please come back and say why not if you dont mind? I would really like to read that POV.


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## cocoberry10 (Jul 22, 2008)

I definitely think a husband can rape his wife.

Some men who rape their wives may use Corinthians as their "justification"
*1 Corinthians 7:3-5*
*3 The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. 4 The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife. 5 Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.*

*However, I will always believe God looks at our "hearts." I have no doubt in my mind that one of the benefits of marriage that God intended was for a healthy and plentiful sex life between the spouses. However, we are human beings and this means that there may be times when a spouse cannot or does not want to "perform" sexually.  I think God will always look at the heart of His children in a situation. For example, if a wife never "feels like it," does this give a husband permission to force her, or permission to "cheat?"  I would say not quite, but it would indicate a serious problem that IMO a loving husband and wife would address.  Let's say a wife that was NEVER in the mood was also unwilling to seek counseling or medical help to address that problem. I would definitely say that's kind of a problem, but I still don't think that ever justifies rape (or cheating).  God commands us to do a lot of things, but He never FORCES us. Therefore, I cannot justify a husband raping his wife (although I can understand why a husband would feel angered or possibly even tempted to coax or try to pressure his wife into having sex if she refused, especially if this was regularly and not just a one time "no").*

*I have more to say, but I'll wait to see the other responses before addressing that Corinthians passage!*


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## cocoberry10 (Jul 22, 2008)

HeatSeeker said:


> Can the person who said no please come back and say why not if you dont mind? I would really like to read that POV.


 
*I voted yes, but my guess is that they would use something like 1 Corinthians 7:3-5 to justify (see my post above for the passage).*

*When we marry, we are supposed to merge into one.  As Corinthians says, a husband no longer belongs to himself, and neither does a wife. Therefore, the person that voted no may believe that when you are married you don't have the "right" to say no.  I guess IMO, even if this is the truth (a spouse doesn't have the "right" to say no to their spouse), I can't imagine that this permits the other spouse to FORCE someone into an act that they are unwilling to do. Also, since we no longer "belong to ourselves," my question to the person who said "no" would be, isn't putting your own individual needs violating the "I don't belong to myself" theme a little bit too? I mean, I can understand that a husband wants to have regular, even frequent sex with his wife. And I know in many marriages, there are a lot of situations where a wife REFUSES to have sex (for probably a million reasons). You read about couples who haven't had sex in 2 yearserplexed, but I still can't say that "rape" is the answer!*

*I would equate that with let's say anal sex I mean, what if I as a wife am pretty much down with all kinds of sexual acts, but I just can't get with anal sex, and my husband is just DYING to try it???? Do I have the "right" to say no. Does my husband have the "right" to make me do it, since we are now "one" and "we belong to each other???" If I refuse, does this give him "permission" to seek it elsewhere?*


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## cocoberry10 (Jul 22, 2008)

Excerpt from a Christian website (they also reference 1 Corinthians 7:3-5)
http://www.biblestudy.org/question/can-husband-rape-wife.html



> Benevolence means 'good will, kindness.' A man and his wife are supposed to have good will toward one another and be kind to each other. _Just those two things would make a change is marriages that would seem almost miraculous if people would just be that way._
> 
> However, SELFISHNESS (a major characteristic of Satan) always rears its ugly head! The husband wants HIS WAY, and the wife wants HER WAY. _THEY ARE NOT ONE as God intended them to be._. They are not one in mind, one in direction, one in thought, one is deed, and therefore there is that "battle of the sexes" which is so often promoted by groups like NOW (National Organization of Women). There is that faction which promotes "women equal to men" (and they really mean women OVER men.)
> 
> ...


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## kayte (Jul 22, 2008)

yes and God help the wife ..some do..and never get reported.....
you may as well ask can a man kill his wife..yes and some do 
conjugal co-rights never equates abuse...sex by force..
that has nothing to do with the sanctity of the marriage under the law of God.....it's tragic and as already pointed out.... unlawful and punishable by God ..and by human laws 

but here is what is questionable....and tragic to me

the joking???? on this thread???...what's remotely humorous..about RAPE? ....
in ANY context....just because the topic is posted on CF?? 

& by _women?_

God help us...what have we evolved to


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## divya (Jul 23, 2008)

Yes, a man can rape his wife, and God will hold him responsible for his actions.


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

This is truly a stupid question and if it was posted here in the Christianity forum as a 'joke' or as a 'spectational' for Christian responses, that's also stupid. 

Rape is rape, whether it's in or out of marriage.  Women aren't stupid, be they Christian or non Christian.  When a man violates a woman's body, it's rape and nothing less.   

I can't see the necessity for even asking such a question.  Rape is rape...period! Be it in marriage or out.  It doesn't take rocket science, the Bible or foolishness to answer such a question.

Sometimes I wonder....


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## Highly Favored8 (Jul 23, 2008)

^^^^^Thank You Shimmie,^^^^^

I agree it is just how the question is asked. It is not what you ask it it how you ask it?

Now, to try and get an answer. My ex fiance says that a man who is married to his wife can do this to her b/c they are married. I am like that is why you are divorced and I am your ex fiance. 

So, IMHO a man cannot and should not be able to rape his wife.
NO, Means NO!  Just b/c I am married to you does not mean you have the right to TAKE my Rubies from me!

*I would like to know who said I don't care?*


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## kayte (Jul 23, 2008)

> This is truly a stupid question and if it was posted here in the Christianity forum as a 'joke' or as a 'spectational' for Christian responses, that's also stupid.
> 
> Rape is rape, whether it's in or out of marriage. Women aren't stupid, be they Christian or non Christian. When a man violates a woman's body, it's rape and nothing less.
> 
> I can't see the necessity for even asking such a question. Rape is rape...period! Be it in marriage or out. It doesn't take rocket science, the Bible or foolishness to answer such a question.


 
ITA....
THANK YOU SHIMMIE...

It's a sad sad SAD statement of humanity that this subject would be seen posited as question here,among women _by women _as potential for 'drama' among Christians... 
and thus "entertainment" 
Jesus was goaded and provoked.....I sure wished I had HIS patience 

that whole 'evil grin...evil laugh' bit & "LOL!"..... is scary and hurtful..insensitive

FYI .....think on this.... 
the woman next to you on the train... your manicurist....a woman family member....a beloved friend
_your sisters on this board where you get your hair tips to grow your hair_


evil? laugh?
indeed


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## MrsQueeny (Jul 23, 2008)

The same way God does not force His will on us, a husband cannot force his will for sex on his wife.  We as wives have a choice. Just like we as Christians chose to follow Christ.  God doesn't hold us down and make us obey Him. So if the creator wouldn't do it, no one else has the power to do so either.  So yes a man can rape his wife.  Q


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## Ms.Honey (Jul 23, 2008)

Queeny20 said:


> The same way God does not force His will on us, a husband cannot force his will for sex on his wife. We as wives have a choice. Just like we as Christians chose to follow Christ. God doesn't hold us down and make us obey Him. So if the creator wouldn't do it, no one else has the power to do so either. So yes a man can rape his wife. Q


 
ITA You should post this in the other thread


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

Highly Favored8 said:


> ^^^^^Thank You Shimmie,^^^^^
> 
> I agree it is just how the question is asked. It is not what you ask it it how you ask it?
> 
> ...


 


kayte said:


> ITA....
> THANK YOU SHIMMIE...
> 
> It's a sad sad SAD statement of humanity that this subject would be seen posited as question here,among women _by women _as potential for 'drama' among Christians...
> ...


 


Queeny20 said:


> The same way God does not force His will on us, a husband cannot force his will for sex on his wife. We as wives have a choice. Just like we as Christians chose to follow Christ. God doesn't hold us down and make us obey Him. So if the creator wouldn't do it, no one else has the power to do so either. So yes a man can rape his wife. Q


 
  Thank you ladies.   

I was a little 'miffed' about this question because of the 'intent' of it being asked here.  What was the point?   For something as serious as rape and the horrendous impact that it has on the lives of its victims, this is nothing to place 'mocking' posts about to see what the Christian perspective is.

From a Christian perspective, 'mine', I pray to God that those who asked this question as a joke in this thread never get raped to find out what anyone's opinion is regarding this heinous crime.   Rape is a disaster no matter the victim or the relationship they have with the person who has raped them.  

"evil laugh" ?????  What's the purpose of this?  May God have mercy...


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## cocoberry10 (Jul 23, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Thank you ladies.
> 
> I was a little 'miffed' about this question because of the 'intent' of it being asked here. What was the point? For something as serious as rape and the horrendous impact that it has on the lives of its victims, this is nothing to place 'mocking' posts about to see what the Christian perspective is.
> 
> ...


 

Shimmie, I don't think Whipz meant it at all as a joke. I've read many of her threads and posts, and I think she was trying to get a Christian perspective on the topic. She also posted it in off-topic. I've posted a thread in both Christian and off-topic to discuss (since not every member here is Christian).

I can't know 100%, but I definitely think Whipz was very seriously asking this question based on a discussion she had (or overheard).  I have heard this discussed by Christians before, especially in light of 1 Corinthians 7:3-5. Although as in all things, God will always look at the heart of a man, and his intent when he's doing something. I have an impossible time believing that God would justify a man who was selfish and arrogant enough to assert power over his wife to rape her, and try to find God in that

I definitely and always will believe rape is about asserting power and not about sex.


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## cocoberry10 (Jul 23, 2008)

Who I would really like to hear from are one of the four people that voted no. I am genuinely (and non-judgmentally) curious why some women think a man cannot rape his wife. It's going to be hard to truly have this discussion, since everyone posting seems to believe that the answer is a solid YES!


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

cocoberry10 said:


> Shimmie, I don't think Whipz meant it at all as a joke. I've read many of her threads and posts, and I think she was trying to get a Christian perspective on the topic. She also posted it in off-topic. I've posted a thread in both Christian and off-topic to discuss (since not every member here is Christian).
> 
> I can't know 100%, but I definitely think Whipz was very seriously asking this question based on a discussion she had (or overheard). I have heard this discussed by Christians before, especially in light of 1 Corinthians 7:3-5. Although as in all things, God will always look at the heart of a man, and his intent when he's doing something. I have an impossible time believing that God would justify a man who was selfish and arrogant enough to assert power over his wife to rape her, and try to find God in that
> 
> I definitely and always will believe rape is about asserting power and not about sex.


Hi Sweet Coco....

I love  Whipz and Blosssom.   It's the intro posts of this thread that are in question and the reason behind it.


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

I wonder who said I DON'T CARE!    That's horrible!


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm sorry... I didn't mean to upset you all.  Yes, in hindsight, it was insensitive and Whips and I would never make a joke about being raped.  We just wanted the perspective of Christian wives.  We didn't mean any harm.

We're sorry for having bothered you.


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## cocoberry10 (Jul 23, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> I'm sorry... I didn't mean to upset you all. Yes, in hindsight, it was insensitive and Whips and I would never make a joke about being raped. We just wanted the perspective of Christian wives. We didn't mean any harm.
> 
> We're sorry for having bothered you.


 
I don't think she meant you and Whipz. I think she was talking about the person that said from a Christian perspective women can't be raped!

I hope we all know women can be raped in marriage

I am still dying to hear from those that said no. I genuinely want to know why they think this (no attacking, just asking)


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## WhipEffectz1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Hi Sweet Coco....
> 
> I love  Whipz and Blosssom.   It's the intro posts of this thread that are in question and the reason behind it.



Shimmie, you know I love you too but its a question just like all the other "stupid" questions that are asked here. I also think it would make a good debate question if the people voting no would show up and explain why they think that way. Consequently, I don't think they will do so in fear of being massacred, called stupid, or labeled incompetent. 

CoCo, thanks for interpreting my question thoroughly!


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

WhipEffectz1 said:


> Shimmie, you know I love you too but its a question just like all the other "stupid" questions that are asked here. I also think it would make a good debate question if the people voting no would show up and explain why they think that way. Consequently, I don't think they will do so in fear of being massacred, called stupid, or labeled incompetent.
> 
> CoCo, thanks for interpreting my question thoroughly!


I'm glad we still love  each other  

You and Blosssom BEHAVE yourselves.


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> I'm sorry... I didn't mean to upset you all. Yes, in hindsight, it was insensitive and Whips and I would never make a joke about being raped. We just wanted the perspective of Christian wives. We didn't mean any harm.
> 
> We're sorry for having bothered you.


You didn't bother anyone.  I never stopped loving you   Never will.  Just behave yourself. 

I was trying to figure out what was going on and why the question was presented the way it was.   

Anyway, it's over and now we know that rape is still rape, no matter who it comes from or happens to.  

Love you much Blossssom....


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

cocoberry10 said:


> I don't think she meant you and Whipz. I think she was talking about the person that said from a Christian perspective women can't be raped!
> 
> I hope we all know women can be raped in marriage
> 
> I am still dying to hear from those that said no. I genuinely want to know why they think this (no attacking,* just asking*)



Yea, well don't!  LOL!

Again, the women who say know are going based on the Word... that is all and I'm sure it's their belief that a man who lives the Word wouldn't ever dream of raping his wife as he wouldn't have to if the wife is living by the Word as well... that's just my take on it 

I want to know (AND WHY) who said "I DON'T CARE!"  That's shocking to me 

Well, someone was talking about the evil grin and evil laughter, so she was clearly talking about me and Whipz, but we are truly sorry.  We didn't mean anything by it


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

WhipEffectz1 said:


> Shimmie, you know I love you too but its a question just like all the other "stupid" questions that are asked here. I also think it would make a good debate question if the people voting no would show up and explain why they think that way. Consequently, I don't think they will do so in fear of being massacred, called stupid, or labeled incompetent.
> 
> CoCo, thanks for interpreting my question thoroughly!



In my best Lucy Ewing voice:  No one under-STANDS ME!


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> You didn't bother anyone.  I never stopped loving you   Never will.  Just behave yourself.
> 
> I was trying to figure out what was going on and why the question was presented the way it was.
> 
> ...



Thank you, Shim... I love you too... it hurt me to think I hurt you when I was being foolish.  I'm glad you understand.  Your unwavering love and support means more than words can ever express *sniff*


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> In my best Lucy Ewing voice: No one under-STANDS ME!


I 'understand' you.  But there's someone else who loves and understands you even more.  Someone who loves you beyond any distance placed upon maps or even a GPS device.   Someone who loves you beyond the world wide web; beyond the universe, beyond the stars, beyond the Heavens above and the deepest of depths below.  

Someone loves you and so much so that you are all He cares and thinks about.  So much so, that if you at anytime have a need, it is His good pleasure to fulfill it for you beyond measure.  

Someone loves you beyond the hurts and disappointments that you had and have seen in this life.  Beyond the ones who have forsaken you and have disloyaled themselves to you and to the expectations that you had of them.  

Someone who will never disappoint you; never leave you; never mislead you neither bleed you dry of hope, love, and tears.   Someone who love for you demands nothing.   Only to give to you more love.  

This someone is Jesus.  Jesus who has your name written upon His heart.....forever.  And forever is just how long He will wait.......just for you, His beautiful and precious Blosssom.


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> Thank you, Shim... I love you too... it hurt me to think I hurt you when I was being foolish. I'm glad you understand. Your unwavering love and support means more than words can ever express *sniff*


  See, now you got me crying.  Cause I love you too, Blosss.  We're 'girls' forever.


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> I 'understand' you.  But there's someone else who loves and understands you even more.  Someone who loves you beyond any distance placed upon maps or even a GPS device.   Someone who loves you beyond the world wide web; beyond the universe, beyond the stars, beyond the Heavens above and the deepest of depths below.
> 
> Someone loves you and so much so that you are all He cares and thinks about.  So much so, that if you at anytime have a need, it is His good pleasure to fulfill it for you beyond measure.
> 
> ...



Thank you, Shim... you really should write professionally for a Christian magazine or maybe write a book with inspirational thoughts... that was absolutely beautiful...


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> Thank you, Shim... you really should write professionally for a Christian magazine or maybe write a book with inspirational thoughts... that was absolutely beautiful...


That was for you... "His Heart for Blosssom"


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## cocoberry10 (Jul 23, 2008)

WhipEffectz1 said:


> Shimmie, you know I love you too but its a question just like all the other "stupid" questions that are asked here. I also think it would make a good debate question if the people voting no would show up and explain why they think that way. Consequently, I don't think they will do so in fear of being massacred, called stupid, or labeled incompetent.
> 
> *CoCo, thanks for interpreting my question thoroughly!*


 

No problem! You know thoroughness is my specialty


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## WhipEffectz1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> Yea, well don't!  LOL!
> 
> Again, the women who say know are going based on the Word... that is all and I'm sure it's their belief that a man who lives the Word wouldn't ever dream of raping his wife as he wouldn't have to if the wife is living by the Word as well... that's just my take on it
> 
> ...



I'm not sorry for nothing but you can be.


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

WhipEffectz1 said:


> I'm not sorry for nothing but you can be.


Behave.......I putting both of you in time out away from your favorite hair products.


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Behave.......I putting both of you in time out away from your favorite hair products.



I've been wearing my "turban" all week with no end in sight, so time ME out!  LOL!


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## WhipEffectz1 (Jul 23, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Behave.......I putting both of you in time out away from your favorite hair products.



You better ask somebody, I been fell off that bandwagon! I keep it simple.


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## leeshbeesh (Jul 23, 2008)

Queeny20 said:


> The same way God does not force His will on us, a husband cannot force his will for sex on his wife.  We as wives have a choice. Just like we as Christians chose to follow Christ.  God doesn't hold us down and make us obey Him. So if the creator wouldn't do it, no one else has the power to do so either.  So yes a man can rape his wife.  Q




IA I was going to use this same point!


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## PaperClip (Jul 23, 2008)

I don't like the way Oprah "dismisses" the Bible folk and the obey thing. I don't know if anybody else caught that.

And yes, rape can occur with in marriage....

Can a woman rape a man as well?


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## Blossssom (Jul 23, 2008)

WhipEffectz1 said:


> You better ask somebody, I been fell off that bandwagon! I keep it simple.



Yea, water and dishwashing detergent!


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## Ramya (Jul 23, 2008)

...... I never thought this would be a question that someone would need to ask.


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## Nice & Wavy (Jul 23, 2008)

FoxyScholar said:


> I don't like the way Oprah "dismisses" the Bible folk and the obey thing. I don't know if anybody else caught that.
> 
> And yes, rape can occur with in marriage....
> 
> Can a woman rape a man as well?


 
Well, Oprah hasn't met US yet either....

We wouldn't let her get that "diss" in at all.  She would know wassup!

If a woman "take" a man like that....most probably he won't mind, seriously...men can be like that because of their fantasy mind...they are always thinking something wild and weird anyway, so even if a woman really wanted to do it, he would enjoy it.

BUT, if she tied him up and really hurt him, like in the "back door" or something....now that then would be considered rape for sure


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> I've been wearing my "turban" all week with no end in sight, so time ME out!  LOL!





WhipEffectz1 said:


> You better ask somebody, I been fell off that bandwagon! I keep it simple.



I'm hiding the turban and the simple method from both of you. 

You both knew I was going to see this thread and put my rant into it...I was baited. Shame on you, both.  

Now I have to get deep and answer the question if a woman can rape a man....

Now see what you both done started up in here...     Pitiful, the two of you, just pitiful.  

I love you both though...


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

Nice & Wavy said:


> *Well, Oprah hasn't met US yet either....*
> 
> We wouldn't let her get that "diss" in at all.  *She would know wassup!*
> 
> ...


Okay.... lemme get up off the floor  .    :rofl3:   

The thing is with rape is that a woman is NOT aroused therefore she is an unwilling victim.  Seriously....she has been attacked / violated against her will.  

Now on the other hand, a woman cannot rape a man unless she is able to obtain penetration and that won't occur unless he is aroused.  And if he is aroused he is a willing partner. 

See ---  there are some men who tried to tell his wife he was 'forced' and that 'she' made him do it.   ummmmm, nah=uh... 

NOW, I do believe that a man can be raped by another man.  It happens in jail all the time.


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## Shimmie (Jul 23, 2008)

FoxyScholar said:


> I don't like the way Oprah "dismisses" the Bible folk and the obey thing. I don't know if anybody else caught that.
> 
> And yes, rape can occur with in marriage....
> 
> * Can a woman rape a man as well*?



Why you startin' stuff up in here...  I can't even give this a straight faced answer.  

  Just so you know, you're still my little sis.


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## kayte (Jul 23, 2008)

> *Well, someone was talking about the evil grin and evil laughter, so she was clearly talking about me and Whipz*


 
Yeah..well that would be me..and that was known ..so whatever



> Yes! LOL!
> You really posted here, huh?
> Now let's see what happens *evil grin*
> 
> ...


I stand by what I said..

For the record.....the question was not the issue for me
It was the ensuing progression of comments 



> *If a woman "take" a man like that....most probably he won't mind,? seriously...men can be like that because of their fantasy mind...they are always thinking something wild and weird anyway, so even if a woman really wanted to do it, he would enjoy it.*


 
Here another example of a question asked earlier with all sincerity and responded to as foolery...
yes...a man can be victimized and maybe not in the same way...it's called sodomy...or there are other forms of sexually violating a male.and ways to induce him to a state where he could be violated..and...no it is not some dormant fantasy come true..that's as sterotypical,ignorant and shocking as saying _the woman enjoys it..._it is a horror and it's traumatic for all vicims regardless of gender..regardless of gender of the perpetrator and yes sometimes a woman can be the perpetrator/ abuser and this is probaby the most under-reported to police because of precisely what this thread is doing...furthering myths by treating rape...as a joke

You _think _that there is no correlation with your thoughts and actions on a moral scale or even with an actual rape victim male or female
but in fact ...we are all connected...laughing icons and levity...trivializing this _perpetrates the tragedy_ and does NOTHING to empower solution..it's destructive energy and it is NOT OF GOD...has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with GOD
(shrug) Different values, I guess. 

Be wise in the way you act toward outsiders; make the most of every opportunity. Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone. 

_*Ephesians 4:29* – “Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.” _


_*Leviticus 19:16* – “Do not go about spreading slander among your people. Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor’s life. I am the Lord.” (NIV)_


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## Farida (Jul 24, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Okay.... lemme get up off the floor  .    :rofl3:
> 
> The thing is with rape is that a woman is NOT aroused therefore she is an unwilling victim.  Seriously....she has been attacked / violated against her will.
> 
> ...



Arousal is not synonymous with consent. Arousal is an involuntary act. I read an article which talked about how some women have a hard time dealing with the fact that they were raped because their lady parts got really wet. It is a reflex response, the way our bodies are designed not a conscious decision. 

You can read some more:
http://www.ncvc.org/ncvc/main.aspx?dbName=DocumentViewer&DocumentID=32361#3

You may be aroused by someone, but it doesn't mean you are okay with having sex with him/her


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## discobiscuits (Jul 24, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Now on the other hand, a woman cannot rape a man unless she is able to obtain penetration and that won't occur unless he is aroused.*  And if he is aroused he is a willing partner. *


A man's penis can and will get an erection regardless of his state of arousal. Conversely, a man can be aroused but not get an erection. Erection does not = arousal. Even _some _paraplegic men are capable of erections even though they may be paralyzed. A penis will react to stimulation from a variety of sources, the most effective of which is touch. So, a woman can stimulate a man's penis to elicit an erection and proceed to commit sexual acts upon said man with out his consent. Of course this is very rare but it does happen, just as it happens that men are the victims of battery in domestic violence at the hands of women. We can speculate as much as we would like about the reasons a man "allows" himself to be victimized by a woman (term used extremely loosely as it is not true that men or women "allow" mistreatment). We can say that he did not want to hurt her by fending her off, as he may be stronger than she. We can say he was a "Norbit" to a "Rasputia" (NO jokes here, just making sure you get the image I'm trying to convey) and physically weaker than the woman and unable to fight her off. We can say that he wanted it anyway, what man does not want to get laid.  But no matter what reason and/or fallacy we try to attach to a man being raped by a woman and regardless of its rarity, it does happen and the man does not have to be "aroused" to get raped, he just needs an erection which is a natural, physiological and biological response to stimulation; wanted or unwanted.


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## Nice & Wavy (Jul 24, 2008)

.................................


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## Nice & Wavy (Jul 24, 2008)

................................


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## Nice & Wavy (Jul 24, 2008)

> You _think _that there is no correlation with your thoughts and actions on a moral scale or even with an actual rape victim male or female
> but in fact ...we are all connected...laughing icons and levity...trivializing this _perpetrates the tragedy_ and does NOTHING to empower solution..it's destructive energy and it is NOT OF GOD...has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with GOD
> (shrug) Different values, I guess.




First of all, sis...if you would have read what I said, I did NOT say rape, I said 


> "If a woman *"take"* a man like that....most probably he won't mind, seriously...men can be like that because of their fantasy mind...they are always thinking something wild and weird anyway, so even if a woman really wanted to do it, he would enjoy it.
> 
> BUT, if she tied him up and really hurt him, like in the *"back door"* or something....now that then would be considered rape for sure Yesterday 05:54 PM


 
I wasn't make light of the situation, I meant what I said because as a woman who ministers, along with MY HUSBAND many times with couples, we get to talk about these types of things and 98% of the men have said that they will get aroused if their wife "took" it so to speak. A man cannot be raped by a woman in the same way a man can rape a woman....it's not the same.

We may not have the same values, but if you noticed, I used a laughing smiley when the OP talked about Oprah and you saw my response to that and yes, I used a smiley because I thought that was funny.

If you choose to be that serious about what I said, then that's ok, but don't say that what I said is NOT of God...that's a serious judgement about something that is truth.

If you would have really understood what I was saying, you wouldn't have jumped on me that way....you could have asked if I could have expounded on what I said and I would have told you.

I deal with woman who have been raped...people who have been very close to me have dealt with this. I've gotten up at 3am to go to the hospital when this type of thing has happened and have prayed with the victim and the family. I take this very seriously...but, because you don't know me, you make a judgement about me....that's sad indeed.

I hope that we can continue to walk in the spirit of "love" in this forum and not walk in division. I've been on this forum too long and I know that most of the people who have been on here for quite awhile, know my heart and know that I would NOT trivilize something like 'rape'.

Blessings to you and yours....N&W


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## Shimmie (Jul 24, 2008)

vivmaiko said:


> Arousal is not synonymous with consent. Arousal is an involuntary act. I read an article which talked about how some women have a hard time dealing with the fact that they were raped because their lady parts got really wet. It is a reflex response, the way our bodies are designed not a conscious decision.
> 
> You can read some more:
> http://www.ncvc.org/ncvc/main.aspx?dbName=DocumentViewer&DocumentID=32361#3
> ...


 


h.e.a.d.s.t.r.o.n.g. said:


> A man's penis can and will get an erection regardless of his state of arousal. Conversely, a man can be aroused but not get an erection. Erection does not = arousal. Even _some _paraplegic men are capable of erections even though they may be paralyzed. A penis will react to stimulation from a variety of sources, the most effective of which is touch. So, a woman can stimulate a man's penis to elicit an erection and proceed to commit sexual acts upon said man with out his consent. Of course this is very rare but it does happen, just as it happens that men are the victims of battery in domestic violence at the hands of women. We can speculate as much as we would like about the reasons a man "allows" himself to be victimized by a woman (term used extremely loosely as it is not true that men or women "allow" mistreatment).
> 
> We can say that he did not want to hurt her by fending her off, as he may be stronger than she. We can say he was a "Norbit" to a "Rasputia" (NO jokes here, just making sure you get the image I'm trying to convey) and physically weaker than the woman and unable to fight her off.
> 
> We can say that he wanted it anyway, what man does not want to get laid. But no matter what reason and/or fallacy we try to attach to a man being raped by a woman and regardless of its rarity, it does happen and the man does not have to be "aroused" to get raped, he just needs an erection which is a natural, physiological and biological response to stimulation; wanted or unwanted.


Thank you ladies.  I know where you both are coming from.  I can 'see' where a 'rare' situation such as this can arise with a grown man.  And it would have to be 'rare' and under extreme and vunerable circumstances.

*On an even more serious and tragic side.*  I do indeed see a woman committing an act of rape upon a child or upon a man who may be mentally or physically disabled, a man in a position where he truly does not have the capacity to make a sound judgement or able to fend for himself.   There are some truly sick women in this world who prey upon those unable to defend or make rational concious decisions for themselves.  

Back to a grown man, with all of his capacities and able to fend for himself, I don't see it as rape.  He is able to get up and walk away.  

Women live this everyday, that a man choses whether or not he wants to sleep with her or not, or someone else.


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## kayte (Jul 24, 2008)

> I hope that we can continue to walk in the spirit of "love" in this forum and not walk in division


 

8 Love never ends. There are gifts of prophecy, but they will be ended. There are gifts of speaking in different languages, but those gifts will stop. There is the gift of knowledge, but it will come to an end.9 The reason is that our knowledge and our ability to prophesy are not perfect.10 But when perfection comes, the things that are not perfect will end.11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became an adult, I stopped those childish ways.12 It is the same with us. Now we see a dim reflection, as if we were looking into a mirror, but then we shall see clearly. Now I know only a part, but then I will know fully, as God has known me.13 So these three things continue forever: faith, hope, and love. And the greatest of these is love.

Be blessed,beloved:Rose:


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## Nefertiti0906 (Jul 24, 2008)

amerikan said:


> ...... I never thought this would be a question that someone would need to ask.


 
Unfortunately some people really don't know.

At a church event I was attending a while ago, they had a marriage seminar.  This is one of the questions asked.

Do you know that some men said "no", as in it's not possible for a man to rape his wife because it's his?! 

In chauvanistic cultures, this is the norm...


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## Farida (Jul 24, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Thank you ladies.  I know where you both are coming from.  I can 'see' where a 'rare' situation such as this can arise with a grown man.  And it would have to be 'rare' and under extreme and vunerable circumstances.
> 
> *On an even more serious and tragic side.*  I do indeed see a woman committing an act of rape upon a child or upon a man who may be mentally or physically disabled, a man in a position where he truly does not have the capacity to make a sound judgement or able to fend for himself.   There are some truly sick women in this world who prey upon those unable to defend or make rational concious decisions for themselves.
> 
> ...



I will say a woman raping a man is possible but not very probable, because for the most part a man can fight a woman off a lot easier than vice versa. I do remember in high school reading a story about these girls at an all-boarding school who got together in a group, overpowered and raped the security guard at their dorm. As in, some girls held him down while the others took turns. I was shocked. You never expect that behavior from females. The man didn't want to be involved because they were minors and he knew he'd lose his job and be prosecuted.


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## Shimmie (Jul 24, 2008)

vivmaiko said:


> I will say a woman raping a man is possible but not very probable, because for the most part a man can fight a woman off a lot easier than vice versa. I do remember in high school reading a story about these girls at an all-boarding school who got together in a group, overpowered and raped the security guard at their dorm.
> 
> As in, some girls held him down while the others took turns. I was shocked. You never expect that behavior from females. The man didn't want to be involved because they were minors and he knew he'd lose his job and be prosecuted.


Viv, isn't that frightening?  What kind of demonic influence were these girls under?  They obviously thought it was a joke.    I can't even imagine the horror that this man went through.  

The beauty and the sacredness of sexual intimacy between a man and a woman (husband and wife) has been literally 'raped' itsself.  No longer has society chosen to preserve the beauty of this precious and pure gift from God.  Instead, it has become an endangered species. 

I hold dear this gift, even more.  Let it live a full life deserving of honor within my heart and the heart of my husband, where no evil may tread upon...ever.  

In Jesus's name...for all marriages this I pray.  Amen and Amen. :heart2:


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## caligirl (Jul 25, 2008)

kayte said:


> yes and God help the wife ..some do..and never get reported.....
> you may as well ask can a man kill his wife..yes and some do
> conjugal co-rights never equates abuse...sex by force..
> that has nothing to do with the sanctity of the marriage under the law of God.....it's tragic and as already pointed out.... unlawful and punishable by God ..and by human laws
> ...



Thank you for saying this.  How can we joke about rape?  NO ONE has the right to force someone else to have sex.


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## Blossssom (Jul 25, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> I'm hiding the turban and the simple method from both of you.
> 
> You both knew I was going to see this thread and put my rant into it...I was baited. Shame on you, both.
> 
> ...



Pitiful?  I'm downright PATHETIC!  LOL!

Happy Friday, Shim!


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## Blossssom (Jul 25, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Okay.... lemme get up off the floor  .    :rofl3:
> 
> The thing is with rape is that a woman is NOT aroused therefore she is an unwilling victim.  Seriously....she has been attacked / violated against her will.
> 
> ...



Yes, I would like to see how many cases of male rape by a woman that are on the books?  Not many, I would imagine.

Not saying it's impossible, but... good luck proving it!


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## Blossssom (Jul 25, 2008)

kayte said:


> Yeah..well that would be me..and that was known ..so whatever
> 
> 
> I stand by what I said..



Why am I not surprised it was you?  LOL!

Yes, you should stand by what you say, I know I do, but I also know when an apology is required, and I made that... but I'm sure you "skipped" it!


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## Blossssom (Jul 25, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Thank you ladies.  I know where you both are coming from.  I can 'see' where a 'rare' situation such as this can arise with a grown man.  And it would have to be 'rare' and under extreme and vunerable circumstances.
> 
> *On an even more serious and tragic side.*  I do indeed see a woman committing an act of rape upon a child or upon a man who may be mentally or physically disabled, a man in a position where he truly does not have the capacity to make a sound judgement or able to fend for himself.   There are some truly sick women in this world who prey upon those unable to defend or make rational concious decisions for themselves.
> 
> ...



What about the 68 year-old woman that had the 34 year-old man performing oral sex on her?


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## Shimmie (Jul 27, 2008)

Blossssom said:


> What about the 68 year-old woman that had the 34 year-old man performing oral sex on her?


   Women are getting dangerous.  This is scarey; the thought that he was unable to get away from her.  Sick....just plain sick.   

Hugs Blosssom.  Happy Sunday Angel.


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## carcajada (Jul 27, 2008)

vivmaiko said:


> I will say a woman raping a man is possible but not very probable, because for the most part a man can fight a woman off a lot easier than vice versa. I do remember in high school reading a story about these girls at an all-boarding school who got together in a group, overpowered and raped the security guard at their dorm. As in, some girls held him down while the others took turns. I was shocked. You never expect that behavior from females. The man didn't want to be involved because they were minors and he knew he'd lose his job and be prosecuted.



Terrible!



Blossssom said:


> Yes, I would like to see how many cases of male rape by a woman that are on the books?  Not many, I would imagine.
> 
> Not saying it's impossible, but... good luck proving it!



They probably do not report the incidences. 

I know a guy who was almost raped in college. He was a basketball player and took medication to help him sleep. Well, he said two girls called his room (later discovered they were "big" girls), check to see if he sounded like he had taken his medicine by asking where his roommate was, went over to his dorm with rope and textbooks (I kid you not), and knocked on his door. When he answered the door they shoved the door open and hit him on the head the textbook. His suite mates heard the commotion but figured the guy was just having wild sex. They were struggling to tie him up when he said he cried out that someone was trying to kill him (because that's what he thought at first). The suit mates came in and helped and campus police were called. It was only after the girls were questioned that they found out the girls were trying to have sex with him. It was not reported to the local police nor did it go on record. 

I was laughing as he told me about it, but stopped laughing when I saw the look on his face.  My initial reaction is probably one reason why cases of female raping males aren't reported.


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## Shimmie (Jul 28, 2008)

ClassyND said:


> Terrible!
> 
> They probably do not report the incidences.
> 
> ...


 
This is scarey... 

You would think that women would think before acting on something like this.  It's not a joke.  There are too many cases of men who have 'gang raped' a helpless woman; it's wrong!  The same applies to women who 'gang rape' men.  It's still wrong.  

I have to apologize, for I'm been so focused as women being victims that I never ever considered a man being a victim of being raped by a female or females as well.   But as you shared, it's probably never reported when it happens to a man.  

There are cases of many women who are afraid or ashamed to report that she has been raped.  The same would defintely apply to a man, as I can see in these circumstances shared in this thread. 

Women have really gone off the charts with crazy and sick behaviors.


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## kayte (Jul 28, 2008)

> Yes, you should stand by what you say, I know I do, but I also know when an apology is required, and I made that... but I'm sure you "skipped" it!



Actually ..the thread was distressing on so many levels it took a lot of courage for me to take a stand on it.... as unpopular and personally upsetting as that was...... and while skipping over nothing..it registered that there was a lot of confusion for me

However, I'm very glad to not only see the tenor of the thread changed considerably but that a lot of unfortunate myths were brought to light
and re-examined and in their place significant information was deciminated...and we are all now better educated for it..
I know God was guiding the process and that was a blessing and
and I wish the same for you
be blessed

to clear up a misunderstanding


> Why am I not surprised it was you? LOL!



confused why anyone could be 'surprised'...there was no attempt to disguise my statements and if there was a misunderstanding about that..then I apologize because my post was not..nor was it intended to be anonymous..it had my name and pics/siggy etc  of me for all to see and clearly identify

remain blessed
~~~~~K~~~~~


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## Paradox (Aug 12, 2008)

especially when he hurts her.
men who rape wives, will use the Bible to justify their actions, yet they don't even follow their biblical duty to love their wives as christ loved the church.


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## He_Leads_I_follow (Aug 12, 2008)

......---------------------------------


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## GV-NA-GI-TLV-GE-I (Aug 18, 2008)

I mean, honestly.  Force for sex?  Rape is a violent crime.  What's the difference if someone is married?  Maybe the victims should hot-poker his penis and see how he feels having something shoved up an orifice unwillingly!  For Pete's sake.


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## Mz.Shug (Sep 5, 2008)

_Can_they yes....anyone can do anything......Is it justified in the Lord's eyes? I don't believe so.


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## silenttullip (Jun 24, 2009)

I'm all behind marriage. I said maybe because if he forces you to do it against your will THERE IS NO LOVE IN THAT and the man should love his wife as christ loves the church. He always protected and defended everything God stood for.
On the other hand if it's a playful dominance thing I don't consider that rape. We both men and women should be understanding and try to oblige when the other has sexual needs but NO ONE should be forced.


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## rayness (Jun 25, 2009)

I know this thread is old but it is ironic that I am on this board right now and I am watching "What's Love got to do with it?" and that rape scene just occured.  I would say YES a woman can be raped in her marriage and I personally know someone who was who is very close to me.  She did not press charges but I wish that she would have.


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## Laela (Jun 25, 2009)

Rape is an act of violence, and morally wrong, like any other sin.  




WhipEffectz1 said:


> thinking....
> 
> *Coming from a religious standpoint only!*


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## caligirl (Jul 16, 2009)

Why is this even a question for debate?  This discussion is very disturbing.

Mods: can you please change the title of this thread so it doesn't pop up on the main forum page or close this thread.


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