# Sweden And Immigration: Why Black Women Should Care



## Chicoro (Oct 27, 2019)

There is an anti-immigration sentiment rising in Sweden, as is in many Western countries. My goal is to inform you and let you know about the information that you are not likely to hear about in a travel vlog.

The title is what is really happening in Sweden, Greta


----------



## intellectualuva (Oct 27, 2019)

It's been rising in all the western countries since 2015. Interestingly its not just black immigrants they have an issue with, but the Syrians into Germany for example are getting strife. 

I will say this...technically she is correct. Sweden can't solve the worlds problems and it is unsustainable for many western countries to support large influx of immigrants...even if they did break/destabilize some of these countries. I just don't know what the solution is because people clearly are in need of help around the world. I know for a fact that if something pops off here in the states, I'm looking at a list of western countries to resettle myself.


----------



## Kanky (Oct 27, 2019)

I understand not wanting to deal with a large number of immigrants using up all of the welfare and you can’t save everyone. They need to remain in their own countries and fix things.


----------



## Laela (Oct 28, 2019)

This is just the fallout from Colonialism that has been reverberating for years.... a simmering pot, if you will.  These immigrants are coming from places that have been exploited to the max and now  are largely wastelands; so they are seeking refuge in the very countries that caused their demise.
You can't talk about anti-immigrant sentiments without bigotry/racism rearing its ugly  head else you have your head in the sand.
These nations have hoarded the wealth and don't care to share it with anyone who doesn't look or worship or live the way they do. Yeah, "When in Rome..."
Lest we forget that for centuries, these nations have gone to Africa and parts of Asia and imposed their languages and religions on the natives....it's  happening to them now and it's utterly intolerable.


----------



## dicapr (Oct 28, 2019)

Kanky said:


> I understand not wanting to deal with a large number of immigrants using up all of the welfare and you can’t save everyone. They need to remain in their own countries and fix things.



That is just the smoke screen. Most countries spouting this type of rhetoric don’t what “those” types of immigrants ie non white non secular. If the outcry was about immigration in general I could sympathize. But it is about the immigration of those deemed undesirable that is their real issue.


----------



## RoundEyedGirl504 (Oct 28, 2019)

This cycle will go on in perpetuity, as it has happened before. Destabilizing the economies and political infrastructure of other countries for your own gain will always result in the chickens coming home to roost. Globalization and the internet just sped up the cycle. And true to form we start seeing a rise in nationalism,anti-immigrant rhetoric because the not only are the other countries getting screwed, their own citizens are getting screwed as well.


----------



## Kanky (Oct 28, 2019)

dicapr said:


> That is just the smoke screen. Most countries spouting this type of rhetoric don’t what “those” types of immigrants ie non white non secular. If the outcry was about immigration in general I could sympathize. But it is about the immigration of those deemed undesirable that is their real issue.


I assume that white people are racist until they prove otherwise. Still a lot of people are mad about immigrants period. One of the complaints behind brexit was white Eastern Europeans coming over and working for lower salaries. 

Immigrants that don’t assimilate can be a problem when there are a large numbers of them. For example here we have huge numbers of people who only speak Spanish and don’t need to learn English at home because of the ways that we accommodate them. This happens at the expense of the people who were already here. A lot of poor black schools now have the additional burden of teaching English as a second language. Jobs require people to speak Spanish which puts the native population at a disadvantage. The immigrants are often anti-African American racists themselves.  

It is not racist to not want to pay taxes to support  a large number of immigrants while the people who actually contributed are suffering.


----------



## Crackers Phinn (Oct 28, 2019)

Kanky said:


> I understand not wanting to deal with a large number of immigrants using up all of the welfare and you can’t save everyone.* They need to remain in their own countries and fix things*.


Nonblack Muslim immigrants aside (because they are go be fine), due to Post Traumatic Slave/Colonialism Syndromes, it is impossible for black immigrants to remain in their own countries and fix things.  In order to to do better it is imperative for black people to go live in racist white countries and just tell everyone that one day they will go back to their homeland which they are never going to do but it sounds like something they are supposed to say.

I have said for years that black folks have it within us to take over the world or at least make our own corners of the world enviable.   Black folks have told me that we can't do it because of white supremacy, institutionalized racism and colonialism so I'm done arguing.


----------



## dicapr (Oct 28, 2019)

Kanky said:


> I assume that white people are racist until they prove otherwise. Still a lot of people are mad about immigrants period. One of the complaints behind brexit was white Eastern Europeans coming over and working for lower salaries.
> 
> Immigrants that don’t assimilate can be a problem when there are a large numbers of them. For example here we have huge numbers of people who only speak Spanish and don’t need to learn English at home because of the ways that we accommodate them. This happens at the expense of the people who were already here. A lot of poor black schools now have the additional burden of teaching English as a second language. Jobs require people to speak Spanish which puts the native population at a disadvantage. The immigrants are often anti-African American racists themselves.
> 
> It is not racist to not want to pay taxes to support  a large number of immigrants while the people who actually contributed are suffering.



That is assuming that immigrants are Hispanic. I don’t see anyone up in arms when Asians come to this country not speaking English and needing second language programs-but they do. 

One again it’s the narrative of the undesirable. Plus the same complaint about not liking the American black can be said for immigrants from anywhere-including predominately black countries.


----------



## Farida (Oct 28, 2019)

dicapr said:


> That is assuming that immigrants are Hispanic. I don’t see anyone up in arms when Asians come to this country not speaking English and needing second language programs-but they do.
> 
> One again it’s the narrative of the undesirable. Plus the same complaint about not liking the American black can be said for immigrants from anywhere-including predominately black countries.


There is still very much the idea of Asians as the model minority in the US. When in fact immigrants such as Nigerians are killing it. They are usually in the STEM field or achieve post-grad degrees at a higher rate than any other group, including natives.

I straight up saw an article on Fox about chain migration and the title was something like “Every Mexican Immigrant brings Six relatives.” Chain migration is available to everyone but they made that headline for a reason.


----------



## Crackers Phinn (Oct 28, 2019)

dicapr said:


> That is assuming that immigrants are Hispanic. *I don’t see anyone up in arms when Asians come to this country not speaking English and needing second language programs-but they do. *



It's always happened and sometimes makes it to the news, it's just that as black people, we don't really care.


----------



## dicapr (Oct 28, 2019)

Crackers Phinn said:


> It's always happened and sometimes makes it to the news, it's just that as black people, we don't really care.



I rarely hear it about Asians. More of the rhetoric is against Spanish speakers. For some reason blacks think that we should be fighting to the bottom over jobs that barely make minimum wage. The thing is many Hispanic immigrants-especially white ones-melt into American society quite easily. It’s only the darker ones that can’t pass for white that are the issue.


----------



## Kanky (Oct 28, 2019)

dicapr said:


> I rarely hear it about Asians. More of the rhetoric is against Spanish speakers. For some reason blacks think that we should be fighting to the bottom over jobs that barely make minimum wage. The thing is many Hispanic immigrants-especially white ones-melt into American society quite easily. It’s only the darker ones that can’t pass for white that are the issue.


A lot of the jobs in question are government jobs which are very important to the black middle class. If you only speak English and have a job that deals with the public and the public doesn’t speak English then you have a problem. There are a lot of jobs where you need to speak English and Spanish and they aren’t all “barely minimum wage.”

I hear it about Asians too, but a lot of the Asian immigrants are college educated and English speaking. There also a lot fewer of them.


----------



## Crackers Phinn (Oct 28, 2019)

dicapr said:


> I rarely hear it about Asians. More of the rhetoric is against Spanish speakers.* For some reason blacks think that we should be fighting to the bottom over jobs that barely make minimum wage*. The thing is many Hispanic immigrants-especially white ones-melt into American society quite easily. It’s only the darker ones that can’t pass for white that are the issue.


I fully agree that the bolded is hustling backwards.  Where Asian's catch the most hell is on college campuses and that's been consistent yearly since I was in college 20+ years ago.  After Trump got into office there have been more documented attacks by the "Speak English" whites but they aren't physically intimidated by Asians so there's less 911 calls hoping someone gets shot.


----------



## Farida (Oct 28, 2019)

Crackers Phinn said:


> I fully agree that the bolded is hustling backwards.  Where Asian's catch the most hell is on college campuses and that's been consistent yearly since I was in college 20+ years ago.  After Trump got into office there have been more documented attacks by the "Speak English" whites but they aren't physically intimidated by Asians so there's less 911 calls hoping someone gets shot.


Yeah  and people are so against the so-called border-hoppers and claim national security...when I point out 9/11 was by middle easterners who came on visas...crickets.

Asians are also running asylum and birth tourism scams making lots of money and bringing people here illegally. Most of us send our kids to college not for the jobs hispanics are “stealing.”

Don’t even get me started on how Trump and his family benefit from both legal servitude and illegal labor for their businesses.


----------



## dicapr (Oct 29, 2019)

Kanky said:


> A lot of the jobs in question are government jobs which are very important to the black middle class. If you only speak English and have a job that deals with the public and the public doesn’t speak English then you have a problem. There are a lot of jobs where you need to speak English and Spanish and they aren’t all “barely minimum wage.”
> 
> I hear it about Asians too, but a lot of the Asian immigrants are college educated and English speaking. There also a lot fewer of them.



I’m not understanding your point. So now you need to upgrade your skills to maintain a job. Yes it involves learning a second language. Is the point that you shouldn’t have to because immigrants should learn to speak English? 

 Being bilingual is a huge plus across the board and not just for government jobs. It means increase in pay and opportunities. And if immigrants are taking those jobs it’s because they learned a second language even if it is English. 

I have to basically relearn my entire job every few years. So I don’t understand the resistance to upgrading and learning new skills. I’ve heard coworkers grumble when it’s time to upgrade technology and procedures but I’ve always enjoyed it. Maybe it’s just my own weird little tic. I like learning and expanding my knowledge even if it is for my job.


----------



## Kanky (Oct 29, 2019)

dicapr said:


> I’m not understanding your point. So now you need to upgrade your skills to maintain a job. Yes it involves learning a second language. Is the point that you shouldn’t have to because immigrants should learn to speak English?
> 
> Being bilingual is a huge plus across the board and not just for government jobs. It means increase in pay and opportunities. And if immigrants are taking those jobs it’s because they learned a second language even if it is English.
> 
> I have to basically relearn my entire job every few years. So I don’t understand the resistance to upgrading and learning new skills. I’ve heard coworkers grumble when it’s time to upgrade technology and procedures but I’ve always enjoyed it. Maybe it’s just my own weird little tic. I like learning and expanding my knowledge even if it is for my job.



Language is most effectively learned by immersion. It is a lot easier for a person who speaks Spanish to learn English in America than it is for English speakers to learn Spanish. When jobs require you to be bilingual they are usually looking for people who speak the language as well as a native. That kind of mastery of comes from immersion. (For example, 3 months in France did more for my French than years of practice in the US.)

I will never be in favor of anything that puts AA’s at a  disadvantage.


----------



## Kanky (Oct 29, 2019)

Again, these aren’t minimum wage jobs that we are discussing. These jobs are literally the backbone of the black middle class. I am not suggesting that black people fight to pick tomatoes and clean toilets.  


*Hispanics following African Americans’ example in finding government jobs*
Emily Wax-Thibodeaux





*Correction:* An earlier version of this story inaccurately reported the percentages of Hispanics and African Americans in the U.S. population. The story has been corrected. 

Iraq war veteran Chris Gomez, a Mexican American, was sure he was a perfect candidate for a government job. He had a bachelor’s degree in criminal justice and was still serving in the Army Reserve as a sergeant first class. 

For two years, month after month, he sent off applications to the Labor Department, the Bureau of Prisons and other federal agencies. They seemed to disappear. Where to? He didn’t know. He was never sure whom to call or how to follow up.

“I almost gave up,” Gomez said.

With a wave of government retirements opening the way for a new generation of federal employees, Hispanic Americans, the nation’s fastest-growing minority group, remain chronically
underrepresented in the government. And Hispanics say in large part that they are hamstrung because they lack the kind of contacts and networks that have helped African Americans secure federal jobs.

In the years after President John F. Kennedy tried to make government a model of fair hiring practices, African American fraternities and sororities — known as the “Divine Nine” — along with mentoring programs and fellowships helped unlock federal jobs and carve out a path to the middle class for hundreds of thousands of blacks. African American families often have become their own networks, and it is common, especially in Washington, to find multiple relatives across several generations all working for the government. 

LatinoMagazine.com article put it this way: “Tio Sam [Uncle Sam] has not yet been able to make any real progress.”

The numbers are stark. Just 8.2 percent of about 1.9 million federal workers are Hispanic, compared with 15 percent in the private sector, according to an Office of Personnel Management report released in September. By contrast, African Americans make up 18.2 percent of the federal workforce, nearly double their percentage in the private sector. (Hispanics represent 17 percent of the U.S. population, while African Americans make up 13 percent, according to the Census Bureau.)

“Our community could be way ahead financially if we were able to participate in federal government hiring the way African Americans did,” said Edward Valenzuela, co-chairman of the national Coalition for Fairness for Hispanics in Government.

Ultimately, it was Valenzuela’s group that provided the network Gomez needed. Gomez realized that his aunt was married to one of the leaders in the coalition and turned to it for help. The group identified job openings and guided him through the application process.

“There’s a real need for mentors to walk young Hispanics through the maze that is government culture,” Gomez said. “If I had that earlier, that would have changed everything for me.”

Before he completely abandoned the search, he landed a government job at a veterans hospital in Waco, Tex., working with traumatized military service members.

Family tradition

Established at the start of the 20th century, the Divine Nine fraternities and sororities promoted leadership training, networking and mentoring programs for African Americans. The aim was to help graduates find jobs in what was considered a highly hostile mainstream environment, according to a compilation of essays called “African American Fraternities and Sororities: The Legacy and the Vision.” 

These groups operate much the same way today, with graduate mentors assigned to pledges, guiding them not just through college life but through life after college, letting them know about job openings and holding job fairs.

“It’s an amazing thing, because you get a mentor right from Day One,” said Kayla Taylor, 20, a Howard University student and member of Alpha Kappa Alpha, established by African American college women in 1908 at Howard University.

When Taylor joined, she mentioned her interest in public service, and the sorority matched her with a mentor who works as an international affairs lawyer in the State Department. “That sort of contact really helps the process of getting a federal job feel way more doable,” she said. 

The story of African American employment in the government is not, of course, a fairy tale. Blacks have faced discrimination over the years in securing jobs and moving up.



Gladys Derricotte, 90, recalls the resistance she encountered during her long federal career. In the 1980s, she joined a successful class-action lawsuit alleging that African Americans faced discrimination when it came to promotions. 

But Derricotte is the matriarch of a Washington family that exemplifies how kinship has helped African Americans move into the federal workforce through tradition and encouragement.

As a young woman, she came to Washington from Texas fresh from secretarial school after hearing from relatives who had migrated to the capital that the Government Accountability Office had clerical work. She married Randolph Derricotte, 88, who had come from rural Virginia and got a job at the Postal Service. Together, they put in more than 70 years with the federal government, opening the way for their children and grandchildren.



“ ‘Go on and get yourself a good government job!’ When we were coming up that’s all we heard,” recalled their daughter Denise Derricotte, 61, of Northeast Washington, who has worked in a variety of agencies and now handles procurement for the Forest Service.

Her sister, Michelle Peyton, 63, agreed. “It was just a life surrounded by government,” said Peyton, who most recently worked at the Patent and Trademark Office reviewing inventions for everything from airplanes to zippers. “Washingtonians would talk to each other on the street about job openings. It was just a part of the culture.” 

Through their government work, Randolph and Gladys were able to help their children buy homes and their granddaughter Tisha Derricotte pay for her education at Howard, where she received an undergraduate degree and an MBA. Tisha, 43, now works at the GAO like her grandmother, but as an analyst reviewing programs related to community investment and financial markets.

Working together

In the small city of Belen, N.M., Paco Perezdidn’t have one relative or neighbor who worked for the federal government. 

“No one ever talked about it as an option,” said Perez, 30.



While attending law school at the University of New Mexico, he met Martin Brennan, a former ambassador to Zambia and Uganda, who was at the school as part of the Diplomat in Residence Program. Established in 1964 at colleges that are historically black or have other large minority populations, the program was set up to end the “bastion of white men in the State Department through recruiting,” said Terry Davidson, its coordinator.

While studying for the bar exam, Perez decided to take the highly competitive Foreign Service exam. He started meeting “religiously” with the diplomat and his successors at the school. “They would have me for dinner and coach me. I don’t think I would have made it without them,” Perez said.

He passed the test and joined the Foreign Service as a public diplomacy officer in 2008.



“There was maybe only one other Hispanic and it was like a punch in the stomach,” he recalled. “But then I thought, ‘I could have real impact here.’ ”

Forty years ago, African Americans at the State Department formed the “Thursday Luncheon Group,” a place where they could talk openly about the workplace. 

Perez and others, including his diplomat wife Stephanie Espinal, have formed the “Tuesday Luncheon Group” for Hispanics. They’ve come together recently to organize happy hours with other minority groups at the department. And Perez has visited high schools to talk about opportunities for Hispanics.

Antonio R. Flores, president of the Hispanic Association of Colleges and Universities, said some government recruiters have an “outdated” concern that Hispanic applicants may not be U.S. citizens or don’t speak English well. 

But in Perez’s case, his bilingual skills have been an asset at the State Department.

“The irony is many of us have cultural experience and are bilingual and would be perfect candidates,” said Perez, who has been posted to Mexico and the Dominican Republic. “We look at the African American experience and think, ‘Well, we could do that, too. It’s just taking some time.’ ”

*8.2 percent *

Proportion of the 1.9 million federal employees who are Hispanic. 
Hispanics make up 15 percent of the private-sector workforce and 13 percent of the U.S population.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...d9d46e-5159-11e3-a7f0-b790929232e1_story.html


----------



## RoundEyedGirl504 (Oct 29, 2019)

Indians and Asians are catching it in different ways. When I was researching moving I read a lot of city-data forums, the white people were definitely not feeling all the competition at the good public schools and college entry level. The thing is they don't come out and directly attack them like they do with us and Mexicans, because it's not PC to do so.


----------



## NijaG (Oct 29, 2019)

RoundEyedGirl504 said:


> Indians and Asians are catching it in different ways. When I was researching moving I read a lot of city-data forums, *the white people were definitely not feeling all the competition at the good public schools and college entry level. The thing is they don't come out and directly attack them like they do with us and Mexicans, because it's not PC to do so*.



Also.... they are not going to admit that their onyibo children are not as smart as the Indians and Asians. That wouldn’t mesh with their superiority narrative.


----------



## RoundEyedGirl504 (Oct 29, 2019)

NijaG said:


> Also.... they are not going to admit that their onyibo children are not as smart as the Indians and Asians. That wouldn’t mesh with their superiority narrative.


Absolutely not. They go on these long diatribes about wanting their kids to enjoy school and not be under so much pressure etc etc. and its the fault of those kids for messing things up with their tiger moms and ish LOL


----------



## ScorpioBeauty09 (Oct 31, 2019)

Kanky said:


> Language is most effectively learned by immersion. It is a lot easier for a person who speaks Spanish to learn English in America than it is for English speakers to learn Spanish. When jobs require you to be bilingual they are usually looking for people who speak the language as well as a native. That kind of mastery of comes from immersion. (For example, 3 months in France did more for my French than years of practice in the US.)


True.

Spending a summer in Spain helped me get comfortable speaking Spanish more than my HS and college classes combined, even using my Spanish in Belgium and France which surprised me that it helped me there. This is true despite my SO being Latino and his relatives speaking Spanish.


----------



## Dellas (Nov 1, 2019)

The conservative U.S. politicians start wars and exploit poor countries  (resource curse)--> because of the wars people choose not to sit and die and flee with the clothes on their back and because there are few jobs in a a country with resource course they seize their youth and refuse to just die--->Countries who started the wars and caused the poverty and corruption in the refugee countries get upset that people dare care for their lives and expect to be treated humanely-->the US and other western countries export fear and bigotry and their citizenry gets more conservative. Win,Win.
The only solution given is a military state for all minorities and daily the citizenry heart is hardened and get more callous.


----------



## itsallaboutattitude (Nov 3, 2019)

What countries are people referring to when they say Asia? 

Last time I checked, you are Asian if you are from 
Russia
China
India
Malaysia
Cambodia
Japan
and others

Having said that. Here in Atlanta Airport there are more Asians taking traditionally black jobs in the Airport.   In this instance, they are Indian/Bangladeshi.  Not sure how they got a foothold, but someone needs to shack them loose.


----------



## Farida (Nov 3, 2019)

itsallaboutattitude said:


> What countries are people referring to when they say Asia?
> 
> Last time I checked, you are Asian if you are from
> Russia
> ...



Americans only seem to consider Chinese, Japanese and Koreans Asians. They look ag me like I am crazy if I include Indians and others...


----------



## intellectualuva (Nov 4, 2019)

I consider that entire list Asian except Russia. 

South of Russia and East of "the stans" (Kazakhstan, Pakistan)....including India of course, but west of the Pacific....that's all Asian to me. Lol.


----------



## itsallaboutattitude (Nov 5, 2019)

intellectualuva said:


> I consider that entire list Asian except Russia.
> 
> South of Russia and East of "the stans" (Kazakhstan, Pakistan)....including India of course, but west of the Pacific....that's all Asian to me. Lol.



I went to a Montessori school and out geography puzzle had a Europe and an Asia as separate continents. Like two whole pieces. 

When we got to the next level of geography to the specific countries, guess who was in the Asia block?

My family decided when others refuse to remember specific places of birth for the diaspora we won’t either. 

Let me introduce you to ... they are from the Caribbean or Africa. 

You will get a they are from EurAsia response from me.


----------



## WhoIAm (Nov 9, 2019)

itsallaboutattitude said:


> What countries are people referring to when they say Asia?
> 
> Last time I checked, you are Asian if you are from
> Russia
> ...



Typically when (not just) Americans use Asians they mean Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese anyone with Asiatic features. 

Everyone else from the continent of Asia gets called according to what country they are from. Russian, Indian etc.


----------



## Farida (Nov 9, 2019)

WhoIAm said:


> Typically when (not just) Americans use Asians they mean Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese anyone with Asiatic features.
> 
> Everyone else from the continent of Asia gets called according to what country they are from. Russian, Indian etc.


Not true. I grew up outside the states and Indians were considered Asian. What do you mean by “Asiatic features.” Most of the world speaks British English so trust they consider Indians and Malaysian Asian....and others...


----------



## WhoIAm (Nov 9, 2019)

Farida said:


> Not true. I grew up outside the states and Indians were considered Asian. What do you mean by “*Asiatic features.*” Most of the world speaks British English so trust they consider Indians and Malaysian Asian....and others...



Not true for you, but true for me and I also grew up outside the states as well. It's the reason people call them "Chinese" regardless of if they are Korean, Japanese. Those folks are not including Indians on the bucket.

Tbh I think the term is mongoloid not sure if its the right term (or offensive).


----------



## itsallaboutattitude (Nov 9, 2019)

There was a documentary (over a decade ago) about an area in Russia where the male to female ratio was out of wack (more men than women). Added to it, the men were not seeking higher education as their female counterparts. They had taken to kidnapping young women. Because you know, the women were not looking for LE men aka uneducated lay abouts.

If 1. It didn’t say they were in Russia and 2. Speaking a Russian dialect, t.v. on mute, I would have  thought we were watching an Asian aka Chinese people. 

IJS, if you go far enough in Southern Russia you cannot tell the difference. 



WhoIAm said:


> Not true for you, but true for me and I also grew up outside the states as well. It's the reason people call them "Chinese" regardless of if they are Korean, Japanese. Those folks are not including Indians on the bucket.
> 
> Tbh I think the term is mongoloid not sure if its the right term (or offensive).


----------

