# Pet Peeve



## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 11, 2010)

I had to share this in this thread.  Perhaps someone else has felt the same way at some point.  Perhaps I am alone in my sentiment.  

It has become a serious pet peeve of mine when I am out and about in public and I am approached by strangers who often either:
1. Ask if I am saved before launching into a discussion that shows that they are assuming I am not
2. Ask if I am saved and then launch into a monologue about how young people need to get right and get more involved in church
3. Ask what church I attend and then proceed to encourage me to come to THEIR church
4. Ask if I attend church and upon finding out that I don't attend regularly, launch into a monologue about being saved and honoring God. 

I don't like having people who don't know me come up to me and assume that I am not saved or launch into speeches about how I need to improve my walk with God.  The truth is that no one really entirely knows another person's relationship with God once they have accepted Him into their lives.  It is this kind of behavior that is a turn off for those who have not yet accepted Him.  I personally don't feel that this is the way to really help bring lost souls to Him. 

sorry for the rant, but it happened to me recently and I let the person know that I was mildly annoyed and that they should not make such assumptions.  Not to mention that I really didn't feel like engaging in conversation with a perfect stranger that day.


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## Sharpened (Apr 11, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I had to share this in this thread.  Perhaps someone else has felt the same way at some point.  Perhaps I am alone in my sentiment.
> 
> It has become a serious pet peeve of mine when I am out and about in public and I am approached by strangers who often either:
> 1. Ask if I am saved before launching into a discussion that shows that they are assuming I am not
> ...


Are you serious? So what if the person assumed? You missed an opportunity to fellowship because of your mood? God does not care about your mood, obviously, or it would not have happened. Don't believe me; ask Him yourself.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 11, 2010)

Nymphe said:


> Are you serious? So what if the person assumed? You missed an opportunity to fellowship because of your mood? God does not care about your mood, obviously, or it would not have happened. Don't believe me; ask Him yourself.



Are YOU serious?  You don't make those kinds of assumptions.  It is rude and bordering on judgmental.  Not to mention the fact that no one is obligated to "fellowship" every time they are out.  Sometimes I just want to be left alone.  And I don't think God calls for people to approach people in that manner.  Even when I have "fellowshipped" in those instances, I did not feel at ease.   Being bold for Christ is one thing.  Shoving it down someone's throat when you don't even know their walk is entirely another.  

  So yes, I AM serious.


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## Guitarhero (Apr 11, 2010)

Oftentimes, people mean well but they do not realize how obnoxious they can be.  It it rude to assume that a complete stranger wishes to exchange anything with another, let alone religion.  Some people live out their faith by demonstrating and others by shouting.  I run into those as well.  At the end of the day, I'm not changing my views no matter what the others think.  I just wish they understood that. But a brick cannot hear.


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## WAVES4DAYS (Apr 11, 2010)

............


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

CreoleNat said:


> Oftentimes, people mean well but they do not realize how obnoxious they can be.  It it rude to assume that a complete stranger wishes to exchange anything with another, let alone religion.  Some people live out their faith by demonstrating and others by shouting.  I run into those as well.  At the end of the day, I'm not changing my views no matter what the others think.  I just wish they understood that. But a brick cannot hear.



I seem to find myself encountering the ones who live out their faith by shouting.     I'm just glad that I'm secure in my beliefs and willing to enforce the boundaries I have in place.  I have friends who are scared to acknowledge that they don't feel comfortable having these discussions when these people approach them.  They think it means that they are somehow going against God.  I explain to them that if they know that they worship and honor God and feel secure in their walk with Him, then they should not let someone they don't even know come and undo that security they feel.  And they should not let someone like this make them feel inferior in any way.


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## Sharpened (Apr 12, 2010)

When it comes to things done in His name or how I behave towards people in any situation, I keep in mind that Our Father is watching and refining us 24/7. The last time I was witnessed to was over the phone. I was in a hurry, so I simply said, "I am sorry, but the Lord is my pastor and I could not place myself under any organization structured by man's laws, thanks." I should have told her to call me back later to talk. Oh well...

Witnessing to strangers is the toughest things to do when one is trying to be like Christ. You get insulted, spit at, peed on, arrested, even killed. I empathize with them, regardless of religious affiliation. Some of them need witnessing, too. I want to ask that so-called Rev. Phelps cat if he is a CIA agent.

If they are cool with it, like handing out a tract or preaching the gospel, I give them encouragement, a brief moment of fellowship. Other times, He puts things in my mouth that stun them briefly and KIM with a smile. This very rarely happens; most of the time, I run into people who just want to talk about the Father. I love doing that the best!

I guess because I do not attend church, I see things in a different way. Jesus' main place of worship was out in the world, sharing the good news, giving hope along the way, no matter how random the situation was (Romans 12). I don't think we are supposed to have any pet peeves, considering our path towards His likeness. I apologize if I offended you, but I am always serious when I say ask Him and He will show you.


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## Guitarhero (Apr 12, 2010)

Nymphe said:


> I guess because I do not attend church, I see things in a different way. Jesus' main place of worship was out in the world, sharing the good news, giving hope along the way, no matter how random the situation was (Romans 12). I don't think we are supposed to have any pet peeves, considering our path towards His likeness. I apologize if I offended you, but I am always serious when I say ask Him and He will show you.




But what would you have done if someone accosted you saying you are failing to attend according to scripture?

Hebrews 10:25 (NIV)
_25 Let us not give up meeting  together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one  another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.  _



I guess it's all relative.  For me, as long as people have respect.


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## Poohbear (Apr 12, 2010)

CreoleNat said:


> But what would you have done if someone accosted you saying you are failing to attend according to scripture?
> 
> Hebrews 10:25 (NIV)
> _25 Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching. _
> ...


Hebrews 10:25 is often used as the verse to say "You must go to church" or "assemble yourself in the house of the Lord"...But if you really think about it, that verse you posted is not saying we need to be in a church building with other Christians for 1-3 hours every Sunday morning. And it does not say that the church building is the House of the Lord. You can worship and praise God anywhere with fellow Christians.


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## Poohbear (Apr 12, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Are YOU serious? You don't make those kinds of assumptions. It is rude and bordering on judgmental. Not to mention the fact that no one is obligated to "fellowship" every time they are out. Sometimes I just want to be left alone. And I don't think God calls for people to approach people in that manner. Even when I have "fellowshipped" in those instances, I did not feel at ease. Being bold for Christ is one thing. Shoving it down someone's throat when you don't even know their walk is entirely another.
> 
> So yes, I AM serious.


I believe Nymphe was also trying to point out that you shouldn't have made those assumptions when they asked you those questions.  Some people ask questions out of mere ignorance. They may have seriously wanted to know if you were saved and what church you attend without thinking you weren't saved or you didn't go to church. It was just a question to get information or start up conversation with you. Maybe you could have shared your knowledge or experience and even give them pointers on how to better approach people they do not know.


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## Guitarhero (Apr 12, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> Hebrews 10:25 is often used as the verse to say "You must go to church" or "assemble yourself in the house of the Lord"...But if you really think about it, that verse you is not saying we need to be in a church building with other Christians for 1-3 hours every Sunday morning. And it does not say that the church building is the House of the Lord. You can worship and praise God anywhere with fellow Christians.



Except that it is the nature of most assembly today.  I believe Jesus did go to synagogue and not just to get lost from Joseph and Mary.  He and his family regularly went, aside from home worship/traditions.  In other words, what would she have done to prove her point when it just wasn't understood that not all strangers engage in conversation with others, christian or not, felllowship or not. 

In my own case, I usually find that people who automatically assume something about me because of any jewelry representing my side are just blindly unaware that they are actually attacking me.  Asking me if I'm saved or heaven-bound just according to physical appearance is rudeness.  I'd rather someone first introduce themselves and attempt to befriend me over weeks and months and demonstrate they truly care about me, the person.  

Sometimes, ppl will say that the "spirit" led them. Well, in my case, evidently not. They weren't led by the "spirit" but were judging according to their religious preferences which were bent on denying the holiness and correctness of mine.  I'll never change my faith, God so help me, never.  I'm not saying there aren't cases where God does ask you to give a word of kindness to someone or maybe even a rebuke.  But the point is, unless it's genuine, then it's not effective. What's the point of telling someone who is a devout xyz of Christ that they are hellbound?


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## Reminiscing (Apr 12, 2010)

I believe that questions are not assumptions.  The purpose of a question is to acquire knowledge.  Now if they had approached you straightaway saying "you need to get saved" with no prior info then that is an assumption and I agree with you for taking offense to it.  However, considering that they asked you if you were saved, I feel that their approach was not offensive and whether or not you choose to respond is entirely up to you.

I also want to point out that sometimes when we feel like someone insulted us, it could just be our own mind and spirit convicting us.  How we react to someone is a result of that person's actions towards us AND our perception of that person's actions towards us.  How we feel about ourselves affects our perception.  Not saying that's what happened to you but I want to throw it out there for others who may be experiencing the same thing.  It's something to think about.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> I believe Nymphe was also trying to point out that you shouldn't have made those assumptions when they asked you those questions.  Some people ask questions out of mere ignorance. They may have seriously wanted to know if you were saved and what church you attend without thinking you weren't saved or you didn't go to church. It was just a question to get information or start up conversation with you. Maybe you could have shared your knowledge or experience and even give them pointers on how to better approach people they do not know.



If you read my original post, you will see that the assuming was on THEIR part.  Not mine.  Once they began talking I didn't have to assume anything. 

Furthermore, I just find it problematic that people think a good conversation starter is the question, "are you saved?"  That's a very personal question for a stranger to ask.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

Reminiscing said:


> I believe that questions are not assumptions.  The purpose of a question is to acquire knowledge.  Now if they had approached you straightaway saying "you need to get saved" with no prior info then that is an assumption and I agree with you for taking offense to it.  However, considering that they asked you if you were saved, I feel that their approach was not offensive and whether or not you choose to respond is entirely up to you.


You weren't there so you don't KNOW that their approach wasn't offensive.  But I can assure you it was.  Please refer back to my original post.  



> I also want to point out that sometimes when we feel like someone insulted us, it could just be our own mind and spirit convicting us.  How we react to someone is a result of that person's actions towards us AND our perception of that person's actions towards us.  How we feel about ourselves affects our perception.  Not saying that's what happened to you but I want to throw it out there for others who may be experiencing the same thing.  It's something to think about.


Perhaps, but I think in an effort to avoid overspiritualizing this, sometimes it just boils down to having an issue with someone accosting you in such a way when you don't even know them.  I find it odd that very few people seem to feel that you have the right to enjoy your personal space without having to have a discussion you don't feel like having.  In general, outside of certain forums, I don't engage in much religious discussion or debate.


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## Guitarhero (Apr 12, 2010)

For example, someone has on a crucifix or Mary medal and then someone asks with NO LOVE on their faces, in a rude and abrupt way, "are you saved?"  That's an assumption, not a question.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

CreoleNat said:


> For example, someone has on a crucifix or Mary medal and then someone asks with NO LOVE on their faces, in a rude and abrupt way, "are you saved?"  That's an assumption, not a question.



Exactly.  You know, most times before someone provides a follow up to their original question, where they are coming from with their question.  And as I stated in my original post, they follow the question with a monologue indicating that they have assumed that I am not saved.  

And if I state that I don't wish to discuss the matter with them, they start talking about not allowing Satan to rob me of my salvation or something similar.  smh


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## JinaRicci (Apr 12, 2010)

Reminiscing said:


> I believe that questions are not assumptions. The purpose of a question is to acquire knowledge. Now if they had approached you straightaway saying "you need to get saved" with no prior info then that is an assumption and I agree with you for taking offense to it. However, considering that they asked you if you were saved, I feel that their approach was not offensive and whether or not you choose to respond is entirely up to you.
> 
> I also want to point out that sometimes when we feel like someone insulted us, it could just be our own mind and spirit convicting us. How we react to someone is a result of that person's actions towards us AND our perception of that person's actions towards us. How we feel about ourselves affects our perception. Not saying that's what happened to you but I want to throw it out there for others who may be experiencing the same thing. It's something to think about.


 
I agree with this. Cause I am just not following where the offense or insult comes in. The only thing I can think of is that the stranger should know somehow not to ask the question based on one's appearance but then that would be a huge assumption & an opportunity missed if only the people who 'look like they need it' were approached.

TBH, I have gotten irritated at times, when I'm in a rush but then I have to stop myself and remember the deeper purpose- the intent of what that individual is trying to do. Walking up to a complete stranger to talk about Jesus today is hard and many people react badly. 

Even if I may think that I don't need to be witnessed to, my reaction could further discourage that stranger from witnessing to someone else. Something like "Sorry I have to run but keep up the good work" to me is a better alternative. 

So yeah, like Reminiscing said I look at myself. God uses other people too to reach us who are already Christians.


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## Poohbear (Apr 12, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> If you read my original post, you will see that the assuming was on THEIR part. Not mine. Once they began talking I didn't have to assume anything.
> 
> Furthermore, I just find it problematic that people think a good conversation starter is the question, "are you saved?" That's a very personal question for a stranger to ask.


 
I did read your original post. You said:

_It has become a serious pet peeve of mine when I am out and about in public and I am approached by strangers who often either:
1. Ask if I am saved before launching into a discussion *that shows that they are assuming I am not*_

About the bolded part, you said they showed they are assuming you are not saved. Can you be more specific as to how they showed that they were assuming you are not saved???

Trust me, I'm not attacking you, I do see why you were frustrated and annoyed... it would throw me off too if someone out of the blue just ask me a straight question like that without saying hi, introducing themselves, or talking to me in a normal fashion at first. Is that what happened?


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> About the bolded part, you said they showed they are assuming you are not saved. Can you be more specific as to how they showed that they were assuming you are not saved???
> 
> Trust me, I'm not attacking you, I do see why you were frustrated and annoyed... it would throw me off too if someone out of the blue just ask me a straight question like that without saying hi or normally talking to me first. Is that what happened?



Yes, that is what happened.  For instance, I was at a Japanese steakhouse and was seated at a table with 8 other people.  The person was sitting next to me with some other friends and family.  after we ordered, she turned to me, smiled and asked, "are you saved?" Before I could answer, she started talking about how I would be lost if I did not accept Him as my Savior.  she then proceeded to talk about how young people today aren't as into the Word as they should be and she handed me one of those little tiny Bibles.  Finally I got a word in and told her that I AM saved and that I READ my Word.  I told her the name of the church where I am a member, but that I don't go often.  She THEN launched into a discussion about how I needed to go to church  and that if I could go out to the club I could go to church.  And the latter part just adds more evidence of why you shouldn't make assumptions: I don't go to the club.  Period.   But not knowing me, and not taking the time TO know me before making such a statement, she only succeeded in aggravating me.


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## Poohbear (Apr 12, 2010)

CreoleNat said:


> Except that it is the nature of most assembly today. I believe Jesus did go to synagogue and not just to get lost from Joseph and Mary. He and his family regularly went, aside from home worship/traditions. In other words, what would she have done to prove her point when it just wasn't understood that not all strangers engage in conversation with others, christian or not, felllowship or not.
> 
> In my own case, I usually find that people who automatically assume something about me because of any jewelry representing my side are just blindly unaware that they are actually attacking me. Asking me if I'm saved or heaven-bound just according to physical appearance is rudeness. I'd rather someone first introduce themselves and attempt to befriend me over weeks and months and demonstrate they truly care about me, the person.
> 
> Sometimes, ppl will say that the "spirit" led them. Well, in my case, evidently not. They weren't led by the "spirit" but were judging according to their religious preferences which were bent on denying the holiness and correctness of mine. I'll never change my faith, God so help me, never. I'm not saying there aren't cases where God does ask you to give a word of kindness to someone or maybe even a rebuke. But the point is, unless it's genuine, then it's not effective. What's the point of telling someone who is a devout xyz of Christ that they are hellbound?


 
Thanks for your response. It is true that the nature of society today is to worship in a church building with fellow believers on Sunday, but is someone like Nymphe being disobedient or really going to be doomed for not going to a traditional church building every Sunday? I don't think so. 

About your case, how did you know that they are asking you these questions based on your physical appearance? Do they mention your physical appearance to you when asking the questions?

And I agree that not everyone is led by the Spirit when they approach people to engage in conversation about religion. If they have to say they are led by the Spirit, they probably more than likely aren't. They wouldn't have to say it to begin with. Their actions should show instead of having to say they are led by the Spirit. And there is no point in telling a Christian of a different church that they are hellbound, but is that what happened to you and nathansgirl? Did they find out you were a Christian but since you weren't of their denomination, they said you were hellbound?

Sorry for all the questions... just trying to understand where you're coming from.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

JinaRicci said:


> I agree with this. Cause I am just not following where the offense or insult comes in. The only thing I can think of is that the stranger should know somehow not to ask the question based on one's appearance but then that would be a huge assumption & an opportunity missed if only the people who 'look like they need it' were approached.
> 
> .



The insult/offense comes in the same way it would if a stranger walked up to someone and asked that person their credit score, or their weight, or whether they were sexually active.   I think maybe you are thinking that the person just wanted to talk about God.  But these are situations where people think I need to be saved.  

Like I said, "are you saved" is not the most appropriate conversation starter in certain situations.  Just picking someone in the line at the grocery store or seated near you at dinner isn't going to cut it.  And I think that when God wants you to reach someone, He gives you the insight in how to do it so as not to offend or be off-putting.


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## Poohbear (Apr 12, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Yes, that is what happened. For instance, I was at a Japanese steakhouse and was seated at a table with 8 other people. The person was sitting next to me with some other friends and family. after we ordered, she turned to me, smiled and asked, "are you saved?" Before I could answer, she started talking about how I would be lost if I did not accept Him as my Savior. she then proceeded to talk about how young people today aren't as into the Word as they should be and she handed me one of those little tiny Bibles. Finally I got a word in and told her that I AM saved and that I READ my Word. I told her the name of the church where I am a member, but that I don't go often. She THEN launched into a discussion about how I needed to go to church and that if I could go out to the club I could go to church. And the latter part just adds more evidence of why you shouldn't make assumptions: I don't go to the club. Period. But not knowing me, and not taking the time TO know me before making such a statement, she only succeeded in aggravating me.


Oh wow!  Thanks for elaborating. I was picturing myself in your shoes as I read this. I started to feel uncomfortable myself just imagining someone like her doing that to me.


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## Sharpened (Apr 12, 2010)

CreoleNat said:


> But what would you have done if someone accosted you saying you are failing to attend according to scripture?
> 
> Hebrews 10:25 (NIV)
> _25 Let us not give up meeting  together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one  another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.  _
> ...


But I do, just like the early believers did, in my home, on the street, on the internet, on the phone, in the car, whenever and wherever. Just recently, I got a call from a good friend I have not seen in a while. She blew my mind when she said the same thing my brother told me: there is no church we can go to around here. We will be getting together for lunch and prayer very soon. I hope Our Father is drawing some of us together to form our own worship group. That'll be cool by me!

*Matthew 18:20 *"For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in  the middle of them."


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## Reminiscing (Apr 12, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> You weren't there so you don't KNOW that their approach wasn't offensive.  But I can assure you it was.  Please refer back to my original post.



Notice I stated that "I feel their approach was not offensive," which means I stated my opinion.  So no I was not there but I do KNOW what my opinion is.  I believe your original post asked for our opinions and our thoughts on this.

I'm not trying to disregard your feelings at all.  If you were offended by the lady's actions that is completely your perrogative.  I just differ in that questions from complete strangers hold little bearing on my emotions.  Now, if these questions came from someone I knew, I'd probably feel a way about it because in that case I'd feel like they're using information about me to ignite their need to question me.  Their questions could be taken as judgment.  

However, in the case of strangers, especially pushy witnesses (and I live in NY so trust me I've seen my share) they are seeking information and they pretty much treat everyone the same no matter how they look or act.  It's my guess that the lady who questioned you at dinner, would've questioned whoever sat next to her that day.  It was nothing personal about you.  She was on a mission to witness and she didn't care who it was, which is why I tend to brush overly pushy witnesses off.  I answer if I feel like it and I ignore them if I don't but I don't walk away feeling offended.  

Again, this is MY opinion and if you feel different that is 100% your right.



nathansgirl1908 said:


> Perhaps, but I think in an effort to avoid overspiritualizing this, sometimes it just boils down to having an issue with someone accosting you in such a way when you don't even know them.  I find it odd that very few people seem to feel that you have the right to enjoy your personal space without having to have a discussion you don't feel like having.  In general, outside of certain forums, I don't engage in much religious discussion or debate.



My comment was not intended to be "spiritualizing" or "overspiritualizing."  I would have applied the "check yourself" theory for a non-christian situation as well.  Our perception affects us in everything we do, not just godly matters.

And, I do agree with you that we all have the right to enjoy our personal space but that's not what I was addressing with my comment.  I was discussing whether or not asking you if you are saved is offensive.  I have no problem with the way you handled the situation.  If you didn't feel like dealing with her then you didn't have to.  

I see pushy witnesses on the train all the time.  They try to force their tracks into my hand.  Sometimes I take them, sometimes I don't.  It's all about what I feel in my spirit at the time.  But, once I've walked past the person, that's it.  It doesn't annoy me for days to come.  But that's just me, I completely respect that you feel differently about it.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> Oh wow!  Thanks for elaborating. I was picturing myself in your shoes as I read this. I started to feel uncomfortable myself just imagining someone like her doing that to me.



  yeah


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## Guitarhero (Apr 12, 2010)

I personally don't have to think about it because I've seen various sides of the issue at work.  My religious beliefs are personal, very personal to strangers and there are limits to prying into a stranger.   It's intrusion.  That's my point.  Nearly 100% of the people I've encountered or have seen doing this are 1)not interested in the individual at all 2)think they are gaining heavenly points and 3)unaware just how insulting they are.  It's called proselytization.  That is not spreading the gospel, that's beating people over the head with a bible.  If you are at the dinner table, then freaking eat your dinner.  Jesus wept, Jesus ate!  LOL.

Reactions to such inquiry?  Very gentle with a "well, thank you but I have my faith and am firmly planted."  They don't stop with that and that where it's very evidently proselytization or attempted force of religion on another.  It is not right.  It is rude and it leaves a very stale taste in the mouths of many.  One also should realize that not all christians use the same descriptions, neither do they all believe the same.


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## Guitarhero (Apr 12, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> Thanks for your response. It is true that the nature of society today is to worship in a church building with fellow believers on Sunday,* but is someone like Nymphe being disobedient* or really going to be doomed for not going to a traditional church building every Sunday? I don't think so.
> 
> About your case, how did you know that they are asking you these questions based on your physical appearance? Do they mention your physical appearance to you when asking the questions?
> 
> ...




I'm not going to determine for Nymphe what she should do and she should have the exact same respect for anybody else in what they do.  It was a counter question to show that others can see things from different perspectives, just like her.  I'm not attacking her, just pointing out that we are all different and interpret differently.

Per the second bolded, I agree. And this leads to the third bolded. I never let them get that far to know what I am and how I believe, just that I am fulfilled right where I am.  So, that couldn't be led by the spirit - they were rather led by themselves.  I don't fault them for trying to do humanity a favor.  I just don't want people assuming anything about it.  I do not dress provocatively, do not appear homeless (another common assumption that the poor are unsaved) and do not behave in an unseemly manner.  

I don't use the lingo "saved" in the same sense and hold a different doctrine than the one-prayer-always-saved model.  I'm not saved in that sense-----------YET.  I'm still here and I've not gone to heaven.  I do have a relationship with the Lord but I'm going to just live every day in faith until the very end, with His help.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 12, 2010)

CreoleNat said:


> I'm not going to determine for Nymphe what she should do and she should have the exact same respect for anybody else in what they do.  It was a counter question to show that others can see things from different perspectives, just like her.  I'm not attacking her, just pointing out that we are all different and interpret differently.
> 
> Per the second bolded, I agree. And this leads to the third bolded. I never let them get that far to know what I am and how I believe, just that I am fulfilled right where I am.  So, that couldn't be led by the spirit - they were rather led by themselves.  I don't fault them for trying to do humanity a favor.  I just don't want people assuming anything about it.  I do not dress provocatively, do not appear homeless (another common assumption that the poor are unsaved) and do not behave in an unseemly manner.
> 
> I don't use the lingo "saved" in the same sense and hold a different doctrine than the one-prayer-always-saved model.  I'm not saved in that sense-----------YET.  I'm still here and I've not gone to heaven.  I do have a relationship with the Lord but I'm going to just live every day in faith until the very end, with His help.



well said.

@the bold: this was a point I was going to raise.  For some reason too many people think that homeless or poor people are unsaved.  I don't get that either.


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## CoilyFields (Apr 13, 2010)

Witnessing is our DUTY as christians...

How you do that should most definately be done in love and lead by the spirit...

As Christians we should do our best NOT to get offended...especially by those trying to spread the gospel...no matter their approach.

A better and more effective response would be to say "Yes I am most definately saved...but you know honey, if I wasnt, your approach would not have lead me to listen to what you had to say about Christ.  I am glad you are winning souls to Christ, but it might help if you started with xyz instead of abc..." or something along those lines.

We should be helping each other spread the gospel...not ignoring each other or getting offended. If a fellow believer is going about it the wrong way...dont pass them on to the next person-who may be unsaved-without trying to help them improve their approach to be a better witness

(This is not to discount how people may make you feel-annoyed or offended-but it is to focus on our loving reaction to them...if we can't react in love to our fellow believers then how do we appear to the unsaved?)


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## Guitarhero (Apr 14, 2010)

Living out one's faith speaks louder.  I've gotten more of the in-your-face ones than I care to remember.  I won't name sects but 3 of them particularly offend me deeply.   Love one another.  That's scripture.  How to demonstrate that?  Live it daily with kindness and honesty.  

The apostle were FRIENDS.  They befriended (got to know each other), spread the good news and the befriendment continued on to include a big family of LOVE and true concern.  Forcing one sect's beliefs over another is not friendly.  Does one intend to continue a friendship with this person or collect points?

No one has to shout "I love the world."  If you wish to share with someone, then do so in an appropriate and timely manner, if someone is receptive.  I don't like being accosted by religious anybody on the street, restaurant or on the job but it has happened and from a variety of folks from different religions altogether.  It's akin to someone handing me a condom and saying, "have safe sex because people are dying from AIDS."    Are people dying? Yes.  Do people need to hear the Good News?  Yes.  Does it have to be forced?  NO. 

Love one another.  Good news. Be faithful and just at home and work. Live it out daily so others will see your light shine. Excusing just any approach to get the word out is  arrogance IMHO.  I'm not willing to share anything with someone I don't feel comfortable around.  They cannot save my soul, only God can.  I don't owe anyone else a description of my prayer life.  It's not taking offense, it's guarding self and my faith which is my right to do.  It's not moodiness, it personal and I'm not obligated to see things from your denomination's point of view.   

I wish the christian community understood this.  But it seems we are always apologizing decades, even hundreds of years later for how we've "evangelized"  peoples and cultures throughout history, often, to their physical or cultural attrition.  We oftentimes killed the baby with the bath water.  

You see it at work with people inviting ABC to XYZ bible study for lunch.  If someone declines politely, they are talked about and targeted for "evangelization" and socially black-marked.   Perhaps ABC wishes to spend time in private reflection?  Or studying for an exam? Or just plain eating lunch?  Perhaps they are praying for you?  Then XYZ evangelizers give them the side-eye and talk negatively about them.  That's gossip.  

They have no intention of making this a family friend, just want the credits to say "they got somebody saved."  They're not in heaven, there's no evidence they are going in that instant. That's not love.  It just isn't.  I'm sorry.  Meanwhile, true christian TUV sits quietly, is honest on the job and nonconfrontational and is actually living out the Good News and more effectively than the ones forcing their denomination down someone's throat when they should be working.   Give to Caesar what is his.  Unless you've been on that side, I guess it would be difficult to empathize but there's no set way to show your faith other than in love and righteousness.  Everything else requires reflection and prayer before acting.  Charity is the key or so I've been told.


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## Poohbear (Apr 14, 2010)

CreoleNat said:


> Living out one's faith speaks louder. I've gotten more of the in-your-face ones than I care to remember. I won't name sects but 3 of them particularly offend me deeply. Love one another. That's scripture. How to demonstrate that? Live it daily with kindness and honesty.
> 
> The apostle were FRIENDS. They befriended (got to know each other), spread the good news and the befriendment continued on to include a big family of LOVE and true concern. Forcing one sect's beliefs over another is not friendly. Does one intend to continue a friendship with this person or collect points?
> 
> ...


Beautifully said. 

I agree that living out one's faith speaks louder and is best in most cases. Actions speak louder than words. That's why we have so many people pointing out hypocrisy among fellow Christians.  

It is so true how bad people are talked about when they decline an invitation. They may very well have a good personal relationship with Christ or a church home without the evangelist even knowing. 

It seems like alot of "Christianity pushers" have hidden agendas (ie. getting more people in their particular church, get more tithes and offering to cover costs and spending for their particular church, get more fame, or get control over more people).


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 14, 2010)

CoilyFields said:


> Witnessing is our DUTY as christians...
> 
> How you do that should most definately be done in love and lead by the spirit...
> 
> ...


I would not necessarily take that approach because for me that would be way too much talking to answer a question I think is inappropriate to start.

And I'm not sure why people think that Christians are not supposed to be annoyed at being approached like this.    When people behave like this, they are not coming from a Godly perspective.  They are trying to check off their "list" and brag about winning a soul to Christ.  At the end of the day, in order to win souls to Christ, you have to meet unsaved people where they are.  That doesn't mean demanding to know if they are saved before launching into a monologue about why they should be.  It is about noticing a need they have and trying to help them meet it while SHOWING them the love of Christ.


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## Poohbear (Apr 14, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I would not necessarily take that approach because for me that would be way too much talking to answer a question I think is inappropriate to start.
> 
> And I'm not sure why people think that Christians are not supposed to be annoyed at being approached like this. When people behave like this, they are not coming from a Godly perspective. They are trying to check off their "list" and brag about winning a soul to Christ. At the end of the day, in order to win souls to Christ, you have to meet unsaved people where they are. That doesn't mean demanding to know if they are saved before launching into a monologue about why they should be. It is about noticing a need they have and trying to help them meet it while SHOWING them the love of Christ.


And you know what else? Most of the time when these "evangelists" are asking their list of questions, they really do not care what answer you give them. They are more concerned about getting their own beliefs, opinions, and thoughts across to you more than anything.


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## Guitarhero (Apr 14, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> Beautifully said.
> 
> I agree that living out one's faith speaks louder and is best in most cases. Actions speak louder than words. That's why we have so many people pointing out hypocrisy among fellow Christians.
> 
> ...





			
				Nathansgirl said:
			
		

> At the end of the day, in order to win souls to Christ, you have to meet unsaved people where they are. *That doesn't mean demanding to know if they are saved before launching into a monologue about why they should be.* It is about noticing a need they have and trying to help them meet it while SHOWING them the love of Christ.



Thank you! Some folks don't realize that not all christian sects exhibit this behavior.  So accosting me and anybody like me is an attempt to change my religios base to theirs.


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## JinaRicci (Apr 14, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I would not necessarily take that approach because for me that would be way too much talking to answer a question I think is inappropriate to start.
> 
> And I'm not sure why people think that Christians are not supposed to be annoyed at being approached like this. When people behave like this, they are not coming from a Godly perspective. They are trying to check off their "list" and brag about winning a soul to Christ. *At the end of the day, in order to win souls to Christ, you have to meet unsaved people where they are.* That doesn't mean demanding to know if they are saved before launching into a monologue about why they should be. It is about noticing a need they have and trying to help them meet it while SHOWING them the love of Christ.


 
nathansgirl- thanks for the clarification. ITA with the bolded. I think the underlined however is an assumption. But I'm glad we're having this discussion. While I am not offended by someone asking me if I'm saved, you are and other people are. 

So, what do you think should be the approach? If someone is approaching a stranger to witness, how should they go about doing it? Maybe we can understand better from your perspective and offer up that solution.


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## Poohbear (Apr 14, 2010)

JinaRicci said:


> nathansgirl- thanks for the clarification. ITA with the bolded. I think the underlined however is an assumption. But I'm glad we're having this discussion. While I am not offended by someone asking me if I'm saved, you are and other people are.
> 
> *So, what do you think should be the approach? If someone is approaching a stranger to witness, how should they go about doing it? Maybe we can understand better from your perspective and offer up that solution.*


Check out this link: http://www.sharejesuswithoutfear.com/templates/System/default.asp?id=27043

There's a book and there's some segments you can listen to if you click on "Listen" link in that lefthand corner.

I went to a Southern Baptist convention workshop and one of the classes talked about sharing Jesus without fear and discussed how to share Jesus without being forceful and in a way that allows God to do the changing in one's life.  It emphasized how Christians cannot save people, it's God that does the saving. We are mere messengers, not converters.


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## CoilyFields (Apr 14, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I would not necessarily take that approach because for me that would be way too much talking to answer a question I think is inappropriate to start.
> 
> And I'm not sure why people think that Christians are not supposed to be annoyed at being approached like this. When people behave like this, they are not coming from a Godly perspective. They are trying to check off their "list" and brag about winning a soul to Christ. At the end of the day, in order to win souls to Christ, you have to meet unsaved people where they are. That doesn't mean demanding to know if they are saved before launching into a monologue about why they should be. It is about noticing a need they have and trying to help them meet it while SHOWING them the love of Christ.


 
I really don't think we should make assumptions about peoples motives when they are witnessing simply because we do not agree with the way they do it.  The bible says that some will have a zeal of God but not according to knowledge...doesnt mean they have impure motives.

Also, I did not say that the approach would not annoy or offend you...but Christ has taught us how we should *respond* when offended, especially to a fellow believer. I just think that if the goal is to win souls to Christ, then its a small thing to forgive an offense to help a believer be a less offensive witness. 

And For real for real...Im kind of confused about why you are offended by the question of if you are saved. To me its like, Im going to ask if you are a registered voter before I explain to you the merits of doing your civic duty and offering to sign you up (sorry thats the most recent example I have of street "pandering"). Or is it that the person asked and didnt stop to hear the answer before they proceeded? And even if you notice a need, as you say, as an inroad...you still need to know if they are saved already.

I totally agree that we must live our lives as witnesses. But thats not enough. God has told us to go to the ends of the earth and spread the gospel. There are plenty of people who will never get to see you live out your christian life but who still need to hear the gospel. After all, the apostles went out and witnessed. They stood in streets and squares and preached the gospel to passing crowds. They employed many methods of spreading the gospel, not just living good lives. We will not all use the same methods, but we should support each others efforts in love. And if that means gently correcting someones approach...then a few words are worth the time.


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## Poohbear (Apr 14, 2010)

*@ Coilyfields*... I don't think nathansgirl1908 was offended by the question necessarily.... she was offended by how the question was asked to her.  It's like you're minding your own business at a dinner table and someone you don't know is just going to ask you out of the blue "Are you saved?" and that's it. No greeting, no introduction, or anything.


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## CoilyFields (Apr 14, 2010)

^^^I understand. That can be a little unexpected. But I thought she was also encompassing the people who stand outside and pass out tracts and ask passers-bye if they know the Lord. I wouldnt expect those folks to strike up a convo with ALL the strollers.

I had this delimma a while ago in a thread...trying to figure out how to witness to more people. I wasnt really sure how to approach some random person who I may need to get straight to the point with. I personally did not feel like standing on the corner was the most effective way for me...but I do have a respect for those who take that public risk.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 14, 2010)

CoilyFields said:


> ^^^I understand. That can be a little unexpected. But I thought she was also encompassing the people who stand outside and pass out tracts and ask passers-bye if they know the Lord. I wouldnt expect those folks to strike up a convo with ALL the strollers.
> 
> .



I provided an example of what I was referring to.  But I am not referring to people who stand outside and pass out stuff.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 14, 2010)

CoilyFields said:


> I really don't think we should make assumptions about peoples motives when they are witnessing simply because we do not agree with the way they do it.  The bible says that some will have a zeal of God but not according to knowledge...doesnt mean they have impure motives.



You can get a feeling for motives by the way they approach and the content of their speech.  And as I suggested earlier, boldness for the Lord does not translate into offending people or making judgments about them.  Nor is it about meeting your "saved quota" for the month.  





> And For real for real...Im kind of confused about why you are offended by the question of if you are saved. To me its like, Im going to ask if you are a registered voter before I explain to you the merits of doing your civic duty and offering to sign you up (sorry thats the most recent example I have of street "pandering"). Or is it that the person asked and didnt stop to hear the answer before they proceeded? And even if you notice a need, as you say, as an inroad...you still need to know if they are saved already.


  My annoyance about the entire exchange was about more than just the question.  But even with your voting example, do you just ask random people in a restaurant if they are a registered voter?  There are usually other circumstances that should or would prompt such a discussion. 



> I totally agree that we must live our lives as witnesses. But thats not enough. God has told us to go to the ends of the earth and spread the gospel. There are plenty of people who will never get to see you live out your christian life but who still need to hear the gospel. After all, the apostles went out and witnessed. They stood in streets and squares and preached the gospel to passing crowds. They employed many methods of spreading the gospel, not just living good lives. We will not all use the same methods, but we should support each others efforts in love. And if that means gently correcting someones approach...then a few words are worth the time


Some people take that charge and run with it without real guidance or consideration on HOW to do it.


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## Laela (Apr 14, 2010)

Nathansgirl, what would've been your approach --or in your perspective -- the best approach that woman couldn't given in that scenario you gave? I understand the annoyance and how you felt. But putting emotions aside, what would you have done/said differently that would've been effective witnessing in that given scenario, given the place and time? 

One thing I've learned is that the thing we most complain about is the very thing we have the solution for, and I believe that you have something to share with us about witnessing that may benefit some reading this thread.

I'm glad you brought this up, because it brings up real-life situations about  being an effective witness. Nymphe expressed that it probably was a lost opportunity to teach another Christian how to be more gentle/loving in her approach...but even that's no guarantee against any rejection. For a believer, it is a very a fine line. Being offensive (the how) isn't the same as offending (the what, i.e. God's Word)  So you have somewhat***** of a valid point

I have a high level of respect for anyone who witnesses any chance they get, unashamedly. CoilyFields is right... we have been COMMANDED by God himself to go out and preach the Gospel. So we go out there _knowing _and expecting risk -- getting doors slammed in our faces, getting cursed out, or receiving vehement objections from someone trying to catch a train.   But I tell you this, if the Holy Spirit instructs a believer to do/say something, no matter what it is, and they don't do it, they risk disobeying God.  There shouldn't be any quandary about whether to risk being offensive (people bondage) or to obey God's voice*****. What, then, may seem like an aggressive move to some people could very well be a life-saving directive.

And, we should all have the understanding that it's not going to be peaches and cream when we get saved. It's not supposed to be easy. An effective witness will approach someone with the softness of butter and still get cursed out. And approaching other Believers doesn't mean there's assumption that person isn't saved. My face could shine like Moses when he finally came down from Sinai.... if someone doesn't know me, they'll ask.

I say all this to say, even if we don't get our witnessing right the fist time, as we learn and grow, we become more effective because the Love that lives in us (GOD) teaches us to become more responsive and less reactionary. Each one teaches one. We'll rely more on the Holy Spirit and not our feelings/emotions for when to speak and when to leave someone alone and KIM. That's not God forcing us to do/don't do anything, but rather Him _moving _in us.  I'm still learning this...


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 14, 2010)

Laela said:


> Nathansgirl, what would've been your approach --or in your perspective -- the best approach that woman couldn't given in that scenario you gave? I understand the annoyance and how you felt. But putting emotions aside, what would you have done/said differently that would've been effective witnessing in that given scenario, given the place and time?
> 
> One thing I've learned is that the thing we most complain about is the very thing we have the solution for, and I believe that you have something to share with us about witnessing that may benefit some reading this thread.




I think the solution is what I have stated in other posts: recognizing that there is a time and place for everything. Even when we want to do things for God, we can't be out of order while doing it.  





> I have a high level of respect for anyone who witnesses any chance they get, unashamedly. CoilyFields is right... we have been COMMANDED by God himself to go out and preach the Gospel. So we go out there _knowing _and expecting risk -- getting doors slammed in our faces, getting cursed out, or receiving vehement objections from someone trying to catch a train.   But I tell you this, if the Holy Spirit instructs a believer to do/say something, no matter what it is, and they don't do it, they risk disobeying God.  There shouldn't be any quandary about whether to risk being offensive (people bondage) or to obey God's voice*****. What, then, may seem like an aggressive move to some people could very well be a life-saving directive.



I don't think anyone is saying that we are not supposed to preach the gospel.  But you should not accost people you don't know in the situation like the one I described.  Funny thing is, the opportunities where I have had a chance to witness in my life have not been opportunities that I had to seek out.  Somehow, someway, that person was led to me and the situation presented itself.  I did not have to approach a random person and ask that question: "are you saved?"






> And, we should all have the understanding that it's not going to be peaches and cream when we get saved. It's not supposed to be easy. An effective witness will approach someone with the softness of butter and still get cursed out. And approaching other Believers doesn't mean there's assumption that person isn't saved. My face could shine like Moses when he finally came down from Sinai.... if someone doesn't know me, they'll ask.
> 
> I say all this to say, even if we don't get our witnessing right the fist time, as we learn and grow, we become more effective because the Love that lives in us (GOD) teaches us to become more responsive and less reactionary. Each one teaches one. We'll rely more on the Holy Spirit and not our feelings/emotions for when to speak and when to leave someone alone and KIM. That's not God forcing us to do/don't do anything, but rather Him _moving _in us.  I'm still learning this...



Again, no one is saying that being saved is easy.  And yes, you will get cursed out while witnessing.  But the saying is that you draw more flies with honey.  If you have a loving approach, even if they don't want to hear what you have said, they will be less likely to be combative.  Yes,you have those people who are going to be violent no matter what is done, but as I have said numerous times, I have seen some of the most hateful people respond in a respectful manner to a discussion about God

You can't approach someone who is unsaved with a judgmental attitude.  You can't act as though you have something better than what they have (even though you DO because you have God).  You have to show them how real His love is.  Lecturing doesn't cut it.


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## CoilyFields (Apr 15, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I had to share this in this thread. Perhaps someone else has felt the same way at some point. Perhaps I am alone in my sentiment.
> 
> It has become a serious pet peeve of mine when I am out and about in public and I am approached by strangers who often either:
> 1. Ask if I am saved before launching into a discussion that shows that they are assuming I am not
> ...


 

I guess I am focusing on what YOU can do in these situations. Maybe these are opportunities that God is presenting to you to help someone who may be zealous but not aware of the abbrassiveness of their approach. Whats the point of complaining about something if we're not willing to help change it...especially when it comes to the kingdom? (which is bigger than us and more important than our feelings and annoyances).

Even sharing with them what you've said to us would be helpful. LEt them know their approach makes you feel like a quota met instead of a valued soul...or showing them how to not make assumptions while still spreading the word. 

Girl if you have this list of the wrong ways believers have approached you then make a correspsonding list of applicable loving respsonses that will help them while still respecting your time and personal boundaries etc.


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## Laela (Apr 15, 2010)

I agree with you... God is a God of order; you clearly missed the gist of what I said,  but that's OK. I respect your opinion.



nathansgirl1908 said:


> I think the solution is what I have stated in other posts: recognizing that there is a time and place for everything. Even when we want to do things for God, we can't be out of order while doing it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 15, 2010)

CoilyFields said:


> I guess I am focusing on what YOU can do in these situations. Maybe these are opportunities that God is presenting to you to help someone who may be zealous but not aware of the abbrassiveness of their approach. Whats the point of complaining about something if we're not willing to help change it...especially when it comes to the kingdom? *(which is bigger than us and more important than our feelings and annoyances).*



@ the part in bold: The subtle attempt at chastisement is really unnecessary.   It is attitudes like this in the Kingdom that are a major turn-off to some people.  And no, there is nothing wrong with the fact that some are turned off by this.  

 I never said I was unwilling to change it, but I can complain if I wish and talk about it with others who can or are at least WILLING to understand where I'm coming from.    One of the biggest problems I have noticed in the church is that people often advocate for suppression of real feelings.  One can recognize that the Kingdom is more important than annoyances, but still have moments where they wish to talk about the annoyances.  No one should be expected to keep their feelings on every subject related to god, bottled up or act as if they don't exist.  That's absurd and it only breeds resentment.  God knows my heart and the truth of the matter is that people down here on earth often hold themselves and each other to more exacting, rigid, and judgmental standards than GOD actually does. 




> Even sharing with them what you've said to us would be helpful. LEt them know their approach makes you feel like a quota met instead of a valued soul...or showing them how to not make assumptions while still spreading the word.
> 
> Girl if you have this list of the wrong ways believers have approached you then make a correspsonding list of applicable loving respsonses that will help them while still respecting your time and personal boundaries etc.


There are times when I may address the situation and provide an explanation of why I feel it is inappropriate.  But there are other times when I don't feel like getting into all of that with these people I don't know.


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## Nice & Wavy (Apr 15, 2010)




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## Laela (Apr 15, 2010)

don't know why that's funny to me... it just is. 



Nice & Wavy said:


>


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## Nice & Wavy (Apr 15, 2010)

Laela said:


> don't know why that's funny to me... it just is.


Did I do that? (in my Urkel voice)


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## Poohbear (Apr 15, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> @ the part in bold: The subtle attempt at chastisement is really unnecessary. It is attitudes like this in the Kingdom that are a major turn-off to some people. And no, there is nothing wrong with the fact that some are turned off by this.
> 
> I never said I was unwilling to change it, but I can complain if I wish and talk about it with others who can or are at least WILLING to understand where I'm coming from. *One of the biggest problems I have noticed in the church is that people often advocate for suppression of real feelings.* One can recognize that the Kingdom is more important than annoyances, but still have moments where they wish to talk about the annoyances. No one should be expected to keep their feelings on every subject related to god, bottled up or act as if they don't exist. That's absurd and it only breeds resentment. God knows my heart and the truth of the matter is that people down here on earth often hold themselves and each other to more exacting, rigid, and judgmental standards than GOD actually does.
> 
> There are times when I may address the situation and provide an explanation of why I feel it is inappropriate. But there are other times when I don't feel like getting into all of that with these people I don't know.


Yes @ the *bolded...* I see it as a big problem too!


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## Poohbear (Apr 15, 2010)

Nice & Wavy said:


>


 So rude, unneccessary, and uncalled for....


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## Nice & Wavy (Apr 15, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> So rude, unneccessary, and uncalled for....


You know what, Poohbear........

*I love you girl!*



Jesus need to be the Lover of your soul!!!

Have a great day!


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## Laela (Apr 15, 2010)

I understand the need to have a good time in the Lord and not suppress the laughter.. lol. 

God bless you for that. 




Nice & Wavy said:


> Did I do that? (in my Urkel voice)


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 15, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> So rude, unneccessary, and uncalled for....



I agree.


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## Nice & Wavy (Apr 15, 2010)

Laela said:


> I understand the need to have a good time in the Lord and not suppress the laughter.. lol.
> 
> God bless you for that.


Why, thank you very much my sister....the bible does say laughter is like medicine, so I'm going to take a whole, heaping dose of it today, that's for sure!!!

Thanks for sharing the 'medicine' with me girlfriend!!!

  

The joy of the Lord.....it's a beautiful thing!!!

God bless you too!


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## Poohbear (Apr 15, 2010)

Nice & Wavy said:


> You know what, Poohbear........
> 
> *I love you girl!*
> 
> ...


Whatever... So fake... Maybe He needs to be the lover of YOUR soul...


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## nathansgirl1908 (Apr 15, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> Whatever... So fake... Maybe He needs to be the lover of YOUR soul...





Well said.

Unfortunately this is how drama starts. People enter a thread and instead of making a meaningful addition to the discussion, they want to be sarcastic and unnecessarily rude.


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## Nice & Wavy (Apr 15, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I agree.


I'm sorry but, ya'll got all that out of some smiley's?

Ok.....

Listen sis....it's easy to get caught up in the crowd.  Listen to your heart and just be joyful...there's no need for anything else....Joy should be our strength!!!

I love you too!!!





Have a wonderful day!


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## Nice & Wavy (Apr 15, 2010)

Poohbear said:


> Whatever... So fake... Maybe He needs to be the lover of YOUR soul...


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## Nice & Wavy (Apr 15, 2010)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> Well said.


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## PinkPebbles (Apr 15, 2010)

I will post in this thread since it involves witnessing...

My spirit is grieved right now...I'm trying to shake the feeling.

Someone that I know wants to increase their membership in their ministry. Now they want to do an outreach program in a community where a church already presides and currently making an impact. So I'm like why go there!?! Are you serious about saving souls and changing lives or are you more concerned about adding bodies to your church!?! 

I just hope and pray that whatever any of us do it's unto the Lord; with a sincere and pure heart, And not for our own personal gain and fame. 

Thanks for letting me vent....


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## Laela (Apr 15, 2010)

Hi, PinkPebbles,

I'm sorry to hear you feel this way...did you ever get an answer to the bolded from this person?




PinkPebbles said:


> I will post in this thread since it involves witnessing...
> 
> My spirit is grieved right now...I'm trying to shake the feeling.
> 
> ...


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## PinkPebbles (Apr 15, 2010)

Laela said:


> Hi, PinkPebbles,
> 
> I'm sorry to hear you feel this way...did you ever get an answer to the bolded from this person?


 
Yes, and it didn't make sense Laela. That's why my spirit is grieved. 

People of God really need to stop trying to make a *career* out of the gospel. One is called and chosen, it's not a game; it's nothing to play with it. People lives are at stake.

There are people who sincerely desire to have a relationship with the Lord, and want to change. They don't want to be just a number in a church building or make the pastor / church look good.


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## Guitarhero (Apr 15, 2010)

PinkPebbles said:


> I will post in this thread since it involves witnessing...
> 
> My spirit is grieved right now...I'm trying to shake the feeling.
> 
> ...




Sounds like you're concerned about this person's sincerity and if they are competing for popularity and/or donations.


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## Laela (Apr 15, 2010)

ITA, and it's unfortunate you don't feel the person is sincere. That's something God will deal with them with, if that's the case. Sometimes it's hard to separate what a person does from the person themselves, and we end up hating the person and not what they did/said, to the point they can do or say nothing right. That's not a good place to be, either, because it'll put us in the role of "stumbling block" or accuser. I've been in that dark corner before and God doesn't operate like that. 

I hope you're able to help them with this, in spirit and in truth. If it grieves your spirit so, maybe you're the one chosen to help them. 




PinkPebbles said:


> Yes, and it didn't make sense Laela. That's why my spirit is grieved.
> 
> People of God really need to stop trying to make a *career* out of the gospel. One is called and chosen, it's not a game; it's nothing to play with it. People lives are at stake.
> 
> There are people who sincerely desire to have a relationship with the Lord, and want to change. They don't want to be just a number in a church building or make the pastor / church look good.


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## Laela (Feb 8, 2011)

I was approached by a older lady this morning while I was pumping gas in my car, of all things.   At first, I thought she was going to ask for directions. But she started witnessing. I told her I was saved and that I agreed that Jesus is the only hope for this world....We had a nice quick chat, and she waved good-bye.  I told her to stay blessed. She then went to another car and I don't know what the young woman in the car told her but she was shooed away quickly and the driver pulled off quickly.

This is all expected when we go out into the world to tell others about Jesus. Some people will flat out reject, others won't. Some will get angry, others won't. Some would get annoyed if someone approached them while pumping gas, others won't. Not everyone has the same tolerance level, thus there are people who will allowed themselves to be interrupted at any time. So, depending on whom you ask, witnesses of the Gospel could be seen as inconsiderate.

I say all this to say, we can't forget what *Hebrews 13:1-2 *reminds us: 
_"Let brotherly love continue. Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares". _

The word angel is the Greek word [aggelos], meaning messenger... so it's not necessarily angelic beings, but people, whom God would use to send a _message _to us. Thing is.... that message is always timely: when we need to hear it most.


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## nathansgirl1908 (Feb 8, 2011)

I agree.  But I still think there are times when people are not operating in the right spirit.  They approach you with the attitude of condescension.  

For instance, (and i may have already told this story) I was out early one morning around 9 headed to breakfast.  I was dressed in jeans and it was a Sunday morning.  A woman approached me to talk about God and then questioned me as to why I was not in church.

I didn't appreciate it because she really had no reason to ask that question.  But I informed her that I was not in church because I had already gone to the early service at 7am.       She backpedaled, but it is that kind of thing that I don't care for.  

And I think witnessing involves much more than just approaching people and talking.  It involves living your life in a certain way which I believe I said before.  I don't feel bad about the fact that there are times when I don't care for how people approached me.  I can discern when they really are approaching me in love and when it is something else.  And truthfully speaking, the ones who approach me in love don't start talking to me about being saved.  They sense that I'm already saved and the conversation flows from there.


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## Prudent1 (Feb 8, 2011)

nathansgirl1908 said:


> I agree. But I still think *there are* *times when people are not operating in the right spirit*. They approach you with the attitude of condescension.
> True, true
> For instance, (and i may have already told this story) I was out early one morning around 9 headed to breakfast. I was dressed in jeans and it was a Sunday morning. A woman approached me to talk about God and then questioned me as to why I was not in church.
> 
> ...


I can def see why that would've offended you. We all are free to choose when we will be offended or not. It's true. Sometimes we are just not in the mood to take the time to correct ppl and explain our POV. I kinda scanned through here but was just going to say things like that have happened to me too. I am usually not offended and when I had time responded including telling them they may want to consider changing their wording/ approach. There was one time though where some of my former church members came to my home to witness to me. Now, these are ppl who I practically grew up with. So, I was like are y'all practicing or trippin'? I think they were still a little salty about me leaving the church. I chose to laugh it off and KIM. It's not just you. I'm still chuckling now b/c I could've launched into some of the unsavory aspects of their lives I know of right then and there but it wasn't that deep. Satan does not discriminate when picking available bodies to use to aggravate us. We just have to be sharp enough to recognize him when he is near and blam- put the word on him. He will 'get out of Dodge' real fast then.


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