# It has begun



## blazingthru (Nov 10, 2009)

Sunday Shopping Banned in Croatia
Within Most Shops in France, Citizens are NOT permitted to Shop on Sunday
Pope says that in Austria, Sunday MUST be protected as a day of REST 

In Europe Sunday Laws are coming strongly in effect.  this is very serious. God has told us all that is to happen but some will not believe.  Many say so it has nothing to do with them. but it does. It all comes down to the day you worship.  Why is the day so significant to Satan.  It is so significant because he counterfeits everything that God has said we are to do. He always find a way to change it around. It is his plan to be worshiped.  It has been that way from the very begining.  He has gotten most of the world to accept his day of worship without question. Yes without question.  The sabbath has been established throughout the bible and yet people say this happen or that happen to change the day but you can't change your birthday can you. or the day you gave birth to your child. God will never changed the day he completed his work.  Not ever. It is the day that points to the one and true God.  It is his holy day.  Now it comes down to whether you will live or die to follow it or not.  I have made my decision and it was not easy at first but it became easy.  I am praying for others to make a decision we do not have much time.  Once its fully in affect there is no more chances of being saved.  

*The Beast from the Earth 

11Then (AD)I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had (AE)two horns like a lamb and he spoke as a (AF)dragon. 

12He (AG)exercises all the authority of the first beast (AH)in his presence And he makes (AI)the earth and those who dwell in it to (AJ)worship the first beast, whose (AK)fatal wound was healed. 
13He (AL)performs great signs, so that he even makes (AM)fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men. 
14And he (AN)deceives (AO)those who dwell on the earth because of (AP)the signs which it was given him to perform (AQ)in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the (AR)wound of the sword and has come to life. 
15And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even [c]speak and cause (AS)as many as do not (AT)worship the image of the beast to be killed. 
16And he causes all, (AU)the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves, to be given a (AV)mark on their right hand or on their forehead, 
17and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the (AW)mark, either (AX)the name of the beast or (AY)the number of his name.  18(AZ)Here is wisdom Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that (BA)of a man; and his number is [d]six hundred and sixty-six.*


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## Nice & Wavy (Nov 10, 2009)

blazingthru said:


> Sunday Shopping Banned in Croatia
> Within Most Shops in France, Citizens are NOT permitted to Shop on Sunday
> Pope says that in Austria, Sunday MUST be protected as a day of REST
> 
> ...


This is so condescending on many levels...for those who are Catholic's and for those of us who choose to worship on Sunday

God's desire is for US TO WORSHIP HIM IN SPIRIT AND IN TRUTH!  

Anyway, I shouldn't even be in this thread....I'm out.


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## aribell (Nov 10, 2009)

I understand that we're coming from different perspectives on the Sabbath, but even still, I would think that the church (and even society to a certain extent) openly and explicitly affirming a day of rest and the need to honor the Lord (in the case of the Catholic Church) would be a very good thing, and more heartening than anything else.  

Regardless of one's view on the Sabbath, I don't believe the Bible says anything about it with reference to the end times.  We don't worship a _day_, but the Lord, so I don't think that passage should be construed to be talking about days of the week.


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## blazingthru (Nov 10, 2009)

I should not have wrote sunday worship because there are true, and honest christians that really believe with their whole heart so that is for God to judge not me and I am not judging anyone.  But the truth is Satan counterfeit Gods Laws. The sabbath is Gods law. It is very important regardless of our personal opinions about it.


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## Irresistible (Nov 10, 2009)

I'm confused and lost.......


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## Irresistible (Nov 10, 2009)

I mean to say I dont get the point of the OP at all


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## blazingthru (Nov 10, 2009)

Nice & Wavy said:


> This is so condescending on many levels...for those who are Catholic's and for those of us who choose to worship on Sunday
> 
> God's desire is for US TO WORSHIP HIM IN SPIRIT AND IN TRUTH!
> 
> Anyway, I shouldn't even be in this thread....I'm out.


 

Yes in Spirit and in Truth.  the fact is most do not bother to search hard for the truth. it is not hard to find. The truth is easy to say but many run from the truth. The truth requires change and sacrifice. Not many are willing to sacrifice.

John 1:17
For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ.
John 1:16-18 (in Context) John 1 (Whole Chapter) 
John 3:21
"But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God."
John 3:20-22 (in Context) John 3 (Whole Chapter) 
John 4:23
"But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.
John 4:22-24 (in Context) John 4 (Whole Chapter) 
John 4:24
"God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth."
John 4:23-25 (in Context) John 4 (Whole Chapter) 
John 5:33
[ Witness of John ] "You have sent to John, and he has testified to the truth.
John 5:32-34 (in Context) John 5 (Whole Chapter) 
John 8:31
[ The Truth Will Make You Free ] So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, " If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine;
John 8:30-32 (in Context) John 8 (Whole Chapter) 
*John 8:32
and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free."
*John 8:31-33 (in Context) John 8 (Whole Chapter) 
John 8:40
"But as it is, you are seeking to kill Me, a man who has told you the truth, which I heard from God; this Abraham did not do.
John 8:39-41 (in Context) John 8 (Whole Chapter) 
John 8:44
" You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father *He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies*.
John 8:43-45 (in Context) John 8 (Whole Chapter) 
John 8:45
*"But because I speak the truth, you do not believe Me*.
John 8:44-46 (in Context) John 8 (Whole Chapter) 
John 8:46
"Which one of you convicts Me of sin? If I speak truth, why do you not believe Me?
John 8:45-47 (in Context) John 8 (Whole Chapter) 
John 14:6
*Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.
*John 14:5-7 (in Context) John 14 (Whole Chapter)


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## joy2day (Nov 10, 2009)

I tried to not come in this thread, really, really hard...

...when Jesus told us to "keep the Sabbath" He wants us to keep the Sabbath EVERYDAY! Not just something to do once a week out of religious obligation. Have you not read in your Bible where Pharisees and Sadducees wanted to stone Jesus for performing miracles "on the Sabbath." Why do you think that was? It was because these individuals didn't have a revelation of what Jesus came to do here in the first place. Jesus' love, mercy, grace, salvation, deliverance, healing, etc. is available EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THE WEEK. Why create division among us over a day. All I want to know is that you are worshipping Him in Spirit and Truth. *Following religion is not Spirit and Truth*.

The Sabbath is not about a day per se, yes you can worship on Saturday and on Sunday--no problem. Just make sure you don't forget Monday - Friday as well.


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## Irresistible (Nov 10, 2009)

joy2day said:


> I tried to not come in this thread, really, really hard...
> 
> ...when Jesus told us to "keep the Sabbath" He wants us to keep the Sabbath EVERYDAY! Not just something to do once a week out of religious obligation. Have you not read in your Bible where Pharisees and Sadducees wanted to stone Jesus for performing miracles "on the Sabbath." Why do you think that was? It was because these individuals didn't have a revelation of what Jesus came to do here in the first place. Jesus' love, mercy, grace, salvation, deliverance, healing, etc. is available EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THE WEEK. Why create division among us over a day. All I want to know is that you are worshipping Him in Spirit and Truth. *Following religion is not Spirit and Truth*.
> 
> The Sabbath is not about a day per se, yes you can worship on Saturday and on Sunday--no problem. Just make sure you don't forget Monday - Friday as well.


ok now I get what the OP was saying more

still dont get why 

but ok , I probably wont


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## Nice & Wavy (Nov 10, 2009)

I know I said I was out, but since you responded to my post...I must say this:

If you have the Holy Spirit living within you, He will teach you all things and bring all things to your remembrance what the Lord said.  What you are saying is that the only Truth is for those who worship from sundown Friday night to sundown on Saturday.  You are really stepping on rocky ground on this one and need to step back and take a look at yourself and remind yourself what Jesus said to Peter concerning John and Peter asked Jesus this:
*John 21:20-22 (The Message)*

_Turning his head, Peter noticed the disciple Jesus loved following right behind. When Peter noticed him, he asked Jesus, "Master, what's going to happen to him?" _

_Jesus said, *"If I want him to live until I come again, what's that to you? You—follow me.*"_


Our concern for those that don't know Christ is to lead him to Him.  God desires that no one perish and ALL come to repentance.  That's what we are called to do.  



blazingthru said:


> Yes in Spirit and in Truth.  the fact is most do not bother to search hard for the truth. it is not hard to find. The truth is easy to say but many run from the truth. The truth requires change and sacrifice. Not many are willing to sacrifice.
> 
> John 1:17
> For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ.
> ...


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## joy2day (Nov 10, 2009)

First we all gonna go to hell for wearing lipstick...now we all gonna go to hell for praising God on a Sunday...Lord help people's minds!

I am so thankful that I know who my Redemer is!

"...Lord please open our eyes to the devices of the enemy! Man has taken so much of Your Word and twisted it completely out of context...people need to be delivered from man made ideology and religion ASAP." --This is my earnest prayer. Simple as that.


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## Nice & Wavy (Nov 10, 2009)

joy2day said:


> *First we all gonna go to hell for wearing lipstick...now we all gonna go to hell for praising God on a Sunday*...Lord help people's minds!
> 
> I am so thankful that I know who my Redemer is!
> 
> "...Lord please open our eyes to the devices of the enemy! Man has taken so much of Your Word and twisted it completely out of context...people need to be delivered from man made ideology and religion ASAP." --This is my earnest prayer. Simple as that.


 .....


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

Yes, it has begun.  I read about Croatia and having been in France in 2008, it is true that  most everything is closed on Sunday. It amazing that France take issue with less than 400 women in their whole nation who wear burqa but finds no issue trying to force others to close their businesses on Sunday. 

Also, in Tonga, in the South Pacific, there are Sunday blue laws but due to time zone abnormalities, Sabbath-keepers are able to worship on the actual 7th day without being in violation.


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## Laela (Nov 10, 2009)

--- post deleted ---

exiting thread...... SMH


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

Nice & Wavy said:


> This is so condescending on many levels...for those who are Catholic's and for those of us who choose to worship on Sunday
> 
> God's desire is for US TO WORSHIP HIM IN SPIRIT AND IN TRUTH!
> 
> Anyway, I shouldn't even be in this thread....I'm out.



No one said anything about those who choose to worship on Sunday. The thread is about keeping Sabbath holy. There is a difference...


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## Nice & Wavy (Nov 10, 2009)

divya said:


> No one said anything about those who choose to worship on Sunday. The thread is about keeping Sabbath holy. There is a difference...


So, why did she say this:



> *The Beast from the Earth ( sunday worship)*



Also this:



> God has told us all that is to happen but some will not believe. Many say so it has nothing to do with them. but it does. It all comes down to the day you worship.



And a few others I could quote, but I'm not...no need to.

I totally understand what she is doing, divya and I understand the difference when people are being condescending and when they are actually teaching a truth from scripture.


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## aribell (Nov 10, 2009)

I would hesitate read too much spiritual significane into Europe's strict Sunday laws given that Europe has very stringent labor standards and regulations regarding how many hours per week employees may work, how many weeks per year, types of shifts allowed, etc.  I would sooner read these strict Sunday laws to flow out of that mindset and that the countries were seeking to ensure that every employee had a day off than that it has anything at all to do with it being "Sunday."

Most European countries could care less about anyone's day of worship...unfortunately.


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

joy2day said:


> I tried to not come in this thread, really, really hard...
> 
> ...when Jesus told us to "keep the Sabbath" He wants us to keep the Sabbath EVERYDAY! Not just something to do once a week out of religious obligation. Have you not read in your Bible where Pharisees and Sadducees wanted to stone Jesus for performing miracles "on the Sabbath." Why do you think that was? It was because these individuals didn't have a revelation of what Jesus came to do here in the first place. Jesus' love, mercy, grace, salvation, deliverance, healing, etc. is available EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THE WEEK. Why create division among us over a day. All I want to know is that you are worshipping Him in Spirit and Truth. *Following religion is not Spirit and Truth*.
> 
> The Sabbath is not about a day per se, yes you can worship on Saturday and on Sunday--no problem. Just make sure you don't forget Monday - Friday as well.




Actually, following religion the way the Scriptures define is in Spirit and Truth. 

*James 1:27 *- _ Pure *religion* and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world._

It's about love and sincerity. There are people who sincerely believe in the Ten Commandments, including the 4th Commandment. Jesus said He did not come to destroy the Law but fulfill. He also said all will not be fulfilled until until heaven earth pass away. Matt. 5:17-18. So that there are people who believe in the entire Ten Commandments is according to Jesus' instruction.




joy2day said:


> First we all gonna go to hell for wearing lipstick...now we all gonna go to hell for praising God on a Sunday...Lord help people's minds!
> 
> I am so thankful that I know who my Redemer is!
> 
> "...Lord please open our eyes to the devices of the enemy! Man has taken so much of Your Word and twisted it completely out of context...people need to be delivered from man made ideology and religion ASAP." --This is my earnest prayer. Simple as that.




No one said you going to hell for praising God on Sunday. It is not right to put false statements in people's mouths.


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## joy2day (Nov 10, 2009)

I felt a different spirit in operation here, and it was not one that came to edify...The Pharisees and Saducees thought that they would "keep the Sabbath Holy" by telling Jesus to go somewhere and sit down when He came to heal, deliver and set free, even on "the Sabbath." So, frankly, I don't get the distinction to be made between keeping the Sabbath Holy and Worshiping on the Sabath. That should be seen as one in the same.

People are allowed to believe anything that they want. Now condemning people when they don't agree with you is not cool...



divya said:


> No one said anything about those who choose to worship on Sunday. The thread is about keeping Sabbath holy. There is a difference...


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

Nice & Wavy said:


> So, why did she say this:
> 
> And a few others I could quote, but I'm not...no need to.
> 
> I totally understand what she is doing, divya and I understand the difference when people are being condescending and when they are actually teaching a truth from scripture.



Again, was something said something about individuals who worship on Sunday? Obviously, it does come down to the day people worship, and that's why there are Sunday blue laws. 

Call it condescending, but it's different if you are Sabbath-keeper and your rights are being infringed upon...


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

joy2day said:


> I felt a different spirit in operation here, and it was not one that came to edify...The Pharisees and Saducees thought that they would "keep the Sabbath Holy" by telling Jesus to go somewhere and sit down when He came to heal, deliver and set free, even on "the Sabbath." So, frankly, I don't get the distinction to be made between keeping the Sabbath Holy and Worshiping on the Sabath. That should be seen as one in the same.
> 
> People are allowed to believe anything that they want. Now condemning people when they don't agree with you is not cool...



What does that have to do with anything? The Pharisees and the Saducees were concerning themselves with rules on the Sabbath day. We are talking about keeping the Sabbath holy v. worshiping on Sunday. It isn't one and the same when you understand what Sunday blue laws are...


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

nicola.kirwan said:


> I would hesitate read too much spiritual significane into Europe's strict Sunday laws given that Europe has very stringent labor standards and regulations regarding how many hours per week employees may work, how many weeks per year, types of shifts allowed, etc.  I would sooner read these strict Sunday laws to flow out of that mindset and that the countries were seeking to ensure that every employee had a day off than that it has anything at all to do with it being "Sunday."
> 
> Most European countries could care less about anyone's day of worship...unfortunately.



Yes, I'm aware of Europe's laws. My stance is that if it isn't about Sunday, then people should be able to choose one day to take off - any day.


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## Nice & Wavy (Nov 10, 2009)

divya said:


> Again, was something said something about individuals who worship on Sunday? Obviously, it does come down to the day people worship, and that's why there are Sunday blue laws.
> 
> Call it condescending, but it's different if you are Sabbath-keeper and your rights are being infringed upon...


If *I* was the one infringing on YOUR rights, then I could see this being something that you post to me about...but,* I* didn't say anything about YOUR Sabbath day, yet my right as a believer to worship on a SUNDAY is being infringed upon in this thread.

It's one thing to stand with your fellow believer in something, yet its something else to stand with them when they are wrong, divya and in this, she was wrong to post this thread and state the things she stated that not only 'infringed' but offended as well.


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## joy2day (Nov 10, 2009)

^^^I was trying to collect my thoughts...suffice to say that Nice & Wavy's response is sufficient for me. 

Peace and Blessings to all.


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## aribell (Nov 10, 2009)

divya said:


> Yes, I'm aware of Europe's laws. My stance is that if it isn't about Sunday, then people should be able to choose one day to take off - any day.


 
I think that it's a mix of tradition, and also the benefit of everyone having the same day off, society taking a break at once.  You don't have the same benefit if everything is still running 24/7.  The US can't seem to get that, though we used to.  Sunday blue laws have traditional religious significance, but have been emptied of their spiritual significance.  It's just what people are accustomed to now.


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

nicola.kirwan said:


> I think that it's a mix of tradition, and also the benefit of everyone having the same day off, society taking a break at once.  You don't have the same benefit if everything is still running 24/7.  Sunday blue laws have traditional religious significance, but have been emptied of their spiritual significance.  It's just what people are accustomed to now.





> Throughout Europe, laws differ vastly. In Sweden, most shops stay open Sundays. Poland's stores are open, *but the Roman Catholic church has been fighting to force shopping malls and supermarkets to close.The church is leading a similar battle in Croatia.*



I cannot view that as devoid of "spiritual significance"...


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

Nice & Wavy said:


> If *I* was the one infringing on YOUR rights, then I could see this being something that you post to me about...but,* I* didn't say anything about YOUR Sabbath day, yet my right as a believer to worship on a SUNDAY is being infringed upon in this thread.
> 
> It's one thing to stand with your fellow believer in something, yet its something else to stand with them when they are wrong, divya and in this, she was wrong to post this thread and state the things she stated that not only 'infringed' but offended as well.



Do you understand the point of this thread? No one is infringing on your right to worship on Sunday in this thread. That's very clear.  It's really sad to me that anyone would claim that their rights are being infringed upon in such a discussion, when people are actually dealing with their rights being infringed upon in other parts of the world (even here in the U.S.)   There was nothing wrong with posting the thread. There are beliefs that I don't agree with in the Christian forum, but I don't claim that my rights are being infringed upon because people choose to discuss them. It is based on their beliefs. That's a God-given freedom.


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## Nice & Wavy (Nov 10, 2009)

joy2day said:


> ^^^I was trying to collect my thoughts...suffice to say that Nice & Wavy's response is sufficient for me.
> 
> Peace and Blessings to all.


Sufficiency....we need to know this for sure 

_2 John {1:4} I rejoiced greatly that I found of thy children
walking in truth, as we have received a commandment from
the Father. {1:5} And now I beseech thee, lady, not as
though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that
which we had from the beginning, that we love one another.
{1:6} And this is love, that we walk after his
commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have
heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

_
From the beginning the commandment was to love one another. How could it be otherwise? God is love. When man fell into sin it was into a world that knew only love and now it would know the opposite of love, it would know hatred. The commandment to love is a command to live. People try to make it so God is harsh and restrictive, but He's love and all He asks is out of love. Loving one another is so important. Loving one another is what it's all about. Love. Putting others before ourselves. Putting God before ourselves. We walk in love.

_1 John {4:11} Beloved, if God so
loved us, we ought also to love one another. {4:12} No man
hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God
dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us. {4:13}
Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us,
because he hath given us of his Spirit.

_
No man has seen God at any time. 


No man has seen God.


God dwells in us... if we love one another. God's love is perfected in us. 


We know we dwell in God and God in us because God's given us his Spirit.


With the Holy Spirit in us, living in us, we know that God's love is in us and we can love with God's love. We need the Holy Spirit in our lives. The Holy Spirit will help us to love with God's love. Nothing is of ourselves. 


*2 Cor. {3:4} And such trust have we through Christ to Godward:
{3:5} Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think
any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency [is] of God

*
*Our sufficency is of God.  *


*We are NOT sufficient of ourselves.*


_May the Lord bless us and keep us, may the Holy Spirit dwell in us so that we may love one another with the only true and powerful love that is God's, all through the love of Christ, by His grace and His mercy now and forever. _

I'm done here...God bless you all!


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## Nice & Wavy (Nov 10, 2009)

divya said:


> Do you understand the point of this thread? No one is infringing on your right to worship on Sunday in this thread. That's very clear.  It's really sad to me that anyone would claim that their rights are being infringed upon in such a discussion, when people are actually dealing with their rights being infringed upon in other parts of the world (even here in the U.S.)   There was nothing wrong with posting the thread. There are beliefs that I don't agree with in the Christian forum, but I don't claim that my rights are being infringed upon because people choose to discuss them. It is based on their beliefs. That's a God-given freedom.


Divya, I don't have anything else to say about this...I think I've said what I needed to say.

Go in peace!

Have a good night.


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

Nice & Wavy said:


> Divya, I don't have anything else to say about this...I think I've said what I needed to say.
> 
> Go in peace!
> 
> Have a good night.



Take care lady! Good night!


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## joy2day (Nov 10, 2009)

Divya, for me this is what I was totally offended by...you were not the poster who posted the quoted paragraph below...this I find to be inflammatory, and frankly, I stand by what I have already posted. Truly, truly this is not edifying to the Body of Christ at all. She says "it all comes down to the day we worship", hence *we* are all in error who worship on Sunday, right? I can assure you that I am not worshipping a devil on Sunday...I am worshipping The Lord Jesus Christ who has given me access to the Throne Room of the Most High by His precious Blood!

...So please don't tell me that (even if you weren't the one who posted this) this isn't about Sunday worship, 'cause the OP made it so.

I am officially out of this thread.

Quoted from Blazingthru...
"In Europe Sunday Laws are coming strongly in effect. this is very serious. God has told us all that is to happen but some will not believe. Many say so it has nothing to do with them. but it does. *It all comes down to the day you worship. Why is the day so significant to Satan. It is so significant because he counterfeits everything that God has said we are to do. He always find a way to change it around. It is his plan to be worshiped.* It has been that way from the very begining. He has gotten most of the world to accept his day of worship without question. Yes without question. The sabbath has been established throughout the bible and yet people say this happen or that happen to change the day but you can't change your birthday can you. or the day you gave birth to your child. God will never changed the day he completed his work. Not ever. It is the day that points to the one and true God. It is his holy day. Now it comes down to whether you will live or die to follow it or not. I have made my decision and it was not easy at first but it became easy. I am praying for others to make a decision we do not have much time. Once its fully in affect there is no more chances of being saved."


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

*Daniel 7:25* -_ And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time."
_

*Revelation 13:18* -  _Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six._

But through it all...

*Revelation 14:12* -  _Here is the patience of the saints; here are those[a] who *keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.* _


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## divya (Nov 10, 2009)

joy2day said:


> Divya, for me this is what I was totally offended by...you were not the poster who posted the quoted paragraph below...this I find to be inflammatory, and frankly, I stand by what I have already posted. Truly, truly this is not edifying to the Body of Christ at all. She says "it all comes down to the day we worship", hence *we* are all in error who worship on Sunday, right? I can assure you that I am not worshipping a devil on Sunday...I am worshipping The Lord Jesus Christ who has given me access to the Throne Room of the Most High by His precious Blood!
> 
> ...So please don't tell me that (even if you weren't the one who posted this) this isn't about Sunday worship, 'cause the OP made it so.
> 
> ...



Alright, I do understand how this is coming across to you. It is not an attack on _you_ and anyone else but on the Satan's counterfeits. That's is what Satan does, create counterfeits for God's truth. We simply disagree as to what the counterfeits.  

The thing is that there are some of us who do believe, based on our understanding of Scriptures, that Sunday is a counterfeit to God's Holy Sabbath. Does that mean we believe Sunday worshipers are automatically _going to hell_? Absolutely not. In fact, many of us do not even define _hell_ the same way most Christians do (that's another discussion). We do believe that those who choose to keep God commandments, including the Sabbath, will be persecuted. And there will come a time when we will have to choose...


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## joy2day (Nov 10, 2009)

_*Isaiah 14:*_


_* 12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! *_
_* 13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: *_
_* 14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. *__* 15Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.* _

To put a group of Christians in league with satan, because they worship God on Sunday, certainly does imply that you believe that Christians that worship on Sunday are going to Hell as far as I am concerned. According to the passage of scripture quoted above, lucifer will be brought down to hell, anyone who follows him will join him there. Hell is real. Hell is a place. Hell is a pit. In the book of Matthew there is described a fire in this pit. So, no, I didn't put words in anyone's mouth. We're just getting over the surface fluff and getting to the heart of the matter. 

I pray people see this doctrine for what it is.



divya said:


> Alright, I do understand how this is coming across to you. It is not an attack on _you_ and anyone else but on the Satan's counterfeits. That's is what Satan does, create counterfeits for God's truth. We simply disagree as to what the counterfeits.
> 
> The thing is that there are some of us who do believe, based on our understanding of Scriptures, that Sunday is a counterfeit to God's Holy Sabbath. Does that mean we believe Sunday worshipers are automatically _going to hell_? Absolutely not. In fact, many of us do not even define _hell_ the same way most Christians do (that's another discussion). We do believe that those who choose to keep God commandments, including the Sabbath, will be persecuted. And there will come a time when we will have to choose...


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## pebbles (Nov 10, 2009)

nicola.kirwan said:


> I understand that we're coming from different perspectives on the Sabbath, but even still, I would think that the church (and even society to a certain extent) openly and explicitly affirming a day of rest and the need to honor the Lord (in the case of the Catholic Church) would be a very good thing, and more heartening than anything else.
> 
> Regardless of one's view on the Sabbath, I don't believe the Bible says anything about it with reference to the end times. We don't worship a _day_, but the Lord, so I don't think that passage should be construed to be talking about days of the week.


 

Thanks for this post! Thread closed.


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