# Divorce and Remarriage



## gone_fishing (Feb 4, 2008)

I know some of you have the good sense to stay out of "off topic" discussions about the bible. I wish I had. I'm learning.

But I wanted to ask this question in here for those who probably saw the thread but didn't want to get involved in that topic in the OT forum.

Here are two conflicting views on remarriage and divorce.

*VIEW 1 - REMARRIAGE IN THE CASE OF ADULTERY*



> First of all, no matter what view one takes in the issue of divorce it is important to remember the words of the Bible from Malachi 2:16a: “I hate divorce, says the Lord God of Israel.” According to the Bible, God’s plan is that marriage be a lifetime commitment. “So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate” (Matthew 19:6). God realizes, though, that since a marriage involves two sinful human beings, divorce is going to occur. In the Old Testament, He laid down some laws in order to protect the rights of divorcees, especially women (Deuteronomy 24:1-4). Jesus pointed out that these laws were given because of the hardness of people’s hearts, not because they were God’s desire (Matthew 19:8).
> 
> The controversy over whether divorce and remarriage is allowed according to the Bible revolves primarily around Jesus’ words in Matthew 5:32 and 19:9. The phrase “except for marital unfaithfulness” is the only thing in Scripture that possibly gives God’s permission for divorce and remarriage. Many interpreters understand this "exception clause" as referring to "marital unfaithfulness" during the "betrothal" period. In Jewish custom, a man and a woman were considered married even while they were still engaged “betrothed.” Immorality during this "betrothal" period would then be the only valid reason for a divorce.
> 
> ...


 
Which one do you think is correct?


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## gone_fishing (Feb 4, 2008)

*VIEW 2: - NO MARRIAGE UNTIL ONE SPOUSE PASSES AWAY*



> If divorce is a devastating problem for God's church, remarriage is as great. Divorce is an evil because of the sin it often leads to: remarriage, while one's original spouse still lives. With God's people of old, "with overwhelming grief I weep," because of this violation of God's law.
> 
> Has it come to such as pass, however, that divorce and remarriage are not considered evils? Is it so, that God's people have so wearied of the problem that they have given in? Has the church surrendered to the pressures to allow divorce for "every cause" and remarriage of any who have "confessed" their sin?
> 
> ...


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## gone_fishing (Feb 4, 2008)

*View 2 (Continued)...*



> FOURTH, Jesus' apostles understood well what Jesus taught here. Paul, the chief among them, took the time to explain and apply Jesus' teaching about remarriage when he wrote I Corinthians 7. In verses 10 and 11 Paul makes a distinction between what the Lord commands and what he, Paul, commands. The difference is not between what is required by God and what is Paul's own opinion, but between that the Lord _Jesus_ had explained in His earthly ministry and what Paul _adds_ to that teaching by inspiration of the Spirit. In verse 10 Paul refers to something the _Lord Himself had commanded_. What was that? "Let not the wife depart from (divorce) her husband: but and if she depart (divorce), let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband". That's amazing! It is also powerful. Paul says that _Jesus_ gave two options to a woman who had to leave her husband: (1) Remain unmarried; (2) Be reconciled. It would be the height of cruelty (to say nothing of wicked folly) for Paul to give only these _two_ options to a divorced mother of children, if Jesus had given _another_ option - remarry. Faithful to Jesus' teaching in Matthew 19, Paul does not give permission to remarry while one's spouse is living.
> 
> I Corinthians 7:15 is often used to support remarriage while one's spouse still lives. Briefly, the explanation goes, if a man deserts his wife (or vice-versa) the wife is not "bound" any longer. Then, since verse 39 shows "not bound" means free to marry, this deserted spouse is free to marry. One sad aspect of this line of thought is that it is based on the NIV translation that carelessly translates two _different_ Greek words with the _same_ English word. Verse 15 speaks of being in bondage (slavery), and verse 39 speaks of being bound (tied firmly). Marriage _binds_ a man to his wife for life; but a deserted spouse is not a _slave_ (in bondage) to the dread of guilt, excommunication, etc. God calls us to peace. (For a lengthier explanation of this passage, please call or write us, and we will gladly send it to you.)
> Why this strict teaching of Scripture? Because marriage is a bond made by God, to be broken only by Him. No legal contract that can be broken by the parties at their will and whim, marriage is God's bond (I Corinthians 7:39). Genisis 2 says, "They two shall be one flesh." No man can do that.
> ...


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## kbragg (Feb 4, 2008)

I'm just having a hard time with the idea that God wants me to rip my family apart and send me to hell because I am divorced from my ex non Christian spouse who cheated on my and tried to kill me.


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## gone_fishing (Feb 4, 2008)

Honestly, hon...

It's easy to take a verse and try to use it to suit our own wants and desires. We DO have to be careful of that.

Before I filed for a divorce, I was confused about this very thing. 

As I stated in that other thread, I went to counseling at my church and they have always been very strict when it comes to their doctrine.

This is my church website:

http://www.centralchurchofgod.org

I was told by Pastor Douglas that I could remarry and I trusted and believed that he was correct and followed him in verses that discussed that issue. This was 3 or so years ago at this point.

Obviously, this is a dear subject to me since I'm about to get married next month. I had thought this issue was settled (after consulting with my church).


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## Browndilocks (Feb 4, 2008)

I just believe that God would not allow divorce AT ALL if getting one meant that you were still married to your ex spouse.  What sense does that make? 


"I got a divorce but I'm still married to my ex wife."  That even _sounds_ stupid.

Come on now.

Forget all of the philosophical hoopla for a second.  It's simple logic.  If you are divorced, then you are not married.  Period.

The fact is - God allows divorce when your spouse cheats on you. Period.

That doesn't mean He likes it, but He does allow it.  How many things in your life have you allowed although you weren't too fond of doing so? For me, plenty.  So God definitely knows about that... 

A divorce means that you are no longer married.  Period.

If you are divorced because your spouse cheated on you, then you are single.

If you are single, then you are not married. Period.

If you are not married, then you can get married.  Period.


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## janiebaby (Feb 4, 2008)

kbragg said:


> I'm just having a hard time with the idea that God wants me to rip my family apart and send me to hell because I am divorced from my ex non Christian spouse who cheated on my and tried to kill me.


 
If this happens to me I'm getting a divorce. A close family member of mine was killed by her spouse and a friend of mine was shot several times and saved by the grace of God by an ex.


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## Shimmie (Feb 4, 2008)

kbragg said:


> I'm just having a hard time with the idea that God wants me to rip my family apart and send me to hell because I am divorced from my ex non Christian spouse who cheated on my and tried to kill me.


Lady K, your present marriage is ordained of God...let no one tell you any different.  

You are not being held accountable for the sins of your first husband who gave you no other option than divorce.  

God is the Giver of new beginnings.  He puts away the old and begins with the new.  Rejoice in your marriage which God will allow no man to put assunder.

And may I say this to precious you and precious Adequate?   Stay out of OT with these matters.  It's bringing about confusion which God is NOT the author of.  Too many 'counselors' is not the will of God.  Especially when the counsel is of man and not of God.   God says to 'seek' Him.  At least over here, when and if we disagree on something, you can best believe we have the Holy Spirit right here in the midst where He can settle it in our hearts and correct us.   In the midst of confusion, that's all it's going to ever be....confusion.  

So..........stay outta there with these matters.  The devil just waiting to pounce all over the peace that God has ordained for you.

      

  Before you two come after me....


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 4, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Lady K, your present marriage is ordained of God...let no one tell you any different.
> 
> You are not being held accountable for the sins of your first husband who gave you no other option than divorce.
> 
> ...


 
Whew....thank you, sis.


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## CandiceC (Feb 4, 2008)

I would have posted the same scriptures if the thread was posted over here instead of over there. erplexed

ETA: More people were able to see the topic over there so hopefully it has sparked someone to study the topic for themselves.


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## janiebaby (Feb 4, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Lady K, your present marriage is ordained of God...let no one tell you any different.
> 
> You are not being held accountable for the sins of your first husband who gave you no other option than divorce.
> 
> ...


 
Thank you!


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## Shimmie (Feb 4, 2008)

janiebaby said:


> Thank you!


  Awww, is it safe for me to come back in?


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## gone_fishing (Feb 4, 2008)

Thank you for your comments Shimme. I was feeling pretty down after reading that thread so you're right...he is just waiting there to pounce all over our peace. 

I never really understand why N&W had made the promise, to self, to stay out of OT (with these matters) but now I understand why.


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## Browndilocks (Feb 4, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Awww, is it safe for me to come back in?



Come back in Shimmie.  I'm intrigued by this subject.  POVs that come from topics such as these are often the reasons why I dislike conversing with "bible scholars" and shall I say it, have no desire to be able to quote the bible front and back to anyone. I'm not trying to attack anyone personally but I'm just speaking for myself.  Biblical interpretations can be so extreme that it is often discouraging and downright foolish looking.

I don't know.  I guess this is bringing me down a little.  And I don't know why because I'm not even married erplexed.


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## CandiceC (Feb 4, 2008)

Browndilocks said:


> Come back in Shimmie. I'm intrigued by this subject. POVs that come from topics such as these are often the reasons why I dislike conversing with "bible scholars" and shall I say it, have no desire to be able to quote the bible front and back to anyone. I'm not trying to attack anyone personally but I'm just speaking for myself. Biblical interpretations can be so extreme that it is often discouraging and downright foolish looking.
> 
> *I don't know. I guess this is bringing me down a little.* And I don't know why because I'm not even married erplexed.


 
I began to feel down too cause it seemed like people's feelings were being hurt when that wasn't my intent. I don't think I was saying anything mean. 

I figure it's ok to agree to disagree. I like all of you guys here.


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## Browndilocks (Feb 4, 2008)

CandiceC said:


> I began to feel down too cause it seemed like people's feelings were being hurt when that wasn't my intent. I don't think I was saying anything mean.
> 
> I figure it's ok to agree to disagree. I like all of you guys here.



It's really nothing personal.  The subject itself just makes me sad.  I have a lot of friends who married RIGHT out of college.  2 of them are now divorced.  Both because of infidelity.  My one friend is a BEAUTIFUL mother of 2 small children... someone who would love to (and who I'd love to see) get married again.  She's someone who could use the help of a good husband.  We're just hittin 30.  If her ex doesn't die then she's doomed to a life of lonliness or sin because of fornication?  My heart goes out to people in those situations.  

What if you are a single woman with a desire to marry, and you meet a man who is divorced from his wife and he now wants to marry you? You came along after his first marriage had already come & gone. You've prayed about things pertainng to the relationship, etc and you believe that your relationship with this man is blessed. Let's say the ex wife cheated on him.  What if his ex wife has already moved on with her life, remarried, had someone else's kids and everything? And just speaking for my boy: what if you're just approaching 30?  He's doomed if he marries you and you're doomed by association?  I just don't buy that.  Moreover, something about that - all for the sake of trying to live righteous - just doesn't sit right with my own spirit.

These are situations that I've seen first hand.  I'm forever being told that God is a God of second chances.  If you go through a divorce and God blesses you with a healed heart that enables you get to a place where you would ever consider marriage again - it seems to me that a Christian would be even MORE determined to make that second marriage work.  Even more dedicated to the promise of God. They'd enter into the second union with an enlarged sense of gratefulness; that much more selective, cautious and spiritually sound when choosing a second mate.  It seems to me that in many cases, (and if your heart is TRULY sincere) the blessing of a second marriage is the tangible ability to be blessed with the opportunity to try it again. I'm not talking about people who abuse divorce over and over again.  There's a clear difference. Maybe it's just me.


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## Mahalialee4 (Feb 4, 2008)

deleted to make room as this was double posted.


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## kbragg (Feb 4, 2008)

Thank you all so much for your posts. Thank you Shimmie and everyone else, you've truly blessed me. I have to remember that God is my only judge and He does not seek to condemn me. Romas 8:1

Hubby made a good point to me earlier. King David's marriage to Bathsheba was ceertainly un-Godly, yet God did not instruct David to un-marry her. Matter of fact, nowhere in the Bible does it command you to un-marry your spouse. I know now that it is God's Will for me to stay in my marriage, raise my children up in His ways, and walk in His forgiveness and mercy.


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## Crackers Phinn (Feb 4, 2008)

CandiceC said:


> I began to feel down too cause it seemed like people's feelings were being hurt when that wasn't my intent. I don't think I was saying anything mean.



For what it's worth, I agree with EVERYTHING you concluded based on what the scripture says.

It would be hypocritical for people to interpret the bible literally when it's being applied to everyone else, but figuratively when it applies to themselves.

Now wouldn't it?


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## Mahalialee4 (Feb 4, 2008)

Since this topic has opened up here, I will repeat what I posted on the OT as

A THOUGHT for Christians :The Law without JUSTICE MERCY FAITH

I was in a church once that were (pulpit driven) hardliners on the "deevorce" issue" as they put it. A black pastor. They beat that to death from the pulpit, and really condemned people. Elders and their wives stopped speaking to former friends (stopped talking to the wife only but would talk to the husband... seem(ed) to be par for the course.)...refused to let divorced people sing in the choir, lead anything, be included in certain church social events, made sure they singled out and pointed out the "deevorced " people so others did not get contaminated etc. etc. FAST FORWARD..... 15 years later ....like to hear the state of affairs today?

1. Pastor is dead...his wife is a widow
2. Pastor's son got a girl pregnant...they got married when she was showing and it was public knowledge, while Pastor was alive. Two of his sisters that attended same church....divorced....niece, divorced twice...HIS DAUGHTER divorced while he was alive, she is now remarried. Incidentally, the same hardline restrictions were not imposed on his daughter, she taught Sunday School, sang in choir, taught choir, prophesied etc. etc.
3. Three of his elders divorced, plus one elder separated after he became a pastor himself, and another elder is separated and his wife has no intent of returning to the marriage....and this was after two "prophets" were brought in to "bind these men and their wives in marriage and set an example to the church.
4. A good every 3 out of five marriages that were performed in that church ended in divorce, which would total at least 15 couples who never reunited and maybe 12 divorced, moved on and some remarried. One righteous older brother is now living common law with a 19 year old, and he had been held up as a shining example and his wife was shunned when they divorced. One lady who set herself as the "moral guardian of the church", was the pastor's sister....it was her daughter that is now twice divorced, and one was "living in sin," , the same daughter who was not even allowed to have coffee with a "divorced sister", even with supervision, and finally married and ended up separating several times, and has a cheatin man and looks a wreck from being married to a triflin man. Oh well!

As I stated to one lady who was so self righteous when her friend divorced...I reminded her, you still have years to go, you have a daughter and a son to go through marriage ....and grandchildren....be careful...can you guarantee it will not happen to you and in your family?

I wonder if your husband or your wife leaves and you are a young person, and there can be no reconciliation., (man a pervert, molester of children, chronic cheater and abusive , refuses to abide with you and provide with you....or is mentally insane....and you are a hardliner about divorce... say you are 25 years old...like when you been living alone for 10-20 years etc. maybe next door to the same lady or man you judged....can we do a followup in 15-20-30 years and see what happened to you? Like, if you stayed married or are now single and never HAD SEX EVER AGAIN, even once after the separation or the divorce?.... Cause if we want to get hardline, then that would have to be the case cause the Word says "He will judge FORNICATORS AND ADULTERS... And if that is what you are holding people to, that will also have to apply to hardliners. No marriage No sex! Ever!!!!  And if only widows are free to remarry, there is the "fornication" issue again. If a widow is not married, she is not free to "fornicate" any more than a single person who had never married.  Fallout Could be interesting.
I                   Divorce is not the "unforgiveable" sin.  

Seriously consider this:

At one time, IF YOUR PARENTS WERE NOT MARRIED, you were considered a "bastard", could not serve in the temple, could not inherit anything. Well there are a lot of "illegitimate" Christians, who were not born in wedlock. In your families, perhaps and in your church. In fact 2/3 of your church may be "bastards". Now, those who are really into Scripture: This should really bring the matter home. Deuteronomy 23:2 Quote: "A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord; even to his 10th generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the Lord". So that would include you, your children, your great grandchildren etc. etc. etc. if you were to apply this. And if any of your children have babies out of wedlock.......none of ya'll could even attend Church! Or do we only apply the scriptures about divorce? Hey, it is in the Bible!
Now if you were born out of wedlock, and we know that the other terms are illegitimate, or "bastard", back in the day....don't stone me....I am only using the term as in the Scriptures to make my point about being a hardliner!

Now since My mother was unwed when she had me, when I read that Scripture, and the way the church folks acted about it...For years, I believed I could not be accepted by God...just because I was illegitimate, a "bastard" and I was stumbled for YEARS!!!!!!! Now, if we are going to held to the one, are we not held to the other, or was it nailed to the cross, and under the blood? And if anyone is a believer and happens to have a baby out of wedlock....WOULD THIS SCRIPTURE apply to your baby? and we won't even get into: Whether or not you were a virgin on your wedding night!Deuteronomy 22:20-21...naw...we are not going to go theRE. RIGHT?




Just some food for thought!


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 4, 2008)

First, I'd like to say thank you, adequate, for understanding.

Secondly, the Holy Spirit confirms the Word of God in the heart of every person that is open to hear what saith the Lord.  The Holy Spirit knows what is in the heart of the Father and He reveals that to those that are His.

Everyone will/can have an opinion about this topic.  This isn't the first time and it won't be the last.  But, we know in our hearts what the Father says about it because the Holy Spirit reveals it to us.

Kbragg, don't ever, ever, ever let anyone tell you that your marriage relationship is wrong.  You love the Lord and He loves you too and your husband and your children.  You listen to the Holy Spirit, just as we do and He would have let you know, without a shadow of a doubt, that you were wrong for doing it.  I don't/won't/will not judge anyone for this...not me.

Praying for all in this forum....ALL OF US!

Blessings...always.


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 4, 2008)

CandiceC said:


> I began to feel down too cause it seemed like people's feelings were being hurt when that wasn't my intent. I don't think I was saying anything mean.
> 
> I figure it's ok to agree to disagree. I like all of you guys here.


 
CandiceC, I love you girl

What happens in situations like this is that our hearts really want to share what we think will get across to others...and sometimes, it just doesn't work out the way we thought it would.  To us as believers, the scriptures is the truth...the light in which we choose to live our lives with.  It's the mirror for our souls and we don't take it lightly.  But, for those that don't, it is foolishness and it doesn't make sense.  This is why its so important to discern when to speak and when to remain quiet.  Sometimes, quiet is good....I learn this every day that I live.

God does give opportunities to share His Word in season.  There are times when people are not going to want to hear it either, and that too is ok.  We must always be reminded that it is God who gives the understanding to those whose hearts may be hardened by hearing what we have to say.  But, God has called us to PEACE!

Thank you, for being a vehicle in which God is using in this forum.  I always look forward to hearing what you will say in your posts...you make me smile....

Blessing to you, always...my sister, my friend!


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## Shimmie (Feb 4, 2008)

kbragg said:


> Thank you all so much for your posts. Thank you Shimmie and everyone else, you've truly blessed me. I have to remember that God is my only judge and He does not seek to condemn me. Romas 8:1
> 
> Hubby made a good point to me earlier. King David's marriage to Bathsheba was ceertainly un-Godly, yet God did not instruct David to un-marry her. Matter of fact, nowhere in the Bible does it command you to un-marry your spouse. I know now that it is God's Will for me to stay in my marriage, raise my children up in His ways, and walk in His forgiveness and mercy.


Exactly Lady K... Your husband heard from the Holy Ghost regarding King David.  Also King David's original intent was 'sex' only and not marriage to Bathsheba.   He was straight up in total sin from beginning to end.  

Your husband also heard from God when he chose to marry you.  How could he resist for scripture surely came to pass when he 'found' you...for when a man finds a wife, he has found a good thing.   You are his good thing and there's none better suited for him.  

Lady K, God did not call you to 'unmarry' your present husband.  If anything he moved the previous 'meathead' out of the way to clear the way your REAL husband...the one you are with now.  

You're not like the woman at the well.  Your first marriage was a mistake which God has corrected.  So be blessed and stay happily married and continue to glorify God all the days of your life.  Giving Him full reign of your life and marriage to fulfill your Destiny.   Don't undo what God gave you in answer to your prayers.   Someone to love you, eternally.


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## Shimmie (Feb 4, 2008)

Mahalialee4 said:


> Since this topic has opened up here, I will repeat what I posted on the OT as
> 
> A THOUGHT for Christians :The Law without JUSTICE MERCY FAITH
> 
> ...


You 'nailed it' Mahalailee ........................'to the cross'. 

Jesus nailed it all, to the cross. :heart2:


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## Shimmie (Feb 4, 2008)

Nice & Wavy said:


> Whew....thank you, sis.


 
Precious Wavy, I learned from you well indeed....   Stay out of the den!!!!


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## Shimmie (Feb 4, 2008)

Browndilocks said:


> I just believe that God would not allow divorce AT ALL if getting one meant that you were still married to your ex spouse. What sense does that make?
> 
> 
> "I got a divorce but I'm still married to my ex wife." That even _sounds_ stupid.
> ...


Browndi....you 'cut' it and 'dried' it...Period!    

BTW:  Thanks for letting me back in here.     I was 'scurred'


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 4, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Precious Wavy, I learned from you well indeed....  Stay out of the den!!!!


 
Girl...you know about those dens....


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## shynessqueen (Feb 4, 2008)

CandiceC said:


> I began to feel down too cause it seemed like people's feelings were being hurt when that wasn't my intent. I don't think I was saying anything mean.
> 
> I figure it's ok to agree to disagree. I like all of you guys here.


 

I was the one who started that thread and all I want to know was it true are not. It turned in to something else. I should have known better. You shouldn't feel bad. I'll feel bad for the both of us.


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 4, 2008)

shynessqueen said:


> I was the one who started that thread and all I want to know was it true are not. It turned in to something else. I should have known better. You shouldn't feel bad. I'll feel bad for the both of us.


 
Don't feel bad, shynessqueen.  You asked a question, and I find that when you ask that type of question in the OT forum, it goes haywire quickly

How could we know when something that we ask/say will turn out bad?  I was in the "PedEgg" thread and it went from good to bad to ugly then back to bad and then funny as heck.  In the end, it turned out ok.

I hope you don't feel bad starting another thread like that, but...I hope you find it to start it here in this forum.  

Blessings.


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## Shimmie (Feb 4, 2008)

Nice & Wavy said:


> Girl...you know about those dens....


Dey gon' bite ya'....


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 4, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Dey gon' bite ya'....


 
Wit raza sharp toofusus....


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## chellero (Feb 5, 2008)

JCoily said:


> For what it's worth, I agree with EVERYTHING you concluded based on what the scripture says.
> 
> It would be hypocritical for people to interpret the bible literally when it's being applied to everyone else, but figuratively when it applies to themselves.
> 
> Now wouldn't it?



I agreed with her conclusions too.  I think that people will interpret the Bible in the way that works for them.  People once used God's word to justify slavery and you couldn't convince them that slavery was wrong because slavery was what they wanted.


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## Shimmie (Feb 5, 2008)

JCoily said:
			
		

> It would be hypocritical for people to interpret the bible literally when it's being applied to everyone else, but figuratively when it applies to themselves.
> 
> Now wouldn't it?


While it is true, that many in life have and will continue to 'turn' scripture to their advantage, *no one in this thread* has done so regarding divorce and remarriage.  

For each divorce and remarriage represented here, there is solid scriptual license for the situations of those in this thread for divorce, which allows one to divorce and remarry.  

And _juuusssssssst _for the record , my divorced husband (who committed adultery and was abusive), is dead and buried, literally (God rest his soul).

So surely I have no 'turning' of scripture for personal justification. 

Therefore, I can and will without a doubt in God's literal word, be a support for others being judged unjustly.   

Peace and blessings...


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## lawyer2be371 (Feb 6, 2008)

Well I'm up in the air on this topic...
I have a friend that is newly divorced. His wife left him and filed for divorce.. He is feels that marriage is ordained by God, and although "MAN" says he is divorce, he still considers himself married to his wife. 

He told me that he knows that he will get back with his wife, because it was prophecied to him. Well he is a great, great, great guy. And I don't know if he is going to get back with his wife or not BUT, I pray and tell me if I'm right or wrong....

That God's will be done. And if it is for him and his wife to get back together let it be, but if not..God heal his hurt and set him free of his personal bondage...

Now I wrestle, with my feelings too, because he is saved (truly saved), and a Man of God..and i sort of feel that I'm being teased..not to sound crazy...So I'm praying to God so that he can reveal to me what am I suppose to be learning and how should I proceed in my friendship with him.


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## Shimmie (Feb 6, 2008)

lawyer2be371 said:


> Well I'm up in the air on this topic...
> I have a friend that is newly divorced. His wife left him and filed for divorce.. He is feels that marriage is ordained by God, and although "MAN" says he is divorce, he still considers himself married to his wife.
> 
> He told me that he knows that he will get back with his wife, because it was prophecied to him. Well he is a great, great, great guy. And I don't know if he is going to get back with his wife or not BUT, I pray and tell me if I'm right or wrong....
> ...


He's not the only great, great, great guy; neither is he truly saved for he is in bondage. Hurting...yes. In love with a woman who didn't want him, unable to accept the ending of his marriage, unable to deal with the 'rejection' of someone he depended upon. 

It's bondage and when one is in bondage it's like an addiction; for even when feeling the pain, they still choose to stay in it, hoping it will help them gain back the love they've lost. In this state no matter how 'saved' they are, all of their faith is spent upon regaining the 'loss' at any expense.

Here's the thing, don't get into bondage with him.  You have a lot in store and you deserve so much more, that God has to offer that this man cannot. He has a long journey towards healing to travel through. And it's not designed for you to be ensnared. 

You deserve better, far better and you cannot be denied. 

God bless you precious lawyer to be. You've already passed the 'bar'.


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 7, 2008)

I listened to these two messages about divorce, and it is very good.  I hope this will also help to clarify some things about the limited grounds for divorce as a christian. These messages are from Pastor Paul Sheppard of Enduring Truth Ministries.  www.enduringtruth.org


Listen to this one first: "Shutting the Door of Divorce" 
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/Enduring_Truth/archives.asp?bcd=2008-2-5

And then listen to part 2: "Conclusion of Shutting the Door of Divorce."
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/Enduring_Truth/archives.asp?bcd=2008-2-6

Blessings to all!


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## chellero (Feb 7, 2008)

lawyer2be371 said:


> Well I'm up in the air on this topic...
> I have a friend that is newly divorced. His wife left him and filed for divorce.. He is feels that marriage is ordained by God, and although "MAN" says he is divorce, he still considers himself married to his wife.
> 
> He told me that he knows that he will get back with his wife, because it was prophecied to him. Well he is a great, great, great guy. And I don't know if he is going to get back with his wife or not BUT, I pray and tell me if I'm right or wrong....
> ...



If he feels that he is still married in God's eyes and the Bible backs that up then your friendship can only be a friendship because he's married.


----------



## Shimmie (Feb 7, 2008)

Nice & Wavy said:


> I listened to these two messages about divorce, and it is very good. I hope this will also help to clarify some things about the limited grounds for divorce as a christian. These messages are from Pastor Paul Sheppard of Enduring Truth Ministries. www.enduringtruth.org
> 
> 
> Listen to this one first: "Shutting the Door of Divorce"
> ...


Precious Wavy, I'm so glad God placed you here. We need God's echo and you and you husband are the perfect marriage team to minister to us. What I respect is that you share other Pastor's teachings which gives everyone a broader perspective and understanding. 

Marriage is no doubt a complex experience. 

But then so is 'chocolate'....

Both are extremely enjoyable and rewarding, yet you have to work off the calories to avoid the extra burden of weight. We have to work at marriage to keep it from becoming a burden or ruined chocolate.


----------



## Belle Du Jour (Feb 7, 2008)

JCoily said:


> For what it's worth, I agree with EVERYTHING you concluded based on what the scripture says.
> 
> It would be hypocritical for people to interpret the bible literally when it's being applied to everyone else, but figuratively when it applies to themselves.
> 
> Now wouldn't it?





GREAT point.


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 8, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Precious Wavy, I'm so glad God placed you here. We need God's echo and you and you husband are the perfect marriage team to minister to us. What I respect is that you share other Pastor's teachings which gives everyone a broader perspective and understanding.
> 
> Marriage is no doubt a complex experience.
> 
> ...


 
I appreciate your kind words, sis.  I believe that when you hear someone teaching sound doctrine, it should be shared with all.

You sure are right about marriage...and, chocolate

God surely has given you spiritual insight on the marriage relationship.  I know that in the future, I will be calling on you to speak at one of our marriage conferences....(yes, I know you will come...I'm being prophetic)

Blessing to you, always and much love!


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## Crackers Phinn (Feb 8, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> While it is true, that many in life have and will continue to 'turn' scripture to their advantage, *no one in this thread* has done so regarding divorce and remarriage. For each divorce and remarriage represented here,* there is solid scriptual license for the situations of those in this thread for divorce, which allows one to divorce and remarry.   *



If you are applying what the bible literally says to ALL situations described in this thread, then you are incorrect. You are aiding and abetting untruth regardless of how many e-high fives you get.

It IS hypocritical to read Mark 10:12 and run looking for some other scripture to 'cancel it out', because it fits your situation.

Now my point IS NOT that people ought to stay in abusive/messed up marriages. My point IS NOT that people should never remarry.  I'm not the one to tell Tina she needed to stay married to Ike and deserved no happiness until he died. This is because I do not interpret the bible literally.  I don't hold people to that standard because it would be cruel. 

My point IS that Christians who interpret the bible literally and cast stones at homosexuality, fornication, or whatever explicit situation they find in scripture, need to apply that same literal interpretation when it applies to themselves.  

Call me the devil if you want to, but the Golden Rule is a good idea IF you are a fair and just person.


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## firecracker (Feb 8, 2008)

JCoily said:


> If you are applying what the bible literally says to ALL situations described in this thread, then you are incorrect. You are aiding and abetting untruth regardless of how many e-high fives you get.
> 
> It IS hypocritical to read Mark 10:12 and run looking for some other scripture to 'cancel it out', because it fits your situation.
> 
> ...


 
Hey don't waste your time.  Agree to disagree.  Cuz aint naw one of us got the keys to heaven nor the keys to sainthood.  Just follow me back on over to the den of sin! Where folks can fuss and fight w/o protection just locking of thread and banishment tis all.


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## Belle Du Jour (Feb 8, 2008)

JCoily said:


> If you are applying what the bible literally says to ALL situations described in this thread, then you are incorrect. *You are aiding and abetting untruth regardless of how many e-high fives you get.*
> 
> It IS hypocritical to read Mark 10:12 and run looking for some other scripture to 'cancel it out', because it fits your situation.
> 
> ...



Again,


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## Crackers Phinn (Feb 8, 2008)

firecracker said:


> Hey don't waste your time.  *Agree to disagree*.  Cuz aint naw one of us got the keys to heaven nor the keys to sainthood.  Just follow me back on over to the den of sin! Where folks can fuss and fight w/o protection just locking of thread and banishment tis all.



@ the bolded is fair.


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## Princess4real (Feb 9, 2008)

JCoily said:


> If you are applying what the bible literally says to ALL situations described in this thread, then you are incorrect. You are aiding and abetting untruth regardless of how many e-high fives you get.
> 
> It IS hypocritical to read Mark 10:12 and run looking for some other scripture to 'cancel it out', because it fits your situation.
> 
> ...


 
I agree with your whole post.


----------



## Princess4real (Feb 9, 2008)

firecracker said:


> Hey don't waste your time. Agree to disagree. Cuz *aint naw one of us got the keys to heaven nor the keys to sainthood*. Just follow me back on over to the den of sin! Where folks can fuss and fight w/o protection just locking of thread and banishment tis all.


 
That needed to be said!


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## Shimmie (Feb 9, 2008)

JCoily said:


> If you are applying what the bible literally says to ALL situations described in this thread, then you are incorrect. You are aiding and abetting untruth regardless of how many e-high fives you get.
> 
> It IS hypocritical to read Mark 10:12 and run looking for some other scripture to 'cancel it out', because it fits your situation.
> 
> ...


I'm not going to call you a devil.  Life has hurt you enough, which is why you're so cynical and I feel sorry for you.  

What you've shared comes from a person with an injured heart.  The 'bully' who deep down is sad and afraid.  You came into this thread to throw negative stones;carrying an angry grudge because someone here voices what you don't agree with regarding gays, etc.. all of which has nothing to do with the topic.

Yet each thing you've spoken negatively about 'me' and other Christians, is what you see and don't like about yourself...hypocricy.  

You can't call us hypocrites without being one yourself.  After all, it's the golden rule...."do unto others...."

I wish you peace and I mean this sincerely.


----------



## klb120475 (Feb 9, 2008)

I haven't read the thread but I wanna give my .........
I wish somebody would tell say me and Boo marriage won't be blessed.


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## lawyer2be371 (Feb 9, 2008)

klb120475 said:


> I haven't read the thread but I wanna give my .........
> I wish somebody would tell say me and Boo marriage won't be blessed.


 
Girl, i was reading like who is BOO!, and then I read the FYI.........! (lol)
Maybe thats what I need to do , give my imaginary husband a name!


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## Shimmie (Feb 9, 2008)

klb120475 said:


> I haven't read the thread but I wanna give my .........
> I wish somebody would tell say me and Boo marriage won't be blessed.


I wouldn't dare mis-'lachen' with you and your Boo...

I'm no fool.....  

I love you KLB. I wish all of God's very best for both you and Boo...


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## chellero (Feb 10, 2008)

JCoily said:


> If you are applying what the bible literally says to ALL situations described in this thread, then you are incorrect. You are aiding and abetting untruth regardless of how many e-high fives you get.
> 
> It IS hypocritical to read Mark 10:12 and run looking for some other scripture to 'cancel it out', because it fits your situation.
> 
> ...




I agree with you again.  It is really bothering me that people are twisting the  Bible to suit their purposes in this thread and others.  And I realize that we all do it from time to time. I am consistent in my beliefs on marriage in cases of divorce _and _for gay people, but I am sure that there's some area where I am less consistent.  I think that we as Christians want badly to be living in accordance with God's word, AND want to do want makes us the happiest at the moment, and those aren't always the same things.  So we deny, justify and twist to try to have it both ways. 

I think that's what's happened in this thread and others about divorce and remarriage.  It's easy to throw stones at gay people as most of us aren't gay and have no desire to partake of that particular sin, but when it's something that we want (like a new marriage) then we can't see it.


----------



## Crackers Phinn (Feb 10, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> I'm not going to call you a devil.  Life has hurt you enough, which is why you're so cynical and I feel sorry for you.
> 
> What you've shared comes from a person with an injured heart.  The 'bully' who deep down is sad and afraid.  You came into this thread to throw negative stones;carrying an angry grudge because someone here voices what you don't agree with regarding gays, etc.. all of which has nothing to do with the topic.
> 
> ...



I wouldn't dream of interfering with your need to 'feel sorry for me'.  

I completely understand how me disagreeing with you spreading misinformation would make me a Goliath in good need of a slingshot full of  amateur therapy.  



			
				 Jcoily said:
			
		

> My point IS that Christians who interpret the bible literally and cast stones at homosexuality, fornication, or whatever explicit situation they find in scripture, need to apply that same literal interpretation when it applies to themselves.



Proverbs 11:1 The LORD abhors dishonest scales, but accurate weights are his delight. 

Shimmie, you wished me peace.  

Thank you.

I am going to wish you the gift of clarity to see past your own pride.

Proverbs 11:2
When pride comes, then comes disgrace, but with humility comes wisdom.

*BTW - nice use of a 'b' word to describe me.


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## Crackers Phinn (Feb 10, 2008)

chellero said:


> I agree with you again.  It is really bothering me that people are twisting the  Bible to suit their purposes in this thread and others.  And I realize that we all do it from time to time. I am consistent in my beliefs on marriage in cases of divorce _and _for gay people, but I am sure that there's some area where I am less consistent.  *I think that we as Christians want badly to be living in accordance with God's word, AND want to do want makes us the happiest at the moment, and those aren't always the same things.  So we deny, justify and twist to try to have it both ways. *
> 
> I think that's what's happened in this thread and others about divorce and remarriage.  It's easy to throw stones at gay people as most of us aren't gay and have no desire to partake of that particular sin, but when it's something that we want (like a new marriage) then we can't see it.



We see eye to eye on this.


----------



## Shimmie (Feb 10, 2008)

JCoily said:


> I wouldn't dream of interfering with your need to 'feel sorry for me'.
> 
> I completely understand how me disagreeing with you spreading misinformation would make me a Goliath in good need of a slingshot full of amateur therapy.
> 
> ...


Again, nothing you've said applies to anyone in this thread. The women's situations, gave them no other choice than to divorce. And they each have scriptual license to re-marry. Not my word, but God's. 

If you disagree, that's your right, but that does not give you the right to come into this thread with cynical remarks and accusations for which there is no 'just' cause.  

Coily, you are a 'hurting' person who's carrying a grudge that goes beyond the topic of this thread. This is your standard "MO", seeking opportunities to discredit Christians. It's been this way for as long as I've been here. And it's so unnecessary. You've not the God of us. Neither can you fix what you don't like about us. 

Using the 'gay' issue doesn't hold water. For even those who do not believe in God and do not read nor follow the Bible, do not advocate homosexuality. Meaning, that the majority of the human race, be they Christian or non-Christian, Bible or no Bible, do not advocate the lifestyle. So leave God out of this as your basis to accuse us...namely me. You have no just cause, only a deep grudge that you cannot let go of. 

I can see you doing what you've never failed to accuse 'us' Christians (namely 'me') of; using scripture to justify your point. The thing is you've used scripture which again does not apply to anyone in this thread, unless it's you. 

The bottom line is that...

You cannot stop God's love from flowing in this forum.
You cannot stop the much needed ministry that members are receiving.
You cannot stop the loving Christian fellowship that flows here.
You cannot stop the Bible from being what it is, whether you agree with it or not.
You cannot 'whip' your way into the path of the Holy Spirit, to prevent Him from healing those who come here for healing from brokenness, comfort and someone to listen to them and just be here for them.
Whether I'm personally here or not, Jesus will still be here and you cannot undo His presence or His purpose for the Christianity Forum. It's here to glorify Him, and no one else...not even me (whom you seek to discredit). 

Your whole point was to undo or to throw a wrench in the flow of love and comfort that abides in the Christianity Forum. You see, even when Christians disagree, they have the conviction of the Holy Spirit to correct them and those of us who abide in Him, follow Him with the corection. 

Your presence here is without the desire to do such, but only to discredit and that's what you get pleasure from; and it's so sad. Yet it's understood for this is what people who are hurting or those seeking attention do. They seek to hurt others for relief. This is so, so sad. 

From this post forward, I have to place you on 'ignore'.  

It's unfortunate, yet I advise you to do the same, for we will never 'agree' on your accusations. Yet I will pray for you...sincerely. 

Take care, JCoily..... "Jesus Loves You" all the more....


----------



## Shimmie (Feb 10, 2008)

chellero said:


> I agree with you again. It is really bothering me that people are twisting the Bible to suit their purposes in this thread and others. And I realize that we all do it from time to time. I am consistent in my beliefs on marriage in cases of divorce _and _for gay people, but I am sure that there's some area where I am less consistent. I think that we as Christians want badly to be living in accordance with God's word, AND want to do want makes us the happiest at the moment, and those aren't always the same things. So we deny, justify and twist to try to have it both ways.
> 
> I think that's what's happened in this thread and others about divorce and remarriage. It's easy to throw stones at gay people as most of us aren't gay and have no desire to partake of that particular sin, but when it's something that we want (like a new marriage) then we can't see it.


chellero, the women in this thread DO have scriptual basis for divorce (adultery and abuse), and they are also scriptually safe to remarry.

I can't help but wonder if this were 'you'.....what would you do.  If a man came into your life to love you, you too would remarry.   And I'm not 're-writing scripture.  

For me personally, my ex-husband is deceased, so I have no personal reason to re-definfe scripture to justify my re-marriage. let alone mis-lead someone else.  

None of us are 'perfect', I'm first to admit it.  But I'm most certain, that God honors re-marriage between a man and a woman, who choose to give Him glory, than a gay relationship.   

Blessings....


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## Crackers Phinn (Feb 10, 2008)

Many a prideful shepherd has lead their flock astray. 

The ignore button can't and won't stop the truth.


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## chellero (Feb 10, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> chellero, the women in this thread DO have scriptual basis for divorce (adultery and abuse), and they are also scriptually safe to remarry. I don't want to delve further into someone's personal situation, but based on what was posted in the OT thread of remarriage one poster in particular has no scriptural basis to remarry.
> 
> I can't help but wonder if this were 'you'.....what would you do.  If a man came into your life to love you, you too would remarry.   And I'm not 're-writing scripture.  I've said this before : If it were me, I'd remarry. But I would NOT claim that I was permitted to remarry based on what the Bible says because that would be misrepresenting God's word to others.
> 
> ...




My response is in red.


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## kayte (Feb 10, 2008)

Shimmie....thank you for setting a _lovely_ example and standard...especially to a newbie to this forum and board... 
.. at times the best response is prayerful loving honesty,_detachment _and respectful boundaries. 

& see..
calvary love continues and is passed on and on 

I guess I am OT.
but maybe not ...after all is God IS love 


Blessings. 
Kayte


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## Nice & Wavy (Feb 11, 2008)

kayte said:


> Shimmie....thank you for setting a _lovely_ example and standard...especially to a newbie to this forum and board...
> .. at times the best response is prayerful loving honesty,_detachment _and respectful boundaries.
> 
> & see..
> ...


 
Welcome, Kayte.

ITA with your whole post and no, you are not OT, but a woman after God's own heart.  Thank you for seeing the "truth".

Luv, N&W


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## Crackers Phinn (Feb 11, 2008)

chellero said:


> I've said this before : If it were me, I'd remarry. But I would NOT claim that I was permitted to remarry based on what the Bible says because that would be misrepresenting God's word to others.







chellero said:


> What scripture do you base this on? I don't think that God honors adultery (if your marriage is not allowed) any more than homosexuality. Sin is sin in God's eyes.





The book says what it says, even when it hits close to home.


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## chellero (Feb 11, 2008)

Shimmie said:


> Again, nothing you've said applies to anyone in this thread. The women's situations, gave them no other choice than to divorce. And they each have scriptual license to re-marry. Not my word, but God's.
> 
> If you disagree, that's your right, but that does not give you the right to come into this thread with cynical remarks and accusations for which there is no 'just' cause.
> 
> ...



I wasn't going to say anything in response to this at first, but this comment keeps bothering me.  I think that what you've said is unfair.  I don't think that Jcoily or anyone tried to stop God's love from flowing in this forum, or keep the Holy Spirit from healing people.  I don't think that she's  trying to hurt people or make them feel bad.  

I think that she just wants for people to be honest about God's word.  Sometimes what the Bible says about a particular situation seems cruel or painful for someone else to hear.  I certainly sympathize with people who find themselves married to an abuser and later divorce.  It's a horrible situation.  But that situation does NOT allow remarriage according to the Bible. You've referred to the situation as bondage, but it's not.  It's a *covenant *between 2 people and God. 

For what it's worth, I think that you went too far with your comment. What you said was not the truth in love.  It was more like saying something cruel to someone and then adding "bless your heart," at the end as if that makes it ok.  I seriously don't mean to offend you, and I'm pretty sure that jcoily can stick up for herself and doesn't need my assistance.  But I still felt like this needed saying.


ETA:  I hope that I don't end up on ignore as well.  Even if I do, I won't be ignoring you, because I feel that most of the time the things that you say are interesting, and insightful.


----------



## Browndilocks (Feb 11, 2008)

chellero said:


> I wasn't going to say anything in response to this at first, but this comment keeps bothering me.  I think that what you've said is unfair.  I don't think that Jcoily or anyone tried to stop God's love from flowing in this forum, or keep the Holy Spirit from healing people.  I don't think that she's  trying to hurt people or make them feel bad.
> 
> I think that she just wants for people to be honest about God's word.  Sometimes what the Bible says about a particular situation seems cruel or painful for someone else to hear.  I certainly sympathize with people who find themselves married to an abuser and later divorce.  It's a horrible situation.  But that situation does NOT allow remarriage according to the Bible. You've referred to the situation as bondage, but it's not.  It's a *covenant *between 2 people and God.
> 
> ...



I believe that most people on here really just want honesty when it comes to God's word.  The thing is - people just have to remember to be mindful of the condescending tone that they send when they chose to translate certain words into posts.  That goes for Jcoily, me, you, and everybody else.

You can't try to justify God's truth when you're also being a smart ass.  Just doesn't work.

See?


----------



## Crackers Phinn (Feb 11, 2008)

Browndilocks said:


> You can't try to justify God's truth when you're also being a smart ass.  Just doesn't work.
> 
> See?



I got zero beef with you as a matter of fact, IMHO you are good peoples.

I think that if you were to read the posts in this thread, the 'smart assedness' began before I made an appearance.   

There are people who I respect on this board who were basically called 'the devil' in this thread for asking questions and providing accurate answers. But it seems that folk can't see the duplicity when 'she who has me on ignore' is the one calling people out.


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## Browndilocks (Feb 11, 2008)

JCoily said:


> I think that if you were to read the posts in this thread, the 'smart assedness' began before I made an appearance.



Yup - that's really all I was trying to say. 

I hate that this thread took this type of turn though.  It would have been nice to hear from more divorced Christian people, and whether they feel like they're still married to their ex spouses.


----------



## Princess4real (Feb 11, 2008)

Browndilocks said:


> I believe that most people on here really just want honesty when it comes to God's word. The thing is - people just have to remember to be mindful of the condescending tone that they send when they chose to translate certain words into posts. That goes for Jcoily, me, you, and everybody else.
> 
> *You can't try to justify God's truth when you're also being a smart ass. Just doesn't work.*
> 
> See?


----------



## gone_fishing (Feb 11, 2008)

About 3 years ago now...hmmm...yes, it's been three years...I went to Pastor Douglas in tears at my church in agony about the prospect of filing for a divorce. It was not with a light heart that I made the decision. I went to counseling, brought my bible, and took notes and I was RESIGNED to the fact that if my church told me I could not remarry - then I wouldn't.  I had heard it here and there that I couldn't remarry until my ex died and I wanted to make sure this was so.

When I walked into Pastor Douglas' office (asst. Pastor), I was not looking for an "out". At the time, the idea of being married again repulsed me.  I was so hurt and in pain that the thought of another marriage coudln't have been farther from my mind.

But on that day, I sat with Pastor Douglas at my church and I asked him - what does the Word say. And I took a 16 week course on Courting-Marriage-Remarriage which was very detailed and insightful. 

If you doubt the integrity of my church or my pastor, feel free to listen to some of the candid sermons offered by my church:

http://www.centralchurchofgod.org

My church does not candy coat or play games with scripture and I searched far and long for a church who will give it to me like it is.

I was told that I could remarry at THAT time and it wasn't until recently on this forum that this question for me was called into play.

I will be making another appointment with Pastor Douglas in a few weeks. I want him to meet my fiancee and I want him to discuss with us God's expectations for our relationship. I want to ensure that we have God's blessing. 

I'll report back with what he says.

If you are curious this is my churches requirements for performing a wedding.

*Wedding Application & Forms*

*To begin the planning process, please fill out the following forms and mail to:*

*Central Church of God*
*c/o Terry McHam*
*5301 Sardis Road*
*Charlotte, NC 28270*

*Wedding Application*
*Click here to download a printable version.*

*Premarital Questions (Bride)
Click here to download a printable version.*
*Premarital Questions (Groom)
Click here to download a printable version.*


*Wedding Requirements*



*Officiating Pastors *

A member of the pastoral staff MUST officiate at all weddings at Central Church. The couple may request which member of the pastoral staff they would like to perform the wedding.

*Premarital Counseling*

We believe that marriage is the most important decision that anyone will make in this lifetime outside of accepting Jesus Christ as his Savior. It is because of this that we believe marriage should not be entered into hastily but only after much prayer and counsel. 

Central Church has an excellent Premarital Counseling Program that will assist the couple in facing many of the realities and challenges that are involved in marriage. All couples who are going to be married at Central will complete this program with their officiating pastor. The wedding date will NOT be officially confirmed until this program consisting of 6-8 sessions and outside homework is completed. 

Special counseling for couples who have experienced a divorce may be recommended. Divorced persons should observe a waiting period of at least one year prior to a subsequent marriage. 

We believe that premarital counseling is a vital part of our ministry at Central Church and therefore there will be no charge to the couple.

*Wedding Director*

Before you begin your premarital sessions, the church’s Wedding Coordinator will contact you to schedule an orientation meeting. At this meeting the Wedding Director will be discussing your wedding plans, as well as church policies and procedures. This is to help you plan your wedding but your wedding date is not officially confirmed until you have completed the Pre-Marital counseling. 

Weddings, rehearsals, decorations and use of church facilities will be supervised solely by the church’s Wedding Director.


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## Zuhus (Feb 12, 2008)

ITA with Chellero. I believe some things and words being thrown around are totally uncalled for and even unnecessary. Lets just allow God's true love to flow among us all here. 
Otherwise I understand we all want to try and follow God's will I believe, so no need to throw about words to anyone. 

*Romans 14:1-13* says,1 Accept those whose faith is weak, without quarreling over disputable matters. 2 One person's faith allows them to eat everything, but another person, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. 3 The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted that person. 4 Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To their own master they stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand. 5 Some consider one day more sacred than another; others consider every day alike. Everyone should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Those who regard one day as special do so to the Lord. Those who eat meat do so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and those who abstain do so to the Lord and give thanks to God. 7 For we do not live to ourselves alone and we do not die to ourselves alone. 8 If we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. 9 For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. 10 You, then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat your brother or sister with contempt? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat. 11 It is written: " 'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, 'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.' " 12 So then, we will all give an account of ourselves to God. 13 Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister. 
God bless you all


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## Princess4real (Feb 12, 2008)

Zuhus said:


> ITA with Chellero. I believe some things and words being thrown around are totally uncalled for and even unnecessary. Lets just allow God's true love to flow among us all here.
> Otherwise I understand we all want to try and follow God's will I believe, so no need to throw about words to anyone.
> 
> *Romans 14:1-13* says,1 Accept those whose faith is weak, without quarreling over disputable matters. 2 One person's faith allows them to eat everything, but another person, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. 3 The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted that person. 4 Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To their own master they stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand. 5 Some consider one day more sacred than another; others consider every day alike. Everyone should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Those who regard one day as special do so to the Lord. Those who eat meat do so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and those who abstain do so to the Lord and give thanks to God. 7 For we do not live to ourselves alone and we do not die to ourselves alone. 8 If we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. 9 For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. 10 You, then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat your brother or sister with contempt? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat. 11 It is written: " 'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, 'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.' " 12 So then, we will all give an account of ourselves to God. 13 Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister.
> God bless you all


 
Beautiful, those words should be on every church bulletin every Sunday!!! People don't realize how their words and attitudes keep people who really want to hear the word, from going to church.


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