Sense and Sensuality ("Loving" Spinny)

[Southernbella.]

Thanks to the poster who posted those books. I started reading Art of Seduction. I like it so far.

I skimmed through Fascinating Womanhood and had to laugh at myself. I just knew I would hate it but I actually do most of the stuff in the book already

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using LHCF

 

[tatiana]

Thanks for saying this. ITA. I also think it's important for BW to recognize this as I believe we've lost a great deal of our femininity over the years.

I agree. I was reading a book by Audrey Chapman who stated that AA parents (mothers and fathers) indirectly and directly encourage their daughters' masculine side and discourage their feminine side.

 

[FemmeFatale]

I agree. I was reading a book by Audrey Chapman who stated that AA parents (mothers and fathers) indirectly and directly encourage their daughters' masculine side and discourage their feminine side.

Did the book explain why?

 

[MonPetite]

@LittleGoldenLamb

Have you ever read THE RED TENT. I love that book, its the epitome of femininity. I love it, I think its based on the first testament.

SophieDulce

Parts of it, yes. It is based on the Old Testament --historical fiction.

 

[MonPetite]

I agree. I was reading a book by Audrey Chapman who stated that AA parents (mothers and fathers) indirectly and directly encourage their daughters' masculine side and discourage their feminine side.

tatiana Did the book say why?

Because Thanks wasn't enough . This was a big one for me. When I was younger I was heavy into the Asian culture (manga, anime, etc.) We all know their ideal of beauty (long black hair, pale skin, big eyes) well I didn't quite look like that . Then of course you have the white standard of beauty (blond hair, blue eyes, super skinny) I didn't look like that either . Then the Black standard of beauty, my Southern culture's ideal ("good" hair, light skin "yellow bone" and light eyes) I didn't make the cut there either . This really affected me throughout my middle/high school years. I was tomboyish and had very masculine mannerisms. Funny thing was I had no problems attracting boys, I was(am) pretty; it was just the way I seen myself that was the problem, my self-esteem was shot.

Society will have you believing that your femininity and self-worth is based on your looks and if you don't meet the ideal standards than your worth is less than the woman that does meet the standard. Don't fall for it!!

I understand this as well. I was raised in Japanese culture as the first I was ever exposed to. Then was thrown into mid-western culture. By the southern culture of my family, I met the mark on the skin tone, but not hair or eye color and was terrorized for being the color I am, despite it being "praised".

My post on this can be read here.

I fully break down why beauty does not, and never will equal feminine AND how you can actually effect a greater sense of beauty about yourself to others by being feminine that NEVER FADES as physical beauty does, even if you happen to fit your culture's standard.

It's a long one, so I don't want to cut and paste it into the thread.

 

[Zaynab]

TracyNicole we think just alike on this topic, I find it totally fascinating and amazing and if I ever have a daughter she'll be a BAD MAMA JAMA OK! I've actually been studying this for a few years now too but your reading list is SUPERB! See you're married so I want to know how implementing all of this great knowledge has improved your marriage and your day to day life.

And yes, you are spot on about a woman's home being a reflection of her womanhood. I have purchased more accent pieces, candles and duvets.

Anyway, here's my short list of books that I have gotten from Amazon (I do the same thing as you, get my used copies, lol). I'm also subscribed to a few blogs and YT channels.

The Art of Seduction
48 Laws of Power
The Rules
Powerful and Feminine
Simply Irresistible
Healing Love Through Tao: Cultivating Female Sexual Energy
Seven Days to Sex Appeal
Backwards in High Heels
For Woman Only: What You Need To Know About the Inner Lives of Men

Who is the author of Sex Secrets? And where do you store/hide your books (these are clearly not coffee table books )?

@ the bolded, I've read all of these books and they are very good. Being truly feminine and embracing that is VERY powerful. I wish women would learn to use this power. It's not even so much about relationships with men or doing these things to woo a man, it's a inner confidence you will exude. There will be a noticeable shift in the way people treat you. And if you're with an SO or DH, they will treat you differently, they won't even know why.

I'm pretty feminine and men and women cater to me in that because of the way I carry myself. It's also not about beauty as LittleLamb (love her blogs) is always explaining. I've seen attractive women who aren't at all feminine yet probably deeply believe they are. These two things are not at all synonymous.

Good book suggestions ladies

 

[BK Bombshell]

Here's a link to the original Fascinating Womanhood.

The original pamphlets were written in 1922 and as far as I know have no mention of religion at all. Helen Andelin used it as the basis for her book in the 1960's, but she also added a lot of religious language because of her Mormon faith. The language is a bit archaic and wordy, but I liked it much better than Andelin's book.

 

[Zaynab]

I'd always considered myself well versed in things related to femininity and taking care of my husband but reading Fascinating Womanhood completely changed my life and marriage... I don't recommend it often because most women I run into just can't handle the values shared in the book.

This. I always think that women think they have an understanding of femininity and how it relates in a marriage but they really don't often have the concept down. I always recommend this book, I don't mind the flack

 

[Enyo]

I had a talk with my intern yesterday and she admitted she didn't think she was that good looking. I asked her to repeat herself and when she confirmed my ears were not broken, I promptly got up and enlisted the help of an older co-worker who I trust to speak with her nicely because my instinct is to rant and rave about how wrong she is. The auntie who came over told the intern to look in the mirror, ask herself who the stunning young woman is in the mirror, and then pinch yourself so that you realize it's you.

We have to instil confidence in our girls. When another woman says, "You think you're cute!" they should respond, "Yes, I do.". I'm all for modesty but when a woman/girl feels beautiful she's more confident, and confidence is so important. I've never seen a self-actualized woman who didn't have it.

The intern was also told that I'm adopting her during work hours. She seemed both amused and pleased.

 

[ladysaraii]

Here's a link to the original Fascinating Womanhood.

The original pamphlets were written in 1922 and as far as I know have no mention of religion at all. Helen Andelin used it as the basis for her book in the 1960's, but she also added a lot of religious language because of her Mormon faith. The language is a bit archaic and wordy, but I liked it much better than Andelin's book.

I'm reading the 1922 pamphlets now and I'm really enjoying them.

This. I always think that women think they have an understanding of femininity and how it relates in a marriage but they really don't often have the concept down. I always recommend this book, I don't mind the flack

Zaynab

You've probably answered this before, but as there are like 3 of these books, which one are you recommending?

 

[FemmeFatale]

So what challenge are we doing?

 

[CarLiTa]

I am having trouble looking to old Hollywood for feminine inspiration. At least, I don't feel very excited to do so. First, I don't see many who look like me. Second, it seems like a boxed/cookie-cutter version of femininity: dresses, make up, wavy hair, red lipstick, whatever.
I'm looking for some more... holistic... inspiration. Women who are feminine + are leaders + (still figuring it out)

I want to look up to women who navigate both male and female spaces well... NOT the women who are viewed simply as an object of admiration in male spaces. I want to be looked at as a lovely woman, but I also need men to LISTEN to me once I open my mouth.

Got any examples of those types?

 

[LunadeMiel]

Great and informative thread!

 

[Enyo]

I am having trouble looking to old Hollywood for feminine inspiration. At least, I don't feel very excited to do so. First, I don't see many who look like me. Second, it seems like a boxed/cookie-cutter version of femininity: dresses, make up, wavy hair, red lipstick, whatever.

I want to look up to women who navigate both male and female spaces well... NOT the women who are viewed simply as an object of admiration in male spaces. I want to be looked at as a lovely woman, but I also need men to LISTEN to me once I open my mouth.

It's about nuances. How they smoke their cigarettes, how they deliver lines with innuendo and still not sound crass, how they look over their shoulders flirtatiously, how they take their coats/capes off and hand them to the waitstaff, and even how they argue. I strongly disagree that old Hollywood is just filled with women/roles who are "simply an object of admiration in males spaces". But maybe it's because I watch loads of old films and am familiar with ones where the woman is strong and yet sensual. I grew up on them, so my view is not limited to red lipstick (though the best films are in black and white ) or wavy hair.

ETA: Oh, and I learned the power of having a vanity table complete with lights from Old Hollywood. Even if it's just a magnified lighted mirror that you sit on your sink, dresser, or kitchen table to get ready. It really gets you in the mood to be glamorous - even if it's just a regular work day.

 

[Kimbosheart]

I've read the first chapter of Powerful and Feminine. I can't wait to finish this book. But so far in just the first chapter she has explained so many things for me.

I questioned why I am drawn to this topic so much given the fact that I already feel I am in touch with that femininity. I've read all 3 versions of fascinating womanhood. I find those teachings comfortable for me. I think the feminine essence, whats behind books like FW are alluring for me because of the connection to something higher. That spiritual element for me and because I notice when I'm in that zone personally things flow, including things like the FW teachings. All my relationships are better, I feel better, I'm not trying because I'm too busy being. It's hard to explain.

For learning purposes I can share one specific way. In my current relationship there was a period of time where things were undefined. And, I read the relationship forum and I follow conventional girl wisdom. So I would "fight" our status. Always questioning "what are we?", "where do you see this going?", "am i your girlfriend?". I don't know what happened but I changed focus for awhile, I think I had some stress at work. I let go of that concern and I somehow got back into my comfort zone. I am very girly, in the traditional sense. I started just enjoying myself when I was around him. I just forgot the other drama. I was starting to love this guy and he made me smile and I smiled without fear of status. And that was the beginning of our great relationship. He committed, he treats me like a queen, I don't have to ask for much with him. I think it was that vulnerability and softness that the author of powerful and feminine speaks about. I stopped asserting and I was so relaxed with him and off the focus of what we are that I attracted what I wanted.

I think this is the real draw to this topic for me. Instincts are great. And I think, judging from feedback, that I have great instincts. But now I want control. I don't want things to be happenstance. I want to control it so I can control how I stay in that spiritual connection. If I can practice controlling it now, I can do it under any circumstance. For me it's like a source of strength.

 

[RegaLady]

I've read the first chapter of Powerful and Feminine. I can't wait to finish this book. But so far in just the first chapter she has explained so many things for me.

.

Yes, I am finishing this book up now.

I like your example because she also talks about women just "being". Masculine energy is in invested in "doing"

I like how she says many women need to connect with the "Dantian" or lower parts of our bodies(three inches bellow our belly button on the inside, which is our center). I was watching women walk in the streets since reading this book and I noticed the women who walked with upper parts of their bodies verses the ones who walked in the hips and lower half. It was interesting to see. I ordered some Bellydancing dvds and dancing is going to be my form of body expression and exersise.

 

[greight]

I started just enjoying myself when I was around him. I just forgot the other drama. I was starting to love this guy and he made me smile and I smiled without fear of status. And that was the beginning of our great relationship. He committed, he treats me like a queen, I don't have to ask for much with him. I think it was that vulnerability and softness that the author of powerful and feminine speaks about. I stopped asserting and I was so relaxed with him and off the focus of what we are that I attracted what I wanted.

I think this is the real draw to this topic for me. Instincts are great. And I think, judging from feedback, that I have great instincts. But now I want control. I don't want things to be happenstance. I want to control it so I can control how I stay in that spiritual connection. If I can practice controlling it now, I can do it under any circumstance. For me it's like a source of strength.

I love this thread because your post just made me realize that this is how I am. I can honestly recall the moments where I'm "me" vs the moments where I'm completely and utterly self-conscious and it's pretty much the same kind of revelations. People start having random crushes on me and I'm like "how? where did this happen?" I'm like the last to know, too. And then I over think things and POOF my magic disappears . Like it enters my subconscious and alters my actions even if I don't try to act different.

 

[NewDayNewMe]

Maybe you ladies can help me out. In high school I was that girl, I was best dressed, always had my hair and nails done and only owned one pair of sneakers. I have always considered myself cute or pretty but not sexy. I feel more like a girl and less like a women. I was always able to get people male and female to do things for me because I look so sweet and innocent. Now that I am a SAHM I have completely fallen off. The problem is I am in the house 90% of the time or at grocery store, school. I dont see the point of getting dolled up to go to these places or to clean up or do laundry. Most of the time i look a mess(sweats or yoga gear and bonnet or scarf). DH syas he doesnt care he knows what i look like and whenever we step out he is proud but I feel bad. Becuase I have identified so much with being "cute" I feel uncomfortable or like a fraud if I try to do sexy.DH would like me to be more sexually aggresive but that also makes me uncomfortable. In my dreams I would be like Joan from Mad Men I think she is so feminine and sensual it seeps out her pores.
Sorry for rambeling I just know I need to step it up but it is hard given my lifestyle, natural inclinations and DH indifference.

 

[Kimbosheart]

Yes, I am finishing this book up now.

I like your example because she also talks about women just "being". Masculine energy is in invested in "doing"

I like how she says many women need to connect with the "Dantian" or lower parts of our bodies(three inches bellow our belly button on the inside, which is our center). I was watching women walk in the streets since reading this book and I noticed the women who walked with upper parts of their bodies verses the ones who walked in the hips and lower half. It was interesting to see. I ordered some Bellydancing dvds and dancing is going to be my form of body expression and exersise.

Lol, my background is heavily in dance. Ballet mostly but notice how even male ballet dancers are highly feminine. Although Barishnikov made it somehow very sexy and male. It's like it's all coming together. I take dance classes on and off but lately I've been re-committing to dance as my form of creative expression. Some people can sing, others can draw or write. I'll just be happy with dance. Performing is really an incomparable feelings.

I love this thread because your post just made me realize that this is how I am. I can honestly recall the moments where I'm "me" vs the moments where I'm completely and utterly self-conscious and it's pretty much the same kind of revelations. People start having random crushes on me and I'm like "how? where did this happen?" I'm like the last to know, too. And then I over think things and POOF my magic disappears . Like it enters my subconscious and alters my actions even if I don't try to act different.

This is exactly what I was trying to say. It's all coming together, so many lightbulbs. I want to be in control of just being. Sometimes I'll have to be more assertive but I want to switch that right off and flow every chance I can. It's funny because I don't think I'm the prettiest girl in the room but especially when I'm not thinking about it men are attracted. It's very real, I have to watch myself because thats not always a good thing.

I think there is something to the "vulnerability/softness" of being feminine. Men protect things that are vulnerable and soft. Even those things that are within in themselves. They cover it, the protect and treat it like gold. Think of the "family jewels" which are soft and vulnerable most of the time. So when we allow that to shine through, maybe to them it's something instinctive to protect. Just a thought/theory.

 

[CarLiTa]

I identify with the above a lot. ETA, greight's post, I mean.
I think my energy is calm and some men like that. I don't think I radiate b.tch vibes at all. I tend to attract men who are the opposite... sometimes with hype social energy, other times with hype nerd energy lol. One guy I dated and hung out with recently said that whenever he's around me he feels super mellow, super relaxed. Funny, I used to feel the same way around him too. Likewise, on a date last night, was hanging out with a guy who's intellectually brilliant, the kind who thinks a mile a minute. He commented a bit on my energy too, and that took me by surprise. He had a lot of complementary things to say, and I felt like: really? Hm, thanks!
On the other hand I know I have a hard time connecting with boisterous guys. Sometimes I like to be (momentarily) silent and savor the moment, and all their talking and joking is blocking my authentic energy. I don't know if I should even consider their "boisterousness" to be extremely masculine. It's just distractingerplexed

 

[greight]

This is exactly what I was trying to say. It's all coming together, so many lightbulbs. I want to be in control of just being. Sometimes I'll have to be more assertive but I want to switch that right off and flow every chance I can. It's funny because I don't think I'm the prettiest girl in the room but especially when I'm not thinking about it men are attracted. It's very real, I have to watch myself because thats not always a good thing.

I think there is something to the "vulnerability/softness" of being feminine. Men protect things that are vulnerable and soft. Even those things that are within in themselves. They cover it, the protect and treat it like gold. Think of the "family jewels" which are soft and vulnerable most of the time. So when we allow that to shine through, maybe to them it's something instinctive to protect. Just a thought/theory.

I ALWAYS used to say this. Switch light on, switch light off. For whatever reason, when it's "on", it's ON .

I don't even recognize it until afterwards which is so interesting. It's all hindsight. I wish I wasn't so oblivious sometims

I wish I could say that I have a softness, but while I don't have a hardness about me, I wouldn't call myself soft either.

I identify with the above a lot. ETA, greight's post, I mean.
I think my energy is calm and some men like that. I don't think I radiate b.tch vibes at all. I tend to attract men who are the opposite... sometimes with hype social energy, other times with hype nerd energy lol. One guy I dated and hung out with recently said that whenever he's around me he feels super mellow, super relaxed. Funny, I used to feel the same way around him too. Likewise, on a date last night, was hanging out with a guy who's intellectually brilliant, the kind who thinks a mile a minute. He commented a bit on my energy too, and that took me by surprise. He had a lot of complementary things to say, and I felt like: really? Hm, thanks!

Carlita, I don't even know what I attract I've had personalities across the spectrum, it's crazy. I don't know what it is, maybe my personality is just all over the place too

 

[CarLiTa]

It's about nuances. How they smoke their cigarettes, how they deliver lines with innuendo and still not sound crass, how they look over their shoulders flirtatiously, how they take their coats/capes off and hand them to the waitstaff, and even how they argue. I strongly disagree that old Hollywood is just filled with women/roles who are "simply an object of admiration in males spaces". But maybe it's because I watch loads of old films and am familiar with ones where the woman is strong and yet sensual. I grew up on them, so my view is not limited to red lipstick (though the best films are in black and white ) or wavy hair.

ETA: Oh, and I learned the power of having a vanity table complete with lights from Old Hollywood. Even if it's just a magnified lighted mirror that you sit on your sink, dresser, or kitchen table to get ready. It really gets you in the mood to be glamorous - even if it's just a regular work day.

I don't know... I'm not sure that that answers my questions. I'm pro-femininity, but I feel like I'm looking for role models who better suit my style and interests, and I am not sure where to look. I need visuals lol. Please post clips as you find them. Some of us are visual learners, which is why I love that video with Brandon Marlo and the Black woman with the sensuous walk.

I wanna see a feminine woman slaying it in the boardroom, at an old-boys club company party. Smarts, grace, sensuousness. EVERYTHANG.

 

[CarLiTa]

There's a male writer discussing and promoting vulnerability in men, actually. Discovered and started reading his blog last week so that I can feel more comfortable being vulnerable myself. He speaks out against fake alpha males who have a hard time really keeping women around because they don't even lay down a real foundation to connect with said women. I really liked this piece:

http://krillco.hubpages.com/hub/Men-Intimacy-and-Emotional-Vulnerability

 

[Kimbosheart]

CarLiTa, what about Olivia Pope? To me she is very feminine. She goes with her gut no matter the facts she has before her. She is very nurturing and protective of her people. She allows herself to be vulnerable and soft. Yet she's the fixer and people listen to what she says.

 

[ladysaraii]

Loving this thread! I am finishing up Power and Feminity (I think that is the title) and it is such a great book. I have work to do!

I have this. I had put it aside (I'm having a bit of book overload lol) but I pulled it out last night. I think I'll let this be my first book about unleashing the feminine power and then move on to learn how to refine and channel it.

 

[shelli4018]

Yes, I am finishing this book up now.

I like your example because she also talks about women just "being". Masculine energy is in invested in "doing"

I like how she says many women need to connect with the "Dantian" or lower parts of our bodies(three inches bellow our belly button on the inside, which is our center). I was watching women walk in the streets since reading this book and I noticed the women who walked with upper parts of their bodies verses the ones who walked in the hips and lower half. It was interesting to see. I ordered some Bellydancing dvds and dancing is going to be my form of body expression and exersise.

I had the same thought recently. My daughter and I had fun doing this beginner's bellydancing workout yesterday. I really want to loosen up a bit as my body seems to fight feminine movement (LOL)!

 

[MonPetite]

I don't know... I'm not sure that that answers my questions. I'm pro-femininity, but I feel like I'm looking for role models who better suit my style and interests, and I am not sure where to look. I need visuals lol. Please post clips as you find them. Some of us are visual learners, which is why I love that video with Brandon Marlo and the Black woman with the sensuous walk.

I wanna see a feminine woman slaying it in the boardroom, at an old-boys club company party. Smarts, grace, sensuousness. EVERYTHANG.

CarLiTa Unfortunately, you will not find lots of clips for that if you're looking for a visual to possiblke imitate one-to-one.

I would suggest watching the recent film about Margaret Thatcher to get you started, though if you want to see a powerful woman. You may not like her politics, but she knew how to be a strong woman and still be feminine.

Also, watch (search YouTube) the BLACK Film Noir movies and take the mannerisms of black screen sirens who were keeping up with black detectives and the police (while surviving Jim Crow) and move their manner of being and presence into male-dominated situations in your own life.

I found I had to do much of the transposing myself.

Just like you can watch a ballerina and adopt her more graceful posture at the super-market, you can watch a movie like "Elizabeth" or a film Noir movie (black or white cast) and pull their way of owning a room into your next meeting.

I hope that helps. Let me know if I can be more clear or provide more detailed examples. I'm about to head off to work, then class, then more work.

 

[RegaLady]

Lol, my background is heavily in dance. Ballet mostly but notice how even male ballet dancers are highly feminine. Although Barishnikov made it somehow very sexy and male. It's like it's all coming together. I take dance classes on and off but lately I've been re-committing to dance as my form of creative expression. Some people can sing, others can draw or write. I'll just be happy with dance. Performing is really an incomparable feelings.


.

Yasss! This is me to a T. I was a cheerleader in high school and pom pon in grade school. I wished my parents put me in a dance class, because I REALLY think dancing is my thing. Aside from getting dolled up, it is naturally my body's way of expression. I release energy this way
DD wanted to get into ballet really badly. So to get in touch with her femininity, she will have to do it.

How do you think ballet worked to heighten your sensuality?

 

[tatiana]

Did the book explain why?

FemmeFatale and LittleGoldenLamb

Yes, the book explained why. It is believe by being more masculine protects black girls/women in a world where a man may or may not be available. She states that AA are taught not to trust their "feminine" side because being feminine makes one too vulnerable.

The author encourages women to embrace their feminine side.

 

[Enyo]

I don't know... I'm not sure that that answers my questions. I'm pro-femininity, but I feel like I'm looking for role models who better suit my style and interests, and I am not sure where to look. I need visuals lol. Please post clips as you find them. Some of us are visual learners, which is why I love that video with Brandon Marlo and the Black woman with the sensuous walk.

I wanna see a feminine woman slaying it in the boardroom, at an old-boys club company party. Smarts, grace, sensuousness. EVERYTHANG.

Well, I wasn't really trying to answer your question. I was just pointing out that it's not just about the superficial things. To me, femininity is almost all nuanced. It should as much a part of you as your fingernails or your voice. It's something that's totally present but hard to describe. More like an experience, I guess, know what I mean? Also femininity isn't everything at once. We use different parts when we need them. I've yet to see a woman who was everything at once.

Some of my favorite Old Hollywood Moments:

Bette Davis in Jezebel. She acts like a stubborn child, but she's perfectly aware of what she's doing to the man and to the greater society - and she likes it. Poor guy doesn't have a clue as to what just went on. He thinks he's put her in her place. Spoiler: She wears the red dress.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASNO9QuKLj0

Lena Horne. Very fun without being shuck and jive. Look at the perfect carriage of her arms and hands.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLwREAX4d2A


Liz Taylor in Cleopatra (first clip). You. Will. Kneel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOathC56zFk

Dorothy Dandridge in Carmen Jones. Best body language every. Sorry about the quality, but it was the only video I could find.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xO5udGCZ3Yo