What does it say when a man won't pay for dinner?

[frida1980]

I just found this post on another message board.

I went out for a dinner date with this girl recently and we had a nice dinner. Once we were done though, I got the check from the waiter and told her what her half was. The look she gave me was murderous and after that it was a very awkward goodbye.

I really hate that as a guy you're expected to pay for a meal. I'm in university and I'm studying not making money why should I foot the girl's bill as well?

I was a little stunned. In my experience, if you're dating it's well known that the guy is going to pay. If not, it's not a date. His situation is a little different since the girl suggested that they do something together, rather than him as her out. But then I asked myself, how would I feel if someone took me out to dinner and wanted me to pay? Um... Well I think he wants to be friends. After a few more dates, I think he's hard on cash.
And then after a few months, and he says that we're dating or boyfriend/girlfriend, and he still won't pay I'd say he's cheap or triffling. There are some girls that prefer it that way. But honestly, what does it say when a man that wants to date you won't pay?

 

[Transformer]

It sounds like if was a friendly meet-up instead of a date.

 

[Syrah]

Won't pay? HAHA...I can't even imagine that. What'd he do when the bill came? Just sit there and look at his date like "what??"?? Pretend like he didn't notice that the bill has come?? Get up and walk to the bathroom and wait for his date outside?

If a man won't pay for a romantic date, it says he has no pride as a man.

I'm tired of men acting like paying on a date is an option "maybe I will, maybe I won't". We need to be raising our sons to believe that paying for a date, especially in the beginning, is PART OF DATING. It's not an option. If its a date, its what you do. If a woman offers to pay or suggests paying, that's a bonus, but it is not to be expected nor assumed.

 

[awhyley]

In the wrapped portion, he said "dinner date". If he's a broke Uni. student, he shouldn't be taking girls on dinner dates. (Is there a link or something, cause I didn't get this 'meet-up' thing from what was posted)

 

[frida1980]

Oh, I'll just post that portion too.

We both sort of decided to meet for dinner a few days earlier. She was like we should do dinner sometime. And I told her yeah lets meet at this nice Mexican place on Tuesday.

And clarifying these sort of things before meeting up just makes me really uncomfortable. I never really know how to deal with such matters.

 

[nikolite]

It not only says that he is cheap, but that he's just not that into you. You aren't worth paying the meal for. Usually the guy asks the girl out, or at least is the pursuer, then he needs to pay. Its a first date, it really isn't that serious. If he can't do that then then there's a problem.

Now, the woman should offer to pay on subsequent dates, or at least to split in half, particularly if she is the one to initiate. I'd feel uneasy as a guy if I was always pressured to pay for everything for months. I still believe in chivalry though. And I think men who claim they are into feminism are just using it as an excuse: most of these same men would never make the plates or feed the kids later on down the line, but act like you're wrong for expecting chivalry. They only pick and choose when they want to invoke the "feminism" excuse but largely denounce feminism in public.

I'm honestly tired of the way men have responded to the feminist movement by "allowing" us to work and do what they do, but doing nothing to help ease our burdens anymore while retracting chivalry at the same time. We've only got more work and sacrifices now and they have less. There were once wives/mothers and working men; now there are working wives/mothers/women and working men. Most men haven't adopted the working husband/father/man role that it would take to balance things out. To the point where now they can't even pay for a damn $8.50 plate.

 

[runwaydream]

i hate when guys say stuff like this. thankfully i've never been in that situation. if i were i would just pay for my half and never hang out w. him again.

but the way i see it is, it cost a lot of time and money for a woman to keep herself up and dress up nice. the money that it costs to go on a date, a woman would've spent that much or more to look good for her date. that is, hair, clothes, nails, waxing, eyebrows, makeup, etc. guys don't have to do all that, therefore the money that we spend on looking nice, they spend on dates. the way i see it, if a guy expects a girl to pay for her portion of the date, then he better not expect her to look nice at the same time.

i agree w. the PP, if you can't afford to date, then don't do it. or at least make it known from the beginning what the situation is so she can decide beforehand if she wants to go out with you or not.

ETA: what were the responses he received.

 

[frida1980]

Here are some responses.

While I agree you certainly shouldn't have been expected to pay, I think it's just good practice to clarify beforehand so you're both on the same page. Prevents awkward situations like yours.

If a girl expects me to pay the whole ticket, then I usually don't want to date her. Girls like that usually have a specific idea on who they want their boyfriend to be.

Just sayin'.

My boyfriend usually pays for my meals, but he always the one that asks me to dinner/lunch, I always tell him that it's okay and that we can just watch a movie at his place, but he doesn't listen and I really can't afford to go out as often as he likes to, so I don't want to seem like a ***** but he kind of has to pay, you know? Of course, I have no problem paying for myself, but if he wants me to do that then we have to eat at taco bell or something which he doesn't really like to do. But I get what you're saying since you were just casually meeting up and technically she asked you to hang out she should at least pay for herself.

If I ask the guy, we go dutch. If he asks me on a formal date, he pays. I'm an old fashioned sort of gal. Sounds like she asked you and it would have been dutch (IMO) You need to get over your discomfort of clarifying it before hand though. The discomfort of clarifying it after is worse. Granted, I always come prepared to pay just in case even if he asked me. And I won't go out on a date unless I can afford it just in case. Also, just friends is dutch or whoever offers to pay. If you are wanting to date this girl romantically, man up and pay. If you can't afford it, do a cheap or free date. Even college kids manage to have dates without paying through the nose. Also, if she got that mad that you didn't pay, she was thinking that it was a romantic date, and a dutch date is NOT romantic. You just kicked her to the curb by making it dutch so far as she is concerned.

I'm in college, and I would totally pay my half on a date. I mean, we're ALL hard up for money, being students, so obviously he won't be able to consistently pay for my meal.

However, I think once you're in a steady job, if a guy asks you out, he should pay. If not, it should be made clear beforehand.

I'm a guy and I always pay, seems to be the way to go.

It's called chivalry. Act like a man.

And if you can't pay, let her know before the dinner.

That's about it.

Hey, some of us are still old fashioned. And some men are still gentlemen. To me, as a woman who wants to be a writer and stay at home mom, if a man can't man up over dinner, he's no breadwinner and I'm not going to carry him through life. If he's a student and going to end up a breadwinner, that's different. It makes an impression when a guy gets weak about paying for dinner (if he's the one that bothered to do the asking). To me, how they handle this situation is how they'll handle marriage. I don't want a roommate that has the same last name. I want a husband. 50/50 all the way is lame. I did date a guy that paid every time, even when I explicitly said I would be paying. It made me uncomfortable, but I'm also used to taking care of myself and going dutch when I ask. He was uncomfortable with allowing a woman pay for anything. Sometimes, it's nice to be taken care of and we as women should allow men to take care of us. And men, quit being babies about doing your part. We women can't do EVERYTHING!

And Finally, my post.

To be honest, I have to pay or I chose to pay that's my way of saying "just friends" or "Not interest." After a boring date or a time with a guy I really don't like, I rush to pay my half. The LAST thing I want is for someone to think that this is going somewhere and it isn't. And if I guy expects me to pay, I figure that he's saying the same thing. All my BFs paid for me, it's just chivalry. Besides when I was in college, most guys were insulted if I paid because I knew they were low on funds. For them was a matter of pride.

I guess I'm old fashioned, or it's because I'm in the south. But I see nothing wrong with being on a "getting to know you" state where you go dutch. But if you continue to do that, I think most girls would think you're not interested, cheap, or just broke. All are big turn offs for girls. You can just be a cheap creative dater. Hit the RedBox and watch movies, hang out at friends parties, do stuff on campus, take walks and stuff.

Otherwise, don't expect to get any for awhile....

 

[MD_Lady]

I can't knock a man for not wanting to be subjected to certain expectations as long as he doesn't have gender-based expectations of women. Don't about how a woman shouldn't expect you to pay for dinner because you're a man, but turn around and her for doing/not doing something it's not "ladylike".

 

[nappystorm]

It says he should go directly to "Friend-Zone", do not pass Go, do not collect the vajayjay.

I can't get with this new age dating. Yall can have it. Even my platonic never touched me male friends pay the ticket just because that's what men are expected to do.

 

[frida1980]

I wonder if this guy has ever had a girl leave him on his "date" for another guy in the restaurant. The "men" are always on the look out for "friendly guys" that screw up on dates. All it takes is a bored and very pretty looking woman wandering at a bar, and voila! There's someone to pay her half and take her home. I know if I decided to wear make up, stylish clothes, excellent hair and heels for a man, either he's paying or someone else will.

Do guys like this not know how weak and indecisive it makes them look when they don't want to pay? Do they know how much sex and woman their missing out on because there are plenty of men that will?

 

[lea86111]

i think that a man should casually maybe even jokingly say something about the paying situation to the girl over the phone before the actual date so that she will know what's up. But he should only let the chick pay if she invited him. If he's the one inviting her out and he doesn't want to pay, then he needs to become creative and come up with dates ideas that don't involve money (or very little money and PAY)

me myself and i would hate it if a dude made me pay on a date

 

[Syrah]

Why are we acting like dinner is some enormous expense? We spend more than a meal on hair care products and that's based solely on some bogus post on LHCF.

While I get that dude is a Uni student - he shouldn't be suggesting dinner if he can't afford to pay for 2.

And brothers who act like a woman expecting a man to pay for dinner is "golddigger-ish" behavior deserve to stay dating hood-rats. If you don't want to spend $100+ on a dinner, don't suggest Ruth's Chris. Some of the best dates I've ever been on were CHEAP because dude was more interested in showing me who he was, or learning about who I am than trying to impress with some fancy meal with menu items neither one of us can pronounce.

Side note: Why is it always the dudes rocking the fake chains and icey-earrings that want to act like they shouldn't be expected to pay for a woman's meal?

 

[AstroQueen77]

I'm not understanding if this was a romantic date or a get together with a friend who is a woman. Men should always pay for first dates...but I'm willing to grant a little leeway if this was just a platonic thing. That is why people should be clear on where they stand, so they don't get the evil eye someone they pissed off.

If a man wants me to go dutch on a first romantic date with him, I equate that to him asking me for money to pay his bills. No go!

 

[HollyGolightly]

Most of the successful guys that I know expect to pay on the first few dates, but they think that the woman is cheap or a gold digger if she never offers to split the check.

One of my friends is a big time lawyer and he just cut a girl loose because she never paid. On their last date she slid the check over to him and made a joke about the recession. That's when he decided to get rid of her broke @ss!

I almost always split the check with my boyfriend. We're a modern couple.

 

[HollyGolightly]

All it takes is a bored and very pretty looking woman wandering at a bar, and voila! There's someone to pay her half and take her home. I know if I decided to wear make up, stylish clothes, excellent hair and heels for a man, either he's paying or someone else will.

Do guys like this not know how weak and indecisive it makes them look when they don't want to pay? Do they know how much sex and woman their missing out on because there are plenty of men that will?

Sorry, but that's kinda gross. I'm not for sale, I don't hand out my goodies in exchange for a meal. And I don't expect people to pay for me just because I'm a woman.

A date is when two people that are romantically interested in each other go out. If they both want to be there, then neither one should have a problem paying for their own food.

 

[~Sparklingflame~]

Ok well if they re just friends then yeah, you as the girl should pay your way. BUT if hes auditioning for the role of your man then how in da hayl is he going to expect her to pay for her own meal??? Is THAT the way that relationship is supposed to go, according to this dude?

Thats why her look was murderous.

Men need to get a clue about such things, my GOSH.

 

[~Sparklingflame~]

And really what do these men want??? If you let a man "be a man" and pay for a meal or 2 youre a gold digger. But then on the other hand if you pick up the tab everytime for you and/or him then you wont let a man "be a man" and you too independent. WTH do they want????

 

[AstroQueen77]

^They want whatever is convenient for them at the time.

 

[frida1980]

Sorry, but that's kinda gross. I'm not for sale, I don't hand out my goodies in exchange for a meal. And I don't expect people to pay for me just because I'm a woman.

A date is when two people that are romantically interested in each other go out. If they both want to be there, then neither one should have a problem paying for their own food.

I said that in jest, since I doubt any woman would give up sex for a measly dinner. But I just did inventory the other day, I found that own I 120+ products just for my hair and skin that total a crap load of money. And I'm a TOM BOY! I devote WAY too much money attracting the opposite sex. As far as I'm concerned, if I have to use any of these expensive products to get a man to ask me out the least he can do is pay me for my time and effort.

Otherwise we can hang out, and I'll be in a jeans, sneakers, ponytail, and a college sweatshirt. I'll listen to only what I'm interested in, text freely during the "hang out", and ditch him when I feel like it. That's the true beauty of going dutch, your not obligated to look good, look interested, or stick around. But if a guy decides to formally ask me out, and I spend days trying to look perfect, I will be PISSED if he asked me to pay. Men aren't paying for sex, their paying for my time. Their paying for an opportunity to see me at my best, my most beautiful, charismatic, etc.

In Japan there were prostitutes, and there were Geisha. Geisha were walking art that were trained in the art of music, song, dance, and conversation. Men wouldn't pay to have sex with them, they'd pay just to spend time in their presence. I think of myself like that. Just like them, I put a lot of work into myself that they don't have to. If they want to spend time with me at my best, they will pay for it. Otherwise, they can settle for the crumbs I give the rest of my guy friends.

In his case, I can't imagine that a guy like this gets far with women. Going dutch is such a lame thing to do when your "dating", especially long term. It makes him no different than your friends. Most men appreciate a beautiful woman. They appreciate the things they do to make themselves more appeasing. So they show their appreciation appropriately. I really don't get guys that think it's just prostitution, when all we're doing is evaluating a mate and his worth. If he can't pay, he doesn't apprieciate me, like me, or want me. It's just that simple.

 

[FlowerHair]

To me that's a little odd, even if it's just a friend or a relative. My brothers and male friends always pay for me regardless. My female friends' husbands/boyfriends also pay for all of us if we go out to eat.

That's just common courtesy.

There was a guy here at my new job who said he always asks the girl to pay for half when he goes out on dates (he spends a lot of time on the Swedish match.com) and I showed him how shocked I was.

The other co-workers were surprised at my reaction and called me conservative.

I guess I am...at least with some things. I'm glad I move in so called conservative circles. Or should I say, I mostly hang out with foreigners who haven't bought into the Swedish ways (yet).

 

[LovinLocks]

I picked "other" only because . . . my first thought was "who is to say" what it says, wouldn't there be a need to ask the guy THEN one could determine if something on the list fits? IOW, I don't know that parties not privy to the conversation/circumstances can definitively say what's up with dude. erplexed

 

[ThickHair]

I almost always split the check with my boyfriend. We're a modern couple.

I don't split a check with my boyfriend, nope, but I will pick him up a shirt or a book. He wouldn't dream of it. I have written in a previous threads about how my SO feels about that. We have found a nice balance that works for us.

Now my exhusband, he would look at the check and I got sick of it and I picked it up and paid. Even though we were married and our money was our money it still didn't sit right me and towards the end he even had the nerve to say that I never let him be a man. Whateva's cleva fool.

In all seriousness, I think who every ask is the person who should pay. That is why ladies shouldn't ask guy's out, because if the relationship is started like that, then that will be the dynamic and it will be hard to break.

Another thing that I wonder is how is this worked out in the dynamic's of a homosexual relationship?

 

[cartelise]

I think whoever initiated the date should pay.

 

[ambergirl]

I think it's unrealistic to expect a college student to pay for both of you at a nice dinner. but I also think it's awkward and confusing when a guy doesn't treat on a first date. What he should have done on a first date is pick something he could afford like a coffee or pizza date.

 

[ThickHair]

I think it's unrealistic to expect a college student to pay for both of you at a nice dinner. but I also think it's awkward and confusing when a guy doesn't treat on a first date. What he should have done on a first date is pick something he could afford like a coffee or pizza date.

A college student shouldn't have selected a nice dinner as a date. I agree they should have went for coffee or pizza.

 

[nikolite]

I don't split a check with my boyfriend, nope, but I will pick him up a shirt or a book. He wouldn't dream of it. I have written in a previous threads about how my SO feels about that. We have found a nice balance that works for us...

Another thing that I wonder is how is this worked out in the dynamic's of a homosexual relationship?

To your first point, great point. While they are expected to pay for dates, we are more than happy to drop by with that warm thermos of soup they might need or grab a nice shirt we saw at the mall. We don't expect them to do it back, but it all balances out in the end. I always thought chivalry was created mainly as a way to re-balance the things that women already constantly do for men. Things don't have to be EXACTLY equal (i.e. like splitting cost of gas 50/50 or something crazy like that).

To your question, I've talked about this with some gay friends of mine and they all say its not a big problem. Its usually the person who asked the other out pays, or they treat the other person as they would a friend: I'll pay for you now, and I expect you to pay next time, but otherwise its no biggie. That being said, unless there are 3 or 4 people at a table, I have no problem offering to pay lunch for a girlfriend of mine. And I've had others do that for me. Its just common decency. And its much easier that way.

 

[FemmeFatale]

Sorry, but that's kinda gross. I'm not for sale, I don't hand out my goodies in exchange for a meal. And I don't expect people to pay for me just because I'm a woman.

A date is when two people that are romantically interested in each other go out. If they both want to be there, then neither one should have a problem paying for their own food.

I thought I was the only one that gave that post the side eye.

 

[LisaMar]

I would deifinitely have to say other...it could mean many things including all those mentioned in the poll. If he only views you as a friend, or is not attracted to you then maybe he will expect you to contribute. It could also mean that he is attracted to you and wants to spend some time with you to see if you "fit the bill" (no pun intended), and does not want to invest too much of his money initially to find this out...if in the end he feels your worth it he will either offer to pay or ask you out on a real date....yeah, maybe thats it... since he's not offering this would be considered a "screening" or "pre-date" to weed out the woman that does not measure up. Imagine, if a guy were to take every woman he had some interest in to dinner, he would be broke!......P.S. this is only my opinion, and doesnt mean I agree with this kind of thinking/strategy..Lol

 

[asubeauty]

I posted a thread about this a few months ago when my ex wanted to go dutch in our relationship. It caused a big problem when I was like "Hayle naw!!!" I wish I could show him this thread.