Spin-off: Are you married without the paper???

[envybeauty]

I dont get it. I thought you either do church or mosque or whichever religion wedding but still have to get a legal document from the govt?

yes? no? Maybe so?

In some states, marriages performed in religious ceremonies are recognized as valid even if no marriage license is obtained. NY is one. That marriage would also have to be recognized from sister states/countries under the full faith and credit of the Constitution. Again....as long as it does not go against general law or public policy (like marrying your sister is not allowed even if it would be allowed in Hohum country).

So some states do recognize Muslim weddings as valid even though quite a few imans do not obtain marriage licenses prior to performing nikah ceremonies. It helps that Muslim weddings do have a contract, have certain practices, etc. so some Muslim women are granted "legal" divorces and can get stuff pursuant to their contract.

 

[Mortons]

In some states, marriages performed in religious ceremonies are recognized as valid even if no marriage license is obtained. NY is one. That marriage would also have to be recognized from sister states/countries under the full faith and credit of the Constitution. Again....as long as it does not go against general law or public policy (like marrying your sister is not allowed even if it would be allowed in Hohum country).

So some states do recognize Muslim weddings as valid even though quite a few imans do not obtain marriage licenses prior to performing nikah ceremonies. It helps that Muslim weddings do have a contract, have certain practices, etc. so some Muslim women are granted "legal" divorces and can get stuff pursuant to their contract.

OK so basically it depends on the state (and I'm banking on the fact that which religion it is matters as well). I hope people doing this know their state laws in and out.

 

[Priss Pot]

I'm on the fence when it comes to shacking. I can understand shacking for financial reasons, but I dunno

I wouldn't want dude to get tooooooo comfortable and hold off on marrying me. Shacking does work for some, but it can also backfire for others.

If the guy I'm with doesn't want to marry, that's kool. WE just don't have to be together. He can go on his merry way and live his life as he chooses. I am not one to force a man to marry me. He can go be with someone who doesn't believe in marriage.

Marriage is not the end all be all when it comes to life. I will not die without it, BUT it's something that *I* want, and *I* have to be with someone who wants it with me.

 

[Vanity1]

I think that is for common law marriag but, I don't know. We were "married" in April and filed our taxes that next February.



How would they fall for the okie doke if the governement says they're married?

I guess I am confused...isn't the point for the governement to recognize you anyway? Thought it was...

Not everyone wants to get married "under god" or by a judge...for religious and cultural reasons. I can respect if someone had a ceremony to commit to each other forever, to me it's all about the vows and the belief system.

If someone is telling them their marriage is recognized by the government for doing less than the law requires to be acknowledged legally in their state, that is how.

ETA: Nothing to be confused about. My whole point is, check your state laws (because marriage is regulated by state law, not federal) and make sure if you WANT your marriage to be legallly acknowledged, you follow the correct procedures. This has nothing to do with anything else, and it is not about what me, you or anyone else personally respects, the law is the law and I am simply stating my knowledge of LEGAL marriages.

It is not my intentions to dictate how someone chooses to marry, I could care less.

 

[Bachelorette]

Interesting, but as far as I remember, Muslims don't have to have a legal marriage in order to be viewed as married in Islam.

I understand that. It's just the whole being recognized as being married in your current state/country of residence that is confusing me.

 

[freshlikemoi]

I moved in with my fiance a month after he proposed...Hmmm more like 2 months after! I am not living with him without the ring!!!!

 

[MrsHdrLe]

I did it twice. I did it for the first time when my son was 10 (I was 28) and we were planning on marrying within two years (or so I thought) but after living with him exactly two months, I was like, Nah. I saved my money and got on with in a few months of that. I never regretted doing that in that situation.
Fast forward. I met my current three months after I left my ex, we dated (seeing eachother on weekends only for four years (he wanted to move faster but I didn't b/c of my son. I felt he'd been uprooted once and that was enough).
Fast Forward. I broke up with him after four years of causal dating and he pursued me so we got back togethr, but didn't move in together. We did holidays and family events and he finally met my son and I his during this time. My son went to live w/ his dad a year later (he was 15 then) and I gave up my rented house b/c I didn't like living alone in a 2bd/ba house with many points of entry. I moved with him and my son returned later that year and we stayed for another year or so. My son turned 18, moved on to college and I stayed an additional 9months. I moved out in April, he proposed in June, we have a date (May 22, 2010 and my lease is up in April 25th next year).
I can't say that I have a lot of regrets over all. No it hasn't been roses all along, but I'm glad I love him, know him and accept him for who he is. Not saying that others should do what I did, but I didn't want to broach marriage until I felt like I could work with him based on my first experience. I'd like to say I'm not the shack up type too, but we know that's a lie, so I guess I am, I did and think others should do what is in line with their expectations and life requirements. I do think men take you more seriously when they know what you expect and I wouldn't advise doing it unless you were willing to shack for a long time if not for ever.
By the way his previous marriage and dating lasted seven years total (married for 2 and they didn't shack.) I figure he was meant to be with me. I'm glad we met and look forward to our life together.
(sorry for the book length)

 

[Kirei]

If someone is telling them their marriage is recognized by the government for doing less than the law requires to be acknowledged legally in their state, that is how.

ETA: Nothing to be confused about. My whole point is, check your state laws (because marriage is regulated by state law, not federal) and make sure if you WANT your marriage to be legallly acknowledged, you follow the correct procedures. This has nothing to do with anything else, and it is not about what me, you or anyone else personally respects, the law is the law and I am simply stating my knowledge of LEGAL marriages.

It is not my intentions to dictate how someone chooses to marry, I could care less.

Okay. It seemed like you were trying to be sly on the side or something.

I agree people should know the laws in their state.

What is a common law marriage?


In a handful of states (listed below), heterosexual couples can become legally married without a license or ceremony. This type of marriage is called a common law marriage. Contrary to popular belief, a common law marriage is not created when two people simply live together for a certain number of years. In order to have a valid common law marriage, the couple must do all of the following:

• live together for a significant period of time (not defined in any state)
• hold themselves out as a married couple -- typically this means using the same last name, referring to the other as "my husband" or "my wife," and filing a joint tax return, and
• intend to be married.

When a common law marriage exists, the spouses receive the same legal treatment given to formally married couples, including the requirement that they go through a legal divorce to end the marriage.
For information about other legal unions, such as domestic partnership and traditional marriage, see Marriage Laws in Your State.

Common law marriage is recognized only in the following states:
Alabama
Colorado
District of Columbia
Georgia (if created before 1/1/97)
Idaho (if created before 1/1/96)
Iowa
Kansas
Montana
New Hampshire (for inheritance purposes only)
Ohio (if created before 10/10/91)
Oklahoma
Pennsylvania (if created before 1/1/05)
Rhode Island
South Carolina
Texas
Utah


http://www.nolo.com/article.cfm/pg/...E-20FF-467A-9E9395985EE7E825/118/304/192/FAQ/

 

[msa]

Man, now I feel really bad that gay people can't get married. I know lots of gay couples that have common law marriages according to the law in certain states.

That's just not fair.

 

[growth2come]

I guess I am "shacking up"...I am not ashamed of it nor am I in a rush to go to the alter!...Yes he talks of marriage a lot more than me because where he is from "shacking up" is just not allowed or "relations" without marriage for that matter. I have my reasons for not wanting to get married right now...I have plenty I want to do and planning a wedding is not at the top of my list right now...

 

[Vanity1]

Okay. It seemed like you were trying to be sly on the side or something.

Trying to be sly on the side for what?

 

[Kirei]

Trying to be sly on the side for what?

I took what you said the wrong way, I thought you were trying to be funny and sly. I guess I was just defensive due to the "lols" and the "" like you were trying to say I was not married or not LEGALLY married.

But, I was wrong and you didn't mean it the way I took it.

Sorry.

 

[Kirei]

Man, now I feel really bad that gay people can't get married. I know lots of gay couples that have common law marriages according to the law in certain states.

That's just not fair.

I guess I am confused as to what gay marriage has to do with this? Do you mean since it isn't mandatory to go to a church and marry under "god" than there is no reason for gays to be denied marriage? Or is it b/c it doesn't take much to be considered married?

Hope I am understanding correctly.

 

[ThickHair]

I guess I am "shacking up"...I am not ashamed of it nor am I in a rush to go to the alter!...Yes he talks of marriage a lot more than me because where he is from "shacking up" is just not allowed or "relations" without marriage for that matter. I have my reasons for not wanting to get married right now...I have plenty I want to do and planning a wedding is not at the top of my list right now...

Not trying to be a smart a$$ but where he is from he obviously doesn't agree with the anti shacking and relations theory if you two are doing said activities. So why bring "that" up?

 

[Aviah]

adlock2:
Oh Lord...

 

[envybeauty]

Not to make this thread about you, but your marriage was not a common law marriage. No state is going to recognize a couple moving in together one year then filing taxes together the next year as a common law marriage. Even according to your own post where it says ALL must be done (living together SIGNIFICANT period of time, using same name, intent, etc.).


To all, I would also add INTENT is very necessary. Some women live with men for 5, 10, 15 years and think they have a common law marriage based on that ALONE. Nah. You BOTH have to do more than that to have a common law marriage.

Okay. It seemed like you were trying to be sly on the side or something.

I agree people should know the laws in their state.

What is a common law marriage?


In a handful of states (listed below), heterosexual couples can become legally married without a license or ceremony. This type of marriage is called a common law marriage. Contrary to popular belief, a common law marriage is not created when two people simply live together for a certain number of years. In order to have a valid common law marriage, the couple must do all of the following:

• live together for a significant period of time (not defined in any state)
• hold themselves out as a married couple -- typically this means using the same last name, referring to the other as "my husband" or "my wife," and filing a joint tax return, and
• intend to be married.

When a common law marriage exists, the spouses receive the same legal treatment given to formally married couples, including the requirement that they go through a legal divorce to end the marriage.
For information about other legal unions, such as domestic partnership and traditional marriage, see Marriage Laws in Your State.

Common law marriage is recognized only in the following states:
Alabama
Colorado
District of Columbia
Georgia (if created before 1/1/97)
Idaho (if created before 1/1/96)
Iowa
Kansas
Montana
New Hampshire (for inheritance purposes only)
Ohio (if created before 10/10/91)
Oklahoma
Pennsylvania (if created before 1/1/05)
Rhode Island
South Carolina
Texas
Utah


http://www.nolo.com/article.cfm/pg/...E-20FF-467A-9E9395985EE7E825/118/304/192/FAQ/

 

[Kirei]

Not to make this thread about you, but your marriage was not a common law marriage. No state is going to recognize a couple moving in together one year then filing taxes together the next year as a common law marriage. Even according to your own post where it says ALL must be done (living together SIGNIFICANT period of time, using same name, intent, etc.).


To all, I would also add INTENT is very necessary. Some women live with men for 5, 10, 15 years and think they have a common law marriage based on that ALONE. Nah. You BOTH have to do more than that to have a common law marriage.

Please take into account we were married under our religion. Nonetheless, I wil lgo by what the government tells me, they say I am married so I'll go by that when it comes to the "law of the land".

 

[envybeauty]

Please take into account we were married under our religion. Nonetheless, I wil lgo by what the government tells me, they say I am married so I'll go by that when it comes to the "law of the land".

That's my point. Your marriage was not one of common law but of a religious means.

I wouldn't want some chick reading this thread to think that all she has to do is file taxes while shacking up so that she can say she is married. Not so.

 

[cocoaluv]

I shacked, and fully planned on doing so - after I got a ring AND a wedding date. And he tried to get salty after we were engaged because I pushed - and pushed hard for a date. I straight up told him - if you can't commit to a date, you ain't commited to getting married. Period. I was trying to play with that 'yeah, we engaged, but we don't know when we are getting married' ****. Hell nawh.

I love your posts JustKiya. This is the ONLY way I would ever shack. I got the ring and the date ( date of wedding being within next 4-6 months). Otherwise its a no go.


BTW back on topic no I am not married or pretending to be married.

 

[Kirei]

That's my point. Your marriage was not one of common law but of a religious means.

I wouldn't want some chick reading this thread to think that all she has to do is file taxes while shacking up so that she can say she is married. Not so.

Oh okay!

I wonder how long someone has to be together to be married under common law? The states don't specify that...

 

[ThickHair]

Oh okay!

I wonder how long someone has to be together to be married under common law? The states don't specify that...

I don't even understand why one would even entertain the thought to essentially end up being married. That is like 2nd place IMHO. I want to always be in 1st place.

 

[Kirei]

I don't even understand why one would even entertain the thought to essentially end up being married. That is like 2nd place IMHO. I want to always be in 1st place.

I don't know either. I truly think some people are lazy, they may just settle for what they have.

Women who I know that are common law, don't have relationships I look up to.

*When I say common law I mean, they didn't even have a religious ceremony, didn't exchange any vows, nothing but shack up.

 

[msa]

I guess I am confused as to what gay marriage has to do with this? Do you mean since it isn't mandatory to go to a church and marry under "god" than there is no reason for gays to be denied marriage? Or is it b/c it doesn't take much to be considered married?

Hope I am understanding correctly.

It's because it really doesn't take that much, at least in certain states. If all people have to do is live together for a certain period of time, have the intention of getting married, and act like a married couple then there shouldn't be any reason to bar gays from getting married under state law.

This is just a new thought for me, I hadn't considered it before, that's why I said that.

From a Christian perspective if gays getting married is against the religion then common law marriage should be as well. Hmmm...I have to think about this more.

 

[envybeauty]

It's because it really doesn't take that much, at least in certain states. If all people have to do is live together for a certain period of time, have the intention of getting married, and act like a married couple then there shouldn't be any reason to bar gays from getting married under state law.

This is just a new thought for me, I hadn't considered it before, that's why I said that.

From a Christian perspective if gays getting married is against the religion then common law marriage should be as well. Hmmm...I have to think about this more.

Common law marriage is against the religion if there is fornication (as it is in almost all common law cases).

Gay marriage is against the religion for obvious reasons.

 

[nappystorm]

I don't understand why everyone is so casual about living with someone, swapping fluids, having kids but it is a big issue about getting married. WTH?!?!?!? I guess I will never understand it.

This has always been my school of thought but to each his own. Do you.

I never believed in shacking. At a very low point in my life (financially and emotionally)I did get suckered into it. It started with him spending nights, leaving an outfit here and there. I looked up on day an my SO at the time was living there. I didn't like it but he was paying the bills at the time and I didn't want to upset him by saying anything so I decided to roll with it.

It turned out to be the biggest mistake of my life. I learned that he was extremely filthy and disrespectful. He lost his job two months after he moved in and I had to pay for everything, go to school, and come home to a nasty house and no food. I still let him stay because he had helped me during a rough patch and I thought it would be wrong of me to kick him out. One day, I woked the hell up and snapped out of it and called myself putting him out. However, GA law says that I can't put him out without an eviction (even if his name wasn't on anything). And his sorry arse stayed for 3 months! I ended up borrowing money and pawning ish just to get him out of my apartment.


I will never do that again. Being a fool, i let an even bigger fool talk me into doing something I didn't believe in and it ended up being diaster.

 

[mswoman]

Shacking is nothing new... A Concubine as described in the Bible are women whom are in a sexual relationship with a man and are used by the man for gratification or status.

'Concubinage was practised in many ancient cultures, especially in Mesopotamia.....where a private citizen might have one or two concubines in addition to his primary wife.....a concubine was often a slave or part of the booty of war (Judges 5:30). A man might have a concubine simply as an economical form of marriage, since no dowry or bride-price was required. A concubine could add to a man's prestige by giving him two wives and thus an increased capacity for children. Such offspring were normally delivered onto the knees of the legal wife, thus establishing their legitimacy as family members. The concubine was also another servant to add to his work force.' (Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible, 1997, Vol 1, p504).


Therefore a woman whom chooses to be a concubine rather than a wife is sad because many women still fall into the trap of a man leaving and they have nothing when the relationship is finished. Also if you are a Christian then you know that any man that you have sex with is your husband anyway. The the problem is many people get it twisted and begin to accept something that is not acceptable. However, men also have a choice if a woman doesn't want to marry him, he should leave and find one whom feel he is worthy to be married to them.

 

[envybeauty]

So not the same as shacking up today...

Shacking is nothing new... A Concubine as described in the Bible are women whom are in a sexual relationship with a man and are used by the man for gratification or status.

'Concubinage was practised in many ancient cultures, especially in Mesopotamia.....where a private citizen might have one or two concubines in addition to his primary wife.....a concubine was often a slave or part of the booty of war (Judges 5:30). A man might have a concubine simply as an economical form of marriage, since no dowry or bride-price was required. A concubine could add to a man's prestige by giving him two wives and thus an increased capacity for children. Such offspring were normally delivered onto the knees of the legal wife, thus establishing their legitimacy as family members. The concubine was also another servant to add to his work force.' (Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible, 1997, Vol 1, p504).


Therefore a woman whom chooses to be a concubine rather than a wife is sad because many women still fall into the trap of a man leaving and they have nothing when the relationship is finished. Also if you are a Christian then you know that any man that you have sex with is your husband anyway. The the problem is many people get it twisted and begin to accept something that is not acceptable. However, men also have a choice if a woman doesn't want to marry him, he should leave and find one whom feel he is worthy to be married to them.

 

[ThickHair]

Shacking is nothing new... A Concubine as described in the Bible are women whom are in a sexual relationship with a man and are used by the man for gratification or status.

'Concubinage was practised in many ancient cultures, especially in Mesopotamia.....where a private citizen might have one or two concubines in addition to his primary wife.....a concubine was often a slave or part of the booty of war (Judges 5:30). A man might have a concubine simply as an economical form of marriage, since no dowry or bride-price was required. A concubine could add to a man's prestige by giving him two wives and thus an increased capacity for children. Such offspring were normally delivered onto the knees of the legal wife, thus establishing their legitimacy as family members. The concubine was also another servant to add to his work force.' (Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible, 1997, Vol 1, p504).


Therefore a woman whom chooses to be a concubine rather than a wife is sad because many women still fall into the trap of a man leaving and they have nothing when the relationship is finished. Also if you are a Christian then you know that any man that you have sex with is your husband anyway. The the problem is many people get it twisted and begin to accept something that is not acceptable. However, men also have a choice if a woman doesn't want to marry him, he should leave and find one whom feel he is worthy to be married to them.

From my understanding a concubine is more of a mistress.

 

[Dominican09]

.....................................

 

[antisocial]

WTH!!!??? after this...I AM DONE with this thread...goodbye!

I didn't completely agree with anything else you posted in this thread but on this I am with you 100%