Codependency Support Thread...breaking The Cycle

[Smiley79]

This topic is so crucial in regards to having healthy relationships. This topic is a spin off of the "How to Spot a Narcissist" thread. Codependents and Narcissits often times go hand in hand; so while you may learn how spot a Narci,you also want to work on or avoid the pattern of Codependency. (You may be doing it and not even realize it) I just learned about this less than a year ago and it has been very enlightening. I wish I had known about it sooner in life; now I'm eager to dedicate a thread about it in hopes of helping others or simply give us a playground to discuss it and overcome it together. If you can identify with COD or have overcome it, please share your experiences, feelings, advice and so forth.

I have to thank a fellow LHCF member who, after reading several of my past posts on the board, was kind enough to share these videos about COD and Narcis with me. Surprisingly and ironically, around the same time, my therapist introduced me to that very same topic and suggested that it would benefit me to work on codependency issues. As I said before, I never heard of that word before in my life, so right away I found it extremely interesting and I easily identified with many, if not all, of the identifying factors. I no longer felt like I was crazy or doomed when it came to relationships. Or that I was destined to run into bad batches of love for the rest of my life. Things started to make sense now...why my relationships outcomes were so repetitive and similar in result. Can anyone else identify with this?

These are just a few helpful videos that discuss Codependency, it's traits, patterns and habits.
I highly recommend Ross Rossenberg's books and/or following his Youtube channel.



(the correlation with Narcissism)





Helpful books:
http://www.amazon.com/The-Human-Magnet-Syndrome-People/dp/1936128314

http://www.amazon.com/Codependency-For-Dummies-Darlene-Lancer/dp/1118095227

 

[hopeful]

This is a great idea @Smiley79. Looking forward to seeing this thread's progress.

 

[DarkJoy]

I will come back. But yes. I was a co dependent in marriage for a long time. Not saying he waz a narc but had other issues. Took years of therapy to break it and leave.

I want to watch these vids later. A bit heavy for morning material

 

[caribeandiva]

I was a codependent for years and didn't even know it. I grew up with a mom who was a gambling addict and both of my parents are narcissists on top of that. To say I had a messed up childhood is an understatement. Childhood? What childhood? I was born an adult basically. It wasn't until I moved out of my parents' house at age 25 that I realized what went on. By then I was deeply depressed, suicidal and desperate for a change.

I started therapy a year later. My therapist suggested I joined support groups such as Gam-anon (for families of gamblers) and later I found CODA (codependents anonymous). I'll be forever grateful to all of the people God put in my path in those groups. I also discovered the book: Codependent no more by Melodie Beattie. Life changer!!

Codependents are addicts. We're addicted to relationships. We take everything personally, think it's our fault when something goes wrong (usually because the addict told us so repeatedly) and are always trying to fix things. In the process we neglect ourselves, our well being, our lives because we don't know any better. We truly believe we're helping the addict, or the narc by neglecting ourselves. Of course we always end up being used or taken for granted by the very people we gave everything for. "Oh you only gave me $1000? Don't you know I needed $2000?! You're so selfish!" It takes years and lots of dedication to rewire the brain of codependents. I'd say at least 5 years of dedicated effort but it can be done! I'm living proof of that.

 

[tatiana]

A&E has a show called "Intervention:Codependents"

I saw it on Sunday. I thought about this thread.

It is similar to Intervention except the specialist points out the codependent behavior and she tries to help the non-addict family more.

I would like if they did a show with a narc parent and non-narc child because I think people could see codependency a bit easier without the substance abuse drama.

 

[barbiesocialite]

*subscribing*

 

[caribeandiva]

@tatiana I'm watching Intervention: codependents episode 2. It's about a young couple addicted to heroin: Caitlyn and Gianluca. They're about to be evicted from yet another apartment. Caitlyn is like: "I'm really nervous about all of this" all calmly while flipping through a freaking magazine!! Umm what? And mom and dad are paying her phone bill, her car payment, and want her to move back in to "help" her out. Thank goodness for the intervention specialist! She put a stop to that quick. Oh and Caitlyn has had a pacemaker since she was 5!!! Jesus take the wheel!

 

[Smiley79]

I was a codependent for years and didn't even know it. I grew up with a mom who was a gambling addict and both of my parents are narcissists on top of that. To say I had a messed up childhood is an understatement. Childhood? What childhood? I was born an adult basically. It wasn't until I moved out of my parents' house at age 25 that I realized what went on. By then I was deeply depressed, suicidal and desperate for a change.

I started therapy a year later. My therapist suggested I joined support groups such as Gam-anon (for families of gamblers) and later I found CODA (codependents anonymous). I'll be forever grateful to all of the people God put in my path in those groups. I also discovered the book: Codependent no more by Melodie Beattie. Life changer!!

Codependents are addicts. We're addicted to relationships. We take everything personally, think it's our fault when something goes wrong (usually because the addict told us so repeatedly) and are always trying to fix things. In the process we neglect ourselves, our well being, our lives because we don't know any better. We truly believe we're helping the addict, or the narc by neglecting ourselves. Of course we always end up being used or taken for granted by the very people we gave everything for. "Oh you only gave me $1000? Don't you know I needed $2000?! You're so selfish!" It takes years and lots of dedication to rewire the brain of codependents. I'd say at least 5 years of dedicated effort but it can be done! I'm living proof of that.

^^^This post speaks volumes to me...i can identify with a lot of what you mention. The scary part is going on for years or decades thinking that this behavior is normal; all the while i was battling feelings of inferiority, loneliness, and an absence of self love. Breaking the behavioral patterns of codependency has been the biggest challenge I have ever fought but it has equally been the most rewarding quest to conquer. Every bit of progress makes a difference in a more positive direction.

 

[caribeandiva]

^^^This post speaks volumes to me...i can identify with a lot of what you mention. The scary part is going on for years or decades thinking that this behavior is normal; all the while i was battling feelings of inferiority, loneliness, and an absence of self love. Breaking the behavioral patterns of codependency has been the biggest challenge I have ever fought but it has equally been the most rewarding quest to conquer. Every bit of progress makes a difference in a more positive direction.

Yeah when you're codependent you think what's happening to you is normal. But normal is relative. It's not until you see healthy families that you realize how toxic yours is. The addict isn't gonna tell you to stop enabling them because it benefits them to keep you where you are. Changing patterns that were taught to you for decades is tough but the best thing you can do for everyone involved.

 

[Smiley79]

Yeah when you're codependent you think what's happening to you is normal. But normal is relative. It's not until you see healthy families that you realize how toxic yours is. The addict isn't gonna tell you to stop enabling them because it benefits them to keep you where you are. Changing patterns that were taught to you for decades is tough but the best thing you can do for everyone involved.

Exactly...in most cases the Codependent is usually drawn to the narcissist and begins the cycle of enabling them emotionally and mentally. Therapy helped me to understand that a codependent may eventually develop a feeling a resentment after giving for so many years and still feeling unappreciated, unloved or empty. So that resentment often times is the wake up call that something is wrong and that this pattern is NOT normal. Very interesting stuff once you're standing on the other side of it and start working at changing things around. The funny part of codependency is seeing the reaction of the narcissist (or other toxic people)...they're not necessarily happy/supportive to see this new and improved you, so eventually you end up weeding out those who never had your best interest at heart vs those who longed for the day to see you blossom.

 

[hopeful]

Thank you ladies for keeping this thread going. I think one of the hardest parts is that some narcissists can do so many sweet and good things for you while doing so many cruel things as well. The good things are overt and easy to see by you and others. The bad things can be covert, harder for you and others to see. It is difficult to break free from covert narcissists. You have to be very strong. They are not going to hit you or curse you out -- but they will hurt you nonetheless.

 

[caribeandiva]

The funny part of codependency is seeing the reaction of the narcissist (or other toxic people)...they're not necessarily happy/supportive to see this new and improved you, so eventually you end up weeding out those who never had your best interest at heart vs those who longe

They're never happy for you when you change. They like you right where you're at. Narcissists indeed. When I broke I didn't know who to trust. It felt like everyone was out to get me. Most of the friendships I made before I got help turned out to be toxic too. The dance was familiar to me. Those friendships have slowly weeded themselves out over the years.

 

[Smiley79]

I just wanted to add that Codependency does not have to be an embarrassing or depressing conversation. It does require acknowledgment and firm action in over to overcome it. On the bright side, the potential outcome is equivalent to having a significant weight lifted off your shoulders; a truly liberating and enlightening experience. It may help to solve the riddle of why we are always attracted to the same type of men or why we tend to stay in unfavorable situations for so long in hopes of it miraculously changing one day or why we are extremely giving in relationships/friendships but always end up with the short end of the stick when it's all over or why we (subconsciously) tend to overcompensate in a relationship in hopes of being loved or appreciated more by the other person. These are just a few thought off the top of my head, I can add more later.

Because codependency usually stems from something in childhood or some deep trauma from the past, chances are the men we date aren't really the problem as much as the problem is what we allow and what we put ourselves into. This is why therapy is highly recommended if possible. But if for any reason you or someone you know is unable to enroll in therapy or a therapy group, maybe you can try reading up on this topic in the meantime.

If you have any book suggestions, do share. Below are a few. Check your local library first to see if you can just check it out before buying.

 

[caribeandiva]

@hopeful Are narcs ever overt? All them mofos are covert, sneaky and shady af. After all they have an image to uphold. God forbid their mask falls off and the true them is revealed.

 

[caribeandiva]

@Smiley79 I read Codependent no more. Awesome book!

 

[Smiley79]

Thank you ladies for keeping this thread going. I think one of the hardest parts is that some narcissists can do so many sweet and good things for you while doing so many cruel things as well. The good things are overt and easy to see by you and others. The bad things can be covert, harder for you and others to see. It is difficult to break free from covert narcissists. You have to be very strong. They are not going to hit you or curse you out -- but they will hurt you nonetheless.

This is why this illustration is often used to depict an emotionally abusive narcissist. The one who KNOWS that they are taking advantage of a vulnerable situation and tend to leech on to individuals who are an easy prey for them. As much as this is true, I really try to put the responsibility on myself to simply say NO and not allow the wolves into my life anymore.
He's a smooth talker with little action=NO
He is unsure of wanting a relationship but he's a charmer who wants all the good benefits=NO
He's coming around or calling only when it's convenient for him=NO
He speaks negatively of his past relationships; everyone else is always the problem=NO

You get the drift guys....

 

[Smiley79]

They're never happy for you when you change. They like you right where you're at. Narcissists indeed. When I broke I didn't know who to trust. It felt like everyone was out to get me. Most of the friendships I made before I got help turned out to be toxic too. The dance was familiar to me. Those friendships have slowly weeded themselves out over the years.

Yup, that was me EXACTLY! It was my first ever feeling like I was actually going "crazy". I was completely drained emotionally and mentally. Thankfully I got help right on time from that emotional fall.

 

[Smiley79]

@Smiley79 I read Codependent no more. Awesome book!

Oooh, thanks for sharing. That one is next on my life. I saw high reviews for it. I'm in the middle of Human Magnet and Codependency for Dummies.

 

[Smiley79]

deleted

 

[hopeful]

From what I've read an overt narcissist is the wife beater or the man who flirts with or stares at other women right in your face. The man that will call you out of your name. I think the overt ones are the guys your friends encourage you to leave. The covert one wins over your friends and the public in general. Everyone thinks you are lucky and he is so nice.

 

[Smiley79]

From what I've read an overt narcissist is the wife beater or the man who flirts with or stares at other women right in your face. The man that will call you out of your name. I think the overt ones are the guys your friends encourage you to leave. The covert one wins over your friends and the public in general. Everyone thinks you are lucky and he is so nice.

Oh okay, I got it mixed up then. My mistake. That makes sense.

 

[hopeful]

I just wanted to add that Codependency does not have to be an embarrassing or depressing conversation. It does require acknowledgment and firm action in over to overcome it. On the bright side, the potential outcome is equivalent to having a significant weight lifted off your shoulders; a truly liberating and enlightening experience. It may help to solve the riddle of why we are always attracted to the same type of men or why we tend to stay in unfavorable situations for so long in hopes of it miraculously changing one day or why we are extremely giving in relationships/friendships but always end up with the short end of the stick when it's all over or why we (subconsciously) tend to overcompensate in a relationship in hopes of being loved or appreciated more by the other person. These are just a few thought off the top of my head, I can add more later.

Because codependency usually stems from something in childhood or some deep trauma from the past, chances are the men we date aren't really the problem as much as the problem is what we allow and what we put ourselves into. This is why therapy is highly recommended if possible. But if for any reason you or someone you know is unable to enroll in therapy or a therapy group, maybe you can try reading up on this topic in the meantime.

If you have any book suggestions, do share. Below are a few. Check your local library first to see if you can just check it out before buying.

Thank you for this post, especially the colored parts. It's so important to focus on what it means and feels like to be codependent.

 

[caribeandiva]

From what I've read an overt narcissist is the wife beater or the man who flirts with or stares at other women right in your face. The man that will call you out of your name. I think the overt ones are the guys your friends encourage you to leave. The covert one wins over your friends and the public in general. Everyone thinks you are lucky and he is so nice.

Oh ok. Makes sense. Yeah most narcs are coverts. The overt ones are not as prevalent.

 

[Smiley79]

You're welcome @hopeful . At first I was hesitant to start this thread because I know we have to be really careful about using labels and terms such as Narcissist and Codependent since it's really a case by case situation. But time and time again, I can identify with people who manifest codependent traits and they feel helpless. You see that they're usually not "strong" enough or "alert" enough to pick up on it in time to avoid going down a futile and emotionally draining path. As we said before, we usually don't know that there's a problem until it's too late. So I really hope this thread can spread awareness, encouragement, support and an outlet to vent and hopefully it will encourage change so this cycle does not have to continue.

 

[caribeandiva]

I think the book: Will I ever be good enough is a good one.

http://www.amazon.com/Will-Ever-Good-Enough-Narcissistic/dp/1439129436#immersive-view_1458921555372

 

[DarkJoy]

Anyone here raised by narcs or abusive ppl? That's what got me sucked in. What was healthy? I had no clue until spending years in the therapists office. I realized around year 5 that all I talked about was him and my abusive parents. There was no space in the sessions for me! Wow. I was the poster child for codependence.

Marriage ended. Parents went to super-low contact. Life is much better.

 

[Smiley79]

Yup, I was. That behavior and environment was the norm for me and I learned so well how to adapt and behave in order to keep the peace and "feel" accepted by the ones who raised me.
In therapy it has always been difficult for me to talk about my childhood, it's like a door I didn't want to open. I just felt like "what's the use of bringing it up, I can't do anything about it now". Surprisingly, when I do open up about it during my sessions, it does feel like a weight is off my shoulders and it finally makes sense why I instinctively behave certain ways in relationships or why I am drawn to a pattern of individuals in relationships/friendships.

 

[caribeandiva]

Anyone here raised by narcs or abusive ppl? That's what got me sucked in. What was healthy? I had no clue until spending years in the therapists office. I realized around year 5 that all I talked about was him and my abusive parents. There was no space in the sessions for me! Wow. I was the poster child for codependence.

Marriage ended. Parents went to super-low contact. Life is much better.

I was raised by narcissist parents.

 

[hopeful]

...
There was no space in the sessions for me!
...

This is what it all amounts to. We end up being left out of our own lives. Everything is always about someone else, always. And when you try to break free from the dynamic, you feel guilty and people accustomed to how you are send subtle and not so subtle signals that you are being selfish. And if you want to continue being liked or loved by them you must continue being the old you.

Childhood programming is so incredibly hard to break. But it must be done if we are going to be happy and fulfilled. We have to be strong and determined.

 

[Smiley79]

This is what it all amounts to. We end up being left out of our own lives. Everything is always about someone else, always. And when you try to break free from the dynamic, you feel guilty and people accustomed to how you are send subtle and not so subtle signals that you are being selfish. And if you want to continue being liked or loved by them you must continue being the old you.

Childhood programming is so incredibly hard to break. But it must be done if we are going to be happy and fulfilled. We have to be strong and determined.

^^^This could not have been said any better. You hit it on the nail 100%. Am I the only one who finds talking about it to be therapeutic? Its like a mystery that's finally solved....things make so much sense now. I can't imagine the thought of living the rest of my life like this. I thank God every moment I can that he brought this to light.

Do any of you still struggle with feelings of guilt from time to time? Breaking the codependency pattern will do it to you, especially if youre around Narcs. You could be fooled to believe that you are selfish or you are the bad guy. Whatever!