Have you ever "stolen" someone else's man?

[LisaLisa1908]

I agree at SOME POINT, someone is doing too much (considering the partner at home) but if the other person is okay with it, something obviously exists that cannot be denied. The fact that it CAN EVEN EXIST with the partner at home says something in itself, no?

That's when it stops being innocent. And it wouldn't have been an issue in the first place had the opportunity NOT presented itself. People PURPOSELY open themselves to the reciprocation of information. It doesn't JUST HAPPEN.

I don't deny that you're right about how these things happen, I just disagree with the whole "innocence" thing. Some conversations don't need to be had, even in the name of "human interaction." Falling in love with someone I WOULD THINK is more involved that just work-appropriate anecdotes. But that's me. My next question is, why are y'all talking about the things that people talk about in the course of building a relationship TO fall in love? I don't care how much time you spend with someone, some things you owe to your spouse and no one else. That's how people slide up into these raggedy situations in the first place.

Just call it what it is - sloppy pimping and home wrecking.

 

[SvelteVelvet]

That's when it stops being innocent. And it wouldn't have been an issue in the first place had the opportunity NOT presented itself. People PURPOSELY open themselves to the reciprocation of information. It doesn't JUST HAPPEN.

I don't deny that you're right about how these things happen, I just disagree with the whole "innocence" thing. Some conversations don't need to be had, even in the name of "human interaction." Falling in love with someone I WOULD THINK is more involved that just work-appropriate anecdotes. But that's me. My next question is, why are y'all talking about the things that people talk about in the course of building a relationship TO fall in love? I don't care how much time you spend with someone, some things you owe to your spouse and no one else. That's how people slide up into these raggedy situations in the first place.

Just call it what it is - sloppy pimping and home wrecking.

At the bolded, with the original topic at hand and the different types of scenarios possible mentioned in this thread where a man will LEAVE ONE WOMAN FOR ANOTHER. I can't call it that.

Like Demi said, there really are two totally different conversations going on in this thread. Similar (same outcome of someone losing someone for someone else) but when you break it down as it's been done in this thread it really is apples and oranges.

Criticism, name-calling, labeling, judging - affects no one but the person spewing them really, cuz WHAT? People gon' do what they gon' do. Regardless of how people WISH the world was to make them feel more secure, the reality exist that there is a way things are which equates to NOTHING and NO ONE in life is GUARANTEED to anyone forever...

 

[1Aleeesha]

How about when the marriage is at a common weak point and he goes to your little desperate *** "friend" and they grinning all up in ya face like nothing is going on. Meanwhile whatever their little union is, is all a secret everyone knows but you until the man decides never mind wife's desperate little "friend" this isn't what I want so the "friend" starts contacting you harassing you...I say **** them both...

 

[Everything Zen]

Why won't you? You already lost your friend over him. Or did you mean that the girl was like an SO?

I don't love him.

 

[gn1g]

how can you know the difference btween selfish and higher self?

 

[LoveisYou]

This is an interesting discussion....

Scenario

Man is in love with woman. Man meets other woman and falls in love with her. Man leaves woman for other woman. Is this behavior justifiable because "love" is involved? What about his love for the first woman? Does love inflict undue pain? Is love just a feeling, or is it more than that? Is it a decision? Does it involve commitment especially when the couple is married? What is commitment exactly, is it a choice to give up other choices? Once commited doesn't your energy focus on making that commitment work?

Just some points to think about.....

 

[LoveisYou]

I found this post very interesting, and I have a few questions if you don't mind.

To the first bolded...are you saying that you can seduce any man you want no matter what?
No ma'am that is not what I am saying....we all attract different people to us depending on our vibrations...me and him were attracted to each other thats why it would of been easy to seduce him specifically if that was my intention

That if you came across a man that was in love w. his wife and was happy in his relationship, if you wanted to you could have taken him away from her?
Another no....see above answer

To the red, kissing someone else's husband is a form of energy exchange...ok...
So...if and when you get married, you're saying you would be ok with your husband kissing some other woman b/c all he's doing is exchanging energy? Also, why stop there? Wouldn't your husband having sex with another woman be a form of them exchanging sexual energy? Where do you draw the line here in this "energy exchange"?
My ideas on sex and love are very different from other people's...I have no desire to possess or own anybody nor to stop them from doing anything they feel like doing....if my husband were to run across another woman whom he felt attracted to I would be interested in knowing what the attraction levels were and would be open to understanding their connection to each other and understanding where his feelings and heart is without judgment or punishment for his feelings nor emotionally manipulating him into feeling guilty about anything (nor her)...I'm also very aware and can see when people are operating from ego mode vs heart mode so either way I will be able to understand what is going on...if he felt that he had to leave for her I would let him go, I definitely would not try to stop or deter him or...neither him nor her can ever take anything away from me, esp love and I would still wish both of them love in their lives regardless...its who I am and I am always in it and will always experience it

To the blue, you can say your intention isn't to hurt the wife but you had to have known if she somehow found out she would be hurt and devastated. You wouldn't care or feel guilty about that? I kind of liken that to...idk...randomly shooting a gun somewhere. (Maybe this is an extreme example, but bear with me here) Say you pick up a gun and you were just curious about it and you shoot it and hit someone. Sure you didn't mean to shoot someone, but when you picked up the gun and shot it b/c you were curious, you knew what could've been the possible outcome of your actions. So whether you meant to hurt someone or not, you are still responsible.

No I would not have felt guilty and honestly I don't think her specifically would of been devastated over a shared kiss, however if he were to leave her would be a different story and I knew that much....I do know and talk to people and can read them very well....if I had felt any sort of guilt I would of told her because guilt is one of the most destructive emotions that will tear a person down...If she had found out I would of been honest and told her the truth and my intentions were not to hurt her and she is free to feel any which way about me she feels like

No matter what you meant it to be, if you know what the situation can be..why even pick up the gun to begin with?
Every situation anybody is ever involved in is for a specific reason and very different than any other anybody else is in...that specific situation went down how it went down...easily if it were two different people and me same circumstances it could of went down a whole nother way...or different mindsets

I'm not saying any of this in judgement. I'm just curious and a bit fascinated with all of this
Its all good, I don't mind answering

T you said that you're "ideas on sex and love are very different from other people's..." . As a result of that, do you believe it's necessary for you to take the mainstream view on sex and love into account to ensure that your actions do not inflict pain on others? Do your ideas on sex and love bar you from the potential consequences of your actions? In other words, you kissing her husband could potentially be a painful experience for her if the kiss is revealed. Are we not responsible for how our actions affect others whether we think on a higher plane or not?

Shouldn't our intentions correalate with our actions? Are intentions enough when the possibility of inflicting pain exists?

 

[SvelteVelvet]

This is an interesting discussion....

Scenario

Man is in love with woman. Man meets other woman and falls in love with her. Man leaves woman for other woman. Is this behavior justifiable because "love" is involved? What about his love for the first woman? Does love inflict undue pain? Is love just a feeling, or is it more than that? Is it a decision? Does it involve commitment especially when the couple is married? What is commitment exactly, is it a choice to give up other choices? Once commited doesn't your energy focus on making that commitment work?

Just some points to think about.....

Good points and this isn't to be combative or hijack your purpose of raising the questions but..

For your first sentence (bolded), I believe for the second sentence to occur, it would be more appropriate to say Man is WITH one woman. If a man is able to fall in love with another woman, I don't believe he is truly IN LOVE with the woman he is with. He could love her, they could have been IN love at one point but they can also fall out of love during the duration of the relationship but the love they have FOR them and no major falling out can keep them in a relationship together long after their being IN LOVE has ended. Sometimes it isn't until the man meets someone he does find himself falling in love with that he realizes he isn't in love with the one he's with. Of course the sexes can be reversed here in this situation.

There are always signs and feelings when two people in a relationship are no longer on the same path or growing at the same speed or in the same direction, but it usually takes quite some time for the end to come to realization. When the end involves a third party showing up, it's just more of a sting.

It really is a case by case thing too. There is just so much more than what the situation LOOKS like on the outside to come to a general conclusion for what it means when a person leaves a relationship in ORDER to start another and that's where my defensive stance for the judgement comes from. The slightest details and possibilities are imperative in getting to the core of what a situation like this is REALLY about.

 

[LoveisYou]

Good points and this isn't to be combative or hijack your purpose of raising the questions but..

For your first sentence (bolded), I believe for the second sentence to occur, it would be more appropriate to say Man is WITH one woman. If a man is able to fall in love with another woman, I don't believe he is truly IN LOVE with the woman he is with. He could love her, they could have been IN love at one point but they can also fall out of love during the duration of the relationship but the love they have FOR them and no major falling out can keep them in a relationship together long after their being IN LOVE has ended. Sometimes it isn't until the man meets someone he does find himself falling in love with that he realizes he isn't in love with the one he's with. Of course the sexes can be reversed here in this situation.

There are always signs and feelings when two people in a relationship are no longer on the same path or growing at the same speed or in the same direction, but it usually takes quite some time for the end to come to realization. When the end involves a third party showing up, it's just more of a sting.

It really is a case by case thing too. There is just so much more than what the situation LOOKS like on the outside to come to a general conclusion for what it means when a person leaves a relationship in ORDER to start another and that's where my defensive stance for the judgement comes from. The slightest details and possibilities are imperative in getting to the core of what a situation like this is REALLY about.

I don't think you are combative at all, I think your post exemplifies one of the reasons why I raised so many questions in my post about love and commitment.

How are we defining love here? Is it just an emotion, a feeling? Or, is it commitment?

Maybe I should have said "Man loves woman" because the notion of being "in love" I believe, can sometimes paint a picture of the cookie cutter, happy couple. I don't believe that's love.

I do believe that love is a decision and it involves acting on that decision to honor and respect your relationship and your partner.

Our culture encourages a lot of selfish behavior. Do what makes you feel good. If that means pursuing a married man or woman go ahead....and it's easier when a relationship is going through a rocky period, when people are most vulnerable.

I don't think anyone can be owned, we aren't borned to be slaves. Yet I don't take commitments (esp. marriages) lightly.

 

[aribell]

This is an interesting discussion....

Scenario

Man is in love with woman. Man meets other woman and falls in love with her. Man leaves woman for other woman. Is this behavior justifiable because "love" is involved? What about his love for the first woman? Does love inflict undue pain? Is love just a feeling, or is it more than that? Is it a decision? Does it involve commitment especially when the couple is married? What is commitment exactly, is it a choice to give up other choices? Once commited doesn't your energy focus on making that commitment work?

Just some points to think about.....

I believe that once you make a vow before God to join yourself to one person, then you are bound by that vow. Otherwise, "commitment" is a choice and being "in love" with someone does not in itself commit you to stay with them.

At this point in the conversation, it might seem like I or others are trying to advocate not taking commitments seriously. But I don't think it's about that. I for one think that the desire to keep someone bound to me simply because my ego would be bruised and I would experience rejection if they left for someone else has little to do with "love" or "commitment" and everything to do with my own sense of security (or insecurity).

You can only be bound by what you choose to bind yourself to. People should probably be more clear within themselves and with the people they are with what exactly the nature of their "commitment" is. Even in the case of marriage, if two people go into it assuming that divorce is always an option, then can that commitment really be said to be "forever"? They've implicitly said to themselves and one another that they very well might change their minds and break their union. And dating relationships for most people could at best be termed commitments for "right now," at least until people decide whether they want it to be permanent or not.

Playing devil's advocate now...My question is, given society's general approval of breaking up and divorcing for reasons of "incompatibility (of whatever kind)," "irreconcilable differences," "unfulfillment," whatever, what makes "leaving for someone else" so much more heinous? Someone can break up with someone because they're not sexually fulfilled in the relationship, the person annoys them, they're bored, etc., but they can't break up if they find someone that they have a deeper/better connection with?

 

[Princess4real]

I don't think you are combative at all, I think your post exemplifies one of the reasons why I raised so many questions in my post about love and commitment.

How are we defining love here? Is it just an emotion, a feeling? Or, is it commitment?

Maybe I should have said "Man loves woman" because the notion of being "in love" I believe, can sometimes paint a picture of the cookie cutter, happy couple. I don't believe that's love.

I do believe that love is a decision and it involves acting on that decision to honor and respect your relationship and your partner.

Our culture encourages a lot of selfish behavior. Do what makes you feel good. If that means pursuing a married man or woman go ahead....and it's easier when a relationship is going through a rocky period, when people are most vulnerable.

I don't think anyone can be owned, we aren't borned to be slaves. Yet I don't take commitments (esp. marriages) lightly.

ITA..............................

 

[tiara76]

T you said that you're "ideas on sex and love are very different from other people's..." . As a result of that, do you believe it's necessary for you to take the mainstream view on sex and love into account to ensure that your actions do not inflict pain on others? Do your ideas on sex and love bar you from the potential consequences of your actions? In other words, you kissing her husband could potentially be a painful experience for her if the kiss is revealed. Are we not responsible for how our actions affect others whether we think on a higher plane or not?

Shouldn't our intentions correalate with our actions? Are intentions enough when the possibility of inflicting pain exists?

Good question mama....and yes I do take the mainstream views into account of my actions....like I said every body and every situation is different...the particular one I described involving myself and the married guy and his wife were three people who also didn't have the same views as people normally have....I talked to both him and his wife, she was around us alot even in the midst of the convos....she wasn't oblivious to us and their issues nor their relationship had anything to do with insecurities around other people or sex

they were both looking for a temporary escape of what they were going thru...she preferred to gamble and any chance she got she was on the tables.....if I came into the room she would be like..

hey girl keep him company for me
go dance with him
glad your here, come dance with us
I'm goin to bed, take care of him for me
when the guy i was with was tryin his best to get to me she would tell her husband to take me to dance and hang out so i wouldn't get upset

when I talked to her alone she told me from what I could recall that when her husband hooked up with other women she wasn't trippin and told me something along these lines

have fun, be safe and come home and teach me something new.....

we would talk for hours and she would come in and sit down on the convos, get up and leave...she definitely was not paranoid and insecure about another woman nor would her world have ended had she found out we kissed

me and him decided on our own accord to not make it into anything because we knew it wouldn't just be so "casual" and it would be a distraction to him when he needed to be present to go through what they were going through...some people grow apart, those two weren't done growing together...I knew that, he knew that....there was no need to make it into anything...if by chance his wife were to read the few emails we exchanged she wouldn't have felt "betrayed" by them

now he may not have went home with any new sex tricks but he may have had a different outlook on their relationship and some new understanding on how to work through it since we talked alot about him and her and the problems they were facing which were they had been together so long that his mindset and outlooks and consciousness levels have changed and hers hasn't so they butt head on alot of things and they were both looking for a way to not face it at the time...however running away wasn't gonna help either of them

yes I think we would of had great amazing sex and great chemistry
yes I wanted to
what was the higher action.....what i want wasn't necessarily what I was feeling in my heart...a higher choice was to go with my heart on the matter and to leave it be

now my first love...his wife is so insecure and paranoid over me that if she even hears my name she is ready to throw herself off a cliff.....I don't have a desire to be with him but I would have liked to at least had a friendly relationship with him and I know how to reach him, I know all his contact info I am still cool with his family and friends but I leave him alone...we have spoken all of 7 min total in the past 11 years, I know that he would respond to me if I made contact with me.....now even if we exchanged emails as simple as

hey, hope all is well hope your family and wife are great and life is bringing you blessings and he responded to it and she found out she would totally interpret it as me trying to "take" him from her and him responding she would take as a betrayal....so do I ever contact him directly

no

out of respect for her more so than anything....

she has some insecurity issues and one way or another they are gonna have to be addressed, however Im not volunteering to step into the picture to press buttons to highlight them for her....

so yes at the present time of who I am... I do take into account other people, what they feel, their views and where they are with themselves in accordance to my own actions

I don't like anything heavy on my heart, if I truly thought I betrayed his wife or that she would be "devastated" to learn we kissed I would of told her....i can't hold it in and its very emotionally draining and with me these days if it was on my heart and had to be brought up in the open even if i tried to avoid doing it, the universe would of made it happen if it was necessary

again I want to talk to him
I would love to have a friendly relationship with him
I know it would be hard for him and devastating to her

so do I go with what I want, or do i go with what I truly feel in my heart...again...I will choose to act from my heart on it and leave it alone

 

[SvelteVelvet]

I don't think you are combative at all, I think your post exemplifies one of the reasons why I raised so many questions in my post about love and commitment.

How are we defining love here? Is it just an emotion, a feeling? Or, is it commitment?

Maybe I should have said "Man loves woman" because the notion of being "in love" I believe, can sometimes paint a picture of the cookie cutter, happy couple. I don't believe that's love.

I do believe that love is a decision and it involves acting on that decision to honor and respect your relationship and your partner.

Our culture encourages a lot of selfish behavior. Do what makes you feel good. If that means pursuing a married man or woman go ahead....and it's easier when a relationship is going through a rocky period, when people are most vulnerable.

I don't think anyone can be owned, we aren't borned to be slaves. Yet I don't take commitments (esp. marriages) lightly.

ITA about not taking commitment lightly. In defining love here I'd define it as a genuine all-consuming affinity for another from the emotions, thoughts, feelings, desires strong enough to take the shape of a relationship no matter what. (no matter what including a previous established commitment).

I wouldn't define love as commitment. Love can lead to commitment (the promise of) but I believe for commitment to endure there has to be total and continuous reciprocity between both individuals for the things that caused them to fall in love in the first place and the ability to fall in love with each other all over again as time goes on.

As it's been said here, long term relationships, most especially marriages go through ups and downs, stages and phases, strong points and weak points. They are live entities in themselves. Some can bounce back from the lows and some reach the point of no return. All in all I feel the power a third person has to influence an ending of a relationship depends on the strength of the glue holding that relationship together FIRST.

 

[LoveisYou]

I believe that once you make a vow before God to join yourself to one person, then you are bound by that vow. Otherwise, "commitment" is a choice and being "in love" with someone does not in itself commit you to stay with them.

At this point in the conversation, it might seem like I or others are trying to advocate not taking commitments seriously. But I don't think it's about that. I for one think that the desire to keep someone bound to me simply because my ego would be bruised and I would experience rejection if they left for someone else has little to do with "love" or "commitment" and everything to do with my own sense of security (or insecurity).

You can only be bound by what you choose to bind yourself to. People should probably be more clear within themselves and with the people they are with what exactly the nature of their "commitment" is. Even in the case of marriage, if two people go into it assuming that divorce is always an option, then can that commitment really be said to be "forever"? They've implicitly said to themselves and one another that they very well might change their minds and break their union. And dating relationships for most people could at best be termed commitments for "right now," at least until people decide whether they want it to be permanent or not.

Playing devil's advocate now...My question is, given society's general approval of breaking up and divorcing for reasons of "incompatibility (of whatever kind)," "irreconcilable differences," "unfulfillment," whatever, what makes "leaving for someone else" so much more heinous? Someone can break up with someone because they're not sexually fulfilled in the relationship, the person annoys them, they're bored, etc., but they can't break up if they find someone that they have a deeper/better connection with?

See I disagree with society on a lot of things and your last paragraph is one of them. To be frank, many people are in relationships with themselves. I can't comment on commitment for now relationships, because in my definition that is not a commitment, but in the context of marriage, what makes "leaving for someone else" so much more heinous? What about the vow you made to your partner before man and many times before God? As you said yourself, you are bound by that vow. If marriage is the ultimate display of a commitment then if another person is an option...what are we saying about commitments?

The list of reasons you give in the last paragraph for breaking up just highlight the self-seeking mindset that many people enter relationships with. Is it too much to expect your partner to be committed in the face of difficulty? Whatever happened to "for better or for worse" and the duty partners have to each other? Nowadays you say duty and many people can't see past their selfishness to realize that they have a responsibility toward another person when they enter a relationship.

In response to your second paragraph, you really can't expect to bind someone to you if there was no commitment in the first place. That's correct! However, expecting someone to respect and honor you in the context of a committed relationship is a reasonable expectation, I don't see it as ego driven in the least.

Commitment is the glue that holds love together. Without that key ingredient, it's difficult for a love relationship to be a successful relation. When you're fully commited your only option is your partner. It doesn't mean you can't be attracted to other people, what id does mean is that you do not allow that attraction to develop into anything else but that.

I'm not advocating for people to be unhappy or for them to stay in abusive disrespectful relationships. I just think people would benefit from knowing the responsibilities and duties that comes with commitment.

 

[MissYocairis]

[/B]
In response to your second paragraph, you really can't expect to bind someone to you if there was no commitment in the first place. That's correct! However, expecting someone to respect and honor you in the context of a committed relationship is a reasonable expectation, I don't see it as ego driven in the least.

ITA. And, I find the paradox on this board really interesting. How many threads and discussions have gone on about why women should demand exclusivity in a relationship before sex? It's been pretty much a given around here that if you are giving of yourself sexually to a man who has not committed himself to your relationship exclusively (but is also sexing others), that you are endangering your own health and comprimising your integrity.

However, in this thread, there should be a distinction between the marriage commitment and the relationship commitment? Women in exclusive relationships should not expect true monogamy? If that is the case, then what is the deal with all the outrage and rabid fear over cheating? We are obsessed with cheating on this board even when the dude isn't married!

Furthermore, WHY, if we really believe that it's honorable on some higher level, to fall in love with someone's spouse or SO, why then, do we at the same time, have an issue with someone like Steve McNair? He was living out his highest truth. Mechelle McNair was free to release him with love and good wishes...that was on her. What about all the Alicia Keyes bashing? Swizz and his wife were DONE as a couple (though not on paper) before they got together...but she's being called a homewrecker.

There are communities for people who prefer to express love in a more free manner without the constraints of ego and binding....Polyamorous communities and Swinging communities come to mind. I love those because people of like minds agree together. That seems more honorable to me. IDK.

 

[jada1111]

they were both looking for a temporary escape of what they were going thru...she preferred to gamble and any chance she got she was on the tables.....if I came into the room she would be like..

hey girl keep him company for me
go dance with him
glad your here, come dance with us
I'm goin to bed, take care of him for me
when the guy i was with was tryin his best to get to me she would tell her husband to take me to dance and hang out so i wouldn't get upset

when I talked to her alone she told me from what I could recall that when her husband hooked up with other women she wasn't trippin and told me something along these lines

have fun, be safe and come home and teach me something new.....

Couples like this are called freaks or swingers.

 

[SvelteVelvet]

[/b]
See I disagree with society on a lot of things and your last paragraph is one of them. To be frank, many people are in relationships with themselves. I can't comment on commitment for now relationships, because in my definition that is not a commitment, but in the context of marriage, what makes "leaving for someone else" so much more heinous? What about the vow you made to your partner before man and many times before God? As you said yourself, you are bound by that vow. If marriage is the ultimate display of a commitment then if another person is an option...what are we saying about commitments? .

The list of reasons you give in the last paragraph for breaking up just highlight the self-seeking mindset that many people enter relationships with. Is it too much to expect your partner to be committed in the face of difficulty? Whatever happened to "for better or for worse" and the duty partners have to each other? Nowadays you say duty and many people can't see past their selfishness to realize that they have a responsibility toward another person when they enter a relationship.

In response to your second paragraph, you really can't expect to bind someone to you if there was no commitment in the first place. That's correct! However, expecting someone to respect and honor you in the context of a committed relationship is a reasonable expectation, I don't see it as ego driven in the least.

Commitment is the glue that holds love together. Without that key ingredient, it's difficult for a love relationship to be a successful relation. When you're fully commited your only option is your partner. It doesn't mean you can't be attracted to other people, what id does mean is that you do not allow that attraction to develop into anything else but that.

I'm not advocating for people to be unhappy or for them to stay in abusive disrespectful relationships. I just think people would benefit from knowing the responsibilities and duties that comes with commitment.

EVERYONE should have a superb relationship with themselves before joining with another person. Just like a persons relationship with God should always come before their relationship with their spouse (which if both people put God above their marriage, situations like this isn't even an issue, AMEN?) It's not selfish at all. In fact it's what makes a person a great husband or great wife. Like the adage that you must be good to yourself before you can be good to someone else.

What are we saying about commitments if another person is an option?

What I'M taking into consideration is the different levels and reasons for why people become committed in the first place. The dynamics that occur inside that commitment. There is a reverse side when taking vows, the other side takes them too. And marriage vows say a whole lot more than you are bound to me and no one else. They equate to unconditional love BUT the fact that there is the responsiblity for two separate beings to uphold them together makes it conditional all at the same time, with the reality is that YES divorce IS an option.

There are so many books and common ideas women have on how to get a man or get him to marry you, and men have their own form of desperation when wanting to 'lock a woman down' people lie about who they are to receive a commitment. Once they get it they can completely change, totally taking for granted the other persons needs and wants. But because that person took vows they are obligated to stay and be unhappy even if the other person is beyond the point of making the person happy because they were holding up a front to begin with? They are obligated to work on it, much harder than they would with a 'commitment for now' relationship. But IT.TAKES.TWO.

I can't help but hear this argument as "You made a commitment you better keep it no matter what, even if I become a witch after getting what I wanted so bad which was a commitment, and even if that does mean we are no longer compatible, YOU made a vow before God and man so like it not you are mine even if you are miserable, and if you find happiness somewhere else then you are a bad person" Yeah ok, well he'll/she'll be a happier bad person.

You say you are not advocating for a person to be unhappy or to stay in abusive disrespectful relationships, but you seem to be ignoring the fact that separation can become a necessary and MORAL decision and exonerating ONE persons responsiblity towards the relationship when you ask "Is it too much to expect your partner to be committed in the face of difficulty?" What difficulty are we talking? Difficulty faced together or difficulty CAUSED by one or both?

It is a reasonable expectation for your partner to respect and honor you in the context of a committed relationship IF you are doing the same and IF you are being reasonable. If you are doing neither, then yes it is a VERY ego driven expectation.

I believe more than knowing the responsibilities and duties that come with commitment people AND relationships would benefit more from being totally and openly honest with each other and honest with themselves about who they are, what they want, and the part they play in the fruit beared from their relationship with others.

 

[aribell]

[/b]

See I disagree with society on a lot of things and your last paragraph is one of them. To be frank, many people are in relationships with themselves. I can't comment on commitment for now relationships, because in my definition that is not a commitment, but in the context of marriage, what makes "leaving for someone else" so much more heinous? What about the vow you made to your partner before man and many times before God? As you said yourself, you are bound by that vow. If marriage is the ultimate display of a commitment then if another person is an option...what are we saying about commitments?

The list of reasons you give in the last paragraph for breaking up just highlight the self-seeking mindset that many people enter relationships with. Is it too much to expect your partner to be committed in the face of difficulty? Whatever happened to "for better or for worse" and the duty partners have to each other? Nowadays you say duty and many people can't see past their selfishness to realize that they have a responsibility toward another person when they enter a relationship.

In response to your second paragraph, you really can't expect to bind someone to you if there was no commitment in the first place. That's correct! However, expecting someone to respect and honor you in the context of a committed relationship is a reasonable expectation, I don't see it as ego driven in the least.

Commitment is the glue that holds love together. Without that key ingredient, it's difficult for a love relationship to be a successful relation. When you're fully commited your only option is your partner. It doesn't mean you can't be attracted to other people, what id does mean is that you do not allow that attraction to develop into anything else but that.

I'm not advocating for people to be unhappy or for them to stay in abusive disrespectful relationships. I just think people would benefit from knowing the responsibilities and duties that comes with commitment.

As to the bolded, I was just throwing out different scenarios, but they are entirely common ones. My general point would be that people use the term "commitment" to refer to relationships that they really aren't commited to, which is evidenced by the divorce rate and the various reasons people choose to leave certain relationships. I think that people kind of "act" commited much more than they actually are commited and that's the real problem imo. Given that no one is obligated to be in any type of commited relationship with anyone else, I think that people should think long and hard before they begin making "forever-type" statements to the other person implying a level of commitment that they in actuality are not prepared to carry out.

As for marriage, like I said, in my understanding that is a binding vow. At the same time, as Tiara's story showed, every couple defines for themselves what the nature of their commitment to the other is.

 

[PeaceFlow]

I agree with someone on the first page when they said that they made it hard for the guy.

A guy flirted with me then told me that he had a SO at the end of the night. We made choice to carry on with inapropriate flirting for a few weeks ish then left it. I never asked him to leave her but he did and we didn't do anything physical. I'm guessing sometimes people want to come out of a relationship anyway but don't want to be alone, if they think there is someone attractive there waiting for them lovingly then they will jump ship.

I'm actually with the woman now because we get on really well and we have both moved on from the guy. We both kinda got fooled coz he wasn't who either of us thought he was so maybe thats why it doesn't come between us.

 

[cookie1]

people can't be stolen, people just choose to leave

and karma is all based off intentions

I agree that "people choose to leave". The guy I'm with today left his GF 14 years ago and we're still together and things are good. I didnt' say perfect but good. He may choose to leave today, tomorrow, or in 15 years or maybe I will. Nothing is guaranteed so, we can't live feeling guilty or insecure because of how things began.

 

[donna894]

I voted wrong - so subtract one from "other, please explain." I met a guy who wanted to date me, but told me straight away that he had a girlfriend. I said Woe buddy I don't do man-sharing. He eventually broke up with her and we dated for a while. So I should have voted "No, never would,"

 

[MrsBurns82]

My current boyfriend was "stolen" and we've been together for 4 years now. I'm accidently but happily pregnant and expecting an engagement soon although I've declined him once. It's an extremely long story but basically we were friends he lived and had a child with someone some where along the line we developed feelings. He left prior to us having sex but not prior to us dating. Then came the drama, drama, drama, drama. I love him and my life and don't regret any of it. BUT!! if I could do it over I would have had no dealings with him until he left. It caused way too much drama because regardless if the relationship was sh!t b4 you came along it will alway be your fault and you will be thought of as a home wrecker in the other woman's eyes regardless if you feel as if you are not.

 

[simplertimes]

Ladies just please be careful of acting on "feelings" for attached men. You can get your self into things way worse than emotional damage .

 

[Princess4real]

Ladies just please be careful of acting on "feelings" for attached men. You can get your self into things way worse than emotional damage .

Yep No man is worth getting cut up or shot in the buttocks over.

 

[PeanutButterandHoney]

My current boyfriend was "stolen" and we've been together for 4 years now. I'm accidently but happily pregnant and expecting an engagement soon although I've declined him once. It's an extremely long story but basically we were friends he lived and had a child with someone some where along the line we developed feelings. He left prior to us having sex but not prior to us dating. Then came the drama, drama, drama, drama. I love him and my life and don't regret any of it. BUT!! if I could do it over I would have had no dealings with him until he left. It caused way too much drama because regardless if the relationship was sh!t b4 you came along it will alway be your fault and you will be thought of as a home wrecker in the other woman's eyes regardless if you feel as if you are not.

wow. A few questions.

How do you ACCIDENTLY get pregnant? Did you ACCIDENTLY have sex? Did you ACCIDENTLY forget the condom or accidently FORGET TO NOT be on birth control?

Also, why would you decline one engagement and request another one? Did he change or something...? if the answer is yes, are you admitting that he probably wasn't the best man for you?

You mean to tell me you "dated" this man while he was living with his girlfriend, and then sent him back hom with his girlfriend and child?

Sounds like you both engaged in selfish behavior and you ACCIDENTLY got pregnant to seal the deal.

 

[LBoogie]

My current boyfriend was "stolen" and we've been together for 4 years now. I'm accidently but happily pregnant and expecting an engagement soon although I've declined him once. It's an extremely long story but basically we were friends he lived and had a child with someone some where along the line we developed feelings. He left prior to us having sex but not prior to us dating. Then came the drama, drama, drama, drama. I love him and my life and don't regret any of it. BUT!! if I could do it over I would have had no dealings with him until he left. It caused way too much drama because regardless if the relationship was sh!t b4 you came along it will alway be your fault and you will be thought of as a home wrecker in the other woman's eyes regardless if you feel as if you are not.

Oh dear...

 

[Princess4real]

wow. A few questions.

How do you ACCIDENTLY get pregnant? Did you ACCIDENTLY have sex? Did you ACCIDENTLY forget the condom or accidently FORGET TO NOT be on birth control?

Also, why would you decline one engagement and request another one? Did he change or something...? if the answer is yes, are you admitting that he probably wasn't the best man for you?

You mean to tell me you "dated" this man while he was living with his girlfriend, and then sent him back hom with his girlfriend and child?

Sounds like you both engaged in selfish behavior and you ACCIDENTLY got pregnant to seal the deal.

I guess like this

 

[MrsBurns82]

wow. A few questions.

How do you ACCIDENTLY get pregnant? Did you ACCIDENTLY have sex? Did you ACCIDENTLY forget the condom or accidently FORGET TO NOT be on birth control?

Also, why would you decline one engagement and request another one? Did he change or something...? if the answer is yes, are you admitting that he probably wasn't the best man for you?

You mean to tell me you "dated" this man while he was living with his girlfriend, and then sent him back hom with his girlfriend and child?

Sounds like you both engaged in selfish behavior and you ACCIDENTLY got pregnant to seal the deal.

Like I stated b4 long story... but I'll entertain...
The Accidently was said as a joke to insinuate that it wasn't planned. I was actually on birth control for 2 years and the pharmacy screwed up my refill and being that I am in a committed relationship I threw caution to the wind and here I'm am pregnant for the first time at 27. I'm sure there are plenty women who've gotten pregnant under worse circumstances.

I declined the engagement because I simply wasn't ready to be married period and wanted to accomplish things as a single person before I made that type of commitment and now 2 years and a lot of accomplishments later I feel as if I'm ready.

And yes I surly did date him. People, generally women, want to believe that when a man leaves a woman he's leaving some poor saint that is home waiting by the window with his dinner and slipper which isn't always the case. Prior to me deciding to date him he explained a situation and told me he was leaving I made a choice to believe him and he indeed left. And the events that followed only reinforced the situation he explained as well as my decision to believe him. Like I said b4 knowing what I know now I would have waited to avoid a lot of the drama but I don't regret a day of being with him, his child, or being pregnant with mine. Sorry if that goes against peoples selective moral code.

And regarding your comment that I got pregnant to seal the deal. If you knew anything that about me or my relationship you'd truly understand how comical that statement is. But people tend to make judgments on things they know nothing about.

 

[SvelteVelvet]

Yep No man is worth getting cut up or shot in the buttocks over.

But they ARE worth going to jail over? UhYeah..

 

[-Volare]

Like I stated b4 long story... but I'll entertain...
The Accidently was said as a joke to insinuate that it wasn't planned. I was actually on birth control for 2 years and the pharmacy screwed up my refill and being that I am in a committed relationship I threw caution to the wind and here I'm am pregnant for the first time at 27. I'm sure there are plenty women who've gotten pregnant under worse circumstances.

I declined the engagement because I simply wasn't ready to be married period and wanted to accomplish things as a single person before I made that type of commitment and now 2 years and a lot of accomplishments later I feel as if I'm ready.

And yes I surly did date him. People, generally women, want to believe that when a man leaves a woman he's leaving some poor saint that is home waiting by the window with his dinner and slipper which isn't always the case. Prior to me deciding to date him he explained a situation and told me he was leaving I made a choice to believe him and he indeed left. And the events that followed only reinforced the situation he explained as well as my decision to believe him. Like I said b4 knowing what I know now I would have waited to avoid a lot of the drama but I don't regret a day of being with him, his child, or being pregnant with mine. Sorry if that goes against peoples selective moral code.

And regarding your comment that I got pregnant to seal the deal. If you knew anything that about me or my relationship you'd truly understand how comical that statement is. But people tend to make judgments on things they know nothing about.

I hope you and your baby are blessed. Your story reminds me of someone very close to me.