Bun Mistress
Well-Known Member
sorry again have to say bad sign. he knows he has no plan, doesn't want to talk about it.
At what age should a man be established?
- Thread starter CarmelCupcake
- Start date
sorry again have to say bad sign. he knows he has no plan, doesn't want to talk about it.
sunnieb
Well-Known Member
The bolded actually makes him look worse. WTH kind of grown man states that he doesn't want to work for anyone else and doesn't have a tangible plan to own his own business?
What was that word Bunny77 used to describe men like this??? Blacktreprenuer?
He's not going on 20, he's going on 30. I know I've stated this before, but ladies please stop taking these sorry a$$ excuses from sorry a$$ men! Of course he treats you well. He knows he won't get another chance to get a woman of your caliber!
You already know what you want to do. Just do it.
chocolat79
Well-Known Member
THIS! OP, you must think of the future. He's a great BF now, but will you resent him as a husband if you're doing all the work and bringing home the bacon while he's STILL talking about a production company? Will he resent YOU for being the breadwinner? This could turn very bad, very quickly for you and they you'll have wasted these years with someone who wasn't going anywhere anyway. Pipe dreams have NEVER paid a bill OR kept a marriage together.
Ask yourself these questions about him:
-If you were unable to work, would he be able to take care of you?
-Does he have a plan? If so, what is it? (If you don't know, ask him.) If not, why not?
-Is he working toward his goal? Ex. He says he wants to own a production company. What does he know about it? Does he hang with the people in the business? Does he have any mentors or contacts in the business? Is he actively trying to pursue it in some way? Has he ever MADE a video or produced anything before?
-Ask him why he chose a production company. The "why" is just as important as the "when". If he says because he can make a lot of money quickly or because of the lifestyle or anything other than related to a complete and utter passion, you may want to think REAL hard about your future with him.
-Can you see yourself being financially stable with this man and have a family?
-Is this his passion? If not, what is?
-Most importantly, what skills does he have?? If he wants to own a production company, he's going to need some creativity AND some knowledge. Does he have either?
-Last question- what is he doing in the meantime while his dream is being realized?
It's okay to want to own a production company if you're taking classes that will help you in the field. Even if he's not going to college FT, is he even taking classes or something in the field? If he's doing odd jobs, it would seem that he could make his schedule, and would be able to go to school, even PT or take some classes in the field.
Odd jobs will not pay the bills for a family, OP. They may pay HIS bills, but if you go into a marriage with someone, odd jobs is not a career or even a steady JOB, for that matter. What does he do for odd jobs? For example, does he hang drywall, do some plumbing or lay bricks or whatever? If so, can he turn any of these odd jobs into a career and have his own company?
IMHO (and I do mean humble), when I hear almost 30 year old men talking about trying to get into the music or movie industry (on any level) and haven't done nary a thing to put themselves in that position, he gets the side-eye. It sounds good that you want to do something to make a lot of money and don't really have to have an "education", so it seems.
Just my two cents. I think you've gotten some great advice already. Good luck, OP!
I hope you make a decision that you're happy with for the long-term, whatever you decide.
Last edited:
HauteHippie
Well-Known Member
I hate to say it, but it sounds like this relationship has passed its expiration date. If a man is working towards a goal and he has a supportive woman, then he wants to share his dreams with the one person (besides his Momma) that believes in them. I can't say with certainty as I'm not there, but it sounds like he doesn't have a plan and that could be why he is defensively not sharing.
HauteHippie
Well-Known Member
Yep, my college (apt) roommate was in his mid thirties when he sold his business and went back to school. We lived like students together, so it's not like he had major money. 6 years later he has his six figure job. So proud of him!
On another note, one of my exes was left at the alter b/c his ex-fiancé didn't think he could provide for her like her father did. Within two years, he pulled a Great Gatsby on her and was living well with his own appreciating assets. Unfortunately, she left him such a mess that he took off almost two years to find himself emotionally/career-wise. He was NOT sitting around and talking during that time. He was formulating a plan and spending time with those he considered to be some of his most intelligent/business savvy professors (UT-Austin). He shadowed some of them for a year and reimmersed himself in entrepreneurial culture. Then he implemented his plan and followed through to success. Good thing he had a solid plan and a product society wanted... this time.
Anyway, both of these men had concrete, well thought out, written down/typed up, plans. It's hard to implement/follow a plan if there is none.
CarmelCupcake
Well-Known Member
Ok guys, so i was talking to him about his plans for the future today, and he was saying that he wants us to get married this upcoming summer. I told him that i think we should hold of on the wedding until he, then i said we, are a little more established. He became really upset. He said that he bet if he were a millionaire, i wouldn't be saying this. I told him that he doesn't have to be making a million dollars, i just want him to be a little more established first. He said that there is another woman out there that will take him like he is.
starfish
Well-Known Member
x2. Word.
Skiggle
Well-Known Member
That in the bold made me feel uncomfortable..
be careful this can be a hint of what might happen in the future.
chicitygirl
Well-Known Member
Ok, get rid of him, for real. You tried to have a reasonable conversation about the future and he got all defensive. He's obviously threatened by the fact that you expect more of him. He's right, he can find a whole bunch of women that will settle for his mediocrity and lack of real ambition and who will take care of him financially. And they'll be a bunch of unhappy suckers. You'll set yourself up for a lifetime of misery dealing with his ego about what you deserve and him not stepping up to the plate financially like a man should. Cut your losses and move on. You can do better!
sunnieb
Well-Known Member
Of course he's "saying" he wants to marry you. He wants to keep you on the hook. What if you fall for this, marry him, and have kids??
erplexedYou'll wake up from this nightmare of a relationship, divorce him, and wind up paying HIM alimony.
Do you realize how much of a catch you are???Do whatever you want to do, but it sounds like you want to stay and work this out with him. Good luck.
UmSumayyah
Well-Known Member
CC he is trying to lock you in and lock you down. Please use 2-3 methods of birth control from now on. You can use the pill, spermicide and a condom concurrently. Sorry to get all personal, but for real.
I’m not sure a specific age can be cited as to when a man should be established. Lots of people are late bloomers, and it takes time for people to figure out what they want from life and how they are going to get it. Morgan Freeman, Ving Raimes, dude from that movie with Tom Hanks, Samuel L Jackson, JK Rowling all got their success later in life, so I don’t think that just because someone is 30 and doesn’t have x car, x degree, x cash in the bank that they aren’t worth your time.
It sounds like you have a good man, who just hasn’t figured things out yet. My concern really is that when you talk to him about his plans for the future he gets upset. I can kinda understand, I suppose from his perspective you are telling him he’s not good enough for you and this probably brings out some latent insecurities he has.
I think you need to try and speak to him again in a calm and rational manner. If it helps, write him a letter, pour out all your hopes and fears and assure him you will work with him towards his goals. That’s assuming you really want to be with him. I understand why you don’t want to let him go, but don’t stay with him because you are scared you won’t find someone else or miss out on being with a potential multi millionaire. You seem like a great catch, if this isn't the man for you, then there are plenty more in the sea who will treat you good. If you feel he is the love of your life, then work with him to support his dreams, just as I hope he would do with you. If he can’t meet you half way, then I think it’s time to say goodbye to this relationship and focus on being a better you.
Whatevet you decide, good luck.
BTW - have you discussed this with any of your friends/family in real life
It sounds like you have a good man, who just hasn’t figured things out yet. My concern really is that when you talk to him about his plans for the future he gets upset. I can kinda understand, I suppose from his perspective you are telling him he’s not good enough for you and this probably brings out some latent insecurities he has.
I think you need to try and speak to him again in a calm and rational manner. If it helps, write him a letter, pour out all your hopes and fears and assure him you will work with him towards his goals. That’s assuming you really want to be with him. I understand why you don’t want to let him go, but don’t stay with him because you are scared you won’t find someone else or miss out on being with a potential multi millionaire. You seem like a great catch, if this isn't the man for you, then there are plenty more in the sea who will treat you good. If you feel he is the love of your life, then work with him to support his dreams, just as I hope he would do with you. If he can’t meet you half way, then I think it’s time to say goodbye to this relationship and focus on being a better you.
Whatevet you decide, good luck.
BTW - have you discussed this with any of your friends/family in real life
MiamiHottie
Well-Known Member
OP, I was in your situation before. My ex dropped out of college our sophomore year in 2003 to pursue "Real Estate". He too was working odd jobs in the mean time. His ultimate plan sounded great but there was a disconnect from how he was going to get there. I am a very practical person. Whenever we sat down to talk about his "plan" every new years, birthday etc, we ended up arguing. I was looking for concrete steps and time line of when he was going to do things. He spent a lot of time going to conferences, seminars and reading books in borders etc. My suggestion of getting a job at a commercial real estate company and actually getting a real estate license was absurd to him. Since then I graduated and have almost completed my graduate degree. I left him in 09. I didn't believe his dream anymore. People always cite example of other people who have made it but they are the exception, not the rule.
ThatJerseyGirl
Well-Known Member
You know when you hang with a dumb person for a long time that the condition can get contagious. In other words, you'll start acting and sounding just like them and unlike the flu, there is no vaccine for it.
Good luck with whatever you do.
luckiestdestiny
Well-Known Member
You've hit the nail on the head. When you're looking for a husband certain qualities should be in place period. Because you're going to have to rely on him and have children with him. He doesn't want to 1) discuss his plans because you should believe in him coupled with 2) His inability to work a steady job and also 3) Floundering at 30 = disaster.
How can you count on this man in a marriage. He was a nice, fun distraction, but he's not husband material. And living in "what if" doesn't help..."what if he changes?" Do you know how many people live in what if land and never get out of it? I agree it's time to let him go especially if he has no intentions of discussing concrete plans and does not appear to show (actions speak louder than words) those plans by putting them into actions.
luckiestdestiny
Well-Known Member
I'd like to add that some people stick to relationships because they are good in some ways (but not in the ways that matter), and they hang in there because he's not horrible. BUT really there is a time when things end, and it's okay to end a relationship that isn't down in the pits in every way when it doesn't match your goals and dreams. He's not a match for your life (as you want it to be) so it's time to say goodbye. Not everything has to dissolve into a horrible screaming match relationship before you let go of it. Just because it's good or okay doesn't mean it's great. Good luck to you because I realize this is really a hard situation for you and must be weighing on your heart. I wish you great things in this New Year.
luckiestdestiny
Well-Known Member
Here's the thing though, Samuel L Jackson and J K Rowlings both had plans. Samuel L Jackson was a working, struggling actor waiting for a break auditioning his butt off and waiting in the sidelines (another good ex of that is Morgan Freeman) and some people struggle forever in these types of careers (as they are creative like mine) and never make it.
Samuel L Jackson said he was about to leave acting, on his last audition when he got the role that changed his life. Because he didn't want to sit around broke. So he did have a back up plan too.
This guy is completely clueless.
I met my ex when I was 19. He was 22. I was on track to finish my BA by the time I was 21. He was in a community college for nursing. He didn't do with that. In the mean time, he had just gotten into the ministry. To make a long story short, he switched majors in cc and decided to get an Associate's degree in the humanities and go to seminary. We stayed together, because I saw that he had potential. He was intelligent and he had recorded a Christian album.
I was a little scared, because he was still struggling A LOT. He was also still having difficulty in school. He had no concrete plans besides telling everyone about Christ. I was a Christian, but so many of his friends were saying similar things and getting EVICTED out of their homes. Their wives were looking "tow up," and his counterparts claimed that they were suffering for Christ. We argued a bit, and I said "XYZ, that ain't suffering for Christ. That's not paying your rent/mortgage..." To make a long story short, during our three years together. I went back and forth about being with him in my mind. After all, birds of a feather flock together, right?
Well, one day, we were having a conversation about a problem he was having in the ministry. I suggested that he change his presentation style a bit. He went off. Now, by the this time, I had decided that HE WAS THE ONE. He broke up with me.
Now, fast forward, about five years later. He earned his associate's and bachelor's. He is an assistant pastor and he works a small job. My ex does not make a lot of money, but he is married and moving up quickly in the world.
As I grow wiser, I realize that I would be divorced now if we had married, because I was too immature for marriage. At the same time, you really need to seek God for the best course for your life. BTW, my ex also told me something similar about him getting someone who recognize that he was a great catch. He even went further and talked about women with degrees and careers being "a dime a dozen." That never rubbed me the right way, actually...It's one thing to know your worth, but...Anyway, seek God ASAP.
I was a little scared, because he was still struggling A LOT. He was also still having difficulty in school. He had no concrete plans besides telling everyone about Christ. I was a Christian, but so many of his friends were saying similar things and getting EVICTED out of their homes. Their wives were looking "tow up," and his counterparts claimed that they were suffering for Christ. We argued a bit, and I said "XYZ, that ain't suffering for Christ. That's not paying your rent/mortgage..." To make a long story short, during our three years together. I went back and forth about being with him in my mind. After all, birds of a feather flock together, right?
Well, one day, we were having a conversation about a problem he was having in the ministry. I suggested that he change his presentation style a bit. He went off. Now, by the this time, I had decided that HE WAS THE ONE. He broke up with me.
Now, fast forward, about five years later. He earned his associate's and bachelor's. He is an assistant pastor and he works a small job. My ex does not make a lot of money, but he is married and moving up quickly in the world.
As I grow wiser, I realize that I would be divorced now if we had married, because I was too immature for marriage. At the same time, you really need to seek God for the best course for your life. BTW, my ex also told me something similar about him getting someone who recognize that he was a great catch. He even went further and talked about women with degrees and careers being "a dime a dozen." That never rubbed me the right way, actually...It's one thing to know your worth, but...Anyway, seek God ASAP.
But this guy does have plans, he just hasn't put pen to paper to figure out how. Not everyone has a concrete idea of who they want to be and how they are going to go about doing it. Sometimes it takes a guiding hand to help a person to become a better person, which is why I suggested that OP can help him, if she really wants to be with him.
And re the example of Samuel and others, a lot of women on this board would not have stuck around because they he didn't have his ish together. It would have been very easy to see Samuel as another dude with a pipe dream.
luckiestdestiny
Well-Known Member
I understand where you're coming from but I still think oh well. This whole staying with someone because what if...doesn't bode well with me. You stay because you're secure, you stay because you feel comfortable, you stay because you wouldn't have it any other way. You stay because you feel confident in your relationship, and partnership as a couple. And you marry because you mesh well in ways that are important from ethics, to beliefs about life, levels of ambition, and other things that are on your "must list", as well as things like agreeing on how you raise children, and just plain being confident in your man enough to know he'll be a good father and husband and that you're already starting out on a good (non doubtful) foot.
For those who left Sam, whose to say whether their life would be better or not. His money says nothing about his character, or anything. I recall reading someonewhere that he had a ton of issues including drug troubles, etc so I'd be like good riddens to that anyways lol! I know that's off the subject but...really I don't think she should wait on a lottery ticket because of fear of "what if he's a winner (down the line)?... So why stay? I think stay 1) if you believe in him 2)if you believe he has ambition and is going to find a way to make things happen because he's going to need it just to raise a family...what happens when you have a problem? Is he going to wax poetic or find a way to solve it? Or should you do everything for him? 3) Stay if he has plans, or is in the process of evolving plans 4) Stay if you're okay with those plans. If those plans don't mesh with what she wants then that's a deal breaker. Money does not solve ethical dilemmas for instance.
Only toss that lottery ticket if she's willing to be okay with the consequences of if she loses. I use that analogy because some one will win...it's just a matter of crossing the fingers. But it may not be her man.
In the case of old boy though, it's not like he's coming to her for help, or seeking help elsewhere to formulate his plans...and when she brings it up, he's resistant.
So really I'm thinking he doesn't really want to do anything (it's all talk). Because what kinda guy starts asking about marriage when you're trying to tell him you're worried about where he's headed? What kind of sense does that make? If he really wanted to show that he's husband material he would've said, "You're right. Let's talk about how I can take some steps. I have no idea...maybe I should do some research...can you help me. Then maybe after I start laying some ground work we can get married. I'd like that if you want to." Instead it's more like
Her: hey hun we need to talk about where you're headed I'm worried about your future and as a consequence ours.
Him: Marry me.
Her: Huh?
Him:Marry me.
Her: Uhm...I think we should work on having direction first--
Him: You'd marry me if I were a millionaire!
Her: What?
Him: Another woman would take me just as I am.
Okay I wasn't there but that's basically how my brain sums up the interaction...but you get the point. Not only is he unsure of himself but he's deluded. Does he really think marriage will solve everything? Yeah this whole save a man thing and carry him over the finish line I'm not down with. NOW if he wanted to save himself, and needed help getting there that's one thing. But I don't think he's going anytime soon.
Meanwhile I think it's up to her to decide if he's the one for her.
And I don't recall the name of the other poster who mentioned the preacher but the guy was 22. Even if he took four years, he was 26 no biggie and he was in school (switching majors happens often at least he was searching for where he wanted to go and he was relatively young) and eventually had an idea of what he wanted to do...and was making steps to make it happen. This guy seems lost. He's not in school. He's not working a steady job. He's talking lofty and wanting to lock down someone without a clue as to how to pull his share in the relationship, nor does he want to talk about it. It's not like he said, "I'm in school for business" or "I'm going to intern at Sony and work my way up like pdiddy" or whatever. Or even "I need help! I need some guidance, I'm going to find it". No instead he does odd jobs, and gets mad when things are brought up.
I feel sorry for him, but I'd feel worse if she married him, resented him, and had to divorce. And yes this fairytale could work out....I'm sure it's possible and I think that's what she has to be willing to decide. Will she wait around for a miracle, or not.
And I also think she has to be willing to walk and not regret her decision even if he becomes the next pdiddy! Like oh well he wasn't ready for me when I was ready for him, we were on different tracks. And I'm fine now and I'm with a man who was ready when I was ready (or willing to get ready).
Last edited:
vevster
Well-Known Member
Oh come on.... can you say PIPEDREAM?
JUST read thread... boy these black guys just think they can come with empty pockets... Jee.....
Drop that loser....
When he started talking marriage I would get down to numbers..
I would say I don't want to marry someone who has no money in the bank and doesn't make a certain level of consistent income.
OP is so cute; are there really no decent men out there?
Last edited:
HauteHippie
Well-Known Member
In 2 years , though! He should put pen to paper or fingers to keyboard at least once. The least he could do is communicate effectively without being defensive (or coming back later after being defensive and then talking).
LivingDol1
Well-Known Member
umm... 30.
i know that 30s might be the new 20s these days with people getting higher degrees and the economy is sucking so people go back to live with their parents after college... but.... no. certain things aren't tolerable (in my opinion).
i graduated from college on time, days before my 22nd birthday. never moved back home. had a full time job by July of that year and have been doing my thing ever since.
so for me, if a guy is 30, he needs to not just have a job but a career... with health benefits. he should be living away from home. having a roommate is very questionable but maybe acceptable only if the house or apartment is large enough.
and a decent credit score as well.
no waiters. no actors. no musicians. no bartenders. none of that unless you are sitting on a trust fund and even that isn't good enough because who wants to date some guy who is sitting on a pile of $$ just burning it away with no aspiration?!!
i know that 30s might be the new 20s these days with people getting higher degrees and the economy is sucking so people go back to live with their parents after college... but.... no. certain things aren't tolerable (in my opinion).
i graduated from college on time, days before my 22nd birthday. never moved back home. had a full time job by July of that year and have been doing my thing ever since.
so for me, if a guy is 30, he needs to not just have a job but a career... with health benefits. he should be living away from home. having a roommate is very questionable but maybe acceptable only if the house or apartment is large enough.
and a decent credit score as well.
no waiters. no actors. no musicians. no bartenders. none of that unless you are sitting on a trust fund and even that isn't good enough because who wants to date some guy who is sitting on a pile of $$ just burning it away with no aspiration?!!
vevster
Well-Known Member
Errah, I'll take the trust fund.... I'm not attracted to flighty guys....
MzLady78
Well-Known Member
Ok, he's not a millionaire so his "point" is moot.
@ the bolded, I'm sure there is and if I were you I'd let him go find her. You, my dear, can do better. It sounds to me like you can't even have a real conversation with this dude without him being extra, the part that I bolded would have me ready to go upside his head.
InchHighPrivateEye
Well-Known Member
Okay, so many posters have made good points that I wasn't going to comment, but I want to add my 2 cents.
Your boyfriend is right, some woman will love him for who he is, poor thing, but you deserve the best. 30 is relatively young in the span of a lifetime, but at 30 a person is who they are going to be. I am not normally one to encourage someone to break up with an SO, but your story sounds very familiar, and therefore, I know from experience that everyone's advice is spot on.
And in regards to his dream. It's not that it's silly, it's just that this is real life, so he has to pursue that while making a way for himself and a family to live. I have an artistic background and an artistic dream as well, but I managed to pursue a skill and a career that can support myself. I would expect no less from a grown a** man trying to take on a girlfriend and/or family.
Good luck to you OP, and don't be afraid to look out for yourself.
Your boyfriend is right, some woman will love him for who he is, poor thing, but you deserve the best. 30 is relatively young in the span of a lifetime, but at 30 a person is who they are going to be. I am not normally one to encourage someone to break up with an SO, but your story sounds very familiar, and therefore, I know from experience that everyone's advice is spot on.
And in regards to his dream. It's not that it's silly, it's just that this is real life, so he has to pursue that while making a way for himself and a family to live. I have an artistic background and an artistic dream as well, but I managed to pursue a skill and a career that can support myself. I would expect no less from a grown a** man trying to take on a girlfriend and/or family.
Good luck to you OP, and don't be afraid to look out for yourself.
Last edited:
Similar threads
