Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear

[Jhuidah]

This is an interesting read. I don't know if I have the fortitude to withstand something like this.

I commend her for not letting her ego get in the way--I know if my husband told me “I don’t love you anymore. I’m not sure I ever did", the first thing that would jump up is my ego. I would want to protect myself from being hurt any further. Chances are, my initial gut reaction would be, "Well, leave then. Don't let me keep you."

I'm not certain I would be able to fight for very long under the strain he put her through. Especially with children there, having to answer questions about daddy not being there for family events, not coming home from work every night like her used to, etc.

My main issue with this essay is her likening her husband's insistence of not being in love anymore and wanting to hurt her with that idea to a child's tantrum. Last I checked, a 3 year old and a 40 year old have different sensibilities, different ways of handling things. It's one thing to understand that your husband is having some issues he needs to work through...it's quite another to insist that it's not about you, it's all him. What if some of it is you? What if some of his issues stem from something you did or didn't do in the marriage?

As a married woman, what I got from this article was to keep in mind that sometimes my ego has to go out the window if I am to be in a relationship with another adult. I'm not certain if that's a lesson that the author learned.

Her situation is her situation. While her idealism is noble, this advice will not work for everyone. I hope she got some counseling or did some self-analysis while her husband was going through it.

 

[aribell]

My main issue with this essay is her likening her husband's insistence of not being in love anymore and wanting to hurt her with that idea to a child's tantrum. Last I checked, a 3 year old and a 40 year old have different sensibilities, different ways of handling things. It's one thing to understand that your husband is having some issues he needs to work through...it's quite another to insist that it's not about you, it's all him. What if some of it is you? What if some of his issues stem from something you did or didn't do in the marriage?

The bolded is the one hesitation I had about her story. I understand her saying "I don't buy it," given that apparently he had loved her well enough in the years leading up to that point. And that doesn't just go out the window. But she didn't say much about her needing to change anything. I'm not sure whether that was because her intuitions were right and it really was all about him, or because she didn't actually do any self-reflection, or if she just left that part out.

But in either instance, it wasn't as if he was saying "I'm going to leave unless you change x, y, or z." The way he stated it, her changes were an excuse for him to abandon the marriage/family.

 

[JFemme]

Interesting, this could not have been me If the tables were turned would the husband have done the same thing? This man was extremely selfish IMO. I could not look at a man the same way after the he treated me like he treated her. What about the next crisis he has? IMO she gave him permission to treat her and his family this way in the future.

In the vast majority of cases, I do not believe he would...

I'm glad some-ONE picked up on that fact....

 

[jada1111]

I'm glad it worked for her. I couldn't do it.

Yeah, I wouldn't be the "root" of his problem, but I wouldn't be able to tolerate the disrespect.

I can definitely see him pulling this crap again though.

 

[JFemme]

This happens to women as well, ladies...(not a male affliction by any means)

What are YOU gonna do when your crisis, midlife or otherwise rears its head..

That's the thousand dollar question.... fo' sho..

 

[JFemme]

I never looked. Is it a bunch of debbie downer stuff?

Nope, they were quite complimentary... (as commenters, go)

 

[MD_Lady]

I respect the heck out of this woman and I'm glad her approach worked in her situation. One of the lost messages in this story is that people have to chart their own courses in working on their marriages. This woman knew herself, her husband, her situation, and did what worked for her (and far too many people talk to everyone but their spouse about their marriages). I think a lot people can learn from her underlying approach: assess your situation and avoid knee-jerk responses.

My approach would have been different because, for me, patiently waiting for someone to cycle through their own selfishness isn't always the best option (again, IMO). I also have a side (and enduring) issue with the fact that "for better or for worse" applies to women while "for better" applies to men. I've had to deal with a lot of "for worse" with my husband in the short time we've been married. Side stepping all of that would be one of the most profoundly disrespectful things he could do to me (midlife crisis be darned). I also can't help but wonder if all the men (in the responses) who think this is such a great idea would be so quick to take this approach with their wives.

 

[MD_Lady]

I never looked. Is it a bunch of debbie downer stuff?

It's a mix. Most of the people who disagreed with her approach did so without being disrespectful. The people who agreed with her approach absolutely raved about it.

 

[JFemme]

I respect the heck out of this woman and I'm glad her approach worked in her situation. One of the lost messages in this story is that people have to chart their own courses in working on their marriages. This woman knew herself, her husband, her situation, and did what worked for her (and far too many people talk to everyone but their spouse about their marriages). I think a lot people can learn from her underlying approach: assess your situation and avoid knee-jerk responses.

My approach would have been different because, for me, patiently waiting for someone to cycle through their own selfishness isn't always the best option (again, IMO). I also have a side (and enduring) issue with the fact that "for better or for worse" applies to women while "for better" applies to men. I've had to deal with a lot of "for worse" with my husband in the short time we've been married. Side stepping all of that would be one of the most profoundly disrespectful things he could do to me (midlife crisis be darned). I also can't help but wonder if all the men (in the responses) who think this is such a great idea would be so quick to take this approach with their wives.

Quite an eye opener is it not...

 

[tiara76]

for me I personally believe its women who are going to be the ones to have to rise up first and lift men up....its rare the man is going to be able to step up to the plate, esp in a strong emotional state of self and well being and be able to be the ones to do anything close to what she did to bring a relationship to a new level...relationships that are long lasting and HAPPY are relationships that withstand and go with the flow of change vs resist change or let their emotions, baggage and insecurities dictate their behavior vs their heart...the heart knows what is really going on....and she knew her boundaries and what she was willing to give...I would never suggest "wait" forever for somebody to figure themselves out and her giving herself six months was her setting her limit of when she told her self she would let it go and move on.....her heart was guiding her thru the whole experience even when she got emotional over it and she learned to separate and release her emotions from the true feeling she felt in her heart

everybody's situations and relationships are different....this could easily have been a relationship where she stayed 20 years too long with the guy and just ignored her heart tellin her this isn't it and there would be no need to even question it or see if it will change just be like...Im out , be blessed

 

[JFemme]

for me I personally believe its women who are going to be the ones to have to rise up first and lift men up....its rare the man is going to be able to step up to the plate, esp in a strong emotional state of self and well being and be able to be the ones to do anything close to what she did to bring a relationship to a new level...relationships that are long lasting and HAPPY are relationships that withstand and go with the flow of change vs resist change or let their emotions, baggage and insecurities dictate their behavior vs their heart...the heart knows what is really going on....and she knew her boundaries and what she was willing to give...I would never suggest "wait" forever for somebody to figure themselves out and her giving herself six months was her setting her limit of when she told her self she would let it go and move on.....her heart was guiding her thru the whole experience even when she got emotional over it and she learned to separate and release her emotions from the true feeling she felt in her heart

everybody's situations and relationships are different....this could easily have been a relationship where she stayed 20 years too long with the guy and just ignored her heart tellin her this isn't it and there would be no need to even question it or see if it will change just be like...Im out , be blessed

Excellent point, Tiara ...ITA !!!

 

[hopeful]

for me I personally believe its women who are going to be the ones to have to rise up first and lift men up....its rare the man is going to be able to step up to the plate, esp in a strong emotional state of self and well being and be able to be the ones to do anything close to what she did to bring a relationship to a new level...

ITA, that is what I have seen. Women have to be really strong. If a man loves you, he will follow you to the end of the earth and do just about anything you ask within reason. It is in their nature to please us and take care of us, but we have to know exactly what we want and stay firm. You have to be very strong emotionally and spiritually.

Now if dude is a jerk or doesn't really love you...he ain't following you anywhere.

ETA: I would like to say that I don't personally think that what she did was the right thing or wrong thing in general. It was the right thing for her. Me, the right thing would have been to kick him out or the kids and I woulda been gone for awhile to a cute condo or apartment and carried on with our lives till he got himself together and he would have had to apologize to me in so many ways. The thing is YOU have to find your strength as a wife and do what your heart and your God leads you to do.

ETA2: And this is why I don't have a problem with a man carrying the financial load sometimes or doing the heavy lifting in other areas because the wife often does some very heavy lifting with regard to her marriage, her family, the children, her family's activities, the home environment, in-laws, etc. etc.

 

[tiara76]

Excellent point, Tiara ...ITA !!!

one of the reasons why I focus so much on helping myself and other women become emotionally, mentally, sexually, spiritually and physically healthy is because at the critical point we are in of self destruction of selves, families, relationships and families...divine feminine energy is going to have to be harnessed and expressed outwards to bring the masculine energy back down and into a balance...and mostly women are the representatives of this energy...men reject it in themselves and they reject the energy as a collective so unless men start embracing their own feminine sides on their own to come to healthy emotional states vs ego fear based states... maaaan alot of relationships where we women are expecting men to do "better" or the men to "change" are gonna leave alot of people upset and disappointed and feeling even more jacked up than they do already.....very few people are at levels of true unconditional loving and men are more resistent to getting to these levels than women are..the faster women get to it the faster men will be able to feel it and start to be affected by it positively instead of trying to get women to play down into their energy

alot of us do a good job at holding onto hurt, loathing ourselves, rejecting ourselves and others, holding onto our pride at all costs, being frustrated without ever trying to understand ourselves or another...all sorts of things that keep people going thru relationships trials and tribulations and keep repeating them over and over and blaming it on others

sometimes those we percieve to be the weakest are the strongest of us....
it's easy to be brought down to negative energy levels and respond to it negatively, very hard to rise above it and still show love without taking the actions of another in a negative energy personal and not reject them for being in that state

the true test of a loving person isn't how easy they can love somebody who is acting lovable, but how much can they love somebody who isn't

 

[tiara76]

ITA, that is what I have seen. Women have to be really strong. If a man loves you, he will follow you to the end of the earth and do just about anything you ask within reason. It is in their nature to please us and take care of us, but we have to know exactly what we want and stay firm. You have to be very strong emotionally and spiritually.

Now if dude is a jerk or doesn't really love you...he ain't following you anywhere.

ETA: I would like to say that I don't personally think that what she did was the right thing or wrong thing in general. It was the right thing for her. Me, the right thing would have been to kick him out or the kids and I woulda been gone for awhile to a cute condo or apartment and carried on with our lives till he got himself together and he would have had to apologized to me in so many ways. The thing is YOU have to find your strength as a wife and do what your heart and your God leads you to do.

I agree and you know in your heart what your man is feeling for you regardless of his outside actions...
We overvalue what we perceive with our physical senses and undervalue what we know to be true in our hearts...Love is the intuitive knowledge of our hearts

 

[MD_Lady]

for me I personally believe its women who are going to be the ones to have to rise up first and lift men up....its rare the man is going to be able to step up to the plate, esp in a strong emotional state of self and well being and be able to be the ones to do anything close to what she did to bring a relationship to a new level...relationships that are long lasting and HAPPY are relationships that withstand and go with the flow of change vs resist change or let their emotions, baggage and insecurities dictate their behavior vs their heart...the heart knows what is really going on....and she knew her boundaries and what she was willing to give...I would never suggest "wait" forever for somebody to figure themselves out and her giving herself six months was her setting her limit of when she told her self she would let it go and move on.....her heart was guiding her thru the whole experience even when she got emotional over it and she learned to separate and release her emotions from the true feeling she felt in her heart

everybody's situations and relationships are different....this could easily have been a relationship where she stayed 20 years too long with the guy and just ignored her heart tellin her this isn't it and there would be no need to even question it or see if it will change just be like...Im out , be blessed

I respect your POV, but IMO, people do what is expected of them. Women take this role because that's what we expect of ourselves and what men, in turn, expect from us. Men don't do this because they don't have to. The woman is the one who is expected to place mind over matter while the man is given a pass to be human. I agree 100% with your recipe for a happy and lasting relationship, but the general belief (explicitly stated and implied- and I'm not saying you feel this way) that this is (the proverbial) her responsibility not (the proverbial) our responsibility doesn't sit right with me.

 

[amara11]

Sometimes those we percieve to be the weakest are the strongest of us....
it's easy to be brought down to negative energy levels and respond to it negatively, very hard to rise above it and still show love without taking the actions of another in a negative energy personal and not reject them for being in that state

the true test of a loving person isn't how easy they can love somebody who is acting lovable, but how much can they love somebody who isn't

I agree and you know in your heart what your man is feeling for you regardless of his outside actions...
We overvalue what we perceive with our physical senses and undervalue what we know to be true in our hearts...Love is the intuitive knowledge of our hearts

ETA2: And this is why I don't have a problem with a man carrying the financial load sometimes or doing the heavy lifting in other areas because the wife often does some very heavy lifting with regard to her marriage, her family, the children, her family's activities, the home environment, in-laws, etc. etc.

These are gems

 

[jada1111]

Interesting, this could not have been me If the tables were turned would the husband have done the same thing? This man was extremely selfish IMO. I could not look at a man the same way after the he treated me like he treated her. What about the next crisis he has? IMO she gave him permission to treat her and his family this way in the future.

ITA to your entire post, but especially the bolded. IMO he didn't EARN his way back into her life like he should have.

He called her names, came home when he wanted and didn't even apologize. It was like nothing happened.

No, I'm not this "strong" at all nor do I want to be. Not going to have my kids (daughters especially) thinking it's alright for their bfs or husbands to treat them messed up because of his "issues".

 

[tiara76]

I respect your POV, but IMO, people do what is expected of them. Women take this role because that's what we expect of ourselves and what men, in turn, expect from us. Men don't do this because they don't have to. The woman is the one who is expected to place mind over matter while the man is given a pass to be human. I agree 100% with your recipe for a happy and lasting relationship, but the general belief (explicitly stated and implied- and I'm not saying you feel this way) that this is (the proverbial) her responsibility not (the proverbial) our responsibility doesn't sit right with me.

Its all good mama..I respect yours as well

rising to other levels is realizing we are way more than human beings

 

[JFemme]

one of the reasons why I focus so much on helping myself and other women become emotionally, mentally, sexually, spiritually and physically healthy is because at the critical point we are in of self destruction of selves, families, relationships and families...divine feminine energy is going to have to be harnessed and expressed outwards to bring the masculine energy back down and into a balance...and mostly women are the representatives of this energy...men reject it in themselves and they reject the energy as a collective so unless men start embracing their own feminine sides on their own to come to healthy emotional states vs ego fear based states... maaaan alot of relationships where we women are expecting men to do "better" or the men to "change" are gonna leave alot of people upset and disappointed and feeling even more jacked up than they do already.....very few people are at levels of true unconditional loving and men are more resistent to getting to these levels than women are..the faster women get to it the faster men will be able to feel it and start to be affected by it positively instead of trying to get women to play down into their energy

alot of us do a good job at holding onto hurt, loathing ourselves, rejecting ourselves and others, holding onto our pride at all costs, being frustrated without ever trying to understand ourselves or another...all sorts of things that keep people going thru relationships trials and tribulations and keep repeating them over and over and blaming it on others

sometimes those we percieve to b e the weakest are the strongest of us....
it's easy to be brought down to negative energy levels and respond to it negatively, very hard to rise above it and still show love without taking the actions of another in a negative energy personal and not reject them for being in that state

the true test of a loving person isn't how easy they can love somebody who is acting lovable, but how much can they love somebody who isn't

More gems....



And we wonder- postulate why the divorce rate is so high...

 

[MyHeavenlyFatherKnows]

Wow. Love it. She honored that commitment and she was wise enough to understand that it's not all about her--it stopped being all about her when she decided to marry a man who could never be perfect--she loved him through his faults. Amazing. That pain had to be unbearable at times. Wow. "Happily ever after" ain't easy and requires more than a pretty dress and a dashing groom--you have to adapt.

 

[CarLiTa]

ITA to your entire post, but especially the bolded. IMO he didn't EARN his way back into her life like he should have.

He called her names, came home when he wanted and didn't even apologize. It was like nothing happened.

No, I'm not this "strong" at all nor do I want to be. Not going to have my kids (daughters especially) thinking it's alright for their bfs or husbands to treat them messed up because of his "issues".

I disagree. At least it's not what I got from her account.

A man who comes home and says he is thankful for his family when he wanted to abandon them sounds to me like a man who is repentent, who has realized how great of a thing he would have voluntarily lost... and all this without having anyone drill it into his head.

She said she planned a summer of fun for the kids and for herself... that was strategy there. Not crying, yelling, but maybe bringing back the sweetness of family life which might have been lost for a while prior to him telling her "I don't love you anymore."

I also think it depends on what kind of man one has, and this woman seemed to know her husband, so that approach worked for her. She seemed to have been observant enough to realize that he was going through a lot of hard times and had been for a while... so the mid-life crisis had some precedent.

And maybe he was of the character to find a scapegoat for his issues, and at that point in his life, he chose the family as that scapegoat. I applaud her for rising her family above his blames and making him realize "no, buddy, what you're dealing with are YOUR problems, don't turn them against us." She showed him, without telling him, that the family could survive without him, and ultimately he probably realized that he couldn't be without them.

 

[LisaLisa1908]

Excellent discussion ladies!

Wow. She is better than me. But that's the thing - when you marry someone, it is for better or for worse. This situation would be a "worse."

And let's be honest - he was looking for PERMISSION to leave. You see he didn't. She set her terms and lived her life with her kids. I think that's honorable. And again, this is THESE PEOPLE'S MARRIAGE. Time will bear their choices out.

 

[amara11]

I think in general, this issue is easily confused with the countless examples of women who stick it out through thick and thin, regardless of foolishness. They endure all types of ridiculous behavior and stand by their man without any question.

But to me, that's not strength- it's more of a fear of standing alone, and a lack of willingness to be introspective enough to realize self-worth, compare that to personal investments into the relationship, and recognize that ROI is not yielding an wealthy relationship (emotionally, physically, mentally, etc).

The key with this story is the context. Some questioned her lack of introspection- but I contest that. It takes exactly that to dig deep enough to pull this strength out to endure for the family. The better portion of the article was a testament to her introspective process during that period in her life.

Also- this wasn't a situational issue her husband had with her. He didn't say you work too much, we don't have sex anymore, we fight too much, etc (in which instances, her saying "I don't believe you" would be arrogant/immature). He said- I don't love you anymore- very vague and all encompassing. Asking "what did I do wrong" in response to such a broad statement would be digging a hole for insecurity to breed.

And in terms of her using the tantrum example, I do liken that to a kid saying "I hate you" if their mom grounds them or won't let them have something they want. Was the kid wrong, hurtful, disrespectful? Absolutely! But the mother knows that this is something her child will have to get over, and that she is not a bad mother because the child didn't get what he or she wanted. Digging for her own personal fault in a situation like that (which I think is somewhat analogous to the author's sitch) would demonstrate a lack of understanding of the nature of children-- and how they respond when life doesn't go their way.

The same way digging for her own fault in her husband's midlife crisis would demonstrate a lack of understanding of the nature of men- and how they respond when the standard that affirms their manhood (their ability to provide for their families, build wealth) is threatened.

I just don't see this as analogous to women who habitually endure abuse or destructive relationship woes for men who would not do the same in return. Sure she could have decided on 3 months instead of 6, or to give him a piece of her mind instead of remaining stoic, but she did it her way- based on their rlp (the same way a mom with a tantrum throwing child could either spank, or scold, or ground, depending on the nature of the parent-child rlp). The point is, she made the decision- based on her own understanding of both herself and her husband- to sustain her marriage.

 

[amara11]

I disagree. At least it's not what I got from her account.

A man who comes home and says he is thankful for his family when he wanted to abandon them sounds to me like a man who is repentent, who has realized how great of a thing he would have voluntarily lost... and all this without having anyone drill it into his head.

She said she planned a summer of fun for the kids and for herself... that was strategy there. Not crying, yelling, but maybe bringing back the sweetness of family life which might have been lost for a while prior to him telling her "I don't love you anymore."

I also think it depends on what kind of man one has, and this woman seemed to know her husband, so that approach worked for her. She seemed to have been observant enough to realize that he was going through a lot of hard times and had been for a while... so the mid-life crisis had some precedent.

And maybe he was of the character to find a scapegoat for his issues, and at that point in his life, he chose the family as that scapegoat. I applaud her for rising her family above his blames and making him realize "no, buddy, what you're dealing with are YOUR problems, don't turn them against us." She showed him, without telling him, that the family could survive without him, and ultimately he probably realized that he couldn't be without them.

ITA- esp bold. The bold is the context that frames this entire picture.

Excellent discussion ladies!

Wow. She is better than me. But that's the thing - when you marry someone, it is for better or for worse. This situation would be a "worse."

And let's be honest - he was looking for PERMISSION to leave. You see he didn't. She set her terms and lived her life with her kids. I think that's honorable. And again, this is THESE PEOPLE'S MARRIAGE. Time will bear their choices out.

Great post.
The bold is so very true. The door was always open for him to leave. He didn't take it.

 

[jada1111]

I disagree. At least it's not what I got from her account.

A man who comes home and says he is thankful for his family when he wanted to abandon them sounds to me like a man who is repentent, who has realized how great of a thing he would have voluntarily lost... and all this without having anyone drill it into his head.

She said she planned a summer of fun for the kids and for herself... that was strategy there. Not crying, yelling, but maybe bringing back the sweetness of family life which might have been lost for a while prior to him telling her "I don't love you anymore."

I also think it depends on what kind of man one has, and this woman seemed to know her husband, so that approach worked for her. She seemed to have been observant enough to realize that he was going through a lot of hard times and had been for a while... so the mid-life crisis had some precedent.

And maybe he was of the character to find a scapegoat for his issues, and at that point in his life, he chose the family as that scapegoat. I applaud her for rising her family above his blames and making him realize "no, buddy, what you're dealing with are YOUR problems, don't turn them against us." She showed him, without telling him, that the family could survive without him, and ultimately he probably realized that he couldn't be without them.

Like I said, I'm glad it worked out for HER, but this is something I could never tolerate.

She went thru this for six months. I'd be damned if I'd go thru it for SIX DAYS. He would have to pack and "think" things over somewhere else, not in my home. He's not going to be disrespecting me or our kids, because of his emotional issues. Coming and going as you please, ignoring family events, etc., - NO, "I" could not deal with this. I guess I'm "weak" and if so, then so be it. Rather be weak than having to spend time in jail cause somebody wants to play me for a sucka in my own home.

Excepting the type of disrespect she went through takes great patience, which most women don't have, especially if they have children and are going through their own "issues".

I'm sorry, but I believe she blocked out what he said, because she couldn't mentally/emotionally handle it. I mean he really didn't have a reason to leave, because she wasn't giving him any *ish about his comings and goings or plans. She let him do what he wanted for as long as he wanted until he got bored or the other chick dumped him. She played the good, long suffering wife to the hilt and it paid off.

I honestly believe he could have continued his disrespect for years just as long as he was still living in the house to play the "family" role she had set up in her mind. She's just lucky he decided to reprise his role as the good husband and father again.

I wonder when it's her turn will he be so understanding?

 

[sunflower]

I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand I think the author is a remarkable woman. I cannot sit up here and call her a fool because she knows her husband better than I ever will. She called him bluff and she did so because in her heart she knew his outburst was a lie. On the other hand, I feel that often times women carry a burden that no man would ever be required to carry. We are expected to nurture and to care often times to the level of neglecting our needs and feelings. I wonder what the response would of been had the tables been turned. After all women are more likely to experience break downs and stress, due to our expected role as the caregivers. Also, what if this was not a midlife crises but a bout of depression. Those type of episodes can sometimes last from 2 to 6 months but often times the depression comes back.

I think this situation speaks to the imperfections of relationships, especially marriage. I think all too often people have this misconception of happily ever after once a couple gets married. Most of us know that is not the always the case.

 

[hopeful]

^^^excellent point sunflower. Had not considered that it may have been depression.

 

[sunflower]

Like I said, I'm glad it worked out for HER, but this is something I could never tolerate.

She went thru this for six months. I'd be damned if I'd go thru it for SIX DAYS. He would have to pack and "think" things over somewhere else, not in my home. He's not going to be disrespecting me or our kids, because of his emotional issues. Coming and going as you please, ignoring family events, etc., - NO, "I" could not deal with this. I guess I'm "weak" and if so, then so be it. Rather be weak than having to spend time in jail cause somebody wants to play me for a sucka in my own home.

Excepting the type of disrespect she went through takes great patience, which most women don't have, especially if they have children and are going through their own "issues".

I'm sorry, but I believe she blocked out what he said, because she couldn't mentally/emotionally handle it. I mean he really didn't have a reason to leave, because she wasn't giving him any *ish about his comings and goings or plans. She let him do what he wanted for as long as he wanted until he got bored or the other chick dumped him. She played the good, long suffering wife to the hilt and it paid off.

I honestly believe he could have continued his disrespect for years just as long as he was still living in the house to play the "family" role she had set up in her mind. She's just lucky he decided to reprise his role as the good husband and father again.

I wonder when it's her turn will he be so understanding?

You know Jada, there is so much in this post that I agree with. I do not think I could respond the way this woman did. I do not think that makes me weak as I expect the man I married to lean on me when times get tough. I do not expect him to take his pain out on me, and in my opinion, I believe this is what the man in question did. Now as I said before the wife knows her husband better than I ever will. Maybe deep down she knew that he did not really mean what he said. Although, I think someone who would treat their spouse in such a way probably would not be as understanding if the tables were turned.

This comment is written by a man from the NYT comments

On one hand, I'm as impressed as the commenters above. On the other hand, I'm thinking about your husband and what an absolute blank he is/was. I'm not sure he deserves you or your kids. I'm married, 52. the father of four kids. I've been unemployed for over a year. Like your husband, my pride is shot, particularly on the breadwinner front. But I would never in a million years blame my wife for that or want out of our relationship. That relationship and the beautiful kids we've created is the one thing I hold onto during these difficult times. I'm able to count them on the positive side of the equation. I'm able to ask myself, "Which would you rather have? A great job, a great career, or a fantastic family?" I answer wholeheartedly, "Family!" And that keeps me holding on and moving forward. Thanks for your essay.

http://community.nytimes.com/commen...8/02/fashion/02love.html?sort=oldest&offset=2

 

[tiara76]

I think in general, this issue is easily confused with the countless examples of women who stick it out through thick and thin, regardless of foolishness. They endure all types of ridiculous behavior and stand by their man without any question.

But to me, that's not strength- it's more of a fear of standing alone, and a lack of willingness to be introspective enough to realize self-worth, compare that to personal investments into the relationship, and recognize that ROI is not yielding an wealthy relationship (emotionally, physically, mentally, etc).

The key with this story is the context. Some questioned her lack of introspection- but I contest that. It takes exactly that to dig deep enough to pull this strength out to endure for the family. The better portion of the article was a testament to her introspective process during that period in her life.

Also- this wasn't a situational issue her husband had with her. He didn't say you work too much, we don't have sex anymore, we fight too much, etc (in which instances, her saying "I don't believe you" would be arrogant/immature). He said- I don't love you anymore- very vague and all encompassing. Asking "what did I do wrong" in response to such a broad statement would be digging a hole for insecurity to breed.

And in terms of her using the tantrum example, I do liken that to a kid saying "I hate you" if their mom grounds them or won't let them have something they want. Was the kid wrong, hurtful, disrespectful? Absolutely! But the mother knows that this is something her child will have to get over, and that she is not a bad mother because the child didn't get what he or she wanted. Digging for her own personal fault in a situation like that (which I think is somewhat analogous to the author's sitch) would demonstrate a lack of understanding of the nature of children-- and how they respond when life doesn't go their way.

The same way digging for her own fault in her husband's midlife crisis would demonstrate a lack of understanding of the nature of men- and how they respond when the standard that affirms their manhood (their ability to provide for their families, build wealth) is threatened.

I just don't see this as analogous to women who habitually endure abuse or destructive relationship woes for men who would not do the same in return. Sure she could have decided on 3 months instead of 6, or to give him a piece of her mind instead of remaining stoic, but she did it her way- based on their rlp (the same way a mom with a tantrum throwing child could either spank, or scold, or ground, depending on the nature of the parent-child rlp). The point is, she made the decision- based on her own understanding of both herself and her husband- to sustain her marriage.

thats what I got out of it as well...every single relationship between people are different, every woman is different, every man is different....from what she wrote its easy to tell she was in a very different place with herself and understanding of herself and her man than alot of people are with themselves and their mates....how she responded and reacted would not have worked for alot of people and to try to be this way without being a certain place with the self could easily turn out not so pretty...I definitely didn't pick up depression....depressive people are good for taking all the blame and wallow in suffering vs find ways to be out of it inspite of a not so happy go lucky situation going on outside of them...she definitely wasn't dillusional...there was a serious problem that may have or may not have gotten solved if he didn't want to elevate himself, she just followed her heart on what to do...everybody's hearts when listened to will guide them for their best interest and each person best interest and course of action are different from the next persons....out of control emotions and enraged ego will lead you somewhere else, we all have a choice of which to follow

 

[MD_Lady]

...I wonder when it's her turn will he be so understanding?

I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand I think the author is a remarkable woman. I cannot sit up here and call her a fool because she knows her husband better than I ever will. She called him bluff and she did so because in her heart she knew his outburst was a lie. On the other hand, I feel that often times women carry a burden that no man would ever be required to carry. We are expected to nurture and to care often times to the level of neglecting our needs and feelings. I wonder what the response would of been had the tables been turned. After all women are more likely to experience break downs and stress, due to our expected role as the caregivers. Also, what if this was not a midlife crises but a bout of depression. Those type of episodes can sometimes last from 2 to 6 months but often times the depression comes back...

Not only would he be less likely to extend the gesture (IMO), very few people would expect him to. If the tables were turned, wrestling with her internal demons would have been this woman's responsibility and dealing with the potential fall out would have been par for the course. Like I said in an earlier post, I respect this woman for doing what she felt was best for her relationship. She took a step back and evaluated her situation without letting knee-jerk responses and outside opinions guide her (and that's a lesson we can all learn). If the tables are ever turned, I can only hope her husband remembers how she upheld her end of "for better or for worse" even when he didn't.

...This comment is written by a man from the NYT comments

On one hand, I'm as impressed as the commenters above. On the other hand, I'm thinking about your husband and what an absolute blank he is/was. I'm not sure he deserves you or your kids. I'm married, 52. the father of four kids. I've been unemployed for over a year. Like your husband, my pride is shot, particularly on the breadwinner front. But I would never in a million years blame my wife for that or want out of our relationship. That relationship and the beautiful kids we've created is the one thing I hold onto during these difficult times. I'm able to count them on the positive side of the equation. I'm able to ask myself, "Which would you rather have? A great job, a great career, or a fantastic family?" I answer wholeheartedly, "Family!" And that keeps me holding on and moving forward. Thanks for your essay...

I wish more men had the same commitment he does. Yielding to a man's ego is expected in our society, but his taking the feelings of others into account, unfortunately, is not.