Ordering Lobster On The First Date

[lexi08]

Well, the reason I'm so adamant about it is because most of the good, well-raised men that I've met insist that a man should pay for a woman on a first date and sometimes, every time during the relationship! Now I don't mind treating my boyfriend sometimes (just did it last week), but pretty much every man I've dated/been involved with has insisted that as a man, he wants to pay in the vast majority of cases, if not every time.

So when I meet a man who doesn't or who suggests dutch, it suggests to me that he's cheap or someone who doesn't know how to properly court a woman. It falls in the same vein of these "dates" that are just going to a dude's apartment to "chill" and watch a DVD.

I feel that too many young women are selling themselves short in the dating arena and settling for less and less... and going dutch is just another example of that to me.

Now sure, there are exceptions to that rule, of course, but I personally haven't run into them.

As for the "owe a man something" thing, see, I don't go into dates thinking that way. If he thinks that he's "owed" something because he bought me dinner, then he's not someone I want to be with anyway. When I go on a date, I'm not thinking, "What if he pays and thinks he's gonna get some?"

If I'm thinking that, then I'm selling myself short and might as well not bother going on the date! So I'm not hardly concerned about him having "expectations" because he paid for my dinner.

(The physical issue... well, that's a different story and I can understand a woman's fear of that... I just don't live my life that way, and so far, I've not had one issue with a man ever expecting a thing simply because he paid for dinner.)

I think that encouraging women to go dutch on the first date is helping them sell themselves short and lowering expectations for what a man is supposed to do in a potential future relationship.

So no dutch for me on a first date... no way, no how. Hasn't been an issue yet!

ITA with your post well said In my experience those I want to go dutch types are arseholes sorry If they expect you to pay for dinner they expect you to pay for other things also. I don't know any exceptions.....

 

[Theo]

Lobster is good. However, it is nothing to really get frazzled about when ordering it. To me it is like having crab, shrimp or any other shellfish on a menu.

The cost varies by restaurant and the market price of lobster at the time of purchasing (the restaurant purchasing from the market). However, you can just go the market yourself or any other seafood store that sells fresh lobster and prepare it at home.

As for restaurants:

Lobster from Red Lobster is (to me) equivalent to getting a Big Mac at McDonalds. Cheap, most likely frozen (not fresh), poor quality and not prepared right. Like snack attack lobster on the go.

At other restaurants that fall under the category as fine dining, if on the menu, the lobster is sold at the "market order/price" price, which is basically the going price for lobster plus a little mark up.

Market price lobster is fresh live lobster that the restaurant purchases at the market (as opposed to having it shipped frozen). This is the best quality lobster and is often prepared the right way - where it is melt in your mouth tender and rich, it's not stiff, hard or shruken. The size of the lobster is a nice size.

HTH

I might be exposing my "low-class" upbringing here, but @ Red Lobster... don't they go pick up those lobsters from the tank in the front? I know they're alive cuz I see them moving! I've never had lobster before.... I'm student and I'm not making the big bucks just yet.

 

[Seeking8Rights]

I might be exposing my "low-class" upbringing here, but @ Red Lobster... don't they go pick up those lobsters from the tank in the front? I know they're alive cuz I see them moving! I've never had lobster before.... I'm student and I'm not making the big bucks just yet.

The red lobster I remember in the outter skirt of Seattle, didn't have lobster tanks. But that was a looooong time ago.

They were frozen lobster tails that should have been served in between hoaggie bread. I didn't care for them at all. I don't know, Red Lobster to me is like an upscale version of Old Country Buffet........

But let me hush up before I get e-jumped...

 

[Maynard]

I wouldnt order lobster on the first date. I have never went dutch on a date. Women do that?

 

[BroadstreetBully]

I completely disagree.

If a man asks me out, he's paying or there won't be another date.

First dates should never be dutch at all.

However, this doesn't mean you have to go crazy with the ordering. On a first date, I am reasonable with what I order because I am not trying to test a man... I'm just interested in his company and I don't need to get lobster to do that.

But he BETTER be paying for the date... no ifs ands or buts about it.

I agree. I guess it's about what works for everyone.

I have a lot of male friends, and when we go out, we'll often go dutch because it's nothing more than friendship. In some instances they'll pick up the ticket. It just depends.

But there is no way I'm going dutch if a guy is attempting to court me. It lets me know that this guy is interested in pursuing a relationship that might lead to marriage, and he is willing to take the role of primary breadwinner and man of the household. I know it doesn't seem that deep, but like Bunny, most of the guys I know believe in paying for the first date if they are seriously interested in the girl for relationship purposes.

After the relationship is official, things can become a little more casual. We can chill at home and cook, we can go dutch, I'll treat him sometimes, and he can treat me. But before that, no way is he expecting me to go dutch while he pays for another girl he's dating at the same time. Cause some guys will do that.

 

[BroadstreetBully]

I totally understand what you are saying and agree to some degree. My perspective on going dutch comes from having a friend who was dating online. She was going out with different people week to week she met on the Internet.

Well, 1 guy she went out with (maybe more I just heard of this one) she met at a restaurant..he wasn't her type and she wasn't his. The conversation was akward and they just did not hit it off. He let her know he goes out on these types of dates at least once a week.

Well when the check came he proceeded to tell her what her portion was. She was flabbergasted, put out her money and then commented "every man she met pays for a first date". He then responded "well every woman I went out with who says she is 30 LOOKS 30". I had to tell her "you asked for that rude comment because your comment to him was rude". Granted, it may have been what she was thinking but since they both were not hitting it off why not just pay your bill and keep it moving? Why make the comment? She knew she would not go out with him again........so why NOT go Dutch? No implied obligations or "after dinner treat".

I would not have a problem going Dutch with a man I did not now well and I do not see it as settling for less. Many women understand their worth and most cost more than what it costs to pay for their own meal. It is just no biggie to me.

What I want to see more women do is not sleep with a new guy so quickly out the gate whether he paid for lobster or McDonald's........save the cookies.

I see what you're saying. If I was in that situation, I would have just paid for myself and left it at that. I say a woman should always be willing to pay her portion on any date, especially when doing casual-online-dating.

But when it's a guy who I've been speaking to and we're hitting it off, when he's ready to court me, I expect for him to pay for the first date. I guess it's because I tend to date guys I already know on some personal level.

 

[PatTodd]

I love lobster and I would order it on a first date, but only if I knew I never wanted to see the man again.

Otherwise he might think that i was trying to take advantage of him...

....and he'd be right.

 

[syze6]

I love lobster and crab legs and I when I go out with my friends I order it also. If a guy takes me to a seafood restuarant, then he should expect that I just might choose one or the other from the menu. If I want it, I'm going to order it and not think about the whole etiquette dating thing!

Our youth staff went out to dinner and it was the left over money in the budget that funded it. Everyone ordered all these small items and appetizers. No one wanted to seem as if they were being greedy.The menu had king crab legs and I had been craving some, so I ordered it. Everyone at the table got a taste of those legs! They were eating and talking about how good they were and they should have ordered some.

As far as the whole worrying about how it looks to the date. I say, if you want it, order it. If I take someone out on a date, it's my treat. If they order lobster, I'm paying for it. If I have a problem with it, I'll think twice the next time brfore going to a restuarant that serves it.

Women worry too much about etiquette how they present themselves to men, men don't put give it a second thought! If it's lobster she wants, it's lobster she should get!

 

[runwaydream]

yea...in the red lobsters around where i live they're alive in a tank you see them when you first walk in. and when u order it someone takes it out and boils it

 

[CurleeDST]

I am not sure of the proper protocols for dating people from the Internet.

I wouldnt order lobster on the first date. I have never went dutch on a date. Women do that?

 

[CurleeDST]

OT: I HATE Red Lobster! It totally SUCKS rotten eggs. Back on topic or possibly still off topic, someone posted about getting married and the man being the main breadwinner. Does that imply the man makes more money than the woman if both are working outside the home? Does that imply an expectation once married the man needs to be prepared for the woman to work inside the home while he works outside?

What does being the "breadwinner" really mean in this context and what does a man paying for an initial dinner date (and after folks are official she constantly picking up the tab) have to do with a man being the breadwinner if married?

Just trying to keep the discussion going b/c I find it intriguing. I have my own experience when my husband and I were courting and now that we are married (just celebrated 6 years).

 

[lexi08]

I love lobster and I would order it on a first date, but only if I knew I never wanted to see the man again.

Otherwise he might think that i was trying to take advantage of him...

....and he'd be right.

Really even if it were a pricey restaurant that he suggested? I guess I just don't understand why a women would fear a man thinking she was trying to take advantage of him over a meal . I mean I could see if you asked dude to pay your mortgage or something, but a meal.....

 

[CurleeDST]

Because people tend to start slowly and give small indications into their character before something more obvious is done. That is why I think some people may avoid ordering expensive stuff on the menu since they are trying to give a good impression on the first date and small things give people an impression (bad, good or indifferent).

 

[Syrah]

Me and a friend had an etiquette disagreement.

She's been doing the online dating thing and attractive woman that she is, she's met quite a few men who have asked her out to dinner to become better acquainted.

When she'd tell me about the dates, with very few exceptions she'd mention how the lobster was. Come to find out, if there's a lobster dish on the menu in appetizer, entree or dessert form - she's ordering some. Now here's the catch - I don't think she even likes lobster. I been knowing her for 16 years (lived with her 2 of those years) and haven't ever seen her eat seafood.

Now I'm normally in 'get it how you live' mode, but I find this a little.....unseemly. I asked why doesn't she just get what she wants and her response is alway 'well what's wrong with ordering lobster'?

So umm yeah, poll question - Would you order lobster on the first date just cuz it's 'free'?

I don't do it.

But then, if I'm going out to dinner with good family friends or parents of my good friends, I still would be hesitant to order lobster or the most expensive thing on the menu. It doesn't mean I'm going to eat something that doesn't taste good - I'm just cognizant of what I order.

 

[Seeking8Rights]

OT: I HATE Red Lobster! It totally SUCKS rotten eggs. Back on topic or possibly still off topic, someone posted about getting married and the man being the main breadwinner. Does that imply the man makes more money than the woman if both are working outside the home? Does that imply an expectation once married the man needs to be prepared for the woman to work inside the home while he works outside?

What does being the "breadwinner" really mean in this context and what does a man paying for an initial dinner date (and after folks are official she constantly picking up the tab) have to do with a man being the breadwinner if married?

Just trying to keep the discussion going b/c I find it intriguing. I have my own experience when my husband and I were courting and now that we are married (just celebrated 6 years).

Right! I would like to know the same thing.....

Also, with some of the responses I see alot of silent "expectations" being thrown around....

 

[Seeking8Rights]

Because people tend to start slowly and give small indications into their character before something more obvious is done. That is why I think some people may avoid ordering expensive stuff on the menu since they are trying to give a good impression on the first date and small things give people an impression (bad, good or indifferent).

But let the man propose........with a less than "perfect" ring! The impressionism is thrown right out the door, then the woman is like :skitzo:

I guess I would like to know when does the "real" communication begin.
It seems that "expectations" do all the talking while dating/courting (or whatever term that one fancys) and there is no room for communication or consideration.

 

[LivingDoll]

Does it come with fries?

Seriously though, your friend sounds tacky.

I don't expect anything I ain't bringing to the table. Period. Lobster is something I do order when out with friends and pay for myself and for others if I'm treating so if that's what I wanted yes I'd order it.

When I go to a resturant there's nothing on the menu I can't afford. That's just how I roll and a $30, $50 or $75 lobster ain't gonna break my bank. If you can't afford it why are we here? Shoot I like Claimjumpers Damn a shellfish, if I wanna 'test you' I'll ask you to pay my mortgage.

You aight with me.

 

[reallynow]

Because people tend to start slowly and give small indications into their character before something more obvious is done. That is why I think some people may avoid ordering expensive stuff on the menu since they are trying to give a good impression on the first date and small things give people an impression (bad, good or indifferent).

OP: I wouldn't order lobster on a first date as a test, that is a childish game, please!

 

[MissScarlett]

It's funny how you can get so many different opinions on a subject.

Cause everything I've ever read with regards to first dates said that the man should pay.

But to answer the question, I LOOOOOVE lobster, but I highly doubt I would order it on a first date. *I* would feel like I'm being extra.

Listen to your big sister, Let the man pay.....don't start out with that ish.

 

[MissScarlett]

Well, the reason I'm so adamant about it is because most of the good, well-raised men that I've met insist that a man should pay for a woman on a first date and sometimes, every time during the relationship! Now I don't mind treating my boyfriend sometimes (just did it last week), but pretty much every man I've dated/been involved with has insisted that as a man, he wants to pay in the vast majority of cases, if not every time.

So when I meet a man who doesn't or who suggests dutch, it suggests to me that he's cheap or someone who doesn't know how to properly court a woman. It falls in the same vein of these "dates" that are just going to a dude's apartment to "chill" and watch a DVD.

I feel that too many young women are selling themselves short in the dating arena and settling for less and less... and going dutch is just another example of that to me.

Now sure, there are exceptions to that rule, of course, but I personally haven't run into them.

As for the "owe a man something" thing, see, I don't go into dates thinking that way. If he thinks that he's "owed" something because he bought me dinner, then he's not someone I want to be with anyway. When I go on a date, I'm not thinking, "What if he pays and thinks he's gonna get some?"

If I'm thinking that, then I'm selling myself short and might as well not bother going on the date! So I'm not hardly concerned about him having "expectations" because he paid for my dinner.

(The physical issue... well, that's a different story and I can understand a woman's fear of that... I just don't live my life that way, and so far, I've not had one issue with a man ever expecting a thing simply because he paid for dinner.)

I think that encouraging women to go dutch on the first date is helping them sell themselves short and lowering expectations for what a man is supposed to do in a potential future relationship.

So no dutch for me on a first date... no way, no how. Hasn't been an issue yet!

ITA Bunny

 

[Divine_Order]

I put down "if I was in the mood for it." Why would he take me to a place that had lobster on the menu if he couldn't afford it? But, in all honesty, lobster is messy as heck...who would even wanna eat that on a first date?! "I'll have the steak please..medium".

 

[lux10023]

ditto
i mean lobster is not even the priciest thing on a REAL menu--come on now

lobster is like shrimps now--i can understand if we r talking about caviar or etc--but damn if a man felt i was taking advantage of him for ordering some lobster then--he aint it...lolol..broke ****---

Really even if it were a pricey restaurant that he suggested? I guess I just don't understand why a women would fear a man thinking she was trying to take advantage of him over a meal . I mean I could see if you asked dude to pay your mortgage or something, but a meal.....

 

[Divine_Order]

I wouldnt order lobster on the first date. I have never went dutch on a date. Women do that?

Me neither. I wouldn't even consider that a date.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

I'm shocked i got responses!

I answered - I'd order lobster if I was in the mood for it. (Thinking about the Lobster Ravioli at Reeds that I can't have ) Like I said, my normal mode is 'get it how you live' so if dude got an attitude over what I'm ordering I know I can cover my part of the bill and wish him all the best with the next chick he pulls that with.

I don't agree with going dutch unless it's obvious there is no chemistry and it's unlikely that a relationship will flourish. Then each person should pay there own way and then go their separate ways.

Everything is relative to the people involved, but I think if a man suggests that you pay your own way that he's not that into you and is trying to keep his investment in your time at a minimum. Not to say he won't want to sleep with you, he'll smash but if he can do it for free all the better.

 

[Mimi22]

at this thread. I swear I didnt think it was about price when I entered this thread. lol

Lobster on a date always reminds me of my girlfriend that went out with her boyfriend to a fancy island restaraunt. The lobster was still in the shell and she tried to cut it with a knife and fork, well guess wah happened? Yup the lobster went FLYING over the table!!! She said her bf felt so embarrassed that he grabbed the lobster, put it in his plate and removed the shell for her.


I will never order lobster on a date...PERIOD!!! lol

 

[Kurlee]

It's extra. Just because you are getting a free meal, it doesn't mean it's time to take advantage of another person. A mans willingness to spend money on lobster, says very little if anything about his relationship potential in the grand scheme of things. I would order what I like to eat. You never know someone;s situation and going for the most or almost most expensive thing is just

 

[BroadstreetBully]

OT: I HATE Red Lobster! It totally SUCKS rotten eggs. Back on topic or possibly still off topic, someone posted about getting married and the man being the main breadwinner. Does that imply the man makes more money than the woman if both are working outside the home? Does that imply an expectation once married the man needs to be prepared for the woman to work inside the home while he works outside?

What does being the "breadwinner" really mean in this context and what does a man paying for an initial dinner date (and after folks are official she constantly picking up the tab) have to do with a man being the breadwinner if married?

Just trying to keep the discussion going b/c I find it intriguing. I have my own experience when my husband and I were courting and now that we are married (just celebrated 6 years).

I speaking of "courting" in old fashioned terms and how dating/marriage is approached in the Western world. You conciously or subconciously choose a mate based on a connection physically and emotionally...but also financially. Courting in the Western world has been a way for the man to show that he can provide financially. Granted, we're talking about dinner, but those customs have a history related to the idea of "courting" or competition for a woman's affection.

It's not that deep in the 21st century, but those of us who expect a man to pay on the first date are speaking of men we are trying to get to know on a deeper level. It's like a man saying, look...let me show you a good time on my dime, let me show you that I don't mind "taking care" of you.

As far as "breadwinner" that ties into tradition and courting. I'm just going on why the man has been expected to pay when courting a woman based on gender roles.

Going dutch seems to be more common outside of the US, so it's not to say a woman is "settling" if she feels most comfortable with that route. On dates I always pull out my wallet when the check comes, and often the man refuses and picks up the tab. This happens 99% of the time, so it's expected. The few times I ended paying for myself felt very odd after that. It's the men who seem to set the standard for other males.

 

[sky_blu]

No, I wouldnt order lobster just because. But Im one of the rare people they dont like lobster anyway. If you cant afford it on your own then you shouldnt get it on a date. What if he stuck her with the bill, would she have had enough money to cover the cost?

 

[CurleeDST]

I understand the history behind it and also think if a woman is using that to assess a man's ability to "afford her" she will be miserably disappointed.

I remember going out with my husband on dates when we first met. He was consulting and was out of town Monday through Thursday. We would go out on the weekends. Initially he took me to this restaurant and that restaurant and about 3 weeks in he said to me (still makes me laugh when I think about it) "Just need you to know, every time we go out won't be at a restaurant. We may be eating Domino's or McDonald's some days".

Fast forward 2 children later - if we eat out we look at each other like "you paying, are YOU paying?" We have the majority of our money go into a family account and then we both have our own personal spending accounts which we use to pay for our personal items, work lunches, gas, etc.

More important to me than a man paying for dinner was me observing how he managed his finances and how he was living while we dated. Sure he can pay for my dinner, yet his cell phone is off b/c he didn't pay the bill - what does THAT really say? He always looking for "da hook up" and trying to get out of paying his bill by finding a problem with the food and sending it back when there is only 1 bite left on the plate. That tells me WAY more than a man simply paying for dinner on our first date.

That is why, if I were back in the dating scene I would have no problem paying for my meal on a first date - he don't really know me and I do not really know him so keep it relaxed and fun. Plus, even before I met my husband - I wasn't going out on dates thinking "this is the one". I went out on a dates b/c I thought he was fine, cute and interesting and wanted to hang out with the person.

QUOTE=redRiot;4539441]I speaking of "courting" in old fashioned terms and how dating/marriage is approached in the Western world. You conciously or subconciously choose a mate based on a connection physically and emotionally...but also financially. Courting in the Western world has been a way for the man to show that he can provide financially. Granted, we're talking about dinner, but those customs have a history related to the idea of "courting" or competition for a woman's affection.

It's not that deep in the 21st century, but those of us who expect a man to pay on the first date are speaking of men we are trying to get to know on a deeper level. It's like a man saying, look...let me show you a good time on my dime, let me show you that I don't mind "taking care" of you.

As far as "breadwinner" that ties into tradition and courting. I'm just going on why the man has been expected to pay when courting a woman based on gender roles.

Going dutch seems to be more common outside of the US, so it's not to say a woman is "settling" if she feels most comfortable with that route. On dates I always pull out my wallet when the check comes, and often the man refuses and picks up the tab. This happens 99% of the time, so it's expected. The few times I ended paying for myself felt very odd after that. It's the men who seem to set the standard for other males.[/QUOTE]

 

[Seeking8Rights]

I understand the history behind it and also think if a woman is using that to assess a man's ability to "afford her" she will be miserably disappointed.

I remember going out with my husband on dates when we first met. He was consulting and was out of town Monday through Thursday. We would go out on the weekends. Initially he took me to this restaurant and that restaurant and about 3 weeks in he said to me (still makes me laugh when I think about it) "Just need you to know, every time we go out won't be at a restaurant. We may be eating Domino's or McDonald's some days".

Fast forward 2 children later - if we eat out we look at each other like "you paying, are YOU paying?" We have the majority of our money go into a family account and then we both have our own personal spending accounts which we use to pay for our personal items, work lunches, gas, etc.

More important to me than a man paying for dinner was me observing how he managed his finances and how he was living while we dated. Sure he can pay for my dinner, yet his cell phone is off b/c he didn't pay the bill - what does THAT really say? He always looking for "da hook up" and trying to get out of paying his bill by finding a problem with the food and sending it back when there is only 1 bite left on the plate. That tells me WAY more than a man simply paying for dinner on our first date.

That is why, if I were back in the dating scene I would have no problem paying for my meal on a first date - he don't really know me and I do not really know him so keep it relaxed and fun. Plus, even before I met my husband - I wasn't going out on dates thinking "this is the one". I went out on a dates b/c I thought he was fine, cute and interesting and wanted to hang out with the person.

[/quote]

Great post!