You are NOT a princess.

[ambergirl]

For those who think it's anti-woman, can you pull out an example from the OP that you feel is anti-woman and explain why?

The title to start with is inflammatory...I have never related to the "princess" archetype and honestly can't think of one of my friends who does...I suppose they're out there.

Secondly the whole tenor of the article is very scolding and parental as if women need to be told how to behave and to know "their place". The author could have made the same points without being so judgmental and scolding. Makes me question what exactly the author is intending with the article. Or alternatively they have some personal issue they're working out through this post.

That silly statement that being a stay at home mom is not a sacrifice to your own career development (and hence financial independence) is a load of crap. In my experience when a woman chooses to stay home with her children it's often a mutual decision and many women struggle with that choice as they know this makes them even more beholden to their husbands for the health and well being of themselves and their children. It's a supreme act of trust and faith in their husband and the marriage. Doesn't mean you lord it over him, but let's be honest about how staying at home increases a woman' vulnerability and dependency.

I could go on and on.

Personally, I don't see the attraction some women have to being lectured at like this. I don't need some blogger wagging their finger at me telling me how to behave to know what's right or wrong in a relationship. I think someone mentioned this was written by a psychiatrist? I highly doubt it, or if that's true I wouldn't waste one dime seeing her/him.

 

[Bachelorette]

well as Kiya pointed out this is most likely based on what this psychiatrist hears from her male clients

The thoughts/insights of men should be considered too contrary to what we're told nowadays

 

[anon123]

The title to start with is inflammatory...I have never related to the "princess" archetype and honestly can't think of one of my friends who does...I suppose they're out there.

Secondly the whole tenor of the article is very scolding and parental as if women need to be told how to behave and to know "their place". The author could have made the same points without being so judgmental and scolding. Makes me question what exactly the author is intending with the article. Or alternatively they have some personal issue they're working out through this post.

That silly statement that being a stay at home mom is not a sacrifice to your own career development (and hence financial independence) is a load of crap. In my experience when a woman chooses to stay home with her children it's often a mutual decision and many women struggle with that choice as they know this makes them even more beholden to their husbands for the health and well being of themselves and their children. It's a supreme act of trust and faith in their husband and the marriage. Doesn't mean you lord it over him, but let's be honest about how staying at home increases a woman' vulnerability and dependency.

Thanks for responding. I can see where you are coming from. I think more points than not actually point to a balance rather than the "worship me" attitude some may have. But I can appreciate the point about staying at home. Also I'm not totally convinced about the alimony thing.

About the bolded, though, may I refer you to a sticky at the top of this forum.

 

[ambergirl]

Thanks for responding. I can see where you are coming from. I think more points than not actually point to a balance rather than the "worship me" attitude some may have. But I can appreciate the point about staying at home. Also I'm not totally convinced about the alimony thing.

About the bolded, though, may I refer you to a sticky at the top of this forum.

You know I remembered that sticky AFTER I posted my reply!

But I think that sticky refers to valuing yourself and expecting that of others...at least I hope!

 

[kbragg]

I only wonder what kind of relationship she has. I'm sure with lists like these she must remember to keep herself in check at all times.

By the tone of the article I wouldn't be surprised if she was a side ho Hey don't gimmie that look ya'll this ain't the "Say something nice" thread Seriously the whole tone of it sounds like "Your wife is no good, come here baby and let a REAL woman take care of you."

I at the whole evil wife attitude. I DO believe I am a Princess and should be treated as one Likewise I do believe hubby is a Prince and should be appreciated and respected as such. As Dr John Gray says in Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus, women need to be cherished, men need to be respected.

I believe that if I have dedicated my whole life to popping out babies, preparing your meals, doing your laundry, supporting you in your career, being your concubine, babysitter, maid, therapist, cheerleader, on call nurse, financial planner, etc. then that contribution IS deserving of having "my way paid" I am MORE than carrying my own weight, and my contribution to the household is equal if not greater than bringing in an equal paycheck.

Married men do better career wise than single men do because of the fact that ALL they have to really concern themselves with is work. Their wife for the most part manages everything else. They don't have to worry about kids doctor appointments, when the phone bill is due, choosing whether to switch electric providers or lock in a new rate, paying the car insurance, balancing the check book, planning meals, planning b-day parties, doing the Christmas Shopping, nursing sick kids back to health, cleaning up poo in the middle of the day, breastfeeding, colic, need I go on?

So really she can GTFOOHWTBS about Sahm's If she truly is a therapist then I guess she is who we can thank for all these non chivalrous, non door opening, non gentlemanly a-holes we have out here. Thank Tara!

 

[Mortons]

T

That silly statement that being a stay at home mom is not a sacrifice to your own career development (and hence financial independence) is a load of crap. In my experience when a woman chooses to stay home with her children it's often a mutual decision and many women struggle with that choice as they know this makes them even more beholden to their husbands for the health and well being of themselves and their children. It's a supreme act of trust and faith in their husband and the marriage. Doesn't mean you lord it over him, but let's be honest about how staying at home increases a woman' vulnerability and dependency.

Now I'm gonna ask us to keep it real. How many times, purely on this forum, have seen women say, and I quote "I'm gonna have kids immediately so I don't have to work", "once I get married I'm gonna quit my job", "I aint marrying him if I cant stay home". These quotes usually dont strike me as, I am going to make the supreme sacrifice to my family, and take care of the home and this is gonna be extra hard for me.

It just usually sounds to me like the woman does not wanna work If he is ok with it cool, but the bolded is not what the reality of a lot of situations are.

 

[kbragg]

And what's wrong with Alimony? Let's say we're married for 20 years and during that time I manage your household for you and provide you a loving stress free environment to come home to. I keep our 5 kids managed, support you in your career aspirations, etc. You will be able to attain higher levels in your career because of me being by your side. Well if you decide that you wanna have a midlife crisis and now that you've arrived trade me in for a new young chick, you dang right I am entitled to half. I helped you get where you got. WE built a LIFE together. Same goes if the roles are reversed. Many states recognize this (mostly Red States like Texas...loves it here) and consider any property, pension, money, whatever acquired after the wedding day community property. I'm down with community states

 

[ambergirl]

Now I'm gonna ask us to keep it real. How many times, purely on this forum, have seen women say, and I quote "I'm gonna have kids immediately so I don't have to work", "once I get married I'm gonna quit my job", "I aint marrying him if I cant stay home". These quotes usually dont strike me as, I am going to make the supreme sacrifice to my family, and take care of the home and this is gonna be extra hard for me.

It just usually sounds to me like the woman does not wanna work If he is ok with it cool, but the bolded is not what the reality of a lot of situations are.

Honestly, I haven't seen those posts and my friends all struggled with staying home because they had invested some time in their careers and were very worried about being out of the work circuit for too long, but I suppose they're out there...somewhere. Also it's possible these women want to raise their own kids so it's less about not working then its is about not wanting to send them to day care.

On another note, any woman who is getting married and having kids JUST so they don't have to work is silly as heck given we have a 50%+ divorce rate (and probably higher in the black community).

 

[kbragg]

Now I'm gonna ask us to keep it real. How many times, purely on this forum, have seen women say, and I quote "I'm gonna have kids immediately so I don't have to work", "once I get married I'm gonna quit my job", "I aint marrying him if I cant stay home". These quotes usually dont strike me as, I am going to make the supreme sacrifice to my family, and take care of the home and this is gonna be extra hard for me.

It just usually sounds to me like the woman does not wanna work If he is ok with it cool, but the bolded is not what the reality of a lot of situations are.

I have never seen anyone say anything like that but even if they did so what? Being a SAHM is work, much harder work than having a regular job and splitting the chores between the two of you. What's wrong with wanting to be a wife and mother? Women have done it for generations without issue. Now it's all women need to work, work, work, and yet most of us ain't got a man. Makes you think:scratchch

 

[Kurlee]

By the tone of the article I wouldn't be surprised if she was a side ho Hey don't gimmie that look ya'll this ain't the "Say something nice" thread Seriously the whole tone of it sounds like "Your wife is no good, come here baby and let a REAL woman take care of you."

I at the whole evil wife attitude. I DO believe I am a Princess and should be treated as one Likewise I do believe hubby is a Prince and should be appreciated and respected as such. As Dr John Gray says in Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus, women need to be cherished, men need to be respected.

I believe that if I have dedicated my whole life to popping out babies, preparing your meals, doing your laundry, supporting you in your career, being your concubine, babysitter, maid, therapist, cheerleader, on call nurse, financial planner, etc. then that contribution IS deserving of having "my way paid" I am MORE than carrying my own weight, and my contribution to the household is equal if not greater than bringing in an equal paycheck.

Married men do better career wise than single men do because of the fact that ALL they have to really concern themselves with is work. Their wife for the most part manages everything else. They don't have to worry about kids doctor appointments, when the phone bill is due, choosing whether to switch electric providers or lock in a new rate, paying the car insurance, balancing the check book, planning meals, planning b-day parties, doing the Christmas Shopping, nursing sick kids back to health, cleaning up poo in the middle of the day, breastfeeding, colic, need I go on?

So really she can GTFOOHWTBS about Sahm's If she truly is a therapist then I guess she is who we can thank for all these non chivalrous, non door opening, non gentlemanly a-holes we have out here. Thank Tara!

lol @ side ho! I agree and i never thought of the bolded this way.

 

[kbragg]

Honestly, I haven't seen those posts and my friends all struggled with staying home because they had invested some time in their careers and were very worried about being out of the work circuit for too long, but I suppose they're out there...somewhere. Also it's possible these women want to raise their own kids so it's less about not working then its is about not wanting to send them to day care.

On another note, any woman who is getting married and having kids JUST so they don't have to work is silly as heck given we have a 50%+ divorce rate (and probably higher in the black community).

I think most women are not all that keen on entrusting their children to basically total strangers. I mean most people wouldn't hand over their debit cards, credit cards, bank account, all their passwords, entire financial life to someone else to manage for them after only meeting the person a couple weeks prior but women are supposed to do that with their children.

 

[Mortons]

Honestly, I haven't seen those posts and my friends all struggled with staying home because they had invested some time in their careers and were very worried about being out of the work circuit for too long, but I suppose they're out there...somewhere. Also it's possible these women want to raise their own kids so it's less about not working then its is about not wanting to send them to day care.

On another note, any woman who is getting married and having kids JUST so they don't have to work is silly as heck given we have a 50%+ divorce rate (and probably higher in the black community).

I have never seen anyone say anything like that but even if they did so what? Being a SAHM is work, much harder work than having a regular job and splitting the chores between the two of you. What's wrong with wanting to be a wife and mother? Women have done it for generations without issue. Now it's all women need to work, work, work, and yet most of us ain't got a man. Makes you think:scratchch

Yall must not be around the forum much cause those posts are everywhere. And like I said if your man is cool with it hey be my guest. I just dont think those reasons are as noble as we make it out to be.

And kbragg I think that Black women nowadays forget that we worked outside of the home and were wives and mothers since we came here. There is no history of Black women only staying home. Not saying its a good thing, but there is no sense in making like we need to go back to our "roots" of staying at home when our roots always have been working hard in and out of the home.

 

[JustKiya]

Yall must not be around the forum much cause those posts are everywhere. And like I said if your man is cool with it hey be my guest. I just dont think those reasons are as noble as we make it out to be.

And kbragg I think that Black women nowadays forget that we worked outside of the home and were wives and mothers since we came here. There is no history of Black women only staying home. Not saying its a good thing, but there is no sense in making like we need to go back to our "roots" of staying at home when our roots always have been working hard in and out of the home.

I see a lot of value in being a SAHM - and I think that the black community would be in better shape if more women were able to be the primary caretakers of their children without being branded 'welfare queens' - but that's a whole nother train of thought.

I'm also fully aware that being a SAHM isn't a 'traditional' part of black culture, and have been told that wanting to be a SAHM means I 'think I'm white'. *sigh* Just because we've always done it this way doesn't mean it's the best way.

 

[kbragg]

Yall must not be around the forum much cause those posts are everywhere. And like I said if your man is cool with it hey be my guest. I just dont think those reasons are as noble as we make it out to be.

Ok well Ima let you be me for a month, manage these kids and deal with hubby's male PMS all the while keeping a clean house, food on the table, and oh yea don't forget to put in my 32 hours a week (I work at home, telemarketing), oh and you'll have almost no human contact outside of the work IM, a couple forums, and an occasional usher at church or a cashier at the grocery store, don't forget to make sure the girls do their homework, Angel needs to practice her flute, read to Baby Hulk and please don't let him flood the toilet, do two heads of butt length hair, color and face paint several times a week and you must be enthusiastic...no slacking, you gotta be Sasha Fierce Errrrrr night, don't forget you gotta keep yourself up to, workout everyday, stay nicely shaved and pretty, make sure all the bills are paid on time, switch from vonage and verizon to Clear, lock in a new rate so we don't get stuck month to month on the electricity, keep track of both family's birthday,s visit the inlaws at least twice a month...THEN when you are ready to shave your head and jump off a cliff because you don't even know who YOU are anymore I'll be waiting here for my apology from you

And kbragg I think that Black women nowadays forget that we worked outside of the home and were wives and mothers since we came here. There is no history of Black women only staying home. Not saying its a good thing, but there is no sense in making like we need to go back to our "roots" of staying at home when our roots always have been working hard in and out of the home.

But see that has not always been our roots. Our roots don't start here in America. Pre slavery we were no different than any other race (there's Biblical evidence of this as well).There were women in Biblical times that "worked" but it was no where near this 40+ hour a week grind we have going on today. Women didn't give their children over to some stranger to raise. There was community and family support (grands, great grands, etc.) and kids knew who momma was, and it wasn't the babysitter.

And again SO WHAT if black women have always worked in America. What does that have to do with now? Is being a SAHM another one of those "white things" that black people need to avoid, you know like eating healthy, not destroying our own neighborhoods, and not protecting ourselves from infectious diseases?

 

[kbragg]

I see a lot of value in being a SAHM - and I think that the black community would be in better shape if more women were able to be the primary caretakers of their children without being branded 'welfare queens' - but that's a whole nother train of thought.

I'm also fully aware that being a SAHM isn't a 'traditional' part of black culture, and have been told that wanting to be a SAHM means I 'think I'm white'. *sigh* Just because we've always done it this way doesn't mean it's the best way.

THANK YOU!!! Hey I'm the whitest of the whiteys! I exercise daily like the white people, I eat healthy white people food, I work at home like a white woman, raise my own kids like white folks do, shoot not only have I lost my black card, I have been banned from reapplying later

 

[Mortons]

I'm not saying Black women have to avoid being a SAHM. Someone brought that up as being the reason for low marriage rates or not having a man, and I wanted to nullify that point quickly.

Do as you please but as for me, I see more benefits in a woman working at least part time. Thats just MHO

 

[ladylibra_30]

My thoughts - Yes, I AM a Princess/Queen and Dr. Tara is a Quack/Man.

J/K

I agree with some of the points but I don't agree with this one:
17. Your husband/boyfriend should be more important to you than your child(ren) just as you should be more important to your husband than the child(ren). In other words, you should be each others’ first priorities; children second. You don’t need a husband if your sole desire is to have children—unless you see the man as a source of income for yourself and the children. If you can’t support yourself, you probably shouldn’t be having children. Marriage is a bond between two grown adults; not a bond between parent and child (Marc Rudov, 2008). You vow to honor your spouse and put him or her before all others, this includes your children. Children eventually fly the coop. If you make them the focus and raison d’être of your marriage, don’t be surprised when you no longer have much of a marriage as the years pass.

I mean I get that your spouse has to be a priority to maintain a healthy relationship/marriage but the kids' needs come first. Period.

 

[kbragg]

My thoughts - Yes, I AM a Princess/Queen and Dr. Tara is a Quack/Man.

I still don't believe she is a she Frankly it reminds me of those comments in blogs that start off "I am a middle aged rich white man, but white people suck and are racist and are the devil, and this is a WHITE person saying this!"

 

[kbragg]

Ok I am convinced this woman is a man LOL! She has no contact information but an email. No official website, apparently she doesn't practice in real life, only by email, phone, or skype and she cannot accept insurance (cuz IMO she is a he and NOT a real doctor)

 

[Crackers Phinn]

I was trying to put my finger on why this sounded familiar and then my old friend Tom Leykis came to mind. Everything in the OP is straight out of Leykis 101.

You are not a princess. You do not deserve to be treated like royalty just by virtue of your sex. You deserve to be treated no better or worse than you treat others.

If I define myself as a princess, then who is this other person to define me differently? Who else gets to define my outlook of myself and the world? Especially if this "who" is someone that wants me to change that outlook so that it is in their favor?

 

[Crackers Phinn]

Ive never taken women who go around claiming to be "princess/queen/diva/goddess" seriously anyway.

I agree with this, but I do take women who carry themselves as though they are "princess/queen/diva/goddess" seriously

 

[JustKiya]

I agree with this, but I do take women who carry themselves as though they are "princess/queen/diva/goddess" seriously

Precisely. You should never have to state it - your every action should be talking on your behalf.

 

[Bachelorette]

I agree with this, but I do take women who carry themselves as though they are "princess/queen/diva/goddess" seriously

Those that carry themselves as such ironically usually dont go around claiming it which is very cool to me.

 

[Bachelorette]

Lol mwedi, thanks for mentioning that sticky

Now I'm gonna ask us to keep it real. How many times, purely on this forum, have seen women say, and I quote "I'm gonna have kids immediately so I don't have to work", "once I get married I'm gonna quit my job", "I aint marrying him if I cant stay home". These quotes usually dont strike me as, I am going to make the supreme sacrifice to my family, and take care of the home and this is gonna be extra hard for me.

It just usually sounds to me like the woman does not wanna work If he is ok with it cool, but the bolded is not what the reality of a lot of situations are.

Exactly! it's like people forget there are some whose prime reason for wanting to get married is so as NOT to work

 

[PeanutButterandHoney]

Honestly, I haven't seen those posts and my friends all struggled with staying home because they had invested some time in their careers and were very worried about being out of the work circuit for too long, but I suppose they're out there...somewhere. Also it's possible these women want to raise their own kids so it's less about not working then its is about not wanting to send them to day care.

On another note, any woman who is getting married and having kids JUST so they don't have to work is silly as heck given we have a 50%+ divorce rate (and probably higher in the black community).

Yall must not be around the forum much cause those posts are everywhere. And like I said if your man is cool with it hey be my guest. I just dont think those reasons are as noble as we make it out to be.

And kbragg I think that Black women nowadays forget that we worked outside of the home and were wives and mothers since we came here. There is no history of Black women only staying home. Not saying its a good thing, but there is no sense in making like we need to go back to our "roots" of staying at home when our roots always have been working hard in and out of the home.

I made a thread asking would women marry a man who expected her to work and about 80% of the responses were no.

 

[Bachelorette]

Do as you please but as for me, I see more benefits in a woman working at least part time. Thats just MHO

as do I. I know many who do part time and I personally would do the same if my dude and I could afford it

 

[Bachelorette]

I made a thread asking would women marry a man who expected her to work and about 80% of the responses were no.

LOL I saw that thread. Not sure how others didnt. Berra link them so they'd know we're not mentioning these threads out of thin air

 

[kbragg]

I made a thread asking would women marry a man who expected her to work and about 80% of the responses were no.

Was this thread talking about before or AFTER children? The reason I ask is I personally have the belief that it is best for the children to have at least 1 parent 100% available (especially in the teen years...sneaking boys and girls all up in the house...) and depending on how many kids you have it's just plain stupid for both parents to work outside the home. If I were to work outside the home for example, $300 right off the top would go to daycare each week. I'd basically be working just to pay the daycare, not cost effective at all so we decided that me being home was best and I found I job I can do at home so it works well for us. Now if hubby was one of those men like my friend's hubby who just wanted her to work just for the sake of working (If Ima suffer you gotz to suffer too, you ain't living off me) and wanted me to hand my baby over to strangers 6 weeks after delivery and was ok with that? No I wouldn't marry him

But to each their own. Heck Caleb is 18 months old now and DH is still leery about letting him go to the kids Sunday school (our church has high level security and everyone is background checked etc.) for the hour we're in service Kayla is 6 now and she was finally allowed to start going last year Why DH thought she wasn't ready for Kindergarten and was still calling her a baby when she was 4?

 

[kbragg]

as do I. I know many who do part time and I personally would do the same if my dude and I could afford it

So you both think it's better for the children to be in the care of strangers rather then the parents for the tiny bit of change you'd get from working part time? With the cost of daycare and gas etc. how would that even be cost effective?

This is not a diss on anyone who HAS to work but for me my children's welfare is way more important to me than a little $100-200 extra week by the time you take out childcare, taxes, and gas. But I understand that unfortunately many in the black community do not see the value in an at home parent.

 

[PeanutButterandHoney]

Was this thread talking about before or AFTER children? The reason I ask is I personally have the belief that it is best for the children to have at least 1 parent 100% available (especially in the teen years...sneaking boys and girls all up in the house...) and depending on how many kids you have it's just plain stupid for both parents to work outside the home. If I were to work outside the home for example, $300 right off the top would go to daycare each week. I'd basically be working just to pay the daycare, not cost effective at all so we decided that me being home was best and I found I job I can do at home so it works well for us. Now if hubby was one of those men like my friend's hubby who just wanted her to work just for the sake of working (If Ima suffer you gotz to suffer too, you ain't living off me) and wanted me to hand my baby over to strangers 6 weeks after delivery and was ok with that? No I wouldn't marry him

But to each their own. Heck Caleb is 18 months old now and DH is still leery about letting him go to the kids Sunday school (our church has high level security and everyone is background checked etc.) for the hour we're in service Kayla is 6 now and she was finally allowed to start going last year Why DH thought she wasn't ready for Kindergarten and was still calling her a baby when she was 4?

The thread was titled How would you feel if your husband expected that you work after having children.
It didn't specify whether this was displyed before or after the kids.
I asked using various hypothetical situations.
Many women stated they wouldnt even married him.

I was also reading in the archives a SAH thread were people were saying that working is considered "embracing the struggle"
Reading your posts, I can begin to understand you reasoning for not working.
Hell, you dont even have to reason it for me.
It's you and your hubby's personal choice and that is JUST enough to satisfy me.
It has to work for YOU TWO.

What's good for the goose...