Oh Lord, Black Love Will Keep You Broke

:rofl: You a mess!

Now I'm on the pro-black woman tip but even this article had my spidey senses raised. Like why the need for so many of these kind of articles? It's 2 birds with 1 stone. BM ain't sht and BW you're less than other woman, nobody want you, your families don't mean sht, etc. Geez!
Exaaaaaactly. :rolleyes: You know this, I know this, we all know this. But if people wanna keep playing dumb and brand new like they just got here, I'm done explaining. I did my part for the youngins, explained the game how I see it. Other than that, I'm bout done on this topic.
 
This sounds so reasonable yet so many women don't seem to get it. My relative, who makes at least $100k in an affordable large city, turned down guy with nice middle class job...for a guy with tear drop face tattoos. o_O I'm unclear about his job and kid situation.

Black women just need to be more selective of who they date. Don't date the unemployed . Don't date felons. Don't date dope boys. Don't date someone with multiple children to women/woman he wasn't married to.
 
i don't think that's the conclusion that should be taken from the study

Right. Just like everything else we discuss here, structural inequality is implicated:


"Our results strongly echo those of the Chetty team. So what conclusions can be drawn? Chetty’s team are blunt, writing that “the key to closing income disparities for both black and white women is to close intergenerational gaps in income between black and white men.”

"Breaking the cycle of intergenerational poverty for black Americans requires a transformation in the economic outcomes for black men, particularly in terms of earnings."
 
Black women just need to be more selective of who they date. Don't date the unemployed . Don't date felons. Don't date dope boys. Don't date someone with multiple children to women/woman he wasn't married to.

The research wasn't about any of those things though. It was about the difference in earnings between black and white men, so we can surmise that we're talking about black men who work.
 
Right. Just like everything else we discuss here, structural inequality is implicated:


"Our results strongly echo those of the Chetty team. So what conclusions can be drawn? Chetty’s team are blunt, writing that “the key to closing income disparities for both black and white women is to close intergenerational gaps in income between black and white men.”

"Breaking the cycle of intergenerational poverty for black Americans requires a transformation in the economic outcomes for black men, particularly in terms of earnings."


The research wasn't about any of those things though. It was about the difference in earnings between black and white men, so we can surmise that we're talking about black men who work.

5ajbeWB.gif



I cheer you from the sidelines, kind lady. Tally ho, oui- oui, bon bons, and all that good stuff. :lol:
 
The research wasn't about any of those things though. It was about the difference in earnings between black and white men, so we can surmise that we're talking about black men who work.

At this point black men need to try and fix their own collective problems with the infrastructure..let them pontificate, rally etc..Black women should try to save themselves (however that may be) in the interim cause the stress is killing us.
 
Right. Just like everything else we discuss here, structural inequality is implicated:


"Our results strongly echo those of the Chetty team. So what conclusions can be drawn? Chetty’s team are blunt, writing that “the key to closing income disparities for both black and white women is to close intergenerational gaps in income between black and white men.”

"Breaking the cycle of intergenerational poverty for black Americans requires a transformation in the economic outcomes for black men, particularly in terms of earnings."

this is nice brick in the case for reparations, reforming labor laws that require disclosure of prior convictions, and expanding opportunities for minority entrepreneurship. All of which would benefit BW too, before anybody says anything lol
 
At this point black men need to try and fix their own collective problems, Black women should try to save themselves (however that may be) in the interim cause the stress is killing us.

I agree generally. I never shy away from criticizing bm but as it relates to this issue...how is the average bm worker supposed to fix widespread, systemic income inequality? Every single one of us in here who is partnered with a working bm is partnered to a man who, if he were white, would almost certainly be making more money for the exact same work.
 
The research wasn't about any of those things though. It was about the difference in earnings between black and white men, so we can surmise that we're talking about black men who work.
But selectiveness of who you date and marry still rings true but I also think we just have to accept that it comes with the territory. Income inequality between black men and white men on similar levels is not going to go away any time soon. And I don't support black women running to white or others in mass, which is what I think alot of people will take away.
 
So has it sunk in yet? Are we done feeling bad about life every time a new article comes out? Are we done with the 20 page threads of discussion and handwringing and cool quotes that can't and don't address structural problems? I had a feeling when I saw it that THIS would be the article that broke the camel's back.

Someone asked about Brookings... trust that most anything they publish is designed to get the attention of the people with money and power to make institutional change. They aren't taking to us. In order to influence public policy you have to paint a picture that clearly speaks to the direness of a situation.
 
But selectiveness of who you date and marry still rings true but I also think we just have to accept that it comes with the territory. Income inequality between black men and white men on similar levels is not going to go away any time soon. And I don't support black women running to white or others in mass, which is what I think alot of people will take away.

I agree with you. Life is a series of choices and trade offs, particularly if you're black. We want easy solutions to societal problems but there aren't any. We can make better choices in our individual lives and do better than we have been but as you said, some stuff just comes with the territory of living in racist America. The sooner we realize this the better.
 
So has it sunk in yet? Are we done feeling bad about life every time a new article comes out? Are we done with the 20 page threads of discussion and handwringing and cool quotes that can't and don't address structural problems? I had a feeling when I saw it that THIS would be the article that broke the camel's back.
At this point, whoever doesn't get it is not getting it on purpose.
 
But selectiveness of who you date and marry still rings true but I also think we just have to accept that it comes with the territory. Income inequality between black men and white men on similar levels is not going to go away any time soon. And I don't support black women running to white or others in mass, which is what I think alot of people will take away.

I am on the Pink Pill mailing list and I saw she sent out an e-mail last night referencing this article and basically like yelling fire in a movie theater. This will be fodder for all the wrong debates, I am sure of it.
 
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Genuine Question: Has The findings from these studies influenced policy in any significant way within the last decade or so? I get that they aren't talking to "us", but for those they are talking to, the power brokers, has this lead to institutional, far- reaching structural changes? Or even laid the groundwork for these changes? There May be things happening behind the scenes we're not aware of. If It isn't making a difference, then a different strategy is needed. All the article and research in the world means nothing if those who have the power to change these outcomes don't give a ****
So has it sunk in yet? Are we done feeling bad about life every time a new article comes out? Are we done with the 20 page threads of discussion and handwringing and cool quotes that can't and don't address structural problems? I had a feeling when I saw it that THIS would be the article that broke the camel's back.

Someone asked about Brookings... trust that most anything they publish is designed to get the attention of the people with money and power to make institutional change. They aren't taking to us. In order to influence public policy you have to paint a picture that clearly speaks to the direness of a situation.
 
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Genuine Question: Has The findings from these studies influenced policy in any significant way within the last decade or so? I get that they aren't talking to "us", but for those they are talking to, the power brokers, has this lead to institutional, far- reaching structural changes? Or even laid the groundwork for these changes? There May be things happening behind the scenes we're not aware of. If It isn't making a difference, then a different strategy is needed

I can't give you specific examples off top that are related to this issue but I can say that anytime public policy has been enacted to address racial inequality it is due in large part to social research.

The thing is, it takes a long time for attitudes and practices to catch up to policy. We have laws in place to prevent discrimination in the real estate industry for example but black folks still pay more for mortgages and see less appreciation for homes in our neighborhoods.
 
Genuine Question: Has The findings from these studies influenced policy in any significant way within the last decade or so?
Excellent question. Not that I can tell, which is why a lot of us are looking at Obama funny. That was our shot and he rode the wave knowing what we expected of him. Trump owes us nothing, we made sure of that. Can't get mad at him when 'our guy' presided over the greatest theft of AA wealth since ever.

NewsOne: 53 % of Black Wealth Wiped out: Foreclosure Crisis Erodes Communities of Color (1/15)
The Intercept: New Report Looks at How Obama's Housing Policies Destroyed Black Wealth (12/17)
 
If you click on the links in the Brookings Institute study the write up for the following analysis pops up.

TLDR - Policy change will do very little because it depends on white people waking up tomorrow forgetting how to be racist. Reducing (less tolerance of) crime in black neighborhoods, more black men as hands on fathers, educators/administration and police presence in black neighborhoods will produce more upwardly mobile black men which will put a bigger dent in the wage gap than ANYTHING black women can do besides only reproducing with men whose socioeconomic value exceeds their own. That sounds great but would downwardly spiral overall black birthrates. What black women can take from these articles/statistics is to stop running forward to explain away why it's too hard for black men to step up and do their part in making the black community more self sufficient.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Although closing this gap may appear to be a daunting challenge given its persistence, there are some encouraging signs that the problem can be solved. First, black children have rates of relative mobility comparable to whites: they are not stuck at the same income levels as their parents. Closing the gap in opportunities between black and white children at a given parental income level could therefore eliminate much of the black-white income gap within two generations.

Second, the black-white gap is significantly smaller for boys who grow up in certain neighborhoods { those with low poverty rates, low levels of racial bias among whites, and high rates of father presence among low-income blacks. Black boys who move to such areas at younger ages have significantly better outcomes, demonstrating that racial disparities can be narrowed through changes in environment. The challenge is to replicate the conditions that lead to these smaller disparities more broadly across the country. Our findings suggest that many widely discussed proposals may be insufficient to narrow the black-white gap in the long run.

Policies focused on improving the economic outcomes of a single generation { such as cash transfer programs or minimum wage increases { can narrow the gap at a given point in time, but are less likely to have persistent effects unless they also affect intergenerational mobility.

Policies that reduce residential segregation or enable black and white children to attend the same schools without achieving racial integration within neighborhoods and schools would also likely leave much of the gap in place, since the gap persists even among low-income children raised on the same block.

Instead, our results suggest that efforts that cut within neighborhoods and schools and improve environments for specific racial subgroups, such as black boys, may be more effective in reducing the black-white gap. Examples include mentoring programs for black boys, efforts to reduce racial bias among whites, or efforts to facilitate social interaction across racial groups within a given area (e.g., Devine et al. 2012; Heller et al. 2015). Our analysis does not offer guidance on which interventions of this type are most effective, but calls for greater focus on and evaluation of such efforts.

http://www.equality-of-opportunity.org/assets/documents/race_paper.pdf

They're still calling for policy change, just a different kind. Their suggestion of interventions at the neighborhood level to counteract neighborhood effects will still be very dependent on funding, which comes from bureaucracy.

Eta: they may also be appealing to nonprofit organizations as well. But the funding for interventions has to come from somewhere.
 
Why is it when other people talk about black people they try to plant a negative stigma on them. “Black people are likely to be on welfare” statistics show it is mostly Caucasian people. “Black people are likely to steal”. Studies show other whys. Now, is this article a peer review study or a regular article. I have seen happy and will established black couples. Also, I think the media portrays black families in a bad light as well.

Heck, statistics shows there is a raise in single white mothers (and other races of women as well; however, Asians are less likely) whether it’s interracially or from their own men and it is increasing (I am not saying it’s high. I’m saying it is increasing). Unfortunately, everyone has something negative to say about black people, but nothing when it comes to anyone else.
 
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Are you all partnered with the average black man tho? Despite the demographics of this board, I think the black college graduation rate including both sexes in the U.S. is less than 10%. If you are a black woman married to a black man with one or more degrees then you and he are indeed a unicorn pairing.

When you're talking about income disparities, no matter how much of a unicorn your bm is, he's still making less than he would if he were a white man in the same position. That's partly why their model equalizing marriage rates didn't show a significant change in the gap in household income between black and white women.
 
I get this and normally I'm in agreement, but the bolded bothers me for some reason. How can you grow in a neighborhood with low poverty rates if

1.) BM (an BW too for that matter) aren't even paid livable wages and have fewer economic opportunities. As long as redlining exists, that may not be an option.There are significant barriers to entry and most of the people who are struggling do not have the resources to access them or the connections to gain these resources. It's like when a Section 8 family moves into a nice, mixed neighborhood. Once one homeowner or resident catches wind, divestment in that neighborhood begins and soon it looks like the ghetto that they just left :sad:

2.) Poverty is a perfect example of a negative feedback loop. How do you change your circumstances as an adult when you lack the tools or money to get the necessary tools. More opportunities exist for early intervention, so we may have to shift focus is bringing the next generation up and expose them to as much as possible that will help them rise above their circumstances.

As to the low level of racial bias among whites...good luck with that ****. I don't know man- the solutions seem almost circular at this point. If it wasn't so dire, I would say it's laughable. Studies have also shown that historically lower wages and economic hardship influences the rate of marriage. BUT, if you are working poor with spouse and child, you probably make too much to qualify for aid- so what's the point in getting married if at your income it offers little in terms of protection? This reduces incentives for getting married in the first place if you make below a certain income threshold. They also showed that in this study even increasing marriage for BW changes very little as long as the pairing remains BW-BM (Increased marriage rates between BW-BM is a point I argued for in a previous thread. Combining resources should improve some aspects of the income disparities but they don't. The reason it doesn't is systemic)

At this point, I'm going to lean on the Serenity Prayer :rofl:
If you click on the links in the Brookings Institute study the write up for the following analysis pops up.

TLDR - Policy change will do very little because it depends on white people waking up tomorrow forgetting how to be racist. Reducing (less tolerance of) crime in black neighborhoods, more black men as hands on fathers, educators/administration and police presence in black neighborhoods will produce more upwardly mobile black men which will put a bigger dent in the wage gap than ANYTHING black women can do besides only reproducing with men whose socioeconomic value exceeds their own. That sounds great but would downwardly spiral overall black birthrates. What black women can take from these articles/statistics is to stop running forward to explain away why it's too hard for black men to step up and do their part in making the black community more self sufficient.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Although closing this gap may appear to be a daunting challenge given its persistence, there are some encouraging signs that the problem can be solved. First, black children have rates of relative mobility comparable to whites: they are not stuck at the same income levels as their parents. Closing the gap in opportunities between black and white children at a given parental income level could therefore eliminate much of the black-white income gap within two generations.

Second, the black-white gap is significantly smaller for boys who grow up in certain neighborhoods { those with low poverty rates, low levels of racial bias among whites, and high rates of father presence among low-income blacks. Black boys who move to such areas at younger ages have significantly better outcomes, demonstrating that racial disparities can be narrowed through changes in environment. The challenge is to replicate the conditions that lead to these smaller disparities more broadly across the country. Our findings suggest that many widely discussed proposals may be insufficient to narrow the black-white gap in the long run.

Policies focused on improving the economic outcomes of a single generation { such as cash transfer programs or minimum wage increases { can narrow the gap at a given point in time, but are less likely to have persistent effects unless they also affect intergenerational mobility.

Policies that reduce residential segregation or enable black and white children to attend the same schools without achieving racial integration within neighborhoods and schools would also likely leave much of the gap in place, since the gap persists even among low-income children raised on the same block.

Instead, our results suggest that efforts that cut within neighborhoods and schools and improve environments for specific racial subgroups, such as black boys, may be more effective in reducing the black-white gap. Examples include mentoring programs for black boys, efforts to reduce racial bias among whites, or efforts to facilitate social interaction across racial groups within a given area (e.g., Devine et al. 2012; Heller et al. 2015). Our analysis does not offer guidance on which interventions of this type are most effective, but calls for greater focus on and evaluation of such efforts.

http://www.equality-of-opportunity.org/assets/documents/race_paper.pdf
 
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Thanks for this.That Intercept was ....enlightening to say the least. I"ll have to read up on the implications of that omnibus package

Excellent question. Not that I can tell, which is why a lot of us are looking at Obama funny. That was our shot and he rode the wave knowing what we expected of him. Trump owes us nothing, we made sure of that. Can't get mad at him when 'our guy' presided over the greatest theft of AA wealth since ever.

NewsOne: 53 % of Black Wealth Wiped out: Foreclosure Crisis Erodes Communities of Color (1/15)
The Intercept: New Report Looks at How Obama's Housing Policies Destroyed Black Wealth (12/17)
 
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