Daughter-in-law Versus My Spouse Drama

[okange76]

I'm siding with your husband. There comes a time when you have to be selfless and take one for the team. Your DIL is disrespectful and selfish. If my MIL put in all that work and involved me, I'd appreciate her efforts and work within the guidelines. She could have chosen another occasion and taken pics on her own dime to show her weight loss. This was not the time. This is not that major of a sacrifice to make for the sake of peace in the family. Honestly , I feel like if you did not fund a lot of stuff for your son and grandkids, she would not be married to him. She seems like she's resentful of you and uses your son to get back at you by doing petty things. This is just an assumption based on a lot of stuff you have shared about them.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

For anybody who is team adult children adulting. Read between the lines of what all the planning that went into these pictures may mean and why a grown man old enough to have grandchildren with a serious illness is upset and crying.

There's a lot of times when it's appropriate to flex on your parents/in-laws - THIS. WASN'T. THE. . TIME. There's a lot of focus on MIL being mad at DIL but her son didn't wear what he was supposed to neither. Showing up in some cut off shorts.

Cut.
Off.
Shorts.

And then asking for passwords so he can keep his money in his pocket. They are 50 kinds of wrong.

 

[mrselle]

I think there's a lot going on beneath the surface. Unfortunately, it reared its ugly head at the wrong time. Like others have suggested, have a talk with your DS and DIL.

 

[LeftRightRepeat]

I've written a couple of posts and then backspaced my way out of the thread. I see it from both POVs
(the coddled perhaps rebelling children; and the older conservative parents who give the children just *one* job and they can't even do that* -throws hands up in the air)

I'm sorry to hear about your dh ((((hug)))

 

[michelle81]

For anybody who is team adult children adulting. Read between the lines of what all the planning that went into these pictures may mean and why a grown man old enough to have grandchildren with a serious illness is upset and crying.

There's a lot of times when it's appropriate to flex on your parents/in-laws - THIS. WASN'T. THE. . TIME. There's a lot of focus on MIL being mad at DIL but her son didn't wear what he was supposed to neither. Showing up in some cut off shorts.

Cut.
Off.
Shorts.

And then asking for passwords so he can keep his money in his pocket. They are 50 kinds of wrong.

I agree with you and some of what @Evolving78 said as well. Mostly because of previous threads. I definitely think there's some or maybe a lot of codependent behavior. Sounds like some entitlement issues from the son and DIL as well. I do agree that @Transformer that the DIL has been mentioned several times, but this goes squarely on both of them. DIL didn't stop it and DS didn't as well, says entitlement to me. Not what I would want for my family, but I don't think this is the first time an issue like this has come @Transformer.

IMO, seems like a never-ending cycle. Codependent, needy, entitlement - really bad combo; again IMO. Majority of it totally subconscious I would think.

 

[Transformer]

I can imagine its frustrating to not get the picture you wanted, and that your children didn't seem to grasp why this was so important. I would say, looking to the future, that you would get most benefit from a proper and full conversation with your son and DIL. They should understand why your DH is upset and what they could have done differently to avoid it. Equally you need to understand why they didn't wear the right clothing - I can't imagine that blatant contrariness came into it at all, and I suspect it is due to a misunderstanding in what was expected.

Whatever the outcome, limiting the collegiate future of your grandchildren because your children didn't wear the right clothes in a picture seems like a spectacularly self defeating action. Not to mention somewhat controlling.

Had you never planned for that money to go to them, then reallocating is absolutely appropriate. However, if it was a set plan, then this is a punishment, and I really do not agree that you should be punishing grown (married) adults. If you want an adult relationship, then you need to treat them like adults.

An example of this is the suggestion of displaying an unflattering photo of your DIL - it is unkind and unnecessary; added to this it doesn't achieve anything.

Correct me if I am wrong but there seems to be something unsaid regarding your DIL, the undertone being that you and DH do not like her. From what I read, both your son and his wife did not adhere to the dress code, yet your son's choice of cut shorts has only been mentioned once in the OP but your DIL has received quite the dragging. From her crop tops, to her "pokey" belly and spandex dresses, it just feels to me like it's more than just about what she wore. Added to this, DS got a request to change his shirt, DIL did not,which likely implied to her that, at the time, her outfit was acceptable.

There have been a number of replies also stating that your having paid for their trip means that they should align to whatever is demanded. I would disagree with this line of thought, as any expectations of behaviour should absolutely be confirmed up front, to allow a decision as to whether or not the price is bearable. When the price is obscured, or presented as being negotiable (as in this case - they should wear the clothes you bought) there should be no surprise that there were competing outcomes. I would also say that a gift should have no hidden strings. If the price was to wear a dress ad stand for a picture, make that unmissable when inviting them so that there is no confusion as to what you expect.

It seems to me for your DS and DIL this was just a nice family picture, which they complied with; whereas for you it was a specific sort of picture, complete with outfits and poses.

I’m not as upset as hubby for a couple of reasons. One, it does no good and in the overall picture of life it means nothing. Second, DIL is theatrical which I’m now accustomed. Third, she is really proud of her body bounce back although it might not be 100%. I do not dislike DIL and in fact I now talk to her more than I do my own daughter or son. I certainly discussed this trip with her more than anyone.

What they didn’t consider is our feelings after all that joint planning, being caught off guard on something we had discussed just hours earlier. Maybe they didn’t consider it as important a factor as hubby and I. I surely thought everyone was on the same wavelength. When the clothes arrived from Nordstrom everyone tried on everything at our house and seemed satisfied. I think expectations were clear.

Also, while we are not prudes the crop top and low rider shorts were a bit much for a family picture in my opinion...which is hubby’s primary complaint. I was more pissed at son and attempted to mitigate the “damage” by asking son to do the quick change. I couldn’t do or take on anything more at that time. DD was arguing with the photographer in Spanish because he wanted to postpone and expected another travel fee. As for the comments on the pokey belly that was actually her own comment when she saw the photos two days later. Me....I was spanxed and avoid comments on physical attributes. I’m not unkind. But I think it should have been her consideration of clothing choices....if it was going to bother her.

Here is how hubby feels...that DS will go through great lengths to please her family. In fact he probably would have sponsored the trip himself. We spend a lot of time babysitting, extra logistics back up support for a lot of things but we don’t think we get the respect of her mother or ******* father..thus hubby feels like Dress freelancing wouldn’t have been an issue. If they had requested Zombie costumes, son would have complied.

What should have happened....”Mom we would like to take some shots with different outfits...can that be arranged. Maternal grandmother would like some shots in these outfits...is that okay?”

As far as finances....the only thing I have promised is to take care of the GKs educational expenses. Hubby gets mad and says he didn’t promise that. I pay him no attention because there is nobody he loves more than those two little people. The Savings Bonds were not promised....they were forgotten. I want to transfer ownership and hubby is just being grumpy. He’s the same guy that has set aside all his bowling winnings for grandson...he’s a top bowler. He will come around but it might take until his other children, Serena/Venus win a slam.

Hubby is mad because I not mad enough in his opinion.

 

[Transformer]

Sounds like some entitlement issues from the son and DIL as well

Actually my sister and I think the pettiness, vengeful attitude, entitlement is from son. He thinks we spent more time and money on DD. Which is true but he was never deprived of anything either.

DIL is smart and said she knows where she her support lies. She has openly said this. She really tried to convince son not to buy a house far away from us. But does she like to express herself artistically in settings when not expected.....YES.

 

[lesedi]

What I've realised in life is that everybody doesn't think the way we do....you have to be explicit with your demands or there's a large chance that you won't get what you want.

I honestly think there's been some miscommunication here, and let's just say DIL and DS are a little selfish, that's still no reason to fracture what otherwise seems like a very happy family. Explain how your feelings were hurt and give them the opportunity to apologise and make it up.

And I think you should direct this to your son mainly IMO

 

[Kurlee]

A big part of the problem is a lack of communication. If she is a Fashion Nova aficionado, I would not have left the leeway for them to return/change it. You opened the door to all of this. Her wearing something else, therefore, was seemingly appropriate to her. There was room to do that. If it were THAT important to me and I know that she's fragile, I would have confirmed the outfits beforehand, so there were no suprises, even if I had to go shopping WITH her. Just because you paid for/planned everything doesn't mean she has to go along and since you opened the door for flexibility, this happened. Once already at the shoot, I would have asked for some pics with the planned outfit just to have "options" and made sure I got my pics that I paid for.

Also, you seem to kind of not like DIL and it comes through every time you talk about her. I think that is playing a role, too. There's underlying or unsolved issues also at play here. I find it interesting that so much of the posts talked about her belly, body, tacky/"creative" bodycon wear, her fragility, petty ways to get back at her by using the big belly pics anyway, to cropping HER/them out, family comments about her dress and like one line about your son's cut off shorts? Ya'll already don't like this girl and it's obvious. She's tolerated . Try to fix it. I agree that in a case like this, though, common sense should have prevailed (wear the damn free outfit!), but I'm learning that common sense isn't all too common.

Lastly, your husband is being extra petty and kind of controlling, but he's hurt and I get it. I just hope his reaction is temporary and that he won't make any long-term decisions based on this incident.

 

[brownb83]

I think there's a lot going on beneath the surface. Unfortunately, it reared its ugly head at the wrong time. Like others have suggested, have a talk with your DS and DIL.

I agree. This situation is the result of a bigger issue.

 

[brownb83]

A big part of the problem is a lack of communication. If she is a Fashion Nova aficionado, I would not have left the leeway for them to return/change it. You opened the door to all of this. Her wearing something else, therefore, was seemingly appropriate to her. There was room to do that. If it were THAT important and I know that she's fragile, I would have confirmed the outfits beforehand, so there were no suprises, even if I had to go shopping WITH her. Just because you paid for/planned everything doesn't mean she has to go along and since you opened the door for flexibility, this happened. Once already at the shoot, I would have asked for some pics with the planned outfit just to have "options" and made sure I got my pics that I paid for.

Also, you seem to kind of not like DIL and it comes through every time you talk about her. I think that is playing a role, too. There's underlying or unsolved issues also at play here. I find it interesting that so much of the posts talked about her belly, body, tacky/"creative" body con wear, her fragility, petty ways to get back at her by using the big belly pics anyway, to cropping HER/them out, family comments about her dress and like one line about your son's cut off shorts? Ya'll already don't like this girl and it's obvious. She's tolerated . Try to fix it. I agree that in a case like this, though, common sense should have prevailed (wear the damn free outfit!), but I'm learning that common sense isn't all too common.

Lastly, your husband is being extra petty and kind of controlling, but he's hurt and I get it. I just hope his reaction is temporary and that he won't make any long-term decisions based on this incident.

quoted for emphasis

 

[Dee-Licious]

Free trip, free clothes, and free photos and it’s “controlling” to want certain outfits for photos you’re paying for and paid for everything else?
Go on your own dime or stay at home in your specific outfits you care so much about.

I think people like to have a cause to stand on, but this is so insignificant in the grand scheme that them doing an outfit change was ludicrous.

Just don’t display any pics with them I’m those outfits and keep it moving.

I’m trying to see why if your son makes more than your husband y’all taking up so much financial burden and school expenses for the grandkids?

And if you know he’d pay for a trip for his in-laws and where whatever they request, why do you allow the treatment that y’all get? @Transformer

People can only use you if you keep letting them use you. People can only control you if you keep letting them.

 

[LeftRightRepeat]

Free trip, free clothes, and free photos and it’s “controlling” to want certain outfits for photos you’re paying for and paid for everything else?
Go on your own dime or stay at home in your specific outfits you care so much about.

I think people like to have a cause to stand on, but this is so insignificant in the grand scheme that them doing an outfit change was ludicrous.

Just don’t display any pics with them I’m those outfits and keep it moving.

I’m trying to see why if your son makes more than your husband y’all taking up so much financial burden and school expenses for the grandkids?

And if you know he’d pay for a trip for his in-laws and where whatever they request, why do you allow the treatment that y’all get? @Transformer

People can only use you if you keep letting them use you. People can only control you if you keep letting them.

You can’t take it with you so I agree with helping the grand kids thru college. I think they should consider scaling back on what they gift to the son and dil and allow them to live within their means. It’s kinda natural to expect gratitude or for people to fall in line when you do so much for them. Son and dil haven’t figured that out yet or don’t care. This causes resentment on parents part

 

[Dee-Licious]

You can’t take it with you so I agree with helping the grand kids thru college. I think they should consider scaling back on what they gift to the son and dil and allow them to live within their means. It’s kinda natural to expect gratitude or for people to fall in line when you do so much for them. Son and dil haven’t figured that out yet or don’t care. This causes resentment on parents part

Trust fund set up for the grandkids would solve all that without dishing out money to the parents now. I’m talking about the everyday expenses and trips OP and her DH are doing.

I’m a strong proponent of generational wealth and inheritance.... if the adults feel the money is “controlling” then stop money with them and set up trust for the grands.

 

[LeftRightRepeat]

Trust fund set up for the grandkids would solve all that without dishing out money to the parents now. I’m talking about the everyday expenses and trips OP and her DH are doing.

I’m a strong proponent of generational wealth and inheritance.... if the adults feel the money is “controlling” then stop money with them and set up trust for the grands.

Yes that’s what I said

 

[Black Ambrosia]

Actually my sister and I think the pettiness, vengeful attitude, entitlement is from son. He thinks we spent more time and money on DD. Which is true but he was never deprived of anything either.

DIL is smart and said she knows where she her support lies. She has openly said this. She really tried to convince son not to buy a house far away from us. But does she like to express herself artistically in settings when not expected.....YES.

How old is DS? If he’s acting out based on his childhood experience then you have a much bigger issue and it explains his callousness in light of his father’s health.

What did DH say to DS when he asked for the password? Did he give an explanation?

 

[prettyinpurple]

Somebody gives you a FREE trip and ask you to take FREE photos in a FREE outfit for pictures that you don’t even have to hang in your own house if you don’t like them, and it’s a huge deal to wear the outfit? Annnnndddd you know it’s anniversary family pictures for a very sick man?

Sorry, that’s ungrateful and stupid.

For anybody who is team adult children adulting. Read between the lines of what all the planning that went into these pictures may mean and why a grown man old enough to have grandchildren with a serious illness is upset and crying.

There's a lot of times when it's appropriate to flex on your parents/in-laws - THIS. WASN'T. THE. . TIME. There's a lot of focus on MIL being mad at DIL but her son didn't wear what he was supposed to neither. Showing up in some cut off shorts.

Cut.
Off.
Shorts.

And then asking for passwords so he can keep his money in his pocket. They are 50 kinds of wrong.

Yep and yep.

There are times in life where you go along with the flow and expectations for good reasons and this is one of them.

They need to set an example for their kids as well.

Grown folks with children need to do better. They aren't teenagers who need to be coaxed into getting it together. If the grown folks can't get it together, then they need to hear it from their peers and elders. They won't like it, but oh well. Eventually it will click when it happens to them.

 

[lesedi]

Honestly , I feel like if you did not fund a lot of stuff for your son and grandkids, she would not be married to him. She seems like she's resentful of you and uses your son to get back at you by doing petty things. This is just an assumption based on a lot of stuff you have shared about them.

Ok I don't know all of the things shared but this seems like a very unfair accusation.

By the way, I think she probably should have worn the dress that was given her but...she didn't. And I don't want OP and her husband to lose their son over this, family feuds have started over less. The most important thing is that DH is happy and at peace as he battles his illness - being right is overrated.

It is clear that DIL isn't in the good books, but as long as their son chooses to remain married, they are going to have to respect that and tolerate her. I do agree that it's important that DIL and DS are independent financially - as much for their sake as for OP's. But the grandkids have nothing to do with it, and from what OP has mentioned, those kids are their pride and joy. They will regret snubbing them just to get at their mother IMO.

 

[Transformer]

I’m trying to see why if your son makes more than your husband y’all taking up so much financial burden and school expenses for the grandkids?

That question deserves an answer. We do have a trust set up for our children which we now have an appointment next month to amend/revoke--directly naming the grandkids as the primary beneficiaries. By the way, we didn't know EXACTLY how much DS made until three days before the trip when he discussed "just in case plans" with his father. But we had an estimate based on him maintaining their lifestyle with a SAHW. We are glad to assist if it is beneficial to our grandkids. Education is MY THING. It is my top priority after teaching life skills. This is my legacy to my grandkids, it really isn't about if son can afford to fund himself.

I've said many times that I (emphasis on "I" and not hubby) practice a "Die Broke" philosophy which is based on assisting while you are alive and able to see the pleasure it brings. I practiced this BEFORE I had grandkids. The vacations, schooling....and such are monies that exist outside the trust that we would like to see the benefit gained. Hubby goes along but he is not as entirely committed as I am. This is why he is now mad at me--he wants me to change. Here's how this trip went.

GS --Granddad I want to go to the beach.
Hubby--We can do that.
GS -I want to go to a beach on an airplane.
Me--We can do that.....looks at parents....."Y'all coming?"
Then the planning started which was scheduled at the same time as our yearly anniversary trip.

Thinking back on things now, I am 95% sure that my son suggested the change in outfits. He openly congratulates her on getting back to pre baby physically which is good. I'm sure he probably said "why not wear something more form fitting to show your body" and she went along. I really don't think she would had done this without his prodding. I believe the BodyCon dress was brought along initially to wear for the nightclubs which I had told her about.

Now having come to that conclusion---it still does not make hubby feel better and in fact it makes him feel worse.

 

[Kurlee]

Free trip, free clothes, and free photos and it’s “controlling” to want certain outfits for photos you’re paying for and paid for everything else?
Go on your own dime or stay at home in your specific outfits you care so much about.

I think people like to have a cause to stand on, but this is so insignificant in the grand scheme that them doing an outfit change was ludicrous.

Just don’t display any pics with them I’m those outfits and keep it moving.

I’m trying to see why if your son makes more than your husband y’all taking up so much financial burden and school expenses for the grandkids?

And if you know he’d pay for a trip for his in-laws and where whatever they request, why do you allow the treatment that y’all get? @Transformer

People can only use you if you keep letting them use you. People can only control you if you keep letting them.

If someone does something for you, especially in part because they want something from you (family pics with the grandkids) that doesn't entitle the giver to dictate everything and the recipients have to comply. That's not a gift, that's control. Gifts shouldn't have strings and expectations attached. People should of course be appreciative and gracious, but they shouldn't have to yield to everything with the giver because of the gift.

I also think punishing the grandkids and perhaps the DIL and son is petty because it's like " hey, you didn't do what I want, so I'm taking X away from you". Why not just talk? Communicate? Problem solve?

-Hey son and DIL, you know I was a little disappointed that you did X when we went away. I know it was probably not intentional, but I was hoping to achieve Y, which is why I purchased the outfits, and Z happened instead. It made us feel unappreciated. Done!

It's really not that deep. I think during the shoot, I would have just politely asked them to take a few pics with the outfits I chose so I could choose which ones look best color scheme wise. Problem solved. If they acted a fool about that request, then I'd just make sure to get plenty of photos with just the grands and not blow up the ones with them in it .

There's definitely some dynamics with DIL and son beyond this incident why it's sparking such a strong reaction.

 

[Transformer]

How old is DS? If he’s acting out based on his childhood experience then you have a much bigger issue and it explains his callousness in light of his father’s health.

What did DH say to DS when he asked for the password? Did he give an explanation?

Both of my kids are in their thirties. He never understood his sister's life struggles which is our fault for not explaining it to him when he was young.

Nope DH doesn't explain himself--he just says NOPE. He has always been this way.

 

[Black Ambrosia]

Thinking back on things now, I am 95% sure that my son suggested the change in outfits. He openly congratulates her on getting back to pre baby physically which is good. I'm sure he probably said "why not wear something more form fitting to show your body" and she went along. I really don't think she would had done this without his prodding. I believe the BodyCon dress was brought along initially to wear for the nightclubs which I had told her about.

I wondered about this initially but the slant was so much toward DIL that I didn’t bring it up. It makes way more sense that she’d feel comfortable with the change if her husband suggested it vs going rogue and him siding with her to keep the peace. It also kind of explains her remorse over how she looks in the pictures if he led her to believe she’s made more progress than she actually has. Do you think DS intended to disrupt the vision you and DH had or was he clueless about the impact? Why do you think this was important to him?

 

[Transformer]

o you think DS intended to disrupt the vision you and DH had or was he clueless about the impact? Why do you think this was important to him?

I think he was all about making her feel good about herself--we didn't matter.

 

[Black Ambrosia]

I think he was all about making her feel good about herself--we didn't matter.

This sounds harsh. How involved was he in the planning and selections? Any chance he didn’t understand how important the outfits were?

 

[GeorginaSparks]

Yup DIL is wrong but what does that have to do with the grandkids? That's unnecessary imo.

 

[classychic1908]

I bet your son didn't like the clothing choices for his wife and that is why she wore more figure showing outfits.
He probably also told her that it wouldn't be a big deal. I can see my husband doing the same thing and my mother-in-law being mad at me for showing too much skin.

 

[Ms. Tarabotti]

So the question now is - do you or how much do you fall back without risking losing access to the grandchildren?

If this is not just 'your' money but 'you and your husbands' money, he should have some say in how it is used. Your money philosophy is to use it before you die- what is his? Is there room for compromise on either side? Can you stop 'helping' the parents out so much since you know how much the son makes? He seems to be resentful that his sister was helped out more than he was during the childhood years but was is past is past, it can't be changed.

I know that you want to provide quality education for your grandchildren and quality costs but what would happen if you didn't fund most of their schooling? Would the parents pick up the slack so grandson could attend the best schools possible? Could they see your support as some how trying to control their lives? I think that in the past you said that you paid for your DIL to stay at home- is that still going on? Since you know that DS is more than capable of supporting a SAHM, maybe you should reconsider doing that.

Just some things to think about........

 

[urbanchic]

I wondered about this initially but the slant was so much toward DIL that I didn’t bring it up. It makes way more sense that she’d feel comfortable with the change if her husband suggested it vs going rogue and him siding with her to keep the peace. It also kind of explains her remorse over how she looks in the pictures if he led her to believe she’s made more progress than she actually has. Do you think DS intended to disrupt the vision you and DH had or was he clueless about the impact? Why do you think this was important to him?

Yep, I started to feel this way after OP posted the dynamics of the family between parents, DD, and DS. I honestly think DS did it on purpose. I could be wrong but he would definitely get the 'What you not gon' do' talk while my DH is battling an illness.

@Transformer the more you posted the more DS sounded entitled and spoiled. He's in his 30s??! He's a man that should be doing manly things (i.e. being the sole provider for his family). It's okay to invest in the GK education needs and to do extra things for the Gk but that would be it for me.

I now think the fault lies squarely at his feet. I can't remember everything up thread but it almost sounds like you and DH may have been on different pages throughout his upbringing.

 

[Daina]

Unlike many of the others who have chimed in, I don't have the back story or the perspective of the other issues or drama you've presented so feel free to take this with a grain of salt but know that I'm saying this in the spirit of love and kindness. With that being said, this is a larger issue with your son and his passive/aggressive attempts to low-key or point blank get back at you and hubby for some real or perceived slight in his childhood or adulthood. What bothers me is that both of them are okay using their children as pawns in this drama. If these are self-sufficient adults, even if it is for the children they shouldn't be relying on you or your husband period! Is it just a coincidence that 3 days before the trip you and hubby suddenly find out how much he makes? What happened on the trip is a symptom of a larger issue.

With all things in life we have to pick which hill we want to die on...I think your hubby is in his feelings which his health issues may be playing a large role to a certain degree. If you're using joint funds being it bonds or other assets you and hubby need to be on the same page even if it means holding up and falling back until his anger subsides. How would you feel if he made decisions with joint assets against your wishes? I don't think the grandchildren should suffer but I also believe in the scripture that says, "how can two walk together less they agree"?

At this point my conversation would be with my son first and not with DIL. I would need to hear his perspective and thoughts without the influence of his wife being there. This would also allow an opportunity to go into other areas that may be bothering him and gives you and hubby a chance to express your feelings without the theatrics that DIL may bring. I pray that at the end of the day your family is able to forgive, heal and move forward in a positive way.

 

[Nalin]

I find it hard to believe both DS & DIL weren't aware of why they were asked to wear a certain color and style. You can easily change back to what you wanted to wear after photos were taken.

I remember my grandmas 13 kids getting together with just their children (no grands, that was a different shoot) for photos to surprise my grandma on her 90th. I'm glad everyone had enough respect to be ok with the color scheme and attire.