My hair got molested this morning in the corner store

[LunadeMiel]

This thread has been very informative

 

[labelfree]

That was totally disrespectful. I bet if a Black man stuck his hand in an Arab woman's hair the men would let him know that he was being disrespectful or beat him senseless. Yes for any man this is a no no. However, I think they think they can treat us any kind of way because we are Black women. I've had to educate a few Arab men when it comes to touching or propositioning me. I asked them do you behave this way with your women. The guy had the nerve to say NO! our women are virgins and respected.

Wow I wouldn't even know what to say after that. but I blame the media most people look to TV for how they perceive the world. In his mind he probably thought she would be flattered that he touched her hair

 

[Almaz]

Flattered no. He was looking for a booty call and she thought maybe she would take the bait. I dont' know if any culture Black White Hispanic ME or anything that would just appreciate a guy coming up to them and touching their hair or other parts of the body.

Even prostitutes don't like people invading their space like that.

Wow I wouldn't even know what to say after that. but I blame the media most people look to TV for how they perceive the world. In his mind he probably thought she would be flattered that he touched your hair

 

[suburbanbushbabe]

One word. Boundaries...

 

[jerseyjill]

Alright lets move back into the 60's and the Vietnam war. Okay after the war tons of Amerasian babies coming to America. Because places like Vietnam Thailand have different views on touching women and sex. That is why there is such a large Sex Industry in those regions. NOT generalising not saying its better or worse it is just different.

When was the LAST time anyone heard of a AmerIraqi baby scaping to get to Merica to find him papa??? Again nobody is touching those women. YOU maybe Might find one or two but I would be hard pressed and hopefully she ran away to America because again she could suffer greatly because of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honor_killing


Thanks for the wealth of information you provide - just want to point out that many of the Amerasian children were results of rapes. In war, rape is a tool used by sodiers against the enemy's women ( or in Vietnam the south Vietnamese women were not the enemy). Many of these Amerasian children were thrown to the street in Vietnam, and lived in colonies as beggars. So it wasnt all consentual sex with the Vietnamese women.

As far as Iraq is concerned it is too early to tell how many Ameraqui children exist.

But your information is well received and respected Sister, carry on!

 

[isobell]

Please some of the most Americanised Perfectly English Speaking men from that area have some of the worst behaviours towards black women in the Grocery stores you see them with the Bling their hair faded talkin smack and treating certain people the same way. This is almost a Bodega culture. Remember this is not to everyone but those stores are usually NOT in the greatest of areas and they tend to take on the traits of the people that are in the area along with some of their own preconcieved notions about Blacks and other cultures.

One store owner got shot when he did this to a young girl and her Father got mad at went to the store and busted a cap in his arse. This man was in Gulf War one so he knew what the 411 was. The man at the store went back to the ME after that incident never to be seen again.

In Detroit one BM got beat to death when he tried to defend his daughter from such kind of person talking to her any kind of way and talking under her clothes. The father yes was BEAT to DEATH. Again this is not all ME people but there are enough out there that would try this and they are not ALL fresh off the boat. Cause the ones in Detroit were Born and Bred right in Dearborn, Michigan these guys were not fresh off the boat

ok I will reiterate my point as well. I was not born in this country either, I also speak more than one language. I also was raised with these kinds of religious/cultural practices around me. In my culture this fellows actions are taboo and unacceptable as well. However it doesn't sit well with me to conclude that this "arab" man was treating op like a prostitute or whatever because "arab" men in general think of black women as such. Just as your experience validates that conclusion, my experience validates the premise that every individual should be taken as such. I make my mind up after I know the person. As someone who often acts in ways that are neither the norm nor even acceptable in my own culture I can tell you with conviction that racial/cultural markers are not dispositive of motive or life philosophy. live and let live and all that. i'm probably just a pollyanna but it works for me

I'm not trying to invalidate your point or experience, it's just that I've never experienced what you are talking about. what really made me respond was the op's comment about some black women dating "those" men. I failed to see the connection between his rudeness, him possibly trying to date her and being arab. If a man of any other race stuck his hands in my hair i would feel the exact same way. To me its just as disrespectful. On an aside I've been noticing a lot of anti-arab sentiment around me lately. i just feel that people will always grab the opportunity to be racist if they can get away with it. If it's not against hispanic people, then its arabs or native americans. Black people are no less likely to be ignorant and racist as people of other races. People in general are just sometimes.

 

[shamarie]

DAMN GIRL!!!!! You hair must be the ssshyt for an Arab man to just come out of the blue and had to touch it!!!!!!!

 

[Almaz]

Again Not saying that they were Arab They could have been Puerto Rican or black I understand that. But again He does not do this to his own women why think that because this woman is black and they believe the hype about all the negative stuff about Black women that it was okay to do this to her.

YOU have never experienced anything like this but you said you was kind of Pollyannish maybe you have and you just didn't realise. Who knows I hope not though.

ok I will reiterate my point as well. I was not born in this country either, I also speak more than one language. I also was raised with these kinds of religious/cultural practices around me. In my culture this fellows actions are taboo and unacceptable as well. However it doesn't sit well with me to conclude that this "arab" man was treating op like a prostitute or whatever because "arab" men in general think of black women as such. Just as your experience validates that conclusion, my experience validates the premise that every individual should be taken as such. I make my mind up after I know the person. As someone who often acts in ways that are neither the norm nor even acceptable in my own culture I can tell you with conviction that racial/cultural markers are not dispositive of motive or life philosophy. live and let live and all that. i'm probably just a pollyanna but it works for me



First impressions mean a lot and I would be very had pressed to know someone after they have accosted me like that.


I'm not trying to invalidate your point or experience, it's just that I've never experienced what you are talking about. what really made me respond was the op's comment about some black women dating "those" men. I failed to see the connection between his rudeness, him possibly trying to date her and being arab. If a man of any other race stuck his hands in my hair i would feel the exact same way. To me its just as disrespectful. On an aside I've been noticing a lot of anti-arab sentiment around me lately.

Yeah I have been noticing that also everytime I get patted down and searched at the airport


i just feel that people will always grab the opportunity to be racist if they can get away with it. If it's not against hispanic people, then its arabs or native americans. Black people are no less likely to be ignorant and racist as people of other races. People in general are just sometimes.

Yes so true so true

Did you grow in any of those places. Or Europe?

 

[Almaz]

Yes that is so true about a lot of Rape babies happening in Vietnam and they are treated like total Crap. (Especially the Black Children) And how did I know this?
But as far as Iraq Hummm I highly doubt you will see this in high numbers

Alright lets move back into the 60's and the Vietnam war. Okay after the war tons of Amerasian babies coming to America. Because places like Vietnam Thailand have different views on touching women and sex. That is why there is such a large Sex Industry in those regions. NOT generalising not saying its better or worse it is just different.

When was the LAST time anyone heard of a AmerIraqi baby scaping to get to Merica to find him papa??? Again nobody is touching those women. YOU maybe Might find one or two but I would be hard pressed and hopefully she ran away to America because again she could suffer greatly because of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honor_killing


Thanks for the wealth of information you provide - just want to point out that many of the Amerasian children were results of rapes. In war, rape is a tool used by sodiers against the enemy's women ( or in Vietnam the south Vietnamese women were not the enemy). Many of these Amerasian children were thrown to the street in Vietnam, and lived in colonies as beggars. So it wasnt all consentual sex with the Vietnamese women.

As far as Iraq is concerned it is too early to tell how many Ameraqui children exist.

But your information is well received and respected Sister, carry on!

 

[mj11051]

I don't feel like I'm generalizing, I used to go to this restaurant that arabs owned and I'm a very personable, I will speak and be nice to those that treat me that way. This guy thought because I was a nice person, i was easy. One night he asked me if he could take me out to dinner and I asked him if my brother could take his sister out with us for a double date? He gave me a look I'll never forget and that was the last time he ever asked me about going out.I have lived in this city all my life and I see how they treat black woman and talk to them. Like I said I'm a nice person, but don't over step your bounds with me. Now when hubby came home I told him what happen and we went to the store. My hubby told that guy if you ever disrespect my wife again, there will be no place for you to go sir, because I'll find you. He apologized again to me and him and promised e it would never happen again. He said he got carried away because my hair is always beautiful when he sees it. My hubby told him just don't ever, ever touch my wife again. Because my hubby knows how they are about their women. He said if that was him, he would be found dead somewhere.erplexed

 

[GV-NA-GI-TLV-GE-I]

hmm I agree that this person invaded her personal space and was very disrespectful but don't you think you're kind of over generalizing a little bit? Many of us lhcfers have reported myriad instances where people, not only men, of all races, even our own, have done similar things to us. Why generalize about a culture that includes people of so many different religions and nationalities in that manner? Just because you have seen similar men acting badly towards black women does not mean they all do. I'm sure there are people who can likewise tell of just the opposite experience. No need to fan the flames of cultural misunderstanding and burgeoning bigotry.

Overgeneralizing? Nope, it is a culture I know! It's bigotry to treat a Black woman as an abid/sharmuta then attempt to backtrack and feel scared when she's on to you. I'm not promoting any kind of misunderstanding, I'm trying to help other who have gone through this to UNDERSTAND just what has transpired. I do not live in an ethnocentric bubble in anyone's community, esp. not the Black one. If anyone knows anything at all about respectful Arab culture...s/he'd know that this is not appropriate, not even amongst the secular. Yella, bye-bye.

 

[beans4reezy]

Arab, African American, Hispanic, Italian, Jewish, Muslim, Christian, Wiccan: regardless of race, color, or the religion of a man, you do not invade someone's personal space period.

I don't understand why a man of Arab descent should be held at a higher moral standard than anyone else.

 

[GV-NA-GI-TLV-GE-I]

How do you know he's not americanized? He might even be a citizen. He might have mental health problems. He might just have liked her. So called "Arabic" men also date and marry black women. Also arab is not synonymous with muslim. Furthermore not all muslim people observe their religion or adhere to their cultural practices when they live in the usa....IMO there are any number of possibilities. My point is that you are extrapolating a lot of information from the fact that OP said he was arab. And really would these actions not be equally disrespectful had he been black or white or asian? i just don't see the correlation. I have known many arab people, as well as many muslim people, their behavior and beliefs run the gamut that others do. I am not trying to make anyone out to be a saint, just human like you and me. IMO we would need a lot more specific information about this individual to make a reasonable assertion about his particular actions towards the OP meant. I'm just not one for jumping to conclusions. Yes he was dead wrong for his actions especially since OP justifiably felt violated, but the rest is a little extra in my opinion.

An Middle-eastern christian is not going to touch another woman that way either. Secular or not, this is not appropriate behavior. And more specifically, this is referring to BLACK women...about whom many men in islamic countries consider a "slave/whore." Abid/sharmuta? This is the difference. She could be covered in a nun's habit...but with some men, if she's Black? Automatically she's a whore. This is not everyone...but it is a stereotype, a prejudice, a reality. Black people don't just have to deal with racist white Americans....they have to deal with an entire world that despises them and considers them less-than. And note, I believe the store owner was from this man's culture or country...and he profusely apologized to her for him. He was embarassed. Why? Because he knows how effed up his behavior was. Shame. No one here is hating anybody from the Middle East...we are putting things into proper perspective and this is not kosher hon.

 

[Almaz]

Exactly I have a friend from Somalia who is not religious but Went to KSA to work well his neighbour the one that managed that apartment building where he lived at thought to take it upon himself to wake him up early in the morning to go to prayer. My friend Ismail got so tired of it. He was like I don't want to be rude to the man but I am not religious I am only here to make money and I don't like being awaken at 5 am in the morning.

I said ask for his sisters or daughters hand in marriage. See what happens.

Well he did and the man NEVER EVER came to his door again. Notice the men can marry any women they want but when was the last time you saw Arab ME women married to Non Arab or ME men. I have seen Turks, Persians, Arabs, Azeris, Kurds Pakistani, all sorts of men from that part of the world married to Blacks, Whites, Hispanics, Asians all sorts of women

But how many times can you say that about women from those parts of the world married to men that are NOT a part of that culture. The ratio is startlingly low. When was the last time you heard of a Saudi or Kuwati woman married to an non Saudi or Non Kuwati man.

Just sayin

I don't feel like I'm generalizing, I used to go to this restaurant that arabs owned and I'm a very personable, I will speak and be nice to those that treat me that way. This guy thought because I was a nice person, i was easy. One night he asked me if he could take me out to dinner and I asked him if my brother could take his sister out with us for a double date? He gave me a look I'll never forget and that was the last time he ever asked me about going out.I have lived in this city all my life and I see how they treat black woman and talk to them. Like I said I'm a nice person, but don't over step your bounds with me. Now when hubby came home I told him what happen and we went to the store. My hubby told that guy if you ever disrespect my wife again, there will be no place for you to go sir, because I'll find you. He apologized again to me and him and promised e it would never happen again. He said he got carried away because my hair is always beautiful when he sees it. My hubby told him just don't ever, ever touch my wife again. Because my hubby knows how they are about their women. He said if that was him, he would be found dead somewhere.erplexed

 

[Almaz]

You are right but in that part of the world they "SUPPOSEDLY" have a higher moral standing to begin with. If you are not going to let others treat your women like Sharmutas please practise what you preach and don't treat other women from other cultures like that either

Arab, African American, Hispanic, Italian, Jewish, Muslim, Christian, Wiccan: regardless of race, color, or the religion of a man, you do not invade someone's personal space period.

I don't understand why a man of Arab descent should be held at a higher moral standard than anyone else.

 

[Almaz]

An Middle-eastern christian is not going to touch another woman that way either. Secular or not, this is not appropriate behavior. And more specifically, this is referring to BLACK women...about whom many men in islamic countries consider a "slave/whore." Abid/sharmuta? This is the difference. She could be covered in a nun's habit...but with some men, if she's Black? Automatically she's a whore. This is not everyone...but it is a stereotype, a prejudice, a reality. Black people don't just have to deal with racist white Americans....they have to deal with an entire world that despises them and considers them less-than. And note, I believe the store owner was from this man's culture or country...and he profusely apologized to her for him. He was embarassed. Why? Because he knows how effed up his behavior was. Shame. No one here is hating anybody from the Middle East...we are putting things into proper perspective and this is not kosher hon.

Thank you the store owner knew good and damn well that this was not right. He knew. He knew and he understood well what the problem was and that is why he said he apologised for the guy. This will let this man know that Black women do have husbands and protectors also.

 

[GV-NA-GI-TLV-GE-I]

On an aside I've been noticing a lot of anti-arab sentiment around me lately. i just feel that people will always grab the opportunity to be racist if they can get away with it. If it's not against hispanic people, then its arabs or native americans. Black people are no less likely to be ignorant and racist as people of other races. People in general are just sometimes.

I'm Native America and my cousin to whom you are communicating is Jewish. Try that on for size before hinting we are "likely to be ignorant and racist as people of other races"....perhaps some middle easterners towards any black people of any country???? Woman's intuition...saved many a life in this world. Her instinct kicked right in and she was right.

I'm not trying to be mean to you...I'm going to put it as it is in many a case. It's like this...the people you are speaking to? Might have middle eastern relatives and blood themselves. We have threads on here proclaiming Euro men glorifying the Black women in Europe...and Black Europeans coming on and telling them "no, no, it's not quite like that." People need to be educated about the good and the bad... It's up to the individual to determine what the situation actually was...and she was in it. I'm actually happy you have never ever been subjected to this kind of racist sexism. Consider yourself spared. I haven't been.

 

[jerseyjill]

I don't feel like I'm generalizing, I used to go to this restaurant that arabs owned and I'm a very personable, I will speak and be nice to those that treat me that way. This guy thought because I was a nice person, i was easy. One night he asked me if he could take me out to dinner and I asked him if my brother could take his sister out with us for a double date? He gave me a look I'll never forget and that was the last time he ever asked me about going out.I have lived in this city all my life and I see how they treat black woman and talk to them. Like I said I'm a nice person, but don't over step your bounds with me. Now when hubby came home I told him what happen and we went to the store. My hubby told that guy if you ever disrespect my wife again, there will be no place for you to go sir, because I'll find you. He apologized again to me and him and promised e it would never happen again. He said he got carried away because my hair is always beautiful when he sees it. My hubby told him just don't ever, ever touch my wife again. Because my hubby knows how they are about their women. He said if that was him, he would be found dead somewhere.erplexed

I APPLAUD your husband sister! God bless you both!

 

[beans4reezy]

You are right but in that part of the world they "SUPPOSEDLY" have a higher moral standing to begin with. If you are not going to let others treat your women like Sharmutas please practise what you preach and don't treat other women from other cultures like that either

Suposedly, yes, but in actuality no. There isn't a high book of morality with Arabs first on the list. I do agree with you though that if they respect their own women, that Black women are 100 percent deserving of this same respect.

 

[TexturedTresses]

MJ, your hair does look soft and pretty. If I saw you I would have the urge to touch it too. but.... i would control myself.

 

[mj11051]

MJ, your hair does look soft and pretty. If I saw you I would have the urge to touch it too. but.... i would control myself.

And if you asked me I would say yes

 

[Almaz]

When I finally men you I will rub my HANDS all up in your head hahahahaha.

 

[mj11051]

As long as you asked me first or you get bopped with my sock full of quarters.

 

[IDareT'sHair]

Chile......Errrr Day You Got: A Situation

Where You Live???

 

[msa]

Chile......Errrr Day You Got: A Situation

Where You Live???

Mmmmmhmmm at the bold.

I was just about to pm you.

 

[Almaz]

hahahah naw baby I will ask and you can cash in the quarters and put toward lunch

As long as you asked me first or you get bopped with my sock full of quarters.

 

[Almaz]

Oh Chile I just looked you live in Chicago yep are you on the South Side or the North Side most of the Arab Bodegas are on the south side in those Food store Desert Zones. Even if the neighbourhood is nice. But yeah this happens a LOT in CHI-Town in those stores. The place where I cursed the man out for calling me a Sharmuta without even knowing me was on 55th Jordan food and liquor. The owner are the Sweiss family Huge Jordanian Christian family but the man that did it was not a part of the family Hence he is no longer working there.

 

[isobell]

I'm Native America and my cousin to whom you are communicating is Jewish. Try that on for size before hinting we are "likely to be ignorant and racist as people of other races"....perhaps some middle easterners towards any black people of any country???? Woman's intuition...saved many a life in this world. Her instinct kicked right in and she was right.

I'm not trying to be mean to you...I'm going to put it as it is in many a case. It's like this...the people you are speaking to? Might have middle eastern relatives and blood themselves. We have threads on here proclaiming Euro men glorifying the Black women in Europe...and Black Europeans coming on and telling them "no, no, it's not quite like that." People need to be educated about the good and the bad... It's up to the individual to determine what the situation actually was...and she was in it. I'm actually happy you have never ever been subjected to this kind of racist sexism. Consider yourself spared. I haven't been.

wow, i'm not sure if i even understand your post, but thank you for not being mean to me...if you will go back and read my comment, i prefaced it with "on an aside", meaning other tangential thought...i have noticed enhanced "anti-arab" sentiment AROUND me. As i'm sure you realise i don't live inside lhcf, so when i say around me, I mean in the world . i've no need to hint at anything, I simply made a comment. you and your cousin are not the only people related to middle easterners, nor are you the only people with experience with cultures outside the US. The reason i cannot generalize is because i have close friends and family of many minority groups. Knowing these people intimately as I do, I can't separate myself from them and start attributing beliefs to them that i have never seen them express. Your experience is not THE TRUTH, its your truth. Realise that although your experience is authentic so is mine and the same freedom you have to express your views is the same that i have. I choose not to go through the world thinking that the beliefs of a whole culture are defined by the behavior of a few. Additionally i don't think i said i had not experienced racist sexism I was referring to being called a prostitute simply because i am a black woman. I am not a child and I have experienced many negatives things in my life. I just refuse to have my world view besmirched by the actions of a few idiots.

Does the fact that you are native american and your cousin jewish mean you cannot be racist? if so you may need to come and have a strong word with some of the people i know!

 

[Almaz]

wow, i'm not sure if i even understand your post, but thank you for not being mean to me...if you will go back and read my comment, i prefaced it with "on an aside", meaning other tangential thought...i have noticed enhanced "anti-arab" sentiment AROUND me.

Me too every time I try to fly I get stopped, searched and patted down


As i'm sure you realise i don't live inside lhcf, so when i say around me, I mean in the world .

I do think anyone LIVES inside LHCF we all have lives

i've no need to hint at anything, I simply made a comment. you and your cousin are not the only people related to middle easterners, nor are you the only people with experience with cultures outside the US. The reason i cannot generalize is because i have close friends and family of many minority groups.

Me too former UN Brat

Knowing these people intimately as I do, I can't separate myself from them and start attributing beliefs to them that i have never seen them express. Your experience is not THE TRUTH, its your truth. Realise that although your experience is authentic so is mine and the same freedom you have to express your views is the same that i have. I choose not to go through the world thinking that the beliefs of a whole culture are defined by the behavior of a few.

Neither do us and most of the people on this site

Additionally i don't think i said i had not experienced racist sexism I was referring to being called a prostitute simply because i am a black woman. I am not a child and I have experienced many negatives things in my life. I just refuse to have my world view besmirched by the actions of a few idiots.

Neither do any of us

Does the fact that you are native american and your cousin jewish mean you cannot be racist?

Whose says anything about being racists this person commited a very grave faux pas on the preconceived notion that Black women are easy. This has happened time and time again I have seen it I have witnessed it and I don't like it but that is in no way saying that ALL people are like that because I am an Arabic Speaker myself and I am just a much a part of that culture as Arabs and I know the 411

if so you may need to come and have a strong word with some of the people i know!

again this is not the put down the whole on the actions of a few but there is a problem that needs to be addressed

 

[mj11051]

Oh Chile I just looked you live in Chicago yep are you on the South Side or the North Side most of the Arab Bodegas are on the south side in those Food store Desert Zones. Even if the neighbourhood is nice. But yeah this happens a LOT in CHI-Town in those stores. The place where I cursed the man out for calling me a Sharmuta without even knowing me was on 55th Jordan food and liquor. The owner are the Sweiss family Huge Jordanian Christian family but the man that did it was not a part of the family Hence he is no longer working there.

I live on the south side in Bronzeville and not from 55th