No . . . He is the second oldest of five. The oldest male. His older sister has some kind of development issue, so he was like the oldest.
Letting Go With Positivity, Peace, Courage, And Interdependence
- Thread starter mysblossom
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No . . . He is the second oldest of five. The oldest male. His older sister has some kind of development issue, so he was like the oldest.
A few people in my life have asked me if he might be a homosexual. They told me, "I don't mean ANY harm, but do you think he might be a closet homosexual?"
I can't imagine so. Like not at all. Excuse my bluntness, but he likes vijayjay too much.
But for the sake of argument imagine he is. I would still expect him to work!!! Women work. Homosexual men work. I just . . . Aaaaaaaaagh! (smh and giving a wry smile)
I can't imagine so. Like not at all. Excuse my bluntness, but he likes vijayjay too much.
But for the sake of argument imagine he is. I would still expect him to work!!! Women work. Homosexual men work. I just . . . Aaaaaaaaagh! (smh and giving a wry smile)
hopeful
Well-Known Member
Very interesting. First born sons are usually take charge over achievers.
This is very interesting. He may not be homosexual but goodness he is extremely feminine from what you have described. WHATEVER his issue is, stay focused on YOU. You could go on for years trying to figure out what's up with him, why he does this and that. Heal YOUR heart, pursue your dreams. I know I wouldn't let no man keep me from being a mother
.Very interesting. First born sons are usually take charge over achievers.
This is very interesting. He may not be homosexual but goodness he is extremely feminine from what you have described. WHATEVER his issue is, stay focused on YOU. You could go on for years trying to figure out what's up with him, why he does this and that. Heal YOUR heart, pursue your dreams. I know I wouldn't let no man keep me from being a mother
Yes.
I am opening my mind, given the situation now, to other ways of becoming a mother AFTER I get myself together. Black children need healthy homes. If I become a mother, I want it to be a good situation for the child and not just be about my desire.
I have quite a few adoptions in my family. And who knows? If I triumph over this situation in a timely fashion, I may even get to have my own.
hopeful
Well-Known Member
Yes.
I am opening my mind, given the situation now, to other ways of becoming a mother AFTER I get myself together. Black children need healthy homes. If I become a mother, I want it to be a good situation for the child and not just be about my desire.
I have quite a few adoptions in my family. And who knows? If I triumph over this situation in a timely fashion, I may even get to have my own.
Both matter
, a good home for the child and your desires being fulfilled.
Kimbosheart
Well-Known Member
God can but most usually doesn't whisper a specific direction in your ear. As a woman of faith, you know when God has placed a feeling on your heart.
For me, it's a peace and lightness. It's that feeling that someone has removed this burden and my yoke is easy, or I feel surrounded by love and warmth as if I'm being held in the palm of a hand.
When facing a decision, especially one that tests me spiritually, I pay attention to what choice gives me a hint of that feeling. That's the way I should go, the choice I should make. The rest is fear. And I've read varying numbers, I'm no biblical scholar, but I believe the number is around 300 times the bible says "Do Not Fear"
You've got some legitimate concerns, but I agree with everyone who has said you can't control him or heal him. And this situation has already caused you to separate from God and become agnostic in your search for answers. I would think that is the last thing he wants.
For me, it's a peace and lightness. It's that feeling that someone has removed this burden and my yoke is easy, or I feel surrounded by love and warmth as if I'm being held in the palm of a hand.
When facing a decision, especially one that tests me spiritually, I pay attention to what choice gives me a hint of that feeling. That's the way I should go, the choice I should make. The rest is fear. And I've read varying numbers, I'm no biblical scholar, but I believe the number is around 300 times the bible says "Do Not Fear"
You've got some legitimate concerns, but I agree with everyone who has said you can't control him or heal him. And this situation has already caused you to separate from God and become agnostic in your search for answers. I would think that is the last thing he wants.
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@UmSumayyah, I meant to pointedly thank you for taking the time to post this message for me.
When I read back through the posts and I get to that one, I usually close my eyes and inhale and nod and say to myself, "Yes. That. So stop being soooooo hard on yourself."
It's hard not to be hard on myself about all of this. I keep thinking, "I did this to myself! Nobody forced me to marry this man." Or, "Why didn't I see this coming? I in some part did this to me."
I know that I need to reflect and learn and understand my own actions surrounding this, but your post reminds me to do it with balance.
So your post really, really helps.
And, yes: I'm really hoping this thread helps others besides myself. It is helping TREMENDOUSLY for me to have to read what I've written. And it helps TREMENDOUSLY for me to read others' thoughts and see whether I agree and why or why not.
I have NEVER had this much peace about the situation. I'm getting more and more strength every day.
Thank you to EVERYONE, and much encouragement to any and all lurkers who may be in a similar situation.
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Would you believe it if I told you that my hairdresser's story is almost the same as mine? 
She's about 10 years older than I am, and she has two kids with her husband. She told me all about her situation before I ever mentioned mine. She has actually divorced her spouse . . . finally after 10 years of drama and something like 21 years together. But it has been a struggle for her. She still cares about his well-being.
It is helpful to watch her and learn from her, as she is a few steps ahead of me with all of this.
I saw her today. She "updated" me on her situation. She met a new, kind, mature man. They are really hitting it off. She's taking things slowly and taking her time, but wow.
She is an INTERESTING soul. Good people. When she talks, she talks at the speed of light, and she says stuff like this (these aren't things she's said but things LIKE what she says):
She's gorgeous and hilarious. Such a strong lady.
She's about 10 years older than I am, and she has two kids with her husband. She told me all about her situation before I ever mentioned mine. She has actually divorced her spouse . . . finally after 10 years of drama and something like 21 years together. But it has been a struggle for her. She still cares about his well-being.
It is helpful to watch her and learn from her, as she is a few steps ahead of me with all of this.
I saw her today. She "updated" me on her situation. She met a new, kind, mature man. They are really hitting it off. She's taking things slowly and taking her time, but wow.
She is an INTERESTING soul. Good people.
When she talks, she talks at the speed of light, and she says stuff like this (these aren't things she's said but things LIKE what she says):- "See, the Lord showed me that the word 'divorce' has the word 'voice' in it. You see that? That showed me that I wasn't going to have my full VOICE until after the DIVORCE."
- "And then you see how the world 'belief" has both the words 'lie' and 'life' in it? The Lord is telling me that I won't have LIFE until I stop this LIE."
- "And now look at this, look at this: Think about the word 'marriage' . . ."
She's gorgeous and hilarious. Such a strong lady.
MsNaturalcurl82
Well-Known Member
Hi. Thank you so much for the message. I've been at the hair salon getting my hair done for my birthday, so I have time to respond while I'm under the dryer.
He grew up watching all the men around him work and take care of their families. His dad continues to work in a separate city from the mom, but they are together. He comes home on the weekends.
My spouse has two brothers. They work and take care of their families.
Wow, well it seems that you have done all you can. I'd suggest going to counseling one last time, but this time, he does not get to op-out of it. If he refuses, then you tell him that you will initiate separation. Counseling could help him get to the bottom of what his real issues are, while helping him improve his confidence, and empowering him to do what he needs to do. It would hopefully help you and him repair the marriage. Good luck, God bless.
@Mortons,
I wanted to make sure that I thank you for these words above.
The word "permissive": VERY enlightening.
The idea of confusing permissive behavior with being love and understanding . . .
VERY HELPFUL PHRASING! Thank you!And you wrote:
"From now on, you need to offer that same love and understanding to yourself and allow yourself to say "no" to situations that only serve to take away from the life you wish to build."
This might only make sense to those who grew up in a legalistic christian environment, but I have always been advised (and frankly, WARNED) to put God's desires first above mine. "The life I wish to build" comes in second to "follow God's Word."
THAT SAID
- Reading and listening to Joseph Prince has helped me see that differently, to see the overlap.
- And I believe I will be doing both . . . following God's Word AND protecting my desired life . . . if I separate so that I'm not allowing a grown, able-bodied, non-working man to eat.
I was scared that this meant I could never have a partnership, marriage, and family, so I kept trying with DH.
TIME IS *NOT* ON MY SIDE WITH THIS, IT DOESN'T SEEM
However, at this point, I'm ready to move forward. I can no longer deal with this amount of heavy unhappiness, and although I've wanted time to be on my side in this situation (i.e. giving him more time = a chance things will turn around), it doesn't seem like time is on my side here: It seems like time = permissiveness = less likelihood of changed behavior = continued enabling on my part and sin (sin = missing the mark) on his part.
I'M READY . . . AND MASCULINE VS EFFEMINATE MEN
I'm ready! I know I still have worries, but I'm ready to attend the divorce/separation group at church. And after some time, I'm ready to see how I feel dating different types of men: Masculine versus effeminate in particular. My husband has some effeminate ways. I am sure that I saw these traits as being loving and was attracted to his being a good listener, so understanding of women, a cleaner, etc. . . . especially since my dad was SO NOT understanding of my mom that she has cried about this virtually their whole marriage.
The majority of the masculine guys I grew up around in church were arrogant. The legalism and relationship teachings of the church created this, I believe. I found my husband refreshing, and no alarm bells went off. I was glad his mom taught him how to cook and clean for himself. I was glad he was sensitive to me and listened to me.
I'm pretty curious: A healthy, very masculine man: What would he be like, and what would our dynamic be like? While I've never had to complain about my spouse not listening to me or helping me around the house, my spouse is not a go-getter and largely has not been a provider. I'm guessing being with very masculine man would be very different.
Maybe one day I'll get to see!
Thanks, @MsNaturalcurl82 !
Hmm. Counseling. We'd have to do that in November and December if we did. It's a good idea, though.
I like it! Because even if it doesn't lead to us working out as a couple, it has many other benefits:
- Spouse could connect with emotional and financial help (the new grace-based church we're attending is huge and has a lot of resources, and they may guide him through them if he/we go in for counseling).
- It would provide a space for him to talk out what's going on and what he wants, is willing to do, etc.
- It would provide a space for me to communicate what I feel my options/choices are at this point, and a third party witness would serve to make it really concrete for the both of us.
Thank you so much!
Well, I have not done a good job of refraining from posting!
I know it's because my heart and mind are just SPILLING! Besides my hairdresser (who I've seen twice, the last time months ago), I haven't had anyone to talk to about all of this. I stopped talking to my church girlfriends a while ago. It just got too painful.
And talking about it instead of ruminating internally about it are two completely different things. My heart is starting to open up again. I have even started listening to a little bit of music again.
Today is my 40th birthday, so I'm making a commitment to myself to not be online all day but instead interact with the people and environment around me.
I'm not sure what Dh will do or say about today, but no matter what, I'll make it a good day.
Many blessings, ladies! Have a wonderful day.
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Godsdaughter001
Well-Known Member
Happy birthday @mysblossom!! I hope you have a wonderful day
hopeful
Well-Known Member
The Queen's Code and her other books give good insight into a healthy masculine man. Their primary focus is to provide to the ones they love. A big part of providing is financial security, going out into the world, and building a castle for his queen and family. And protecting. Providing and protecting. There's more, a lot more, but IMO if a man isn't concerned with providing those things he is not masculine. Some mothers lean too heavily on their sons emotionally and that can help create an overly emotional, more sensitive, and effeminate man sometimes. They share too much of their pain, loneliness, and heartache with the child. And some men I suppose are born this way as well.
MsNaturalcurl82
Well-Known Member
Well, I have not done a good job of refraining from posting!
I know it's because my heart and mind are just SPILLING! Besides my hairdresser (who I've seen twice, the last time months ago), I haven't had anyone to talk to about all of this. I stopped talking to my church girlfriends a while ago. It just got too painful.
And talking about it instead of ruminating internally about it are two completely different things. My heart is starting to open up again. I have even started listening to a little bit of music again.
Today is my 40th birthday, so I'm making a commitment to myself to not be online all day but instead interact with the people and environment around me.
I'm not sure what Dh will do or say about today, but no matter what, I'll make it a good day.
Many blessings, ladies! Have a wonderful day.
One thing that helps with dealing with a stressful relationship is to get out the house and do new things. Try "Meet Up", it's a good place to find community service groups and special interest groups who get together and do stuff. It's a great place to meet new friends and a good place for professional networking as well. They have all types of groups like, arts and crafts, cultural events, single professionals, Christian, Yoga, Health and Fitness, African American female social groups, pretty much anything you're looking for you can find an interest group on there.
GeorginaSparks
Well-Known Member
Happy birthday OP! I hope it works out in your favor
God_Favor
Well-Known Member
We have the ability to create our on reality. Being stuck in an unhappy situation doesn't have to be yours. This isn't your lot in life. Your post has been so honest and I appreciate you sharing and I admire your willingness to listen to all input and advice with an open mind. You haven't gotten snarky or offended at any comment. This says soooooooo much about your mind space and your character. You are so level headed and you know this situation doesn't feel right for you. It doesn't inspire or motivate you. It is actually weighing you down. You deserve everything. Don't settle based on what others think, or because he could've been a cheater or abuser etc.... You are saying I will settle because it could be worst . What kind of life is that??
I think if you decide to stay you have to accept him for who is . He isn't a provider and by the looks of it , he doesn't care to be. He seems like he prefers the role of househusband. He needs someone to take care of him. He still talking about if u leave going to stay and live off of a family member, not going out to fend for himself. I think the kids moving in , was the nail in the coffin for him to work things out in his mind that not working is just fine.
And him not working has nothing to do with you not caring enough for you. He has just made it all about him and his issue. Don't carry his mess.
I think if you decide to stay you have to accept him for who is . He isn't a provider and by the looks of it , he doesn't care to be. He seems like he prefers the role of househusband. He needs someone to take care of him. He still talking about if u leave going to stay and live off of a family member, not going out to fend for himself. I think the kids moving in , was the nail in the coffin for him to work things out in his mind that not working is just fine.
And him not working has nothing to do with you not caring enough for you. He has just made it all about him and his issue. Don't carry his mess.
Grateful For Your Posts!
There are SEVERAL posts here that are helping me SO very much that I've only had the time to "like" and haven't yet had the chance to reply to specifically. I will do so, because I re-read them and they are valuable to me and I want you to know. Thank you all so much. People are so good.
Birthday Yesterday
Yesterday was nice. In the morning my mom baby-sat the oldest nephew (he's a HANDFUL!) so that I could have some time. And my husband baby-sat the youngest nephew. Our evening baby-sitters fell through for a large part of the afternoon and evening: They are the nephews' grandparents, but they had a death in the family and had to go to the funeral home.
I was still able to do some birthday things, though! DH had planned a nice dinner outing, but I just couldn't drum up an appetite after the day's big breakfast. Instead I went to the spa and got a manicure and pedicure and massage. And DH got me a bottle of Moscato (it's my favorite).
I was grateful to reach 40. I thought of all my blessings.
One of my old friends that used to be one of my closest, closest friends wished me a happy birthday on FB and said, "I hope you are doing something special for your 40th!" She's the friend in my circle who probably has the most amazing marriage of us all. She had a really disappointing first marriage, divorced, spent her after-divorce years working on self, and then an amazing man came into her life later on and it is a beautiful thing to see! She's the type of friend who, if I had stayed close to her, would have made HUGE plans for me for my 40th birthday, gotten a sitter for me, etc., etc. She's just like that.
Reflecting
Last night I spent a little time reflecting and looking forward: This relationship has caused me to feel like a young-minded 19-year-old or something and not a grown woman. That has caused me to feel out of place around my friends and their healthy spouses. And that's caused me to do a lot of self-secluding. My spouse has mentioned several times, "You don't even talk with your girls anymore. What gives?" I wanted to say, "You not working makes socializing weird! You live with my Dad . . . Folks can invite us over but we can't invite them over . . ." But honestly, having to explain to him such things at this point just makes me feel some kind of way, so I've stopped a lot of that. Only so many years can you keep saying that type of stuff in the face of no change in behavior.
I say all of that to say this: When I had that train of thought, I didn't get down. I didn't complain. I didn't feel bad or internally whine. Instead, I recognized how amazing a blessing it is to reach 40. And I made a commitment to myself to keep moving in the right direction toward regaining my social life and sense of mature self and stop living in this weird "can we please get grown?" type of space.
Sigh. That's really serious. Being married to someone who doesn't act his age has affected me because in order to keep walking alongside him to try to help, I'M THERE WITH HIM. This has GOT to change.
Heavy stuff, but I'm feeling alright right now, though. I can see this all being a memory. I can see myself doing well soon because I've CHOSEN that for myself. I am so ready for better.
There are SEVERAL posts here that are helping me SO very much that I've only had the time to "like" and haven't yet had the chance to reply to specifically. I will do so, because I re-read them and they are valuable to me and I want you to know. Thank you all so much. People are so good.
Birthday Yesterday
Yesterday was nice. In the morning my mom baby-sat the oldest nephew (he's a HANDFUL!) so that I could have some time. And my husband baby-sat the youngest nephew. Our evening baby-sitters fell through for a large part of the afternoon and evening: They are the nephews' grandparents, but they had a death in the family and had to go to the funeral home.
I was still able to do some birthday things, though! DH had planned a nice dinner outing, but I just couldn't drum up an appetite after the day's big breakfast. Instead I went to the spa and got a manicure and pedicure and massage. And DH got me a bottle of Moscato (it's my favorite).
I was grateful to reach 40. I thought of all my blessings.
One of my old friends that used to be one of my closest, closest friends wished me a happy birthday on FB and said, "I hope you are doing something special for your 40th!" She's the friend in my circle who probably has the most amazing marriage of us all. She had a really disappointing first marriage, divorced, spent her after-divorce years working on self, and then an amazing man came into her life later on and it is a beautiful thing to see! She's the type of friend who, if I had stayed close to her, would have made HUGE plans for me for my 40th birthday, gotten a sitter for me, etc., etc. She's just like that.
Reflecting
Last night I spent a little time reflecting and looking forward: This relationship has caused me to feel like a young-minded 19-year-old or something and not a grown woman. That has caused me to feel out of place around my friends and their healthy spouses. And that's caused me to do a lot of self-secluding. My spouse has mentioned several times, "You don't even talk with your girls anymore. What gives?" I wanted to say, "You not working makes socializing weird! You live with my Dad . . . Folks can invite us over but we can't invite them over . . ." But honestly, having to explain to him such things at this point just makes me feel some kind of way, so I've stopped a lot of that. Only so many years can you keep saying that type of stuff in the face of no change in behavior.
I say all of that to say this: When I had that train of thought, I didn't get down. I didn't complain. I didn't feel bad or internally whine. Instead, I recognized how amazing a blessing it is to reach 40. And I made a commitment to myself to keep moving in the right direction toward regaining my social life and sense of mature self and stop living in this weird "can we please get grown?" type of space.
Sigh. That's really serious. Being married to someone who doesn't act his age has affected me because in order to keep walking alongside him to try to help, I'M THERE WITH HIM. This has GOT to change.
Heavy stuff, but I'm feeling alright right now, though. I can see this all being a memory. I can see myself doing well soon because I've CHOSEN that for myself. I am so ready for better.
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NOTE TO SELF:
A VERY CRUCIAL REASON FOR NOT STAYING IN THIS UNHEALTHY SITUATION
I don't feel grown. There's a 40-year-old me that I'm supposed to feel like, and she doesn't exist! I feel like some kind of teenager-ish kid begging her man, "Please work. Please work! I want to get a house some day, and maybe have kids some day. Let's grow up! Please work . . ."
I am not myself. That is not okay. That makes me cry.
Need to reconnect with the powerful truths herein:
A VERY CRUCIAL REASON FOR NOT STAYING IN THIS UNHEALTHY SITUATION
I don't feel grown. There's a 40-year-old me that I'm supposed to feel like, and she doesn't exist! I feel like some kind of teenager-ish kid begging her man, "Please work. Please work! I want to get a house some day, and maybe have kids some day. Let's grow up! Please work . . ."
I am not myself. That is not okay. That makes me cry.
Need to reconnect with the powerful truths herein:
MamaBear2012
Well-Known Member
Wow. I read this thread and was like, "dang, I could know this woman". It sounds like the churches we grew up in were very similar. I grew up in a very fundamental Baptist church in the South with the same ideology- that you have one spouse for life. If that person is unfaithful, you can divorce, but you don't get re-married. And many women in my church did this and lived single lives after their marriage. But it's something that I've always grappled with. Plenty of people left that church, divorced spouses, and went on to have what appear to be awesome second marriages.
I can't say that I "totally understand" because I'm not in your shoes, but I do understand your faith background.
I'm praying for you. If my husband did not work, I would walk away from the marriage. It might be a separation to see if he could get his act together, but I would not support a man who had no intentions of working. I echo someone else. I'd suggest fasting and praying. My childhood church also didn't talk about this much, but the Bible says that there are some things that can only be unlocked through fasting and prayer. I think that God will speak to you and give you direction.
I can't say that I "totally understand" because I'm not in your shoes, but I do understand your faith background.
I'm praying for you. If my husband did not work, I would walk away from the marriage. It might be a separation to see if he could get his act together, but I would not support a man who had no intentions of working. I echo someone else. I'd suggest fasting and praying. My childhood church also didn't talk about this much, but the Bible says that there are some things that can only be unlocked through fasting and prayer. I think that God will speak to you and give you direction.
On the way home, sermon #441 "Your Destiny Supersedes Your Mistakes" came on in the car.
There's a sermon summary on this page http://www.podfeed.net/episode/441+-+Your+Destiny+Supersedes+Your+Mistakes/2132511.
Man, that message spoke, spoke, spoke to me about not feeling like things are ruined now . . . and understanding that my destiny is just as available as it always has been.
Osteen is hope-instilling, if nothing else.
There's a sermon summary on this page http://www.podfeed.net/episode/441+-+Your+Destiny+Supersedes+Your+Mistakes/2132511.
Man, that message spoke, spoke, spoke to me about not feeling like things are ruined now . . . and understanding that my destiny is just as available as it always has been.
Osteen is hope-instilling, if nothing else.
strenght81
Well-Known Member
I think you should pray for your situation. You never know God has in store. Also your husband might be going through some things that you aren't privy to. It's good to communicate showing genuine interest.
I'm sure Osteen did not intend this, but "Connect with the Right People" (sermon #470) about loving certain people from a distance, protecting your destiny by only being around people who protect theirs, getting around the right people, etc., etc., . . . It's got me feeling downright positive and energized and excited about moving on, upward, and ahead if it does come to it.
It's like Osteen read this exact thread except that it's about a couple who's dating, and he paid the woman in the situation a visit to explain why she must move on, move up, protect hers and God's dreams for her . . . and to describe how wonderful the change will be and feel.
The next sermon, "Something Big Is Coming" #503 looks like it'll be soul uplifting, too, but I've got to get started on the day!
It's like Osteen read this exact thread except that it's about a couple who's dating, and he paid the woman in the situation a visit to explain why she must move on, move up, protect hers and God's dreams for her . . . and to describe how wonderful the change will be and feel.
The next sermon, "Something Big Is Coming" #503 looks like it'll be soul uplifting, too, but I've got to get started on the day!
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Kimbosheart
Well-Known Member
@mysblossom just curious are you listening to this from a podcast or weblink? Or do you attend Lakewood?
Hi, @Kimbosheart.
I listen to it on Sirius radio in my car. A new sermon comes on every 30 minutes and is about 20 minutes long, with commercials and announcements and all.
Lakewood is in Houston, TX, and I don't live there.
Just musing aloud:
My family would think my soul was lost if I attended Lakewood. And I hear all sorts of backlash in the Christian community against Joel Osteen. Some people feel he doesn't preach the full gospel, that he preaches "Christianity lite," that he is a prosperity preacher, that he's just a motivational speaker referencing God/Jesus/scripture every so often.
Personally, I've had enough hell-fire-and-brimstone and legalistic teaching and uber-analytical scripture sessions and sermons to last 17 lifetimes.
There's not really any danger of me getting too lax about the gospel. One of my aunts is disappointed that I get so much out of Joel and tries to steer me to "more balanced" resources. I explained to her that all this positivity IS balancing out a lot of the negativity from before. She just purses her lips at me, breathes it out, and moves on. 
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@strenght81, many, many thanks.
Your comment makes me realize that now that I'm so many years into this situation, my communication with him can't be really said to be characterized as genuine interest. It's always pretty cautious or pointed.
So I tried it a little bit this morning. I prayed and prayed before opening my mouth.
UPDATE: LATEST RELEVANT CONVERSATION WITH DH
- Me: "Can I ask you something? So, are you just basically done with going out into the work world if you don't find a job with specific features?"
- DH: "No. I realize now that I'm going to have to start over again in some new area. I was just trying to make my way back into my field and then the car happened and it just all got really challenging when I took that non-paying internship."
- Me: "So in your dream world, you are not a house husband?"
DH: "What?!?? No. No. Where is this coming from? Has something happened to make you think I'm not going to follow the plan -- to work with your Dad, get a car that just runs, and start temping if I can't find anything?" - Me: "Nothing new has happened. I'm just reading 'The Queens Code' and learning about how critical it is for masculine guys to be a provider . . . To provide in all sorts of ways. I'm just wondering if I can help."
When he finished, I took a deep breath and said, "I'm just wondering about your priorities."
DH: "My priorities?"
And then the alarm went off. Time to get older nephew ready for school.
Next time we talk, I'll share with him how it seems like he prioritizes his comfort-level (job-wise) over providing, and how that makes me feel. (I have done this before, of course). Then I will bring up the marriage counseling/class.
We'll see!
For those of you who might be worrying that I'm getting sucked in again or too hopeful, don't worry! 
I'm in a good place. A really good place. I'm okay if he starts getting it together, and I'm okay if he doesn't. 
There's too much beautiful, stress-free
, peace-filled, fun 
living LEFT to live, and I'm ready.
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Question before I go into lurker mode for the day:
How do you define love? What is your favorite definition of love?
My favorite definition of love is: "to seek the well-being of."
I first heard it at a Scream-Free Marriage seminar I attended at the grace-based church of Christ we attended in hubby's home state.
Brillllllllliaaaaaaaant!
With that definition, you can check:
). Oh, and here's the link to a couple of Scream-free Marriage resources for anyone interested:
I still see the value of all those biblical/Greek nuances for the English word love . . . You know, agape love versus eros love versus philos love, etc.
But the above definition is one that I want to share with everyone I care about. I think it would be wonderful if our little boys and girls grew up thinking of love in that way in addition to thinking of it as appreciation of others, desire for someone, like of someone, etc.
How do you define love? What is your favorite definition of love?
My favorite definition of love is: "to seek the well-being of."
I first heard it at a Scream-Free Marriage seminar I attended at the grace-based church of Christ we attended in hubby's home state.
Brillllllllliaaaaaaaant!
With that definition, you can check:
- Am I loving myself? = Am I seeking my own well-being right now?
- Does this person love me? = Does this person seek my well-being?
- Am I loving this person? = Am I seeking this person's well-being by doing this?
). Oh, and here's the link to a couple of Scream-free Marriage resources for anyone interested:- The book "Scream-free Marriage" (there's also Scream-free Parenting, etc.)
- The Scream-free blog (you have to scroll far down and look on the right-hand side for marriage-related material)
I still see the value of all those biblical/Greek nuances for the English word love . . . You know, agape love versus eros love versus philos love, etc.
But the above definition is one that I want to share with everyone I care about. I think it would be wonderful if our little boys and girls grew up thinking of love in that way in addition to thinking of it as appreciation of others, desire for someone, like of someone, etc.
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strenght81
Well-Known Member
@strenght81, many, many thanks.
Your comment makes me realize that now that I'm so many years into this situation, my communication with him can't be really said to be characterized as genuine interest. It's always pretty cautious or pointed.
So I tried it a little bit this morning. I prayed and prayed before opening my mouth.
UPDATE: LATEST RELEVANT CONVERSATION WITH DH
Then DH spoke a little about his plans, about our roles in the marriage, and some other things.
- Me: "Can I ask you something? So, are you just basically done with going out into the work world if you don't find a job with specific features?"
- DH: "No. I realize now that I'm going to have to start over again in some new area. I was just trying to make my way back into my field and then the car happened and it just all got really challenging when I took that non-paying internship."
- Me: "So in your dream world, you are not a house husband?"
DH: "What?!?? No. No. Where is this coming from? Has something happened to make you think I'm not going to follow the plan -- to work with your Dad, get a car that just runs, and start temping if I can't find anything?"- Me: "Nothing new has happened. I'm just reading 'The Queens Code' and learning about how critical it is for masculine guys to be a provider . . . To provide in all sorts of ways. I'm just wondering if I can help."
When he finished, I took a deep breath and said, "I'm just wondering about your priorities."
DH: "My priorities?"
And then the alarm went off. Time to get older nephew ready for school.
Next time we talk, I'll share with him how it seems like he prioritizes his comfort-level (job-wise) over providing, and how that makes me feel. (I have done this before, of course). Then I will bring up the marriage counseling/class.
We'll see!
There's too much beautiful, stress-free
Im glad you were able to open up and converse with your husband. I think the next conversation shouldn't be about him going out to find work and why he isn't working, it's putting stress and strain on your relationship. It's clear he is uncomfortable with not being able to provide for you and it doesn't help that your tone confirms your disgust with him.
Work on building your man's confidence in himself and in you. When you come home from work greet him with a hug and kiss. Look excited about coming home to him. Ask him about his day ( even though in your mind you may be thinking "all you did was stay home and do nothing" lol). Show him encouragement, praise him for the good that he has done for you and continue to pray for your situation. Also pray that you have restored faith in your man, love on him. Don't make the lack of employment festure in your mind. He will do right by you. It shows that he wants to but there is a block. Be the catalyst to remove it. Best of luck to the both of you
Thank you for the advice and well-wishes, @strenght81 !
Do you mean to say that my WORDS confirm disgust with him, or my tone?
You wrote: "Show him encouragement, praise him for the good that he has done for you and continue to pray for your situation. Also pray that you have restored faith in your man, love on him." I feel like I did that for month 1, month 2, month 3, month 4, month 5, month 6, month 7, month 8, month 9, month 10 . . . month 27, month 28 . . ." and that this has yielded a person COMFORTABLE with the situation . . . a person who felt I must be okay with everything despite my saying the contrary.
Now we are on month ____??? 67? 70??? I've lost track.
I do agree that I shouldn't ruminate on this as much as I do. It would be WONDERFUL if he could get unblocked. I am not sure how I can remove the block (have offered to purchase him a car, help pay for education or certification and he can repay me if that's the issue, family has offered him job hookups, etc., etc.), but I am open to the fact that God can do anything.
I think he has to remove the block. I'm here for support, though. I guess I am feeling like it's coming down to the last few months and he deserves really clear talk and knowledge of my feelings and of how this all REALLY looks and affects LIVES. (And, yes, he HAS had such clear talk all along from various sources: his family members, my family members, me, friends of his, etc.).
I'm going to pray and meditate on your words, though. I know that many times we can't see ourselves. What I feel is simply CLEAR talk might additionally display disgust, and I don't mean to display disgust, only gravity.
ETA:
I do admit I feel disgust when he starts using words to stave off working.
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Last night and this morning I've been dealing with a little bit of an emotional setback.
Last night a family member called me to check on me. He said, "You okay? You're dealing with a LOT. Learning how to take care of children, grad school, and your DH. Man, what's going on with this guy? There's something strange here about this guy, and I can't put my figure on it and can't quite figure this guy out. Observing him now for a few months, I can't see this guy ever working much less making enough to provide for you. I really want you to be careful and NOT get your hopes up. What's the end game here? You sure you're okay???"
I know the phone call was one of care, but, man! All of that made me feel sad and bad and heavy in my spirit and all that other stuff.
That's because this has been my "issue," my "story," for so long now. It feels bad to be "worried about," to always be living the kind of life where you are "worried about." After so many years, it just wears on you. You need different. You need healthy.
When I got home, I looked at DH and realized that if I were to share with him what was said to me, how it makes me feel, that this 5+ year behavior of his elicits this type of concern/worry, that I really need him to get serious about working if this relationship is going to survive and be healthy . . . if I were to share that, then I would likely get the response he typically gives: how can they say that about me when I do 'a,' 'b,' 'c,' and 'd' . . . if this isn't want you want then just let me know . . . they don't see/acknowledge all the effort that I put in and all I do for you . . . I try to do what a lot of other guys would likely not do for you in the meanwhile . . . I don't know why I have the worst luck in finding work . . . no, I can't take that available job because . . . and so on. It's never, "Good news! I submitted several job applications in several new fields and so we'll see! In the meanwhile, I found a temp agency so that I can at least start having things to put on my resume again . . ."
It's hard to shake it when you get that call that makes you feel pitiable.
Deep breath in, deep breath out. I wanted to tell that male relative, "Yeah. You really won't ever be able to put your finger on it or figure it out, unless you take the time to read a book called "Narcissistic Lovers." It's an education that just shifts your whole world. You will see my DH exactly and 'get it.'"
People are accustomed to making guesses/judgments based on past experience: "Maybe your spouse is just ____." Or, "You know what, he probably just needs . . . and you probably just need to . . . "
I know this male relative of mine would have a different take if he had the information and knowledge base that "Narcissistic Lovers" provides. But you can't just go assigning to people books to read. So at the end of the call I felt like my male relative was really wondering about me and my emotional well-being, and that made me sad. I deeply wanted to be able to say, "We're likely dealing with a clinical case of narcissism. _______ (this and this and this) is why it's so hard. ______ (this and this and this) is how this person experiences life, what this person puts others through, and what can be expected. I know all this now and am in a place to move forward."
Last night a family member called me to check on me. He said, "You okay? You're dealing with a LOT. Learning how to take care of children, grad school, and your DH. Man, what's going on with this guy? There's something strange here about this guy, and I can't put my figure on it and can't quite figure this guy out. Observing him now for a few months, I can't see this guy ever working much less making enough to provide for you. I really want you to be careful and NOT get your hopes up. What's the end game here? You sure you're okay???"
I know the phone call was one of care, but, man! All of that made me feel sad and bad and heavy in my spirit and all that other stuff.
That's because this has been my "issue," my "story," for so long now. It feels bad to be "worried about," to always be living the kind of life where you are "worried about." After so many years, it just wears on you. You need different. You need healthy.
When I got home, I looked at DH and realized that if I were to share with him what was said to me, how it makes me feel, that this 5+ year behavior of his elicits this type of concern/worry, that I really need him to get serious about working if this relationship is going to survive and be healthy . . . if I were to share that, then I would likely get the response he typically gives: how can they say that about me when I do 'a,' 'b,' 'c,' and 'd' . . . if this isn't want you want then just let me know . . . they don't see/acknowledge all the effort that I put in and all I do for you . . . I try to do what a lot of other guys would likely not do for you in the meanwhile . . . I don't know why I have the worst luck in finding work . . . no, I can't take that available job because . . . and so on. It's never, "Good news! I submitted several job applications in several new fields and so we'll see! In the meanwhile, I found a temp agency so that I can at least start having things to put on my resume again . . ."
It's hard to shake it when you get that call that makes you feel pitiable.
Deep breath in, deep breath out. I wanted to tell that male relative, "Yeah. You really won't ever be able to put your finger on it or figure it out, unless you take the time to read a book called "Narcissistic Lovers." It's an education that just shifts your whole world. You will see my DH exactly and 'get it.'"
People are accustomed to making guesses/judgments based on past experience: "Maybe your spouse is just ____." Or, "You know what, he probably just needs . . . and you probably just need to . . . "
I know this male relative of mine would have a different take if he had the information and knowledge base that "Narcissistic Lovers" provides. But you can't just go assigning to people books to read. So at the end of the call I felt like my male relative was really wondering about me and my emotional well-being, and that made me sad. I deeply wanted to be able to say, "We're likely dealing with a clinical case of narcissism. _______ (this and this and this) is why it's so hard. ______ (this and this and this) is how this person experiences life, what this person puts others through, and what can be expected. I know all this now and am in a place to move forward."
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