Why Does "struggling" With A Man Only Payoff For White Women?

[perfumenista]

@Bkbombshell said something profound in a recent thread:

Guy is down on his luck, woman comes along and uses her energy and resources to get him on track. He starts looking better, feeling better about himself, dressing better. The woman thinks he's going to be grateful, because she helped build him up from his lowly status, but then the guy runs off with another woman who had higher standards.

The "Work With A Brother" thing is a scam. It might work out 5% of the time. But 95% of the time, the first woman does all the heavy lifting and the next one that comes along reaps the benefits. I hate when BW try to sell other BW this foolishness. Men don't think like us. We see sticking with him as being loyal, they see it settling, especially when the woman has a lot going for herself (which is usually the case.) We try to pretend otherwise, but men can smell desperation and they want someone who only sees them as they see themselves now - successful, well-dressed, charming, etc. Not as the loser they were before. They don't want to be reminded of that guy.

Is there a racial component to this or am i tripping?

I'd argue that typically white dudes have no problem doing the right thing and marrying the woman that struggled with him. I've known many struggling white couples that ate beans for dinner every night, lived on a tight budget etc. in order to get to the next level.

When that guy get his med degree, business degree etc. he doesn't act brand new and leaves the woman who was by his side during his low moments. Instead his loyalty compells him to marry her and she enjoys the spoils of his success.

However, on the flip side, this type of set up generally doesn't work for black women. We all know the line from the Kayne song, "when he gets on...."

Why doesn't this set up work for black women? Is it black men's self hatred? Lack of loyalty? How can bw better position ourselves to not only recognize potential in men, but benefit from and actually enjoy it when it is realized?

 

[HairBarbie]

It could be that these women are choosing the wrong men to struggle with or it could also be the timing of how far behind or further along he was when they started struggling with him i.e has he already taken half of the steps needed to make something of his life or is he living in his mom's house and daydreaming about a better life.

 

[Gin&Tonic]

It doesn't really work for white women eather.

You struggle on the level you have too. You don't settle for struggle love. I never pays off.

 

[LeftRightRepeat]

white men leave struggle wives and "trade up" too.

 

[jerseyhaircare]

It isn't a racial thing, its a human being thing. It boils down to the character of the man. I know plenty of men who traded in their wife for a younger, hotter version once they "make it." It's because once they have more money/desirable occupations, they become more desirable to the opposite sex. Some guys value loyalty enough that they will stick with their woman, no matter what. However, many men will go for the trade in option, just because they can. Some will even admit that they were only stuck by their current mates till something better came along.

 

[sarumoki]

It doesn't really work for white women eather.

Exactly. Look at RG3.

 

[chassiecrane]

OT, but I've never met a white person struggling in my life. Every bean eating white person I know was just giving a middle finger to their parents or "society" or the establishment

 

[Crackers Phinn]

Exactly. Look at RG3.

RG3 was rich when he met his wife.

 

[Dellas]

One of the biggest white privilege is forgiveness and ability to make a mistake and get back on track.

As blacks, we can forgive ourselves, but we are held to a higher standard and pay a higher cost.

So Buffy can experiment with black guys and drugs and never be seen as a loser. She can have child OOW and still be seen as the damsel in distress needing a good yt guy to come along.

This is white privilege.
Just like the article that said rich kids major in English and working class major in Nursing. We don't have certain privileges.

Most times they have inherited wealth that also makes their fall less of a fall.
Think of Obama's Mama.
She had her parents.
She was still able to continue her education, find another man, and have a second family.

For a black woman in that same situation, instead of support she would be ridiculed, and if she was a first gen college student, she might have to use public funds to help her while still pursuing her dreams. A four year degree might take 6-8 years. And she will have to work.

 

[perfumenista]

white men leave struggle wives and "trade up" too.

But the women that that white men trade up for are typically still other white women, correct?

I guess what i'm getting at is how can bw benefit once a man becomes successful, instead of staying on the loosing end of thing?

 

[Holla]

White men coined the terms "trophy wife" and "starter marriage" - not us. Black women are not typically seen as "valuable" in this society so too many Black guys see a blonde chick as a reward for / measurement of when they become "successful" in their minds. Countless Black celebs (not to mention high earning unknown professionals) made that "upgrade" when they reached a certain level so it reinforces it in the minds of younger Black men. Not all but enough for it to be noticeable.

I met a lady last year who was dumped by her then Black med school boyfriend. That POS not only wanted a white woman but he told her that too. He said flat out that a Black woman would not add to his success as a soon to be doctor so he dumped her. Where did he get that idea if not from what he saw in society? !!!! SMH

 

[sarumoki]

RG3 was rich when he met his wife.

They met when they were in college.

 

[toaster]

They met when they were in college.

RG III was a top college QB in college. He was small and too mobile so people had doubts, but he was always going to be in the NFL.

That's kind of like people saying LeBron's wife met him in high school. That doesn't mean much when you're identified as a top prospect from a young age.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

They met when they were in college.

I stand corrected. RGIII was not rich when he met his wife. He was expected to be rich immediately after college and he was.

 

[Leeda.the.Paladin]

OP, this happens to white women too. I've seen it quite a few times with women who marry a med student, get him through school and residency, only to have him run off with a new woman once his practice is established.

 

[tibb1908]

Exactly. Look at RG3.

I don't think athletes are a good example because they can date who they want (beautiful women) because the women see the dollar signs in the very near future. I don't think it's really struggling with a man who's a college athlete because everything is given to him, especially if he's good.

 

[tibb1908]

I never saw a benefit in working with a brother. Find someone who's on your level and stop worrying about struggle dudes.

 

[Dellas]

White men coined the terms "trophy wife" and "starter marriage" - not us. Black women are not typically seen as "valuable" in this society so too many Black guys see a blonde chick as a reward for / measurement of when they become "successful" in their minds. Countless Black celebs (not to mention high earning unknown professionals) made that "upgrade" when they reached a certain level so it reinforces it in the minds of younger Black men. Not all but enough for it to be noticeable.

I met a lady last year who was dumped by her then Black med school boyfriend. That POS not only wanted a white woman but he told her that too. He said flat out that a Black woman would not add to his success as a soon to be doctor so he dumped her. Where did he get that idea if not from what he saw in society? !!!! SMH

All brown women are dealing with this:

https://qz.com/1016554/aziz-ansari-...tors-have-reduced-brown-women-to-a-punchline/

 

[Dellas]

The pursuit of white women: Brown actors like Aziz Ansari have reduced brown women to a punchline

https://qz.com/1016554/aziz-ansari-...tors-have-reduced-brown-women-to-a-punchline/

 

[BK Bombshell]

I'm just seeing this.

My point was not that it doesn't happen to other races because it absolutely does. My point was that many BW are quick to tell other BW to Work With a Brother(TM) even when there's no evidence that he's worth working with. Plenty of WW do the same and get dumped later, but I don't care about what they're doing. As I've said many many times, my only goal is to see BW winning.

Becky is always looking for the best option because she always tries to elevate herself. We should be doing the same and that will only happen if we stop deluding ourselves about what we see. If a guy is a bum, all the love and support in the world won't change him unless he wants to change. Yet some of us insist on giving chance after chance and pouring all our energy into a man that didn't deserve it in the first place and not only doesn't want to change - at least for you - but resents you for it.

My biggest problem with WWAB is that for the most part, a lot of BW don't do it strategically. Dude will have absolutely no proof that he is trying to do anything - no track record of success or completions or even a simple plan that he's executing, nothing but words. Yet another BW will hype him up like he could be the next Barack Obama and should be given a chance. Next thing you know, things go all the way left and said BW is in a situation that shouldn't have happened in the first place. It doesn't make sense. The women that are successful with working with a guy usually sees something tangible- whether it's a strong work ethic, intelligence, resilience - that's applicable to being successful. She also sees he has a goal he's working toward. The key is he's ALREADY doing something. This is where the vetting should go into overdrive because you have to assess whether his plan is realistic and he's the guy to execute it.

Everybody has potential. So what? We should be demanding much more than potential to give a guy a chance.

A lot of women go into relationships thinking they're slot machines. "If I put x amount of love and care into this guy, it's going to pay off." It doesn't work that way. As I said in my post, men don't think like us. Also some of us don't want to admit that we just don't want to be alone. There's nothing wrong with that. But don't try to convince your friends that Bummy McBummerson is a great guy and he's going to do this that and the next when it's clear to everyone that he's content to continue doing the bare minimum to eat and have a roof over his head. Many BW bought into the "prove yourself" mentality so much that we think that getting in the trenches with him and building him up will make him grateful and fall madly in love. Every man I know in a happy relationship was inspired by his wife to be better. She gently encouraged him and helped SOMETIMES, but she also knew her value and let him come to her. She wasn't trying to prove anything because she gave him the impression that he'd be lucky to have her. (I CANNOT STAND Steve Harvey, but he's the poster boy for this. Most women think the first wife should be the one at the Paris shows and on IG; most men probably think that Marjorie was the North Star that inspired him to do better so she deserves everything.)

I think it was Muslim Bushido that said hope is not a strategy. And that's what a lot of BW do: hope that he's going to be the man you want someday and then wake up 5-10-20 years later wondering what happened. That's my problem with WWAB for BW.

 

[Gin&Tonic]

But the women that that white men trade up for are typically still other white women, correct?

I guess what i'm getting at is how can bw benefit once a man becomes successful, instead of staying on the loosing end of thing?

I edited this to get to the point:
The point is- Be more selfish. Keep looking for the comeup. Worry about love after you are secure. Most of us are poor-we can't afford go-nowhere struggle love with a dude who (odds are )will turn out not to love us anyway.

What I said before:

Step your game up. Its working for me.

I got my ex-husband to send me to school for an MBA. The MBA was used after that divorce not to make money but for access to men with more money.

I accentuated the looks I had to appeal to men with money.

I pretended not to care about money.

 

[perfumenista]

I edited this to get to the point:
The point is- Be more selfish. Keep looking for the comeup. Worry about love after you are secure. Most of us are poor-we can't afford go-nowhere struggle love with a dude who (odds are )will turn out not to love us anyway.

What I said before:

Step your game up. Its working for me.

I got my ex-husband to send me to school for an MBA. The MBA was used after that divorce not to make money but for access to men with more money.

I accentuated the looks I had to appeal to men with money.

I pretended not to care about money.

Bingo! Can you please go into a bit more detail about the bolded?

 

[hopeful]

...
I guess what i'm getting at is how can bw benefit once a man becomes successful, instead of staying on the loosing end of thing?

By never agreeing to be the sacrifice. By not putting her needs on hold while a man feeds her a steady diet of fantasy and someday we will do this, someday we will do that. I think the issue is that the type of woman who can struggle and suffer for long periods of time attracts the kind of man who is ok with her suffering.

I personally believe that real men are not ok with their women being left alone for long periods while they study, pursue their dreams, etc. There is a level of intense focus and selfishness required to allow another person to suffer for them in the first place. In other words givers attract takers. The man is using that woman to have his needs met while she waits. She is a situational wife for his current situation. Once he gets where he wants to go he wants a different type of women for his new situation. But either way it's about him and his needs first and foremost.

Extreme caretaking and patience attracts a user. So I think the best way for all women to win is to be more balanced, to not be a taker or a giver, but a person who requires reciprocity always and from the start.

If we both meet in grad school and we both finish together that's one thing. But IMO it's never a good idea to put your life or needs on hold for anyone, no matter how big the pay off may appear.

 

[awhyley]

Can someone tag the poster who started that thread about how working with a brother only works for white women. Cause this is a clear "working with a brother" fail and #noblackwomenwereharmed.

May we draw your attention to the thread below:
Link: https://www.longhaircareforum.com/t...billionaire-and-his-wife-is-not-happy.820611/

 

[movingforward13]

I edited this to get to the point:
The point is- Be more selfish. Keep looking for the comeup. Worry about love after you are secure. Most of us are poor-we can't afford go-nowhere struggle love with a dude who (odds are) will turn out not to love us anyway.

What I said before:

Step your game up. Its working for me.

I got my ex-husband to send me to school for an MBA. The MBA was used after that divorce not to make money but for access to men with more money.

I accentuated the looks I had to appeal to men with money.

I pretended not to care about money.

Preach!

 

[sarumoki]

RG III was a top college QB in college. He was small and too mobile so people had doubts, but he was always going to be in the NFL.

That's kind of like people saying LeBron's wife met him in high school. That doesn't mean much when you're identified as a top prospect from a young age.

I stand corrected. RGIII was not rich when he met his wife. He was expected to be rich immediately after college and he was.

That doesn't really negate my point, which is that he still left her in the end and is now all on social media talking about how his new girl and his new baby are his sun and moon and his whole life while wife and baby #1 are basically kicking rocks somewhere.

As for Savannah James, didn't they just get married a couple of years ago? I would say she got lucky because she could just as easily have been another Laura Govan.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

That doesn't really negate my point, which is that he still left her in the end and is now all on social media talking about how his new girl and his new baby are his sun and moon and his whole life while wife and baby #1 are basically kicking rocks somewhere.

As for Savannah James, didn't they just get married a couple of years ago? I would say she got lucky because she could just as easily have been another Laura Govan.

My point with RGIII was more of that his wife didn't spend their courtship building him up to be rich. Odds are he had a full ride scholarship with living expenses paid plus foot player perks so her entire ride with him was a come up on her end.

I think what the OP is getting at is more of women who have spent a good deal of time building men up just to be cast aside when they come up.

The old ladies used to say don't buy a man a pair of shoes because he will use them to walk all over you and right out of your life I think the relevence to this discussion is that it hurts to be dumped for another woman. There's an added level of betrayal if you can directly reference how the man used you as a come up and then went on to use that to benefit the new chick, i.e., Steve Harvey's ex wives or when George Lopez' wife donated him a kidney and he left her right afterwards so he could date 20 year olds.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Savanna is the exception to the baby mama rule turned wife to a pro athlete rule.

 

[Brwnbeauti]

white men leave struggle wives and "trade up" too.

I'd say they created and perfected this method.

 

[LiftedUp]

My mother warned me about this mess when I was a teen. She even gave me real life examples of men who were no longer with their first wives or the women who put them through university.

 

[greight]

My point with RGIII was more of that his wife didn't spend their courtship building him up to be rich. Odds are he had a full ride scholarship with living expenses paid plus foot player perks so her entire ride with him was a come up on her end.

I think what the OP is getting at is more of women who have spent a good deal of time building men up just to be cast aside when they come up.

The old ladies used to say don't buy a man a pair of shoes because he will use them to walk all over you and right out of your life I think the relevence to this discussion is that it hurts to be dumped for another woman. There's an added level of betrayal if you can directly reference how the man used you as a come up and then went on to use that to benefit the new chick, i.e., Steve Harvey's ex wives or when George Lopez' wife donated him a kidney and he left her right afterwards so he could date 20 year olds.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Savanna is the exception to the baby mama rule turned wife to a pro athlete rule.

Damn - can we repo kidneys? He's scum of the earth for that