Why is birth control/contraception wrong?

[Iwanthealthyhair67]

I'm just not just how what I said got tagged the rhythm method does not waste, block or kill the seed ...

Please do not misunderstand my opinions- If you totally disagree with everything I am about to say please take away this one point. God should be the final authority for everything in our lives including contraception.


This is NOT an attack on you or anyone but some of your statements have made me sad . Why? I'll tell you. Your train of thought appears to line up with some of the erroneous info I hear non-believers citing. I've highlighted a few things and would like to present you with a different POV. May I?
So now the earth is FULLY populated, overly really, so its not a commandment to have a whole lot of children.
So, The God who said be fruitfull and mulitply, who also said I am God and I change not, and also said his word is eternal is now wrong and out of control of the human population in 2012. What He didn't know 2012 was coming? He needs our help b/c our biggest and brightest humans have a certain number and certain races in mind as acceptable. We believe them even though we know they cannot be wiser than God who has not changed. Mkay
Is the earth really overpopulated or do we have a problem with selfishness that shows up in a lot of forms? Case in point a few years ago in Myanmar when the tsunami hit as usual the crazy bible thumpin' Christians and mean ole Westerners donated money immediately to the cause. Within a very short amount of time boats and planes loaded with supplies desperately needed arrived on the shores of Myanmar. Most of them sat there and rotted/ were never used b/c the local government would not accept them. The same thing happens in countries all over the world especially on the continent of Africa. Supplies arrive>crooked or ignorant gov officials do not allow said supplies to be distributed> crooked officials only allow certain ppl access to supplies> majority of ppl die. Or you have phony charities that rob from collected donations and pocket the majority leaving little for those in need. That's a problem with morals/ integrity. Many stories of dwindling food supply sound credible on the surface until you dig deeper. When you learn of all of the red tape and interesting practices of farmers being told what to grow, how much, of food being destroyed for no reason, food being patented etc. If God is God and has somehow been managing to keep the human population in control for the past several thousand years, why does he need our help now? Wars, disease, other natural disasters, plus plain ole human stupidity will keep all of that in check. Plus, let's say all the intelligent and all the believers follow the standard boy for me, girl for you, praise the Lord now we're through rule in the interest of keeping population to a certain level, will the ignorant do the same? So, we already live in a world where the non-believers have more live births that believers. In the next generation, who is going to represent Christ? Have you seen the end results of population control? Check out what is happening in China (kidnappings, rape, etc) and Japan. It's not good. It sounded good back in the 80's when it was being implemented though. We cannot play God. His thoughts are so far above ours. We have and waste so much food here. If the food got to where it needed to go w/o all the hinderances everyone could eat and then some. Have you ever worked in a restaurant? I have. The amount of food thrown away is staggering! Plus, the very concept of restaurants is a luxury.
If you have a husband and a wife that only makes $32,000/year and can't afford children, I would rather them take the steps to prevent pregnancy until they are financially stable verses them bringing kids into this world they cant afford to take care of.
Interesting, how do you arrive at the number of financial stability? BTW, what it truly takes to meet human necessity versus what we have redefined our expectations of living to be are two entirely different things. I do not think couples should procreate like bunnies but I do know that a lot of what we want to have is all extra. As a result, while I would not want to live on less than a certain dollar amount a year, I could. I would have to change my thinking and be twice as smart with my money. I would have to learn not to compare my existence with that of others and the like. Others can do the same but they don't want to (selfish maybe?). I would rather a loving couple to raise kids on a less than lavish lifestyle than a couple loaded financially to have kids but be too busy to be bothered with parenting (which is often what happens). So, the kids get material goods but no substance.
Like this women on TV with these 20 kids. She almost died her last two pregnancy and just had a miscarriage. Now by no means am I trying to talk down about this woman. But her health and life is in jeproady.I'll admit, I'm not a member of the quiver full movement but I respect the Duggar's right to choose (interestingly enough it seems they meet your criteria for a family but you disapprove of the number of kids they have knowing that 1- the kids will be well taken care of in the event of either parent’s demise and 2- the kids are being taught fiscal skills that will enable them to survive w/o dependence on anyone else ). Did you know they were financially independent well before a TV camera ever started rolling? They seem to love each other. The kids seem to be well adjusted children. They appear to seek God first. I would not want 20 kids. I wouldn't want 1/2 that number but, they are not public assistance recipients. Their offspring will likely not inherit the lifestyle those a part of the poverty cycle will. I have not seen anything to say her life is in jeopardy either. If it is, I respect her right to choose just like someone can refuse cancer treatment or something. I will say I would much rather married, in love, Mrs. Duggar to have kids than long term public assistance (like for the past several generations w/ no end of dependency in sight) BM/ BF (yeah men too) to be out there procreating like there’s no tomorrow.

 

[LucieLoo12]

So I guess husbands and wife just go at it like bunny rabbits and have 12 kids they cant afford .

No one has yet to provide biblical scripture on why birth control is right or wrong. Which goes back to my ORIGINAL point. If someone does decide to do it or not, no one is wrong. It doesn't matter if we write essay size responses to the question, it all comes down to PERSONAL PREFERENCE. We have gotten HEALTH reasons on why BC may not be ok, and thats fine. When I was making my comment, I was giving situations on why a couple may want to use it. I am not going to condemn anyone on wanting to take precautions for themselves.


And I realize that God is the same and dont change. But if you look in the bible one of the commandments in the old testament was, we shouldnt wear any type of material that is mixed. I know 99% of us is wearing a shirt mixed with cotton or polyester today. We have to seek out and see why God said certain things at certain times. Yes he said be fruitful and multiply, but why? Because the Earth was not inhabitated. Back then men had more than one wives. Why? To help with reproduction. Now it's a sin to commit adultery. You must have ONE wife. Certains things was done for certain times. We just have to research things and not come to conclusion without studying it.


So I am done with the issue. I've stated my point of view and I'm not going to keep proving it. If some dont agree....well. We may agree to disagree.

 

[CoilyFields]

^^^I agree that I have yet to see the Biblical support of contraception being a sin.

Question: For those who believe birth control is a sin, do you also believe that inducing pregnancy (IVF) a sin as well? Becuase you are interferring in God's process?

And I am also curious as to why some people consider NFP ok but not medical contraception? I know there was an attempt to explain it above but I still dont understand the difference. In both instances you are taking steps (natural or artificial) to prevent pregnancy. Im confused...

I do understand the objections due to medicines having side effects (which doesnt make it wrong just not preferable for some)

 

[cutiebe2]

^^^I agree that I have yet to see the Biblical support of contraception being a sin.

Question: For those who believe birth control is a sin, do you also believe that inducing pregnancy (IVF) a sin as well? Becuase you are interferring in God's process?

And I am also curious as to why some people consider NFP ok but not medical contraception? I know there was an attempt to explain it above but I still dont understand the difference. In both instances you are taking steps (natural or artificial) to prevent pregnancy. Im confused...

I do understand the objections due to medicines having side effects (which doesn't make it wrong just not preferable for some)

I think it was explained that the was hormonal BC works, it prevents a fertilized egg from attaching to the Uterus, so it is "killing" a life (if life starts at conception). NFP just tries to make sure life isn't created in the first place.
at least that is what I gathered

 

[aribell]

The only thing I can think of with respect to the biblical perspective on children is that I cannot recall any instance in Scripture where another child was not considered a blessing. Even David, in the midst of being judged for adultery and murder, deeply wanted that child to live, and the fact that the baby died was a part of his punishment. Now, I know that a child passing away is different than one not being conceived at all, but I just always thought it was striking how much, even in that circumstance, David wanted that child.


NFP advocates will begin with the principle that sex is unitive and procreative. It is wrong to attempt to separate the procreative part of sex from the unitive part of sex. It is like taking something that God created and only taking the part that you want and leaving the other out (blocking sperm, stopping implantation, etc). NFP advocates would also say that a couple who chooses not to have sex when the woman is fertile is not separating out the unitive and procreative elements of sex. Everything is still present, and if she gets pregnant, OK. But they are still engaging in the act itself holistically.

So I think there are really two issues at play. One is whether attempting to control the number of kids you have is OK, and under what circumstances. And the other is whether it is OK to change the biological component of sex such that conception/implantation is rendered impossible.

 

[LucieLoo12]

Agreed.

We all know that when it comes to any type of BC, that none is 100 %. For ME it would to control when and how many. I dont want to be preggie 6 weeks after I get married and I dont want to be preggie every year either. But if I do get preggie while I am on BC, Glory TO GOD!

So I think there are really two issues at play. One is whether attempting to control the number of kids you have is OK, and under what circumstances. And the other is whether it is OK to change the biological component of sex such that conception/implantation is rendered impossible.

 

[loolalooh]

Ladies, can we just agree to disagree and end this discussion?

We each have shared our own personal beliefs and are just beating a dead horse at this point. Just because I am against BC and NFP, doesn't mean I'm going to produce 12+ kids or 19+ kids. I'll produce however many children the Lord wants me to produce. (For example, my maternal grandmother never used BC/NFP and only had one - yes, one - child. My paternal grandmother didn't use BC/NFP and only had three children, I believe.)

I have Scripture to support my personal belief, and no, it doesn't come in the form of "Let us be fruitful". I've already quoted Scripture in the previous pages.

So, let us just agree to disagree. I may think one is blocking God's blessing by using BC/NFP, but don't think that I am foolish for giving God control of my womb.

^^^I agree that I have yet to see the Biblical support of contraception being a sin.

Question: For those who believe birth control is a sin, do you also believe that inducing pregnancy (IVF) a sin as well? Becuase you are interferring in God's process?

For me, the answer is yes.

 

[sidney]

This thread makes my head hurt [but in a good way I think]. I like that Prudent suggested prayer, which I had never really considered asking the Lord how many children I to have...which is great! But, the steward in me is saying a baby every year is just not practical. If God has called me to be X,Y,Z...it's not practical to do the things he has called me do with serial pregnancies. The important thing has been already suggested, ask the Lord. Hagar and Abraham had a baby that was not in God's plan...at a time when it was acceptable for men to have multiple children by multiple concubines...yet it was not the Lords plan for him. We are still dealing with the results of that decision today. We can't swing the pendulum all the way on the other side. Let's be good stewards but most importantly stay prayerful!

 

[CoilyFields]

I think it was explained that the was hormonal BC works, it prevents a fertilized egg from attaching to the Uterus, so it is "killing" a life (if life starts at conception). NFP just tries to make sure life isn't created in the first place.
at least that is what I gathered

Gotcha! Ok. I see what you mean now. I know that some hormonal birth control methods do this but others work before fertilization by preventing the release of mature eggs. So I guess it depends on what kind of hormonal methods you use. And so in this case things like condoms, spermicide etc are ok contraceptives as well?

 

[cutiebe2]

Ladies, can we just agree to disagree and end this discussion?

We each have shared our own personal beliefs and are just beating a dead horse at this point. Just because I am against BC and NFP, doesn't mean I'm going to produce 12+ kids or 19+ kids. I'll produce however many children the Lord wants me to produce. (For example, my maternal grandmother never used BC/NFP and only had one - yes, one - child. My paternal grandmother didn't use BC/NFP and only had three children, I believe.)

I have Scripture to support my personal belief, and no, it doesn't come in the form of "Let us be fruitful". I've already quoted Scripture in the previous pages.

So, let us just agree to disagree. I may think one is blocking God's blessing by using BC/NFP, but don't think that I am foolish for giving God control of my womb.




For me, the answer is yes.

I think this was actually I healthy debate. Maybe there was some shade that I just didn't read.

I think its important to learn of both views the right way and be able to question them as to why. I never knew that there was different types of hormonal BC in terms of blocking the fertilized egg. I learned something in here

Republicans are out debating birth control on our behalf. Women on both side should be heard, even if its in the confines of LHCF

 

[sidney]

I think this was actually I healthy debate. Many there was some shade that I just didn't read.

I think its important to learn of both views the right way and be able to question them as to why. I never knew that there was different types of hormonal BC in terms of blocking the fertilized egg. I learned something in here

Republicans are out debating birth control on our behalf. Women on both side should be heard, even if its in the confines of LHCF

I think it is too...Loolalooh, if you feel that some of us are missing the boat here, please keep explaining. I'm open to your opinions about it.

 

[loolalooh]

I think this was actually I healthy debate. Maybe there was some shade that I just didn't read.

I think its important to learn of both views the right way and be able to question them as to why. I never knew that there was different types of hormonal BC in terms of blocking the fertilized egg. I learned something in here

Republicans are out debating birth control on our behalf. Women on both side should be heard, even if its in the confines of LHCF

I thought it was a healthy debate as well, but now it's getting unhealthy. This is almost feeling like a thread from the Off Topic forum. Christians will have varying degrees of opinions based on how God convicts them. I agree, women on both sides should be heard. It is not expected that we will all have the same viewpoint. However, what separates us from the world is that we back our beliefs by Scripture ... not by how we "feel" or what we "want". The latter is derived from the flesh.

I think it is too...Loolalooh, if you feel that some of us are missing the boat here, please keep explaining. I'm open to your opinions about it.

If everyone is on the boat of relying on Scripture (or even on what the Lord personally told them), I'm on that boat. We can debate on the interpretation of the Scripture, what this Scripture says versus what that one says, etc. Once, we start getting away from that and talking about "well, I only want" ... then I'm off that boat.

 

[LucieLoo12]

I think it was going fine. I just dont like anyone to point out some one's opinion in particular and call it wrong with out backing it up facts.

I keep stating over and over, no one is wrong in this......

I think this was actually I healthy debate. Maybe there was some shade that I just didn't read.

I think its important to learn of both views the right way and be able to question them as to why. I never knew that there was different types of hormonal BC in terms of blocking the fertilized egg. I learned something in here

Republicans are out debating birth control on our behalf. Women on both side should be heard, even if its in the confines of LHCF

 

[LucieLoo12]

As far as scripture goes on THIS topic, I believe the only time someone can call someone's statement WRONG is if they have a scripture supporting. Other than its personal preferences...

Lets be careful we are not reading comments in the wrong way as well.. (not to you, just speaking generally)

I thought it was a healthy debate as well, but now it's getting unhealthy. This is almost feeling like a thread from the Off Topic forum. Christians will have varying degrees of opinions based on how God convicts them. I agree, women on both sides should be heard. It is not expected that we will all have the same viewpoint. However, what separates us from the world is that we back our beliefs by Scripture ... not by how we "feel" or what we "want". The latter is derived from the flesh.



If everyone is on the boat of relying on Scripture, I'm on that boat. We can debate on the interpretation of the Scripture, what this Scripture says versus what that one says, etc. Once, we start getting away from that and talking about "well, I only want" ... then I'm off that boat.

 

[loolalooh]

As far as scripture goes on THIS topic, I believe the only time someone can call someone's statement WRONG is if they have a scripture supporting. Other than its personal preferences...

Lets be careful we are not reading comments in the wrong way as well.. (not to you, just speaking generally)

People had Scripture that they believed supported it. We can debate upon whether that person's interpretation of the Scripture was correct. We can bring in Scripture to justify the other side of the argument. That's all fine.

I don't like pointing out people, but I guess I have to get specific. One poster based her argument on "Don't be so heavenly minded that you are no earthly good". That is not a biblical statement. As a matter of fact, that is a defense mechanism the world uses against a believer. I wouldn't expect to hear such a comment in a Christian thread ... an Off Topic thread, yes, but a Christian thread?

 

[sidney]

I think it was going fine. I just dont like anyone to point out some one's opinion in particular and call it wrong with out backing it up facts.

I keep stating over and over, no one is wrong in this......

This is true. On the topic of how many children one should have, it will vary from person to person. God will have different plans for each person so therefore there can be no consensus on that. Each person will have to pray and find out. No more or no less will be born than what God wills anyway.

 

[LucieLoo12]

loolalooh

We have to know that when we do a thread we can't control on what type of responses we get. Some will be good, and some will be bad. But dont let a couple of comments make you feel as though the thread was ruined. I believe alot of women got some very good information in here.

People had Scripture that they believed supported it. We can debate upon whether that person's interpretation of the Scripture was correct. We can bring in Scripture to justify the other side of the argument. That's all fine.

I don't like pointing out people, but I guess I have to get specific. One poster based her argument on "Don't be so heavenly minded that you are no earthly good". That is not a biblical statement. As a matter of fact, that is a defense mechanism the world uses against a believer. I wouldn't expect to hear such a comment in a Christian thread ... an Off Topic thread, yes, but a Christian thread?

 

[loolalooh]

loolalooh

We have to know that when we do a thread we can't control on what type of responses we get. Some will be good, and some will be bad. But dont let a couple of comments make you feel as though the thread was ruined. I believe alot of women got some very good information in here.

You've got a point.

 

[sidney]

@loolalooh

We have to know that when we do a thread we can't control on what type of responses we get. Some will be good, and some will be bad. But dont let a couple of comments make you feel as though the thread was ruined. I believe alot of women got some very good information in here.

I agree. I feel more open minded about how many children I can have one day from this thread...wouldn't have considered it before. So, the opinions here have not been made in vain. We all just have to be open to God's will and his plan for our lives. I must admit, I am partial to NFP but with no basis [not from scripture/prayer]. What do y'all think about Onan wasting his seed? Do you think God was angry because this was natural "birth control" or because he defrauded his brother's wife?

 

[Iwanthealthyhair67]

Acutally, I want to be so heavenly minded that I am no earthly good...

People had Scripture that they believed supported it. We can debate upon whether that person's interpretation of the Scripture was correct. We can bring in Scripture to justify the other side of the argument. That's all fine.

I don't like pointing out people, but I guess I have to get specific. One poster based her argument on "Don't be so heavenly minded that you are no earthly good". That is not a biblical statement. As a matter of fact, that is a defense mechanism the world uses against a believer. I wouldn't expect to hear such a comment in a Christian thread ... an Off Topic thread, yes, but a Christian thread?

 

[aribell]

Ladies, can we just agree to disagree and end this discussion?

We each have shared our own personal beliefs and are just beating a dead horse at this point. Just because I am against BC and NFP, doesn't mean I'm going to produce 12+ kids or 19+ kids. I'll produce however many children the Lord wants me to produce. (For example, my maternal grandmother never used BC/NFP and only had one - yes, one - child. My paternal grandmother didn't use BC/NFP and only had three children, I believe.)

I have Scripture to support my personal belief, and no, it doesn't come in the form of "Let us be fruitful". I've already quoted Scripture in the previous pages.

So, let us just agree to disagree. I may think one is blocking God's blessing by using BC/NFP, but don't think that I am foolish for giving God control of my womb.

For me, the answer is yes.

I don't think the discussion is directed at you; it's just that whatever the church teaches in general will have particular implications for every woman. Not all women will end up with big families, but many would; so I don't think it's a judgment on you or big families in general. It's that women like myself with our particular family history want to know what the implications of certain practices will be.

If that's what the Lord wants, it's fine, but it does change things.

 

[Rainbow Dash]

I think that this thread has some great information. Great points especially on praying to God and asking His will in family planning. I did not ask God, I just got pregnant while on the pill. I wanted to wait 5 years, God gave us 3. With my second child, in my heart I wanted another child, so my husband and I decided to get pregnant and we did.

So, asking God is wise. People can choose how they want to plan. If a family feels they can't have or should not have more kids, I think that God will honor that too. It is really up to the family and God. Each situation is different, there is no scripture against birth control as long as we are not aborting babies.

If someone chooses NFP that is okay, if some chooses modern medicine that is okay with the understanding that there are risks. Me personally, I could not risk getting pregnant again so we had to take serious precautions and I do not feel that God is upset with us.

We have to remember that we live in a fallen world and the consequences of sin in the garden are still affecting Christians, if not, Christians would never get sick, die, or need any surgeries.

 

[sidney]

I actually have a real headache now...I will have to lay on my face about this. It does seem like in every other aspect of our faith, we are "open" to what God has for us. But it's almost like birth control/NFP "intercepts" God's natural plan. In his word, God says...before you were in your mother's wound...I knew you....he knows the time, place, and date for each of us. So...if I was not meant to conceive on X date, God will not allow it to happen...because according to his plan, baby X was not supposed to be born at that time. Seems like intercepting it is like limiting God's control. However...this all goes against reasoning to just go for it and literally multiply. But that is what the word says...I will pray about it.

 

[sidney]

Also, I would like it if some pro-NFP'ers comment on my question about Onan wasting his seed...

 

[Rainbow Dash]

I actually have a real headache now...I will have to lay on my face about this. It does seem like in every other aspect of our faith, we are "open" to what God has for us. But it's almost like birth control/NFP "intercepts" God's natural plan. In his word, God says...before you were in your mother's wound...I knew you....he knows the time, place, and date for each of us. So...if I was not meant to conceive on X date, God will not allow it to happen...because according to his plan, baby X was not supposed to be born at that time. Seems like intercepting it is like limiting God's control. However...this all goes against reasoning to just go for it and literally multiply. But that is what the word says...I will pray about it.

I get what you are saying. In a perfect world this would be wonderful. Christians still have to use wisdom. There are Christian women that still have pregnancy complications, miscarriages, and still births just like anyone else. My point is that if I did not stop, I was putting my life at risk and I do not think that God is upset about it. It is like using common sense but I know many Christians do not feel that we should use common sense but only ask God. If that were the case, our brains should be taken away once we accept Christ. There is no need to really think.

Just like a story a read years ago about a Christian woman who was fasting a lot and it was affecting her health. She ended up dying because she would not listen to those who told her that she needed to use some wisdom and stop but she felt because she was doing it for God that it was okay. That woman is dead, she went on to be with the Lord. Her health was too far gone. If maybe she had listened to wisdom she would be alive today.

 

[sidney]

^^I think that for health reasons it's understandable, if the husband and wife presented this to God and God was in agreement. And if they couldn't perceive an answer, yes, wisdom is the principal thing! I agree! However, for women who do not have health issues...I was thinking about the two ladies who said they got pregnant while on birth control...it made me feel like God was "overriding" something that was blocked. And it made me think of Fred Hammond's testimony. His mother had an abortion, twice to removed the conceptus, but both attempts failed. God had a plan for Fred Hammond but he had to "override" what was done. And the fact, the he overrode made me feel like this action was "against" his will or at least not permitting him to control the process of creation. We could argue that, If God wanted individuals to still have children while on NFP/birth control...he can make it happen. Which is true. But with obviously God's does not always block the free will of individuals who decide to have an abortion. Its possible that "missed" pregnancies are taking place by abstaining. There's the scripture that says that husband and wife should only refuse to come together for the purpose of fasting/prayer or something like that. Not to prevent pregnancy. And of course, the scripture about Onan spilling the seed...which is like birth control.

Someone mentioned Paul being single, and therefore avoiding the conception process. But Paul was submitted to God's will. Likewise, married people should submit to God's will. I think in the end it's all about God having control. And of course, it does not necessarily mean that everyone will have 10 kids. Maybe you would only have 3 or 4 as the Lord permits. The sperm and ovum can't come together and form a child unless God allows it to do so...so if he permitted it...he permitted it....he says he forms us in our mother's womb. It's not a spontaneous process that we have to block. Just some thoughts.

 

[Iwanthealthyhair67]

But it's almost like birth control/NFP "intercepts" God's natural plan. In his word, God says...before you were in your mother's wound...I knew you....he knows the time, place, and date for each of us. So...if I was not meant to conceive on X date, God will not allow it to happen...because according to his plan, baby X was not supposed to be born at that time. Seems like intercepting it is like limiting God's control.QUOTE]

The sperm and ovum can't come together and form a child unless God allows it to do so...so if he permitted it...he permitted it....he says he forms us in our mother's womb. It's not a spontaneous process that we have to block. Just some thoughts.[/[/COLOR]QUOTE]



All day I have been hesitating to post my thoughts, this thread really got me thinking too...Looking back I'd say my remark was careless about the rhythm method, even though it's a healthy form of birth control it is still 'birth control' because even in that my husband I (if I had one) would still be in 'control' .

Yes, by all means pray consult God first when making any decision, but let’s say he wants to give you 5 and you only wanted 3 cause thats all your $32,000 can afford...shouldn't we trust that he can provide for us and the 5 that he blessed us with...I think it's a matter of trust, yes trust, trusting God with the little seemingly insignificant things like birth control.

I see the concern on both sides, so my question is; are we really trusting God in this matter when we limit him in our finance and so called logical thinking, or are we limiting him working in our lives…

 

[LucieLoo12]

Well if HE allows me to have the kids, He will provide. But you can't make someone feel wrong because they would like to plan and take precautions.

 

[loolalooh]

^^I think that for health reasons it's understandable, if the husband and wife presented this to God and God was in agreement. And if they couldn't perceive an answer, yes, wisdom is the principal thing! I agree! However, for women who do not have health issues...I was thinking about the two ladies who said they got pregnant while on birth control...it made me feel like God was "overriding" something that was blocked. And it made me think of Fred Hammond's testimony. His mother had an abortion, twice to removed the conceptus, but both attempts failed. God had a plan for Fred Hammond but he had to "override" what was done. And the fact, the he overrode made me feel like this action was "against" his will or at least not permitting him to control the process of creation. We could argue that, If God wanted individuals to still have children while on NFP/birth control...he can make it happen. Which is true. But with obviously God's does not always block the free will of individuals who decide to have an abortion. Its possible that "missed" pregnancies are taking place by abstaining. There's the scripture that says that husband and wife should only refuse to come together for the purpose of fasting/prayer or something like that. Not to prevent pregnancy. And of course, the scripture about Onan spilling the seed...which is like birth control.

1 Corinthians 7
5 Do not deprive one another except with consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer;

Someone mentioned Paul being single, and therefore avoiding the conception process. But Paul was submitted to God's will. Likewise, married people should submit to God's will. I think in the end it's all about God having control. And of course, it does not necessarily mean that everyone will have 10 kids. Maybe you would only have 3 or 4 as the Lord permits. The sperm and ovum can't come together and form a child unless God allows it to do so...so if he permitted it...he permitted it....he says he forms us in our mother's womb. It's not a spontaneous process that we have to block. Just some thoughts.

Proverbs 3:5-6
5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart,
And lean not on your own understanding;
6 In all your ways acknowledge Him,
And He shall direct[a] your paths.

All day I have been hesitating to post my thoughts, this thread really got me thinking too...Looking back I'd say my remark was careless about the rhythm method, even though it's a healthy form of birth control it is still 'birth control' because even in that my husband I (if I had one) would still be in 'control' .

Yes, by all means pray consult God first when making any decision, but let’s say he wants to give you 5 and you only wanted 3 cause thats all your $32,000 can afford...shouldn't we trust that he can provide for us and the 5 that he blessed us with...I think it's a matter of trust, yes trust, trusting God with the little seemingly insignificant things like birth control.

I see the concern on both sides, so my question is; are we really trusting God in this matter when we limit him in our finance and so called logical thinking, or are we limiting him working in our lives…​

Matthew 6
30 Now if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is, and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will He not much more clothe you, O you of little faith?

31 “Therefore do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’​

 

[loolalooh]

Onan is an interesting story. But I'm not sure that those who are against BC/NFP have a valid basis with this story. I need to go and re-read it, but I think Onan's sin was something else ... Be right back.