My discovery

[Patricia]

I'm not sure I asked this question here or not but I really want to know this. What do you ladies think about watering down the hardcore aphogee treatment by mixing in some moisturizing DC with it before application? Afterall, we can mix other protein and moisturizing deep conditioners together. I'm thinking it probably wouldn't dry quite as hard as it would without the Moisturizing DC but does that really matter? IDK, just throwing thoughts out there....I am still tempted to try it though.

That could work! It seems like it would be a watered down version like it is anyway compared to it 20 years ago. You think it stink now. HAHAHAHAHA It really stinked back then and got super harder than now. OK I'm starting to feel old now. If anyone has tried to dilute it with moisturizing conditioners let us know.

 

[Patricia]

I'm loving this thread, it's been so enlightening! Thanks Patricia for sharing your experience.

You are so welcome. I wrote about my experience hoping someone would benefit from the mistakes I made. Its good to know I am truely not alone with this experience.

 

[Patricia]

Yes, IA protein has been VITAL to my hair. It's a big part of my regimen.

Love your avi

 

[Patricia]

I too have learned that my hair needs protein. Unfortunately I never had a clue about it until I joined this board. Who KNOWS how long my hair could be now if I'd know about this a few years ago! Thanks ladies!

Oh my, I always think about me being waist by now

 

[Patricia]

My hair also thrives with protein! Loves it! It used to be thin and it has gotten so much more think and healthy with my use of protein!

Oh Yes

 

[Lucky's Mom]

Your hair is beautiful centeredgirl. Yeah you have been MIA

She was very sick - Much better now... We talked over the holidays.

 

[ItsyBitsy]

I just wanted add ladies that I know many might be thinking, oh lawd, I gotta make some changes and get more stuff but your products don't have to be expensive either. I love joico but it ain't the only fish in the sea and it won't work for everybody. I have started experimenting with some other brands and have found some other great products.

Here are some products you can look into trying with many choices for avoiding spending tons of money.

Protein shampoos

aphogee shampoo for damaged hair
naked naturals shampoo- you can get it from walgreens, has lots of vegetable protein and it is sodium lauryl and laureth free, lathers well and smells good. One of my new favorites
Coloresse Repairing shampoo- get it from sallys, it is part of their knockoff pureology line and it comes in blue bottles. Slightly higher protein content than regular shampoos and it is sulfate free. Right now, it and all of the coloresse products are part of that 2for10 special.



Protein conditioners that can still give your hair moisture

Ion Effective care treatment- found at sallys and is marketed as a protein moisturizing conditioner. Very nice option and comes in sample packs.
Loreal Natures Therapy Fortifying line- again at sallys and currently there are coupons in the store for it right now; they also have a shampoo
Affirm 5n1
Coloresse Repairing conditioner- again at sallys, comes in blue packaging, more moisturizing so this could possibly be a moisturizing options for us needing more protein in our lives.
Motions CPR in the bottle and the motions silk protein are both pretty nice too
Paul Mitchell Hair repair- Super creamy, works fast and a tube will last you a long time. (Thanks Artemis for this one

You can also looking into the Paul Mitchell Superstrong line, Lanza repair line and their healing strength line. Redken Extreme has some good treatments too and many ladies here like it.

Lets add to the list ladies so if you have any other suggestions that you haven't already mentioned, please add them.

Hey Sis!
Please add TiGi Dumb Blonde Reconstructor to the list. I think it has an excellent balance of moisture & protein. I can't say enough about this conditioner..I LUV IT!

 

[Patricia]

Thank you so much for this post! This forum has me sooooo scared of protein! And I have had some recent breakage and was really contemplating Nexxus Emergencee. I'm going for it now! Thank you!!!!!!

:wink2:

I understand I was so scared of a protein overload. I think I'll be fine as long as I stay clear of the aphogee 2 step

 

[Patricia]

Great thread. my hair definitely needs protein. I have a question - tonight i used Joico reconstuctor for 15 minutes with heat and my hair felt great - it was soft and moist. then i used the intense hydrator and my hair felt kinda hard. do you always need to use a moisturiser after a moderate protein treatment like Joico. i feel as if my hair would have been better without the moisture step. TIA

I just use it by itself. Never use the intense hydrator. Maybe someone else will reply

 

[Lucky's Mom]

Patricia,
I just wanted to thank you for this valuable post.

Ten years later...Dang.......my hair could have been TAILBONE a long time ago.

I am using eggs more often... And in the last year - I did use more protein than I ever really did before.

I think that we just don't know what the heck we are doing.... We are so conditioned to MOISTURE as nappies....

Well, I have seen the difference incorporating Yogurt and eggs.

So - Thanks again mama!!!! To GREAT lengths!

 

[gymfreak336]

Hey Sis!
Please add TiGi Dumb Blonde Reconstructor to the list. I think it has an excellent balance of moisture & protein. I can't say enough about this conditioner..I LUV IT!

I forgot that one (even thought I got 2 big bottles of it here ) Yes, you are right. Great conditioner and affordable too.

 

[gymfreak336]

Hi,
I use the joico reconstructor as well and yes you really do need to follow any protein treatment with moisture, however the intense hydrator has protein in it as well. So that's probably why your hair came out a little hard. Next time try following the reconstructor with something like Kera MC, nexxus humectress, kera care humecto or schescentit conditioners. Should work like a charm then.

I agree with silkii locks. The only time I follow with the intense hydrator is when I know my hair probably needs it like a week or two after a chemical. Sometimes, just to check, I rub a little just on on section of my hair for a couple of minutes. If it feels good then I will proceed with my whole head.

 

[Patricia]

I recently realized that my hair needs more protein too. A week ago I prepooed with Mane N Tail conditioner on dry hair (attempting to use it up) and after I washed it out my hair felt strong, it wasn't shedding/breaking and was moisturized. As soon as a put a moisturizing shampoo on it (CON professional w/green labeling), long hairs would come out at the touch. Would a protein-based conditioner be better for the moment until I combat the protein/moistute balance?

TIA

I'm not a expert but from my experience I use garnier frutis long and strong shampoo because it has a bit of protein and it makes my hair feel stong and not weak. Maybe you can switch your shampoo and see how your hair feels. I heard aphogee shampoo contain protein too! Main and tail conditioner suppose to have protein in it. I think its a light one though. Correct me if I 'm wrong. If your hairs is coming out to the touch like mine was I would do a reconstructor of some type. I do mine weekly

 

[Patricia]

My hair was never crazy about loads of protein, but I always tried to keep a balance, especially while texlaxed/relaxed. Now that I have way more natural hair, I'm finding that in order to keep breakage and excessive shedding at bay, I need to use some type of reconstructor every couple weeks. I figured this out only after I was having breakage issues and tried everything under the sun from trimming more to chelating and doing more moisturizing dc's. My hair didn't need any of that . Being at my wit's end, I decided to try my reconstructor. I figured it was already breaking so if it got worse, I'd just BC . My hair has thanked me ever since. I'm retaining more moisture, my hair is stronger and I have no breakage at the line of demarcation.

It's amazing how your hair care needs can change so much when going from relaxed to natural and vice versa. This journey has definitely led to a lot of product revisitations and discoveries.

My hair when natural craved different products than my now relaxed hair

 

[Muse]

Great thread. my hair definitely needs protein. I have a question - tonight i used Joico reconstuctor for 15 minutes with heat and my hair felt great - it was soft and moist. then i used the intense hydrator and my hair felt kinda hard. do you always need to use a moisturiser after a moderate protein treatment like Joico. i feel as if my hair would have been better without the moisture step. TIA

I know what you mean. I used the Kpak poo and hydrator for the first time with the reconstructor last night. Previously I was using the reconstructor with the MR poo and balm. I do have to say I got better results as far as less breakage when I used the whole K pak line (I LOVE the Kpak poo it's better than the MR one!) but I really didn't care for the Intense Hydrator. My hair didn't feel as moisturized as it does when I use the MR balm afterward. I started to put the MR balm on after I rinsed out the hydrator but I didn't want to load my hair with products. I'm hoping when I get the MR leave in styling creme that will help combat some of the dryness. I would substitute the hydrator for the balm if I didn't have such great results as far as less breakage so I'm just going to leave it alone for now and find a good leave in.

I think it's a must to moisturize after any protein treatment even if you don't use the hydrator, moisturizing conditioner is a step you do not want to leave out. This is how you keep things balanced.

 

[Patricia]

That's what I would like to know ORS Replenishing - I have the bottle - can that be used as a weekly conditioning agent or is that too much protein?

I also bought the bottle and when I use it my hair is overmoisturized. I guess I will mix it with reconstructor to use it up. See how your hair feels after using it. It might work for you

 

[TaraDyan]

Yep ... protein is my friend too. I have heard a lot of naturals say that natural hair really doesn't need protein, but that is sooooo not the case for my hair. My hair always thanks me when I give it a hearty dose of protein, followed by a deep moisturizing conditioner. My protein/moisture treatments seriously define my curls and give them more structure ... it makes them "boingy". I like all kinds of protein too -- both mid grade and hardcore.

Yep ... protein in my friend.

 

[Patricia]

She was very sick - Much better now... We talked over the holidays.

Oh wow sorry to hear that. Thanks for letting me know. Keep us posted on your blog.

 

[JDandBeyond]

I know what you mean. I used the Kpak poo and hydrator for the first time with the reconstructor last night. Previously I was using the reconstructor with the MR poo and balm. I do have to say I got better results as far as less breakage when I used the whole K pak line (I LOVE the Kpak poo it's better than the MR one!) but I really didn't care for the Intense Hydrator. My hair didn't feel as moisturized as it does when I use the MR balm afterward. I started to put the MR balm on after I rinsed out the hydrator but I didn't want to load my hair with products. I'm hoping when I get the MR leave in styling creme that will help combat some of the dryness. I would substitute the hydrator for the balm if I didn't have such great results as far as less breakage so I'm just going to leave it alone for now and find a good leave in.

I think it's a must to moisturize after any protein treatment even if you don't use the hydrator, moisturizing conditioner is a step you do not want to leave out. This is how you keep things balanced.

OT: what products from the kpak line do you use and love? Do you use the moisture line as well? I have been using kenra shampoo and condish as well as Nexxus Therapee and Humectress and LOVE them, but the more I hear about Joico the more I want to give it a try! I went to Trade Secret a few days ago to pick some up and they had the AUDACITY to be closed at 3pm! I thought maybe that was my sign to stick with Kenra, but it seems Joico is calling my name!

 

[LivingDoll]

I'm not a expert but from my experience I use garnier frutis long and strong shampoo because it has a bit of protein and it makes my hair feel stong and not weak. Maybe you can switch your shampoo and see how your hair feels. I heard aphogee shampoo contain protein too! Main and tail conditioner suppose to have protein in it. I think its a light one though. Correct me if I 'm wrong. If your hairs is coming out to the touch like mine was I would do a reconstructor of some type. I do mine weekly

Wow, I never, ever considered using a shampoo with protein! That may be what my hair needs!

 

[Patricia]

Patricia,
I just wanted to thank you for this valuable post.

Ten years later...Dang.......my hair could have been TAILBONE a long time ago.

I am using eggs more often... And in the last year - I did use more protein than I ever really did before.

I think that we just don't know what the heck we are doing.... We are so conditioned to MOISTURE as nappies....

Well, I have seen the difference incorporating Yogurt and eggs.

So - Thanks again mama!!!! To GREAT lengths!

Oh my goodness you are my hair idol! To get a compliment from you means so much to me.
All the heartache, sleepless nights was worth it. Are you still on BHM?

 

[LivingDoll]

OT: what products from the kpak line do you use and love? Do you use the moisture line as well? I have been using kenra shampoo and condish as well as Nexxus Therapee and Humectress and LOVE them, but the more I hear about Joico the more I want to give it a try! I went to Trade Secret a few days ago to pick some up and they had the AUDACITY to be closed at 3pm! I thought maybe that was my sign to stick with Kenra, but it seems Joico is calling my name!

I've been thinking about trying the Joico K-pak too...

 

[Patricia]

Yep ... protein is my friend too. I have heard a lot of naturals say that natural hair really doesn't need protein, but that is sooooo not the case for my hair. My hair always thanks me when I give it a hearty dose of protein, followed by a deep moisturizing conditioner. My protein/moisture treatments seriously define my curls and give them more structure ... it makes them "boingy". I like all kinds of protein too -- both mid grade and hardcore.

Yep ... protein in my friend.

I'm hearing this from naturals and relaxed ladies too

 

[Patricia]

Wow, I never, ever considered using a shampoo with protein! That may be what my hair needs!

It made a difference between night and day for me. I had a bottle in the cabinet from a couple years ago and deceided to try it again. Thats what my hair has been missing too!

 

[JDandBeyond]

Umm Patricia I nominate you to start the Protein Lovers' Challenge... Challenge to determine the CORRECT usage of protein for maximum hair growth!

 

[gymfreak336]

Wow, I never, ever considered using a shampoo with protein! That may be what my hair needs!

Hey Daephae!

A protein shampoo is a easy way to tweak what you are doing already. In fact, a long time ago, the Lanza Protein Plus shampoo was a board staple. They changed the formula but now, their healing strength line has a similar shampoo to the orginal protein plus. Other ones you can look into that would be similar to the Garnier would be the Redken Extreme or the Biolage fortifying. All of those are fortifying poos which us a little protein but also use fortifying agents like ceramides, fruit acids and panthenol. Other shampoos you can look more into joico kpak shampoo (which is great during the relaxer process btw), paul mitchell super strong, and naked naturals. There are many more but these are just some starter points.

 

[gymfreak336]

I'm not a expert but from my experience I use garnier frutis long and strong shampoo because it has a bit of protein and it makes my hair feel stong and not weak. Maybe you can switch your shampoo and see how your hair feels. I heard aphogee shampoo contain protein too! Main and tail conditioner suppose to have protein in it. I think its a light one though. Correct me if I 'm wrong. If your hairs is coming out to the touch like mine was I would do a reconstructor of some type. I do mine weekly

It also has a low pH which helps the cuticle stay nice and smooth. I love how their stuff smells.

 

[LivingDoll]

Hey Daephae!

A protein shampoo is a easy way to tweak what you are doing already. In fact, a long time ago, the Lanza Protein Plus shampoo was a board staple. They changed the formula but now, their healing strength line has a similar shampoo to the orginal protein plus. Other ones you can look into that would be similar to the Garnier would be the Redken Extreme or the Biolage fortifying. All of those are fortifying poos which us a little protein but also use fortifying agents like ceramides, fruit acids and panthenol. Other shampoos you can look more into joico kpak shampoo (which is great during the relaxer process btw), paul mitchell super strong, and naked naturals. There are many more but these are just some starter points.

Hey Gym!

Oh my goodness. Thanks so much! Not sure if you saw my post but I used to use Biolage years back (before joining LHCF). My hair was strong and grew very nicely but my scalp was super duper dry. I battled with "dandruff" real bad during that time. Since I joined the board, I figured that I am sensitive to SLS. I have avoided it like the plague and now my dandruff is gone. I think in a previous post you said that the Naked Naturals has no SLS and is available at Walgreens? If so, i'm all over that!

Thanks so much once again!

 

[gymfreak336]

Hey Gym!

Oh my goodness. Thanks so much! Not sure if you saw my post but I used to use Biolage years back (before joining LHCF). My hair was strong and grew very nicely but my scalp was super duper dry. I battled with "dandruff" real bad during that time. Since I joined the board, I figured that I am sensitive to SLS. I have avoided it like the plague and now my dandruff is gone. I think in a previous post you said that the Naked Naturals has no SLS and is available at Walgreens? If so, i'm all over that!

Thanks so much once again!

Yeah, naked naturals doesn't have SLS *goes and grabs bottle*

It uses milder cleansing agents. Here is what it says on the back of the bottle.

No lauryl or laureth sulfates
No DEA or TEA
No animal by products
No artificial colors
No synthetic fragrance
Not tested on animals and pH balanced


Vegetable protein is the 6th ingredient. It lathers well and is thick, almost sticky when you put it in your hands so you don't need much. I have the orange one and it smells like tic tacs. They also have a lavender on which is for color treated hair. I plan on getting that one next.

 

[JerriBlank]

Hey Daephae!

A protein shampoo is a easy way to tweak what you are doing already. In fact, a long time ago, the Lanza Protein Plus shampoo was a board staple. They changed the formula but now, their healing strength line has a similar shampoo to the orginal protein plus. Other ones you can look into that would be similar to the Garnier would be the Redken Extreme or the Biolage fortifying. All of those are fortifying poos which us a little protein but also use fortifying agents like ceramides, fruit acids and panthenol. Other shampoos you can look more into joico kpak shampoo (which is great during the relaxer process btw), paul mitchell super strong, and naked naturals. There are many more but these are just some starter points.

What about Cream of Nature in the green bottle?
The original one?
Please say it has some kinda protein...*closes eyes and crosses fingers*