Is type 4b hair uncommon?
- Thread starter jupitermoon
- Start date
Priss Pot
Makeup + Bench Pressing
Oh dang! I'll have you measure the diameter of my penspring for you all!
But the thing is... someone like the OP has kinky coily curly characteristics too and she considers herself a type 3! Her hair looks kinky than yours and yours looks silkier than hers. Hair types are interesting
______________________________________________
Hair typing is important to me because things that people 4a and below do to their hair leads to disasterous consequences for my 4b hair. I read the advice, look at the persons hair and then decide if it is applicable to me or not.
Her curl pattern is much much much much looser than mine, so that is why she is a type 3. Regardless of how thick or kinky her strands are, she has a loose curl pattern which puts her in 3 category.
I have fine strands, but my hair curls tighter than hers, so that puts me at a type 4.
but why with only type 4 hair?
Seriously, straight up, would folks REALLY be arguing about type 3?
I'm not sayin; I'm just sayin.....
msa
New Member
but why with only type 4 hair?
I don't know.
I can't tell the difference between the subtypes in 1, 2, or 3 either. In my mind hair is straight (1), wavy (2), curly(3), or coily(4). All the a's, b's, and c's don't make a difference to me.
jupitermoon
New Member
Oh dang! I'll have you measure the diameter of my penspring for you all!
But the thing is... someone like the OP has kinky coily curly characteristics too and she considers herself a type 3! Her hair looks kinky than yours and yours looks silkier than hers. Hair types are interesting
______________________________________________
Hair typing is important to me because things that people 4a and below do to their hair leads to disasterous consequences for my 4b hair. I read the advice, look at the persons hair and then decide if it is applicable to me or not.
I didn't type myself, but asked for posters on the hair boards to type my hair and type 3 was the response I got from the majority. I'm still a newbie myself.
I agree that Priss Pot's hair appears much finer and silker than mine. I have coarse strands. If you were to touch my hair it would feel smooth but coarse to touch.
My hair pretty much straightens when wet, dries curly, and gets bigger with time. My wet hair with conditioner is heavy and slippery/"slimmy" feeling. Are these also properties of type 4 hair? I find this thread interesting and am learning a lot about the variations in hair.
Here is my second day hair:
Here's my second day hair with gel:
The pic in my siggie is 5th day hair.
Her curl pattern is much much much much looser than mine, so that is why she is a type 3. Regardless of how thick or kinky her strands are, she has a loose curl pattern which puts her in 3 category.
I have fine strands, but my hair curls tighter than hers, so that puts me at a type 4.
Seriously, straight up, would folks REALLY be arguing about type 3?
I'm not sayin; I'm just sayin.....
I do not have coils but "wavy curls", and underneath my hair I have my smaller curls. It looks like this:
Priss Pot, your hair is very fine and silky looking versus my thicker coarse looking hair. Your hair is pretty and I like the color.
All of you that posted in this thread have beautiful hair.
ETA: I guess I have type 3 sized curls with a type 4b texture? Or I'm a type 4 with bigger curls instead of coils?
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Neith
New Member
I can definitely tell the difference in the subtypes especially of types 1,2 and 3. 1a doesn't look like 1c and 3a doesn't look like 3c for example. Very DISTINCT differences there.
Sometimes there is overlap and confusion in those types, but it is nothing like the topic of type 4 hair.
What I think is that maybe type 4a, b and whatever else is out there looks very similar. The difference in coil diameter between them would be really tiny.
Unlike the big loose 3a curls compared to tight 3c curls. That's a big difference. It's not like you can't tell a tight curl from a loose curl or a tight wave from a loose wave.
I don't know. I don't understand the difference between 4a and 4b hair (again! after thinking I had it figured out
). Coil size seems to be the same, maybe it's all the same stuff with different clumping based on texture.However, it's also very strange to me that type 4 hair would be the only hair type without any discernable subtypes. Is there really basically less variety in type 4 hair than other types?
I dunno. I'm looking at this from all sides. Blame Andre for making it up
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knt1229
Well-Known Member
I always thought the biggest difference between 4a and 4b is that 4a can look like 3c hair if the right products are applied. But 4b is never going to look like anything other than 4b.
Also, I thought that 4a curls can be seen at a distance. Whereas any definition a 4b may have can only be seen if you get right up on the person and get very close to the hair.
Also, I thought that 4a curls can be seen at a distance. Whereas any definition a 4b may have can only be seen if you get right up on the person and get very close to the hair.
msa
New Member
The thing is, it's not that I think there is less variety in type 4. I think it has the most variety. The problem with the amount of variety is it makes it more difficult to categorize subtypes.
I really think type 4 on a basic level is coily (ranging from larger to tiny) and it's "kinky" (though I don't like that term..."nappy" is more what I mean). Outside of that, there's too much on even one person's head for me to care about categorizing it. Especially since you basically have to treat a "4a" and a "4b" the same way in order for them to thrive.
locabouthair
Well-Known Member
I know for a fact I'm a 4b. If there was such a thing as 5a or 5b that would be me.
PPGbubbles
Well-Known Member
I initially voted 4b but after reading through this thread I dont know anymore!!!! Yikes this is confusing :/
princessnad
New Member
I didn't know the "silkiness" of the hair had anything to do with hair typing.
Nonie
Well-Known Member
Can I tell you all something? Knowing your type is really neither here nor there. It really isn't. When I joined the forum, I had no question whatsoever what my hair looked like. I have had natural hair for 3/4 of my life and lived around people with hair like mine for more than half my life. So I knew what my hair looked like. What I didn't know was how to make it grow long.
However, a couple of years before finding LHCF, I discovered www.blackwomenrejoice.com and got my first lesson on good hair care. Hair type was not brought up; just info that we now take for granted coz we've been on hairboards long enough to know the basics. What's more, my teacher was relaxed and I was planning to transition but she armed me well for the task at hand.
After joining LHCF, types were introduced to me. Out of curiosity, I wondered if adopting "type-specific regimens" would be the magic formula that I was yet to discover. In no time I had spotted who had my hair and was busy adopting regimens and buying products. It wasn't long before I realized I hated how my hair felt with the changes I was making.
Since simple good haircare had worked for me well before I got busy with types (Those two years before LHCF I saw my hair grow to 11 inches from one inch, and that with trimming--a feat I'd never known possible) , I decided to return to focusing on general good haircare regardless of type.
For instance, I learned not to comb my hair dry. I learned about CWs. But I didn't just buy everything I read. For instance, I heard shampoo was bad for you, but I hadn't had any problems with it and like how it made me feel so I ignored that and moved on to the next tidbit on good haircare. The more I applied the general haircare tips to my hair and focused on my hair instead of wondering who had my type what they do, the better I became acquainted with my own hair seeing things I never noticed before. Before long, it was as if I had freed my hair to show me what it was all about. And for the first time in my life I discovered I had soft hair that was a joy to work with.
When you join any group in life, it's easy to be brainwashed and so immersed in the beliefs of the group that you feel there's nothing outside of it that is real. It's like being in a cult where you start to believe that what the preacher says is gospel and so you just go with the current and never seek out the truth for yourself. I think that's what typing does. No wonder so many of us get frustrated with our hair; because we listen to the next person in the group instead of exploring our own hair and listening to what it tells us.
Seriously, when this hair growing journey starts to consume us and drain us and make us unhappy or stressed, then that's a sign that we're trying too hard. It's time to go back to basics and remind ourselves what it is that makes hair healthy. And as we focus on that applying general good haircare habits, and using TLC when handling our hair, the journey becomes an adventure of self-discovery and we come to realize that we really do have the best hair in the world. Ask me, I know I do.
However, a couple of years before finding LHCF, I discovered www.blackwomenrejoice.com and got my first lesson on good hair care. Hair type was not brought up; just info that we now take for granted coz we've been on hairboards long enough to know the basics. What's more, my teacher was relaxed and I was planning to transition but she armed me well for the task at hand.
After joining LHCF, types were introduced to me. Out of curiosity, I wondered if adopting "type-specific regimens" would be the magic formula that I was yet to discover. In no time I had spotted who had my hair and was busy adopting regimens and buying products. It wasn't long before I realized I hated how my hair felt with the changes I was making.
Since simple good haircare had worked for me well before I got busy with types (Those two years before LHCF I saw my hair grow to 11 inches from one inch, and that with trimming--a feat I'd never known possible) , I decided to return to focusing on general good haircare regardless of type.
For instance, I learned not to comb my hair dry. I learned about CWs. But I didn't just buy everything I read. For instance, I heard shampoo was bad for you, but I hadn't had any problems with it and like how it made me feel so I ignored that and moved on to the next tidbit on good haircare. The more I applied the general haircare tips to my hair and focused on my hair instead of wondering who had my type what they do, the better I became acquainted with my own hair seeing things I never noticed before. Before long, it was as if I had freed my hair to show me what it was all about. And for the first time in my life I discovered I had soft hair that was a joy to work with.
When you join any group in life, it's easy to be brainwashed and so immersed in the beliefs of the group that you feel there's nothing outside of it that is real. It's like being in a cult where you start to believe that what the preacher says is gospel and so you just go with the current and never seek out the truth for yourself. I think that's what typing does. No wonder so many of us get frustrated with our hair; because we listen to the next person in the group instead of exploring our own hair and listening to what it tells us.
Seriously, when this hair growing journey starts to consume us and drain us and make us unhappy or stressed, then that's a sign that we're trying too hard. It's time to go back to basics and remind ourselves what it is that makes hair healthy. And as we focus on that applying general good haircare habits, and using TLC when handling our hair, the journey becomes an adventure of self-discovery and we come to realize that we really do have the best hair in the world. Ask me, I know I do.
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nymane
Well-Known Member
This is exactly what I thought. I classify myself as 4b mainly because I can't do wash n go hair styles; no amount of water or product transforms my tresses into curls or waves. However, I can't deny that my new growth clearly has a wavy/curly (lol I don't know how to describe it) texture, but it's not super defined. Any who...nice thread, carry on
msa
New Member
This is exactly what I thought. I classify myself as 4b mainly because I can't do wash n go hair styles; no amount of water or product transforms my tresses into curls or waves. However, I can't deny that my new growth clearly has a wavy/curly (lol I don't know how to describe it) texture, but it's not super defined. Any who...nice thread, carry on
Ummm you can still do wash n go's. Just because yours doesn't look the next person's doesn't mean you can't do it. I don't have curls or waves when I wash and go, so what? I rock my fro anyway.
Dacia38
New Member
I'm a 4b and I love my relaxed hair. I never heard of hair typing until I joined this board. I can say that I have the "type" of hair that I can pretty much do anything or nothing to and it still manages to stay fairly healthy. I'm not bragging about that, but it is just a fact. In fact, I didn't know how deprived my hair was until I lucked up across this board a few weeks ago. My daughter has 4b hair also....but her hair breaks easily (which is why I searched out the boards). Frankly it doesn't matter to me what type of hair we have. However, I can honestly say that within the 4 weeks of reading these boards and learning how valuable deep conditioning is, me and my daughters hair is noticeable stronger.
I realize I am way off topic, but I would like to thank everyone for their comments and for being such a supportive "family" regardless of what hair type.
...ramble over..now to our regularly schedule program...
~Dee
I realize I am way off topic, but I would like to thank everyone for their comments and for being such a supportive "family" regardless of what hair type.
...ramble over..now to our regularly schedule program...
~Dee
Priss Pot
Makeup + Bench Pressing
I don't think it does. I thought it only had to do with curl size. The thickness/coarseness of the strand is just a trait and not a determining factor of the 1,2,3,4 types, IMO.
virtuenow
Well-Known Member
Let me throw in 2 more cents before the forum closes:
After reading the whole forum and the "Her 4b is not my 4b" forum, this is how we need to break down the type 4 category:
Characteristics to look for and distinguish
- coarse (like thread) v. fine (like silk)
- coarse (as in thick single strands) v. fine (as in small thin strands of hair)
- hard v. soft
- silky/moist/shiny v. dry/rough/wiry
- clumping v. matting
It seems we need to break the 4 hair type into at least four categories:
(here is why: dry/thick/coarse/matting v. silky/moist/clumpers----> this is the common denominator that always gets in the way.
4a1 Category 1:
size curl: small to tiny (pencil to average pen spring diameter)
shape/definition: coils/waves/ziggy 5's /"S's/O's
texture: SILKY, MOIST, *kicker--> may be fine or coarse
properties: CLUMP and wave
natural style ability (water to dry): wash and go with clumps of curls/coils/waves; may lay hair down flat- with visible waves and shine
4a2 Category 2:
size curl: tiny to micro (diameter of he average pen spring or smaller)
shape: coils/waves/ziggy 5's /"S's/O's
texture: moist/shiny/silky
properties: clumping or waving
natural style ability (water to dry): wash and go with clumps of curls/coils/waves; may lay hair down flat- with visible waves and shine
4b1 Category 3:
size curl: small to tiny (pencil to average pen spring diameter)
shape/definition: coils/waves/ziggy 5's/"S's/O's
texture: fine or coarse/hard, wiry + dry
properties: matting + tangling + extreme shrinkage
natural style ability (water to dry): hmmm, let me know; wash n no
4b2 Category 4:
size curl: tiny to micro (average pen spring diameter or smaller)
shape/definition: coils/waves/ziggy 5's/"S's/O's
texture: fine or coarse/hard, wiry + dry
properties: matting + tangling + extreme shrinkage
natural style ability (water to dry): wash n no
Root of Confusion:
It looks like the tightly coiled dry/matting hair vs. silky/moist/clump hair is the biggest factor that is confusing us at this point. I beleive we need sub categories in the 4hair type for several reasons. For one, my dry/thick/coarse 4B hair could never do what the SILKY/MOIST 4a, b, ab hair types do. No matter how tightly coiled a person is, if they have that moist/shiny hair that lays down in waves or clumps in coils, then I cannot fully relate to them or their product use (i.e. water, grease and gel, ha!). Resolution I!
* please note:
I have found multiple definitions for many of these terms; and they seem to be used interchangably. For coarse, some people use it to describe the "feel" of hair; some use it
to describe the thickness; and some even use it to describe the dryness factor of hair.
I believe we have all agreed that hair has to have some form of texture (from straight to looping) but it will not come in the form of a uniform "z" or hard angles growing out of the scalp
After reading the whole forum and the "Her 4b is not my 4b" forum, this is how we need to break down the type 4 category:
Characteristics to look for and distinguish
- coarse (like thread) v. fine (like silk)
- coarse (as in thick single strands) v. fine (as in small thin strands of hair)
- hard v. soft
- silky/moist/shiny v. dry/rough/wiry
- clumping v. matting
It seems we need to break the 4 hair type into at least four categories:
(here is why: dry/thick/coarse/matting v. silky/moist/clumpers----> this is the common denominator that always gets in the way.
4a1 Category 1:
size curl: small to tiny (pencil to average pen spring diameter)
shape/definition: coils/waves/ziggy 5's /"S's/O's
texture: SILKY, MOIST, *kicker--> may be fine or coarse
properties: CLUMP and wave
natural style ability (water to dry): wash and go with clumps of curls/coils/waves; may lay hair down flat- with visible waves and shine
4a2 Category 2:
size curl: tiny to micro (diameter of he average pen spring or smaller)
shape: coils/waves/ziggy 5's /"S's/O's
texture: moist/shiny/silky
properties: clumping or waving
natural style ability (water to dry): wash and go with clumps of curls/coils/waves; may lay hair down flat- with visible waves and shine
4b1 Category 3:
size curl: small to tiny (pencil to average pen spring diameter)
shape/definition: coils/waves/ziggy 5's/"S's/O's
texture: fine or coarse/hard, wiry + dry
properties: matting + tangling + extreme shrinkage
natural style ability (water to dry): hmmm, let me know; wash n no
4b2 Category 4:
size curl: tiny to micro (average pen spring diameter or smaller)
shape/definition: coils/waves/ziggy 5's/"S's/O's
texture: fine or coarse/hard, wiry + dry
properties: matting + tangling + extreme shrinkage
natural style ability (water to dry): wash n no
Root of Confusion:
It looks like the tightly coiled dry/matting hair vs. silky/moist/clump hair is the biggest factor that is confusing us at this point. I beleive we need sub categories in the 4hair type for several reasons. For one, my dry/thick/coarse 4B hair could never do what the SILKY/MOIST 4a, b, ab hair types do. No matter how tightly coiled a person is, if they have that moist/shiny hair that lays down in waves or clumps in coils, then I cannot fully relate to them or their product use (i.e. water, grease and gel, ha!). Resolution I!
* please note:
I have found multiple definitions for many of these terms; and they seem to be used interchangably. For coarse, some people use it to describe the "feel" of hair; some use it
to describe the thickness; and some even use it to describe the dryness factor of hair.
I believe we have all agreed that hair has to have some form of texture (from straight to looping) but it will not come in the form of a uniform "z" or hard angles growing out of the scalp
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chicacanella
New Member
I'm 3c/d/4a.
LaidBak
New Member
If that's the definition of 4b then I think that's what I am.
BotanyGrl
Well-Known Member
Nonie, your whole post was on point. At this point in my journey I feel that hair typing is irrelevant. After transitioning for a year, I'm pretty sure that my hair is in the "Type 4" spectrum but knowing that has not helped me take care of my hair in any way. Outside of hair boards nobody even knows what the hair typing crap means.
What does it mean outside of finding a hair twin or thinking someone's regimen may work for you? I've seen a ton of 4Bs on this board stating that what another 4B did to their hair does not work for her... And the same for 4As. If you want healthy hair, don't complicate it with hair typing... worry about if you have fine, normal, or coarse strands, hair porosity, protein/moisture imbalances... stuff that actually matters.
wavezncurlz
LHCF addict
I have read all these pages and I'm STILL not sure what 4b hair is. Hell, I don't know what 3c and 4a is. I'm confused.
Hell, I don't know what 3c and 4a is. I'm confused.
Nonie
Well-Known Member
I know Chicacanella didn't just insert a D.
We need T-shirts that say Team 4-Something, those of us who've reached a conclusion.
ETA: The rest of you still trying to figure this out...
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Her curl pattern is much much much much looser than mine, so that is why she is a type 3. Regardless of how thick or kinky her strands are, she has a loose curl pattern which puts her in 3 category.
I have fine strands, but my hair curls tighter than hers, so that puts me at a type 4.
Seriously, straight up, would folks REALLY be arguing about type 3?
I'm not sayin; I'm just sayin.....
imo you are not type 4 at all!! i see no 4. Your hair is gorgeous though!!
Daughter
UK Blak
For me this is a moot point though, cos even two heads of type 4 hair that look similar may react very differently to products and other stuff. My cousin had (she's relaxed her hair now) lovely long natural type 4 hair that was at least BSL. Swimming and so on had no effect on her hair, it was resilient. Mine, on the other hand broke off easily and needs much more TLC. If you looked at our hair you'd think we were hair twins but what works for her didn't for me and vice versa.
Hair typing is useful, but only to an extent.
Hair typing is useful, but only to an extent.
luckiestdestiny
Well-Known Member
The original question to where are the four b's seems to have shown up in the poll. There are more 2x as many 4bs then 4as and more 4bs the all the 3 groups. The only group that overshadows the 4bs seems to be the combination 4a/4b group. So from this poll so far, 4b's are not hiding out somewhere. They are darn near the majority if you count the combo group of 4a/4b as well. If not, they are the second majority so far in this time, in the poll.
bravenewgirl87
New Member
Thank you Nonie and Neith for all your help.
Typing 4b hair is not nearly as complicated as members are making it out to be. People simply don't want to accept the truth.
To be honest, the only time your hair texture serves some importance is if you are natural and want to figure out how to achieve certain styles that require curls. If you are relaxed, it is kind of not important to know your texture. Your hair will let you know what products it likes from what it does not like.
The reason I say this is because completely natural hair behaves significantly different from relaxed hair. Once you have your relaxed ends completely off, you're in a whole new ballgame. The conditioners you used previously to promote healthy beautiful hair might not (more than likely) won't work on your natural hair. Crazy as it sounds, those little ends can make a world of difference.
Typing 4b hair is not nearly as complicated as members are making it out to be. People simply don't want to accept the truth.
To be honest, the only time your hair texture serves some importance is if you are natural and want to figure out how to achieve certain styles that require curls. If you are relaxed, it is kind of not important to know your texture. Your hair will let you know what products it likes from what it does not like.
The reason I say this is because completely natural hair behaves significantly different from relaxed hair. Once you have your relaxed ends completely off, you're in a whole new ballgame. The conditioners you used previously to promote healthy beautiful hair might not (more than likely) won't work on your natural hair. Crazy as it sounds, those little ends can make a world of difference.
Kurlee
Well-Known Member
Her curl pattern is much much much much looser than mine, so that is why she is a type 3. Regardless of how thick or kinky her strands are, she has a loose curl pattern which puts her in 3 category.
I have fine strands, but my hair curls tighter than hers, so that puts me at a type 4.
Seriously, straight up, would folks REALLY be arguing about type 3?
I'm not sayin; I'm just sayin.....
stop skewing the categories, if you're 4a then you push the rest of us into 5. Love the hair and colour though
Kurlee
Well-Known Member
it doesn't but silkiness in many's minds ups your hair "quality", therefore, higher category, regardless of curl size
bravenewgirl87
New Member
it doesn't but silkiness in many's minds ups your hair "quality", therefore, higher category, regardless of curl size
It does determine the texture of hair. silkiness=moisture retention=clumping of curls. They are all pretty related.
Take for example: Type 3s are more glossy, well defined curls. While there are different variations amongst those type 3s (3A-3B-3C) and each of those require a certain amount of care to achieve a curly look, it's very obvious that there's a difference in the way type-3 feels and reacts to products compared to type-4. Type 4 can have mild shine--with care-- but it is not naturally shiny.
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