A Link to Something Interesting About Hair Growth...

[HairPhoenix]

Check it out. It's interesting:

http://www.hairfinder.com/hairquestions/grow_hair_out.htm

My intention in posting this link here was not to discourage anyone, but to give encouragement. Please don't take the info in the link as the final word, it's just a vague guideline at best. Please read this entire thread discussion before you throw your hands up. We are here to support each other.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

ETA: THIS IS A QUOTE FROM THE ARTICLE IN THE LINK

This means that if your hair averages a four-year anagen phase, and you have your hair trimmed one-half inch every three months, you can expect your hair to grow four inches each year, or a total of sixteen inches before it reaches the catagen phase.

I think that it shouldn't be unreasonable to see 16 inches of retained length over 4 years with proper hair care. And I don't think it only applies to non-black people either.

 

[~Nigeria~]

If you've been trying to grow your hair out for more than five years, you may have
to consider that your hair just isn't predisposed to grow as long as you'd hoped.
Otherwise, be patient for a while longer, and see if you can't get a few inches more.

I read about this a few months ago on another website. But isn't this what msniq was talking about in her anti-trim thread? guess she was right .

 

[HairPhoenix]

I think that it shouldn't be unreasonable to see 16 inches of retained length over 4 years with proper hair care. And I don't think it only applies to non-black people either.

ITA. Hair is hair and is made up of the same cellular materials and all grows the same way. The difference is whether the hair shaft is round (straight hair) or oval (wavy to curly hair). I was just reading another source which stated that average human hair has a terminal length of between 1 and 3 feet, while some people have even greater terminal lengths. Which means a minimun of brastrap if you measure from the nape on the average person. Reaching that terminal length for wavy to curly hair takes TLC because those hair types are more fragile.

 

[HairPhoenix]

I read about this a few months ago on another website. But isn't this what msniq was talking about in her anti-trim thread? guess she was right .

I wanted to know if she was right about this particular thing. That's why I looked it up. About the whole "Less Filling... Tastes Great" thing, that's another story.

 

[*ElleB]

so many of us may work all we want, but if mother nature says "the buck stops here!" or the hair for that matter, we have to live with it, or weave it up....

 

[HairPhoenix]

so many of us may work all we want, but if mother nature says "the buck stops here!" or the hair for that matter, we have to live with it, or weave it up....

The thing is we don't know where the buck stops unless we try. Unless we do all that we can to keep our hair healthy and strong and stop as much breakage as possible and let that hair grow, then we won't know. It could be brastrap, it could be waistlength, or it could be longer than that. From what I've been reading, average terminal length is between brastrap and waistlength. I am encouraged by that.

 

[myco]

The way I look at it is: My genetics might say that my terminal hair length is 30 inches. Unless I know how to read DNA, that's not something I know off the top of my head. But if I'm styling and treating my hair in a manner that keeps it at 20 inches, I'll never know that there are 10 extra inches to be had. I think this is what women, especially African-American women have to overcome. Historically, we have confused the way that we nurture our hair, with the actual nature of our hair. We have to put our hair in an optimal healthy, growing position before we can definitively say that this is the most that my hair will ever grow. The steps to that optimal, healthy growing position differ from person to person. That's why so many people on the board are growing their hair longer than they or anyone in their family ever thought possible. You have to do something you've never done before, to get something you've never had before.

 

[HairPhoenix]

The way I look at it is: My genetics might say that my terminal hair length is 30 inches. Unless I know how to read DNA, that's not something I know off the top of my head. But if I'm styling and treating my hair in a manner that keeps it at 20 inches, I'll never know that there are 10 extra inches to be had. I think this is what women, especially African-American women have to overcome. Historically, we have confused the way that we nurture our hair, with the actual nature of our hair. We have to put our hair in an optimal healthy, growing position before we can definitively say that this is the most that my hair will ever grow. The steps to that optimal, healthy growing position differ from person to person. That's why so many people on the board are growing their hair longer than they or anyone in their family ever thought possible. You have to do something you've never done before, to get something you've never had before.

Exactly!!!

And I am just going to add a little diddy here: There are many scientific "facts" that have been proven to be wrong or even not exact throughout the history of science. I know for sure that I have done different things that have resulted in a faster growth rate in my hair, like increasing my protein intake. So do what works for you and keeping reaching for your goals.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

Notice the part of the article that said over four years you could expect 16 inches of hair even if you trim 2 inches per year? On most of us that is armpit or brastrap.

I don't know, it's almost like people want to talk themselves out of their goals.

 

[HairPhoenix]

Notice the part of the article that said over four years you could expect 16 inches of hair even if you trim 2 inches per year? On most of us that is armpit or brastrap.

I don't know, it's almost like people want to talk themselves out of their goals.

No, no, no... That's not the purpose here. You know that something came up in another post about genetics determining hair length. Well, I just put this link in here so that everyone can read the info and draw their own conclusions.

Personally, I think it is a motivator for women who think their hair will only be short. We know that with the proper nurturing we all can do more.

This information is only a guideline as to how the hair grows. It is not an exact science, biological sciences sometimes are not. Most of these studies were conducted on mice. Those of the studies actually done on human hair only span a short period of time. I haven't found any studies that showed a group of human subjects that were actually observed throughout their entire lifetime. So there is room for bias in the science here.

And I don't think we should just throw up our hands and say "oh well I'm only going to reach brastrap or whatever". There are women on this board who actually have increased their rate of hair growth by doing extra work (supplements, hair products, MTG, etc.). So right there the science is proven to not be solid. It is possible to get more length in a shorter period of time.

Again, most of us have no idea what our terminal length is unless we put in the effort of nurturing our hair. I'm just saying to all the ladies if you have found what works for you keep doing it. And if you haven't found the right combination yet, then keep trying. Don't forget that some things in life have yet to be proven, so keep reaching for your goals.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

HP, I totally understand why you provided the link. I was part of that other thread.

Having more information is always better than having less. My fear is that people stopped reading at the point that said 'while still others find that getting their hair to grow past their
shoulders is a Herculean task.'

All the important stuff came after that opening line.

 

[Isis]

Quote:
Originally Posted by myco
The way I look at it is: My genetics might say that my terminal hair length is 30 inches. Unless I know how to read DNA, that's not something I know off the top of my head. But if I'm styling and treating my hair in a manner that keeps it at 20 inches, I'll never know that there are 10 extra inches to be had. I think this is what women, especially African-American women have to overcome. Historically, we have confused the way that we nurture our hair, with the actual nature of our hair. We have to put our hair in an optimal healthy, growing position before we can definitively say that this is the most that my hair will ever grow. The steps to that optimal, healthy growing position differ from person to person. That's why so many people on the board are growing their hair longer than they or anyone in their family ever thought possible. You have to do something you've never done before, to get something you've never had before.

Exactly!!!
And I am just going to add a little diddy here: There are many scientific "facts" that have been proven to be wrong or even not exact throughout the history of science. I know for sure that I have done different things that have resulted in a faster growth rate in my hair, like increasing my protein intake. So do what works for you and keeping reaching for your goals.

I agree with you ladies including about those scientific "facts". I'm one of those people who believes we can do anything, including growing our hair to the lengths we want, in spite of science says.

 

[HairPhoenix]

HP, I totally understand why you provided the link. I was part of that other thread.

Having more information is always better than having less. My fear is that people stopped reading at the point that said 'while still others find that getting their hair to grow past their
shoulders is a Herculean task.'

All the important stuff came after that opening line.

JC, I agree that the bold statement could possibly stump some people, but I am hoping they will read it as Herculean and NOT impossible. I hope that anyone who went to the link continued to read through the whole section. When I first read it and saw Herculean it made me think about all the Black women who walk around with damaged hair that don't seem to make any growth progress. But I also took it as "hey, it may be difficult, but it's not impossible."

I'm not trying to get anyone upset or have them think I'm calling them out, but I was just offended to hear someone on this board slap everyone in the face by saying no matter what you do you don't have any control over your hair growth. I don't think that's what all of us are here for. I think we need to continue to give each other encouragement.

 

[MissYocairis]

Interesting debate on the inherent growth potential of hair. My perspective is that, just like the mind can heal the body, so can the mind influence the growth rate of hair. If you BELIEVE your hair is INCAPABLE of growing beyond shoulder/brastrap length, then, I am pretty sure your cellular and chemical makeup will follow suit. If you have no barriers in thought about the growth potential of your hair, then your body's physiological ability for hair growth more than likely has no barriers either.

Your hair follicles don't KNOW when the ends have reached brastrap. That's just silly. Regardless of your perspectives on the power of the mind, scientists have already PROVEN that physical ailments generally are an EFFECT of mental stress and anxiety (including hatred, bitterness, resentment and anger) and not a cause in and of themselves.

Read up on the amazing power of the human mind to heal and change the cellular and chemical functions of the human body. I am not jumping on this "hair can only grow so much" bandwagon. Who strives for things they do not even believe exist?

 

[Lioness]

The way I look at it is: My genetics might say that my terminal hair length is 30 inches. Unless I know how to read DNA, that's not something I know off the top of my head. But if I'm styling and treating my hair in a manner that keeps it at 20 inches, I'll never know that there are 10 extra inches to be had. I think this is what women, especially African-American women have to overcome. Historically, we have confused the way that we nurture our hair, with the actual nature of our hair. We have to put our hair in an optimal healthy, growing position before we can definitively say that this is the most that my hair will ever grow. The steps to that optimal, healthy growing position differ from person to person. That's why so many people on the board are growing their hair longer than they or anyone in their family ever thought possible. You have to do something you've never done before, to get something you've never had before.

MYCO YOU SPEAK THE TRUTH!!!!!!!
I completely agree with this. The way I care for my hair now, if I told some of my friends and fam, they'd be like..ohh thats too long...or what's the point of moisturising your ends every day?.... Since I started taking vitamins and doing PROPER hair care methods (i.e less amnipulation and gentleness with my hair while washing and combing) my hair has thrived. It's longer than it's ever been (or at least as long as it was when I was little). This morning I was watching a program which had a segment about hair loss. The hair expert said that hair grows for about 5 years before it reaches its 'resting stage'. So, I look at it this way, For example In 2005, my hair grew about 8 inches. If I times that by 5,.......
It's sad that a lot of black women think that long hair can only be a reality for women who ARE NOT black.
Wisdom is the principal thing
It's true that knowledge, and the application thereof to hair care will help us to reach our 'pre-determined length'.

 

[Sistaslick]

Read up on the amazing power of the human mind to heal and change the cellular and chemical functions of the human body. I am not jumping on this "hair can only grow so much" bandwagon. Who strives for things they do not even believe exist?

This might be a lil OT, but it reminds me of a class in medical anthropology I took. It talked about the power of the placebo effect and our minds. One study was about balding men who were given two lotions. One lotion contained minoxidil (the only scientifically proven regrowth agent*found in rogaine and stuff*) and the other lotion was just plain Jergens or some other lotion Both groups were told that they had the lotion that regrew hair... both groups of men had hair growth-- even the one with the plain lotion.

Another study had people given a red pill and another group given a blue pill. Both were random pills that did absolutely nothing. The group with the red pills were told that their pill may cause itching, jitters, and hyper activity. The group with the blue pill were told that their pill would calm them, make them drowsy. Once the participants took their respective pills, they surprisingly played out the symptoms they expected to have! The people in the red pill room were lively,itching, jittery, and loud. The people in the blue pill room were sleepy, quiet, and reserved. The power of the human mind. That always just stuck in my mind. Its better to go into something with optimism. If you go in planning to fail or doubting yourself-- you might not ever see your full potential.

 

[Victorian]

Here's another good article with lots of stuff about hair. It's long and detailed, but worth the read. The print is really tiny for some reason, so you might want to enlarge it in your browser. Growth and Loss of Hair.

I really believe that natural terminal length rarely even comes into play for the average person. There are just way too many things about the way we (don't) care for our bodies and our hair that inhibit us. Our charge is to learn what they are and try to address them wherever possible. The existence of growth cycles just shouldn't be something that's striking fear and doubt into hair growers. Being positive about your hair journey is everything

 

[myco]

Here's another good article with lots of stuff about hair. It's long and detailed, but worth the read. The print is really tiny for some reason, so you might want to enlarge it in your browser. Growth and Loss of Hair.

I really believe that natural terminal length rarely even comes into play for the average person. There are just way too many things about the way we (don't) care for our bodies and our hair that inhibit us. Our charge is to learn what they are and try to address them wherever possible. The existence of growth cycles just shouldn't be something that's striking fear and doubt into hair growers. Being positive about your hair journey is everything

I agree. You don't want to become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

 

[Isis]

Interesting debate on the inherent growth potential of hair. My perspective is that, just like the mind can heal the body, so can the mind influence the growth rate of hair. If you BELIEVE your hair is INCAPABLE of growing beyond shoulder/brastrap length, then, I am pretty sure your cellular and chemical makeup will follow suit. If you have no barriers in thought about the growth potential of your hair, then your body's physiological ability for hair growth more than likely has no barriers either.

Your hair follicles don't KNOW when the ends have reached brastrap. That's just silly. Regardless of your perspectives on the power of the mind, scientists have already PROVEN that physical ailments generally are an EFFECT of mental stress and anxiety (including hatred, bitterness, resentment and anger) and not a cause in and of themselves.

Read up on the amazing power of the human mind to heal and change the cellular and chemical functions of the human body. I am not jumping on this "hair can only grow so much" bandwagon. Who strives for things they do not even believe exist?

ITA. This is what I was talking about.

 

[Phoenix]

I'm not sure if I buy this terminal length thing...

Let's say I reach brastrap and that's my terminal length. That would mean that I could relax my hair and never have to relax again because my hair is no longer growing?

That just doesn't make sense to me. I've never met anyone (with long hair or short hair) whose hair doesn't grow at all.

 

[MissYocairis]

This might be a lil OT, but it reminds me of a class in medical anthropology I took. It talked about the power of the placebo effect and our minds. One study was about balding men who were given two lotions. One lotion contained minoxidil (the only scientifically proven regrowth agent*found in rogaine and stuff*) and the other lotion was just plain Jergens or some other lotion Both groups were told that they had the lotion that regrew hair... both groups of men had hair growth-- even the one with the plain lotion.

Another study had people given a red pill and another group given a blue pill. Both were random pills that did absolutely nothing. The group with the red pills were told that their pill may cause itching, jitters, and hyper activity. The group with the blue pill were told that their pill would calm them, make them drowsy. Once the participants took their respective pills, they surprisingly played out the symptoms they expected to have! The people in the red pill room were lively,itching, jittery, and loud. The people in the blue pill room were sleepy, quiet, and reserved. The power of the human mind. That always just stuck in my mind. Its better to go into something with optimism. If you go in planning to fail or doubting yourself-- you might not ever see your full potential.

The power of the human mind is one of my favorite subjects....it's limitless!

 

[Victorian]

Phoenix, your hair doesn't just stop growing. An individual hair grows, sheds and gets replaced over and over. Only relatively few hairs are at the shedding point each day (which is why our hair doesn't all just shed at once). A hair follicle is in the growth phase for a certain period of years (varies from person to person). However long it can get within that period, before the hair rests and then sheds, is what we mean by "terminal length". How long it actually gets depends on how fast your hair grows and how much length you lose to trims or breakage. Your growth rate can vary with environmental factors (like warm vs. cold seasons) and also depends on your diet, the health of your scalp, etc. How much you retain depends on how well you take care of it of course, but it's not totally independent of internal factors. If your hair health is degraded due to poor nutrition no amount of s-curl is going to help

The techniques and regimens and stuff that we work on on this board are affecting how much growth we can gain and retain within the growing period. I also remember reading on this board where someone came across some information saying that there was evidence that some supplements, like MSM, might actually affect the length of the growth phase but I haven't looked into that myself. It seems plausible to me though. If your diet can affect the health of your hair and how fast it grows it could probably affect your growth phases as well, although to what degree I don't know.

 

[HairPhoenix]

I'm not sure if I buy this terminal length thing...

Let's say I reach brastrap and that's my terminal length. That would mean that I could relax my hair and never have to relax again because my hair is no longer growing?

That just doesn't make sense to me. I've never met anyone (with long hair or short hair) whose hair doesn't grow at all.

Actually different strands of your hair all across your head are growing in different phases, according to the article, so not all of it will be at the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd phase at the same time. I remember that I thought the same thing (in the bold) years ago and my mom told me that as long as you are alive you hair grows. She's not a scientist but what she said made a whole lot more sense to me. Then I found out that your hair continues to grow for a short period after you die.

This type of science is not the end all or be all of all things. It's biological. We may know a lot about the human body, but no one can absolutely say that they are an all out expert. Like some others have posted here, and I agree with them, the mind controls the body. There is no science that can prove nor disprove the power of the human mind over the body.

Sometimes we see or hear about people sick in the hospital, some terminally ill, and suddenly they unexpectedly start getting better. The first thing most doctors will say is "This shouldn't be happening", "This goes against everything we've learned in medical school", or what have you. The thing is the human mind/human spirit can accomplish a great many things that have yet to be measured or tested or labeled as standard.

 

[Phoenix]

Thanks BlackCardinal & HairPhoenix...that makes much more sense.

On the other hand...I refuse to entertain the idea that I won't be able to reach waistlength. If I have to walk around wearing a plastic bubble on my head to protect my hair, I'll do it!

 

[Lucia]

Notice the part of the article that said over four years you could expect 16 inches of hair even if you trim 2 inches per year? On most of us that is armpit or brastrap.

I don't know, it's almost like people want to talk themselves out of their goals.

16" from nape of neck for me that's passed BSL already

Sometimes we see or hear about people sick in the hospital, some terminally ill, and suddenly they unexpectedly start getting better. The first thing most doctors will say is "This shouldn't be happening", "This goes against everything we've learned in medical school", or what have you. The thing is the human mind/human spirit can accomplish a great many things that have yet to be measured or tested or labeled as standard.

ITA great point, you have to believe enough to at least try and see how far you can go.

 

[Crystalicequeen123]

The way I look at it is: My genetics might say that my terminal hair length is 30 inches. Unless I know how to read DNA, that's not something I know off the top of my head. But if I'm styling and treating my hair in a manner that keeps it at 20 inches, I'll never know that there are 10 extra inches to be had. I think this is what women, especially African-American women have to overcome. Historically, we have confused the way that we nurture our hair, with the actual nature of our hair. We have to put our hair in an optimal healthy, growing position before we can definitively say that this is the most that my hair will ever grow. The steps to that optimal, healthy growing position differ from person to person. That's why so many people on the board are growing their hair longer than they or anyone in their family ever thought possible. You have to do something you've never done before, to get something you've never had before.

EXACTLY!! Good point!

Because think about it.... If you always do what you always did, then you'll always get what you always got.

You can't expect to use sort of the same techniques and expect different results. IF a lot of the ladies on this board are finally seeing good results with their hair health and length, it's because they have done something DIFFERENT from what they used to do.

 

[Crystalicequeen123]

bumping for more responses