Wash And Go, To Grow And To Dazzle 2020 Challenge

First hair pic of 2021
Did an Apogee protein treatment over the weekend. Then yesterday did some Wella demi permanent color with Olaplex (treatment plus the shampoo and conditioner) to get rid of the gray. I'm pretty sure I hadn't colored since November so I was literally looking a rough around the edges. :lachen:


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Mapleoats said:
What would the As recommend as a base layer for a twist out? What is the difference between a thick leave in and a cream styler? Do the As suggest liquid leave ins over heavier cream ones? I’m intrigued by this discussion @faithVA @DVAntDany @toaster.

i used the earth tones max gel last night and whew!! That was a new experience. I felt like I had to work hard to get it in my hair and I didn’t particularly like it with the twist cream. The twist cream is basically a gel in its own right. I realized last night I have a lot to learn about product application lol.
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They typically recommend a leave-in. I don't remember which brands they recommend.

What would be an example of a thick leave-in. Usually a leave-in conditioner is around the same consistency or lighter than a conditioner. Is the product truly a leave-in or is it just called that? Is it a marketing ploy or is it really a leave-in? I can't say I know what a thick leave-in would be.

Remember what they give are guidelines to help make decisions. They ultimately want each person to understand what product are for, the details of their hair and what they are going for. There is no cut or dry answer.

My guess is that most of the time they are recommended a thinner leave-in with a cream with hold for out styles. They make exceptions but that is based on a lot of details.

The A's really do try to help people understand what they are doing and not just throwing stuff together. They want us to ask the right questions and then we will know what to use and when.
 
GettingKinky said:
Thanks @beebee83 I love short videos from the As.

ETA- I just watched the video, the basics of her current technique are there, but she has definitely evolved and changed her process quite a bit in the last 6 years. I’m in shock that she air dried her hair. And used a paper towel to scrunch out some of the water. :-O
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The use of the paper towel is funny to see now, but I recall that it worked for me at the time! Back in 2015, I didn't have an at-home dryer, so a paper towel got the job done. :-) It's also fun to see that she's still an adherent of Malibu UnDooGoo and Uncle Funky's for product rec's.


GettingKinky said:
Thanks @beebee83 I love short videos from the As.

ETA- I just watched the video, the basics of her current technique are there, but she has definitely evolved and changed her process quite a bit in the last 6 years. I’m in shock that she air dried her hair. And used a paper towel to scrunch out some of the water. :-O
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@Mapleoats earthtones is definitely a weird gel and takes some getting used to! It’s probably not for everyone. At some point maybe this year or next year I plan to go to a stylist that uses it on her own hair, and I’m going to ask a lot of questions.

I generally only follow the A’s for advice on wash and go’s, as I was always happy with my twist outs in the past, so I’m not sure what they say.

I never used a gel for twistouts. I believe the last product I was using was the melanin haircare cream in a tub. I’d twist my hair and leave it in twists as a style for at least a week. I found when I unraveled the twists after that long I didn’t need a product with hold, my hair just held the style. That’s probably not what works best for everyone.
 
toaster said:
@Mapleoats earthtones is definitely a weird gel and takes some getting used to! It’s probably not for everyone. At some point maybe this year or next year I plan to go to a stylist that uses it on her own hair, and I’m going to ask a lot of questions.

I generally only follow the A’s for advice on wash and go’s, as I was always happy with my twist outs in the past, so I’m not sure what they say.

I never used a gel for twistouts. I believe the last product I was using was the melanin haircare cream in a tub. I’d twist my hair and leave it in twists as a style for at least a week. I found when I unraveled the twists after that long I didn’t need a product with hold, my hair just held the style. That’s probably not what works best for everyone.
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I have the same experience. If I leave my hair in twist for a while it holds better. But I am also one who uses gel on twists because I usually keep my twists in for a week. Whenever I get hair I will try a cream to set. I've never had much luck with creams in the past, so have that learning curve.
 
Mapleoats said:
What would the As recommend as a base layer for a twist out? What is the difference between a thick leave in and a cream styler? Do the As suggest liquid leave ins over heavier cream ones? I’m intrigued by this discussion @faithVA @DVAntDany @toaster.

i used the earth tones max gel last night and whew!! That was a new experience. I felt like I had to work hard to get it in my hair and I didn’t particularly like it with the twist cream. The twist cream is basically a gel in its own right. I realized last night I have a lot to learn about product application lol.
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Their latest stance is that you don’t need a leave in for a twist out, you can use just foam. But if you want to use a leave in for more lubrications, they recommend Innersense Quiet Calm.
They also recommend drying the twists under a dryer and letting them cure for at least 24 hours before taking them down.
 
toaster said:
@DVAntDany

I’m not a chemist but I think a cream styler with no hold would be analogous to a facial moisturizer. It has both water (for moisture) and also occlusive ingredients to keep the moisture from evaporating so quickly. A leave in is like a serum, it usually has water and maybe some ingredient that tackles a certain problem (detangling, usually) but not enough heavy ingredients to keep the moisture in for very long, that’s why you have to top it with something.

Similar to skincare, no product is going to prevent water from evaporating from your hair, but I’d guess a heavy cream styler slows it down a bit.
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That makes sense. The one and only leave in I have, I can’t see it doing much to my hair. I’ve never been liberal with its application though.

My Innersense products came in today. I have a sample of Quiet Calm. The directions say to apply a pea size amount to wet hands and gently rake through wet hair to separate and shape curls. Hmm, I’m not sure if that applies to my hair.

I also have a sample of the hydrating cream hair bath since it’s suggested as a moisturizing shampoo. I think the Mielle Pom and Honey shampoo worked just fine because it’s not stripping. I’ll see how this one compares. I can see why they only suggest using the AG for once a week. It’s strong.
 
GettingKinky said:
Their latest stance is that you don’t need a leave in for a twist out, you can use just foam. But if you want to use a leave in for more lubrications, they recommend Innersense Quiet Calm.
They also recommend drying the twists under a dryer and letting them cure for at least 24 hours before taking them down.
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I agree they just say foam but on their newest course thingy, the example shows twists being used on dry hair. The hair was shampooed, conditioned and placed into braids to dry. A few days later the hair was styled with a styler. On dry hair quiet calm was placed on first and then the hair was wet with styling foam.

I’m not sure if they would suggest it that same product combo if doing twists while hair is wet.

The vid had Nairobi foaming lotion but they often suggest The Doux Mousse Def. Both of those styling foams are listed on their current product list.
 
DVAntDany said:
I agree they just say foam but on their newest course thingy, the example shows twists being used on dry hair. The hair was shampooed, conditioned and placed into braids to dry. A few days later the hair was styled with a styler. On dry hair quiet calm was placed on first and then the hair was wet with styling foam.

I’m not sure if they would suggest it that same product combo if doing twists while hair is wet.

The vid had Nairobi foaming lotion but they often suggest The Doux Mousse Def. Both of those styling foams are listed on their current product list.
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I haven't watched the videos. It sounds like in 1 year they have changed their stance twice. It sounds like they are making it up on the fly. Neither of them are big twist/braid out girls. This last option sounds like more time and more work.
 
I know someone had mentioned clays a few days ago and I had said I wasn't getting rid of mine. I looked at my YT and I notice the the Maximum Hydration method is making a come back. I saw at least 8 videos in the past 4 months. That is surprising. I didn't expect that. I wonder why and who got it restarted. Just an observation.
 
faithVA said:
Just going with the A's. The A's recommend a base layer which varies with your style. If you are doing a wash and go your base layer is a gel. If you are doing some type of twist out/braid out etc, your base layer is a leave-in. The base layer is botanical and is basically to start the set of your hair. I have not heard the A's recommend a cream product as a base layer. They aren't saying you can't use one but they would ask what the purpose of it is.

If the style is a wash and go, after your base layer you can choose whether to add another layer to address a condition like hold or frizz, etc. That is where toppers come in which can be a gel, mousse, cream depending on your hair and your desired outcome.

With a out style the next layer would be something with hold.

Speaking generally, the only reason I can see using a cream styler with no hold is if the person was going to wear twists or braids and not take them out for a twist out. Or if the person did not want a defined style.

There are some products that might be considered both the base layer and the product with hold.
And there are some products that are part of a system, like Kinky Curly that have an application process outside of the A's recommendations.
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This is the exception to the rule.
Quiet Calm topped with ICH, but she definitely states why.

I get what you are saying. Select products intelligently. There has to be a rhyme and reason for all choices when it comes to styling hair.

I think the curl mix system is meant to be like Kinky Curly but the A’s sees one as a base and the other as a topper. They classify TreLux as a system.
 
faithVA said:
I haven't watched the videos. It sounds like in 1 year they have changed their stance twice. It sounds like they are making it up on the fly. Neither of them are big twist/braid out girls. This last option sounds like more time and more work.
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I watched the vids used on the kids too. So Glasses styled her daughter similar to this. She shampooed and conditioner her daughter and left the hair in plaits to style once dried at a later time. Nothing was placed on the hair after the conditioner.

So maybe this is a way to do it if you are short on time or going to sleep. It gives you clean hair to work on that is manageable when you do get to styling.

Editing to say that even in those Mielle live tutorials, they do something similar. They shampoo, conditioner and let the hair air dry over night. The next day they dampen the hair with water from spray bottle and add product/stylers for the flat twists.

Monique mentioned not doing it on soaking wet hair or freshly washed hair. This was co-signed by her stylist. She says it not only takes forever to dry but does not turn out right. So air drying overnight without products seems to be the way to do it. Even Jennifer talked about blow drying the hair first before using setting lotion.
 
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DVAntDany said:
I watched the vids used on the kids too. So Glasses styled her daughter similar to this. She shampooed and conditioner her daughter and left the hair in plaits to style once dried at a later time. Nothing was placed on the hair after the conditioner.

So maybe this is a way to do it if you are short on time or going to sleep. It gives you clean hair to work on that is manageable when you do get to styling.

Editing to say that even in those Mielle live tutorials, they do something similar. They shampoo, conditioner and let the hair air dry over night. The next day they dampen the hair with water from spray bottle and add product/stylers for the flat twists.

Monique mentioned not doing it on soaking wet hair or freshly washed hair. This was co-signed by her stylist. She says it not only takes forever to dry but does not turn out right. So air drying overnight without products seems to be the way to do it. Even Jennifer talked about blow drying the hair first before using setting lotion.
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Early during the quarantine Aishia did 4 different hair style videos and posted them on YouTube. She called it a Hair-intine. I’m sure they’ve been removed. But for her twist out, flat twist out and braid out she styled on wet hair with just the Doux. I think starting from dry hair gives less shrinkage. They also used to have a video of a twist out on blow dried hair.

Really there are no hard and fast rules, except to wash and condition your hair on a regular basis. The rest all depends on what you want your hair to look like, and how long you want it to last. If your hair is in good condition I think anything is fair game to try.
 
DVAntDany said:
I watched the vids used on the kids too. So Glasses styled her daughter similar to this. She shampooed and conditioner her daughter and left the hair in plaits to style once dried at a later time. Nothing was placed on the hair after the conditioner.

So maybe this is a way to do it if you are short on time or going to sleep. It gives you clean hair to work on that is manageable when you do get to styling.

Editing to say that even in those Mielle live tutorials, they do something similar. They shampoo, conditioner and let the hair air dry over night. The next day they dampen the hair with water from spray bottle and add product/stylers for the flat twists.

Monique mentioned not doing it on soaking wet hair or freshly washed hair. This was co-signed by her stylist. She says it not only takes forever to dry but does not turn out right. So air drying overnight without products seems to be the way to do it. Even Jennifer talked about blow drying the hair first before using setting lotion.
Click to expand...
in the winter time I air-dry overnight with my leave in conditioner. They are right. Not only does it take forever for the hair to dry but the hair can turn out really harder than expected. For me, I cant tell if a leave in conditioner works if I have to put something on top of it. I cleanse, conditioner and add my leave in and air-dry. Then the next day, dampened and style.

However in the warm weather I go straight to styling because Im not using a leave in. I have routinely used a gel based styler and then a creamy based styler on top for my moisture for years.
 
Interesting. I’ve been dropping the leave ins lately for my twists because I’ve been feeling like they don’t actually do much when I’m already using a cream based styler that is moisturizing/lubricating. Really trying to take a closer look at my products and understand what I’m getting out of them.
 
Did my reset today. Optimally I should reset every 3 days but for now I think I may have to settle for every 4 until I really get a consistent regimen.

I shampooed once with diluted shampoo and detangled with my Tangle Buster. I had definition here.

I applied my diluted conditioner. I had definition for a bit but the more conditioner I applied the less defined it became. I added a lot of water but that didn't seem to matter. Going to try diluting the conditioner some more and look for more of a rinse than a conditioner. I let the conditioner sit while I showered.

I rinsed and then used the concentrated shower head on my hair.

I applied the UFD and made sure I got my roots and ends. This time I made sure I smoothed it in horizontally and vertically. I think this makes a difference as far a coverage in my shorter parts. Then I loaded it down with water.

I tried putting on a baggy and letting my hair sit while I dressed. I know this helps a lot of ladies but it doesn't seem to make a difference for my hair. I think what I will try though is rolling/twisting my hair in sections and pinning it up. I think my hair needs compression or pressure.

Then I applied the Aunt Jackie's and smoothed it in. I actually did smaller sections and shingled and that seemed to work nicely with my curls. I did it horizontally though.

I shake my hair but I am wondering if my hair looks better if I just shingle and don't shake. I will have to figure that out.

My hair is super wet so I see a diffuser or dryer in my future :lol:


For next CCS, the changes I will make are
- dilute my conditioner more
- smooth in the UFD horizontally and vertically
- roll/twist sections and pin
- shingle in smaller sections
- decide if I want to try just shingling without shaking.
 
Looking on Ulta site for some lightweight conditioners. I'm wondering if most conditioners are just too heavy for my coils. Looking at some travel sizes to try them out. If they don't work I will just give them to SO. DevaCurl has a lightweight and I like the DevaCurl Decadence so that may work. Pureology has one as well. I have not used Pureology but I know it is very popular in salons. And Pattern has one. Why not? :lol: Innersense has a lightweight conditioner as well but I can only get it online and not in the store.

I'm going to hold them in my cart for now and decide on Friday whether I am going to purchase them.
 
I really need a shape-up. My wash and gos have had a really weird shape lately, and I'm getting a bit more breakage than usual, which is what happens when I go too long without a trim.

On the plus-side, I used the Earthtones Natural Max Enhancing Gelly again and the results were great. This time, I used in it the shower and wet my hair multiple times to make sure that it fully emulsified in my hair, which it didn't last time. It foamed up beautifully, I have minimal frizz, and my hair is soft. My hair typically has less hold when I use gels on super wet hair, so we'll see how it goes this time.
 
faithVA said:
Looking on Ulta site for some lightweight conditioners. I'm wondering if most conditioners are just too heavy for my coils. Looking at some travel sizes to try them out. If they don't work I will just give them to SO. DevaCurl has a lightweight and I like the DevaCurl Decadence so that may work. Pureology has one as well. I have not used Pureology but I know it is very popular in salons. And Pattern has one. Why not? :lol: Innersense has a lightweight conditioner as well but I can only get it online and not in the store.

I'm going to hold them in my cart for now and decide on Friday whether I am going to purchase them.
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I just decided that I don’t like my Deva Decadence because it’s too light.
I did my UFD only mid week wash/style and I’m pretty sure this one is going to last longer than last week because I used a heavier conditioner.

I would offer you my bottle of Decadence @faithVA, but it’s been open for almost 2 years now.

@toaster now that I realize I need a “heavy” conditioner how does the Curl Charisma compare to Innersense hydrating conditioner or the color radiance conditioner?
 
toaster said:
@GettingKinky I have only ever used the innersense hydrating conditioner, but curl charisma is definitely more thick in texture and I need to use less product (still a lot of product, but less than innersense) to coat my strands.
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Cool. I am going to order some. Not that I need it any time soon. I still have a full 32oz bottle of color radiance under my sink and a 1/4 full bottle in the shower.
 
GettingKinky said:
I just decided that I don’t like my Deva Decadence because it’s too light.
I did my UFD only mid week wash/style and I’m pretty sure this one is going to last longer than last week because I used a heavier conditioner.

I would offer you my bottle of Decadence @faithVA, but it’s been open for almost 2 years now.

@toaster now that I realize I need a “heavy” conditioner how does the Curl Charisma compare to Innersense hydrating conditioner or the color radiance conditioner?
Click to expand...
I was thinking about you and the Deva Decadence. And I was thinking I probably liked it because it was light. It is the only conditioner that I know of that semi works on my hair. I never put two and two together. I'm going to get the Deva conditioner that is even lighter than the Decadence to see how it works. You are making me push the Check out button :grin:

I appreciate the thought. It probably costs more to ship it to me than what it is worth :lol:
 
I tried the shampoo brush. I’m never planning to try and detangle with shampoo, so I didn’t use it until I had my hair soaked in conditioner. Surprisingly I liked it for detangling. The bristles are just a tad shorter than on my wet brush, but it worked very well. I have the flimsy cheap shampoo brush with lots of little plastic bristles.

I also used it to smooth my gel in while I was styling. I have to see how it dries to see if it was worth the extra step versus just raking with my fingers.

You guys know my wash and go always looks the same, so we’ll see in about an hour.
 
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