Placebo effect?

[webby]

My coworker wears her hair shaved close to her scalp.
Last week, she accidently put the wrong size guard on her buzzers and took her hair down too short (dayum near bald in the back). I returned from vacation and she's got hair again.

It occured to me, that even when we shave our legs in the morning, by the end of the day it's possible to feel stubble, right?

So, that means that most of the products that promise amazing hair growth, cannot possibly do anything to speed up the process. Our hair is going to grow at the rate is it supposed to grow at, unless it is slowed down due to meds or stress.

Are we experiencing hair growth, or is it a placebo effect? What do you think?

 

[moda]

It just may be placebo effect. It seems all the people I know personally trying to grow out their hair and always claiming to have found the miracle product, never show any amazing results, at least not IMO. If these products produced so much growth why aren't the people using them ever satisfied? There is a new product claiming to increase hair growth rate all the time, and it seems that some people want to use them all. If something is working so great for you, why are you still looking for the next best thing erplexed

 

[MomofThreeBoys]

I think people get really excited about a new product and really want it to work. So I can easily see the placebo affect occuring in many cases.

Hence the value of measuring.....

 

[pink_flower]

It just may be placebo effect. It seems all the people I know personally trying to grow out their hair and always claiming to have found the miracle product, never show any amazing results, at least IMO. If these products produced so much growth why aren't the people using them ever satisfied? There is a new product claiming to increase hair growth rate all the time, and it seems that some people want to use the all. If something is working so great for you, why are you still looking for the next best thing erplexed

ITA!


I'm still iffy on hair growth products myself. I often wonder how people can really know if its one product when they do so many different things to promote growth.

 

[Poohbear]

So, that means that most of the products that promise amazing hair growth, cannot possibly do anything to speed up the process. Our hair is going to grow at the rate is it supposed to grow at, unless it is slowed down due to meds or stress.

I agree with what you said in what I quoted above.

 

[sillygurl18]

Preach that! LOL!

I think it's the placebo effect.

 

[Poohbear]

It just may be placebo effect. It seems all the people I know personally trying to grow out their hair and always claiming to have found the miracle product, never show any amazing results, at least not IMO. If these products produced so much growth why aren't the people using them ever satisfied? There is a new product claiming to increase hair growth rate all the time, and it seems that some people want to use them all. If something is working so great for you, why are you still looking for the next best thing erplexed

Great point! For example, I've seen where someone used MTG, claimed about extreme growth, and show these so-called amazing result pics (which looked like normal growth to me)...then you see them buying Lenzi's Request. Was the MTG not working anymore?

 

[webby]

Cincy, you're right. I have been using:

Vitatress biotin
Nioxin
ORS Growth Stimulator

Recently added
Surge and Dr. Miracles.

All of this to combat post partum shedding, when I know there is nothing these products can do to adjust my hormones. I chipped the ends of the hair around my hairline and noticed that it was looking better and immediately wanted to attribute it to one, or all of the products I've been using.

BULL! My hormones are finally levelling out and I always use good conditioners. I won't be buying into the "grow hair faster" myth anymore

 

[webby]

Great point! For example, I've seen where someone used MTG, claimed about extreme growth, and show these so-called amazing result pics (which looked like normal growth to me)...then you see them buying Lenzi's Request. Was the MTG not working anymore?

I'm not knocking products usefulness. Maybe they do help, by adding nutrients, but I don't think that anything can speed up the process.

And, although I may have seemed as if I was condemning Lenzi's Request, I want to clarify that I KNOW that God gives out talents and special gifts to people. Maybe He gave Ms. Sue the ingredients that will help a lot of people, but I still don't believe that anything can grow the hair with more speed. Does that make sense?

 

[Poohbear]

I still don't believe that anything can grow the hair with more speed.

This is the main point I making with the example I used.

 

[moda]

I'm not knocking products usefulness. Maybe they do help, by adding nutrients, but I don't think that anything can speed up the process.

And, although I may have seemed as if I was condemning Lenzi's Request, I want to clarify that I KNOW that God gives out talents and special gifts to people. Maybe He gave Ms. Sue the ingredients that will help a lot of people, but I still don't believe that anything can grow the hair with more speed. Does that make sense?

I am not knocking it either, but I just about fall out of my chair when I see XXXXX post such great "progress" shots from ______ and then ______ made YYYYY hair grow 2" in 30 days, so then XXXXX runs and orders it, makes me a little complexed and then at the end of the year XXXXX and YYYYY still ain't hit brastrap when they predicted they would in 3 months

 

[webby]

I am not knocking it either, but I just about fall out of my chair when I see XXXXX post such great "progress" shots from ______ and then ______ made YYYYY hair grow 2" in 30 days, so then XXXXX runs and orders it, makes me a little complexed and then at the end of the year XXXXX and YYYYY still ain't hit brastrap when they predicted they would in 3 months

Oh man...it's a good thing Mo, Ash and Sha aren't in this thread...

 

[moneychaser]

I don't know. I have seen a great difference in my hair since the introduction of supplements. I can't believe how strong and hair they have made my nails, its crazy

 

[moda]

Oh man...it's a good thing Mo, Ash and Sha aren't in this thread...

Don't talk em up

I am not saying these products cannot help with length retention, I just question that they can really increase the growth rate. I don't think anyone has a problem growing hair, it just may be something in their diet or regimen causing them not to retain length.

I have seen things along these lines:

Person starts using surge because XXXX says it makes your hair grow, well then they can't style their hair because surge is water based, so they are in a bun all month, then since they are in a bun they are exercising since their hair is pulled back anyway and then they are eating healthier because they don't want to negate the exercise, and then they are increasing protein intake because they are weight training and they gain 1" of growth vs their normal 1/2", so it had to be the surge right erplexed

 

[pink_flower]

Why does someone always know someone who knew someone who grew their hair really fast in 6 months...

Anyways I always chuck it up to THAT person has a faster growth rate than ME.

Certain products and vitamins can help with the appearance and structure of hair but I don't think it speeds up your natural growth rate. The only way I can see anything effecting my rate is if I were deficient in certain nutrients before vitamins and they boosted me to my maximum growth rate.

But this is my personal opinion.

 

[Poohbear]

I don't know. I have seen a great difference in my hair since the introduction of supplements. I can't believe how strong and hair they have made my nails, its crazy

I think there's a difference between supplements (which you consume internally) and hair products that claim faster growth (which you apply externally). See, supplements are a part of your diet which will affect your entire body. So are vitamins. I agree with what pink_flower said about being deficient in a certain vitamin or nutrient, and after taking it, you get a boost on your growth rate. I just don't think you can apply a certain hair product onto your scalp and speed up the growth rate. I'm sure if you apply Surge Plus 14 to your legs, it won't make your hair grow faster.

 

[NewlyNature12]

Sooo....are you saying that all the rage about MTG/Surge/insert whatever growth product is just the placebo effect? Looking at pictures, I think some products really have helped people grow their hair....

 

[Poohbear]

Why does someone always know someone who knew someone who grew their hair really fast in 6 months...

I would like to know the answer to that question too!

 

[deedabug]

im gonna have to go the opposite direction....

what if a person had a bald spot and had it for years without puttin anything on the spot...

discovered surge or somethin and started puttin it on like the directions say...

and they got fuzz in a cpl of weeks then in a mth is fillin in nicely...

so that doesnt have anything to do with surge?? uh k lol....

i do get what yall r sayin tho about why use a bunch of things if the first thing was workin so hot...

i also think that like anything to do with the body...like if u r loosing weight....

u may loose alot at first then u cant loose nothin....

i think hair can do the same...it may shoot off at first then slow back down for a while....

i'm not a chemist or a hair expert but aren't some things proven to grow hair....like sulfur...monoglycerides (sp?)

 

[Babygurl]

I have no clue, but I will say this: the people that claim to go from getting 1/4 inch a month to suddenly growing 2 inches a week are the people I never see pictures or meet. I always "hear" about someone who had "2 inches in 2 days", but they never seem to want to show proof.

**Ducking out of thread QUICKLY**

 

[Poohbear]

Sooo....are you saying that all the rage about MTG/Surge/insert whatever growth product is just the placebo effect? Looking at pictures, I think some products really have helped people grow their hair....

The creation of hair cells happens beneath the surface, in the hair bulb. The cells in the hair bulb divide rapidly. As new hair cells are created, the older hair cells are pushed up to the surface. As they reach the surface, their supply of nourishment becomes cut off. Eventually they die and form a hard protein called keratin.

By the time the hair has reached about one third of it's way to the surface of the skin, the keratinization process would be completed. And the hair comes out as a tough strand of dead cells.


Now how is MTG, Surge, super gro grease, or whatever gonna reach the hair bulb which is beneath the surface of the scalp in order to increase the rate of growth???

For the pictures you have seen, the amount of new growth that they take a picture of may be the result of their diet, or they may be in the anagen phase (growth phase). Also, when using a promising growth product, you are going to take pics of your hair growth. Do you ever see comparison pics of their hair before they start using the product? Not always, so you really don't know how much faster their hair is growing and you never know which cycle they are in of hair growth.

 

[webby]

I don't know. I have seen a great difference in my hair since the introduction of supplements. I can't believe how strong and hair they have made my nails, its crazy

Now, I will quickly admit that there are a number of products that I have used that have made my hair stronger, easier to manage and have prevented breakage, but my hair has not grown any faster, ya know?

 

[LaNecia]

Well, I have to add my two cents cause I'm one of those try everything under the sun girls ya'll are talking about...

Anyway, over the years, I've found VERY FEW products that have done what they claim, as far as rapidaly accelerating hair growth. Recently, I've found one or two that have done a decent job at aiding MY growth but the curious side of me (maybe partially out of habit/the other out of morbid curiosity) wants to try the latest and great claim to hit the streets). It's not a matter at all of the other product not working at all, in fact, I can't say there's a logical explaination for the continued search, at least for me. Maybe it's the PJ in me...

I think it's a bit hard to say that folks are claiming super growth and it looks normal to you, so it's not really increased growth at all. I know personally, my hair usually does not start reflecting visible new growth until at least 2 weeks after a relaxer. Lately, it's been doing much better and I haven't changed my eating, exercise and I've stopped taking all my vitamins just cause I'm too lazy to package them every day. But I could be just in a growth phase or it could be the seasonal factor.

Who knows? I keep photos on a monthly basis so I'm able to see the results (or lack thereof). The befores and afters. Not only that but I keep a written journal of what I use, how often, in what combinations, etc, so along w/the photos, I can make an assessment if I'm being 'hysterical' or not.

But for the most part, I think often it's a case of we see what we want to see. As for me, those things which have worked, I will continue using cause it's been proven, at least to me.

***Turning on my cloaking device!***​

 

[Annakei]

It sounds like alot of people are cosigning because they have had doubts al along but see them cosigning elsewhere on this board congratulating someone's progress.

I am one of those people with a faster growth rate since using MTG and adding supplements to my diet. Before I would get about 1/2 inch per month. Afterwards, I was getting about 1.5 inches per month. I have pictures to prove it. *shrug* I think we all know what someone's hair looks like (at the starting point) when it is braided or freshly relaxed. That is how I determine NG. Currently my twists have been in for 3 weeks and I can take pics and show where there are parts of my hair that have grown out to almost 2 inches as well as my "sides and kitchen". Placebo...I think not..



Now how is MTG, Surge, super gro grease, or whatever gonna reach the hair bulb which is beneath the surface of the scalp in order to increase the rate of growth???
Simple..it absorbs into your scalp when you use it.

The creation of hair cells happens beneath the surface, in the hair bulb. The cells in the hair bulb divide rapidly. As new hair cells are created, the older hair cells are pushed up to the surface. As they reach the surface, their supply of nourishment becomes cut off. Eventually they die and form a hard protein called keratin.

Hair is made mostly of protein. If you take supplements, then in most cases you will see an increase in growth and strength of your hair.



I don't see how scores of women on this site could be just overlyhyped. I was VERY VERY skeptical when I read about MTG on another site:BHCM, and bought it, and have seen results not typical as per my previous growth rate.

I know Im stepping on toes ut again my experience.

 

[Poohbear]

Simple..it absorbs into your scalp when you use it.

Of course when you apply something to your scalp, it will absorb the product chemicals/ingredients/or what not. Just because your skin absorbs it does not mean it will increase the rate of growth which is genetically determined.

Hair is made mostly of protein. If you take supplements, then in most cases you will see an increase in growth and strength of your hair.

You are right about hair being made mostly of protein. I was not denying that food, supplements, or vitamins wouldn't have an affect on your hair. Those are things you consume internally. I just don't believe a hair product or substance that you apply externally will make your hair grow faster. Products like MTG, Surge, or whatever may help retain the hair you grow (keep it from breaking off, may make your hair stronger), but not increase the growth.

 

[webby]

Annakei, I think that you are misunderstanding my post.
I'm not questioning whether or not products can improve the condition of one's hair, thereby adding the overall length. What I'm saying is that perhaps what we are deeming an excelerated rate of growth, is actually the normal rate. Since we are using a plethora of products, we think that the product has enhance the overall growth rate.

 

[Annakei]

Well, in my case it has, and I have pictures to prove it. Not that I NEED to but do if I have to do pluck down the doubters out here. Again, I dont think that any of us (unless you are a medical doctor...and still, everyone's body is different) can TELL the other that NO your hair isnt growing as you say it is. PAHLEASE. There are many of us who take different combinations of things to make their hair grow. I take vitamins and use Surge/MTG. I started seeing a change after using the SURGE/MTG combo and THEN added the supplements and then changed my diet. Others only take vitamins, others only use topical things like MTG to increase growth. After seeing some FOTKI albums here, I know that it is possible with good health, excercise and even a topical product that is formulated to increase growth that it can happen. Take women who have alopecia that can attest to <insert hair product here> hellping then increase hair growth in a certain area. My step mother is in the same situation and used another produc to stimulate growth and it has totally worked for her....afterwards she began to change her diet and be more active.

Think it over...

So are you saying that after giving that testimony which I deem true that I am somehow mistaken? LOL I think not. I just think that until you find something that works for you then you'll still be a doubter. You don't have to believe it but know that for ME and many others reading it works.

 

[Annakei]

Annakei, I think that you are misunderstanding my post.
I'm not questioning whether or not products can improve the condition of one's hair, thereby adding the overall length. What I'm saying is that perhaps what we are deeming an excelerated rate of growth, is actually the normal rate. Since we are using a plethora of products, we think that the product has enhance the overall growth rate.

So what do you say to well heck ME where my growth rate BEFORE MTG (no vitamins, but still good diet) was 1/2 inch per month and after I was getting 1-1.5 inches? If I had no other change in diet or regime then what would you attribute it to.

I wish someone would do a clinical trial of it and see how it stacks up because I would definately put my money down on it.

 

[Belle Du Jour]

I'm not knocking products usefulness. Maybe they do help, by adding nutrients, but I don't think that anything can speed up the process.

And, although I may have seemed as if I was condemning Lenzi's Request, I want to clarify that I KNOW that God gives out talents and special gifts to people. Maybe He gave Ms. Sue the ingredients that will help a lot of people, but I still don't believe that anything can grow the hair with more speed. Does that make sense?

It took me a year or so to figure that out.

 

[Cichelle]

Just because you get results from a product or treatment does not necessarily mean that product works. That's what the placebo effect is about. There is some disagreement about what actually causes the benefit of a "placebo pill". But some think it is psychological. In other words, some people believe in something and this belief has a powerful effect, even on the hormones and reactions of the body. Consider that experiments have been done where people were given inert pills or treatments and yet had great results. Warts disappeared, asthma got better, etc...all from "placebo" treatments that were sometimes mere suggestions.

Some people are more suggestable than others. And some things will make some people believe more than others. For instance, if you are a very religious person, you may be drawn in by religious claims that something works. People may also be convinced when they see other people claiming to have good results. It is also true that sometimes it is WHO is doing the suggesting. When a doctor gives you a perscription and tells you it will help you feel better....you are likely to believe her....and your mind gets ready to feel better.

I'm not saying products don't work. I am just saying that you can get results and still be using a product with no benefit. The best way to determine whether something really works is to subject it to scientific testing. It needs to be used in a controlled study, peer reviewed and duplicated. (This way, any intervening variables would be accounted for as much as possible, as well.) In other words, the study must be reliable and valid. I suspect most hair growth products, particularly topical ones, would not pass this test.

Again, I am not saying there are no products that work, or that people do not get results from certain products. I am just trying to explain more about the placebo effect and the fact that it is possible to get results from products that actually have no benefit.