Messianic Hebrews/Yisra'el/Nazarenes???

[alexstin]

I've heard of the Lemba people. Anyone ever see "Return to Glory"? It's talks about the same kind of stuff...Egyptians, The lemba people and so on. It talks about how Napoleon shot the nose off the Great Sphinx because of it's "black" features. The funny thing is this documentary is research done by a caucasian who wanted the truth to be known.

My DH and I actually showed it at our college ministry one night. Many of the caucasians were surprised. I remember one guy came up to DH and said It never entered his mind that the Egyptians weren't white.

http://www.returntoglory.org/

 

[Belle Du Jour]

Very interesting thread.

 

[Nice & Wavy]

All those who accept Messiah and His Ways become Israel, in other words one becomes a part of Israel in Messiah!!
(There is scripture on this, I will find them.)

I wanted to present what I previously stated to show that ALL (black, white, asian, etc.) are accepted by those who want to live. Messiah is equal opportunity.

Nextly ladies, at some point physical Israel was dispersed to the four corners of the globe by General Titus during the Jerusalem siege around AD 70'ish. I am very much an ancient historian of sorts with concentrated concerned over the ancient parts of Africa. Many of Israel did go into Africa. ( I will post ancient depictions later, since many were mistaken for an Egyptian---please take a look at the computer reconstruction of RamesesII. Paul(Sha'ul) was mistaken for an Egyptian.
Acts 21:38 "Art not thou that Egyptian, which before these days madest an uproar, and leddest out into the wilderness four thousand men that were murderers?" Think of Moses(Moshe) too and the rest of the people. As well as Abraham.)

I posted earlier a link to the Igbo Benei Yisrael, they are physical descendents of Israel. Many over the hundreds of years had become muslim and Christian(not Nazarene) and lost who they were but there were pockets who maintained who they were.

I have a friend who is American black and part Igbo- they get called "Hebrews" by non-hebrew peoples in Nigeria. The term Igbo or Ibo is a corruption of the word.. Hebrew(Ibri)

Igbos, Ashanti, and Many other WEST African tribes are also Israel. (I will get a more extensive list later) Many of your infamous West African empires including Timbuktu, were once Israelite. The term Ashanti is not a Hamitic term. It is purely Aramaic/Hebrew. Ashan means smoke and ti means people of.
Therefore you have People of Ashan (Please read Josh 15:42, you will see the town of Ashan, the Ashanti are probably from Yahudah (Judah).


It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out once we know this, that many of us are the same physical descendents as the Igbo, Ashantis and others. This was prophesied before the time of Messiah to occur that we would be dispersed and our heritage forgotten. This is why many do not accept us, as "jews". There is an entire population of people who are currently at the bottom of the totem pole who are the same as Igbos and thus the same as Paul and Moses. There is more than just the Ethiopian east African contingent. There is the Central African, Southern African (black) as well as WEST African. The Lemba people who reside in Central to southern Africa are the TRUE Priests of Aaronic lineage. (Think Aaron the brother of Moses, I sat an watched a show where the PEOPLE THEMSELVES said, "WE are the TRUE African HEBREWS!!!!" They showed them saying that more than once. I have it on tape and they said so themselves!!!! They are not my words.

I will be back later...this is YOUR story ladies!!!

interesting, indeed!

 

[Shimmie]

Strangled means that the animal was literally strangled and not killed properly. The animal must be killed in a way that the blood is drained out as much as possible. When an animal is strangled certain hormones are unleashed in the body that aren't good and in turn you eat it.

Our Creator when He created the Instructions for eating is wise. There are bio-chemical reasons as well as spiritual for eating certain foods and killing them a certain way. It is not because He simply said so and was being a harsh diety. There are scientific reasons that many are unaware of.

tsiporah, please keep this coming. I'm so humbled by this information being posted. These pictures are breath taking and no one can dispute the truth of what you are sharing.

Maybe this thread can become a 'sticky'.

I thank God for you.

 

[StrawberryQueen]

So...it seems like more is being said than just religion.

I know there are certain people of African that are descendants of one or more of the 12 tribes, is that what you're saying you are?

And does this have an effect on you being a Messanic Jew? Do you know what I mean? I don't think I'm being clear. Sorry.

 

[tsiporah]

I was thinking the same thing... like a New Year's resolution.... but how to begin to do this? How to ask for this in a restaurant?

You can begin by reading Lev. 11 and checking to see what is clean and unclean. There are some online lists on some Messianic site that give information. You can continue to eat meats like chicken, fish with scales, beef. But with the read meats and chicken make sure you soak it in Kosher salt to get rid of the blood. It doesn't take much. When shopping look for the Kosher symbols. Some have a U or K or some version of it or Parve. (These foods do not contain unclean animals.)

Take note that unclean animals clean the earth!! Yahuah (The Father) never intended for His children to eat things that clean the earth.

Did you know that Pork is a meat that spoils from inside out??

 

[tsiporah]

RelaxerRehab,

I used to be a Methodist then Non-Denominational. Born Israelite. I had been studying Hebraism for years though, until I got the nerve to leave church and begin observing the things we were commanded to do. I was a member of a synagogue for a while but it is so far then the gas situation occurred so I just got up with me and my boys and study on early Sat mornings and we do Scripture study. We also do all of the Feasts. People have no idea that this Way of life that Yah gave to us is sooooo much easier and great blessings do come to you!!!

I don't mind the questions at all....keep them coming you guys!! I love to teach.

 

[tsiporah]

I've heard of the Lemba people. Anyone ever see "Return to Glory"? It's talks about the same kind of stuff...Egyptians, The lemba people and so on. It talks about how Napoleon shot the nose off the Great Sphinx because of it's "black" features. The funny thing is this documentary is research done by a caucasian who wanted the truth to be known.

My DH and I actually showed it at our college ministry one night. Many of the caucasians were surprised. I remember one guy came up to DH and said It never entered his mind that the Egyptians weren't white.

http://www.returntoglory.org/

Yes girl! I have seen the site before. I am VERY familiar with it. Yes, this not only prooves Egypt was "Negroid" but so was Israel since they were neighbors. The reason why media wants Egypt white is because it then paints the other peoples around them white. But if portrayed black (which is true) then it portrays it close neighbors the same.

 

[Belle Du Jour]

Here's my question: do white jews/israelis deny that black jews exist? What is the relationship like between them?

 

[Shimmie]

Yes girl! I have seen the site before. I am VERY familiar with it. Yes, this not only prooves Egypt was "Negroid" but so was Israel since they were neighbors. The reason why media wants Egypt white is because it then paints the other peoples around them white. But if portrayed black (which is true) then it portrays it close neighbors the same.

You are such a blessing...I'm actually speechless with all of this informaton and yet almost ashamed for not knowing.

All I can do is thank God for you. Please keep sharing.

 

[tsiporah]

So...it seems like more is being said than just religion.

I know there are certain people of African that are descendants of one or more of the 12 tribes, is that what you're saying you are?

And does this have an effect on you being a Messanic Jew? Do you know what I mean? I don't think I'm being clear. Sorry.

I understand your question

Yes I am an physical Israelite and according to many people I have spoken with including some knwoledgable Igbos, you are too! They are quite aware of our position as Hebrews. My great-great-grandfather had passed down that my family is from the twelve tribes as he put it. My family is not the only one.

I am Messianic because that is the Original Faith of the Apostles. It is the faith of Paul, Peter, Mary, John, James, Timothy, and so on. The Gentiles when coming into the faith observed this too.

So there is both physical and spiritual significance, not just for me but you too!

There is a scripture that says All Matters Will Be Restored. It is in Acts I believe. I have so many Scripts to post but I will take my time so I have it right.

 

[tsiporah]

Shimmie Todah (thanks)!

Yes,this has been hidden from all of us. Often with an agenda. But it was prophesied to occur. The one that got me some years ago was the Roman picture of the Israelite. We often see movies depicting them another way, including the movie "Prince of Egypt".

We often here of African tribes being Israelite but for whatever reason we don't connect them to us. Funny thing is, most of the world including Arabs KNOW who you are, they are the ones who told the Portuguese about the People of the Book in West Africa.

Ancient historians have ALWAYS thought that Hebrews were of the African "race" so to speak. There are comments I will post. Give me time.

 

[tsiporah]

Here's my question: do white jews/israelis deny that black jews exist? What is the relationship like between them?

That is a dangerous question and the answer will vary.

I will say this ( and you are thinking ):

There is a reason for the State of Israel's conversion factor and Mother being Jewish factor. It is a modern invention to limit who comes in.

These factors are NOT Scripture. But it is the Father who decides what is what, not a society that is 70-75% secular!!!

There are *some* who do acknowledge black jews--albeit certain groups. There is an author who admits the Black Americans are Israel. Unfortunately I do not have the book.

They may embrace the Ethiopian jews as Israel's 'black darlings' but when an American black comes to visit or return home----big problem.

There are some messianic black people who are Israelite aware who have relayed their experiences. I have heard them speak personally. They say that they STARE you down and when they know you are from the US and they know that you KNOW who you are and you say that you are returning home, they drop their gaze and begin moving out of your way. Sometimes they get an angry disgusted look as if his time were up. This guy said they expect you to move out of their way but when they realize that you know about yourself it is like parting the Red Sea in the crowd! The children stare even the Ethiopian Jews stare. According to him, as well as others, Ethiopian jews are a "yes-man" people to the Israelis.

But there is much more to learn as many who call themselves 'jews' are not. Yet these are the same ones who want to define others and say who can come and who can't.

 

[Shimmie]

Shimmie Todah (thanks)!

Yes,this has been hidden from all of us. Often with an agenda. But it was prophesied to occur. The one that got me some years ago was the Roman picture of the Israelite. We often see movies depicting them another way, including the movie "Prince of Egypt".

We often here of African tribes being Israelite but for whatever reason we don't connect them to us. Funny thing is, most of the world including Arabs KNOW who you are, they are the ones who told the Portuguese about the People of the Book in West Africa.

Ancient historians have ALWAYS thought that Hebrews were of the African "race" so to speak. There are comments I will post. Give me time.

Take all the time you need. Just don't leave us. This is a 'grounding' experience. In other words, we as Blacks didn't borrow Jesus. Hope that makes sense.

Question: In church we've been taught that Adam and Eve were Black. I believe it from the standpoint of their origin geographically.

Some believe it because it validates having something over the white race. Whatever you can share will be most appreciated.

How do I say, you are a blessing? "Todah"... I like the sound of that.

 

[tsiporah]

You are such a blessing...I'm actually speechless with all of this informaton and yet almost ashamed for not knowing.

All I can do is thank God for you. Please keep sharing.

Aaaww! Don't be ashamed. All of this was prophesied to happened to our people because of our disobedience in ancient times to our Father in heaven. Soooo AD 70 happened when General Titus destroyed Jerusalem.

Everyone MUST Read Deut. 28 Read it all through and start paying attention when it goes into the curses--they will sound familiar. Read it through, something should ring a bell about a certain historical event in history that occurred with NO OTHER people. This is your identifying mark of who you are. Yah is awesome and He left it there so that we may ID ourselves when it comes time for us to wake up. If there are questions about that particular scripture, please ask!!! I will certainly explain.

See the shofar in my avatar? That is something I blow--literally.

A shofar is being blown to wake up.

You are Daughters of Zion!!

We have been missing so much as a people, I am willing wage that many of us knew there was a hole and knew that something was off key with our people but didn't know what it was. Why we were always at the bottom and other matters. This is your answer!

 

[tsiporah]

Take all the time you need. Just don't leave us. This is a 'grounding' experience. In other words, we as Blacks didn't borrow Jesus. Hope that makes sense.

Question: In church we've been taught that Adam and Eve were Black. I believe it from the standpoint of their origin geographically.

Some believe it because it validates having something over the white race. Whatever you can share will be most appreciated.

How do I say, you are a blessing? "Todah"... I like the sound of that.

Shimmie, Todah means Thanks in hebrew. Todah Rabah is Thank you very much.

About the Adam and Eve, yes they were black by geography. I don't express them being black because it is simply something other than white.
Scientist will even say they were 'African'.

Let me add,

In Gen. 10 you have the table of nations.

It lists the descendents of all three sons of Noah-- Ham, Shem, Japhet.

Now this is how we must think critically and carefully.

1. If Adam were black
then Eve was black because a rib was taken (DNA material) and used to form wo-man. First evidence of Genetic work being done outside of Adam.

2.Since both were black then the people in Pre-Flood times were black.
This included Noah.

3. Now get this: If Noah and his wife were black, then Ham is not the only black child!! Ham has two full-blooded brothers. Shem and Japhet. They were black.

Things did not change until AFTER the tower of Babel, Gen. tells you where they went. Japhet went north and became more separated from his brethren. Japhet remained black for a while until some later period. Meanwhile the Hamites and Shemites continued to mingle-mangle and for the most part through out history remain the same. This is evident with the Roman pic of an Israelite(the black and white one) and that same pic could also be representative of Yahusha's(Jesus) looks. They wore afros at that time and no kippas (the Yarmulke ).

 

[Shimmie]

Shimmie, Todah means Thanks in hebrew. Todah Rabah is Thank you very much.

About the Adam and Eve, yes they were black by geography. I don't express them being black because it is simply something other than white.
Scientist will even say they were 'African'.

Let me add,

In Gen. 10 you have the table of nations.

It lists the descendents of all three sons of Noah-- Ham, Shem, Japhet.

Now this is how we must think critically and carefully.

1. If Adam were black
then Eve was black because a rib was taken (DNA material) and used to form wo-man. First evidence of Genetic work being done outside of Adam.

2.Since both were black then the people in Pre-Flood times were black.
This included Noah.

3. Now get this: If Noah and his wife were black, then Ham is not the only black child!! Ham has two full-blooded brothers. Shem and Japhet. They were black.

Things did not change until AFTER the tower of Babel, Gen. tells you where they went. Japhet went north and became more separated from his brethren. Japhet remained black for a while until some later period. Meanwhile the Hamites and Shemites continued to mingle-mangle and for the most part through out history remain the same. This is evident with the Roman pic of an Israelite(the black and white one) and that same pic could also be representative of Yahusha's(Jesus) looks. They wore afros at that time and no kippas (the Yarmulke ).

Oh My! Do you know that I had questions regarding Ham? We've all read the event when Ham 'discovered' his father Noah 'drunk and naked' and Noah in a 'drunken state' yelled out 'Cursed be Caanan'... (Genesis 9)

20 And Noah began to be an husbandman, and he planted a vineyard:
21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.
22 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.
23 And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness.
24 And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him.
25 And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.
26 And he said, Blessed be the LORD God of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.

For years, this scripture was used by racist to justify that Blacks were the lessor and the servants to all. They expanded the 'lie' by saying Ham became Black when Noah cursed him.

tisporah, we need to have a 'tele-conference.' This information you are sharing is too rich to be ignored. You have scriptural history to back this up. This statement of yours blows me away...

This is evident with the Roman pic of an Israelite(the black and white one) and that same pic could also be representative of Yahusha's(Jesus) looks. They wore afros at that time and no kippas (the Yarmulke )

The thing is, I've had some of this taught to me when I was in college but it didn't 'stick' with me. I was too White oriented.

I'm being real. I've lived in the 'White World' for a very long time; even to the point of considering marriage. But, I always felt giving a gift of myself to someone who has no right to it...my heritage.

Keep the lessons coming...I still have so many questions.

We have a brother here who is also on point and extremely grounded in 'our' Black Heritage.

I'm so glad you are here to 'teach' us.

 

[alexstin]

You can begin by reading Lev. 11 and checking to see what is clean and unclean. There are some online lists on some Messianic site that give information. You can continue to eat meats like chicken, fish with scales, beef. But with the read meats and chicken make sure you soak it in Kosher salt to get rid of the blood. It doesn't take much. When shopping look for the Kosher symbols. Some have a U or K or some version of it or Parve. (These foods do not contain unclean animals.)

Take note that unclean animals clean the earth!! Yahuah (The Father) never intended for His children to eat things that clean the earth.

Did you know that Pork is a meat that spoils from inside out??

Okay you got me with that part. I always wondered why some meats were considered unclean. That makes sense. Now I feel sick.erplexed

 

[Shimmie]

Okay you got me with that part. I always wondered why some meats were considered unclean. That makes sense. Now I feel sick.erplexed

I know. We're so used to 'quisine' (sp?)

But here's something else that went through one ear and out the other with me..."Scavengers of the Earth." I've heard this 'preached' for years. I don't eat pork, but I sure will down a crab cake and I have some wonderful recipes for crab meat. Oh well, I've learning quite a lot here...

 

[tsiporah]

Shimmie,

I will post something on the Canaan's Curse later. It was Canaan that was curse and NOT Ham. (OOOOPpppsss!!)

We have been taught Ham was cursed.

 

[alexstin]

I know. We're so used to 'quisine' (sp?)

But here's something else that went through one ear and out the other with me..."Scavengers of the Earth." I've heard this 'preached' for years. I don't eat pork, but I sure will down a crab cake and I have some wonderful recipes for crab meat. Oh well, I've learning quite a lot here...

Well, I've always known that shrimp are sea "roaches" but I have them a few times a month. DH and I can get down with Alaskan crab legs too! Don't even get me started on crab cakes. That's my staple dish at Cheesecake factory.


So I read DH the part about unclean animals cleaning the earth. He said, "Well I can do without lobster and shrimp." He's cracking me up!!

 

[tsiporah]

Canaan's Curse

I have met the guy, in person, who wrote this booklet years ago.

http://www.clubcanaan.com/studies/Canaan.html

What Canaan forfeited was the land.

Read through, I think it is too long to post but atleast you have a link.

The main home page is: CLUBCANAAN

 

[tsiporah]

This is a repost of an article originally posted at Afrikan Frontline Network. © Frontline News Service. All Rights Reserved.

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]THE CURSE OF HAM[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Fact or Fiction?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Genesis 9:20-27, popularly known as the Curse of Ham, in conjunction with the scriptures immediately following (Gen. 10 in its entirety), known as the Table of Genealogies, is most used to explain and even justify the plight of the black peoples of the world throughout history. This most decisive derogatory racial tradition stems from a collection of Jewish oral traditions in the Babylonian Talmud dating from the second to sixth century A.D. that holds that the descendants of Ham were cursed by being black.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]It is the intent of this author to discredit this ludicrous myth totally and reveal the scriptural truth behind the curse of Noah. Genesis 9:20-27 reads as follows:[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]And Noah began to be a husbandman, and he planted a vineyard and he drank of the wine, and was drunken and he was uncovered within his tent. And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness. And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him. And he said, cursed be Canaan. A servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren. And he said, blessed be the Lord God of Shem, and Canaan shall be his servant. God shall enlarge Japheth, and he shall dwell in the tents of Shem, and Canaan shall be his servant.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]As stated above, this scripture popularly known as the curse of Ham, is used to explain the plight of the black race. However, in order to understand the truth, this scripture must be correctly interpreted by asking the three following questions.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]1. Who is actually committing this sin?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]2. What is the sin being committed?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]3. What is the punishment (or curse) for this sin?[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]In the Bible, it is customary to document genealogies from eldest to youngest and in most instances this is the case (the exception being from youngest to eldest). Therefore, Ham is the second son of Noah (Gen. 9:18), not his youngest. Ham is noted as being the father of Canaan. Canaan was the youngest son of Ham (Gen. 10:6). The lack of a word for grandson and nephew in the Hebrew dialect used in the Old Testament of the Bible adds further confusion to the interpretation of this curse. All male descendants were referred to as son whether grandson or nephew. Also, Deuteronomy 24:16 reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The fathers shall not be put to death for their children, nor shall the children be put to death for their fathers; a person shall be put to death for his own sin.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Considering, these substantiating scriptures, it was Canaan, not Ham, who had committed the sin thus the prophetic curse of Noah, was on Canaan, and it did not apply to Ham or any of his other descendants.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]There have been many different interpretations of the sin committed. Some say Canaan looked upon Noah's naked body, or that he committed a homosexual act while Noah slept. The confusion over this sin is what keeps many from understanding the nature of the curse that followed. In order to determine what the sin was, you must understand the scriptural definition of "thy father's nakedness". Leviticus 20:11 reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The nakedness of thy father's wife shalt not thou uncover. It is thy father's nakedness. And the man that lieth with his father's wife hath uncovered his father's nakedness.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]With "thy father's nakedness" so defined, the indication is that Noah and his wife, both, were asleep in the tent, thus the need for both Shem and Japheth to lay a garment over their shoulders to cover the occupants of the tent, and enter backwards so as not to see "their father's nakedness". Canaan apparently had sex with Noah's wife while they slept. The nature of the sin is further indicated by the punishment or curse for the sin.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]In reading of another person who committed this exact sin, Genesis 35:22 reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]While Israel was living in that region, Ruben went in and slept with his father's concubine Bilhah, and Isreal heard of it.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The punishment or curse that Ruben (Israel's firstborn son) received for sleeping with his father's wife (concubine), was the loss of the choice land that went to the first born and therefore his descendants did not excel (Gen. 49:3-4, I Chron. 5:1-2). Thus, the penalty for this sin is the loss of your birthright, which is land. This is the exact punishment Canaan received. He lost his inheritance to his land. Thus Genesis 9:20-27 properly interpreted reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]And Noah awoke from his wine, and he knew what his grandson had done unto his wife. And he said, cursed be Canaan. He will be conquered by his brethren (decsendants of Shem), who themselves will be conquered (by decsendants of Japheth). And he said, blessed be the Lord God of Shem, and Canaan's land will be conquered and possessed by Shem. God shall enlarge Japheth's territory, and he will live in the homes Shem built in the land of Canaan.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]This curse dealt exclusively with land ownership and in fact, is what later became the blessing of Abraham. The land of Canaan is the land God promised to give to the descendants of Abraham, who himself was a descendant of Shem. All of the great conquering powers that swept through the land of Canaan (once the descendants of Shem had established themselves there) were in fact descendants of Japheth and did indeed cause a dispersion of the descendants of Shem and occupied the cities they built.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Those who translated and thereby interpreted the Bible were not the ones who wrote it. They defined blacks based on misinterpretations of their translations. It is interesting to note that the people who have the worst (though not only), history of enslaving people, would interpret these verses for their own gain - that of keeping their slaves enslaved. For example, the belief that blacks are cursed originating from the Babylonian Talmud received even greater elaboration during the Middle Ages when Noah's curse was further explained:[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"It must be Canaan, your firstborn, whom they enslave... Canaan's children shall be born ugly and black!... Your grandchildren's hair shall be twisted into kinks... [their lips] shall swell." Men of this race are called Negroes; their forefather Canaan commanded them to love theft and fornication, to be banded together in hatred of their masters, and never to tell the truth."[/FONT]


(Tsiporah's comment: Now you know those who wrote the Babylonian Talmud were liars period. That is why I do not read it.)


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]That passage includes not only a clear description of the color and physical type of the "cursed" people, it also presents the principal stereotype associated with blacks - thieves, fornicators, and liars. In actuality, blacks are enslaved if they accept any part of this misinterpretation.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The translation of a manuscript of Benjamin ben Jonah, a twelfth-century merchant and traveler from Spanish Navarre, not only supports the same theme but suggests that it was fairly widespread:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"There is a people who like animals, eat of the herbs that grow on the banks of the Nile, and in the fields. They go about naked and have not the intelligence of ordinary men. They cohabit with their sisters and anyone they find. These sons of Ham are black slaves."[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]To the extent that this myth was generally accepted by Europeans, to that same extent could the inferior position of blacks be explained by Noah's curse and thus rationalized biblically.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The black peoples of the world must take caution in their understanding of biblical scripture and be more responsible in their acceptance of interpretations thereof. Consideration must also be given to historical and scientific fact.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Scientists, using genetic technology to examine the races have determined that the first man and woman were black, the oldest race on Earth is African, and that the origin of every other race is of this race. Paintings on the walls of tombs in Egypt clearly show that there were at one time two distinct and seperate groups of black peoples living in Africa. One very dark race and another that was brown. The dark race in most cases was depicted as the rulers, kings, pharaohs, and priests. Further, many of the kingdoms, rivers, and land masses described in the Bible are found in Africa, which included parts of what is today called the middle east.[/FONT]

The rest of it is here.....

http://www.clubcanaan.com/studies/Canaan2.html

 

[tsiporah]

For those interested in the Dietary Instructions check here.

There is an extensive list on what is clean and unclean.

Think of it like this, let's say Yah the Father gave us a mechanical toy to play with a robot or something and then He said do not play with the buzz saw! There is a reason why a Father told His child not to play with the buzz saw.

The unclean animals are earth cleaners, filters, and garbage disposals of His planet. Live bio-mechanical machines to clean up.

Pigs clean the ground and eat dead animals- including dead humans (corn fed pig doesn't count because their systems are toxic still. It is something about how they process and excrete their waste.)

Shell fish and shrimp filter out the waters of natural as well as artificial pollutants.

Certain birds clean up (you see them in the street when driving by.) the road kill and dead animals.

Cat fish also filter out and clean.

These animals are unclean because they clean up the dirty and dead stuff.

Yahuah is wise in how to care for this earth. These animals are good in the sense, that they function in what they are to do- and not to eat as we have been taught. Check out some of the diseases that pop up in Asia where they eat almost anything.

Yah wants to preserve those who are His and therefore live longer to present the Truth to the world. In essence an expression of His love.

Keeping the Laws of Lev. 11 is not a salvational issue, but an issue of obedience to the father.

Before our ancestors were brought to this country we ate clean foods-ONLY!! Why do you think Massa threw us that pork in slave times?!?!

http://www.clubcanaan.com/studies/bgck04.html

 

[Shimmie]

Shimmie,

I will post something on the Canaan's Curse later. It was Canaan that was curse and NOT Ham. (OOOOPpppsss!!)

We have been taught Ham was cursed.

Take your time. I'm on the edge of my seat. I even stopped shopping online at Bath and Body Works for this thread. And I'm not making light of this by saying so.

May I tell you what has literally griped my heart? You made this statement and it will not let me go...it's Key and Revelation...

There is a scripture that says All Matters Will Be Restored.

My Lord! "All Matters Will Be Restored". This is profound all in itsself. I can take this and run with it. It applies to every area of our lives. Can you even see what the Lord is doing here? I know you can.

"All Matters Will Be Restored."

tsiporah, nothing can hinder Truth. The truth being Jesus...our Messiah.

You said something else. I made a statement...

This is a 'grounding' experience. In other words, we as Blacks didn't borrow Jesus.

In your replies you mentioned this...

We have been missing so much as a people, I am willing wage that many of us knew there was a hole and knew that something was off key with our people but didn't know what it was. Why we were always at the bottom and other matters. This is your answer!

I can't get past this... "There was a 'hole' and knew that something was off key... and didn't know what it was." tsiporah, this is true...so very true with me personally. I've known for a long, long time, that something about 'me' (regarding my heritage) was missing.

As Blacks here in the US we have not been 'grounded' which is why I believe we have still not progressed as far as God intended us to.

You have a 'captive' audience in me. That's for sure.

 

[Shimmie]

Well, I've always known that shrimp are sea "roaches" but I have them a few times a month. DH and I can get down with Alaskan crab legs too! Don't even get me started on crab cakes. That's my staple dish at Cheesecake factory.

So I read DH the part about unclean animals cleaning the earth. He said, "Well I can do without lobster and shrimp." He's cracking me up!!

Girl please... "Crab Cakes" are in my "Get a Husband' manual.
You know I have a "Romance Series" for Wives and Wives to be.
Oh well.... Menu change coming up.

 

[Shimmie]

This is a repost of an article originally posted at Afrikan Frontline Network. © Frontline News Service. All Rights Reserved.

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]THE CURSE OF HAM[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Fact or Fiction?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Genesis 9:20-27, popularly known as the Curse of Ham, in conjunction with the scriptures immediately following (Gen. 10 in its entirety), known as the Table of Genealogies, is most used to explain and even justify the plight of the black peoples of the world throughout history. This most decisive derogatory racial tradition stems from a collection of Jewish oral traditions in the Babylonian Talmud dating from the second to sixth century A.D. that holds that the descendants of Ham were cursed by being black.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]It is the intent of this author to discredit this ludicrous myth totally and reveal the scriptural truth behind the curse of Noah. Genesis 9:20-27 reads as follows:[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]And Noah began to be a husbandman, and he planted a vineyard and he drank of the wine, and was drunken and he was uncovered within his tent. And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness. And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him. And he said, cursed be Canaan. A servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren. And he said, blessed be the Lord God of Shem, and Canaan shall be his servant. God shall enlarge Japheth, and he shall dwell in the tents of Shem, and Canaan shall be his servant.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]As stated above, this scripture popularly known as the curse of Ham, is used to explain the plight of the black race. However, in order to understand the truth, this scripture must be correctly interpreted by asking the three following questions.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]1. Who is actually committing this sin?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]2. What is the sin being committed?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]3. What is the punishment (or curse) for this sin?[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]In the Bible, it is customary to document genealogies from eldest to youngest and in most instances this is the case (the exception being from youngest to eldest). Therefore, Ham is the second son of Noah (Gen. 9:18), not his youngest. Ham is noted as being the father of Canaan. Canaan was the youngest son of Ham (Gen. 10:6). The lack of a word for grandson and nephew in the Hebrew dialect used in the Old Testament of the Bible adds further confusion to the interpretation of this curse. All male descendants were referred to as son whether grandson or nephew. Also, Deuteronomy 24:16 reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The fathers shall not be put to death for their children, nor shall the children be put to death for their fathers; a person shall be put to death for his own sin.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Considering, these substantiating scriptures, it was Canaan, not Ham, who had committed the sin thus the prophetic curse of Noah, was on Canaan, and it did not apply to Ham or any of his other descendants.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]There have been many different interpretations of the sin committed. Some say Canaan looked upon Noah's naked body, or that he committed a homosexual act while Noah slept. The confusion over this sin is what keeps many from understanding the nature of the curse that followed. In order to determine what the sin was, you must understand the scriptural definition of "thy father's nakedness". Leviticus 20:11 reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The nakedness of thy father's wife shalt not thou uncover. It is thy father's nakedness. And the man that lieth with his father's wife hath uncovered his father's nakedness.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]With "thy father's nakedness" so defined, the indication is that Noah and his wife, both, were asleep in the tent, thus the need for both Shem and Japheth to lay a garment over their shoulders to cover the occupants of the tent, and enter backwards so as not to see "their father's nakedness". Canaan apparently had sex with Noah's wife while they slept. The nature of the sin is further indicated by the punishment or curse for the sin.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]In reading of another person who committed this exact sin, Genesis 35:22 reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]While Israel was living in that region, Ruben went in and slept with his father's concubine Bilhah, and Isreal heard of it.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The punishment or curse that Ruben (Israel's firstborn son) received for sleeping with his father's wife (concubine), was the loss of the choice land that went to the first born and therefore his descendants did not excel (Gen. 49:3-4, I Chron. 5:1-2). Thus, the penalty for this sin is the loss of your birthright, which is land. This is the exact punishment Canaan received. He lost his inheritance to his land. Thus Genesis 9:20-27 properly interpreted reads:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]And Noah awoke from his wine, and he knew what his grandson had done unto his wife. And he said, cursed be Canaan. He will be conquered by his brethren (decsendants of Shem), who themselves will be conquered (by decsendants of Japheth). And he said, blessed be the Lord God of Shem, and Canaan's land will be conquered and possessed by Shem. God shall enlarge Japheth's territory, and he will live in the homes Shem built in the land of Canaan.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]This curse dealt exclusively with land ownership and in fact, is what later became the blessing of Abraham. The land of Canaan is the land God promised to give to the descendants of Abraham, who himself was a descendant of Shem. All of the great conquering powers that swept through the land of Canaan (once the descendants of Shem had established themselves there) were in fact descendants of Japheth and did indeed cause a dispersion of the descendants of Shem and occupied the cities they built.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Those who translated and thereby interpreted the Bible were not the ones who wrote it. They defined blacks based on misinterpretations of their translations. It is interesting to note that the people who have the worst (though not only), history of enslaving people, would interpret these verses for their own gain - that of keeping their slaves enslaved. For example, the belief that blacks are cursed originating from the Babylonian Talmud received even greater elaboration during the Middle Ages when Noah's curse was further explained:[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"It must be Canaan, your firstborn, whom they enslave... Canaan's children shall be born ugly and black!... Your grandchildren's hair shall be twisted into kinks... [their lips] shall swell." Men of this race are called Negroes; their forefather Canaan commanded them to love theft and fornication, to be banded together in hatred of their masters, and never to tell the truth."[/FONT]


(Tsiporah's comment: Now you know those who wrote the Babylonian Talmud were liars period. That is why I do not read it.)


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]That passage includes not only a clear description of the color and physical type of the "cursed" people, it also presents the principal stereotype associated with blacks - thieves, fornicators, and liars. In actuality, blacks are enslaved if they accept any part of this misinterpretation.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The translation of a manuscript of Benjamin ben Jonah, a twelfth-century merchant and traveler from Spanish Navarre, not only supports the same theme but suggests that it was fairly widespread:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"There is a people who like animals, eat of the herbs that grow on the banks of the Nile, and in the fields. They go about naked and have not the intelligence of ordinary men. They cohabit with their sisters and anyone they find. These sons of Ham are black slaves."[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]To the extent that this myth was generally accepted by Europeans, to that same extent could the inferior position of blacks be explained by Noah's curse and thus rationalized biblically.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The black peoples of the world must take caution in their understanding of biblical scripture and be more responsible in their acceptance of interpretations thereof. Consideration must also be given to historical and scientific fact.[/FONT]


The rest of it is here.....

http://www.clubcanaan.com/studies/Canaan2.html

tsiporah, thank so much. This is really humbling me. I've had these teachings presented to me and I just did not allow them to flourish my knowledge.

God bless you for 'bringing me back... to Truth."

 

[tsiporah]

Here is a forum done by a sista'.

Here she presents some of the same information I do.

http://forums.delphiforums.com/n/main.asp?webtag=yshuaandmoshe&nav=start&prettyurl=%2Fyshuaandmoshe%2Fstart

One would have to sign into delphi forums to join it (free).

The name is Authentic Jews, Yehudah & Binyamin. It is a very beautiful site.

 

[tsiporah]

Here is a picture of Assyrians

Look at the negro features and hair type!!

 

[tsiporah]

Israelite captives taken by Assyrians..notice the 'rolly-bally' hair and large eyes and thick features of these ancient brothers of Judah.


Imagine: David, Joshua, Moses, Joseph (both of them), Paul, Yahusha( Jesus), Mariam, Mary, Ruth (Moabitess), Deborah etc. etc...