Masturbation and the Single Christian

[Honeyhips]

13:4

Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge


Strongs definition on Undefiled

Definition

1. not defiled, unsoiled
   1. free from that by which the nature of a thing is deformed and debased, or its force and vigour impaired

You can look up all the other words in that scripture here: http://bible.crosswalk.com/OnlineStudyBible/bible.cgi?word=Hebrews+13%3A4&section=0&version=str&new=1&oq=&NavBook=heb&NavGo=13&NavCurrentChapter=13





NKJV on HEB 13:4

Marriage is honorable among all, and the bed undefiled; but fornicators and adulterers God will judge


New American standard

Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled; for fornicators and adulterers God will judge

CROSS REFERENCES:
1 Corinthians 7:38;
So then he who marries his virgin does well, but he who does not marry will do better.

1 Timothy 4:3
They forbid marriage and demand abstinence from foods that God created to be received with gratitude by those who believe and know the truth.
R626:
1 Corinthians 6:9;
Do you not know that the unjust will not inherit God's kingdom? Do not be deceived: no sexually immoral people, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals,
Galatians 5:19,21;
Now the works of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, moral impurity, promiscuity,
5:21
envy, drunkenness, carousing, and anything similar, about which I tell you in advance--as I told you before--that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
1 Thessalonians 4:6
4:6
This means one must not transgress against and defraud his brother in this matter, because the Lord is an avenger of all these offenses, as we also previously told and warned you.



I'm not sure why they listed the cross references but I included them b/c they did. You can look up the KJv and Strongs definitions yourself. I don't have anymore room in this post.

Holman bible

Marriage must be respected by all, and the marriage bed kept undefiled, because God will judge immoral people and adulterers.



New LIving Translation

Give honor to marriage, and remain faithful to one another in marriage. God will surely judge people who are immoral and those who commit adultery.



The Message

13:4

Honor marriage, and guard the sacredness of sexual intimacy between wife and husband. God draws a firm line against casual and illicit sex.

Darby Translation



13:4

[Let] marriage [be held] every way in honour, F179 and the bed [be] undefiled; for fornicators and adulterers will God judge.



Merriam Webster defintion of defiled


to make unclean or impure: as a : to corrupt the purity or perfection of : [size=-1]DEBASE[/size] <the countryside defiled by billboards> b : to violate the chastity of : [size=-1]DEFLOWER[/size] c : to make physically unclean especially with something unpleasant or contaminating <boots defiled with blood> d : to violate the sanctity of : [size=-1]DESECRATE[/size] <defile a sanctuary> e : [size=-1]SULLY[/size], [size=-1]DISHONOR[/size]
synonym see [size=-1]CONTAMINATE[/size]



I also looked up Debase b/c it was in the strongs definition too.
1 : to lower in status, esteem, quality, or character
2 a : to reduce the intrinsic value of (a coin) by increasing the base-metal content b : to reduce the exchange value of (a monetary unit)
synonyms [size=-1]DEBASE[/size], [size=-1]VITIATE[/size], [size=-1]DEPRAVE[/size], [size=-1]CORRUPT[/size], [size=-1]DEBAUCH[/size], [size=-1]PERVERT [/size]mean to cause deterioration or lowering in quality or character. [size=-1]DEBASE [/size]implies a loss of position, worth, value, or dignity <commercialism has debased the holiday>. [size=-1]VITIATE [/size]implies a destruction of purity, validity, or effectiveness by allowing entrance of a fault or defect <a foreign policy vitiated by partisanship>. [size=-1]DEPRAVE [/size]implies moral deterioration by evil thoughts or influences <the claim that society is depraved by pornography>. [size=-1]CORRUPT [/size]implies loss of soundness, purity, or integrity <the belief that bureaucratese corrupts the language>. [size=-1]DEBAUCH [/size]implies a debasing through sensual indulgence <the long stay on a tropical isle had debauched the ship's crew>. [size=-1]PERVERT [/size]implies a twisting or distorting from what is natural or normal <perverted the original goals of the institute>.

 

[Honeyhips]

*faints* y'all are hilarious.

Girl you ain't never lied. It'll be 3 years for me in January but I'm gonna be patient cause come post Honeymoon this diva is gonna be calling into work sick A LOT.

 

[Honeyhips]

Man no wonder so many Christians are so uptight. Many of them probably have prudish unfulfilling jacked up sex lives! Poor husbands/wives can't leave, can't cheat, whew!

Opinions and preferences are one thing but bringing God into it and making it wrong, please have some back up~

Uh... who has ever condoned cheating?

 

[Honeyhips]

Oh I'm sorry,I did too, but then explain what you mean, because I'm a little confused.

??? huh
That's not what I meant, I'm in no way condoning cheating, and that 1 sentence you picked out was in reference to an entire topic but .. ok

 

[Honeyhips]

I know what you mean. I've walked away from threads b/c they turned into I want to prove you are wrong and not really hearing from God debates too. I hope I haven't done it to anyone.

This is something I'll have to meditate on b/c I truly don't know now. I have heard oral sex was wrong. And I have heard as long as sex is pleasurable for both oral is ok. Not sure about toys though. Recently I've only been told that if it is not natural (anal sex) then it is not ok.

I'm not doing any of it anytime soon, but when the time comes I'm sure I'll get the revelation.

God bless you HH. I would love to share what I've learned. It's just, well....what I've noticed on this forum, is it's hard to really express my feelings about the Bible, what I've learned, and what my Holy Spirit has revealed to me bececuse this thread becomes so argumentative at times. What's a trip is I don't see any of this going on in any of the other forums (when I would expect it too). I don't know maybe it's just me.

Since I started and joined the "Celibacy" thread, my Holy Spirit is soooo much stronger now. And everyday I'm growing stronger in the Word. You ladies know what I mean. I do Bible study faithfully for 5 hours out of the day, becuase I know God is trying to show me something and get me ready for something...just don't know what it is yet. But I will ask Him to reveal it to me.

Please go to my Study Thread and tell me what you do, or a little bit about how you study.

Oh and could my post to you have sounded anymore selfish. I don't mean revelation just for me, but to all who reads it.

 

[Lena_1961]

MAY 6, 2005

BLUDACIOUS

YOU ARE TOTALLY CORRECT. IF PEOPLE ONLY MARRY FOR SEX, THEN THAT MARRIAGE WILL START OUT ON A BAD FOUNDATION FOR SURE, AND WON'T LAST UNLESS THE TWO PEOPLE GET COUNSELING ETC., OR LEARN WHAT THE TRUE MEANING OF LOVE, MARRIAGE AND COMMITMENT ARE ALL ABOUT .

WOW, MASTURBATION AND THE SINGLE CHRISTIAN :scratchch ?

MY STORY IS VERY UNUSUAL, AS ME AND MY BOO , ARE WAITING UNTIL WE GET MARRIED BEFORE WE MAKE LOVE. NOW I AM A NATURAL VIRGIN WHO HAS NEVER BELONGED TO ANY SPECIFIC RELIGION, BUT WHO CONSIDERS HERSELF EXTREMELY SPIRITUAL AND WHO HAS ALWAYS LOVED GOD EVER SINCE SHE WAS A LITTLE GIRL. MY BOO IS A PK, WHO HAS BEEN RAISED IN THE CHURCH HIS WHOLE LIFE WHO HAS BEEN WITH TWO OTHERS AS HE HAS TOLD ME ABOUT TRUTHFULLY. BUT BEFORE WE MET, HE DECIDED TO ABSTAIN TOTALLY FROM SEX, BY CHOOSING TO PLACE MORE OF HIS TIME, ENERGY AND EFFORTS INTO HELPING OTHERS AND INTO HIS CAREER, AND TOWARDS HELPING HIS FAMILY AND THE COMMUNITY. SO BY DOING THESE POSITIVE THINGS WHICH HE LOVES DOING, HE THEN DECIDED TO ASK GOD TO SEND HIM THE 'RIGHT WOMAN,' AND LOW AND BEHOLD IT WAS ME , AND WE THANK GOD EVERY DAY BY SERVING HIM, AND BY BEING THE BEST TWO PEOPLE WE BOTH CAN BE, THE WONDERFUL THING I ALSO LOVE ABOUT MY BF IS THAT HE NEVER FORCES ME TO JOIN HIS CHURCH, AND HE LOVES ME ENOUGH TO RESPECT MY SPIRITUALITY AND FAITH IN GOD EXACTLY THE WAY IT IS .

NOW, EVEN THOUGH GOD COMES FIRST IN OUR UNION, WE ARE DEFINITELY DEVOTED TO ONE ANOTHER, AND WE LOVE US SOME EACH OTHER . BUT, WE BOTH LEARNED TO DO THAT BY BONDING EMOTIONALLY AND SPIRITUALLY FIRST, AND BY TALKING TO ONE ANOTHER ABOUT MORE THAN SEX. WE ALSO KNOW THAT LIFE IS ABOUT MORE THAN JUST 'US.' NOW TO BE HONEST, WE CANNOT WAIT UNTIL WE ARE MARRIED , BECAUSE I FEEL THAT MAKING LOVE WITH HIM WITHIN THE BONDS OF OUR MARRIAGE WILL BE ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL THINGS GOD HAS GIVEN US, SO I CANNOT WAIT TO BE WITH HIM IN THAT SPECIAL AND INTIMATE WAY, BECAUSE I TOTALLY TRUST HIM AND HE TOTALLY TRUSTS ME, AND WE DON'T TAKE GIVING OURSELVES TO EACH OTHER INTIMATELY AS A SMALL MATTER, AND THAT WAS WHY IS WAS SO IMPORTANT FOR US TO GROW IN FAITH FIRST, THEN BOND AND ULTIMATELY LEARN TO RESPECT AND TRUST EACH OTHER .

NOW, IS OUR WAY OF GOING ABOUT OUR 'LOVE' THE RIGHT WAY FOR EVERYONE ELSE? NO, AND I WOULD NEVER PUSH MY BELIEFS ON ANYONE ELSE, BECAUSE ULTIMATELY EVERYONE MUST DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES WHAT THEIR LIFE PATH IS, AND WHAT EACH PERSON WANTS OUT OF LIFE WHILE CONTINUING TO STRIVE TO BE THE BEST PERSON THEY CAN BE. BUT GOD KNOWS US WELL, AND HE KNOWS THAT WE MAKE MISTAKES. SO WE MUST NEVER FORGET THAT GOD LOVES US ALL, AND THAT WE ARE HIS CHILDREN NO MATTER WHAT, AND THAT EACH PERSON'S INTERPRETATION OFTHE BIBLE OR WHATEVER RELIGIOUS TEXT THEY READ IS THEIR INTERPRETATION AND THAT THEIR REPRESENTATION OF GOD'S WILL OR TEACHINGS MAY BE DIFFERENT THAN MINE ARE .

LATER

 

[AngelicRose07]

great post lena!

interesting thread as well....

 

[Poohbear]

Masturbation is a sin. It's mentioned in Leviticus.

It can be classified with sexual immorality and most importantly... not using your body to glorify God.

I've never masturbated before either and don't know how.

 

[Poohbear]

Ladies, don't be afraid to express your beliefs and don't be afraid to STAND ON THE WORD OF GOD which is in the Holy Bible.

The whole idea behind sex and engaging in sexual acts is that it's wrong if you DO IT BEFORE MARRIAGE (according to God). God intended sex for marriage ONLY. If you are single, glorify God with your body and avoid/flee from any kind of sexual immorality!!!

 

[Cinnabuns]

This is such a great post! I too agree that masturbation is wrong to do.

We have to realize where have we seen these kinds of images (anal sex, oral sex, etc.) to make it all right to do these things in our relationships.

And Sugaplum I hear ya girl, just remember to stand up for whatever comes at you in Jesus' Name!

 

[MJ]

Did anyone ever examine the relationship between the beliefs regarding sex put forth in the Bible and the historical periods they occured/were developed in?

I'm sorry I am going to offend people, but what some of you people are talking about here is just plain unnatural. First of all when these laws/beliefs were laid down, women and men were marrying at a much younger age. A woman was a "woman" at 12 and there was nothing unnatural for a woman to be married at 12 (as it is in our times). Hence by the time she'd hit what we now define as her "teenage years" she would have been married and been engaged in sexually intercourse. That would have surely eased some of that extreme sexual agitation and tension that builds up during and after the teens.

Why do I say it's unnatural? Well women are no longer marrying at 12, instead we are marry regularly in our 20s and 30s, that's an additional 10-20 years longer than what the typical biblical woman would have waited before engaged in (marital, if you wish) sexual intercourse. So why are we following these particular rules in the way we are, while ditching other on the claims that they're outmoded. For example, you're not supposed to eat pigs, it's in the bible; in fact in the Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve, were forbidden to eat meat/flesh; you're supposed to observe the sabbath (just like the orthodox Jews do, Friday sundown through Saturday sundown), etc., etc. but how many of ya'll are doing it? Well you're sinning if you're not!

Humans are blessed with a wonderful range of sexual energy. Female are particular blessed because in addition to the vagina and the breasts, she has a clitoris that gives her the ultimate ability to enjoy sex and her sexuality to the fullest. But what do we do? We spend generations, lifetimes, telling people (women) that sex is BAD before marriage (and during, according to some major religious) and that it is OKAY to SUFFER those undescribable feelings and pains that is generated by loneliness and UNFULFILLED sexuality. God forbid a woman should never find a husband, then according to what many of you are saying here, she will have to remain sexually unfulflilled (not even being allowed to masturbate) her entire life wouldn't she! The assumption is that God will provide a husband to every women, but we all know that's not every woman will find a husband and that in our day and age many won't find a decent one before her 30s.

Some religious group says sex is only to engaged in only for procreation. Well God didn't make humans like dogs now, did he? Humans, unlike the vast majority of other creatures, are in "heat" 24/7. Whereas dogs and other creatures are in heat only when they need to procreate. So why are we going around telling people to stiffle their sexually, unnaturally, and say it's in the name of God! If you really want to follow God's wisdom, then ya'll (who are promoting this) should lobby to have marriageable age lowered to 12 (just as in biblical times). That way little girls won't be growing up into grown women who are unhappy and miserable as hell (even if they won't admit it; some don't even know the real reason why) because they are taught that it is BAD, A SIN, to allow themselves to feel the full range of their God-given, positive, emotions and desires. And even worse they won't be teaching their daughters or others girls/women that it's okay to experience that particular torture. As far as I can see, this is no different than when the slave-owners were telling black people (and made it law) that it is unnatural for them to read or learn how to read because God made (and they used the Bible to support them) white people to teach black people what they needed to know.

Institutionally-dictated celibacy is the most vicious and POWERFUL means of CONTROLing people. Do your research, the most VIOLENT cultures (including this one) are the ones that promote sexual repressions. I'm not saying people should run around and sleep with anything that moves. Far from it, but some people here are on one hand basically saying sex and sexuality are NASTY and DIGUSTING -- A SIN -- and one the other saying it will be GREAT with a husband. Well if a woman should spend the first 20-30 years or so of her life repressing her sexuality to the point where masturbation is considered disgusting by thinking and totally believing that sex or "fornication" as some defines it, is wrong, -- which is basically mental clitoridectomy -- she's ONE MESSED UP woman by the time she hits the marriage bed. A person just cannot switch the brain on and off like that. Just as she is taught and learns to think of sex (masturbation, sex outside of marriage, even oral sex or use of toys according to some -- within marriage) as sinful and disgusting by default, which is what I'm leaning here, she will have to learn how to reverse that when she gets married, who's going to teach her? I don't see any classes around teaching married Christian women how to enjoy sex after a lifetime of repression, etc. (if there are I would like to know). By that time it's too late.

I read some of these posts and I because we have obviously learnt nothing from history. Learnt nothing from looking back and see how female sexual repression have created so much emotional instability and depression and suicides in various forms in women for most of human civilization.

I am not going run out of this thread. Nah, I'll be back checking to see what people are saying. And before any of ya'll judge me by thinking I must one loose woman, I'll have you know that in my almost 24 years I've had sex only once and my celibacy has been by choice (partly because I'm just picky and partly because I'm still unlearning what I was taught and am now learning to accept the truth that my body isn't sinful) and not because of institutional dogma. So whenever I choose to have sex or think about it, I will not have the guilt and shame and depression and burden that some of the women here are obviously experiencing. And before anyone here judge me "because I'm not a Christian" well I'll let you know I grew up, and spend most of my life, VERY Christian, probably what some of you would describe as orthodox, but learnt, and you all know this, that the Bible is open to many, unlimited, interpretations (hence the various Christian denominations) and decided that my only purpose in life is to be compassionate...

 

[CatSuga]

Sista, you done broke it down to a whole nutha level. Thank you!
Can I mail you some cookies?

 

[CatSuga]

Masturbation is a sin. It's mentioned in Leviticus.

Show me the scripture.

 

[EssentialGrowth]

MzJones,
Well said...very well said...

You'd be surprised, what many of use deem as "disgusting, unnatural, immoral" is the exact same thing members of your church and even your pastor/preacher is partaking in. Do you honestly believe all those Christian sisters and brothers in the faith haven't once touched themselves? We are born with sexual inclinations, and THAT is natural!

It's just unfortunate to see many of you buy into our patriarchal society and agree to suppressing your feelings . What's even more unfortunate is the fact that you won't know what sexually feels good for you, and how to achieve that satisfaction for when you actually partake in intercourse..and believe me, your future husband is NOT going to be the one teaching you how to satisfy your needs. YOU first have to know YOUR body before ANY man can begin to know and understand yours...

 

[CatSuga]

YOU first have to know YOUR body before ANY man can begin to know and understand yours...

Every woman needs to know this.

 

[victorious]

I've faced these exact struggles in regards to abstinence and masturbation before. I had no ring but I was doing my own thing when I wanted to, where I wanted to, how I wanted to, and with whom I wanted.

Although I thought I was always in control, I wound up in some sticky situations that was hard to get out of. I made some irrational decisions while in and out of control. When my boyfriend wasn't around, or I didn't have a boyfriend at the time, I was lonely and in need. Not just sexual needs, but sometimes overall companionship.

I personally felt there should be more for me. Sex was great (I ain't gonna lie), but I knew I didn't have the full package I wanted. At one point I thought I could 'be like a guy' and have no real strings attached. I wasn't sleeping around with every Tyrique, DeAndre and Hakeem*, but yet I felt I was investing more and not getting satisfactory returns. I think I wasted a lot of time in those relationships. Sometimes I went for the wrong type, and I probably missed the one that was compatible for me.
(* I initially wrote 'every Tom, Dick and Harry' but it just didn't sound right to me. )

Shortly after I decided to live a Christian life, I forgot that God was in control. I then lost control and had a sex with a guy I knew and wanted for a long time before I became a Christian. Since I didn't want to look for the way of escape when facing that temptation, that relationship blew up in a bad way.

Later on a cutie from work went beyond his usual hello and started flirting, pointing out our similarities, and inviting me out. Despite my feelings, I knew something wasn't right. Weeks later there was some drama with him, and I was so happy not to be entangled in it. Since God knocked me upside my head once, I learned to seek him first.

While in waiting, my mind went off track and focused on fleshly desires instead of spiritual ones. I would imagine what it would be like for me to have a sexual relationship in marriage. (Like God would approve of that because I honored marriage in my impure thoughts. )

I've learned that impure thoughts and masturbation are mental and/or physical distractions that give temporary pleasure and little substance. They're simulations of an experience fulfulled mainly in the mind, but they short change one's emotions. (Picture winning a million dollars but the IRS taking $999,995 because of back taxes. Five bucks isn't much in proportion to what you could have had.)

Through God's Word I know I should trust in the Lord with all of my heart and not depend on my own understanding. When I acknowledge Him, He will direct my paths. Now when I see a handsome guy, I've learned to give God praise, admire His work, and say "Lord, You're good. You made another handsome one over there." That way God knows what I like, and he'll internally prepare the right one for me!

---

I believe sex is a beautiful, intimate part of love for husbands and wives. When a husband tells his wife he loves her and then shows his devotion by giving his body solely to her, that wife has proof of his intimate love. She in return shows him she feels the same love and devotion he does. I believe that's a great bond of committment.

Is everything rosy in marriages? Absolutely not. It gets rocky sometimes; but if God is the head of their union, a husband and wife will both seek God. Marriage is a working commitment. In their every day lives, husbands and wives must keep the vows they made, despite the issues they face.

And so is my commitment to God. Since I'm the spiritual bride of Christ, I must show my devotion to God. In the natural, I have to keep my mind and body in order. When God unites me with my future husband, I want to give my husband my body as proof of my devotion. He'll know that I'm seriously committed to him. Yes I'm not a virgin, but my husband will appreciate my renewed and purified gift because it was set apart for him.

And as far as what should do ... err ... umm... It will be within reason of course and ... err ... umm,

Whatever we will do​

Will satisfy us two.
And please God too.
Now I'm through.

 

[NewlyNature12]

Wow MzJones you brought up some interesting points in your post. I would like to know what others feel about it.

I think masterbation is a sin because it involves lust, which the Bible does speak out against. It involves having impure thoughts about someone you are not married to. There are many passages about that all over the Bible.

Do any of you think that masterbation while fantasizing about your spouse is a sin? Don't want to hijack this thread, but this question was actually brought up in a Bible study...and a lot of people said it wasn't. Just wanted to know what ya'll thought...

 

[NYCQT16]

Do any of you think that masterbation while fantasizing about your spouse is a sin? Don't want to hijack this thread, but this question was actually brought up in a Bible study...and a lot of people said it wasn't. Just wanted to know what ya'll thought...

You were reading my mind Camille!!! I was wondering too if it is a sin to masturbate while married

 

[AngelicRose07]

For example, you're not supposed to eat pigs, it's in the bible; in fact in the Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve, were forbidden to eat meat/flesh; you're supposed to observe the sabbath (just like the orthodox Jews do, Friday sundown through Saturday sundown), etc., etc. but how many of ya'll are doing it? Well you're sinning if you're not!

great post mzjones, but this part has me confused a bit(bold). i have read in the bible (leviticus i think) about there being certain KINDS of meat that were ok vs. the ones you shouldnt eat. i dont eat pork, shrimp, crab etc anymore and i am a SDA, but can you tell me the verse of the bible that says ALL flesh is bad?

 

[Bublnbrnsuga]

Lets think about this. There is a feeling that comes from sex. You get aroused and all of that. With masturbation, you lend you thoughts, eyes, and ears to things that cause you to have those same feelings that you would if you were getting ready to or have sex. It would be those things that God does not approve of because you are no longer thinking of those things that are pure, of good report, etc that God commands us to think on in his word. Masturbation is like a short-cut to sex or takes the place of sex just so a person can quench those feelings and experience the outcome of sex. Instant gratification is the word. Is God involved in this? No. If you examine yourself when you want to masturbate or have sex, your mind probably is not even thinking about God. You gotta cast those thoughts and imaginations down.

ITA with everything you said, especially with the bold statement!

 

[MJ]

Thanks Weaveitup:

These are the versus that I refers when I said "in fact in the Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve, were forbidden to eat meat/flesh"

Gen 1:28-30

28: And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air and over every living thing that moved upon the earth. Man and women are to watch over and take care of the animals, critters, etc.

29: And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat Man and woman were are only to eat the plant -- seed producers.

30: And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so Here is seem that ALL the animals and critters were vegetarians also
Gen 2:16
And the Lord God commanded the man, saying Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat;

But this was with Adam, because God changed everything with Noah Gen 9:3-4 and then later in the old testament when he made another distinction between edible and non-edible meats with the cloven non-cloven foot business. Hopes that help.

great post mzjones, but this part has me confused a bit(bold). i have read in the bible (leviticus i think) about there being certain KINDS of meat that were ok vs. the ones you shouldnt eat. i dont eat pork, shrimp, crab etc anymore and i am a SDA, but can you tell me the verse of the bible that says ALL flesh is bad?

 

[toinette]

But this was with Adam, because God changed everything with Noah Gen 9:3-4 and then later in the old testament when he made another distinction between edible and non-edible meats with the cloven non-cloven foot business. Hopes that help.

it says God changed everything with Noah so it is ok to eat meat no? as long as it is within the guidleines of the edible and non-edible meats right? i'm SDA as well and follow the dietary laws so i dont eat crustaceans, pork, etc.

 

[MJ]

it says God changed everything with Noah so it is ok to eat meat no? as long as it is within the guidleines of the edible and non-edible meats right? i'm SDA as well and follow the dietary laws so i dont eat crustaceans, pork, etc.

Yep. God changes the eating guidelines so it's okay to eat SOME of types meat. I should have put my comment in my original entry about A/E before the pig one.

For those who don't know what we're discussing here:

In the Bible, Genesis and Leviticus, God gave 3 dietary guidelines"

(1) In the beginning Man and Women and all living creatures were only allowed to eat plant-based foods (vegetarian). (2) But with the advent of the flood, etc. God gave Noah and humans to eat EVERYTHING and ANYthing. (3) However, in Leviticus 11, God gave Moses and Aaron a new dietary guideline in which he changed things again, this time limiting what's permissable to eat within the meat kingdom. Forbidden foods include rodents, pigs, hares, rabbits, lobsters, crawfish, shrimps, crabs, oysters, twenty types of birds including vultures, insects, etc. That's what I was referring to earlier when I said if you are a Christian and you eat these things you are committing an abomination and are sinning! But what percentage of Christians actually follow this?

Thanks toinette and Weaveupit for bringing this to my attention so I could clear it up.

I was going through Bible, reading versus, checking out indexes and stuff, and I couldn't find anything that said masturbation is bad. Fornication, yeah, but not masturbation. And to all who said masturbation = lust: a person doesn't have to be lusting after someone to masturbate, they could just focus on what their body is feeling without conjuring hot fantasies between themselves and another person.

I also have another question... the stats are something like every 3 out 5 women have been sexually abused in some form or another. Masturbation and positive sexual outlook and positive sexual encounters are some of the most effective ways in which sexual abuse/rape victims get over/through their traumas and grow to love themselves. (The body stores and remembers information just like the mind. So a person may know that it wasn't their fault, etc. and they have even forgiven the abuser in their head, but if they never learn/re-relearn to love their bodies sexually or experience positive sex/sexual activities they willl NEVER got over their traumas completely)...

So couldn't one argue that telling a Christian sexual abuse/rape victim (which could be any Christian woman, 'cos people you don't know who's been abused) that she isn't allowed to re-discover and re-define her sexuality in a positive light through masturbation, etc. if she wants to (as a means to counteract the violence she indured and in her path to love/re-love herself) because she must wait until she choosen by man (for whom she should remain "pure") as his wife -- effectively taking away her power to choose (again) -- is a form of mental abuse????

It's a long complex question, so read it slow. Re-read if it helps.

I've said my piece(s). I'm done posting here. I'll just be reading from now on...

 

[AngelicRose07]

great post! thanks alot!

youve cleared up quite a few things for me!

 

[IntelligenceisBeautiful]

mzjones, you bought up some really good points....you really have me thinking here

 

[Koffie]

I've faced these exact struggles in regards to abstinence and masturbation before. I had no ring but I was doing my own thing when I wanted to, where I wanted to, how I wanted to, and with whom I wanted.

Although I thought I was always in control, I wound up in some sticky situations that was hard to get out of. I made some irrational decisions while in and out of control. When my boyfriend wasn't around, or I didn't have a boyfriend at the time, I was lonely and in need. Not just sexual needs, but sometimes overall companionship.

I personally felt there should be more for me. Sex was great (I ain't gonna lie), but I knew I didn't have the full package I wanted. At one point I thought I could 'be like a guy' and have no real strings attached. I wasn't sleeping around with every Tyrique, DeAndre and Hakeem*, but yet I felt I was investing more and not getting satisfactory returns. I think I wasted a lot of time in those relationships. Sometimes I went for the wrong type, and I probably missed the one that was compatible for me.
(* I initially wrote 'every Tom, Dick and Harry' but it just didn't sound right to me. )

Shortly after I decided to live a Christian life, I forgot that God was in control. I then lost control and had a sex with a guy I knew and wanted for a long time before I became a Christian. Since I didn't want to look for the way of escape when facing that temptation, that relationship blew up in a bad way.

Later on a cutie from work went beyond his usual hello and started flirting, pointing out our similarities, and inviting me out. Despite my feelings, I knew something wasn't right. Weeks later there was some drama with him, and I was so happy not to be entangled in it. Since God knocked me upside my head once, I learned to seek him first.

While in waiting, my mind went off track and focused on fleshly desires instead of spiritual ones. I would imagine what it would be like for me to have a sexual relationship in marriage. (Like God would approve of that because I honored marriage in my impure thoughts. )

I've learned that impure thoughts and masturbation are mental and/or physical distractions that give temporary pleasure and little substance. They're simulations of an experience fulfulled mainly in the mind, but they short change one's emotions. (Picture winning a million dollars but the IRS taking $999,995 because of back taxes. Five bucks isn't much in proportion to what you could have had.)

Through God's Word I know I should trust in the Lord with all of my heart and not depend on my own understanding. When I acknowledge Him, He will direct my paths. Now when I see a handsome guy, I've learned to give God praise, admire His work, and say "Lord, You're good. You made another handsome one over there." That way God knows what I like, and he'll internally prepare the right one for me!

---

I believe sex is a beautiful, intimate part of love for husbands and wives. When a husband tells his wife he loves her and then shows his devotion by giving his body solely to her, that wife has proof of his intimate love. She in return shows him she feels the same love and devotion he does. I believe that's a great bond of committment.

Is everything rosy in marriages? Absolutely not. It gets rocky sometimes; but if God is the head of their union, a husband and wife will both seek God. Marriage is a working commitment. In their every day lives, husbands and wives must keep the vows they made, despite the issues they face.

And so is my commitment to God. Since I'm the spiritual bride of Christ, I must show my devotion to God. In the natural, I have to keep my mind and body in order. When God unites me with my future husband, I want to give my husband my body as proof of my devotion. He'll know that I'm seriously committed to him. Yes I'm not a virgin, but my husband will appreciate my renewed and purified gift because it was set apart for him.

And as far as what should do ... err ... umm... It will be within reason of course and ... err ... umm,

Whatever we will do​

Will satisfy us two.
And please God too.
Now I'm through.

Are you like my spiritual twin sister?

 

[Poohbear]

Show me the scripture.

Chapter 15 of Leviticus. The whole chapter talks about purification after bodily discharges.

Chapter 18 of Leviticus talks about sexual perversions forbidden.

 

[toinette]

Yep. God changes the eating guidelines so it's okay to eat SOME of types meat. I should have put my comment in my original entry about A/E before the pig one.

For those who don't know what we're discussing here:

In the Bible, Genesis and Leviticus, God gave 3 dietary guidelines"

(1) In the beginning Man and Women and all living creatures were only allowed to eat plant-based foods (vegetarian). (2) But with the advent of the flood, etc. God gave Noah and humans to eat EVERYTHING and ANYthing. (3) However, in Leviticus 11, God gave Moses and Aaron a new dietary guideline in which he changed things again, this time limiting what's permissable to eat within the meat kingdom. Forbidden foods include rodents, pigs, hares, rabbits, lobsters, crawfish, shrimps, crabs, oysters, twenty types of birds including vultures, insects, etc. That's what I was referring to earlier when I said if you are a Christian and you eat these things you are committing an abomination and are sinning! But what percentage of Christians actually follow this?

Thanks toinette and Weaveupit for bringing this to my attention so I could clear it up.

I was going through Bible, reading versus, checking out indexes and stuff, and I couldn't find anything that said masturbation is bad. Fornication, yeah, but not masturbation. And to all who said masturbation = lust: a person doesn't have to be lusting after someone to masturbate, they could just focus on what their body is feeling without conjuring hot fantasies between themselves and another person.

I also have another question... the stats are something like every 3 out 5 women have been sexually abused in some form or another. Masturbation and positive sexual outlook and positive sexual encounters are some of the most effective ways in which sexual abuse/rape victims get over/through their traumas and grow to love themselves. (The body stores and remembers information just like the mind. So a person may know that it wasn't their fault, etc. and they have even forgiven the abuser in their head, but if they never learn/re-relearn to love their bodies sexually or experience positive sex/sexual activities they willl NEVER got over their traumas completely)...

So couldn't one argue that telling a Christian sexual abuse/rape victim (which could be any Christian woman, 'cos people you don't know who's been abused) that she isn't allowed to re-discover and re-define her sexuality in a positive light through masturbation, etc. if she wants to (as a means to counteract the violence she indured and in her path to love/re-love herself) because she must wait until she choosen by man (for whom she should remain "pure") as his wife -- effectively taking away her power to choose (again) -- is a form of mental abuse????

It's a long complex question, so read it slow. Re-read if it helps.

I've said my piece(s). I'm done posting here. I'll just be reading from now on...

thanx hun. i got it now .

 

[JuJuBoo]

MAY 6, 2005
NOW, EVEN THOUGH GOD COMES FIRST IN OUR UNION, WE ARE DEFINITELY DEVOTED TO ONE ANOTHER, AND WE LOVE US SOME EACH OTHER . BUT, WE BOTH LEARNED TO DO THAT BY BONDING EMOTIONALLY AND SPIRITUALLY FIRST, AND BY TALKING TO ONE ANOTHER ABOUT MORE THAN SEX. WE ALSO KNOW THAT LIFE IS ABOUT MORE THAN JUST 'US.' NOW TO BE HONEST, WE CANNOT WAIT UNTIL WE ARE MARRIED , BECAUSE I FEEL THAT MAKING LOVE WITH HIM WITHIN THE BONDS OF OUR MARRIAGE WILL BE ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL THINGS GOD HAS GIVEN US, SO I CANNOT WAIT TO BE WITH HIM IN THAT SPECIAL AND INTIMATE WAY, BECAUSE I TOTALLY TRUST HIM AND HE TOTALLY TRUSTS ME, AND WE DON'T TAKE GIVING OURSELVES TO EACH OTHER INTIMATELY AS A SMALL MATTER, AND THAT WAS WHY IS WAS SO IMPORTANT FOR US TO GROW IN FAITH FIRST, THEN BOND AND ULTIMATELY LEARN TO RESPECT AND TRUST EACH OTHER .

NOW, IS OUR WAY OF GOING ABOUT OUR 'LOVE' THE RIGHT WAY FOR EVERYONE ELSE? NO, AND I WOULD NEVER PUSH MY BELIEFS ON ANYONE ELSE, BECAUSE ULTIMATELY EVERYONE MUST DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES WHAT THEIR LIFE PATH IS, AND WHAT EACH PERSON WANTS OUT OF LIFE WHILE CONTINUING TO STRIVE TO BE THE BEST PERSON THEY CAN BE. BUT GOD KNOWS US WELL, AND HE KNOWS THAT WE MAKE MISTAKES. SO WE MUST NEVER FORGET THAT GOD LOVES US ALL, AND THAT WE ARE HIS CHILDREN NO MATTER WHAT, AND THAT EACH PERSON'S INTERPRETATION OFTHE BIBLE OR WHATEVER RELIGIOUS TEXT THEY READ IS THEIR INTERPRETATION AND THAT THEIR REPRESENTATION OF GOD'S WILL OR TEACHINGS MAY BE DIFFERENT THAN MINE ARE .

LATER

Proverbs 14:12
There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death.


I encourage you to abstain till you marry the guy. It soulds like you really love eachother...why not wait?

While I do agree that there are several interpretations of the Bible, sex before marraige isn't one of them. The Bible makes it way to clear that premarital sex displeases God.

 

[LondonDiva]

Proverbs 14:12
There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death.


I encourage you to abstain till you marry the guy. It soulds like you really love eachother...why not wait?

While I do agree that there are several interpretations of the Bible, sex before marraige isn't one of them. The Bible makes it way to clear that premarital sex displeases God.

ITA with you Jujuboo. You can't praise God and fornicate in the same breath. He sees and knows every single thing we do and think. By you having sex before marriage is not you 'making mistakes' it's knowingly and openly sinning. Yes God will forgive you for it, if you genuinely are sorry and repent, he will listen and overlook it. But in the meantime no no, man (us) can't run tings so to speak and make up our own interpretations of sex before marriage and try to sugarcoat it. That's one thing that you can't decifer, it's straight up there in black & white no poom poom before marriage. As my friend says NO RING, NO TINGS! Infact before the whole sex thing, it even clearly states that you aren't even to live together before marriage. At the end of the day Lena you and only you one day are going to have to stand and answer before God.

There are some things I want to do but I can't because my concious is too strong and I have to say to myself, Do I love God enough NOT to do this (sin), and as hard as it yes I do because I will be rewarded for these trying times one day.