Losing my religion
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fine_beauty
Jesus, I Trust In You!
Your opinions and sources about Catholics and Catholicism is so full of ERRORS. Please, carry out a search on my userid for info on what Catholics believe. Luterans founded by Martin Luther still hold dear to a lot of things he left them. Carry out a research on the Lutheran church. I believe these researches would shed light.
Thanks and God bless.
Editted to say: None of the above is meant as an insult. I do get passionate about my faith. I have come to the realization that convicting souls about the truth of his Church belongs to God and God alone.
AnnDriena,
Thanks and God bless.
Editted to say: None of the above is meant as an insult. I do get passionate about my faith. I have come to the realization that convicting souls about the truth of his Church belongs to God and God alone.
AnnDriena_ said:
AnnDriena,
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DelightfulFlame
New Member
about hearing the Word of God from a spirit filled church with a spirit filled believer…I have yet to have my Spirit bear witness in a church like that. However, my Spirit has been doing just fine with what I’m learning a part from church. I am where I am because this is where God wants me to be, just like He apparently wants you at church. Again, I’m fine with that. I don’t really care who God chooses as a messenger. I’m sure some people in Jesus’ day didn’t want to be taught by a carpenter’s son, but the ones who got past that…what a blessing they received. God doesn’t dwell in churches anyway (Acts 17:23-25, 1 Cor 3:16). Oh, and you never know where pastor’s get their sermons. I used to work for a pastor who listened to other pastor’s tapes, read books, the internet, etc. Was he any less of a pastor because of that? I don’t think so, because he preached what God wanted him to anyhow.
about tithing...I believe that what I said about that was in another thread. I do not believe that tithing 10% is required. It was required under the law, and I am no longer under the law. I am under the grace of Jesus. In my mind, it is a spiritual thing. Again, God is not reduced to an equation. If God wants you to give 100% then you should be open to that. If He wants you to give 1%, then you should do that as well. Anything more or less than what He tells your Spirit to give is an abomination.
first of all, the tithe was not money. It was food. Most preachers will tell you it was because there was no money. But check out Deuteronomy. There was clearly money, and it was called “money”. In fact, if the place where the Lord told them to take the tithe was too far, they were supposed to sell the food that they had to tithe with, go to that place, and then buy some more food and/or strong drink (Deut. 14:22-29)
Abraham tithed on what he won in a war, not anything that he owned and had been blessed with from God. He gave it to a Levite priest and the king of Sodom. (Genesis 14:16-20, Hebrews 7:1-10)
Jacob tithed after God blessed him first (not before like some people who can’t even pay their bills, yet are paying tithes). (Genesis 28:20-22)
So what did they do with the tithe? They ate it and shared with the fatherless, the widow, and the stranger. (Deut. 12:6-18, 14:29)
The tithe was the seed, or the fruit of the tree. If it was an animal, it was the tenth animal whether it was good or bad…meaning the last tenth and not the first. If he has less than 10 cattle, he doesn’t tithe at all. (Leviticus 27:30-33)
The tithes from the children of Israel that God spoke to Moses about were to be used for a Levite inheritance. So if you weren’t a Levite and could trace your heritage back to Aaron, you couldn’t get the tithe. (Numbers 18:24-28)
Israel, like Jacob, didn’t tithe on their poverty, but tithed on their increase and in the third year (Deut 26:12). Also did not tithe money (2 Chronicles 31: 5-12)
A new tithe set up by Hezekiah also does not mention money (Nehemiah 10:37-38, 12:44, 13:5, 12)
Paul taught to give freely according to what you have (2 Cor 8:10-12, 9:7)
Other tithes that don’t mention money (Amos 4:4, Malachi 3:8-10 (meat and bread…try putting that in the collection plate…lol), Matthew 23:23, Luke 11:42)
Not under the letter (law), but under the spirit with the new covenant (2 Cor 3:6, Rom 2:29, Rom 8:1-4, 8-9, Acts 15:1-12, Hebrews 8:8-10, 13)
Finally, when did Jesus and the disciples tithe? When did Jesus accept a tithe? If anyone should receive a tithe, shouldn’t the HIGHEST priest? In fact, Jesus threw the money changers out of the church (Matthew 21:12-13) He also didn’t pay the temple tax required under the law of Moses. (Exodus 30:13-16). He did pay it to save Peter embarrassment and not to offend them (Matthew 17:24-27), but not out of necessity.
So how then did Jesus and the disciples support their ministry? *gasp* they worked!
Paul worked and said he was an example that we ought to follow. (2 Thes 3:7-9, 1 Thes 2:9, Acts 18:3, Acts 20:31-35; 1 cor 4:9-16)
So are we to give? Yes, we give freely. (Matthew 10:8, Luke 6:38, Acts 20:35, 2 Cor 9:6-7, 1 Tim 5:8)
about tithing...I believe that what I said about that was in another thread. I do not believe that tithing 10% is required. It was required under the law, and I am no longer under the law. I am under the grace of Jesus. In my mind, it is a spiritual thing. Again, God is not reduced to an equation. If God wants you to give 100% then you should be open to that. If He wants you to give 1%, then you should do that as well. Anything more or less than what He tells your Spirit to give is an abomination.
first of all, the tithe was not money. It was food. Most preachers will tell you it was because there was no money. But check out Deuteronomy. There was clearly money, and it was called “money”. In fact, if the place where the Lord told them to take the tithe was too far, they were supposed to sell the food that they had to tithe with, go to that place, and then buy some more food and/or strong drink (Deut. 14:22-29)
Abraham tithed on what he won in a war, not anything that he owned and had been blessed with from God. He gave it to a Levite priest and the king of Sodom. (Genesis 14:16-20, Hebrews 7:1-10)
Jacob tithed after God blessed him first (not before like some people who can’t even pay their bills, yet are paying tithes). (Genesis 28:20-22)
So what did they do with the tithe? They ate it and shared with the fatherless, the widow, and the stranger. (Deut. 12:6-18, 14:29)
The tithe was the seed, or the fruit of the tree. If it was an animal, it was the tenth animal whether it was good or bad…meaning the last tenth and not the first. If he has less than 10 cattle, he doesn’t tithe at all. (Leviticus 27:30-33)
The tithes from the children of Israel that God spoke to Moses about were to be used for a Levite inheritance. So if you weren’t a Levite and could trace your heritage back to Aaron, you couldn’t get the tithe. (Numbers 18:24-28)
Israel, like Jacob, didn’t tithe on their poverty, but tithed on their increase and in the third year (Deut 26:12). Also did not tithe money (2 Chronicles 31: 5-12)
A new tithe set up by Hezekiah also does not mention money (Nehemiah 10:37-38, 12:44, 13:5, 12)
Paul taught to give freely according to what you have (2 Cor 8:10-12, 9:7)
Other tithes that don’t mention money (Amos 4:4, Malachi 3:8-10 (meat and bread…try putting that in the collection plate…lol), Matthew 23:23, Luke 11:42)
Not under the letter (law), but under the spirit with the new covenant (2 Cor 3:6, Rom 2:29, Rom 8:1-4, 8-9, Acts 15:1-12, Hebrews 8:8-10, 13)
Finally, when did Jesus and the disciples tithe? When did Jesus accept a tithe? If anyone should receive a tithe, shouldn’t the HIGHEST priest? In fact, Jesus threw the money changers out of the church (Matthew 21:12-13) He also didn’t pay the temple tax required under the law of Moses. (Exodus 30:13-16). He did pay it to save Peter embarrassment and not to offend them (Matthew 17:24-27), but not out of necessity.
So how then did Jesus and the disciples support their ministry? *gasp* they worked!
Paul worked and said he was an example that we ought to follow. (2 Thes 3:7-9, 1 Thes 2:9, Acts 18:3, Acts 20:31-35; 1 cor 4:9-16)
So are we to give? Yes, we give freely. (Matthew 10:8, Luke 6:38, Acts 20:35, 2 Cor 9:6-7, 1 Tim 5:8)
AnnDriena_
New Member
Please point out the errors.
Did the catholic church condemn suicide as the unpardonable sin or did the bible?
Do catholics not ask saints to pray for them? I know that many think that catholics pray to saints but that's a common mistake that I don't believe. I know that they ask saints to pray for them. Is that the error? Because it's true that Catholics
1) ask saints to pray for them
2) Pray to the virgin mary
3) Go to confession with priests.
Those were my statements regarding Catholics. And those are not errors. Those are facts supported by the Catholic Church. So please point out the errors to me.
Did the catholic church condemn suicide as the unpardonable sin or did the bible?
Do catholics not ask saints to pray for them? I know that many think that catholics pray to saints but that's a common mistake that I don't believe. I know that they ask saints to pray for them. Is that the error? Because it's true that Catholics
1) ask saints to pray for them
2) Pray to the virgin mary
3) Go to confession with priests.
Those were my statements regarding Catholics. And those are not errors. Those are facts supported by the Catholic Church. So please point out the errors to me.
AnnDriena_
New Member
Nyambura said:
Stating the differences in beliefs between Catholicism and Christianity is not bashing. Explain the bashing to me. If Catholics don't go to priests and confess then I lied and as far as I know I didn't lie and I didn't bash anyone for going to a priest.
None of the Christian churches I have ever been too consider Catholics to be Christian so I separate the two and your above statement:
Supports that. You just said the statements come from people who are not Catholic and you are correct I'm not Catholic, I'm Christian.
I didn't put any statements in this topic to debate or offend and if something I stated about Catholics is not supported by the Catholic Church please point it out to me.
AnnDriena_
New Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnDriena_
Catholics
1) ask saints to pray for them
2) Pray to the virgin mary
3) Go to confession with priests
Those are the facts I stated that are apparently offensive to some. They were not meant to be offensive I just wanted to show the evidence for my belief in the difference between Catholicism and Christians.
It's like Muslims and Christians. Muslims believe in God but not the same one we believe in and to call them Christians just because they believe in God would be erroneous because the paths we believe in are different and Jesus said no man can get to the Father but by me and since Muslims don't believe in Jesus as the son of God then we don't believe in the same path.
So that's why my beliefs are the way they are.
I'm not here to debate. I just know that in the bible there are a few things that separate Christians from others, well there are a lot but for the interest of shortening this post here are a few key ones that shape my view.
Jesus said do no pray to anyone but Him. He will not share our worship.
Jesus died so that the people could come straight to him and not have to go through priests.
In general study of the bible Paul warned against man inserting his own beliefs and customs into what is required of Christians.
It's not just the Catholic Church that does this. It's just that the Catholic Church is so organized about it and some things are now recognized as being religious when in fact they are Church requirements and not Christ requirements.
For example the last Christian church that I stopped attending has us stand up and read the Church Creed from the back of the hymnal before communion. For the longest time I thought this was a Christian creed but it was really the church's creed and when I realized that they were incorporating it as part of the communion I was upset and no longer go to that church. I don't like man putting his own little spin on things and making it seem as if it's from Christ. That baptist church was the second church I had ever been a member of I didn't agree with they used communion to get people to recite the church creed.
Now there was nothing wrong with the Church creed but it should be recognized as the CHURCH creed and not incorporated into Holy and Christ commanded traditions.
Originally Posted by AnnDriena_
Catholics
1) ask saints to pray for them
2) Pray to the virgin mary
3) Go to confession with priests
webby said:
Those are the facts I stated that are apparently offensive to some. They were not meant to be offensive I just wanted to show the evidence for my belief in the difference between Catholicism and Christians.
It's like Muslims and Christians. Muslims believe in God but not the same one we believe in and to call them Christians just because they believe in God would be erroneous because the paths we believe in are different and Jesus said no man can get to the Father but by me and since Muslims don't believe in Jesus as the son of God then we don't believe in the same path.
So that's why my beliefs are the way they are.
I'm not here to debate. I just know that in the bible there are a few things that separate Christians from others, well there are a lot but for the interest of shortening this post here are a few key ones that shape my view.
Jesus said do no pray to anyone but Him. He will not share our worship.
Jesus died so that the people could come straight to him and not have to go through priests.
In general study of the bible Paul warned against man inserting his own beliefs and customs into what is required of Christians.
It's not just the Catholic Church that does this. It's just that the Catholic Church is so organized about it and some things are now recognized as being religious when in fact they are Church requirements and not Christ requirements.
For example the last Christian church that I stopped attending has us stand up and read the Church Creed from the back of the hymnal before communion. For the longest time I thought this was a Christian creed but it was really the church's creed and when I realized that they were incorporating it as part of the communion I was upset and no longer go to that church. I don't like man putting his own little spin on things and making it seem as if it's from Christ. That baptist church was the second church I had ever been a member of I didn't agree with they used communion to get people to recite the church creed.
Now there was nothing wrong with the Church creed but it should be recognized as the CHURCH creed and not incorporated into Holy and Christ commanded traditions.
DelightfulFlame
New Member
back on the subject of free will...this scripture says that God DECLARED the end from the beginning...not very free to me.
Isaiah 46
9Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,
10Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
Isaiah 46
9Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,
10Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
AnnDriena_
New Member
Delightful, do you believe in free will?
I like your post about free will. The people were instructed to give food because that is how the descendents of Leviticus, the priests, survived, our tithes sustained them and now we sustain our leaders with our tithes because our money is what we bring into our store house.
I think God already knew what we were going to do from beginning to end and he lets us do it. Knowing the mind and will of God is helpful too. He doesn't want anything bad for any of us but he knows the bad things we are going to do to others and ourselves.
I like your post about free will. The people were instructed to give food because that is how the descendents of Leviticus, the priests, survived, our tithes sustained them and now we sustain our leaders with our tithes because our money is what we bring into our store house.
I think God already knew what we were going to do from beginning to end and he lets us do it. Knowing the mind and will of God is helpful too. He doesn't want anything bad for any of us but he knows the bad things we are going to do to others and ourselves.
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DelightfulFlame
New Member
Nope...I don't think I do. I believe in God's will. I believe the things we do were declared before we were born. I believe we all have a mission to complete while on earth, and we will complete it because it is God's will that we do.
I don't think we are running around here haphazordly doing things that God didn't intend for us to do. He created us, and planned what we would do way before we ever got here. Have I done bad things that I regret? Yes. Were they necessary? Yes. EVERYTHING has a purpose...according to the will of God. He has orchestrated it all. Man is not in control.
So then the argument becomes...well if you believe you have no control, then you could just do anything you want. No, I can't do anything I want. I can't kill a person...why? because it is not in me to kill a person. that might change one day b/c according to ecclesiastes there is a time and place for everything, including killing. However, with the way God made me it would have to be a life or death situation.
The point is that I can do nothing outside of what/who God has made and allowed me to be.
The scripture says that God DECLARED what would happen in the end from the beginning. So God in essence designed what must be long before it ever was...including me.
I don't think we are running around here haphazordly doing things that God didn't intend for us to do. He created us, and planned what we would do way before we ever got here. Have I done bad things that I regret? Yes. Were they necessary? Yes. EVERYTHING has a purpose...according to the will of God. He has orchestrated it all. Man is not in control.
So then the argument becomes...well if you believe you have no control, then you could just do anything you want. No, I can't do anything I want. I can't kill a person...why? because it is not in me to kill a person. that might change one day b/c according to ecclesiastes there is a time and place for everything, including killing. However, with the way God made me it would have to be a life or death situation.
The point is that I can do nothing outside of what/who God has made and allowed me to be.
The scripture says that God DECLARED what would happen in the end from the beginning. So God in essence designed what must be long before it ever was...including me.
AnnDriena_
New Member
That's good reasoning but then if we didn't have free will it wouldn't be fair to put someone to death for killing another but that's what the bible gives for the punishment of murder. I think God has already let this thing called life play out and it's already done and now we are just going through it and he has already seen it from beginning to end. That's why he is displeased with some of the things we do because he didn't intend it for us but he lets us, within certain boundaries.
DelightfulFlame
New Member
That's where we differ. I believe that nothing can happen that my all knowing, all powerful God doesn't intend.
If I can do something that God doesn't intend for me to do (He being the creator of all things-even me and evil), then who is more powerful? who is God? Man is in control...making man God. I don't believe that.
If we do things that God didn't intend for us to do, then we are not in His perfect will or plan. Scripture says that God's will is always done. (I believe I posted that one earlier).
If I can do something that God doesn't intend for me to do (He being the creator of all things-even me and evil), then who is more powerful? who is God? Man is in control...making man God. I don't believe that.
If we do things that God didn't intend for us to do, then we are not in His perfect will or plan. Scripture says that God's will is always done. (I believe I posted that one earlier).
AnnDriena_
New Member
I don't think anything can happen that he didn't intend but I do think he allows us to do things that he doesn't want for us and that are not good for us.
DelightfulFlame
New Member
If He allows it...then He is in control. He could not allow it, but doesn't do that. For whatever reason, evil is part of His perfect will.
AnnDriena_
New Member
Yes. I think it brings balance. And that it's in all of us.
DelightfulFlame
New Member
I believe so too. If there were no evil, then there would be no good. Everything would just...be.
I'm with you, girl!
Tai
New Member
AnnDriena_ said:Worship is a lot of things. Get creative but be careful of some things like:
--I don't mean to rag on Catholics but repitition with the purpose of you thinking the more times you say it the better it will work. (This is not the same as pressing in to GOD and praying until something happens, like if someone is sick and you pray for them everynight). But with things like Hail Mary's. I know my friend is Catholic and she's was telling me about a certain number of Hail Mary's for a certain sin. She can say Hail Marys until her tongue falls off. God cares about your heart and when you say a prayer from your heart thoughtfully He cares and hears but just repitition because of tradition and decorum is not the right way to worship and Paul himself warns us of that in the bible.
-Once again not to rag on the Catholics but worship directed towards anyone but God is not worship. I know Catholics don't pray to saints but ask the saints to pray for them. But Jesus Christ died on the cross so that you will have a direct line to him. You don't have to pray to saints to ask them to put in a good word. You don't have to slaughter a lamb for the blood (He's the Lamb of God remember). You don't have to go through priests (why are they so holy that they can be an intermediary between you and God? He sent his son to die so you didn't have to go through priests anymore). Also Mary is not to be prayed to. She is the mother of Jesus Christ but God Himself said you are so precious he will not share your worship and devotion with anyone else. I think his momma was included in that
.
If you don't intend to "rag" on Catholics, what is your intention, Ann_Driena? The Catholic Church does not require that anyone ask saints pray for them. There is power in prayer. So if I can ask my best friend, this board, my Church, and my priest to pray for me, why can't I ask St. Teresa of Avila?
Prayers like the rosary aren't about repetition. When I pray the rosary, it's my personal meditiation that draws me closer to God. While Mary is not worshiped, she is to be respected. She is the mother of Jesus. What if she had said "No" when the Lord came to her and asked her to bear His son? It is only right to pay respect to Mary, IMO. But respecting her and worshiping her are two different things.
pebbles
New Member
Tai said:
The reason is that while the members of this board, your church, and your priest are alive, St. Teresa and Avila are dead. The bible says that the dead know not what the living do. They have no knowledge of the things of the earth. Ecclesiastes 9:3-12 is pretty clear on that.
I do hope that people understand that the differences between beliefs is what is being highlighted. We're not here to bash or offend anyone.
MomofThreeBoys
Well-Known Member
If she had said no, God would have found another worthy woman. There have been times when God's chosen have strayed.
See the story of King Saul. God ended up giving his throne to David.
See the story of King Saul. God ended up giving his throne to David.
Tai said:
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DelightfulFlame
New Member
It was God's will that she was the one...so she was. Who can say no to God? You mean that God would have re-written His entire will/plan for the earth because the one woman He chose to be the mother of Christ said no?
Even if I think I'm saying no to something I think He's asking me to do...it wasn't in His will for me to do it then...or I would have. When God wants you to do something, you do it. No ifs, ands, or buts...
where did God ask Mary if she wanted to? All I recall was an angel appearing saying that she would.
Even if I think I'm saying no to something I think He's asking me to do...it wasn't in His will for me to do it then...or I would have. When God wants you to do something, you do it. No ifs, ands, or buts...
where did God ask Mary if she wanted to? All I recall was an angel appearing saying that she would.
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MomofThreeBoys
Well-Known Member
Then why bother to worship? Why read the bible? I should just do what I want to do if I can't control antying..
It's would be much easier to believe what you believe. That way, I could do ABSOLUTELY ANTHING to anybody and say "Oh well, God's well."
Cheat on my hubby. Sorry Hubby, God's will.
Steal. Rob. God's will.
Betray a friend. Oops, God's will again.
Molest a child. umm....God's will again.
Your way would be fun. No need for jails b/c nobody should be accountable for anything they do. It was Gods will.
No need fo jails. No need fo apologies. No choice. No accountability.. God's Will.
It's would be much easier to believe what you believe. That way, I could do ABSOLUTELY ANTHING to anybody and say "Oh well, God's well."
Cheat on my hubby. Sorry Hubby, God's will.
Steal. Rob. God's will.
Betray a friend. Oops, God's will again.
Molest a child. umm....God's will again.
Your way would be fun. No need for jails b/c nobody should be accountable for anything they do. It was Gods will.
No need fo jails. No need fo apologies. No choice. No accountability.. God's Will.
DelightfulFlame said:
DelightfulFlame
New Member
Nope...doesn't work like that. I don't cheat on my hubby, go to jail, etc. b/c it is not God's will for me to. The mistakes that I do make, I get convicted in my Spirit something terrible. Was it God's will for me to make those mistakes? Yep. Everything that happens on this earth is God's will...OR ELSE IT WOULDN'T HAPPEN.
How does the DIVINE creator, create something with a purpose, and then let it get out of control? Not just some joe smoe we're talking about here. It's GOD, ALMIGHTY. Who created good and evil, you and me with sinful natures.
If He wanted us to be perfect, don't you think we would?
If He didn't want us to be sinners, we WOULD NOT.
Simple as that. He's God, and He always gets what He wants.
How does the DIVINE creator, create something with a purpose, and then let it get out of control? Not just some joe smoe we're talking about here. It's GOD, ALMIGHTY. Who created good and evil, you and me with sinful natures.
If He wanted us to be perfect, don't you think we would?
If He didn't want us to be sinners, we WOULD NOT.
Simple as that. He's God, and He always gets what He wants.
MomofThreeBoys
Well-Known Member
Then why have jails? Why would anyone every say sorry?
DelightfulFlame said:
DelightfulFlame
New Member
because apparently they are part of His will too. Remember, He said He created evil. There is evil in the world. Evil has a purpose. I don't claim to know what that purpose is...I'm still trying to figure out mine. But if you do something wrong, you will be punished. And that punishment is apparently part of God's will as well. It's definitely a learning experience when I do something wrong.
I say sorry because I feel bad when I do something wrong. Apparently part of God's will too. And jails...yep...in His will to.
You think that something can exist on this earth without being apart of His will?
Me and you conversing right now...out of all the people on earth...at this very moment...miles away from each other...all planned and a part of His will.
I say sorry because I feel bad when I do something wrong. Apparently part of God's will too. And jails...yep...in His will to.
You think that something can exist on this earth without being apart of His will?
Me and you conversing right now...out of all the people on earth...at this very moment...miles away from each other...all planned and a part of His will.
MomofThreeBoys
Well-Known Member
No, he didn't create evil. He CREATED the being that started EVIL. There is a difference. Many biblical scholars who analyzed the orginal text believe this is what was meant based on the words used in the original language.
The god that you describe is cruel and heartless.
I know a God of Love. A God of Love does not reconcile with what you are saying.
Thanks for sharing your beliefs but I just can't buy it.
The god that you describe is cruel and heartless.
I know a God of Love. A God of Love does not reconcile with what you are saying.
Thanks for sharing your beliefs but I just can't buy it.
DelightfulFlame said:
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DelightfulFlame
New Member
So he created a being and didn't know or plan for it to be evil?
Thank you too for sharing. We can agree to disagree. If everyone thought the same this would be one big boring place. Peace and love.
Thank you too for sharing. We can agree to disagree. If everyone thought the same this would be one big boring place. Peace and love.
fine_beauty
Jesus, I Trust In You!
webby said:
Webby,
I have on other occasions and other threads in which you participated explained my faith. Your stance is non-confrontational and I thank you. If you're still interested in learning about the Christians who belong to the universal (catholic) church. Please pm me.
Thanks and God bless,
AnnDriena_
New Member
Thank you pebbles. The differences are what I was highlighting.
I respect Mary and other saints but when you say a prayer to her such "Mary mother of God...." then that's what I was talking about as worshipping her. God said to pray to no one but him so that's where my stance was coming from regarding that. I do not consider that to be "ragging" on Catholics.
And I didn't say the Catholic Church requires Catholics to pray to saints. But it is part of their doctrine and it is practiced in their churches. So that's why I attributed it to them. If they do not practice it in their churches please forgive me for saying so. As for asking someone to pray for you. That is a wonderful idea but the bible says the dead can't do anything for us.
We on earth are actually saints. Yep. I'm not kidding. Saints are the children and ambassadors of God. So I also don't think the Catholic church has the right to appoint sainthood. Does that offend you? Well it shouldn't. I'm discussing the differences between Catholics and Christians which caused the offense in the first place and I'm just trying to explain my viewpoint that you said was full of errors which I have not seen any error in. So you needn't be offended on a personal level. But if my information is incorrect feel free to correct me please.
But I must say one more thing I do have a problem with the Catholic Church as an organization. Every church and denomination has it's faults and let's face it, some downright crazy people in it . But with things like the case of the little girl in whose health problem wouldn't allow her to eat the normal communion wafer because of her allergy to it and a priest volunteered to give her a wheat wafer and the Catholic church disallowed her communion and said it was not valid.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5762478?GT1=4529
And the way they have been moving priests around who have abused children instead of dealing with them and protecting the little children (whatever you do unto them you are doing unto Christ). That sickens me to no end and it angers me that people have to picket and go to court with the Church organization to get some justice and the Catholic Church is still moving pedophile priests around.
Same thing with the Southern Baptist Association, Yep, their CHRISTIAN and I can't stand the way they try and put their organizational crap into CHRISTIANITY. Did you know that Baptists aren't supposed to dance? (David danced before the Lord and the Lord was pleased with his honest worship) Well good thing I'm not Baptist or the SBA would have a little problem with me.
I respect Mary and other saints but when you say a prayer to her such "Mary mother of God...." then that's what I was talking about as worshipping her. God said to pray to no one but him so that's where my stance was coming from regarding that. I do not consider that to be "ragging" on Catholics.
And I didn't say the Catholic Church requires Catholics to pray to saints. But it is part of their doctrine and it is practiced in their churches. So that's why I attributed it to them. If they do not practice it in their churches please forgive me for saying so. As for asking someone to pray for you. That is a wonderful idea but the bible says the dead can't do anything for us.
We on earth are actually saints. Yep. I'm not kidding. Saints are the children and ambassadors of God. So I also don't think the Catholic church has the right to appoint sainthood. Does that offend you? Well it shouldn't. I'm discussing the differences between Catholics and Christians which caused the offense in the first place and I'm just trying to explain my viewpoint that you said was full of errors which I have not seen any error in. So you needn't be offended on a personal level. But if my information is incorrect feel free to correct me please.
But I must say one more thing I do have a problem with the Catholic Church as an organization. Every church and denomination has it's faults and let's face it, some downright crazy people in it
. But with things like the case of the little girl in whose health problem wouldn't allow her to eat the normal communion wafer because of her allergy to it and a priest volunteered to give her a wheat wafer and the Catholic church disallowed her communion and said it was not valid.http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5762478?GT1=4529
And the way they have been moving priests around who have abused children instead of dealing with them and protecting the little children (whatever you do unto them you are doing unto Christ). That sickens me to no end and it angers me that people have to picket and go to court with the Church organization to get some justice and the Catholic Church is still moving pedophile priests around.
Same thing with the Southern Baptist Association, Yep, their CHRISTIAN and I can't stand the way they try and put their organizational crap into CHRISTIANITY. Did you know that Baptists aren't supposed to dance? (David danced before the Lord and the Lord was pleased with his honest worship) Well good thing I'm not Baptist or the SBA would have a little problem with me.
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