Is it 10% of each pay check or 10% a month?

[Iwanthealthyhair67]

Mrs. H.

It's unfortunate that you had to sit under a Pastor who point blank fleeced the sheep. All churches are not like that and believe in tithing (not trying to argue or debate).

I've never shared this here but I'll give a little tidbit of info... When I first came to the Lord I was eager to do whatever it took to please the Lord. I was saved in a prosperity church so money was talked about every single sermon. Well I started tithing, not looking for riches but to support the church and "be obedient". Well.... My finances fell apart for no apparent reason. I lost my apartment and all my bills fell behind. Whenever I went to church I kept hearing that lack was a result of lack of faith and the "Bishop" would say that if anybody came to him and said they were having financial issues the only thing he'd say is, "Are you tithing?". I started to feel like something was wrong with me and it made me really ashamed. I happen to know there were several people having financial difficulty though and you know what he used to do? They took up 2 offerings per service and he'd ask who didn't have money to give. Then he'd tell them to come up and give them money. Guess why though... So they could put it right back into the offering and "feel wealthy". That's why nobody can tell me anything about faith. I had faith even while my stuff was being put on the street while I was at work and people were riding around like vultures waiting on the sheriff to leave so they could take my things. Yes I have since recovered but after what I went through... It took faith for me to remain with the Lord despite feeling cursed and rejected. I have prayed for healing because yes that is abuse. And I have found balance so I am not against giving to the local church one attends. However, that situation put me in study mode and I found the tithe doctrine to be false. Giving is to be Spirit led and nobody can pay God enough for His blessings. He blesses because He is God. So, in a nutshell that has been my experience. I think its easy to read a persons comments and judge them not knowing what God has brought them through in life. He's brought me through and despite going through some difficult times financially I love him more now than I did before because I know he's faithful regardless of what "I" do.

ALSO, sinners have money. In fact, they have all the money, lol. Having financial blessings is nothing sinners don't get as well so it doesn't mean paying a "tithe" is the reason a person gets financial blessings. I have been far more blessed allowing the Lord to tell be what HE would have me do with what He blesses me to have.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Mrs. H.

It's unfortunate that you had to sit under a Pastor who point blank fleeced the sheep. All churches are not like that and believe in tithing (not trying to argue or debate).

Hi Sis. I don't view what you said as argument or debate. I know not all churches are like that and I am not against giving. If I attended a local church I would absolutely give but it would be as the Spirit leads, be it 5% or 55%. That's up to the Lord. I simply do not believe there is a mandate for new testament believers to pay a minimum of 10% of their earnings to the local church. I pray for my old Pastor and the members and I have grown a lot from that experience. I'm not mad at all

 

[sunnysmyler]

I think it would be nice if they took the word tithe out of the equation all together and call it what it is...... A Freewill Offering.

 

[janeemat]

I've never shared this here but I'll give a little tidbit of info... When I first came to the Lord I was eager to do whatever it took to please the Lord. I was saved in a prosperity church so money was talked about every single sermon. Well I started tithing, not looking for riches but to support the church and "be obedient". Well.... My finances fell apart for no apparent reason. I lost my apartment and all my bills fell behind. Whenever I went to church I kept hearing that lack was a result of lack of faith and the "Bishop" would say that if anybody came to him and said they were having financial issues the only thing he'd say is, "Are you tithing?". I started to feel like something was wrong with me and it made me really ashamed. I happen to know there were several people having financial difficulty though and you know what he used to do? They took up 2 offerings per service and he'd ask who didn't have money to give. Then he'd tell them to come up and give them money. Guess why though... So they could put it right back into the offering and "feel wealthy". That's why nobody can tell me anything about faith. I had faith even while my stuff was being put on the street while I was at work and people were riding around like vultures waiting on the sheriff to leave so they could take my things. Yes I have since recovered but after what I went through... It took faith for me to remain with the Lord despite feeling cursed and rejected. I have prayed for healing because yes that is abuse. And I have found balance so I am not against giving to the local church one attends. However, that situation put me in study mode and I found the tithe doctrine to be false. Giving is to be Spirit led and nobody can pay God enough for His blessings. He blesses because He is God. So, in a nutshell that has been my experience. I think its easy to read a persons comments and judge them not knowing what God has brought them through in life. He's brought me through and despite going through some difficult times financially I love him more now than I did before because I know he's faithful regardless of what "I" do.

ALSO, sinners have money. In fact, they have all the money, lol. Having financial blessings is nothing sinners don't get as well so it doesn't mean paying a "tithe" is the reason a person gets financial blessings. I have been far more blessed allowing the Lord to tell be what HE would have me do with what He blesses me to have.

You and I must be members of the same church! To the bold, I have witnessed this often by the Pastor and visiting preachers! Thanks for sharing because I know you are telling truth! Be strong and keep "studying to show thyself approved"!

 

[blazingthru]

We still pay tithes, there is no mandate that says that's an old thing of the past we still are to tithe and pay offerings. The blessings actually come in after you pay above the 10 percent. Jesus mentions the tithes as do not leave the other undone. Paying tithes is just what you do.

Matthew 23:23 (KJV 1900)
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Paul also reminds of in 1 Cor 9:13, 14 1 Corinthians 9:13 (KJV )
13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?"Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel." We still have to support our Church keep the lights and gas and so on on. Besides this is something that God has said and that is all. We cannot change it. We follow it, we support our church and we return the tithe and offering. We find a church that is a bible believing Church, many or not, and see what is going on with the money.

Oh by the way. People will tell you over and over that this is no longer to be followed but unless you read for yourself don't believe it. The Ceremonial Laws were nailed to the cross, its important to know what the Ceremonial Laws were to know exactly what was nailed to the cross. Tithes was carried about before Abraham it was not part of the Ceremonial Laws. Anything that has been changed God has said so and he gave the reasons why the change. The things folks do now is what they chose to do, not from a mandate from the bible, which means they have added to the book, without even knowing that they have done so.

I was listening to a sermon and the pastor said so many people believe they are christian, they really believe it but their hearts are not with God at all. Their hearts are always on themselves and finding ways or loop holes to not be obedient and they are sincere about it not knowing how much they sin, for they never took the time to studying out what God has been saying and even bother to obey any of his teachings. There is no place for them, except the grave and its destruction.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

We still pay tithes, there is no mandate that says that's an old thing of the past we still are to tithe and pay offerings. The blessings actually come in after you pay above the 10 percent. Jesus mentions the tithes as do not leave the other undone. Paying tithes is just what you do.

Matthew 23:23 (KJV 1900)
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Paul also reminds of in 1 Cor 9:13, 14 1 Corinthians 9:13 (KJV )
13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?"Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel." We still have to support our Church keep the lights and gas and so on on. Besides this is something that God has said and that is all. We cannot change it. We follow it, we support our church and we return the tithe and offering. We find a church that is a bible believing Church, many or not, and see what is going on with the money.

Oh by the way. People will tell you over and over that this is no longer to be followed but unless you read for yourself don't believe it. The Ceremonial Laws were nailed to the cross, its important to know what the Ceremonial Laws were to know exactly what was nailed to the cross. Tithes was carried about before Abraham it was not part of the Ceremonial Laws. Anything that has been changed God has said so and he gave the reasons why the change. The things folks do now is what they chose to do, not from a mandate from the bible, which means they have added to the book, without even knowing that they have done so.

I was listening to a sermon and the pastor said so many people believe they are christian, they really believe it but their hearts are not with God at all. Their hearts are always on themselves and finding ways or loop holes to not be obedient and they are sincere about it not knowing how much they sin, for they never took the time to studying out what God has been saying and even bother to obey any of his teachings. There is no place for them, except the grave and its destruction.

"Keeping the law" can make a person feel like they are following God as well when they are separated from Him and following their own righteousness. You are still under the old covenant. There is no new covenant command to tithe. The tithe was for the Levitical priesthood because they could not work and had no inheritance among the people of Israel. The tithe was abolished when Christ gave up the ghost and the veil of the temple was split. The Levitical Priesthood was done away with and Christ is our High Priest. Upon careful examination of the Scripture you will find nothing that even resembles the tithe doctrine today because its man made. You will also find nothing that says only the ceremonial laws were done away with. This too is man made for people who want to follow law because they have not accepted the righteousness of Jesus Christ.

 

[Renewed1]

Let me clarify, I decided to pay 10% of annual earning on my own accord. God didn't put it on my heart and I wasn't guilt into it. I attend a mega church and I believe in the work that my church was doing and wanted to contribute. I also respected how (as far as I know) they handled the finances.

I attended a church similiar to MrsHaseeb, every service was about giving money. For the life of me I couldn't figure out how this church was always broke!!! Until I started dating a family member of the Pastor. The Pastor and his committee weren't stealing money. But they mismanaged the church finances on a regular basis, but blamed the members for not tithing/offering.

NOW, I have gave my tithe to individuals in need and I enjoyed doing so. I'm glad this thread was created, because once I get back on my feet, I think I will expand my tithe to other organizations that have been on my heart, that my church doesn't contribute to.

 

[dicapr]

"Keeping the law" can make a person feel like they are following God as well when they are separated from Him and following their own righteousness. You are still under the old covenant. There is no new covenant command to tithe. The tithe was for the Levitical priesthood because they could not work and had no inheritance among the people of Israel. The tithe was abolished when Christ gave up the ghost and the veil of the temple was split. The Levitical Priesthood was done away with and Christ is our High Priest. Upon careful examination of the Scripture you will find nothing that even resembles the tithe doctrine today because its man made. You will also find nothing that says only the ceremonial laws were done away with. This too is man made for people who want to follow law because they have not accepted the righteousness of Jesus Christ.

Tithing predates Levitical law so the argument that it was nailed to the cross with Christ is moot. Not all, but many who tithe, do so under the example of giving a tithe to Malchesadec ( sorry about the spelling) out of thankfulness for the increase God has given us. It is an act of love and free will rather than an act of fear or works. The old covenant was built on consequences and fear. The new covenant is built on the love of God taking away our sins. Expressions of love to the Father are permitted under both covenants. No, you may not feel led to tithe but to insinuate that those who do have an incomplete understanding of the law and are living under the old covenant is incorrect.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

I think I'm going to do a blog about what new testament giving should really look like. I have since left that church but imagine what it felt like to be losing my apartment when the pastors wife is wearing Louboutin's and he's wearing tailor made suits and since she doesn't cook they go out to eat everyday. What have we become??? How can people believe they have the love of God in them giving 10% to a church and rarely is tithe money being used for anything more than "clergy" salaries, a little outreach, very little charity, and no distribution among the body of Christ? Giving 10% to a church that, many times, Christ has nothing to do with while brethren in the Lord have need and people think they're blessed by the Lord? Give me a break. What about the poor and persecuted believers in other parts of the world? Shouldn't those who are "blessed" be thinking of these people and not themselves? We are really messed up and the fact is, most are blind to it. Why aren't we praying for the Lord to show us who is in need and who we can bless. Christ didn't tell us to build big buildings on the backs of the people then implement a lying tithe doctrine to pay for them. I'm still in recovery mode and not where I was financially but my goal is to help those people who can't help themselves. How wretched and pitiful we are when we can brag about how "blessed" we are because we pay tithes when there were many poor believers in the Bible. Did anybody tell them to tithe to be blessed? No! They pulled their resources together and distributed to the body of Christ where it was needed. How selfish have we become? The tithe and blessing doctrine doesn't come from the Bible at all. Its nothing but the same heresy of the prosperity movement. Malachi 3, when studied in context, has nothing to do with us. So quoting it to bless and curse people is using the Bible as a tool of divination and manipulating people. Its all foolishness.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Tithing predates Levitical law so the argument that it was nailed to the cross with Christ is moot. Not all, but many who tithe, do so under the example of giving a tithe to Malchesadec ( sorry about the spelling) out of thankfulness for the increase God has given us. It is an act of love and free will rather than an act of fear or works. The old covenant was built on consequences and fear. The new covenant is built on the love of God taking away our sins. Expressions of love to the Father are permitted under both covenants. No, you may not feel led to tithe but to insinuate that those who do have an incomplete understanding of the law and are living under the old covenant is incorrect.

Circumcision predated the law as well but that commandment was done away with too, wasn't it? You don't see anybody arguing this hard for circumcision and the only reason people argue over the tithe is because they've been brainwashed to think they have to pay for God's blessings. Abraham tithed war spoils, not his own money and wealth and there is no evidence that he did that more than once. Melchizedek was a Christ type... We don't give Christ 10%, we present our bodies as a living sacrifice. And I never said that those who tithe lack understanding of the law, I simply explained what the tithe was according to the law. It doesn't really take a rocket scientist to see that the tithe was not money and was given to maintain the Levitical Priesthood that didn't work. Christ is the High Priest. The tithe doctrine of today is simply false. I'm not against giving, I'm against the attitudes I see amongst professing Christians about giving when compared to the believers in the Bible.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Let me clarify, I decided to pay 10% of annual earning on my own accord. God didn't put it on my heart and I wasn't guilt into it. I attend a mega church and I believe in the work that my church was doing and wanted to contribute. I also respected how (as far as I know) they handled the finances.

I attended a church similiar to MrsHaseeb, every service was about giving money. For the life of me I couldn't figure out how this church was always broke!!! Until I started dating a family member of the Pastor. The Pastor and his committee weren't stealing money. But they mismanaged the church finances on a regular basis, but blamed the members for not tithing/offering.

NOW, I have gave my tithe to individuals in need and I enjoyed doing so. I'm glad this thread was created, because once I get back on my feet, I think I will expand my tithe to other organizations that have been on my heart, that my church doesn't contribute to.

I left that church a while ago. Definitely pray about where the Lord would have you give. And for clarification, I am in no way against you giving to your local church and definitely not speaking against it.

 

[sunnysmyler]

"Keeping the law" can make a person feel like they are following God as well when they are separated from Him and following their own righteousness. You are still under the old covenant. There is no new covenant command to tithe. The tithe was for the Levitical priesthood because they could not work and had no inheritance among the people of Israel. The tithe was abolished when Christ gave up the ghost and the veil of the temple was split. The Levitical Priesthood was done away with and Christ is our High Priest. Upon careful examination of the Scripture you will find nothing that even resembles the tithe doctrine today because its man made. You will also find nothing that says only the ceremonial laws were done away with. This too is man made for people who want to follow law because they have not accepted the righteousness of Jesus Christ.

Yes, exactly Mrs H. and to add blazingthru, you said

We still have to support our Church keep the lights and gas and so on on. Besides this is something that God has said and that is all. We cannot change it. We follow it, we support our church and we return the tithe and offering.

Has anyone ever said not to support your church financially? It would be a short lived organization who didn't have financial support from their supportors. What we are talking about is a mandate pressed upon people in the form of "God will bless you if you give 10% or God will curse you if you don't give 10%". Or what about telling people that if they want to participate in any area within the church "choir, praise team, usher" you MUST be a faithful tither. It's mandates such as these that put people in bondage.

Tithes was carried about before Abraham it was not part of the Ceremonial Laws

Ok, yes, let's take a look at when Abram gave Melchizedek a tenth/ tithe of the SPOILS OF WAR.

Genesis 14: 16 says "Abram recovered all the goods that had been taken, and he brought back his nephew Lot with his possessions and all the women and other captives.

Genesis 14: 19 says "Melchizedek blessed Abram with this blessing: "Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth."

v.20 .....And blessed be God Most High, who has defeated your enemies for you." Then Abram gave Melchizedek a tenth of all the goods he had recovered.

So it was after Melchizedek blessed Abram, not Abram give the tithe first in order to recieve a blessing.

So Abram, went to war to capture back his nephew Lot who had been taken hostage. In addition to getting Lot, Abram took all of the goods/possessions of the tribe Kedorlaomer. He then met up with the King of Salem who was Melchizekek and the King of Sodom who was Bera.

It was ONLY after Melchizedek gave a blessing to Abram did he give a tenth of the spoils of war, the possessions of the people of Kedorlaomer, over to him, but wait Abram didn't stop there.........he didn't want to keep any of the possessions for himself, in fact he insisted that the rest of the goods be shared with his alies equally.

Look at v. 21 The king of Sodom said to Abram, "Give back my people who were captured. But you may keep for yourself all the goods you have recovered."

v.22 Abram replied to the king of Sodom, "I solemnly swear to the LORD, God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth,

v.23 that I will not take so much as a single thread or sandal thong from what belongs to you. Otherwise you might say, 'I am the one who made Abram rich.'

v.24 I will accept only what my young warriors have already eaten, and I request that you give a fair share of the goods to my allies—Aner, Eshcol, and Mamre."

So, please tell me how this would equate to me giving 10% of cash money from my paycheck every week/ two weeks....how?

In fact it would look to me like anyone who is using this scripture to support New Covenant believers giving a tithe should keep reading and see that they should be giving all of their paycheck away, and not keep any of it!

When Christ spoke about the tithe, he was talking to the Pharasees, those who kept the law. Remember, they were not a good representation of how Christ said we should live, remember he called them "white washed tombs" clean looking on the outside and ugly and dirty on the inside. He never put a mandate on his disciples or any one to pay a tithe.

 

[dicapr]

Circumcision predated the law as well but that commandment was done away with too, wasn't it? You don't see anybody arguing this hard for circumcision and the only reason people argue over the tithe is because they've been brainwashed to think they have to pay for God's blessings. Abraham tithed war spoils, not his own money and wealth and there is no evidence that he did that more than once. Melchizedek was a Christ type... We don't give Christ 10%, we present our bodies as a living sacrifice. And I never said that those who tithe lack understanding of the law, I simply explained what the tithe was according to the law. It doesn't really take a rocket scientist to see that the tithe was not money and was given to maintain the Levitical Priesthood that didn't work. Christ is the High Priest. The tithe doctrine of today is simply false. I'm not against giving, I'm against the attitudes I see amongst professing Christians about giving when compared to the believers in the Bible.

@MrsHaseeb You are over the line. While you are entitled to your opinion you are being offensive. To imply that just because we understand the word of God differently that that I lack understanding or I am less than a believer than you is just wrong in so many ways. Once again you have proven why I, as a Christian, must avoid the Christian forum. Some Christians believe that so long as they using speaking the "truth" that they do not have to treat fellow believers with the same level of respect and care you would extend to others. You seem content spewing your regurgitated argument without addressing what the poster is telling you about their attitude and reason for tithing. I am not trying to buy God's love or grace by paying tithes. It isn't necessary or possible But how I choose to express my gratitude for what he has done for me isn't a lack of knowledge or being under the law. It is an act of love. Showing God that I will withhold nothing from him, including MY money, is part of MY worship. Being under the law is when Uncle Sam takes 26% of my income off the top to run a government and support programs that I may or may not want to support. Tithing is of my own free will. God will not stop blessing me if I don't tithe, but the simple act of trusting the Lord to provide despite me giving up part of my income has been an added blessing.

It seems that some posters have had tithing presented to them in a way that has turned them off from the process. But just as something can be presented in a way to turn someone off from the process there are those of us who were presented with the act of tithing as a beautiful sacrifice before the Lord.

You should be careful of how you treat your brothers and sisters in Christ. The way you are addressing those who disagree with you is over the top. You are calling them less than all because they disagree with you on doctrinal issues. It is not ok to stoop to the level of questioning someone's faith or level of understanding over something as petty as how they choose to spend their money.

 

[sunnysmyler]

MrsHaseeb You are over the line. While you are entitled to your opinion you are being offensive. To imply that just because we understand the word of God differently that that I lack understanding or I am less than a believer than you is just wrong in so many ways. Once again you have proven why I, as a Christian, must avoid the Christian forum. Some Christians believe that so long as they using speaking the "truth" that they do not have to treat fellow believers with the same level of respect and care you would extend to others. You seem content spewing your regurgitated argument without addressing what the poster is telling you about their attitude and reason for tithing. I am not trying to buy God's love or grace by paying tithes. It isn't necessary or possible But how I choose to express my gratitude for what he has done for me isn't a lack of knowledge or being under the law. It is an act of love. Showing God that I will withhold nothing from him, including MY money, is part of MY worship. Being under the law is when Uncle Sam takes 26% of my income off the top to run a government and support programs that I may or may not want to support. Tithing is of my own free will. God will not stop blessing me if I don't tithe, but the simple act of trusting the Lord to provide despite me giving up part of my income has been an added blessing.

It seems that some posters have had tithing presented to them in a way that has turned them off from the process. But just as something can be presented in a way to turn someone off from the process there are those of us who were presented with the act of tithing as a beautiful sacrifice before the Lord.

You should be careful of how you treat your brothers and sisters in Christ. The way you are addressing those who disagree with you is over the top. You are calling them less than all because they disagree with you on doctrinal issues. It is not ok to stoop to the level of questioning someone's faith or level of understanding over something as petty as how they choose to spend their money.

I didn't feel she was making her statement towards you at all. I totally agree with what she said.

You might want to take your own advice because Christ tells us that a soft answer turns away wrath and to give the other cheek if we've been slapped. Your answer was not soft and you forum slapped her and I called yourself putting her in her place. I didn't see where that was called for. Don't take it personal.

Many people are reading this thread and I know for a fact that they can identify with why MrsH and myself are saying.

Thank God that you haven't been abused spiritually.

Op I would tell you pay your bills, give what you can to your church, help those in need. Everyday you wake up, God has blessed you because he is faithful.

 

[LiftedUp]

10% of your paycheck every 2 weeks will equal to 10% of the overall paycheck every 4 weeks (1 month).

Contributing to the thread, I commit to a certain contribution each month and I give offering every week. During a sermon our priest pointed to scripture in the New Testament showing where the 10% no longer holds so I follow that and I feel great about my decision

 

[Nice & Wavy]

I think I'm going to do a blog about what new testament giving should really look like. I have since left that church but imagine what it felt like to be losing my apartment when the pastors wife is wearing Louboutin's and he's wearing tailor made suits and since she doesn't cook they go out to eat everyday. What have we become??? How can people believe they have the love of God in them giving 10% to a church and rarely is tithe money being used for anything more than "clergy" salaries, a little outreach, very little charity, and no distribution among the body of Christ? Giving 10% to a church that, many times, Christ has nothing to do with while brethren in the Lord have need and people think they're blessed by the Lord? Give me a break. What about the poor and persecuted believers in other parts of the world? Shouldn't those who are "blessed" be thinking of these people and not themselves? We are really messed up and the fact is, most are blind to it. Why aren't we praying for the Lord to show us who is in need and who we can bless. Christ didn't tell us to build big buildings on the backs of the people then implement a lying tithe doctrine to pay for them. I'm still in recovery mode and not where I was financially but my goal is to help those people who can't help themselves.

How wretched and pitiful we are when we can brag about how "blessed" we are because we pay tithes

when there were many poor believers in the Bible. Did anybody tell them to tithe to be blessed? No! They pulled their resources together and distributed to the body of Christ where it was needed. How selfish have we become? The tithe and blessing doctrine doesn't come from the Bible at all. Its nothing but the same heresy of the prosperity movement. Malachi 3, when studied in context, has nothing to do with us. So quoting it to bless and curse people is using the Bible as a tool of divination and manipulating people. Its all foolishness.

I think you are overstepping your boundaries here and insinuating this because of my posts upthread. I would appreciate an apology to me and to others who KNOW that God does bless those of us who tithe. You are intentionally being divisive and its uncalled for and certainly not what God desires for this forum and the members in it.

I have tried to ignore this thread and give the OP what she asked for in her original post, but there always seems to be those who can come in and name call and say that there is heresy going on when it doesn't line up with your thinking or you because of what you experience in your own church.

I don't appreciate your saying that I am speaking a prosperity movement message, knowing that I am a minister who happened to post in this thread about tithing. You have totally offended not just me but many here who post about believing that God does bless with their giving of tithes. You say you are doing it in love, but you are being very messy in the process. I for one am not going to stand for this any longer.

@beverly @pebbles @Supergirl I am asking that this thread be closed and correction given because of the divisiveness of this thread and for the sake of the members who are offended by being called names because they tithe to THE CHURCH.

 

[Nice & Wavy]

@MrsHaseeb You are over the line. While you are entitled to your opinion you are being offensive. To imply that just because we understand the word of God differently that that I lack understanding or I am less than a believer than you is just wrong in so many ways. Once again you have proven why I, as a Christian, must avoid the Christian forum. Some Christians believe that so long as they using speaking the "truth" that they do not have to treat fellow believers with the same level of respect and care you would extend to others. You seem content spewing your regurgitated argument without addressing what the poster is telling you about their attitude and reason for tithing. I am not trying to buy God's love or grace by paying tithes. It isn't necessary or possible But how I choose to express my gratitude for what he has done for me isn't a lack of knowledge or being under the law. It is an act of love. Showing God that I will withhold nothing from him, including MY money, is part of MY worship. Being under the law is when Uncle Sam takes 26% of my income off the top to run a government and support programs that I may or may not want to support. Tithing is of my own free will. God will not stop blessing me if I don't tithe, but the simple act of trusting the Lord to provide despite me giving up part of my income has been an added blessing.

It seems that some posters have had tithing presented to them in a way that has turned them off from the process. But just as something can be presented in a way to turn someone off from the process there are those of us who were presented with the act of tithing as a beautiful sacrifice before the Lord.

You should be careful of how you treat your brothers and sisters in Christ. The way you are addressing those who disagree with you is over the top. You are calling them less than all because they disagree with you on doctrinal issues. It is not ok to stoop to the level of questioning someone's faith or level of understanding over something as petty as how they choose to spend their money.

I agree 100% with this post and feel that it is divisive and destructive message that is being presented. Everyone has the right to post, even to disagree, but name calling and saying things that are offensive and downright mean isn't gonna fly here in this forum. This is ridiculous.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

I think you are overstepping your boundaries here and insinuating this because of my posts upthread. I would appreciate an apology to me and to others who KNOW that God does bless those of us who tithe. You are intentionally being divisive and its uncalled for and certainly not what God desires for this forum and the members in it.

I have tried to ignore this thread and give the OP what she asked for in her original post, but there always seems to be those who can come in and name call and say that there is heresy going on when it doesn't line up with your thinking or you because of what you experience in your own church.

I don't appreciate your saying that I am speaking a prosperity movement message, knowing that I am a minister who happened to post in this thread about tithing. You have totally offended not just me but many here who post about believing that God does bless with their giving of tithes. You say you are doing it in love, but you are being very messy in the process. I for one am not going to stand for this any longer.

beverly @pebbles @Supergirl I am asking that this thread be closed because of divisiveness and for the sake of the members who may be offended by being called names because they tithe to THE CHURCH.

Um... What I said had nothing to do with you... Really. The tithe thing is something I heard at my previous church, all churches I've visited, and among most believers while I literally lost everything I had. Perhaps you're offended because what I said is true. I never once addressed you in this thread. I addressed attitudes I've seen everywhere, far beyond this thread. I don't understand how this is considered being divisive. We don't have to agree. There have been other threads that have gotten way more "divisive" and you didn't request them to be closed so I'm not seeing the issue here.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

MrsHaseeb You are over the line. While you are entitled to your opinion you are being offensive. To imply that just because we understand the word of God differently that that I lack understanding or I am less than a believer than you is just wrong in so many ways. Once again you have proven why I, as a Christian, must avoid the Christian forum. Some Christians believe that so long as they using speaking the "truth" that they do not have to treat fellow believers with the same level of respect and care you would extend to others. You seem content spewing your regurgitated argument without addressing what the poster is telling you about their attitude and reason for tithing. I am not trying to buy God's love or grace by paying tithes. It isn't necessary or possible But how I choose to express my gratitude for what he has done for me isn't a lack of knowledge or being under the law. It is an act of love. Showing God that I will withhold nothing from him, including MY money, is part of MY worship. Being under the law is when Uncle Sam takes 26% of my income off the top to run a government and support programs that I may or may not want to support. Tithing is of my own free will. God will not stop blessing me if I don't tithe, but the simple act of trusting the Lord to provide despite me giving up part of my income has been an added blessing.

It seems that some posters have had tithing presented to them in a way that has turned them off from the process. But just as something can be presented in a way to turn someone off from the process there are those of us who were presented with the act of tithing as a beautiful sacrifice before the Lord.

You should be careful of how you treat your brothers and sisters in Christ. The way you are addressing those who disagree with you is over the top. You are calling them less than all because they disagree with you on doctrinal issues. It is not ok to stoop to the level of questioning someone's faith or level of understanding over something as petty as how they choose to spend their money.

I'm sorry you feel thay way.. How many times have I said I am not against giving to the local church? I'm really not.... I don't see how you got all of that out of what I said.

 

[Nice & Wavy]

Um... What I said had nothing to do with you... Really. The tithe thing is something I heard at my previous church, all churches I've visited, and among most believers while I literally lost everything I had.

Perhaps you're offended because what I said is true

. I never once addressed you in this thread. I addressed attitudes I've seen everywhere, far beyond this thread. I don't understand how this is considered being divisive. We don't have to agree. There have been other threads that have gotten way more "divisive" and you didn't request them to be closed so

I'm not seeing the issue here.

And you don't see your issue here? You didn't post my name, but you know and I know you were discussing me because of my posts about how God has blessed and STILL is blessing me because of how I tithe. He blesses me without tithing, but I know He gives above and beyond what I imagine or think of because I do tithe. Saying that people are bragging...girl, you are something else....

You are being divisive and you know it. It's all good....you are certainly revealing who you really are on this forum, that's for sure.

I will not address you any longer. I have already reported this, so I will let the Mods and Bev handle it.

My prayer is that you come away from this divisiveness and be in unity with the brethren. You telling the 'Truth in love' is not what you should be doing because you are causing disunity on this forum and its ugly.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

And you don't see your issue here? You didn't post my name, but you know and I know you were discussing me because of my posts about how God has blessed and STILL is blessing me because of how I tithe. He blesses me without tithing, but I know He gives above and beyond what I imagine or think of because I do tithe. Saying that people are bragging...girl, you are something else....

You are being divisive and you know it. It's all good....you are certainly revealing who you really are on this forum, that's for sure.

I will not address you any longer. I have already reported this, so I will let the Mods and Bev handle it.

My prayer is that you come away from this divisiveness and be in unity with the brethren. You telling the 'Truth in love' is not what you should be doing because you are causing disunity on this forum and its ugly.

Again... Had very little to do with you. I was talking about my former church, other churches and professing Christians in general. You shouldn't feel singled out. Its a really good thing my life is not a popularity contest. And the only thing I plan to be in unity with is truth and like minded believers. This is a discussion but you want the thread closed because you feel attacked over what I said about tithing. If you know you've been blessed because of it, why on earth does what I said matter? Perhaps a little more self examination is due. Not just on your end but for us all.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

I didn't feel she was making her statement towards you at all. I totally agree with what she said.

You might want to take your own advice because Christ tells us that a soft answer turns away wrath and to give the other cheek if we've been slapped. Your answer was not soft and you forum slapped her and I called yourself putting her in her place. I didn't see where that was called for. Don't take it personal.

Many people are reading this thread and I know for a fact that they can identify with why MrsH and myself are saying.

Thank God that you haven't been abused spiritually.

Op I would tell you pay your bills, give what you can to your church, help those in need. Everyday you wake up, God has blessed you because he is faithful.

Yep. This. She totally insulted me personally though I was referring to general attitudes and misconceptions regarding the so called tithe. I wasn't personally referring to anyone in this thread but attitudes I have seen everywhere.

 

[Nice & Wavy]

I've been kind of confused about this. I get paid every 2 weeks and I need to know should I be tithing 10% of each pay check or 5% every 2 weeks which equals 10% for the month. I admit I don't tithe 10% but I'd like to. I just want to budget properly for it. Not that I'd have an issue tithing 20% a month but if its really suppose to be 10% I'd like to know.

Kinkyhairlady,

Thank you for starting this thread and acknowledging that you were kind of confused about tithing and the amount to give. I do hope that you have been given a peace in your heart from the Holy Spirit on what to do and how to do it. The one thing I know about the Holy Spirit, He always gives us Peace concerning a matter!

I want to apologize to you for my part in taking your thread off course and ask that you forgive me for it. I believe that you received the answer you were seeking in which you said that you will be tithing from now on. The thread should have stopped at that point but it did not, this is why I am asking that you forgive me for my part in it.

May the Lord continue to bless you because you desire to be what He wants you to be in every aspect of your walk as a Christ Follower. I pray that as you sow your tithe to further the Kingdom of God, you will reap abundantly because of it and that the Lord will meet your need.

God bless you!

N&W

 

[blazingthru]

Yes, exactly Mrs H. and to add blazingthru, you said

Has anyone ever said not to support your church financially? It would be a short lived organization who didn't have financial support from their supportors. What we are talking about is a mandate pressed upon people in the form of "God will bless you if you give 10% or God will curse you if you don't give 10%". Or what about telling people that if they want to participate in any area within the church "choir, praise team, usher" you MUST be a faithful tither. It's mandates such as these that put people in bondage.



Ok, yes, let's take a look at when Abram gave Melchizedek a tenth/ tithe of the SPOILS OF WAR.

Genesis 14: 16 says "Abram recovered all the goods that had been taken, and he brought back his nephew Lot with his possessions and all the women and other captives.

Genesis 14: 19 says "Melchizedek blessed Abram with this blessing: "Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth."

v.20 .....And blessed be God Most High, who has defeated your enemies for you." Then Abram gave Melchizedek a tenth of all the goods he had recovered.

So it was after Melchizedek blessed Abram, not Abram give the tithe first in order to recieve a blessing.

So Abram, went to war to capture back his nephew Lot who had been taken hostage. In addition to getting Lot, Abram took all of the goods/possessions of the tribe Kedorlaomer. He then met up with the King of Salem who was Melchizekek and the King of Sodom who was Bera.

It was ONLY after Melchizedek gave a blessing to Abram did he give a tenth of the spoils of war, the possessions of the people of Kedorlaomer, over to him, but wait Abram didn't stop there.........he didn't want to keep any of the possessions for himself, in fact he insisted that the rest of the goods be shared with his alies equally.

Look at v. 21 The king of Sodom said to Abram, "Give back my people who were captured. But you may keep for yourself all the goods you have recovered."

v.22 Abram replied to the king of Sodom, "I solemnly swear to the LORD, God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth,

v.23 that I will not take so much as a single thread or sandal thong from what belongs to you. Otherwise you might say, 'I am the one who made Abram rich.'

v.24 I will accept only what my young warriors have already eaten, and I request that you give a fair share of the goods to my allies—Aner, Eshcol, and Mamre."

So, please tell me how this would equate to me giving 10% of cash money from my paycheck every week/ two weeks....how?

In fact it would look to me like anyone who is using this scripture to support New Covenant believers giving a tithe should keep reading and see that they should be giving all of their paycheck away, and not keep any of it!

When Christ spoke about the tithe, he was talking to the Pharasees, those who kept the law. Remember, they were not a good representation of how Christ said we should live, remember he called them "white washed tombs" clean looking on the outside and ugly and dirty on the inside. He never put a mandate on his disciples or any one to pay a tithe.

I suppose in your case the church sets the term of how or what you pay, in my case, I allocated on my tithe envelope what I am contributing too. I have never had an issue with Tithe because I am an observer, I liked when i visited one church and months later they sent me a receipt of the check I wrote them for my taxes, I knew then that they were holding themselves accountable. I serve in treasury so I can see what goes on behind the scenes. We do the same thing give out receipts in January to all the members including those who are not members for their taxes or records.

Both Abraham and Jacob, who lived long before Moses' day, tithed their income. We can therefore conclude that God's plan of tithing preceded Moses' law.

Also there is failure when you think that just because its not mentioned directly in the New Testament its not relevant. It was established there was no and is no need to continue repeating something that folks know that they are to do. However, Everything belongs to God. Everything 10% is pittance and all that God ask, it should be easy

Genesis 14:20 (KJV 1900)
20 And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all.

Genesis 28:22 (KJV 1900)
22 And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God’s house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee.

This is before the ceremonial Laws.

People who really love the Lord gave freely. now a days many folks live off of the 10% and tithe 80%. giving up money is hard to do it really is a sacrifice for so many people, but its a test for God that you trust him to provide for you.

It is not a question of not tithing if your committed to obeying God and you love God with all your heart you should have no issue with tithing at all. Its 10 percent. I tithe my taxes and when I receive money from other sources, I don't tithe everything, but that is my goal. I am learning to. Although I know folks that tithe every single drop or penny they get.

Tithing is a question of obedience, sacrifice and trust.

As for the Pharisees
Jesus endorsed they pay tithes. Jesus was rebuking the Jews for omitting the more important matters of the law--"judgment, mercy, and faith"--even though they were meticulous tithers. He then plainly told them they should continue tithing, but should also be just and merciful and faithful. This doesn't mean that they were the only one tithing it means that this is their only concern and nothing else.

Besides Jesus is the one who receives the money. We return tithe to God, to whom it already belongs.

Hebrews 7:8. And here men that die receive tithes; but there he [Jesus] receives them. Jesus, our heavenly High Priest, receives our tithes.

As for the offering there is no set amount, Offerings are voluntary and should be given joyously.2 Corinthians 9:7.
Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver."

2 Corinthians 8:5
5 And this they did, not as we hoped, but first gave their own selves to the Lord, and unto us by the will of God.

Proverbs 3:9
9 Honour the Lord with thy substance, And with the firstfruits of all thine increase:

Proverbs 11:24
24 There is that scattereth, and yet increaseth; And there is that withholdeth more than is meet, but it tendeth to poverty

Acts 20:35
35 I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.

The size of your gift is not important if you are doing the best you can. Jesus said that the poor widow of Mark 12:41-44, who gave only a pittance (two mites), gave more "than all they which have cast into the treasury" because the others gave "of their abundance; but she ... did cast in all that she had." The Lord measures our gifts by the amount of sacrifice we make and by the attitude or spirit with which we give.


The word Tithe means Tenth

Trust in the LORD, and do good; … Delight thyself also in
the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires
of thine heart” (Psalm 37:3, 4

 

[blazingthru]

"Keeping the law" can make a person feel like they are following God as well when they are separated from Him and following their own righteousness. You are still under the old covenant. There is no new covenant command to tithe. The tithe was for the Levitical priesthood because they could not work and had no inheritance among the people of Israel. The tithe was abolished when Christ gave up the ghost and the veil of the temple was split. The Levitical Priesthood was done away with and Christ is our High Priest. Upon careful examination of the Scripture you will find nothing that even resembles the tithe doctrine today because its man made. You will also find nothing that says only the ceremonial laws were done away with. This too is man made for people who want to follow law because they have not accepted the righteousness of Jesus Christ.

Well actually we have evangelist and others that go out and serve as well as our own community church that we are to support. So we continue paying the tithes, it didn't end with the Cross we no longer need priest since we are all priest but we are to support those that go out and spread the gospel. We still need to be wiling to give back of what we are given, Me personally, I would not belong to a church where money was always an issue, I never liked that. Money is spoken about during time for tithing and that is it. But I did go to services where the Pastor kept putting the plate out please I ignored it, but if they did it in my service I would contribute to whatever need we have because its extremely rare that it happens. But as for the Law which you continue to speak about, I am going to need you to be clear on what Law you are referring to, because I don't get it at all, no offense to you, I really want to know what Law we are not under anymore. Lying? cheating, stealing? Calling God out of his name? what Law do we not follow anymore.

Before the Ten Commandments were written down in stone, the Bible tells us that the law was written in the hearts of the people. In addition, it was transmitted orally from father to son. However, by the time of Moses, after the people had been in slavery under Egypt, and thereby under the influence of the Egyptian pagan religion, their memory had been somewhat corrupted and diluted.
That’s why Moses wrote the first five books of the Bible, so his people would not be confused. Of course, God ultimately wrote the Ten Commandments so there would never have to be any guessing about what is right and wrong. To prove this point: Long before Moses wrote the Ten Commandments onto scrolls, God said to Cain;“If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin lies at the door (Genesis 4:7 NKJV). The Bible also records,“Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws”(Genesis 26:5).And not only did Abraham obey God’s law, statutes, and commandments, Joseph knew it was a sin to commit adultery with Potiphar’s wife. He said,“How then can I do this great wickedness, and sin against God?”(Genesis 39:9). He evidently knew adultery was a sin long before the Ten Commandments were written. It had been passed on, so he knew God’s law. Originally, God’s law went from Adam orally, straight out of the
garden of Eden, to become part of the oral tradition Adam and Eve were created in the image of God, so they knew their Father’s character,which is revealed in the Ten Commandments. They passed this knowledge to their offspring, but because of man’s failing memory, they eventually had to write it down.

 

[dicapr]

I'm sorry you feel thay way.. How many times have I said I am not against giving to the local church? I'm really not.... I don't see how you got all of that out of what I said.

It's not what you said but how you said it that was offensive. I bolded the part in which you basically said that those who tithe are trying to buy God's blessings, be under the law, and have less of an understanding of the bible than you do. Those are all inflammatory words in the Christian culture and you know that. Instead of sticking with the topic you chose to attack poster's relationship with God. Anytime you come into a religious conversation and basically say that those of you who don't agree with you are somehow have less understanding and an improper understanding of God's love makes whatever message you are trying to convey moot. We all are God's children and we all have our own personal relationship with God. God requires different things from each and everyone of us.

 

[pet]

Malachi 3:8-18 King James Version (KJV) 8 Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. 9 Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. 10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

@blazingblue, I agree with everything that you've said. I pay me tithe consistently, and it's to show God that I have faith in him. In my church, I get a statement every January of how much I have paid for the previous year, and I can claim it on my taxes. My church also explains explicitly where the money goes and how it is used....the tithe goes to the conference office (which is used for the salaries of the workers) and the offering goes to the local church expenses. I believe that I have been blessed because I return my tithe. On the tithing envelope, there are other things that I can contribute to like missionary work, religious schooling, etc.

Yes, tithing is hard. I find that when members find that something is hard to do, they try to get around it. You give on faith, and trust in God that he will see you through. I'm sorry for some of you that have experienced money being misused in your churches, or the way that tithing was presented to you lacked clarity. In my case, it was explained very clearly, and I have seen no shadiness occurring when it comes to tithing. @blazingblue provided all of the scriptures and explanations, so I will not rewrite them here.

All of my expenses are based on 90% of my income. I take out my tithe first, and I do what I have to do with the rest.

I pray that we all ask the Holy Spirit to give us understanding when reading the bible. I find that there are many misconceptions (sabbath day, working on the sabbath, not under law but grace, marriages/divorce, etc. ) because
we try to understanding things by our own strength.

God Bless,

Pet

 

[pet]

blazingthru


Sorry, I didn't realize I typed your name wrong...lol.

 

[Iwanthealthyhair67]

This thread has my head reeling.


I don't think that anyone here believes that paying tithes mean that we will not go through this walk unsaved, tithing does not secure us from going through hardships, pain or loss. Just look at Job, he did everything right and yet he still lost everything.

I wonder sometimes why tithing is debated and researched so thoroughly. amongst Christians , some of us have a real problem with God and what we perceive to be OUR money, yes he is God and doesn't need it, but he doesnt send buckets of money down from heaven either he uses people for the needs of the church both the building and the people.

I thank God that many of your eyes have been open up to pastors that have lied to you and misused God's money, woe unto those pastors, I choose to give a 10th and sometimes more and shouldn't be made to feel foolish for doing so.

 

[beverly]

Hi Everyone,

I come to you all in love Interpretations about Christianity and politics can bring out some very strong feelings in all of us including me. I encourage everyone to seek God and under his word for yourself, he left it for all of us to understand it.

I believe no one can get into the kingdom by any works. Yes I do believe in supporting the church financially, and also helping those in need. I also know from my understanding of the word that it will rain on the just as it does the unjust. It is apart of this life and being a human being. Jesus had to suffer because he came in the form of a man, however he was the only man that lived on earth without sin. The one thing that I pretty comfortable in knowing to understand for sure that the commandments that God set out in my life are to love him and have no other Gods and to love my fellow man. I believe if you follow those commandments that God set out in the New Testament with a pure heart and to the best of your ability , then how you give will ultimately be reflected in a way that is pleasing to God.

Just by being a human being your life won't simply just be better because you tithe and that will not get you to heaven. Being heaven bound is the thing we should care about most. I encourage everyone to seek the Lord on your own, by prayer AND STUDY, not by what any person tells you.

The church and spiritual leaders are very valuable for inspiration and deeper understanding and if you find the right church home it should draw you closer in your walk.

God speaks several times throughout the bible about seeking wisdom. So I encourage everyone to seek Gods instruction for our lives daily by reading and studying his word.


Personally I found it hard to read a regular bible straight through, I found The One Year Bible a helpful starting point - http://www.amazon.com/The-One-Year-...F8&qid=1377439281&sr=8-2&keywords=daily+bible


I am a witness to say if you seek you will find. Hopefully we can all encourage one other in the lord. We all have enough struggles dealing with non believers so we should strive not need to be divisive among ourselves.

I hope those who were offended could apologize to each other and love each other as Christ calls us to do. If we don't do so we will be guaranteed not to get into heaven, this is the only thing I can be sure of as this is his commandment which is to love God and have no Gods before him and Love one another. If we do these things, all should fall into place.