guess this hair type.....BEWARE, serious slobbing may occur

[Cherokee-n-Black]

Some type 3's can get afros. I don't think microphone afros are a characteristic that should decide if you are a 3 or 4. It is curl size or how loose the texture is.

Yeah, in my opinion a fro is all about frizz factor, and that really can vary.

 

[Embyra]

EllePixie you have officially been kicked out of the 4 group, please do not return. The receptionist will give your belongings on the way out.

HILARIOUS!! im at work reading this laughing all loud

 

[Cherokee-n-Black]

@serendipity OK, as I said before, that chart is the craziest thing I ever saw. 4C aka CNapp is usually the nickname given to manipulated 4B hair. And anyone who claims to have 4C hair does not post pics of coils. Instead, they post pics like this:

Or like this:

And contrary to what you've heard, 4B hair is not as uncommon as you think. I think there are more people in Africa with 4B hair than any other. And it's the same thing as 4C/CNapp...just that one is the true type and the other is a nickname for its manipulated form. 4C/CNapp is manipulated 4B hair.

@serendipity For comparison, the hair on the left below is 4A and the one to the right 4B:

Notice how small the 4B coils are and it isn't easy to see the coils yet the heads are about the same size.

And if you comb it out, the pics below show the comparisons again. Seen from about the same distance, a combed out afro puff on 4A hair can still show that the hair is made of circular shapes because the coils are big enough for their individual shapes to be seen. 4B on the other hand just looks like a cloud with no distinct shape in the strands when viewed from the same distance:

@Embyra Don't start giving me the giggles all over again.



I totally agree. I'd love to see the examples that go with that.



@ms-gg Yep...and IIRC, we did find images of NappyMe's hair clearly showing coils. I keep telling anyone who claims to have undamaged 4B hair w/o definition to let me have access to their hair for a week. I'll prove it has curls w/o any product. There are already threads where people DC'd their hair and saw coils they never knew they had. No one's hair grows out of their head with sharp corners. If it isn't straight or wavy, it's curly. The end. Show me a 4B head that is growing from bald and I'll show you cute little circles sprouting out from the scalp. It's manipulation to avoid tangling that gives that "no pattern" illusion.



LOL length doesn't change my hair pattern. My hair looks exactly the same as it did when it was short. Here it is about 3 inches long (S Curl applied then combed):

Here it is about full SL (S Curl applied then combed out):

Here it is about 4-5 inches long:

Here it is about Full SL long:

These pics from 2008 finger-combed (no product):

These from 2009 finger-combed base of hair but working toward tips/ends (no product):

These from 2010 not as fully finger-combed as the above pics hence the slight clumping:

Exactly. The true size of the coils is shown in this image below (If you take a ruler and look at the inch side of it and then look at the space of 1/8 inch (the 8 partitions that divide the inch into equal parts), my coils are about size of the distance between those partitions.

@Embyra, you're killing me reminding me of that discussion. My juice went up my nose.





^^ @EllePixie @Embyra is right.



True @Cherokee-n-Black. I have even said I'd like Andre to show me the human who isn't undergoing some weird mutation who has hair growing out of his/her head with sharp corners that would be described as zigzag. 4B hair can look zigzag but that's from manipulation. I even have a photo showing my hair all zigzaggy:

But that was because it had been braided. I guarantee that if you took several pen springs and braided them together, you'd get some irregular pattern resulting from that. Hair is no different. But when washed and if well moisturized on the inside and left to its own devices, it'll curl shrink back into the shape of a compressed spring. That's how 4B is anyway. But because of its small kinks, it tangles easily and so no 4B-er trying to see long hair will keep letting it shrink up to show curls--unless detangling is a hobby they enjoy. Most keep the hair stretched so it's always in its manipulated state. The images of CNapp/4C I posted above are the way you're likely to see most 4B hair unless it's short.

This is 4B hair that is dry as it has been "moisturized" with grease:

This is the same head of hair after DCing and moisturizing with an actual moisturizer not grease--it formed cute little coils not unlike the ones you saw in my hair:

ETA: @EllePixie, my camera does have a video feature but I'm ashamed to say that having never read the manual, I fail miserably at using it as best as it can be used. Not to mention that I'm not at all good at making vids. You've obviously seen my lousy demos in threads. I'd rest it on a bed and sit leaning over it so only my hair is in the frame. Clearly I am an embarrassment to the makers of the cam when it comes to video taping. But I will read the manual one day. Then y'all won't be able to tell me nuffin!

And after all that explanation...(which was informative, by the way), your hair is the bomb, girl! In all it's coily goodness

 

[Nonie]

maybe ur definition is too stringent. My hair is 4a and hangs down

@Kurlee Maybe I'm just uber familiar with fine hair than coarse...plus your hair is long. I also think if we let our hair drip dry, the weight of the water will make it hang and if it's coarse then it will even hang more. But towel drying and then leaving it to dry fully w/o touching it and then applying S Curl and combing out methinks would many any type 4 into a microphone afro. I bet my bottom dollar I could make your hair into an afro, a microphone afro at that.

ETA...now if your hair were much longer...butt and beyond, the microphone might look a bit drunk.

 

[EllePixie]

HILARIOUS!! im at work reading this laughing all loud

I am lol'ing too. That's why I don't get how hair typing threads get so heated? Your hair is your hair...no biggie. Kick me out, I'm still fly dangit!!!

 

[Cherokee-n-Black]

I am lol'ing too. That's why I don't get how hair typing threads get so heated? Your hair is your hair...no biggie. Kick me out, I'm still fly dangit!!!

Are we gonna have to call security?

 

[greenandchic]

You are such a butt. But I do agree with you - a lot of people think that type 3 hair has to be silky and fine, but my texture is clearly more spongy/coarse, which is why I find it so confusing!! I never wanted to put myself in type 3 because I didn't want the texture believers giving me a side eye (Like, "I know dang well she didn't call that kinky stuff type 3 hair..."), but it seems like I get type 4 side eyes too! I'm leaving!!!!

I got the side eye from all angles over calling myself a type 4. "Stop frontin', you know you got that good hur in there. You ain't got to lie to kick it!"erplexed

 

[ms-gg]

Stupid laptop double replied erplexed

*but in the interim goes to look for security to escort Elle off of the Type Fo Property*

 

[wavezncurlz]

type 3 folks wore afros all the time back in the day.

I'm the one with the big afro puff in the back. My texture is the same. Mom just didn't use products to define the puff. We picked those curls out back then.

My mom and me in the 70's. Mom has baby fine hair.

Mom now wears hair in buns and ponytails

 

[ms-gg]

@Kurlee Maybe I'm just uber familiar with fine hair than coarse...plus your hair is long. I also think if we let our hair drip dry, the weight of the water will make it hang and if it's coarse then it will even hang more. But towel drying and then leaving it to dry fully w/o touching it and then applying S Curl and combing out methinks would many any type 4 into a microphone afro. I bet my bottom dollar I could make your hair into an afro, a microphone afro at that.

No ma'am . This hair on my head ain't never hung in its unmanipulated state and my hair is coarse as heck. Maybe I'll have to re holler at you when and if I ever get to BSL or beyond but these coils and kinks of mine are reaching for Heaven only.


Mwedzi is someone else whose unmanipulated hair does not hang. I just think that those with really tight hair textures will always have hair that will reach for Heaven only.

 

[Embyra]

Are we gonna have to call security?

just i want to stay online and your making my manager side eye me

 

[EllePixie]

Forget about hair typing, look at all this gawjus hair!!!

 

[Embyra]

Some type 3's can get afros. I don't think microphone afros are a characteristic that should decide if you are a 3 or 4. It is curl size or how loose the texture is.

on the 3c/4a thread texture was always the underlying presence 3 is fine/silky cant do this and that rachel true was mentioned alot again silky and fine

where the coarse/highly textured girls at i have seen Joy Denalane with a microphone afro and she sure is no 4


ahh well i say we hash it out more so the pics keep flowing

 

[Nonie]

No ma'am . This hair on my head ain't never hung in its unmanipulated state and my hair is coarse as heck. Maybe I'll have to re holler at you when and if I ever get to BSL or beyond but these coils and kinks of mine are reaching for Heaven only.

ms-gg, mine doesn't hang either unless its in twists and left to drip dry. I was not stating that as a rule for all 4 types. I was stating it in response to the statement that one's hair hangs.

For those people whose hair is weighed down by water, if they let it drip dry, it will hang. If they towel-dry, it may not have as much hang. That's all I'm saying. I see that with my twists. If I let them drip dry, they will hang and even swing a bit once dry. If I towel dry, they strike a pose (usually an upright-ish one) and maintain it until I do something to manipulate them.

 

[ms-gg]

@ strike a pose. You funny.

 

[Embyra]

type 3 folks wore afros all the time back in the day.

I'm the one with the big afro puff in the back. My texture is the same. Mom just didn't use products to define the puff. We picked those curls out back then.

My mom and me in the 70's. Mom has baby fine hair.

Mom now wears hair in buns and ponytails

awwwww i love seeing lil girls dressed like this with the tights and cute dresses so freaking ADORABLE!

 

[Nonie]

So interesting how we could wear afros back in the day. ALL of us, it seems...and now some of us can't. Or is it because of global warming and the hole in the Ozone layer?

Or maybe we just put so much glop on our hair that it just gets dragged down and cannot stand up in its glory. I dunno, but @wavezncurlz, those pics have given me a whole new perspective! In my defense, I have never really been around type 3 hair--except that one time when I was trying to style my friend's hair as a kid and it was flopping all over the place not holding a style. She did have long fine hair though... So my theory on the hair is based from observation and claims of those with that type of hair. That it can make an afro makes me question those who say their hair can't make an afro. Now see, I'ma be giving folks the side eye.

Oh wait, maybe as we grow older, thinning makes it not have support so it flops. :scratchch (I'm trying to give folks the benefit of the doubt here). Nah, it has to be product and maybe thickness. @wavezncurlz, I'd like to know what your regimen was back then (Can you ask your mom?) Perhaps that's something that could be pinned up for those who cannot do afros to save their lives. oke:

 

[greenandchic]

I recently tried to do the fro and the crown of my hair sort of stood up and the rest flopped down - the sides and the back. All I had was a light leave-in. Too long?

 

[Nonie]

I recently tried to do the fro and the crown of my hair sort of stood up and the rest flopped down - the sides and the back. All I had was a light leave-in. Too long?

@greenandchic I dunno the answer to that. We'll have to wait till @wavezncurlz gives us the regimen that made her 3B/3C hair stand up in afro before we can begin to figure out what made your not stand up. I think her hair was pretty long in those images from back in the day...but it formed a perfect microphone afro/puff. Perhaps technique, product and tools play apart. So the jury is still out on why yours wouldn't stand up. Maybe it takes some skill. I mean everyone back in the day wore afros w/o issues...so we must missing something. And it's hard to say what exactly your issue was since I wasn't there. I've seen 4B folks struggle to create microphone afros and I have never understood why. I'd have to be there to see what the problem is.

 

[greenandchic]

Nonie I wonder if its the cut. My hair is longer in the back...

I guess we'll have to see. I'm not itching to try it again anytime soon though - my hair was pretty dry/crispy after that failed attempt.

 

[Embyra]

hhmmm today is wash day i want to attempt this my puffs as a child looked like wavesandcurls but thats because my hair was always brushed out with only old school grease used and a sulphate shampoo which increased the frizz/poof

 

[Nonie]

@Nonie I wonder if its the cut. My hair is longer in the back...

I guess we'll have to see. I'm not itching to try it again anytime soon though - my hair was pretty dry/crispy after that failed attempt.

@greenandchic, could be the cut. Also I recommend using S Curl the next time you try--unless we learn what the magic potion is from @wavezncurlz before then. S Curl will give you a puff/afro without making your hair dry/crisp. You would have to apply it to fully dried hair though. I'd say make sure it's fully detangled during the wash, and put it in braids and let it fully airdry in them so it remains detangled. Then undo a braid and apply S Curl to small sections to full coat and soften, and comb. You'll have a soft fluffy 'fro that won't get crisp all day. Best tool for this: a pick, preferably the one with the Power to the People fist handle:

OK, I kid about the sort of pick to use. But I and this thing have had the longest relationship I've ever had with anyone not a blood relative.

 

[greenandchic]

@greenandchic, could be the cut. Also I recommend using S Curl the next time you try--unless we learn what the magic potion is from @wavezncurlz before then. S Curl will give you a puff/afro without making your hair dry/crisp. You would have to apply it to fully dried hair though. I'd say make sure it's fully detangled during the wash, and put it in braids and let it fully airdry in them so it remains detangled. Then undo a braid and apply S Curl to small sections to full coat and soften, and comb. You'll have a soft fluffy 'fro that won't get crisp all day. Best tool for this: a pick, preferably the one with the Power to the People fist handle:

OK, I kid about the sort of pick to use. But I and this thing have had the longest relationship I've ever had with anyone not a blood relative.

Cool, thanks!!

 

[wavezncurlz]

So interesting how we could wear afros back in the day. ALL of us, it seems...and now some of us can't. Or is it because of global warming and the hole in the Ozone layer?

Or maybe we just put so much glop on our hair that it just gets dragged down and cannot stand up in its glory. I dunno, but @wavezncurlz, those pics have given me a whole new perspective! In my defense, I have never really been around type 3 hair--except that one time when I was trying to style my friend's hair as a kid and it was flopping all over the place not holding a style. She did have long fine hair though... So my theory on the hair is based from observation and claims of those with that type of hair. That it can make an afro makes me question those who say their hair can't make an afro. Now see, I'ma be giving folks the side eye.

Oh wait, maybe as we grow older, thinning makes it not have support so it flops. :scratchch (I'm trying to give folks the benefit of the doubt here). Nah, it has to be product and maybe thickness. @wavezncurlz, I'd like to know what your regimen was back then (Can you ask your mom?) Perhaps that's something that could be pinned up for those who cannot do afros to save their lives. oke:

Regimen!?!? What's that? Things were so simple back then. We didn't care about curls we wanted bush! Even the white folks - remember curly Barbara Streisand?
We didn't use no goop! My mom used this:

on my edges to smooth. It had a ton of lanolin but my hair was soft and dry. Then she picked out the curls with this:

My granny called it "training" the hair. I didn't wear braids or twists so my hair was constantly out and wild. She didn't detangle either. We just picked it out. That was the style.

Later when I was around 10, I got the puff cut and wore a short afro until around middle school when fro's were played out (and curls were in). I remember when I found curl activator and found curls.

 

[Poohbear]

Nonie - I'm really not being rude here, but you just showed pictures of your hair with type 4A. The picture in particular is the one where you have "Dry 4B hair" written in white letters on the picture. You definitely have a mixture. Isn't Type 4A hair tight little spring coils that clump together while Type 4B hair is tight little spring coils that are undefined and do not clump? I see both types in your hair.

I also cannot get a perfect wash n go either because of my Type 4B strands which are undefined and do not clump. I also have some parts that shrink more than others.

As far as the zigzag for Type 4B in that picture posted by serendipity, I believe it is indicating hair that grows out of the scalp with bends and undefined coils... not necessarily a perfect zigzag pattern. Hope that makes sense.

And about HairCrush - are you saying she has 3C/4A strands that do not shrink and coil up? How can you tell her hair strands are tighter than what it appears? I just don't see any springs or coils or curls in her hair. And her hair was not previously stretched out nor blowdried. Or is there something you all have seen with her hair that I have not seen? I've looked through her album and videos. Can you show me a picture of her unmanipulated hair being Type 3C/4A???

@Poohbear My hair is NOT 4A/B. My hair is 100% 4B just like @Foxglove's hair. I don't have any A in it. I just have a good camera that takes great closeups otherwise my curls are too tiny to be 4A anything. Also I can't get a WNG at all the way 4A's and maybe 4A/B's can. (I've always said I don't know what 4A/B is but I do know my hair is 4B. I've no doubt about that.)

I explained how I came to the conclusion that HairCrush's hair is 3C/4A. Her hair behaves the way I see 3C/4A hair behave. I don't know how to else to explain this except exactly as I did in the post I stated this. And if you look at the characteristics of other 3C/4A-ers (not the ones jumping on the new fashion trend but the ones who are without a doubt 3C/4A--also mentioned in my post), you will see how similar their hair is. The one difference you may notice is HairCrush's hair hangs more, and I also explained why I believe that is.

My post about my hair that you quoted when you asked the above question had nothing to do with HairCrush's hair or my coming to the conclusion she's 3C/4A. LOL That post you quoted was responding to the statement that 4B hair is zigzag and that 4C is made of tiny coils. I disagreed and was using my images to show what I mean.

 

[WantNatural]

WantNatural, your hair in your siggy looks the way her hair did in some pics someone posted.

LOL! My hair looks NOTHING like hers! Haha! I have a very tight 4a curl pattern that you can't miss! My hair would never dry like hers unmanipulated. She does have lovely hair though!

 

[Nonie]

@Nonie - I'm really not being rude here, but you just showed pictures of your hair with type 4A. The picture in particular is the one where you have "Dry 4B hair" written in white letters on the picture. You definitely have a mixture. Isn't Type 4A hair tight little spring coils that clump together while Type 4B hair is tight little spring coils that are undefined and do not clump? I see both types in your hair.

@Poohbear I don't think you're being rude at all. my hair doesn't clump the way 4B hair does. I do not get tubes of hair that stands out defined. What you're looking at is a few strands taken by themselves and it isn't out of the ordinary for things that have the same pattern to fall into each other, so even my small coils will clump but not to the extend of 4A hair because they are too small to cup each other easily. You would have to have about 20 strands all lined up perfectly then stretched out and then pressed together for them to cup each other uniformly the way 4A and 3's hair clumps.

The same few strands you saw look like this en masse:

You only see that "clumping" when you look at a few strands and if I don't finger comb them.

I also cannot get a perfect wash n go either because of my Type 4B strands which are undefined and do not clump. I also have some parts that shrink more than others.

You see, you do understand that 4B doesn't WNG, but it isn't because they are undefined, it's because the coils are so small they cannot cup each other (or spoon each other) as easily as wider coils. You can try this with coils and springs, you'll find that if you put large springs/coils beside eacher other, they'll interlock and "clump". Try doing the same with pen springs, even stretch them out, you'll find it doesn't happen automatically but you actually have to put some effort to make it happen.

This is what my WNG looks like:

This what a 4A WNG looks like:

Notice how clearly the coils in 4A stand out...while mine don't. @AfroKink once posted a close-up of her 4B hair unmanipulated...a WNG IIRC (Found it) and you can see a close up of what that photo of my hair looks like. From where I stand it looks like a H.A.M.--as if I don't own a comb. I did not care for that style at all...but I did it because a friend with 4A hair was trying to help me learn different ways to wear my now "long" hair. I'd been in braids by the time it got to that length and was now learning ways to wear it out and also what products work--since I had used nothing on my hair for two years.

As far as the zigzag for Type 4B in that picture posted by serendipity, I believe it is indicating hair that grows out of the scalp with bends and undefined coils... not necessarily a perfect zigzag pattern. Hope that makes sense.

But that's also inaccurate, Poohbear. No one's hair grows out of their head like that. Even the people with different hair patterns on their heads have strands that have the same pattern from base to tips. They may have different follicles which are responsible for the different patterns, but every follicles has a specific design and it spits out a defined pattern. No randomness. I will believe this randomness y'all talk about, the day someone shows it to me growing out of someone's head...particularly someone who might not have had any chemical processing in years. (I add that point because, while I don't really know if it's true, there's been the hypothesis that the reason people have scab hair is because the chemicals had some weird effect on their scalp or sth. It seems hair does finally become "normal" so, yes, I'd like to see "normal" hair growing all randomly. Until I do, I will continue to say no one's hair is naturally made of tiny zigzags or worse, random patterns. So far, what I've seen is people who said their hair had no pattern either come to admit they do have a pattern or a photo shows up that clearly shows defined patterns that they didn't have a hand in perfecting...coz that had all been done my the Master Maker.

And about HairCrush - are you saying she has 3C/4A strands that do not shrink and coil up? How can you tell her hair strands are tighter than what it appears? I just don't see any springs or coils or curls in her hair. And her hair was not previously stretched out nor blowdried. Or is there something you all have seen with her hair that I have not seen? I've looked through her album and videos. Can you show me a picture of her unmanipulated hair being Type 3C/4A???

There were photos of hers posted from when her hair was shorter. Those and the other images all led me to the conclusion that FlowerHair and a few others came to: that she's 3C/4A.

 

[Nonie]

LOL! My hair looks NOTHING like hers! Haha! I have a very tight 4a curl pattern that you can't miss! My hair would never dry like hers unmanipulated. She does have lovely hair though!

WantNatural I was saying that the way your hair looks in your siggy is the way her hair looked in the photos posted of when it was shorter worn in a similar do. I didn't say your hair behaves like hers in every way. And if you're 4A, then there's a characteristic you share. Your buns look similar. Also I did state in another post that texture makes a difference. Coarse hair will have more hang the longer it grows and if it absorbs water and is weighed down by it, then it'll airdry in a stretched state.

 

[Nonie]

Regimen!?!? What's that? Things were so simple back then. We didn't care about curls we wanted bush! Even the white folks - remember curly Barbara Streisand?
We didn't use no goop! My mom used this:

on my edges to smooth. It had a ton of lanolin but my hair was soft and dry. Then she picked out the curls with this:

My granny called it "training" the hair. I didn't wear braids or twists so my hair was constantly out and wild. She didn't detangle either. We just picked it out. That was the style.

Later when I was around 10, I got the puff cut and wore a short afro until around middle school when fro's were played out (and curls were in). I remember when I found curl activator and found curls.

Aha! So there y'all have it those of you whose hair was incapable of creating a puff. Leave out the glop and keep things simple.

BTW wavezncurlz, there was a time folks were expressing frustration at not being able to create a perfect afro. IIRC, they were mostly type 4 folks, and I remember someone getting a bit bugged and asking what was so hard about it. I tried to suggest a change in the comb being used...and even I was at a loss on why they were having such difficulty. I remember being asked how my mom could get her afro so round. All she did was comb it and the strands just curled back into themselves and a microphone afro resulted. It's so straightforward to me in my head when it comes to 4B hair, that I honestly wished I could have a go at their heads.

Anyway, I think you nail it when you say "things were simple" when afros were the norm. We fail when we try to complicate matters--and that seems to apply to a lot of things in life, actually.

 

[candycotton]

It may be possible that since she was a long term transitioner, she was able to always keep her hair in a stretched state..I'm a long term transitioner also so I wear my hair stretched 100% of the time, in buns or braids (sew ins) so although I think most of my hair is 4a, the front of my hair looks similar to hers, no defined curled, just a kinky wave that doesn't lie flat to my head and it may be because I never let it hang freely like someone who did a BC could wear wngs or twas..this may be the case with her too..