4th date = coloring???

[JayAnn0513]

That was not true when I was dating my hubby. I think we waited several months after we were exclusive.

 

[Glib Gurl]

Coloring happens when you as the grown woman feels that the time to get some crayon is appropriate for you. Period. If it's the first, fourth or four hundredth date. Now men are well within their rights to decide they don't want to wait and bounce, but the womans decision shouldn't be affected by the fear that he may leave.

I am a fan of whatever a woman wants to do with her body and she should proceed how she sees fit, but I do think that if you are trying to be in a nonsexual relationship til marriage you are going to seriously have to tap into some other uber feminine skills to keep that relationship from fizzling out. I'm not talking about cooking and cleaning neither.
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I think that sex is a commodity. If it wasn't, there wouldn't be so much debate/speculation over why it's right or wrong to do it at whatever time from both the male and female perspectives.

People look at sex as a commodity as a negative, but the truth of the matter is that most of us women just aren't trying to let any and everybody run through us. I'd like to think that there is still a majority who is picky when it comes to who is fathering their children. We hold out for the man we want as opposed to just any dude who offers. So there is an intrinsic value of sex for most of us. On the other side of the fence, you'd be hard pressed to find a healthy virile man who'd say that sex adds no value to his life and that he wouldn't make adjustments in his life to get access to sex.
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Tonight is Shabbat so if anybody has questions I probably won't be able to answer until tomorrow night.

THIS is why I love you, JCoily (or Crackers Phinn ) - you always bring the realness!

 

[Carrie A]

I was abruptly dropped after the fourth date after no whoopie, and I wasn't the ice queen either. It kind of caught me off guard. I didn't hunt the guy down but on reviewing previous conversations it was clear as day. I was a victim of the fourth date dump. He was on his best behavior initially but couldn't keep up the facade. Is this guy in DMV? I wonder if it was the same dude.

 

[Glib Gurl]

I was abruptly dropped after the fourth date after no whoopie, and I wasn't the ice queen either. It kind of caught me off guard. I didn't hunt the guy down but on reviewing previous conversations it was clear as day. I was a victim of the forth date dump. He was on his best behavior initially but couldn't keep up the facade. Is this guy in DMV? I wonder if it was the same dude.

Actually YES He was clear, though . . . .

 

[Ashleescheveux]

Oh hale naw! Not around here, never!

 

[kismettt]

i honestly do not know anyone who follows this rule. there is not a magical formula or a magical wait time.

 

[Nina_deF]

You know, Nina_Def... things are a bit different here in the US. Culturally, we have a different view of casual sex than I have read that Swedes do, generally.

BUT. The bolded has been my experience 1,000%! When I don't even think too deeply about the relationship, when I'm not stressed over how much he likes me etc and I just decide that I want some pleasure and by god, he's gonna give it to me... those men just HAD to have me. I would try to shake them loose but they would be like gnats buzzing around me for ages after I was done with them!

I wonder why that is? I guess maybe it does play into that "chase" theory, because the man knows he has lain with you physically but he still has not captured your heart, so now he keeps trying for that? Or it could be that the sex ends up being hotter when the woman can totally relax? I don't really know how or why... but I have definitely had that experience with men.

Yes, I realize that.
I didn't date much in the US because it just seemed like it was hard work.
I understood even before I got that far, that causal sex was almost extinct.

There were rules I was unfamiliar and uncomfortable with, my girl friends tried to coach me and there were just too many games being played.

It seemed like the men I met were all trying to give me the impression that they wanted to be serious, which for me was a total turn off, but I assumed that was the game they payed with the American women.

The one time I did have what I thought was casual sex the aftermath was not worth it.

It was in L.A (which is an extreme city in itself) and I slept with a guy I had been hanging out with for a while. Not dating, mind you, because we were a gang of maybe 6 people who went out, partied, ate, etc.
One night I drank too much and he ended up in my bed.

The next night he's ringing my door.
I asked how he got in and he said that he told the security guard that he was my boyfriend so he could park in my spot.
We hadn't made any plans but he wanted to take me to this great restaurant, I love food so I'm like sure.
The next thing I know, I'm standing in his house in OC, sahking hands with his mother. Now they were Armenian and she was NOT overly happy to see me, that's a fact. It was a horrible evening, his father and brothers were fine but his mother and sisters decided not to speak english the whole evening. But I'm stuck in OC so I'm being extremely nice.

Lesson learned.

It was so much easier to date in NYC, even if I didn't get any sex, I found a British dude for that.

In Sweden we marry later and have children later.
There are a large amount of women my age (40+) who are single and childless but that's not because of sex, it's more because of standards and expectations, I think.

 

[CurlyMoo]

I was just talking to a friend and she was saying that guys have told her that if you don't color with them on the fourth date then they won't date you any further.

Generally true in your experience?

Bye, Bye. See ya. Pull the door shut on the way out!

If the guy dumps you after the the fourth date because he hasn't colored with you, then he wasn't going to stay even if you painted a mural together.

 

[CurlyMoo]

I'm not coloring by date number 4. If he wants to walk....see ya!

This is kind OT:
I heard on the radio this morning where this guy and girl who were daating called in to get the deejays advice. They'd been seeing each other since September, spent the holidays together but the guy refused to be exclusive....why....the girl is a virgin and wanted to wait until she got married. The giy said that was cool but he didn't want to date exclusively because he wanted to have sex before marriage. Girl wanted to know who was wrong. People were calling in dogging the guy but he put it out there from day one what he wanted...
Girl kept trying to "make him hers." I got the feeling that she is goign to end up coloring with him prior to any marriage just to get him to "commit' to an exclusive relationship...

Crazy...

This girl is about to be another heart broken deflowered virgin. If he truely cared for her he would let her go find a good man who is also a virgin or willing to remain celibate.

 

[tiara76]

This girl is about to be another heart broken deflowered virgin. If he truely cared for her he would let her go find a good man who is also a virgin or willing to remain celibate.

and add to that if she truly cared about herself and this was really that important to her she would just leave him/let him go vs try to make him be with her when its clear thats not what he wants....if she ends up "heartbroken" by giving in to "get him" he wouldn't of caused this situation by himself

 

[CurlyMoo]

You color when you want to, whether it's the 4th date or the 40th. I don't see a rule saying you have to give a man your body by a certain time.

I think it depends. There have been times I wanted to color on the 4th date. But I knew it would only get me a first date and not us actually getting to know each other. When a woman holds out and the guy knows she wants him he sees her hesitency as game playing. Even when you straight out tell them that you want to get to know them first. Holding out could also be a tool for extracting weeds.

I'm the type of person that if I color too soon in the relationship I lose interest. I actually treat them very badly after because they were too easy to get in bed without trying to get to know me first. I want a man who is just as cautious as I am, and wants to actually get to know me. I also need the challange of the chase and anticipation of the romance and adventure that builds up to a climax, which would be vigurous coloring and building a life together.

 

[CurlyMoo]

and add to that if she truly cared about herself and this was really that important to her she would just leave him/let him go vs try to make him be with her when its clear thats not what he wants....if she ends up "heartbroken" by giving in to "get him" he wouldn't of caused this situation by himself

I agree but she's clearly naive and not worldly enough to be the stronger partner. Not to say that there are no worldly virgins out there. Good luck to her though.

 

[tiara76]

I agree but she's clearly naive and not worldly enough to be the stronger partner. Not to say that there are no worldly virgins out there. Good luck to her though.

and he is the "stronger" partner...very good chance hes not emotionally or mentally mature enough to handle his own emotional well being much less hers....accountability at some point will have to come into play on her end as well

again...it won't be all him if ends badly no matter how naive she is

you either get over naivety by "knowing" something or by "experiencing" something

and in this case if it happens thru experience she probably wont like the experience

 

[princessnad]

Yes, I realize that.
I didn't date much in the US because it just seemed like it was hard work.
I understood even before I got that far, that causal sex was almost extinct.

There were rules I was unfamiliar and uncomfortable with, my girl friends tried to coach me and there were just too many games being played.

It seemed like the men I met were all trying to give me the impression that they wanted to be serious, which for me was a total turn off, but I assumed that was the game they payed with the American women.

The one time I did have what I thought was casual sex the aftermath was not worth it.

It was in L.A (which is an extreme city in itself) and I slept with a guy I had been hanging out with for a while. Not dating, mind you, because we were a gang of maybe 6 people who went out, partied, ate, etc.
One night I drank too much and he ended up in my bed.

The next night he's ringing my door.
I asked how he got in and he said that he told the security guard that he was my boyfriend so he could park in my spot.
We hadn't made any plans but he wanted to take me to this great restaurant, I love food so I'm like sure.
The next thing I know, I'm standing in his house in OC, sahking hands with his mother. Now they were Armenian and she was NOT overly happy to see me, that's a fact. It was a horrible evening, his father and brothers were fine but his mother and sisters decided not to speak english the whole evening. But I'm stuck in OC so I'm being extremely nice.

Lesson learned.

It was so much easier to date in NYC, even if I didn't get any sex, I found a British dude for that.

In Sweden we marry later and have children later.
There are a large amount of women my age (40+) who are single and childless but that's not because of sex, it's more because of standards and expectations, I think.

What are the different expectations in Sweden?

 

[Nina_deF]

What are the different expectations in Sweden?

I don't really think that the expectations are that different from the States. And like in the States there's a backlash since woman now are strong, independant, ambitious.....
It doesn't seem like a lot of men have caught up.

IMO we want a man with a (good) job, ambition, a life.
(This might differ-) Someone who will share in household duties and the raising of children 50-50, someone that's our equal, yet strong.

I don't wanna talk smack but Swedish men are kinda weak, colorless (no matter if he's black, Asian, white), boring, stagnent, dependent... oh, I could go on. But this might be my own observation....

When I think of the men my age I know who are single and childless I kinda understand. They look good, most have good jobs but

.
Definately more coloring material than relationship...

 

[Bunny77]

I'm not coloring by date number 4. If he wants to walk....see ya!

This is kind OT:
I heard on the radio this morning where this guy and girl who were daating called in to get the deejays advice. They'd been seeing each other since September, spent the holidays together but the guy refused to be exclusive....why....the girl is a virgin and wanted to wait until she got married. The giy said that was cool but he didn't want to date exclusively because he wanted to have sex before marriage. Girl wanted to know who was wrong. People were calling in dogging the guy but he put it out there from day one what he wanted...
Girl kept trying to "make him hers." I got the feeling that she is goign to end up coloring with him prior to any marriage just to get him to "commit' to an exclusive relationship...

Crazy...

Everyone else already addressed this, but see, this is what happens when women aren't firm in their standards. No one is wrong here, but they are not fit for each other.

I wouldn't necessarily be dogging the guy... but I would be telling HER to move on because he does not want to be exclusive with a woman who wants to wait until marriage.

So while she's in this non-relationship relationship, she might end up having sex anyway to "keep him," he might move on anyway, she'll be upset because she compromised her morals, etc.... when she could have moved on immediately and RIGHT NOW have an actual boyfriend who will wait with her and be on the path to marriage.

This is how women end up wasting time and messing up... and then later, we'll want to talk about how men ain't ish... yeah, okay maybe, but we allow it too, so what does that make us?

 

[loolalooh]

Everyone else already addressed this, but see, this is what happens when women aren't firm in their standards. No one is wrong here, but they are not fit for each other.

I wouldn't necessarily be dogging the guy... but I would be telling HER to move on because he does not want to be exclusive with a woman who wants to wait until marriage.

So while she's in this non-relationship relationship, she might end up having sex anyway to "keep him," he might move on anyway, she'll be upset because she compromised her morals, etc.... when she could have moved on immediately and RIGHT NOW have an actual boyfriend who will wait with her and be on the path to marriage.

This is how women end up wasting time and messing up... and then later, we'll want to talk about how men ain't ish... yeah, okay maybe, but we allow it too, so what does that make us?

I have to applaud this right here ... especially the bolded. :notworthy I think this kind of education should be taught more in the home ... or in conjunction with the high school curriculum. Too many women are learning the hard way.

 

[MissMeWithThatIsh]

- I'm not going to bother with someone that pressures me for it. I'm very clear with guys that no matter how sexual I come across, it's not that dayumed easy. Openly sexual... and promiscuous aren't interchangeable .

- I agree that the emotional connection and soul ties cannot happen if someone isn't open to it. There are different levels and interpretations of sexuality... and no matter how good someone is, if I will NOT let my emotional or psychological barriers down, it's just NOT going to happen.

Likewise, if the sex is wack but I'm emotionally open, I can get even more attached. Does attachment happen randomly? Yes...

 

[longnstrong]

Men are crazy! They want you coloring by the 4th date, but so quick to call somebody a h*e!!!!