"Why Educated Black Men Won't Settle Down" (blog post)

[Glib Gurl]

I'm just the messenger What do y'all think? Seriously . . . I think we've mentioned virtually all of these reasons in one post or a zillion on this board. For your reading pleasure . . . .

http://theninjaparade.wordpress.com/2010/06/27/why-educated-black-men-wont-settle-down/

 

[Livingmylifetothefullest]

There's some truth to what she posted in her blog but at the end of the day, an educated black man is not required to settle down and if he does, he can choose whoever he wants.

 

[LivingDol1]

i think most of what is said in that article can be said for any single educated professional person of any race... why should someone settle down when they don't have to, don't want to, or are in some kind of demand?

it's interesting to read these articles and blogs from time to time.. but at the end of the day... who cares if educated black dudes don't want to settle down? they surely aren't sitting down at their computers and writing blogs about women. they're out and about enjoying themselves.

 

[YankeeCandle]

I know that I am not specifically the demographic of women all these blogs are talking about (I am from an immigrant background, and our women's concerns are more things like "arranged marriage or love-match?" "Too Westernized or not Westernized enough?" etc). So forgive me if I come off as seeming blase` about upwardly mobile Black American women's very real concerns about the men in their communities.

But...when I read this blogger's description of "the type" of man in high demand, my eyebrows inched further and further upwards towards my hairline. The men he described were about as far from attractive to me as possible.

For me, men who are sexual samplers of women "in every city;" who have an uber-lofty opinion of their own smarts and success; who can't resist inserting, "But I brought myself up from nothing!!!' at every juncture; and who generally view themselves as being in the position of the catered-to and served instead of the Servant....

These men make me turn on my heel and walk right in the other direction.

This cannot be the man so many women long for as husbands, can he? My Black American sisters deserve so much more than this.

 

[Glib Gurl]

who cares if educated black dudes don't want to settle down? they surely aren't sitting down at their computers and writing blogs about women. they're out and about enjoying themselves.

Now this is some truth

I know that I am not specifically the demographic of women all these blogs are talking about (I am from an immigrant background, and our women's concerns are more things like "arranged marriage or love-match?" "Too Westernized or not Westernized enough?" etc). So forgive me if I come off as seeming blase` about upwardly mobile Black American women's very real concerns about the men in their communities.

But...when I read this blogger's description of "the type" of man in high demand, my eyebrows inched further and further upwards towards my hairline. The men he described were about as far from attractive to me as possible.

For me, men who are sexual samplers of women "in every city;" who have an uber-lofty opinion of their own smarts and success; who can't resist inserting, "But I brought myself up from nothing!!!' at every juncture; and who generally view themselves as being in the position of the catered-to and served instead of the Servant....

These men make me turn on my heel and walk right in the other direction.

This cannot be the man so many women long for as husbands, can he? My Black American sisters deserve so much more than this.

You are absolutely right that we deserve more . . . but so often we don't know it or get so discouraged we take what we can get erplexed (See the other blog I just posted about in this forum about "ugly girl problems" . . . yes, that's what they called it )

 

[DrC]

This reminds me of the Story about how educated successful black women can't find a man. I'm just saying....Okay honestly IMO, I think the reason is because they set their standards at an unattainable position.

 

[Bunny77]

I know that I am not specifically the demographic of women all these blogs are talking about (I am from an immigrant background, and our women's concerns are more things like "arranged marriage or love-match?" "Too Westernized or not Westernized enough?" etc). So forgive me if I come off as seeming blase` about upwardly mobile Black American women's very real concerns about the men in their communities.

But...when I read this blogger's description of "the type" of man in high demand, my eyebrows inched further and further upwards towards my hairline. The men he described were about as far from attractive to me as possible.

For me, men who are sexual samplers of women "in every city;" who have an uber-lofty opinion of their own smarts and success; who can't resist inserting, "But I brought myself up from nothing!!!' at every juncture; and who generally view themselves as being in the position of the catered-to and served instead of the Servant....

These men make me turn on my heel and walk right in the other direction.

This cannot be the man so many women long for as husbands, can he? My Black American sisters deserve so much more than this.

So I AM of the demographic that he's talking about, being a multigenerational black American woman, but I continually remain confuzzled about how exactly things got to this point.

No. 1 -- A black man with a college degree is a wonderful thing, but it's not the eighth wonder of the world. Maybe because I grew up in a home with a dad who had a master's degree, my panties don't drop when I see a black man with a college degree. If my 66-year-old daddy can have a college degree, your a@@ doesn't impress me because you graduated from college in a non-Jim Crow, post affirmative action period.

No. 2 -- I saw black men in college all around me. I went to high school with smart black boys who became college educated black men. In the 1990s.

We are approaching a second (and sometimes third) generation of black American men getting college degrees, so I don't know why black folks are acting brand new about this and where this arrogance about having a college degree came from. As far as I'm concerned, black degreed men are a dime a dozen... and certainly nothing for me to be fighting over or sweating about.

 

[clevagirl73]

Ugh. erplexed

That entire blog rubbed me the wrong way because it is starting to sound like a broken record. Let me clarify, until I met my husband 5 years ago, I too lamented how hard it was for an educated Black woman to find a similarly educated Black man. However, I didn't sit idly by, twiddling my thumbs waiting for some Black knight to arrive. I dated men of different races and nationalities and by God's grace, I found a good Black man from England.

As we started dating, I noticed we surrounded ourselves with professional Black couples. Every single one of his educated Black male friends were married to educated Black women and a good majority of my female friends were married to educated Black men. And this was in Columbus, Ohio as late as 2005. My earlier complaint that I couldn't find a good educated Black man was turned on its head by the friends we hung with. It was then I came to realize that while yes, sistas are having a helluva time trying to find a good man, but maybe these blogs and CNN specials are actually creating this hysteria. I'm in interracial dating haven Los Angeles and my husband and I are friends with several Black couples; not to mention my relatives so how much of this is a real problem or media looking for a new story??


And, maybe, as Black women, we need to evaluate what type of energy we project when interacting with the opposite sex. I know there are some women with massive chips on their shoulders...who expect to be pampered and cared for without giving their men the same in return. Real talk...Men, esp. Black men, need to feel cared for, needed and appreciated just as much as we do. This doesn't mean settle for non-sense. Not.At.All. If a man treats you like an option rather than a priority....RUN! But if he helps you when you are sick, protects you from getting hurt, and doesn't take your kindness for granted, give that brotha a break if he can't afford to take you Paris, France but can afford a less expensive trip to Paris Hotel in Las Vegas. At least that man is thinking about you.

My paternal grandparents have been married for 67 years and my gram always said, "Your grandfather had 70% of what I wanted in a fantasy man. Thank God, I was smart enough to not toss him aside because of the other 30% because the 70% he did have was loyalty to me and his children, strong work ethic and honesty. No amount of money could have made up for character." I think one of the problems for our generation is we are trying to determine a person's worth by their bank accounts or list of degrees.

I mean, seriously, the blog author's list should have sent up a red flag immediately:

- at least a Bachelors degree
- gainfully employed
- above average earning [NOTE: not earning potential...but actually earning]
- under the age of 35
- heterosexual
- single (not “separated” or “we’re about to get a divorce” but for real single and not legally tied to any woman)

Not once does this person mention being honest, loyal, down-to-earth, funny, religious and/or spiritual. This list is just as shallow as a man demanding all the women he dates have a body like Buffy the Body (video vixen). And I'm perplexed as to exactly what "above average earnings" mean....You could work for Enterprise Rental Car (requires a BA degree) and still make less than $40K. So is this brotha out of contention?

Ugh.

 

[MD_Lady]

So I AM of the demographic that he's talking about, being a multigenerational black American woman, but I continually remain confuzzled about how exactly things got to this point.

No. 1 -- A black man with a college degree is a wonderful thing, but it's not the eighth wonder of the world. Maybe because I grew up in a home with a dad who had a master's degree, my panties don't drop when I see a black man with a college degree. If my 66-year-old daddy can have a college degree, your a@@ doesn't impress me because you graduated from college in a non-Jim Crow, post affirmative action period.

No. 2 -- I saw black men in college all around me. I went to high school with smart black boys who became college educated black men. In the 1990s...

Yes, yes YES!!!

 

[Xerxes]

So I AM of the demographic that he's talking about, being a multigenerational black American woman, but I continually remain confuzzled about how exactly things got to this point.

No. 1 -- A black man with a college degree is a wonderful thing, but it's not the eighth wonder of the world. Maybe because I grew up in a home with a dad who had a master's degree, my panties don't drop when I see a black man with a college degree. If my 66-year-old daddy can have a college degree, your a@@ doesn't impress me because you graduated from college in a non-Jim Crow, post affirmative action period.

No. 2 -- I saw black men in college all around me. I went to high school with smart black boys who became college educated black men. In the 1990s.

We are approaching a second (and sometimes third) generation of black American men getting college degrees, so I don't know why black folks are acting brand new about this and where this arrogance about having a college degree came from. As far as I'm concerned, black degreed men are a dime a dozen... and certainly nothing for me to be fighting over or sweating about.

Firstly, the author pointed out the minimum/baseline requirements for being deemed "educated" and he said having "at least a bachelor's degree" not just a college degree.

Secondly, a black man having a BS/BA is a freaking huge accomplishment when only 34% of blacks enrolled in colleges are black males. Black women outnumber black men 2 to 1 at school and this holds true from my experience.

To put this all in perspective, blacks as a whole lag in education and only 16% of black women and 14% of black men had a college degree. So we all f*ing suck when it comes to having at least a BS/BA. So if you have a degree and you're black, you should feel a little bit special!

And whites are only doing marginally better with just 25% of their males and 24% of their females having college degrees.

Our whole nation needs improvement, so I understand why an educated black man would act a little stank because he's avoided being one more uneducated black amongst the throngs of underachievers.

And finally, where on earth did you come from that allowed you the luxury to think that black men with degrees are a dime a dozen??? Did you sneak into Morehouse??? Did you go to Hillman? Were you on the cast of "A Different World"??? Is that you Whitley Gilbert???? CTFU!!!

Forgive me, Bunny. I'm sort of joking with you, but I really am confused as to where you went to school. Where are all of these educated men at??????

I'm an uber-educated black woman and I have never seen any academic setting where there was an equal balance of black males to females or even enough black males in college and above (including HBCUs) to not see how apparent our gender gap is in higher education.

I found the author's blog to be spot on and the same reasons he listed for BM not wanting to settle down are pretty much the same ones I use to explain my current lack of a spouse. Success is costly, and once you find time to get a spouse, you want the best you can get, so why settle for someone who reminds you of where you came from? You want someone who symbolizes the success you have attained. Someone who won't embarrass you in front of the boss, who will make others jealous.


Their Choice:

Successful BW

Successful WW

And you may think I'm being mean with Michelle, but she looks like a fair representative of most successful BW. I find her to be attractive, but most men that I know don't. Successful BM that I know tend to mention how angry she looks and I see a lot of BW make the same faces, even when just walking down the street. It's scary and a huge turn-off for men. BW, they say, remind them of mama and they don't want that. Whereas, WW have the stupid perma-grin on lock and men tend to prefer it.

The whole reason why most of us on this board want longer hair is so that we can be more appealing and stand out that much more apart from the bulk of BW with damaged, short, overprocessed hair. We all know the deal. That's why fake hair is making a fortune.

The sad thing is that it doesn't matter what successful BM want anyhow, there simply aren't enough successful BM for all of the equally successful BW. Despite the fact that these are very small groups, there is no balance. Successful BW must work on being as attractive as they can be (mostly physically and socially, less attitude) and recognize when nonBM are interested in them.

 

[cheetarah1980]

Firstly, the author pointed out the minimum/baseline requirements for being deemed "educated" and he said having "at least a bachelor's degree" not just a college degree.

Secondly, a black man having a BS/BA is a freaking huge accomplishment when only 34% of blacks enrolled in colleges are black males. Black women outnumber black men 2 to 1 at school and this holds true from my experience.

To put this all in perspective, blacks as a whole lag in education and only 16% of black women and 14% of black men had a college degree. So we all f*ing suck when it comes to having at least a BS/BA. So if you have a degree and you're black, you should feel a little bit special!

And whites are only doing marginally better with just 25% of their males and 24% of their females having college degrees.

Our whole nation needs improvement, so I understand why an educated black man would act a little stank because he's avoided being one more uneducated black amongst the throngs of underachievers.

And finally, where on earth did you come from that allowed you the luxury to think that black men with degrees are a dime a dozen??? Did you sneak into Morehouse??? Did you go to Hillman? Were you on the cast of "A Different World"??? Is that you Whitley Gilbert???? CTFU!!!

Forgive me, Bunny. I'm sort of joking with you, but I really am confused as to where you went to school. Where are all of these educated men at??????

I'm an uber-educated black woman and I have never seen any academic setting where there was an equal balance of black males to females or even enough black males in college and above (including HBCUs) to not see how apparent our gender gap is in higher education.

I found the author's blog to be spot on and the same reasons he listed for BM not wanting to settle down are pretty much the same ones I use to explain my current lack of a spouse. Success is costly, and once you find time to get a spouse, you want the best you can get, so why settle for someone who reminds you of where you came from? You want someone who symbolizes the success you have attained. Someone who won't embarrass you in front of the boss, who will make others jealous.


Their Choice:

Successful BW

Successful WW

And you may think I'm being mean with Michelle, but she looks like a fair representative of most successful BW. I find her to be attractive, but most men that I know don't. Successful BM that I know tend to mention how angry she looks and I see a lot of BW make the same faces, even when just walking down the street. It's scary and a huge turn-off for men. BW, they say, remind them of mama and they don't want that. Whereas, WW have the stupid perma-grin on lock and men tend to prefer it.

The whole reason why most of us on this board want longer hair is so that we can be more appealing and stand out that much more apart from the bulk of BW with damaged, short, overprocessed hair. We all know the deal. That's why fake hair is making a fortune.

The sad thing is that it doesn't matter what successful BM want anyhow, there simply aren't enough successful BM for all of the equally successful BW. Despite the fact that these are very small groups, there is no balance. Successful BW must work on being as attractive as they can be (mostly physically and socially, less attitude) and recognize when nonBM are interested in them.

Wow. This whole post sounds so 2nd season Meredith Grey ("Pick me, love me"). 1st of all, it looks to me like Michelle is not only smiling, but genuinely laughing in that second picture. And for every black man who doesn't find her attractive, there are 10-20 more who are looking for the 2nd coming of Michelle. Your view of what a successful white woman looks like is very telling as well. You act like successful black women have to be 100% perfect to even have a hope of finding the rare, mythical beast that is known as the successful Black Man.
All of the successful black men I know are married to black women who are equally successful. One of the senior managers in my office is an MBA-degreed black man who is married to a law degreed black woman. Actually all of the black men in upper management at my company are married to black women. All of my black male friends from college married black women. Heck, 99% of my black male friends have degrees. I've gotta agree with Bunny, a black man with a degree is a dime a dozen. I've lost track of how many I know. So umm, no I don't see any reason for them to be feeling themselves like they're the last piece of meat on a deserted island full of vultures. And the fact that so many black women view them as such doesn't help their egos either.

 

[Bunny77]

Forgive me, Bunny. I'm sort of joking with you, but I really am confused as to where you went to school. Where are all of these educated men at??????

Sometimes, your posts really confuzzle me... (yes, I know that's not a real word... I just like saying it.) I honestly don't get the point that you're trying to make half the time... all the other stuff you posted is like, ... but I will answer your question above.

Let's see... I'm from Detroit (ooh, scary), and all of my friends' parents had college degrees.

Then I went to this high school.... and all of the black men who graduated went to college. Most of them earned degrees, I'm sure.

http://www.usafootballtour.com/2009/category/detroit-michigan/

Then I went to universities in Michigan, and even though black women outnumbered black men, the black male graduates were not rare unicorns.

Let's see, then in this professional organization...

www.nabj.org

I can expect to see about 1,500 college-degreed black men every year at an annual convention.

Therefore, a black man (and a black woman) with a college degree does not impress me. I mean, I think it's a great achievement for anyone to get a college degree, but my upbringing makes me expect it, and I'm more likely to be around college-educated black men than not... therefore, I hold to my belief that college-educated black men are a dime a dozen in my experience, and I don't get all awestruck when I meet one.

As I said before, if my old-behind daddy can have a master's degree, any black man living in the USA today can AT LEAST have a bachelor's degree.

They really aren't that special.

 

[Carrie A]

So I AM of the demographic that he's talking about, being a multigenerational black American woman, but I continually remain confuzzled about how exactly things got to this point.

No. 1 -- A black man with a college degree is a wonderful thing, but it's not the eighth wonder of the world. Maybe because I grew up in a home with a dad who had a master's degree, my panties don't drop when I see a black man with a college degree. If my 66-year-old daddy can have a college degree, your a@@ doesn't impress me because you graduated from college in a non-Jim Crow, post affirmative action period.

No. 2 -- I saw black men in college all around me. I went to high school with smart black boys who became college educated black men. In the 1990s.

We are approaching a second (and sometimes third) generation of black American men getting college degrees, so I don't know why black folks are acting brand new about this and where this arrogance about having a college degree came from. As far as I'm concerned, black degreed men are a dime a dozen... and certainly nothing for me to be fighting over or sweating about.

Firstly, the author pointed out the minimum/baseline requirements for being deemed "educated" and he said having "at least a bachelor's degree" not just a college degree.

Secondly, a black man having a BS/BA is a freaking huge accomplishment when only 34% of blacks enrolled in colleges are black males. Black women outnumber black men 2 to 1 at school and this holds true from my experience.

To put this all in perspective, blacks as a whole lag in education and only 16% of black women and 14% of black men had a college degree. So we all f*ing suck when it comes to having at least a BS/BA. So if you have a degree and you're black, you should feel a little bit special!

And whites are only doing marginally better with just 25% of their males and 24% of their females having college degrees.

Our whole nation needs improvement, so I understand why an educated black man would act a little stank because he's avoided being one more uneducated black amongst the throngs of underachievers.

And finally, where on earth did you come from that allowed you the luxury to think that black men with degrees are a dime a dozen??? Did you sneak into Morehouse??? Did you go to Hillman? Were you on the cast of "A Different World"??? Is that you Whitley Gilbert???? CTFU!!!

Forgive me, Bunny. I'm sort of joking with you, but I really am confused as to where you went to school. Where are all of these educated men at??????

I'm chuckling at the confuzzlement but both of you are correct. Those stats Xerxes are pointing out are correct and in the grand scheme of things, if you take into account the US population Black degreed men are not all that common. Just at HBCUs alone the retention rate for Blacks males kind of sucks so you are likely to come across men who have had "some university" but not a degree.

I grew up sort of like Bunny in a mixed but predominately Black neighborhood where everybody had a degree and most had two or three. Everyone was expected to finish a BS/BA at the minimum. Even at university it didn't seem like there was a dearth of men. (There was a dearth of maturity but that's another story). So I thought black men with degrees were a dime a dozen too until I started to move up a little in my career and moved to places where our numbers were lower....and moved up in age. That's when I became aware that things weren't as rosy as I thought.

 

[Xerxes]

Wow. This whole post sounds so 2nd season Meredith Grey ("Pick me, love me"). 1st of all, it looks to me like Michelle is not only smiling, but genuinely laughing in that second picture. And for every black man who doesn't find her attractive, there are 10-20 more who are looking for the 2nd coming of Michelle. Your view of what a successful white woman looks like is very telling as well. You act like successful black women have to be 100% perfect to even have a hope of finding the rare, mythical beast that is known as the successful Black Man.
All of the successful black men I know are married to black women who are equally successful. One of the senior managers in my office is an MBA-degreed black man who is married to a law degreed black woman. Actually all of the black men in upper management at my company are married to black women. All of my black male friends from college married black women. Heck, 99% of my black male friends have degrees. I've gotta agree with Bunny, a black man with a degree is a dime a dozen. I've lost track of how many I know. So umm, no I don't see any reason for them to be feeling themselves like they're the last piece of meat on a deserted island full of vultures. And the fact that so many black women view them as such doesn't help their egos either.

So if they're a dime a dozen and you don't have to be perfect to get one, do you have one?

How about all of the BW consulting the likes of Steve Harvey and other sources for advice on getting a BM, where are the men for them?

The truth is an educated, successful, single brother is in limited supply and on astronomically high demand.

I simply don't understand why a number of BW are still in denial about the numbers of available successful BM.

 

[Xerxes]

Sometimes, your posts really confuzzle me... (yes, I know that's not a real word... I just like saying it.) I honestly don't get the point that you're trying to make half the time... all the other stuff you posted is like, ... but I will answer your question above.

Let's see... I'm from Detroit (ooh, scary), and all of my friends' parents had college degrees.

Then I went to this high school.... and all of the black men who graduated went to college. Most of them earned degrees, I'm sure.

http://www.usafootballtour.com/2009/category/detroit-michigan/

Then I went to universities in Michigan, and even though black women outnumbered black men, the black male graduates were not rare unicorns.

Let's see, then in this professional organization...

www.nabj.org

I can expect to see about 1,500 college-degreed black men every year at an annual convention.

Therefore, a black man (and a black woman) with a college degree does not impress me. I mean, I think it's a great achievement for anyone to get a college degree, but my upbringing makes me expect it, and I'm more likely to be around college-educated black men than not... therefore, I hold to my belief that college-educated black men are a dime a dozen in my experience, and I don't get all awestruck when I meet one.

As I said before, if my old-behind daddy can have a master's degree, any black man living in the USA today can AT LEAST have a bachelor's degree.

They really aren't that special.

Let me break this down for you then, no need to "confuzzle" you any more than necessary.

Perspective

That seems to be lacking in most of the posts on this topic. We all love to speak from our varied and limited life experiences and use it to validate or disprove any statistic or study. This is not helpful. It's simply denial.

Your experience is valid, but it is not representative of our population as a whole.

 

[cheetarah1980]

So if they're a dime a dozen and you don't have to be perfect to get one, do you have one?

How about all of the BW consulting the likes of Steve Harvey and other sources for advice on getting a BM, where are the men for them?

The truth is an educated, successful, single brother is in limited supply and on astronomically high demand.

I simply don't understand why a number of BW are still in denial about the numbers of available successful BM.

Nope, I don't have one. But I also know that they are not my only option. I've never had an issue attracting college educated, professional black men. Thus far none of them have been compatible with ME. I've dated them, and I continue to date them. Maybe I will end up with one, maybe I won't. It doesn't matter to me either way. What I do know is that I'm not lamenting their existence and acting like they have done something all that special and therefore I must go above and beyond just to get their attention.

 

[Carrie A]

The truth is an educated, successful, single brother is in limited supply and on astronomically high demand.

I agree that they are on demand but I think it's all those things in one.... successful, professional, highly educated. Certain women want it all. They are looking for "that black man" the guy that "has it all" really.

So a couple of girlfriends were telling me how they went down to visit a few of the guys that we went to college with who, on outside appearance fit the bill. These guys are 35-37 and loving the single life. They have what we like to joke around as "groupies" but these are younger educated ladies who hang around and are strung along by these guys.
We knew them in college and they were not like that at all.

Like Bunny has stated in other threads, eventually the negative cost of being single will push them to marry as they are trying to move up in their communities.

 

[Xerxes]

I'm chuckling at the confuzzlement but both of you are correct. Those stats Xerxes are pointing out are correct and in the grand scheme of things, if you take into account the US population Black degreed men are not all that common. Just at HBCUs alone the retention rate for Blacks males kind of sucks so you are likely to come across men who have had "some university" but not a degree.

I grew up sort of like Bunny in a mixed but predominately Black neighborhood where everybody had a degree and most had two or three. Everyone was expected to finish a BS/BA at the minimum. Even at university it didn't seem like there was a dearth of men. (There was a dearth of maturity but that's another story). So I thought black men with degrees were a dime a dozen too until I started to move up a little in my career and moved to places where our numbers were lower....and moved up in age. That's when I became aware that things weren't as rosy as I thought.

Thank you!

I think a lot of us forget that our singular experience may be exceptional and differ greatly from what is going on the larger scale.

Just because you grew up around educated blacks does not mean having a degree is an easy thing to come by. You can't even expect a white boy to have a degree, since only 1 out of 4 of them are degreed! LOL

All this shows is that it's weird, but most of us live in de facto segregated areas. We tend to live amongst those like us, so if you are degreed, you are only around other degreed folks and you lose all sense of the grander scheme of things.

 

[Xerxes]

I agree that they are on demand but I think it's all those things in one.... successful, professional, highly educated. Certain women want it all. They are looking for "that black man" the guy that "has it all" really.

So a couple of girlfriends were telling me how they went down to visit a few of the guys that we went to college with who, on outside appearance fit the bill. These guys are 35-37 and loving the single life. They have what we like to joke around as "groupies" but these are younger educated ladies a little who hang around and are strung along by these guys.
We knew them in college and they were not like that at all.

Like Bunny has stated in other threads, eventually the negative cost of being single will push them to marry as they are trying to move up in their communities.

<shrug> I think I might know some of your guy friends! LOL

Seriously, I know a number of BM like that and us late 20s successful BW do mess with them, but I have given up. It's pointless. It's like playing musical chairs with 20 other BW and just one chair.

I used to think that all I need is one BM, so the stats shouldn't harm me, but now I'm just an equal opportunist, ready to swoop in and date, marry and mate the best guy I can get.

 

[Syrah]

So if they're a dime a dozen and you don't have to be perfect to get one, do you have one?

How about all of the BW consulting the likes of Steve Harvey and other sources for advice on getting a BM, where are the men for them?

The truth is an educated, successful, single brother is in limited supply and on astronomically high demand.

I simply don't understand why a number of BW are still in denial about the numbers of available successful BM.

I can sit here and go on and on all day about the dudes that I go to business school who are all college educated, who have had at least 4 years of work experience prior to pursuing their MBAs, who admittedly talk a lot of sh!t about how they get down, but are honestly and openly marriage minded and have that not only as a goal in mind, but something worth pursuing etc.

I don't think its a matter of being in denial about the numbers of available successful BM. I think its having ACCESS to relationship-minded successful Black Men that is the issue. And moreso, its access to them in an environment where they are thinking "Barack and Michelle" (healthy relationship) not Ice-T and Coco . It's meeting them at the Playboy Jazz Festival not the NBA After Party. Because the other truth about these successful BM is that until they meet Ms. Right One, they're ok playing with Ms. Right Now.

And while I agree that we all have limited experiences, aren't we also focusing on limited groups of the population? We're not sitting here talking about the average black man (whatever that is) or the average American man (whatever that is).

To take a step back and have to consider the broader picture seems counterintuitive in this discussion if the broader picture or "general population" isn't part of the consideration set. Why would you consider what is average if "average black man" isn't what you're after?

 

[Xerxes]

Nope, I don't have one. But I also know that they are not my only option. I've never had an issue attracting college educated, professional black men. Thus far none of them have been compatible with ME. I've dated them, and I continue to date them. Maybe I will end up with one, maybe I won't. It doesn't matter to me either way. What I do know is that I'm not lamenting their existence and acting like they have done something all that special and therefore I must go above and beyond just to get their attention.

Wow, do you have at least a bachelor's degree?

If so, then you are in the top 16% of all BW in America based on education alone. Then you would be special and accordingly, any BM with the same background deserves some props. All of us educated folks deserve some kind of pat on the back.

 

[Syrah]

I agree that they are on demand but I think it's all those things in one.... successful, professional, highly educated. Certain women want it all. They are looking for "that black man" the guy that "has it all" really.

So a couple of girlfriends were telling me how they went down to visit a few of the guys that we went to college with who, on outside appearance fit the bill. These guys are 35-37 and loving the single life. They have what we like to joke around as "groupies" but these are younger educated ladies who hang around and are strung along by these guys.
We knew them in college and they were not like that at all.

Like Bunny has stated in other threads, eventually the negative cost of being single will push them to marry as they are trying to move up in their communities.

And want it all without being a reflection, a complement or an equal.

Highly Successful Educated BM isn't interested in your college degree, the home you own or the car you drive because he's got that - thats expected. He's looking at how you can enrich his world. And chances are, because of his success, he has exposed himself and been exposed to a LOT - which makes "broadening his horizons" that much more difficult.

You've got to catch him on the come-up or expect that his expectations are going to be off the rictor...

 

[Carrie A]

And while I agree that we all have limited experiences, aren't we also focusing on limited groups of the population? We're not sitting here talking about the average black man (whatever that is) or the average American man (whatever that is).

To take a step back and have to consider the broader picture seems counterintuitive in this discussion if the broader picture or "general population" isn't part of the consideration set. Why would you consider what is average if "average black man" isn't what you're after?

I still think that there is some trickle down effect of the general pop numbers into the select group. Especially in the case of Black men dropping out of college. This ultimately decreases the pool for women who require a degree. I think that even in the selected group we are talking about the edumacated women are still outnumbering the men.

Highly Successful Educated BM isn't interested in your college degree, the home you own or the car you drive because he's got that - thats expected. He's looking at how you can enrich his world. And chances are, because of his success, he has exposed himself and been exposed to a LOT - which makes "broadening his horizons" that much more difficult.

You've got to catch him on the come-up or expect that his expectations are going to be off the rictor...

Funny thing is that, and we've had this convo on here a lot too, the expectations from the mens point of view aren't that high. Or maybe they are different. They are not judging the same things to be plus factors as we are.
For example the guys in my post are looking for women to be stay at home moms. They are not necessarily looking for career driven women. They want a women with education because it looks good and these ladies are easier to relate to because of similar backgrounds. They want their kids to be raised by the "right" woman............. when the time comes of course.

 

[Bunny77]

Let me break this down for you then, no need to "confuzzle" you any more than necessary.

Perspective

That seems to be lacking in most of the posts on this topic. We all love to speak from our varied and limited life experiences and use it to validate or disprove any statistic or study. This is not helpful. It's simply denial.

Your experience is valid, but it is not representative of our population as a whole.

Heh heh heh... okay, you want to talk about perspective? Let's talk about perspective.

In the past year, you have interrupted numerous posts about dating/relationships with your "woe is me, no one wants me," story.

When black women on this board have discussed their experiences dating and enjoying the company of successful, good-looking and generally nice men (black or otherwise), you jump in with the most incredulous questions, pretty much saying, "HOW do you find these men? Where are you? How is this possible?"

In fact, your wording is almost exactly the same as what you asked me above... as if you can't stand the idea that unlike you, there are black women living in black areas having success forming relationships.

What else, hmmm... you've jumped into threads to "inform" the posters that they should just make peace with the idea that they might not get married because the numbers are against them and it's "so hard" for black women...

Then you declared in a thread in which we were ogling non-black soccer players that none of them were likely to be on a board talking about how attractive black women were... and you ran away quickly when folks called you out on your foolishness...

Oh yes, and then you disputed a statistical fact about the longterm success about black women in marriages with non-black men, saying it was from a biased website, when in fact, it came from Census statistics.

And as for the most disturbing thing you've posted... your impassioned defense of a white gunman who shot up a group of women in an exercise class, saying that you could "understand" the feeling of being rejected, and maybe if people were just nicer to him, he wouldn't have gone on a homicidal rampage.

Hmmmm...

So, the reason I can't take any of your posts seriously is because your perspective is one of someone who's had a spectacularly poor time trying to date, and you want to spread your poison among other black women who aren't wearing ashes and sackcloth and weeping and wailing about no one wanting them.

Everything you've posted in this thread is more of a reflection of YOUR confused mindset rather than anything about how black women are unsuited for relationships with good men, black or otherwise.

 

[BeautifulFlower]

Excerpt from blog:

Sexual Prowess. Smart people are freaky. Sex is a stress reliever. Add those two statements together and you potentially have a sexual hurricane on your hands.

 

[cheetarah1980]

Wow, do you have at least a bachelor's degree?

If so, then you are in the top 16% of all BW in America based on education alone. Then you would be special and accordingly, any BM with the same background deserves some props. All of us educated folks deserve some kind of pat on the back.

Class of 02!! I guess because I was raised by two parents with advanced degrees and grew up around people who had degrees it just seemed very ordinary to me. Not going to college (and don't even bring up not graduating) just wasn't an option. College was just a given so in my experience it's not a big deal to meet other black people with degrees. I guess it's like Syrah says, it's all about what you have access to. I have what seems to be unlimited access to college educated, black professionals so they do seem a dime a dozen to me in spite of what the numbers say.

 

[lux10023]

not sure if ive ever quoted your post BUNNY but ditto to everythang you said..

ive observed the same weirdo, bitter, pathetic...POV from blank...and quite frankly....I AGREE 200%
poisioning the masses with that bull...gtfoh
(homegirl need a hug and a d*ldo...smdh)

Heh heh heh... okay, you want to talk about perspective? Let's talk about perspective.

In the past year, you have interrupted numerous posts about dating/relationships with your "woe is me, no one wants me," story.

When black women on this board have discussed their experiences dating and enjoying the company of successful, good-looking and generally nice men (black or otherwise), you jump in with the most incredulous questions, pretty much saying, "HOW do you find these men? Where are you? How is this possible?"

In fact, your wording is almost exactly the same as what you asked me above... as if you can't stand the idea that unlike you, there are black women living in black areas having success forming relationships.

What else, hmmm... you've jumped into threads to "inform" the posters that they should just make peace with the idea that they might not get married because the numbers are against them and it's "so hard" for black women...

Then you declared in a thread in which we were ogling non-black soccer players that none of them were likely to be on a board talking about how attractive black women were... and you ran away quickly when folks called you out on your foolishness...

Oh yes, and then you disputed a statistical fact about the longterm success about black women in marriages with non-black men, saying it was from a biased website, when in fact, it came from Census statistics.

And as for the most disturbing thing you've posted... your impassioned defense of a white gunman who shot up a group of women in an exercise class, saying that you could "understand" the feeling of being rejected, and maybe if people were just nicer to him, he wouldn't have gone on a homicidal rampage.

Hmmmm...

So, the reason I can't take any of your posts seriously is because your perspective is one of someone who's had a spectacularly poor time trying to date, and you want to spread your poison among other black women who aren't wearing ashes and sackcloth and weeping and wailing about no one wanting them.

Everything you've posted in this thread is more of a reflection of YOUR confused mindset rather than anything about how black women are unsuited for relationships with good men, black or otherwise.

 

[Syrah]

Heh heh heh... okay, you want to talk about perspective? Let's talk about perspective.

In the past year, you have interrupted numerous posts about dating/relationships with your "woe is me, no one wants me," story.

When black women on this board have discussed their experiences dating and enjoying the company of successful, good-looking and generally nice men (black or otherwise), you jump in with the most incredulous questions, pretty much saying, "HOW do you find these men? Where are you? How is this possible?"

In fact, your wording is almost exactly the same as what you asked me above... as if you can't stand the idea that unlike you, there are black women living in black areas having success forming relationships.

What else, hmmm... you've jumped into threads to "inform" the posters that they should just make peace with the idea that they might not get married because the numbers are against them and it's "so hard" for black women...

Then you declared in a thread in which we were ogling non-black soccer players that none of them were likely to be on a board talking about how attractive black women were... and you ran away quickly when folks called you out on your foolishness...

Oh yes, and then you disputed a statistical fact about the longterm success about black women in marriages with non-black men, saying it was from a biased website, when in fact, it came from Census statistics.

And as for the most disturbing thing you've posted... your impassioned defense of a white gunman who shot up a group of women in an exercise class, saying that you could "understand" the feeling of being rejected, and maybe if people were just nicer to him, he wouldn't have gone on a homicidal rampage.

Hmmmm...

So, the reason I can't take any of your posts seriously is because your perspective is one of someone who's had a spectacularly poor time trying to date, and you want to spread your poison among other black women who aren't wearing ashes and sackcloth and weeping and wailing about no one wanting them.

Everything you've posted in this thread is more of a reflection of YOUR confused mindset rather than anything about how black women are unsuited for relationships with good men, black or otherwise.

 

[clevagirl73]

Thanks Bunny....

I haven't been on LHCF to know the history of various posters but I got the distinct feeling that Xerxes was dismissive of my experience and perspective as a happily married BW to an educated BM who knows other similarly educated, professional Black couples. Like I said in my post, we need to peel back the layers and figure out what role media (via blogs, television and even discussion boards) play in creating this hysteria that Black men and women cannot or will not get along. There are too many successful Black marriages (not shown in media but still present) to claim otherwise.

Xerxes - Do you honestly believe a educated black man should get a pass to act funky toward sistas? Puh-lease. That's like men who want extra credit for taking care of their kids.

Getting a degree is a minimum given what past generations endured so we could even get a college education. Besides, why set standards so low for Black folks? I don't give a damn what white folks do in terms of education because their skin privilege more often than not trumps our education. We need a college degree as cultural and social capital to help us enter spaces that are closed off to the "average Black man and woman." That is an inarguable fact. So getting a degree was and is a minimum standard for most middle-class Blacks and even many lower-class, uneducated Blacks bust their tail to move into good areas so their kids have a fighting chance at an education. Sure, we should celebrate when a black person gets educated but let's not make out like this is such a rare occurrence that this person deserves to have their name added to some walk of fame. Black men have been getting degrees since the 1800's and still managed to marry Black women. It's not the fact that they are educated that's at issue.

I contend the BW have changed a great deal since the '60's/'70's wherein we are less likely to sit by and allow the man to take the lead and will not wait for a man before we get educated, etc. BM haven't fundamentally changed all that much. They still want a traditional nuclear family arrangement with the father as the head of the household. Since BM can't control much outside of the home, they want to be masters of their domain at home. I'm not saying these BM want a subservient wife but they do want to feel some locus of control over decisions regarding money, children, etc. I think the fundamental problem for Black folks is unwillingness to give a little. I know it was hard for me given I had been alone, putting myself through school and working many jobs to rely on someone else and ask for help. There were times when I expected my husband to drop the ball. But I had to put my faith in the strength of our relationship and his maturity as a man. Basically, I had to stop being a control freak and he had to stop thinking I was going to run our household like his momma ran theirs as a kid. Honestly, I think we need to surrender the need to be in control of everything. Until we do that, we're going to continue to have relationship strife, IMO.

 

[Bunny77]

To go back and address more on this topic...

I find that too often, if one's "black experience" is not a tale from the 'hood or one of struggle, it is dismissed as not being authentic. Which I find to be rather offensive, but even more bothersome when it comes from black folks who would be oh-so-pissed if a white person made the same comments.

Now, that being said, I do think that we are approaching (or are in the middle of) a social shift in which more women are attending college and the men aren't following suit. It's not so much, from what I can tell, that male enrollment is declining significantly, but female enrollment is increasing so much that the gap is becoming obvious.

So... because more black women than ever are getting college degrees (and going for advanced degrees) and the number of black men doing the same might be stagnant, a situation is created where the men might be more inclined to think of themselves more highly than they should.

At the very best, they simply might put off marriage for a while to enjoy their options (which is what many of us are seeing now), but still maintain a goal of marrying. These guys usually do marry, and their wives are often black. You just might not catch them until they're 35.

At the worst, they start stuntin' and strutting like peacocks about being some rare gem, and black women should bow down in their presence. The bad thing is, too many black women do this figuratively, which only serves to blow up their heads even more.

The way I always addressed this was to simply say, "Cool, that's great!" when such men mentioned their educational background and then begin talking about other things. That was a good way to weed out the types that expected a black woman to pay homage to them for just inhaling their essence, versus the really good guys who took pride in their education, but didn't see it as something that made their doo-doo smell good.