Well since we on it, why is hair typing so important?

Priss Pot said:
I think that hair typing has its place in the natural hair community, but it's not the end all be all.

Honestly, I can't wear my hair like someone who is a type 3a may wear theirs. I get less tangles and ssks when I keep my hair stretched, whereas someone who is a 3a may wear wash 'n gos on a regular and still retain all length and not have to worry about knots. That is the difference. It doesn't mean I can't learn anything from her, but in reality I can't just disregard hairtype and do EVERYTHING that a 3a does and still expect the same results. Majority of my techniques I learned from women with a similar hair texture to mine.

I don't see what's so bad about realizing a....reality?
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But Priss...imo, our hair looks fairly similar and I can wear wash n gos all the time with no problem. So how does hair typing come into play there?
 
EllePixie said:
But Priss...imo, our hair looks fairly similar and I can wear wash n gos all the time with no problem. So how does hair typing come into play there?
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But that's where our hair is different. I can wear wash 'n gos too, but they come with consequences = knots and more tangles.

Hair typing comes into play because type 2's and 3a's (as an example) don't normally wear braid-outs or twist sets, right? How would I have discovered the benefits of keeping the hair stretched if I never encountered or sought out other ladies similar to my texture who realized the benefits?

I mean it's the same as a non-Black asking a Black person how to care for Black hair (the non-Black could have a biracial child or something). About a month ago while I was at work this white lady asked me what do I do to take care of my hair because she was in dire need to find a way to care for her adopted Ethiopian toddler's hair. She kept the little girl's hair short cause she didn't really know what to do with it. The lady encountered someone (me) who had a hair type similar to the hair she was looking to care for. I see no problem with that.

Like I said, hair typing is NOT the end all be all. It's to serve as a guide, IMO. I don't feel that people with other types can't teach me. I mean, look at how many type 1s, 2s, 3s, and 4s, use coconut oil as a pre-poo? I do the same, and that technique is not type specific.
 
Priss Pot said:
But that's where our hair is different. I can wear wash 'n gos too, but they come with consequences = knots and more tangles.

Hair typing comes into play because type 2's and 3a's (as an example) don't normally wear braid-outs or twist sets, right? How would I have discovered the benefits of keeping the hair stretched if I never encountered or sought out other ladies similar to my texture who realized the benefits?

I mean it's the same as a non-Black asking a Black person how to care for Black hair (the non-Black could have a biracial child or something). About a month ago while I was at work this white lady asked me what do I do to take care of my hair because she was in dire need to find a way to care for her adopted Ethiopian toddler's hair. She kept the little girl's hair short cause she didn't really know what to do with it. The lady encountered someone (me) who had a hair type similar to the hair she was looking to care for. I see no problem with that.

Like I said, hair typing is NOT the end all be all. It's to serve as a guide, IMO. I don't feel that people with other types can't teach me. I mean, look at how many type 1s, 2s, 3s, and 4s, use coconut oil as a pre-poo? I do the same, and that technique is not type specific.
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Right, I understand what you are saying, but we don't need labeled hair types for all that. We can look at someone's hair and determine how similar it is to our own. Call it highly textured hair, etc...like I love the Lorraine massey system, I think it's more descriptive and talks about the hair properties, like shrinkage and spring factor. I'm saying this whole number letter thing is weak sauce.

Ps I read your other post soooo wrong on my phone at first, I'm glad I reread it, :lol:

Sent from my PC36100 using PC36100
 
EllePixie said:
Right, I understand what you are saying, but we don't need labeled hair types for all that. We can look at someone's hair and determine how similar it is to our own. Call it highly textured hair, etc...like I love the Lorraine massey system, I think it's more descriptive and talks about the hair properties, like shrinkage and spring factor. I'm saying this whole number letter thing is weak sauce.

Ps I read your other post soooo wrong on my phone at first, I'm glad I reread it, :lol:

Sent from my PC36100 using PC36100
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Lorraine Massey's system is sooo much more descriptive. I wanted to mention this earlier, but I didn't have the book in front of me to reference. It's in storage somewhere.
 
I can't get in on this hair typing. I've never typed my hair since beginning my transition and I don't plan to. I like to simplify typing when I describe someone else's or my own hair. I say "curl, kink, straight, coil" attached to something like "big, loose, tight". I don't need a number and letter to say that!
 
I used to think they were helpful in determining products but I've learned more from 4s and white girls with curly hair. Every head is different.

Oh - What are the Lorraine Massey categories?
 
SimplyBlessed said:
Cuz ppl want to tell ppl what they hair ain't lol
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NicWhite said:
Quite honestly, I think that hair typing is so important to some people because most people (in real life) think that a certain hair type is ugly and can't grow (4B). I think some women want validation that their hair is a "prettier" hair type. 4A and up into the 3's. While those who have accepted that they have 4B hair, but their hair looks bad, claim that the other person who has managed to make their kinky hair look nice, obviously does not really have that hair type.
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I find the opposite to be true. I don't see a lot of 4B's claiming a different texture, but I see a lot of ppl pushing others who've taken care of their hair well and have grown it long, up into the 3's whenever they want to justify why their hasn't grown long. Its a fallback for some people.

Anyway, I've stopped paying attention to hair type a year ago. The real deal is whether you have fine, medium, or coarse strands, and whether you have thin or thick density. I will borrow from the regimens of a 2A and a 4B if she has fine strands and was able to get them to grow long.
 
I think it was meant to be a generalized way to specify straigt wavy or curly kinky the problem is we knew what a that was already without typing. I never buy products based in hairtype alone cause that dosnt work at all I see my similar hairtypes using all kind sof products that I can't use but sometimes the recommend from a diff hairtype works.
I just know that there are certain things curlykinky hair needs to thrive regardless.
When you have multiple textures on one head you can't type cause it sounds ridiculous.
 
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Priss Pot said:
Hair typing comes into play because type 2's and 3a's (as an example) don't normally wear braid-outs or twist sets, right? How would I have discovered the benefits of keeping the hair stretched if I never encountered or sought out other ladies similar to my texture who realized the benefits?

I mean it's the same as a non-Black asking a Black person how to care for Black hair (the non-Black could have a biracial child or something).
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I think this is true when you're comparing across racial groups or between 2A and 4B hair. But for 3B, 3C, 4A, and 4B (which are the main hair types everybody argues and splits hairs over on LHCF) its really not that big of a difference between these groups. And there are so many variations within each group its hard to tell who is who anymore, so what's the point?
 
snillohsss said:
I think strand density matters more than the type.
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^^ This ^^

When I first went natural like so many people, I thought curl size was the be all end all when it comes to care and products. I then realized that since I still used salon brands (Redken, Matrix) and drugstore brands like Suave that are designed and marketed towards straight haired people for the most part, it wasn't as big a deal as I thought if it worked on my hair. For years, I never used products marketed to curly/kinky/natural hair mostly because I didn't felt I need to.

I started putting hair type in my signatures years ago when I was getting PMs from people on other message boards asking me my hair type. It became a habit I never got out of I guess. Its not on my Fotki because I think it mattered even less since I have a number of photos up for people to see.

When I speak of hair type/texture, I talk more about how porous my hair is than anything.

I thought I had a "hair twin" on Youtube for a long time. We had similar curl/kink patterns and I though this was it. When she started using products my hair would be sick from like Miss Jessie's and highlighting her hair (my hair would fall OUT if I did that), I realized we are not hair twins after all. There is really no such thing.
 
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nikolite said:
I think this is true when you're comparing across racial groups or between 2A and 4B hair. But for 3B, 3C, 4A, and 4B (which are the main hair types everybody argues and splits hairs over on LHCF) its really not that big of a difference between these groups. And there are so many variations within each group its hard to tell who is who anymore, so what's the point?
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No matter the racial make-up, the point is a 3b (even a Black one) may not have to worry about SSKs as much as a 4a/4b. So to say that there's no difference between the hair types is a little (i.e. a lot) off, don't you think?

In the end, I think more people make this whole hair typing thing bigger than what it really should be. There is no reason to over-analyze hair typing or understate it. It is simply a guide...a reference. Yet you have people on either extreme of the hair typing debate who can't just take something for what it is. Chime's hair does not directly fit into Andre's hair typing system, IMO...which is OKAY! Everyone is not supposed to fit into one type of hair, which is why the system is pretty much a guide and not an absolute.

You have one group trying to force her into one type and another group trying to eradicate everyone from even acknowledging that a hair type (in general) even exists. Why can't there be a happy medium?

Someone with type 1-2 hair has their own struggles, as I and many others with my hair type have our own. I highly doubt knots is part of type 1-2 problems. If I were to ask a type 1 "how do you prevent knots?" she would probably look at me as if I had an extra head growing out of the side of my neck.

Type does matter, but folks always gotta get so extra with it (on both ends of the debate).
 
When I originally read about hair typing it helped me to understand the basics that my hair needed based on my curl patterns (:yep: I have numerous patterns). I do feel that certain products don't work on my hair but not because of my hair types but moreso for the quality of my hair (it's super thick and coily). I'm not a "Hair Type Expert" so I don't waste time trying to analyze someone else curl type. If you have type 3 hair and it's healthy, I will listen to what you have to say based on the fact that your hair is healthy. I don't put much emphasis on ppl's hair type.
 
LOL I guess hair typing is officially passe. It was helping me figure out a regimen and what products/techniques are best for my hair but I guess it's not P.C. anymore. I wonder what the next big system will be...a thing can't remain nameless forever...(I hope it's not the LOIS system, that one confuses me and makes me feel dumb. Like caveman dumb.)
 
Priss Pot said:
No matter the racial make-up, the point is a 3b (even a Black one) may not have to worry about SSKs as much as a 4a/4b. So to say that there's no difference between the hair types is a little (i.e. a lot) off, don't you think?

In the end, I think more people make this whole hair typing thing bigger than what it really should be. There is no reason to over-analyze hair typing or understate it. It is simply a guide...a reference. Yet you have people on either extreme of the hair typing debate who can't just take something for what it is. Chime's hair does not directly fit into Andre's hair typing system, IMO...which is OKAY! Everyone is not supposed to fit into one type of hair, which is why the system is pretty much a guide and not an absolute.

You have one group trying to force her into one type and another group trying to eradicate everyone from even acknowledging that a hair type (in general) even exists. Why can't there be a happy medium?

Someone with type 1-2 hair has their own struggles, as I and many others with my hair type have our own. I highly doubt knots is part of type 1-2 problems. If I were to ask a type 1 "how do you prevent knots?" she would probably look at me as if I had an extra head growing out of the side of my neck.

Type does matter, but folks always gotta get so extra with it (on both ends of the debate).
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I didn't say there was no difference, I'm saying there isn't much difference (IMO) between 3B-4B that warrant the need for basing hair care off of these categories, since we all have to deal with SSK's and detangling to some extent while 1A-3A don't.

But like I said in another post, I think strand width, porosity, and density are much more important, and there I see a big difference between those who can grow their hair more easily and those that can't. I've seen 3B hair that was very thin, fine and broke off easy and 4B hair that was very long, thick, strong and coarse. And the opposite too.

It's not that hair typing should be completely eradicated (I wasn't saying that at all) but I don't see the point of it other than as a physical description. Which is why its caused so much heated debates. When I first went natural I didn't look for my hair type (its very unique anyway and very hard to find)--I tried that route for a sec, but my hair never quite worked out like other 3C's or 4A's and I realized later on that the fact that I had fine hair was more important.
 
I think hair typing is very useful and will prove to be the foundation by which products can be scientifically developed to cater to Afro textured hair.

The next chick being a type 1,2, or 3 or yearning to be a type 1,2 or 3 has no bearing on my need for products that work on my type 4 hair.

There has to be a starting point in order to make progress. Andre's system is basic, not perfect, but easy enough to be a starting point. Hell, I've been on this piece 6 years and I still don't understand LOIS. I think it's a case of cutting of your nose to spite your face to dismiss hair typing just because you don't like how somebody else deciphers the system.
 
Not to sound like I have an attitude *Because I don't* it was important to me because I wanted to know what my hair type was...Simple...Some people say because it can create a foundation for product development and that is true too but my mommas hair is straight like bone straight but it's coarse as all hell so most products for straight hair do nothing for her. *Shrug*
 
I don't really find it to be very useful, at least not Andre's system. I have not really delved much into the others, it gets too confusing for me. I feel that my curl pattern is one characteristic of my overall hair type, not the end all be all. As has already been said, density, porosity, texture, and strand thickness are additional characteristics which to me round out my hair type. My siggy describes it - 4a/3c curl pattern, medium-thick strands, mostly cottony, normal density, some silky texture, frizzy. I have normal porosity. What has helped me is looking for ladies that describe their strands as medium or thick, regardless of whether they are 3a or 4b. This has helped me in determining what types of products to use for my hair. There is just so much variation within the different categories, at least to me. My 4a does not look much like other 4as that I have seen - my curls fall on the tighter end of the 4a spectrum and many 4as that I have seen have looser curls, so trying to pattern my hair after theirs doesn't work. I have found one other person with hair that looks like mine, and although that gives me a peek into what my future hair may look like (she's several years ahead of me on this journey), I still don't model my products after her. It's just cool to see what my hair may look like at a longer length. After these latest threads about Haircrush's hairtype I'm officially over the whole thing anyway. I'll continue to figure out what's best for my hair based on my hair as a whole, and not just one characteristic.
 
It is important because although on-line people like to put "good hair" in quotes they really do believe in the concept. People seek validation through the hair typing system.

With the hair typing system, all the nappy headed little girls now get to join the ranks with the good haired people because their hair has curls and coils (even if it takes a jar and a half of gel to "define" them :lol:). Nobody wants to drop below 4a because then you are back in nappyville. :lol:

Without the typing system, then there are only two castes: soft, silky, good haired folks and nappy, rough bad haired folks. With the hair typing system, hair judgment gets extended to include "curl pattern." So, if you are one of the nappy, rough haired folks but you have a curl pattern, then you get to go up a rung or two on the ladder :).
 
Seems like there are two kinds of hair typing being discussed. One is the Andre curl-size typing. And the other is including density, strand size, porosity, etc...like a modified LOIS plus curl size.

The posters who see hair typing as useless seem to mostly be referring to curl size only based typing. And that makes sense. If curl size is the only aspect of hair you are taking into account, it's probably not going to be very helpful.

The posters who think of hair typing that includes a wide set of factors seem to get more value from it. By moving beyond curl size to include porosity, strand size, shrinkage, density, sheen, etc. hair typing discussions help explain the reason certain products and techniques work or don't work. Online I can't feel your hair, so the more aspects of it you can describe the better I can understand the ways our hair might be similar or what aspects of your regimen may work for me.

I understand the exasperation with the "good hair" attitude that creeps into discussions of curl size, but I disagree that the solution to that is simply to dismiss hair typing altogether.
 
I do know that all these multi-page discussions on it are doing too much. :look: It was useful to me as a natural (and still is useful even now relaxed) because it helps to more quickly find and zoom in on people whose hair is more similar to your own, so you can see what they're doing and what's working for them. There's still much variation among people in the same group, but it's a great starting point for finding heads that are similar to your own. It's easier and quicker to find someone whose hair looks & behaves similar to my own in a 4B shout-out thread than in a general free-for-all thread. I see nothing wrong or sinister or "self-hating" or all this other hubboo about it. No two heads are alike, we know that. And even among one group there's still much variation, yeah, but still it's a great starting point. I do wish people put as much stock in strand size and density though.
 
Hey ladies,
I'm new here but it's important to me cause I have been struggling on my natural hair journey. There have been times I have dream of a relaxer literally. Funny thing is I never like relaxers I just got them because that was all I ever knew. I still don't know my hair type and some people hate the topic. What are newbies to do?? I def need help!
 
Pharmgirl247 said:
Hey ladies,
I'm new here but it's important to me cause I have been struggling on my natural hair journey. There have been times I have dream of a relaxer literally. Funny thing is I never like relaxers I just got them because that was all I ever knew. I still don't know my hair type and some people hate the topic. What are newbies to do?? I def need help!
Click to expand...

Focus on learning the properties of your hair - texture, porosity, density, strand thickness - instead. That will help you much more in the long run. There are several resources on this site and on the internet to explore this information.
 
It has always been very helpful to me. I knew my hair type right away even when transitioning. I'm a 4a. What does drive me a bit crazy about hair typing is when folks over analyze your hair and say stuff like it looks like you're 3c on the sides, 4a in the crown, etc. Who cares??? I'm a 4a. I have tight coils the size of coffee stirrers, a high frizz factor if my hair is not properly moisturized, difficult to detangle most times, my hair is growing out before growing down, and some days I just can't do a puff or ponytail because no matter what I do it feels so tiiiiiiight. I knew all this before I bc'd because I knew my hair type.

Also people use the terms hair type and hair texture interchangeably. I am guilty of it some times too. They are not the same.
 
Thanks ladies I'm going to figure out the other qualities. I do agree that the topic is used for other means but for me I just want to make dealing with my hair easier.
 
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