Spinoff: Does Voodoo/Black Magic have REAL Power?

[divya]

Of course God will never approve Voodoo..its not the same religion. Again, I will not call Voodoo evil. I just put it in a basket with every other religion that is out there. Again, its not my religion. If I say that Voodoo is evil then I would have to say the Judiasm, Hinduism, Islam, etc is too (which they are not)..because my exposure and knowledge about Voodoo has not been far off from the exposure of other religions. But again, since I don't practice the religions they don't apply to me. I just respectfully keep my distance...

I agree with being careful about how we describe the religions of others. If we are to reach people, we ought to watch our speech. We may not agree with their practices but at least, we should respect their choice.

Further, as Christians, I do believe we should be careful when pointing fingers, particularly with the amount of non-Christian practices that have found their way into the mainstream of the religion. Some of us who have exposure to both can see how similar certain practices are within Christianity and Orisha faiths...where did it really come from? I'll just leave it at that.

 

[Nice & Wavy]

May God lift up His Word today in our hearts. As people of God, we should be coming together and praying, rather than showing who's right and who's not right.

How can two walk together unless they are in agreement? And, how can God's Word be established in the heart of man unless His people come together, in love?

We must show the world that Jesus is alive by our actions. What we say and do is very important in this journey because people are watching us.

We must be willing to grow with God and let our light shine in this dark world. When God is about to do something, He takes the initiative and comes to one or more of His servants. He invites them to adjust their lives to Him so that He can accomplish His eternal purpose through them. When God speaks we must respond. What will your answer be?

We influence the people around us for good or bad. Like the pebble thrown into the lake we send out ripples that touch distant shores. Sisters, let’s touch those distant shores in our heavenly Father’s name as we live out our prayer that His will be done on earth as it is in heaven. No two people are exactly the same and we have callings hand picked for us by our Lord. Let’s take advantage of every opportunity to be God’s faithful servants until He calls us to our eternal rest with Him.

 

[divya]

How many people have studied Orisha religions? To be completely honest, it can be compared in certain ways to Hinduism...and even Roman Catholicism. That's why the two have been melded to some extent in certain places, particularly in the Americas.

Adherents believe in one supreme god over all, who uses many deities to carry out his work. The aspect that tends to alarm people is the invoking of the deities (orishas) for communication. There are also believed to be evil spirits that can be invoked to harm individuals, if a particular person so chooses (also known as black magic).

You can find a mixture of orishas and saints in many places, as it doesn't seem different for people. Certain people have even mixed of orishas and Hindu deities.

Anyway, I don't agree with Voodoo or any other orisha religion and avoid spiritualism in any form. In my belief, those practices are not of God. At the same time, I am careful not to being insulting because if it wasn't for God's grace, where would I be? We all need the Lord, and I pray that we are walk in the truth we are given.

 

[Janice]

I posted this in another forum, but I might as well post it here as I see that there appears to be alot spirtual misconceptions concerning Haiti posted among several of the posters here.


God is no respector of persons. We are living in the last days whether you believe it or not, or are a Chrisitan or not. What hapenned in Haiti can happen anywhere else. Jesus said it himself, that he did not come to judge the world but to save them. So as far as anyone saying that these nations/countries that have undergone horrible natural disasters because of some sort of judgement for their sins, are inaccurate statments and certainly not biblical to begin with.


These natural disasters mark the beginning of ends times. They are not judgement on any nation. These natural disasters, famines, pestilences, will continue to happen in other countries and in increasing numbers as the end draws near to Jesus's second coming. Similar to how labour pains increase as a woman is close to delivery. God knows all. I'm no God but one thing for sure that I know is that he wouldn't have allowed Haiti to undergo it unless there was a greater purpose behind it,.. hence the purpose of salvation. Its sad and devasting that countless lives were lost, even lives of the missionaries working there, but in the wake of this tragedy many are turning to him.


Desperate times call for desperate measures and only God above knew that he would have to use such great disaters when the end was soon near to turn many ppl at huge numbers to him. He doesn't want anyone to be without excuse. By the grace and mercy of God, many in Haiti are praying and turing to him as a nation. This wasn't just a wake up call for Haiti but for those on the outside as well.

Jesus told those who felt that ppl or nations deserved judgement or were judged to "repent, lest you receive a harsher judgement". So please lets stop perpetuating the nonsensical statements as far as God is concerned. He already told us about these diasters and that is all they are, the marking of ends times. (Rd more of Luke 21, Mark 13)

 

[cutiebe2]

How many people have studied Orisha religions? To be completely honest, it can be compared in certain ways to Hinduism...and even Roman Catholicism. That's why the two have been melded to some extent in certain places, particularly in the Americas.

Adherents believe in one supreme god over all, who uses many deities to carry out his work. The aspect that tends to alarm people is the invoking of the deities (orishas) for communication. There are also believed to be evil spirits that can be invoked to harm individuals, if a particular person so chooses (also known as black magic).

You can find a mixture of orishas and saints in many places, as it doesn't seem different for people. Certain people have even mixed of orishas and Hindu deities.

Anyway, I don't agree with Voodoo or any other orisha religion and avoid spiritualism in any form. In my belief, those practices are not of God. At the same time, I am careful not to being insulting because if it wasn't for God's grace, where would I be? We all need the Lord, and I pray that we are walk in the truth we are given.

I agree 100%, especially with the bold

 

[cutiebe2]

What exactly was your point in resurrecting this thread in the first place? It's not going to change the fact of what voodoo is.. which is indeed darkness.


I'm speaking to you and any and everyone else who is wasting so much precious time and energy complaiing about what is being said about Haiti. Do what others are doing instead. Get up from the keyboard and get some money over there and keep it going.

Instead of pouting about what so and so said about Haiti and voodoo and who-doo, PRAY -- STOP wasting your time and words on what somebody said and use your words to keep praying.

These folks just had another earthquake ... 6.0 on the richter. For God's sake! Ignore the distractions and Pray. Stop complaining about what other folks have said and do something productive.

1. I did not bump this thread. I kept seeing it in the "new post" so I clicked on it and entered. And you are right, this thread is not about Haiti. I guess someone bumped it because of other thread? I don't know

2. I will say this very clearly. Do not question what I am doing for Haiti. If you read the post I have made over the past few months, I do a lot of work in Haiti. I went there last summer and will be going again to continue to the community health project that I have going with my school. I have attended national conferences and am setting up another event at my school as we speak, even though I am abroad right now (in DR, where I will probably get involved in Haitian human rights issues). I have done a whole lot more than texting $5 to yele so please do not disrepect me.

The comments in bold have honestly been the most disrespectful thing anyone has ever said to be on LHCF.

 

[divya]

1. I did not bump this thread. I kept seeing it in the "new post" so I clicked on it and entered. And you are right, this thread is not about Haiti. I guess someone bumped it because of other thread? I don't know

2. I will say this very clearly. Do not question what I am doing for Haiti. If you read the post I have made over the past few months, I do a lot of work in Haiti. I went there last summer and will be going again to continue to the community health project that I have going with my school. I have attended national conferences and am setting up another event at my school as we speak, even though I am abroad right now (in DR, where I will probably get involved in Haitian human rights issues). I have done a whole lot more than texting $5 to yele so please do not disrepect me.

The comments in bold have honestly been the most disrespectful thing anyone has ever said to be on LHCF.

Bless your heart. The thread was likely resurrected because someone answered the polled. Anyway, I was awaiting your response, being that you have been so active in the Caribbean region. It's really refreshing to see people - especially those of us of descending from the region - giving back. It's unfortunate that anyone would attempt to suggest that others must not be doing anything simply because they have chosen to disagree with certain statements made here. It's interesting that no thought was given to the fact that significant exposure may be what leads others to different conclusions. But then, sometimes that's what happens when you dare to perceive things differently...

Since I may fall under the everyone else who is spending time on this time (in other words, voicing disagreement), I also began give to Haiti before the earthquake. It was nothing more than giving clothes for the next mission/health-related trip and looking into going myself. Now there's all the more reason to go, of course.

Very sad that the Christian forum can be the place where someone experiences the worst disrespect, but guess we all have our issues. It's sometimes easier to point fingers than to do some self-examination. We have to pray for each other.

On another note, where are you in the DR? Are you able to see a lot of the movement of aid going through to Haiti?

 

[Laela]

Cutie,

When a poll is attached to a thread, each time someone votes it brings up the thread as 'new' even though there's no new comment. I figured with all the Haiti discussions someone voted and resuscitated the thread. It happens all the time.

It's good to see what you've been doing and are doing in Haiti. Reading your post, I'm humbly reminded that whatever we do for the least of us, we do for Christ.

1. I did not bump this thread. I kept seeing it in the "new post" so I clicked on it and entered. And you are right, this thread is not about Haiti. I guess someone bumped it because of other thread? I don't know

 

[cutiebe2]

Bless your heart. The thread was likely resurrected because someone answered the polled. Anyway, I was awaiting your response, being that you have been so active in the Caribbean region. It's really refreshing to see people - especially those of us of descending from the region - giving back. It's unfortunate that anyone would attempt to suggest that others must not be doing anything simply because they have chosen to disagree with certain statements made here. It's interesting that no thought was given to the fact that significant exposure may be what leads others to different conclusions. But then, sometimes that's what happens when you dare to perceive things differently...

Since I may fall under the everyone else who is spending time on this time (in other words, voicing disagreement), I also began give to Haiti before the earthquake. It was nothing more than giving clothes for the next mission/health-related trip and looking into going myself. Now there's all the more reason to go, of course.

Very sad that the Christian forum can be the place where someone experiences the worst disrespect, but guess we all have our issues. It's sometimes easier to point fingers than to do some self-examination. We have to pray for each other.

On another note, where are you in the DR? Are you able to see a lot of the movement of aid going through to Haiti?

thank you Divya
I am in Santo Domingo. There is tons of stuff being done here which is great considering the DR-Haiti issues. There are billboards up everywhere to donate, I get text messages everyday from my cellphone company telling me to donate and the DR gov is doing a lot it terms of supporting the Haitian gov. It actually touches me more than the US helping because 1. Dominicans had to overcome their issues and see whats importing (helping others) and 2. this may lead to new relations between the two countries and maybe even better treatment of Haitians in DR on a day to day basis

 

[Jenibo]

I literally screamed when you said you saw a black cat walking off on it's hind legs like it was nothing!!! Lord Jesus!!!

I have to tell a story and I hope and pray I do not scare anyone. I lived in the Caribbean and for anyone to say it's not real there, they're lying, honestly. They know. I had a neighbor who ran a pension (student housing) down the corner from me. My best friend took a room with her but I didn't want to because I had gotten my own kitchenette. The lady started giving me evil looks and I felt something was wrong. When I visited my bff there, she was just glaring at me...I took the hint and didn't come around inside anymore. Just waited for my friend outside when we wanted to go somewhere.

Things began happening to us in very strange ways. I lost all my book money - something impossible for me. Left my money in the ladies bathroom. Just mindlessness. Accidents and other unfortunate things were happening all over the place to me and my friend and suddenly. One evening, when I was walking her down the street to the pension, we just stopped and prayed and asked G-d to protect us because something was not right. We felt we needed to. All those bad things ceased.

It wasn't 2 weeks later that I later learned from the other students there that this woman dabbled in the occult, in black magic or something like it. She had children!!! Looked like a nice christian lady with a lovely home. Some of the girls left.

Another time in summer, I lived elsewhere when my family was remodeling and wasn't going to have students. This lady was a military person. The only available space was a bunk in her room. The house was full.

One evening, she was explaining to me about her Silva mind control. I was like, erplexed Okay. But I wasn't interested. We were conversing like normal and when I looked around at her...she had instantly fallen into a very deep sleep with a glassy look on her face...she had gone to another plane. I kid you not. Out of mind experiences. She was altering her conscience. I felt instant evil.

Later that night, I was awakened to something shaking the bunk bed and it happened twice. I also heard growling little voices in my ears. I sat up and looked out the hurricane window and there was a black cat slyly walking away on its hind legs . I picked up a rosary hanging above and started praying the Our Father. It went away. I told one of the girls about some strange happenings later and learned that not only she but another girl were witches, in that very house. Oy vey. When my family came back...I ran to them!!!! They prayed the rosary nightly. Very holy family.

That stuff is evil, ugly and real. But it's another level in the Caribbean and Africa. However, G-d is more powerful. It doesn't mean, though, that one will be untouched by evil. But I have seen evil things and I have experienced very holy things. I prefer the holy.

Moral? If you learn of something about someone like that, get moving fast. Do not delay. Pray without ceasing. Most of all, trust in Creator!!!

 

[Almaz]

Thank you my thoughts exactly. These same people that are saying how evil voodoo. Which came from Ifa and Indigenous AFRICAN religion is bad but some of these same people have Christmas trees in their homes and pay homage to the easter bunny. (Pagan) Not all but some.

I am saying I grew up in Africa and the Mid East and I have seen it in many forms. Also in my travels. Yes it may be powerful to some and others don't care.

Cause let me ask it is REALLY that powerful. They why are the people that usually practise it poor. Why couldn't the slaves used what they know to kill their oppressors? If people who I know personally are still practising it and if very successful with it is a white man. I see white people taking up IFA from which Voodoo (which means light came from)

I just wanna know if it is really that powerful then why are blacks as a whole still not quite there yet. We should be ruling.

Please clarify. I am sorry I am looking at this from a Non-christian stance so I am just asking for some clarity thats all

Voodoo is not "black magic" or evil

evil is evil
Voodoo has been propagandized to be an evil religion. Why? Because colonialist wanted to make sure that we thought everything that came from Africa was evil and bad. Voodoo is the religion of our ancestors. If you know what it really it you will not attack it.

To be clear, I am a Christian, and I do not participate in Voodoo. It is present in every place where there are African diaspora...from Lousiana to Venezuela and it makes my heart break to hear how there people had to hide in secret and were beaten for practicing what they believe it.

Black magic on the other hand is evil...but I don't know much about it. I have never come across it

 

[lilanie]

It is real enough for me to leave it and those who concern themselves with it - alone...

Angel Heart and Devil's Advocate put it in its proper perspective. (also two of the best movies that unintentionally advocate turning to Christ as your Lord/Saviour)

 

[Shimmie]

Someone must have 'voted' in the poll which bumped this thread.

 

[JaneBond007]

Honestly^^^. And for the record, the Christmas tree and Easter Bunny are not evil. Whichever is transformed for Christ is transformed for Christ. The symbolism is one thing, that of fertility. Madonna and Child new? Prefigured for eons. There is one authentic and is for salvation of mankind. The evergreen symbolizes everlasting life. Circumcision began in Egypt. It was transformed. So is the symbolism of the Pesach egg...transformed. This is nothing new. I'm not about to honor Ifa, which is not even remotely related to my African tribe to begin with. Those are separate g-ds.

Catholics do not worship separate g-ds and the saints are venerated, not worshipped. We do not have a hierarchy of g-ds with a primary one and millions of lesser ones. Caribbean religion is a syncretism. When a symbol is transformed into usage in a religion, it is not syncretism or two distinct beliefs or one covering for a secretive other. Afterall, G-d uses the spiritual and the physical and the latter is likewise a blessing that can explain the former. But when something is covering for another religious system - meant, actual worship of other g-ds, as in the religious practices of using catholic saints to represent non-catholic religion and other g-ds, that is apples and oranges. Ifa is not the African American's "true religion." One's true religion is what one desires today. There were plenty of christians and muslims on those slave ships.

I know that people do not have understanding so I won't be angry but let us gain understanding before we expound incorrectly on things we have no interest nor knowledge about. For the record, voudoun is the anti-thesis of faith.

----------------

For the record, spiritual manipulation as in trying to control for oneself or for another is either white magic or black magic. Black magic attempts to inflict harm. They are both wrong in that G-d is the one to look to and not self. Voudoun is "real" because anything the devil wishes to destroy (us human beings) can be given "power" so that humans will think they have control and will believe in it.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Honestly^^^. And for the record, the Christmas tree and Easter Bunny are not evil. Whichever is transformed for Christ is transformed for Christ. The symbolism is one thing, that of fertility. Madonna and Child new? Prefigured for eons. There is one authentic and is for salvation of mankind. The evergreen symbolizes everlasting life. Circumcision began in Egypt. It was transformed. So is the symbolism of the Pesach egg...transformed. This is nothing new. I'm not about to honor Ifa, which is not even remotely related to my African tribe to begin with. Those are separate g-ds.

Catholics do not worship separate g-ds and the saints are venerated, not worshipped. We do not have a hierarchy of g-ds with a primary one and millions of lesser ones. Caribbean religion is a syncretism. When a symbol is transformed into usage in a religion, it is not syncretism or two distinct beliefs or one covering for a secretive other. Afterall, G-d uses the spiritual and the physical and the latter is likewise a blessing that can explain the former. But when something is covering for another religious system - meant, actual worship of other g-ds, as in the religious practices of using catholic saints to represent non-catholic religion and other g-ds, that is apples and oranges. Ifa is not the African American's "true religion." One's true religion is what one desires today. There were plenty of christians and muslims on those slave ships.

I know that people do not have understanding so I won't be angry but let us gain understanding before we expound incorrectly on things we have no interest nor knowledge about. For the record, voudoun is the anti-thesis of faith.

----------------

For the record, spiritual manipulation as in trying to control for oneself or for another is either white magic or black magic. Black magic attempts to inflict harm. They are both wrong in that G-d is the one to look to and not self. Voudoun is "real" because anything the devil wishes to destroy (us human beings) can be given "power" so that humans will think they have control and will believe in it.

JaneBond007 For clarification, are you saying that the Christmas tree and easter bunny have been transformed for Christ? If so, where did Christ transform them to make them symbols for Himself and what purpose do they serve? What is the purpose of taking pagan symbolism and trying to "transform" it for Christ. Let's not use examples of cultures who had practices that are also mentioned in the Bible such as circumcision. God is the sovereign creator. He has no need to copy pagan customs.

 

[JaneBond007]

The symbolism of representing fertility (body of Christ, winning souls for Christ) and the tree (evergreens, eternal life) make them not sinful. Jesus never said, "don't get on the Internet, there's porn in other sites, it's pagan." The Internet can be used for Christ and it is. I'm not going to involve myself into legalism. We have sacramentals of the physical which can be a vehicle of blessing into the spiritual realm. G-d created this earth as He has and many lessons of the scripture as we have them today have been prefigured long before Abraham.

 

[Shimmie]

Just an FYI:

Each time someone discovers this thread and votes in the attached poll, it bumps the thread.

So just in case someone wonders why the date of the latest post is not recent, that's why.

God bless...
Shimmie