Just because I'm a 3b, my advise doesn't matter??? RANT!

[jennboo]

If it's really the big of a deal, I wonder why I got some banging advice from *gasp* RELAXED ladies here that actually worked on my natural hair. Must've been a fluke.

No one is saying that what works for straighter textures absolutely cannot work for more textured hair. Folks just need to quit playin' and acknowledge the fact that all hair textures and types will not respond the same way to things. Folks who make a conscious effort to seek out advice from people whose hair textures look more like their own recognize this.
General, common sense info (like making sure to lubricate the hair and keep it clean) is fine and can transcend textures. However, specific techniques and products will not affect the hair in the same way across textures...and thats fine...nothing wrong with it.

 

[Fine 4s]

I take advice from er'ybody!

HOWEVER, I also intuitively know what's good for my hair. Something I think we all must strive towards and the rest (ie information that you KNOW won't work) simply...doesn't affect us anymore and we can be grateful for being a lil' bit wiser

 

[empressri]

No one is saying that what works for straighter textures absolutely cannot work for more textured hair. Folks just need to quit playin' and acknowledge the fact that all hair textures and types will not respond the same way to things. Folks who make a conscious effort to seek out advice from people whose hair textures look more like their own recognize this.
General, common sense info (like making sure to lubricate the hair and keep it clean) is fine and can transcend textures. However, specific techniques and products will not affect the hair in the same way across textures...and thats fine...nothing wrong with it.

Well that goes without saying. I'm not going to tell a 4b to wrap her hair around her head and let it dry to get it straight like a sister that's relaxed can do.

And this is why I don't offer advice on my own. Ask me if you want, but if you want to talk smack afterwards then just leave me the hell alone.

 

[jennboo]

Well that goes without saying. I'm not going to tell a 4b to wrap her hair around her head and let it dry to get it straight like a sister that's relaxed can do.

Thank you! That's all im sayin' lol.

 

[empressri]

Thank you! That's all im sayin' lol.

lol im not talking about the impossible though, i can't see someone giving some crazy advice like that (but you never know)

for instance, if you have a tight TIGHT z pattern, im not going to say "trying empressri's blue fondue hair goop! you'll get soft, cascading waves that will put celebrities to shame!"

nah, aint happening.

but the possible, like what conditioners are good or how to condition, xyz. it's not the curl pattern or kink pattern or whatever else hair pattern that decides if a product (again not talking about styling products) work. cause i've seen women of all different races use the same product, and then two other women, same race same hair type, and one loved the product while the other hated it.

 

[sylver2]

Well that goes without saying. I'm not going to tell a 4b to wrap her hair around her head and let it dry to get it straight like a sister that's relaxed can do.

And this is why I don't offer advice on my own. Ask me if you want, but if you want to talk smack afterwards then just leave me the hell alone.

lol..i can't do that. hair never dried straight like that.

 

[andromeda]

It is reasonable for people, especially those new to haircare, to give more consideration to the advice of those who they can relate to hair-wise.

It's really a matter of knowing which advice is generally applicable and which advice is not and, moreover, how certain recommendations correlate to certain specific properties of hair.

I think that people need to get beyond curl-size when considering who they can relate to hair-wise. Yes, we shouldn't be indiscriminate in which advice we take, just for the sake of being "fair" or "politically correct". BUT we need to realize that a 4a/b might have some things in common with a 3b - porosity, strand size, density, texture, etc - that they might not necessarily have in common with other 4a/bs.

So, while it's reasonable to prioritize certain advice based on hair type, we need to expand our definition of what constitutes a hair type.

And for those of us who are in a position to give advice, esp cosmetologists, we should acknowledge these reasonable tendencies and tailor how we explain our advice accordingly. I think it really comes down to emphasizing "why" and "how" over "what".

 

[dicapr]

I'm 4a/b and I think the whole thing that our hair type is sooo much different than other hair types is more hype than fact. I tried to follow the advice geared toward my "type" and ended up with a dry, matted, tangled mess. Good advice is good advice no matter the curl pattern. I would rather listen to a 3a with fine strands than a 4b with thick strands. When I stopped trying to take care of my hair according to my type and started focusing on strand density my natural hair turned around.

 

[Neith]

I pay more attention to people who have type 4 hair myself when it comes to some things. I have asked for specific help with my hair type too.

I would never say that type 4 and type 3 hair are exactly alike. That'd be dumb. Not even all type 4's are exactly alike.

Of course you listen and talk with people who have similar hair as you.

Of course you may not use the same products and techniques as the next person. That goes without saying.


That doesn't mean that there is absolutely no common ground. We're all here to learn. "They" can learn from "us" and "we" can learn from "them"

It just seems very closeminded to me to not even give someone a chance because of their curl pattern.

You don't know what they know... they may be able to help or give you an idea you wouldn't have come up with on your own.

What you know isn't determined by your hair type.

That's supposed to be what a board like this is for. ALL of us together will be able to come forth with more information and more ideas. Good for all "sides"

Just don't see why there has to be such a division sometimes. It's truly sad.

 

[andromeda]

I'm 4a/b and I think the whole thing that our hair type is sooo much different than other hair types is more hype than fact. I tried to follow the advice geared toward my "type" and ended up with a dry, matted, tangled mess. Good advice is good advice no matter the curl pattern. I would rather listen to a 3a with fine strands than a 4b with thick strands. When I stopped trying to take care of my hair according to my type and started focusing on strand density my natural hair turned around.

Exactly! And I def agree with you on the fine vs. coarse strands bit. I meant to include that as one of the other factors that people with diff curl sizes can have in common and that accounts significantly for why certain products and techniques work.

 

[Diva_Esq]

I agree with you, I'm 3c and I get tired of the mixed comments....my mom fought with my hair all the time which is why it was relaxed most of my life....then I transtioned and am natural. I had a long learning curve with managing my hair. I have learned so much from others that don't have my hair type and applied it to my reggie. Moisture is important for highly textured hair.

I agree! I'm sick of the mixed/ easy for you cuz you have good hair/ I would've been natural a long time ago if I had your hair comments! Build a bridge and get over the jiggaboo vs. wannabe stuff! I don't like people trying to illegitimize my transition and my naturality. And when I'm trying to explain universal concepts to people that apply across the board (protective styling, moisture/ protein balance, etc.), don't act like what I'm saying is incorrect b/c my curl pattern is not similar to yours!

Whew! Thanks for the vent!

 

[yardgirl]

I understand where she's coming from. I take my inspiration from women with my hair type.

 

[Vashti]

I can understand not always taking advice from people with different textured hair, but type 4rs MUST stay on top of our moisturizing game unless we don't mind unhealthy, broken off hair, so OP gave her some good advice. She just wasn't in the right headspace to listen and that happens all of the time. You can have the same hair texture or curl pattern as the person you are giving hair advice to but they have to be willing to listen. Most people don't care as much about their hair as we do so they don't listen. Even when their texture is similar or the same as ours.

But there is something important I've learned from all women who take good care of their hair, no matter their hair texture or race and that's establishing a good diet, a good hair care regimen and sticking to it. You can learn that from a type 1 or a type 4.

 

[havilland]

that's a shame. some people just don't want to let go of themselves and learn.

my hair is 3c. i have had type 1 hair caucasian stylists give me good advice, and i have had stylists whose hair was just like mine give me crap advice. it's the advice and the expertise that matters.

my question to ALL stylists regardless of their hair type, color or the salon they work in......

"are you familiar with my hair type?"

period. end of story.

that's all that should matter. you keep giving good advice to your clients who will listen and forget the rest of them...they will be back. (hopefully)

 

[Lovelylife]

She didn't say that wasn't good advice, she just said that it was easy for you. A lot easier said and done for your hair than hers. When I was natural I cowashed and deep conditioned daily but it was still hard to retain moisture.

 

[Hairsofab]

This topic comes up here from time to time. Yes I do take people who have significantly loser texture hair advice with a grain of salt.

 

[Hairsofab]

She didn't say that wasn't good advice, she just said that it was easy for you. A lot easier said and done for your hair than hers. When I was natural I cowashed and deep conditioned daily but it was still hard to retain moisture.

Moisture is a big issue for me. Like my sister is a 3c/4a. It is a lot easier for her to keep her hair moisturized than me. Sometimes she'll say, all you have to do is "xyz" to moisturize because for her yes all she has to do ix xyz and her hair will stay moisturized for days. But with my hair type I can't do the same thing. I still have issues retaining moisture. I only was able to retain moisture throughout the day after I texturized my hair.

 

[lexiwiththecurls]

I get the same comments like the OP stated and Im 4a/3c... "Oh you don't understand because my hair won't look like yours"...with certain people, I don't even try to give tips because some people who don't know ANYTHING about hair probably would make a comment like that, especially if the tip was on something general like moisture, trimming, etc... I could see if she said "You should try the same products I use to get my curls", then that would definitely warrant the person to not take the advice because their hair is completely different. But I do understand where you are coming from...but I will say I get mad when people tell me on YT that I should get Terri's book or do her method--Im thinking..are you blind?? My hair is nothing like hers so why would I think her methods would work on my hair.--but then I have to realize the people giving me these tips don't know anything about the different types of natural hair. Me and another YTer have long convos about this....I just don't give tips unless asked because I get tired of hearing those type of comments from people you are trying to help...

 

[Lovelylife]

Moisture is a big issue for me. Like my sister is a 3c/4a. It is a lot easier for her to keep her hair moisturized than me. Sometimes she'll say, all you have to do is "xyz" to moisturize because for her yes all she has to do ix xyz and her hair will stay moisturized for days. But with my hair type I can't do the same thing. I still have issues retaining moisture. I only was able to retain moisture throughout the day after I texturized my hair.

I agree. I relax my hair about twice a year now. Just having less volume helps me retain moisture. I sorry that people can't understand this.

 

[cdawnlewis]

I understand you were offended because I would have been too. But, don't feel bad or think she is ignorant. I have read her sentiments right here on this site. Some folks just don't want to take advice from individuals who don't have their hair type even on LHCF. So I wouldn't expect a random person with 4 a/b hair IRL to be enthused about taking advice from a type 3 or looser curl pattern.

To be the best stylist you can be you have to find ways to educate your clients by seeing things from their perspective. Try showing them other clients you have with their hair type and explain what those customers did to transition or get healthy hair or whatever.

Also, give more of an explanation as to why your advice should be followed. Say something "like afro textured hair tends to be very dry and break off easily. So keeping your hair moisturized would help retain length. Also, keeping the hair from rubbing up against your clothes by bunning is another way....blah blah blah" This way your advice is more directed specifically to that client. Hopefully, that made sense to you. (not trying to tell you how to talk to your clients but people tend to respond better when things are broken down to them and addresses their personal concerns).

Sometimes you have to say things in a way that will make people want to listen to you. In your line of work that's important.

I did tell her about tighter curls needing extra moisture, yadda yadda, how to twist outs can help, yadda yadda, breakage, protein/moisture balance, but nope she was not having it! I agree, you do have to say things in a way that people will want to listen to you, I've just never had this happen to me lol

 

[Lovelylife]

I did tell her about tighter curls needing extra moisture, yadda yadda, how to twist outs can help, yadda yadda, breakage, protein/moisture balance, but nope she was not having it! I agree, you do have to say things in a way that people will want to listen to you, I've just never had this happen to me lol

Don't worry. It's probably at the back of her mind. You just got her knee jerk reaction. She'll look it up later.

 

[Naturallista]

Why are we in here acting like 4b hair acts and responds to things exactly the same as type 3b hair? I mean really, is it to be PC?

OP, the advice you gave about moisturizing and protective styling is fantastic and is a general rule of thumb for all textured hair. Cool. However, if you were to tell me that a specific moisturizer or product XYZ has done wonders for YOUR hair, I'd be skeptical about its effects on MY type of hair.

I honestly am much more likely to take hair advice, if it makes sense, from a person with my texture hair over someone with straighter or silkier hair...that kinda makes sense to me Even when viewing youtube vids for styling methods and product reviews, i take heed to people like Cynthiarf and Rustic Beauty over folks like curly chronicles because the latter referenced folk have hair like mine.

I mean if a person with type 1 straight hair gave a 3b head advice and touted how White Rain shampoo is spectacular and that there is no need to moisturize and that you shoud wash your hair twice a day you'd be like heck no, lol.

I tend to agree with you on this, but the OP stated that this woman came to her for advise because of her background... Why ask and then discount? People are so strange to me erplexed

 

[knt1229]

I did tell her about tighter curls needing extra moisture, yadda yadda, how to twist outs can help, yadda yadda, breakage, protein/moisture balance, but nope she was not having it! I agree, you do have to say things in a way that people will want to listen to you, I've just never had this happen to me lol

Oh well.... You tried. Charge it to the game and KIM.

ETA: You must be doing something right if this is the first time someone has said this to you. Maybe she will come around eventually.

 

[Christina Dior]

mehhh i typically only click on threads and take advice from healthy haired 4z's.. shoot me. lol

 

[EccentricRed]

Sad situation, but don't waste your energy on it...If you didn't want to hear what I had to say, then YOU shouldn't have asked ME...Ugh!

I agree with my hair twin!

 

[vainღ♥♡jane]

goingnatural did a thread like this a while ago. i'm sorry you feel your advice is unappreciated. ♥

 

[JaszyFaye]

She doesn't feel like she can relate to you. I would feel a certain way too. Especially if this was my first transition and new nothing about being natural.

Now I'm more educated but if that were me back then, I would give you the side eye too.

ITA. I can kinda understand where your friend is coming from. I know I have a tendency to get advice from people whose hair looks just like my hair and, unintentionally disregard advice from people whose hair doesn't look like my hair. Most of us have used the "your hair is easier to style" b/c xyz reason. I know, I used to argue with a friend because she had long 3b/3c hair and I have short 4a/4b hair and she would tell me my hair is easier to style because it's short and I would say just the opposite.

But I really wouldn't get to worked up over it. You tried, charge it.

 

[vainღ♥♡jane]

here is her thread if you want to read it. ♥

RANT: do i have to be a type 4 for or highly textured for people irl to take my advice?

 

[Vshanell]

I totally agree with this entire post especially with the bolded and ESPECIALLY when it comes to issues of transitioning long term. Hair is hair may be the PC to say but the truth is napptural 4a/b hair behaves dramatically different than the 3's. It even grows out of heads differently lol (meaning our hair grows up and out rather than down.)

A type 3 WILL have an easier time transitioning than a type 4. Not invalidating type 3 struggles and not saying it's EASY just easier. Most type 3's can blend the 2 textures and detangle easier than a type 4 will. Most type 3's will never have to deal with single strand knots. Basic hair 101 type of advice can span across all hair types but type 4's have very unique issues that other types truly don't.

And yes I'm one of those ignant people that would take hair advice on type 4 specific issues from someone like Rustic Beauty or BlackMasterPiece before someone with type 2 or 3 hair.

I agree with most of your post girl but the ssk's.....I think I have one on every strand of my hair.....some have up to 3!!!!! If it curls it will knot.

 

[Vshanell]

If it's really the big of a deal, I wonder why I got some banging advice from *gasp* RELAXED ladies here that actually worked on my natural hair. Must've been a fluke.

Me too. And some of the best advise from natural type 4's. When i started my hair journey I didn't have the mentality of putting myself in a type box....it wasn't even on my radar so it baffles me at how many people start out that way on the boards. I was just so excited about learning about hair, I didn't think to shut anyone out because of type. I listened to everyone of all textures, it was insane the amount of products and techniques I tried learning from everyone. Great learning experience.

And I'm still learning and taking advise from everyone. You guys should see who I follow on youtube. I have texutres from Taren to RusticBeauty and everyone in between.