Is hair texture the new paper bag test???

[Supervixen]

If you're talking about another's ancestry, there's a better chance THEY know where it comes from that you would, right? Nobody knows anything fo sho...mama's baby...papa's MAYBE!

I gotta be honest, If you take me back to 1850 and how Massa Willie was your great great great great g'ma's daddy, I'm kinda NOT LISTENING.

 

[Irresistible]

whew! didnt know there were so many strong feelings over this subject or that there was a silent/quiet storm brewing over hair types til now.

is there a happy medium we can all reach ? can we all agree that:

a. we are all beautiful !!!

b. for the sake of culture, all are welcome

c. no one is perfect

d. to make mistakes goes with the territory of being human

e. a lack of others clicking thanks to your post does not mean your input has a lesser value or was not appreciated.

f. we all have something wonderful to offer.

g. your hair does not define how awesome of a person you are.

we can dream

 

[Almaz]

I don't get it cause Rosa Parks for sure could have passed for something and even SHE had to sit on the back of the bus. Light skinned darked skinned light bright almost like white to Ebony Black didn't Black folks no matter what colour they are go through hell in America anyway. So what is the difference it Mr. Charlie was swinging you up on a tree he did not give a damn as to how light or how dark you are and the white ancestors in your family

Why should we. Are we ever going to move on from that mess. Black people did not make those rules but it is time for those rules to be squashed

 

[happylife]

we can dream

true, true....or commit

 

[LadyRaider]

OT: Happy Life: I like your Siggy.

 

[Neith]

or commit.......

I hate to say it, but to me it seems hopeless.

Maybe it's just a part of human nature to divide, exclude and have prejudices. No matter what group of people you look at, it's always present.

 

[happylife]

OT: Happy Life: I like your Siggy.

ot: roll tide!

 

[happylife]

I hate to say it, but to me it seems hopeless.

Maybe it's just a part of human nature to divide, exclude and have prejudices. No matter what group of people you look at, it's always present.

i dunno. just thought it might be something to chew on

 

[dynamic1]

This is my last post in here b/c I can see where this is going (accusing people of lying about their hair type). I just want to say that you (in general) can't claim that the good hair/bad hair myth needs to change and then continue behaviors that perpetuate it.

People cannot see how their own value judgments are equivalent to the accusations they make…projection indeed. I try to give others the benefit of the doubt and try not to guess intentions but jeez Louise.
I doubt people would complain if a 4a claimed his or her 4b patch, calling themselves 4a/4b. Would they be “liars” as well?

Offtopic : Everyone's "other" ancestry did not originate during slavery and was not the result of a liaison with the massa or rape. Some people coexisted with their great great grandparent(s). Stating ancestry does not necessarily indicate the individual thinks they are somehow "better". I hope my great great grandbabies don't count me out.

 

[Rain20]

I vote to abolish hair typing on LHCF. Instead describe hair in terms of dry, cottony, porous, breaking. Lets make 2010 hair type free on the board. This thread really is disturbing.

 

[happylife]

What has hair typing done good for us?

If its only divided us ,then yeah let it kick rocks

 

[Neith]

It's not the hair typing that is fueling this though. It adds another layer, but this mentality still going to be there.

Like many others have said... this issue has been around way longer than Andre.

I dunno... it just sucks. lol

 

[AvaSpeaks]

What if it's the truth? If people INSIST that to know where you got your trait and you tell them the truth, why is this considered a fault? If they didn't ask, I hear ya, but people ask and often. I've literally seen people insist here that someone IS mixed even when they say they aren't...so what's the solution?

BTW, genetics isn't as selective about where it asserts itself as the one drop rule! One gen or 5...genetics can throw curve balls whether society can deal or not!

I think the problem is that sometimes when people pinpoint a trait that society or they themselves would consider "desirable", then it's usually traced back to some ancestor that is not Black.

But what if that trait came from a Black ancestor? I mean African genes had so much diversity just by itself way before colonialism enter into the picture. Maybe we have beautiful hair because of them and not necessarily because of a European, Asian or Native influence.

I mean at least that's how some people would see it

 

[happylife]

It's not the hair typing that is fueling this though. It adds another layer, but this mentality still going to be there.

Like many others have said... this issue has been around way longer than Andre.

I dunno... it just sucks. lol

I think I understand what you are saying. But as long as hair types can be misread then what use could they serve other than to divide?

 

[LadyRaider]

Interesting, Ava Speaks.

African Americans ARE a mixed raced. I would bet that 99.4 percent of us are not pure African. How come we can't be proud that we are mixed like the other African-descendants in the Americas?

I know, I know. We were beat down for being African in the first place, so to now be proud of our mixed heritage would seem somehow like forsaking the struggle of our forefathers. But then again, because of our past mistreatment, we not can't accept who we are?

But we ARE different than Africans. I can tell the difference immediately from an African and an African American... just by looking at them. We come from the same place but we are not the same.

I read some research once that traced the genetic lineage of African American males and the majority could be traced to European ancestry.

 

[ceebee3]

Interesting, Ava Speaks.

African Americans ARE a mixed raced. I would bet that 99.4 percent of us are not pure African. How come we can't be proud that we are mixed like the other African-descendants in the Americas?

I know, I know. We were beat down for being African in the first place, so to now be proud of our mixed heritage would seem somehow like forsaking the struggle of our forefathers. But then again, because of our past mistreatment, we not can't accept who we are?

But we ARE different than Africans. I can tell the difference immediately from an African and an African American... just by looking at them. We come from the same place but we are not the same.

I read some research once that traced the genetic lineage of African American males and the majority could be traced to European ancestry.

All the racial mixing in the world is still not going to change who we are. It doesnt matter how many other races you descended from, African-Americans are not that different from Africans.

We are far more equal than we are seperate.

 

[Foxglove]

What has hair typing done good for us?

If its only divided us ,then yeah let it kick rocks

Hair typing isn't all bad. I used to wonder why my hair didn't do the things other members mention like straighten at 300-anything degrees or laying down the edges with just water/moisturizer, stuff like that
I also use it as a rough (I said rough) guideline to products
I wouldn't use it to say my hair is better/worse than somebody else's
It just helps me as far as ruling out methods of detangling, styling, etc that other types do that isn't possible with my hair

 

[LunadeMiel]

 

[BeetleBug]

this thread is still here? i thought it would have died down already.

 

[LadyRaider]

Ceebee,

Mexicans rightly claim a heritage that is Spanish and Native American. But I think being proud of that part of us is denied to us because of how it happened. I identify with Africa because that is my obvious heritage. But the struggle... the struggle that we inherit is purely an African American one. If you tried to drop me off in the middle of the most western-like city in Africa, I'd probably die of culture shock.

Just speculating. I don't know.

 

[HeChangedMyName]

Great thread topic. and I feel that yes it is. we don't say "good hair" anymore because it is not pc, but we say speak all about our types and which ones are better and easier to manage and so on and so forth. So, yep.

 

[ceebee3]

Ceebee,

Mexicans rightly claim a heritage that is Spanish and Native American. But I think being proud of that part of us is denied to us because of how it happened. I identify with Africa because that is my obvious heritage. But the struggle... the struggle that we inherit is purely an African American one. If you tried to drop me off in the middle of the most western-like city in Africa, I'd probably die of culture shock.

Just speculating. I don't know.

I don't think there's anything wrong with acknowledging who you are or where your ancestors came from.

African Americans do have a different struggle, but to say they are a different race from Africans does not make sense.

I really can't concern myself on which groups anyone chooses to identify with, that's an individual thing but I'm not going to agree that African Americans are so different from other blacks across the globe.

 

[Liege4421]

I think the intentions of the hair typing were good (to help people determine how to take care of their hair, or what types of products would work best on their hair). However, just like any tool, if used in a negative way, the results will be devisive, which some people have noticed on this forum.

As an aside (a little off topic), I have noticed some threads have become more and more combative. I'm not sure where this animosity is coming from; I know it is difficult to keep emotions in check when discussing a topic that one cares about, but sometimes I feel like people are responding to each other as if their livelihood were at stake. This is a forum and it only works when people feel like they can state their opinion, however controversial, without being attacked. Otherwise, it will just be a board of people saying the same stuff to the same people over and over again.

That being said, we have to remember that free speech doesn't offer carte blanche to say whatever we want in any fashion we want; as an example, it's not the hair typing system itself that is divisive, it is how it is employed by some people that is devisive. In much the same way, EVERY MESSAGE can be conveyed in a non-combative, mutually respecting way and EVERY MESSAGE can be conveyed in an aggressive, hurtful way. I tend to lurk, and I must add it's not as fun reading comments where we are being nasty to one another.

Finally, I know I'm not perfect myself, so I don't mean this to be a judgemental rant. I hope it is not taken in that way, and I apologize in advance if my comment causes any offense.

 

[almond eyes]

I keep saying........curly, wavy, coily, springy, spongey, cottony or wool and combination hair. Andre didn't realise all the confusion he has caused years later unintentionally. The typing system is too confined. This is why I wrote a thread many months ago that I didn't like the hair typing system. I only typed my own hair in past posts when asked so that others who thought they had my own particular issue might be able to learn something from me.

Other than that, I'm not saying aything else.

Best,
Almond Eyes

 

[LadyRaider]

I don't think there's anything wrong with acknowledging who you are or where your ancestors came from.

African Americans do have a different struggle, but to say they are a different race from Africans does not make sense.

I really can't concern myself on which groups anyone chooses to identify with, that's an individual thing but I'm not going to agree that African Americans are so different from other blacks across the globe.

Ah... well I'm the one that is always posting this link:

http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm

So I wasn't really talking about race per se. I think I was talking more about ethnicity... because that is a geographical, social thing. We can agree to disagree. I think we are very different than African blacks. 400+ years and several generations different. And you are right to say race/ethnicity depends about 90 percent on how you choose to identify.

What made me think about all of this is Latinos. Are all Latinos the same "race?" Are the Mexicans and Brazillians and Pueto Ricans the same? It's the Latinos that really blew the lid of the idea of "race" for me.

Iraqis and Swedes are both "white." Are they the same "race?"

 

[ceebee3]

Of course there are distinguishing factors regarding ethnicity, that's within every race.

A Latino is simply someone from Latin America, just like an American is simply someone from North America.

How would you know what race they identify with?

 

[chrisanddonniesmommy]

A Latino is one that identifies with the Latin Diaspora. They can from the Caribbean, Latin America, Central America, etc. It's an ethnicity, not a race. You have Asian Latinos, Black Latinos, White Latinos, and so on.

 

[Kurlee]

If Andre is strictly about curl size, that is a lot simplier than what it seems like LHCF tries to do. I really think people try to add texture to it, which makes it confusing. Granted it's just curl size and not texture, I think this board has a wide variety of types 2-4.

I was just about to post this. It's not that hard. 1 is straight, 2 is wavy, 3 is curly, 4a = tightest curls, 4b = fuzzy, underfined, z pattern. 3-4a are curls getting progressively smaller. Choose which one is CLOSEST to urs and keep it moving. It is not hard. How fine, coarse, medium, silky, your hair is, is irrelevant..... curl size from biggest to smallest to non existent.

 

[Kurlee]

Umm...what if they WERE Indian?! Why such bigotry? This statement is pure bigotry, sorry.

it doesn't count unless u "look" the part

 

[Supervixen]

Ah... well I'm the one that is always posting this link:

http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm

So I wasn't really talking about race per se. I think I was talking more about ethnicity... because that is a geographical, social thing. We can agree to disagree. I think we are very different than African blacks. 400+ years and several generations different. And you are right to say race/ethnicity depends about 90 percent on how you choose to identify.

What made me think about all of this is Latinos. Are all Latinos the same "race?" Are the Mexicans and Brazillians and Pueto Ricans the same? It's the Latinos that really blew the lid of the idea of "race" for me.

Iraqis and Swedes are both "white." Are they the same "race?"

RACES: Caucasoid, Negroid, Mongoloid

To my understanding everything else is culture or ethnicity.