Possible protein-sensitive hair with breakage ... what to do??!!

[jcanalena79]

So, I do have some breakage, and have been using protein trtmts (DT: Apoghee, La Bomba Avocado, Silicon Mix; Leave-in: Joico K-pak Reconstructer Leave-in, Apoghee Keratin and Green Tea Mist) but my hair CONSISTENTLY feels hard and wiry after applying (and rinsing, in the case of the DTs) these trtmts. I only used each protein leave-in once b/c of how horrible my hair felt. They were leave-ins but I had to wash them out of my hair. The DTs had the same result. The issue? I STILL have breakage. I have a TON of hair so you can't really tell that it's breaking, but I see shorter pieces than my usual length that I shed when I do my hair. It's not a ton, but they are there. How do I end breakage if I can't use protein trtmts??!

 

[Esq.2B]

I'm not sure that you can't use protein treatments. No one can over use protein and it appears you may have done so, causing protein overload. What is your weekly/bi-weekly regimen. I need the specifics on the steps and the products used.

 

[IDareT'sHair]

My Question:

Are you following up each Protein Treatment with a Moisturizing Deep Conditioning Treatment? Moisture should always follow Protein.

You may also want to switch to something extremely lightweight and perhaps even a reconstructor for your protein until you get your hair back on track like: Giovanni Nutra-Fix or even AO GPB may also be good to incorporate for a while which will offer you both Protein & Moisture.

Or you could solely use moisturize for your DC'er but use a lighter protein for your daily leave-in treatments.

 

[equestrian]

So, I do have some breakage, and have been using protein trtmts (DT: Apoghee, La Bomba Avocado, Silicon Mix; Leave-in: Joico K-pak Reconstructer Leave-in, Apoghee Keratin and Green Tea Mist) but my hair CONSISTENTLY feels hard and wiry after applying (and rinsing, in the case of the DTs) these trtmts. I only used each protein leave-in once b/c of how horrible my hair felt. They were leave-ins but I had to wash them out of my hair. The DTs had the same result. The issue? I STILL have breakage. I have a TON of hair so you can't really tell that it's breaking, but I see shorter pieces than my usual length that I shed when I do my hair. It's not a ton, but they are there. How do I end breakage if I can't use protein trtmts??!

Do some deep conditioning.

 

[Demi27]

My hair is VERY protein sensitive. I really can't use any.
I would suggest DC'g with moisture at least once a week until you can get your hair back on track. That's what I had to do, and my hair got back on track.

Just make sure that you're using a true moisturizing shampoo and not one that says moisturizing, but it's really protein.

 

[Natirelle]

I dont use protein treatments or conditioner anymore, Even if I follow with a deep conditioner I still get dry breaking hair. No matter what type of reconstructner or light weight etc my hair wont allow it. So I just deep condition and my hair is retaining length.

 

[jcanalena79]

I'm not sure that you can't use protein treatments. No one can over use protein and it appears you may have done so, causing protein overload. What is your weekly/bi-weekly regimen. I need the specifics on the steps and the products used.

I didn't apply the trtmts all at the same time. One week I tried Apoghee 2-step. Some days later, tried Silicon Mix. BOTH times followed up with moisturizing DCs and was super-heavy handed with my regular moisturizing regime. Those helped restore the softness, but the concern is that after the treatments my hair was no better and after rinsing them my hair felt horrendous.

As far as the leave-ins go ... I only used each once, each occasion separated by two weeks or so. Had to rinse them out my hair felt so wiry and hard.

My Question:

Are you following up each Protein Treatment with a Moisturizing Deep Conditioning Treatment? Moisture should always follow Protein.

You may also want to switch to something extremely lightweight and perhaps even a reconstructor for your protein until you get your hair back on track like: Giovanni Nutra-Fix or even AO GPB may also be good to incorporate for a while which will offer you both Protein & Moisture.

Or you could solely use moisturize for your DC'er but use a lighter protein for your daily leave-in treatments.

Yep ... followed with a moisture trmt including honey, which, when used without doing a protein trmt first, leaves my hair heavenly. I read that the Joico K-pak was a light protein trtmt ... Also, I forgot - I do have Giovanni Nutra-Fix - it does nothing for my hair regarding repair. I must say my hair wasn't as wiry feeling as it was with the others.

 

[jcanalena79]

My hair is VERY protein sensitive. I really can't use any.
I would suggest DC'g with moisture at least once a week until you can get your hair back on track. That's what I had to do, and my hair got back on track.

Just make sure that you're using a true moisturizing shampoo and not one that says moisturizing, but it's really protein.

I dont use protein treatments or conditioner anymore, Even if I follow with a deep conditioner I still get dry breaking hair. No matter what type of reconstructner or light weight etc my hair wont allow it. So I just deep condition and my hair is retaining length.

I may have to do that and pray that it gets back on track with just the moisture. I was considering trying Nexxus Emergencee as my last resort, just to say that I really did make a concerted effort re: repair. I may do that anyway, and if it works, great. If not, then do as you both suggest and just up my moisturizing DC trtmts (though I currently do one at least once a week).

 

[IDareT'sHair]

I personally consider K-Pak as a Medium Protein Treatment like on the lines of a Nexxus Keraphix etc.....

Are you following the directions? Some people use products that say 1-3 minutes, 3-5 minutes and leave them on an hour????

Do you or have you Clarified? Are you familiar with your Hair's Porosity?

Have you tried a Hot Oil Treatment? OR possibly mixing a penetrateable Oil in with your DC'ers?

ETA: I went back and re-read your Post. Is it Shedding? Or is it Breakage?

 

[omachine]

i had a similar issue....i just did an aphrogee 2 minute reconstructor treatment on friday for the first time and i literally almost passed out...my cousin, who is a nurse told me that i had had an allergic reaction...i felt nauseous most of saturday and spent the majority of the morning washing my hair...my hair, which is natural, incredibly curly and managable clumped together as if i hadn't combed it in months...i shedded a handful of hair and i had to cut out the severly tangled parts....i followed the directions on the bottle and never anticipated feeling so faint and light headed...i had to bag my hair in coconut and olive oil to combat the dryness from all the hair washing ...goodluck jcanalena79...

 

[jcanalena79]

Amswers in blue:

I personally consider K-Pak as a Medium Protein Treatment like on the lines of a Nexxus Keraphix etc.....

Are you following the directions? Some people use products that say 1-3 minutes, 3-5 minutes and leave them on an hour????

I definitely left on the Silicon Mix longer than the 3-5 mins on the directions. The Apoghee was as directed. The leave-ins were leave-ins ... so yes, as directed.

Do you or have you Clarified? Are you familiar with your Hair's Porosity?

Up until yesterday I was using shampoo and washing twice so I'm pretty sure I didn't have any build-up. Re: porosity - when moisturized properly (water-based then oil-based), my hair does attract and retain moisture well. I don't really have a problem with dry hair.

Have you tried a Hot Oil Treatment? OR possibly mixing a penetrateable Oil in with your DC'ers?

Last night I pre-pood(for the first time) with avocado, olive and coconut oils [mixed with honey and La Bomba avocado trmt (which I later discovered contained protein which explained why my hair *didn't* feel heavenly after the pre-poo)].

ETA: I went back and re-read your Post. Is it Shedding? Or is it Breakage?

I've always had shedding for as long as I remember being alive. I have a ton of hair and never really saw any significant thinning as a result so I've just accepted the shedding as something my body does as per my body chemistry.

The problem really lies with the breakage. That's what I thought only protein trmts could correct and thus led to my frustration with how they made my hair feel. My hair takes like a day or two (even post moisturizing DC and washing and moisturizing) to get back it's softness.

 

[Esq.2B]

JCanalena79 what kind of moisturizing DC are you using? And how long are you leaving it in?

Also, did you use a protein leave-in after you used the Aphoghee 2 step? That might've been too much protein.

 

[Aggie]

My Question:

Are you following up each Protein Treatment with a Moisturizing Deep Conditioning Treatment? Moisture should always follow Protein.

You may also want to switch to something extremely lightweight and perhaps even a reconstructor for your protein until you get your hair back on track like: Giovanni Nutra-Fix or even AO GPB may also be good to incorporate for a while which will offer you both Protein & Moisture.

Or you could solely use moisturize for your DC'er but use a lighter protein for your daily leave-in treatments.

ITA with you here Terri. I would not take out the protein entirely because it is needed for the hair to absorb moisture better. Even if it just has some hydrolyzed wheat protein (very mild protein) in it.

I would actually try baggying with some water based moisturizers and sealed with a light natural oil like kukui nut oil, jojoba oil or sweet almond oil for example. I would do this nightly for a week or two, depending on the degree of protein overuse or until hair elasticity is restored.

 

[jcanalena79]

JCanalena79 what kind of moisturizing DC are you using? And how long are you leaving it in?

Also, did you use a protein leave-in after you used the Aphoghee 2 step? That might've been too much protein.

I used a Burt's Bees Moisturizing DC w/honey. When that finished I used La Bomba Avocado Moisturizing DC, which I later discovered had some protein in it (also mixed w/honey, btw).

I actually just bought some shea butter, vegetable glycerin, and the following oils: avocado, sweet almond, castor and coconut. I bought them to make a substitute for Miss Jessie's Buttercreme, but if anyone has a suggestion for how they may best be combined as a moisturizing DC I'm all ears.

No, the protein leave-in wasn't used after apoghee. Each was used on two separate occasions at least a week apart.

ITA with you here Terri. I would not take out the protein entirely because it is needed for the hair to absorb moisture better. Even if it just has some hydrolyzed wheat protein (very mild protein) in it.

I would actually try baggying with some water based moisturizers and sealed with a light natural oil like kukui nut oil, jojoba oil or sweet almond oil for example. I would do this nightly for a week or two, depending on the degree of protein overuse or until hair elasticity is restored.

Do you have any suggestions of any hair care products with hydrolyzed wheat protein?

 

[Aggie]

Do you have any suggestions of any hair care products with hydrolyzed wheat protein?

Actually a lot of them do like Kenra Moisturizing DC, Joico Silk Results Conditioner nad Mizani Fulfyl Conditioning Treatment just to name a few. The latter canditioner is a moisture/protein balanced conditioner and the first 2 are actually moisturizing conditioners. You will find this ingredient somewhere in the ingredients list on the conditioners you purchase and use.

Just be mindful to keep looking for the ingredients in products that your hair needs and steer clear of the ones that are causing adverse issues with it. You are doing the right thing by listening to your hair and seeking advice when needed instead of going it alone.

The aim is not to eliminate protein completely from your regimen but use it sparingly and wisely until your hair moisture balances. Another good thing is to know about the proteins used on your hair.

Here is something that might you might find helpful:

PROTEINS USED ON HAIR


Here is a handy guide for understanding the different types of protein products.

All proteins are strengthening proteins to some degree but here are the more specific characteristics of these proteins:

Collagen Protein--known for increasing elasticity in the hair

Silk Protein--known for softening the hair

Wheat Protein--a moisturizing and strengthening protein known for increasing the hair's ability to maintain & receive moisture also.

Keratin Protein – this is responsible for keeping the hair strong and pliable. This is the strongest of the (hair product) proteins and is actually the one that hair is made from. This one re-structures hair that has been damaged or broken down by chemicals. It helps to replace the amino acid cysteine which is the main one lost during chemical processing. This is the heavy duty protein. If you see the following as an ingredient

*Vegetable protein -- Vegetable protein absorbs more easily into the hair shaft [than animal protein] and does not create build-up, leaves the hair very shiny, radiant, luxuriant, and healthy.

*Animal protein -- Animal protein breaks down into fatty acids, which coat the hair and create residual build-up.

Silk Amino Acids/Protein--Natural silk is the strongest, natural fiber known to mankind. Discovered in Japan and has been used for centuries in all kinds of products that require durability. Silk has a tiny molecule that can penetrate the entire hair shaft deeper than all other proteins without adding any weight leaving the hair feeling clean and non-greasy
Keratin protein More In depth:

*a) Keratin protein--this will re-structure and strengthen the hair cuticle (the outer layer only & the most important layer)

The keratin in some reconstructors should not leave your hair hard like the Aphogee Treatment for damaged hair (which contains hydrolyzed animal protein). This treatment hardens on your hair for a reason and is used with mild heat. A moisturizing conditioner is a must with this in order to soften like Keracare's humecto.

Reconstructors that contain keratin and other proteins are supposed to have enough moisture to soften the hair therefore leaving your hair with a nice protein/moisture balance."


* Hydrolyzed Keratin Protein or Keratin Amino Acids--this means that the Keratin molecules have been broken down and are small enough to go beyond the cuticle and penetrate the hair shaft. It will strengthen all 3 layers of the hair. That is why the term "deep conditioning" technically only refers to this kind of treatment using penetrating proteins.

*c) Hydrolyzed Human Hair Keratin--This is an exact match for the keratin your hair has (or has lost due to chemical processing). This is the highest quality and most potent keratin that can be used in hair products.

If you use a lye relaxer you need conditioners that are a balance of moisture and protein. That is where the myth of moisture only came from, the whole box relaxer usage. If you are using no lye, you need more moisture than a lye relaxer user.

Moisture and Protein balance isn't about swinging to each extreme. You shouldn't try to go from super mushy to super hard. It’s too much stress on the hair and that is what causes weak spots, split ends, thinning and breakage. Moisture swells the hair strand. I know everyone is moisture happy but if you are moisturizing daily, deep conditioning with moisture at every wash for an hour, and co-washing with moisture every 2 days, you are doing too much. All you are doing is stretching out your hair and setting yourself up for breakage and thinning. If your hair doesn't have enough protein, it won't hold any moisture. If you keep on having to buy more and more moisture products looking for higher and higher levels of moisture, you need protein.

Also if your hair is stretched beyond repair, protein can only do so much. Staying consistent with reconstructors helps prevent too much natural protein loss over time (weathering of the cuticle). By definition, reconstructors and straight protein treatments fill in the cracks of the hair shaft that occur from protein loss (which then incites moisture loss). So if your hair is stretched 50x its natural threshold, you can try to repair it over time but if it still doesn't resolve all of the issue, don't go back to the excessive moisture treatments. It'll just be time for a trim.

The wheat and silk proteins attract and help retain moisture as well as strengthen and Keratin, reconstructors and the others build.

I really hopes this helps you out a bit.

 

[jcanalena79]

WOW!!! Thank you so much Aggie!!! In all my reading on various blogs, I haven't seen it broken down like that. That was a *very* helpful read!!!

 

[Aggie]

WOW!!! Thank you so much Aggie!!! In all my reading on various blogs, I haven't seen it broken down like that. That was a *very* helpful read!!!

You're quite welcomed jcanalena. Good luck getting the moisture/protein balance back in your hair.

 

[KittyMeowMeow]

For me, my hair gets wirey, dry, and unmanageable and starts breaking when I need to clarify. In fact, I was having said breakage, wiriness and dryness for about a week until yesterday and blaming it on protein when I realized it was time to clarify. Today my hair is soft, moisturized, and breakage free.

This is different than using a regular shampoo (even if lathering it multiple times). Using so many different products can cause buildup, so if you have never used an actual clarifying shampoo, I'd look into it! My hair actually feels more moisturized after clarifying if my hair needed it. This then allows any treatments or conditioners to actually work - if my hair has buildup, then those things aren't able to penetrate so they don't do anything, or even make things worse because they are adding to the problem.

How I do it:

Prepoo hair & scalp w/ oil. Working in sections, I use clarifying shampoo on hair only avoiding my scalp. I lather it and gently squeeze it through the section. I rinse this very well, then use a moisturizing shampoo (must say "moisturizing" on it) on the section. Rinse. I do all the sections, then DC. Zing! Moisture!

Ingredients that I know dry my hair out and give me wiriness and/or breakage: cones, wax.

HTH and good luck!

 

[jcanalena79]

@KittyMeowMeow ... I never thought of that! I suspect it may be a combination of this and a protein sensitivity (b/c I had the bad exp w/ a protein leave-in early on). I'll probably clarify and then choose one of the moisturizing/silk/wheat DCs and take it from there. Do you have any recommendations for a good clarifying shampoo?

 

[KittyMeowMeow]

I use Ion clarifying shampoo and it works well!