your silkener questions answered...

suncypress

suncypress

New Member
hello ladies! /images/graemlins/wave.gif
i know a few of you have PM'd me about curve salon and my silkener process, and options asked for a tutorial over on another thread. honestly i don't have all the answers b/c i've only been to curve twice, once for my first silkener and once for a touch-up/corrective that loosened my curl more. but i'll tell you what i do know, and feel free to ask whatever questions.

here are the basics of what i know, but first, the one big thing i *don't* know--what kind of relaxer they use. i have heard it's an affirm product, but i don't know. they bring it over to the station already mixed so i have never seen the container. plus i wear glasses and if i don't have them on i can't see a thing! /images/graemlins/confused.gif next time i will try to ask.

how do they apply the relaxer? they had to do my silkener in several sections, b/c my hair is so thick, to prevent over/under processing. no way you could get consistent results trying to do my whole head at once. so in each section of hair miko would apply the relaxer with her fingers, parting off a bit of hair at a time.

did they smooth the relaxer/how? yes. the first time, when she left more kink in my hair, she used a wide-tooth comb to stretch my curls out partially. as in, comb down through the hair about an inch--the comb couldn't get much farther than that, lol! the second time, she smoothed with her fingers, as i recall.

how long did they leave it on? between 5 and 7 minutes, per section. by this i mean no more than 7 minutes from the moment the chems touch the hair to the moment they are rinsed.

ok i think that does it. but of course i am happy to answer any other questions. i am a big fan of curve--both the owners have always been nothing but courteous and professional to me and i don't mind the prices b/c the results make me quite happy! everyone's experience is different, though, and i know not everyone can get to brooklyn or wants to pay what they charge. in any case, hope this post helps anyone who is interested. /images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Thanks, Saucy. I would've asked anyone doing my hair what, exactly, they were using, if I couldn't see it for myself. But that is just the part within me that doesn't really trust anyone to be up in my hair. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

So when they smoothed it, for the brief time they did, was it basically smoothed like a traditional relaxer?

What is it, in your opinion, about the Curve process, that enables them to achieve their results? Is it more the silkener, more the technique, more the product, etc.?

I (well, my DH helped) applied a texturizer (Silk Elements) to my hair a few weeks ago. We left it on 13-15 minutes and it still looks and acts almost as if nothing was done to it. It is softer and easier to comb, but based on that, I can't see 5-7 minutes of processing having much of an impact on my type 4A hair.
 
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your hair is ridiculously thick!! What's your regime? How do you keep your ends so nice?

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hi, shelli! i can't give too many tips on the thickness part, since i was born with it--literally, came out of the womb with a full head of hair and it's been thick ever since. :lol:

as far as my ends, it helps that i started from a shaved head in 2001, so my ends were completely "new" if you know what i mean. i've kept my hair in pretty low-manipulation styles for years--when it was shorter, just wash and moisturize and wear curly. as it got longer i did afro puffs (tied back w/ a silk scarf), then low ponytails (always with no-damage scrunchies) and of course twist-outs and braidouts. until the texturizer i didn't even own a blow dryer or bonnet dryer and i never wear my hair pressed or blown out (i prefer curly and kinky styles), so heat damage was not really an issue.

until recently i rarely trimmed (i mean, like, almost never) b/c i don't trust random stylists. [Edited to Add: ok but in my next post i say "i'm pretty trusting"--contradiction. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif basically i think i got a good feeling at curve so i trusted them, but in general i have encountered very few stylists who i trusted to trim or cut my curly hair] now i like the cuts they do at curve but they don't distinguish between a "trim" and a "cut" in terms of price, so now that i'm working on achieving length, who has the moolah to pay over $100 for a dusting? /images/graemlins/nono.gif

anyway sorry to write a book! my regime is pretty simple so i think that helps. i'm too lazy to be a PJ--i experiment sometimes but not nearly as much as other people. i guess i'm pretty boring, but it has led to pretty good hair results!
 
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But that is just the part within me that doesn't really trust anyone to be up in my hair. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

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that makes sense! i tend to be pretty trusting, i guess. they did give a full consultation to me before my first silkener. but b/c i hadn't had my hair relaxed in 11 or 12 years, and basically hadn't been in a salon in that long either, it didn't occur to me to ask what kind of relaxer they were using. a chemical is a chemical to me! before discovering lhcf and other hair boards i didn't know the difference between Affirm and ... damn, i can't even think of another relaxer brand! /images/graemlins/rofl.gif

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So when they smoothed it, for the brief time they did, was it basically smoothed like a traditional relaxer?

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yup. i think the only difference was the time left on.

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What is it, in your opinion, about the Curve process, that enables them to achieve their results? Is it more the silkener, more the technique, more the product, etc.?

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i think it is their technique and the fact that they have done hundreds upon hundreds of silkeners (judging from their before/after photo albums). so they can guesstimate on how long to leave it on, etc., for a particular head of hair. think about it, most regular beauticians do one or two texturizers among their clients, compared to so many that prefer a bone-straight look. b/c curve specializes in texturizing i think their expertise allows for better results.

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I (well, my DH helped) applied a texturizer (Silk Elements) to my hair a few weeks ago. We left it on 13-15 minutes and it still looks and acts almost as if nothing was done to it. It is softer and easier to comb, but based on that, I can't see 5-7 minutes of processing having much of an impact on my type 4A hair.

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maybe the texturizer was too mild? i'm sure they use full strength on my hair b/c it is so thick and the strands are coarse too. i think my hair may even be a little chem-resistant (i remember model chick saying her hair never got bone straight even when it was relaxed, and my hair was the same way back in the day).

HTH!
 
Your hair looks fantabulous! /images/graemlins/up.gif

Thanks for the tips. I will probably be incorporating some during my next self-relax. I will do it in sections this time and use a comb that will stretch out my waves just so (since I will probably going the texturizer route).

Chichi /images/graemlins/bdance.gif
 
I am so glad you decided to do this thread /images/graemlins/grin.gif I was really wondering how to get in touch with you to ask questions about your hair!!! First and foremost, your hair, texture, length, and curl, are too much for me to put into words....OK.. your are my hair idol /images/graemlins/notworthy.gif /images/graemlins/notworthy.gif /images/graemlins/notworthy.gif

My first question, have you had to switch products because you have gone from natural to texterized hair? I've been natural for over 10 years and I know that some products do not work the same on natural hair as it does on relaxed hair. What products do you use while you maintain your hair at home ?

How long does the texturizer last after it is first applied ( 2 to 3 months)? After the texturizer has grown out does the curly pudding, curly buttercreme, curly meringue ( which ever product you use /images/graemlins/scratchchin.gif ) have a lasting effect ( like moisture, length, shine ) on natural hair like the texturized hair ?

So many questions to ask....
 
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I am so glad you decided to do this thread /images/graemlins/grin.gif I was really wondering how to get in touch with you to ask questions about your hair!!! First and foremost, your hair, texture, length, and curl, are too much for me to put into words....OK.. your are my hair idol /images/graemlins/notworthy.gif /images/graemlins/notworthy.gif /images/graemlins/notworthy.gif

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girl, thank you! you are so sweet! where is the blushing smiley when you need it?

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My first question, have you had to switch products because you have gone from natural to texterized hair? I've been natural for over 10 years and I know that some products do not work the same on natural hair as it does on relaxed hair. What products do you use while you maintain your hair at home ?

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well, before i went to curve i was very random about products--i avoided grease and heavy oil, but i used gel (Dep, i think) and various leave-ins, though i never had a moisturizer that i was really happy with, actually. then when i got the first silkener i bought curly pudding and that was my miracle product for a while--i even threw out my gel! /images/graemlins/nuts.gif but THEN i discovered hair boards and learned about CO-washes. my first silkener was jan 2004, and by the time summer came i was tired of all the curly styling b/c my hair is heavy and HOT in the summertime. so i started doing CO-washes and braids/braidouts in the summer months, using just organics hair mayonnaise on my damp/wet hair before i braided it. (lots of growth that way, btw).

then after my 2nd silkener, where my curl was loosened even more which made things more manageable, i experimented more. so now i like fruit of the earth gel, sometimes curly pudding (though i don't think it works as well after CO washes. i think CP needs buildup-free hair to work best), and when i'm doing a bun or french twist i just use nature's gate conditioner as a leave-in.
in other words i think i use the same products natural-heads use. but that's b/c i style my hair curly exclusively. i still identify more as a "natural" even though i know i'm not anymore. b/c my hair still responds well to gel and moisturizing products, as my natural hair did.

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How long does the texturizer last after it is first applied ( 2 to 3 months)? After the texturizer has grown out does the curly pudding, curly buttercreme, curly meringue ( which ever product you use /images/graemlins/scratchchin.gif ) have a lasting effect ( like moisture, length, shine ) on natural hair like the texturized hair ?

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i go back twice a year, whether it lasts that long or not--i can't afford those prices any more than every 6 months! /images/graemlins/grin.gif the first silkener i got, there was SO little difference btwn my silkened hair and my natural hair that i honestly could not detect what my demarcation line was. it all seemed like the same texture(s). this time i know i'm going to start seeing new growth soon, but it's been two full months and i can't tell the difference yet. maybe after another month or two i'll notice the new growth. curly pudding works on natural hair too, but you have to use more to get the hair weighed down/elongated... which means hair takes longer to dry. these days i'm wearing more buns and other updos so i'm not so worried about all of that, b/c i don't use curly pudding for that--just conditioner and gel.

ask as many questions as you like--this thread is keeping me distracted so i don't obsess over the election too much! /images/graemlins/whyme.gif (p.s. i hope yall have taken a few minutes away from hair care to VOTE today!!!)
 
I am really blown away by your hair!!! your album is a keeper and again your hair is gorgeous!!!
 
Jiminy Crickets! You've got a WHOLE LOTTA HAIR!!!! I would kill a bunny to get mine that thick and long!

Something is wrong with the comments feature in Fotki...cause I know I left like 10 comments.
 
a few questions - 1) what did you get done
2) did you get your hair cut while you were there
3) did you get a steam
4) what is a steam
5) how much was your treatment
6) have you found something similar to curly pudding that gives you a similar result
7) what brand of hair mayonnaise do you use
8) which nature's gate conditioner do you use as a leave in

Sorry for all the questions, but inquiring naturals need to know /images/graemlins/rofl.gif /images/graemlins/rofl.gif /images/graemlins/rofl.gif
 
Is it just me or does the Curly Pudding scent drive anyone else up a wall? The effect on my hair is decent. But I hate commuting on the train smelling like grape vicks vapor rub!
 
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I believe they use the Fiberguard relaxer . I don't know where I got that info from.

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You are correct. When I got mine done they told me without asking that they use the Affirm Fiberguard relaxer.
 
hi shortydw,
my answers to your questions are typed in between, below.

1) what did you get done

first time i went i got a silkener and a hair cut. second time another silkener only.

2) did you get your hair cut while you were there

see #1.

3) did you get a steam

i don't think so, unless a steam is a deep-conditioning treatment, which is what it sounds like on their website. i didn't pay extra for any service that was called a "steam," but they did do a deep treatment (including sitting under a warm dryer with a conditioning cap on) post-silkener, both times that i went.

4) what is a steam

see # 3. unless it's a deep treatment i have no idea.

5) how much was your treatment

silkeners start at $250, and haircuts start at $110, i think? or even $125 now that prices have gone up. mine cost more than that, b/c they charge based on length and density and my hair is both long and thick--so there was no way i was paying the "base" price, lol! you don't get a pricebreak on retouches--whatever your initial cost for the silkener is, that's how much the retouch costs.

6) have you found something similar to curly pudding that gives you a similar result

almost any gel gives similar results. it's all in the application technique, in my opinion. i apply it in small sections on soaking wet hair in the shower (a technique which i learned from Curve, btw). when applied this way i get similar results using curly pudding, fruit of the earth aloe gel, and even cholesterol conditioner (though i get less hold and more frizz w/ the conditioner--check my fotki albums).

7) what brand of hair mayonnaise do you use

i use Africa's Best Organics. NOT to be confused with organic root stimulator, which costs twice as much.

8) which nature's gate conditioner do you use as a leave in

herbal chamomile.

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Sorry for all the questions, but inquiring naturals need to know /images/graemlins/rofl.gif /images/graemlins/rofl.gif /images/graemlins/rofl.gif

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no problem--i like answering questions. bring it on! /images/graemlins/user.gif
 
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How do they cover the hair that is not being texturized and washed?

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she didn't cover it in my case, just put each section up in a tight claw clip (except the section she was currently working on). she worked from back to front too so that made rinsing easier. also she didn't "wash" with neutralizing shampoo until after all four sections were done, though she did rinse each processed section thoroughly with plain water after it was finished. then the whole head was neutralized at once.
 
By what percentage is your curl pattern lossened?

I can't believe they charge the same amount for a retouch as for a virgin silkener. Talk about getting over.

Isn't chemical still active if it hasn't been neutralized?
 
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By what percentage is your curl pattern lossened?

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hard to answer, especially since i have multiple textures. but if i had to guess i'd say on the first silkener my overall curl pattern was loosened only about 25%. the second time it was loosened more like 50%. but i still have a 3c/4a mix, it's just weighted more towards 3c than it used to be, i guess. although when my hair was natural the hair in my crown was so loose it looked almost like 3b hair. now that part blends in better so everything looks like a more consistent 3c.

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I can't believe they charge the same amount for a retouch as for a virgin silkener. Talk about getting over.

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hey no need to start HATIN'! /images/graemlins/wink.gif anyway i thought so at first, too, but here is the way titi explained it to me. doing a silkener "re-touch" is not like doing a relaxer retouch, where the goal is simply to get the new growth bone straight. that can be done quickly and easily with no calculation. a silkener re-touch actually requires more skill than the original silkener, b/c they have to "match" the curl pattern of the new growth to the curl pattern of the already-silkened hair, without over or underprocessing. and as anyone who has tried self-texturizing probably knows, this is easier said than done. so i for one can understand why retouches don't cost less. why the *overall* price for the service is so high is another thing, of course. but that's a separate issue.

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Isn't chemical still active if it hasn't been neutralized?

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yes, probably so. but in my case since she starts in the back where my hair is kinkiest, and each section takes such a short time anyway, it's not like any residue that is left on is going to drastically change the overall effect in the few minutes it takes to get around to neutralizing. plus it's important to realize that my hair is unusually dense/thick--i've been told both at curve and by many other beauticians (when i was younger and going to salons) that i have the equivalent of 2 or 3 "average" heads of hair packed onto my head. (they usually said this with disgust as they tried unsuccessfully to press my hair--one salon sent me home with my hair still wet from the shampoo b/c they couldn't handle it!) /images/graemlins/rofl.gif

at curve most people's silkeners they do in one go, not in sections. so the neutralizing happens right away in most cases. if you have a normal head of hair and are not chewbacka (sp?) like me, you would be fine.
 
I just wanna say UR HAIR IS BEAUTIFUL!!! Sorry, I've been stalkin' ur hair album again... I left EVEN MORE comments /images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
Suncypress, your hair is very beautiful, I think if I was thinking about getting a texturiser, I would go to curve, because they seem to really know what they are doing.
 
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oh yeah p.s. blacktresses i love that collectible barbie in your sig! beautiful.

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Thanx /images/graemlins/grin.gif,

How long was your salon visit to Curve ( an hour or two) ? You know how most salons are these days. You go in early and will come out late. I was just wondering was it the same for this salon ?

Did they show you how to apply the pudding, buttercreme, meringue...to your tresses before you left the salon? At least this way you are able to maintain this style at home.
 
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How long was your salon visit to Curve ( an hour or two) ? You know how most salons are these days. You go in early and will come out late. I was just wondering was it the same for this salon ?
Did they show you how to apply the pudding, buttercreme, meringue...to your tresses before you left the salon? At least this way you are able to maintain this style at home.

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[btw, thanks again for the compliments, yall. lhcf is such a self-esteem booster, plus i get to be inspired by all of you gorgeous ladies! /images/graemlins/notworthy.gif]

blacktresses, my first silkener i was in the salon ALL DAY. for real, like morning until afternoon. mostly b/c i got a consultation first, and a haircut too. so they talked to me for nearly an hour, then silkened my hair, did a deep conditioning, rinsed, sat me under the dryer to partially dry it, then used a blowdryer and comb attachment to dry the rest of the way. then cut it. then wet it again, added product, and put me under the dryer with my hair curly. and since my hair is so thick and my first silkener wasn't that aggressive, my hair took FOREVER to dry. whew.

second time i was in and out in a couple of hours. no haircut, so just silkening retouch/corrective, in which they processed me more so my hair was easier to handle and to get dry. between the hood dryer and diffusing, titi had my hair mostly dry in around an hour. also it was summertime so they sent me home with my hair not fully dry, something they probably wouldn't get away with in the winter.

they give you a handout explaining fingerstyling and talk to you about it, but don't really do a demonstration or anything. the instructions are also written on the jar of curly pudding. it's pretty easy to figure out, honestly. and like i said, the application technique works with almost any product (gel, conditioner, etc). if i had known about 'applying in sections to soaking wet hair' pre-texturizer, i might have stuck with my natural hair! (although i have to admit the texturizer makes washing and styling much much easier for me b/c of how much it helps control the thickness of my hair, so i can't say i really regret it).
 
CLASSYEBONYGIRL said:
Bumping this for the ladies that are curious about Curves salon texturizing techniques.:)
Click to expand...

You are the best! Thanks a bunch, it's a little late for me this go around but there's always NEXT TIME!!
 
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