Would you divorce your husband if...

nope i sure wouldn't. Separate for a time probably, but divorce? never and my reason is

Matthew 19:8 Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. 9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

i mean it says right here if one of us remarries we'd be adulterers, us and the other person... don't anybody see that? written right there?
Fornication and adultery is not the same, fornication is between 2 SINGLE PEOPLE BOTH are single. Adultery is when at least one is married.
U have the title husband and wife before you're even married. So if they cheat on you while you're engaged, before you're married THEN you can put them aside.
Once you're married that's it, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder
let no man put asunder is no person put asunder EVEN the person who slept with your spouse ! there's 1 and there's 2. maybe the word vow is not clear, or the word one i don't know.

TheEphesianMarriage – Fornication vs Adultery Part 1 (Updated)

I came in here to be all serious, and your siggy pic with the lion is throwing me off, LOL!!!! Thank you so much, you have no idea how I NEEDED to laugh. :yep: :lachen:

Thank you for this information. I realized with the Bible, when a person wants to do something they will find any Scripture they can to defend their decision whether falsely interpreted or not. And please ladies, know I say that without speaking or typing in my case about any of you. I speak about some in my life. Thank you so much (((MAMITA))) for your input and the well needed laugh.
 
I can understand that scripture. But if MY. Spouse cheats. He can live in a diffrent house and we can talk for the kids if we have any. But aint no WAY he's coming back home. I've seen the pain and destruction cheating unleashes. A husband giving wife an uncurable std because he felt it right to persue his lust. Based on what I've seen and expierenced myself dating. We may not be legally allowed to divorce. But AINT NO WAY HE'S COMING BACK HOME. HE CAN GET OUT AND STAY OUT!
 
I can understand that scripture. But if MY. Spouse cheats. He can live in a diffrent house and we can talk for the kids if we have any. But aint no WAY he's coming back home. I've seen the pain and destruction cheating unleashes. A husband giving wife an uncurable std because he felt it right to persue his lust. Based on what I've seen and expierenced myself dating. We may not be legally allowed to divorce. But AINT NO WAY HE'S COMING BACK HOME. HE CAN GET OUT AND STAY OUT!

Luthiengirlie, sometimes we say one thing, and if (God forbid) the situation should occur, we do another. I have a girlfriend whose mother had done some very bad things and as a result they did not speak for many years. Wouldn't you know that they are working on their relationship this week? Praise God! God knows why certain things happen even when they do not make sense to us. Although my friend is a bit apprehensive (naturally) I feel so blessed for her and her mother. And the mother is just so grateful to be forgiven and allowed back into her life. My whole point (sorry for rambling, LOL) is that you never know what your beliefs are until they are tested. God bless you lovie!!! (((HUGS)))
 
Bull Girl.. I will pray you are one of my buddies :(

Thank you so very much luthiengirlie. This was one of the toughest decisions I have ever had to make. In the end, I knew I would never be able to look at him with any real measure of love....certainly never again trust him nor respect him. :nono: :nono: I absolutely loved everything about being a wife and I pray that God will, one day, bless me with that honor again.

:blowkiss:
 
nope i sure wouldn't. Separate for a time probably, but divorce? never and my reason is

Matthew 19:8 Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. 9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

i mean it says right here if one of us remarries we'd be adulterers, us and the other person... don't anybody see that? written right there?
Fornication and adultery is not the same, fornication is between 2 SINGLE PEOPLE BOTH are single. Adultery is when at least one is married.
U have the title husband and wife before you're even married.

I'm sorry and will kindly disagree. Fornication means "shtooping" when you have no right to....in marriage. If you "shtoop" with another and you are married, it's fornication in adulterous relations. Adulterers fornicate as do singles but the bar is raised to other dimentions when the fornication is done by those who are married. The difference is that one is married and the other is not. That scripture says it very plainly...in red :giggle:

I feel your heart, not wanting divorce. But when a man or woman commits adultery, they've broken the contract and the other has the right to freedom. In that sexual act, they've already "divorced" their spouse. When I remarry, no, I will not be committing adultery in doing so. I won't have the title of wife until I marry under sacrament of the church and seal the deal with a ceremony. Dating and being engaged does not make me married. This was the case back then and under Jewish law, not now.
 
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Anyone have any thoughts about the article below?

Did Jesus Say Adultery Is Grounds for Divorce?

By Jimmy Akin

In the first-century Mediterranean world, divorce and remarriage were common—except among the Jews. Jesus in particular used strong language in condemning the practice. In Matthew 5:31–32, he says,

“It was also said, ‘Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.’ But I say to you that every one who divorces his wife, except on the ground of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.”

Similarly, in Matthew 19:9, he says,

“And I say to you: Whoever divorces his wife, except for unchastity, and marries another, commits adultery” (emphases added).


Many Protestants seize on these so-called “exceptive clauses” as legitimizing divorce in cases where one of the spouses has committed adultery or engaged in some sort of sexual sin.

There are a number of problems with this. First among them is that the exceptive clauses do not appear in the parallel passages in Mark and Luke. In Mark 10:11–12, Jesus says only,

“Whoever divorces his wife and marries another, commits adultery against her; and if she divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery.”

Likewise, Luke 16:18 says,

“Every one who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery.”

This is striking. How could Mark and Luke, writing for the Greco-Roman world, omit the one, glaring exception that allows remarriage after divorce? Adultery and sexual sins were rampant in the Roman culture. Mark and Luke would have realized that their audiences needed to know about the exception even more than the Jewish audience for which Matthew wrote.

The exceptive clauses also do not appear in Paul’s discussion of divorce and remarriage. In Romans 7:2–3, he writes that

“a married woman is bound by law to her husband as long as he lives; but if her husband dies she is discharged from the law concerning the husband. Accordingly, she will be called an adulteress if she lives with another man while her husband is alive. But if her husband dies she is free from that law, and if she marries another man she is not an adulteress.”

And in 1 Corinthians 7:10–11, 39, he writes,

“To the married I give charge, not I but the Lord, that the wife should not separate from her husband (but if she does, let her remain single or else be reconciled to her husband)—and that the husband should not divorce his wife. . . . A wife is bound to her husband as long as he lives. If the husband dies, she is free to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.”

Paul was dealing also with a Greco-Roman audience, and he also does not make an exception for unfaithfulness or sexual sin. (The only exception he does make is for the dissolution of a non-sacramental marriage when one spouse has converted to Christianity [1 Cor. 7:12, 15]—what we know today as the Pauline privilege—but that is a different matter.)

Because the exceptive clauses occur only in Matthew’s Gospel—one written for a Jewish audience—it suggests that they reflect some issue of particular concern to Jews. What might this be?

One possibility is that the exceptive clauses are there as an illustration of the precision demanded in rabbinic logic. In other words, the clauses indicate that if one divorces an adulterous wife, one isn’t making her into an adulteress because she already is one. That doesn’t mean that he’s free to remarry; it just means that he isn’t forcing her into an adulterous situation if you divorce her.

Another possibility is that the Greek term used for “unchastity”— porneia—is being used in a special sense. For example, some have taken it to refer to unchaste behavior before the marriage is consummated. At that point, it is possible to dissolve the marriage, for marriages become indissoluble only when they are consummated.

Today, with the tradition of the wedding night, it is highly unlikely a spouse could be unfaithful between the marriage ceremony and the consummation. However, in Jesus’ time it was customary for a couple to be legally married for about a year before the consummation. The bride continued to live with her family while the husband prepared their home. At the end of this time there was the “fetching of the bride” ceremony, where the groom took her back to his own home with family and friends accompanying them. Then, during the wedding party, the couple would retire and consummate their union. Clearly, within this long time frame unchastity was possible on the part of one of the spouses.

Others have interpreted the Greek term used for “unchastity”— porneia—as a reference to incest, the idea being that divorce and remarriage is permissible in the case of incestuous marriages, since the marriage was never valid to begin with. If this is correct, then we have the principle that underlies modern annulments: Those who are not validly married are free to contract it.

Advocates of this interpretation point out that porneia is not the usual Greek term for adultery. Indeed, in the passages cited above, Jesus uses the term for adultery (moicheia) and does not identify it with porneia. These advocates point out also that many peoples in the eastern-Mediterranean region had marriage practices that allowed unions forbidden by Leviticus 18. This caused problems when individuals wanted to convert to Judaism and Christianity. Did they have to leave their spouses? Matthew, writing in an eastern-Mediterranean context, would have had reason to insert a clarification to prevent such converts from using the unqualified statement as justification for staying with their current spouses.

The idea that porneia is being used in this narrow way is suggested by two other biblical passages. In Acts 15:29, it is proposed that, to avoid offending Jewish believers, Gentile converts abstain from eating idol meat, blood, strangled animals, and from porneia. These objections are often regarded as being based directly on Leviticus 17–18, where the same things are prohibited in the same order.

The second passage is 1 Corinthians 5:1, where Paul applies the word porneia to the case of a man who has married his stepmother—a case forbidden by Leviticus 18:8. These considerations make it reasonable to assume that porneia is being used in the exceptive clauses to refer to incestuous unions.

Whichever above arguments you find convincing, it is clearly false that Jesus meant to allow divorce and remarriage when one party has committed adultery. Matthew 19:9 has often been read against the context of the Hillel-Shammai debate and interpreted to mean that Jesus was simply siding with Shammai in permitting divorce only for adultery. But this does not square with two key points in the text.

First, 19:3 specifically says that the Pharisees were trying to test Jesus, and it uses a Greek word—peirazo—that the synoptic Gospels use to indicate an act of malice. Even John P. Meier, a biblical liberal, notes, “If the Pharisees are simply asking Jesus if he favors the opinion of Hillel or Shammi, how does this constitute a malicious attempt to force him into a dilemma whereby one choice or either choice would involve a damaging statement? After all, both rabbinic opinions were perfectly respectable” (The Vision of Matthew, 252).

Second, Jesus’ answer is so amazing that in 19:10 the disciples declare that it would be better not to marry if what Jesus has said is true. Meier again: “This is not a reaction to the well-known position of Shammai, which would hardly lead a Jew or anyone else to such a conclusion. Matthew has the disciples react all too humanly to Jesus’ total prohibition of divorce” (ibid., 253).

Finally, “if Matthew were espousing adultery as grounds for divorce, he would soon run up against grave practical difficulties. In this hypothesis, Matthew would allow divorce and remarriage for a husband and wife who had committed adultery. But a husband and wife who remained faithful to each other would not be allowed to divorce; indeed their attempt at divorce would be considered adultery. Obviously, the only thing to do for a faithful Christian couple who wanted a divorce would be to commit adultery, after which a dissolution of the marriage would be allowed. What we wind up with is divorce on demand, with a technical proviso of committing adultery. This all constitutes a strange church discipline, one in which adultery seems encouraged and fidelity discouraged” (ibid.).

The situation Meier describes is actually found in many Protestant churches. Any experienced Evangelical counselor can attest that many Evangelicals who find themselves in difficult marital situations do commit such sins specifically for purposes of being able to divorce and remarry. They may say to themselves, “Jesus will forgive me afterwards” or “I have already been forgiven for all my sins—future ones included.” Through this loophole Evangelicalism has absorbed the secular world’s divorce and remarriage ethic, just as it has absorbed the secular world’s contraceptive mentality.

Fortunately, in recent years all the interpretive options mentioned above have found advocates in conservative Protestant circles. Time will tell whether this new recognition of the seriousness of Jesus’ teaching on divorce and remarriage will bear significant fruit.

Did Jesus Say Adultery Is Grounds for Divorce?
 
Anyone have any thoughts about the article below?

Paul was dealing also with a Greco-Roman audience, and he also does not make an exception for unfaithfulness or sexual sin.

Did Jesus Say Adultery Is Grounds for Divorce?

Contradiction with that very sentence. We are not that Greco-Roman audience and the scriptures are meant to evolve with the society throughout all times. Who today is held to an ancient cultural and religious mandate that the first person they willing had sex with is actually their husband? That would make lots of married christians actively living in adultery if scripture was not allowable to change interpretation of non-absolutes It's not an 11th commandment. I believe that the respect for the individual is evident in that it afforded the offended spouse the freedom to move on.

Just as Jesus broke the Sabbath by gathering grain and consuming it for the sake of the individual and, in effect, reinterpreting the Sabbath law, there is provision for divorce in certain circumstances. Even the answer given has many different meanings, consistent with the nature of written and oral law. It's the intent or spirit of the law that is more important and that's what I believe it is saying. And according to scripture, whatever is bound on earth is also bound in heaven. Jesus gave the apostles this ability and according to apostolic tradition, all those after them would have interpreted under the same. This is why annulments are granted. It's the understanding of the church today and is made lawful under the right that Christ gave.
 
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Just as Jesus broke the Sabbath by gathering grain and consuming it for the sake of the individual and, in effect, reinterpreting the Sabbath law, there is provision for divorce in certain circumstances. Even the answer given has many different meanings, consistent with the nature of written and oral law. It's the intent or spirit of the law that is more important and that's what I believe it is saying. And according to scripture, whatever is bound on earth is also bound in heaven. Jesus gave the apostles this ability and according to apostolic tradition, all those after them would have interpreted under the same. This is why annulments are granted. It's the understanding of the church today and is made lawful under the right that Christ gave.


I understand that this is a sensitive and extremely significant topic for many people. But I feel that there's room and need for a real discussion of the verses and interpretations thereof. With respect to annulments, though, receiving an annulment alleviates concern about divorce and remarriage questions, as the marriage is declared to have been invalid from the beginning. So I don't think that anything said in the article would impact someone whose marriage was annuled.

But more generally, my respect for tradition notwithstanding, what does and does not please the Lord has not changed. It's extremely easy to focus on what one is legally allowed to do, while still missing the Lord's heart. Honestly, I think that divorce is rampant in evangelicalism because we're not really seeking the Lord's heart about such things. It's interesting that you mention the bit about being married to the first person one sleeps with, as I've been reading about that as well. I don't think Scripture says that one is automatically married, but rather that a man who seduces (or rapes) a virgin is obligated to marry her. (Exodus 22:16) Even if we we are not under the law such that this is a modern-day commandment, it is nevertheless a reflection of something regarding the mind of the Lord about such things. I still think it's very profitable to sit down and think about why the Lord would have issued such a command and what it reflects about His mind in this respect.
 
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