Korean BSS Topic Agains: Black-owned Entrepreneur Interviews

Although I support taking back the black hair care industry, as in trying to have a larger level of ownership in the bss (hair weave is really a personal "I could care less about" because of the unethical practices that are behind acquiring it), I do not support blanket statements about other racial groups.

Just because you encountered 2 bad apples, does not mean the whole bunch is spoiled. As black people, we should know how it feels to be stereotyped. We don't have to put down one group in order to stand strong. There are some asian bss owners who are nice, or at least they know how to exhibit excellent customer service skills. I've seen disrespect both ways while in a BSS. But that is a whole-nother issue.

Yes a lot of shady things have been done as far as the bhci is concerned but we can blame our own government for some of that as well. If you read the resources, watch the documentary I posted, do research, then you will know that the koreans are not the only guilty party here. There were a lot of politics behind what happened.

I respect this:yep:

But can we find a solution to the problem?

Instead of jus sayin " that's just the way it is". Does it HAVE to just be that way?

ETA: not saying you said that...but that's what I'm hearing from some posters here.

Should we just leave it like it is? I don't think so.
 
That's interesting because my post didn't say you said those things, hence the question marks. I'm telling the OP that this is NOT the reason that BSS are failing.I'm entitled to my viewpoint as is everyone else.

I'm sorry. I misunderstood but when you quote someone's comment it means you are talking to them in forum world (or at least here) in case you didn't know. So if you were "telling the OP" then you should @ their name or quote what they said so he/she will know you are talking to him/her. :yep: Everyone knows you are entitled to your viewpoint, no need to state the obvious.
 
. .......You think African Americans are the majority of the hair market worldwide?

Not African americans alone but black people as a whole, absolutely! Asian owned bss exist in other nations besides the US and we as black people spend a pretty big chunk of money on haircare products and other consumer goods overall. Our buying power is tremendous and we have more power than we think when it comes to the general marketplace. If black people EVER got together and stop spending money money on one industry we would put a hurting on them.

Black people like to look good and do not mind spending money to do so. Data shows that.
 
I know how this industry works. If you don't have a credit account with a distributor, you MUST pay cash/money order etc. They are not being blocked from buying from certain distributors. They open accounts based on VOLUME. The issue is NOT race!! Black BSS want to buy 1 box and get the same price as somebody buying 10 boxes! If you want a Centurion Amex, you have to spend $250k annually. If other people find out you're offering for less, they're gonna get pissed! They're gonna start demanding price cuts. There are rivals in that business. Ask any Korean BSS owner in NJ about Macy beauty supply. Koreans want to kill her (I have heard them say they want to burn her store down) because she made a deal with distributors that even other Koreans CAN'T COMPETE WITH. The accounts are about who can create a constant flow of cash moving to the distributor. Certain products are not to be sold within certain distances of each other because of the manufacturer's price control. Bohem hair is sold at Macy Beauty in Newark. NO OTHER BSS within a certain distance of Macy can get Bohem. Sure, Korean's only sell to each other that's between them. But distributors sell to whoever is gonna pay up. Other distributors exist!! They can't call talkin bout no $100 order. You have to build relationships with distributors. I know black people who have done it and they are the selected few who have been in business long term. They open on time. They have staple products on hand. If you can't keep rice, then what kind of Chinese store are you running? Of course you can't expect to cut a deal straight from the manufacturer on $100, but you have to get your product from somewhere otherwise, you're not running your business. Period. I don't care if you're selling rice or rollers.

ETA: The word "lazy" never crossed my keyboard. If you think you can retain customer by offering what you want when you want, you're misunderstood.

as someone who is working and living in Asia, JeterCrazed is very much on point regarding Korean/asian business practices. Most of Asia is cash-based--excluding financial hubs like Hong Kong, Singapore and Bangkok. Here in Beijing, almost 90% of business needs/transactions are paid using cash--most vendors and financial institutions won't even touch US dollars or foreign credit cards/checks--and credit is extended only after establishing a strong, consistent relationship. This goes for private and government business. Nothing can move forward until the relationship is established, and then, you must be consistently solid in your dealings and the way you conduct business, in order to maintain the relationship. Here, its called 'guangxi' (gwang-shee).

They do this in-country, amongst other Asians and in their western dealings. More than likely, a lot of the Korean-owned businesses in the US have ties to a parent company/owner in Korea, so they conduct business accordingly. The US companies and organizations that I've dealt with who've had a long history of doing business in Asia have worked hard to establish strong ties by taking the time to understand the business practices of their asian partners and competitors and being flexible enough to meet them halfway. Of the companies/organizations that struggle (incuding Uncle Sam's crew), you find many are not willing to meet halfway or take the time to understand their way. In my line of work, we've had the best success when emphasis is placed on mutual respect and cooperative activities--things that bring us closer together and focus on our similarities rather than our differences.

On a personal note: unless you are in a western-style store, you must negotiate/bargain/haggle/hustle for EVERYTHING...clothes, food, services--everything is negotiable and everyone gets their hustle on, buyer and seller alike. the average person here knows the market prices of goods and services and will bargain for the best price, and if a vendor doesn't give you the price you want, you walk away, the seller gives in, you look around elsewhere, or admit defeat.

Not taking any sides...just wanted to share what I'm seeing daily.:yep:
 
Bc there's 3 of them in my hood and they are rude as hell and still expect us to give them our money even tho they treat us like $h!t....THAT'S why they're the priority.

It shouldn't BE that way and we need to fix it.

Now if this thread gets locked....we start anew.


I don't give my money to ANYBODY treating me like crap! I would LOVE for you to come to NJ and see how the Black BSS run, the successful ones and otherwise. Maybe I will go to the one in your original post and video tape the experience.
In no capacity can I believe that black people in America are a victim to anything today.
 
I don't give my money to ANYBODY treating me like crap! I would LOVE for you to come to NJ and see how the Black BSS run, the successful ones and otherwise. Maybe I will go to the one in your original post and video tape the experience.
In no capacity can I believe that black people in America are a victim to anything today.

im SO done. :yawn:
 
Exactly. Which is why the "black people didn't do xyz..." is pointless. There are multiple players in this game and all had a hand in creating the current problem. Like SmilingElephant said, this thread IS about brainstorming solutions not creating more problems or nit picking what black people didn't do in the past but what we will do now.


I like you, welcome to the forums :yep:
 
Excellent thread. I'm definitely down for boycotting or doing anything to further contribute to the cause. I'm all about doing better when I know better. I already make it a priority of mine to support black hair care businesses. My hair care is 90%+ from black companies. The only things I purchase from BSS's (Sally's) is nail polish, plastic caps, and recently flexi rods.

I have nothing else to add to this thread other than my committment. Also, I'm inspired to dedicate further research into this issue by using this as a topic for my cultural politics research paper.

*Note to self: check to see if "Hair Story" is in my school library*
 
I don't give my money to ANYBODY treating me like crap! I would LOVE for you to come to NJ and see how the Black BSS run, the successful ones and otherwise. Maybe I will go to the one in your original post and video tape the experience.
In no capacity can I believe that black people in America are a victim to anything today.

So basically you sayin things should stay the way they are?
 
I don't give my money to ANYBODY treating me like crap! I would LOVE for you to come to NJ and see how the Black BSS run, the successful ones and otherwise. Maybe I will go to the one in your original post and video tape the experience.
In no capacity can I believe that black people in America are a victim to anything today.

I refuse to employ a gif to demonstrate how that statement made me feel.
 
nisemac
Relationships are the make it or break it in the hair industry. If you don't make your way in with a business benefiting the distributor, you will be cut. That is the culture. They don't take every dollar passed at them, it's not worth it to them to cater to small, short-lived accounts. AND they don't want other people thinking that's the way they do business.

OT:Have you been to the bath houses out there? I went to the Korean one in Jersey and it was like I woke up in Soeul.
 
nisemac
Relationships are the make it or break it in the hair industry. If you don't make your way in with a business benefiting the distributor, you will be cut. That is the culture. They don't take every dollar passed at them, it's not worth it to them to cater to small, short-lived accounts. AND they don't want other people thinking that's the way they do business.

OT:Have you been to the bath houses out there? I went to the Korean one in Jersey and it was like I woke up in Soeul.

if you read the OP you would see that these people REFUSE to create relationships with black business owners.
 
oh,.. and i keep on mentioning "price" because the other day I went to buy miss jessies curly pudding (she's black right?) and one jar was $28! :nono: How long does that thing really last. And obviously,.. that was the retail price, but retail price is usually reflective of the producer price. I'm going to assume that that company was looking for a high profit margin per unit sold instead of depending on mass sales/modest price to generate profit.

Carmelella, why is it wrong that they charge what they charge for their products? If I understand correctly, Miss Jessie's started out in their salons as a salon quality product, right? Then, why shouldn't they charge salon prices for their products? I dunno what their business plan was...they probably saw a need in a special market (curly/kinky hair) and saw that the need wasn't being filled.

I think, if we are willing to support AA business and products made and distributed by AAs, then we need to be willing to pay/invest. i've never understood why we are willing to spend on others but not ourselves? as its been mentioned, we have an enourmous amount of spending power, and if we collectively decide where to put our money, we could send a very strong message.
 
nisemac
Relationships are the make it or break it in the hair industry. If you don't make your way in with a business benefiting the distributor, you will be cut. That is the culture. They don't take every dollar passed at them, it's not worth it to them to cater to small, short-lived accounts. AND they don't want other people thinking that's the way they do business.

OT:Have you been to the bath houses out there? I went to the Korean one in Jersey and it was like I woke up in Soeul.

Okay so it's based on building relationships.

1.) Are you saying that Black ppl are incapable of building rapport with businesses of a different culture?

2.) what if Blacks are having issue with building these relationships bc let's not remain oblivious to the fact that blatant racism is alive and still kickin as we speak.

The question still remains:

WHAT IS THE SOLUTION???!
 
The OP was so informative and had such potential.

Now all i'm reading are e-debates. Do the semantics matter? May we just pass the information on so that others can make informed decisions? People will come to their own conclusions and i highly doubt many will say at the end of this - "man, i sure do wish i was still in my ignorant bubble" some will but it's not our job to babysit or drive our opinions home to everyone.

I'm telling my family and my friends about this. In the future, i will think twice before shopping at an aisian BSS. this info is food for thought. thoughts lead to ideas and ideas lead to movements. plant a seed without the expectation that a ginormous beanstalk has to grow RIGHT NOW. That is all.

-if you disagree with me. I respect that. But please believe that i will not be responding to any attacks on this post. I will not cultivate heated or riotus dissent.
 
So basically you sayin things should stay the way they are?

I'm saying black people should work smarter to better their business and not immediately react to paranoia that some other ethnic group, race, religion, creed...is honing in on their success. I HOPE that there are Black BSS owners even lurking on this thread :pray: trying to find out what we're using. I've even pleaded with Black BSS owners to buy products I know people are flocking to WHITE (not Korean) BSS to get. Even promising to buy out their stock if it doesn't sell and still they don't buy it. :ohwell: And these are people who I talk to on a personal level, NOT random stores I'm walking into. Stop selling fake Gucci bags and bootleg Michael Jackson CDs in the front. Stop burning oils and incense! Who wants to buy a new headscarf smelling like old cigarettes?
Of course there may be Koreans who are racist toward blacks. There are blacks racist toward Koreans! But the culture difference is creating an impression of a blanketed malice that's just not there.:nono:
 
I respect this:yep:

But can we find a solution to the problem?

Instead of jus sayin " that's just the way it is". Does it HAVE to just be that way?

ETA: not saying you said that...but that's what I'm hearing from some posters here.

Should we just leave it like it is? I don't think so.

I think we on hairboards do the right thing. We help each other become better consumers by informing others of the ingredients in a product and choosing to shop at black hair care companies who meet our needs. Or better yet, we teach each other how to become independent and create our own products that fit our own needs. We are ahead of the curve on hairboards as far as the "natural haircare 'movement' " is concerned. These big companies are trying to play catch up to US. They are studying US. They are seeing what we use and trying to catch up.

We set the trends in the marketplace, not the stores/producers. Do you think it is an accident that more natural hair products are popping up in the stores? More "transitioning" kits are showing up in the store. It is up to us to continue to be a leader in haircare and like I said before, we have the power to shift control of haircare back in the hands of more blacks if we continue to buy products that blacks make.

Maybe we need a "black list" or an "all black everything" haircare list for those to shop at black businesses if they so chose to.
 
Not African americans alone but black people as a whole, absolutely! Asian owned bss exist in other nations besides the US and we as black people spend a pretty big chunk of money on haircare products and other consumer goods overall. Our buying power is tremendous and we have more power than we think when it comes to the general marketplace. If black people EVER got together and stop spending money money on one industry we would put a hurting on them.

Black people like to look good and do not mind spending money to do so. Data shows that.

So do other races. I've seen how much people (usually non-blacks) spend at Sephora, sephora.com (worked at the corporate level there once), Ulta.com and a host of other stores and sites, but do we have to spend SO much more? We are not spending that kind of money on skin care products, teeth whitening, plastic surgery, etc, but its mostly hair care products and mostly weaves. As someone said, if we can stop the dependence on weaves, it would/could make a huge impact.

Mo to the...:welcome3:
 
if you read the OP you would see that these people REFUSE to create relationships with black business owners.


tamz412 I'd say its both...those that won't do business and those that they must establish a relationship with. there are aspects of the asian culture that are very challenging. often, a lack of willingness to engage in any dealings could be attributed to the benefit factor. If off the top, they see that a $1000 sale is not worth it, they cut ties then. I'm not defending the behavior, just stating what I've seen. To them, its not always offensive, but a matter of why wasting anyone's time. They tend to be very short and curt in their dealings--something considered rude by western standards.

again, i'm not disputing the racism and other tactics described in the OP, but there are so many other factors involved that don't even include them.
 
Okay so it's based on building relationships.

1.) Are you saying that Black ppl are incapable of building rapport with businesses of a different culture?

2.) what if Blacks are having issue with building these relationships bc let's not remain oblivious to the fact that blatant racism is alive and still kickin as we speak.

The question still remains:

WHAT IS THE SOLUTION???!

Some black people are incapable of building rapport with businesses of a different culture :yep: absolutely and unfortunately. Those who cannot, fail. Survival of the fittest.

Racism exists in all directions.

Retail is about the customer. Focus on DEMAND! There is no demand in my area for black-owned BSS who are unwilling to stock products customers need. "Scared money don't make no money." That boils it down right there.
 
Okay so it's based on building relationships.

1.) Are you saying that Black ppl are incapable of building rapport with businesses of a different culture?

2.) what if Blacks are having issue with building these relationships bc let's not remain oblivious to the fact that blatant racism is alive and still kickin as we speak.

The question still remains:

WHAT IS THE SOLUTION???!

if i may offer my thoughts...:grin:

1. I can speak about my experience here in China....one the reasons I chose to come to Asia was because I had the opportunity, back in the U.S. to participate in a meeting between a US gov agency and its Chinese equivalent. During the meeting, i noticed that the 'face' of the U.S. government, the people the Chinese had to deal with, were all african americans. The face of America, was not only black because of our President, but black at the grassroots, inter-agency level. the people who do the ground work so that our high level political leaders can sit face to face on the world community was black. Also, when I arrived here, i saw Nigerians (there's a 'little Nigeria' here), Ghanians, and other blacks of the diaspora doing business here. So, blacks are VERY capable of forging relationships of different cultures. The main problem is that there are so few of us on the scene. So few of us who even bother to get a passport
and travel to somewhere other than Europe or a cruise to the Bahamas.

2. Yes, blatant racism is alive and well. I've had some special treatment--mainly by other westerners (germans, russians, and white americans), or asians who didn't know my nationality. I've been mistaken for South African, Libyan, mixed (either chinese or white or something) or they're confused. But I've learned that, there is respect for the authority of the position.

Solution:

1. Create a database of black owned hair supply/resources etc. A comprehensive list with a ratings sytems.

2. Hold these businesses accountable. Encourage customer reviews and ratings. Designate a 'business of the year' that recognizes a business that contributes to the black community, provides quality products at fair prices, and outstanding customer service.

3. Just as we have challenges here on the forum, create one for people to 'buy black' be it for a month, 3 months etc. Have participants submit receipt totals showing how much of their money went to black owned business. Tally everything up and send it to the major Black business association and tell them

This might not be much, but its one of those things, i think, where an individual has to consciously decide they are going to do this...like going vegan, or raw food, or organic.

i don't think there is an immediate solution, people have to be in it for the long haul.
 
@nisemac
Relationships are the make it or break it in the hair industry. If you don't make your way in with a business benefiting the distributor, you will be cut. That is the culture. They don't take every dollar passed at them, it's not worth it to them to cater to small, short-lived accounts. AND they don't want other people thinking that's the way they do business.

OT:Have you been to the bath houses out there? I went to the Korean one in Jersey and it was like I woke up in Soeul.

I do agree about the relationships, but I also feel that China, Korea, and a host of other Asian countries need to step up to the plate if they wish to be full participants of the global community. of course, there's no real incentive when there are 4 billion customers within your region. They have to start accepting that not all of their ways are beneficial and acceptable for long-term relationships. and that is the problem. a lack of understanding on both sides.

OT:I've had Chinese massage (lawdy), but haven't made my way to Seoul for the baths yet...its definitely on my list of places to visit while living here (I've got 3 years!)
 
if i may offer my thoughts...:grin:

1. I can speak about my experience here in China....one the reasons I chose to come to Asia was because I had the opportunity, back in the U.S. to participate in a meeting between a US gov agency and its Chinese equivalent. During the meeting, i noticed that the 'face' of the U.S. government, the people the Chinese had to deal with, were all african americans. The face of America, was not only black because of our President, but black at the grassroots, inter-agency level. the people who do the ground work so that our high level political leaders can sit face to face on the world community was black. Also, when I arrived here, i saw Nigerians (there's a 'little Nigeria' here), Ghanians, and other blacks of the diaspora doing business here. So, blacks are VERY capable of forging relationships of different cultures. The main problem is that there are so few of us on the scene. So few of us who even bother to get a passport
and travel to somewhere other than Europe or a cruise to the Bahamas.

2. Yes, blatant racism is alive and well. I've had some special treatment--mainly by other westerners (germans, russians, and white americans), or asians who didn't know my nationality. I've been mistaken for South African, Libyan, mixed (either chinese or white or something) or they're confused. But I've learned that, there is respect for the authority of the position.

Solution:

1. Create a database of black owned hair supply/resources etc. A comprehensive list with a ratings sytems.

2. Hold these businesses accountable. Encourage customer reviews and ratings. Designate a 'business of the year' that recognizes a business that contributes to the black community, provides quality products at fair prices, and outstanding customer service.

3. Just as we have challenges here on the forum, create one for people to 'buy black' be it for a month, 3 months etc. Have participants submit receipt totals showing how much of their money went to black owned business. Tally everything up and send it to the major Black business association and tell them

This might not be much, but its one of those things, i think, where an individual has to consciously decide they are going to do this...like going vegan, or raw food, or organic.

i don't think there is an immediate solution, people have to be in it for the long haul.

*queue the fireworks*

THIS!!! This is what I'm talkin about! Possible solutions!!!

I really like this list and a Buy Black challenge sounds awesome! I didn't even think of that:yep:
 
if i may offer my thoughts...:grin:

1. I can speak about my experience here in China....one the reasons I chose to come to Asia was because I had the opportunity, back in the U.S. to participate in a meeting between a US gov agency and its Chinese equivalent. During the meeting, i noticed that the 'face' of the U.S. government, the people the Chinese had to deal with, were all african americans. The face of America, was not only black because of our President, but black at the grassroots, inter-agency level. the people who do the ground work so that our high level political leaders can sit face to face on the world community was black. Also, when I arrived here, i saw Nigerians (there's a 'little Nigeria' here), Ghanians, and other blacks of the diaspora doing business here. So, blacks are VERY capable of forging relationships of different cultures. The main problem is that there are so few of us on the scene. So few of us who even bother to get a passport
and travel to somewhere other than Europe or a cruise to the Bahamas.

2. Yes, blatant racism is alive and well. I've had some special treatment--mainly by other westerners (germans, russians, and white americans), or asians who didn't know my nationality. I've been mistaken for South African, Libyan, mixed (either chinese or white or something) or they're confused. But I've learned that, there is respect for the authority of the position.

Solution:

1. Create a database of black owned hair supply/resources etc. A comprehensive list with a ratings sytems.

2. Hold these businesses accountable. Encourage customer reviews and ratings. Designate a 'business of the year' that recognizes a business that contributes to the black community, provides quality products at fair prices, and outstanding customer service.

3. Just as we have challenges here on the forum, create one for people to 'buy black' be it for a month, 3 months etc. Have participants submit receipt totals showing how much of their money went to black owned business. Tally everything up and send it to the major Black business association and tell them

This might not be much, but its one of those things, i think, where an individual has to consciously decide they are going to do this...like going vegan, or raw food, or organic.

i don't think there is an immediate solution, people have to be in it for the long haul.

Thank you so much for this constructive piece of advise. It is highly needed, much preferred, and greatly appreciated.
 
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