Keratin Treatment Support Thread

[luckiestdestiny]

Is anyone else getting small broken hairs like less than an inch ( like a half of inch) long when they comb or brush? It looks kind of like as long as the damage that is left on my hair. It appears that the damaged ends are falling/ breaking off! Anyone else getting this?

Please share details. What type of keratin did you use? What products did you use during, before, and a couple of weeks before as well. Did you also use indian products.

Is it only the damaged parts too? Just curious. I'm just comparing those who had problems so that we can have a list of do's and don'ts for those who may be interested in the BKT.

I realize that the others think the damaged hair is the problem. But I just want to isolate and am curious about the other possibilities. Thanks so much.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Please share details. What type of keratin did you use? What products did you use during, before, and a couple of weeks before as well. Did you also use indian products.

Is it only the damaged parts too? Just curious. I'm just comparing those who had problems so that we can have a list of do's and don'ts for those who may be interested in the BKT.

I realize that the others think the damaged hair is the problem. But I just want to isolate and am curious about the other possibilities. Thanks so much.

Thank you for doing this. I want to know how BKT hair will react with henna. I want to henna so badly because it covers my gray. It's totally unknown territory.

I know they recommend that you do hair color before a BKT because it will strip the BKT. I wonder if the bonding of the henna with the keratin will interfere with or compete with the BKT.

I know Sunshinne used henna 1 week before she BKTed, her hair came out beautiful. I want to try a light henna glossing in about 1 month or so to see what happens. I need to cover my gray

 

[Stepiphanie]

Wondering if it's the brahmi combined with the bkt? We need to start looking at combinations of what works and what doesn't.

Brami strengthens the hair and has protein and conditioning properties from what I read. It is more moisturizing, but it is also acts like a protein. I know it's NOT a protein..but the whole acts like a protein thing may be possible.

Maybe it was almost like a protein overkill.

Just a thought.

Honestly, I'm not sure what the hell happened. I feel like my whole bkt went wrong bc I'm not having the experince at all that everyone is having.I've tried to pinpoint what it could be but can't. I don't think it was the brahmi bc the reson I used it is bc my hair started breaking. Also as soon as I washed my hair my ng felt the same, a little more manageable but really not much change which makes me wonder if the bkt took well in the first place?

I henna'd 5 days prior do ya'll think it could be that? My hair was in pretty good shape before the application, very little breakage and well balanced(I did strand test w/ every wash). I really want to figure out what went wrong bc most likely I want to give the bkt another try.

 

[Kacie]

^ When is the last time that you did a S&D? Maybe the blowdrying and flat ironing manipulation causes splits?

 

[Stepiphanie]

No blowdrying except for during application.I don't use direct heat, so the only time I flat ironed was also durin the treatment

 

[Dak]

Honestly, I'm not sure what the hell happened. I feel like my whole bkt went wrong bc I'm not having the experince at all that everyone is having.I've tried to pinpoint what it could be but can't. I don't think it was the brahmi bc the reson I used it is bc my hair started breaking. Also as soon as I washed my hair my ng felt the same, a little more manageable but really not much change which makes me wonder if the bkt took well in the first place?

I henna'd 5 days prior do ya'll think it could be that? My hair was in pretty good shape before the application, very little breakage and well balanced(I did strand test w/ every wash). I really want to figure out what went wrong bc most likely I want to give the bkt another try.

Stepiphanie, that's awful! Especially since your hair was in good shape before you did the treatment. Couple questions come to mind, is the breakage all over or just in a particular place? Did you have enough product to completely coat your hair? Is it possible that not all the hair was coated? Are you skilled with a flat iron, could the heat have damaged your hair? You clarified first? I colored my hair right before I did my treatment, then clarified, so I don't think the henna could be the problem.

I really hope your breakage stops soon.

 

[luckiestdestiny]

Questions for Dak, Stepiphanie, and any one who has applied BKT to help isolate potential problems:

Hey I'm back and asking questions from what I've read. Sunshinne used henna a week before her treatment did you do henna too Dak or was it another type of color?

A few issues come up:
If you did not use henna, but sunshinee did. Perhaps there needs to be a week between the treatments. Henna does coat the hair. Perhaps different types may interfere with the BKT. We have to find out what kind of henna Sunshinne used, as it appears to be a "safer" brand to use with BKT.

And if you used henna...what kind did you use and how soon after?


In addition I go back to the brami. Stepiphanie claims to have used brahmi for breakage to stop. So we already know one thing.

1)Stepiphanie was already having breakage. Her hair was already comprimised. Even if she whipped it into shape, perhaps it was not ready for all that heat.

2) Stepiphanie used Brahmi and Henna. We know that others have henna'd without problem so it could or could not be a problem for her. Meaning maybe depending on the hair type depends on
A)who can henna (just whether the hair likes it or not, more than the hair type. I just wanted to define that).
B)Or the type of Henna (some types may be okay to use w/ BKT others do not work well.. ) It may be that there are certain types that ensure success. If others can share, we can compile a list of do's and don'ts of sort.

3) As for Brahmi: If it was used for strengthening. Sometimes if you use protein to stop breakage and then it stops but you add MORE protein the hair starts breaking again. Since brahmi strengthens it may have been enough. Perhaps BRami was the overkill.
Not that brahmi is bad, but the combination...

Reasons:

A)Brami strengthens (acts like protein) and moisturizes slightly....so that's 1 protein like substance.

B) Henna acts like a protein and strengthens ....so that's another protein substance.

c) Keratin is infused in the hair strengthening it so that's ANOTHER protein substance.

= PROTEIN OVERKILL and HAIR BREAKAGE

Just a theory. I'm still isolating depending on everyone's answers. Even then I'm sure BKT will work better on some and not others, but I'm hoping we can find a way to ensure proper steps for OUR hair type. Since it wasn't made with our hair in mind.

 

[Stepiphanie]

Thanks Dak!

I actually had my treatment applied professionaly bc I didn't trust myself to do it alone.she seemed to have followed all the steps.The breakage seem to be all over, haven't really noticed more from once spot, but it seems to be getting better, so we'll see what happens when I wash later.I've also been sticking to braid outs to avoid too much manipulation.

 

[luckiestdestiny]

Thanks Dak!

I actually had my treatment applied professionaly bc I didn't trust myself to do it alone.she seemed to have followed all the steps.The breakage seem to be all over, haven't really noticed more from once spot, but it seems to be getting better, so we'll see what happens when I wash later.I've also been sticking to braid outs to avoid too much manipulation.

We're all pulling for you. That's why I'm asking so many questions. I'm glad that the breakage is getting better.

 

[Dak]

Questions for Dak, Stepiphanie, and any one who has applied BKT to help isolate potential problems:

Hey I'm back and asking questions from what I've read. Sunshinne used henna a week before her treatment did you do henna too Dak or was it another type of color?

I color with Robert Craig hair color. The shampoo I got with my BKT was really clarifying/stripping. Nothing was left on my hair after 2 shampoos with that stuff. I think a good clarifying shampoo would even remove the coating from henna. I remember reading too that coloring opens the cuticle of the hair, making it more receptive to take in the BKT.

I think the BKT aren't being marketed to our hair because it's such a time consuming process, not because it's harmful for our hair.

Stepiphanie, I'm glad the breakage is getting better!

 

[Stepiphanie]

Questions for Dak, Stepiphanie, and any one who has applied BKT to help isolate potential problems:

Hey I'm back and asking questions from what I've read. Sunshinne used henna a week before her treatment did you do henna too Dak or was it another type of color?

A few issues come up:
If you did not use henna, but sunshinee did. Perhaps there needs to be a week between the treatments. Henna does coat the hair. Perhaps different types may interfere with the BKT. We have to find out what kind of henna Sunshinne used, as it appears to be a "safer" brand to use with BKT.

And if you used henna...what kind did you use and how soon after?


In addition I go back to the brami. Stepiphanie claims to have used brahmi for breakage to stop. So we already know one thing.

1)Stepiphanie was already having breakage. Her hair was already comprimised. Even if she whipped it into shape, perhaps it was not ready for all that heat.

2) Stepiphanie used Brahmi and Henna. We know that others have henna'd without problem so it could or could not be a problem for her. Meaning maybe depending on the hair type depends on
A)who can henna (just whether the hair likes it or not, more than the hair type. I just wanted to define that).
B)Or the type of Henna (some types may be okay to use w/ BKT others do not work well.. ) It may be that there are certain types that ensure success. If others can share, we can compile a list of do's and don'ts of sort.

3) As for Brahmi: If it was used for strengthening. Sometimes if you use protein to stop breakage and then it stops but you add MORE protein the hair starts breaking again. Since brahmi strengthens it may have been enough. Perhaps BRami was the overkill.
Not that brahmi is bad, but the combination...

Reasons:

A)Brami strengthens (acts like protein) and moisturizes slightly....so that's 1 protein like substance.

B) Henna acts like a protein and strengthens ....so that's another protein substance.

c) Keratin is infused in the hair strengthening it so that's ANOTHER protein substance.

= PROTEIN OVERKILL and HAIR BREAKAGE

Just a theory. I'm still isolating depending on everyone's answers. Even then I'm sure BKT will work better on some and not others, but I'm hoping we can find a way to ensure proper steps for OUR hair type. Since it wasn't made with our hair in mind.

Thanks for all the help Luckiestdestiny. I used Jamila henna for the record, and it was 5 days before my treatment. With my first wash being at the salon day of bkt. The reason I wasnt so sur it could be the brahmi is b/c I only added about 1tsp to 3/4 cup of conditioner..but who knows.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

I color with Robert Craig hair color. The shampoo I got with my BKT was really clarifying/stripping. Nothing was left on my hair after 2 shampoos with that stuff. I think a good clarifying shampoo would even remove the coating from henna. I remember reading too that coloring opens the cuticle of the hair, making it more receptive to take in the BKT.

I think the BKT aren't being marketed to our hair because it's such a time consuming process, not because it's harmful for our hair.

Stepiphanie, I'm glad the breakage is getting better!

ITA with the bolded. I have read on numerous sites that stylist say since BKTs don't really straighten Afro textured virgin hair with one application coupled with the fact that the treatement doesn't last as long as it would with chemically treated hair they don't generally recommend it. The service done by a stylist is expensive to only have it last 1 - 2 months with minimal straightening. That's looking at it from a stylist's perspective.

Now we know as DYIers the story is different.

 

[Dak]

ITA with the bolded. I have read on numerous sites that stylist say since BKTs don't really straighten Afro textured virgin hair with one application coupled with the fact that the treatement doesn't last as long as it would with chemically treated hair they don't generally recommend it. The service done by a stylist is expensive to only have it last 1 - 2 months with minimal straightening. That's looking at it from a stylist's perspective.

Now we know as DYIers the story is different.

That's another thing, they assume we expect it to completely straighten, while many of us are simply happier with easier to manage hair, like a texlax that will eventually wash out.

So glad to have this community here, I think many ladies here are better than most professionals.

 

[luckiestdestiny]

I color with Robert Craig hair color. The shampoo I got with my BKT was really clarifying/stripping. Nothing was left on my hair after 2 shampoos with that stuff. I think a good clarifying shampoo would even remove the coating from henna. I remember reading too that coloring opens the cuticle of the hair, making it more receptive to take in the BKT.

I think the BKT aren't being marketed to our hair because it's such a time consuming process, not because it's harmful for our hair.

Stepiphanie, I'm glad the breakage is getting better!

Thanks for all the information. Of course! I definitely do NOT believe that it is harmful for our hair. I am just trying to find out what caused her breakage to help others to prevent it from happening.

Who Knows...it could've been a fluke.

However I just wanted to ask as many questions as possible so that we can find out what works with the bkt and what doesn't, IF there is such a thing.

For instance...too much protein.

Maybe when you BKT you need HIGHLY moisturizing stuff because the strength is already there. So when I mentioned henna, I'm just talking about it's effects on the hair. I was reading an article that was posted on lhcf where a hairstylist was using turpentine (quiodad) to get the henna out of an actresses' hair and still could not get it all out. So he had to chop her hair.http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=92&highlight=henna+turpentine

I'm not saying henna sucks. I like the possibilities of henna.

I'm just saying if it's still on the hair, combined with the protein treatments she's using (I see that stepiphanie is in the protein is my friend challenge), combined with brahmi, combined with keratin (which acts protein like), it may be too much.

So it's not the BKT that I'm looking at, it's the process she used before and after getting the BKT, combined with the fact that she was already having breakage. Which just seems to be a recipe for disaster.

I think BKT may be the greatest thing ever...just checking all sides of the coin so to speak, and the possibilities for what we need to do when applying the henna.

I'm going to put your color on my list. I'm compiling it for myself but will post it later once I have everything together, if others want to see.

 

[Dak]

luckiestdestiny, I didn't think you were saying that, I just was responding to the literature I've read on BKT's. I appreciate that you're researching this so well.

Personally, I think breakage with the BKT's come from the heat. First, not using any product after a really harsh shampoo, then detangling & drying can cause breakage. Second, having to use high heat to bake the product in, what if the stylist missed some spots? 3 to 10 runs of a 450 degree flat iron on hair that has no heat protection would certainly cause breakage.

 

[luckiestdestiny]

luckiestdestiny, I didn't think you were saying that, I just was responding to the literature I've read on BKT's. I appreciate that you're researching this so well.

Personally, I think breakage with the BKT's come from the heat. First, not using any product after a really harsh shampoo, then detangling & drying can cause breakage. Second, having to use high heat to bake the product in, what if the stylist missed some spots? 3 to 10 runs of a 450 degree flat iron on hair that has no heat protection would certainly cause breakage.

I was trying to find your post. What degree did you use? I pm'd Brittanynic16 and she actually did 450 degrees and up to 10 passes.

However, I realize not everyone can handle that much heat.

I know sheba1 used less.

Just curious as to what you used too, sorry if you posted it elsewhere.

Thanks!

 

[Dak]

Well, I initially thought that my generic Sally's went up to 450, it does have a thermostat, but it only went up to 410. I used about 3 passes, after a while you get a feel for when the stickiness changes, which seemed like more than enough. I used QOD that I bought from ebay.

I made a small fotki if you want to see pictures: http://public.fotki.com/dakini555/bkt-treatment/

 

[luckiestdestiny]

Well, I initially thought that my generic Sally's went up to 450, it does have a thermostat, but it only went up to 410. I used about 3 passes, after a while you get a feel for when the stickiness changes, which seemed like more than enough. I used QOD that I bought from ebay.

I made a small fotki if you want to see pictures: http://public.fotki.com/dakini555/bkt-treatment/

It's good that you pointed this out. The stickiness changes. Being aware of how much is left on "coating" determines how many passes in addition to hair condition. Thanks for the info.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

It's good that you pointed this out. The stickiness changes. Being aware of how much is left on "coating" determines how many passes in addition to hair condition. Thanks for the info.

I did something similar, I used 450 but I only need 3 - 4 passes on average. The hair was shinny and soft and light, vs the coated way it felt before I flat ironed. I kept looking in the mirror and saw the hair shinning and said to myself that's it...That piece of hair is done, and moved to the next.

I think we need to really know our hair and how much heat it can take. I used to get my hair done in the salon with the irons and the stylist would sometimes comment on how much heat my hair held, that it was hot to the touch. My hair felt like that when I was doing the BKT so I know it's been through some heat in the past and survived

 

[AtlantaJJ]

I'm going to do a henna perhaps in the middle of this bkt stretch. Then I plan to just use moisture moisture moisture leading up to my next BKT which would be at least 3 - 4 weeks after the henna. My thoughts right now (subject to change with further research) is that the hair will have time to balance its self back out before the BKT during this time stretch. I am also going to do more of a henna glossing vs. a straight henna as an experiment.

I plan to do a Cellophane right before my next BKT. That should get those pesky grays. The Cellophane has Sodium Chloride in it so it will strip the BKT somewhat.

 

[yodie]

Hi Ladies.

Haven't posted much, but I'm still in the midst of things when it comes to researching BKT. Not much to add today, other than hello and that I also use Robert Craig hair color.

 

[yodie]

I saw Mill's Creek Keratin conditioner. Are any of you ladies using this with your BKT?
Question for you:

1. Would keratin conditioner simulate BKT, in that it coats the strands?
2. Is keratin condition similar to an aphogee/joico kpak treatment? I suffered protein overload from megatek. So, would keratin conditioner help or hurt?

I plan to wait on BKT right now, until I get rid of most of these splits. My hair is growing in healthy again, thank you Jesus and I'm a little over protective of it right now.

 

[girlyprincess23]

No, Girlyprincess, I haven't experienced anything like this. hmmm Is it many of them?

Yeah it actually stopped. I think it was the hair that was already split and was gonna fall out anyway. I actually think it was the last remanants of the damage i sustained from relaxers.

I'm going to have to figure out how to time my henna/cellophane treatments in with my BKT reggie..:scratchch I have a couple of grays I need to cover


I'm just a week in but I haven't noticed any broken hairs. I've had two good trims since I got the treatment though. They recommend a trim after the first treatment. I just bought some keratin filler to add to my conditioners.

Be sure to baby your ends and don't forget to DC. I know our hair feels wonderful but I'm not going to stop DCing. I'm going to do keratin protein followed by moisture and a liquid leave in. One of the girls with the BKT is loving the Aphogee 2 minute miracle and the keratin green tea leave in spray.

Yeah I was wearing it down but i think it was damage that was already to far for even the BKT to fix because the ends were atrocious because of having relaxers and then re relaxing and things like that. But it has stopped now so everything is all good now.

 

[girlyprincess23]

Has anyone noticed OCT/MN mixtures making your BKT wear off faster than you expected?

 

[Reinventing21]

Honestly, I'm not sure what the hell happened. I feel like my whole bkt went wrong bc I'm not having the experince at all that everyone is having.I've tried to pinpoint what it could be but can't. I don't think it was the brahmi bc the reson I used it is bc my hair started breaking. Also as soon as I washed my hair my ng felt the same, a little more manageable but really not much change which makes me wonder if the bkt took well in the first place?

I henna'd 5 days prior do ya'll think it could be that? My hair was in pretty good shape before the application, very little breakage and well balanced(I did strand test w/ every wash). I really want to figure out what went wrong bc most likely I want to give the bkt another try.

Hi! I am so sorry to hear this. Hopefully your hair will correct itself very soon. My hair is also relaxed, and I am in the middle of purchasing all the equipment I will need. The heat is the part I am scared of. What temperature did you use? What kind of flat iron did you use? How many swipes did you do each section. TIA

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Has anyone noticed OCT/MN mixtures making your BKT wear off faster than you expected?

I haven't been using my MT because I'm not sure of the reaction. I'm going to oil based essential oils for my scalp for my growth aids. I'm just not sure what the BKT likes yet so I'm playing it safe. I might rub a MT mix of oils and MT into my temples to help them grow in better at some point. I have a slight receding hairline due to my age and from wearing braids for years, so I need to use growth aids to keep it as full as possible.

 

[girlyprincess23]

I haven't been using my MT because I'm not sure of the reaction. I'm going to oil based essential oils for my scalp for my growth aids. I'm just not sure what the BKT likes yet so I'm playing it safe. I might rub a MT mix of oils and MT into my temples to help them grow in better at some point. I have a slight receding hairline due to my age and from wearing braids for years, so I need to use growth aids to keep it as full as possible.

I don't know for sure that is the OCT/MN yet. It may be a couple of things. One I did not have the right shampoo and the dominicans used their shampoo which I am sure had sulfates in it. Second the leave in i've been using I haven't checked for sulfates in it. Also my roots are natural (no relaxer) so I expected it to wear off faster. Also it could be new growth also because my head has been itching more than it usually does and this "wearing off of BKT" or what I think is wearing off didn't happen for several weeks so some of it just might be new growth. Who knows. I still love the BKT my relaxed hair is still very straight and soft and shiny and healthy looking!

 

[AtlantaJJ]

I don't know for sure that is the OCT/MN yet. It may be a couple of things. One I did not have the right shampoo and the dominicans used their shampoo which I am sure had sulfates in it. Second the leave in i've been using I haven't checked for sulfates in it. Also my roots are natural (no relaxer) so I expected it to wear off faster. Also it could be new growth also because my head has been itching more than it usually does and this "wearing off of BKT" or what I think is wearing off didn't happen for several weeks so some of it just might be new growth. Who knows. I still love the BKT my relaxed hair is still very straight and soft and shiny and healthy looking!

I textlaxed to what would normally be a frizzy under processed mess (on purpose) and now with the BKT I wash and airdry smooth as silk. I keep checking my ends because they were pretty wonky but they are doing great.

I'm still trying to figure out the best shampoo condish combo because my hair feels great, I can't tell if it needs protein or moisture...

You might be experiencing new growth, I have a little myself....little waves at the roots.

Now if I can figure out how to henna without problems I might be in hair heaven.... Darn grays!!

 

[girlyprincess23]

I textlaxed to what would normally be a frizzy under processed mess (on purpose) and now with the BKT I wash and airdry smooth as silk. I keep checking my ends because they were pretty wonky but they are doing great.

I'm still trying to figure out the best shampoo condish combo because my hair feels great, I can't tell if it needs protein or moisture...

You might be experiencing new growth, I have a little myself....little waves at the roots.

Now if I can figure out how to henna without problems I might be in hair heaven.... Darn grays!!

I decided to use L'anza healing moisture line. I actually washed and conditioned it yesterday. It didn't feel so great after the shampoo but after the condish it felt awesome!!

 

[belle_reveuse28]

Regarding the issue Steph is having, I was thinking... I had been concerned before about getting this treatment because my hair does not like protein in products. It gets very brittle and snaps quite easily, and so as a natural, it is of dire importance that I have the proper protein moisture balance, with moisture always being my real concern.

I see how this treatment works, and those who may be protein sensitive may do well with this. But with that, I've also seen the suggestions that one should use conditioners and poos that have keratin to fill in the holes where the treatment wears off. Isn't that the same as using protein products, and if your hair is protein sensitive, wouldn't you therefore get protein overload.

In addition, I use ayurvedic regimen. Most of the powders are strengthening and so is henna. Basically, isn't this treatment subsituting the strengthening part of those powders? Seriously, how much strength does one need, and if the BKT makes the hair strong, then there you go, what else do you need? Please correct me if I'm wrong. I do know that the powders do have a stimulating effect as well to increase growth, and in that case, I would probably use the oil infusions rather than doing a rinse with the powder itself. When I use these powders, my hair feels so strong its ropey and feels like I could pull a truck with it. So I know for sure they really make the hair strong.

Hopefully, the BKT would substitute for all of those things in a way, but it seems to me that one could surely get protein/strengthening overload with using all of this in conjunction with a BKT. For some reason, I'd advise against it. I'd see how my hair did without the powders for awhile if BKT is what I'm going to do to my hair. I think the process itself and the application is sufficient in keeping the hair strong for a period of time, and therefore, would concentrate on maintaining moisture... So I believe this may be the reason why the hair is snapping and breaking all over the place...

What do you ladies think?