Is Suicide a Sin?

[Nonie]

Just an fyi, the word suicide is not in the bible.

But the word kill, which falls under "suicide" is in the bible. I don't know how old English is but the word suicide was introduced to the English language from Latin around 1651.

I remember someone arguing that the bible doesn't say you cannot listen to secular music or watch porn or whatever it is that his pastor had said he couldn't do but he wanted to do. The response was something along the lines that there was no TV or radio back then but the basic advice given then can be applied to today using common sense we've been blessed with--or something along those lines.

 

[Coffee]

But the word kill, which falls under "suicide" is in the bible. I don't know how old English is but the word suicide was introduced to the English language from Latin around 1651.

I remember someone arguing that the bible doesn't say you cannot listen to secular music or watch porn or whatever it is that his pastor had said he couldn't do but he wanted to do. The response was something along the lines that there was no TV or radio back then but the basic advice given then can be applied to today using common sense we've been blessed with--or something along those lines.

I respectfully disagree with you that suicide falls under kill. The bible can and is interperted differently by each person, which is why we are the only ones responsible for us getting into heaven .

Common sense is not that common.

 

[Nonie]

I respectfully disagree with you that suicide falls under kill. The bible can and is interperted differently by each person, which is why we are the only ones responsible for us getting into heaven .

Common sense is not that common.

Isn't the definition of suicide "killing oneself" or how do you define it? That's what I mean. It involves taking a life, which is another way of saying, it involves killing.

1 Corinthians 3:16-17 says:

Don't you know that you yourselves are God's temple and that God's Spirit lives in you? If anyone destroys God's temple, God will destroy him; for God's temple is sacred, and you are that temple.

 

[Crown]

But since killing at war or self-defense (as David did Goliath) was never taught to me as being a sin but rather it was done "with God's help", I am guessing that suicide is one of those things we as humans cannot make judgments on--since depression is a disease--and perhaps we'll just have to let the true Judge make that call on Judgment Day.

Remember those verses :
1Chr. [FONT=&quot]28.2[FONT=&quot] Then David the king stood up upon his feet, and said, Hear me, my brethren, and my people: As for me, I had in mine heart to build an house of rest for the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and for the footstool of our God, and had made ready for the building: 28.3 But God said unto me, Thou shalt not build an house for my name, because thou hast been a man of war, and hast shed blood.[/FONT][/FONT]

Killing at war or self-defense or someone else (planned) or yourself (suicide) is killing and means taking a life, so it is a sin.

Is it a sin that can be forgiven ? The Bible speaks about one sin that can not be forgiven :
Matt. 12.31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. 12.32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

So, your conclusion is right on point :

suicide is one of those things we as humans cannot make judgments on--since depression is a disease--and perhaps we'll just have to let the true Judge make that call on Judgment Day.

 

[Nonie]

I agree with you killing is killing even at war. The only reason I mentioned I don't know what to think when it comes to war, is because David fought Goliath with God and killed Goliath. So in a way, God was behind David's killing of Goliath. David asked God for help and then killed Goliath. See my point?

When it comes to suicide, unless one is not of sound mind, to me it is sin. Why? Because God is the author and finisher, He decides how many days you will live so if you take your life, you're taking matters into your own hands and totally disregarding His plan for you. In other words, you are playing god; taking that decision away from God. Is that OK to do?

My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place. When I was woven together in the depths of the earth, [16] your eyes saw my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.

(Psalm 139:15-16 NIV)

[19]Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; [20] you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.

(1 Corinthians 6:19-20 NIV)

Does doing harm to your body fall under honoring God?

Then there's the issue about forgiveness that you mention.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

(1 John 1:9 NIV)

OK, God will forgive if we confess our sins. Usually that happens after we commit the sin, so obviously if you commit the sin of murder and you're the victim, you will not get to confess your sin. (I am still referring to one of sound mind. I will return to address one who is insane later.)

Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live? {24} "But if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits sin and does the same detestable things the wicked man does, will he live? None of the righteous things he has done will be remembered. Because of the unfaithfulness he is guilty of and because of the sins he has committed, he will die. {25} "Yet you say, 'The way of the Lord is not just.' Hear, O house of Israel: Is my way unjust? Is it not your ways that are unjust? {26} If a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits sin, he will die for it; because of the sin he has committed he will die. {27} But if a wicked man turns away from the wickedness he has committed and does what is just and right, he will save his life. {28} Because he considers all the offenses he has committed and turns away from them, he will surely live; he will not die.

(Ezekiel 18:23-28 NIV)

So if you live a godly life and then sin and don't get a chance to turn away from that sin, then all the good you did will be forgotten. And if you kill yourself, you don't get a second chance.

Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment

(Hebrews 9:27 NIV)

So if you kill yourself, you die having committed a sin, and then comes judgment.

That last verse actually addresses my line that you quoted "suicide is one of those things we as humans cannot make judgments on--since depression is a disease--and perhaps we'll just have to let the true Judge make that call on Judgment Day" because God will know how to deal with each one. If it happens out of madness, I believe God is a merciful God. But if you were of sound mind and reached that crossroad where you had a choice to go either

1. the way of pain and trust that the Almighty, All-Knowing, Ever-Present God who has a plan for you (Jer 29:11) and who has asked countless of times to call unto Him in your time of need, who has shown you in His word and I'm sure in your life that He is Lord and no one that comes to Him is ever disappointed...believing He will see you through; or
2. ignore God and His will for your life; forget all that you know of His Person and his ability to put all the pieces of your life together. In other words, you lose faith and doubt that He will bring you through ("And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him." (Heb 11:6 NIV) and ignore his command "Call unto me"...but decide to do what you in your human mind (not Spirit led) believe is the thing to do.

In other words, just like God gives us a choice whether to accept Him in our lives or not, at that crossroad, you have a choice whether to reject God's plan and will for your life and do your own thing, or whether to accept his plan for your life (even if it means it could be a journey as trying as Job's) and His help believing in the promises in His word. ("No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it." (1 Cor 10:12 NIV))

An interesting read on the Bible on suicide: http://www.christiananswers.net/q-dml/dml-y038.html

 

[Coffee]

Nonie, my thoughts are that God knows everything about us, including when and how we will die. My beliefs are we are put here for a certain amount of time and when that time is up, we are called home or where ever we have choosen to go. I don't think that anyone who commit suicide is of sound mind therefore they cannot be held responsible for the act. Because our God is God full of grace and mercy I don't see Him holding someone responsible for committing suicide who is not in their right mind. As I said earlier, my son committed suicide and God showed me how much pain, suffering and hopeless he was in. My son went to heaven, because God as good as He is allowed me to see and know things that people go their whole lives without seeing or knowing. As I said before we all have our interptation of our understanding of the bible. I know what I know and nothing will change that. An example of suicide is what if a soldier jumps on a grenade to save his friends, he committed suicide, he took his own life. Do you believe that God will look at him as sinning? I don't want to or care to get in a disagreement with you, I respect your belief of what suicide is and prayerfully you will respect mine and the knowledge I was shown by God. Have a wonderfully blessed day my Sister.

 

[divya]

Just want to add that even though God knows when and how we will die, doesn't mean that is what He intended for us. God is all-Knowing. He knows all kinds of things that we will do, even the negative things.

That's not saying anything about the ultimate fate of those who commit suicide though. Only the Lord knows...

 

[Nonie]

Coffee, I see your point. My argument was from the fact that when I was a teen, I toyed with the idea over some BS. I wasn't crazy. I knew it was wrong but just didn't want to face another day. I was being selfish. I just didn't care. I cannot be so dishonest as to claim that I was "not of a sound mind" no matter how down I was. My pain and sorrow was nowhere near what it might've been had I been Job or had any of the reasons we read of why people kill themselves. I was not crazy. I was just thinking about myself and didn't give a damn about someone else.

I know someone who committed suicide because he couldn't make ends meet and knew if he died his wife and kids would be OK coz of the life insurance. As "noble" as that might seem to some, it was very selfish on his part and he didn't give God a chance to show him how all things work for the good for them that love God.

So that's the suicide I'm talking about. I realize it's a topic that is difficult because you dealt with it from the perspective of one who was not "of sound mind" and I have said it quite a few times that that person will meet God in the state they died and our merciful Father will address him accordingly. But I think it's very irresponsible to ignore the fact that suicide isn't always done because we don't know better. Sometimes we just don't care. It's human nature to ignore consequences for the moment and just throw hands in the air and figure "Oh well! I'll cross that bridge when I get to it." It's why people do wrong knowingly because they only think about themselves and about now.

 

[Crown]

I agree with you killing is killing even at war. The only reason I mentioned I don't know what to think when it comes to war, is because David fought Goliath with God and killed Goliath. So in a way, God was behind David's killing of Goliath. David asked God for help and then killed Goliath. See my point?

I agree with you as well and I understand your questioning.
Keep in mind that there is a line between a judgement/will of God (like David and Goliath, or ..., or ..., or the lake of fire at the end) and an human action based on good vs evil. Sometimes, as humans, it can be difficult to state on this line.
Sound mind or insane/disease, are we sure to tell ?
Thou shall not kill ! Suicide is wrong and it is a sin. But, how can we know there was no repentance ? 30 minutes, 10 minutes are plenty enough for repentance, even if the death occurs.
Only God knows the hearts. Only Him can judge.

 

[Laela]

Nonie, well said..it can be a very tough topic to discuss...I've had a brief suicide scare in my family years ago as well. But, I was leaning more toward people who are not of "sound mind" or sober. Thanks for differentiating between the two. That was firm but compassionate, IMHO.

Only our all-seeing, all-knowing God makes that judgment call, in the end.

So that's the suicide I'm talking about. I realize it's a topic that is difficult because you dealt with it from the perspective of one who was not "of sound mind" and I have said it quite a few times that that person will meet God in the state they died and our merciful Father will address him accordingly. But I think it's very irresponsible to ignore the fact that suicide isn't always done because we don't know better. Sometimes we just don't care. It's human nature to ignore consequences for the moment and just throw hands in the air and figure "Oh well! I'll cross that bridge when I get to it." It's why people do wrong knowingly because they only think about themselves and about now.

 

[Coffee]

Nonie, I hear what you are saying, but you did not commit suicide because you were of sound mind and you were angry and not "mentally disturbed" You knew what you were doing was wrong. The majority of people who committ suicide aren't of sound mind and therefore are unable to tell right from wrong.

Between my husband and I we have about 10 bibles in our home. All of them say "Thou shall not murder" and not "kill". There is a difference between murder and kill. God often ordered people to be "killed" but not to be murdered.

As someone said only God knows the real truth and that is true. I do know that's not going to be the first question I asked when I get to heaven. I'm just going to be happy to be there. By then it's not going to even matter with me. Everyone has their own opinion and that's okay with me , and prayerfully with everyone else. As far as your friend committing suicide because of money problems, that may or may not have been true, even if it is, it doesn't sound like what a person in their right mind would do. We will never know what causes a person to commit suicide, God is the only one who truly knows.
While I am unable to speak for all who commit suicide, I can speak for my son who joined God at His Throne.

It's always interesting to hear everyone version of the bible and how it's interperted by them.

I will soon be meeting with a lady who works with my hubby who just lost her 21 year old daughter to suicide. She needs hope, peace and comfort right now, not weather or not her child committed a sin. She told my hubby she wants to know how I survived it. It was by the same God who I depend on daily. That is one of the blessings that came out of my son committing suicide, I have been able to talk /help people who have experienced the loss of a child, either by suicide or other means. God uses us in spite of the pain and trials we go through.

God's love & blessings to everyone.

 

[Nonie]

Nonie, I hear what you are saying, but you did not commit suicide because you were of sound mind and you were angry and not "mentally disturbed" You knew what you were doing was wrong. The majority of people who committ suicide aren't of sound mind and therefore are unable to tell right from wrong.

Between my husband and I we have about 10 bibles in our home. All of them say "Thou shall not murder" and not "kill". There is a difference between murder and kill. God often ordered people to be "killed" but not to be murdered.

As someone said only God knows the real truth and that is true. I do know that's not going to be the first question I asked when I get to heaven. I'm just going to be happy to be there. By then it's not going to even matter with me. Everyone has their own opinion and that's okay with me , and prayerfully with everyone else.

While I am unable to speak for all who commit suicide, I can speak for my son who joined God at His Throne.

It's always interesting to hear everyone version of the bible and how it's interperted by them.

I will soon be meeting with a lady who works with my hubby who just lost her 21year old daughter. She needs hope, peace and comfort right now, not weather or not her child committed a sin. She told my hubby she wants to know how I survived it. It was by the same God who I depend on daily.

God's love & blessings to everyone.

When you say that I didn't commit suicide because I had a sound mind, I get the feeling that you assume I stopped myself; that I came to my senses and didn't do it. How about if I tell you it's coz I got lucky and failed?

Not everyone that commits suicide is mentally ill, Coffee. Your son might've been. But many people just give up on God or don't give God a chance or don't think of Him or don't even know of Him. Without God, you can sink into despair, into anxiety, into crime, etc. With God you can have the fruit of the Spirit and life abundantly.

If we make excuses for suicide, we might as well make excuses for homicide too, and rape, and theft...and say "They are not of sound mind". But we all know that's not always the case. We know there are people who do wrong knowing it's wrong as long as they can get away with it.

People not in the Lord don't really believe that there is such a thing as eternal life or condemnation; or heaven or hell; or life after death for that matter. Some might believe there's life after death but only in the sense of reincarnation as something/someone else and usually they hope it'll be better than what they are today so might choose to take a gamble and end this life to see what they'll return as next--after all, they could just repeat the process if they hate that too. People like that are not mentally ill. They just chose to ignore everything God has given us to show us that He is.

18The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.

21For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

(Romans 1:18-23 NIV)

28Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

(Romans 1:28-32 NIV)

 

[Coffee]

Nonie, I'm not trying to make you come over to my way of thinking. As I said we have different understandings of the bible and its meaning. You believe one way and I believe another, would be a dull world if we all thought and believed the same. This question won't be answered here on earth, I think we can both agree to that. We can agree to disagree and respect each others beliefs and end it on that note. It's been interesting hearing your thoughts. Have a blessed evening.

 

[discobiscuits]

bumping for kerryann

 

[MoniintheMiddle]

Having been someone who has failed 10+ times of committing suicide I know now that it's a sin in my opinion because your unable to repent. I know that God will be the one who make the final decision as to where you spend eternity but I know that even though I may feel like Im already in hell doesn't mean I am.

This is why I was taught that suicide is a sin.
As i've gotten older, there seems to be a lot of "scenarios" in which suicide can take place. For example, if someone is mentally ill (as has been mentioned on this thread) I don't see how they can be held accountable but I just don't know to be honest.

I also think about those who suffer from terminal and painful illnesses.

I hope and pray that I never get to a point where I feel that suicide is the only option

 

[SilentRuby]

Yes, it's a sin.

I'll never forget having to argue a teacher in 4th grade (private school at that ) about suicide being a sin. She told the class that once you were saved, you were always saved so that meant even if you committed suicide, you would still go to heaven I knew better. Needless to say, when I got to 8th or 9th grade (I had started going to public school by then) I heard that one of my classmates that had been in the classroom with me in 4th grade killed himself. I always wondered in the back of my mind if it was because of what she said