can girls from southern africa grow long hair? i know west/central/east africans

[Neith]

To people who say that 4b/black/African or whatever type of kinky hair grows significantly slower than other types of hair...

How fast is it growing? 1/4 of an inch per month? (3 inches per year)

Less than that?

That doesn't seem feasible even from just looking at personal experience and life experience alone.

Sure, there are slow growers (of all races) but I seriously doubt that the majority of people with type 4 hair grow half as much hair as people with looser textures.

Eh. I know that my hair grows about a half inch per month. I guess I should consider myself lucky for a black girl instead of just average. *shrugs*


I don't doubt that there is a possibility that taking an average of "us" vs. "them" may in fact show that their average growth rate is higher. It may show otherwise (that would be funny, lol). Who knows?

I don't think it's by some huge percentage even if they do have a higher average growth rate.

 

[Kurlee]

Nah, until we start to listen/pay attention to our hair and not try to emulate others or pay attention to what their hair does, we'll always buy into the lie that our hair isn't capable of being long or that it is a major chore to care for it if we want it long. And we will continue to hate shrinkage and every little thing that our hair does. And in that pit of misery we'll have dug ourselves into, we'll continue to live in darkness and miss out on all the cute little things our hair can do that would've made this journey the most exciting adventure ever.

Many years ago in my less "informed" days (teens), I believed what many here believe about certain TYPES of hair having limits on what they could be. it wasn't until I learned more about my natural texture and healthy hair care practices and biology, that my hair took off. When I first went natural, it used to hurt to comb my hair and detangling was a nightmare. I hated washing. Now that I learned about washing in sections. I have no issues. Now that I know to properly moisturize consistently, I don't get splits, barely trim and my hair doesn't "hurt" to comb it. Those simple things, changed the texture and maintenance of my hair drastically. If I leave my hair alone, braids, twists, protective styles and buns with lots of moisture, I can be lazy and "ignore" my hair and it will retain it's length and will be fine. Hair is always growing, no matter what you do or who you are. Whether you keep it, is up to u. I love wash and go's but the detangling afterwards is a chore, so that's a "sometimes" style. U have to accept the nature of your hair and what it can do and what it likes, which is unique to every individual. Once you do that, you'll be fine.

 

[Kurlee]

I don't believe this, I don't believe this at all. I have seen a former Caucasian roommate who cut her hair in to a bob and 4 months later it was near bra-strap length again. Even after I wore protective styling and stayed weaved up in those 4 months, my growth rate was not nearly as much as hers. Plus, if we all grew hair at the same rate what would be the point of taking vitamins in hopes of increasing it. Let's just admit the facts, genetics DOES play a part. Most other races of hair do grow faster than the majority of Black hair and when I say black I am being subjective because a lot of us are mixed with various forms of ancestry due to slavery so we have some black people whose hair will grow faster than other black people's hair.

so the magical non-black genes can accelerate the "black" slow geneserplexed. U do know that there is no such thing as "white" and black"" genes and skin color genes are "seperate" or operate independently to hair ones

 

[ellebelle88]

If she did then she's an anomaly. I've been in predominantly white schools and summer camps, most of my friends are white and I have yet to see a white girl grow her hair from neck length to bra-strap in 4 months especially since the average rate is 0.5 in/month. If she were the majority, I'm sure that in my 22 years of living, I would have seen at least one white person do that. I don't even see that on blogs. One blogger that I follow grew her hair from SL to Bra-strap in about 2 years. But again, rates differ on an individual basis. Your hair grows slowly as you claim but I know many black women who would stay weaved up and gain a lot of growth that way. Whether they are able to keep the growth or not is the issue. I'm not sure what vitamins have to do with this because people in general take multivitamins in order to provide their bodies with the proper nutrients. Currently, I'm taking One-a-Day and I'm taking msm for my skin (puberty sucked! haha). It's not like vitamins directly increase your rate but they keep you healthy so if your body is at maximum health, your body processes (growth etc.) will go more efficiently and you'll be able to grow hair at your maximum rate (everyone's maximum rate is different). I looked at hairfinity ingredients and they are regular multivitamins basically. Black people are not the only ones who take vitamins so I don't get why you mentioned them. But just to add that to that, I didn't take any vitamins when I had braids in and I didn't moisturize my hair lol but my hair grew faster than the average rate (all of my friends even noticed that and commented on it). My cousin who recently loc'ed has SL locs (which means that her hair is actually much longer when stretched) and it hasn't even been a year yet. She doesn't take vitamins. All she does is moisturize and wash. As I stated before, if we look at loc'ed women and women in certain protective styles, on average, they should grow at a normal rate. there will always be individual differences as shown by the fact that our protective styling experiences were different.

And for the other poster who mentioned that her white friend colors her hair every two weeks- so does my mother lol and there are tons of women who perm their hair every month (though they shouldn't) because of new growth so clearly their hair growing. so many black women perm too often and then complain that their hair isn't growing (really it's just breaking from poor hair practices-doesn't help that many of us were taught to trim often as well- I used to trim every 6-8 weeks so the longest part of my layers stayed at APL). I just don't understand this mentality that it takes ages for us to grow but there are so many factors that play into how this myth was created and it'd take even longer to get into.

I definitely wouldn't call her an anomaly. I know that she had her hair cut in April before school let out for the summer and when I saw her again in late August, her hair was down her back. So maybe you should live 22 more years, I don't know...BUT I don't think that she's any different. If I could post pictures from her Facebook, I would.

You totally lost me on the vitamins part. You say you don't know why I mentioned vitamins, but I think it is a known fact that people on the boards take Biotin and other hair vitamins to increase their chances of hair growth and they aren't necessarily changing their diets either.

There are plenty of people who may not be eating healthy or doing everything to keep their body in the best shape but they still see some kind of increased hair growth while on the hair vitamins. So I find your whole speil on you taking multi-vitamins a bit irrelevant. Yes, making your body healthy will probably lead to clearer skin and faster hair growth, etc. But you keep missing the point: There are other races who are just as unhealthy as us and their hair still grows without the need for all the hair vitamins, multivitamins, etc. So how do you explain that if it isn't genetics?

 

[ellebelle88]

so the magical non-black genes can accelerate the "black" slow geneserplexed. U do know that there is no such thing as "white" and black"" genes and skin color genes are "seperate" or operate independently to hair ones

Hi Kurlee,

Yes, I am aware that the Human Genome Project ruled race a social construct and I wholeheartedly believe that. But I think you are twisting my words though and I also think you are confusing my references to genes WITH race. Two people of different races can have similar genes, yes! But I'm saying that there are certain genetic factors which allow people to grow hair at varying rates, just like certain genes code for how fast someone grows, etc.

 

[Rain20]

So genetics play a part in hair texture but not growth rate? I think that hair practices do play a part in growth but so do genetics. There are other factors as well, such as hormones and disease states that also play a role in growth. So I dont think protective styling and moisturizing and protein/moisture balance.... are the only factors.There are some people that do not do any of this and their hair is down their backs some people do all of these methods of hair care and they may only be shoulder length. There is variation in growth rates on this board and all of the variation in growth is not from people who have improper hair practices. No heat is practiced on this board and Brittanynic has shown that with proper care some people can thrive using heat regularly. Of course you have to take care of your hair but your family genes as well as genes within an ethnicity play a part. It's nothing negative.

I feel bad for the OP because it doesnt seem as if there have been many S. African ladies posting any pics.

 

[ellebelle88]

Hi ladies, I found this online.

Not only do different people have different rates of growth for their hair, but an individual person’s hair can grow at different rates at various places on his/her head. The hair follicles actually act independently of one another. Otherwise, when the hair starts to shed, a person would suddenly lose all his hair at once, or a person might suddenly discover that all the hairs on his or her head are going gray at the same time. The follicles may behave in similar patterns based on their position on the scalp (some areas seeming to grow faster than others) and their behavior can easily be affected by outside influences based on the position on the scalp (such as with cases of traction hair loss and friction hair loss).

However, studies have shown that the average rate of hair growth (specifically among individuals of Caucasian, European descent) is one-half inch (or 1.25 cm) per month. Some more recent studies suggest that the hair growth rates for those of African-ethnic descent is lower, though exact numbers vary and the studies are still ongoing.

The same principle is true for nails in that different people’s nail will grow at different rates and that we professionals in the industry use the average growth rates based on studies done. The average person’s fingernails grow at a rate of one-eighth-inch to one-quarter-inch per month (from 3 to 7 mm) depending on who you ask. The variance of these measurements and averages may be a result of attrition caused by natural wearing of the nails through daily activities (the nails being worn down tiny amounts each day because of friction against other objects).

I think what most people are doing is confusing the term "average growth" with "all growth." Average is a median number taken, but its definitely not representative of an entire subset. This makes much more sense to me than the "All hair grows at the same length!" claims. According to this, my roommate would have had about 5 inches of growth over 4-5 months. So, I don't think that its hard to believe that her hair went from right at SL to BSL.

I also want to say one more thing. I frequent an acne board and people pose the question about why their skin is haywire even after they have tried everything. Most responses on the boards chalk it up to genes. There is little to no discussion about the fact that some people can do nothing to their skin and it remains flawless, while others can do everything and it's still bad.

However for some reason, I think if there was an all-black acne board, people would be saying, "No, genes is not the reason why we have acne. We just have to do the "right" things to our skin." But it really isn't that simple.

 

[Kurlee]

Hi Kurlee,

Yes, I am aware that the Human Genome Project ruled race a social construct and I wholeheartedly believe that. But I think you are twisting my words though and I also think you are confusing my references to genes WITH race. Two people of different races can have similar genes, yes! But I'm saying that there are certain genetic factors which allow people to grow hair at varying rates, just like certain genes code for how fast someone grows, etc.

i totally understand what you mean, but I genuinely feel it is a retention issue and not an inherent genetic difference/deficiency.

 

[Neith]

Hi ladies, I found this online.


This makes much more sense to me than the "All hair grows at the same length!" claims. According to this, my roommate would have had about 5 inches of growth over 4-5 months. So, I don't think that its hard to believe that her hair went from right at SL to BSL.

I also want to say one more thing. I frequent an acne board and when people pose the question about why their skin is haywire even after they have tried everything. Most responses on the boards chalk it up to genes. There is little to no discussion about the fact that some people can do nothing to their skin and it remains flawless, while others can do everything and it's still bad.

However for some reason, I think if there was an all-black acne board, people would be saying, "No, genes is not the reason why we have acne. We just have to do the "right" things to our skin." But it really isn't that simple.

Does anyone say that darker skin by far gets acne more than lighter skin?

Yes, it can be genetic, but that's on an individual level. Not a racial/ethnic one.

I never said that genetics plays no role in hair growth. I just don't feel that the genes that make your hair kinky are the same as the genes that make your hair grow at a certain speed.

And if hair type plays a role in growth... why is it that type 3's don't have slower growth than type 1's? Why is the slow growth gene only connected to type 4 hair?

To people who say that 4b/black/African or whatever type of kinky hair grows significantly slower than other types of hair...

How fast is it growing (on average)? 1/4 of an inch per month? (3 inches per year)

Less than that?

No one has a response for that question? I'm just curious...

 

[Kurlee]

So genetics play a part in hair texture but not growth rate? I think that hair practices do play a part in growth but so do genetics. There are other factors as well, such as hormones and disease states that also play a role in growth. So I dont think protective styling and moisturizing and protein/moisture balance.... are the only factors.There are some people that do not do any of this and their hair is down their backs some people do all of these methods of hair care and they may only be shoulder length. There is variation in growth rates on this board and all of the variation in growth is not from people who have improper hair practices. No heat is practiced on this board and Brittanynic has shown that with proper care some people can thrive using heat regularly. Of course you have to take care of your hair but your family genes as well as genes within an ethnicity play a part. It's nothing negative.

I feel bad for the OP because it doesnt seem as if there have been many S. African ladies posting any pics.

Just to add to this, even if there is a genetic difference, the few articles that I have read that talk about growth, imply that some of the shortest growth phases are about 2.5 years, with the longest being 6 years. So at 0.5 inches/month X 30 months = 15 inches (approximately past APL - BSL, depending on height. If we go to in between at say 4 years = 0.5 inches/month X 48 months = 24 inches (definitely at least waist length). Even in the "middle" of the ranges, if the hair grew less than 0.5 inches a month, you would still hit at least BSL. If in the shortest growth phase, the person grew less than the average, they could still hit 11-12 inches, and that would still be very close to APL on most people. So what's the excuse then? Even if "black" people were to have the shortest growth cycle AND grow less than average per month (which is highly unlikely), their hair would still be longer than most have it now (APLish), so what's the excuse now?

The logic is just and basically, "good" hair/ "bad" hair under the guise of "keeping it real

 

[Kurlee]

Does anyone say that darker skin by far gets acne more than lighter skin?

Yes, it can be genetic, but that's on an individual level. Not a racial/ethnic one.

I never said that genetics plays no role in hair growth. I just don't feel that the genes that make your hair kinky are the same as the genes that make your hair grow at a certain speed.

And if hair type plays a role in growth... why is it that type 3's don't have slower growth than type 1's? Why is the slow growth gene only connected to type 4 hair?

ON damn point!

 

[HauteHippie]

I'd almost forgotten why I went on a LHCF hiatus. There is some absolute craziness in response to this question. Facts are facts, period. The question is valid, especially considering that the origin of hair types, texture, and color were initially related to the environment. We just cemented what nature provided over the centuries. And yes, genotypes/phenotypes are real. If they're not, then how could Israel administer ridiculous DNA tests to look for the "Jewish gene"?

And for the record, yes, some ethnic groups are genetically predisposed to being taller than some other ethnic groups. It has to do with climate, elevation, and the bottle-neck effect among many other things. The other person who brought up osteoporosis is dead-on. It's good to know I'm not the only one who passes 7th-grade science. I don't think Asian and Caucasian women are inferior because their bones have a higher chance of being brittle, nor do I think women of African descent (yeah--African descent, and please don't get all Lucy theory on me since half the people who are writing on this post are reaching very far or perhaps, very deep into their own insecurities and transferring them onto others) are inferior because our hair has a tendency to be more dry making it more prone to breakage. Those who attach values onto those things have a whole list of issues to tackle themselves. This posting has managed to turn into exactly what the OP did not want it to turn into. Are we really going to talk about wording? "You should have worded it like this..." Really? Maybe I work with too many males, but I find it difficult to imagine that there are that many overly sensitive people around-- and, yet, here they are clickty-clacking away. It should be shocking, but it's not. This is very similar to the lynching that can go on in some [bad] churches when someone asks a simple question. Way to convert a non-believer...

Can someone please step out to get the fostering and nurturing environment that once was LHCF? I'd like to think we haven't lost it completely.

 

[Neith]

I'd almost forgotten why I went on a LHCF hiatus. There is some absolute craziness in response to this question. Facts are facts, period. The question is valid, especially considering that the origin of hair types, texture, and color were initially related to the environment. We just cemented what nature provided over the centuries. And yes, genotypes/phenotypes are real. If they're not, then how could Israel administer ridiculous DNA tests to look for the "Jewish gene"?

And for the record, yes, some ethnic groups are genetically predisposed to being taller than some other ethnic groups. It has to do with climate, elevation, and the bottle-neck effect among many other things. The other person who brought up osteoporosis is dead-on. It's good to know I'm not the only one who passes 7th-grade science. I don't think Asian and Caucasian women are inferior because their bones have a higher chance of being brittle, nor do I think women of African descent (yeah--African descent, and please don't get all Lucy theory on me since half the people who are writing on this post are reaching very far or perhaps, very deep into their own insecurities and transferring them onto others) are inferior because our hair has a tendency to be more dry making it more prone to breakage. Those who attach values onto those things have a whole list of issues to tackle themselves. This posting has managed to turn into exactly what the OP did not want it to turn into. Are we really going to talk about wording? "You should have worded it like this..." Really? Maybe I work with too many males, but I find it difficult to imagine that there are that many overly sensitive people around-- and, yet, here they are clickty-clacking away. It should be shocking, but it's not. This is very similar to the lynching that can go on in some [bad] churches when someone asks a simple question. Way to convert a non-believer...

Can someone please step out to get the fostering and nurturing environment that once was LHCF? I'd like to think we haven't lost it completely.

I think that people should be able to share their opinions freely without being belittled or attacked on a personal level if you want to get back to that old nurturing environment.

It's a discussion board. Discussions and debates happen. I don't see why people take disagreements as personal attacks.

On top of that it seems that you misunderstand my thoughts on the subject. The OP has the right to ask the question as I said in my very first post in this thread. I don't feel that kinky hair is inferior and I'm well aware that it's more fragile and breaks more as I'm sure I've said more than once here. I just don't think it grows at a snail's pace as some people seem to think.

Also, I can't see where I personally "lynched" anyone. I'm respectful of the OP and anyone I responded to. If your post was directed at me...

*clickety clack*

 

[ellebelle88]

Ok ladies, I agree with the poster EtherealEnigma. So I will just say that I think it all boils down to believing what you want to believe about your hair. I am not going to hide under any false guise about my hair and what it needs and how fast it grows. I do understand what you all are saying but I think a bigger part of the conversation is being obliterated because we are consciously ignoring certain factors.

Happy Hair Growing ladies.

 

[Neith]

Ok ladies, I agree with the poster EtherealEnigma. So I will just say that I think it all boils down to believing what you want to believe about your hair. I am not going to hide under any false guise about my hair and what it needs and how fast it grows. I do understand what you all are saying but I think a bigger part of the conversation is being obliterated because we are consciously ignoring certain factors.

Happy Hair Growing ladies.

Yep, everyone is entitled to their opinion. I am not trying to force my views down anyone's throat. Not trying to convert anyone. lol I don't think that's the point of discussions.

I choose not to believe that type 4 hair has some kind of slow growth gene attached to it - (one that apparently no other hair type has) The structure of type 4 hair makes it more fragile and prone to damage and breakage, and it needs a lot of TLC, but long lengths are a possibility for any healthy person.

That's just how I see things. Anyone who may disagree with me... fine. That's your opinion. Please don't feel that I have something against you personally because we disagree about hair. I just like to discuss topics that interest me.

HHG

 

[LunadeMiel]

Ok ladies, I agree with the poster EtherealEnigma. So I will just say that I think it all boils down to believing what you want to believe about your hair. I am not going to hide under any false guise about my hair and what it needs and how fast it grows. I do understand what you all are saying but I think a bigger part of the conversation is being obliterated because we are consciously ignoring certain factors.

Happy Hair Growing ladies.

Exactly. People will continue to believe what they want. All we can do as individuals is make sure that you take care of your hair and scalp.

 

[Vintageglam]

The fact is we need more sub-Saharan type 4s involved in this debate in order to address the original issue and OPs original question. OP asked a valid question based on her personal experiences and we are not qualified to belittle that. I think it's imp that these debates are had on LHFC without the proponents of one theory overruling the others. Our experiences are all real and valid and we should not take it for granted that we can speak on behalf of another group when there are objective and identifiable differences. To me it just seems more fair and objective to provide a suitable forum where I can talk about the growth rate of my hair type. Essentially I feel the whole hair typing system is a mess and this is where the discord originates from. If I wanted to live in a perpetual state of denial I would have joined a multi ethnic board. But I chose LHFC to be able to dialogue with women facing the same challenges as me. Surely we should not lose sight of this fact.

 

[ConstantlyDynamic]

I definitely wouldn't call her an anomaly. I know that she had her hair cut in April before school let out for the summer and when I saw her again in late August, her hair was down her back. So maybe you should live 22 more years, I don't know...BUT I don't think that she's any different. If I could post pictures from her Facebook, I would.

You totally lost me on the vitamins part. You say you don't know why I mentioned vitamins, but I think it is a known fact that people on the boards take Biotin and other hair vitamins to increase their chances of hair growth and they aren't necessarily changing their diets either.

There are plenty of people who may not be eating healthy or doing everything to keep their body in the best shape but they still see some kind of increased hair growth while on the hair vitamins. So I find your whole speil on you taking multi-vitamins a bit irrelevant. Yes, making your body healthy will probably lead to clearer skin and faster hair growth, etc. But you keep missing the point: There are other races who are just as unhealthy as us and their hair still grows without the need for all the hair vitamins, multivitamins, etc. So how do you explain that if it isn't genetics?

Everyone has a maximum growth rate that is genetically predetermined, not predetermined by race seeing that even within a race, there are HUGE differences. And if I'm already growing at my max rate, I can take all of the vitamins in the world- my hair will still grow at that max rate. Vitamins aren't a magic pill to make your hair grow faster than what it was genetically destined to grow- they just make you healthier overall so that your body can perform functions better and you can reach/maintain your max rate if this is the case. Even if you aren't eating healthy but are taking vitamins, as you stated in the example given, you're still giving your body more nutrients than it would otherwise take in from the poor diet so that goes back to what I said. We don't need vitamins more than a white person would (I've never heard that black people needed vitamins more than any other race) and no black girl that I know even takes vitamins yet they grow their hair at good rates. I didn't know people took multivitamins specifically for hair until I came on here. I see that they do this on LHC too. This was all new to me. I mean multivitamins are just good to take and people should take them for the health benefits (shrugs). And I'm not denying the story about your friend. I believe this is possible but that it isn't typical. I said neck-length in my post btw but you said her hair was SL? I was just trying to say that my white friends have had all types of hairstyles-pixies, bobs, etc. but I've never had a friend grow a NL bob to bra-strap in 4 months and I've never seen acquaintances (or even people online) do such either. I feel like too many black people think that white people go from bald-headed to butt-length in a year and they don't. Either way, I think people will always disagree on this subject until a proper study is done and I already suggested that a good study would control for the retention variable.

 

[Naturel]

People are still conflating the issues of growth and retention?! This is not directed to the OP. I'm just confused as to why people are still claiming that black people take a longer time to grow. When I look at naturals with locs, I don't see that. And generally, when black women that I know wear braids for 2-3 months, they get the inches that were expected. It really is about retention mainly because growth rate differs from individual to individual. White women don't grow hair faster-they just retain it easier and therefore are able to achieve certain length faster. I'm willing to bet that if they did a study that controlled for the retention variable by using women of various races that were protective styling (i think braids are the best way to tell but I could be wrong), we would find that there is no vast difference based on race though there maybe individual differences. We have yet to have a study that controls for that factor but based on what I've seen with loc'ed women and women in certain protective styles (including my own experience with braids- I grew 1.5-2 inches in a little over 2 months whenever I wore braids but would lose length due to breakage and cuts by stylists whenever I went in to straighten my hair. i have NEVER been able to achieve the same thing without braids. I'm sure my hair is growing but it's breaking off as well), our growth rate is no different on average

I definetly agree. This is the reason ladies who burns all the time grow their hair fast, it doesn't break!

 

[tHENATuRALhAiRpRoJEcT]

i'm enjoying some great... and very interesting or eyebrow raising discussion in this thread ladies!

my only small.... minute point is to add that the vast differences in DIET (to include vitamin, supplement, and general nutrient intake) from the different cultures we are comparing would ... will... and always have made a much larger difference in growth (and even retention to a degree) than that of RAW genetics

however...... almost every other point above are all contributing factors

 

[sithembile]

I think this debate has strayed away from the OP's question. She specifically asked about regional differences in hair growth based on her observations in South Africa. Now we are debating about 'type 4' hair, which is not limited southern Africa. As I said before, I don't believe that because I'm southern African that my hair grows slower than my central African cousin, who is also a '4'. But I am in no way offended by the question, I just don't understand why we're talking about colonialism, free speech and issues with LHCF.

 

[nzeee]

^^^the fact that the discussion has strayed came up a few times in this thread. Not sure why tho; this is an open forum. The contents of the discussion are what we make it. If ou want to change it then make a contribution more in line with the OPs request. Don't stop by just to critique.

This isn't meant to single out any one person. Just a point on general nature of public forums. If you want to see pictures of southern African people with long hair as initially requested then post them and see who follows. There is always a chance of changing the direction of a discussion at any point.

Personally I've enjoyed this thread and found the opposing viewpoints educational. Clearly if this discussion keeps coming up it's because we need to work it out.

These are not trivial issues. And it's a sign of our growth as a people that we are even able to engage in rational discussions around 'it'.

When the tide has change and enough women abandon centuries of miseducation and we relearn how to take care of our hair we will no longer need to talk about it. We could solely focus on growth.

Until a black womans hair is just hair, debate will pop up; sometimes when least expected.

If strong opinions make you uncomfortable stick to product and regimen threads. If you want to avoid starting debates be careful how you word your starting posts.

THIS PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT BROUGHT TO YOU BY HE LETTERS N & Z ;-)

 

[miss cosmic]

thank you for all the responses. very enlightening.
I'm not even going to further clarify what I meant.
this thread has become waaay more interesting than I expected.

 

[Junebug D]

I think 4b problems with length are for the most part a factor of retention and not growth rate. Girls getting touch-ups every 6 weeks tells me that the hair is obviously growing at a normal, average rate... maybe even faster than the average rate. But will you ever see those same girls with hair past SL? Heck no. Even if 4b has a different growth rate than every other type out there, the difference is probably not large enough to account for the type-based differences in length that we observe every day. Our hair is just far more fragile and we treat it like it's the exact opposite. Even when we are protective styling, we still may get breakage around the hairline and nape from buns, or breakage where you place your wig, breakage from tension, and all these other things that other hair types don't have to worry about half as much.

 

[FutureMD]

I do think the poster needs to hear from more people who have similar hair. I think retention is a big part of it, and hair grows at different rates in different people, so yeah, genetics are huge. If everyone in your family has long hair, you aren't going to be asking the question clearly. I never grew up thinking black women didn't have long hair. My whole family did. It still shocks me that people are surprised by it and become groupies to women on You Tube. I'd hate to think about what someone could probably convince a lot of black women to do by claiming that it would give her long hair.

There is that whole correlation or causation. If everyone around is damaging their hair, it will be hard for her to find the example that she seeks. She doesn't know how women in her area would look if they had better hair care habits. Not shampooing and relaxing once a month sounds like a nightmare for your hair.

I can say that she might have a harder time finding an answer b/c of the kinds of hair care practices that she described.

Hair texture isn't tied to growth rate, but you're going to have an easier time seeing your hair's change in length when it is a looser texture, and you'll have an easier time not breaking it off it is is less tangly and easier to comb. So a lot of the hair myths spring from that, b/c yeah, a lot of people were able to see their hair's growth and were yanking a lot less of it out when for example, they got relaxers. So you used to hear people say that they made your hair grow. Silly.

Then we've got what seems to be a world wide epidemic in people refusing to get their hair properly cut and trimmed. So that contribute to hair that is at the same length b/c the damaged ends continuously break off.

I think the only real answer for anyone is to do the best with what you have, take care of it, and then you'll see.

Finding someone of your ethnic heritage who has long hair still doesn't mean that you'll have long hair.
Hair is like a lot of other things (your figure/body/shape for example). You can work out and diet like mad, but you won't look like someone who has the same habits (or maybe even someone who doesn't work at it at all) b/c of genetics. It doesn't mean you can't try, but I think you do yourself a disservice by trying to think you can transform yourself into someone else just b/c you idealize what they look like.

So I think that if you take care of your hair, and shampoo and condition and trim it (look, so many black women are paranoid about that but your hair will break off and you'll see less length retention if you don't trim it), you'll probably have the best hair of your life. Maybe not down your back, but certainly in optimum condition.

If you are natural, you'll face one set of challenges, and if you are relaxed, you'll face another, and hopefully either you or your hairdresser can properly handle your hair or it won't turn out well.

I mean, I think genetics play a huge role, or at least in terms of some people not having to stress or struggle with it. It's not that you can't wait it out, but it will require patience and then your efforts still have to contend with genetics.

These boards and you tube can be interesting, but you have women investing lots of time and money chasing hair idols b/c someone who had short hair now has long hair.

I'd love for us to have more discussions about why we are so caught up in all of this, but that is a different conversation for a different day.

 

[EssenceOfBeauty]

Wow, I have been reading this thread and debating on whether to chime in or not.

As a full blown sub-saharan Zambian, mother is Tumbuka from Zambia and father is Ngoni from Zambia, I can most certainly say answer yes to your question OP.

I believe you probably don't see as many because of the 'in' hair right now. Currently,the common trends among women at least in Zambia, friends and family included, are weaves and relaxers. Unfortunately, most are not practising proper hair techniques to retain length while wearing weaves in addition to incorrectly using relaxers. Of course, this only applies to the ones who are trying to grow their hair long.

Others, like some else mentioned, keep it short for work, school or personal reasons. I went to a pretty popular boarding school that did not allow relaxers and only allowed hair of a specific length to be braided up or tied back. Anybody who had shorter hair usually resorted to cutting it to rock a TWA. As LHCFer's, we know how difficult it is to retain length if you rock a TWA 24/7 all year. Once out of school, most celebrate by relaxing their hair, which is usually done incorrectly.

Case in point, my sister is absolutely obsessed with weaves right now and literally 'fries' her hair with a relaxer as soon as she sees a curl peek through her scalp. When she was younger, maybe early teens, her hair was past arm pit length. I suspect it was because my mother kept her hair natural and threaded 99% of the time. My grandmother died a few years ago with natural BSL hair, most probably retained using the threading method. I have a Zambian friend who has relaxed BSL hair, not the healthiest, but BSL nonetheless. So despite her horrible hair practices, she still manages to retain a good portion of it.

I know you did ask for pictures but unfortunately I don't have any. I have seen loads of pictures of my parents and their friends from back in the day with BAA and long braids. So IMO it is probably because of the adopted methods of hair care and styling that we don't see so many with WSL, BSL or even APL hair. As for the absence of sub saharan african women with BSL or longer hair on LHCF, there aren't as many in the first place so that may explain it.

 

[Rain20]

Well most type 4 hair is common in those of african descent. This seems to be genetically determined. We cannot change it with diet or vitamins. We are born with type 4 hair. The same way this is genetically determined, hair growth rates, thin hair, oily skin/scalps are also are encoded in our genes. This is not to say you still cannot grow long hair.

Does it matter that we can grow hair to our butts or knees? From the african posters it seems as if rocking TWAs is considered stylish. Wanting such long hair seems to be most popular among african americans. Maybe this desire is also in part a subconscious desire to have a more European trait (whether hair is natural or not) meaning my hair is better than yours because it grows fast like my European counterparts.

Short hair can be healthy and long hair can be unhealthy.There are several women that have been on this board for years that practice the LHCF standard of hair care and retention methods that do not have waistlength hair. I think it is important to have clean, strong, moisturized hair.I just dont think everyone's hair will reach BSL or WL in 2-3 years because I just dont think everyone's hair grows the exact same rate and this in part is genetically determined.

 

[bibirockz]

lesedi

I'm South African by heritage (and currently living there) and my hair was MBL as a child.It is SL now after some setbacks but there is no doubt that it can and will grow long again I think what you are seeing is the result of bad hair practices. Also culturally, hair cutting is done for specific rituals here (when mourning etc) and that could be it. Also, having short hair is not seen as masculine as it sometimes is in the West. My mum has had a fade for the past 15 years and rocks it!

im so sorry this is all late. But I currently moved here (pretoria) from the US &there are soooo many products I hear about on this site that I have no idea about where to get them. Do u or anyone else who lives here, have any online websites or shops near my city that you can please suggest? TYIA

 

[Urban]

bibirockz , I'm not in SA but I just wanted to add that I've heard some high-end salons stock Mizani, Chi etc. For example, here's a salon in PT that sells Mizani, Keracare etc: UPscale Salon - Hair and Nail - Pretoria.. Here's another that may stock products that you're familiar with: Proline Hair Design - Professional Hairdressing, Styling, products for your hair and hair care. The last time I was in SA I found ORS products in Clicks, so it might be worth a visit.

SA is pretty much up there in on a lot, including fashion and beauty. The products are there, it's just a matter of finding who stocks them.

Since I'm not sure which products in particular you're after, another suggestion is to contact the manufacturer in the US and ask them to give you the contact details of their distributors in SA.

I don't know if you use oils/ essential oils, but here's a site I often come across when I'm searching for information regarding oils: Our product catalogue of pure essential oils. and what do you know? They are located in PTA! I'm sure there are other sources, but this is the only one I know.

How are you faring with local products? I know it always feels better using something you're at least familiar with, but a lot of local products are just as good. Just like in the US, you might have to sort through a few to find ones that work best for you.

Good luck!

 

[CurlyMoo]

I'm South African by heritage (and currently living there) and my hair was MBL as a child.It is SL now after some setbacks but there is no doubt that it can and will grow long again I think what you are seeing is the result of bad hair practices. Also culturally, hair cutting is done for specific rituals here (when mourning etc) and that could be it. Also, having short hair is not seen as masculine as it sometimes is in the West. My mum has had a fade for the past 15 years and rocks it!

I know I'm late but this is very interesting. Some would have you believe that the short fades of African women come from the fact that the hair doesn't or can't grow any longer. Who knew Africans owned a pair of shears.