"Nice hair for a black girl"

[Faith]

See I just don't have that kinda patience. That's why the Lord doesn't put me in those situations where ppl say things like that

WORD!!

 

[Deluxe]

This reminds me of a few months ago I was in Beauty Brands here in Dallas. It's a salon and spa with attached store. The store sells many salon brands and has a section of salon brands made for ethnic hair. They have great products and the staff is really nice.

Yet one night a girl, an employee in the store part of the operation, began questioning me about black hair and relaxers the conversation naturally led to hair growth and she questioned why so many black women have damaged hair....I explained as best to my knowledge...and then finally she asked what I think she was wanting to ask all along

"so what makes their hair look nappy?"

I didn't want to get into the fact nappy is a word most black people use to just describe really kinky hair and not damaged or unattractive hair and simply said that many black women abuse chemicals and have antiquated ideas about caring for their hair, but we're gaining new knowledge all the time. I even told her about LHCF and suggested she log on and view some of the pictures of you beautiful ladies.

She was totally innocent and I could tell she just had been wondering about "our" hair and felt like I was a nice person she could ask without offended, but it's rather sad all the same that some white women have a misconception that all black women have short dry nappy hair. I hope that we ladies on LHCF can lead the pack in changing these misconceptions and spreading the word to our sisters on healthy hair care.

Chayil

Is it a misconception that all black women have short dry nappy hair?

Black women having short hair is a misconception, but I think describing black women as possessing nappy hair that tends to be naturally dry as accurate.

Maybe I have misconceptions about the entire black ethnic group because I believe majority of black people have some degree of nappiness as their hair texture.

I would be offended by the "compliment", but I would quickly get over it. It is not totally her fault that she believes that black women in general should have "nice" hair that looks like whites, hispanics, asians, or any other non-black ethnic group. It is also not her duty to be informed of the reasons that black women she may have seen have damaged straight hair or to be aware of the fact that what she has seen is not normal/natural for black women.

 

[*Frisky*]

It was the point in bold that read as a bit accusatory as if I was picking on the OP, and that was not the case. This particular post at this particular time provoked my thought about what I asked about. I also made note in my first post that I was not speaking to the OP personally, but it was general questions.

I know more now about this topic than I did when I first posted, so for me, it's all good. I always appreciate a rigorous, respectful conversation, as long as everybody remains courteous and direct.

Well honestly IMO you should have started a separate thread to ask your question. I guess people might feel you were directing your comments to the OP because this is HER thread. I think that happens alot on every forum even OT, Entertainment, etc. People come up in there making certain comments but do it in a "general" sense and it gets confusing.

 

[MissYocairis]

Love, love, love this post!
And my 2 cents RelaxerRehab is that your observation was also a thinly veiled way of saying 'so what?' or 'who cares?' in response to the OP rather than even considering whether the comment made was or would be offensive. That's why I can understand where CBC is coming from, even if this was not your intention.

I personally would be offended by the qualified compliment "nice hair for a black girl", the necessary implication is that my hair is only nice if judged by this (more likely considering the context) lowered standard. The qualification overwhelms the compliment to me and if it were me I would draw her attention to the problem with the comment (in a gentle way if I thought she was just clueless).

Spoken like a true lawyer, girl! (I agree 100%)

 

[seeminglysweet]

This has turned into a very interesting thread. In reading a lot of the responses, most of you remember when someone made a backhanded comment regarding your hair or weight. I am glad that we are interested in analyzing such comments.

I had to do a lot of soul searching this month because I have had a few "comments" made to me that I let get me down and some even made me mad, but then I considered the persons who made the comments and I decided that some people have inter conflicts with their own self-esteem which makes it so easy to come at someone with negative comments.

I have a co-worker who is very color struck and has a distaste for darker skinned people. I came to work one day and was telling her that I had met a guy who thought that I was Dominican. For some reason, sometimes people ask me if am I from the Islands or am I Cuban or Dominican. I believe it is my skin tone because I don't have naturally straight hair, I have fine strands that need mild relaxing. Well, my co-worker said "I don't know why people ask you that, I could see them asking me that questions because I am light skinned and I have nice hair". I was like, WHAT. I could believe that she came out of her mouth like that.

Well, I thought about it for a minute and then I asked her what makes her think that just because she is light skinned that she looks "other" than Black? She replied that she just thinks because she is light with nice hair that she looks like she has "something in her". I didn't comment on the hair because she does not have "nice" or "good" hair. Actually, she highlighted her hair and now it is very damaged and has broken off. I did let her know that her hair looked very damaged and that I could recommend some conditioners to fix her "nice" hair. She has that brown paper bag mentality. I feel sorry for her. She believes that you cannot be Black and beautiful unless you are light skinned or have "something" in you.

As for the weight issue. I have had comments made to me as well suggesting that I would be a dime piece if I was slim. Personally, I think that TSU Princess is very pretty regardless of how much she weighs. I have never seen her body, just her headshots and in her recent photos her hair is in a bun and she has on no makeup that I can see, yet she has the most beautiful face. If she lost weight, she would be the same "pretty" women with less body fat. Being plus size doesn't make one ugly. I know some really ugly skinny women!

Also, why does every Black women with a nice length of healthy hair have to have a weave and be called a liar if they say they don't?

I think that comments about hair whether positive or negative should be shared in order to see what the public thinks about Black hair and the myths surrounding the perceptions. Maybe this site will reach hundreds of thousands of Black women and help them understand that having nice hair is about taking time and care, no matter what grade it is.

I have encountered many people who are colorstruck also. It's amazing what people will say to you when they feel that you can identify with them. Things like "I'm glad I'm not dark skinned." I never thought of myself as different growing up and I'm glad because I would hate to be walking around with a false confidence that stems meerly from the shade of my skin.
People ask me all the time if I'm mixed, one person even went so far as to tell a friend of mine that he "knows i'm mixed, I just don't want people know"
It's amazing how stereotypes can influence those within our own culture that should know better. It helps me understand how people outside of our culture have such a hard time understanding things when they see something that isn't stereotypical.

My mom always told me to choose my battles and I guess more so than worrying about backhanded compliments or clueless white folks, I would first be concerned with the root of the problem and the fact that we have a lot to correct within our culture before we can attempt to correct things
outside of it.

ETA:
I understand everything that relaxer rehab had to say. She clearly said that she wasn't attacking my original post so I didn't think twice about it. I guess it could have been put into a seperate thread but it got this one jumpin' so it's cool with me.

 

[Soleado]

See I just don't have that kinda patience. That's why the Lord doesn't put me in those situations where ppl say things like that

Yep, that is why in all of my years I have never had anyone say anything crazy to me like that.

 

[Soleado]

As a WHOLE, we don't. That's why we corner the weave market. I mean, we have a really nice thing going on here at LHCF but I definitely do not see much hair like I see in this forum in the gen pop. Why pretend? erplexed

I agree! I DO NOT see all of this nice, healthy hair in the general population of black woman.

 

[Lynnerie]

Well, with all this debating can we just decide to agree to disagree?

The majority of us have had an insulting compliment whether it be directed toward us individually or against our race.

1. You pretty to be a big girl. You got a pretty face.
2. You have good hair you got Indian in yo' familiy?
3. You sound white cause you talk proper.
4. You so pretty for a dark-skinned girl.
5. I've had the comment made about being pretty and dark-skinned.

When these kinds of comments are made the person usually knows that they are pretty or have nice hair. They don't need anyone to tell them that. I get #3 and #4 alot. But I already I'm cute and I talk proper. I didn't for someone to tell me. But people who say things like this are ignorant. I do ask them to explain just cause its funny to see what other stereotypes will come out their mouth. Just pass them off as being ignorant.


Their will always be these ignorant comments made whether it be about our hair, skin, or whatever. But if someone wants to comment about it on the forum then by all means go ahead.
You paid your $5. But this could go on and on so lets agree to disagree.

 

[PaperClip]

ETA:
I understand everything that relaxer rehab had to say. She clearly said that she wasn't attacking my original post so I didn't think twice about it. I guess it could have been put into a seperate thread but it got this one jumpin' so it's cool with me.

I appreciate you saying this...and I'm glad that you understand what I was asking.... In retrospect, my point would have been perfect for a separate thread.... I really didn't expect the thread to jump off like it did.... I didn't mean to hijack or take away from your original topic....

 

[msstarelite]

The conversation started out with her asking me about doing hot oil treatments with olive oil, because a former hairstylist that works in our office told her that her hair was brassy and needed a good trim and a couple months of intensive deep conditioning.

I let her try some Elucence MB and she likes it but that is not a deep conditioner.

She asked me for all of my "tricks" for hair/beauty and I told her I didn't have any tricks, I just do what works for me. This is when she said "nooo you have to have tricks....how come you have such nice hair for a black girl?"

We are friends at work and I didn't take offense to her comment because I know she wasn't being malicious but it's just eye opening to hear something like that said outloud.

It makes you think that as a whole, they feel we don't have "nice" hair.

I have known people who have been in similar situations. I think it is crazy that some people still have that mentality that black women don't have nice hair. Not all of our hair is "nappy."

 

[caligirl]

C'mon, people. Let's start educating people out there. We don't have to yell, get an attitude or even lecture but we have to start giving them for food for thought so they'll think (imagine that) before they make another comment like that.

Yes, I like the idea of teachable moments. I had a lady on the street go on and on about how she loved my natural puff. She told me that her sister had "water and grease hair" and that she had "*igger hair." I just said "its all good hair" and kept it moving.

 

[WomanlyCharm]

Yes, I like the idea of teachable moments. I had a lady on the street go on and on about how she loved my natural puff. She told me that her sister had "water and grease hair" and that she had "*igger hair." I just said "its all good hair" and kept it moving.

WTH would someone let something so ignorant come out of their mouth?
There are some people you just can't teach.

 

[caligirl]

WTH would someone let something so ignorant come out of their mouth?
There are some people you just can't teach.

Yeah, I had never heard that expression before. I hope she doesn't ever repeat that.

 

[esoterica]

I would be offended by the "compliment", but I would quickly get over it. It is not totally her fault that she believes that black women in general should have "nice" hair that looks like whites, hispanics, asians, or any other non-black ethnic group. It is also not her duty to be informed of the reasons that black women she may have seen have damaged straight hair or to be aware of the fact that what she has seen is not normal/natural for black women.

i agree with this. what people see is what they will believe, and if anybody commented to me that i had "nice/long hair for a black girl" i'd have to keep my mouth shut or just say thanks, but i couldnt get mad. cause the only healthy looking 4a/b hair i ever see is on this board. so how can i blame Becky for thinking my hair is nice for a black girl, when all she sees around her are blacks with chewed up hair. maybe one day it will be the norm for people to see all blacks with long/healthy hair, but until then the comments will keep coming.

 

[Ms_Twana]

I do believe generalizing black people through a less than complimentary perception (i.e. that most don't have nice hair and this girl was an exception to the rule) IS offensive to us collectively.

I would not have taken it as a compliment because I would have taken it as, you offend my sister, you offend me, kind of attitude. You can KEEP your compliment about my hair if you are going to undercut the beauty of my demographic in the process.

I'm not interested in a compliment on my hair from someone who thinks so little of BW's hair as a rule. And, that has absolutely NOTHING to do with seeking out attention on LHCF.

PREACH GIRL, PREACH!!! ITA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Ms_Twana]

I think it's great that you are able to be so positive regardless. You could have went off on her and probably fed into some other stereotypical thoughts she may have had and your whole post could have been very different. I thnk it's great that she felt comfortable enough with you to have the dialogue.

I agree!!!

Actually, your post reminded me of my first full time job when I was about 19 in a small town in Middle Tennessee. I was one of the few black people working there. There was me and a guy on my shift and a chick and guy on the second shift. Anyway, the little safety guy came up to me one evening while I was working and struck up a conversation and asked me if there were a lot of "colored people" where I was from (Memphis - southwest Tennessee) and I started laughing. I asked him "What 'color' of people do you mean?" and he turned bright red! I told him that I wasn't offended but that we generally don't cotton to being called "colored" anymore and I went on to talk to him about Memphis' diversity as compared to the area we were in at that time. At that job, I was often the first black person they had seen in person and/or had an opportunity to speak to.

I live in Middle Tennessee. Girl where were you???? That way I NEVER step foot there!!!!!

 

[Southernbella.]

so how can i blame Becky for thinking my hair is nice for a black girl, when all she sees around her are blacks with chewed up hair. maybe one day it will be the norm for people to see all blacks with long/healthy hair, but until then the comments will keep coming.
__________________

I agree, but to me, it doesn't seem like it would matter how many black women had long, healthy hair. To Becky, bw's hair will only ever be "nice for a black girl" because it still wouldn't be white girl hair.

 

[Ebonygurl00]

Yes, I like the idea of teachable moments. I had a lady on the street go on and on about how she loved my natural puff. She told me that her sister had "water and grease hair" and that she had "*igger hair." I just said "its all good hair" and kept it moving.

I can't believe someone would say that outloud and think that you would be fine with it! I don't think I'd be able to take it if someone said something like that to me.

 

[esoterica]

I agree, but to me, it doesn't seem like it would matter how many black women had long, healthy hair. To Becky, bw's hair will only ever be "nice for a black girl" because it still wouldn't be white girl hair.

then i would just assume that she is biased towards her own hair type. which is fine by me, but at least i would know that their are BW out there representing in large numbers and it will be the norm to see us with decent hair. cause once that happens everybody will have to shut the hell up won't they. and if they do try to talk nonsense, there will be so many examples to choose from that we can shut them down quick. especially those BW and BM who bash their own hair type!

 

[so1913]

Yeah, I had never heard that expression before. I hope she doesn't ever repeat that.

I have a friend that used that expression to describe her hair.....

Even after confronting her about it, I don't think she understood what was wrong with what she said...

 

[jasmin]

The minute that women said ****** she would have been told off. Why let that slip.

 

[Barbara]

I'm sort of deviating from the topic, but I just have to say the following:

There is a popular myth that African American hair will not grow. That's why it’s prevalent to see beauty supply stores in African American neighborhoods saturated with floor to ceiling, wall to wall hair weaves, extensions, wigs, etc., especially in beauty supply stores owned by Asians. The majority of their customers are African Americans, so what else are they suppose to believe? We as a whole were never taught how to take care of our hair. Thank God for hair salons, because my hair would never receive compliments from friends, workmates, relatives and strangers.

My stylist doesn’t recommend daily washing for African Americans. He feels that once a week is fine, though, because he said years ago: “Our hair is too fragile, and it is the weakest of all nationalities. African American women as a whole don’t know how to take care of their hair.” Incidentally, his customers have the longest hair than any of the other customers in the salon.

The Asians that I work with and the ones in my beauty salon know that some of us don't need to add hair to our head to make it long. They are astonished to see our hair gradually grow to bra clasp or waist length. I have even had my hair washed and detangled by my Vietnamese manicurist several times when my stylist gets backed up. So some of them know, but even Whites say the same thing: “African American hair just don’t grow.” This is what they were taught.

Some African American women don’t want to work with their hair. They want it to be black, straight and shiny like Asians hair, so they demand their stylist that it’s dyed jet black and pressed extremely hard. It started falling out in clots. Then they want to be really creative with their hair, and their hair cannot handle the daily abuse, because it’s fragile. As I told my coworker: “We have to work with our hair, not work against it, and that’s where the problem lies.” Then they turn to wigs, weaves (which my stylist says that’s not good for the hair in the long run), braids, dyed, perm, etc. I’ve seen it all with my coworker.

She’s been obsessed with her hair all her life, and when all the weaves, braids, etc., are removed, her stylist has to cut her real hair short because of the abuse her hair has suffered. She’s always asking me questions about my hair even before I stumbled across the Wanakee Verifen Complex products. When I learned about Wanakee’s regimen, I let her copy the brochure, and she’s seen the products shipped into the office. In fact, she brings the boxes to me, and I showed the items to her--but she’s going to do what she wants to do, because as she says: “But I want my hair to be this way or that way,” so what else can I say? Nothing much.

 

[cmw45]

See I just don't have that kinda patience. That's why the Lord doesn't put me in those situations where ppl say things like that

DITTO!!!!!

 

[wheezy807]

It really sad but folks need to actually think before these saying such things. Honestly, i have too laugh most times to keep from crying or cursing for that matter. I mean just think, "would i like if someone said that too me?" Ummmmmm........NO!!!!!

 

[NYAmicas]

See I just don't have that kinda patience. That's why the Lord doesn't put me in those situations where ppl say things like that

lol, that certainly must be it.

 

[Ganjababy]

Many black women also believe that we cannot grow our hair long or have healthy looking hair. Many women don't realise that they are actually preventing their hair from reaching a certain length and fullness because of the way they care for their hair. They don't realise that our hair does grow as much as anyone elses but it is more delicate and we therefore have to take more care in the way we manage our hair and the products we use. What frustrates me is the new trend of people putting extensions in their childrens hair. I live in London and I see a lot of little black girls with extensions in their hair, some as young as a year old! A co-worker of mine brought her baby to show us recently and this baby is 18 months old and had a curly braid-in extension! Her hairline had many little hair bulbs where the extension was too tight and it had pulled out the baby's hair. When I saw it I wanted to cry. Though I tried to bite my tongue I could not. I told her she was too young to have extensions and that she was teaching her child to hate her hair. This lady said that her daughter had horrible tough hair This made me sad. Another acquaintance of mine, her daughter is 11 and wears a wig!! Now this girls natural hair is past shoulder length when stretched.

My hair is textlaxed. When it air dries it looks natural and is 4b frizzy looking. This is how it looks 99% of the time worn in a scrunchie with the ends tucked in. Once in a while if I am going out to a special occasion I will blow it out and flat iron. My hair is no way long, it is shoulder length when blown out. Whenever I do this I am always asked by a fellow black lady if I have on a weave or is that my real hair. As long as they don't touch (which some do to feel for tracks?) I am not offended. However it does show that just like other groups of people, black people also believe that we cannot grow our hair long or have healthy looking hair.

 

[napgurl]

I have known people who have been in similar situations. I think it is crazy that some people still have that mentality that black women don't have nice hair. Not all of our hair is "nappy."

Nappy is beautiful. The standard "your hair looks like "our" hair so it is nice." Give me a break. This isn't 1970. Naturally nappy is just as beautiful as chemically straight - it's all the perspective.

 

[Glitter]

A few people have suggested educating the general public about bw hair and hair care. My question is this: at some point, don't you get tired of teaching?

For my entire schooling, I've gone to schools that are mainly white as in, often times, I'm the only MINORITY period (asian, black, hispanic, etc.) in the entire class or grade. I feel like I've had to explain my hair to everyone. As a child, I had to explain my hair which I can understand (the sophisticated answer of a second grader: "Why doesn't your hair blow when you run?" "Because I'm more special than you are." )...but I had to do explaining even in college.

It's frustrating to me, because it's not like anyone ever explained to me about white folks and their hair. Also, at some point, shouldn't you have had enough contact with black people to dispell your myths?

I also recall a time in high school. A bunch of girls were talking about how black people don't swim and how you'll never see blacks at a swimming pool. The majority of the girls said it was because black people are afraid of water. Only 2 said something along the lines of black people don't swim as much because it messes up 'our hair' it's expensive and time consuming to deal with the hair afterwards, not because blacks are scared or afraid of water. Good for the two girls, but the others -- are they even worth educating?

 

[almondjoi85]

I get that too. Or the oh well what are you mixed with? because you can't be just black with nice hair... these things used to drive me crazy but now i just laugh at the people saying it for their lack of intelligence and keep it moving.

 

[sonce]

It makes you think that as a whole, they feel we don't have "nice" hair.

I think this is true. The white men whom I have dated who have expressed opinions about black women's hair have either thought it wasn't possible for black women to grow hair as long as mine or found it surprising that my hair was so thick and soft. Same with the white women I've befriended. But can you blame them? One guy had dated black women for a long time and had never been with a black woman who wore her own hair. All of his black girlfriends had weaves (and they weren't hoodrats either), so he was used to black women with hair that didn't feel quite right to the touch.

From what I see when I look around, it is true that most black women don't have nice hair. They have broken off relaxed hair and poorly done weaves. Ignorance has robbed most of us of healthy, beautiful hair.