The "gift" of salvation is free, but is salvation free?

[FIRESTARTER]

Luke 13:24 "The door to heaven is narrow. Work hard to get in, because many will try to enter"
John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life."
Matthew 16:24-26 Then jesus said to the disciples. "If any of you wants to be my follower, you must put aside your selfish ambition, shoulder your cross, and follow me. If you try to keep your life for yourself, you will lose it. But if you give up your life for me, you will find true life. And how do you benefit if you gain the whole world but lose your own soul in the process? Is anything worth more than your soul? For I the son of Man, will come in the glory of my Father with his angels and will judge all people according to their deeds.

Is salvation free? I know that the gift of salvation was free. But once someone accepts salvation isnt there things that must be done daily to remain saved. We discussed it in bible study and im comfused. Im not a bible scholar and have a bad memory so since I cant find the scriptures I might be wrong but doesnt Jesus say that on the day of judgement there will be people that say we ate with you we did this and that with you and Jesus says that wasnt what what it took to enter the gates. I dont know you. The more I started to think about it the more it puzzled my mind. Just because someone confesses Jesus Christ is Lord and Savior, does it mean that they will automatically go to Heaven? The bible says that its easier for a camel to get through the eye of a needle than for some to enter the Kingdom(Please correct me), or something like that, right. I would think there is much more after accepting the gift that has to be done to show ourselves approved. On the other hand God has unconditional love for us. We dont have to do this and that for him to love us. But just because he loves us doesnt mean were going to heaven. Help me out.

 

[FlyyGyrl]

[COLOR=#ff0000The bible says that its easier for a camel to get through the eye of a needle than for some to enter the Kingdom(Please correct me), or something like that, right. I [/QUOTE]

The bible says it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get into heaven in Matthew chap 19:23-24. So that is something different I believe. But I understand your point and I agree with you. Salvation does not cost money but it does cost other things. Jesus said If ye love me keep my commandments John14:15
So I believe if you want to get into heaven you have to keep his commandments as well as believe. This means putting God first, before family, before friends, and before yourself. So especially if you get saved as an adult it will cost you some things, most likely your friends will go first and your relationship with your family will change (esp if they are not saved). I am not a bible scholar either but I do know that living God's word is difficult and it comes with some sacrifice.

 

[Enchantmt]

There is much debate about this in the church, but I personally dont believe you can lose your salvation. We have a promise from Jesus that we shall not be plucked from His hands. If you have to live in fear of losing it then its not secure and we know its secure.

I looked online to find something similar to the teaching that I have received. I only skimmed this but what I've read seems sound and this may help you:
http://www.dyeager.org/fud/losesal.php

 

[FIRESTARTER]

There is much debate about this in the church, but I personally dont believe you can lose your salvation. We have a promise from Jesus that we shall not be plucked from His hands. If you have to live in fear of losing it then its not secure and we know its secure.

I looked online to find something similar to the teaching that I have received. I only skimmed this but what I've read seems sound and this may help you:
http://www.dyeager.org/fud/losesal.php

There really is a debate because I could feel the tension in the air when we started the discussion. erplexed

 

[FlyyGyrl]

Ok, I think maybe I misunderstood your question a little bit at first. I think the scenario can be explained by the parable of the sower in Matthew 13. This is a popular one so I will just sum it up. There was a sower who sowed and some of his seeds fell by the wayside, some on stony places, some fell on thorns, some fell on good ground. Jesus said those that fell by the wayside were those that heard the word and did not understand and the devil took their seed from them. Those that fell on stony places were ppl that heard the word and recieved it but could not withstand tribulation or persecution. Those that fell on thorns were ppl who heard the word and fell for the lure of the world (riches etc) and became unfruitful. And finally those that fell on good ground were the ppl who heard the word understood it and brought forth fruit (ie walked the walk).

Therefore I believe that those who bear fruit and keep the commandments will enter heaven. This doesn't mean that these ppl never make mistakes. I don't believe anyone can lose their salvation either. However many ppl did not really have it in the first place, ie those seeds that fell on stony places and thorns. Those ppl will not withstand persecution and tribulation. The seeds on good soil will, and they will inherit the kingdom. That is my understanding.

 

[Bublnbrnsuga]

First and foremost of being saved is believing in your heart who the Bible says Jesus is and next confessing your sins. I really stress believing in your heart because being saved is so much more than lip service. After this happens, a change comes on the inside of you to want to please God, since you are now a representative of Christ. The Holy Spirit, who convicts, teaches, guides, etc comes to live on the inside. The Bible tells us that salvation nor inheritance of the kingdom is not obtainable by good works (Ephesians 2:8,9; 2 Timothy 1:9; Titus 3:5.) The main verses many would use to try to prove to you that a Christian could lose their salvation is Matthew 7:21-23. In this scripture, Jesus explains that not everyone who claims to know Christ will inherit the kingdom of heaven, but at the end of that verse, He explains that He never KNEW them. They believed their WORKS were sufficient and apparently, there was no heart change, only lip service as described above. God looks at the heart of a man. You always have to remember something- we live in a world where God's laws are not 'popular'. This is when WE (with the power of the Holy Spirit) work to keep our lives in line with God's Word. The Bible says the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak.
So to answer, no salvation can't be lost (John 10:27-29; Romans 8:35,38,39; Phillipians 1:6; 1 Peter 1:4,5);however, when a person who is claiming to be saved, but their life continuosly (unrepentant for their sins, not representing Christ) shows otherwise, there is a question if salvation actually took place.. There's no way one can come into contact with Christ and not seek to please Him.

 

[Bublnbrnsuga]

There really is a debate because I could feel the tension in the air when we started the discussion. erplexed

Tension from where?
I know for me, I get 'tensed up' when people ask me questions about the Bible or any other issue that requires explanation. This is mainly because I have an issue of 'perfectionism.' I want EVERYTHING to flow right at that moment. When it doesn't, I get flustered and frustrated, resulting in tension. Heck, I was getting tensed answering your question a few minutes ago because in the beginning, I was not going in the 'order' I desired, so when people appear tensed at you, try not to take it personally. Yeah, I know some people who get upset because 'how dare you question the Bible?' but as I just shared my short story, sometimes the tension you sense is actually coming from them in how to relay the message appropriately. Does this make sense?

 

[phynestone]

If we all receive salvation by believing in Him, then why is it necessary to keep God's commandments? I know he knows our heart, but why? Also, the Word also says that few will enter the gates of heaven and God will give those who do not make it to heaven another chance after the Rapture, or some type of tribulation after He returns. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Enchantmt]

If we all receive salvation by believing in Him, then why is it necessary to keep God's commandments? I know he knows our heart, but why? Also, the Word also says that few will enter the gates of heaven and God will give those who do not make it to heaven another chance after the Rapture, or some type of tribulation after He returns. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Well we still have to be righteous to have fellowship, which means we have to confess our sins. Being saved isnt only about the afterlife, its about the quality of your life while you are here, and about having a relationship with God, receiving guidance, internal peace and answered prayer among other things. The commandments given in the new testament are that we believe in Jesus/accept Him as Lord and Savior and that we love one another. If we are truly loving one another we dont need a list of rules to follow...thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal, thou shall not commit adultery...if you love me are you going to do these things to me? The Holy Spirit inside you helps you keep these commandments. God does know your heart and if in your heart you desire to do sin then what does that speak to?


Our relationship with God is not about works. Works count toward rewards in heaven, but not toward salvation. Its not about doing as little as possible to stay saved as nothing we can do can make our salvation more or less. Many people look for loopholes to see what they can get away with because they want to walk along the edge and still be of the world but we are called to be set apart. The more they renew their minds in the word of God, the less they will do this.

God is faithful and just which means that no one will be condemned to hell without having had a chance to accept or deny Christ, and if someone seeks knowledge of Him they will receive it. He's not out to get us. He WANTS us to be saved. Jesus died to save us. That being said we know some folx will have had denied Him, scripture says those not found in the book of life are thrown in the lake of fire.

There is nothing that I know of says humans get a second chance after the rapture. After the 1000 years of peace on earth, Satan is released to again tempt people before he is totally destroyed and I supposed there may be folx there who escaped hell the first time that eventually gets to join him, but of that group they would all have been people who were originally in the book of life. Maybe someone else can weigh in on this.

 

[FIRESTARTER]

Tension from where?
I know for me, I get 'tensed up' when people ask me questions about the Bible or any other issue that requires explanation. This is mainly because I have an issue of 'perfectionism.' I want EVERYTHING to flow right at that moment. When it doesn't, I get flustered and frustrated, resulting in tension. Heck, I was getting tensed answering your question a few minutes ago because in the beginning, I was not going in the 'order' I desired, so when people appear tensed at you, try not to take it personally. Yeah, I know some people who get upset because 'how dare you question the Bible?' but as I just shared my short story, sometimes the tension you sense is actually coming from them in how to relay the message appropriately. Does this make sense?

That makes total sense Thanks! I didnt mean tension here, Bubln! Sorry. I meant there was tension at bible study Some people believed that salvation was given freely but some felt that even if someone accepted it, they might not make it to heaven because of the things the did or didnt do in the eyes of the Lord. It was heated but in the end everyone went away from the discussion with the opinion they came in with. I just didnt know where I stood. I didnt have enough time to formulate my own opinion because I never really thought aboutl. I guess I needed more discussion about to stimulate my mind. What you were saying in the previous post was inlightening though. "Lip service" as you said is exactly what was on my mind. Some people confess Jesus is Lord and have no change of heart. They dont even desire to change. So, just because you "confess" does it mean your saved or does it take more? They just couldnt come to an agreement. Like you said Jesus said everyone that claims to know him will not inherit the Kingdom.

 

[FIRESTARTER]

Well we still have to be righteous to have fellowship, which means we have to confess our sins. Being saved isnt only about the afterlife, its about the quality of your life while you are here, and about having a relationship with God, receiving guidance, internal peace and answered prayer among other things. The commandments given in the new testament are that we believe in Jesus/accept Him as Lord and Savior and that we love one another. If we are truly loving one another we dont need a list of rules to follow...thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal, thou shall not commit adultery...if you love me are you going to do these things to me? The Holy Spirit inside you helps you keep these commandments. God does know your heart and if in your heart you desire to do sin then what does that speak to?


Our relationship with God is not about works. Works count toward rewards in heaven, but not toward salvation. Its not about doing as little as possible to stay saved as nothing we can do can make our salvation more or less. Many people look for loopholes to see what they can get away with because they want to walk along the edge and still be of the world but we are called to be set apart. The more they renew their minds in the word of God, the less they will do this.

God is faithful and just which means that no one will be condemned to hell without having had a chance to accept or deny Christ, and if someone seeks knowledge of Him they will receive it. He's not out to get us. He WANTS us to be saved. Jesus died to save us. That being said we know some folx will have had denied Him, scripture says those not found in the book of life are thrown in the lake of fire.

There is nothing that I know of says humans get a second chance after the rapture. After the 1000 years of peace on earth, Satan is released to again tempt people before he is totally destroyed and I supposed there may be folx there who escaped hell the first time that eventually gets to join him, but of that group they would all have been people who were originally in the book of life. Maybe someone else can weigh in on this.

This is good stuff, all of it. As for the bolded text, I find myself doing this. I try to justify things that might or maybe not be wrong because I dont want the guilt of displeasing God if it is. I wrote a confession that this year I will work on this. ~Back to the subject~ You said, "Its not about doing as little as possible to stay saved, as nothing we can do can make our salvation more or less." This I think is so important, so if I accept Jesus Christ and am sincere he wont take his salvation back. What if I understand this concept and accept him without a clean heart, its just lip service. I cant judge but it seems there are people who have no desire to live a life unto God but they know what to "say" to guarantee a place in heaven(<-----this is my delimma). When is it not just lip service if you DONT give your life over to him? Im beginning to get it a little.

 

[phynestone]

Well we still have to be righteous to have fellowship, which means we have to confess our sins. Being saved isnt only about the afterlife, its about the quality of your life while you are here, and about having a relationship with God, receiving guidance, internal peace and answered prayer among other things. The commandments given in the new testament are that we believe in Jesus/accept Him as Lord and Savior and that we love one another. If we are truly loving one another we dont need a list of rules to follow...thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal, thou shall not commit adultery...if you love me are you going to do these things to me? The Holy Spirit inside you helps you keep these commandments. God does know your heart and if in your heart you desire to do sin then what does that speak to?


Our relationship with God is not about works. Works count toward rewards in heaven, but not toward salvation. Its not about doing as little as possible to stay saved as nothing we can do can make our salvation more or less. Many people look for loopholes to see what they can get away with because they want to walk along the edge and still be of the world but we are called to be set apart. The more they renew their minds in the word of God, the less they will do this.

God is faithful and just which means that no one will be condemned to hell without having had a chance to accept or deny Christ, and if someone seeks knowledge of Him they will receive it. He's not out to get us. He WANTS us to be saved. Jesus died to save us. That being said we know some folx will have had denied Him, scripture says those not found in the book of life are thrown in the lake of fire.

There is nothing that I know of says humans get a second chance after the rapture. After the 1000 years of peace on earth, Satan is released to again tempt people before he is totally destroyed and I supposed there may be folx there who escaped hell the first time that eventually gets to join him, but of that group they would all have been people who were originally in the book of life. Maybe someone else can weigh in on this.

Great post! Thanks for answering my questions.

 

[sithembile]

I agree with Enchanmt, great explanation.

 

[star]

Salvation is free but the Christian walk is expensive. It will cost you something to walk in obedience.

 

[Poohbear]

Bump

 

[Guitarhero]

It's free but unless you rsvp to the invitation, you ain't likely getting in

 

[Laela]

This is what I believe as well....

Salvation is free but the Christian walk is expensive. It will cost you something to walk in obedience.

 

[empressaja]

Well we still have to be righteous to have fellowship, which means we have to confess our sins. Being saved isnt only about the afterlife, its about the quality of your life while you are here, and about having a relationship with God, receiving guidance, internal peace and answered prayer among other things. The commandments given in the new testament are that we believe in Jesus/accept Him as Lord and Savior and that we love one another. If we are truly loving one another we dont need a list of rules to follow...thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal, thou shall not commit adultery...if you love me are you going to do these things to me? The Holy Spirit inside you helps you keep these commandments. God does know your heart and if in your heart you desire to do sin then what does that speak to?


Our relationship with God is not about works. Works count toward rewards in heaven, but not toward salvation. Its not about doing as little as possible to stay saved as nothing we can do can make our salvation more or less. Many people look for loopholes to see what they can get away with because they want to walk along the edge and still be of the world but we are called to be set apart. The more they renew their minds in the word of God, the less they will do this.

God is faithful and just which means that no one will be condemned to hell without having had a chance to accept or deny Christ, and if someone seeks knowledge of Him they will receive it. He's not out to get us. He WANTS us to be saved. Jesus died to save us. That being said we know some folx will have had denied Him, scripture says those not found in the book of life are thrown in the lake of fire.

There is nothing that I know of says humans get a second chance after the rapture. After the 1000 years of peace on earth, Satan is released to again tempt people before he is totally destroyed and I supposed there may be folx there who escaped hell the first time that eventually gets to join him, but of that group they would all have been people who were originally in the book of life. Maybe someone else can weigh in on this.

My Father did his dissertation for his ThD. on this subject I spoke some particular verse in which I haven't been able to shake.

1 Corinthians 15:22-23 "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive, but each one in his own order."

Colosians 2 states some powerful things that i haven't heard being taught outside the Universalists circle, but it stuck out to me.

Colossians 2

15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

20And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

21And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

22In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

23If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

24Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

25Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;

26Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: