Strong Protein Treatments and Reconstructors

[EllePixie]

Aloe vera contains protein because it has amino acid, but I wouldn't consider it a strong enough protein to call it a protein treatment. Many products that are considered protein-free contain aloe vera. Kinky Curly Curling Custard is a perfect example of this. AV juice is the second ingredient, but it is often suggested for those who are protein sensitive.

 

[Aireen]

Aloe vera contains protein because it has amino acid, but I wouldn't consider it a strong enough protein to call it a protein treatment. Many products that are considered protein-free contain aloe vera. Kinky Curly Curling Custard is a perfect example of this. AV juice is the second ingredient, but it is often suggested for those who are protein sensitive.

EllePixie, thanks for the clear up! I wasn't sure either.

 

[Aireen]

Treasured Locks Deep V Conditioner - Contains Hydrolyzed Protein as the 3rd ingredient.

(Says that it's a deep treatment on its website: http://www.treasuredlocks.com/deep-conditioner.html)

 

[EllePixie]

EllePixie, thanks for the clear up! I wasn't sure either.

No prob, love! I was discussing it with a fellow hair geek and she gave me a great analogy: Amino Acids are to legos as Proteins are to lego castles.

I laughed.

 

[lettieg27]

Well ladies this makes me wonder what ingredients are necessary for a strong protein treatment or a light protein treatment

 

[Aireen]

Well ladies this makes me wonder what ingredients are necessary for a strong protein treatment or a light protein treatment

lettieg27 - The PLACEMENT of ingredients and the TYPE of protein determines it's strength and effectiveness. The reason why I asked for protein treatments or reconstructors that have protein as the first to fifth ingredient is because the first five ingredients of a product make up most of its content; the rest after that is almost just filler and helps to balance the product. Most of the products others have listed in this thread have protein as the first five listed to make up the content from what I've checked with a few exceptions.

As for what proteins are strong to make them a heavy protein treatment or a lighter one, you can look here, http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=502376. Basically to sum it up though, Keratin protein is the strongest of them all.

 

[Aireen]

No prob, love! I was discussing it with a fellow hair geek and she gave me a great analogy: Amino Acids are to legos as Proteins are to lego castles.

I laughed.

EllePixie - Oh yeah I knew the analogy from school but I didn't know that aloe vera contained amino acids, that was an eye-opener.

 

[IDareT'sHair]

Neutral Protein Filler.

To Add to your regular DC'ers.

 

[destine2grow]

I am leanong towards Dudley Hair repair and Cream Protein! The only problem is I cant find the ingredients for the products. Cant try nexxus emergencee b/c the propeleyne glycol is high in the ingredient list.

 

[Zaz]

IDareT'sHair between the keraphix and emergencee which do you prefer? Also, have you purchased Sebastian's penetrait recently? I can't seem to find it anymore

 

[yora88]

Smooth N Shine Repair Xtreme Leave In Protein Treatment.

Silk amino acids are the 5th ingredient.

The last time I deep conditioned I used Nexxus Pro Mend conditioner, Smooth N Shine Repair Xtreme Leave In Protein Treatment, and Proclaim Argan Oil Intense Moisturizing Conditioner and there has been a noticeable decrease in shedding.

 

[GreenEyedJen]

Wow, this thread is right on time! I was going to make one myself, as I just dyed my hair and the parts that were hit with developer are looking a little sad. Does anyone have experience with any of these on colored hair?

 

[Honi]

Ultra Sheen Duo Tex - Hydrolyzed Collagen second on the list.

I like that this is a liquid as opposed to a creamy product.

 

[baglady215]

ORS RP is listed here, but this is nothing but a moisturizer on my hair. I used it today and my hair is so soft and silky. I love it!

Like Aireen said, I think it's more the type of protein than where it is on the list. ORS has collagen high on the list, but Joico K-pak (keratin is the 7th ingredient) is a much stronger treatment. Kenra MC contains wheat protein (6th), but it's definitely not a protein treatment at all.

HHG!

 

[Missi]

Aloe vera contains protein because it has amino acid, but I wouldn't consider it a strong enough protein to call it a protein treatment. Many products that are considered protein-free contain aloe vera. Kinky Curly Curling Custard is a perfect example of this. AV juice is the second ingredient, but it is often suggested for those who are protein sensitive.

I use UBH Deep Conditioner by Cathy Howse and I must say this is a protein treatment, if not the strongest protein on the market. I mean that is why she created the conditioner (protein) in the first place...but that was over 14 years ago. I'm pretty sure she has competition by now.

Sent from my HERO200 using Long Hair Care Forum App

 

[Aireen]

ORS RP is listed here, but this is nothing but a moisturizer on my hair. I used it today and my hair is so soft and silky. I love it!

Like Aireen said, I think it's more the type of protein than where it is on the list. ORS has collagen high on the list, but Joico K-pak (keratin is the 7th ingredient) is a much stronger treatment. Kenra MC contains wheat protein (6th), but it's definitely not a protein treatment at all.

HHG!

baglady215 - To add, not all proteins have the same strengthening property, some DO make the hair soft because they allow for moisture to be better received by hair. For example, instead of collagen protein making the hair super strong like keratin, it allows for the hair to have more elasticity. Wheat protein allows for moisture to able to be better accepted into the hair. All proteins have different properties pertaining to them.

BOTH the TYPE of protein and it's PLACEMENT on the list are important, I don't really think one is MORE important than the other. The reason ORS may feel less strengthening is because collagen helps with elasticity (the hair's ability to stretch) and not so much with the durability/strength of the strand per say. If collagen is the 5th ingredient in one product and keratin is the 2nd last in another, the collagen treatment would be a lot stronger no matter what the bottle's marketing ploy says about the product 'featuring' keratin. To say that Joico K-PAK is stronger than ORS RP, I don't feel I can really say because of the fact that keratin is 7th place and collagen is 5th. I CAN say that ORS RP has a higher concentration of protein than the Joico K-PAK product you speak of. Anything after the 5th ingredient only makes up about 1% or less of the product's content like I said before.

I'm going to post an article below so everyone can understand a bit better, it discusses ingredients and their placement.

 

[Aireen]

I asked a lovely member who is always able to answer my questions about ingredients. lilikoi, provided me with a wonderful article below to help everyone understand ingredients and ingredient placement a little better.

Hi Aireen,

Questions don't bother me. Keep 'em coming! (and yes, you can quote this PM)

This article summarizes things nicely:

Beauty Armor – How to read an ingredient list
by THEBEAUTYBRAINS on June 13, 2006

"Many times you will see us refer to a product’s ingredient statement. In the business it’s called an LOI or List of Ingredients. To arm you with all the knowledge we can, we thought it would be useful to tell you a little bit about these LOIs and how you might read them.
In the United States, cosmetic manufacturers are compelled by the governing industry trade organization known as the Cosmetic, Toiletry and Fragrance Association or CTFA to include a list of ingredients on their labels. They maintain a book known as the International Cosmetic Ingredient Dictionary and Handbook which the names of nearly all the ingredients used in cosmetic products worldwide. It’s quite a tome that makes groovy bedtime reading.
Why have the labels?
The labels are required because the industry wants consumers to know exactly what chemicals they are putting on their bodies. This will allow you to make choices as to what chemicals you want to be exposed to.
Of course, that assumes you know what any of the chemicals are, which for most consumers is not the case. Fortunately, with the internet you can simply look up chemical names using a search engine to get more information about the compounds. Be careful however, there are plenty of sites loaded with misinformation about perfectly safe chemicals. Compounds like propylene glycol, mineral oil, and sodium lauryl sulfate have been slandered by biased sources all over the internet. Read all things on the internet with a skeptical eye. (Even the stuff you find here at the Beauty Brains).
What does the label mean?
When properly written, the labels can provide you with a lot of useful information. In the United States, any chemical above 1% by weight in the formula is required to be listed in order of
concentration. Below 1% the order can be anything they like. Typically, preservatives, fragrances, and colors are listed at the end. Let’s look at this Jergens Natural Glow Daily Moisturizer product as an example.

Ingredients: Water, Glycerin, Cetearyl Alcohol, Petrolatum, Mineral Oil, Ceteareth 20, Dimethicone, Glyceryl Dilaurate, Erythrulose, Persea Gratissima Fruit Extract (Avocado), Avena Sativa Meal Extract (Oat), Simmondsia Chinensis Seed Extract (Jojoba), Calendula Officinalis Flower Extract, Olea Europaea Fruit Oil (Olive), Tocopherol, Cyclopentasiloxane, Stearic Acid, Acrylates/C10 Alkyl Acrylate Crosspolymer, Methylparaben, Propylparaben, Citric Acid, Disodium EDTA, Sodium Hydroxide, DMDM Hydantoin, BHT, Fragrance, Caramel, Titanium Dioxide, Mica, Dihydroxyacetone

The first ingredient is water which means this formula is mostly water. Based on this Brain’s knowledge of lotions, it is about 80% water. Glycerin is the next most abundant ingredient probably in there at about 5%. The next few ingredients are anywhere from 1-3%. Look at other skin lotions. I bet you find many of the same ingredients listed in the first line.
Now, when you get to a “natural” sounding ingredient like Persea Gratissima Fruit Extract you know you’ve dropped below the magic 1% level. This is where manufacturers can start to make things look different. Generally, natural ingredients are so expensive and ineffective that only a very small amount is in there.
Most manufacturers like to throw lots of these “feature” ingredients in the formula just so they have something to talk about and to show their formula are different. The truth is the real functional work of the product is done by the ingredients above this 1% line. This isn’t strictly true as there are many ingredients that give quite good benefits below the 1% level, but generally it’s true. The more abundant a material, the more function it will have.
Beauty Brain’s Bottom Line
Ingredient lists are included on your cosmetics to give you useful information about the products you use everyday. They are put together following specific rules and if you know these, you can learn a lot about a product. The next time you’re thinking of spending $25 on that upscale hair conditioner, compare the ingredient list to the $3 bottle. You might be surprised by the striking similarities."

 

[MsLizziA]

I mean i just use egg and conditioner ~shrug~

 

[Aireen]

I mean i just use egg and conditioner ~shrug~

MsLizziA - I've never liked using egg because the molecular weight is too large to really penetrate into hair, my mother always told me this and I've read a book that states this. If you like it, do what works for you. I think this thread will help people that like to use hydrolyzed protein to be sure the protein is small enough to penetrate and bind to the cuticle.

Here's an article about eggs as a protein treatment and their molecular weight. It also argues that amino acids are too small to be beneficial and even though I read other articles that say the contrary, I don't use amino acids as a treatment to care.

http://thenaturalhaven.blogspot.com/2009/06/size-matters-protein-conditioning-part.html

 

[baglady215]

baglady215 - Not all proteins have the same strengthening property, some DO make the hair soft because they allow for moisture to be better received by hair. For example, instead of collagen protein making the hair super strong like keratin, it allows for the hair to have more elasticity. Wheat protein allows for moisture to able to be better accepted into the hair. All proteins have different properties pertaining to them.

BOTH the TYPE of protein and it's PLACEMENT on the list are a big deal, I don't really think one is MORE important that the other. The reason ORS may feel less strengthening is because collagen helps with elasticity (the hair's ability to stretch) and not so much with the durability/strength of the strand per say. If collagen is the 5th ingredient in one product and keratin is the 2nd last in another, the collagen treatment would be a lot stronger no matter what the bottle's marketing ploy says about the product 'featuring' keratin. To say that Joico K-PAK is stronger than ORS RP, I don't feel I can really say because again, different proteins have unique qualities and it all depends on what you're looking for. I CAN say that ORS RP has a higher concentration of protein than the Joico K-PAK product you speak of. Anything after the 5th ingredient only makes up about 1% or less of the product's content like I said before.

I'm going to post an article below so everyone can understand a bit better, it discusses ingredients and their placement.

I understand what you are saying. When I said that K-Pak was stronger than ORS, I meant in its strengthening/rebuilding properties. I guess I could say that ORS is stronger than K-Pak in it's ability to provide elasticity.

But do we know for sure that anything after the 5th ingredient contains 1% or less of the ingredient? I mean, I do know that the ingredients are listed in order of concentration and that water is usually the most abundant. I don't know if this theory can apply to every product. And we probably will never know because manufacturers don't release their patented formulations.

Thank God for LHCF where we can learn and share how different things work for different people! HHG!!!

 

[Aireen]

I understand what you are saying. When I said that K-Pak was stronger than ORS, I meant in its strengthening/rebuilding properties. I guess I could say that ORS is stronger than K-Pak in it's ability to provide elasticity.

But do we know for sure that anything after the 5th ingredient contains 1% or less of the ingredient? I mean, I do know that the ingredients are listed in order of concentration and that water is usually the most abundant. I don't know if this theory can apply to every product. And we probably will never know because manufacturers don't release their patented formulations.

Thank God for LHCF where we can learn and share how different things work for different people! HHG!!!

baglady215 - I re-editted what I said to make more sense but I finally get what you're saying.

I think it's so for most standard products. For example water is usually the first ingredient and is the base of a product so like the article, it would take up about 80% of the product. The others after that would take up 5% and LESS to make up for 100% of the product.

 

[Aireen]

Contrary to the article though, ceramides even when the amount is only 1% are still beneficial to hair.

Hello Aireen,

You're not bothering me--it's a nice surprise to hear from you since I'm actually a fan of your hair and usually agree with, and like, your posts.

Your questions are very good and both easy and difficult to answer. Here's the easy answers: Yes, sun, saff, and grape oils contain ceramides. The percentages (of ceramides) for most oils are less than 5%, yet, as low as 1% should be enough to give benefits. Just use what you hair (and your nose!) likes.

The difficulty in answering arises from the fact that, as a technical person (read: science nerd) I finding hard to state facts without backing them up with either references or my own research. I'm very interested in the potential benefits of ceramides for both skin and hair but never officially joined the ceramide challenge because I was not convinced the benefits touted by some of the participants were from the ceramides, the products, or the oils! Some of the products identified as containing ceramides in the challenge post only listed some ceramide-containing oil as an ingredients (way down the middle of the list) so I couldn't see how such a low concentration could be responsible for the effect. A confounding factor with most oils is that they would probably be very beneficial even without the ceramides (either as penetrating oils or moisture sealants) so it's hard to tell what's the 'magic ingredient'.

This brings us to linoleic acid: it is essential for healthy skin and hair, so high linoleic acid oils are also very good for you, with or without ceramides, but it seems like the two go hand in hand (i.e., you usually find them together).

I've read a couple of research papers on ceramides and linoleic acid and I'm convinced they're good for hair and skin. When I have time I'll pull them out and summarize them and post them. I'm also experimenting with a non-hair care product that has ceramides listed as 5th ingredients. If I experience benefits I will share.

Hope this answers your questions!

P.S. Can I quote your questions if I decide to post this answer?

Hi, sorry to bother you. I'm in the ceramides challenge for 2011 and I just wanted to know if sunflower, safflower, or grapeseed oil had a high amount of ceramides or a sufficent amount to see benefits for my hair? I stumbled upon a list in the 2010 ceramide challenge thread that said safflower oil's content was 78% in ceramides but you corrected this by saying the list is actually stating the percentage of linoleic acid. I also wanted to know if you knew what linoleic acid does for the hair and if the benefits are similar to ceramides? Again, sorry to bother you and thank you for your reply in advance. My questions are in bold and if there's any further information you can provide me, it would be appreciated.

 

[Barbara]

Affirm 5 in 1 Reconstructor

 

[IDareT'sHair]

@IDareT'sHair between the keraphix and emergencee which do you prefer? Also, have you purchased Sebastian's penetrait recently? I can't seem to find it anymore

Zaz

I Like them both. Emergencee is liquidy, thick and gooey and Keraphix is a Cream. I rotate them both into my Regimen.

You should be able to find Sebastian Penetraitt on Amazon for about 6 bucks & some change excluding shipping.

Great Reconstructor isn't it?

 

[Aireen]

Rene Furterer Tonucia Toning and Densifying Mask - Contains Hydrolyzed Wheat Protein as the 4th ingredient.

 

[IDareT'sHair]

Redken Anti Snap

 

[Zaz]

Zaz

I Like them both. Emergencee is liquidy, thick and gooey and Keraphix is a Cream. I rotate them both into my Regimen.

You should be able to find Sebastian Penetraitt on Amazon for about 6 bucks & some change excluding shipping.

Great Reconstructor isn't it?

Thanks , I guess I'll buy a bunch from Amazon, I used to be able to find it at local salons I'll try the emergencee and keraphix for now since I can get those from Ulta along with my Joico Kpak reconstructor.

 

[babyu21]

I've used Ultra Sheen Duo Tech but I didn't like the liquid consistency. I prefer Aphogee 2 minute treatment, quick, easy in just one step, no mixing involved.

 

[IDareT'sHair]

Redken CAT
Redken PST-77

 

[kassieme]

Mega-Tek
Dudley's Cream Protein
Dudley's Hair Rebuilder
Dudley's DRC 28
Nexxus Emergencee Reconstructor
Nexxus Keraphix Reconstructor
Mane N' Tail Rebuilder
Ultra Sheen Duo-Tex
Apoghee 2 Step
Hairveda Methi Sativa
Hydratherma Naturals Amino Protein
Affirm Treatments *various*


I'm sure there are more, I'd have to think on it some more.erplexed

Will be back later.

Nexxus Emergencee Reconstructor is the best!

You dont need to DC or re moisturize and I find that it loosened my curl pattern and help aid binding so my curls were defined (Think Janet in the 80s curls)