Not Christians?

[MindTwister]

I was born and raised a Catholic and even though I don't practice the Catholic religion anymore I still don't understand why some say Catholics are not Christians. I read it on this board a while back and a some people I know have told me the same thing to

So can someone please explain to me why Catholics are not considered Christians?
Some of the reasons a friend mine has given me are that: Catholics don't pray to Jesus, they pray to the Virgin Mary and Saints, they have carved images (the Jesus on the Cross and statues of Mary etc...), they don't believe in speaking in tongues or in laying hands etc...
Anyone can shed more light for me please? Also what is wrong with praying Mary?

Also Catholics of the board, what do you reply to these kinds of things?

 

[comike]

I think someone may have been misinformed. Anyone that believes that Jesus is the Christ and is a follower of Jesus is considered a Christian. Catholicism is one of the many Christian denominations. As a matter of fact, the Roman Catholic Church is the largest Christian Church in the world. I've never known Catholics not to be considered Christians....never known them not to be followers of Jesus. They celebrate Christmas and Easter don't they.

 

[Denim And Leather]

I was born and raised a Catholic and even though I don't practice the Catholic religion anymore I still don't understand why some say Catholics are not Christians. I read it on this board a while back and a some people I know have told me the same thing to

So can someone please explain to me why Catholics are not considered Christians?
Some of the reasons a friend mine has given me are that: Catholics don't pray to Jesus, they pray to the Virgin Mary and Saints, they have carved images (the Jesus on the Cross and statues of Mary etc...), they don't believe in speaking in tongues or in laying hands etc...
Anyone can shed more light for me please? Also what is wrong with praying Mary?

Also Catholics of the board, what do you reply to these kinds of things?

I like to first state that there are true Christians in the Catholic church. I wouldn't say that Catholics are not true Christians, but a lot of the practices they do are not Christian.

A lot of Catholic traditions have their roots in pagan religions. Praying to Mary goes back to worshipping Semiramis, the so-called Queen of Heaven (and Nimrod's wife) and the Tower of Babel. In fact, the whole mother-child worship that you see in Catholic churches came from Semiramis. Also, having the carved images, calling the Pope "Holy Father" (only God is the Holy Father) and putting him in the place of Christ is unbiblical, not to mention blasphemous. These are just a few examples.

Praying to Mary is wrong, because she cannot make intercession for us, only Jesus can, He bridged the gap between man and God, not Mary.
Mary, while blessed to carry the Savior, was a sinner just like the rest of us, who needed a Savior, which she confessed in Luke 1:47. Also, 1 Timothy 2:5 says "For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus".

As for speaking in tongues, that varies from church to church, and has nothing to do with whether or not one is truly (saved) Christian just because they don't believe nor speak in tongues. Some churches believe that tongues are for today, while I, for example, believe that it something that is an actual foreign language that the person speaking would not know, meant to reach an unbeliever in his/her native tongue, because this is what the Bible teaches, and what happened in the book of Acts on the day of Pentecost. But I digress. This is not an issue of salvation, and is something what I call an In-house Debate.

If you have any more questions, feel free to email me at [email protected], as I won't be on this forum much for awhile.

I hope this has shed some light for you, and may God bless you for your efforts in seeking knowledge and the truth.

 

[melodee]

Basically, anyone who is have given their life over to Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior is a Christian. I like to call myself a believer or follower of Christ, because many people say they are Christian because they are Gentile. So ther term Christian is often misused.

So if you are a Catholic who has surrendered your life to Christ and see Him as the only way to Heaven/the Father, then you are part of the Kingdom.

Where it gets sticky--many Catholics are taught "religion" not a relationship with the Lord. I believe that a priest cannot forgive sins, and it is not necessary to confess sins to a priest and to recite anything for forgiveness. Why do I think this? Because it is not in the Bible. Pastors/priests do and have served a very special role throughout the Bible, but when Jesus came on the scene He said "I am The Way". So, essentially, we come to Him directly with our problems and our sins. Priests/pastors/ministers are all sinners saved by the same grace that we are saved by. So with Jesus we need not go to a man in order to be forgiven. We can just get on our knees and go straight to the Lord!

I also believe that Mary was a very special lady to have been chosen to carry our Lord. But Jesus never told us to "come to Mary all who are heavy laden", He said to come to Him always.

We often wear crosses or have pictures or images in our homes. But I know that the power does not dwell in an image, it comes from God. He doesn't mind that we have things to remind ourselves of Him or to identify ourselves as His, but we don't pray to them--we pray to Him.



I believe that a relationship with God comes through the Son (Jesus) and it comes by personal choice. So salvation comes to those who choose Him. No one else can choose Him for us. We're not saved by being sprinkled And we aren't saved simply by being a member of a church--any chruch.

Mindtwister, when it comes down to it, I follow the Bible. When it comes down to it, I believe that one is saved by admitting they fall short of the glory of the Lord and by ACCEPTING the full and perfect gift of sacrifice through Jesus.

 

[pebbles]

This is always a basis for confusion, but let's all be clear about this once and for all: Catholics ARE Christians!! There are major differences between Catholics and Protestants, one of the biggest being that the Catholic Church believes the Pope is GOD's chosen representative on this earth, and he is basically infallible. (sp?) But there are differences amongst the Protestant churches.

What is most important is what unites us: Catholics and Protestants alike ALL believe that Jesus Christ IS Lord, and He died for our sins, was buried and rose again. And that, ladies, is the most important thing and what we all need to focus on.

ETA: Catholics also believe in praying to dead saints cannonized by the church, ex: Mary the mother of Jesus and Saint Mathew, etc. Protestants believe that we are given only one intercessor to God, and that's Jesus Christ.

 

[MindTwister]

because many people say they are Christian because they are Gentile. So ther term Christian is often misused.

Can you please explain what you mean by this, especially the word Gentile?

I have read everyone's reply quickly and I am not sure I get certain things so I'll just read the posts again when I have more time
I like the different perspectives in the responses so far

 

[Integrity]

Basically, anyone who is have given their life over to Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior is a Christian. I like to call myself a believer or follower of Christ, because many people say they are Christian because they are Gentile. So ther term Christian is often misused.

So if you are a Catholic who has surrendered your life to Christ and see Him as the only way to Heaven/the Father, then you are part of the Kingdom.

Where it gets sticky--many Catholics are taught "religion" not a relationship with the Lord. I believe that a priest cannot forgive sins, and it is not necessary to confess sins to a priest and to recite anything for forgiveness. Why do I think this? Because it is not in the Bible. Pastors/priests do and have served a very special role throughout the Bible, but when Jesus came on the scene He said "I am The Way". So, essentially, we come to Him directly with our problems and our sins. Priests/pastors/ministers are all sinners saved by the same grace that we are saved by. So with Jesus we need not go to a man in order to be forgiven. We can just get on our knees and go straight to the Lord!

I also believe that Mary was a very special lady to have been chosen to carry our Lord. But Jesus never told us to "come to Mary all who are heavy laden", He said to come to Him always.

We often wear crosses or have pictures or images in our homes. But I know that the power does not dwell in an image, it comes from God. He doesn't mind that we have things to remind ourselves of Him or to identify ourselves as His, but we don't pray to them--we pray to Him.



I believe that a relationship with God comes through the Son (Jesus) and it comes by personal choice. So salvation comes to those who choose Him. No one else can choose Him for us. We're not saved by being sprinkled And we aren't saved simply by being a member of a church--any chruch.

Mindtwister, when it comes down to it, I follow the Bible. When it comes down to it, I believe that one is saved by admitting they fall short of the glory of the Lord and by ACCEPTING the full and perfect gift of sacrifice through Jesus.

excellent reply. WELL DONE!!!

OT: not to mention what a lovely siggy pic you have there!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[melodee]

Mindtwister-Gentile comes from Hebrew origins (goyim) and it translates as pagan or heathen. However, in the New Testament of the Bible, it is used to mean those who are non-Jew. So that means anyone who is not Jewish can be considered Gentile.

Integrity- thanks girl!

 

[melodee]

This is always a basis for confusion, but let's all be clear about this once and for all: Catholics ARE Christians!! There are major differences between Catholics and Protestants, one of the biggest being that the Catholic Church believes the Pope is GOD's chosen representative on this earth, and he is basically infallible. (sp?) But there are differences amongst the Protestant churches.

What is most important is what unites us: Catholics and Protestants alike ALL believe that Jesus Christ IS Lord, and He died for our sins, was buried and rose again. And that, ladies, is the most important thing and what we all need to focus on.

ETA: Catholics also believe in praying to dead saints cannonized by the church, ex: Mary the mother of Jesus and Saint Mathew, etc. Protestants believe that we are given only one intercessor to God, and that's Jesus Christ.

Hey Pebs! How are you.

Great job explaining the differences between Protestant and Catholic. I would like to add for clarification though, that there can be Catholics and Protestants who have not yet given their lives over. That is probably what the person who told MT that Catholics aren't Christians. I know lots of folks who grew up in the church (Catholic or Protestant) who never surrendered to Christ. In most Catholic churches, the salvation message is not preached properly. So alot of them think that by going to confession and mass regularly gets them into the kingdom of heaven. They never really ask for Jesus to come into their lives and have a real relationship with them.

This also happens in protestant churches. Sometimes the word isn't really preached. I've been in these churches before. And sometimes it is in the church members lap and they don't want to make that step in their heart.
So they are not "saved believers". But they call themselves Christian simply because they attend Church or their parents took them to church as a child and they were sprinkled or even emersed without knowing or caring what was going on.

So there are Catholic christians who believe Christ is their personal savior and there are some who are "good catholics" who have never taken the step. Same goes for protestants. It's not in the ACTS, it's in the FAITH.

Not to step on your toes or anything lady, just to add my 2cents.

 

[kisz4tj]

VERY WELL STATED EVERYONE

 

[pebbles]

Hey Pebs! How are you.

Great job explaining the differences between Protestant and Catholic. I would like to add for clarification though, that there can be Catholics and Protestants who have not yet given their lives over. That is probably what the person who told MT that Catholics aren't Christians. I know lots of folks who grew up in the church (Catholic or Protestant) who never surrendered to Christ. In most Catholic churches, the salvation message is not preached properly. So alot of them think that by going to confession and mass regularly gets them into the kingdom of heaven. They never really ask for Jesus to come into their lives and have a real relationship with them.

This also happens in protestant churches. Sometimes the word isn't really preached. I've been in these churches before. And sometimes it is in the church members lap and they don't want to make that step in their heart.
So they are not "saved believers". But they call themselves Christian simply because they attend Church or their parents took them to church as a child and they were sprinkled or even emersed without knowing or caring what was going on.

So there are Catholic christians who believe Christ is their personal savior and there are some who are "good catholics" who have never taken the step. Same goes for protestants. It's not in the ACTS, it's in the FAITH.

Not to step on your toes or anything lady, just to add my 2cents.

Hey sweetie, I'm doing well!

Girl, you're not stepping on my toes. I grew up in the Catholic church, but I was saved almost 20 years ago, so I've forgotten a lot of the differences between the two churches. Correct anything I've said or add as many 2 cents as necessary. It's all good!

 

[MindTwister]

Hey sweetie, I'm doing well!

Girl, you're not stepping on my toes. I grew up in the Catholic church, but I was saved almost 20 years ago, so I've forgotten a lot of the differences between the two churches. Correct anything I've said or add as many 2 cents as necessary. It's all good!

I am loving this discussion so far even though as busy as I am I haven't had time to ponder what has been said so far.

But Pebbles see the bolded part is what kind of rubbs me the wrong way. First you say: "Catholics and Protestants alike ALL believe that Jesus Christ IS Lord, and He died for our sins, was buried and rose again. And that, ladies, is the most important thing and what we all need to focus on"

And now you say the bolded part as if being Catholic is opposite to being saved. I don't know if I'm expressing it right. It sounds as if you got saved from the Catholic Church, as though though unlike what you first said, Catholics are not believer of Jesus as our Lord and Savior.

Excuse me if I'm misunderstanding or if I'm dense, I'm really tryingto understand. I've had lots of questions but since I don't go to any Bible studies, this is going to become my outlet (if ya'll allow me )

 

[pebbles]

I am loving this discussion so far even though as busy as I am I haven't had time to ponder what has been said so far.

But Pebbles see the bolded part is what kind of rubbs me the wrong way. First you say: "Catholics and Protestants alike ALL believe that Jesus Christ IS Lord, and He died for our sins, was buried and rose again. And that, ladies, is the most important thing and what we all need to focus on"

And now you say the bolded part as if being Catholic is opposite to being saved. I don't know if I'm expressing it right. It sounds as if you got saved from the Catholic Church, as though though unlike what you first said, Catholics are not believer of Jesus as our Lord and Savior.

Excuse me if I'm misunderstanding or if I'm dense, I'm really tryingto understand. I've had lots of questions but since I don't go to any Bible studies, this is going to become my outlet (if ya'll allow me )

I'll try to explain it as best as I can.

No, I wasn't saved from the Catholic church, I was saved to a new life in Christ Jesus, with a much deeper relationship and understanding of who Jesus is and what He did for me.

I can't lie about it: when I was in the Catholic church, I was bored to tears, and going to church was all about mechanics. I really didn't feel connected to God. God was light years away from me. I was just going to church once a week, day dreaming through a 55 minute service, and coming out the same way I went in, with my astrology seeking self!

Having spent my entire elementary and high school years in Catholic School, I had questions in religion class that the nuns couldn't answer. And sometimes they got upset at me for asking them. To make a long story short, my experience with church is so much different now, so much more profound. It's not just church anymore, it's a time of fellowship with the Lord and other saints in the church that did not exist before on any level. I don't daydream in church anymore. Girl, there's no time! I feel connected to the word, and the scriptures have so much more meaning to me. In short, my spiritual life is alive like it never was before.

Despite all of that, my point is that Catholics are Christians just like Protestants, because both acknowlege Jesus Christ as Lord and savior. And the word says that NO man will go to the Father but through Jesus. There are some big differences that separate us, but the essential point unites us.

I hope I explained it a little bit better.

 

[MindTwister]

Thanks Pebbles for explaining it further and for not taking my question the wrong way

 

[pebbles]

Thanks Pebbles for explaining it further and for not taking my question the wrong way

Not a problem. I understood what you were asking.

 

[mkh_77]

I can't lie about it: when I was in the Catholic church, I was bored to tears, and going to church was all about mechanics. I really didn't feel connected to God. God was light years away from me. I was just going to church once a week, day dreaming through a 55 minute service, and coming out the same way I went in, with my astrology seeking self!

Having spent my entire elementary and high school years in Catholic School, I had questions in religion class that the nuns couldn't answer. And sometimes they got upset at me for asking them. To make a long story short, my experience with church is so much different now, so much more profound. It's not just church anymore, it's a time of fellowship with the Lord and other saints in the church that did not exist before on any level. I don't daydream in church anymore. Girl, there's no time! I feel connected to the word, and the scriptures have so much more meaning to me. In short, my spiritual life is alive like it never was before.

Some people could say the same about attending a Protestant church. I don't think this is indicative of Catholic churches/schools. (I am not attacking you, I did notice that this was your experience.)

Despite all of that, my point is that Catholics are Christians just like Protestants, because both acknowlege Jesus Christ as Lord and savior. And the word says that NO man will go to the Father but through Jesus. There are some big differences that separate us, but the essential point unites us.

I think the above is very well said.

 

[pebbles]

Some people could say the same about attending a Protestant church. I don't think this is indicative of Catholic churches/schools. (I am not attacking you, I did notice that this was your experience.)

Sure! Anything is possible. But I can tell you that I, personally, have never met any of them. Wish I did know one. I'd love to get their perspective on what caused them to convert to Catholicism. I think it would be a very interesting discussion.