Mom And I Argued...

[Supergirl]

went something like this:

Mom: I hope you covered up enough today, you'll be sick again

Me: Yeah, since you just said it

Mom: Oh, that is so silly. That's not true. You can't speak things into existence. I can't believe your church teaches you that

Me: Mom, it's in the Bible.

Mom: Well, your church just interpreted it the way they wanted to and I think it's ashame that you believe that.

Me: Mom, I can think for myself too ya know and my church is not the only church that "interprets" that scripture that way.

Then she goes on to say that I've changed since I've gone to that church. (7 years ago) She always says this when I bring up something that she's never heard before or that her church does not bring up. She goes to a Methodist church and mine is non-denominational, but that's beside the point. The Bible says "You shall have whatsoever you say..." and there are many scripture references where Jesus spoke things and they became. There's also a scripture that talks about speaking those things that be not as though they were.

Any business seminar will tell you to say your goals aloud everyday (affirmations) whether they are Bible believers or not, because it's a basic principle/law. (like sowing and reaping is)

I love my mom with all my heart and we are very close, but it really hurts me when she makes it sound like my beliefs and who I am is tied up in my church as if I am a robot and can't think for myself. I ended up crying when I got off the phone with her. My question is, do you ladies believe what the scriptures say about speaking things. Do you have a different interpretation to offer?

 

[pebbles]

Nope! I'm with you. The bible says in Proverbs 18:21 (Amplified Bible)
"Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and they who indulge in it shall eat the fruit of it" [for death or life].

The Word says what it means, and means what it says. Stand firm in the truth, sweetie.

 

[TrustMeLove]

You know what, im really sorry you had an argument with your mom, I have those type of arguments too, but mine are more like MOM GO TO CHURCH GET UP WE WANT YOU (MY LITTLE BROTHER AND I) TO COME AND WORSHIP WITH US. I don't like how things like that separate family, church doctrines. I pray for unity in your household a house divided...you know the saying.

However, I don't agree with the doctrine of speaking words into existence either.

I don't believe you can speak things into existence. It in someways makes us like little gods. This type of thinking is a main doctrine of the Word of Faith Movement.

God spoke things into existence, he did not give us that power, not according to scripture. Only person in history who was able to just speak and things came into existence was God and Jesus while on earth.

I can say oh my dogs going to die today, but if its not in GODS WILL, my dog isn't going to die today. We don't control the things on this earth by our words, its all in GODS WILL, he chooses what he wants to do, when he wants to do it. Not because I spoke something. I could say the dog is going to die and I may not saying, but if she is suppose to die she will die without me saying anything.

But Proverbs 18:21, when it says that death and life are in the power of the tongue, it relates more to James 3:8. That by your tongue you can create life or death. The tongue can be used to harm, gossip, oppress, and belittle which is DEATH. But the tongue can also be able to uplift, speak a good word to someone, bring people into the fold which is LIFE.

I looked for other verses that said we can speak things into existence, and found none. (If you have any please post, so I may be enlightened too.)

I did find other verses that spoke of how the tongue can be a deadly thing or a good thing.

1 Peter 3:10 - For he that will love life, and see good days, let him refrain his tongue from evil, and his lips that they speak no guile:

Jam 3:6 And the tongue [is] a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.

Jam 3: 8 But the tongue can no man tame; [it is] an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.

According to 1 Thessalonians 5:21. Ive taken a doctrine and tested it against scripture and have not found any supporting evidence.

Have a Bless Day.
I too have to get ready for church, im on the west coast time, I k now some of yall already Praisin'

-TrustTheWord

 

[gn1g]

yes, it is biblical. AFFIRMATIONS WORK.

WE ARE LITTLE GODS! PSALMS 82: 6. That's gods with a little g. god jr's. We are xerox copies of GOD. made in the image and likeness of him. He spoke the world into existance.

Back in the day there was no wide spread revelation, so when my mother goes off I just chalk it up to no revelation.

 

[Sweet C]

yes, it is biblical. AFFIRMATIONS WORK.

WE ARE LITTLE GODS! PSALMS 82: 6. That's gods with a little g. god jr's. We are xerox copies of GOD. made in the image and likeness of him. He spoke the world into existance.

Back in the day there was no wide spread revelation, so when my mother goes off I just chalk it up to no revelation.

This is so good. Yep, u can speak things into existence. You can speak life or sow discord with your words. That is why it is so important to watch your tongue. God's will reigns supreme, so it is key that what we do speak is in his will, lest it fall upon death ears.

Supergirl, I know how u feel. I have that same problem with some members of my family, b/c they always want to tell you what they "think" about God, but never have any scripture to back it up, and once u show them scripture, they wanna bring something else up. I too chalk it up to no revelation.

 

[pebbles]

Personally, I don't believe that we are little gods, but we do have the power of the Holy Spirit in us. And you can speak things into existence. I've always been taught that we are able to "call things that be not as though they were," and let me tell you, I've experienced it myself. If you say what you see, you will only see what you say. Step out on faith, and speak "life" into any situation.

 

[Supergirl]

Thanks Sisters. I appreciate you all taking time to respond. You're wonderful.

 

[star]

It is the spirit in which something is given that makes all the difference. You can have what you say whether good or evil but me must use spiritullay with wisdom.

went something like this:

Mom: I hope you covered up enough today, you'll be sick again

Me: Yeah, since you just said it

Mom: Oh, that is so silly. That's not true. You can't speak things into existence. I can't believe your church teaches you that

Me: Mom, it's in the Bible.

Mom: Well, your church just interpreted it the way they wanted to and I think it's ashame that you believe that.

Me: Mom, I can think for myself too ya know and my church is not the only church that "interprets" that scripture that way.

Then she goes on to say that I've changed since I've gone to that church. (7 years ago) She always says this when I bring up something that she's never heard before or that her church does not bring up. She goes to a Methodist church and mine is non-denominational, but that's beside the point. The Bible says "You shall have whatsoever you say..." and there are many scripture references where Jesus spoke things and they became. There's also a scripture that talks about speaking those things that be not as though they were.

Any business seminar will tell you to say your goals aloud everyday (affirmations) whether they are Bible believers or not, because it's a basic principle/law. (like sowing and reaping is)

I love my mom with all my heart and we are very close, but it really hurts me when she makes it sound like my beliefs and who I am is tied up in my church as if I am a robot and can't think for myself. I ended up crying when I got off the phone with her. My question is, do you ladies believe what the scriptures say about speaking things. Do you have a different interpretation to offer?

 

[TrustMeLove]

Pslams 82:6 Does not prove that we have the ability to speak words into existence. It just states that we are little gods, basically saying that God made us in his image. But we aren't the real true genuwine thing, if we were we woudln't sin.

And for this comment "If you say what you see, you will only see what you say. Step out on faith, and speak "life" into any situation."

What about those people who use this formula and the situation doesn't change. Are they not using the formula properly, are they not stepping out on faith, are their words not speaking life into the situation? and How are we to judge wether or not someone is using this formula properly?

To me the formula makes no sense, it puts the power into mens hands to do their will and work God to some sort of advantage of theirs. How valid is the statement "God let thy will be done" , if we are able to contrude his will to make it our will, by speaking life into speaking life into a situation conforming the situation into what we want.


"You can speak life or sow discord with your words. That is why it is so important to watch your tongue. God's will reigns supreme, so it is key that what we do speak is in his will, lest it fall upon death ears. "

I agree with this statement. I stated the first 2 sentences in my first post.

Now if anyone has scripture that agrees with the doctrine that they believe or have been taught. Thats more than appreciated, but how can ones heart be changed except by the words of God. We are suppose to be Bereans and test all things according to the scripture like. How can we do this if we just except the doctrines of our church, or what grandma told us, but haven't read it in the bible.

This post isn't to be argumentative. Its a sincere post, wanting real biblical discussion. If anyone feels that they may reply to this post in anger or with any emotions that are contrary to a constructive, God fearing, Loving Reply, then please feel free not to post back. I rather my post go unanswered and just turn dead than to bring anyone into those emotions, while typing a reply.

And if I ever feel these same feelings, I wont reply back either.

God Bless: Sola Scriptura
-TrustTheWord

 

[TigerLily]

Personally, I don't believe that we are little gods, but we do have the power of the Holy Spirit in us. And you can speak things into existence. I've always been taught that we are able to "call things that be not as though they were," and let me tell you, I've experienced it myself. If you say what you see, you will only see what you say. Step out on faith, and speak "life" into any situation.

I agree. You have what you say. God gave us power over all power of the enemy through the Holy Spirit. If we can speak to the enemy and he must flee then I think that we can speak things into existence.

 

[pebbles]

And for this comment "If you say what you see, you will only see what you say. Step out on faith, and speak "life" into any situation."

What about those people who use this formula and the situation doesn't change. Are they not using the formula properly, are they not stepping out on faith, are their words not speaking life into the situation? and How are we to judge wether or not someone is using this formula properly?

To me the formula makes no sense, it puts the power into mens hands to do their will and work God to some sort of advantage of theirs. How valid is the statement "God let thy will be done" , if we are able to contrude his will to make it our will, by speaking life into speaking life into a situation conforming the situation into what we want.
-TrustTheWord

No, this is not a "formula", but rather words spoken in "faith." Let me give you an example. I have a son with ADD, and for the longest time he has been struggling in school. I mean really struggling! But his attitude was just as bad. He called himself stupid, and would say things like, "I'll never get my work done on time," or "I'll never pass this test", and sure enough, he never did.

Well, I was praying for him, but I was reminded by my bishop, of the principle of speaking positively into a situation. As he said, "your words coupled with your faith can determine your destiny." You have to speak positively into dry, dead situations where you need something positive to happen.

Then I remembered Ezekiel in the Valley of dry bones-Ezekiel 37:1-14. This is one of my favorite inspirational stories in the bible. If, when God asked Ezekiel, "Son of man, can these dry bones live?" Ezekiel had responded with something like, "No, these bones can't live, Lord. There's no flesh, no skin, no sinew, and not only are the bones fallen appart, they're dry, and the breath of life is no longer in them," I don't know how that story would have gone, but instead he says, "Lord, you know if these dry bones can live!" And God commands him to speak life into that dead dry situation, and look what happens! Ezekiel didn't hesitate or have doubt, but he did what the Lord told him to do.

I believe, with all my heart, that God wants us to step out on faith in many situations in our life. How do I know this? Because He puts the desire in my heart to pray for situations I would otherwise not pray too much over. And when I pray, the first thing I ask is that my prayers be in line with His will, that I not be praying in the flesh out of my own selfish desires. I'm not talking about trivial things like wanting to win the lottery and saying on "faith" that I'm going to win! No, not things like that. But when it comes to health, and what I'm facing with my son, positive words spoken in faith can change an otherwise hopeless situation. It's true! Things are beginning to change for my son at school.

Allow me another brief example. And this is a testimony as well. I have a friend named Rudy Miller. He's a criminal defense attorney here in MA. In September of last year, he was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, by 3 doctors and 2 biopsies. He was told to get his things in order because he didn't have much time to live.

I don't have to tell you, at 39 years old, it is a devastating blow to hear that you are going to be dead in a matter of months. He was devastated, for lack of a better word. When he told me and my family, I said to him, "You will not die, Rudy. You are going to live." Now, he had 2 biopsies and both confirmed that he was on his way out. He looked at me with a smile, but it was clear he didn't believe a word I said. Let me tell you, we spent months on our knees praying, and confessing loudly that he was going to live. Did we have proof of what we were professing? Nope. But we spoke positively into his life, and fasted and prayed like you wouldn't believe!

In January, things got so bad, that the doctors said they would have to operate to remove the cancer and hopefully give him some more time. We still believed and spoke to him that he was healed. Sis, don't you know that when they opened him up, there wasn't one bit of cancer in his body???

HALLELUJAH!!!!!!

The doctors were stunned, Rudy was shocked, but I fell on my knees and thanked GOD ALMIGHTY for the principle of stepping out on faith and "calling those things that be not, as though they were." Rudy is a walking miracle for the Brigham & Women's doctors. Oh yes! They found that parts of his stomach were rotted, but how, they don't know. So they removed it and his spleen, and that was the end of it. No radiation, no chemotherapy, nothing!

Why did I pray for such an apparently hopeless situation? Because God placed within me the desire to pray for Rudy, and placed in my spirit the need to voice the impossible. Sometimes, you have to put your faith out there and look foolish to the world, so that the world can see what a MIGHTY GOD you really serve! It's not easy, but God is faithful!

Matthew 17:19-20 says: Then the disciples came to Jesus in private and asked, “Why couldn't we drive it out?”

He replied, “Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there’ and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you.”

I believe in this principle with all my heart and soul.

All of this to say, your words are important, but it's your faith that causes God to give wings to your prayer requests and breath life into otherwise dry, dead situations. I don't know for other people, but I've seen God move some unmovable mountains all around me. I can't start doubting this principle now.

I hope my explanation makes a little more sense to you.

 

[TrustMeLove]

Pebbles,

First and foremost Praise GOD for the miraculous works that he is doing in your life. All of your examples are truly testimonies worthy of being shared with other people to give God the glory. Hallelujah!
--------------------------------------------------------

This type of thinking that we can make our positive words come into existence and change a situation is straight from Hindu practices. Check this website out http://hinduwebsite.com/selfdevt/affirmations.htm.

To comment on the examples about how your words “prayer”, and how they have changed a situation.

All I ask, is what about the people who have been in your same situation and prayed, fasted, and praised and their situations didn’t turn out the way they wanted, did they not really have enough faith? And how are we to judge whether their faith was enough?

Prayer is not a means by which we get our will done in heaven. By believing that prayer can change a situation, this view sees prayer as changing God’s mind or helping Him decide what to do since He doesn’t know everything.

Prayer, changes the way we view a situation. Prayer, changes the way we act in the world. Prayer, changes us that we may conform to Gods will. Prayer, changes us from the carnal man into what God wants us to be. Prayer changes US not God.

In Ezekiel 37:1-14 what’s evident to me was that Ezekiel was lead by God to prophesy over the bones. This is a direct command from God. Just like how you were lead to pray for your friend Rudy. When someone prophesies it’s like its coming from God himself, by divine direction were the bones able to live.

I read this analogy somewhere, that God can save souls without us preaching, but our preaching can’t save souls without God’s grace.

So basically, with or without prayer or speaking words of life into a situation Gods will, will still be done. Our prayers need God to be effective in his will, but God doesn’t need our prayers for his will to be effective.

I think Matt 7:7 and James 4:3 are very important scriptures concerning prayer. The lord says in Matt. ask and it shall be given to you and in James he says if you ask and don't receive basically the motivation of your heart wasn't pure. When the Lord says ask and you will receive its under the guise that his thoughts are our thoughts and his desires are our desires. Because why would he grant something thats not in his will or that contradicts his character. According to scripture every prayer is heard and answered according to his will.

Faith doesn’t get our prayers through to God or answered in a certain manner. According to scripture God hears all prayers and answers them according to his will. I can have faith greater than a mustard seed that God can do something eventhough its seems impossible to the world and even to me. But, if my prayer request even coupled with my faith isn’t in his will, its not going to be done.

My whole statement in short is that Prayer doesn’t change God, Prayer changes Us. Like you when you prayed for you friend you were lead by the Lord to pray. He had it already in his will for your friend to be healed and you all prayed, fasted, and praised so that it would be made known that God did the miraculous healing and that he would get the glory.


God Bless

-TrustTheWord

 

[pebbles]

Pebbles,

First and foremost Praise GOD for the miraculous works that he is doing in your life. All of your examples are truly testimonies worthy of being shared with other people to give God the glory. Hallelujah!
--------------------------------------------------------

This type of thinking that we can make our positive words come into existence and change a situation is straight from Hindu practices. Check this website out http://hinduwebsite.com/selfdevt/affirmations.htm.

Ok, let me be honest and say that I didn't click on the link. Most of these religions have taken Christian principles and perverted them to mean something else, so I don't doubt they have something similar to this.

To comment on the examples about how your words “prayer”, and how they have changed a situation.

All I ask, is what about the people who have been in your same situation and prayed, fasted, and praised and their situations didn’t turn out the way they wanted, did they not really have enough faith? And how are we to judge whether their faith was enough?

Prayer is not a means by which we get our will done in heaven. By believing that prayer can change a situation, this view sees prayer as changing God’s mind or helping Him decide what to do since He doesn’t know everything.

Prayer, changes the way we view a situation. Prayer, changes the way we act in the world. Prayer, changes us that we may conform to Gods will. Prayer, changes us from the carnal man into what God wants us to be. Prayer changes US not God.

In Ezekiel 37:1-14 what’s evident to me was that Ezekiel was lead by God to prophesy over the bones. This is a direct command from God. Just like how you were lead to pray for your friend Rudy. When someone prophesies it’s like its coming from God himself, by divine direction were the bones able to live.

I did say that God placed it in my spirit to pray for Rudy. It would have been foolish of me to tell Rudy, of my own will, that he was going to live. While it's clear that God can heal everyone, He clearly does not do so. If there are others who find themselves in my situation, I would hope they have a prayer life and are connected to the Father in order to know how to pray in that situation. But I must say, that I firmly believe that when we pray, we must believe and have faith that God is able to do the things we ask.

I read this analogy somewhere, that God can save souls without us preaching, but our preaching can’t save souls without God’s grace.

I agree 1000%!! No matter how eloquent one might be, you cannot "talk, argue, or preach" anyone into the Kingdom. Only the Holy Spirit can change hearts.

So basically, with or without prayer or speaking words of life into a situation Gods will, will still be done. Our prayers need God to be effective in his will, but God doesn’t need our prayers for his will to be effective.

I think Matt 7:7 and James 4:3 are very important scriptures concerning prayer. The lord says in Matt. ask and it shall be given to you and in James he says if you ask and don't receive basically the motivation of your heart wasn't pure. When the Lord says ask and you will receive its under the guise that his thoughts are our thoughts and his desires are our desires. Because why would he grant something thats not in his will or that contradicts his character. According to scripture every prayer is heard and answered according to his will.

Faith doesn’t get our prayers through to God or answered in a certain manner. According to scripture God hears all prayers and answers them according to his will. I can have faith greater than a mustard seed that God can do something eventhough its seems impossible to the world and even to me. But, if my prayer request even coupled with my faith isn’t in his will, its not going to be done.

My whole statement in short is that Prayer doesn’t change God, Prayer changes Us. Like you when you prayed for you friend you were lead by the Lord to pray. He had it already in his will for your friend to be healed and you all prayed, fasted, and praised so that it would be made known that God did the miraculous healing and that he would get the glory.

Again, of my own will, I could never have saved Rudy. I would hope that I made it clear that I was led by the Spirit to pray for my friend, just as I am led to pray and speak what I would like to see in my son's life. Does God want him to fail in school? No. I believe that rather than telling him he's a failure, it's been very beneficial to call him an A student. He's not an A student yet, but he's not walking around feeling as defeated as before, and believe me when I tell you, his grades have taken a serious upswing! I believed, and I prayed, according to what the Spirit of God led me to speak outloud. As I've said before, when I pray, I ask God that my prayers be in line with His Divine Will, and that I not be in the flesh. No, prayer does not change God. I never would suggest that. But just as prayer changes us, prayer can change our situations. And I think God waits for us to ask Him for certain things. I firmly believe that.

Matthew 21:21-22 says: Jesus replied, “I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, ‘Go, throw yourself into the sea,’ and it will be done. 22If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.”

And John 14:12-14 says: I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.

I suppose the interpretation of these scripture passages is where we may differ. I do think that we agree on many points, but on the question of faith, I don't think we see eye to eye. But that's ok. We can agree to disagree.

Be blessed!

 

[slwe415]

I totally agree. I attend a Baptist church, who is under a 'District', and within the district they are so caught up in the "Baptist Doctrine' that it seems like they are disregarding what the word of God says. I understand where you are coming from Supergirl!

 

[TrustMeLove]

As my conclusion,

Yea we agree on many points, but disagree on probably the doctrine of faith.

Just to clear something up. I read and understood where you wrote that you were lead by the Spirit to pray for your friend Rudy. I used this example to say that when the Spirit moves one to pray its usually because God has something that he going to do already and wants his children to be obedient and pray, praise, and fast so that he may get the glory.

I too agree that God waits for us to ask him for things and we make our request known to him through prayer. I just believe that not all things we ask will get done if its not already in His will.

Regardless, may God continue to use you in his will to be obedient to him and blessings to others. Because it seems like God knows that you are one of his prayer warriors.

God Bless
-TrustTheWord

 

[pebbles]

Regardless, may God continue to use you in his will to be obedient to him and blessings to others. Because it seems like God knows that you are one of his prayer warriors.

God Bless
-TrustTheWord

Thank-you, sweetie! Be blessed!