Moisture & Oil question

[Cowgirl]

You would think I would know the answer to these questions by now ,

For those who's routine is to moisturize and then seal with some type of oil, I've been wondering lately............

I moisturize at night with my homemade spritz concoction..and then seal with a little bit of EVCO. I put a little EVCO in my palms and smooth over my hair and then put a little more on the ends. I then either tie my hair with a silk scarf or do a 3/4 baggie and then tie with the scarf.

The next morning, I loosely comb hair, spritz again with moisturizer and then do a bun or pony for the day. However, when I comb my hair in the morning, I can still see the EVCO on my hair and it comes out on my hands. Although I really am using it very sparingly.

So my questions are.......
1.) Should the EVCO be absorbing better into the hair and not be visible or transferring to my hands the next morning?
2.) Is any moisturizing treatment you use after sealing with oil really going to waste because if the oil is still there, the moisturizer is not penetrating anyway?
3.) How long does it normally take for your oil to disappear (absorb) into the hair once applied?
4.) If you mix the oil with your moisturizer, is that actually prohibiting the moisturizer from penetrating deep into the hair strands? I know the hair may feel moisturized on the top, but is it really sinking in there?

Thanks in advance for any responses.

 

[me-T]

as long as i been on hair boards i have yet to understand these very things myself

 

[Irresistible]

When you get a chance check out this thread about oils and moisture

see if it helps

oops here is the thread
http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=250521

 

[me-T]

just read the link (not all of it) I too have oil hair like you, Iris! i only use water cause i have to! my hair no likey water!

 

[Cowgirl]

When you get a chance check out this thread about oils and moisture

see if it helps

oops here is the thread
http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=250521

Iris, thanks a million for the link. This was very informative. The search function was not quite helpful for me……but I could have been typing in the wrong key words.

I have read thru the entire link plus the spin-off links in some of the post; (good thing my supervisor doesn't work anywhere near me...) The one about “oil rinses” was especially interesting. I’ll have to try that.

It appears there are two camps on this one (One camp believes some oils, “the penetrating oils” do moisturize) and (One camp believes even if the oil penetrates, it may be “conditioning and/or nourishing” but it’s still not moisturizing because it’s not adding water).

So I guess it just depends on that persons hair and what it “likes/dislikes”.

Trying to diagnose my own issues……..I guess if I can still see & feel the coconut oil on my hair at the end of the day……it’s not penetrating.
1.) So, although I think I’m using very little, it may still be too much….
2.) My hair may need more protein because the oil is not absorbing and adhering to the protein bonds.
3.) I need to clarify again because there may be product build-up. I just clarified on Friday with baking soda, but that was my first time doing that and it may not have done the trick for me.

The one thing I am still am confused about even after reading all of that is………if you use a “non-penetrating” oil to seal, does that still mean that any other moisturizer (spray/spritz concoctions, creamy leave-ins etc) put on the hair afterwards, is going nowhere and doing nothing until that oil is pood/cond out???? 'Cuz if that's the case.....I can stop waisting my moisturizer until the "sealing oil" is rinsed out...


Thanks
CG

 

[Irresistible]

Iris, thanks a million for the link. This was very informative. The search function was not quite helpful for me……but I could have been typing in the wrong key words.

I have read thru the entire link plus the spin-off links in some of the post; (good thing my supervisor doesn't work anywhere near me...) The one about “oil rinses” was especially interesting. I’ll have to try that.

It appears there are two camps on this one (One camp believes some oils, “the penetrating oils” do moisturize) and (One camp believes even if the oil penetrates, it may be “conditioning and/or nourishing” but it’s still not moisturizing because it’s not adding water).

So I guess it just depends on that persons hair and what it “likes/dislikes”.

Trying to diagnose my own issues……..I guess if I can still see & feel the coconut oil on my hair at the end of the day……it’s not penetrating.
1.) So, although I think I’m using very little, it may still be too much….
2.) My hair may need more protein because the oil is not absorbing and adhering to the protein bonds.
3.) I need to clarify again because there may be product build-up. I just clarified on Friday with baking soda, but that was my first time doing that and it may not have done the trick for me.

The one thing I am still am confused about even after reading all of that is………if you use a “non-penetrating” oil to seal, does that still mean that any other moisturizer (spray/spritz concoctions, creamy leave-ins etc) put on the hair afterwards, is going nowhere and doing nothing until that oil is pood/cond out???? 'Cuz if that's the case.....I can stop waisting my moisturizer until the "sealing oil" is rinsed out...


Thanks
CG

No girl I personally think things got twisted the moment people started saying that oils dont moisturize they only seal. I just genuinely do not believe that. whether the word is nourish or not, its still penetrating and not just sealing. It would be actually totally normal for you to have some oil left after oiling your hair, but try this , after a wash or CW add your oil overnight , Coconut oil does absorb! than add your moisturizer and what not! Dont worry about what is penetrating or not because no matter how you do this you hair only has a certain saturation point so once its reached that nothing is going to absorb, so if you want to make sure your oil absorbs, use that first, then use your moisturizer, and NO the OIL wont seal it out if you hair needs more moisture its going to take it in. You could try what you said and mix your oil and moisturizer together and that would probably make a difference. You probably dont need to clarify or any of that, just oil and moisturize your hair in whatever order you find will work or use them together-and dont let all the things being said confuse you-just do what is going to work for you hair!

your really not doing anything wrong, its normal to still have some oil , but if you use the oil first it will absorb more

 

[Irresistible]

Iris, thanks a million for the link. This was very informative. The search function was not quite helpful for me……but I could have been typing in the wrong key words.

I have read thru the entire link plus the spin-off links in some of the post; (good thing my supervisor doesn't work anywhere near me...) The one about “oil rinses” was especially interesting. I’ll have to try that.

It appears there are two camps on this one (One camp believes some oils, “the penetrating oils” do moisturize) and (One camp believes even if the oil penetrates, it may be “conditioning and/or nourishing” but it’s still not moisturizing because it’s not adding water).

So I guess it just depends on that persons hair and what it “likes/dislikes”.

Trying to diagnose my own issues……..I guess if I can still see & feel the coconut oil on my hair at the end of the day……it’s not penetrating.
1.) So, although I think I’m using very little, it may still be too much….
2.) My hair may need more protein because the oil is not absorbing and adhering to the protein bonds.
3.) I need to clarify again because there may be product build-up. I just clarified on Friday with baking soda, but that was my first time doing that and it may not have done the trick for me.

The one thing I am still am confused about even after reading all of that is………if you use a “non-penetrating” oil to seal, does that still mean that any other moisturizer (spray/spritz concoctions, creamy leave-ins etc) put on the hair afterwards, is going nowhere and doing nothing until that oil is pood/cond out???? 'Cuz if that's the case.....I can stop waisting my moisturizer until the "sealing oil" is rinsed out...


Thanks
CG

oh and I meant to add I have no clue what oils just 'seal' and dont absorb whatsoever , I highly doubt that its even all the way true , mabye a very thick oil , but as long as your using the oils mentioned in that thread , they will absorb and they dont seal anything out or in. Thats my honest opinion and as you read on that thread I have never bought into all that and I do my oil first many times or the other way around, it doesnt matter , if my hair needs it and its not totally saturated its going to take what it needs in. No oil could keep that out, especically not coconut oil and stuff . I'm wondering if mabye someone confused this with grease and started saying the same things about oil- I just dont believe its true-my hair tells me so-I dont need to listen to all that!

all these technicalities have so many people worried if they are doing this or that right, girl just oil and moisturize your hair in whatever order you want , it will be just fine trust me. MINE IS! been doing it this way for years!

 

[Irresistible]

just read the link (not all of it) I too have oil hair like you, Iris! i only use water cause i have to! my hair no likey water!

yeah there really is something to this! Water being the only moisturizer is nuts to me, when its the one thing that takes all my moisture out and strips everthing-it to me is just one step, without oil my hair wouldnt even be on my head

mabye I'm sealing in the water, maybe I'm sealing in the oil, because alot of times I use my moisturizer after the oil, or maybe I'm moisturzing with oil before water by doing an oil rinse. Its all too messy and 'clinical' as my man would say haha, and just easier to do what works for our hair all this sealing in and sealing out is crazy when oil does absorb!

just use the oil however your hair likes it, thats all you gotta do!

 

[Irresistible]

just think about this if an oil is so capable of 'sealing' things out then how does it rinse out so well with plain water, wouldnt it 'seal' that out too?

I think somebody confused the natural oils with grease , started saying this and it took off and to me has absolutely no proven truth to it.

 

[Cowgirl]

just think about this if an oil is so capable of 'sealing' things out then how does it rinse out so well with plain water, wouldn't it 'seal' that out too?

I think somebody confused the natural oils with grease , started saying this and it took off and to me has absolutely no proven truth to it.

My comment was based on below information posted in the thread by Neroli. But I agree that it seems like different people have different results with different techniques and it's all about what works for that individuals hair. I was just trying to eliminate unneeded steps and wasting products if it was not really helping. Thanks for your responses and help.... I will be trying the oil rinse in a couple of days......I'll let you know how that turns out.

Wow, this thread is so timely for me cuz I have just been trying to google “hair oils” and such to try and figure out, ummm, hair oils. So far, found this abstract of an article (I can’t find the whole thing, but I’ll keep looking): http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.0142-5463.2005.00278_3.x that suggests polyunsaturated oils do not penetrate or do so sparingly because of their large molecules, but monounsaturated oils do readily penetrate hair because they have more compact (smaller) molecular structure. Soooooooo, I’ve come to the following tentative conclusions:

1. all oils “lubricate” – that is they reduce friction by providing a smooth film as a covering over parts that move against each other. However, hair oils can be categorized two ways:

2. penetrating oils: the kind that actually “absorbs” into the hair or skin and I believe these are the more “moisturizing” oils, especially when used on WET hair because they emulsify with the water and then penetrate. Some mono/penetrating oils are: castor, jojoba, emu, olive, rapeseed, hazelnut, almond, avocado, sesame, etc. (please correct and/or add to this list)

3. sealing oils: the kind that create “barrier” on top of the hair or skin, sealing things in or out. So, maybe these oils will weigh wet hair down more because doesn’t penetrate inside with the water, but rather sits on top going nowhere. I think they may work well when used very sparingly on DRY hair. Some poly/sealing oils are: sunflower, safflower, corn (please correct and/or add to this list)

4. Popular hair oils I did not find a definitive answer: coconut, palm oil, palm kernel nut oil = these are “saturated” fatty oils so can’t figure out where they fit in the penetrating vs. sealing categories

Hmmmm, in light of Sisterslick’s explanation, perhaps should be looking at the SIZE of the oil molecules and not whether it is mono or poly? IDK . . . .

 

[Irresistible]

My comment was based on below information posted in the thread by Neroli. But I agree that it seems like different people have different results with different techniques and it's all about what works for that individuals hair. I was just trying to eliminate unneeded steps and wasting products if it was not really helping. Thanks for your responses and help.... I will be trying the oil rinse in a couple of days......I'll let you know how that turns out.

I know it gets confusing , just wanted you to know dont get too frustrtated or confused and like you just said do what works for your hair

Yeah girl let me know how the oil rinse turns out, you will like it , I'm sure!