flyygirlll2
Lioness mane
You're welcomeThe utmost of compliments coming from you with all that lush hair! Thanks, lady!
. Love your hair!
How To Grow & Retain 20" Of 4c Hair
- Thread starter MileHighDiva
- Start date
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- retention
. Love your hair!
VinaytheMrs
Loving Life
Very similar! I think I learned a lot from you in the fine 4c thread? If so thank you!
Saludable84
Better Late Than Ugly
bubbles12345
Well-Known Member
MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
Amen to that, sis! I haven't yet given up on my natural hair. I love clumping and definition. But to be honest I have only been dealing with the roots so far. I think I should transition long term to see what I can get.
So what's your technique for definition? I have tried clay washing, oil rinsing and shingling so far and they all don't do nothing for meThe only thing that works for me for definition is relaxer
Wet hair & lots & lots of Thick moisturizer like Eden body works coconut defining creme or Cantu coconut Curling creme with lots of Wetline Gel or ECO styler clear only. All the other versions of ECO gives "me" flakes but everyone is different. There is white residue remaining until it dries tho. (Journey to Waist Length technique worked for me) My roots & like 2inches down doesn't stayed defined...Im still trying to figure that out
One tip to ensure products mix well so you don't get those product balls in your hair is to mix the two Together b4 applying to your strands.
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MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
Yep..slippery conditioner and comb under running water is still a no go for me. I prefer now to use fingers only and separate not pull through. The hand steamer is the truth after my hair get dry and I want to style. I luv it so much
detangling is easy
charmtreese
Well-Known Member
Your hair looks close to my texture, and the way you describe it sounds like my hair. I'm so excited to see someone with a close hair type and waist length! Gives me hope that I will make it to WL with these fine strands! But I would consider your hair 4b.
Mische
Well-Known Member
So, it starts by not washing your hair... j/k but not really.Can you post your Reggie with products please?
I'm trying to wash 1x a month right now, and would love to get that down to every 3 weeks. I'll try to keep this relatively short!1) Finger detangle on dry hair pre-wash: this usually is split into a few days during Netflix binges, etc. I'll twist or braid sections after I've removed knots/shed hairs to keep them stretched -- otherwise it would be tangled again the very next day. I use Mane & Tail detangler and swear by this stuff. It's truly magic. I let my hair get pretty matted sometimes because I know this will get them out. Which is kind of not a good habit so don't do that. I will add some APB oil for additional slip sometimes.
2) Chelating/clarifying shampoo with Redken cleaning creme while hair is in twists or braids. The last two washes I've done twists with croc clips on the ends because the buildup is easier to get out. This step is usually followed by Komaza protein treatment but a couple months ago I realized I was probably giving myself protein overload by doing this step every time I washed. So, I have skipped this protein step my last two washes and will rotate it back in again soon.
3) Deep condition with either SSI Curl Moist, SSI Moisture Riche, or APB Ultra Conditioning Souffle. Sometimes I'll layer one with the other because why not? All have great slip and provide amazing moisture. I'll let it sit anywhere from 1-3 hours without heat. Before rinsing I finger detangle to get some shed hairs out. I unravel the twists to rinse in the shower then twist the sections back up.
4) Apply leave-ins: SSI Coco Creme and seal with APB oil. The last month and a half I have also been using my new APB boos the Moisturizing Hair Creme and Whipped Cupuacu Butta religiously on wet and dry hair. @Miss Kane has turned my hair out with this combo and now I have to buy my weight in it. I tend to moisturize and seal daily or every other day. This is mostly because I don't wash regularly. If I washed weekly, I'm sure I wouldn't need to. But my difficulty with my wet hair keeps me from weekly washing.
5) At this point I finger detangle some more, say a prayer to the Hair Gods, and let it air dry. It looks terrible and I have to finger detangle on clean, dry hair to get the rest of the hair out. This step is a straight struggle right now. I recently bought the hourglass rollers (@AgeinATL bomb results forced my hand last month. I didn't consider that I never comb my wet hair when making this purchase, so when they collect dust Ima just blame her beautiful pictures). Also considering some version of @charmtreese twist regimen. So, as you can see, this regimen isn't much of one. But to be honest, I really do attribute my length retention to not doing too much and using my fingers. But I'd love to nail down a more effective "final step" in my wash day.
@Saludable84 the hair love is mutual.
Bout to pass all of us in hair length/thickness!@MizzBFly Please share more about using a steamer to help with your detangling!
MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
So, it starts by not washing your hair... j/k but not really.
1) Finger detangle on dry hair pre-wash: this usually is split into a few days during Netflix binges, etc. I'll twist or braid sections after I've removed knots/shed hairs to keep them stretched -- otherwise it would be tangled again the very next day. I use Mane & Tail detangler and swear by this stuff. It's truly magic. I let my hair get pretty matted sometimes because I know this will get them out. Which is kind of not a good habit so don't do that. I will add some APB oil for additional slip sometimes.
2) Chelating/clarifying shampoo with Redken cleaning creme while hair is in twists or braids. The last two washes I've done twists with croc clips on the ends because the buildup is easier to get out. This step is usually followed by Komaza protein treatment but a couple months ago I realized I was probably giving myself protein overload by doing this step every time I washed. So, I have skipped this protein step my last two washes and will rotate it back in again soon.
3) Deep condition with either SSI Curl Moist, SSI Moisture Riche, or APB Ultra Conditioning Souffle. Sometimes I'll layer one with the other because why not? All have great slip and provide amazing moisture. I'll let it sit anywhere from 1-3 hours without heat. Before rinsing I finger detangle to get some shed hairs out. I unravel the twists to rinse in the shower then twist the sections back up.
4) Apply leave-ins: SSI Coco Creme and seal with APB oil. The last month and a half I have also been using my new APB boos the Moisturizing Hair Creme and Whipped Cupuacu Butta religiously on wet and dry hair. @Miss Kane has turned my hair out with this combo and now I have to buy my weight in it. I tend to moisturize and seal daily or every other day. This is mostly because I don't wash regularly. If I washed weekly, I'm sure I wouldn't need to. But my difficulty with my wet hair keeps me from weekly washing.
5) At this point I finger detangle some more, say a prayer to the Hair Gods, and let it air dry. It looks terrible and I have to finger detangle on clean, dry hair to get the rest of the hair out. This step is a straight struggle right now. I recently bought the hourglass rollers (@AgeinATL bomb results forced my hand last month. I didn't consider that I never comb my wet hair when making this purchase, so when they collect dust Ima just blame her beautiful pictures). Also considering some version of @charmtreese twist regimen. So, as you can see, this regimen isn't much of one. But to be honest, I really do attribute my length retention to not doing too much and using my fingers. But I'd love to nail down a more effective "final step" in my wash day.
@Saludable84 the hair love is mutual.
@MizzBFly Please share more about using a steamer to help with your detangling!
Just like you Mane & Tail is truth on wash day OMG but I don't like to use it during the week and I've run out of M&T multiple times. The steamer simply melts the tangles. It's the QRedew & like you on wash day detangling took one hour-hour 1/2. Now it's 30 -45min.
AgeinATL
Well-Known Member
@Mische
Oh no!!! You know what, since you already have them, try them on finger detangled hair and see what type of stretch it gives. It wouldn't hurt!! If not, girl put them on the exchange board. Somebody will buy them, trust.
I want to reiterate what I said before about your hair. It is so lush and I love your texture. Just a beautiful head of hair!
Oh no!!! You know what, since you already have them, try them on finger detangled hair and see what type of stretch it gives. It wouldn't hurt!! If not, girl put them on the exchange board. Somebody will buy them, trust.
I want to reiterate what I said before about your hair. It is so lush and I love your texture. Just a beautiful head of hair!
SAPNK
Well-Known Member
Am I doing something wrong? Not moisturizing enough? I thought 4c hair didn't have a (clearly visible) curl pattern, lol. I don't know if we should be telling ladies they can achieve things they just can't. People telling me that 4c hair can do anything with the right products and techniques, or that I might not have 4c hair, but I think I do because I'm doing something wrong had me chasing a dream I could never obtain. Standing in front of the mirror with wet hair, comparing it to people who have some form of curlage when I know I don't and never will have without manipulation, just wasn't working for me. I even plopped a whole tub of ecostyler on my head to see if I could do a wash-n-go. When my hair didn't look the way I hoped, and felt disgusting, that was the last straw for me. I had to stop.
Anyway, I'm seeing so much diversity in everyone's pictures. Our hair is beautiful and unique. I guess it's true that no two heads are exactly the same, regardless of type.
Anyway, I'm seeing so much diversity in everyone's pictures. Our hair is beautiful and unique. I guess it's true that no two heads are exactly the same, regardless of type.
Napp
Ms. Nobody
I feel at this point we are trying to make things harder for ourselves by trying to fit the boxes made by someone else.
I also think the system is more of a guideline kind of thing. Many people think a hair type has only one curl size. if your hair is not it then it's a whole different type. There are ranges to it. Now some people say if your hair has even a little curl clumpy it's not 4abc.
Also I've been here for quite some time but I seem to have missed the introduction of 4c. I remember a regular sentiment is "if you're 4ab then I must 4z”
Now 4c seems to be a catch all now and people are getting confused.
I also think the system is more of a guideline kind of thing. Many people think a hair type has only one curl size. if your hair is not it then it's a whole different type. There are ranges to it. Now some people say if your hair has even a little curl clumpy it's not 4abc.
Also I've been here for quite some time but I seem to have missed the introduction of 4c. I remember a regular sentiment is "if you're 4ab then I must 4z”
Now 4c seems to be a catch all now and people are getting confused.
MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
It's worth it! I always recommend it as the best detangler w/o a sticky residueY'all made me run out and buy Mane and Tail detangler.
MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
@ the bolded....
Of course I can't speak to your complete experience but your explanation is some indication. If your hair is textured something comes through when shingled or smoothed through right? At your post above it didn't come out to your expectation but something came through
I'm sorry sis your experience hasn't been how you expected thus far but I have some thoughts:-Cheleating Shampoo to remove hard water/ minerals deposits
-Clarifying to remove buildup
-lots of your favorite moisturizer before applying your gel to achieve a wash n go.
-different gel if ECO doesn't fit the bill
-trying a different wng techniques (I tried 2 different methods b4 I found what works for me)
beingofserenity
Well-Known Member
I hate wash n gos on my hair. Crunchy, gunky, tiny coils 
SAPNK
Well-Known Member
@ the bolded....
Of course I can't speak to your complete experience but your explanation is some indication. If your hair is textured something comes through when shingled or smoothed through right? At your post above it didn't come out to your expectation but something came through
-Cheleating Shampoo to remove hard water/ minerals deposits
-Clarifying to remove buildup
-lots of your favorite moisturizer before applying your gel to achieve a wash n go.
-different gel if ECO doesn't fit the bill
-trying a different wng techniques (I tried 2 different methods b4 I found what works for me)
Thanks for the tips sis! I'll try everything you suggested, but I do think my hair is what it's meant to be. I don't want to have a lot of products on my hair making it feel gross just to have some curls, but I'll try it just for fun. You sound like you did a lot of trial and error, so I should probably listen to you
.
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MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
Great! Not cheleating and clarifying at the same time tho...just stating that to be sure- I know having those issues interferes with how ones hair would respond to different products. I haven't done a wash n go in a whole year come July but when I do it lasts all week 7 days and it soft- no worry. I consider it a low manipulation style because of that.Thanks for the tips sis! I'll try everything you suggested, but I do think my hair is what it's meant to be. I don't want to have a lot of products on my hair making it feel gross just to have some curls, but I'll try it just for fun. You sound like you did a lot of trial and error, so I should probably listen to you
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SAPNK
Well-Known Member
Okay, I'll make a note! I haven't bought products in a while so this should be fun!
Saludable84
Better Late Than Ugly
@AbsyBlvd
My coils in the front are very loose. These coils barely coil. They retain the S wave.
My coils in my crown are traditional 4A. They have the rounder coils. The make regular sized O after they decide they don't want to be S anymore.
My coils in the back are tighter. They are smaller coils, but not by that much. Like an o instead of an O when they are tired of being S then s.
I'll try to pull some quadrants tomorrow.
My coils in the front are very loose. These coils barely coil. They retain the S wave.
My coils in my crown are traditional 4A. They have the rounder coils. The make regular sized O after they decide they don't want to be S anymore.
My coils in the back are tighter. They are smaller coils, but not by that much. Like an o instead of an O when they are tired of being S then s.
I'll try to pull some quadrants tomorrow.
sharifeh
Well-Known Member
Wow this topic confuses me so much - fascinating discussion though. This is why I say I'm type 4 and I leave it at that. I get so confused when trying to assign a letter.
You know I will say that I used to think my sister was type 3 and I was type 4. But I think we're both type 4- the same type but hers is silky and mine is cottony?? I think that's the real difference in our hair. And she has the crazy Chili from TLC baby hairs. But other than that our coils or whatever are the same size. Hers just looks so different- so shiny so silky! My hair is not like that.
You know I will say that I used to think my sister was type 3 and I was type 4. But I think we're both type 4- the same type but hers is silky and mine is cottony?? I think that's the real difference in our hair. And she has the crazy Chili from TLC baby hairs. But other than that our coils or whatever are the same size. Hers just looks so different- so shiny so silky! My hair is not like that.
Alma Petra
Well-Known Member
Wet hair & lots & lots of Thick moisturizer like Eden body works coconut defining creme or Cantu coconut Curling creme with lots of Wetline Gel or ECO styler clear only. All the other versions of ECO gives "me" flakes but everyone is different. There is white residue remaining until it dries tho. (Journey to Waist Length technique worked for me) My roots & like 2inches down doesn't stayed defined...Im still trying to figure that out
Thank you so much for your informative reply.
I am wondering if the thick curling cremes have any additional benefit in your case over gel used on top of regular leave-in conditioner, and whether they play well and don't cause any flaking with Wetline gel since it's my go-to gel for my WnGs. If they add any benefit I will consider getting one of those to experiment with.
Also what is the Journey to Waist Length technique?
And I want to say that I found your comment about your roots not getting defined (bolded above) to be very encouraging because I don't think that I have ever let my natural roots grow to as long as 2 inches before giving up on them and relaxing/texlaxing again. So maybe if I allow my hair to grow longer I'll see more definition coming through, who knows! I'm very excited now after having read this. I'm seriously thinking of transitioning and having a closer look at how my natural hair would behave. Very insightful. Thank you very much
MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
Thank you so much for your informative reply.
I am wondering if the thick curling cremes have any additional benefit in your case over gel used on top of regular leave-in conditioner, and whether they play well and don't cause any flaking with Wetline gel since it's my go-to gel for my WnGs. If they add any benefit I will consider getting one of those to experiment with.
Also what is the Journey to Waist Length technique?
And I want to say that I found your comment about your roots not getting defined (bolded above) to be very encouraging because I don't think that I have ever let my natural roots grow to as long as 2 inches before giving up on them and relaxing/texlaxing again. So maybe if I allow my hair to grow longer I'll see more definition coming through, who knows! I'm very excited now after having read this. I'm seriously thinking of transitioning and having a closer look at how my natural hair would behave. Very insightful. Thank you very much
No problem
...lolYou're right they're additional benefits to the layering of moisturizer under gel= soft curls, bouncy wash n go, touchable hair and no breakage to name a few. To test if your products play well with wetline or and other gel Or Any combination; mix it together in your palm first.
-Journey to Waistlength is a YouTube blogger who is a self proclaimed 4a/b and & I agree, compared to mine.
SAPNK
Well-Known Member
Thank you so much for your informative reply.
I am wondering if the thick curling cremes have any additional benefit in your case over gel used on top of regular leave-in conditioner, and whether they play well and don't cause any flaking with Wetline gel since it's my go-to gel for my WnGs. If they add any benefit I will consider getting one of those to experiment with.
Also what is the Journey to Waist Length technique?
And I want to say that I found your comment about your roots not getting defined (bolded above) to be very encouraging because I don't think that I have ever let my natural roots grow to as long as 2 inches before giving up on them and relaxing/texlaxing again. So maybe if I allow my hair to grow longer I'll see more definition coming through, who knows! I'm very excited now after having read this. I'm seriously thinking of transitioning and having a closer look at how my natural hair would behave. Very insightful. Thank you very much
Hello Alma,
I'm just curious, are you considering going natural because there is hope that you might have some curl definition? I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but if so, why? Is it the look, the manageability, easier to grow?
MizzBFly
Well-Known Member
Is there a modified MHM regimen with product suggestions ? I didn't keep up in MHM thread & now it's to large. The roots and like 2in down is more frizz less definition in my wash n goAccording to this thread, I'm 4 a/c. Which sounds kinda right to me, oddly. Odd cuz I was just considering the possibility that I'm 4 a/b, but it didn't seem right to me bc my clumping is like whoa.
@AbsyBlvd Still twins, I see.
(As an aside, I notice that mhm brings the clumping from about halfway up the stand all the way to the root in the 4c area and tightens my 3c/ silky 4a? nape to 'regular', more cottony 4a, leaving me with amazing coils all over.Sadly, as is so often the case with hair
, it nonetheless manages to defy any attempt to be great because the 4c is in the crown. Wngs be looking craaaazy.
)
DarkJoy
Bent. Not Broken.
yea. mine is like that with a wng. the curls are too tiny and strands too fine. I was loosing ends trying to do a limp wng.
No more wng for me.
Honey Bee
Well-Known Member
There have been all kinds of modifications made to the original regimen. Because I already had a decent amount of definition, I never strictly followed product recs.
Is there a modified MHM regimen with product suggestions ? I didn't keep up in MHM thread & now it's to large. The roots and like 2in down is more frizz less definition in my wash n go
But I always follow the steps. 
1-2-3. Cleanse- condition- clay. Dassit.
I'm trying my best to use up my enormous stash, so I use whatever I have around. If I wanna shampoo, I use it as step 1. If I need a protein treatment, I use it as a pre poo, right before step 1. I refuse to over complicate my natural hair life. When it comes to time, as in how much time this whole process takes, again, I try to keep it simple. My clay is already made, in the fridge in one of those huge Dawn bottles. The more you stay consistent, the less time you're required to keep all the stuff on your head, so I can basically run through the whole thing in the shower (1- spray diluted acv before entering, rinse upon entry, 2- apply conditioner, let sit for length of shower, 3- clay rinse right before I get out). The longest thing on my head is conditioner, but it don't even matter cuz you wash it so often, your hair is always in or just coming out of some water.
It's as time consuming/ complex as you make it.
Autumn~Tint~Of~Gold
Rocking the Casbah
I know what you mean. I'm a 3b with some 3c mixed in ( in back where my hair is a lot curlier and seems more resilient too) but when most people imagine 3b they picture smooth hair and while mine isn't "textured" it's extremely frizzy, flyaway and poofy and I have seen tighter textures with less poof factor and frizz.
I think this girl is a 3b but her hair seems so much smoother than mine as if it's heavier and her cuticle is more compact.
So curl size doesn't mean all that much as far as determining how the hair will behave even shrinkage wise. There's a lot more to it than that.'
Excuse me for bringing 3's into this thread
but I think my post was kind of relevant to the discussion.
GGsKin
Well-Known Member
Is there a modified MHM regimen with product suggestions ? I didn't keep up in MHM thread & now it's to large. The roots and like 2in down is more frizz less definition in my wash n go
I do modified versions but I tend to keep certain steps in the same order; cleanse, condition, clay, gel. In the summer, I focus less on DCs, and I'll water rinse and/or clay more often.
While I'm using NW21 spray, I've been shampooing my roots more often due to build-up, so I am less strict with my ingredients but strict with my method/ technique. I do try to keep my conditioners regimen-friendly but I also use protein conditioners where necessary.
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