Could THIS Be the Reason Oprah Relaxed?
- Thread starter westNDNbeauty
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Cherokee-n-Black
Well-Known Member
I have to be honest, I see why stylist do this, and if they have a client who comes in every week asking for them to give them straight hair, I can definitely see why'd they just suggest just getting a relaxer. Why subject your hair to all that heat and manipulation week after week after week?
If someone wants the option of wearing their natural hair texture most of the time and only straightens every once in a blue moon, that's different, and stylists should be able to respect that. But then again, those aren't the large majority of clients coming into their chairs.
I don't know about anyone else, but when I relaxed my hair, it was a manageability issue. I don't think I've ever spent more than a couple of minutes detangling my relaxed hair--at any length. Transitioning/natural hair? A different story. It's not just the stylists who find relaxed hair easier to deal with. I'm transitioning because I want to wear my natural texture--whatever that entails. If I knew I wanted straight hair every time I styled my hair? Bring back the creamy crack. [don't hit me!]
Napp
Ms. Nobody
here is my interpretation
Kinky hair has limited styling options
as a celebrity stylist i am assuming that long flowing styles and sleek updos are the main hair styles. frankly kinky type 4 hair cannot mimic these styles quickly especially without more time and possibly heat. sure there are a variety of styles that once can wear as a natural but they are not easy to achieve in the fast and furious world of show biz unless your hair is short. REAL TALK.and like someone said earlier natural hair has a tendency to be unpredicatable at times and for many that is not comprehended and can add to the viewpoint to being "limited in styling options"
That's the only texture I suggest altering with professional relaxing."
meaning that types 1-3 can be managed to look like the "styling options" he has in mind with some type of product or technique that is standard to the business but type 4 cannot use the same techniques so he suggests altering it in order to conform to the techniques.it makes it easier for the stylist and possibly the model as well.(wont have to worry about having a specialist to get your hair done on different sets or even having to do it yourself )
all you have to do is step into this persons shoes to see what they are saying and why. not everyone is in a tra la la gumdrop world where natural hair is just SO easy and versatile
just look at some of yall regimens. when a stylist only has 30 mins to curtain to make a models hair look good they are not gonna have time just to spend and hour prepooing in a jojoba/castor oil mix just to detangle them nappsCherokee-n-Black
Well-Known Member
here is my interpretation
Kinky hair has limited styling options
ave to do is step into this persons shoes to see what they are saying and why. not everyone is in a tra la la gumdrop world where natural hair is just SO easy and versatile
oh no u didn't!!!! I mean...not saying you're wrong...just sayin'!The TRUTH is also that most black women who are going natural right now did not want to deal with their hair in it's natural state up until, like, 2 minutes ago...and many are still wearing straight weaves because it's "easier" and they still get to claim their natural hair underneath the straight weaves and wigs.
Right. The vast majority of folks who relax have kinky hair. That's all he's saying. It's very strange that in one breath, people say that kinky hair is versatile and then in the next breath, they are anti-straightening, etc. weird.
CrueltyFree
Well-Known Member
aquajoyice
Well-Known Member
Andre's lost all his credibility withe me on that one. A stylist should know how to manage all hair types.
RocStar
Well-Known Member
I don't think Oprah does anything she doesn't want to. You really think one of the most powerful women in the US relaxed because her stylist convinced her to? I mean we are talking about Oprah. I think earlier in her career she did things because people suggested it or told her it was best, but at this stage in her life, she does what the heck she wants to. Like another poster said, let's give Oprah some credit.
ETA: I do not agree with Andre.
ETA: I do not agree with Andre.
Embyra
Well-Known Member
just look at some of yall regimens. when a stylist only has 30 mins to curtain to make a models hair look good they are not gonna have time just to spend and hour prepooing in a jojoba/castor oil mix just to detangle them napps
mzteaze
Pilates and Yoga Kinda Gal
I agree.
I thought about it and one other thing occurred to me. Natural 'kinky' hair is STILL not the norm for many entertainers and celebrities esp on the same level in terms of recognition with Oprah. Those who ARE natural tend to wear straight wigs and weaves as part of their public persona. So as a 'celebrity' stylist, while it not be the most PC thing to say, he sort of has a point from that perspective.
I love my natural hair but considering the amount of hellacious heat treatment needed to keep it straight (and not revert midway), maybe I wouldn't choose to keep it natural. Or stick to a wig/weave for work and cover my natural. Just like many other stars.
I get what he was saying. If your hair texture is something like Florida Evans how many 30 minute styling options do you have? Florida didn't change it up in the whole run of Good Times.
I believe that Oprah does Oprah when it comes to her hair. She's done everything under the sun when it comes to her hair from short naturals, short relaxed to thick, long natural hair under long flowing weaves.
I believe that Oprah does Oprah when it comes to her hair. She's done everything under the sun when it comes to her hair from short naturals, short relaxed to thick, long natural hair under long flowing weaves.
halee_J
Don't worry be happy
I had to thank you again. I don't see why I should use a hair typing system developed by someone who clearly dislikes highly textured hair.
Napp
Ms. Nobody
I get what he was saying. If your hair texture is something like Florida Evans how many 30 minute styling options do you have? Florida didn't change it up in the whole run of Good Times.
DDTexlaxed
TRANSITION OVER! 11-22-14
I can see what he means when he says natural hair is limited. Some natural styles take a long time to do, like straitening. If you prefer it 24/7, it will revert with humidity. Maybe he meant natural hair was limited on Oprah because I've never seen her in twists or other textured styles.
Not all BW who are natural is like LHCF. You even excel with knowledge the pros don't even have.
Not all BW who are natural is like LHCF. You even excel with knowledge the pros don't even have.
nzeee
Well-Known Member
uhm... i'm assuming Mr. Walker knew he was being interviewed for a magazine targetted to the general public; not other stylists, not hair models, not A-D level celebs.
those who are defending his statements and referencing context are missing the fact that he knows he's speaking to non-celebs who aren't "required" to straighten their hair daily for their next public appearance.
it's clear that his opinion falls in-line w/ that of the general public (black public at least): Type 4 hair (not all natural hair, only type 4 is considered in the kinky category) is best worn straight and the best way to straighten it is a relaxer.
giving someone the benefit of a doubt is one thing, but no one is twisting this man's words, he came out and talked foolishness all on his own. it's a MASSIVE deal and not just an opinion because:
- it's published in a magazine with broad readership
- it's available on the internet so many people not reading the magazine are seeing this limited thinking
- he is an Expert and everything he says has a lot more weight
Can't we hold our experts accountable? The negative weight of this article for Type 4's (yes i get the irony here) thinking of transitioning but unaware of how to care for natural hair and ignorant of hair boards / YT natural gurus is potentially massive. It also obviously contributes to kinky hair hatred which is a very real thing.
I'm absolutely unsurprised but no less sad that a strong statement like this was made in such a public way.
erplexed
those who are defending his statements and referencing context are missing the fact that he knows he's speaking to non-celebs who aren't "required" to straighten their hair daily for their next public appearance.
it's clear that his opinion falls in-line w/ that of the general public (black public at least): Type 4 hair (not all natural hair, only type 4 is considered in the kinky category) is best worn straight and the best way to straighten it is a relaxer.
giving someone the benefit of a doubt is one thing, but no one is twisting this man's words, he came out and talked foolishness all on his own. it's a MASSIVE deal and not just an opinion because:
- it's published in a magazine with broad readership
- it's available on the internet so many people not reading the magazine are seeing this limited thinking
- he is an Expert and everything he says has a lot more weight
Can't we hold our experts accountable? The negative weight of this article for Type 4's (yes i get the irony here) thinking of transitioning but unaware of how to care for natural hair and ignorant of hair boards / YT natural gurus is potentially massive. It also obviously contributes to kinky hair hatred which is a very real thing.
I'm absolutely unsurprised but no less sad that a strong statement like this was made in such a public way.
erplexed
Last edited:
Rei
New Member
uhm... i'm assuming Mr. Walker knew he was being interviewed for a magazine targetted to the general public; not other stylists, not hair models, not A-D level celebs.
those who are defending his statements and referencing context are missing the fact that he knows he's speaking to non-celebs who aren't "required" to straighten their hair daily for their next public appearance.
it's clear that his opinion falls in-line w/ that of the general public (black public at least): Type 4 hair (not all natural hair, only type 4 is considered in the kinky category) is best worn straight and the best way to straighten it is a relaxer.
giving someone the benefit of a doubt is one thing, but no one is twisting this man's words, he came out and talked foolishness all on his own. it's a MASSIVE deal and not just an opinion because:
- it's published in a magazine with broad readership
- it's available on the internet so many people not reading the magazine are seeing this limited thinking
- he is an Expert and everything he says has a lot more weight
Can't we hold our experts accountable? The negative weight of this article for Type 4's (yes i get the irony here) thinking of transitioning but unaware of how to care for natural hair and ignorant of hair boards / YT natural gurus is potentially massive. It also obviously contributes to kinky hair hatred which is a very real thing.
I'm absolutely unsurprised but no less sad that a strong statement like this was made in such a public way.
agreed...wasn't this article filled with tips for joe blow? When he says things like this he means it for everyone, not just supermodels, otherwise he would've (or shoud've) clarified.
He can be pro relaxer but to reccomend it like its a 'fix' for people who were born with their own hair is kind of messed up. I don't see him walking around with one
"make peace with your hair...but only if you are type 1-3' should be his mottosoutherngirl1994
New Member
I think that embracing my natural texture has been a challenge for me. But i did it at the request of my head stylist who does relaxers all the time. She said I should use only natural products and my skin didnt react well to relaxers and to stop. She was the first and only one to tell me that.
aicramphoto
Member
http://andresays.andrewalkerhair.com/
He tried to explain his comments on his site. I see everyone's point of view, but I must say that I almost used the wrong products and advice when I tried to use his typing system. Plus, the pictures that people used as examples were often misleading. Other sites devoted to curly hair were often not originally considering women of color and their good-hearted efforts almost were disastrous (some have improved in the past 5 years) LCHF helped me much more tremendously.
He tried to explain his comments on his site. I see everyone's point of view, but I must say that I almost used the wrong products and advice when I tried to use his typing system. Plus, the pictures that people used as examples were often misleading. Other sites devoted to curly hair were often not originally considering women of color and their good-hearted efforts almost were disastrous (some have improved in the past 5 years) LCHF helped me much more tremendously.
Giselle685
New Member
I think Oprah flat irons... she said she had a bad relaxer once and it turned her against the chemical. She said this when Chris (comedian) came on her show promoting his movie "Good Hair"
westNDNbeauty
Well-Known Member
She used to flat iron but she now relaxes. She was definitely using a Dr. Miracles relaxer on the Behind the Scenes show where they were taping the Oscar interviews.
mzteaze
Pilates and Yoga Kinda Gal
Thanks for posting this link as it does clarify his thoughts. I understand where he was going with it (more clearly now)...and I am still not offended personally by what he said.
koolkittychick
Well-Known Member
uhm... i'm assuming Mr. Walker knew he was being interviewed for a magazine targetted to the general public; not other stylists, not hair models, not A-D level celebs.
those who are defending his statements and referencing context are missing the fact that he knows he's speaking to non-celebs who aren't "required" to straighten their hair daily for their next public appearance.
it's clear that his opinion falls in-line w/ that of the general public (black public at least): Type 4 hair (not all natural hair, only type 4 is considered in the kinky category) is best worn straight and the best way to straighten it is a relaxer.
giving someone the benefit of a doubt is one thing, but no one is twisting this man's words, he came out and talked foolishness all on his own. it's a MASSIVE deal and not just an opinion because:
- it's published in a magazine with broad readership
- it's available on the internet so many people not reading the magazine are seeing this limited thinking
- he is an Expert and everything he says has a lot more weight
Can't we hold our experts accountable? The negative weight of this article for Type 4's (yes i get the irony here) thinking of transitioning but unaware of how to care for natural hair and ignorant of hair boards / YT natural gurus is potentially massive. It also obviously contributes to kinky hair hatred which is a very real thing.
I'm absolutely unsurprised but no less sad that a strong statement like this was made in such a public way.
You can hold your experts accountable, but that still doesn't change the assertions that are made by that expert. Natural type 4 hair, by it's very characteristics, requires a significant investment in time and skill from the person caring for the hair in order to bring out its natural beauty and versatility, and quite frankly, the general public tends to not be too interested in the process.
We all know the rules to having healthy natural hair here (you can't wear it straight all the time, you can't necessarily wear it out all the time, if you want to show its curl pattern and/length you must do braid or twist outs, stretching, etc.), and well, if you look at it objectively, they can be limiting to someone who wants a quick, easy style that doesn't involve a TWA.
Just to play devil's advocate, would anyone have had a major problem if he had said something like, "Type 1 hair has limited styling options and is the only type I recommend to get a curly perm," because technically that is true in terms of wavy/curly styles, which really make up the majority of desirable styles out there.
While I love my natural hair (it's the only time I can safely play with color!) and wore it for many years, the fact is straighter, longer-looking hair is better suited to my fuller face now. Thus, relaxer is the best and healthier option for me, as opposed to frying my hair off with a blowdryer and flat iron every other day because I work out.
One of the nice things we have as women of color is the ability to utilize all the resources at our disposal (natural and otherwise) to exercise the options we choose to express ourselves through our hair. I don't see why we should get ourselves in a tizzy because someone states a reality about our hair without adding a bunch of mollifiers about how beautiful type 4 hair is--we already know.
Janet'
Well-Known Member
...At the end of the day, Mr. Walker is a man who calls himself an expert and some big names agree--but he is just a man, prone to imperfection...
I try to take everything in stride and with a grain of salt...I hope that if Oprah relaxed, she did of her own volition and not under the influence of someone else...
I try to take everything in stride and with a grain of salt...I hope that if Oprah relaxed, she did of her own volition and not under the influence of someone else...
nzeee
Well-Known Member
One of the nice things we have as women of color is the ability to utilize all the resources at our disposal (natural and otherwise) to exercise the options we choose to express ourselves through our hair. I don't see why we should get ourselves in a tizzy because someone states a reality about our hair without adding a bunch of mollifiers about how beautiful type 4 hair is--we already know.
I don't think anyone is getting 'in a tizzy' or responding in an overly sensitive way. It really bothers me when 'negative' or contrary opinions are called out like this since it tends to minimize valid opinions as overly emotional.
anyhoo, if what was quoted here is any kind of direct quote the gist of the matter is that in a widely read publication AW said: 4a/b hair is less versatile and should be relaxed.
sorry, this is not true and propagates a damaging myth. his additional explanations to clarify his intensions aside (because who really is going to see that compared to the many who will read the article), i would think someone in his position would be able to better express themselves without 'mollifying' or pandering. it's called effective communication and it sorta goes w/ the expert title. i don't judge a corner stylist who doesn't know anything besides what her school taught her the same way i judge this man who's written books on the subject of hair.
if anyone disagrees w/ those of us concerned by his remark that's fine of course, but don't tell us it's because we don't understand what he really meant or that we're taking it out of context. tell us you agree most women w/ 4a/b hair should just relax (teehee, punny).
mzteaze
Pilates and Yoga Kinda Gal
Just as a point of reference, here is the DIRECT quote:
"I always recommend embracing your natural texture. Kinky hair can have limited styling options; that’s the only hair type that I suggest altering with professional relaxing" - Andre Walker
But also, this is the WHY behind the comment (again directly from Andre Walker):
The quote comes from: http://andresays.andrewalkerhair.com/
In the scheme of things, isn't what he is saying EXACTLY what many type 4's here on LHCF find on their HHJ? How many threads have we read where the person finds out that they have to use protective styling (limited options) darn near 24/7 in order to get growth? Or, if they aren't happy with those options, texturize (aka use a mild relaxer with oils) their hair to allow them more styling options outside of relaxing?
His thoughts don't read like a gigantic conspiracy to force all type 4s (or black women) to relax their hair. It seems like a fairly honest assessment of the conclusions that many women on LHCF have learned on their own.
NIN4eva
Well-Known Member
That's a good point. Also, Oprah's not doing her own hair is she?
I know I wouldn't be if I had Oprah pockets...
