Keratin Treatment Support Thread

[Muse]

After lurking for weeks I'm compelled to post. Forgive the lack of pictures- I'll post them later this week.

I did my first BKT 3 weeks ago using dream hair (I was 4 weeks post relaxer, my hair is 4a/b, fine, dry, cottony). I was like the poster child for BKT! Soft, silky, shiny hair with swang! I couldn't believe it. The one thing I didn't like was the cooked-hair smell. When I washed my hair the first time it was soft and not frizzy (air dried), like a fresh relaxer but with roots. While I was not losing tons of hair like I always do when I have new growth I noticed some broken pieces of hair on the sink. Nothing major,but it concerned me because it was not my normal pattern. I suspected I had damaged some of my ends because I even though I was careful to cover all my strands I actually used very little product (in my opinion). But since I wasn't seeing my usual handful of broken long hairs I was so encouraged that I decided to order some global 4% to try and tame the roots (using the babyliss root iron). I did my 2nd bkt yesterday. The results were not fantastic. Actually, it was kind of awful.
I followed the directions, did it as before but I somehow used more product and my hair felt more coated. I was disappointed when I started flat ironing and my hair didn't react as before: I didn't fall as nicely, it smelled burnt, and it WASN'T SHINY! Long story short. I ended up with a dull, slightly stiff, head of fragile hair. I've got lots of short (1/2 inch broken pieces) along with longer (3-5 inches) ones. I was so upset I washed and conditionded (with coppola keratin condish) my hair today, followed by Aphogee green tea/keratin spray. It looks and feels better, but not BKT'd.

So this is why I'm posting: It seems like the common link among the people not so thrilled with BKT is RELAXED HAIR. Frankly, even after my mostly positive Dream Hair experience I was slightly underwhelmed. I just kept thinking: "what's the point?" my hair is already straight and the roots are still crunchy. In fact, I got very positive results a few weeks before my first BKT just using Aphogee protein treatment followed by green tea spray and curling iron (with and iron that now seems COLD compared to the heat from the babyliss titanium nano I used for the BKT). It was a lot cheaper, less labor intensive, less traumatic and DID NOT DAMAGE MY HAIR!
Don't get me wrong-I still think BKT has potential for me, but I'll wait until I have a lot more new growth. This post has inspired me to attempt to go natural ( I'm really bored with relaxing) and I had hoped that BKT would be the best option to ease the transition...But, maybe not.

Thank you for posting this, it's people like you who I like to ask questions and find out what went wrong. I keep hearing that technically this treatment is made for relaxed hair but maybe it depends on the condition of the relaxed hair in the first place. Would you consider your relaxed hair in pretty good shape before the BKT? You said you noticed a cooked hair smell. For the first time ever I DIDN'T notice that on my head after doing BKT. Any other time I flat iron on lower temps and I get the cooked smell and my hair breaks. I think if you hair smells that is a sign that the heat is too high and it's not really being protected. Do you think you distributed the treatment evenly and what temp did you have the iron on?

This is a learning process for many of us and unfortunately for some there may be some damaging mistakes done until we get it down but if you are going to try it again at some point I'd stick with Dreamhair since it worked pretty well for you.

BTW-I haven't tried it yet but from what I hear less is more with Global. You can get away with using more Dreamhair without the stiff feeling but Global is not as forgiving in that area. I am going to try Global 4% next and if I don't like it I'm going back to Dreamhair and staying put.

 

[ChristmasCarol]

Guys, what is so different about us?

I was reading through that BKT Pros and Cons thread and some ladies are having real trouble. I mean exploding strands and all kinds of stuff Mystic said her hair is thinning from just two treatments and is near ruined. So what's different about us? What's the common factor in those who's hair thrives on BKT and those who's hair crumbles?

I don't know if my hair was heat sensitive or not; I'd only straightened my healthy hair once before BKT. I know my hair looked a hot mess when I had a relaxer but that was 15 years ago and I didn't know a thing about hair. My strands are extremely fine... Like extreme. No one would ever accuse me of having strong or indestructable hair; it's always been fragile. And my Mom was shocked that it's grown as long as it has. You can see from my siggy that it's not all that long, yet, but she's amazed. Because the only time my hair ever grew past my shoulders was when I had a curl (as a youth).

So what is it?? My hair is fragile and fine and, as far as I know, it can't take heat all that well. Anyone's hair thriving on BKT that used to be protein sensitive? Are these other folks protein sensitive? Heat sensitive? Some strange combination of the two? Because, I'm telling you, it's killing me that my sisters are having so much trouble. And I feel so very sad, because I know many of them were inspired to try the treatment because of the success my own hair has experienced with BKT.

I'm serious, I went to search and destroy on my ends the other day and my hair and it's like my hair doesn't know what a split is, right now. I really want to know why. Am I just lucky? That can't be it...

Is it that some changed their reggies to incorporate more protein after the BKT? While others who'd thought their hair protein sensitive shied away and did moisture moisture moisture? Maybe BKT not only allows our hair to handle more protein... maybe our hair requires it after. I dunno... I'm open to thoughts and ideas from anyone who wants to try to figure this out with me. I'm so sad right now.

Awww sheba1, don't get down on yourself. It's impossible to know what other people's hair is really like, or how they are actually applying it. Some people might have an aversion to certain chemicals, too.

If it wasn't for you explaining everything, I doubt I would have ever BKT'd. And this stuff is "the truth". (OT, I still hate you Paul Pierce)

I also tried a S&D and found 1 split. All these posts about damage have me paranoid! Mind you, I flat-iron every 2 weeks, and yes, on a high temp (by LHCF standards). My hair happens to be the kind that doesn't mind heat. High heat never damaged my hair before, and it still doesn't. The only difference is that now I can swipe once, but before I had to make 2 or 3 passes to get it silky straight. Oh yeah, I don't "clamp" the iron down on the entire length, I leave a few inches of new growth alone.

Anywho, I love BKT and I love your helpful spirit, sheba. I gotta work on that, cuz I'm easily irritated.

 

[ChristmasCarol]

After lurking for weeks I'm compelled to post. Forgive the lack of pictures- I'll post them later this week.

I did my first BKT 3 weeks ago using dream hair (I was 4 weeks post relaxer, my hair is 4a/b, fine, dry, cottony). I was like the poster child for BKT! Soft, silky, shiny hair with swang! I couldn't believe it. The one thing I didn't like was the cooked-hair smell. When I washed my hair the first time it was soft and not frizzy (air dried), like a fresh relaxer but with roots. While I was not losing tons of hair like I always do when I have new growth I noticed some broken pieces of hair on the sink. Nothing major,but it concerned me because it was not my normal pattern. I suspected I had damaged some of my ends because I even though I was careful to cover all my strands I actually used very little product (in my opinion). But since I wasn't seeing my usual handful of broken long hairs I was so encouraged that I decided to order some global 4% to try and tame the roots (using the babyliss root iron). I did my 2nd bkt yesterday. The results were not fantastic. Actually, it was kind of awful.
I followed the directions, did it as before but I somehow used more product and my hair felt more coated. I was disappointed when I started flat ironing and my hair didn't react as before: I didn't fall as nicely, it smelled burnt, and it WASN'T SHINY! Long story short. I ended up with a dull, slightly stiff, head of fragile hair. I've got lots of short (1/2 inch broken pieces) along with longer (3-5 inches) ones. I was so upset I washed and conditionded (with coppola keratin condish) my hair today, followed by Aphogee green tea/keratin spray. It looks and feels better, but not BKT'd.

So this is why I'm posting: It seems like the common link among the people not so thrilled with BKT is RELAXED HAIR. Frankly, even after my mostly positive Dream Hair experience I was slightly underwhelmed. I just kept thinking: "what's the point?" my hair is already straight and the roots are still crunchy. In fact, I got very positive results a few weeks before my first BKT just using Aphogee protein treatment followed by green tea spray and curling iron (with and iron that now seems COLD compared to the heat from the babyliss titanium nano I used for the BKT). It was a lot cheaper, less labor intensive, less traumatic and DID NOT DAMAGE MY HAIR!
Don't get me wrong-I still think BKT has potential for me, but I'll wait until I have a lot more new growth. This post has inspired me to attempt to go natural ( I'm really bored with relaxing) and I had hoped that BKT would be the best option to ease the transition...But, maybe not.

Hmm, that's interesting. My hair had not been texlaxed for many months before my initial BKT, but the ends were processed, so with your theory, they could have suffered damage - but they haven't. Is your hair relaxed straight, or just texlaxed? Maybe the strength of the relaxer and the processing time of the relaxer could have something to do with whether or not BKT works well for an individual. As time passes, there will be many more members sharing their BKT experiences, and then maybe a conclusion will be reached.

In the meantime, I'll let this BKT wear off some more - but if I don't see anything suspicious, I'm certainly doing this treatment again.

 

[lovenharmony]

I was wondering this myself! It's because of this thread and Fabulosity's results with Dreamhair that I decided to BKT my hair and I did loads of research before even contemplating putting any of the formula on my strands. I studied BKT flat ironing techniques, discovered that you could use a lower temperature and get great results, preparing the hair for the treatment with protein treatments (in my case yogurt treatments)...the list goes on! And now I see all these negative threads popping up about how BKT ruined their hair? It got me feeling paranoid since all I've been hearing are the benefits of BKT. Of course I know there are always negatives to anything you use on your hair, but the simple fact is that BKT was made to STRENGTHEN the hair not to damage it! I'd have to agree that it must be other conditions that are making those individuals have such negative experiences. Maybe they used too much heat? Not enough product? Not enough passes with the flat iron to seal the keratin to their hair while continuing to flat iron on a regular basis? Not sticking to their original regimen after the treatment (except for the non sulfate products)? Having really damaged hair BEFORE using BKT? i mean keratin is the building blocks of hair itself! How can adding keratin to strengthen the hair be bad for you?

The only thing I could see negative about the process is the use of formaldehyde in some of the treatments. That in itself can cause traumatic effects to not only your hair, but your scalp (and body) as well so maybe they had an allergic reation to it and that's what is causing all their hair problems. Everyone knows that if you don't have a healthy scalp and/or body, your hair will not thrive no matter what you do.

 

[ChristmasCarol]

I'm sorry.. I done gave up on them wenches... Really I don't e-fight with people about the BKT anymore.. I don't go into random threads where we people are talking smack about it...because it'll be a whole bunch of e- and e-::hardslap:... and I can't take it. I know that my hair thrives and each one of the 5 other heads that I have done it on have as well. I DON'T KNOW NOBODY IRL that I have done it or who has gotten it and has had a bad experience...and lets remember my IRL friends are not LHCF alum who know moisture/protein balance "extraness"... but regular every two weeks going to the salon chicks who do NOTHING to their hair in between. So I just stay away and I have decided that I can't save everybody ... so when people start that yapping... I just go to my happy spot and play with my hair and buy some BKT or other hair products. And I'm just gangsta to say that they didn't follow the directions or left some crucial part out. So there.

All I know is my hair is L U X U R I O U S... and I think I get more comments now about the health and shine than I did when I was waist length if that goes to tell anyone anything.

My advice to you Super Sheba1 is to only give advice when asked for DIRECTLY and stop trying to educate these *ladies*... I swear some of them are on some straight drama and I don't have the patience for that... Half the time I wonder if they even tried BKT or if it was some knock off version of a liquid keratin treatment...

Fab, now tell us what you really think!

 

[chesmi]

Hi All,

I want to BKT but need some help for the prep. I've been perming my hair for 30 years. I guess I have (soft) somewhere around 3b'ish hair which I've been neglecting. I've read that I should start strengthening it with protein therapy, is this correct? I've recently purchased: Sabino Moisture Block 3 oz, Rusk Pro Element's Keratin Treatment; Keratin Conditioner, and Earthly Body Soaking Wet Sulfate-Free Shampoo. Is this a good start? Never been a DC kinda person (I have a short attention span) but will try and get some in.

I will probably be using the DreamHair product but someone mentioned that you should clarify you hair before. I only see it being sold with a poo that I assume is used *after* the process, or am I wrong?

Anybody erplexed? Do I have cooties or something

 

[lilikoi]

Anybody erplexed? Do I have cooties or something

The dream hair sample I got from ebay came with clarifying shampoo to use BEFORE the treatment. You need to get some sodium chloride-free poo to use after the treatment.

 

[chesmi]

The dream hair sample I got from ebay came with clarifying shampoo to use BEFORE the treatment. You need to get some sodium chloride-free poo to use after the treatment.

Thanks lilikoi. Do you suggest I pre-keratin condition/shampoo before I BKT?

 

[lilikoi]

I want to BKT but need some help for the prep. I've been perming my hair for 30 years. I guess I have (soft) somewhere around 3b'ish hair which I've been neglecting.

What do you mean by "perming"? Is that like a regular perm wave? Your hair looks pretty loose (and pretty!) in the pic-is that a a heat set?

Thanks lilikoi. Do you suggest I pre-keratin condition/shampoo before I BKT?

I don't know if the pre-keratin would be stripped with the clarifying shampoo (anyone?) so it probably wont hurt, but I don't know if it would be any help... I did it before BKT but just by coincidence. I'd definitely go with dream hair. I got better results and it was waaay less fume-y than Global.

 

[lilikoi]

Re: Keratin Treatment --My story

Hmm, that's interesting. My hair had not been texlaxed for many months before my initial BKT, but the ends were processed, so with your theory, they could have suffered damage - but they haven't. Is your hair relaxed straight, or just texlaxed? Maybe the strength of the relaxer and the processing time of the relaxer could have something to do with whether or not BKT works well for an individual. As time passes, there will be many more members sharing their BKT experiences, and then maybe a conclusion will be reached.

In the meantime, I'll let this BKT wear off some more - but if I don't see anything suspicious, I'm certainly doing this treatment again.

Thank you for posting this, it's people like you who I like to ask questions and find out what went wrong. I keep hearing that technically this treatment is made for relaxed hair but maybe it depends on the condition of the relaxed hair in the first place. Would you consider your relaxed hair in pretty good shape before the BKT? You said you noticed a cooked hair smell. For the first time ever I DIDN'T notice that on my head after doing BKT. Any other time I flat iron on lower temps and I get the cooked smell and my hair breaks. I think if you hair smells that is a sign that the heat is too high and it's not really being protected. Do you think you distributed the treatment evenly and what temp did you have the iron on?

This is a learning process for many of us and unfortunately for some there may be some damaging mistakes done until we get it down but if you are going to try it again at some point I'd stick with Dreamhair since it worked pretty well for you.

BTW-I haven't tried it yet but from what I hear less is more with Global. You can get away with using more Dreamhair without the stiff feeling but Global is not as forgiving in that area. I am going to try Global 4% next and if I don't like it I'm going back to Dreamhair and staying put.

Thanks for your interest. Here's my story:

My hair was in decent condition before BKT. It's relaxed bone-straight and had about 1/2 new growth. I've been alternating moisture and protein treatments because my hair got really damage last summer from the beach, pool, sun-exposure . It was really rough, with wiry ends (but no split ends) and got somewhat bleached (looked like I got highlights). I September I started researching and found Dr. Sayed's blog (he works for AVLON/Syntonics) which gave me the idea to do protein treatment right after rinsing the relaxer off because the cuticle is open. I did this with my last relaxer (some time in late Sept or early Oct--not sure) and it worked pretty well. It was then that I found out about BKT and started researching it. That led me back to this forum. I had joined back in May but never really participated. In early October, I paid for full membership privileges so I could look at all the cool pictures of all the beautiful hair (You guys are an inspiration!).

I've always had problems with breakage at the transition point when I have new growth so the broken hairs tend to be long. When I relax (I do it myself), I lose some more hair where I accidentally overlap the relaxer on previously relaxed hair (always so scary to see all that hair!) but then the breaking stops for about a month, when the new growth starts really showing, and the whole destructive cycle starts again. This has left me with permanent neck length hair for last many, many years.

So I had high hopes for BKT. The promise of no frizz (I usually air dry my hair, I occasionally use the curling iron, wear my hair back in a short pony), and more importantly, the promise of deep protein conditioning really appealed to me. Also, I liked the possibility of taming my roots with heat (hot comb or flar iron) without damaging the rest of the hair.

**************
DETAILS ON MY BKT PROCESS:

1-shampooed with clarifying shampo 2X (I had lots of product buildup)

2-air dried to ~90% for BKT#1 with Dream hair and used blower to get to 100% dry with Global.

3-Applied product, avoiding scalp.

With DH my hair seemed to suck up the product and felt damp but looked dryish. I used a fine tooth comb to make sure I covered every strand. This was easy since my relaxed hair got really sleek with the product on. There were no drips, and no tangles. I barely lost any hair in the comb.

With Global, i tried not to use too much but the product seemed foam up a little while I combed and I had to squeeze out this excess with the comb.

4. Dried hair- Air dried first then finished with hair dryer. I made sure my hair was 100% DRY. I read Sheba1's hypothesis about what could have caused Cubanit's exploding hair and I agree 100% that flat ironing damp hair at high temp can cause this (the pop-corn effect).

5. Flat ironed using BabyLiss nano pro titanium. Got it specially for this purpose since everyone on this board emphasizes the quality of the flat iron as an important element. First BKY I did it at 450 and it really scared me: my hair never felt this hot! But I continued since it looked and felt good ( soft and swangy) after about 5 passes (with DH- with global it took more passes and never felt quite right).

The 2nd BKT with global I did alternating 410-450 because the burnt hair smell was so strong sometimes. It was also a bit fume-y. I wish I had followed my instinct to lower the temp even more...
************
So, that's what I did. I slightly resent the implications that this failed because I didn't follow directions. I think I did enough research to know what I was getting into. I watched Youtube videos to learn the technique (I had never flat ironed before) and did a pretty decent job on my first try. So I don't think my flat ironing technique was to blame. Right now my theory is that relaxed hair needs to be processed at a much lower temp. Although my hair was OK after DH, other than the few broken pieces.

I'm still stumped on the issue with Global. What's the variable? What it a product incompatibility? I clarified with the DH shampoo since my Global sample(which, BTW, I got got from a seller on this board) didn't come with shampoo. Is this what caused the foaminess with the global (felt kind of like when you mix vinegar and baking soda, in a much smaller scale)? Has anybody experienced this?

Sorry for the super long post. I really needed to unload!

P.S. I opened a photobucket account last night so I can upload pictures. Hope I can do that tonight.

 

[RootPunch]

I'm new to BKT, but have researched and contemplated it since June '09. The 'evidence' of Sheba1 and Fab helped me make the decision to BKT before I would ever slap another relaxer in. Fab making it accessible for a good experimental price took me there; complete with clarifying poo.

I knew I would never entrust anyone else (salon or otherwise) to put it in, much less pay half a car note to do it. I would have to be in control at all times -- [no accidental seeping into my scalp while you talk on the phone, etc.] Plus I know I'm wicked with a flat iron. If anything were to go wrong, it wouldn't be because I gave up the reigns to someone else.

So far, I feel like I've found my miracle product. It's still early (only been about 3 days), but I am enjoying my hair and know I will not be making use of that 'just in case' perm that's been stashed in my closet for the past year+. My DH, who had been wondering when I was gonna gather my sanity back from all that new growth, said to me yesterday "your hair is so soft" as his cheek rubbed against him. TRUST ME............ THIS IS A BREAKTHROUGH. His support for me going natural waned at month 8

I hope the shampoos and subsequent months go just as well. Like it is always said on this board: everything ain't 4 everybody. I'm sorry it didn't work out as hoped for all those who tried. It certainly did for me, and fortunately on the first go 'round. It's like I won the hair lottery.

Thanks for all the testimonials and reviews. Esp Sheba and Fab. If something goes wrong down the line, I will definitely keep you all updated.

 

[me-T]

my hair is both protein & heat sensitive and had some breakage. all that is gone now, my hair is thriving.
imo, aside from some use error, are they researching to a T? or are they just drooling over pics, reading a bunch of posts, buying something that says "keratin" & "brazil(ian)" somewhere on the bottle, and hoppin on the bandwagon? maybe they don't understand how different it is from a relaxer, since those with success stories are praising it like a relaxer alternative?
i think there's not a full understanding of bkt so folks are just trying it. it's more than just baking a cream into your hair. if you have to be so careful with Drano, imagine how serious you have to be with embalming fluid, ya know?

 

[*fabulosity*]

Fab, now tell us what you really think!

You know I always do!!!!
I'm just tired of people giving BKT a bad name. And all of these lurkers who have tried it...never once posted in this thread.. but they coming out in other threads talking about BKT took my hair from WL to NL... I am just like...

 

[*fabulosity*]

Hi All,

I can't stress enough how fabulous I think this forum is! Thank you all for the wealth of valuable information .

I want to BKT but need some help for the prep. I've been perming my hair for 30 years. I guess I have (soft) somewhere around 3b'ish hair which I've been neglecting. I've read that I should start strengthening it with protein therapy, is this correct? I've recently purchased: Sabino Moisture Block 3 oz, Rusk Pro Element's Keratin Treatment; Keratin Conditioner, and Earthly Body Soaking Wet Sulfate-Free Shampoo. Is this a good start? Never been a DC kinda person (I have a short attention span) but will try and get some in.

Hate to wash my hair! I use Soya Protien poo by Biotique (a company with purely Ayurvedic products), 100% Pure Tea poo by Fantasia, Protein hair cream by Himalaya Herbals with dabs of Vatika coconut oil and/or some jasmine oil. I have hair breakage in the front section and no matter how long I leave the relaxer in that part is still rough and frizzy. The time between my last touch-up, 1 year. Yes, lazy I am . The Biotique stuff is really, really wonderful. You can find it online but this is the cheapest place, even if it is being shipped from India, and it arrives within 5/7 days but I digress...

I will probably be using the DreamHair product but someone mentioned that you should clarify you hair before. I only see it being sold with a poo that I assume is used *after* the process, or am I wrong?

ok, I think that's enough for now . Thanks all!

I thanked your contribution but never came back... I also had to when I saw you listing those new products....

No the clarifying poo is to strip the buildup from the hair so the BKT can adhere to it effectively.

The poos I use and luv... Elucence Clarifying, Elucence Moisture Balancing, and any Yes to ... (Carrots/Cucumbers/Tomatoes) poo... they are all natural and don't have SLS in them. They are also all CHEAP...

Good luck!

 

[Muse]

Thanks for your interest. Here's my story:

My hair was in decent condition before BKT. It's relaxed bone-straight and had about 1/2 new growth. I've been alternating moisture and protein treatments because my hair got really damage last summer from the beach, pool, sun-exposure . It was really rough, with wiry ends (but no split ends) and got somewhat bleached (looked like I got highlights). I September I started researching and found Dr. Sayed's blog (he works for AVLON/Syntonics) which gave me the idea to do protein treatment right after rinsing the relaxer off because the cuticle is open. I did this with my last relaxer (some time in late Sept or early Oct--not sure) and it worked pretty well. It was then that I found out about BKT and started researching it. That led me back to this forum. I had joined back in May but never really participated. In early October, I paid for full membership privileges so I could look at all the cool pictures of all the beautiful hair (You guys are an inspiration!).

I've always had problems with breakage at the transition point when I have new growth so the broken hairs tend to be long. When I relax (I do it myself), I lose some more hair where I accidentally overlap the relaxer on previously relaxed hair (always so scary to see all that hair!) but then the breaking stops for about a month, when the new growth starts really showing, and the whole destructive cycle starts again. This has left me with permanent neck length hair for last many, many years.

So I had high hopes for BKT. The promise of no frizz (I usually air dry my hair, I occasionally use the curling iron, wear my hair back in a short pony), and more importantly, the promise of deep protein conditioning really appealed to me. Also, I liked the possibility of taming my roots with heat (hot comb or flar iron) without damaging the rest of the hair.

**************
DETAILS ON MY BKT PROCESS:

1-shampooed with clarifying shampo 2X (I had lots of product buildup)

2-air dried to ~90% for BKT#1 with Dream hair and used blower to get to 100% dry with Global.

3-Applied product, avoiding scalp.

With DH my hair seemed to suck up the product and felt damp but looked dryish. I used a fine tooth comb to make sure I covered every strand. This was easy since my relaxed hair got really sleek with the product on. There were no drips, and no tangles. I barely lost any hair in the comb.

With Global, i tried not to use too much but the product seemed foam up a little while I combed and I had to squeeze out this excess with the comb.

4. Dried hair- Air dried first then finished with hair dryer. I made sure my hair was 100% DRY. I read Sheba1's hypothesis about what could have caused Cubanit's exploding hair and I agree 100% that flat ironing damp hair at high temp can cause this (the pop-corn effect).

5. Flat ironed using BabyLiss nano pro titanium. Got it specially for this purpose since everyone on this board emphasizes the quality of the flat iron as an important element. First BKY I did it at 450 and it really scared me: my hair never felt this hot! But I continued since it looked and felt good ( soft and swangy) after about 5 passes (with DH- with global it took more passes and never felt quite right).

The 2nd BKT with global I did alternating 410-450 because the burnt hair smell was so strong sometimes. It was also a bit fume-y. I wish I had followed my instinct to lower the temp even more...
************
So, that's what I did. I slightly resent the implications that this failed because I didn't follow directions. I think I did enough research to know what I was getting into. I watched Youtube videos to learn the technique (I had never flat ironed before) and did a pretty decent job on my first try. So I don't think my flat ironing technique was to blame. Right now my theory is that relaxed hair needs to be processed at a much lower temp. Although my hair was OK after DH, other than the few broken pieces.

I'm still stumped on the issue with Global. What's the variable? What it a product incompatibility? I clarified with the DH shampoo since my Global sample(which, BTW, I got got from a seller on this board) didn't come with shampoo. Is this what caused the foaminess with the global (felt kind of like when you mix vinegar and baking soda, in a much smaller scale)? Has anybody experienced this?

Sorry for the super long post. I really needed to unload!

P.S. I opened a photobucket account last night so I can upload pictures. Hope I can do that tonight.

You are right about the bolded, depending on the condition of the relaxed hair. I use to be relaxed bone straight AND my stylist COMPLETELY over processed my hair each time. There is no way my old relaxed hair could take a 450 degree iron even with the treatment on. So a lower temp sounds perfect for you. Also, there is a girl on youtube, Brittney(sp?), who has been doing BKT for 2 years and when she started she had some damage. She would stress to viewers that BKT does not stop breakage from previous damage. It wasn't until she cut the damaged hair away that she could enjoy completely healthy BKT'd hair. So perhaps, even though you may not have experienced a lot of breakage before the relaxed ends still can be very delicate and the high heat could have been the breaking point. Maybe you can start texlaxing now to leave some integrity to the hair and use BKT to get it bone straight.

IDK about global but I do know that Dream Hair contains collagen as well as keratin and I believe the collagen gives added conditioning effects that we are all experiencing. Does anyone know if Global contains collagen as well? I'm kinda thinking that I should stick to Dream Hair only now and stop trying to experiment. Excessive experimenting with my hair early on caused a lot of my damage now so if it ain't broke...

ETA: By lower temp I mean maybe 430 range. The thing is you don't want to set it too low or you won't bake the treatment in and you will have problems too. The temp is something you just have to get a feel for on your own head, but 20 degrees can make a heck of a difference in whether you burn your hair or not.

 

[lilikoi]

You are right about the bolded, depending on the condition of the relaxed hair. I use to be relaxed bone straight AND my stylist COMPLETELY over processed my hair each time. There is no way my old relaxed hair could take a 450 degree iron even with the treatment on. So a lower temp sounds perfect for you. Also, there is a girl on youtube, Brittney(sp?), who has been doing BKT for 2 years and when she started she had some damage. She would stress to viewers that BKT does not stop breakage from previous damage. It wasn't until she cut the damaged hair away that she could enjoy completely healthy BKT'd hair. So perhaps, even though you may not have experienced a lot of breakage before the relaxed ends still can be very delicate and the high heat could have been the breaking point. Maybe you can start texlaxing now to leave some integrity to the hair and use BKT to get it bone straight.

IDK about global but I do know that Dream Hair contains collagen as well as keratin and I believe the collagen gives added conditioning effects that we are all experiencing. Does anyone know if Global contains collagen as well? I'm kinda thinking that I should stick to Dream Hair only now and stop trying to experiment. Excessive experimenting with my hair early on caused a lot of my damage now so if it ain't broke...

I agree with the bolded statement. Also, where did you find info on the Dream Hair ingredients? Their website is so uninformative...

 

[Muse]

my hair is both protein & heat sensitive and had some breakage. all that is gone now, my hair is thriving.
imo, aside from some use error, are they researching to a T? or are they just drooling over pics, reading a bunch of posts, buying something that says "keratin" & "brazil(ian)" somewhere on the bottle, and hoppin on the bandwagon? maybe they don't understand how different it is from a relaxer, since those with success stories are praising it like a relaxer alternative?
i think there's not a full understanding of bkt so folks are just trying it. it's more than just baking a cream into your hair. if you have to be so careful with Drano, imagine how serious you have to be with embalming fluid, ya know?

Very well said me-T. How many treatments did you do before you saw the breakage subside? Did you cut the breaking ends off or did they just stop breaking after so many treatments?

 

[lilikoi]

YAY! I learned how to post pics! (see, I can follow instructions!). I'll make sure I reduce the size next time I post.

Here's the evidence of my BKT experience with dream hair. It was lovely, while it lasted...

BEFORE:

About 4 weeks post relaxer. Had been applying different products all week (I had just gone to Sallys LOL!) and ended up applying too much coconut oil (another first). My ends were kind of ratty. I had done several protein (aphogee, Redken) treatments alternating with moisture (Dr. Miracle, Charles Worthington,neutrogene triple moisture leave in, etc). I was just experimenting but ended up not able to wear my hair down because it was so goopy.



DRY HAIR AFTER CLARiFYING SHAMPOO

I didn't comb my hair because it felt stripped and rough. Notice the rough texture of even the relaxed part.



PRODUCT ON (DREAM HAIR)

I could feel something was happening. The hair was really sleek and soft already, like it was covered in glycerin. But it was also not super wet-feeling. It really absorbed the product. Also notice how long it looks! It kinda stretched.

HOW MUCH PRODUCT I USED

This is a 4 oz. bottle- It arrived completely full. I wasn't being stingy. I thought I used just enough to cover every strand. Did I use too little?

AFTER FLATIRONING 1

I try to iron as close to hte scalp as I could. I'm glad I didn't burn myself. This is just to show that some hairs that were broken before the treatment were really sticking up right after. Drove me nuts! I tamed them a little with a tiny tiny bit of coconut oil (my new friend)



AFTER FLATIRONING2

So here's the end result. I really need a trim in the front.



AFTER FLATIRONING3

My hair was SWANGY!!



AFTER FLATIRONING4

Back view



AFTER FLATIRONING5

MORE SWANG!



AFTER FLATIRONING6 CLOSE UP

Ugh! I have to deal with all the gray! But at least it's shiny gray...



AFTER FLATIRONING7 ROOT CLOSEUP

It was really smooth and soft



AFTER FLATIRONING8 BLING!!

Need I say more...



AFTER FLATIRONING9

This was actually my first BEFORE picture after I finished. It's taken in sunlight through the window, hence the lighter color

******************

So this was my DreamHair BKY experience. My complain was that after the first wash my hair was not as shiny and I didn't want to use heat again. It also lost a lot of the swang. But I was just air drying, not styling at all. I also nocited a few split ends (the HORROR!--I haven't had those in years). But in all, it wasn't a negative experience. Just bleh after such spectacular results the first few days.

This all changed with my second BKT with GLOBAL. Imagine these same pictures WITHOUT SWANG OR SHINE and you'e got it. Also, my ends are thinner, though the length overall is the same. Sorry, I didn't take pictures of the 2nd BKT. I was in a foul mood.

 

[ChristmasCarol]

WOW! That was some gorgeous hair! I'm on the iPhone right now, but when I get home, I have got to see your Dreamhair on a big screen.

 

[me-T]

Very well said me-T. How many treatments did you do before you saw the breakage subside? Did you cut the breaking ends off or did they just stop breaking after so many treatments?

after the very first treatment! it slowed down a lot. after this second, it's even less!
my shedding stopped completely too. i thought it was normal cause i've always shed a lot, but after bkt, it stopped! don't know how, don't care how!

 

[lilikoi]

WOW! That was some gorgeous hair! I'm on the iPhone right now, but when I get home, I have got to see your Dreamhair on a big screen.

Thanks! Trust me-I was grinning from ear to ear! I can't express how ideal my hair felt: light but "heavy" with body, and so very sleek and soft. No relaxer ever did that to my hair. I really hope I work out the issues I've had so I can do this again.

BTW-I just got a message from paypal that my full sized bottle of Moroccan Dream Hair is on it's way! I'm sorry I'll have to wait to use it...

 

[chesmi]

What do you mean by "perming"? Is that like a regular perm wave? Your hair looks pretty loose (and pretty!) in the pic-is that a a heat set?

Oops, relaxing, been doing it myself. Thank you . My hair texture hasn't really changed a lot with relaxing but what it afforded me was for my hairline not to kink up when I'd sweat. This doesn't happen anymore. It's as if after all these years my hair is fighting the relaxer. I think it's time for a change and BKT sounds like just the thing.

I don't know if the pre-keratin would be stripped with the clarifying shampoo (anyone?) so it probably wont hurt, but I don't know if it would be any help... I did it before BKT but just by coincidence. I'd definitely go with dream hair. I got better results and it was waaay less fume-y than Global.

Since I've noticed some breakage (something that has happened before in the past but grew back), I want to give my hair some serious attention. It might be stripped to a point but I figure if I give my hair 2 months of some serious TLC (and of course continue after), particularly with keratin, that it would help to make it stronger.

 

[Ediese]

YAY! I learned how to post pics! (see, I can follow instructions!). I'll make sure I reduce the size next time I post.

Here's the evidence of my BKT experience with dream hair. It was lovely, while it lasted...

Need I say more...

WOW!! Thanks for all the pics. I am in awe over the after pictures. It looks like a different head, and I can definitely see your swang.

What kind of camera are you using? What's the setting? Those closeup shots are awesome.

 

[beana]

I dont know why people are getting bent out of shape on either end... If something works for a person they have the right to praise it, if something doesn't work, they have the right to share that too.

I will say that if a there is a "support" thread you shouldnt chime in with negativity. If a thread is asking for general experiences with a product, people have the right to say whatever they want. This is borderline ridiculous and petty... You don't see people catching a 'tude if we dont ALL agree/like the same conditioner, relaxer, flat iron etc I mean wtf?

btw lilkoi, your results look really nice!

 

[Ediese]

Fab: can you please add me as a friend so that I can see your bkt results?

 

[deborah11]

what will happen if you don't apply heat that is suficient to melt the treatment into the hair strain? Will insufficient heat to the BKT on your hair cause hair damage or other problems? I hope this question makes sense, but just like for some, too much heat to the hair will cause damage to BKT'ed hair, will too litte heat cause damage as well? If so, how will it damage the hair or cause other problems? What effect will insufficient heat have on the formaldyhe? Without the high heat does the formaldyhe stay on the hair strain and create problems? I hope this ? doesn't sound too stupid.

 

[chesmi]

I thanked your contribution but never came back... I also had to when I saw you listing those new products....

No the clarifying poo is to strip the buildup from the hair so the BKT can adhere to it effectively.

The poos I use and luv... Elucence Clarifying, Elucence Moisture Balancing, and any Yes to ... (Carrots/Cucumbers/Tomatoes) poo... they are all natural and don't have SLS in them. They are also all CHEAP...

Good luck!

Hi Fab,

Got the thanks and thanks for the poo recommendations.

Just a bit more on the Biotique line. I've had the Bhringraj Hair Oil for months and just used it this AM. L-o-v-i-n-g it! This line is the real deal for ayurvedic formulation and to top it off, the herbs/extracts are organic. Very, nice product. If I had extra I'd send you some. There is a store here (in NYC), that sells some of the line, if you want, I can get for you.

I am coming from 30+ years of self-relaxing and honestly my hair should show some kind of extreme damage or fall out but I wack it off with some crusty scissors and it grows back. Yes, i count myself as lucky . Never blow dry my hair mainly cause I'm too lazy and then there is the added damage. I just air dry and use a curling iron (as you see), to straighten. If I don't put add moisturizer (Himalaya or Alaffia), or oil on my hair it burns. [BTW: Alaffia makes great product with clean, clean extractions methods. Black-owned, Fair Trade and the shea is grown and produced by a group of women in Togo, Africa.]

At the end of the day, read, ask questions, ask for help and most important, know thy hair. Just my 2 cents. (If I type all this one more time I'm gonna scream. I keep loosing this when I preview)

 

[*fabulosity*]

Fab: can you please add me as a friend so that I can see your bkt results?

Added you last night... pics are a bit outdated... I'll do another one closer to Xmas.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Thank you for posting this, it's people like you who I like to ask questions and find out what went wrong. I keep hearing that technically this treatment is made for relaxed hair but maybe it depends on the condition of the relaxed hair in the first place. Would you consider your relaxed hair in pretty good shape before the BKT? You said you noticed a cooked hair smell. For the first time ever I DIDN'T notice that on my head after doing BKT. Any other time I flat iron on lower temps and I get the cooked smell and my hair breaks. I think if you hair smells that is a sign that the heat is too high and it's not really being protected. Do you think you distributed the treatment evenly and what temp did you have the iron on?

This is a learning process for many of us and unfortunately for some there may be some damaging mistakes done until we get it down but if you are going to try it again at some point I'd stick with Dreamhair since it worked pretty well for you.

BTW-I haven't tried it yet but from what I hear less is more with Global. You can get away with using more Dreamhair without the stiff feeling but Global is not as forgiving in that area. I am going to try Global 4% next and if I don't like it I'm going back to Dreamhair and staying put.

You hit the nail on the head. You have to use a light touch when applying Global.

 

[sheba1]

I never like my hair immediately after application. It's very soft and won't stay straight, like my old presses. But after my first wash That's how it's been with every BKT for me. I'm in love after the first wash; but while product in... eh