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Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not available...

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Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

My original post:

This is somewhat of a sidebar.

If I'm understanding the replies and their implications correctly.....

Why is it that when someone dislikes or talks negatively about natural hair (be it the texture, the appearance, the maintenance), the natural ladies come in with the strong arm, throwing the word 'ignorant' around like it's a Frisbee, then the relaxed ladies come in reassuring the offended naturals that not ALL relaxed ladies feel this way?

But when a natural person is condescending about relaxed hair (be it the use of chemical, the straightness of it), the other natural ladies come in to cosign; the relaxed ladies just 'stay out of the drama'?

Why can't we just like what we like while respecting everyone's taste/opinion?

And why am I ignorant just for not sharing your taste?

I just don't get it.
 
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Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

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Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I just find it odd when people say that the hair that grows out of their head doesn't or wouldn't "suit" them. Especially if they haven't even experienced it since they were 5.

Also, some of the posters implied (or stated outright) that if there were no heat appliances or relaxers then they'd wear wigs/weaves/braids in order to avoid having to "face" their natural hair. That's weird to me.

I thought those responses were interesting. And, they literally made me shake my head.

Just because someone says that their natural hair doesn't suit them, doesn't mean they hate it.

For some women who have a very active lifestyle, their natural hair is too much work. It doesn't mean they hate it but having relaxed hair lets them have more versatilty. The converse is also true.

My mother had long relaxed hair for a long time. She decided though that it was too much work keeping up with conditioning and styling so in college in 1971, she cut it off and rocked a fro. She has had one ever since. She doesn't like dealing and messing with hair thus her choice to keep it short and natural. My sister just recently re relaxed her hair after being natural because no matter what she was doing, it was just coming out. It wouldn't hold moisture at all and trust me we tried everything. It knotted up all of the time with no avail. She wants to be natural but she wants her hair to retain length. For her, that process is easier being relaxed so that is what she did. Its no different than a relaxed head saying that their hair won't stop breaking so they went natural. Its about what is best for you for your long term hair goals.

I never said that people who choose to relax their hair do it because they hate their natural hair. In fact, I quoted what other people said about their own natural hair. I literally thought some of the answers were odd and weird and they really did cause me to shake my head.

And, looking at some of the responses, there are obviously some people who dislike their natural hair for whatever reason. I mean calling natural hair pubes and saying you'd have a heart attack because you couldn't get to a flat iron is obviously a sign of at least mild distaste for what is growing out of your scalp.

Last, if the party line is that women relax because it fits their lifestyle better, makes their hair more "manageable", or is more versatile, that's cool. I'm sure it's true for those women and if it makes their lives that much easier then so be it. Obviously my definition of manageable and versatile are different so as usual I will agree to disagree with relaxed heads on that issue. My opinion has no bearing on whatever works for you (general you) and your head. If you like it, I love it.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

My original post:

This is somewhat of a sidebar.

If I'm understanding the replies and their implications correctly.....

Why is it that when someone dislikes or talks negatively about natural hair (be it the texture, the appearance, the maintenance), the natural ladies come in with the strong arm, throwing the word 'ignorant' around like it's a Frisbee, then the relaxed ladies come in reassuring the offended naturals that not ALL relaxed ladies feel this way?

But when a natural person is condescending about relaxed hair (be it the use of chemical, the straightness of it), the other natural ladies come in to cosign; the relaxed ladies just 'stay out of the drama'?

Why can't we just like what we like while respecting everyone's taste/opinion?

And why am I ignorant just for not sharing your taste?

I just don't get it.

I don't think you're ignorant for not sharing my taste (general). I think it's ignorant to compare natural hair to pubic hair, or to say that your natural hair would be a hot ugly mess when you haven't seen your natural hair since you were 5. Or, of course, to say that you would only be natural if you had a good grade of hair.:ohwell:

Let's also take into consideration that something like 80% of black women are relaxed. We can surmise, then, that most black people think straight/relaxed hair is better, right? So that already puts natural nappy heads at a "disadvantage". It's pretty crappy to then turn around and "kick us while we're down", so to speak.

I respect your opinion on this, but I don't think relaxed hair, natural hair, and the repective opinions on both are on a level playing field.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

My original post:

This is somewhat of a sidebar.

If I'm understanding the replies and their implications correctly.....

Why is it that when someone dislikes or talks negatively about natural hair (be it the texture, the appearance, the maintenance), the natural ladies come in with the strong arm, throwing the word 'ignorant' around like it's a Frisbee, then the relaxed ladies come in reassuring the offended naturals that not ALL relaxed ladies feel this way?

But when a natural person is condescending about relaxed hair (be it the use of chemical, the straightness of it), the other natural ladies come in to cosign; the relaxed ladies just 'stay out of the drama'?

Why can't we just like what we like while respecting everyone's taste/opinion?

And why am I ignorant just for not sharing your taste?

I just don't get it.

I have noticed that on the board. There are a few natural women who seem to go out of their way to be condescending when referring to relaxers, but WW III would break out if someone were to talk about being natural the same way. Sort of like it did in this thread...:lachen::lachen:
I just chalk it up to people recognizing the sensitivity of the issues that we have in our community about natural hair. We all know that someone with natural hair will get more questions and stares from mainstream society vs. someone with relaxed hair so maybe relaxed women feel sympathetic towards that and don't want to add to it. :ohwell:
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I don't think you're ignorant for not sharing my taste (general). I think it's ignorant to compare natural hair to pubic hair, or to say that your natural hair would be a hot ugly mess when you haven't seen your natural hair since you were 5. Or, of course, to say that you would only be natural if you had a good grade of hair.:ohwell:

Let's also take into consideration that something like 80% of black women are relaxed. We can surmise, then, that most black people think straight/relaxed hair is better, right? So that already puts natural nappy heads at a "disadvantage". It's pretty crappy to then turn around and "kick us while we're down", so to speak.

I respect your opinion on this, but I don't think relaxed hair, natural hair, and the repective opinions on both are on a level playing field.

was there a nationwide/worldwide poll taken? we don't really know.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

My original post:

This is somewhat of a sidebar.

If I'm understanding the replies and their implications correctly.....

Why is it that when someone dislikes or talks negatively about natural hair (be it the texture, the appearance, the maintenance), the natural ladies come in with the strong arm, throwing the word 'ignorant' around like it's a Frisbee, then the relaxed ladies come in reassuring the offended naturals that not ALL relaxed ladies feel this way?

But when a natural person is condescending about relaxed hair (be it the use of chemical, the straightness of it), the other natural ladies come in to cosign; the relaxed ladies just 'stay out of the drama'?

Why can't we just like what we like while respecting everyone's taste/opinion?

And why am I ignorant just for not sharing your taste?

I just don't get it.


i get wht u r saying and agree to an extent. i try to stay out of the relaxedvsnatural drama because its a heated topic tht has been beaten over and over and over and over. but even with all tht... LHCF seems to be the only hair board where we are all blended together and co-exist. no segregation.:lol:
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I think that there is "relaxed privilege". Like white people with white privilege, relaxed ladies are the standard...the default. You are normal. You don't have to deal with being different or being perceived as ugly, wild, unprofessional, unpolished, or crazy because of your hair. Your hair can look like complete crap, but you are still doing better than me, in many people's minds, simply because your hair is straight. Nobody expects you to go natural the way people expect me to relax or press. Your hair isn't seen as a statement...it's just what hair is supposed to look like.

So forgive me if I can't empathize with what you are going through when a few naturals talk about how they feel about relaxers. I understand that on an individual level, it bothers you, but on the whole, that's really about the only issue you have to deal with. You are still normal, and you know when you leave the house, everyone else will look like you. We don't have that privilege.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

Because the thanks button is not enough...THANK YOU.

I don't think you're ignorant for not sharing my taste (general). I think it's ignorant to compare natural hair to pubic hair, or to say that your natural hair would be a hot ugly mess when you haven't seen your natural hair since you were 5. Or, of course, to say that you would only be natural if you had a good grade of hair.:ohwell:

Let's also take into consideration that something like 80% of black women are relaxed. We can surmise, then, that most black people think straight/relaxed hair is better, right? So that already puts natural nappy heads at a "disadvantage". It's pretty crappy to then turn around and "kick us while we're down", so to speak.

I respect your opinion on this, but I don't think relaxed hair, natural hair, and the repective opinions on both are on a level playing field.

I think that there is "relaxed privilege". Like white people with white privilege, relaxed ladies are the standard...the default. You are normal. You don't have to deal with being different or being perceived as ugly, wild, unprofessional, unpolished, or crazy because of your hair. Your hair can look like complete crap, but you are still doing better than me, in many people's minds, simply because your hair is straight. Nobody expects you to go natural the way people expect me to relax or press. Your hair isn't seen as a statement...it's just what hair is supposed to look like.

So forgive me if I can't empathize with what you are going through when a few naturals talk about how they feel about relaxers. I understand that on an individual level, it bothers you, but on the whole, that's really about the only issue you have to deal with. You are still normal, and you know when you leave the house, everyone else will look like you. We don't have that privilege.

:yep::yep::yep::yep::yep::yep::yep::yep::yep:
Exactly.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

This article says 70%

Knowing that approximately 70 percent of all African-American women relax their hair, Soft Sheen has formulated Optimum Care color specifically for women with relaxed hair.

and I'm assuming they're only talking about America. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3374/is_/ai_19289426


This one says 80%, but "relaxed hair styles" could include presses:

Furthermore, more than 80 percent of all African-American women wear their hair in relaxed hair styles.

http://www.allbusiness.com/marketing-advertising/market-research-analysis/7051698-1.html

This one says 68.8%

According to our survey, 68.6 percent of Black women have their hair relaxed or permed, while 16.1 percent say they wear a "natural style."

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1077/is_7_55/ai_61963176/pg_2


So it's probably safest to say between 70-80%.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

My original post:

This is somewhat of a sidebar.

If I'm understanding the replies and their implications correctly.....

Why is it that when someone dislikes or talks negatively about natural hair (be it the texture, the appearance, the maintenance), the natural ladies come in with the strong arm, throwing the word 'ignorant' around like it's a Frisbee, then the relaxed ladies come in reassuring the offended naturals that not ALL relaxed ladies feel this way?

But when a natural person is condescending about relaxed hair (be it the use of chemical, the straightness of it), the other natural ladies come in to cosign; the relaxed ladies just 'stay out of the drama'?

Why can't we just like what we like while respecting everyone's taste/opinion?

And why am I ignorant just for not sharing your taste?

I just don't get it.

I'll bite since I was the one who used the word ignorant :giggle:
The problem I have is when someone talks about good grades of hair, they just need to be checked because it is obvious that person doesn’t have a clue, end of story. The post stated that she had a “good grade of hair so I’d doubt that I’d have a big nappy fro”. Now if that doesn’t sound ignorant I don’t know what does :nono:
For me, I don’t care if a person relaxes their hair or wants it to be straight. I just know that it is not for me.
If you or anyone doesn’t want to be natural, that is obviously your call because I am not you but it seems to be ok for people to talk about nappy hair as the enemy. Natural hair has always been looked down upon and unfortunately, it always will. Statements like the above prove that point :sad:
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

This article says 70%



and I'm assuming they're only talking about America. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3374/is_/ai_19289426


This one says 80%, but "relaxed hair styles" could include presses:



http://www.allbusiness.com/marketing-advertising/market-research-analysis/7051698-1.html

This one says 68.8%



http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1077/is_7_55/ai_61963176/pg_2


So it's probably safest to say between 70-80%.


interesting...thanks so much. i've never participated in any of these surveys. a lot of info missing.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

My original post:

This is somewhat of a sidebar.

If I'm understanding the replies and their implications correctly.....

Why is it that when someone dislikes or talks negatively about natural hair (be it the texture, the appearance, the maintenance), the natural ladies come in with the strong arm, throwing the word 'ignorant' around like it's a Frisbee, then the relaxed ladies come in reassuring the offended naturals that not ALL relaxed ladies feel this way?

But when a natural person is condescending about relaxed hair (be it the use of chemical, the straightness of it), the other natural ladies come in to cosign; the relaxed ladies just 'stay out of the drama'?

Why can't we just like what we like while respecting everyone's taste/opinion?

And why am I ignorant just for not sharing your taste?

I just don't get it.

because people are made to feel ugly and bad about natural hair.
personally, i don't have a problem with relaxed hair. i used to be relaxed. but being relaxed came with a lot more maintaince for me. taking care of my natural hair is easier, cheaper, and healthier for me. relaxers made me feel opressed. i couldn't dance too hard or too long, i couldn't swim or workout, i couldn't sleep right. i hated getting touch ups. i love my natural hair, but a lot of people don't feel the same way about my hair. they think it is ugly, unkept, or the slave look. i must smoke weed, be gay, have no man, go to slam poetry sessions, i'm part of the Jill Scott/Erykah Badu movement, or i'm plotting to taking over the government. i know that you just want us all to get along, but lets be honest, who is truly, deeply doing it for the style of it all? i want to change my nose, i don't like it, i think i would look prettier with a more defined nose. now what type of responses do you think i will get? many folks would just tell me that i'm beautiful and that this is the way God made me and to just accept it, but i'm just want to change it for a different look right? see people see natural hair like the same thing as my nose. i was born with this hair, God made it this way for me right? what is the difference? hair is just hair? it is not that serious that someone will use chemicals or a hot as hell piece of iron to change what they were born with? i don't think you are ignorant though and i respect whatever decision you make about what you feel is best for you.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I don't think you're ignorant for not sharing my taste (general). I think it's ignorant to compare natural hair to pubic hair, or to say that your natural hair would be a hot ugly mess when you haven't seen your natural hair since you were 5. Or, of course, to say that you would only be natural if you had a good grade of hair.:ohwell:

Let's also take into consideration that something like 80% of black women are relaxed. We can surmise, then, that most black people think straight/relaxed hair is better, right? So that already puts natural nappy heads at a "disadvantage". It's pretty crappy to then turn around and "kick us while we're down", so to speak.

I respect your opinion on this, but I don't think relaxed hair, natural hair, and the respective opinions on both are on a level playing field.
I'll agree with you on some points, particularly your first statements.

I guess when I read things about 'bad' or 'good' hair, I take into consideration that everyone hasn't learned what we have regarding hair. And, more importantly, everyone doesn't ACCEPT what we have regarding hair. You and I know what it is. But everybody isn't always going to agree with our viewpoint (that all hair is good). And for me, that's fine. As long as you're respectful with your opinion and you're not spouting foolishness.

But when it boils down to it, I can't really get mad at someone not sharing my opinion. I can't deem their opinion worthless just because it doesn't mirror mine, and that's regardless of if I'm the minority or majority vote.

Thanks for your response, I really appreciate you being level headed about something that I know is dear to your heart. :) :kiss:
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

because people are made to feel ugly and bad about natural hair.
personally, i don't have a problem with relaxed hair. i used to be relaxed. but being relaxed came with a lot more maintaince for me. taking care of my natural hair is easier, cheaper, and healthier for me. relaxers made me feel opressed. i couldn't dance too hard or too long, i couldn't swim or workout, i couldn't sleep right. i hated getting touch ups. i love my natural hair, but a lot of people don't feel the same way about my hair. they think it is ugly, unkept, or the slave look. i must smoke weed, be gay, have no man, go to slam poetry sessions, i'm part of the Jill Scott/Erykah Badu movement, or i'm plotting to taking over the government. i know that you just want us all to get along, but lets be honest, who is truly, deeply doing it for the style of it all? i want to change my nose, i don't like it, i think i would look prettier with a more defined nose. now what type of responses do you think i will get? many folks would just tell me that i'm beautiful and that this is the way God made me and to just accept it, but i'm just want to change it for a different look right? see people see natural hair like the same thing as my nose. i was born with this hair, God made it this way for me right? what is the difference? hair is just hair? it is not that serious that someone will use chemicals or a hot as hell piece of iron to change what they were born with? i don't think you are ignorant though and i respect whatever decision you make about what you feel is best for you.

:lachen::lachen:
I get this all the time.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

There is no way in the world that the hair that grows out of your scalp just like it is does not suit you. That makes no darn sense, and never will.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I have noticed that on the board. There are a few natural women who seem to go out of their way to be condescending when referring to relaxers, but WW III would break out if someone were to talk about being natural the same way. Sort of like it did in this thread...:lachen::lachen:
I just chalk it up to people recognizing the sensitivity of the issues that we have in our community about natural hair. We all know that someone with natural hair will get more questions and stares from mainstream society vs. someone with relaxed hair so maybe relaxed women feel sympathetic towards that and don't want to add to it. :ohwell:
Yeah, I think that's what it is.

Side story - My mom did the BC when I was in 8th grade. I was sensitive about it... :look: I was in science class and this girl was talking to another girl.. I overhead her say, 'Did you see her momma?? She is B A L D H E A D E D!!!!' So my lil 8th grade sensitive tail yelled out, 'My momma ain't baldh3aded, ****!!!!' :lachen: Dag, I had forgotten about that story til this moment...

Anywho, I said all that to say that yeah, I think the relaxed/natural thing touches all of us to a certain degree. It's just about being respectful of others opinions, imho. I'm sensitive about my ish too, ya know?
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I think that there is "relaxed privilege". Like white people with white privilege, relaxed ladies are the standard...the default. You are normal. You don't have to deal with being different or being perceived as ugly, wild, unprofessional, unpolished, or crazy because of your hair. Your hair can look like complete crap, but you are still doing better than me, in many people's minds, simply because your hair is straight. Nobody expects you to go natural the way people expect me to relax or press. Your hair isn't seen as a statement...it's just what hair is supposed to look like.

So forgive me if I can't empathize with what you are going through when a few naturals talk about how they feel about relaxers. I understand that on an individual level, it bothers you, but on the whole, that's really about the only issue you have to deal with. You are still normal, and you know when you leave the house, everyone else will look like you. We don't have that privilege.

I've never been natural so I can't say "I understand" to a full extent. But my mom is natural and I've heard her viewpoint; it mirrors yours to a degree.

I'll leave it at that.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

It would just be the new in thing. I would wear it with a smile.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I'll bite since I was the one who used the word ignorant :giggle:
The problem I have is when someone talks about good grades of hair, they just need to be checked because it is obvious that person doesn’t have a clue, end of story. The post stated that she had a “good grade of hair so I’d doubt that I’d have a big nappy fro”. Now if that doesn’t sound ignorant I don’t know what does :nono:
For me, I don’t care if a person relaxes their hair or wants it to be straight. I just know that it is not for me.
If you or anyone doesn’t want to be natural, that is obviously your call because I am not you but it seems to be ok for people to talk about nappy hair as the enemy. Natural hair has always been looked down upon and unfortunately, it always will. Statements like the above prove that point :sad:
To say 'someone doesn't have a clue'.... I dunno. I mean, there has been something that we ALL have thought incorrectly on. And we may have been told time and time again that our thinking was flawed. But we didn't accept that as truth until we are good and ready. So to put someone down because of their flawed thinking.. I just can't get with that. (that was a general statement, not directing anything towards you in particular)
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

There is no way in the world that the hair that grows out of your scalp just like it is does not suit you. That makes no darn sense, and never will.

People get plastic surgery because they feel something on their body, natural as it is, doesn't suit them.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

never been natural in my adult years, it will take some getting use too. but i can do it:grin:
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

I'll agree with you on some points, particularly your first statements.

I guess when I read things about 'bad' or 'good' hair, I take into consideration that everyone hasn't learned what we have regarding hair. And, more importantly, everyone doesn't ACCEPT what we have regarding hair. You and I know what it is. But everybody isn't always going to agree with our viewpoint (that all hair is good). And for me, that's fine. As long as you're respectful with your opinion and you're not spouting foolishness.

But when it boils down to it, I can't really get mad at someone not sharing my opinion. I can't deem their opinion worthless just because it doesn't mirror mine, and that's regardless of if I'm the minority or majority vote.

Thanks for your response, I really appreciate you being level headed about something that I know is dear to your heart. :) :kiss:

Thank you for posting your opinion, and for "listening" and understanding.:kiss:
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

because people are made to feel ugly and bad about natural hair.
personally, i don't have a problem with relaxed hair. i used to be relaxed. but being relaxed came with a lot more maintaince for me. taking care of my natural hair is easier, cheaper, and healthier for me. relaxers made me feel opressed. i couldn't dance too hard or too long, i couldn't swim or workout, i couldn't sleep right. i hated getting touch ups. i love my natural hair, but a lot of people don't feel the same way about my hair. they think it is ugly, unkept, or the slave look. i must smoke weed, be gay, have no man, go to slam poetry sessions, i'm part of the Jill Scott/Erykah Badu movement, or i'm plotting to taking over the government. i know that you just want us all to get along, but lets be honest, who is truly, deeply doing it for the style of it all? i want to change my nose, i don't like it, i think i would look prettier with a more defined nose. now what type of responses do you think i will get? many folks would just tell me that i'm beautiful and that this is the way God made me and to just accept it, but i'm just want to change it for a different look right? see people see natural hair like the same thing as my nose. i was born with this hair, God made it this way for me right? what is the difference? hair is just hair? it is not that serious that someone will use chemicals or a hot as hell piece of iron to change what they were born with? i don't think you are ignorant though and i respect whatever decision you make about what you feel is best for you.

Thanks for your response... I'm relaxed and I like Jill Scott. :look: :lol:

People are made to feel ugly about ALOT of things. The main point I was tryna make is being respectful of everyones opinion, whether they're on your side or not.
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

To say 'someone doesn't have a clue'.... I dunno. I mean, there has been something that we ALL have thought incorrectly on. And we may have been told time and time again that our thinking was flawed. But we didn't accept that as truth until we are good and ready. So to put someone down because of their flawed thinking.. I just can't get with that. (that was a general statement, not directing anything towards you in particular)

Well, when I read such nonsense, it strikes a nerve with me as I can't stand that type of ignorance. I guess I should be used to reading/hearing statements like that by now...:perplexed
 
Re: Relaxed ladies:If relaxers werent for sale anymore and hotcombs were not availabl

^^ yeah, when I read nonsense about something that I'm a bit sensitive about, it strikes a nerve with me too. So I can definitely understand what that feeling is like. :)
 
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